Forum logs for 22 Jun 2015

Sunday, 24 November, Year 11 d.Tr. | Author: Mircea Popescu
asciilifeform hm, it is, isn't it. [00:00]
BingoBoingo Indeed, under many pretexts including a lab with explicit Air Force connection [00:01]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform yes. [00:01]
asciilifeform << how gcc does linker warnings. [00:03]
asciilifeform (some fella went and dug) [00:04]
BingoBoingo mircea_popescu: The Todd replace by fee patch is probably derp to hell, but it leads to some of the best Hearnia trolling outside this channel [00:04]
BingoBoingo "AntPool just missed out on 4.644BTC/$1128USD worth of transaction fees because they weren't mining with full-RBF" [00:05]
asciilifeform what even was this? [00:05]
* asciilifeform does not, sadly, have time to personally follow all of the crackpotteries [00:05]
BingoBoingo asciilifeform: Hearn and Co are pushing some derp where "Those Bitcoins are yours even before the transaction is mined" idiocies [00:06]
asciilifeform how does it (claim to) work ? [00:06]
ben_vulpes broadcast a transaction with a higher fee, miners will include it preferentially to a previous transaction with the same inputs [00:07]
BingoBoingo asciilifeform: [00:07]
BingoBoingo faith [00:07]
ben_vulpes nevermind that nothing keeps people from selecting transactions for block inclusion arbitrarily [00:07]
BingoBoingo The Tood thing works through pure profit incentive [00:07]
ben_vulpes myeah, and miners should really be doing it already [00:07]
asciilifeform ben_vulpes, BingoBoingo: what is so peculiar about including whatever transaction fee? this was always possible ..? [00:08]
ben_vulpes it is in no way to the best of my knowledge a change in anything of import [00:08]
BingoBoingo asciilifeform: It's basically just Peter Todd made the first public code available to do this [00:08]
asciilifeform to do what? [00:08]
ben_vulpes convention for a long time was that "the earliest broadcast transaction wins" as some sort of half-assed soft-connsensus-aka-fecal-matter prophylactic against double spends [00:08]
BingoBoingo Select for fees [00:08]
BingoBoingo on the same inputs [00:09]
asciilifeform i don't get it. anyone was already able to specify arbitrarily high fee [00:09]
* asciilifeform sorta assumed that miners already optimize for snarfing up max fee [00:09]
BingoBoingo Indeed, but whatever fee maximizing patches miners and pools were running for were like most serious pool code... seekrit [00:09]
asciilifeform if they don't, they are fools, and it isn't any fault of mine [00:09]
asciilifeform let me guess: [00:09]
ben_vulpes prefer transactions with high fees over transactions with low fees [00:10]
asciilifeform shitgang is trying to push a 'for miners' version of turdcoin ? [00:10]
ben_vulpes it's about inclusion logic after transactions got broadcast [00:10]
BingoBoingo Apparently enough pools though were on derp and herp choosing "see first mine first" [00:10]
asciilifeform aimed to replace 'seekrit miner versions' [00:10]
BingoBoingo Pretty much [00:10]
asciilifeform unsurprising [00:10]
ben_vulpes me too [00:11]
ben_vulpes look how dumb we are [00:11]
asciilifeform i can picture the minutes. 'hitler: you know, miners are using own versions of bitcoin and don't particular feel like backporting their necessary mods to yours. hearn: so let's do the work for them. gavin: fine idea' [00:11]
ben_vulpes clearly don't understand how theWerld Werks (tm) [00:12]
asciilifeform btw, one of the (not so) secrets is that mining does not select for 'the brightest bulbs at home depot [u.s. household goods shop]' - nor for political acumen, nor for really much else other than the peculiar countereconomic wormholes which make it sound like a reasonable proposition [00:14]
ben_vulpes moreover i'm not convinced it wasn't a stooge who broadcast the RBF txn to make the tweet in the first place [00:14]
ben_vulpes mining is the worst business. [00:14]
ben_vulpes (or so it seems from the outside). [00:15]
ben_vulpes maybe its the best busines for pillaging some specific kinds of subsidies? [00:15]
* ben_vulpes for bread and cheese [00:15]
trinque probably depends on whether you have a relationship with someone making the hardware [00:16]
* trinque eyeballs the big chinese mining farms [00:16]
asciilifeform mainly on whether you actually pay for the mains current [00:16]
trinque yeah obv free power wins [00:19]
trinque someone should alias to [00:21]
asciilifeform << mno. if it's in the channel, it is a live pre-gavin node (OR crafted impostor...) [00:25]
assbot Logged on 22-06-2015 01:59:36; ben_vulpes: << i have a hunch we're going to see approximately the same ratio in irc [00:25]
asciilifeform but in no case a corpse [00:26]
asciilifeform << -addnode=ip [00:27]
assbot Logged on 22-06-2015 02:00:31; ben_vulpes: are there some scripts kicking around for connecting to arbitrary nodes? [00:27]
asciilifeform [00:28]
assbot Satoshi ... ( ) [00:28]
asciilifeform or do i misunderstand what was being asked for. [00:28]
BingoBoingo I am starting to think "Olde Laptop Colo" might make a nice franchised business [00:29]
asciilifeform BingoBoingo: pre-emplaced in sand pits and fused mains wiring, for the inevitable halt&catchfire ? [00:29]
asciilifeform perhaps bury them in the earth (with chimneys for hot air.) sorta like the tombs in recoleta cemetary in buenos aires [00:30]
asciilifeform (a surprising number had corpse-gas exhaust pipes!) [00:30]
asciilifeform ben_vulpes was there, saw this [00:31]
BingoBoingo asciilifeform: Individual enclosures, one time setup fee which covers adapting the machine to its new cooling and power situation [00:31]
asciilifeform incidentally earth is great for passive cooling [00:31]
asciilifeform (if burial is deep enough) [00:31]
asciilifeform you will need to seal to keep out moisture, but if repair is not a concern (machine is disposable, replacement gets new burial plot) this is relatively simple matter [00:32]
asciilifeform though i still like my proposal for sinking miners to the bottom of the north atlantic, more. [00:33]
asciilifeform (go and steal, aha) [00:33]
BingoBoingo I'm thinking more steel sheds, rural locations that happen to be near interections of big city fiber. Prospective franchisees would be the local small town "computer repair" folk [00:33]
asciilifeform nah, you want to take serious advantage of the expendability [00:34]
asciilifeform but in such a way that the box lives out its remaining life, rather than being lifted by the first idiot copper scavenger who comes along. [00:35]
asciilifeform (not because valuable, but because copper scavengers need to be publicly flayed rather than encouraged) [00:35]
BingoBoingo Sure, but I'm thinking you do so by getting machines from the customers. [00:35]
BingoBoingo customer brings boxen, pay setup then power+pipe. Value proposition to franchisees is small town computer outfit gets an avenue to engage in rent collection. [00:37]
asciilifeform if box is easily accessible, 'skin not worth the tanning' [00:37]
asciilifeform whole point would be the physical security of a few metres of cement [00:38]
asciilifeform (it is possible to break up cement, but not without anyone noticing. this is the basic principle for the nuke test-ban compliance gadget used on both sides of the ocean) [00:39]
asciilifeform see the literature. [00:39]
asciilifeform (machine includes vibration, ph, sensors, clinometer, magnetometer, etc. if readings deviate from 'pylon is happily alone in the earth' memory gets zeroed and walked over, continuously) [00:40]
BingoBoingo Point for the customers is access to pipe and power off of their own premises. Physical security offered against naive scavengers, but premise could scale to hundreds of locations. Cheap and easily replicable [00:41]
asciilifeform BingoBoingo: schmucks in, iirc, germany, doing this already. see logs [00:42]
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asciilifeform snorefest because this has literally no serious advantage over normal hosting [00:42]
asciilifeform (if i wanted a box in some schmuck's house, i'd put it right here in mine) [00:42]
asciilifeform but five metres of cement - or 500m of salt water - that would be something. [00:43]
BingoBoingo Typical imagined customer is small business that wants to support other local business. Connosieur customer wants access to pipe without fucking up their netflix at home. [00:44]
asciilifeform so he would share with ~some other schmuck's~ netflix ? [00:45]
asciilifeform this has all the appeal of renting out the toilet in your house as a public latrine [00:45]
BingoBoingo lol, yes [00:46]
asciilifeform or your kitchen, as a place for bums to cook roadkill in [00:46]
mats brb submitting my ycombinator application for this idea [00:46]
BingoBoingo mats: Go for it [00:47]
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asciilifeform 'sharing economy!!11!!1' (tm) (r) [00:47]
BingoBoingo Seriously, this has all the promise of a great chumpatron except every now and then a customer does something worthwhile [00:48]
asciilifeform btw, my local telco quasimonopoly - 'verizon' - had a hilarious tamer version of this for some years, where you pay a few hundy for a box that opens a vpn to their end and gives you cell signal in your house, via your own net pipe. and they had the audacity to still charge for the 'minutes' and per MB of data. [00:49]
asciilifeform as result, the only folks who bought were 1) chumps 2) people who wanted to make own 'stingray' [00:49]
mats that's kind of brilliant [00:50]
asciilifeform vendor very much did not like (2) and they closed the hole which made reflashing the rom trivial. now you have to actually open the plastic box, oh noez. [00:50]
mats for operator, anyway [00:50]
asciilifeform who wants - go, buy. [00:51]
asciilifeform thing is still sold. [00:51]
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BingoBoingo femtocel [00:51]
asciilifeform [00:51]
assbot Samsung Network Extender (SCS-2U01)- Verizon Wireless ... ( ) [00:51]
asciilifeform i'm told there are equivalents for other american carriers [00:51]
BingoBoingo I think Comcast and a few cableco's do this for wifi [00:52]
BingoBoingo Major revenue source for mothership is selling the franchisees laptop cages, cooling, and FeNi batteries [00:55]
BingoBoingo Revenue source for franchisee is setting up machines, collecting rent, and selling good feels to the locals [00:56]
asciilifeform if the past 40 years of computer retardation hadn't happened, and we used a stack with support for seamless process migration, 'voting circuit' computation, etc. it would be practical to use '1024 chickens' arrays of arbitrarily garbage hardware [00:56]
asciilifeform as it is, there is a lower bound for what is worth bothering with at all. [00:56]
asciilifeform what, other than bitcoind, would you even consider putting on such a thing [00:57]
BingoBoingo Actually this idea was born from I have phree machine, want to appliance it up with Bitcoind, but making it a super public seeder on the home connection would be the suck. [00:58]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8974 @ 0.00039974 = 3.5873 BTC [-] {2} [00:58]
asciilifeform rent a cage at data center [00:58]
asciilifeform this costs money, so find 40 friends to split it with [00:58]
BingoBoingo Other maybe applications of such service though might be IRC bouncers and personal mail machines [00:58]
asciilifeform (typically they go by full rack) [00:58]
BingoBoingo Which is the beauty of this idea. Find folk who would sell fractional rackspace [00:59]
BingoBoingo AirBNB the datacenter [00:59]
asciilifeform fractional rack space with terrible hardware already exists [01:00]
asciilifeform i have a few boxes like this myself [01:00]
asciilifeform thing is, what you're actually paying for is proximity to respectable pipe [01:00]
asciilifeform this is not to be found in a residential unit, and certainly not in usa [01:01]
BingoBoingo And now we have the real crux of the problem. How to get chumps to subsidize serious pipe [01:01]
asciilifeform brings back to a fundamental point from one of mircea_popescu's articles - shuffling things around is not going to increase 'number of turkeys available' [01:01]
asciilifeform usa is a shit-internet country. this won't change because there is no good reason for it to change [01:02]
BingoBoingo More turkeys is a very hard problem. More chickens is much easier. [01:02]
asciilifeform laying cable to nowhere-duelingbajos-fucktown is not an economically +ev proposition. [01:03]
asciilifeform places which only even have telephones because usg imposed it [01:03]
asciilifeform desovietization will leave those folks where they belong - with highest tech level available being the hog harness [01:03]
asciilifeform (hell, possibly whole usa is candidate for this) [01:04]
BingoBoingo Mapsploring I am finding a disturbing number of duelingbajos-fucktowns which by all right ought to have datacenters advertising colospace based on cable locations and intersections. [01:04]
asciilifeform they probably have cable in cement vault [01:05]
BingoBoingo A number of these fucktowns even have major connection endpoints in the form of bezzelversities [01:05]
asciilifeform incidentally, just about every american town of any size has a version of this: the hollowed-out fortified walls of the old strowger-switch telco exchanges [01:06]
asciilifeform they are being filled up with 'dc on the cheap' [01:07]
BingoBoingo Prime candidate for such an operation is carbondale, Illinois. Lived there once. Oasis of connectivity in a desert. Major chicago-New Orleans pipe. Indianapolis pipe. St Louis pipe. Shithole Kentucky pipes. Many hippies who want to "buy local" [01:07]
asciilifeform but still largely empty, because in bezzleworld 'cheap' is a relative thing. [01:07]
asciilifeform but at no point does it make sense to emplace anything of any value whatsoever in mr. randomschmuck's house. [01:07]
BingoBoingo USG datacenters 10 miles away in Marion, IL off of the pipe path because prisons and FBU [01:07]
asciilifeform i will have no part in it. and i can't picture any sane person wanting a part in it. [01:08]
BingoBoingo Oh I never said house. I said shed. Shed goes on shitland, in town's once industrial district. Preferably a "superfund" site. [01:09]
asciilifeform what, again, would you pay actual money to host in such a place ? [01:09]
BingoBoingo to host three machines in different locals for the price of one machine in a big city datacenter [01:09]
asciilifeform and how does it beat the 20-30bux/mo an old pentium3 in data center costs? [01:09]
asciilifeform methinks we're speaking of a 'chinese backyard steel mill' situation here. [01:10]
asciilifeform !s backyard steel [01:10]
assbot 6 results for 'backyard steel' : [01:10]
BingoBoingo AH, in this region there is not such a deal I can drive to. A bring the box colo costs $70 USD for 1 rack unit [01:11]
BingoBoingo At half depth [01:11]
BingoBoingo I'm trying to think out a way to chump this down to $20 per box [01:12]
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asciilifeform BingoBoingo: that'd easily fit half a dozen of, e.g., these, [01:13]
assbot Logged on 12-06-2015 21:46:21; trinque: << looks great [01:13]
BingoBoingo It really would. Or what was that thing which clustered a bunch of opteron slices. [01:14]
* assbot gives voice to pete_dushenski [01:14]
pete_dushenski self-scoop : [01:15]
assbot Statelessness of fearlessness. | Contravex: A blog by Pete Dushenski ... ( ) [01:15]
BingoBoingo But the franchise model was suggested for a reason. When dealing with homo reddictus must put meatshield up to absorb derp. [01:15]
asciilifeform BingoBoingo: i'm just at a serious loss to picture how this wins. [01:15]
pete_dushenski cazalla: i'm seeing the comment. also, replied. [01:16]
assbot Epidemiology is hard to follow. | Contravex: A blog by Pete Dushenski ... ( ) [01:16]
pete_dushenski mircea_popescu: nice job ? y'know i'm taller than that guy ;) though i can see the similarity [01:17]
BingoBoingo asciilifeform: Who said it wins? I'm merely suggesting it could take in more dollars than expended. At the moment McDonalds is losing. [01:17]
pete_dushenski ben_vulpes: your blog has a header ! and it's a c-c-c-car !! [01:18]
asciilifeform pete_dushenski: 'Sorry, hun, doesn’t work like that. That was the Ambien you took.' << is this the new substitute for lsd ? [01:19]
asciilifeform what's it do, specifically ? [01:19]
asciilifeform feel like i heard of it before [01:20]
asciilifeform (tlp?) [01:20]
BingoBoingo Consider college towns. Local population of students who want a seedbox for torrents who can't on the campus network because of network restrictions on. Just need any box they can ftp into. [01:20]
