Forum logs for 21 Oct 2014

Sunday, 24 November, Year 11 d.Tr. | Author: Mircea Popescu

mircea_popescu	cazalla but when you quote what the man says whle the man's puffing up his business, you are in fact publishing paid pr.	[00:00]
mircea_popescu	whether you get paid or not.	[00:00]
cazalla	but i should've mentioned the non existent vol kraken has	[00:00]
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mod6	ah. yeah, recall some mil stuff he talked about. been a while. i liked his angle on things.	[00:00]
mod6	and he was teh grammar nazi & had a love for beating trolls.	[00:01]
mircea_popescu	;;rated vragnaroda	[00:01]
gribble	You rated user vragnaroda on Sat Sep 22 16:11:20 2012, with a rating of 2, and supplied these additional notes: when he's a naxi who keeps corecteing ppls grammer 24/7.	[00:01]
mircea_popescu	that was an actual quote.	[00:01]
mod6	haha. yup. :)	[00:01]
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mircea_popescu	cazalla anyway, you can mention the time they lost customer deposits, too, round it all up, since it's there.	[00:02]
kakobrekla	fuck the deposits nice logo	[00:04]
cazalla	when did that happen	[00:04]
mircea_popescu	cazalla few months ago, they had this embarassing moment when they sent the same deposit address to anyone asking for a deposit address for a day or two	[00:04]
mircea_popescu	ended up with ~100 btc in deposits they couldn't properly credit.	[00:04]
kakobrekla	hm i have a different recollection but could as well be wrong	[00:05]
kakobrekla	could be it was a separate incident.	[00:06]
kakobrekla	but anyway, if you need to 'balance' things, you can always link bash :)	[00:06]
mircea_popescu	kakobrekla how did yours go ?	[00:07]
kakobrekla	now that i started to think about it it - the more i think the less i recall	[00:07]
mircea_popescu	heh.	[00:08]
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bounce	all that's needed to put someone at a crime scene today is an old hairbrush, or a worn shirt, or anything. << oh yes. there was this mass-everything criminal, showed up everywhere, who eventually turned out to be a sloppy worker in a dna swab factory	[00:08]
kakobrekla	honestly, they still have issues all the time	[00:08]
kakobrekla	hard to keep up whats the latest problem	[00:08]
*	assbot gives voice to pete_dushenski	[00:09]
pete_dushenski	howdy!	[00:09]
mircea_popescu	hey p.	[00:09]
kakobrekla	also i am unable to find anything written re that incident	[00:10]
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pete_dushenski	mircea_popescu heya wd on that latest usgaving piece :)	[00:11]
mircea_popescu	kakobrekla mpoe-pr told kraken pr to quit over their trying to paper over that incident.	[00:11]
mircea_popescu	https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=290799.msg4924847#msg4924847	[00:12]
assbot	[ANN] KRAKEN.COM - Exchange Now Open with USD, EUR, BTC, LTC, XRP, NMC, XDG	[00:12]
PinkPosixPXE	Good, almost done, I had to jump in a work meeting to discuss the Bash Shellshock vuln, and repatching some systems.. But I gave BingoBoingo an update, and will be sending it off shortly. It's my first shot at this, so I hope it's not too egregious.	[00:12]
pete_dushenski	fwiw our ddos buddy hit contravex with 30mbit/s for a whopping 30 mins.	[00:12]
cazalla	mircea_popescu, the no vol i'll include but this missing 100 and same deposit address i can find nothing of	[00:12]
PinkPosixPXE	mircea_popescu: ^	[00:12]
mircea_popescu	and it was 600ish bitcoin they admitted to	[00:12]
mircea_popescu	cazalla link above :p	[00:12]
cazalla	ty	[00:13]
mircea_popescu	PinkPosixPXE ok ok	[00:13]
mircea_popescu	;;unrate PinkPosixPXE	[00:13]
gribble	Successfully removed your rating for PinkPosixPXE.	[00:13]
mircea_popescu	don't go around trying to buy ratings, it's criminal.	[00:13]
kakobrekla	yes rings bells mircea_popescu .	[00:13]
PinkPosixPXE	Yea, that was my mistake, the joke was in poor taste, and I also misunderstood the ranking system a bit. Sorry about that.	[00:13]
mircea_popescu	poor taste never got anyone in trouble here.	[00:14]
mircea_popescu	but some things are sacred	[00:14]
kakobrekla	and natural balances of the assiverse were restored	[00:14]
PinkPosixPXE	I will openly admit I am still learning, and new, but will try to avoid putting my foot in my mouth too much :P. I've combed over all the wiki's for bt-otc and bt-assets, and am going through the 6 months of logs as I find time.	[00:15]
mircea_popescu	what do you do for a living anyway ?	[00:15]
pete_dushenski	;;later tell BingoBoingo daniel "speeks" ? i'm not the only one who noticed this...	[00:15]
gribble	The operation succeeded.	[00:15]
mircea_popescu	pete_dushenski did the 30mbps do anything ?	[00:15]
PinkPosixPXE	I'm one of the Senior Linux/Unix Admins for a publishing company.	[00:16]
mircea_popescu	a hey. good for you.	[00:16]
BingoBoingo	pete_dushenski: Where I spell ungood this time?	[00:16]
pete_dushenski	mircea_popescu i'm told the site was down but it was while i was sleeping. it was back up when i awoke.	[00:16]
pete_dushenski	so not much to speek of...	[00:17]
mircea_popescu	lol	[00:17]
PinkPosixPXE	Thank you much, and thank you for the unrate, and clarifying the matter :).	[00:17]
mircea_popescu	PinkPosixPXE you know people have been clamoring for a bitcoin host for a while.	[00:17]
pete_dushenski	http://www.contravex.com/2014/10/20/software-doesnt-fail-socialism-does/	[00:18]
assbot	Software Doesn’t Fail. Socialism Does. \| Contravex: A blog by Pete Dushenski	[00:18]
pete_dushenski	^cuz rip penguirker	[00:18]
mircea_popescu	ahahaha didja run off with the niquette piece ?	[00:19]
pete_dushenski	...maybe	[00:20]
pete_dushenski	plus some money logs!	[00:21]
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pete_dushenski	http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/2jgmbm/we_won_without_trying/	[00:22]
assbot	We won without trying : Bitcoin	[00:22]
mircea_popescu	good, stuff needs to breathe.	[00:23]
pete_dushenski	in through the nose, out through the mouth.	[00:23]
mircea_popescu	"All those haters that come in here with economic models and charts telling us it's impossible; all the hit pieces penned by pros like Krugman telling us to 'grow up' - none of them really quite grasp that there could possibly be a group of people who have the audacity to sit around their hallowed poker table without needing to win."	[00:24]
mircea_popescu	ahem.	[00:24]
mircea_popescu	"bitcoin won without the reddit doge derps trying"	[00:24]
mircea_popescu	.... right. so ?	[00:24]
pete_dushenski	so majick!	[00:24]
mircea_popescu	let's pretend like things are other things and stuff!1	[00:24]
pete_dushenski	BingoBoingo maybe this is qorth a qntra ? http://www.tonewsto.com/2014/10/jp-morgans-jamie-dimon-bitcoin-will-try.html	[00:25]
assbot	JP Morgan’s Jamie Dimon: Bitcoin Will “Try to Eat Our Lunch” \| Cryptocurrency And Bitcoin News information on other digital currencies.	[00:25]
pete_dushenski	mircea_popescu reddit is bitcoin and vice versa so bitcoin winning is because of derpage!	[00:25]
BingoBoingo	pete_dushenski: You want to give newswriting a try? It's fun.	[00:26]
pete_dushenski	i did for a few years with the car industry.	[00:26]
mircea_popescu	lol isn't he a tad late ? but yeah	[00:26]
pete_dushenski	i had fun with it too.	[00:26]
mircea_popescu	pete_dushenski so write it up.	[00:27]
pete_dushenski	yes mlad	[00:27]
pete_dushenski	:)	[00:27]
mircea_popescu	lol	[00:28]
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kakobrekla	PinkPosixPXE you know people have been clamoring for a bitcoin host for a while. < meh the only way you can do anything in this direction is to be another reseller	[00:29]
mircea_popescu	kakobrekla best i can tell, all someone needs to do is a) be a sysadmin and b) colocate a few boxes in a decent dc	[00:29]
mircea_popescu	then sell space.	[00:29]
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kakobrekla	adding another liability in the chain	[00:30]
mircea_popescu	a liability could be a responsibility.	[00:30]
mircea_popescu	if it's someone you trust then it's someone you trust.	[00:30]
mod6	yea, we need The Crypt like in cryptonomicon	[00:31]
mircea_popescu	colocate in locked boxes, don't allow the dc or anyone else any sort of access to the boxes, kivm or whatever	[00:31]
mircea_popescu	thus creating a single point of failure. which people can evaluate for trust.	[00:31]
kakobrekla	btc people wont pay for premium host	[00:31]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 23800 @ 0.00074197 = 17.6589 BTC [+] {2}	[00:31]
kakobrekla	cheap dirtbags	[00:31]
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mircea_popescu	kakobrekla listen, people like the amateur ddos guy will be helping with this.	[00:31]
kakobrekla	by ddosing?	[00:32]
mircea_popescu	consider yest, qntra was up but say bingo's blog was down. well ? what's he to do ?	[00:32]
mircea_popescu	and yeah he'd pay.	[00:32]
mircea_popescu	yep	[00:32]
kakobrekla	average blogger cant afford any but free hosting	[00:34]
mircea_popescu	blogger that can't afford any but free hosting should stfu and turn the fries.	[00:34]
mircea_popescu	the idea that poor people have something to say boggles.	[00:34]
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kakobrekla	dunno, with hosting providers having the margins same as the fees of bitcoin exchanges	[00:36]
kakobrekla	there isnt much space	[00:36]
mircea_popescu	!up dr_love	[00:37]
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mircea_popescu	kakobrekla i specifically recall say asciilifeform asking for one.	[00:37]
mircea_popescu	it's rare that you get the customers asking for you, usually people have to create markets	[00:37]
dr_love	mircea_popescu: thanks.	[00:37]
mircea_popescu	sure. who're you ?	[00:37]
kakobrekla	how did bitvps do?	[00:37]
dr_love	is there any value in a provably fair bitcoin lottery?	[00:38]
mircea_popescu	great, up until rg went on a drinking binge or w/e it was he did	[00:38]
mircea_popescu	dr_love define lottery ?	[00:38]
jurov	kakobrekla bitvps went down in flames	[00:38]
jurov	and kicked its customers at first occassion	[00:38]
kakobrekla	classic problem of small providers	[00:39]
dr_love	mircea_popescu: when you need to buy a ticket to have a 1 in xxx,xxx,xxx chance to win the jackpot	[00:39]
mircea_popescu	in short i'd put bitvps down to poor management rather than poor fundamentals.	[00:39]
mircea_popescu	dr_love how is this different from a dice site ?	[00:39]
kakobrekla	when one customer will threaten all the seven you got	[00:39]
BingoBoingo	dr_love: I'd recommend picking a fiat lottery and starting a BitBet on its drawing	[00:40]
mircea_popescu	kakobrekla that's a flawed premise. collective security, baby.	[00:40]
dr_love	mircea_popescu: player's perception? the jackpot grows huge after a few rollovers	[00:40]
kakobrekla	like cloudflare!	[00:40]
mircea_popescu	dr_love so it's a dice meets gem site ?	[00:40]
dr_love	well yeah, I was just looking at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EuroMillions#Distribution_of_revenue, where 50% goes to shit	[00:41]
assbot	EuroMillions - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia	[00:41]
dr_love	a Bitcoin lottery could do much better than that	[00:41]
mircea_popescu	dr_love basically it's a marketing wrapper on top of a dice site. best work as a promoter then i guess.	[00:41]
jurov	mircea_popescu: how do you imagine economic model of such hosting? if we put everything onnto one basked and then one ddos burns $100/week of bandwidth, who'll pay?	[00:42]
dr_love	so you're saying all gambling is dice, it being the best way to put it out there?	[00:42]
jurov	*basket	[00:42]
BingoBoingo	dr_love: Write a bitbet "Between XX/YY/ZZZ and AA/BB/CCC the sum of the numbers drawn in a powerball drawing will be Divisible by 37" put 1 BTC on yes, wait for people to take the other side when they do the math.	[00:42]
dr_love	*the best, most efficient wrapper	[00:42]
mircea_popescu	jurov a) most dcs that are even half decent don't charge for ddos ; b) those that do rent you fixed pipe anyway	[00:42]
kakobrekla	100$ a week should not be a number of importance	[00:42]
mircea_popescu	so i dun get the question.	[00:42]
kakobrekla	or you are doing it wrong	[00:43]
mircea_popescu	buy 10gpps, put a rack in there, forget it.	[00:43]
dr_love	BingoBoingo: that is interesting	[00:43]
jurov	so you'll gonna having customers that dwarf the $100 figure right from the start?	[00:43]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14904 @ 0.00074128 = 11.048 BTC [-]	[00:43]
BingoBoingo	dr_love: BitBet only takes 1% and most people who bet there can math	[00:43]
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jurov	is asciilifeform actually paying so much for his blog?	[00:44]
jurov	*wanting to pay	[00:44]
mircea_popescu	jurov so if a business isn't insta-cash positive it shouldn't exist ?	[00:44]
kakobrekla	no, he didnt get ddosed & kicked out yet :)	[00:44]
BingoBoingo	jurov: Well... if he doesn't have any other way to spend BTC it might be their only way to avoid burial with him.	[00:44]
mircea_popescu	start with oh i dunno, 10k in venture capital	[00:44]
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m4rCsi	malaimo_ mariorz mats_cd03 MCM-Mike menahem_ midnightmagic MiningBuddy- mircea_popescu mius mixdio_ MobGod mod6 Mrstickball mthreat	[00:46]
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mircea_popescu	!up MCM-Mike	[00:46]
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jurov	i'm a dc noob... how much is such a pipe?	[00:46]
BingoBoingo	http://www.missilebases.com/#!communications-bunker-paris-mo/c1kkg << prototype for BTC datacenter?	[00:47]
assbot	Missile bases, communication bunkers and underground properties	[00:47]
dr_love	mircea_popescu: so dice is the cutting edge in gambling, you're saying	[00:47]
mircea_popescu	jurov depends a lot where and for how long you're getting it, really.	[00:47]
BingoBoingo	dr_love: Well dice is the prototype for all of the pure chance games	[00:47]
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dr_love	btw, why aren't you running JD already?	[00:47]
mircea_popescu	cuz dooglus is not answering emails ?	[00:47]
PinkPosixPXE	There are some BTC only vps providers out there that I've gleamed, but haven't dug in.. Would be interesting to look into, I've got all the experience needed, and a few others I know are vps sellers/resellers (not that I'd recommend many of them, heh.. but I just find their style a bit sloppy).	[00:47]
dr_love	fucker	[00:47]
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dr_love	what a waste :(	[00:48]
mircea_popescu	hey, his thing.	[00:48]
PinkPosixPXE	brb, gonna finish this novel up and send it to BingoBoingo.	[00:48]
BingoBoingo	Oh a long one!	[00:48]
mircea_popescu	jesus, qntra chick lit now.	[00:48]
*	jurov is pondering http://www.maxdedicated.com/10GBPS-Unmetered-Server.html	[00:49]
assbot	10GBPS Unmetered Dedicated Servers Windows and Linux Cpanel PLESK WHM	[00:49]
jurov	$600/mo +	[00:50]
PinkPosixPXE	Well.. since it's my first, I figure you can at least cut and scrap what you don't like. But I wanted to include as much as I could, didn't realize it'd be so long, heh..	[00:50]
mircea_popescu	jurov that's a reseller.	[00:50]
jurov	just ballparking	[00:50]
mircea_popescu	should be more or less in the $100 range that you were discussing.	[00:50]
dr_love	BingoBoingo: what's "exciting" in lotto is the huge, lifechanging jackpot. dice is much more real in that sense, so the conversion rate might just be bigger in lotto	[00:51]
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mircea_popescu	but very congested places it can run significantly more, and some (esp new) places may be giving it away free for a long commit	[00:51]
mircea_popescu	dr_love understand : either the player wins his own money (ie, risks 1 cent, may make 100 btc 1:10000 times)	[00:51]
bounce	"13 acres" parces size and "8200 sqft usable, underground space". seems like a rather small bunker for that plot of land. so essentially buying a farm with some stray concrete in the soil?	[00:51]
bounce	s/parces/parcel/	[00:51]
mircea_popescu	or else he wins other's money. to get a jackpot large you need a bunch of idiots to play a bad odds gamre for a long time.	[00:51]
mircea_popescu	they may just as well play dice in that interval for better EV	[00:51]
BingoBoingo	bounce: Well more parcel for smaller bunker means more surface area for missiles to miss	[00:52]
dr_love	I do understand that, however people are perceiving it differently and positive EV tickets are a few jackpot rollovers away	[00:52]
mircea_popescu	bounce 8k sqft underground is a respectable wine cellar.	[00:52]
mircea_popescu	dr_love you can still run it like BingoBoingo suggested, for no extra cost, if you got the "people" in question	[00:53]
bounce	what was it used for, missiles?	[00:53]
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BingoBoingo	bounce: That one ATT long lines.	[00:55]
BingoBoingo	Another interesting candidate for DC use http://www.missilebases.com/#!storage-depot-ne-kansas/c1d1o	[00:55]
assbot	Missile bases, communication bunkers and underground properties	[00:55]
BingoBoingo	"Storage Depot"	[00:56]
mircea_popescu	BingoBoingo pretty much the only thing about a dc location is if it's on a ring or not.	[00:56]
mircea_popescu	is there one in kansas ?	[00:56]
bounce	that's positive, means presumably already optimised for sticking in racked gear, except probably not for the density and consequent heat required these days	[00:57]
dr_love	what if you fund it for it to be neutral EV from t0 with a little jackpot kickstarter fund on the side? you can surely make it back if you grab enough attention with the initial offering	[00:57]
BingoBoingo	That one seems to be by KC, so probably feasible to get fiber from a few different directions	[00:57]
bounce	might be more useful to shoot for two of those connected to each other, and stick some fibre in the connecting tubes. maybe check if there's still copper in there and sell it.	[00:58]
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kakobrekla	speaking of bunkers http://www.cyberbunker.com/web/swat.php	[00:59]
kakobrekla	heh	[00:59]
assbot	CyberBunker DataCenters	[00:59]
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mircea_popescu	http://personalpages.manchester.ac.uk/staff/m.dodge/cybergeography/atlas/williamscommunications_large.gif << seems west kansas should be ok	[00:59]
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BingoBoingo	http://www.missilebases.com/#!nike-indiana/c1aq8 << Missile Magazine to home conversion	[01:00]
assbot	Missile bases, communication bunkers and underground properties	[01:00]
mircea_popescu	dr_love hence the "gem website" reference.	[01:00]
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bounce	cb3rob and friends are complete nitwits, sadly. claim to've snagged the thing "with sovereignty" then allows a bunch of idiots to burn the place down with a meth lab and on top of that lets the (soi-disant foreign) authorities in.	[01:01]
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mircea_popescu	Once the SWAT team reached the bunker's blast doors, they 'knock' to announce their presence. It is unclear exactly what they say, as no sound is recorded from the surveillance system. CyberBunker is equipped with an advanced Intruder Detection System (IDS), however due to a testing drill the previous night the IDS system was accidentally left in the inactive mode. Two SWAT officers are seen to hit the blast door of th	[01:02]
mircea_popescu	e bunker with a battering ram. It must not have occurred to the officers that the blast doors were designed to withstand a 20 megaton nuclear explosion from close range. When the SWAT team realized that the door was not being opened for them, they throw flashbangs and take other actions to draw attention. The surveillance footage shows quite a lot of activity at this point. On the other side of the blast doors, no one	[01:02]
mircea_popescu	inside the bunker noticed anything unusual. The SWAT team did some further investigating, and appears to be making phone calls. Finally the SWAT team realized what occurred when City Hall attempted to breach the blast doors. Apparently recognizing that they had gone overboard on their raid, the SWAT team decided to go home.	[01:02]
mircea_popescu	aww.	[01:02]
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mircea_popescu	dat phonecall lol. like a chick stood up on a date, only lulzier.	[01:03]
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bounce	that is the upside to "forgetting" to turn on your "advanced surveillance system" on your cold war bunker. "what, swat tried to raid us? didn't notice"	[01:03]
undata	that is beautiful	[01:03]
mircea_popescu	"CyberBunker's lawyers later discovered that the police had indeed sent officers to the bunker for what they claimed was a “routine check” and that nothing out of the ordinary had taken place. When CyberBunker's lawyers suggested that the surveillance footage could be put online, the police department then quickly offered to pay to repair the damage caused to the fence.	[01:04]
mircea_popescu	After paying € 8088.- euros to CyberBunker, nothing further was heard from the SWAT team."	[01:04]
mircea_popescu	ahem. shitheads.	[01:04]
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BingoBoingo	!up dr_love	[01:04]
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BingoBoingo	!up Diablo-D3	[01:04]
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kakobrekla	at least they admi it	[01:04]
Diablo-D3	mircea_popescu: that was proven to be completely false	[01:04]
kakobrekla	admit	[01:04]
Diablo-D3	someone called their local cops	[01:04]
Diablo-D3	it never happened	[01:04]
kakobrekla	yeah like cops will say "yeah we are such dorks"	[01:05]
kakobrekla	not saying its true story, just your argument is meh	[01:05]
Diablo-D3	kakobrekla: they did a lot of research into it	[01:05]
Diablo-D3	and theres zero proof it ever happened	[01:05]
undata	"It was ruled a suicide with 4 shots to the back of the head."	[01:05]
kakobrekla	reeshurrdurrch	[01:05]
Diablo-D3	so cyberbunker is just another scam	[01:06]
undata	Diablo-D3: citation	[01:06]
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mircea_popescu	"they". who ?	[01:06]
Diablo-D3	undata: well thats the problem	[01:06]
Diablo-D3	undata: cyberbunker needs to cite that it actually happened	[01:06]
Diablo-D3	and by their own admission, they wont post the video	[01:06]
Diablo-D3	but its not because they were paid off by the police to hide it	[01:07]
Diablo-D3	its because there isnt one	[01:07]
mircea_popescu	it could be, sure.	[01:07]
mircea_popescu	or it could not be. so far, word against word.	[01:07]
Diablo-D3	people were even offering money for proof	[01:08]
Diablo-D3	nothing ever came up	[01:08]
mircea_popescu	"people" "money", meh.	[01:08]
Diablo-D3	this was big news a few years back	[01:08]
undata	Diablo-D3: yeah, I want citations in both directions	[01:08]
Diablo-D3	undata: well, Im not going to cite something that long ago	[01:08]
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Diablo-D3	I dont think the scam is still operating	[01:08]
mircea_popescu	so basically you had nothing to say ?	[01:08]
undata	Diablo-D3: you're claiming "scam" hence citation or gtfo	[01:09]
Diablo-D3	mircea_popescu: I already said it	[01:09]
Diablo-D3	it was debunked.	[01:09]
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mircea_popescu	except it wasn't.	[01:09]
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Diablo-D3	no proof it ever happened, they refused to provide it	[01:09]
Diablo-D3	so it never happened	[01:09]
mircea_popescu	right.	[01:09]
mircea_popescu	good enough.	[01:09]
mircea_popescu	in other news, http://sarademcutoti.files.wordpress.com/2012/08/424219_347892685293888_904705219_n.jpg	[01:10]
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mircea_popescu	ahhh. hey, am i the only strega fan here ?	[01:12]
mircea_popescu	;;google liquore strega	[01:12]
