Forum logs for 21 Aug 2015

Sunday, 24 November, Year 11 d.Tr. | Author: Mircea Popescu
ben_vulpes http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-08-2015#1246539 << cute [00:00]
assbot Logged on 21-08-2015 01:22:37; mircea_popescu: maybe the conversation's too o'cult. [00:00]
ben_vulpes http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-08-2015#1246551 << subject of programmers, there's a bit of ruby in a client ios build [00:00]
assbot Logged on 21-08-2015 01:23:44; mircea_popescu: a programmer! [00:00]
ben_vulpes it shells out to curl [00:00]
ben_vulpes TO SEND YOUR GPG KEYS TO SOME RUBRO [00:01]
* trinque shudders [00:01]
trinque ben_vulpes: fighting back the blob-thing? [00:01]
ben_vulpes http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-08-2015#1246600 << running under a linter? [00:02]
assbot Logged on 21-08-2015 01:43:43; *: asciilifeform presently breaking brain trying to find what the fuck IF_LINT is for [00:02]
ben_vulpes trinque: blob from hell has me by the short and curlies [00:02]
mod6 asciilifeform: lol, that worked. [00:02]
mod6 looks great now. [00:02]
mod6 i'll post my script and my new output diff [00:03]
trinque ben_vulpes: godspeed against the pussdemon [00:03]
ben_vulpes vile [00:04]
ben_vulpes it's like ironing bubbles out of wallpaper [00:04]
BingoBoingo What the fuck [00:04]
ben_vulpes with the eraser on tthe ass of a #2 [00:04]
trinque so this vac-u-loc thing, does it ummm... unlock? [00:05]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu et al: what was the deal with the gpg sig thing ?! [00:05]
* asciilifeform catching up on log [00:05]
ben_vulpes pebkac [00:05]
* trinque closes the tab before the phrase "jelly dongs" destroys him [00:06]
BingoBoingo What doesn blob from hell mean in the context above? [00:07]
asciilifeform http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-08-2015#1246633 << ahahahahahaha. happened! just, sideways. [00:07]
assbot Logged on 21-08-2015 02:22:08; mircea_popescu: Иное дело — социализм. Уничтожение различия между физическим и умственным трудом будет происходить именно по линии объединения хозяйства в единый организм во всемирном масштабе, по линии всеобщего обязательнР[00:07]
trinque BingoBoingo: fail-katamari of open source [00:07]
ben_vulpes asciilifeform: i *do* hope to get to genesis. am remiss. [00:07]
asciilifeform holy fuck is assbot broken. [00:07]
asciilifeform or possibly just my client. [00:08]
asciilifeform (who else just saw a mountain of rubbish instead of cyrillic) [00:08]
mod6 asciilifeform: http://thebitcoin.foundation/misc/genesis.sh && http://thebitcoin.foundation/misc/mod6.genesis-cmp-20150820.txt [00:08]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1JlNTk8 ) [00:08]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1JlNRc2 ) [00:08]
ben_vulpes mess of
ums 		[00:08]
mod6 <+asciilifeform> (who else just saw a mountain of rubbish instead of cyrillic) << me [00:08]
* assbot removes voice from Vexual [00:08]
phf asciilifeform: broke [00:08]
ben_vulpes !up Vexual [00:08]
* assbot gives voice to Vexual [00:08]
BingoBoingo trinque: Ah, I though maybe ben_vulpes was suffering a Hamplanet attached to his pubes [00:08]
asciilifeform mod6: your diff is correct (only timestamps at variance) [00:08]
trinque BingoBoingo: he would never [00:09]
ben_vulpes http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=20-08-2015#1244897 << i chuckled [00:09]
assbot Logged on 20-08-2015 02:04:39; pete_dushenski: internet 0.5.4 [00:09]
BingoBoingo But THEY would attack him [00:09]
ben_vulpes BingoBoingo: they don't dare come near [00:09]
mod6 <+asciilifeform> mod6: your diff is correct (only timestamps at variance) << right on. thanks for the tip about locale. [00:10]
* trinque imagines a charging hoarde cresting a hill, falling over, wheezing [00:10]
ben_vulpes http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=20-08-2015#1244903 << staff found plaintext passwords in a new client's database [00:10]
assbot Logged on 20-08-2015 02:09:25; mircea_popescu: anyway, notice the word wizardry. "if there is full credit card data in a dump, it’s not from us". whereas the dump clearly and pointedly states "some credit card data". [00:10]