pete_dushenski asciilifeform: indeed it's from tlp. and it's a sedative. [01:20]
BingoBoingo asciilifeform: Ambien makes one trip balls if you stay awake instead of sleeping [01:20]
pete_dushenski ambien "It is a short-acting nonbenzodiazepine hypnotic of the imidazopyridine class[3] that potentiates GABA, an inhibitory neurotransmitter, by binding to GABAA receptors at the same location as benzodiazepines.[4] It works quickly, usually within 15 minutes, and has a short half-life of two to three hours." [01:21]
BingoBoingo Less LSD alternative and more "robotrip" alternative [01:21]
asciilifeform so ghb-like mechanism ? [01:21]
asciilifeform robotrip ? [01:22]
BingoBoingo ghb like, if GHB were ken shamrock and Ambien Kimbo Slice [01:22]
* asciilifeform is very much out of date on dope trivia [01:22]
pete_dushenski robotrip sounds like robocop come back from the dead as a walking zombie [01:23]
BingoBoingo asciilifeform: You've never had a whole bottle of dextromorphan only cough syrup and communed with your toilet bowl contemplating "All" [01:23]
* asciilifeform will catch up on dope when he is finally confined to the психушка [01:23]
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asciilifeform pete_dushenski still awake ? [01:25]
asciilifeform pete_dushenski ought to write a piece on the uprising at treblinka. [01:25]
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asciilifeform (specifically) [01:25]
pete_dushenski hm. can't say i know much about it. [01:25]
asciilifeform ^ this re: the quoted thread with spandrell [01:25]
pete_dushenski asciilifeform: have some source material handy ? [01:25]
asciilifeform re 'wives & children' [01:25]
pete_dushenski aha. [01:25]
asciilifeform what languages does pete_dushenski have a command of ? [01:26]
* BingoBoingo was prescribed Ambien to sleep in Undergrad. Made the mistake of taking before getting last cigarette of the evening. Ambien can trigger some odd things. [01:26]
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pete_dushenski asciilifeform: for translation purposes : french and spanish. the romanian bits i do, awful as they are, are only because mp authored them. [01:27]
BingoBoingo Also... get ready for more bearded ladies (female facial hair is most notorious metformin side effect) [01:28]
assbot Aging As a Disease. In the Pipeline: ... ( ) [01:28]
asciilifeform pete_dushenski: my recollection (ru sources) is that treblinka was the site of one of the very few uprisings on account of the participants in said uprising having already lost their women [01:28]
pete_dushenski BingoBoingo: what 'odd things' did ambien trigger for you ? [01:28]
pete_dushenski asciilifeform: ah yes, this rings a bell now. probably from the logs. [01:28]
pete_dushenski !s treblinka [01:29]
assbot 4 results for 'treblinka' : [01:29]
BingoBoingo pete_dushenski: Mostly it triggered some interesting visual things and a profound compromise in judgement equivalent to a fifth of bourbon, but without the other tell tale warnings actual booze would offer. [01:29]
asciilifeform 'At Treblinka, an underground organization plotted an armed rebellion and mass escape. Learning about the Warsaw ghetto revolt from the last transports of Jews brought to Treblinka from Warsaw, the organizers decided the moment for revolt had arrived. On August 2, 1943, the underground fighters put their plan into action: to steal arms from the warehouse; eliminate the German and Ukrainian guards on duty; set the camp on fire; [01:30]
asciilifeform destroy the extermination area; and, then help the remaining prisoners escape to the forest. Many were killed during the rebellion, including all the resistance leaders, as the flames and reports of the revolt brought German reinforcements from all directions. But as many as 200 prisoners escaped to the neighboring forest, and perhaps twenty of those men survived German efforts to recapture them.' [01:30]
asciilifeform ^ engl. summary [01:30]
BingoBoingo If in bed immediately after ambien... much sleep. Problem is I developed tolerance to the stuff rapidly. [01:31]
pete_dushenski << firsthand account of one of said 200 escapees. [01:32]
assbot Uprising in Treblinka ... ( ) [01:32]
pete_dushenski written in 1945 and presented before us congress. [01:32]
asciilifeform does it mention the interesting detail re: the women ? [01:32]
BingoBoingo pete_dushenski: I'm probably missing some nuances because... a decade ago [01:33]
trinque I had a roommate who would sleepwalk on ambien [01:36]
trinque started talking to me about the rollercoaster theme park he was at one night [01:36]
trinque and other hilarious nonsense [01:36]
pete_dushenski asciilifeform: just scanned it. account describes particular atrocities against women and babies, but doesn't specifically state that 700 "workers" who staged coup were mostly or entirely men. [01:37]
pete_dushenski BingoBoingo: alcohol sounds more fun. [01:37]
BingoBoingo pete_dushenski: It is [01:38]
BingoBoingo trinque: The cognitive impairment if I remember correctly is at least equivalent to 750ml of 80 proof liquor [01:38]
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asciilifeform pete_dushenski: that they were men is no surprise of any kind. but the detail i recall was that they were men who either had no wife, no sister, in the camp (or knew that these were safely dead) [01:38]
trinque BingoBoingo: yeah I took some for the hell of it [01:39]
trinque felt disoriented, confused, but nothing worth repeating [01:39]
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BingoBoingo A couple years later I was at a conference I wanted to nope the fuck out of, had one left in my grooming package. Challenged the up escalator and lost. Thankfully my (actual) sherpa kept me from falling in the Chicago river [01:40]
asciilifeform pete_dushenski: spandrell's 'we should stop and think what makes bold people bold, and what patterns are common to people who can fight back' is reasonable observation [01:42]
pete_dushenski asciilifeform: seems like a tricky and rather specific detail to unearth about treblinka. may be apocryphal ? [01:42]
asciilifeform pete_dushenski: may be. [01:42]
pete_dushenski asciilifeform: also ties into mp's "married men should stfu" piece [01:43]
pete_dushenski though most don't need to be told this, as spandrell points out. [01:43]
asciilifeform pete_dushenski: re: spandrell and courage: think about the soviet propagandists' exhortation to 'go kill a german with your bare hands.' was it this that won the war? or also other things, like supply lines from factories set up in open air past urals, etc. ? [01:43]
asciilifeform bare courage gives you: zulu. [01:44]
asciilifeform charging british 'maxim' [01:44]
asciilifeform (there were occasions where zulu - won! but notice we have a britain today, shrivelled cock and all, but still on the map; but no zulu) [01:44]
pete_dushenski well, strategy's a thing. [01:45]
pete_dushenski courage doesn't mean kamikaze in a port-a-potee [01:46]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu might disagree [01:46]
pete_dushenski perhaps. [01:46]
asciilifeform if saturday's thread is anything to go on [01:46]
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pete_dushenski ok so courage is necessary but not sufficient [01:47]
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pete_dushenski it's *all* the zulu had [01:47]
funkenstein_ there may be things in the world not on your map [01:47]
pete_dushenski there most certainly are. [01:48]
funkenstein_ as someone who spend fathers day cleaning shit off lightbulbs, i look forward to the opportunity to disprove the thesis [01:48]
asciilifeform if funkenstein_ has a secret map pointing out a kingdom of nuke-wielding zulu, he oughta share. [01:48]
pete_dushenski lmao [01:48]
funkenstein_ they show up in gibson's cyberspace don't they [01:49]
* asciilifeform wonders how shit might end up on a light bulb [01:49]
asciilifeform own a pet hippo ? [01:49]
pete_dushenski funkenstein_: this'd be the thesis that family men have too much to lose to wage war ? [01:49]
funkenstein_ that's the one [01:49]
funkenstein_ compare e.g. mao and kai-shek [01:50]
funkenstein_ at least from the histories i have read [01:50]
funkenstein_ kai-shek had son captured by russians, was incapacitated [01:50]
funkenstein_ mao, didn't give a flying fuck about kids [01:50]
asciilifeform famously, fate of stalin's son [01:51]
pete_dushenski funkenstein_: i suspect that a healthy chunk of b,tmsr~ is equally prepared to prove this wrong. [01:51]
pete_dushenski the digital domain being quite a different landscape from the concentration camps, i suspect it's entirely possible. [01:51]
pete_dushenski like the deficits that we can run, no one else can do. [01:51]
asciilifeform i never grokked that part [01:52]
asciilifeform by same argument, e.g., linux, has been running a far bigger 'deficit,' longer [01:52]
pete_dushenski difference between voluntary and coerced taxation model is my understanding. [01:52]
asciilifeform (are we simply mentally tallying unpaid specialist labour?) [01:52]
asciilifeform who was coercively taxed to write linux kernel ? [01:53]
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pete_dushenski we're mentally tallying 'the state's' revenues vs. expenses [01:54]
pete_dushenski revenues are decentalised and therefore 'off the book' [01:54]
pete_dushenski expenses are 'for the greater good' and 'on the book' [01:55]
asciilifeform just pointing out that herr torvalds could run the same kind of calculation, and end up with similarly fantastic numbers [01:55]
asciilifeform of how many armadas could have been bought with the money he never had to pay [01:55]
asciilifeform obligatory >> << [01:56]
assbot Re: realistic but short and simple LISP examples? - Naggum cll archive ... ( ) [01:56]
funkenstein_ time to reveal my complete ignorance of lisp [01:56]
asciilifeform funkenstein_: read link. not actually about lisp [01:56]
pete_dushenski asciilifeform: torvalds might do just that if he saw the value of such a calculation and understood the implications [01:57]
funkenstein_ ah, you are on topic :) [01:57]
asciilifeform colour me thick, but i still don't feel like i have a grasp of the implications. [01:57]
funkenstein_ he feels "tricked" to "give away work"? [01:59]
pete_dushenski well you're far from thick and not all that coloured, but the implication is that for an organisation as ambitious as this one, our enemies have their work cut out for them. [01:59]
asciilifeform digging up an old thread: [01:59]
assbot Logged on 18-02-2015 16:36:33; mircea_popescu: it's not so much a "i want those guys back" as it is "i want the situaiton where being 20 and into computers was more distinctive than any other thing - and you could spot a govt mole from a mile away" [01:59]
asciilifeform ever wonder how this went away ? [02:00]
asciilifeform the original generation of 'computers are interesting and we know basic maths, etc' grew old, mostly did not die yet except in ben franklin's sense of 'most people die at 25 but buried at 75' [02:00]
pete_dushenski asciilifeform: i dunno torvalds well, but he doesn't seem to have 1/10 mircea_popescu's ambition [02:00]
pete_dushenski as such, torvalds won't direct his unpaid armadas towards anything like the targets and projects that mp will. [02:01]
asciilifeform but they went into the meatgrinder described in linked naggum piece. [02:01]
ben_vulpes asciilifeform: my nodes are actually failing to connect to either IP [02:02]
asciilifeform ben_vulpes: mine connect 100% [02:02]
asciilifeform anyone else having same experience as ben_vulpes ? [02:02]
funkenstein_ doing useful work is hardly a meatgrinder [02:02]
ben_vulpes i must be cocking this up in some novel way [02:02]
asciilifeform funkenstein_: read the naggum piece again. [02:02]
asciilifeform esp. the part re: 'is a surplus phenomenon' [02:03]
funkenstein_ i'm not hugely impressed by his analysis [02:05]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 46500 @ 0.00039824 = 18.5182 BTC [-] {4} [02:06]
asciilifeform funkenstein_: would you be willing to share, roughly, how old you are ? [02:06]
funkenstein_ this might apply to say, nethack coding [02:06]
funkenstein_ but some things do have needs they address [02:06]
funkenstein_ probably older than you, just not wiser [02:07]
funkenstein_ due to various factors you may have already surmised [02:07]
asciilifeform funkenstein_: so you oughta be well-equipped to understand the observation re: 'it costs a hell of a lot to live' [02:07]
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funkenstein_ ok i don't know norway.. but i think that needs a bit of sussing out [02:08]
funkenstein_ he does mention "advanced society¨.. [02:09]
asciilifeform norway was considerably more expensive for naggum than for just about anyone [02:09]
asciilifeform on account of how he ended up - literally - taxed to death [02:09]
funkenstein_ ok that context does help thanks [02:10]
asciilifeform (short version: he decided that he could easily live off the consulting pay from working a few months / year. no. gov. decided that he must be secretly working the remainder of the year, and demanded tax, which he could not afford to pay. was driven into penury and died of self-neglect from easily treatable diseases) [02:10]
funkenstein_ it is an often discussed irony that technology decreases leisure time [02:11]
asciilifeform but overall he was, i think, referring to the more prosaic fact that it costs a hell of a lot to ~not live like a 17 y.o. shit~ [02:11]
asciilifeform that is, having four walls to sit in without strangers sharing the space, to eat real food, to sometimes visit doctors, etc [02:11]
asciilifeform this is even aside from the expensive things folks sometimes ~choose~ to do when they grow older, like producing children, etc [02:12]
pete_dushenski children, traveling, cars, hobbies... [02:12]
pete_dushenski it adds up quickly. [02:13]
asciilifeform there are other 'costs' that aren't precisely monetary, like the fact that you can't do the 20 years where you became a serious specialist in something - over again [02:13]
funkenstein_ the travel one rings true. [02:13]
pete_dushenski ah yes, 'opportunity costs' [02:13]
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funkenstein_ damn in norway? that is surprising, from what i hear of social system there [02:15]
funkenstein_ anyway, the irony is that he is.. while complaining about it.. donating his time to write the piece [02:15]
funkenstein_ for us to discuss here now [02:16]
asciilifeform funkenstein_: a usenet post (or, for that matter, me speaking here) is more like a fart [02:16]
asciilifeform than 'donated time' [02:16]
asciilifeform it doesn't soak up concentration of the kind that is a serious limited resource in a thinking person's day [02:16]
funkenstein_ useful work [02:16]
funkenstein_ you can't be serious [02:17]
asciilifeform next time you're hungry, try eating this 'useful work' [02:17]
funkenstein_ i'm sure you dream IRC [02:17]
funkenstein_ I'll stick with oats and water [02:18]
funkenstein_ I had a dream, something happenend in channel, and you or someone said "six months! right on schedule" [02:18]
asciilifeform wasn't me [02:19]
funkenstein_ hehe [02:19]
* asciilifeform doesn't recall doing the 'six months' thing personally, either [02:19]
funkenstein_ so it's a thing? [02:19]
funkenstein_ i mean, past the excellent Yeshiva post [02:20]
asciilifeform it was a maxim made up by either mircea_popescu or pete_dushenski (forgot who) [02:20]
asciilifeform whereby a n00b 'must read log for 6 mo' before he can make any sense [02:20]
funkenstein_ :D [02:20]
funkenstein_ maybe that's what it was [02:20]
* asciilifeform is still not certain that he 'makes sense' even today [02:20]
funkenstein_ lol [02:20]
* asciilifeform off to bed [02:20]
funkenstein_ sleep well [02:21]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 39200 @ 0.00039511 = 15.4883 BTC [-] {2} [02:21]
pete_dushenski obligatory : [02:21]
assbot IRC Yeshiva | Contravex: A blog by Pete Dushenski ... ( ) [02:21]
pete_dushenski where have the last 15 months gone ? [02:21]
funkenstein_ maybe we will later complain, we were immature to give away our time? I don't think so. [02:23]
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pete_dushenski i've personally taken a lot more than i've given, at least intellectually. [02:25]
pete_dushenski for that, i've received a hell of a deal. [02:25]
pete_dushenski i couldn't imagine having spent the last year and a bit more productively, even if, yes, it wasn't free. but what of value is ? [02:27]
funkenstein_ the whole shebang maybe? [02:29]
pete_dushenski ? [02:29]
funkenstein_ hawking said, the universe is the ultimate free lunch [02:30]