gribble	Strega (liqueur) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: ; Liquore Strega Herbal Liqueur Profile and Cocktail Recipes - Cocktails: ; Liquore Strega : Strega Alberti Benevento S.p.A.:	[01:12]
dr_love	mircea_popescu: is it off topic if I ask you what do you think of jarmusch, the filmmaker? any fav movies?	[01:12]
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mircea_popescu	dr_love nothing's offtopic anyway. kakobrekla's favourite film director.	[01:12]
kakobrekla	certainly one of the fav yes.	[01:13]
mircea_popescu	kakobrekla who else ?	[01:13]
dr_love	I'm just starting to discover him, watched the limits of control recently	[01:14]
mircea_popescu	;;google trilema coffee and cigarettes	[01:14]
gribble	Coffee Talk Table of Contents - Columbia Evangelical Seminary: ; UI Critical Thinking Handbook: Chapter Seven -- Theory: ; Topic tags for the tutor2u Economics blog:	[01:14]
mircea_popescu	hm	[01:14]
kakobrekla	nothing out of the ordinary list. kubrick and such.	[01:14]
kakobrekla	and from 'local' ones, kustarica	[01:15]
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*	Adlai liked ghost dog	[01:17]
mircea_popescu	anyway, i thought i had written about coffee and ciggs. seems not ?!	[01:18]
dr_love	you should	[01:19]
kakobrekla	dr_love : from him dead man and the limits of control	[01:19]
kakobrekla	dead men being lulzy as fuck	[01:19]
mircea_popescu	kakobrekla o you didn't like coffee and ciggs ?	[01:20]
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kakobrekla	i dont recall if i watched it?	[01:20]
dr_love	kakobrekla, what about only lovers left alive	[01:20]
kakobrekla	i havent seen it	[01:21]
kakobrekla	seems a new thing	[01:21]
kakobrekla	limits of control is a metaphysical art movie.	[01:21]
mircea_popescu	!up morgan-freeman_	[01:21]
-assbot-	You voiced morgan-freeman_ for 30 minutes.	[01:21]
*	assbot gives voice to morgan-freeman_	[01:21]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 35225 @ 0.00074068 = 26.0905 BTC [-] {4}	[01:22]
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morgan-freeman_	hey guys, did you see this epic use of bitcoin? www.shitexpress.com	[01:23]
dr_love	kakobrekla: ye, I like the way his movies aren't intended as message films. it's more like art, really	[01:23]
morgan-freeman_	i am literally laughing my shit off	[01:23]
kakobrekla	morgan-freeman_ now you only need to ship it.	[01:24]
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morgan-freeman_	to shit it and ship it	[01:24]
kakobrekla	dr_love myea sort of. one more than others naturally.	[01:24]
mircea_popescu	morgan-freeman_ let me guess, you can mail shit to people ?	[01:25]
kakobrekla	correct	[01:25]
mircea_popescu	new way to stegano, i guess.	[01:26]
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morgan-freeman_	well, I don't know but there is only a horse manure as a choice.. once I saw an elephant shit on one site, but no bitcoins	[01:26]
bounce	why are you spamming this in as many channels as you can?	[01:26]
mircea_popescu	yeah, morgan-freeman_ is this your site ?	[01:26]
dr_love	what do you guys listen to?	[01:27]
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mircea_popescu	http://virtualglobetrotting.com/map/paul-krugmans-house/view/bing/ << send krugman one lb, i'll pay you once he gets it.	[01:27]
assbot	Paul Krugman's house (Bing Maps) - Virtual Globetrotting	[01:27]
kakobrekla	>At the end of a tree-lined driveway in the small Dutch town of Goes sits a hulking gray bunker, a communications center built by the Dutch military in 1955. Its 60 rooms are mostly bare save for a few relics, including a cinderblock-size phone and a giant board that used to record nuclear attack alert levels across Europe. There’s no sign of the high-tech nerve center depicted on the CyberBunker website: no racks of supersecur	[01:28]
kakobrekla	e servers; no underground swimming pool. No Sven Olaf Kamphuis either.	[01:28]
kakobrekla	lol	[01:29]
kakobrekla	apparently a legit company bought this fake company bunker.	[01:29]
kakobrekla	legit hosting company	[01:29]
kakobrekla	dunno	[01:29]
mircea_popescu	haha link ?	[01:29]
kakobrekla	all is weird	[01:29]
morgan-freeman_	bounce: I don't spam! my friends told me to put it on #bitcoin-assets and #bitcoin-otc - I've never seen these two channels so I tried	[01:29]
kakobrekla	http://www.businessweek.com/articles/2013-04-04/cyberbunker-hacking-as-performance-art	[01:29]
assbot	CyberBunker: Hacking as Performance Art - Businessweek	[01:29]
bounce	who're these friends of yours?	[01:29]
kakobrekla	“It was all Photoshop,” says Guido Blaauw, general manager of the bunker’s current tenant, a company called Bunkerinfra Datacenters, which plans to turn the site into a data facility for corporate and government clients. The building was full of junk when Bunkerinfra started renovations two years ago. “It took us three months to clean it out,” Blaauw says. Kamphuis lived there for a few years in the early 2000s, sub	[01:29]
kakobrekla	letting a room from its owner at that time. According to Blaauw, Kamphuis seized on the image of the bunker as a marketing tool to attract Russian and Chinese clients who wanted a secure place to host their websites. “It’s time to put an end to the fairy tale,” Blaauw says.	[01:29]
mircea_popescu	o hey.	[01:30]
morgan-freeman_	bounce: just my friends :-) but I suppose some of their friends created the website	[01:31]
bounce	that isn't really an answer.	[01:31]
morgan-freeman_	bounce: or they saw it today on producthunt.com	[01:31]
undata	:-) One weird trick to mail shit to your friends! Must see!	[01:31]
BingoBoingo	morgan-freeman_: How is your shit better than the shit I can by by the truckload at the farm down the road for a few dollars a ton?	[01:32]
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dr_love	I know a few people who I look up to, who have bad taste in art. I always wondered if there's a correlation of some sort	[01:33]
kakobrekla	bing'o'shit express?	[01:33]
mircea_popescu	dr_love some pretty girls are terrible lays, too.	[01:33]
mircea_popescu	just how the world works.	[01:33]
mircea_popescu	lol bing'o'shit express now that sounds like business.	[01:33]
BingoBoingo	kakobrekla: Well if you are mailing shit why get clean clinically presentd shit from the Internet while there's piles of shit Dairy farms are selling which has been stewing all summer.	[01:34]
*	assbot removes voice from dr_love	[01:34]
*	assbot removes voice from Diablo-D3	[01:34]
kakobrekla	hmm	[01:35]
kakobrekla	for more effect you could just modify a 'jokerbox' to 'shitbox'	[01:35]
kakobrekla	illustration not necessary.	[01:36]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 36621 @ 0.00074029 = 27.1102 BTC [-]	[01:36]
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mircea_popescu	!up dr_love	[01:39]
-assbot-	You voiced dr_love for 30 minutes.	[01:39]
*	assbot gives voice to dr_love	[01:39]
dr_love	means it works the other way too? retards can show appreciation for good art?	[01:41]
mircea_popescu	sure.	[01:41]
mircea_popescu	dogs loive music all the time, too.	[01:41]
dr_love	or shit artists can create good art, from time to time	[01:42]
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dr_love	illustrious example: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6KQoHKkZZkA	[01:43]
assbot	GEORGE MICHAEL Spinning the wheel - YouTube	[01:43]
dr_love	sorry, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qSoMTkn_Qfg	[01:45]
assbot	George Michael - Spinning The Wheel - YouTube	[01:45]
fluffypony	I'm 14 and what is this	[01:47]
[]bot	Bet placed: 2 BTC for No on "Bitcoin to rise above $600 before December" http://bitbet.us/bet/1055/ Odds: 25(Y):75(N) by coin, 27(Y):73(N) by weight. Total bet: 12.8359 BTC. Current weight: 64,561.	[01:47]
bounce	oh. you went over to the dark side too then?	[01:49]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 23753 @ 0.00074005 = 17.5784 BTC [-] {2}	[01:56]
asciilifeform	jurov: is asciilifeform actually paying so much for his blog << machine is wanted for nosuchlabs.com - currently home to 'phuctor.' i've an astonishingly vast quantity of donated pubkeys - job that wants real, vs. virtual, cpu to crunch (and plentiful memory)	[01:56]
asciilifeform	bunker << if against usg - grave. marauders - sure, so long as you have independent air, water, fuel, food supplies.	[01:56]
asciilifeform	if you're a very special customer, they'll pump in sarin/vx.	[01:57]
bounce	what sort of cpu do you need? would gpu do?	[01:57]
asciilifeform	these were never designed to withstand physical attack by men (vs nuke)	[01:57]
asciilifeform	bounce: no	[01:57]
asciilifeform	my father, as a private in soviet army, was trained, like many others, to take out 'silo' type missile installations with ordinary grenade. (how? jam the door by propping small explosive, e.g., grenade, under one rail. tricky bit is to get to the damn thing, across an ocean and under guard...)	[01:58]
asciilifeform	but hypothetical enemy in our modern scenario has no problem getting to the door.	[01:59]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16130 @ 0.00073892 = 11.9188 BTC [-] {2}	[02:02]
cazalla	"blah blah new australian exchange is where investors, traders and everyday people come to buy and sell Bitcoin." today's vol 21 btc	[02:02]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6570 @ 0.0007382 = 4.85 BTC [-]	[02:03]
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BingoBoingo	asciilifeform: Who ever said anything about bunker having meat operating inside?	[02:03]
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kakobrekla	isnt cutting the net pipe the first and the last thing ?	[02:04]
BingoBoingo	^ that	[02:04]
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BingoBoingo	But who knows? maybe drilling netpipe to china will be feasible eventually	[02:05]
kakobrekla	even if you have a netpipe straight down its sill easy to undercut it	[02:08]
kakobrekla	:	[02:08]
BingoBoingo	Yeah	[02:09]
mircea_popescu	kakobrekla through earth pipe will never happen	[02:09]
BingoBoingo	It might	[02:09]
mircea_popescu	mantle movements and besides, it's where lava comes from	[02:09]
mircea_popescu	BingoBoingo it provably won;t, no.	[02:09]
kakobrekla	shutthefuckup in this metaphysical conversation	[02:09]
mircea_popescu	lmao	[02:09]
BingoBoingo	mircea_popescu: No one said it would last	[02:10]
pete_dushenski	BingoBoingo my first qntra is ready for your consideration: http://pastebin.com/ctTHPWbg	[02:10]
assbot	Bitcoin tells Big Banks: "Thanks for lunch!" - Pastebin.com	[02:10]
BingoBoingo	Just needs to work long enough to pass "hello Wor[melts]" kind of like reverse moon probe	[02:10]
mircea_popescu	o hecy check that out, 7 pieces today so far ?	[02:11]
pete_dushenski	what a team!	[02:11]
mircea_popescu	im pretty impressed yeah	[02:12]
pete_dushenski	BingoBoingo hopefully you have footnotes plug-in that accepts double brackets ?	[02:12]
BingoBoingo	pete_dushenski: Who doesn't	[02:12]
mircea_popescu	lol standards are a thinb	[02:12]
pete_dushenski	lol there's a square bracket one too yknow	[02:12]
pete_dushenski	i don't use it but it exists	[02:13]
pete_dushenski	and i kept the contravex links to a single one ;)	[02:13]
Apocalyptic	in other news http://rt.com/news/197648-moscow-vnukovo-jet-crash/	[02:14]
mircea_popescu	"I am Ratna, 47 years, still having good figure, which is a result of satisfying fucking with different people during last 15 year. In my first 32 year I took only one cock in my cunt whereas in next 15 year I must have taken at least 3000 cocks in my body. This all because of my only son."	[02:14]
mircea_popescu	logic.	[02:14]
pete_dushenski	yup. no conflating variables there.	[02:14]
xanthyos	<@xanthyos> AND SB SAW MY PENIS, WHICH IS LIKE A GRANDMOTHER TO ME, SINCE MINE DIED	[02:14]
mircea_popescu	all these planes keep crashing in russia ...	[02:15]
kakobrekla	but its been like days since the last one	[02:15]
mircea_popescu	ah right. nm, my bad.	[02:15]
pete_dushenski	still safer than russian cars too so that maxim holds	[02:15]
kakobrekla	he ends with 'im sure we will be getting in more details as we get them.'	[02:17]
kakobrekla	righto	[02:17]
BingoBoingo	http://qntra.net/2014/10/bitcoin-tells-big-banks-thanks-for-lunch/ << pete_dushenski	[02:20]
assbot	Bitcoin tells Big Banks: "Thanks for lunch!" \| Qntra.net	[02:20]
kakobrekla	>his new Lords < extra space	[02:20]
pete_dushenski	https://twitter.com/pete_dushenski/status/524339019954794497	[02:21]
assbot	My first piece for /qntra: Bitcoin tells Big Banks: "Thanks for lunch!" http://t.co/DtFQOFXNEL	[02:21]
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pete_dushenski	my goodness we're an efficient bunch	[02:22]
*	pete_dushenski getting teary	[02:23]
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pete_dushenski	have a wonderful evening b-a!	[02:25]
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kakobrekla	;;later tell pete_dushenski pics no worky:	[02:26]
gribble	The operation succeeded.	[02:26]
kakobrekla	eh	[02:26]
kakobrekla	;;later tell pete_dushenski pics no worky: http://www.contravex.com/2014/07/31/y-combinator-the-american-idol-of-venture-capital/	[02:26]
gribble	The operation succeeded.	[02:26]
assbot	Y Combinator: The American Idol of Venture Capital \| Contravex: A blog by Pete Dushenski	[02:26]
*	kakobrekla will fix all your sites	[02:27]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13705 @ 0.0007382 = 10.117 BTC [-]	[02:42]
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mircea_popescu	lol kako teh pentester	[02:56]
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ben_vulpes	does anyone in la serenissima have a copy of the bitcoin repository of june 2012 vintage?	[03:15]
cazalla	http://qntra.net/2014/10/independent-reserve-becomes-australias-latest-bitcoin-exchange/	[03:17]
assbot	Independent Reserve Becomes Australia's Latest Bitcoin Exchange \| Qntra.net	[03:17]
mircea_popescu	ben_vulpes http://sourceforge.net/projects/bitcoin/files/Bitcoin/bitcoin-0.5.3/ etc.	[03:19]
assbot	Page not found - SourceForge.net	[03:19]
mircea_popescu	eh ?!	[03:19]
mircea_popescu	bwahahaha	[03:19]
ben_vulpes	all i have is the github repo	[03:20]
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mircea_popescu	!up TheKingOfCPU	[03:20]
-assbot-	You voiced TheKingOfCPU for 30 minutes.	[03:20]
*	assbot gives voice to TheKingOfCPU	[03:20]
TheKingOfCPU	hi	[03:20]
TheKingOfCPU	hi everyone	[03:21]
TheKingOfCPU	=)	[03:21]
mircea_popescu	ello.	[03:21]
ben_vulpes	salad	[03:21]
mircea_popescu	ben_vulpes https://codeload.github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/legacy.tar.gz/v0.7.1 << there	[03:22]
mircea_popescu	https://codeload.github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/legacy.tar.gz/v0.6.3 etc	[03:22]
ben_vulpes	ya got it	[03:23]
mike_c	should the news have as much of a slant as a blog post?	[03:24]
mike_c	or, to rephrase. a news article shouldn't have as much of a slant as a blog post.	[03:24]
ben_vulpes	"news" is all slant	[03:24]
mike_c	all communication has a slant. a news article should strive to have less than a blogger.	[03:25]
cazalla	mike_c which article	[03:25]
mike_c	i don't mean to poop on pete, but his is the one i just read.	[03:26]
cazalla	it is listed under commentary	[03:26]
mike_c	ok, that is good. but that is also news i would like to have.	[03:26]
mircea_popescu	mike_c be specific ?	[03:27]
mike_c	generally the editorial that is slanted is not the only source of news on the topic.	[03:27]
mircea_popescu	(i've not read it)	[03:27]
mike_c	" the world's largest banks gathered together to hold hands and sing kumbaya in the hope that Bitcoin would be gentle"	[03:27]
TheKingOfCPU	is maynous an instrument?	[03:28]
mike_c	nothing wrong with this in a commentary, but I would also like to be able to read the un-slanted version.	[03:28]
mircea_popescu	yeah hardly news this.	[03:28]
TheKingOfCPU	is maynous an instrument?	[03:28]
kakobrekla	should be pythra instead qntra	[03:28]
mircea_popescu	!down TheKingOfCPU	[03:28]
cazalla	mike_c, which pete linked to but it's a commentary and as news alone, i don't think anyone cares what someone said regarding bitcoin so it could only be commentary on qntra	[03:28]
*	assbot removes voice from TheKingOfCPU	[03:28]
mircea_popescu	cazalla no but he has a point, what kumbaya.	[03:29]
BingoBoingo	I hit publish on Pete's piece, in the Commentary category not the news category.	[03:33]
cazalla	usurper!	[03:34]
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mircea_popescu	lol	[03:34]
BingoBoingo	My bad	[03:34]
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mircea_popescu	BingoBoingo you know ther's really no diff the site makes. if commentary went to a special page you had to click for then i see it	[03:34]
mircea_popescu	but as is, it's all the same thing, aka news.	[03:35]
cazalla	this independent reserve mob are on irc apparently, just wrong network and channel	[03:35]
asciilifeform	BingoBoingo: Who ever said anything about bunker having meat << if the universe favoured defenders of castles, rather than attackers, bitcoin would not be necessary	[03:35]
asciilifeform	the 'martian bank' could be a literal martian bank.	[03:35]
mircea_popescu	anyway, guy's prose is rather florid, but there IS a news bit in there.	[03:35]
BingoBoingo	asciilifeform: Well what protected the Wasp's bag?	[03:36]
mircea_popescu	cazalla where ?	[03:36]
BingoBoingo	Why can't a datacenter be protected similarly?	[03:36]
asciilifeform	BingoBoingo: until destroyed - obscurity	[03:36]
cazalla	irc.oz.org #ir but i've invited them here	[03:36]
BingoBoingo	asciilifeform: And maybe people learn not to visit datacenters uninvited...	[03:37]
asciilifeform	BingoBoingo: cut pipe from safe distance.	[03:37]
BingoBoingo	Safe distance is a mystery though...	[03:37]
mircea_popescu	cazalla good idea.	[03:38]
asciilifeform	a datacenter that can't be diddled from a safe distance is also called 'a nuclear power'	[03:38]
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BingoBoingo	asciilifeform: Nothing I said contradicts that conclusion. At $900k/BTC a lot of things become possibilities	[03:39]
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*	asciilifeform addresses the worms who people his future grave 'eh boys, you'll be lighting benjies with lit benjies'	[03:40]
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mircea_popescu	lol	[03:41]
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BingoBoingo	!b 2	[03:45]
assbot	Last 2 lines bashed and pending review. ( http://dpaste.com/2ZT50FA.txt )	[03:45]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 19050 @ 0.00073803 = 14.0595 BTC [-] {2}	[03:47]
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mircea_popescu	dude varnish is sweet.	[03:53]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu re-varnishing transformers again?	[03:53]
mircea_popescu	nono, varnish the web cache	[03:53]
*	asciilifeform is a 20th century creature	[03:54]
mircea_popescu	https://www.varnish-software.com/	[03:54]
assbot	Varnish Software	[03:54]
asciilifeform	varnish - lives on transformers.	[03:54]
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ben_vulpes	varnish is okay	[03:56]
ben_vulpes	so: isStandard() - this is not related to blockchain and transaction processing rules, correct?	[03:57]
ben_vulpes	no it's totally in the transaction processing rules	[03:58]
ben_vulpes	if 0.9 says "this txn sucks!" but an 0.6 miner included it, this takes us right to a hard fork	[03:58]
ben_vulpes	if an 0.9 node...	[03:58]
asciilifeform	http://www.cbronline.com/news/tech/software/enterprise-apps/google-to-nix-piracy-sites-in-search-rank-201014-4411175	[03:59]
assbot	Google to nix piracy sites in search rank - Computer Business Review	[03:59]
danielpbarron	what is it with people pronouncing '0' as 'oh'?	[04:00]
ben_vulpes	syllabic efficiency	[04:00]
danielpbarron	"an zero" sounds strange	[04:00]
ben_vulpes	wouldn't it be "a zero"?	[04:00]
ben_vulpes	ah hue	[04:01]
ben_vulpes	i'm retarded, it's fine	[04:01]
danielpbarron	well no; not if you pronounce it "an oh point nine"	[04:01]
ben_vulpes	i'd probably say "oh nine", but i should write "a 0.9..."	[04:02]
ben_vulpes	and i never say the decimal	[04:02]
ben_vulpes	"oh nine three"	[04:02]
*	gabriel_laddel (~user@c-67-161-28-199.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[04:02]
danielpbarron	"zero point nine point three"	[04:03]
*	assbot gives voice to gabriel_laddel	[04:04]
ben_vulpes	i'm sure it matters to someone	[04:04]
bounce	``In August 2012 we first announced that we would downrank sites for which we received a large number of valid DMCA notices.'' -- they get flooded with bot-generated "DMCA notices". what do they do to make sure they're "valid"? looking at youtube, not that much.	[04:07]
asciilifeform	'heighten the contradictions'	[04:09]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7606 @ 0.00073798 = 5.6131 BTC [-]	[04:10]
mircea_popescu	if 0.9 says "this txn sucks!" but an 0.6 miner included it, this takes us right to a hard fork << yep	[04:12]
mircea_popescu	and an incurable one, at that.	[04:12]
mircea_popescu	this was the mechanism of the previous hard fork : .8 miners included tx rejected by the network, moved on a different chain.	[04:13]
*	AdamIR (~Avatar@wf-171-99-151-3.revip9.asianet.co.th) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[04:13]
mircea_popescu	!up AdamIR	[04:13]
-assbot-	You voiced AdamIR for 30 minutes.	[04:13]
*	assbot gives voice to AdamIR	[04:13]
cazalla	mircea_popescu, that's Adam Tepper from that new aussie exchange	[04:15]
mircea_popescu	is this the thing with the bitfury buys ?	[04:15]
cazalla	no, that's digitalBTC	[04:15]
mircea_popescu	ah independent reserve, kay.	[04:16]
AdamIR	http://www.independentreserve is our site.	[04:16]
AdamIR	Thanks for the invitation and introduction cazalla.	[04:16]
AdamIR	http://www.independentreserve.com rather.	[04:16]
assbot	Independent Reserve - The Bitcoin Market	[04:16]
mircea_popescu	AdamIR get in the wot. actually why aren';t you in there already ?	[04:16]
undata	http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2014/10/20/secret-service-fbi-hack-cybersecuurity/17615029/	[04:19]
assbot	Officials warn 500 million financial records hacked	[04:19]
undata	<< "Our government and our businesses are in a daily fight against hackers," Pawlenty said. "It's getting increasingly concerning, and it needs to be met with action by Congress." >>	[04:19]
undata	oh good, more legislation	[04:19]
AdamIR	mircea_popescu - I joined #bitcoin-otc. Will have a look in more detail later, thanks.	[04:19]
mircea_popescu	cazalla i imagine these should really be all massed into one weekly post or something. X, Y and Z opened. K L and M closed."	[04:19]
asciilifeform	microshit still not razed and employees not publicly impaled, news at 11.	[04:19]
mircea_popescu	maybe even have a dead pool	[04:19]
kakobrekla	AdamIR you dont want to be there.	[04:20]
undata	asciilifeform: they're going to make hacking even more illegal; you'll see!	[04:20]
mircea_popescu	oh good, more legislation << asciilifeform has it. "everyone ever worked for microsoft, one year in prison per year worked, plus one year in prison per 100k in salary ever received. sentences over 20 years commuted to death."	[04:20]
AdamIR	kakobrekla - just having a look what it's all about.	[04:20]
mircea_popescu	everyone OTHER than ms has a year to either discontinue their business or fix it.	[04:20]
mircea_popescu	check out the sudden security everywhere	[04:20]
*	AdamIR is now known as AdamIRAway	[04:21]
cazalla	mircea_popescu, that's an idea, i like to cover them just so i know if/when they close i have something to refer back to if they change their story at that point	[04:21]
mircea_popescu	AdamIRAway ok, so when you say last mover advantage/having studied what others did worng, what specifically do you mean ?	[04:21]
asciilifeform	'One Romanian hacker was lured to Boston by Secret Service Special Agent Matt O'Neill, who used the Internet to pose as a woman and invite the cybercriminal on a trip to the USA to enjoy gambling and romance. "He was quite surprised that I was the one meeting him when he arrived," said O'Neill, who worked on the case for months.' << lol, is anyone actually this stupid? even sp4mz0rs?	[04:21]