ben_vulpes and five minutes later, found the commit wherein previous slaves had "fixed tests" [00:10]
ben_vulpes the fix? [00:10]
ben_vulpes many octothorpes. [00:10]
ben_vulpes approximately one for every assertion. [00:11]
ben_vulpes at the beginning of each line. [00:11]
trinque bwahaha [00:11]
phf if i had a dollar for ever password in a database i've fixed. oh wait i have [00:13]
ben_vulpes ;;later tell pete_dushenski lady v approves of your ashley madison article title [00:13]
gribble The operation succeeded. [00:13]
ben_vulpes (for those mythical ben_vulpess who read only ml but not #b-a) << may you experience many mild unpleasantnesses [00:15]
* Birdman (20d45712@#64;gateway/web/freenode/ip.32.212.87.18) has joined #bitcoin-assets [00:16]
ben_vulpes http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=20-08-2015#1244973 << on another client thinger recently i saw a pull request that replaced naive iteration through the list of files as provided by the ruby fs abstraction with an iteration over a hand-curated list of files because "differences between linux and os x" [00:16]
assbot Logged on 20-08-2015 03:18:03; asciilifeform: srsly there is no end to the retardation of linux [00:16]
ben_vulpes there is no end to /the retardation/ [00:16]
* assbot gives voice to Birdman [00:17]
ben_vulpes hai Birdman [00:18]
Birdman hello ben_vulpes [00:19]
ben_vulpes howya [00:19]
Birdman im well [00:19]
ben_vulpes any nyooz? [00:21]
ben_vulpes http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=20-08-2015#1245234 << i was once busted by this lolzatron! [00:23]
assbot Logged on 20-08-2015 06:02:54; punkman: http://untappedcities.com/2015/03/30/cities-101-the-mythic-undercover-yellow-taxi-cab-nypd-cop-car/ [00:23]
ben_vulpes wee benkay running around nyc, drinking beers in public not giving a shit about things [00:23]
ben_vulpes *woop woop* cab pulls a uie on 14th [00:24]
ben_vulpes there i stand shocked and inebriated at this turn of events [00:24]
ben_vulpes (inebriated, and shocked) [00:24]
ben_vulpes charges eventually dismissed because entropy can't in2 my dumb ass [00:25]
ben_vulpes http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=20-08-2015#1245248 << released yet? [00:25]
assbot Logged on 20-08-2015 07:21:28; hanbot: hey mircea_popescu http://dpaste.com/1675NTK [00:25]
mircea_popescu today i learned ass-russian mostly consists of fractions of a Ð. о, м etc [00:27]
BingoBoingo http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=20-08-2015#1245234 << i was once busted by this lolzatron! << Rural privilege [00:27]
assbot Logged on 20-08-2015 06:02:54; punkman: http://untappedcities.com/2015/03/30/cities-101-the-mythic-undercover-yellow-taxi-cab-nypd-cop-car/ [00:27]
ben_vulpes http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=20-08-2015#1245312 << never gets old [00:27]
assbot Logged on 20-08-2015 11:15:47; jurov: !t m f.mpif [00:27]
* joshbuddy has quit (Quit: joshbuddy) [00:27]
asciilifeform hanbot awake? [00:27]
asciilifeform iirc hanbot also had the out-of-order thing with genesis [00:27]
asciilifeform while folks are awake, i would like to pose the question, [00:28]
asciilifeform of what to do with timestamps. [00:28]
ben_vulpes recap plz? [00:28]
ben_vulpes i humbly submit for poor log-following canings. [00:28]
ben_vulpes but timestamp recap plz? or link? [00:29]
asciilifeform basic choices reduce to a) let'em live and pollute diffs b) tear'em out c) copy from filesystem timestamps of originals somehow [00:29]
ben_vulpes raaaaaa [00:30]
ben_vulpes in output of 'diff'? [00:30]
asciilifeform ben_vulpes: see mod6's link earlier. [00:31]
asciilifeform ben_vulpes: basic boojum here is that no two diffs ever diff cleanly on account of timestamps. [00:31]
asciilifeform try it. [00:31]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform the timestamps are truly meaningless here. [00:31]
mircea_popescu code is timeless or not code. [00:31]
ben_vulpes omit. [00:31]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: they are not ~entirely~ meaningless, in that they impose an ordering. BUT my antecedent hashes do that now. [00:32]
mircea_popescu aha [00:32]