funkenstein_ i think this whole cost analysis thing only makes sense to do in a specified context [02:30]
pete_dushenski bbl. [02:30]
funkenstein_ which is part of the problem with the naggum piece as well [02:31]
funkenstein_ cheers [02:31]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 69450 @ 0.0003901 = 27.0924 BTC [-] {2} [02:44]
cazalla pete_dushenski, no auto approve for second comment onwards? [02:51]
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cazalla today is the winter solstice and gee it is fucking cold [03:01]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 49900 @ 0.00040915 = 20.4166 BTC [+] {2} [03:04]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform: i dunno torvalds well, but he doesn't seem to have 1/10 mircea_popescu's ambition << eh let's not exagerate, guy's been dealing with linux for two decades. [03:04]
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mircea_popescu "more efficient use of physical memory. All processes share the same physical pages for the code in the DSOs. With prelinking startup times for dynamically linked code is as good as that of statically linked code." [03:07]
mircea_popescu retard put thios right after his two "security" "killer arguments" ? [03:08]
mircea_popescu so what's the idea, "using the bus instead of owning a car is a killer security feature, because a) if someone wants to piss in your seat they don't know which seat you will take (you're of course still open to sitting in a pool of urine that nobody intended for you particularly) and if the ny dept of idiocy decides to make the seats smaller and affix dongs, you get smaller seats and a dong up your ass the next day, no [03:09]
mircea_popescu need to go buy a new car" [03:09]
mircea_popescu at least they're brave. [03:09]
mircea_popescu << somewhat lulzy. [03:12]
assbot Linux Hater's Blog: A tribute ... ( ) [03:12]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform "Ab 1996 arbeitete er für die Firma Cygnus Solutions. Von 1999 bis September 2010 war er dann Mitarbeiter des Linux-Distributors Red Hat. Seit Oktober 2010 arbeitet er für Goldman Sachs." [03:13]
mircea_popescu see, why can't you be more like lloyd brown. [03:13]
mircea_popescu also lol [03:16]
assbot Munich, Germany realizes that deploying Linux was a disaster, going back to Windows ... ( ) [03:16]
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ben_vulpes ;;later tell asciilifeform can't find my fat-fingering, but my node running your patch *does* connect to lfnet. it does not, however, obtain a connection to another node thereby. [03:17]
gribble The operation succeeded. [03:17]
* ben_vulpes is loath to apply wireshark to this [03:18]
mircea_popescu you will have to somehow answer the question of "does it try to send" [03:19]
ben_vulpes ahaha [03:20]
ben_vulpes well first off there are no clients in the bitcoinchannels [03:20]
cazalla <<< try 3 bottles :P [03:21]
assbot Logged on 22-06-2015 04:19:47; BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: You've never had a whole bottle of dextromorphan only cough syrup and communed with your toilet bowl contemplating "All" [03:21]
mircea_popescu ben_vulpes 01 to 99 ? [03:22]
BingoBoingo cazalla: My CYP450 2D6 is too fast to try that. Converts it to its worst form too fast for a hellish peak (/me kinda also regrets spitting in a tube so USG could profile my dna to discover this) [03:23]
ben_vulpes #bitcoin01,02,03,05,05,10,20,25,30,35,22 [03:25]
cazalla so what's that do, hasten the effects or increase them as well? [03:25]
ben_vulpes confirmed that my node is actually connecting by hardcoding its connection room [03:25]
ben_vulpes i fear there are either no ungavinized nodes out there, or they're allr unning with no irc connectino [03:26]
BingoBoingo cazalla: It hastens turining drug into more extreme version of the drug. [03:26]
cazalla dxmo from memory [03:26]
ben_vulpes i was going to script this, but a visual inspection seems to indicate no nodes on the irc. [03:26]
BingoBoingo Which mean sure, you can trip balls, but the toilet is getting hugged the whole time [03:26]
cazalla SWIM many years ago turned to research chems instead of cough syrup [03:27]
mircea_popescu ben_vulpes now im curious. [03:28]
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ben_vulpes i tried this with both the IP addr for lfnet in the satoshi codebase and also the ip addr provided when loking up [03:29]
ben_vulpes mircea_popescu: lemme know if i can answer anything for ya [03:29]
ben_vulpes i'm appropriately burnt out on self-mgmt on this task for today, but can still turn cranks [03:30]
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ben_vulpes BingoBoingo: it's okay, the toilet needs it. [03:30]
ben_vulpes in other news, i named the car. [03:30]
ben_vulpes "stella", for a favorite kids book "stella luna", because the car is a batmobile. [03:31]
ben_vulpes !up mius [03:31]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 48149 @ 0.00041294 = 19.8826 BTC [+] {2} [03:31]
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ben_vulpes << can only be resolved on a case-by-case basis, not ever at a larger scale i don't think. [03:37]
assbot Logged on 09-06-2015 16:53:02; mircea_popescu: ascii_field the problem of child-herding, so far unresolved, is that women care too much and men don't understand wtf is in the box. [03:37]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 49850 @ 0.00040663 = 20.2705 BTC [-] [03:38]
mircea_popescu ben_vulpes yep, its dead. [03:39]
mircea_popescu plenty of dogecoin chans with 1 user, two full chans of namecoin, 180 users, and otherwise an endless parade of scamcoins omfg, i never heard of most of 'em. [03:40]
mircea_popescu and by "it's dead" i mostly mean lfnet. nothing there. [03:40]
ben_vulpes evening, hanbot. [03:41]
ben_vulpes mwell i'm pooped. [03:42]
ben_vulpes (i had an icecream today - thought of the various ice creams in bsas) [03:42]
BingoBoingo hanbot: Great piece on the Texas drama, congrats. [03:43]
mircea_popescu ben_vulpes productive day [03:44]
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mircea_popescu << let's not get into which power rangers missed 5 btc because there's not poop on their magic markers. [03:45]
assbot Logged on 22-06-2015 03:01:25; BingoBoingo: "AntPool just missed out on 4.644BTC/$1128USD worth of transaction fees because they weren't mining with full-RBF" [03:45]
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mircea_popescu << you will note miners can do this NOW if they feel like it. there's exactly zero need for peter todd or anyone else to be involved. [03:46]
assbot Logged on 22-06-2015 03:03:11; ben_vulpes: broadcast a transaction with a higher fee, miners will include it preferentially to a previous transaction with the same inputs [03:46]
mircea_popescu some do, most don't, principally because it ain't worth the hassle. [03:46]
mircea_popescu more gargle about the pies in the skies of our imaginary homeworld. [03:46]
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pete_dushenski cazalla: your most recent contravex comment did auto-approve. not sure why it might've appeared otherwise on your end. [03:47]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 47000 @ 0.00040336 = 18.9579 BTC [-] [03:47]
mircea_popescu << it's a more complicated problem than it seems to be (mostly because of the short timeframe involved and the layered nature of the mempool) and the miners are more technologically inept than one'd expect. [03:48]
assbot Logged on 22-06-2015 03:05:35; *: asciilifeform sorta assumed that miners already optimize for snarfing up max fee [03:48]
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ben_vulpes i'm off. [03:49]
mircea_popescu sleep well. [03:49]
ben_vulpes harder every night but thanks [03:50]
mircea_popescu << this sounds a lot more professionally qualified than is the case. more like "i invented a novel inovative user-friendly streamlined buzzword-buzzword way to pick up aples : by their tail. can i has consulting gig ? watch my presentation on toilet paper theory." [03:52]
assbot Logged on 22-06-2015 03:07:57; asciilifeform: i can picture the minutes. 'hitler: you know, miners are using own versions of bitcoin and don't particular feel like backporting their necessary mods to yours. hearn: so let's do the work for them. gavin: fine idea' [03:52]
mircea_popescu academia sort of stuff. [03:52]
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mircea_popescu << what's so wrong with recycling ? [03:55]
assbot Logged on 22-06-2015 03:31:44; asciilifeform: (not because valuable, but because copper scavengers need to be publicly flayed rather than encouraged) [03:55]
mircea_popescu it's what bacteria does for us! [03:55]
mircea_popescu << yes without anyone noticing. plants do it all the time. so do ants. so does water. trivial to design a bot that breaks up cement at the rate of a foot a year. [03:56]
assbot Logged on 22-06-2015 03:35:14; asciilifeform: (it is possible to break up cement, but not without anyone noticing. this is the basic principle for the nuke test-ban compliance gadget used on both sides of the ocean) [03:56]
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mircea_popescu << how do you even tell how tall he is ? by comparing with the pins ? [04:02]
assbot Logged on 22-06-2015 04:13:34; pete_dushenski: mircea_popescu: nice job ? y'know i'm taller than that guy ;) though i can see the similarity [04:02]
pete_dushenski proportions with surroudings, sure, including pins. [04:03]
pete_dushenski surroundings* [04:03]
pete_dushenski i'm guessing he's 5'10" - 5'11" [04:04]
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pete_dushenski << fiat court tries to deal with fallout of btcjam scamming [04:05]
assbot Judge Rules in Peer-to-Peer Bitcoin Lending Lawsuit ... ( ) [04:05]
pete_dushenski !s btcjam [04:05]
assbot 139 results for 'btcjam' : [04:05]
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mircea_popescu "You can predict the level of violence in an area just by looking at alcohol sales." << worst stupid ever. [04:08]
mircea_popescu this is in fact a straight revival of 1880s us missionary cant. [04:08]
mircea_popescu they were engaged in a political battle, at hte time, because they didn't like that the men, congregating in bars, decided elections. [04:08]
mircea_popescu they wanted the women, congregating in churches, to decide elections instead. [04:09]
mircea_popescu because they just so happened to have 0% survival changes in a bar, and ran churches. [04:09]
mircea_popescu pretty much every failure of the us post gilded age can be traced to the losing of that battle. and no, giving women the vote was not a bad idea. great idea. but they should have burned the missionaries on a stake. [04:10]
mircea_popescu "Have a daughter, not a son." << heh, mmmmkay. [04:11]
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* pete_dushenski just imagines white collar couple with bundle of female joy in tow citing such 'science' 'proving' the wisdom of their 'decision' [04:16]
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mircea_popescu << riiight. maybe also figure out the patterns that make one go to heaven. go through the motions of being happy. play the harmonica, badly. [04:18]
assbot Logged on 22-06-2015 04:38:11; asciilifeform: pete_dushenski: spandrell's 'we should stop and think what makes bold people bold, and what patterns are common to people who can fight back' is reasonable observation [04:18]
pete_dushenski << because parts are increasing in price ? i'm not seeing this with the w126. too many of them were produced, too many still on the road. parts are monumentally cheap. [04:18]
assbot Logged on 22-06-2015 02:41:52; asciilifeform: incidentally, anyone who owns old cars and frequents mechanics would have to be blind to suggest that usd is not palpably inflating [04:18]
mircea_popescu if this pattern bullshit worked we wouldn't be stuck here with glibc. and that goes exactly to pete_dushenski "wisdom of decisions" thing above too [04:19]
mircea_popescu << it was the bare hands thing that won the war. [04:20]
assbot Logged on 22-06-2015 04:40:08; asciilifeform: pete_dushenski: re: spandrell and courage: think about the soviet propagandists' exhortation to 'go kill a german with your bare hands.' was it this that won the war? or also other things, like supply lines from factories set up in open air past urals, etc. ? [04:20]
mircea_popescu what supply lines, are you fucking kidding me ? the orcs fought the war in borrowed pants. [04:20]
pete_dushenski and rakes iirc [04:20]
pete_dushenski not *in* rakes, with. [04:20]
mircea_popescu << ask any of the women that either travel to zululand to be raped or out of there for lack of enthusiasm for the activity. [04:21]
assbot Logged on 22-06-2015 04:41:08; asciilifeform: (there were occasions where zulu - won! but notice we have a britain today, shrivelled cock and all, but still on the map; but no zulu) [04:21]
mircea_popescu last i know nobody visits london for they currently alive there. [04:21]
* pete_dushenski doesn't know why 'borrowed pants' is such a funny visual image. [04:21]
mircea_popescu it is, isn't it ? :D [04:21]
pete_dushenski lol yup ! [04:21]
pete_dushenski speaking of nothing, i've already dodged two of the four 'wedding bullets' between c4 and i. two scheduled for september already. [04:22]
mircea_popescu now make them name the kids "Seven" [04:23]
mircea_popescu << linux has no money. [04:24]
assbot Logged on 22-06-2015 04:48:44; asciilifeform: by same argument, e.g., linux, has been running a far bigger 'deficit,' longer [04:24]
mircea_popescu now that we're here, the argument can be brought. before, no. [04:24]
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mircea_popescu << wait, you're actually discovering anything in the irc ? [04:29]
assbot Logged on 22-06-2015 04:58:26; asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: mine connect 100% [04:29]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 43100 @ 0.00040336 = 17.3848 BTC [-] [04:31]
pete_dushenski early morning ahead. bon soir ! [04:31]
mircea_popescu << mno. "that is, that once one agrees with the braindamaged pretense that 'end to violence', he is forced to hypocritically reintroduce violence in a very complex form, which reduces to the bezzle, or in carlin's words, 'everyone's quest to stick it to the other guy faster and deeper'. and so he accepts your 50x inflated carrots because he wants to sell you 67x in [04:31]
mircea_popescu flated carrot cake. [04:31]
assbot Logged on 22-06-2015 05:08:06; asciilifeform: that is, having four walls to sit in without strangers sharing the space, to eat real food, to sometimes visit doctors, etc [04:31]
mircea_popescu naggum could not keep up WITH THIS. with the threadmill of sublimated violence that is the bezzle. [04:31]
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mircea_popescu he was an idiot for not understanding he is going into it, and for not acting accordingly, but most of all for misrepresenting the sordid state of affairs as a) civilised and b) a fact of life. [04:32]
mircea_popescu it is neither. it is the unseemly result of delusion shared by idiots. [04:32]
mircea_popescu you have no business sitting at the poker table unless you intend to bluff, and you have no business living in norway unless you have a clear scam to apply to the government in mind. [04:33]
mircea_popescu otherwise, they WILL scam you more than you scam them, and you end up with a hole in your gut. one should not visit the anthill unless one's either an anteater or equipped as one. [04:34]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform "After Chorazycki's death our plan had to be postponed for several months because we had no qualified leader, and none of us wanted to take moral responsibility for an unsuccessful coup." << ye see ? what more dja want ? [04:56]
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punkman [04:57]
assbot ... ( ) [04:57]
mircea_popescu these abject nobodies, everything they thought they knew having not merely failed, but having been well proven to have failed beyond the shadowest shadow of a doubt, [04:57]
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mircea_popescu still exhibit vanity, in a laughable degree hard to put into words. worms, whose lives consist of being generally too low to piss on, think of their "moral responsibility". [04:57]
mircea_popescu what more's needed ? broken in the fucking head, these people. [04:57]
mircea_popescu what moral responsibility ? to whom, to what ? [04:58]
mircea_popescu punkman i never saw that one. [04:59]
punkman that cover is probably the best thing about it [05:01]
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punkman [05:06]