mircea_popescu	cazalla yeah, i feel you. but should really be one paragraph at best. just the details.	[04:21]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform yes.	[04:22]
AdamIRAway	mircea_popescu... there's a number of things we do right, particularly compared with others in the Australia-Pacific region.	[04:22]
mircea_popescu	AdamIRAway the idea was for specificity.	[04:23]
AdamIRAway	Yes... typing...	[04:23]
mircea_popescu	no rush.	[04:23]
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AdamIRAway	I realise some other exchanges do some of these things, but some of the ways I think that Independent Reserve is ahead of a lot of our competition is...	[04:23]
AdamIRAway	1. Rather than rely on a technology/IT focused team (which is my own background), we brought onboard a lot of the executive team and investors with FX Markets, Investment Banking and Finance background, which I think has helped in many of the decisions we have made, and connections that we have made, and gives better overall balance and credibility to what we do.	[04:25]
mircea_popescu	sure, go can't hurt.	[04:26]
AdamIRAway	2. Rather than launch something quickly, we developed an enterprise level trading system over a period of twelve months and followed best practice in software development to develop a platform that we believe is secure, robust and stable. My own background as well as that of our CTO is in enterprise software development, and previously worked for many financial institutions in Australia.	[04:26]
AdamIRAway	3. We have a very rich API. I realise other exchanges have this also, but not so in Australia.	[04:27]
mircea_popescu	what ever came of MMADX incidentally ?	[04:27]
AdamIRAway	4. Most people, particularly Australians (but other nationalities also), can verify themselves online within minutes, usually without having to submit any identification documents. In some cases we can't automatically verify that, we can still verify manually.	[04:27]
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AdamIRAway	5. Australians can make BPAY Deposits (it's an Australian thing), but we convert this to USD at around 2.5 % better than most banks will. International clients can do a SWIFT transfer direct into our USD account. The other Australian exchange trades AUD/XBT, but we chose USD to provide greater liquidity.	[04:29]
mircea_popescu	http://asiaetrading.com/australian-company-to-automate-multi-trillion-dollar-debt-market-mmadx/ <<	[04:29]
assbot	Australian Company to Automate Multi-Trillion Dollar Debt Market MMADX \| AsiaEtrading.com	[04:29]
mircea_popescu	seems to have been "going to" in 2012 and then suddenly dissapeared.	[04:29]
mircea_popescu	is this a reuse of that platform ?	[04:29]
AdamIRAway	6. I think we are the only Bitcoin exchange in the world that is audited by one of the major auditing firms - PricewaterhouseCoopers	[04:29]
mike_c	PWC, the bitcoin experts! :)	[04:30]
gabriel_laddel	"to develop a platform that we believe is secure, robust and stable..."	[04:30]
gabriel_laddel	[emphasis mine]	[04:30]
*	assbot gives voice to decimation	[04:30]
AdamIRAway	7. And again, this only applies to Australians. Because we are an open market exchange (not a brokerage), we are not obligated to charge 10 % GST on transactions, like other brokerages in the region do.	[04:30]
decimation	AdamIRAway: you realize you basically saying "we are awesome at kyc/aml"	[04:30]
mircea_popescu	decimation well, generally, "at interfacing with austrialian banks"	[04:31]
AdamIRAway	decimation... it's important to take KYC/AML seriously, in order for us to work with banks. We do our best to make it as painless as possible for our clients, if we can.	[04:31]
asciilifeform	obligatory:	[04:32]
mircea_popescu	"MMADX hopes to turn profitable in 2015. According to the presentation, its projected earnings before interest, tax, depreciation and amortization for fiscal 2016 and 2017 are A$23.2 million and A$34.2 million, respectively. At that time, or before, the company could undertake an initial public offering, the presentation states."	[04:32]
mircea_popescu	so it never actually listed, best i can discern. did it close down ?	[04:32]
decimation	AdamIRAway: are you going to be transparent to your customers w.r.t. actual daily balances?	[04:32]
decimation	or is that only for pwc?	[04:32]
asciilifeform	'As progressively dumber programmers build progressively more complex systems we will see more of this kind of attempt to paper over coding mistakes with lawyers, sanctions, policies, and laws. Hollywood and the RIAA are usually the most successful at getting the government to do their bidding. Thus I predict that one day Disney will have a Web site where you can buy access to any of their movies. Because all	[04:32]
asciilifeform	of their profits are being used to pay executive salaries this will have to be built at extremely low cost. Deficiencies in the softwrae will enable vast numbers of Americans to download Bambi for free, their ISPs will be forced to rat them out, and they will all get to see Martha's Stewart's cell in West Virginia first hand...' (greenspun. http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/philg/2005/03/08/#a7726 )	[04:32]
assbot	Philip Greenspun's Weblog » 2005 » March » 08	[04:32]
mircea_popescu	cazalla if you have a clue how to go through the aussie corp register, it's company code: 34149069910	[04:33]
AdamIRAway	gabriel_laddel... my emphasis was on secure, robust and scalable ;)	[04:33]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform incidentally, didja know that what actually broke the chicago mob was their ill advised attempt to muscle hollywood into shape ?	[04:33]
BingoBoingo	AdamIRAway: Does you exchange handle shoebox in the mail full of paper money transactions?	[04:34]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: unsurprising	[04:34]
decimation	people who tell the masses how to think and vote tend to maintain their position	[04:34]
asciilifeform	BingoBoingo: probably not, but your postman does!	[04:34]
gabriel_laddel	AdamIRAway: I see.	[04:34]
asciilifeform	BingoBoingo: he'll be happy to pay his grocery bill with them.	[04:34]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: propaganda ministry wins over ordinary mob	[04:35]
AdamIRAway	decimation... Pwc will be auditing our finances, and we will make their report available. We are looking to engage them to audit our XBT reserves as well shortly. We aren't currently transparent day-to-day regarding our reserves/balances, but it is obviously something we will be looking to do shortly after our launch.	[04:35]
cazalla	mircea_popescu, Cancelled from 28 Feb 2014	[04:35]
BingoBoingo	asciilifeform: But in future world a shoebox full a benjies buys what? A single tomatoe?	[04:35]
asciilifeform	BingoBoingo: a few minutes of fire in potbelly stove	[04:36]
decimation	AdamIRAway: that pretty much sounds to me something like "we plan to float bitcoin and hope we don't get screwed"	[04:36]
mircea_popescu	anyway, since michael go doesn't seem on the menu, how did you get Admiral Markets's very own Lasanka Perera ? or what exactly is the arrangement there ?	[04:37]
AdamIRAway	decimation... I'm not sure how you interpreted my statement to reach that viewpoint. We take both our USD and XBT reserves very seriously, and will be looking to provide cryptograhic proof of our Bitcoin reserves shortly.	[04:38]
AdamIRAway	Lasanka Perera is a friend of mine, and co-founder of Independent Reserve.	[04:39]
cazalla	mircea_popescu, http://pastebin.com/DjYmbsEz	[04:39]
assbot	Australian Company MONEY MARKET AND DEBT EXCHANGE PTY. LTD. ACN 149 069 910 - Pastebin.com	[04:39]
*	assbot gives voice to RagnarDanneskjol	[04:39]
mircea_popescu	AdamIRAway any comment on how MMDX got deregistered ?	[04:40]
*	belcher has quit (Quit: Leaving)	[04:40]
AdamIRAway	mircea_popescu - no sorry, can you give me some more context?	[04:41]
mircea_popescu	yes. the context is like so : an old time forex broker with a kind-of mlm-y past that used to do metals and everything got together with a guy that had a company that was going to trade debt advertised then suddenly disappeared. they hired a coupla software dudes (you and the Przelozny) and a very clueless legal chick with no practice. in this context, i'm trying to figure out exactly how did said debt trading platform	[04:43]
mircea_popescu	company get closed down.	[04:43]
*	assbot removes voice from AdamIRAway	[04:44]
mircea_popescu	now my thinking is that you couldn't have spent very long making a dedicated platform, seeing how this just happened this year, so you're either reusing one or the other. i somehow doubt it's admiral's platform, so prolly im guessing mmdx's ?	[04:44]
mircea_popescu	!up AdamIRAway	[04:44]
-assbot-	You voiced AdamIRAway for 30 minutes.	[04:44]
*	assbot gives voice to AdamIRAway	[04:44]
AdamIRAway	mircea_popescu... I think you have the wrong idea about several points.	[04:45]
mircea_popescu	well that's good, that's what you're here for after all.	[04:46]
BingoBoingo	Eric S Raymond builds a computer >> http://esr.ibiblio.org/?p=6389	[04:46]
assbot	Spending the “Help Stamp Out CVS In Your Lifetime” fund	[04:46]
AdamIRAway	First of all, I'm not involved in any waay with MMDX - I hadn't heard of them until you mentioned it.	[04:46]
mircea_popescu	but you did some research on your partners or no ?	[04:46]
AdamIRAway	Secondly, we aren't using any software from Admiral Markets or MMDX, not a single line of code, I don't know what systems they've used previously. Our systems have been developed in-house over the past 15 months.	[04:46]
asciilifeform	eric raymond << obligatory: http://geekz.co.uk/lovesraymond/archives	[04:47]
assbot	Everybody loves Eric Raymond	[04:47]
mircea_popescu	so this thing has existed for the past 15 months ?!	[04:47]
asciilifeform	http://geekz.co.uk/lovesraymond/archive/gpl-sucker-punch	[04:47]
assbot	Everybody loves Eric Raymond » GPL sucker punch	[04:47]
asciilifeform	^	[04:47]
AdamIRAway	Thirdly. Nobody hired a "couple of software dudes and a clueless legal chick", as you described...	[04:47]
AdamIRAway	Myself, along with Adrian Przelozny are the majority shareholders of Independent Reserve.	[04:48]
mircea_popescu	o, it goes the other way ?	[04:48]
mircea_popescu	interesting.	[04:48]
mircea_popescu	ok so basically you and the prezelozny fellow made this thing and reached out for some consultancy work from finance and legal peeps ?	[04:49]
AdamIRAway	Our Compliance Specialist has a lot of experience in compliance obviously, and through her we have engaged Baker & McKenzie for specialised legal advice as required.	[04:49]
*	RagnarDanneskjol wonders how long this infomercial for indy reserve will go on (also do they have shiraz blend?).. changes channel	[04:49]
AdamIRAway	RagnarDanneskjol... I was invited here, and asked questions.	[04:49]
mircea_popescu	RagnarDanneskjol it's the trade gazette, what do you want. ppl gotta be able to answer.	[04:49]
RagnarDanneskjol	ok cool	[04:50]
mircea_popescu	AdamIRAway dun worry about it.	[04:50]
BingoBoingo	asciilifeform: Nao I have more to read	[04:50]
AdamIRAway	Sorry they haven't been to your liking, I will be happy to leave if it's not welcome.	[04:50]
RagnarDanneskjol	dont mind me - sounded more like advert than adderessing relevant Qs	[04:50]
mircea_popescu	AdamIRAway anyway, i think i get the basic idea. it's not bad or anything. get in the wot so bitcoin people have a direct point of contact and other than that, time will tell.	[04:51]
asciilifeform	http://geekz.co.uk/lovesraymond/archive/eric-buys-an-ipod	[04:52]
assbot	Everybody loves Eric Raymond » Eric buys an Ipod	[04:52]
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BingoBoingo	I remember his printer rant	[05:00]
AdamIRAway	mircea_popescu... I've just been trying to get some context regarding what you were saying before... I thought you were referring to something Lasanka had been involved with...	[05:00]
AdamIRAway	Adrian Przelozny, Lasanka Perera and myself were the co-founders of Independent Reserve.	[05:01]
*	AdamIR2 (~Avatar@wf-171-99-151-3.revip9.asianet.co.th) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[05:02]
BingoBoingo	!up AdamIR2	[05:03]
*	assbot gives voice to AdamIR2	[05:04]
AdamIR2	I realise now you were talking about Michael Go, and his involvement with MMADX several years ago. I don't know the details of his involvement with that, but it is not connected with Independent Reserve.	[05:04]
AdamIR2	On that note... I need to go back and so some work. Thanks for your questions.	[05:04]
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*	AdamIR2 is now known as IRaway	[05:08]
ben_vulpes	was the blockchain written directly to disk at some point in the reference client's history?	[05:09]
asciilifeform	'directly' ?	[05:11]
decimation	wasn't it always in a Berkeley db?	[05:11]
ben_vulpes	as opposed to BDB	[05:11]
decimation	like, as a flat text file or something?	[05:12]
*	ben_vulpes does not actually understand how the infinite layers of the modern v.n. architecture does it's nasty business.	[05:12]
ben_vulpes	decimation: i imagined something like that, yeah.	[05:12]
decimation	I doubt it, that would be crazy	[05:12]
decimation	the code is out there for reading though, I suppose	[05:12]
ben_vulpes	still working through the changelog	[05:13]
asciilifeform	http://www.zorinaq.com/pub/bitcoin-0.1.0.tgz	[05:13]
decimation	asciilifeform: is that the 'satoshi' original turd?	[05:13]
asciilifeform	https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=68121.0 << possibly	[05:14]
assbot	v0.1	[05:14]
*	asciilifeform did not check the signature	[05:14]
BingoBoingo	http://qntra.net/2014/10/intel-subsidiary-fined-for-crypto-export/	[05:15]
assbot	Intel Subsidiary Fined for Crypto Export \| Qntra.net	[05:15]
decimation	hashs check the website, fwiw	[05:15]
mircea_popescu	was the blockchain written directly to disk at some point in the reference client's history? << yes.	[05:16]
mircea_popescu	but that was long, long ago.	[05:16]
mircea_popescu	I doubt it, that would be crazy << o yeah ? THE WALLET FILE WAS UNENCRYPTED.	[05:17]
mircea_popescu	FOR TWO YEARS.	[05:17]
decimation	hehe good point	[05:17]
mircea_popescu	do not even get me started. they're using qt for fucks sake.	[05:17]
asciilifeform	incidentally,	[05:17]
asciilifeform	;;buy 1 "Printed and bound copy of Bitcoin ver. 0.6 source; organized into chapters by file, coloured for syntax." at 1 BTC	[05:17]
gribble	Error: For identification purposes, you must be identified via GPG to use the order book.	[05:17]
mircea_popescu	satoshi is like costanza when it comes to implementation. pretty much every choice he has made, be it something to eat, something to wear, has been wrong.	[05:18]
asciilifeform	;;buy 1 "Printed and bound copy of Bitcoin ver. 0.6 source; organized into chapters by file, coloured for syntax." at 1 BTC	[05:18]
gribble	Order id 21595 created.	[05:18]
decimation	that bitcoin-0.1 turd definitely depends on db_cxx.h, which seems to be bdb, but that isn't a full answer	[05:18]
mircea_popescu	;;later tell nubbins` ^ that something you can do ?	[05:18]
gribble	The operation succeeded.	[05:18]
asciilifeform	human skin cover optional.	[05:19]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 35843 @ 0.00073796 = 26.4507 BTC [-] {2}	[05:19]
mircea_popescu	decimation im pretty certain it had flatfiles early on.	[05:19]
decimation	asciilifeform: lol @ your esr cartoon	[05:21]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: not in 0.1...	[05:21]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: perhaps in satoshi's head?	[05:21]
asciilifeform	srsly what is this, anybody can grab the ancient source	[05:22]
mircea_popescu	so you're saying i have hallucinated this ?!	[05:22]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11000 @ 0.00073897 = 8.1287 BTC [+] {2}	[05:23]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: looks like it.	[05:23]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: you remember yourself, when telling the tale of why you didn't port it to msdos	[05:23]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: no working bdb	[05:23]
*	assbot gives voice to gabriel_laddel	[05:23]
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asciilifeform	if not for the db crapolade, mine would be running on bare iron even now.	[05:25]
asciilifeform	(can't speak for other folks)	[05:25]
decimation	transactions are definitely stored in a Db * object, which appears to be the bdb C++ interface	[05:25]
*	mircea_popescu throws hands	[05:25]
mircea_popescu	who the fuck knows. i coulda sworn.	[05:25]
asciilifeform	at any rate, i would genuinely like that book. if someone wishes to make it happen.	[05:27]
asciilifeform	and chances are i'm not the only one.	[05:27]
decimation	asciilifeform: me too	[05:27]
asciilifeform	i'd pay quadruple for an intelligently-commented 'Lions Book'-style item	[05:27]
*	dnaleor has quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)	[05:27]
decimation	printing out your own shit is annoying	[05:27]
asciilifeform	but not sure if anyone is qualified to produce this	[05:27]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform decimation i think it quite likely that once nubsy gets on you'll get your book.	[05:28]
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asciilifeform	happy days.	[05:28]
decimation	yeah he's a printin' guy	[05:28]
decimation	The 'independent reserve' guys claim to use gpg signed email for customer support	[05:29]
decimation	asciilifeform: did you see that the new emacs has a web-browser mode builtin?	[05:30]
asciilifeform	decimation: did for ages ?	[05:30]
decimation	really? I thought one had to download from the crazy lisp package repo	[05:32]
*	asciilifeform confesses to being rather uninterested in ugly-as-sin www browsing	[05:32]
asciilifeform	and similarly stallmanesque exercises	[05:32]
asciilifeform	the sooner 'browser' dies as a paradigm, the better:	[05:33]
decimation	asciilifeform: it seems like a good idea on the surface, but in practice 90% of the web will be broken	[05:33]
asciilifeform	obligatory: http://www.loper-os.org/?p=309	[05:33]
assbot	Loper OS » No Formats, no Format Wars.	[05:33]
*	assbot removes voice from IRaway	[05:34]
decimation	asciilifeform: yeah it's true that the 'vision' of downloading and executing arbitrary code is exactly what the world needs	[05:35]
mircea_popescu	decimation no it had a web browser for a long time	[05:35]
asciilifeform	decimation: everybody seems shocked at that one	[05:35]
asciilifeform	decimation: but 'surgeon' and 'maniac' are different items, though each cuts you open while you sleep.	[05:35]
decimation	exactly. And everyone has been told since they were little that execution is dangerous - which is on c-machines	[05:36]
asciilifeform	decimation: in a same computing environment, nothing about 'downloading and executing arbitrary code' is frightening.	[05:36]
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undata	asciilifeform: regarding the format wars post, I've fantasized about choosing to build for the canvas tag and forgetting the rest of the browser entirely	[05:37]
decimation	asciilifeform: did you see that IBM had to pay $1.5 bn to get rid of their chip business?	[05:37]
asciilifeform	lol yes	[05:37]
undata	just streaming commands to some canvas wrapper via a websocket	[05:37]
asciilifeform	decimation: thing is, this is not like you or i paying a junkman $100 to be rid of an ancient car	[05:37]
decimation	asciilifeform: it makes one sad. "why keep banging head against wall, and digging bigger ditch? why not try something really different"	[05:37]
asciilifeform	decimation: it's laundry / merit-washing. we simply don't know the details.	[05:37]
gabriel_laddel	https://groups.google.com/forum/?hl=en#!msg/comp.lang.lisp/V7yiSIfLEis/sIhFE4M5yk4J	[05:38]
assbot	Google Groups	[05:38]
gabriel_laddel	^ related	[05:38]
decimation	yeah I agree. how can a factory that can produce chips which rival intel's lithography 'lose money'?	[05:38]
decimation	either they are really really bad at making chips, or they are really really bad at choosing what to stamp out	[05:38]
asciilifeform	or leverage shenanigans	[05:39]
asciilifeform	that only the gods know the bottom of	[05:39]
asciilifeform	or nsa contract lineup fell through this year	[05:39]
asciilifeform	or, or, or.	[05:39]
decimation	you mean 'friendly' money from usg	[05:39]
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decimation	I strongly suspect that spending more money on nsa is going to be politically untenable for the near future	[05:40]
decimation	it will be amusing to see who 'starves'	[05:40]
asciilifeform	as if they needed money.	[05:40]
asciilifeform	the future of u.s. taxation and criminal justice is probably the model of the 'traffic camera.'	[05:42]
asciilifeform	see, e.g., orlov:	[05:42]
asciilifeform	'With small businesses and private enterprise made illegal, most people will be forced to resort to illegal activities, under the watchful eye of the NSA. But since putting even more people in jail will be prohibitively expensive, a new, streamlined process of dispensing justice will be put into place: the NSA and the Justice Department will link computer systems, and verdicts of fraud and suspended sentences wi	[05:42]
asciilifeform	ll be issued by a computer program, in absentia. In keeping with current practice, both the charge and the evidence will be kept secret. The newly minted felons will be dropped from voter rolls, their passports cancelled, their bank accounts confiscated, and their employment (if any) terminated. They will receive form letters informing them of their sentence but most of them will be unable to read it because fun	[05:42]
asciilifeform	ctional illiteracy rates will go from the current 40% to 80-90%.'	[05:42]
asciilifeform	^ http://cluborlov.blogspot.com/2014/04/business-as-usual.html	[05:42]
assbot	ClubOrlov: Business as usual	[05:42]
decimation	everyone knows the real purpose of the intel budget is to employ spouses of high-status usg types	[05:42]
asciilifeform	that'd be dept. of state.	[05:43]
decimation	yeah them too	[05:43]
gabriel_laddel	wrong link above. apparently I recorded it by hand. I couldn't find the quote I had intended to post by googling, so here it is: http://pastebin.com/AnDwtySY from Emacs.	[05:44]
assbot	I started to reply at length to the many misstatements in your message. I don - Pastebin.com	[05:44]
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asciilifeform	gabriel_laddel: yes, i linked to this on many occasions	[05:44]
asciilifeform	gabriel_laddel: wish i could remember where, though	[05:45]
gabriel_laddel	asciilifeform: google groups is rotting :/	[05:46]
asciilifeform	for years.	[05:46]
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decimation	gabriel_laddel: yeah, emacs likes to claim 'self-documenting' but I find the quality of documentation to be pretty poor	[05:47]
asciilifeform	gabriel_laddel: https://groups.google.com/forum/message/raw?msg=comp.lang.lisp/XpvUwF2xKbk/Xz4Mww0ZwLIJ << original	[05:47]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15179 @ 0.0007405 = 11.24 BTC [+] {2}	[05:47]
gabriel_laddel	decimation: It's by far the best I've found on UNIX. I've no LispM experiences and so can only imagine.	[05:47]
gabriel_laddel	thank you	[05:48]
asciilifeform	gabriel_laddel: (linked from ancient post of mine - http://www.loper-os.org/?p=85 )	[05:48]
assbot	Loper OS » The Performance of Lisp, or Why Bean Counters Need Bigger Bags of Beans	[05:48]
decimation	I remember when google took over the old usenet archives, thought they would make them useful rather than let them rot	[05:48]
asciilifeform	they did. briefly.	[05:48]
asciilifeform	'dejanews' was a cesspool of pestilential spamvertising, the early 'google groups' was a breath of fresh air	[05:49]
mircea_popescu	decimation> everyone knows the real purpose of the intel budget is to employ spouses of high-status usg types <<< only in places which are bored of living.	[05:50]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: tired of living - 'жить надоело', heh	[05:51]