mircea_popescu blocktime [00:32]
mircea_popescu ironically, it is b-a that has the first and so far only actual application of "blockchain technology" [00:32]
asciilifeform at any rate, they can't be removed entirely because epoch0 is 'magic' to diff [00:34]
asciilifeform (means absent file) [00:34]
asciilifeform but all non-0 stamps could be replaced with some arbitrary. [00:34]
asciilifeform though iirc diff will complain whenever a file on the local filesystem is being replaced with 'older' [00:34]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 51600 @#64; 0.000676 = 34.8816 BTC [-] [00:35]
mircea_popescu there is that [00:35]
ben_vulpes is it me or is that kinda dumb? [00:35]
mircea_popescu doesn't it have a switch to supress timestamps in output ? [00:35]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: not gnu diff... [00:36]
asciilifeform funnily, i was never able to get the custom format string feature in gnu diff to work with the -uNr standard [00:37]
asciilifeform it balks. [00:37]
asciilifeform go, try. [00:37]
ben_vulpes (in other news coracle at 338451) [00:38]
asciilifeform ben_vulpes: that thing is on what, a sat dish? [00:38]
asciilifeform dialup ? [00:38]
mircea_popescu so basically diff is, much like gpg, not actually usable. [00:38]
mats whats a coracle [00:38]
asciilifeform dingdingding [00:38]
mircea_popescu for a long list of reasons, some of which can be diddled [00:38]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu is a winner [00:38]
asciilifeform mats: stone age fishing boat [00:38]
mircea_popescu apparently nobody ever tried to use diff at all, [00:39]
asciilifeform mats: think 'tub' [00:39]
mircea_popescu which is a harder proposition than nobody ever used gpg. [00:39]
ben_vulpes asciilifeform: aws abortion [00:39]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: we might be the first to seriously diff a diff [00:39]
mats but this context [00:39]
* assbot removes voice from Vexual [00:39]
mircea_popescu mats the name he gave his node [00:39]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform everyone's suggestion seems to be "hey, use perl! bash script! fuck my sister she's a slut anyway!" [00:40]
ben_vulpes asciilifeform: the amusing thing is that you seem to think that *you're* the pauper hereabouts [00:40]
* joshbuddy (~josh@#64;wikimedia/Joshbuddy) has joined #bitcoin-assets [00:40]
asciilifeform ben_vulpes: wat [00:40]
ben_vulpes with your servers and trunk conections [00:40]
ben_vulpes connectinos [00:40]
ben_vulpes http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=20-08-2015#1245575 << you may wait quite a while for that ok, boss [00:41]
assbot Logged on 20-08-2015 18:23:28; mike_c: i consider it simply, the foundation says so. [00:41]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform hey, would --label fix it ? [00:41]
asciilifeform ben_vulpes: i just have good geography. a benjie a month buys ~80Mbit here [00:41]
ben_vulpes i don't consider bitcoin production ready in any of the incarnations that i've seen [00:41]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: nope [00:41]
asciilifeform doesn't affect date [00:41]
asciilifeform also recall that not only 'diff' is retarded, but 'patch' ! [00:42]
* menahem (~menahem@#64;unaffiliated/menahem) has joined #bitcoin-assets [00:42]
asciilifeform they are different sides of the same medal. [00:42]
mircea_popescu your vdiff won't be able to be a script. [00:42]
ben_vulpes i've taken to using the -d flag with patch *always* [00:42]
asciilifeform presently it is a 1liner that invokes classical diff [00:42]
asciilifeform and then massages the output [00:42]
ben_vulpes otherwise the damn thing can't figure its own arse out from my elbow [00:42]
asciilifeform (i assume all have read it by now) [00:43]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: i have been deliberately dancing around the spitoon-drinking that reimplementing 'diff' and 'patch' would be. [00:43]
mircea_popescu vdiff/vpatch. [00:43]
asciilifeform oh vpatch is unavoidable [00:43]
ben_vulpes http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=20-08-2015#1245628 << you're all very welcome [00:43]