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cazalla <<< mebe cache issue, who knows [05:11]
assbot Logged on 22-06-2015 06:43:53; pete_dushenski: cazalla: your most recent contravex comment did auto-approve. not sure why it might've appeared otherwise on your end. [05:11]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 42099 @ 0.00038916 = 16.3832 BTC [-] {2} [05:48]
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cazalla looks like sexy saffron is doing ok for herself [06:12]
assbot Iama Pornographer who just hit 10 MILLION views on Pornhub! :) : IAmA ... ( ) [06:12]
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mircea_popescu wonder how much 10mn views is actually worth [06:15]
mircea_popescu i suspect under 1k. [06:15]
cazalla well she claims she and her partner are making more doing porn than their old jobs [06:17]
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punkman "If you record yourselves getting sexy whilst watching a video of yourselves getting it on while you are also watching a video of yourselves getting jiggy, then you can call it Cum-ception for the slam dunk of porn pun movies." [06:18]
cazalla i imagine the tube sites are just a means to funnel people to their pay sites but 10 million views sounds better to the reddit crowd [06:18]
punkman $500 if 5 cents per 1k views, and that's probably high for porn traffic [06:20]
punkman maybe their paid stuff converts well though [06:21]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 28125 @ 0.00039712 = 11.169 BTC [+] [06:22]
cazalla to think indiancandy could've accumulated a similar amount of views if she only didn't piss around paying people to promote her instagram and got her clothes off willingly [06:25]
mircea_popescu i recall paying 5cents per 1k. in 1998. [06:29]
mircea_popescu shitty tube traffic ? i dunno that you could sell it at any price, a decade ago. [06:30]
mircea_popescu cazalla saffron does have enthusiasm going for her, im sure she's doing ok. [06:30]
mircea_popescu and i believe she;s making better money off sexual enthusiasm than off whatever pink collar career. but NOT because 10 trillion clicks. [06:31]
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cazalla meh i won't begrudge her for 10m views, prob far more than some mainstream pros get these days [06:34]
* Now talking on #bitcoin-assets [15:34]
* Topic for #bitcoin-assets is: || || || [15:34]
* Topic for #bitcoin-assets set by kakobrekla!~kako@unaffiliated/kakobrekla at Wed Mar 5 16:58:12 2014 [15:34]
-assbot- Welcome to #bitcoin-assets. To get voice (ie, to be able to speak), send me "!up" in a private message to get an OTP. You must have a sufficient WoT rating. If you do not have a WoT account or sufficient rating, try politely asking one of the voiced people for a temporary voice. [15:34]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 67644 @ 0.00042028 = 28.4294 BTC [+] [15:39]
mircea_popescu << that's fo sho. [15:41]
assbot Logged on 22-06-2015 09:30:38; cazalla: meh i won't begrudge her for 10m views, prob far more than some mainstream pros get these days [15:41]
mircea_popescu mostly on account of their "pros" consisting of NOT being sexually enthusiastic, and imagining that they can substitute self importance for it. [15:41]
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asciilifeform !up ascii_field [15:51]
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ascii_field in other 'news', it's been what, ~7 years, and libpng thing is ~still~ biting [15:51]
ascii_field ~someone~ was responsible for that. [15:51]
mircea_popescu heh [15:53]
mircea_popescu << she's as ugly as a pack of stray dogs. [16:03]
assbot Logged on 22-06-2015 10:57:50; shinohai: With Bonus Pearl Necklace: [16:03]
mircea_popescu << when ? got any logs of anything ? [16:04]
assbot Logged on 22-06-2015 13:54:22; asciilifeform: this worked earlier [16:04]
mircea_popescu they seem utterly dead. [16:04]
mircea_popescu << perpetually. [16:05]
assbot Logged on 22-06-2015 13:55:47; asciilifeform: anyone notice if gavingang sent out 'alerts' recently ? [16:05]
mircea_popescu 2) optionally, irc box << i don't see that we need it. irc is dead, it was stupid to begin with, time to put it to sleep. [16:05]
ascii_field it was begging for bullet for years [16:06]
mircea_popescu (peer over irc acquisition never worked worth a shit - the reason it was moved off freenode for instance is that it needed a special ircd to have even a vague chance) [16:06]
ascii_field what's special in that one [16:06]
mircea_popescu but i am very much perturbed by your proposition that it worked until recently. to what degree worked ? [16:06]
ascii_field i'm not seeing any oddities [16:06]
mircea_popescu can you say, count all the peers you ever got off irc ? [16:06]
ascii_field mircea_popescu: i got peers from it [16:06]
ascii_field ever since i've snipped out the gavindns seeds & the hardcoded seeds from my own tree [16:07]
mircea_popescu did you actually do a full sync that was throughout dependent on irc as sole primary peer source ? [16:07]
ascii_field one full sync and several partial (into the high 200k's) [16:07]
mircea_popescu ascii_field iirc the problem was something about how /who flooded the client. so they made a limit so it only shows 100 entries [16:08]
ascii_field (terminated through no fault of their own, simply because wanted to start from scratch when testing patches) [16:08]
mircea_popescu but then botched it and it always showed the same 100 [16:08]
mircea_popescu which then flooded the clients in question so they stopped working [16:08]
ascii_field l0l! [16:08]
mircea_popescu ikr? [16:08]
ascii_field this almost certainly stopped being a problem ages ago [16:08]
ascii_field as the thing (mostly) died [16:08]
mircea_popescu aha. [16:08]
mircea_popescu still, special. [16:08]
ascii_field so irc on butcher block? [16:09]
mircea_popescu can you discern from whence you sit if the following is a possible explanation : you got now and again (rarely) a peer, which gave you its lists of peers, which is how you actually synced. [16:09]
mircea_popescu irc on butcher block. [16:09]
ascii_field well of course that's how i synced [16:09]
* ascii_field whets knife [16:10]
mircea_popescu so maybe the "doesn't work" vs "worked 3 days ago" is simply that you ran yours for a day and ben_vulpes ran his for fifteen minutes. [16:10]
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ascii_field quite possibly. [16:10]
ascii_field i will remind readers that 'irc on butcher block' means a 100% reliance on seeds we enter in config. and also on specifying node's external ipv4. [16:10]
mircea_popescu aye. [16:11]
ascii_field which is, i suppose, as it should be. but means that: we need seeds. [16:11]
mircea_popescu i will provide no less than three, on physically separate machines, provided this can actually be made to work. which depends on excellent documentation. [16:11]
ascii_field mircea_popescu: do you presently have a system where the thing builds ? [16:12]
mircea_popescu i've not presently seen a package. [16:12]
mircea_popescu the targed is something like what was done for eulora. [16:12]
mircea_popescu ie, [16:13]
assbot Installing Eulora - Eulorum ... ( ) [16:13]
mircea_popescu but! if you're willing to go into the grease, s.nsa server can be the first of those three. [16:13]
ascii_field probably ought to be. [16:14]
mircea_popescu well if you get it to run, identical instances can be spun up, so. there is that. [16:15]
ascii_field will build it there as soon as the last round of amputation, referenced earlier, is complete [16:15]
ascii_field and the result posted to ml [16:16]
mircea_popescu alrightythen [16:16]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11800 @ 0.00042231 = 4.9833 BTC [+] [16:19]
mircea_popescu aannnd speaking of eulora, lol [16:21]
assbot Foxy's Useful Items [16:21]
* assbot removes voice from ascii_field [16:21]
mircea_popescu <<< i was discussing the 38-43ish period. [16:22]
assbot Logged on 22-06-2015 14:05:29; asciilifeform: << i find it smashingly hilarious that everyone today seems to still be buying that particular bit of wartime engineered psychosis. the 'fighting without pants, one rifle for three men' thing 100% lines up with the '41-'42 period when su was having the shit kicked out of it. [16:22]
mircea_popescu yes, by 44 they were doing okay, as far as everyone in europe was doing ok after five years of war. [16:23]
mircea_popescu and yes by 1955ish they were almost on par with the post-war us, on accounts of not being saddled with the baby bloomers. [16:23]
mircea_popescu but a) it all lasted as long as the sputnik and b) i forget what i wanted to be b. [16:23]
mircea_popescu << was he ever part of a "criminal gang" running guns in ehtiopia ? ever a terrorist in kabul ? [16:25]
assbot Logged on 22-06-2015 14:10:38; asciilifeform: << but how, precisely, was herr naggum to get out of it? recall, he did not spend whole life in one country - was in usa for most of the upper '90s [16:25]
asciilifeform !up ascii_field [16:26]
* assbot gives voice to ascii_field [16:26]
mircea_popescu << on this matter there can scarcely be any debate. [16:26]
assbot Logged on 22-06-2015 14:11:04; asciilifeform: << it is my considered view that naggum got out of the game the only way he knew how... [16:26]
ascii_field mircea_popescu: he was not ever, afaik, a puffer fish, either [16:26]
mircea_popescu to his detriment. [16:26]
* ascii_field applies for puffer fish detail [16:26]
mircea_popescu specialisation is not the unilaterally superlative good it is presented as. [16:26]
mircea_popescu specialisation is, much akin to geting used to narrow spaces, a necessary evil. [16:27]
mircea_popescu not more necessary than the goods it actually provides are. [16:27]
ascii_field no shit [16:27]
mircea_popescu in current environs, not necessary at all. [16:27]
mircea_popescu << ehehe. eternal mechanism. "here, have a lot of money, think it's yours so you offload your mental balance, but let it be still ours so we offload ours!" [16:28]
assbot Logged on 22-06-2015 14:12:53; asciilifeform: because why should some schmuck get to keep his pile ? [16:28]
mircea_popescu bezzle at the core. [16:28]
mircea_popescu adults do this sometimes with children, pretend-give them things to motivate them "for their own good". [16:28]
ascii_field and on top of this, my understanding is that herr naggum was considerably 'more pashtun' than i [16:29]
mircea_popescu doubt the comparison "more pashtun than x" can be declared in scopes where nobody's killed anyone for honor., [16:29]
ascii_field sure it can [16:29]
mircea_popescu in any case the actual pashtuns might be nonplussed by the proposition. [16:29]
ascii_field doubtless [16:29]
ascii_field meant shorthand as 'less of a doomed child of specialization and overcivilization in general' [16:30]
mircea_popescu is he more convergent than you, also ? can you apply CBS to your own monotony "to some degree" ? [16:30]
ascii_field l0l [16:30]
mircea_popescu im not sure that less exists. [16:30]
mircea_popescu anyway, to formalize a positive form for this, not merely the negative : [16:32]
mircea_popescu i propose to you that a team of two people selected from five that are only informed in general computer sanity can produce in the same time better software than the sum of all five, each schooled in one specialisation : sysadmin, webdev, db management, ux and marketing. [16:32]
mircea_popescu yes, this means that three people out of five would starve. guess what ? four of five starve now. [16:33]
ascii_field then i ask mircea_popescu, as best proof of this conjecture, to supply two people who know arse from elbow re: therealbitcoin from this pool [16:34]
mircea_popescu nonspecialisation would be strictly a better outcome. the only problem with it is that it relies on falsifying the "we are all human" dogma. [16:34]
mircea_popescu clearly only two out of the five are human. [16:34]
mircea_popescu haha. [16:34]
mircea_popescu no, the two would pointedly NOT know it. [16:34]
ascii_field not specifically [16:34]
ascii_field but, say, able to tell arse from elbow after, say, a month or two [16:35]
mircea_popescu eh get out. mod6 and jurov. what now ? [16:35]
mircea_popescu and i can keep picking pairs. [16:35]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 32947 @ 0.00042231 = 13.9138 BTC [+] [16:35]
ascii_field and these are supposed to be folks with 'only general sense of sanity' ? [16:35]
ascii_field iirc both have programmed for money their whole lives [16:35]
mircea_popescu i dunno... iirc mod6 couldn't get the laptop to open last i saw him :D [16:36]
mircea_popescu something about the lock not being bsd or what was it [16:36]
ascii_field likewise, when mircea_popescu has occasion to visit a doctor, does he visit an 'obsolete' specialist, or just some fella who had a 'general sense of sanity' and decided, on a weekend lark, to open an anatomy book for an hour or two ? [16:36]
mircea_popescu last time i visited a doctor, it was doctor levy [16:37]
mircea_popescu i was about six, and my parents somehow had found an old jew - complete with chained pocketwatch - to be my personal physician [16:37]
mircea_popescu he was very much what i describe (not really what you charicaturize, obviously) [16:37]
ascii_field lucky then, that mircea_popescu did not need a doctor. [16:38]
mircea_popescu lucky indeed. [16:38]
mircea_popescu but i have some, however marginal, hope - that by the time i actually do, one might actually exist. [16:38]
mircea_popescu for otherwise, as the romanian expression goes, "nu ma prea vad in clar" [16:38]
ascii_field !b 9 [16:38]
assbot Last 9 lines bashed and pending review. ( ) [16:38]
ascii_field mircea_popescu might be a fan of the famous heinlein quote re: specialization ? [16:40]
ascii_field << top of page [16:40]
assbot Specialization Is For Insects ... ( ) [16:40]
thestringpuller was thinking about you in traffic this morning ascii_field [16:41]
thestringpuller thought to myself, "ascii has to deal with this shit for 4 hours a day. no use in my gettin' upset" [16:41]
ascii_field thestringpuller: closer to 2 on avg. [16:42]
thestringpuller that's my mentors favorite quote btw ascii_field [16:43]
mircea_popescu ascii_field i dunno about insects, but it is certainly a cheap if ineffectual way to assuage one's feelings of inadequacy. [16:44]
mircea_popescu then you get jwz's all over. [16:44]
mircea_popescu they're all specialists, and all in something else. [16:44]
mircea_popescu consequently nobody's responsible for anything and whatever. [16:44]
ascii_field can we distinguish shit from shinola, even if only to the extend of admitting the existence of shinola ? [16:45]
ascii_field jwz != perelman [16:45]
mircea_popescu sure. [16:45]
mircea_popescu but to their wives, they're interchangeable. [16:45]
mircea_popescu hence - divorce. [16:45]
* ascii_field doesn't recall perelman so much as threatening to have a wife [16:46]
mircea_popescu to their waiter - which they don't have - to their doctor - which idem - to their life, whatever it means, they're interchangeable. [16:46]
ascii_field i must confess that ^ makes literally no sense to me [16:46]
ascii_field why would they be interchangeable to their wives (supposing each had a wife) ? [16:47]
mircea_popescu ok. lety's walk through the path. [16:47]
mircea_popescu guy is 3. he is easily the equal of anything life throws his way. master of his destiny, the three year old roars. [16:47]
mircea_popescu a decade passes, and the thirteen year old is confronted with the sad circumstance that hanna likes basketball players and rachel likes football players, and to become either you gotta talk to the respective coach, and the coach says you gotta spend all your time practicing. well... he can't readily spend all his time twice over. [16:48]
thestringpuller what about guy who is on all the teams? [16:48]
mircea_popescu at which point, guy specializes, and takes rachel. another guy, coming later, takes hanna. for less effort, but lesser pickings. and so with everyone. [16:49]
thestringpuller guy who has letter jacket from baseball, basketball and football. [16:49]
thestringpuller couldn't he date hanna and rachel at same time? [16:49]
mircea_popescu then a kid from australia comes by, wants to play tennis, and well... none of the boys can play. because... mind you... not their speciality. [16:49]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 47761 @ 0.00041888 = 20.0061 BTC [-] {2} [16:49]
mircea_popescu given the lure of exotism, the only stable result here is where australia is a terrorist regime and all the guys sit around discussing immigration reform. [16:50]
mircea_popescu you ever seen birthday girl ascii_field ? [16:50]