mircea_popescu	myeah.	[05:51]
mircea_popescu	they didn't have enough sense to make a wot.	[05:52]
mircea_popescu	no wot, no forum/	[05:52]
decimation	http://www.americanthinker.com/2010/03/what_the_byzantines_can_teach.html	[05:53]
assbot	Articles: What the Byzantines Can Teach Us about Our National Security	[05:53]
asciilifeform	classic	[05:53]
asciilifeform	also the book is neato.	[05:54]
*	asciilifeform likes luttwak	[05:54]
decimation	"The Byzantines had good spies, but no intelligence bureaucracy at all. Officials involved in the management of espionage performed these functions along with other duties. They never had a bureaucratic hierarchy of intelligence and never thought to create one. "	[05:54]
decimation	yeah spies need bureaucracy like ants need blueprints	[05:55]
decimation	asciilifeform: you might enjoy https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fMcoOiOxLf8	[05:58]
assbot	Conversations with History - Edward N. Luttwak - YouTube	[05:58]
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mircea_popescu	yeah spies need bureaucracy like ants need blueprints << lol good one.	[06:01]
mircea_popescu	here's the thing tho : they do.	[06:01]
mircea_popescu	just, not a bureaucracy. they need management tho.	[06:01]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 1874 @ 0.00073768 = 1.3824 BTC [-]	[06:03]
decimation	well, it's certainly the case that someone needs to have the 'big picture' in mind and issue instructions, I would think	[06:03]
asciilifeform	generally there are no 'hobbyist spies' - they're called 'armchair generals' or something alike.	[06:04]
decimation	asciilifeform: I suspect 'armchair general' describes 90% of usg	[06:05]
mircea_popescu	nah, i'll tell you what describes 90% of usg.	[06:06]
mircea_popescu	http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/44/Bill_de_Blasio_and_family.jpg << this.	[06:06]
mircea_popescu	you see this picture ? look well at it, for it's what it looks like. sad, tired, incredibly lonely middle age white guy	[06:06]
mircea_popescu	in a hell of his making.	[06:06]
decimation	pandering the masses must drain the soul	[06:07]
mircea_popescu	clearly in the last place he'd ever be : his own life.	[06:08]
asciilifeform	'This time of year, this part of Massachusetts is overrun by stampedes of shiny late-model SUVs with New York and New Jersey license plates. They are driven by various subspecies of the middle-aged well-to-do American Office Ogre—the lawyer, the doctor, the dentist, the banker, the lobbyist and the corporate businessman—the people who are attempting to run off with all the loot. The majestic scenery is somew	[06:08]
asciilifeform	hat spoiled by these surly, scowling, raspy-voiced ogres and their flabby, overmedicated wives with voices like an unoiled hinge. When not aimlessly driving around, they sit in upscale restaurants, toying with their food and gossiping menacingly. They have long forgotten what it means to be happy and carefree, and their labored attempts at feigning enjoyment are painful to watch. You can be sure that the sight o	[06:08]
asciilifeform	f poor but happy people makes them quite livid.'	[06:08]
asciilifeform	^ http://cluborlov.blogspot.com/2010_08_01_archive.html	[06:08]
assbot	ClubOrlov: August 2010	[06:08]
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decimation	asciilifeform: this is probably one reason why usg policy is generally to crush the poor and happy	[06:13]
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mircea_popescu	"Many people spent a big chunk of their lives investing in this dream and it didn't pan out quite as we wish."	[06:15]
mircea_popescu	no shortage of sad.	[06:15]
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undata	https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EX3rgYRY_zM	[06:18]
assbot	We Called It America - NOFX - YouTube	[06:19]
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mircea_popescu	!up gibson	[06:20]
-assbot-	You voiced gibson for 30 minutes.	[06:20]
*	assbot gives voice to gibson	[06:20]
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undata	where to move, if we're ash heap bound	[06:21]
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asciilifeform	alpha centauri.	[06:22]
asciilifeform	if you can afford it.	[06:22]
mircea_popescu	argentina works.	[06:22]
asciilifeform	just the same as alpha centauri to me.	[06:22]
mircea_popescu	no, the chicks are way better.	[06:22]
asciilifeform	lol	[06:22]
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BingoBoingo	!up bitstein	[06:24]
*	assbot gives voice to bitstein	[06:24]
BingoBoingo	!up RagnarsBitch	[06:24]
*	assbot gives voice to RagnarsBitch	[06:24]
decimation	http://squid314.livejournal.com/340809.html << "All of the white people who joined Indian tribes loved it and refused to go back to white civilization. All the Indians who joined white civilization hated it and did everything they could to go back to their previous tribal lives."	[06:24]
assbot	Jackdaws love my big sphinx of quartz - Book Review: Empire of the Summer Moon	[06:24]
undata	mircea_popescu: what makes you like Argentina? Things like wealth taxes don't convey a sense of respect for private property, though I can see how that'd be irrelevant to BTC wealth	[06:25]
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asciilifeform	decimation: i distinctly remember reading this earlier.	[06:31]
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asciilifeform	linked, almost certainly, from here.	[06:31]
asciilifeform	(or was it mircea_popescu ?)	[06:31]
mircea_popescu	undata da fuck do i care about their taxes.	[06:32]
mircea_popescu	but i like everything. i suppose i should spell it out huh.	[06:33]
undata	mircea_popescu: if you want; it wont be actionable for me for years	[06:33]
asciilifeform	;;later tell nubbins` http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-10-2014#885779	[06:35]
gribble	The operation succeeded.	[06:35]
assbot	Logged on 21-10-2014 02:15:37; asciilifeform: ;;buy 1 "Printed and bound copy of Bitcoin ver. 0.6 source; organized into chapters by file, coloured for syntax." at 1 BTC	[06:35]
thestringpuller	what kind of binding?	[06:36]
asciilifeform	^ this is not merely a printer's job; i can abide neither haphazardly broken lines nor miniscule print.	[06:36]
cazalla	http://qntra.net/2014/10/moopay-scam-leads-to-possible-bitstamp-blacklists/	[06:36]
assbot	MooPay Scam Leads to Possible Bitstamp Blacklists \| Qntra.net	[06:36]
asciilifeform	what kind of binding << lay-flat only.	[06:38]
asciilifeform	absolutely no perforator or 3-ring.	[06:38]
asciilifeform	could do those myself.	[06:38]
decimation	asciilifeform: as in soft leather cover?	[06:38]
asciilifeform	paper ok	[06:39]
asciilifeform	think 'o'reilly' books	[06:39]
thestringpuller	no leather bound LOTR style?	[06:40]
thestringpuller	why not wizard spellbook style	[06:40]
asciilifeform	if someone wants to do this for no more than 1 btc, sure.	[06:40]
asciilifeform	i specified - minimum.	[06:40]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 28376 @ 0.00074074 = 21.0192 BTC [+] {2}	[06:40]
thestringpuller	1 btc may go a long way in the future ;)	[06:40]
asciilifeform	eh.	[06:40]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16400 @ 0.00073768 = 12.098 BTC [-]	[06:46]
*	gabriel_laddel has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)	[06:48]
thestringpuller	;;calc 206000/390	[06:53]
gribble	528.205128205	[06:53]
thestringpuller	;;calc 206000 / 315	[06:53]
mircea_popescu	undata http://trilema.com/2014/mp-what-do-you-like-about-argentina/ there you go.	[06:53]
gribble	653.968253968	[06:53]
assbot	MP, what do you like about Argentina ? pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.	[06:53]
*	assbot removes voice from bitstein	[06:54]
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thestringpuller	!up bitstein	[06:58]
*	assbot gives voice to bitstein	[06:58]
thestringpuller	!up RagnarsBitch	[06:58]
*	assbot gives voice to RagnarsBitch	[06:58]
undata	mircea_popescu: thanks for the write-up	[07:02]
thestringpuller	PinkPosixPXE: nice article on qntra :D	[07:05]
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BingoBoingo	!up kncminer_is_a_sc	[07:09]
*	assbot gives voice to kncminer_is_a_sc	[07:09]
BingoBoingo	Hello kncminer_is_a_sc	[07:10]
kncminer_is_a_sc	KNCMINER IS A SCAM! 5 month late house burning hardware is Useless now, useless. Refund me you gotterdammerung scammers!	[07:10]
mircea_popescu	kncminer_is_a_sc no shit lmao	[07:10]
kncminer_is_a_sc	Damn you KNC!!!! DAMN YOU STRAIGHT TO HEELLLLLL!!!!	[07:10]
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ben_vulpes	"accounts" in btc wallets are kind of stupid, right?	[07:11]
mircea_popescu	kind of ?	[07:11]
ben_vulpes	i'm trying to think of sensible use cases	[07:11]
ben_vulpes	but i keep coming back to "i only want to know the balances and histories of these addresses"	[07:12]
mircea_popescu	http://trilema.com/2014/bitcoin-was-written-by-the-retarded-part-ii/ <<	[07:12]
assbot	Bitcoin was written by the retarded, part II pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.	[07:12]
ben_vulpes	ya there we go	[07:13]
mircea_popescu	yeah nice piece pixie.	[07:14]
mircea_popescu	undata yer welcome.	[07:14]
mircea_popescu	"He then tried to pay with PayPal, and we unsuspended the machines. About 6 hours later the payments were disputed with PayPal as unauthorized and we then suspended again." << wow, carding too ?!	[07:17]
mircea_popescu	perfect pretext for bitstamp to steal even more coins.	[07:17]
mircea_popescu	just in case it's not obvious already, keeping any balances on bitstamp or sending any bitcoin to bitstamp is beyond retarded.	[07:18]
mircea_popescu	try to not do that so you don't ned up like the 62c5186b@gateway/web/freenode/ip.98.197.24.107 retard.	[07:19]
mircea_popescu	and speaking of knc, check out what i found : https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=170332.msg1776663#msg1776663	[07:20]
assbot	Swedish ASIC miner company kncminer.com	[07:20]
ThickAsThieves	https://twitter.com/AmerBanker/status/524293068309008384	[07:21]
assbot	Manifesto Vows to Give Consumers Control of Digital Identities	[07:21]
ThickAsThieves	nice pic	[07:21]
mircea_popescu	i dun get it.	[07:21]
mircea_popescu	how do consumers not have such control ? or ?	[07:21]
ThickAsThieves	it's a woman lookin like she shit her pants, from Ripple, saying,	[07:22]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 62695 @ 0.00074101 = 46.4576 BTC [+] {2}	[07:22]
ThickAsThieves	"Innovation isnt inherently incompatible with regulation"	[07:22]
mircea_popescu	course it isn't.	[07:22]
mircea_popescu	the usg however, IS inherently incompatible with regulation.	[07:23]
mircea_popescu	because we're making the rules, not the fucking other way around, what is this.	[07:23]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3305 @ 0.00074123 = 2.4498 BTC [+]	[07:23]
ThickAsThieves	do we each get to make a rule?	[07:23]
mircea_popescu	sure. and enforce it, too.	[07:24]
ThickAsThieves	scam	[07:24]
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mircea_popescu	better scam than sorry.	[07:24]
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mircea_popescu	ripple's problem is more like "we enabled some scammers stealing a buncha coins" tho.	[07:25]
decimation	one can see why they would need to convince usg why they are very good little slaves	[07:25]
mircea_popescu	right ?	[07:26]
mircea_popescu	already convicted otherwise. better be useful.	[07:26]
decimation	since usg is a dim and neglectful master, they get away with it	[07:26]
mircea_popescu	it's funny that the us lost the "innovation" war back in 2013, and then lost the finance war. no smart kids, no rich kids,	[07:26]
mircea_popescu	its only hope now rests with the felons.	[07:26]
mircea_popescu	who knows, perhaps it has enough criminals that they become a significant minority in the new world, giving it some claim.	[07:27]
mircea_popescu	sad.	[07:27]
decimation	the us has plenty of high iq people, it's just that in general their efforts are misdirected into idiocy	[07:27]
mircea_popescu	so what's that do for me ?	[07:27]
ThickAsThieves	ripple is basically grasping for, Bitcoin for Banks, All the tech, none of the darkwebmunny	[07:27]
mircea_popescu	ThickAsThieves yeah, it and all the 500 other derps.	[07:28]
undata	decimation: or they get so depressed they barely function	[07:28]
mircea_popescu	"we have yet another version of bitcoin without bitcoin, choose us, because this works!!11"	[07:28]
ThickAsThieves	Bonus Undocumented Feature: Print Bitcoins!	[07:29]
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decimation	this is a peculiar habit in the us: trying to find a 'technical' solution for a very human problem	[07:29]
mircea_popescu	like dildos ?	[07:29]
decimation	heh	[07:30]
mircea_popescu	but it props the economy! :D	[07:30]
mircea_popescu	undata is that experience speaking ?	[07:30]
ThickAsThieves	conserve energy!	[07:30]
undata	mircea_popescu: I've seen it happen to friends brighter than I am.	[07:32]
undata	as for me, I keep myself moving hoping to strike at the thing myself someday	[07:33]
undata	but I've yet to make a pile, so that comes first	[07:33]
mircea_popescu	ic	[07:33]
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asciilifeform	not one in ten thousand shall leave the mines.	[07:38]
asciilifeform	that's sorta how it works.	[07:38]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform i dunno, but i dun believe so.	[07:38]
mircea_popescu	pretty much everyone leaves the mines. part of why "big government" is so lulzy.	[07:38]
mircea_popescu	i mean... how many east germans joined west germany ? ... all of em ?	[07:39]
asciilifeform	'leave the mines' - live as idle gentleman scholar.	[07:39]
asciilifeform	a la taleb	[07:39]
mircea_popescu	a	[07:39]
mircea_popescu	we were talkin of different things	[07:39]
*	asciilifeform sees arbeit macht frei as arbeit macht frei under whatever flag, equally odious	[07:40]
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asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: he did say 'I've yet to make a pile' - suggestive of the usual lament of folks who despair of ever buying their freedom	[07:43]
asciilifeform	(esp. while young enough to make something constructive of it)	[07:44]
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undata	eh, I'll get there	[07:45]
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PinkPosixPXE	Thanks thestringpuller and mircea_popescu :)	[07:48]
BingoBoingo	%p	[08:06]
atcbot	>> No data returned from CoinMiner.net << [PityThePool Hashrate]: 857.62 GH/s [iSpace Pool Hashrate]: 1.56 TH/s [P2P Hashrate]: 1.46 TH/s	[08:06]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5600 @ 0.00073959 = 4.1417 BTC [-]	[08:19]
ben_vulpes	regarding recent history of bitcoin: http://cascadianhacker.com/blog/2014/10/20_a-summary-of-changes-to-bitcoin-since-0321.html	[08:19]
assbot	A summary of changes to Bitcoin since 0.3.21	[08:19]
ben_vulpes	good night!	[08:20]
cazalla	qntra down	[08:21]
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mircea_popescu	The takeaway: next to nothing has been done to bring the Bitcoin project forwards since 0.5.3 (the duplicate TXID rules). << pretty much	[08:21]
mircea_popescu	;;isup qntra.net	[08:22]
gribble	qntra.net is down	[08:22]
mircea_popescu	wtf is this.	[08:22]
thestringpuller	~_~	[08:24]
thestringpuller	it had good uptime too	[08:24]
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RagnarDanneskjol	!s is down	[08:26]
assbot	898 results for 'is down' : http://search.bitcoin-assets.com/?q=is+down	[08:26]
mircea_popescu	cazalla kernel panic, brb.	[08:26]
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mircea_popescu	;;isup qntra.net	[08:35]
gribble	qntra.net is up	[08:35]
mircea_popescu	there we go.	[08:35]
cazalla	and here i thought ddosser was back	[08:36]
mircea_popescu	cazalla nah, was an update that wedged.	[08:37]
mircea_popescu	should be fine.	[08:37]
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mircea_popescu	ben_vulpes anyway, good article.	[08:38]
mircea_popescu	finally someone did the work so now when i say .8 and ulterior stuff is pure braindamage i have what to link to.	[08:38]
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BingoBoingo	Nao ben_vulpes can't take his blog down anymoar	[08:40]
mircea_popescu	srsly.	[08:41]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12400 @ 0.00073959 = 9.1709 BTC [-]	[09:20]
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mircea_popescu	From Gavin's own notes: "…accomodate higher transaction volume, and to measure what percentage of hashing power simply goes along with defaults." >> ben_vulpes if you recall the horror in his eyes back then...	[09:28]
mircea_popescu	needless to say, the "measurements" didn't come out like the pencildicks'd have liked them	[09:28]
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mircea_popescu	!up skylytez_	[09:32]
-assbot-	You voiced skylytez_ for 30 minutes.	[09:32]
*	assbot gives voice to skylytez_	[09:32]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12600 @ 0.00073909 = 9.3125 BTC [-]	[09:32]
skylytez_	thank you. i would like to be in the wot	[09:32]
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thestringpuller	;;google bitcoin-otc web of trust gpg guide	[09:33]
gribble	#bitcoin-otc web of trust: ; #bitcoin-otc: ; Using bitcoin-otc - bitcoin-otc wiki:	[09:33]
mircea_popescu	^	[09:34]
skylytez_	correct but to get a rating from one of the 29 people requires asking, if my reading of MP's blog over the past year is correct	[09:34]
mircea_popescu	asking doesn't work, if today's logs are any testament.	[09:36]
mircea_popescu	instead, do something.	[09:36]
mircea_popescu	there's stuff that needs doing coming up here on a regular basis, jump on something within your skillset when it happens.	[09:36]
mircea_popescu	speaking of which, what is your skillset ?	[09:36]
skylytez_	getting honey from bees	[09:37]
*	assbot gives voice to joecool	[09:37]
mircea_popescu	;;ident skylytez_	[09:37]
gribble	Nick 'skylytez_', with hostmask 'skylytez_!180f6af0@gateway/web/freenode/ip.24.15.106.240', is not identified.	[09:37]
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mircea_popescu	are you the chick that was previously here,	[09:38]
skylytez_	yes	[09:38]
thestringpuller	yay more chicks	[09:38]
joecool	hrm	[09:38]
mircea_popescu	maryjane ?	[09:38]
joecool	;;rated mircea_popescu	[09:38]
gribble	You rated user mircea_popescu on Tue Mar 11 16:14:24 2014, with a rating of 1, and supplied these additional notes: seems legit.	[09:38]
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skylytez_	no	[09:38]
mircea_popescu	wow, two beekeepers ?	[09:38]
joecool	oh i keep bees too	[09:39]
mircea_popescu	anwyay, make a wot id, that's the first step.	[09:39]
mircea_popescu	who knew, this was more like #beez than anything	[09:39]
thestringpuller	stealth games are hard as fuck	[09:39]
thestringpuller	you actually have to think	[09:39]
skylytez_	okay. More homework. Thank you (joecool bees are cool!) I will do things as my skillset improves.	[09:40]
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thestringpuller	^ an interesting one	[09:40]
mircea_popescu	this is a very shitty cult, it occurs to me. too much variety	[09:40]
thestringpuller	we're in a cult?	[09:41]
thestringpuller	i don't remember drinking any koolaid or punch	[09:41]
mircea_popescu	i read it somewhere.	[09:41]
undata	topple empire when?	[09:43]
RagnarDanneskjol	mircea_popescu this is a very shitty cult, it occurs to me. too much variety<	[09:43]
RagnarDanneskjol	thestringpuller we're in a cult?<< of course it is.. in the purest sense of the word	[09:43]
mircea_popescu	undata who knows these things...	[09:44]
mircea_popescu	empires generally self-topple tho	[09:44]
mircea_popescu	works sorta like seducing girls.	[09:44]
mircea_popescu	;;ud bofl	[09:45]
gribble	http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=bofl \| BOFL. Bubbling on the Floor Laughing. A less exaggerated version of ROFL - Rolling on the floor laughing. It's more of a chuckle version to that. Last night was a ...	[09:45]
RagnarDanneskjol	huh - I thought it was barfing	[09:46]
*	Now talking on #bitcoin-assets	[14:50]
*	Topic for #bitcoin-assets is: http://bitcoin-assets.com \|\| http://log.bitcoin-assets.com \|\| http://bash.bitcoin-assets.com \|\| http://blogs.bitcoin-assets.com	[14:50]
*	Topic for #bitcoin-assets set by kakobrekla!~kako@unaffiliated/kakobrekla at Wed Mar 5 21:58:12 2014	[14:50]
-assbot-	Welcome to #bitcoin-assets. To get voice (ie, to be able to speak), first identify with gribble and then send "!up" to assbot in a private message. If you do not have a WoT account, try politely asking one of the voiced people for a temporary pass.	[14:50]
*	assbot gives voice to xinxi	[14:50]
*	assbot gives voice to mircea_popescu	[14:51]
mircea_popescu	soo, i would like to share an idea with the group, then people who have worked with this type of thing liek jurov or whoever else can tell me what they think.	[14:51]
kakobrekla	hello mircea and welcome to the group	[14:52]
kakobrekla	everyone say hello	[14:52]
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mircea_popescu	basically, i'd like an installable package that creates a vm and runs code for a third party. everyone running it should be able to set a cost per metric (cpu cycles, ram usage, bandwidth, whatever) and a value per metric (idem), then the package talks to all the other packages installed so that every operation is run on that system with the lowest price.	[14:53]
mircea_popescu	obviously not everything is atomizable enough for this. nevertheless, basically it'd be a better tor + better torrent app + everything else.	[14:54]
*	assbot gives voice to chetty	[14:54]
mircea_popescu	extra points if a) it's provably impossible to crash/hijack a kernel running it from outside and b) it's provably impossible to establish to whom any operation belongs in the group.	[14:55]
chetty	uh I think the ancient ibm machines did this	[14:55]
mircea_popescu	chetty yes, they did.	[14:55]
mircea_popescu	but now that we have bitcoin, and the internet, it's actually feasible at a much better scale.	[14:55]
mircea_popescu	or so my business mind seems to think	[14:55]
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chetty	well these days power consumption seems more relevant than the other stuffs, except maybe % of pay to sysadmins	[14:56]
mircea_popescu	kakobrekla: now listen, get lost once again imma beat you. <<< waitwut ?!	[14:59]
xinxi	who can tell me whether it is cold in Orlando?	[15:00]
mircea_popescu	;;google temperature orlando florida	[15:00]
gribble	10 Day Weather Forecast for Orlando - weather.com: ; Monthly Weather Averages and Records for Orlando, FL: ; Orlando Weather - AccuWeather Forecast for FL 32801:	[15:00]
xinxi	seems a nice place.	[15:03]
mircea_popescu	meh, kinda wet.	[15:03]
xinxi	it should be better than singapore.	[15:05]
bounce	what did ibm do? also what is the scope of this "vm" thing, a complete OS image, or more an execution environment like jvm?	[15:05]
xinxi	I can hardly breathe when i first came to sg.	[15:05]
mircea_popescu	bounce as long as something useful works i'm happy. can be extended later.	[15:05]
mircea_popescu	honestly i'm happy for an alpha if all it does is remote page fetching, a la browsershots.org	[15:06]
bounce	fbsd has per-user cpu accounting, dunno if linux has that. can build on top of that I suppose.	[15:06]
mircea_popescu	xinxi nobody is born in singapore huh.	[15:06]
mircea_popescu	bounce im pretty sure it does have something similar.	[15:07]
mircea_popescu	anyway, ideally this would be for a popular distro. ubuntu, gentoo, something.	[15:07]
bounce	the talking between is going to be a bit of a bitch; rpc has been tried in many kinds and it never works quite right	[15:07]
kakobrekla	mircea_popescu i was talking to assbot	[15:07]
mircea_popescu	bounce maybe the rpc model is no good then.	[15:08]