assbot Logged on 20-08-2015 19:03:57; danielpbarron: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=20-08-2015#1245343 << come to think of it, yes my browsers have also been much slower at loading the log ever since the color change [00:44]
mircea_popescu yeah. hey, anyone looking for something to do that'd be useful and also an incredible walk on coals ? [00:44]
asciilifeform but presently (unpublished) it is ordinary patch and an extra bit to check antecedent [00:44]
asciilifeform in ada. [00:44]
asciilifeform (walk on coals) [00:44]
mircea_popescu haha not in ada, just, they'll have to publish it and we'll go "omfg you can't be this stupid, redo it" like 50 times. [00:44]
asciilifeform idk about the lot of you, but i am not inclined to play 'underhanded c contest' for this. [00:44]
mircea_popescu which is exactly what's 50% of the conversation in my household for the first x months of the life of a new girl anyway [00:44]
asciilifeform betcha mircea_popescu could easily include ada in the gurlz training and no one will notice the difference [00:45]
ben_vulpes vacation is over [00:45]
mircea_popescu except the one whose name's ada. [00:45]
asciilifeform l0l [00:45]
ben_vulpes (hyu!) [00:45]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: for her especially this was made. [00:45]
mircea_popescu lol. [00:45]
mircea_popescu btw, was it actually named for the lucky strike smoker chick ? [00:46]
asciilifeform 'this is your terminal, countess lovelace.' [00:46]
asciilifeform https://metrouk2.files.wordpress.com/2013/10/ay95895977ada-lovelace-engl.jpg [00:46]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1Kz05ib ) [00:46]
asciilifeform ^ her [00:46]
asciilifeform babbage's gf. [00:48]
mircea_popescu secretary! [00:48]
asciilifeform sekretute. [00:48]
asciilifeform (do you have those in ro?) [00:49]
mircea_popescu no. [00:49]
mircea_popescu it's actually what secretary means in romanian. [00:49]
asciilifeform l0l [00:50]
* asciilifeform can picture. [00:50]
mircea_popescu (also let me mention here, as this may come as a suprirse to my western friends - that in romanian classical society, as well as for that matter most of eastern europe, as well as for that matter all of europe in an earlier, simpler time - it was the height of poor taste for a woman to refuse sexual congress, and a pointed declaration of personal infirmity. sort-of like saying you can't read without your glasses [00:51]
mircea_popescu as such it was both uncommon and undiscussed.) [00:51]
asciilifeform but this came with the #include of cocks of low rank not daring to ask [00:52]
mircea_popescu mostly, yes. more effectually, it came with the #include that you'll be a father to her kids. [00:52]
asciilifeform doesn't work terribly well without both #include [00:52]
mircea_popescu well at the time being a father was moreover pleasant. [00:52]
mircea_popescu also #included. [00:53]
asciilifeform aha. [00:53]
mircea_popescu also, this was mostly before syphilis. [00:55]
asciilifeform this also. [00:55]
mircea_popescu which - another thing very little known. that importation was the bane of europe. [00:55]
asciilifeform pretty well-known! [00:55]
asciilifeform what is this [00:55]
mircea_popescu i don't think any disaster hence has had such a chilling impact on society. [00:55]
mircea_popescu orly ? ask around. [00:55]
asciilifeform c'mon, fucking beethoven, even [00:55]
mircea_popescu ask.around. [00:56]
* asciilifeform shudders [00:56]
asciilifeform the last time i 'asked around', i discovered folks who didn't know who won ww2. [00:56]
mircea_popescu then do not protest my rarities! [00:56]
* asciilifeform bbl, eating food [00:56]
mircea_popescu fun fact, since for some reason i'm doing history now. romania's head rabi (niemirower) died in 1940. he was succeded by one alex safran, who was 29 at that time. and by virtue of being head rabi, the young man also had an ex officio seat in the romanian senate. but for not being yet 40 years of age as the senate required, he asked for, and obtained, a special derrogation from the high chamber of cassation. and was sea [01:00]
mircea_popescu ted. [01:00]
mircea_popescu 1940, romania, etc. [01:00]