ascii_field nope [16:51]
ascii_field what was it [16:51]
mircea_popescu an excelent film, see it sometime. the plot is that a russian whore (which just means woman in her 20s) sells herself off to an english eunuch [16:51]
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mircea_popescu (which just means man in his 20s) [16:51]
mircea_popescu she, of course, has a boy back home. and that boy... comes to check her out. [16:52]
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mircea_popescu the way this movie is generally perceived is "oh, russian mob and mail order bride scam". nothing of the kind. the russian boy is pretty much playing it by the ear, [16:52]
mircea_popescu and there's a most endeering scheme where he and the current guy his girl is ... with, let's say, walk in the woods. [16:52]
mircea_popescu and the russian tries to talk to the brit. plainly, man to man. it involves some kickjumps in the vegetation. the other backs off like a cat from a calendar. [16:53]
mircea_popescu it all goes to shit, but ~after~ that. [16:53]
mircea_popescu why exactly can't a random english kid talk the basic language of the other ? [16:53]
ascii_field because orc ? [16:54]
mircea_popescu what is this orc. [16:54]
ascii_field is this yet another 'humans good, orcs bad' yarn [16:54]
mircea_popescu yes, each thinks the other an orc. [16:54]
ascii_field because those are a snore [16:54]
mircea_popescu i just liked that scene. also nicole kidman. [16:54]
mircea_popescu it demands an explanation. WHY is it that the brit can't talk to the other ? he DID actually come in peace. [16:54]
mircea_popescu up until that point, the big reveal (for him), where he discovers that his inferiority complex to "civilisation" is unfounded. [16:55]
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mircea_popescu you recall the amply discussed "soviet realisation". the funny thing is, those people's sons had... a very similar realisation. [16:55]
mircea_popescu except this time, re the west. [16:55]
ascii_field aha. [16:55]
mircea_popescu just how fucking hard is it to speak another's language ? [16:56]
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ascii_field today you will find open discussion among thinking ru sphere folks, that 'islamic picture of western civ is essentially correct' [16:56]
mircea_popescu im not talking, previously, against specialisation in the anti intellectual, acultural manner you seem to have taken in. [16:56]
* assbot removes voice from ascii_field [16:56]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10613 @ 0.00040949 = 4.3459 BTC [-] [16:56]
mircea_popescu i merely speak of this : that when baker tells you a joke about yeast, you'd better fucking get it and laugh. [16:57]
asciilifeform !up ascii_field [16:57]
* assbot gives voice to ascii_field [16:57]
mircea_popescu i have no doubt it is essentially correct, which is why i speak for isis more than i speak for the usg. [16:57]
mircea_popescu if it was backwards i'd speak backwards. [16:57]
mod6 <+mircea_popescu> something about the lock not being bsd or what was it << lol :D [16:57]
* ascii_field re: yeast laugh: graps that mircea_popescu is speaking the basic frustration of every polymath on planet 3 when confronting numbskulls [16:57]
mircea_popescu mod6 :p [16:57]
mircea_popescu how much fucking polymacy does it take to get a fucking joke! [16:58]
mircea_popescu "oh no, we could never do that, WE'RE SPECIALIZED!!1" [16:58]
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mircea_popescu fuck you then. [16:58]
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ascii_field the basic minimal quota adult male circa, say, 1930, shipped from the factory with [16:58]
mircea_popescu i guess. [16:58]
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ascii_field ~that~ kind of 'specialized' can go straight to the biodiesel pot, yes [16:58]
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ascii_field it is, at least partly, why i left academia [16:59]
ascii_field i.e. having to be in the same elevator as those people. [16:59]
* assbot gives voice to funkenstein_ [16:59]
mircea_popescu i can see it. [16:59]
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* mircea_popescu was blessed with an early life in a land with no elevators [16:59]
mircea_popescu thinkaboutit.jpg [16:59]
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williamdunne The women in Romania were beautiful, but I think Czech Republic had it beat out [17:00]
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chetty large buildings (with elevators) look remarkably like beehives [17:00]
mircea_popescu williamdunne generally agreed upon fact. [17:01]
williamdunne Jesus Christ though, when I met the person at the bank I'd been working with for the past few months though.. [17:01]
williamdunne Holy shit [17:01]
williamdunne Just wow [17:01]
mircea_popescu chetty oh, and no "access control" either. as late as 1988 you cvould just fucking WALK INTO the super-secret-only-not-military-because-the-smart-kids-hated-corporals itci [17:01]
mircea_popescu ie, the place working to make missile controls and whatnot. [17:02]
mircea_popescu williamdunne nailedher ? [17:02]
williamdunne Christ I wish [17:02]
mircea_popescu nuts. what do you wish ? [17:02]
williamdunne I'm too babyfaced to do any damage [17:02]
mircea_popescu didja ask her ? [17:02]
ascii_field mircea_popescu: we had elevators. which didn't work. fun on 15th floor [17:02]
mircea_popescu ascii_field see this is it, 4 floors everywhere. [17:03]
williamdunne "Hey, once we've got this account opened, could I bend you over your desk and fuck you in front of your colleague?" [17:03]
mircea_popescu made the butts better at any rate. [17:03]
trinque williamdunne: there may be better strategies [17:03]
trinque lol [17:03]
mircea_popescu williamdunne if you're that kind, which i hadn't judged you for. else, "wanna go for a bite after work ?" [17:03]
williamdunne Aha [17:03]
williamdunne Yeah not that kind [17:03]
williamdunne Maybe I should have tried, sure I'll be there again soonish though [17:04]
williamdunne Still, being a babyfaced 18 year old isn't a good starting point [17:04]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 38017 @ 0.00040878 = 15.5406 BTC [-] {2} [17:04]
chetty never know if you dont try, really nothing to lose [17:05]
mircea_popescu ascii_field but to round it off : i am unimpressed with that utter fear of all usian pencildicks, "omg prison". seriously, lifetime pension ? tyvm. i am also unimpressed with the "difficulties" of "orcs" aka niggers in the us. i have never had a problem making sense of them or the reverse. and THIS is why i say the flight to suburbus is a purely sexual problem. [17:05]
mircea_popescu there is a deep link between sex and communication, not least of all because sex is the communication of biological material. [17:05]
mircea_popescu williamdunne wouldja stop trying to make her decisions for her ? [17:05]
mircea_popescu not your fucking job. specialize already. [17:05]
williamdunne Get your point [17:06]
mircea_popescu "we reject gender specialisation, which is not something anyone asked us about - to focus on professional specialization, which is both impossible and counterproductive" [17:06]
trinque williamdunne: I recall working IT at a hotel in FL when I was 19 [17:06]
trinque I'm sure I was "babyfaced" [17:06]
mircea_popescu is this slang for pimplefaced or something ? [17:07]
ascii_field so when will mircea_popescu be getting on the u.s. prison plane ? [17:07]
trinque chick who was my boss seemed overly friendly, went ahead and chatted her up one day after work [17:07]
trinque fucked her for a couple months thereafter [17:07]
ascii_field there is probably a nice lifetime pension reserved for him here [17:07]
trinque learned a lot :D [17:07]
funkenstein_ the orcs are the pigs, the stormtroopers. right right? [17:07]
mircea_popescu ascii_field well i plan to shoot a few schmucks first. so just as soon as they can line up enough schmucks willing to be shot. [17:07]
williamdunne mircea_popescu: It means young looking [17:08]
mircea_popescu that's a drawback ?! [17:08]
williamdunne noice [17:08]
williamdunne mircea_popescu: Young as in 15 [17:08]
williamdunne Not young as if in pre-30s [17:08]
chetty jailbait [17:08]
mircea_popescu i still dun see it. [17:08]
williamdunne Pretty much [17:08]
mircea_popescu williamdunne they dont have sex jail in the czech republic. [17:09]
williamdunne This was in Bucharest, but yeah [17:09]
williamdunne I more meant it as a negative in terms of attraction [17:09]
williamdunne (Example babyfaced mugshot) [17:09]
williamdunne [17:09]
assbot ... ( ) [17:09]
mircea_popescu lol got your own ? [17:09]
williamdunne Aha, nope, thats not me [17:10]
mircea_popescu anyway, eastern europe bank strategy has been to hire supermodels because a) they're stupid b) they're cheap and c) the stupid and cheap peasants that are their parents still own their own real estate and the best way to get them to lose it to austrian banks is by hiring thei better looking daughters. which they don't fuck because weirdos, but merely drool over.. [17:11]
mircea_popescu the same womenz exist in london, you don't see them in retail bank branches because nobody gives a shit about the english peasant. [17:11]
williamdunne Aha [17:12]
williamdunne Well, I wouldn't call her stupid. She's been rather useful [17:12]
williamdunne but yeah [17:12]
mircea_popescu i'm sure she's a specialist. [17:12]
williamdunne This is what a drunken Wil looks like; [17:12]
assbot ... ( ) [17:12]
williamdunne 3rd from left [17:12]
mircea_popescu may i inquire why are you holding the OTHER DUDE ? [17:13]
trinque bahaha [17:13]
cazalla they're mates! [17:13]
mircea_popescu right, but there's a time for that. [17:13]
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* williamdunne is no longer allowed friends [17:14]
williamdunne Aha [17:14]
williamdunne Well [17:14]
williamdunne I did try it on with the girls in my defence [17:14]
williamdunne They weren't having any of it [17:14]
mircea_popescu srsly ? they look kinda ready to go. [17:14]
mircea_popescu but what's in a photo. [17:14]
williamdunne Either they didn't like me, or a heavily intoxicated Wil isn't good at reading signs [17:15]
cazalla you look pretty tanked and ignore these autists who think putting ya arm around ya mate is weird :P [17:15]
* Guest83976 is now known as thestringpuller [17:16]
mircea_popescu cazalla goes to the brothel holding hands. [17:16]
williamdunne Prague was pretty much me being tanked the entire time [17:16]
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williamdunne I discovered that gay people like me very much, which I guess is a slight ego boost even if very useless to me [17:16]
mircea_popescu i dunno about 15, but you could pass for a twink. [17:17]
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williamdunne Hmmm the only twink I know of is WoW terminology [17:18]
williamdunne !ud twink [17:18]
williamdunne ;;ud twink [17:18]
gribble | The stereotypical twink is 18-22, slender with little or no body hair, often blonde, dresses in club wear even at 10:00 AM, and is not particularly intelligent. A twink  ... [17:18]
mircea_popescu << you know my discussion of his obit still draws angry mail ? [17:18]
assbot Logged on 22-06-2015 14:17:22; asciilifeform: mats: that herr naggum 'did not want to live' is profoundly obvious from the manner in which he died [17:18]
williamdunne Ahahaha [17:19]
williamdunne Well, yeah I qualify for the t.w part [17:19]
mircea_popescu williamdunne a twink is how you say ephebos these days. intelligence got nothing to do with it, just the internet derp seems to insist that anyone sensual is necessarily dumb fior this reason. [17:19]
ascii_field mircea_popescu: l0l! angry mail? [17:19]
ascii_field why? [17:19]
mircea_popescu "how could i say such things!" [17:19]
mircea_popescu well it irritatyes not merely the feminist worldview, but also the collectivist worldview, [17:19]
mircea_popescu "i will see the world is more important than people!111!11" [17:20]
ascii_field ah that [17:20]
ascii_field unsurprised [17:20]
ascii_field the usual suspects will piss & moan, yes [17:20]
mircea_popescu << you will notice this is entirely projected. [17:22]
assbot Logged on 22-06-2015 14:33:29; asciilifeform: i can already picture mircea_popescu's 'recipe': 'naggum should've moved to argentina' 'me: with what' 'mircea: with shirt on his back' 'me: doing what' 'mircea: sharpening knives while living in dumpster' 'me: betcha he knew this, and didn't care for it' [17:22]
cazalla <<< i got one on the 19th.. i get them every 2-3 weeks and can no longer sync after that so i have to restore from backup [17:22]
mircea_popescu !s should from:mircea [17:22]
assbot Logged on 22-06-2015 13:55:47; asciilifeform: anyone notice if gavingang sent out 'alerts' recently ? [17:22]
assbot 2333 results for 'should from:mircea' : [17:22]
williamdunne !s .gif from:mircea [17:22]
assbot 186 results for '.gif from:mircea' : [17:22]
ascii_field mircea_popescu: the conjecture was based on an old thread re: naggum [17:22]
ascii_field where you did say 'why wasn't he on the next boat to ar' [17:23]
mircea_popescu yes but it carries more of the conjecturer than of the subject. [17:23]
ascii_field [17:23]
assbot Logged on 21-09-2014 16:28:55; asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: what's he to do in argentina? teach the pampas cats and ocelots common lisp ? [17:23]
trinque people do it [17:24]
trinque my ancestors left being rather well off in Italy [17:24]
mircea_popescu ascii_field the point was that location's irrelevant, there. which it is, or do you dispute ? [17:24]
mircea_popescu yes, i get it, you have heavy physical equipment. he was a software man. [17:24]
ascii_field it is absolutely relevant unless you are mircea_popescu, flyer of atomic dirigible [17:24]
ascii_field and it isn't about the equipment. i'd burn it all if meatwot were portable [17:24]
ascii_field naggum certainly did not stay in shitland on account of equipment. [17:25]
mircea_popescu more on account of not asking the bank clerk about fucking her over her desk ? [17:25]
ascii_field but, as i surmise, on account of 'rather die than compete with 16 year-olds on their home turf' [17:25]
trinque even that makes very little sense, as though death holds some better alternative [17:25]
mircea_popescu competing with 16yos is how you end up fucking 16yos. [17:26]
ascii_field trinque fails pashtun exam [17:26]
funkenstein_ i guess that meatwot wasn't worth sticking around for either. sometimes it isn't. [17:26]
ascii_field the 'death before dishonour' part [17:26]
trinque haha [17:26]
trinque indeed I do [17:26]
mircea_popescu funkenstein_ interesting how contradictory the proposition is huh [17:26]
mircea_popescu "he couldn't leave because he couldn't leave things he couldn't leave and then he left them" [17:26]
ascii_field mircea_popescu: competing with 16yos is how you end up fucking 16yos << hence why i said 'home turf' [17:27]
* assbot removes voice from ascii_field [17:27]
williamdunne Bug in orderbook? [17:27]
williamdunne [17:27]
assbot X.EUR last 25@0.00460722 ... ( ) [17:27]
asciilifeform !up ascii_field [17:27]
* assbot gives voice to ascii_field [17:27]
mircea_popescu no dude. the species is coded so that women are sluts. which is to say, they fuck the novel. [17:27]
ascii_field advantage as in, where they have whatever advantage (such as being amorphous turds that can be molded to fit what world wants) [17:27]
mircea_popescu williamdunne what's the bug ? [17:27]
williamdunne mircea_popescu: Bid/Ask of same value and with positive quantity [17:28]
mike_c screenshot? I don't see that. [17:28]
mircea_popescu 32 vs 22 ? [17:28]
mike_c only bug I see is euros are way overpriced. [17:28]
mircea_popescu lol [17:28]
mircea_popescu (such as being amorphous turds that can be molded to fit what world wants) << this is not what you make it out to be. [17:29]
williamdunne [17:29]
assbot ... ( ) [17:29]
mircea_popescu well, that's what i see too [17:30]
williamdunne I'm seeing bids and asks at 0.00460732 [17:30]
williamdunne They should match, no? [17:30]
mircea_popescu 0.00460732 130 | 60 0.00460722 [17:30]
mircea_popescu ;;calc 0.00460732 - 0.00460722 [17:30]
gribble 9.99999999994e-08 [17:30]
williamdunne Oh [17:30]
williamdunne aha [17:30]
williamdunne I missed the 3/2 [17:30]
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mircea_popescu 9.99999999994e-08 << that is an... interesting result. [17:31]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17019 @ 0.0003926 = 6.6817 BTC [-] [17:32]
ascii_field ^ 'what is the difference between windows 3.1 and windows 3.0?' '0, according to ms calc' [17:32]