mircea_popescu	maybe make it a queue rather than a rpc thing.	[15:08]
bounce	though qnx and possibly plan9 have kinda nice ipc, fit for clustering. so did vms, IIRC	[15:08]
mircea_popescu	(as in, the distributed network keeps a distributed queue of what's to do, picks from there)	[15:09]
bounce	there's a number of message passing queue packages around, but you'd have to settle on one	[15:09]
mircea_popescu	myeah.	[15:09]
bounce	there's also a number of clustering and misc management packages, cloud whatnots	[15:09]
mircea_popescu	right.	[15:09]
mircea_popescu	this would be a pretty sweet spot for ACTUAL innovation, as opposed to the usual "hi guise i made a new webwallet/scamcoin/exchange" blabla.	[15:10]
bounce	so you could perchance, dunno, take popular opencloud and throw docker at it and have most of what you want	[15:10]
mircea_popescu	make an actual bitcoin-dedicated, user portable cloud system	[15:10]
bounce	oh, add amoeba to the list of OSes	[15:10]
bounce	probably need to look at how much work/research/building you're prepared to spend and how much COTS-cruft you're willing to endure	[15:11]
chetty	so what you are saying is a blockchain work queue?	[15:11]
xinxi	maybe you can try openstack, I use it for my lab.	[15:11]
RagnarDanneskjol	yes this^	[15:12]
mircea_popescu	chetty essentially. it'd practically work as "mine with your computer, for arbitrary workloads and paid 100% out of tx fees" as it were	[15:12]
chetty	hmm like the seti project	[15:13]
bounce	can even go with the el cheapo route; spin up cloud instances across cloud providers based on spot pricing, though you'd need to bridge to fiat for that	[15:13]
mircea_popescu	or that protein folding thing, yes.	[15:13]
mircea_popescu	bounce i dun want that. fuck them.	[15:13]
bounce	oh, look at various "grid" things, moreso than "cloud"	[15:13]
mircea_popescu	the idea is to let people do this at home, say while they sleep.	[15:13]
bounce	http://boinc.berkeley.edu/ but forked and bitcoin added?	[15:14]
assbot	BOINC	[15:14]
mircea_popescu	maybe.	[15:15]
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bounce	or not even forked, maybe just a bitcoin-enabled job manager on top, dunno how that works	[15:16]
RagnarDanneskjol	https://bitcointa.lk/threads/feedback-request-bitcoin-cloud-services.167901/	[15:17]
assbot	[FEEDBACK REQUEST] Bitcoin cloud services \| Bitcointa.lk	[15:17]
kakobrekla	a) it's provably impossible to crash/hijack a kernel running it from outside < is that even possible to prove	[15:18]
kakobrekla	if it would be, we wouldnt have such holes.	[15:18]
xinxi	;;later tel Vexual ai is more general. an expert system is one way for implementing ai and only used for very limited domains.	[15:18]
gribble	Error: The "Later" plugin is loaded, but there is no command named "tel" in it. Try "list Later" to see the commands in the "Later" plugin.	[15:18]
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mircea_popescu	bounce yes, i agree the tech is just about there. all this project needs is a serious head dev.	[15:18]
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mircea_popescu	kakobrekla bonus points are bonus points.	[15:18]
xinxi	;;later tell Vexual ai is more general. an expert system is one way for implementing ai and only used for very limited domains.	[15:19]
gribble	The operation succeeded.	[15:19]
RagnarDanneskjol	mp - i can find him in 48 hours. what's the comp range?	[15:19]
*	bounce thinks there's room for a revamp of OS design, but that's long-term and sky-is-the-limit thinking	[15:19]
kakobrekla	i was hoping there was more to the answer :)	[15:19]
bounce	there a specific goal to this, like mining bitcoin, or more general?	[15:21]
*	assbot gives voice to punkman	[15:21]
mircea_popescu	RagnarDanneskjol about the same torvalds got in 1991.	[15:21]
mircea_popescu	i can name his ftp directory for him.	[15:21]
RagnarDanneskjol	ha k	[15:21]
mircea_popescu	bounce the goal is to obtain an uninterruptible computing platform.	[15:22]
bounce	general computing then	[15:22]
mircea_popescu	as in, confront the government with a manicheian choice : either stop ALL the internet, or none of it.	[15:22]
mircea_popescu	just like bitcoin has removed fine grained control, and tey're stuck to decide whether they stop it all or they stop none of it.	[15:22]
bounce	things like openmosix can do that at the process level, within the cluster	[15:23]
mircea_popescu	child porn, money laundering and so on.	[15:23]
kakobrekla	at first i only hated people. now that i recognize that computers have been lying to me my whole life im starting to dislike them too.	[15:23]
mircea_popescu	bounce so then all that's needed is a bitcoin merge into that ?	[15:23]
mircea_popescu	kakobrekla soon the imaginary friends will start fucking the imaginary girlfriends and there's going to be nothing left!	[15:23]
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punkman	kakobrekla: what happens to assbot anyway, does it crash?	[15:23]
bounce	various users would be sharing the same cluster, so containerisation would be a bit poor	[15:24]
bounce	AIUI anyway, haven't worked with any of those packages	[15:24]
mircea_popescu	;;ud aiui	[15:24]
gribble	http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=AIUI \| Apple touch icon Download the Free App! 1. AIUI. As I Understand It (slang, Usenet, IRC). AIUI, the n00b did not RTFM! by Ivo van der Elzen June 10, 2005. 18 2.	[15:24]
kakobrekla	punkman something tripped do ddos mitigation : null routing ip	[15:25]
*	assbot gives voice to Vexual	[15:25]
kakobrekla	you fall in a box for 3hrs	[15:25]
Vexual	thanks xinxi i know the difference	[15:25]
xinxi	Vexual - you are welcome	[15:25]
kakobrekla	this happened yesterday and today	[15:25]
bounce	for large-scale thingification that user separation is going to be important. and then there's the requirements of disk space and such. eg if you stick that all in a convenient image file you need to ship the entire thing around if you're trying to migrate to a different box	[15:26]
kakobrekla	and im pissed.	[15:26]
bounce	orrr you need a separate storage service, but then you need reliable and fast networking, as commonly found in datacentres optimised for this sort of thing, but much less so on the general 'net	[15:26]
mircea_popescu	bounce maybe better to define some allowed operations. create a language for this.	[15:27]
xinxi	i am more interested in the economic side of the “unstoppable computing platform”. who is going to support that? should the users pay to use like electricity?	[15:27]
mircea_popescu	xinxi obviously you'd pay to use it.	[15:27]
Vexual	a judicairy?	[15:27]
kakobrekla	mircea_popescu yeah, nothing left but to wait for the scythe.	[15:27]
bounce	so, there's lots of approaches, but also a multitude of problems and only specific solutions	[15:27]
xinxi	technically, that’s possible.	[15:28]
bounce	"possible" does not preclude "a right pain to make work" :-)	[15:28]
Vexual	you always pay	[15:28]
xinxi	all people work in a giant clustet. interesting idea.	[15:28]
mircea_popescu	bounce it would definitely be a right pain to make work, however,	[15:29]
mircea_popescu	it's the correct sort of pain	[15:29]
mircea_popescu	as opposed to the other, incorrect sort of pain.	[15:29]
bounce	again AIUI the thing with boinc-usable workloads is that they chop up the data in small bits and parcel them out as work units; not all problems are amendable to this model	[15:29]
xinxi	what are the benefits?	[15:29]
*	assbot gives voice to davout	[15:29]
davout	ohai	[15:29]
mircea_popescu	i imagine most people would want to get/post webpages as a workload model, and then do math as a close 2nd.	[15:30]
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mircea_popescu	hai davout !	[15:30]
xinxi	it’s unstoppable and always available?	[15:30]
mircea_popescu	file distribution may be a distant 3rd or a total blowout of the other two, depending on things and logics.	[15:30]
davout	mircea_popescu: "bounce maybe better to define some allowed operations. create a language for this." <<< with all operations being hard to perform but easy to check you'll probably end up with something quite limited	[15:30]
mircea_popescu	davout sex is also quite limited, and quite enjoyable.	[15:30]
bounce	we pretty much have that; the serving side requires a little more thought, though. can peruse, say, the heroku system architecture	[15:30]
mircea_popescu	xinxi well yeah, it'd be always available i guess.	[15:31]
davout	you'll end up creating a massive distributed computer that's really really good at bruteforcing hash functions :-)	[15:31]
mircea_popescu	doubt it'll work out that way	[15:31]
mircea_popescu	the reason is purely economical : if that worked bitcoin mining'd have made it a thing	[15:32]
bounce	bitcoin mining does exactly that, but in its own specific way	[15:33]
davout	that's what i was saying	[15:33]
bounce	well, the abstraction and access levels are different in this idea	[15:33]
davout	i'm wondering how you'll manage the billing part when the requesting party wants to check what he's paying for	[15:34]
bounce	the interface isn't the blockchain, but more generally usable. presumably.	[15:34]
davout	i'm paying you to compute 2+2	[15:34]
davout	you tell me it's 4 and that I owe you 1 BTC	[15:34]
mircea_popescu	davout a wot i think	[15:34]
davout	ok, so it's trust based	[15:34]
mircea_popescu	machines will need keys and reputation will have to be checked	[15:34]
bounce	you'd end up having to pay multiple people to do the thing so you can cross-check	[15:34]
mircea_popescu	ok, so it's trust based << well yeah i see no other way.	[15:35]
davout	bounce: that would work too	[15:35]
xinxi	maybe we can build a giant bayesian network on that to automatically discover a way for the ultimate AI and bootstrap the technology singularity.	[15:35]
mircea_popescu	you'd end up having to pay multiple people to do the thing so you can cross-check << not necessarily a drawback, this. plus it gives a tor-y sort of immunity.	[15:35]
mircea_popescu	so let's have both. redundancy and reputation.	[15:35]
bounce	this is how google's recaptchas work actually. in essence they're unpaid checks on their OCR input	[15:35]
mircea_popescu	yup	[15:35]
mircea_popescu	which is why that 4chan attack was so lulzy.	[15:36]
davout	if it's wot-based, it's kind of tying the scalability of that system with the scalability of the wot	[15:36]
mircea_popescu	the wot is more scalable than cunt.	[15:36]
xinxi	have you ever used twister?	[15:36]
Vexual	the boared game?	[15:37]
xinxi	p2p twitter	[15:37]
mircea_popescu	nope.	[15:38]
xinxi	i have top 500 companies’ ids on twister.	[15:41]
*	xinxi (~xinxi@nusnet-185-15.dynip.nus.edu.sg) has left #bitcoin-assets	[15:41]
Vexual	good point	[15:41]
mircea_popescu	you tell me it's 4 and that I owe you 1 BTC <<< nah the way this'd work is that you'd advertise you're paying up to 10 satoshi for a math operation ; i accept you send the thing i send the result you pay.	[15:41]
*	xinxi (~xinxi@nusnet-185-15.dynip.nus.edu.sg) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[15:41]
*	assbot gives voice to xinxi	[15:42]
mircea_popescu	or alternatively im paying 62 satoshi for a http request, you accept i send the url you send the page etc.	[15:42]
RagnarDanneskjol	i only halfway paid attention to the maidsafe thing. this sounds like that; i'm sure i missed something	[15:43]
mircea_popescu	RagnarDanneskjol i didn't pay any attention, nor will i, because well, they're not in wot.	[15:44]
mircea_popescu	might as well not exist.	[15:44]
xinxi	if twister works, it’s possible to copy that scheme and change all existing services to purely decentralized versions as well.	[15:44]
RagnarDanneskjol	good point!	[15:44]
mircea_popescu	xinxi maybe, but see above.	[15:44]
mircea_popescu	RagnarDanneskjol seems a distributed storage scheme.	[15:45]
RagnarDanneskjol	yea - running on lamecoin	[15:45]
dub	xinxi: the beauty of that is now, much like namecoin nobody will ever use twister	[15:45]
mircea_popescu	yeah lamecoins are a kiss of death for a project.	[15:45]
xinxi	yeah, usability may be an issue. but the technology is quite interesting.	[15:46]
mircea_popescu	;;google 27.150.231.51	[15:46]
gribble	No matches found.	[15:46]
bounce	CHINANET FUJIAN PROVINCE NETWORK	[15:47]
mircea_popescu	http://pastebin.com/25NbCt0z << fucking idiot, srsly. lrn 2 scriptkiddie, kiddies!	[15:47]
assbot	[Tue Oct 21 05:42:37 2014] [error] [client 27.150.231.51] client denied by serve - Pastebin.com	[15:47]
*	darlidada (~Decima`@unaffiliated/decima/x-7503346) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[15:48]
bounce	something to throw a fail2ban at	[15:49]
mircea_popescu	im kinda running this as half-honeypot half-service	[15:49]
mircea_popescu	the earlier "ddos" proved very productive for me.	[15:50]
bounce	how so?	[15:50]
bounce	in theory you'd throw an abuse complaint to the IP block admin, though this one'll probably only speak chinese and thus ignore non-chinese complaints	[15:51]
mircea_popescu	bounce http://trilema.com/2014/lifes-lemons-a-list-of-steps/ << here's a start.	[15:52]
mircea_popescu	i'd give you a link to the log discussing another approach, but the log site is down!	[15:53]
mircea_popescu	anyway it was something like, "here's a list of ips part of a botnet, which means you know they've been hijacked, which means feel free to take them over and use them, and if you're careful you can always blame the original hijacker"	[15:54]
*	GNULinuxGuy has quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)	[15:54]
*	assbot has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)	[15:55]
bounce	oh right. so you're now sitting on a botnet-crawled copy of teh intarwebz to start your own google with, no?	[15:55]
mircea_popescu	except i dun feel like starting my own google. the premise is borkt.	[15:55]
bounce	they make reasonable monies though	[15:55]
mircea_popescu	i dun wanna make moneys in stupid ways.	[15:56]
bounce	huh. principles. there's a surprise. gdr	[15:56]
mircea_popescu	bounce i wouldn't go as far. suppose you're playing a broken game, like whatever shit some franchise owner paid three dumbasses to code over a weekend.	[15:57]
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mircea_popescu	now, you COULD spend your time in the cave of idiocy, killing rats for a "profit", because hey, it's a profit.	[15:57]
mircea_popescu	i'd rather have fun with my game than make the counter go up.	[15:57]
bounce	alright	[15:58]
mircea_popescu	or, as i used to tell my retarded romanian friends (causality, not mere coincidence), idiots make money whichever way they can. normal people make money whichever way they want.	[15:58]
chetty	but making the counter go up is the fun ... just spoils it if it feels like cheating somehow	[15:58]
mircea_popescu	no, it spoils it if it DOESNT feel like cheating.	[15:59]
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asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: this concept of yours - it's really an idea that virtually every thinking man who's ever dealt with computing - had. not unlike bitcoin.	[15:59]
mircea_popescu	i don't think i know of any worse downer on any achievement possible than the knowledge or implication that i actually earned it.	[15:59]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform sure.	[15:59]
mircea_popescu	im not an innovator, im a manager.	[15:59]
mircea_popescu	im not saying "hey this is new", i'm saying "hey, isn't it time yet ?"	[15:59]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: yes, it's time. but -	[16:00]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: you need new computers.	[16:00]
Vexual	new words	[16:00]
mircea_popescu	and a new penis!	[16:00]
Vexual	satoshi business	[16:00]
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mircea_popescu	sorry stan. unless that new penis is coming out of this old penis somehow, that new penis ain't happening.	[16:00]
mircea_popescu	natura non facit saltus.	[16:00]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: well, it must come out of old penis in the sense that we all have old ones, can use to spray out new.	[16:01]
mircea_popescu	aite, i;m all for it.	[16:01]
*	asciilifeform does not produce electronics with bag of ore and needle	[16:01]
*	Vexual does	[16:01]
mircea_popescu	lol	[16:02]
mircea_popescu	;;ud gdr	[16:02]
gribble	http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=GDR \| The German Democratic Republic (GDR), or simply East Germany as it was commonly known, was a communist state that existed from 1949 to 1990 in the ...	[16:02]
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mircea_popescu	hm. bounce is not only teachning me old irc terms, but is also too advanced for ud	[16:03]
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Vexual	;;ud urbit	[16:05]
gribble	Google found nothing.	[16:05]
asciilifeform	lol	[16:05]
mircea_popescu	that was cold.	[16:06]
mats_cd03	;;ticker	[16:10]
gribble	Bitstamp BTCUSD ticker \| Best bid: 388.43, Best ask: 388.45, Bid-ask spread: 0.02000, Last trade: 388.43, 24 hour volume: 6927.00803736, 24 hour low: 378.01, 24 hour high: 388.45, 24 hour vwap: 383.469987687	[16:10]
*	xinxi has quit (Quit: xinxi)	[16:11]
Vexual	xinxi will be back with ubrbit stip poker	[16:11]
punkman	no meat	[16:11]
mircea_popescu	the stuff Vexual remembers...	[16:11]
*	eizodo (51c21b9c@gateway/web/freenode/ip.81.194.27.156) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[16:11]
Vexual	it comes in flashes	[16:12]
*	aspho has quit (Remote host closed the connection)	[16:12]
mircea_popescu	!up eizodo	[16:12]
mircea_popescu	aww assbot!	[16:12]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: i do so love when thinking folks arrive at this problem - because it is the 'pons asinorum' of existing technological fundaments sucking irredeemably.	[16:13]
mircea_popescu	kakobrekla you know rite ?	[16:13]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform this is not necessarily good news.	[16:13]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: who said good news.	[16:14]
mircea_popescu	see here's the strategic problem involved : if this can be made to work on the c machine, and then a s machine can be made which runs it more efficiently, this practically guarantees a future of s machines, much to the baddie's haples dismay.	[16:14]
*	asciilifeform is optimist, thinks that when the ants rise, perhaps they'll build proper computers...	[16:14]
mircea_popescu	IF however this can not be made to work on the c machine, that alone is sufficient pressure to keep the s machine unmade forever.	[16:14]
mircea_popescu	so it really pretty much all hinges on this point.	[16:15]
mircea_popescu	without it, there will never be an s machine.	[16:15]
mircea_popescu	i am not kidding, either, it's actually what it is. /me has spent a bunch of cpu time on this matter, it's well considered.	[16:15]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: in principle, as you know, anything can be made to 'work' through brute mathematical strength (emulation). the real problem is impedance mismatch - everyone who doesn't like the 1,000+-fold loss of efficiency will run off and go 'closer to metal', eschewing the 's'	[16:16]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: this is what originally happened with, e.g., common lisp	[16:16]
mircea_popescu	i dun think you take my meaning.	[16:16]
Vexual	https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qOyF4hR5GoE	[16:16]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: do explain. my meaning here is quite simple - you can emulate anything you wish on your current inexpensive machine - but if the object differs sufficiently from said machine, at some point you end up with a ruinously inefficient apparatus	[16:18]
mircea_popescu	if this = if the proposed shared computing thing.	[16:18]
asciilifeform	e.g., if you were to emulate 'setun' (ru. trinary cpu) in software (yes, exists)	[16:18]
mats_cd03	;;google "s machine" and "c machine"	[16:19]
gribble	C & S Machine Company \| Home: ; Capabilities - C & S Machine Company:	[16:19]
mats_cd03	;;next	[16:19]
gribble	See latest update from Onefixt here: https://twitter.com/BitcoinOracle/	[16:19]
*	aspho (~aspho@94.204.106.77) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[16:19]
asciilifeform	mats_cd03: 'c machine' is the only one you might turn up	[16:19]
*	aspho has quit (Client Quit)	[16:20]
mats_cd03	dunno how twitter ended up in that query...	[16:20]
mircea_popescu	mats_cd03 we've been calling the x86 the "c machine" for some reason.	[16:20]
mircea_popescu	s stands for stan.	[16:20]
asciilifeform	the original 'c machine' was the pdp.	[16:20]
mats_cd03	http://www.hillydilly.com/2014/10/leon-bridges-coming-home-better-man	[16:21]
mircea_popescu	"Blo.gs has been transferred from Yahoo to Automattic. We look forward to beefing up and refreshing the service. More news to follow."	[16:22]
mircea_popescu	what the fuck is this supposed to mean ?	[16:22]
mircea_popescu	yahoo owns automattic ?	[16:22]
Vexual	6 months = beef	[16:23]
Vexual	theyr're lost in the desert	[16:24]
mats_cd03	lots of yahoo influence in automattic	[16:24]
mircea_popescu	seems so.	[16:24]
*	disident (~disident@unaffiliated/disident) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[16:24]
mats_cd03	previous CEO toni schneider was at yahoo before mullenweg	[16:24]
mircea_popescu	no fucking wonder eh.	[16:24]
asciilifeform	kakobrekla: log dead?	[16:25]
mats_cd03	http://blogs.wsj.com/korearealtime/2014/01/22/jackpot-or-crackpot-park-on-korean-reunification	[16:27]
mats_cd03	i very much doubt there's ever going to be a korean reunification	[16:27]
asciilifeform	'reunification' - sk codespeak for conquest and anal rape of nk	[16:27]
mats_cd03	who would agree to have their economy overwhelmed by beggars?	[16:28]
asciilifeform	s/sk/kr	[16:28]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform what';s to rape ?	[16:28]
Vexual	i agree, they have "let's not run outta rice" policies in place	[16:28]
mircea_popescu	those people are really at the bottom.	[16:28]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: they weren't always at the bottom. almost until late '70s - more industrialized than south.	[16:28]
mats_cd03	even the dummies proposing conquest of nk know its unworkable	[16:28]
mircea_popescu	but they ARE now.	[16:28]
mats_cd03	seoul - raped in fifteen mins.	[16:28]
asciilifeform	they are now, and conquest would be final headshot in half a century of clobbering.	[16:29]
mircea_popescu	well, gotta do the headshot.	[16:29]
asciilifeform	rarely winner hurries to do the headshot.	[16:29]
mircea_popescu	mats_cd03 seoul would prolly enjoy it.	[16:29]
asciilifeform	usually, if he's uncertain, suspects victim might get up.	[16:29]
mats_cd03	dprk's gotta collapse under its own weight.	[16:29]
asciilifeform	south k is usg's 'unsinkable carrier,' and as such, i should like to see the fine folks of nk trash it as thoroughly as they could.	[16:30]
mircea_popescu	uh	[16:30]
Vexual	badman	[16:30]
mircea_popescu	inasmuch as sk is technologically advanced when compared to the primitive us... this carrier theory fails to impress.	[16:31]
asciilifeform	in all seriousness, nk is an important and non-renewable resource on planet 3 - a kind of 'nature preserve' where nothing smelling even vaguely of usg - not even 'big mac' - is permitted	[16:32]
Vexual	i feel that	[16:32]
asciilifeform	this is one of the reasons for the vitriol.	[16:32]
Vexual	its the general conesensus	[16:33]
asciilifeform	'see, these bastards won't allow micky-d?! result - concentration camps!'	[16:33]
mircea_popescu	you know, keeping idiocy away at the cost of bigger idiocy is not any sort of deal.	[16:33]
Vexual	ill just leave then	[16:33]
mircea_popescu	lol	[16:33]
bounce	but! no big macs!	[16:34]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: is not any sort of deal << much of what looks like idiocy of nk is reaction to a state of vicious siege by the 'international komyooniti'	[16:34]