* ag3nt_zer0 has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) [01:01]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 26200 @#64; 0.00066937 = 17.5375 BTC [-] {2} [01:06]
* Transisto2 (~Trans@#64;modemcable148.3-130-66.mc.videotron.ca) has joined #bitcoin-assets [01:12]
BingoBoingo lol https://www.reddit.com/r/Buttcoin/comments/3hrijf/in_no_less_than_six_years_of_block_size_increases/cuab4mk [01:13]
assbot jackbootedstatist comments on In no less than six years of block size increases XTCoin would be a defanged and impotent caricature of actual Bitcoin. ... ( http://bit.ly/1hPiYXx ) [01:13]
BingoBoingo "Wow, is that mind bent. It's like r/iamverysmart crossed with extreme ancap libertarianism, with a dash of cultist "one true bitcoin", and possibly some blockstream fed small block euphoria. It's purified crazy." [01:13]
BingoBoingo Also... apparently there is a smart shaming subreddit [01:14]
mircea_popescu all this "blockstream" stuff is so lulzy. random derpy outfit with enough money to cover 18 months' worth of modest burn rate. [01:14]
mircea_popescu BingoBoingo wait, does that mean idiots trying to make smart people feel bad about being smart ?! [01:15]
BingoBoingo Yeah [01:15]
BingoBoingo "Use smaller words" "I can't read that" "Write for roach comprehension" [01:16]
mircea_popescu in other news... the reddit is mainstream bitcoin now ? in what alt-world ? [01:16]
mircea_popescu https://archive.is/J6Rhw somewhat lulzy. [01:18]
assbot overview for BLUEMEANIE4 ... ( http://bit.ly/1hPjiW0 ) [01:18]
mircea_popescu ;;ud Potemkin [01:19]
gribble http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=potemkin | Comes from a legend of Governor Potemkin of Crimea who supposedly created sham villages (Potemkin Villages) to impress his queen from a distance, but this ... [01:19]
mircea_popescu oh i c. [01:20]
mircea_popescu i had nfi what the anglos are trying to say by "potemkin", which is a common enough name, among people with an actual culture. [01:20]
mircea_popescu i kept thinking salce's "corazzata potemkin" and it just didn't make any sense. [01:21]
mircea_popescu ( www.youtube.com/watch?v=grJNVDs2_70 as clifnotes) [01:21]
BingoBoingo Ah [01:22]
asciilifeform maxim of the day: only visit anthill with a magnifying glass in your pocket. [01:25]
mircea_popescu it's funny what of the outside world makes it in. [01:25]
asciilifeform otherwise, just frustrating. [01:25]
mircea_popescu how did they hear of crimean potemkin but not of the great red ship ? who knows. [01:25]
* asciilifeform was mega-cultureshocked when asked colleagues about ants and magnifying glass and no one knew of this [01:26]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform in maryland they burn the ants with empathy, no need for technology. [01:26]
asciilifeform nah it's closer to 'what's an ant' [01:26]
mircea_popescu see ? [01:26]
mats maybe i had a shit magnifying glass but i never got it to work [01:27]
mircea_popescu mats nobody had shittier glass than russian kids. [01:27]
BingoBoingo how did they hear of crimean potemkin but not of the great red ship ? who knows. << Cold War culture. Those ruskies love playing pretend... [01:27]
asciilifeform mats: gotta be around the size of your palm, to work reliably [01:27]
mircea_popescu just need a stable hand to keep it colimated. [01:27]
asciilifeform and this. [01:27]
asciilifeform most importantly. [01:27]
asciilifeform ~pop~ [01:27]
mircea_popescu by far. as even one inch off... you lose 97% or so of power [01:27]
asciilifeform aha. [01:27]
asciilifeform good tutorial in 1/d^2 [01:27]
mats ic [01:28]
mircea_popescu yes. [01:28]
mircea_popescu best way for kids to understand what nonlinear means [01:28]
asciilifeform can give kid (chemically untreated - go, find, in usa) wooden plank, in lieu of ants, if the latter cannot be had [01:28]
mircea_popescu i think only works on dry pine. [01:29]
mircea_popescu maybe birch bark shavings [01:29]
asciilifeform gotta be dry and sans the 'fire-resisting' crud [01:29]
mircea_popescu actually needs the fire-enabling resin. [01:29]
mircea_popescu i dun think plain wood catches. [01:29]