mircea_popescu >> this fails to expl;ain why hobos go to town rather than diffuse in the fields. [17:33]
assbot Logged on 22-06-2015 14:42:57; thestringpuller: hobo is a phenomenon of the city imo. if forced to be homeless I'd rather be homeless in a jungle or some deserted island and learn to survive there rather than in a city. [17:33]
williamdunne On an unrelated note, I like Tim Parsa of BitReserve [17:33]
mircea_popescu williamdunne << what's whaleclub [17:33]
assbot Logged on 22-06-2015 15:46:33; williamdunne: !rate Drhelmut 1 WhaleClub TS [17:33]
williamdunne mircea_popescu: Some teamspeak thing for price speculators [17:34]
mircea_popescu a nm is in the log [17:34]
mircea_popescu mike_c yo mikey! you missed the event! [17:34]
mike_c father's day, spent it by the pool [17:35]
mircea_popescu omfg you guise are mean. [17:35]
assbot Logged on 22-06-2015 15:54:55; ben_vulpes: bunch of half-int btc holders talking about making markets? [17:35]
assbot Logged on 22-06-2015 15:55:36; mats: to be more generous, probably a buncha poor people following TAT around [17:35]
* funkenstein_ has quit (Quit: Leaving) [17:35]
mircea_popescu mike_c oh, is that where the whole family gathers around to do osanali and genereally worship you ? [17:35]
mike_c yes, except my father was there too, so he got some worship as well. [17:35]
mike_c and i don't know what osanali is [17:36]
mircea_popescu turkish word. this specific calisthenic routine, person kneels then raises hands and then puts them on teh ground. [17:36]
mircea_popescu supposed to show great respek. [17:37]
mircea_popescu !rate Drhelmut 1 Runs some sort of teamspeak server. [17:37]
assbot Request successful, get your OTP: [17:37]
mike_c ah, yes, well that happenned. [17:37]
mircea_popescu !v assbot:mircea_popescu.rate.Drhelmut.1:6d6dc0f4b800d51f6f275f4a001247e02f9e809fbfc19fcc7bc78cceb76dff3a [17:37]
assbot Successfully added a rating of 1 for Drhelmut with note: Runs some sort of teamspeak server. [17:37]
mircea_popescu osanali^ is the plural, and it'd need a thing on the i. otherwise osana, singular. [17:38]
* mius has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) [17:39]
mircea_popescu << i suspect it works as a "strengthening weakness". which is to say, because it's so easily to be annoying, encourages people to not be annoying. sort of canary in the mine if you will. [17:39]
assbot Logged on 22-06-2015 16:02:31; chetty: teamspeak? eew why would one want to have people talking at you all the time? [17:39]
* mius (~mius@unaffiliated/mius) has joined #bitcoin-assets [17:39]
mircea_popescu groups benefit from a certain knowledge that a mechanism for disproportionate reaction exists (as discussed in that old arta pedepsirii article). this arrangement simply makes it exist without anyone actuall being personally involved, which is just what you'd expect these days. [17:40]
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mircea_popescu in other news, that dude i tried to hire to do bitbet advertising absconded with the budget did he. [17:45]
mircea_popescu ;;seen isaackl [17:46]
gribble isaackl was last seen in #bitcoin-assets 4 weeks, 0 days, 17 hours, 29 minutes, and 58 seconds ago: For BitBet, SEO or finding sites with underutilised ad space (as with 8chan) is probably the way to go? Both take time though. I can send your btc back if you want as tbh I have little expertise in that world. Also let me know if you think my reasoning is flawed. [17:46]
mircea_popescu heh. [17:46]
trinque "if you want" lol [17:46]
mircea_popescu !rated isaackl [17:46]
assbot You have not rated isaackl. [17:46]
mircea_popescu !rate isaackl -1 was supposed to work for bitbet, see disappeared. [17:47]
assbot Request successful, get your OTP: [17:47]
assbot Logged on 20-05-2015 10:08:38; mircea_popescu: i prefer to not communicate lol. do your job, report the methodology and results once you're done. you got a blog ? [17:47]
mircea_popescu !v assbot:mircea_popescu.rate.isaackl.-1:72d3d56f7ac65a6e331b6b725cce0e408b21cf3a566d2340ca65326776f66734 [17:47]
assbot Successfully added a rating of -1 for isaackl with note: was supposed to work for bitbet, see disappeared. [17:47]
williamdunne Seems like it would justify more than a -1 [17:48]
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mircea_popescu !up ksipax [17:48]
-assbot- You voiced ksipax for 30 minutes. [17:48]
* assbot gives voice to ksipax [17:48]
shinohai That was lame [17:48]
mircea_popescu williamdunne dja know how i score these ? [17:48]
williamdunne Honestly, no [17:48]
mircea_popescu see [17:50]
assbot What the WoT is for, how it works and how to use it. on Trilema - A blog by Mircea Popescu. ... ( ) [17:50]
* assbot gives voice to Drhelmut [17:51]
Drhelmut Yeeah [17:51]
Drhelmut I did it [17:51]
mircea_popescu lol wd. [17:51]
Drhelmut thx for rating mircea [17:52]
mircea_popescu aha. [17:52]
mircea_popescu << lol win. [17:52]
assbot Logged on 22-06-2015 16:32:46; assbot: im silly, but not that silly. [17:52]
Drhelmut god Wot is not user friendly at all [17:52]
mircea_popescu no, it isn't. [17:52]
mircea_popescu but, unlike other places that are not user friendly, like the us or the uk, at least it doesn't employ armed men to shoot you for trying to get in. [17:53]
mircea_popescu or was it for trying to get out ? i always get my empires mixed up. [17:54]
Drhelmut lol [17:54]
mircea_popescu << at least get us nudies of the czech hotties then. [17:55]
assbot Logged on 22-06-2015 17:04:08; williamdunne: ascii_field: Sorry, still not home. Keeps getting delayed. Probably won't be back until Wednesday D: [17:55]
williamdunne mircea_popescu: Aha [17:55]
williamdunne In the UK [17:55]
williamdunne Just not at home [17:55]
mircea_popescu ah which reminds me. ascii_field you ever seen pulp fiction ? [17:55]
ascii_field nope [17:56]
mircea_popescu it's a good movie. [17:56]
mircea_popescu julius an' vincent have a number of intelligent, culturally relevant discussions. whych is why qt is such an intellectual titan. [17:56]
* ascii_field already had it on list, solely on account of who did it, but hasn't yet seen [17:56]
mircea_popescu among them, one you'll find familiar. [17:56]
williamdunne Watch it [17:56]
williamdunne Today [17:56]
mircea_popescu While You Drive [17:57]
williamdunne Fuck it, imma rewatch it [17:57]
kakobrekla [17:57]
assbot ... ( ) [17:57]
* assbot removes voice from ascii_field [17:57]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 38300 @ 0.00040611 = 15.554 BTC [+] [17:57]
mircea_popescu aahaha [17:57]
mircea_popescu << but lulzy. [17:58]
assbot Logged on 22-06-2015 17:10:13; jurov: < that's microsoft's fud and it never actually took place [17:58]
mike_c kakobrekla: lol :D that's a good one [17:59]
mircea_popescu in other news, [18:00]
assbot Always remember to remove cat before flight ... ( ) [18:00]
mircea_popescu incidentally Drhelmut you ever answered ? [18:01]
assbot Logged on 22-06-2015 17:19:06; kakobrekla: < wait how does this actually work? [18:01]
shinohai [18:08]
assbot ‘Pulp Fiction’ Star Keitel Sues E*Trade Over Ad Campaign - Bloomberg Business ... ( ) [18:08]
mircea_popescu "C++ is philosophically and cognitively unsound as it forces a violation of all known epistemological processes on the programmer. as a language, it requires you to specify in great detail what you do not know in order to obtain the experience necessary to learn it. " [18:09]
mircea_popescu you know there's actually a strong possibility this assertion is correct. from my experience discussing programming with girls that don't program, it often comes to some derivative of exactly this. [18:10]
* mius has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) [18:10]
mircea_popescu either "how do you know that", "how was i supposed to know that" or the more broad "this shit is just fucking stupid already" [18:10]
williamdunne On a side note something I found to be interesting; whenever it came up that I preferred the traditional model of a wife being submissive to her husband who goes to work while she performs domestic duties, it was made out that I am a neo-nazi by people my own age [18:10]
mats thats not egalitarian, man [18:10]
mircea_popescu so ? [18:11]
asciilifeform !up ascii_field [18:11]
* assbot gives voice to ascii_field [18:11]
ascii_field mircea_popescu: i had almost 100% same convo with a maths type who hated programming [18:11]
ascii_field for the same reason naggum gav [18:11]
ascii_field e [18:11]
mircea_popescu i think it's the deep reason for haskell [18:11]
ascii_field 'requires me to name shit that doesn't deserve a name and wtf' [18:11]
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williamdunne mircea_popescu: Well, I didn't realize quite how deep SJW'ism was engraved into the souls of them [18:12]
mircea_popescu but for what it's worth, i don't believe C actually does this. i believe it is merely perceived to do so. [18:12]
ascii_field mircea_popescu: c - no [18:12]
williamdunne I never even said anything particularly controversial in my opinion; only that I would prefer a wife who didn't work over one that did [18:12]
ascii_field cpp, and other idiocies that force-rape the programmer with 'classes' etc - do. [18:12]
mircea_popescu williamdunne why would you prefer a wife that didn't work, and if you do, how do you know you're not actually looking for a mistress ? [18:12]
mircea_popescu ascii_field even cpp. let's model this on the act of telling a joke. [18:13]
williamdunne mircea_popescu: Wife was simply for their understanding, I'm not particularly concerned with the idea of marriage [18:13]
mircea_popescu now, you've probably heard enough jokes in your time to know there are two basic styles. one style is "some guy walks into a bar" and the other style is "this bloke joe walks into the bar". [18:13]
ascii_field (this-bloke (gensym) (walked-into (bar))) [18:14]
mircea_popescu the former is often trampled on by scoping questions by the [lamer] members of the audience. the second uses misdirection (the name's a throwaway) to perhaps enhance the results., [18:14]
mircea_popescu "why should i know who some guy's name is to be able to tell a joke ?" "you only need to know the name if you plan to reuse it" [18:14]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 71550 @ 0.00037614 = 26.9128 BTC [-] {4} [18:15]
mircea_popescu c++ is very faux-texan in this sense. [18:15]
mircea_popescu "objective", except the objectivity is pure nominalism. [18:15]
mircea_popescu which makes it very much an idealism masquerading as an objectivism which then drives a particular sort of people up the wall. [18:16]
mircea_popescu williamdunne point being, if the bitch ain't working for you, she's the pimp and you're the ho. [18:17]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 41850 @ 0.00040074 = 16.771 BTC [+] [18:18]
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felipelalli this conversation about programming languages, lol! [18:20]
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mircea_popescu !up Exemus [18:21]
-assbot- You voiced Exemus for 30 minutes. [18:21]
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Drhelmut good night ppl [18:21]
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mats programming sucks [18:22]
williamdunne mircea_popescu: Sure, I guess thats kinda my point [18:22]
felipelalli ascii_field: are you a scheme programmer too? If yes, which dialect? [18:22]
williamdunne The confusion on my point is the extreme objection to this on the part of my peers [18:22]
williamdunne Anyhow, nothing too profound [18:23]
trinque felipelalli: one doesn't tend to be an X programmer past a certain proficiency [18:23]
ascii_field felipelalli: i haven't used scheme in anger in many years. [18:23]
mircea_popescu he mostly uses python :D [18:23]
williamdunne Although, I'm now thinking that unless I'm given some particularly large incentive not too, I would like to move somewhere in Eastern Europe [18:23]
mircea_popescu williamdunne ukraine ? [18:24]
felipelalli trinque: you're right, my question was if ascii_field did program in scheme before. [18:24]
williamdunne Hate the language [18:24]
williamdunne Not been though [18:24]
williamdunne CZ/RO currently on top [18:24]
williamdunne mircea_popescu: I thought it was quite interesting that Romanian doesn't distinguish between to win and to earn though [18:25]
mircea_popescu "one can only imagine what having to lie to your compiler _every_ day and to make unwarranted guesses that your colleagues will depend on the same way they depend on your hard-earned knowledge _does_ to a human brain -- I know I couldn't handle even the prospect of it." << ya ya. welcome to real life (tm). this is what it is. exactly. there shall never be an escape from it, it is the indelible mark of superiority, [18:25]
mircea_popescu the notion that one can run out of it by running out of c is ridiculous. [18:25]
mircea_popescu ascii_field this goes right into our discussion about how the only reason lisp is ok where c is shot is that the hordes haven't sat on lisp but on c, would have been the other way around if they had sat the other way. [18:26]
mircea_popescu preciselythis. [18:26]
ascii_field naggum pointed this out [18:26]
mircea_popescu williamdunne technically, it's all "gain". [18:26]
ascii_field but it is not a complete story [18:26]
mircea_popescu ascii_field one day ima have an original thought. i swear. [18:26]
ascii_field rather like saying 'this bridge is only here because sufficiently large column of tanks has not yet gone on it' [18:26]
mircea_popescu (to my compiler) [18:26]
ascii_field technically - guaranteed true. [18:26]
mircea_popescu perhaps. [18:27]
ascii_field enough tanks, made of neutron star, and any bridge will go down. [18:27]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 76809 @ 0.00040821 = 31.3542 BTC [+] {2} [18:27]
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mircea_popescu williamdunne what you'll be more interested will be to hear that a) romanian uses a unified concept for gain, which covers "gain from playing the one man bandit", "gain for gainful employment", "gain from having said a funny joke", "gaining time" etc, but the actual word, cistiga, is a direct usage of the latin castigat. [18:28]
mircea_popescu as in, castigat ridendo mores. to, literally, beat into shape. [18:28]
williamdunne Ahh, I wish he'd gone into more detail thats kinda interesting [18:29]
cazalla <<< overrated and the wife does the bare minimum just like anyone else stuck in a job they hate [18:29]
assbot Logged on 22-06-2015 21:06:53; williamdunne: On a side note something I found to be interesting; whenever it came up that I preferred the traditional model of a wife being submissive to her husband who goes to work while she performs domestic duties, it was made out that I am a neo-nazi by people my own age [18:29]
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williamdunne cazalla: If they hate the job, why'd ya give it to them? [18:29]
mircea_popescu cazalla well if she does that she gets the whip. [18:29]
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trinque traditional models are for boring people [18:31]
williamdunne MP, your model IIRC is pretty interesting.. [18:31]
mircea_popescu great training tool tho. what's clueless girly to do ? [18:31]
cazalla williamdunne, well because she's a good mum (the hate my job part is really just having less time for oneself) [18:32]
williamdunne cazalla: Fair nuff, I'm not so keen on the idea of children that I have to look after so between myself and domestic duties they would still have time for themselves, you would hope [18:33]
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cazalla why do you prefer the traditional model of a wife if no desire for kids? [18:34]
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trinque think he means that *he* has to bother with [18:34]
mircea_popescu either because he wants to buy a whore rather than rent ; or because he wants a mistress but is affraid of her bulls. [18:35]
mircea_popescu strangely enough, two very different problems manifesting in the same can. [18:35]
williamdunne Permanent companionship/sexual fulfilment without the hassle of children? [18:35]
mircea_popescu this still doesn't answer. [18:35]
williamdunne mircea_popescu: Not really scared of bulls, but I don't want to share [18:35]
cazalla williamdunne, biggest mistake i made at your age was believing i needed to get into a relationship with women to maintain regular sex [18:36]
williamdunne cazalla: I don't just mean sex [18:36]
mircea_popescu are you looking for a woman to worship you, that you really don't give a shit about ; or for a woman to worship yourself, that doesn't really give a shit about you. [18:37]
williamdunne Option 3, I suppose [18:37]