Vexual	komyooniti?	[16:34]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform let's put the matter in sexual terms, which are easier to think of. so, suppose we're 13, and for whatever reason we don't like girls. your solution is to get rid of everything "girl like" such as the holes in tp rolls, as inconvenient as that may be in the end. my solution is to let them come by even - fancy that, girls! - provided they know they have to strip naked in the garage, go everywhere on all fo	[16:35]
mircea_popescu	urs and do the cleanning.	[16:35]
bounce	anyway, soonish the sandpit currently in spring might be empty again. there, your resource renewed.	[16:35]
mircea_popescu	now which seems more sensible an approach ?	[16:35]
*	TheKingOfCPU (~TheKingOf@c-50-169-19-126.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[16:36]
mircea_popescu	isolation from the inferior is not a sane policy. enslavement of the inferior is the sane policy.	[16:36]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: idea here is, it may be that the micky-d-permitted world is corrupted beyond reformattability, so to speak. then nk will be the folks who keep the fire going.	[16:36]
mircea_popescu	isn't this a bit too close to magical thinking ?	[16:37]
mircea_popescu	i mean, holes in tp rolls won't make you gay.	[16:37]
asciilifeform	it's a wild hypothesis, yes	[16:37]
mircea_popescu	kay.	[16:37]
asciilifeform	not insisting that we actually need nk for anything	[16:37]
asciilifeform	just that the hatred of it by usg et. al. is rooted in something quite real.	[16:37]
mircea_popescu	sure.	[16:37]
asciilifeform	it's the last remaining 'pepsi.'	[16:37]
mircea_popescu	but this isn't art, we're not interested in authentic feeling. productivity is a concern.	[16:38]
asciilifeform	was quite productive compared to kr until blockades of '70s - which continue even now	[16:38]
*	pete_dushenski (~pete_dush@unaffiliated/pete-dushenski/x-8158685) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[16:38]
mircea_popescu	well sure, and in that sense c machines are quite productive when compared to lisp machines	[16:38]
mircea_popescu	except for all the errors and problems.	[16:38]
mircea_popescu	o.O	[16:38]
asciilifeform	nk was a high-volume exporter of very fine machine tools, for example	[16:38]
kakobrekla	kakobrekla: log dead?	[16:38]
kakobrekla	well this is hilarious.	[16:38]
mircea_popescu	they lost the tech race.	[16:39]
Vexual	and freebase colde medecine	[16:39]
asciilifeform	which country would not 'lose the tech race' if all were forbidden by 'international comyoonity' to buy virtually anything from it?	[16:39]
mircea_popescu	a good one ?	[16:39]
asciilifeform	or to ship virtually anything (save food) there?	[16:39]
mircea_popescu	la serenissima, for instance ?	[16:39]
asciilifeform	only works because no geography to it.	[16:40]
mircea_popescu	lmao	[16:40]
mircea_popescu	it makes exactly NO difference why it works	[16:40]
kakobrekla	http://shrani.si/f/C/u5/4Rqc558G/log.png	[16:40]
mircea_popescu	or why it doesn't work. this ain't a game kids play , that can be ammended to "make it fair"	[16:40]
*	ChanServ gives channel operator status to kakobrekla	[16:40]
Vexual	oshit	[16:41]
asciilifeform	diaspora wins in this way against 'country', ancient observation really	[16:41]
*	kakobrekla is now known as assbot	[16:41]
bounce	isn't that what the wto does?	[16:41]
*	assbot is now known as kakobrekla	[16:41]
mircea_popescu	kakobrekla : i see your lulz and raise you my lulz. http://trilema.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/qntra-bw.png	[16:41]
kakobrekla	yeah yeah but here charting is broked	[16:42]
Vexual	you dont get extra credit for borked chartes	[16:42]
mats_cd03	70gb/s?	[16:42]
mircea_popescu	mats_cd03 yeah, because mullenweg's poetry is never used for attacks over 2gbps	[16:43]
mircea_popescu	he knows.	[16:43]
mats_cd03	damn, nigga	[16:43]
asciilifeform	!s mullenweg	[16:43]
asciilifeform	aha no arsebot	[16:43]
mircea_popescu	!s 550 gpbs	[16:43]
asciilifeform	lol	[16:43]
mircea_popescu	it's in the logs.	[16:43]
*	asciilifeform blows dust off personal log	[16:43]
*	kakobrekla is now known as assbot	[16:44]
asciilifeform	aha mullenweg is a flondor.	[16:44]
punkman	that's 70gb/day not sec	[16:44]
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*	assbot (~kako@unaffiliated/kakobrekla/bot/assbot) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[16:44]
*	card.freenode.net gives channel operator status to assbot	[16:44]
*	card.freenode.net gives voice to assbot	[16:44]
Vexual	There was movement at the station, for the word had passed around	[16:45]
*	assbot gives voice to pete_dushenski	[16:46]
Vexual	That the cold from old regret had got away	[16:46]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: you're quite right that a corpse won't get up even if everyone laments how 'unfairly' it was turned into a corpse. but i'm not convinced that nk is a corpse.	[16:46]
Vexual	no it's poorly managed	[16:46]
asciilifeform	for one thing, even the most miserable beggar in nk is homo sapiens and not homo redditicus	[16:47]
asciilifeform	what a reserve!	[16:47]
mats_cd03	https://soundcloud.com/madeon/madeon-imperium	[16:47]
*	assbot gives voice to undata	[16:48]
assbot	manual voicing fuck yea.	[16:48]
asciilifeform	no one in nk, afaik, has partaken of recycled food;	[16:48]
asciilifeform	select elite is permitted net access	[16:48]
Vexual	you lived in soviet union, it's probabbly similar	[16:49]
asciilifeform	Vexual: lol!	[16:49]
assbot	so is everyone ok with 'we just lose logs and keep assbot when ddos' ?	[16:49]
RagnarDanneskjol	no	[16:49]
assbot	alright then, ill decouple.	[16:49]
Vexual	just you have to hide internet nad crank lab as well as cow	[16:49]
assbot	too late!	[16:50]
mircea_popescu	punkman shh! runing my good lulz!	[16:50]
mats_cd03	70gb/s would be quite a feat to resist	[16:50]
mircea_popescu	(but yes, i was cheating, it never came even close)	[16:50]
assbot	scam	[16:50]
mircea_popescu	!down assbot	[16:50]
mircea_popescu	supress all the evidences!	[16:50]
assbot	it already in the logs	[16:51]
assbot	o wait.	[16:51]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform what'd take to convince you ?	[16:51]
Vexual	what fucking evidence?	[16:51]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: convince of what	[16:51]
*	asciilifeform is still waking up	[16:51]
*	mircea_popescu takes advantage of the move to buttsex a now empty kakobrekla.	[16:51]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform nk corpse.	[16:52]
assbot	lol	[16:52]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: aha	[16:52]
Vexual	how do you know he's empty?	[16:52]
mircea_popescu	Vexual contents moved into assbot	[16:52]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: it's a corpse if when usg et al are in ruins, doesn't get up.	[16:52]
Vexual	well well	[16:52]
assbot	whut?	[16:52]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform nonsense. it's a corpse because have you seen their "largest building on earth" thingee ?	[16:53]
Vexual	consider yourself represend assbot	[16:53]
mircea_popescu	a country's a corpse when its achievements are hollow.	[16:53]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: everyone's seen that one	[16:53]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: we had these in ru. and not entirely corpse.	[16:53]
mircea_popescu	"entirely" corspe ? there's no ru. you had them in cccp. which, yes, corpse.	[16:53]
mircea_popescu	and not because of the muricans, either.	[16:53]
asciilifeform	usg does behave as if the corpse still twitched	[16:54]
mircea_popescu	so it would.	[16:54]
mircea_popescu	chicks behave as if the penis is still erect throughout the day.	[16:54]
asciilifeform	lol	[16:54]
chetty	usg just wishes the corpse would twitch so they have a 'qualified' boogeyman	[16:56]
undata	the US govt still uses the anti-russian shtick from time to time (especially since the Ukraine situation) but has segued to using "radical islam" much more frequently	[16:56]
mircea_popescu	for one thing, even the most miserable beggar in nk is homo sapiens and not homo redditicus << this, in particular, i have no time for. seriously, everyone ? like who, like these cumdumpsters http://trilema.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/03/best-cunts.jpg ?	[16:57]
mircea_popescu	yeah, they totally look not like reddit. o.O	[16:57]
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asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: those? they're at work.	[16:59]
chetty	to be fair those are not the poorest beggars	[16:59]
mircea_popescu	yes, they are. they just don't realise it.	[17:00]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: i've never once worked a job that didn't feature this scene.	[17:00]
mircea_popescu	just like your average redditard	[17:00]
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mircea_popescu	leah whatever her name is, with a mortgage and a diploma.	[17:00]
Vexual	leah bitxoin?	[17:00]
chetty	MP harem prolly not that much different :P	[17:00]
mircea_popescu	quite different.	[17:00]
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Vexual	!up mike_c	[17:03]
asciilifeform	the reason i say 'they're at work' and that it is no reddit, is that a reddit is fundamentally a voluntary act	[17:03]
mircea_popescu	so is their "work"	[17:03]
asciilifeform	no one is marched grimly to the reddit	[17:03]
asciilifeform	so they can eat.	[17:03]
mircea_popescu	reddit is the workplace of the failed young adult, unemployable and "educated"	[17:03]
mircea_popescu	o yes they are.	[17:03]
undata	self-immolation is always an option.	[17:03]
asciilifeform	undata: if you can find the petrol!	[17:03]
asciilifeform	yes they are << curious, how?	[17:04]
pete_dushenski	asciilifeform undata siphon from parents' car!	[17:04]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform same exact way stan.	[17:04]
mircea_popescu	"other people"	[17:04]
mircea_popescu	l'enfer, c'est l'autres.	[17:05]
asciilifeform	pete_dushenski: talk to a medic in usa. these folks have a similarly dim concept of how to seppuku as of, e.g., how to program a computer	[17:05]
*	asciilifeform always saw reddit as an ordinary vice, like opium	[17:05]
pete_dushenski	asciilifeform suicide is similarly taboo up north	[17:06]
asciilifeform	one might take to opium from despair, or because you smoked it for the last 5 years and zapped your endorphins - but, required?	[17:07]
Vexual	perhaps	[17:07]
pete_dushenski	the city here is paying $2m for a cage to prevent people from jumping off the highest bridge... and cutting funding to the suicide hotline	[17:07]
pete_dushenski	such bezzle	[17:07]
Vexual	bullshit	[17:07]
undata	depends in my view on whether the "masses" essentially need leadership, or whether they can reasonably be expected to fend for themselves.	[17:07]
undata	asciilifeform: ^	[17:08]
pete_dushenski	undata you read http://www.contravex.com/2014/09/18/you-cant-elect-strong-shepherds-and-you-cant-produce-anything-of-value-without-them/ ?	[17:08]
asciilifeform	in what way is some perverse ceremony the king compels you to take part in, a 'reddit' ?	[17:08]
undata	pete_dushenski: no, but I will	[17:08]
Vexual	how'd you like sydney pete?	[17:08]
*	assbot gives voice to mike_c	[17:09]
pete_dushenski	Vexual patience... i'm still a ways away!	[17:09]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform imo it's the new workplace.	[17:09]
Vexual	oh i thought you'd been there and done that	[17:09]
asciilifeform	new workplace << how's that?	[17:10]
asciilifeform	no pay	[17:10]
mircea_popescu	depends in my view on whether the "masses" essentially need leadership, or whether they can reasonably be expected to fend for themselves. << being owned is a fundamental human need.	[17:10]
mircea_popescu	tho polite psychologists call it "the need to belong"	[17:10]
pete_dushenski	heya mike_c. good point on the qntra blog. if i take another stab at it, i'll definitely tone down the blogger in me.	[17:10]
undata	mircea_popescu: then I'd say the peasants are gathered where they're easy to find; someone should see to them.	[17:10]
mircea_popescu	pete_dushenski the man who knows how to cook two different kinds of things is a better cook.	[17:10]
mircea_popescu	undata except many peasants, few someones. or in other word, ars longa, vita brevis, cock's only up a few minutes a day.	[17:11]
mike_c	pete_dushenski: cool, looking forward to it.	[17:11]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform the kIDing ?	[17:11]
pete_dushenski	mircea_popescu agreed.	[17:11]
undata	mircea_popescu: haha, surely the internet provides something of a cock... amplifier?	[17:11]
asciilifeform	the folks on reddit 12h/day, presumably are fed somehow, and would remain fed if they decided to study mathematics instead	[17:12]
mircea_popescu	undata does not, no.	[17:12]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform not so.	[17:12]
mircea_popescu	you presume this "decision" object that's undefined.	[17:12]
asciilifeform	(on that day, i will propel myself into orbit using the monkeys that will fly from my arse, but that's beside the point)	[17:12]
mircea_popescu	no pay << i didn't fucking say "payplace" did i.	[17:14]
asciilifeform	lol!	[17:14]
mircea_popescu	well ? :)	[17:14]
asciilifeform	then yes, open-air prison	[17:14]
mircea_popescu	best korea!	[17:14]
asciilifeform	amazing korea.	[17:14]
mircea_popescu	amazing ass, bot!	[17:14]
Vexual	the border i swell defined	[17:15]
Vexual	one cannot stroll across	[17:15]
asciilifeform	incidentally, i was always curious why no bezzlatron lord (e.g. mark z) ever thought of opening a reddit which -does- pay the prisoners a subsistence wage	[17:15]
asciilifeform	that one would end up mandatory.	[17:16]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform i had this. fain, it was called, romanian digg.	[17:16]
Vexual	one in ten probably has some understanding of the permeability	[17:16]
asciilifeform	aha that thing	[17:16]
mircea_popescu	it's how romania made 90% of all bitcoin it ever made, back in 2012.	[17:16]
*	assbot gives voice to othernubs`	[17:17]
chetty	the most workable prisons are the ones where the prisoners don't even see the bars	[17:17]
othernubs`	Vexual> the border i swell defined <<< i swell, defined!	[17:17]
Vexual	othernubs`: my tyypos are all accidental i swear	[17:17]
othernubs`	is wear!	[17:17]
Vexual	thats contrite	[17:19]
othernubs`	chetty does devil's island fall under this category? :D	[17:19]
mircea_popescu	othernubs` hey, you got all the orders about making a book ?	[17:19]
othernubs`	mp prolly havent seen any ;;notes, been getting this OLPC box set up and haven't authed as nubbins` in a few days	[17:20]
othernubs`	;;notes nubbins`	[17:22]
gribble	Sent 12 hours and 3 minutes ago: ^ that something you can do ? and Sent 10 hours and 47 minutes ago: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-10-2014#885779	[17:22]
Vexual	;;gettrust othernubs`	[17:22]
gribble	Currently authenticated from hostmask othernubs`!~leel@stjhnf0157w-142163081094.dhcp-dynamic.FibreOP.nl.bellaliant.net. Trust relationship from user muXne to user othernubs`: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 0 via 0 connections. Graph: http://b-otc.com/stg?source=muXne&dest=othernubs%60 \| WoT data: http://b-otc.com/vrd?nick=othernubs%60 \| Rated since: Mon Oct 20 00:55:51 2014	[17:22]
mircea_popescu	lol none of which works i guess	[17:22]
chetty	chetty does devil's island fall under this category?//nope, the bars(water) can be observed	[17:22]
othernubs`	shit, newfoundland is a prison in that case ;p	[17:23]
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othernubs`	none of which works :)	[17:26]
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mircea_popescu	othernubs` gimme a sec here	[17:27]
mircea_popescu	http://pastebin.com/aSnSmds0 << othernubs` and i think someone else wanted a copy but i forget who	[17:28]
mircea_popescu	btw if anyone cares : Ὁ βίος βραχύς, ἡ δὲ τέχνη μακρή, ὁ δὲ καιρὸς ὀξύς, ἡ δὲ πεῖρα σφαλερή, ἡ δὲ κρίσις χαλεπή.	[17:29]
othernubs`	oh fun	[17:29]
othernubs`	definitely do-able, sounds like a bitta work	[17:30]
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othernubs`	how many lines of code, anyone know offhand?	[17:30]
mircea_popescu	it's about 1.5mb or so	[17:31]
mats_cd03	asciilifeform: what did you need a server for? i have access to a beefy cluster if you want to run a job.	[17:32]
chanserv	op #bitcoin-assets	[17:32]
*	ChanServ gives channel operator status to mircea_popescu	[17:32]
*	mircea_popescu gives voice to Adlai	[17:33]
Vexual	shits getting all irc	[17:33]
*	mircea_popescu gives voice to nubbins`	[17:34]
*	mircea_popescu gives voice to mike_c	[17:34]
*	mircea_popescu gives voice to Pierre_Rochard	[17:34]
*	mircea_popescu gives voice to pete_dushenski	[17:34]
*	othernubs` thinks	[17:34]
othernubs`	yeah, gimme a week or so	[17:35]
*	Vexual scoffs	[17:35]
mircea_popescu	othernubs` the actual link was... also in the log lol.	[17:35]
mircea_popescu	to the code i mean	[17:35]
Adlai	othernubs`: http://pastebin.com/3zBvbFD1	[17:35]
othernubs`	ah :D	[17:35]
mircea_popescu	shit you only realise wtf how much better #b-a is than a normal chan once the specific stuff hickups	[17:35]
mircea_popescu	im like... o, rly, irc w/o logs ? wut ?	[17:35]
Vexual	why 0.6?	[17:36]
Adlai	tl;dr: 210k lines of actual code, another ~160k lines of assorted crap	[17:36]
mircea_popescu	problem is... 210k lines would come to what, 3000 pages ?	[17:37]
mircea_popescu	course as a special printing job you could print on sideways paper.	[17:38]
Vexual	mircea_popescu: you're rinstating bait from 8chan? ho wwill you explain the semanitcs?	[17:38]
mircea_popescu	im not doin' anything	[17:38]
Vexual	8 means sonething else in japan	[17:39]
Vexual	its magical tux when he slumps	[17:40]
othernubs`	well the real problem is long lines that need to be broken	[17:41]
othernubs`	this shit is hard to read	[17:41]
mats_cd03	print on legal size!	[17:42]
Vexual	foolscap	[17:42]
othernubs`	fuck that, print on ledger	[17:42]
othernubs`	foolscap is for paper airplanes	[17:42]
mircea_popescu	print on individually cut papr for each line	[17:42]
mircea_popescu	then let user accidentally drop the pile.	[17:42]
*	Guest68195 is now known as thickasthieves	[17:43]
mircea_popescu	bitcoin improvements.	[17:43]
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othernubs`	not bad	[17:43]
*	mircea_popescu gives voice to thickasthieves	[17:43]
othernubs`	confetti	[17:43]
rithm	can it self distruct after reading too?	[17:43]
thickasthieves	;;ticker	[17:44]
thickasthieves	bitstamp is down	[17:44]
gribble	Error: Failure to retrieve ticker. Try again later.	[17:44]
thickasthieves	maybe it's our ddos friend	[17:45]
pete_dushenski	othernubs` some binding ideas for ye: http://www.darkroastedblend.com/2007/08/unusual-books.html	[17:45]
mats_cd03	;;isup bitstamp.net	[17:45]
gribble	bitstamp.net is up	[17:45]
Vexual	im not sure if ive mentioned it before but mr talebs' invite was clturally innapropriate	[17:47]
pete_dushenski	Vexual levantines no like sexy time?	[17:48]
thickasthieves	well if he didnt like the invite, he wouldnt like it here either	[17:50]
othernubs`	asciilifeform, srsly tho, 1btc? :0	[17:50]
thickasthieves	so maybe it was perfect	[17:50]
othernubs`	pete_dushenski, i should prolly wait til i'm at an actual computer before i click that link	[17:50]
othernubs`	this machine slows dangerously when stressed ;p	[17:51]
Vexual	whaddaya got an ipad clitring?	[17:51]
othernubs`	heh	[17:51]
othernubs`	olpc xo-1	[17:52]
Vexual	oh nice	[17:52]
othernubs`	its like a tenth of an ipad	[17:52]
asciilifeform	othernubs`: willing to consider even 2 - but product has to be genuinely nice.	[17:52]
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othernubs`	asciilifeform, i do indeed make genuinely nice things	[17:52]
Vexual	motions the same	[17:52]
asciilifeform	othernubs`: lay-flat?	[17:52]
asciilifeform	colour print?	[17:53]
asciilifeform	no mutilated cpp syntax (e.g. lines broken in places such that a compiler would balk were they re-entered in that form) ?	[17:53]
Vexual	dy na mo	[17:53]
asciilifeform	mats_cd03: server << for nosuchlabs.com	[17:53]
othernubs`	i was a programmer by trade for 5 years, i know how to display code in a sensible fashion :)	[17:54]
xanthyos	https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B0eoDDwIAAIh8B5.jpg	[17:54]
pete_dushenski	yay! dow is soaring again!	[17:55]
pete_dushenski	thanks be to aapl pay!	[17:55]
othernubs`	tell ya what, if you put half a btc down, i'll dive in. if it ends up not working out for practical reasons, i'll refund ya	[17:55]
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asciilifeform	Adlai, nubbins`: the xml crap can be burned, and in the printing job can only be done by a fellow who understands that not all of the tarball is useful	[17:55]
kakobrekla	a compiler would balk were they re-entered in that form) ? < ocr purpose?	[17:56]
Vexual	http://www.vevo.com/watch/robin-thicke/Blurred-Lines-%28Unrated-Version%29/USUV71300526	[17:56]
pete_dushenski	xanthyos lol!	[17:56]
asciilifeform	kakobrekla: nah, i just want the 'fried ice' of text that is at least 4mm tall but no - under any circumstances - extra brain effort to reassemble lines.	[17:57]
othernubs`	if it ends up being made, and being something others want, i'll even give ya 10% of net profits	[17:57]
pete_dushenski	Vexual nb.	[17:57]
othernubs`	;;google diverse capable proud site:youtube.com	[17:58]
gribble	Diverse. Capable. Proud. This is Today's RNC - :60 - YouTube: ; Diverse. Capable. Proud. This is Today's RNC - :15 - YouTube: ; Diverse. Capable. Proud. This is Today's RNC - :30 - YouTube:	[17:58]
othernubs`	^ watch 1st link	[17:58]
othernubs`	;;google rnc tourism video site:youtube.com	[17:58]
gribble	RNC Tourism Video - YouTube: ; AROUND CLEVELAND: RNC finds out what Clevelanders already ...: ; Ad 2 TB AdCast: Branding Tampa Bay (RNC) - YouTube:	[17:58]
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asciilifeform	othernubs`: crank out a pgp-signed proclamation with addr for deposit	[17:59]
othernubs`	^ then that 1st link	[17:59]
othernubs`	asciilifeform, sec	[17:59]
asciilifeform	othernubs`: i'll see to it when i come back from where i'm about to go.	[17:59]
pete_dushenski	othernubs` such snowmobile!	[17:59]
othernubs`	:o	[17:59]
othernubs`	such attack dog, so riot gear	[17:59]
pete_dushenski	cazalla BingoBoingo http://www.coindesk.com/bitnet-lands-14-5-million-series-funding-rival-coinbase-bitpay/	[18:01]
pete_dushenski	^dat bezzlesplosion	[18:01]
Vexual	ratuken	[18:01]
Vexual	now theres a two way enjoy	[18:02]
Vexual	https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iEPTlhBmwRg	[18:03]
pete_dushenski	heh time to print more food stamps >> http://www.usatoday.com/story/money/business/2014/10/21/mcdonalds-fast-food-restaurants-earnings/17652697/	[18:03]
pete_dushenski	"Third-quarter earnings fell a worse-than-expected 30%. McDonald's reported a profit of $1.07 billion, or $1.09 a share, vs. $1.52 billion, or $1.52 a share, a year earlier"	[18:04]
Vexual	ratuken shits all over alibaba	[18:05]
*	Adlai must admit that he first misread that headline as "BitBet lands $14.5M ..."	[18:05]
Vexual	let me count the ways	[18:06]
Adlai	too much lurking in #b-a makes Adlai a lysdexic yob	[18:06]
pete_dushenski	Adlai what is this, 2016?	[18:06]
*	IRaway (~Avatar@wf-171-99-151-3.revip9.asianet.co.th) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[18:06]
Adlai	Is It 2016 Yet?	[18:06]
Vexual	approaching	[18:07]
*	AdamIRAway has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)	[18:07]
Vexual	don't wiah away time	[18:08]
Vexual	*wish	[18:09]
pete_dushenski	othernubs` asciilifeform if this car owner's manual is selling for 10 btc (which it is), 1-2 btc seems perfectly reasonable for this custom code book http://www.collectorstudio.com/index.cfm/ID/23/itemID/4500/details/1?cl=	[18:09]
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pete_dushenski	;;rate cazalla 1 news anchor at qntra.net	[18:15]
gribble	Rating entry successful. Your rating of 1 for user cazalla has been recorded.	[18:15]
pete_dushenski	;;rate BingoBoingo 2 news anchor, blogger, spinozan.	[18:16]
gribble	Rating entry successful. Your rating for user BingoBoingo has changed from 1 to 2.	[18:16]