asciilifeform typically don't want 'catch' but to turn black/brown in nice gradations [01:30]
asciilifeform to draw on. [01:30]
mircea_popescu you know we had a special soldering iron for doing that, at school ? [01:30]
asciilifeform same [01:30]
asciilifeform but i had, brother's, at home [01:30]
asciilifeform http://www.fresher.ru/manager_content/images2/chto-prosili-u-deda-moroza-shkolniki-80-x-godov/6.jpg [01:31]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1NIV0XN ) [01:31]
mircea_popescu BingoBoingo the crimean event was pre-ww2. [01:31]
mircea_popescu but i guess still works discoursively sure. [01:31]
asciilifeform (not quite same device, but similar) [01:32]
mircea_popescu omfg so 1970 [01:32]
asciilifeform mega-70s. [01:32]
BingoBoingo mircea_popescu: Yeah mythology. Stalin was an evolution of Peter's empty facades and clumsy imitation of the west. [01:32]
BingoBoingo So says 'Murican narrative [01:32]
asciilifeform http://embroidery-digitizing.ru/wp-content/uploads/2013/12/burning-device.jpg << also popular [01:33]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1NIVbCp ) [01:33]
asciilifeform my mother (was a dermatologist) had one of these ^ modified as a radiothermal cauterizer [01:34]
asciilifeform (apparatus where a small tesla coil craps out high-freq current which burns out, e.g., a mole; what closes the circuit? ~you~, as an antenna!) [01:35]
BingoBoingo Very common. [01:36]
asciilifeform not mega-surprise, proper medical gear was scarce. [01:36]
asciilifeform http://savepic.net/3474247.htm [01:37]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1NIVq0h ) [01:37]
asciilifeform l0l!!!! [01:37]
asciilifeform ^ 'toy. for children 8-16 years.' [01:37]
asciilifeform just picture trying this in usa!! [01:38]
BingoBoingo not mega-surprise, proper medical gear was scarce. << Still rather state of the art. [01:38]
asciilifeform BingoBoingo: the basic concept was introduced in early '40s and not changed since. [01:38]
asciilifeform as in, while tesla still lived. [01:38]
BingoBoingo of course, how could it be invented otherwise [01:39]
asciilifeform it is lulzy to show this gadget to students/n00bz with a piece of metal uncontacted by any ground on the other side, and nice tall spark [01:39]
asciilifeform and ask 'what closes circuit' ? [01:39]
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mircea_popescu it's lulzier to propose to people that "lightning could never strike aeroplane - what's to close the circuit ?!?!?!" [01:53]
mats https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZStwADQFy9I [01:53]
assbot Bomb Hunters Afghanistan National Geographic Documentary - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1E7R2Yz ) [01:53]
mats 95% of sappers i ever talked to performed missions just like this [01:53]
mats their entire deployment [01:53]
mircea_popescu mats "get us some food" ? [01:53]
mats lots became firefighters after, to chase the thrill [01:54]
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mircea_popescu "Maid of Athens, ere we part, give, oh, give back my heart! Or, since that has left my breast... keep it now, and take the rest! Hear my vow before I go, ζωή μου, σᾶς ἀγαπῶ." [01:58]
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mircea_popescu now that's what i call genius. that thing actually fucking rhymes, agapou / go are exactly homophonic. [01:58]
BingoBoingo lots became firefighters after, to chase the thrill << The one part of the Nordic system that works always. Once people get hooked on the thrill you don't have to pay them in anything other than opportunity to continue. [01:59]
mats welp, the way building codes makes shit safer, you just end up jerking off in the firehouse or starting a business on the job [02:00]
mircea_popescu or getting shot by some ghetto monkey. [02:00]
mats if i wasn't so broke i'd probably make a go at it [02:00]
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* BingoBoingo has moderated his future vehicle plans. Instead of firetruck contemplating pickup truck. [02:07]
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asciilifeform mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-08-2015#1246988 >> i was taught that english call this item 'macaronic poem.' in my mind, the iconic instance is pelevin's 'my sister, do you still recall как Ельцин бился мордой в пол ?' [02:12]