mircea_popescu there is no option 3. [18:37]
williamdunne Well in which case option 1 is the beyond obvious choice [18:37]
mircea_popescu never mind what's obvious, nobody asked your impression of collected social pressure. question's what you would rather. [18:37]
williamdunne Option 1, its an obvious choice [18:38]
williamdunne Not option 1 because societal pressure [18:38]
mircea_popescu well so then why shouldn't she work. [18:38]
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trinque everyone needs something productive to do; what's she going to do, stare at a picture of you all day while you're off living? [18:39]
mircea_popescu ^ very good statement of the problem. [18:39]
williamdunne Why should she work? Are there not alternatives to a job [18:39]
williamdunne kept woman type thing [18:39]
mircea_popescu but that's for option 2 folk. [18:39]
williamdunne Do you have to worship a paid for companion? [18:40]
trinque wtf do you think paid for is? [18:40]
mircea_popescu don't the online whores these days call it exactly that ? [18:41]
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mircea_popescu what is it, "tribute" [18:41]
trinque williamdunne: I have had chicks that don't have a career, and seen the detriment idleness can be [18:41]
trinque so it's a garden, or whatever, still she needs to see that her life has some kind of point [18:41]
williamdunne trinque as if in you pay for their upkeep [18:41]
williamdunne Oh sure [18:42]
williamdunne But I wouldn't call that work [18:42]
mircea_popescu why not ? [18:42]
cazalla well if she's not kept busy raising your kids or some other hobby, don't be surprised when she ends up in the bed of another [18:42]
mircea_popescu if it's worth paying for is work, and if it's not then it doesn't answer to this line. [18:42]
mircea_popescu "Because I am not religious, I have no mystical conception of an afterlife. To me, a person lives on not in Heaven or Hell but instead in the minds and hearts of those they touched while alive" [18:44]
williamdunne By work, I strictly mean doing something which you have to do to support yourself financially [18:44]
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mircea_popescu fucktarded progressive sectarian nuts. "i have no religion except this wonky religion that i claim not to be one" [18:44]
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mircea_popescu williamdunne like sucking cock ? [18:44]
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williamdunne If thats what you're paid to do, sure [18:45]
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trinque so she's supporting herself by being paid by you to do work you find valuable [18:45]
mircea_popescu were you basically meaning to say "my idea of ideal marriage is where im just rich enough to not give a fuck" but misstated it as "woman should not work out of the house" and ended up irritating random people ? [18:45]
trinque that's work [18:45]
williamdunne Pretty much [18:46]
williamdunne Only a handful were particularly irritated, and they weren't worth keeping contact with anyhow [18:46]
trinque bahaha that's on par with: [18:46]
assbot Logged on 07-03-2015 01:58:55; trinque: what I'm gathering though is I have very little rational options beyond get rich, and do it now [18:46]
cazalla anyway williamdunne, you're what? 18? i wouldn't even give thought to wife and kids until you hit your 30s or perhaps even later, go whore it up for the next 15 years [18:47]
williamdunne Aha, its not something I intend to do within the near future [18:47]
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cazalla well better to encourage the sluts around you to get naked than to tell them you think a boring housewife is a better proposition than them [18:49]
mircea_popescu ^ [18:49]
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mircea_popescu total mismatch between meaning and expression, babyface. [18:49]
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williamdunne ahahaha [18:50]
mircea_popescu btw, check out how nicely the cult's gangster outlook is rounding out! we now have a guy nicknamed babyface even. [18:50]
cazalla lol [18:50]
mircea_popescu hopefully someone named schultz joins. i think you haveto have one. [18:50]
trinque !b 2 [18:50]
assbot Last 2 lines bashed and pending review. ( ) [18:50]
* trinque needs to start wearing more suits [18:50]
williamdunne I lol'd [18:50]
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mircea_popescu i swear the quality of tx relaying is shittening every day. [18:54]
mircea_popescu the number of txn broadcast through one node used to be pretty much zero. i would guess by now it's over 10%. which is fucking insane. [18:55]
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mircea_popescu (for the amaterus : txn propagation has a lot in common with epidemiology, a topic recently trouched upon here. in any case : the spots where a transaction goes from "unknown" to "broadcast through one node" to "broadcast to the whole net" are interesting in the general case. and the first move thereof a very good measure of "quality", basically speaking the inverse of an infection's pathogenicity) [18:56]
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mircea_popescu (seeing how a transaction lives as such a finite interval before being included in a block, the % of txn that live as "known to one" vs the total "known to all" is of particular interest) [18:58]
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jurov actually, it's close to usual paymium price (and that's why i shop there) [19:00]
assbot Logged on 22-06-2015 20:24:39; mike_c: only bug I see is euros are way overpriced. [19:00]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6150 @ 0.0003973 = 2.4434 BTC [-] [19:12]
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jurov !up sam0 [19:15]
jurov !up cardigm [19:15]
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jurov i implore theee, speak up [19:16]
mats [19:16]
assbot L'Orange u0026 Jeremiah Jae - All I Need (feat. Gift Of Gab) by Mello Music Group | Free Listening on SoundCloud ... ( ) [19:16]
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mats [19:18]
assbot Meet Porter. The World's First Driving Dog. - YouTube ... ( ) [19:18]
mats ill take a dog over a robot any day [19:18]
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jurov !up ag3nt_zer0 [19:20]
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jurov !gettrust ag3nt_zer0 [19:21]
assbot Trust relationship from user jurov to user ag3nt_zer0: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 0 via 0 connections. | | [19:21]
ag3nt_zer0 thanks and how goes it...? [19:21]
jurov goes okay [19:22]
jurov except maybe i found out i killed 88 hours in eulora in june [19:22]
mats [19:22]
assbot PGP Poster - cem ... ( ) [19:23]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 44700 @ 0.00039879 = 17.8259 BTC [+] [19:23]
mats would buy this poster [19:23]
jurov !rate ag3nt_zer0 1 n3w bl00d [19:23]
assbot Request successful, get your OTP: [19:23]
mats where's the nubs at [19:23]
mats ;;seen nubbins` [19:23]
gribble nubbins` was last seen in #bitcoin-assets 4 days, 0 hours, 30 minutes, and 56 seconds ago: o.O [19:23]
ag3nt_zer0 jurov: haha well it all ends badly so don't sweat it [19:23]
jurov !v assbot:jurov.rate.ag3nt_zer0.1:2e1c33c6523854294ce76c0385e143a9600c5e02c9164ae65268f0d12ed646f6 [19:24]
assbot Successfully added a rating of 1 for ag3nt_zer0 with note: n3w bl00d [19:24]
jurov ohmy another talmudic scholar [19:24]
ag3nt_zer0 I notice that I am one of the few using the mangled substitution of numbers for characters... if this is crass I can change it haha... but is it possible to migrate my trust? probably not huh? [19:25]
trinque who cares? [19:25]
ag3nt_zer0 haha a talmudic scholar [19:26]
trinque u r n0t 2 1337 4 u5 [19:26]
jurov since you have no ratings yet, can just get a new key and register new acct [19:26]
jurov but it's fine i guess [19:26]
ag3nt_zer0 hi trinque noce to see you [19:28]
ag3nt_zer0 is it possible that btc will have any positive effect on the wretched educational system? [19:29]
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jurov !s beatings [19:31]
assbot 74 results for 'beatings' : [19:31]
mats the beatings will continue until morale improves [19:31]
trinque also beatings for not giving out enough beatings [19:31]
trinque meta-beatings if you will [19:32]
trinque ag3nt_zer0: howdy bub [19:32]
mats its beatings all the way down [19:32]
williamdunne yo dawg.. [19:33]
ag3nt_zer0 I am coming from the viewpoint of a non-castrated teacher that believes in the transmissibility of the flame - but sees the flame has been hijacked and perverted by the marxist fag multicultis [19:34]
jurov you're t3ach3r? [19:35]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 63150 @ 0.0003973 = 25.0895 BTC [-] [19:35]
ag3nt_zer0 haha yeah [19:35]
cazalla ag3nt_zer0, not from /pol/ are you ? [19:35]
ag3nt_zer0 lament [19:35]
trinque he's the second to last rhodesian [19:35]
ag3nt_zer0 cazalla: no, I don't know what that is [19:36]
williamdunne ag3nt_zer0: 4chan board [19:37]
jurov no, 8chan [19:37]
jurov :D [19:37]
williamdunne Sorry, both [19:37]
williamdunne The politics board on many different imageboards [19:37]
trinque ag3nt_zer0: seems to me you can't fix education in its present form. [19:37]
trinque current system is predicated on the idea that mass production of "educated" is even possible [19:38]
trinque amply treated here in many threads already [19:38]
trinque !s education [19:38]
assbot 451 results for 'education' : [19:38]
ag3nt_zer0 oh ok great thansk [19:38]
williamdunne Eh, seems like it is a good thing even if just at a primary level [19:39]
williamdunne Although the whole no kid left behind thing is bullshit no matter the level [19:39]
trinque williamdunne: sure and that primary level shouldn't be considered educated [19:39]
williamdunne Sorry, misread as "education" as a wider group rather than educated [19:39]
ag3nt_zer0 yes, the system is fucked, but I wonder about the feasibility of something created entirely outside of it... maybe on a barge... [19:40]
trinque heh! [19:40]
trinque !s sealand [19:40]
assbot 15 results for 'sealand' : [19:40]
trinque ag3nt_zer0: worked for the scientologists though [19:40]
trinque there's a cult that got places [19:40]
ag3nt_zer0 williamdunne: yes no matter what some will be left behind [19:40]
trinque their tax exempt status is the greatest heist of all time [19:41]
trinque or one of. [19:41]
trinque no product, fanatics at your disposal, massive prices for your non-product, no taxes [19:41]
trinque kidding me? [19:41]
williamdunne ag3nt_zer0: Thats my point [19:42]
williamdunne Oh [19:42]
williamdunne ignore me [19:42]
trinque and hell I'm only half kidding [19:42]
trinque look at what those fucking nutbags pulled off [19:42]
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cazalla i guess 2 year data retention wasn't enough.. [19:46]
assbot Internet piracy: Federal Government's legislation to block websites passes Senate - ABC News (Australian Broadcasting Corporation) ... ( ) [19:46]
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trinque artifexd: save us obi wan kenobi [19:46]
ag3nt_zer0 anyone else see this?: [19:47]
assbot ... ( ) [19:47]
trinque ag3nt_zer0: yup, "ok google" [19:47]
trinque just them doing their job, really [19:47]
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jurov !up blazes816 [19:48]
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trinque ag3nt_zer0: given what an extraordinary intelligence asset google hypothetically "could" be it's inconceivable that they are not [19:48]
trinque and the relationship is likely 5% official [19:49]
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mats is pretty well known schmidt is part of meta-nsa [19:49]
trinque yeah [19:50]
ag3nt_zer0 trinque: yes sure... [19:50]
mats other statal regimes have realized google's sigint model beats deep packet inspection every time [19:51]
mats so guess whats being built nao [19:51]
ag3nt_zer0 well, can't wait till maidsafe saves us all from that!... kidding [19:51]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 22450 @ 0.00040169 = 9.0179 BTC [+] {2} [19:53]
jurov ag3nt_zer0: you can now !up yourself [19:54]
williamdunne Has anything been said by maidsafe recently? [19:55]
williamdunne Eh, looks like some code is happening at least [19:56]
williamdunne [19:56]
assbot MaidSafe · GitHub ... ( ) [19:56]
williamdunne this is *definitely* not an endorsement, I was simply wondering if they'd run with the money or if they were pretending to do something [19:56]
jurov maybe both [19:57]
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cazalla crashing this plane.. with NO SURVIVORS! [20:02]
assbot ... ( ) [20:02]
cazalla (hax0r3d planes) [20:02]
ag3nt_zer0 so, if structuralism and post-structuralism are reactions against "traditional" humanism, and "tradition" in general (which seems untenable given that I see Traditonal metaphysics as opposed to humanism), would post-post-structuralism be pro-traditionalism to some degree? [20:05]
ag3nt_zer0 jaberwocky philosophy [20:06]
williamdunne ;;seen indiancandy1 [20:09]
gribble indiancandy1 was last seen in #bitcoin-assets 2 days, 19 hours, 52 minutes, and 39 seconds ago: i watched her documentry [20:09]
williamdunne documentry [20:10]
williamdunne lol [20:10]
trinque williamdunne: did you ever get her keys squared? lol [20:10]
williamdunne Nope, she never came back while I was still in the UK [20:11]
trinque haha, just as well [20:11]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 31153 @ 0.00041001 = 12.773 BTC [+] {2} [20:12]
mats [20:12]
assbot Yifan Lu | Hacking the PS Vita ... ( ) [20:12]
trinque ag3nt_zer0: no offense but I have no idea what you just said [20:17]
trinque care to restate? [20:19]
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trinque ag3nt_zer0: structuralism smacks of "that stolen-from is not your stolen-from; it's all of ours" [20:20]
trinque an attempt of many to claim some aggregate which supercedes the individual [20:21]
trinque so if it's one of those, oldest swindle there is [20:22]
trinque I don't see anything new; talented people try to do interesting things, and others try to hold him back to varying degrees [20:22]
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ag3nt_zer0 trinque: well I had no idea what structuralism was but read something by mircer_popescu and at the end he said "welcome to the post-post- structuralist world that the internet has enabled" or something to that effect... that got me looking at structuralisma dn post structuralism and I was just confused because what I read was that structuralism was a reaction against humanism -and- tradition,, but as far as i understand, [20:28]
ag3nt_zer0 agains tradition [20:28]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 26060 @ 0.00041975 = 10.9387 BTC [+] {6} [20:29]
ag3nt_zer0 I guess I am just trying to grasy what mp was excited about... it did seem like he saw a lot of light in the development, philosophically speaking [20:29]
ag3nt_zer0 nevermind I don't know what the hell [20:29]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 94740 @ 0.00042304 = 40.0788 BTC [+] [20:30]
trinque ah, you'll have to ask him then [20:31]
ag3nt_zer0 anyway it's just nice to be in a room that has some good heads in it... [20:31]
trinque yep [20:34]
trinque ag3nt_zer0: how do you define traditionalism? [20:34]
ag3nt_zer0 trinque: shotgun definition: orientation toward a suprahuman or transcendental "dimension" [20:36]
ag3nt_zer0 Plato was a traditional philosopher [20:37]
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trinque it's interesting then to see humanism in contrast to that term, as humanism seems to imagine this platonic form of "human" which we all resemble, and are therefore intrinsically valuable somehow [20:39]
ag3nt_zer0 it is really perennial traditionalism, or perennialism that I am thinking of [20:40]
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ag3nt_zer0 well I suppose one way to english the difference is that a traditional orientation would be vertical (upward, toward the absolute, what not), vs horizontal (man is measure of all things and human contentment and "happiness" main goals) [20:41]
trinque I tend to be wary of systems that try to provide a taxonomy of human action [20:44]
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trinque ag3nt_zer0: I see roughly what you're pointing at; what do you make of it? [20:45]
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ag3nt_zer0 trinque: still making of it hehe [20:45]
punkman [20:46]
assbot ... ( ) [20:46]
asciilifeform in other news, happy 22nd june, actual-start-of-ww2-day, to all. [20:46]