pete_dushenski	;;rate nubbins` 2 canuckistani, printer of fine things.	[18:17]
gribble	Rating entry successful. Your rating of 2 for user nubbins` has been recorded.	[18:17]
othernubs`	d'aww	[18:17]
pete_dushenski	othernubs` twas overdue ;)	[18:18]
pete_dushenski	;;rate asciilifeform 2 loper, maker, the go-to for infosec.	[18:19]
gribble	Rating entry successful. Your rating of 2 for user asciilifeform has been recorded.	[18:19]
pete_dushenski	i think that's all the catching up for now.	[18:20]
Vexual	you've lied to me	[18:20]
pete_dushenski	http://dealbook.nytimes.com/2014/10/21/4-banks-including-jpmorgan-fined-in-europe-over-cartel-behavior/	[18:22]
pete_dushenski	http://dealbook.nytimes.com/2014/10/20/why-high-frequency-trading-is-so-hard-to-regulate/ << because what's mpex anyways?	[18:23]
othernubs`	;;later tell asciilifeform http://pastebin.com/raw.php?i=CZvVKFM9	[18:23]
gribble	The operation succeeded.	[18:23]
othernubs`	separared into chapters! oh my.	[18:24]
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othernubs`	might be a fun lil project, we'll see	[18:25]
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kakobrekla	jesus nubbs so poor cant afford tx fee	[18:29]
bounce	othernubs`, asciilifeform: how many actual code (C, C++, etc.) lines exceed 80 characters?	[18:30]
thickasthieves	http://www.theverge.com/2014/10/21/7027267/google-launches-support-for-security-key-a-simpler-kind-of-two-factor	[18:31]
assbot	Google launches support for Security Key, a simpler kind of two-factor authentication \| The Verge	[18:31]
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mircea_popescu	cazalla BingoBoingo derpndesk.com/bitnet-lands-14-5-million-series-funding-rival-coinbase-bitpay/ << and somehow in spite of all these "investement" nobody is buying the shorts pretty much.	[18:38]
mircea_popescu	such strange money.	[18:38]
mircea_popescu	* Adlai must admit that he first misread that headline as "BitBet lands $14.5M ..." << da fuck would bitbet do with 15mn.	[18:39]
bounce	spend it on hookers and blow	[18:39]
Adlai	s/spend/invest/	[18:39]
bounce	then it's "no touching the merchandise"	[18:40]
kakobrekla	new css	[18:40]
kakobrekla	shady logo	[18:40]
kakobrekla	and a KYC team	[18:41]
mircea_popescu	;;later tell asciilifeform http://pastebin.com/raw.php?i=CZvVKFM9 <<< i like this shit.	[18:41]
kakobrekla	over wifi.	[18:42]
mircea_popescu	you two are doing it right.	[18:42]
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mircea_popescu	kakobrekla "know your cunt" ?	[18:42]
kakobrekla	know your chump doh	[18:42]
mircea_popescu	oh sorry	[18:43]
mircea_popescu	On 15 June 1961, two months before the construction of the Berlin Wall started, First Secretary of the Socialist Unity Party and Staatsrat chairman Walter Ulbricht stated in an international press conference, "Niemand hat die Absicht, eine Mauer zu errichten!" <<< nobody has any intention to fuck up bitcoin o.O	[18:43]
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mike_c	;;rate nubbins` trustworthy numismatic and printer	[18:47]
gribble	Error: 'trustworthy' is not a valid integer.	[18:47]
mircea_popescu	!b 2	[18:47]
assbot	Last 2 lines bashed and pending review. ( http://dpaste.com/1AT9JWJ.txt )	[18:47]
RagnarDanneskjol	ha	[18:48]
mike_c	;;rate nubbins` 1 trustworthy numismatic and printer	[18:48]
gribble	Rating entry successful. Your rating of 1 for user nubbins` has been recorded.	[18:48]
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pete_dushenski	ok, ima give this qntra news thing another hack.	[18:58]
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xinxi	who is running qntra news?	[18:59]
pete_dushenski	xinxi that'd be mircea_popescu cazalla and BingoBoingo	[18:59]
xinxi	i see	[19:00]
mircea_popescu	xinxi oyu know, someone to do chinese coverage would be very valuable.	[19:00]
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xinxi	yeah, I can help	[19:02]
xinxi	but as far as i know, there are already a few news site about bitcoin in china.	[19:02]
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bounce	in english?	[19:03]
othernubs`	kakobrekla> jesus nubbs so poor cant afford tx fee << cost of doing business ;)	[19:03]
bounce	also, check what sets qntra apart	[19:03]
mircea_popescu	xinxi the idea is to read and summarize chinese news in english	[19:03]
othernubs`	mircea_popescu> you two are doing it right. << if its worth doing...	[19:03]
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xinxi	mircea_popescu - that may be a good idea.	[19:04]
mircea_popescu	so get on it!	[19:04]
xinxi	is it free?	[19:04]
xinxi	for people to publish news?	[19:05]
mircea_popescu	http://mpex.ws/?mpsic=S.QNTR < read that. you get shares.	[19:05]
pete_dushenski	mircea_popescu your two cents on which would make a better qntra article: https://bitcoinfoundation.org/2014/10/corporate-governance-update/ or http://www.prweb.com/releases/2014/10/prweb12263116.htm	[19:05]
mircea_popescu	pete_dushenski neither, bs pr crapolade.	[19:05]
mircea_popescu	pr isn't news.	[19:05]
pete_dushenski	the foundation one is kinda funny because they're announcing "the consideration of a committee"	[19:06]
pete_dushenski	but ya	[19:06]
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mircea_popescu	so if it's funny have a lol at it on blog. not news.	[19:06]
pete_dushenski	http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/2jw5pm/im_gavin_andresen_chief_scientist_at_the_bitcoin/	[19:06]
pete_dushenski	^happening now	[19:07]
chetty	at the bitcoin!!! good enough for a lol	[19:07]
othernubs`	heh	[19:07]
pete_dushenski	[–]gavinandresen[S] 32 points 38 minutes ago Bugs in "Bitcoin" ? "Bitcoin" isn't software, it is a protocol, so that's like asking "what do you think about bugs in HTTP?"	[19:08]
bounce	because http is like perfect and stuff. no bugs there. ever. nosiree.	[19:08]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 25255 @ 0.00073763 = 18.6288 BTC [+] {2}	[19:08]
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asciilifeform	http://pastebin.com/raw.php?i=CZvVKFM9 <<< https://blockchain.info/tx/93a970031f7e4fbcc7970cb34aa386ce66a444a2806f159093a2b6222166b3b0	[19:10]
othernubs`	consider your hand heartily shaken!	[19:11]
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othernubs`	shame deedbot is down	[19:11]
mircea_popescu	yeah srsly.	[19:11]
pete_dushenski	[–]gavinandresen[S] 26 points an hour ago Biggest misconception: That Bitcoin will Topple Governments and the Powerful. Governments will do what they always do -- they will adapt (well, the worst ones will fail, causing misery and suffering; maybe Bitcoin will speed that up a little, and mitigate the misery a little).	[19:13]
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mircea_popescu	pete_dushenski oyu know, if anyone gave a shit about either gavin or reddit they'd just go there.	[19:14]
pete_dushenski	mircea_popescu granted :)	[19:15]
RagnarDanneskjol	deedbot is actually up - in here under different nick - just the server it lives on failed security audit	[19:15]
kakobrekla	wait what?	[19:16]
RagnarDanneskjol	yea	[19:16]
RagnarDanneskjol	punkman's ver is getting very close too	[19:16]
kakobrekla	punkmans deedbot runs on one of my droplets	[19:16]
kakobrekla	a you speak of the carcas	[19:16]
RagnarDanneskjol	talkin bout the old one	[19:16]
pete_dushenski	hey logs are back... just missing 5-16h	[19:16]
kakobrekla	what you are looking at atm is unlive version of logs	[19:17]
mircea_popescu	unlive, you mean dead ?	[19:18]
kakobrekla	its not dead, just not live	[19:18]
mircea_popescu	dead logs, by jim kakoosh	[19:18]
RagnarDanneskjol	is there a zip/torrent of all logs avail somewhere?	[19:18]
kakobrekla	i can make a zip	[19:18]
asciilifeform	http://www.loper-os.org/pub/ba_log_gibblet.txt << for those who missed...	[19:19]
RagnarDanneskjol	would be most grateful for it	[19:19]
bounce	``I'd rather not speculate in an open forum about the best ways to screw with Bitcoin.'' (Perish_In_a_Fire) -- aww.	[19:19]
asciilifeform	^ last 2000 ln.	[19:19]
mircea_popescu	what, our security lies in obscurity now ?	[19:19]
ben_vulpes	it'd be neat if he'd differentiate between Bitcoin the reference implementation which is bug-ridden and shitty, and Bitcoin the protocol which doesn't exist.	[19:20]
mircea_popescu	so "governments" will prevail, as fucking if there can even be such a thing as a government other than bitcoin ; and bitcoin gotta hide its misshapen form in the dark.	[19:20]
mircea_popescu	i totally wish to read more idiocy from this gavin puppet.	[19:20]
kakobrekla	asciilifeform saves the day	[19:20]
kakobrekla	literally.	[19:20]
mircea_popescu	lmao	[19:21]
mircea_popescu	ben_vulpes it exists, it's just not been made.	[19:21]
kakobrekla	anyway RagnarDanneskjol what do you want in the zip? csv? sql? a puddle? daily files?	[19:23]
*	Adlai is quite curious to see what happens if/when changes such as a the blocksize hardfork get pushed to the reference implementation	[19:24]
mircea_popescu	this is sort-of like wanting to see what happens if/when the soviets finally decide to cross fulda ?	[19:25]
Adlai	"some people just wanna see the world burn" ^_^	[19:26]
mircea_popescu	i'm all for it, the level of either cluelessness or desperation such a move entails is promising.	[19:27]
Adlai	such a drastic change would definitely cast this issue (and others) into the limelight, until now it's been confined to a few IRC channels and blog posts	[19:28]
bounce	with enough hashrate on 0.6 (or whichever, maintained etc.) and staying there, hardforks are bound to fizzle. could try and talk to large pool operators.	[19:29]
Adlai	as much as the timecube's four days revolve around the WoT, I wouldn't be surprised if most of the people who have heard about the hardfork proposal haven't heard any competing argument against it	[19:29]
mats_cd03	so?	[19:29]
mats_cd03	the only opinion that matters is that of miners.	[19:29]
mats_cd03	and... they won't let themselves get shit on.	[19:29]
Adlai	miners are people too, and people don't always make the best decisions. even if they act rationally, they might not be aware of all the information about an issue.	[19:30]
mats_cd03	uh...	[19:31]
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chetty	You've long been a proponent of the "Bitcoin is an experiment" line of thinking. While that is technically true, so is "Gravity is just a theory". What needs to happen for you to switch from "Bitcoin is an experiment" to "Bitcoin is established"?	[19:32]
chetty	permalink	[19:32]
chetty	[–]gavinandresen[S] 38 points an hour ago	[19:32]
chetty	We need regulatory clarity, ease of use, and no-single-point-of-failure security.	[19:32]
chetty	I think we're very close on all of those things.	[19:32]
RagnarDanneskjol	kakobrekla - sorry nevermind -apparently Azelphur has everything logged since the beginning of time. I can throw it up somewhere for whoevers wants it	[19:33]
Adlai	gavin on the hardfork: https://pay.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/2jw5pm/im_gavin_andresen_chief_scientist_at_the_bitcoin/clfns8j?context=3	[19:33]
assbot	gavinandresen comments on I'm Gavin Andresen, Chief Scientist at the Bitcoin Foundation. Ask me anything!	[19:33]
mircea_popescu	Adlai the "most people" argument is pretty much nil.	[19:33]
mircea_popescu	most bitcoin reads mp way before it remembers who the fuck this gavin schmuck is.	[19:33]
mircea_popescu	because money doesn't think all that much of code monkeys. and definitely isn't going to start taking their ideas of how to manage things seriously.	[19:34]
Adlai	how closely coupled are "most bitcoin" and "most hashrate"?	[19:34]
mircea_popescu	it hasn't happened yet, in 100 years of computing.	[19:34]
mircea_popescu	most hashrate is a secondary factor here.	[19:34]
mircea_popescu	yeah, it's possible miners won't make the best decision. this was illustrated yesterday, when the atc miners failed to make the best decision.	[19:35]
diametric	maybe i'm mistaken but doesn't the white paper basically state a hard fork will be required in the future to address scalability?	[19:35]
mircea_popescu	their failure was signalled to them within minutes, and they obeyed that signal in an hour.	[19:35]
mircea_popescu	bitcoin will work no different.	[19:35]
othernubs`	ah, i forgot you can disable the backlight on this thing	[19:36]
othernubs`	outdoor irc, here i cum	[19:37]
mircea_popescu	diametric among a bevy of similar nonsense.	[19:37]
Apocalyptic	yeah, it's possible miners won't make the best decision. this was illustrated yesterday, when the atc miners failed to make the best decision. // btw that was pretty impressive	[19:40]
mircea_popescu	after a fashion.	[19:40]
kakobrekla	RagnarDanneskjol if you can put them in order i can include them online (before the log starts)	[19:40]
Adlai	it'd be a little funny if all the devs agreed to the hardfork, got a working patch together, then went miner by miner and couldn't get a single one to agree to switch	[19:40]
RagnarDanneskjol	ok	[19:41]
mircea_popescu	they'd just be a iota more ridiculously pointless than they are today	[19:41]
mircea_popescu	which in the grand scheme of things isn't really much at all. they've already fucked the goat in the public market long ago	[19:41]
mircea_popescu	eating some earthworms or w/e isn't really doing much anymore.	[19:41]
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mircea_popescu	%d	[19:48]
atcbot	[ATC Diff] Current Diff: 469547.73 Est. Next Diff: 829946.86 in 1463 blocks (#48384) Est. % Change: 76.75	[19:48]
mircea_popescu	heh.	[19:48]
xanthyos	apparently canada is adding plastic content to its fiat paper to make it less rippable. the fiat may not be backed, but reinforced paper will fool the masses	[19:50]
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thestringpuller	%tslb	[19:50]
atcbot	Time Since Last ATC Block (#46921): 0 hour(s), 5 minutes	[19:50]
xanthyos	and it has a picture of the queen on it, so that's worth something.	[19:51]
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othernubs`	xanthyos, 100% polymer notes for a while now	[19:54]
othernubs`	they're neat, i'll sell ya one	[19:55]
mircea_popescu	dude this "father of invention" flic is the most god awful pandering piece of shit	[19:55]
mircea_popescu	it'd almost work as a parody of the redditard generation, except spacey is playing it full straight.	[19:55]
mircea_popescu	he should be fucking flogged for this one.	[19:55]
othernubs`	it's rare to see a paper banknote nowadays	[19:55]
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thestringpuller	there is another nubs?	[19:56]
othernubs`	<--	[19:56]
thestringpuller	thee nubs?	[19:56]
thestringpuller	or different?	[19:56]
othernubs`	one and the same	[19:56]
xanthyos	i guess i'd buy one just for the thrill of getting something in the mail	[19:57]
othernubs`	can't go sharing private gpg keys between boxes	[19:57]
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othernubs`	xanthyos, postage is about $2 to usa, what denomination you want?	[19:57]
othernubs`	5/10/20/50/100	[19:57]
xanthyos	the lowest	[19:58]
xanthyos	nevermind i dont' need this	[19:58]
xanthyos	it's silly	[19:58]
xanthyos	but thanks for the offer	[19:58]
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othernubs`	haha	[19:58]
othernubs`	:D	[19:58]
othernubs`	pictures sort-of do them justice	[19:58]
othernubs`	altho the clear panel is way cooler in person	[19:58]
mircea_popescu	lol failed impulse buy. oh #b-a whay are you such a mall!	[19:58]
othernubs`	haha inorite	[19:59]
othernubs`	he prolly realized his local bank stocks CAD	[19:59]
mircea_popescu	!up Pierre_Rochard	[19:59]
-assbot-	You voiced Pierre_Rochard for 30 minutes.	[19:59]
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xanthyos	i'm not a collector	[19:59]
*	assbot gives voice to Pierre_Rochard	[19:59]
mircea_popescu	no, he prolly realised that he doesn't need it or want to use it and it'll just gather dust	[19:59]
mircea_popescu	!up manamex	[20:00]
-assbot-	You voiced manamex for 30 minutes.	[20:00]
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*	othernubs` glances at his coin collection	[20:01]
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othernubs`	yeah, prolly ;/	[20:01]
mircea_popescu	!up pakaloloz	[20:01]
-assbot-	You voiced pakaloloz for 30 minutes.	[20:01]
*	assbot gives voice to pakaloloz	[20:01]
pakaloloz	Good Morning.	[20:02]
othernubs`	hi	[20:02]
othernubs`	welcome, even!	[20:02]
thestringpuller	Pierre_Rochard haven't seen you in awhile	[20:02]
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pakaloloz	so BTCJAM aka BTCSCAM announced... "We are happy to announce that we have added bank account & credit card verification!"	[20:04]
pakaloloz	How scary....	[20:04]
Adlai	so just as gavin is doing his AMA, i get a request to buy coins from "gavi". coincidence? i think not!	[20:04]
pakaloloz	I do think this may be as DPB says "#badforbitcoin"	[20:05]
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*	Adlai hasn't figured out yet whether any of what happens on btcjam is not btcscam	[20:05]
Adlai	although admittedly i've spent a grand total of about fifteen seconds trying	[20:06]
Pierre_Rochard	thestringpuller: work for the employer and my own projects. I have been reading the logs	[20:09]
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kakobrekla	so just as gavin is doing his AMA, i get a request to buy coins from "gavi". < you be in wrong channels	[20:10]
mircea_popescu	Adlai there's not that much in a name.	[20:10]
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*	Adlai will ask gavi what he thinks of the hardfork	[20:12]
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fluffypony	http://www.engadget.com/2014/10/21/we-rode-a-hoverboard/?ncid=rss_truncated	[20:23]
fluffypony	want.	[20:23]
assbot	We rode a $10,000 hoverboard, and you can too	[20:23]
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xanthyos	hoverboards don't work on water. not unless you have power.	[20:26]
asciilifeform	'theoretically raise a building off of its foundation during an earthquake, essentially rendering the natural disaster's tremors harmless' << newton's laws crying from neglect	[20:27]
asciilifeform	the leper's bell of retarded sc4mz0rz - a flagrant and malignant disregard for elementary physics	[20:28]
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xanthyos	but if the ground unit vibrated so too would its magnetic field and thus the building	[20:29]
xanthyos	though it would absorb shock	[20:30]
asciilifeform	why should it absorb shock?	[20:30]
*	assbot removes voice from manamex	[20:30]
asciilifeform	not that an electromagnetic shock absorber is impossible - it exists, and has for years - but no magic here.	[20:31]
asciilifeform	and magnetically-floated item is not resting on 'nothing at all', yes.	[20:31]
xanthyos	well there would have to be magnets in the ground to create the field for the building to be repulsed from in the event of an earthquake	[20:31]
asciilifeform	i have a very special, very deep loathing for 'kickstart' sc4mz0rs. especially of this particular species.	[20:32]
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Apocalyptic	asciilifeform, to be fair it's not the newton's law that is neglected here, but the fact that you won't get a magnetic field even close to be powerfull enough to support that weight	[20:32]
asciilifeform	nope. even with infinitely strong magnetic effect, the ground is still taking up the weight, and were it to move, would propagate vibration to the 'levitated' object.	[20:33]
mike_c	on kickstarter those guys are selling a hover board for $450 that.. doesn't hover.	[20:34]
xanthyos	that propagated vibration would be less than the vibration the building would experience without the field gap between it and the ground magnets	[20:34]
Apocalyptic	"and were it to move, would propagate vibration to the 'levitated' object." that's assuming a magnetic field of constant power, right ?	[20:34]
asciilifeform	they are selling 'hope, chance,' chope, hange.	[20:35]
xanthyos	unless they were "smartmagnets" that could generate the inverse wave to the vibration to cancel it out in the same way that some car radios use microphones to cancel out road noise	[20:36]
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xanthyos	of course, a hacker could then simulate an earthquake on that building to the same extent of magnitude that the smartmagnets were designed to resist against	[20:37]
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asciilifeform	say ground moves 20cm down and then 30cm back up, earthquake. or fell into a ditch. cancel that.	[20:37]
pete_dushenski	lol these contravex commenters are getting angrier and angrier: http://www.contravex.com/2014/10/20/software-doesnt-fail-socialism-does/#comment-3605	[20:37]
assbot	Software Doesn’t Fail. Socialism Does. \| Contravex: A blog by Pete Dushenski	[20:37]
xanthyos	oh if the ground level changes that much there's no way a magnetic field could hold it consistently	[20:37]
xanthyos	project fail.	[20:37]
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xanthyos	also the bouncing of the building would put equal force on the ground and magnetically try to push away the ground structure even more	[20:38]
thestringpuller	wow that's insane	[20:39]
thestringpuller	pete_dushenski: your commentors intellect is slowly deteriorating	[20:39]
pete_dushenski	thestringpuller too popular mebbe	[20:39]
asciilifeform	pete_dushenski: i would seriously like to see someone - anyone - try to argue intelligently against 'software does not fail.' as presented in the essay.	[20:39]
pete_dushenski	mr. "aaa" sorta kinda lamely tried.	[20:40]
pete_dushenski	ended up just pointing out that the software i was advocating for wasn't perfect.	[20:40]
asciilifeform	intelligently.	[20:40]
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pete_dushenski	asciilifeform myeah	[20:40]
pete_dushenski	well, i'll keep sifting through the spam and letcha know	[20:41]
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asciilifeform	but it did not 'fail' - when anyone, anywhere, says 'this software failed' - they are suggesting that it once worked. and that the object that once worked, and then wotrked no longer, consists of the closed system of 'this software.' which is horseshit.	[20:41]
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othernubs`	like it sprained a knee or something and can't parse your bits properly anymore because of it	[20:42]
asciilifeform	yes, apparently.	[20:43]
othernubs`	as well gesture to one's flaccid penis and declare "my pool cue has failed"	[20:43]
asciilifeform	thing is, these poor sods actually believe that they live in a universe where 'software can fail.' as if it were a physical object.	[20:44]
asciilifeform	and therefore needs to be 'maintained' lest it 'break.'	[20:44]
othernubs`	imagine living in a world where logic can fail	[20:45]
kakobrekla	well it does	[20:45]
kakobrekla	all the time	[20:45]
asciilifeform	!s break mathematics	[20:46]
assbot	1 results for 'break mathematics' : http://search.bitcoin-assets.com/?q=break+mathematics	[20:46]
bounce	bit of a definition question. where others say "oh it seemed to work but it doesn't know, must've failed", said essayist says "it may have seemed to work but it was already failing, only invisibly so and nobody knew about it"	[20:46]
kakobrekla	logic as human concept fails all the time	[20:46]
thestringpuller	nanotube: are there json-like feeds of WoT data from gribble? Or must we use the sqlite db dumps?	[20:47]
othernubs`	come across a broken clock at the right moment and it won't seem broken for almost a minute!	[20:47]
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asciilifeform	the whole crock of shit, the culture of tolerating bugs, relies on this notion, that it is 'impossible to write perfect code'	[20:47]
othernubs`	kakobrekla, as a human concept :D	[20:47]
othernubs`	what doesn't?!	[20:47]
kakobrekla	yeah as it stands now, it is impossible	[20:48]
xanthyos	https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B0fKP5AIUAArq3f.jpg	[20:48]
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bounce	http://thedailywtf.com/articles/The-Haunted-Door	[20:49]
assbot	The Haunted Door - The Daily WTF	[20:49]
kakobrekla	!s drop keyboard	[20:49]
assbot	1 results for 'drop keyboard' : http://search.bitcoin-assets.com/?q=drop+keyboard	[20:49]
othernubs`	i guess the leap is in identifying capital-l Logic as a thing which does not simply fail under such benign circumstances	[20:49]
asciilifeform	!s flashlight crash	[20:50]
assbot	1 results for 'flashlight crash' : http://search.bitcoin-assets.com/?q=flashlight+crash	[20:50]
othernubs`	like theory vs theory	[20:50]
kakobrekla	O_o	[20:50]
othernubs`	Theory, even	[20:50]
othernubs`	well it's just a theeery hyuk	[20:50]
*	bounce sells software blessings for bitcoin	[20:51]
othernubs`	it's not 'just' a goddamn theory!	[20:51]
othernubs`	bounce me too ;D	[20:52]
*	bounce tolerates no competition and smites othernubs`	[20:53]
asciilifeform	log bot dead?	[20:54]
kakobrekla	decoupled	[20:54]
kakobrekla	it will get synced	[20:55]
asciilifeform	looks like it	[20:55]
kakobrekla	we are being logged fyi.	[20:55]
othernubs`	the walls have eyes	[21:01]
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asciilifeform	what other organs do the walls have ?	[21:02]
undata	asciilifeform: depends on whether there's a hole cut	[21:02]
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mike_c	http://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/s--1Kt2_ze0--/c_fit,fl_progressive,q_80,w_636/muff83pt0vcc8w15bspf.jpg	[21:09]
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ben_vulpes	gawdamn	[21:31]
gabriel_laddel	thestringpuller: where are you finding those dumps? I ended up writing a scraper...	[21:31]
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jurov	asciilifeform: is it possible to say for software, like for bridges "it must not have more than X life-threatening bugs, hence so much $$$ is needed"?	[21:35]
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nanotube	thestringpuller: there is partial json api coverage. see the [json] links on website.	[21:37]
asciilifeform	jurov: need the basics first. i.e. - total, godlike control over the entirety of the machine by the designer (hw & sw both) to even consider this.	[21:37]
jurov	that needs godlike mind, no?	[21:38]
asciilifeform	jurov: and, if you think you can afford this for c/cpp code of any substantial complexity, you've a mistaken concept of 'this'	[21:38]
jurov	pls calm down. nowhere i mentioned C	[21:39]
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jurov	so i take it your answer it is not possible, unless the designer is a wizard and pours his blood into the project	[21:40]
asciilifeform	jurov: more or less, yes	[21:41]
jurov	from it directly implies that for mere mortals,assertion "all software has bugs" is correct.	[21:41]
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bounce	you can look at the cost of very low bug count software. like rocket steering stuff, the airbus fly-by-wire stuff, or even the full authority software control stuff in the osprey	[21:42]
asciilifeform	bounce: the 'rocket-grade' stuff is largely a scam. but even if we assume that it does what is advertised (ship bug-free) - a titanic boondoggle, like accounting using roman numerals.	[21:43]
bounce	shrug if you're asking for actual current cost, looking at what the industry does works, even if it is fundamentally flawed.	[21:44]
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asciilifeform	bounce: in what way does it make sense to ask for the current cost of something that is not, in fact, available?	[21:45]
bounce	how is it not available?	[21:46]
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asciilifeform	bounce: because if something doesn't fit in one head, for anyone to claim that it is 'bug free' is a brazen lie, given that he could not possibly understand the object to the necessary extent.	[21:48]
bounce	the quest wasn't for "bug free" but for "low bug count", and that's available... for a price.	[21:49]
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asciilifeform	'bug count' ?!?!? in what universe is this concept useful? just one bug, let's say, but it's 'heartbleed.' superior to ten non-exploitable crash conditions?	[21:50]
asciilifeform	code is either correct, for all possible inputs, or it is not.	[21:50]
bounce	who cares how useful the concept is? the question was what it was.	[21:50]
bounce	I mean, really now, we get where you're coming from and for all I know you're right; but that doesn't change that we don't have the ideal world and that people are making do with the needlessly-less-than-ideal one.	[21:51]
bounce	you can perfectly well look at what they do there and what pricetag results.	[21:51]
asciilifeform	what i was trying to say is that the 'proven code' folks are sc4mz0rz, rather than people genuinely trying to solve an unsolvable problem in cruel world, etc	[21:54]
bounce	or perhaps don quichottes, or whatever.	[21:55]
*	bounce is aware that model checking is strictly harder than NP-complete, yes	[21:55]
asciilifeform	no - sc4mz0rz. folks who charge a king's ransom to carry out something they know is impossible - are scamming.	[21:56]
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bounce	hm. wasn't aware that the guys writing ariane s/w and the like claimed to serve "proven" s/w, just very carefully vetted stuff. hence "low bug count", not "bug free".	[21:57]
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othernubs`	bug-free is a bold statement	[22:08]
bounce	it's akin to "100% security". obvious unobtanium.	[22:09]
othernubs`	;;google 100% security site:mpex.co	[22:09]
gribble	English - MPEx:	[22:09]
mike_c	function (bug) { print "this is a feature!" }	[22:09]
mircea_popescu	nope. even with infinitely strong magnetic effect, the ground is still taking up the weight, and were it to move, would propagate vibration to the 'levitated' object. <<	[22:09]
mircea_popescu	for some reason kids going through bad school get this idea that a magnetic field is a sort of couch cushion	[22:09]
mircea_popescu	this is not factual.	[22:09]
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mike_c	i went through a decent school, and i have the idea that magnetic fields are magic.	[22:10]
bounce	noo, they're magnetic	[22:11]
mike_c		[22:11]
mircea_popescu	mr. "aaa" sorta kinda lamely tried. << he had some merit, not sure why all the posturing tho.	[22:11]
mircea_popescu	you wanna posture, get a name. aaa's don't get to, wtf is this.	[22:11]
mircea_popescu	mike_c they are in fact magic, that part is not wrong.	[22:12]
mircea_popescu	nothing wrong to come out of school with the idea that magnetism = magic. that's pretty much an accurate discussion of the current scientific understanding of the topic.	[22:13]
mircea_popescu	it is however mistaken to come out with the idea that magnetism = benevolent magic, or = your id. it's neither.	[22:13]
bounce	``The Byzantines used Christianity to convert and create allies. We create allies through conversion to our democracy and the ideals of our Constitution.'' << behold, american religion	[22:13]
mircea_popescu	"everything you write about so lightly is infinitely more complex?" << lol the "infinitely complex" libtard trick	[22:14]
asciilifeform	one could imagine a universe with 'benevolent magic', but we don't live there.	[22:14]
mircea_popescu	o look, there's a 20 yo junior rabbi in the house. lmao.	[22:14]
mircea_popescu	bounce it works splendidly too.	[22:14]
mircea_popescu	;;google ludovico dandolo	[22:15]
gribble	Andrea Dandolo - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: ; Francesco Dandolo - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: ; Giovanni Dandolo - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia:	[22:15]
othernubs`	speaking of unobtainium, these metallic inks are getting us a bunch of jobs lately. offset printers can suck it	[22:15]
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mircea_popescu	visited the man's grave, too. he was the first and the thickest cock to rape byzantium.	[22:15]
mircea_popescu	you know, like obama, the us ally, was the first and perhaps the thickest cock to rape washington.	[22:15]
bounce	wouldn't benevolence require some sort of intelligence or something?	[22:15]
mircea_popescu	bounce yes, it is begging the question.	[22:15]
mircea_popescu	obviously nothing in nature can be "benevolent" seeing how human agency is an ulterior layer.	[22:16]
mircea_popescu	it's like asking for an "app aware" tcp/ip implementation.	[22:16]
mircea_popescu	othernubs` i tell you, i love my gold ink cards.	[22:16]
bounce	inasmuch as that humanity is part of nature, though picturing itself above it.	[22:16]
mircea_popescu	bounce no, inasmuch as fist though your skull moves the matter of your skull around in one way, but MEANS in a number of different arbitrary ways	[22:17]
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bounce	this doesn't compute. take your hand outta my brains and try again?	[22:17]
othernubs`	mircea_popescu, latest job is biz cards and letterheads w/ gold ink for a boutique hotel	[22:18]
mircea_popescu	bounce i dunno how.	[22:18]
mircea_popescu	let's try it this way. suppose there's a cathedral tower with a clock.	[22:19]
mircea_popescu	what's the time ?	[22:19]
othernubs`	depends how far away the tower is	[22:19]
mircea_popescu	othernubs` o, you want fist in skull too ?	[22:20]
othernubs`	HEH	[22:20]
othernubs`	tell me i'm wrong ;)	[22:20]
*	othernubs` cackles	[22:20]
mircea_popescu	you're not wrong or right, we're not there yet. just waiting for bounce to pick a time.	[22:20]
othernubs`	do it, bounce!	[22:21]
bounce	well, try this on first: "tcp/ip" generally refers to the whole stack. supposing you really ment IP (layer 3, conventionally), then "app aware" (with app: layer 7) would be a bit of a layer violation.	[22:22]
mircea_popescu	bounce exactly my point.	[22:22]
mircea_popescu	"benevolence" as an objective quality is a layer violation.	[22:22]
bounce	I ment that layer 7 still needs the lower layers to function, it doesn't float in air	[22:22]
mircea_popescu	no, it doesn't need them "to function", because it functioning is not a layer 7 thing.	[22:23]
undata	well and even among apps, "benevolence" could be defined differently	[22:23]
mircea_popescu	undata awareness, not benevolence. map correctly!	[22:23]
undata	that's a much harder term to define.	[22:24]
bounce	what is benevolence, really? apparently we can have malicious packets and software, but benevolent ones?	[22:24]
bounce	er, tcp doesn't do crap without ip to transport it. the layers do build on each other	[22:25]
Adlai	malefactors gonna malefact but packets just pack	[22:25]
chetty	isnt the difference between malicious and benevolent and mattr of viewpoint?	[22:25]
mircea_popescu	bounce that is just a manner of speaking.	[22:25]
mircea_popescu	they're obviously not malicious in and of themselves.	[22:26]
Adlai	well there is a missing object. malice and benevolence don't exist in a vacuum, they have to be directed at something	[22:26]
mircea_popescu	just, the fucktards that write about things they don;'t understand, when they're not busy husslking pete in his comment section,	[22:26]
bounce	it does include a value judgement. so it'd require a judging facility	[22:26]
mircea_popescu	misuse the words.	[22:26]
mircea_popescu	bounce it's irrelevant what it "does" at the level where ip is defined, see ?	[22:26]
mircea_popescu	stop mixing utility into ideality, that's not how thinking works.	[22:27]
bounce	"zomg rude!" -- some new guy with no clue of the local rules. << appears to be an american thing?	[22:27]
mircea_popescu	makes no difference "what use is the sun to us", that's an ontological point not an ethical one.	[22:27]
bounce	so there's no ethics to archimedes' mirrors?	[22:28]
mircea_popescu	none.	[22:28]
mircea_popescu	othernubs`> imagine living in a world where logic can fail <<< that's life in a "social sciences" universe.	[22:28]
mircea_popescu	their logic fails all the god damned time, mostly because it's not logic, self-supported, it's dreamweaving	[22:29]
mircea_popescu	and dreamweaving MUST be constantly maintained.	[22:29]
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bounce	warzones typically are unhinging because there's no rhyme or reason to the happenings.	[22:30]
mircea_popescu	http://trilema.com/2009/inchipuiti-va/ << this is incidentally great reading on the topic, albeit in languages.	[22:30]
assbot	Inchipuiti-va pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.	[22:30]
bounce	(thus we conclude that wars are applied social science)	[22:30]
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mircea_popescu	not rly.	[22:30]
bounce	Y U NO LIEK my logic?	[22:31]
mircea_popescu	warzones are "unhinging" because the complexity of "society" is a function of the mean distance between individual and his own death	[22:31]
mircea_popescu	if that is reduced significantly, the need for some forms goes away.	[22:31]
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mircea_popescu	that's why the classical, 19th century murican has the reputation of being uncouth and direct and undecourous in europe	[22:31]
mircea_popescu	cuz he got to see his own death on average a lot closer than the average yurpean	[22:31]
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bounce	I'd say the predictability is the more valued property there	[22:31]
mircea_popescu	how so ?	[22:32]
bounce	if everybody lives to, say, 30, then dies without fail, it's a fact of life	[22:32]
mircea_popescu	you ever been in a warzone ?	[22:33]
chetty	bounce, ever see 'Logan's Run' ?	[22:33]
bounce	no, and I'd like to keep it that way, TYVM	[22:33]
mircea_popescu	but it's nonsense. who the fuck thinks about "the future" lol. people in a warzone think about cunt, and maybe good cognac.	[22:33]
bounce	haven't seen it, roughly know the plot. probably should take the time sometime.	[22:33]
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chetty	people died at 30 ...	[22:33]
mircea_popescu	to think about "your career" you gotta be so far away from a warzone your head'd be spinning	[22:33]
thestringpuller	;;google keep their heads spinnin	[22:34]
gribble	Dr. Dre - Keep Their Heads Ringin' - YouTube: ; Why Figure Skaters Don't Seem Dizzy After Spinning: ; THE READY SET LYRICS - Spinnin' - A-Z Lyrics:	[22:34]
thestringpuller	ah ringin'	[22:34]
mircea_popescu	thestringpuller: where are you finding those dumps? I ended up writing a scraper... << twas in the chan like n times, but : bitcoin-otc.com/otc/	[22:36]
undata	it's interesting that one could ask himself whether it's ethical to establish the conditions necessary for ethical reasoning, but only under the necessary conditions...	[22:37]
mircea_popescu	wait, wut ?!	[22:37]
mircea_popescu	one can ask no ethical questions about ontos.	[22:38]
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mircea_popescu	you can ask, "is it ethical to kill this man", you can not ask "is it ethical for this man to have been killed." obviously, he's dead, so nevermind.	[22:38]
undata	right, ethics concerns action	[22:38]
mircea_popescu	and confusing "was it ethical for this man to be kiled at he point in the past when he was" with "is it" is so fuckin dumb	[22:38]
undata	I was proceeding from the point about war	[22:39]
mircea_popescu	it automatically paints one as an intellectual failure of the english speaking school of idiocy.	[22:39]
mircea_popescu	anyway. there's no ethical violation in the dead being dead, no matter how they got to be there, nor in the raped to be dripping cum, nor in any other thing that is. they're fine as they are ; being trumps fretting.	[22:40]
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undata	or, the present is all there is	[22:41]
mircea_popescu	something like that.	[22:41]
mircea_popescu	depends where you're going with it.	[22:41]
undata	talking about what's ethical in the present is hard to generalize	[22:44]
undata	that's what I was referring to above re: apps	[22:44]
undata	depends on what your goals are, and why, and why, and why	[22:45]
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undata	modern neuroscience makes that "you" itself harder to define by the day	[22:47]
BingoBoingo	Fuck, is nothing newsworthy ever going to drop today?	[22:48]
thestringpuller	hahaha	[22:49]
BingoBoingo	I mean there's the Gavin Q/A, people recycling yesterday's news, and... is anything else happening?	[22:50]
undata	BingoBoingo: need moar ebola to get off or something? ha	[22:50]
bounce	start a bitcoin enterprise or something. then you can report on it yourself.	[22:51]
thestringpuller	http://newsoffice.mit.edu/2014/mit-computer-scientists-can-predict-price-bitcoin	[22:51]
assbot	MIT computer scientists can predict the price of Bitcoin \| MIT News	[22:51]
bounce	got any A series VC?	[22:51]
BingoBoingo	thestringpuller: Other oulets reported that already. I remember thickasthieves making fun of them.	[22:51]
thestringpuller	thats all i got	[22:52]
Adlai	wonderful headline inflation there	[22:52]
thestringpuller	mit is lame	[22:53]
bounce	what's this "digital identity framework", other than a couple highfalutin' bullet points?	[22:54]
bounce	``OMS is a trusted compute platform for developing and deploying secure cloud applications to collect, compute on and share personal data.'' -- apparently in the end it all hinges on "trust us, we have this centralised framework being trustworthy and shit"... again.	[22:55]
jurov	mircea_popescu ...runs code for a third party...<< this is same problem as DRM, i.e. you meed to prevent hardware owner to mucking out with third party code	[22:56]
mike_c	BingoBoingo: here's your headline: "Army Research Office funds bitcoin price research"	[22:56]
jurov	and it isn't solved at all for such general purpose case	[22:57]
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bounce	it apparently start with openid. huh.	[22:58]
BingoBoingo	mike_c: Good one	[22:58]
bounce	s/start/&s/	[22:58]
mike_c	from (retarded) mit paper: "This work was supported in part by NSF grants CMMI=1335155 and CNS-1161964, and by Army Research Office MURI Award W911NF-11-1-0036.	[22:58]
bounce	if you dig a little deeper, see if you can't find the list of NSF grant numbers known to originate at the NSA	[22:59]
BingoBoingo	Interesting	[22:59]
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kakobrekla	!up undata	[23:19]
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assbot	[MPEX] [U] [S.MPOE] 6550 @ 0.00073875 = 4.8388 BTC [-]	[23:25]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 29670 @ 0.00073632 = 21.8466 BTC [-] {10}	[23:25]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 25525 @ 0.00073587 = 18.7831 BTC [-]	[23:26]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 25525 @ 0.00073587 = 18.7831 BTC [-]	[23:28]
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BingoBoingo	http://qntra.net/2014/10/army-research-office-funds-mit-bitcoin-price-research/	[23:34]
BingoBoingo	^ mike_c	[23:34]
mike_c	hehe	[23:34]
BingoBoingo	Any obvious errors?	[23:35]
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undata	BingoBoingo: maybe they'll use their mood-manipulation research to get people to buy coin	[23:36]
BingoBoingo	Maybe?	[23:36]
Apocalyptic	for some reason kids going through bad school get this idea that a magnetic field is a sort of couch cushion // of course it's not, and nobody is contesting that. It just can made to have that sort of behaviour	[23:36]
BingoBoingo	https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/2jx9kv/army_research_office_funds_mit_bitcoin_price/	[23:36]
bounce	you auto-post to reddit?	[23:38]
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BingoBoingo	bounce: No, manul post, that way it isn't spamming	[23:40]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 34800 @ 0.00073592 = 25.61 BTC [+] {2}	[23:40]
BingoBoingo	Oh, and Qntra finally joined the top half million websites https://www.quantcast.com/qntra.net	[23:41]
assbot	Qntra.net Traffic and Demographic Statistics by Quantcast	[23:41]
Apocalyptic	nope. even with infinitely strong magnetic effect, the ground is still taking up the weight, and were it to move, would propagate vibration to the 'levitated' object. // this is true but of no help to the argument, since if you can predict the amplitude/frequency of the "earthquake", you can impose the same variations on the intensity of the current generating your magnetic field	[23:42]
bounce	that means you'd be amplifying the whole thing	[23:42]
Apocalyptic	hence making the object go up or down relatively to the magnetic support, nullifying the eartquake (again all this in theory)	[23:43]
Apocalyptic	well bounce for the sake of the argument let's take the magnetic field generated by a simple solenoid	[23:43]
Apocalyptic	its strength is linear in I	[23:43]
Apocalyptic	what is this "whole thing" you consider ?	[23:44]
bounce	sure you can build a magnetic dampener; things with antiphase and enough room to move and things	[23:44]
Apocalyptic	afaik that was the topic yes	[23:44]
bounce	that doesn't mean that a big large fixed magnetic field will magically cushion any and all vibration, which I understand was the point	[23:44]
Apocalyptic	bounce, never I have seen the word "fixed"	[23:45]
bounce	it was pretty much implied	[23:45]
bounce	"here, magnetic field. problem solved." -- nooo, not quite	[23:45]
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mircea_popescu	// of course it's not, and nobody is contesting that. It just can made to have that sort of behaviour << that depends.	[23:48]
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mircea_popescu	Oh, and Qntra finally joined the top half million websites << Male 195 Female 9 shit's funny.	[23:50]
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BingoBoingo	mircea_popescu: Well, quantcast also seems to think thestringpuller is invisible	[23:51]
mircea_popescu	its strength is linear in I << think about it. your field, want it or not, is a field. A field.	[23:51]
mircea_popescu	the movement of the underlying terrain, like it or not, is not uniform.	[23:51]
mircea_popescu	what are you going to do with one bick cock when confronted with ten thousand tiny microscopic cunts ?	[23:52]
mircea_popescu	it dun go.	[23:52]
mircea_popescu	you're gonna hope it averages out, but in practical reality you will have constructed a magnetic building toppler.	[23:52]
Apocalyptic	mircea_popescu, yeah, I assumed a simple, uniform, vertical translation as the movement	[23:52]
mircea_popescu	well ?	[23:52]
mircea_popescu	you can do the actual math involved, see the probability of your building ending up on the larger surface at the end of it all.	[23:53]
Apocalyptic	cause this all is "in theory"	[23:53]
mircea_popescu	it's mostly a function of its height and perimeter.	[23:53]
mircea_popescu	but it's not really a theory, more like a daydreaming, see ?	[23:53]
mircea_popescu	cause it doesn't properly account for the world, just for what the theorizer'd like.	[23:53]
Apocalyptic	indeed it does	[23:54]
mircea_popescu	which is how good theories are started, of course	[23:54]
mircea_popescu	but not what they actually are.	[23:54]
Apocalyptic	I was just merely showing a theoretical model where it does work	[23:54]
mircea_popescu	yeah i guess for a spherical vacuum earthquake it may help.	[23:54]
BingoBoingo	http://www.journalism.org/2014/10/21/political-polarization-media-habits./	[23:55]
assbot	Political Polarization & Media Habits \| Pew Research Center's Journalism Project	[23:55]
mircea_popescu	who puts a dot in the url.	[23:56]
bounce	they're like, the next hot thing	[23:56]
mircea_popescu	is this some sort of new media, fuck up people's grepping ?	[23:56]
BingoBoingo	Awful people	[23:56]
bounce	used to be commas in urls were a thing	[23:57]
mircea_popescu	at least those aren't special chars in regex	[23:57]
thickasthieves	<@assbot> [MPEX] [U] [S.MPOE] 6550 @ 0.00073875 = 4.8388 BTC [-] ------ what's a [U]?	[23:57]
*	bounce doesn't mention the slashes	[23:57]

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