trinque ag3nt_zer0: more pointedly, I tend to assume that where someone makes broad generalizations about "being", they've actually given me a command [20:46]
trinque and I tend to interpret it along those lines, rather than there actually existing some transcendental realm where concepts exist, dance about, generating meaning [20:47]
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ag3nt_zer0 trinque: well the stuff of matter must rest upon something, no? [20:49]
trinque thought that which matter rests upon was an open question [20:49]
ag3nt_zer0 trinque: are you a mathematical person? [20:51]
ag3nt_zer0 are you interested in mathematics? [20:51]
trinque I'm just a derpy guy with very little formal education. [20:51]
ag3nt_zer0 haha which means you have been subjected to less lobotomy [20:52]
trinque somewhat; though I will not tell the future students of the republic's university to do otherwise [20:52]
ag3nt_zer0 trinque: this is what's up my butt... maybe I am obsolete but my intellection seems to have plateaued here: [20:56]
assbot ... ( ) [20:56]
trinque ag3nt_zer0: thanks, I'll put it in my queue to read [20:58]
ag3nt_zer0 np [21:00]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 19269 @ 0.00041165 = 7.9321 BTC [-] [21:22]
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ben_vulpes so maybe the "doesn't work" vs "worked 3 days ago" is simply that you ran yours for a day and ben_vulpes ran his for fifteen minutes. << it just strikes me as unlikely that a node is going to connect to precisely the room i'm in and then bless me with a usable IP addr [21:34]
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trinque ag3nt_zer0: having read the foreward, looks interesting; I'll probably have it read in a few days [21:41]
trinque I will say that the author's metaphysical end of the world may not be the only one transpiring [21:41]
trinque the best crises are, I'm sure, a nice blend of irl and metaphysical destruction [21:42]
* assbot gives voice to ben_vulpes [21:44]
ben_vulpes << aye [21:44]
assbot Logged on 22-06-2015 19:07:07; ascii_field: i will remind readers that 'irc on butcher block' means a 100% reliance on seeds we enter in config. and also on specifying node's external ipv4. [21:44]
ben_vulpes << aye [21:44]
assbot Logged on 22-06-2015 19:07:18; ascii_field: which is, i suppose, as it should be. but means that: we need seeds. [21:44]
ben_vulpes i let my thermonuked node run all night, picked up not a single seed [21:45]
ben_vulpes !up Vexual [21:46]
* assbot gives voice to Vexual [21:46]
ben_vulpes !up SuchWow [21:53]
* assbot gives voice to SuchWow [21:53]
williamdunne Wow [21:54]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 89665 @ 0.00042304 = 37.9319 BTC [+] [21:57]
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ag3nt_zer0 trinque: yes the best apocalypse is total! [22:07]
ag3nt_zer0 haha [22:07]
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mats ha, just noticed asciilifeform's comment when reviewing my ratings [22:39]
mats for the record i am not a reverse engineer, my interests are narrowly tailored to exploitation [22:39]
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mircea_popescu ben_vulpes it would by the very fact of connecting. shows you its ip [22:50]
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mircea_popescu << yeah that's pretty great. [22:58]
assbot ... ( ) [22:58]
mircea_popescu ag3nt_zer0 ironically enough, im sure teaching will be fine. schools tho... hard to say. [23:00]
* assbot gives voice to thestringpuller [23:02]
thestringpuller What's this bullshit I'm hearing Gavin has 75% (supermajority) support of "the community" on his stupid BIP? [23:02]
mircea_popescu << ahh, such sweet logs await you in the logs. [23:03]
assbot Logged on 22-06-2015 23:01:12; ag3nt_zer0: so, if structuralism and post-structuralism are reactions against "traditional" humanism, and "tradition" in general (which seems untenable given that I see Traditonal metaphysics as opposed to humanism), would post-post-structuralism be pro-traditionalism to some degree? [23:03]
thestringpuller mircea_popescu: everytime you shoot this nigga in the head he comes back to fucking life. [23:03]
mircea_popescu down from the 100% he thought he had back in janaury ? [23:03]
mircea_popescu since we're making up numbers, i would say he needs to have at least 8megapercent support, or else his support won't scale. [23:03]
asciilifeform 'the chocolate ration has increased from 100 to 50g...' [23:04]
mircea_popescu funny that derps using numbers like retarded children use playdo should at any point expect to be engaged by sane people as if serious. [23:04]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 2520 @ 0.00041175 = 1.0376 BTC [-] [23:04]
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* asciilifeform unpacks crate of east german z80 clones, counts, puts on shelf [23:05]
thestringpuller this is what scares me! kids with guns are still dangerous (even if it just them shooting each other) [23:05]
asciilifeform thestringpuller: kids throwing own turds are only 'dangerous' to the orderlies, and this only if the latter forgot their mask [23:08]
thestringpuller in the even there are no orderlies? everyone gets pegged with poo? [23:10]
mod6 it's a shit blizzard, Randy. [23:11]
thestringpuller you need to get off the liquor mister leahy [23:11]
asciilifeform ben_vulpes, mod6, mircea_popescu, et al: 2 items for consideration: 1) what version string is to be used in the first public therealbitcoin nodes? the current one doesn't seem appropriate 2) anyone have existing nodes (of whatever variety) to 'get a light' from? i'd prefer these to 'wild' mysterymeat [23:12]
mod6 I am the liquor, bobandy. [23:12]
mod6 asciilifeform: 1) don't have anything to add to this discussion atm. although, we can have it again if you like. 2) I don't have anything going atm; The working nodes (on deb6) are down because i'm working on the gentoo gcc stuff right now. [23:15]
thestringpuller << for all the people using cloud as a buzzword [23:16]
mod6 The patch we got from that mailing list was from a different version for sure than 4.8.4 -- so i've had to hack it in by hand. gentoo is now applying the patch properly. and it's compiling as we speak. there is one caviat that I need to get over before I can test it though. [23:16]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform [23:17]
asciilifeform mod6: not looking for earth-shaking ideas, but release was, and the thing about to be fielded is clearly something quite else, imho needs a new name, at least new ver. 2) ~somebody~'s gotta have a seed [23:17]
mod6 ah there you go. [23:17]
asciilifeform and mircea_popescu answered 2! [23:17]
asciilifeform ty [23:17]
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ag3nt_zer0 mircea_popescu: yeah i am looking for alternatives that's why I asked about btc and ed... is this question a simple "where does the trust lie?"... btw you know those cuddle-puddle poddies they have all the students arranged in now? You know, the ingenious design that promotes cheating and distraction and love? Those are fucking MANDATORY in some districts... teachers couldn't sit them all facing forward if they wanted [23:19]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform 0.5.4, 0.6, whichever. [23:19]
mircea_popescu ag3nt_zer0 but have ye read the logs ? [23:19]
* asciilifeform still in the process of sawing out the irc sync mechanism. after this, will have to see whether the deterministic-build thing actually works (my last attempt using therealbitcoin's 'official' script died in agony on account of gcc strange) [23:19]
mod6 If we add in (officially the following): { Orphanage Thermonuke, TX Orphanage Amputation, { All DNS Thermonyukyooar Patches } }, I'd say that'd be a new milestone. And I'd propose to call it [23:19]
asciilifeform ^ why not. [23:19]
mircea_popescu works [23:19]
mircea_popescu tho kinda long imo. nobody should need 4 digits of versioning [23:20]
mircea_popescu unless, of course, they're from ms. then they need 8. or unl;ess they're running boost and qt. [23:20]
ag3nt_zer0 mircea_popescu: yes some, not enough, far from done... [23:20]
mod6 haha [23:20]
asciilifeform imho we oughta cleanly break with the gavinists' versioning sequence (e.g., 31337.1) [23:20]
mircea_popescu make it 5.4, good enough [23:20]
mircea_popescu why ? [23:20]
asciilifeform for one thing, would piss on their 'too old' detection mechanism [23:21]
asciilifeform widely deployed among unsuspecting folks [23:21]
mircea_popescu this is the sequence, logically. buncha derps made some rejected "versions", who cares what they numbered them as ? [23:21]
mircea_popescu folks should suspect more. [23:21]
asciilifeform was there a turdalicious 5.4 ? [23:21]
mircea_popescu what idiots did can not now, nor ever be a consideration. [23:21]
mod6 well, there isn't a previous version 5.4 -- stops after 5.3 and goes right to 6... so i guess that could work. [23:21]
mircea_popescu i'm not going to not name something america because obama. [23:21]
asciilifeform idk, what hogs do is in some circumstances a consideration at meat plant [23:21]
asciilifeform 5.4 works [23:22]
mircea_popescu so then, that. [23:22]
mod6 let's let ben weigh in here. [23:22]
asciilifeform again, i'm not about to fire it quite yet. probably needs another evening or two of massage. [23:22]
mod6 oh hey, i think my patch built ok... [23:23]
mod6 now to find out if it actually /works/ XD [23:23]
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mod6 if this works out, it'll be my first official gcc hack [23:25]
mod6 of course... there is the entire question on the table at this point about the "gentoo sanity" patches. [23:26]
mod6 before we cut a new milestone, i'd like to have this sucker up and running on gentoo with uclibc & patched with the "gentoo sanity" patches as well. [23:27]
mod6 then we can finally go off of a version that we support, etc. [23:27]
mod6 (basically, I'm just saying those patches should have been included in my list above) [23:27]
mod6 oh, and I keep hitting an additional problem aside from what the "gentoo sanitiy" resolves. i've been holding off submitting a patch for it until I can get this thing actually compiled and working. [23:28]
mod6 (have been having to add `#define __STDC_LIMIT_MACROS #include ` to the start of net.cpp, util.cpp, and wallet.cpp for some bizzare reason) [23:30]
asciilifeform ^ that's what i was talking about re: the deterministic build script [23:31]
mircea_popescu aha [23:31]
mircea_popescu anyway, this is pretty good progress and intel seems to indicate you're actually ahead of the curve, so, dun stress. [23:31]
* asciilifeform curious re: 'the curve' [23:32]
* asciilifeform wonders how many folks, toiling in forgotten pestholes, have walked same path [23:32]
mircea_popescu not that curve. the "o noes, 75% support" curve. [23:34]
mod6 eh, guess i spoke too soon: my patch comiled in nicely... and much much later in the entire compile process gcc hangs on libcpp: [23:38]
assbot ... ( ) [23:38]
mircea_popescu << do not define, or even think about, things in terms of other things. it is a horrible habit and a path to idiocy. [23:38]
assbot Logged on 22-06-2015 23:24:56; ag3nt_zer0: trinque: well I had no idea what structuralism was but read something by mircer_popescu and at the end he said "welcome to the post-post- structuralist world that the internet has enabled" or something to that effect... that got me looking at structuralisma dn post structuralism and I was just confused because what I read was that structuralism was a reaction against humanism -and- tradit [23:38]
mircea_popescu structuralism is the proposition that elements of human culture are defined by their relationships to other elements. [23:39]
mircea_popescu this is a complex point not accessible to the novice, and so nothing to be taken cavallierly. [23:39]
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mod6 maybe something in my few repeated builds hosed something up. the /work/ dir does seem to get blown away every time. [23:44]
mod6 smh [23:45]
mircea_popescu << this is idealism. and a very idealistic definition to boot, wtf is "orientation towards". like, when i take a piss i'm orientated towards the urinal ? [23:46]
assbot Logged on 22-06-2015 23:32:50; ag3nt_zer0: trinque: shotgun definition: orientation toward a suprahuman or transcendental "dimension" [23:46]
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mircea_popescu !up liquidassets [23:46]
-assbot- You voiced liquidassets for 30 minutes. [23:46]
* assbot gives voice to liquidassets [23:46]
* assbot gives voice to Hasimir [23:47]
Hasimir or to put it another way (re: structuralism), everything is interconnected ... [23:48]
ag3nt_zer0 mircea_popescu: yeah ok, after looking up structuralism, I was just hung up on the idea that if humanism is constructed on erroneous principles, and is structuralism is a reaction to humanism... then its just doubly wayward... [23:48]
mod6 here's the gcc 4.8.4 patch in question (gcc needs to be patched with Gentoo/uclibc/PIE patches beforehand): [23:48]
assbot ... ( ) [23:48]
mircea_popescu of the crooked timber of humanity no correct thing was ever made. [23:48]
mircea_popescu to say that any paradigm is flawed is not to say very much at all. [23:48]
ag3nt_zer0 so maybe with a post-post-post the ship eventually by chance faces due north [23:48]
mircea_popescu it'd be interesting if you can show how its flaws impede its intended results and how can they be cheaply remedied. [23:48]
Hasimir "these sorts of things have happened before and have always been attributable to human error." [23:49]
mod6 i'm gonna nuke that machine again and try to compile it again with the patch. see if it works. if not, i'll just see if it'll even compile gcc itself. [23:49]
mircea_popescu mod6 i didn't know la serenissima had nukes :D [23:49]
mod6 just of the bitwise persuasion :] [23:50]
mircea_popescu hehe [23:50]
mircea_popescu ag3nt_zer0 the entire thing started with the absolutely correct observation that words have i nfact no meanings, not anymore than any one website has google pagerank. a theoretical model was proposed where meaning of all words is produced through iteration, exactly in the same manner pr is calculated (and this is why google used to be notable - it implemented a major tenet of culture at the time) [23:52]
mod6 so one of the reasons i'm being kidna hard-headed about 4.8.4; i'm worried that with a downlevel version such as 3.7 or whatever, that there might not even exist a set of patches (such as Gentoo/uclibc/PIE) that are required for Gentoo -- might be a whole seperate ball of wax & problems. [23:52]
mircea_popescu this model is very stupid, notwithstanding interesting results it produces in some cases, and the failure of google exactly illustrates the failures of the model. [23:53]
mod6 so if we get this one to work, i think that's our best/easiest path, currently. [23:53]
mircea_popescu post-post-structuralism is in no sense and to no degree a return to "Traditionalism", which is strictly distinct from the humanism the original structuralism was supposedly a reaction to. it is merely the observation of coexistence : the stupid generate their pseudo-meanings out of iteration, the smart (i've called these before language creators) have thei own dictionaries, the two categories interplay in praxis. [23:54]
mircea_popescu (praxis being the usage of a language, or more properly, representational system) [23:54]
mircea_popescu and traditionalism, for the record, is the fundamentally correct observation that there can not be such a thing as a new phenomenon, and the fundamentally flawed proposition that for this reason, it is more important to interpret phenomena through history than through any other lens. [23:55]
mircea_popescu stuff like taleb is a much more damaging criticism of traditionalism than structuralism ever was or could aspire to be. [23:56]
mircea_popescu (and humanism is the proposition, beyond naive, that there exists an universal aspect to everything which is immediately accessible to people. if this sounds stupid well... it's because humanism, like any socialist ideology, is made by the stupid for the use of the stupid) [23:57]
mircea_popescu at its core, humanism is the proposition not that there exists a saint peter by the pearly gates, nor that he would understand your language, but that ~you~ would understand ~his~, [23:58]
mircea_popescu or for that matter even recognize pearly gates if you saw 'em. [23:58]
mircea_popescu which is exactly contradictory to the hermetic tradition, nothing else. (which no, is not simply "jewish") [23:59]
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