assbot Logged on 21-08-2015 04:56:04; mircea_popescu: "Maid of Athens, ere we part, give, oh, give back my heart! Or, since that has left my breast... keep it now, and take the rest! Hear my vow before I go, ζωή μου, σᾶς ἀγαπῶ." [02:12]
mircea_popescu nonsense, "macaronic" my foot. it's above language not below it. [02:13]
asciilifeform complain to them, not me, l0l [02:13]
mircea_popescu but hey, the nationalistic ambitions of victoria, regina horsefucker. [02:13]
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mircea_popescu is the "face down fight" a sort of fucking ? [02:14]
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asciilifeform nah it's him hammering the ground with his face (falling down drunk) [02:14]
mircea_popescu lol [02:15]
mircea_popescu btw, i have been wondering since the stuff started : how is it that tatar-bunar's never mentioned re the ukrainian situation ? [02:27]
mircea_popescu the very approximative knowledge in humanities of the english speaking folk, at both astroturf and crackpot/armchair general level never ceases to amaze me. [02:27]
mircea_popescu they've heard of one potemkin but not another, they know of this but not that, they're familiar with queens but don't think the brooklyn bridge exists, stuff like that. [02:28]
mircea_popescu wtf am i to make of all this! [02:28]
BingoBoingo It's broken [02:28]
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mircea_popescu for that matter, "Требование увода советских войск из Грузии и организации референдума "под контролем смешанных комиссий из социалистов и коммунистов" представляет собой одну из самых низкопробных империалистских ловушек под демократи [02:33]
mircea_popescu ческим флагом национального самоопределения." approximately translates to "fuck you nuland". [02:33]
mircea_popescu basically, nobody knows anything anymore. [02:34]
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mircea_popescu http://www.ziartricolorul.ro/fostul-ministru-de-externe-adrian-severin-da-lovitura-de-gratie-amestecului-brutal-al-yankeilor-in-justitia-romana/ << obscure romanian fringe thing, printing the letter an obscure romanian twerp (caught in corruption probe, kicked out of eu parliament, as the last phase of his public decay - only ended up in the eu parliament because at the time that's where romania sent all its bankrupt n [02:52]
mircea_popescu ames to die out). [02:52]
assbot Fostul ministru de Externe Adrian Severin dă lovitura de graţie amestecului brutal al yankeilor în Justiţia Română | | Ziar Tricolorul ... ( http://bit.ly/1NJ0Vfv ) [02:53]
mircea_popescu this thing is only notable because the guy is exactly correct in what he says. but he's easily the least frequentable name in romanian politics, short of actual mental cases. and this not in a good way - he truly is reprehensible. [02:53]
mircea_popescu how this shit works, where truth only ends up spoken by the thoroughly disgraced, is my favourite mystery of nature. [02:54]
mircea_popescu for as long as there's even the faintest hope of maybe one day scamming someone, every last human being is 100% jwz. [02:54]
mircea_popescu once that absolute last hope is lost, suddenly they're all saints somehow. da fuck. [02:54]
mircea_popescu ;;google freedom's just another name for nothing left to lose [02:55]
gribble Janis Joplin - Me and Bobby McG - YouTube: ; Freedom's just another word for nothing left to lose - Genius: ; Kris Kristofferson – Me and Bobby McGee Lyrics | Genius: [02:55]
mircea_popescu it must be. [02:55]
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BingoBoingo !up Vexual [03:15]
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BingoBoingo ty [03:29]
BingoBoingo Oh how the bezzle changes http://www.stltoday.com/news/local/govt-and-politics/dermatologist-agrees-to-sales-tax-deal-with-frontenac/article_cb22f6bc-fe3e-5c12-b65f-1ef832f09590.html [03:33]
assbot Dermatologist agrees to sales tax deal with Frontenac : News ... ( http://bit.ly/1E7UNNT ) [03:33]
BingoBoingo "This city is highly dependent on sales tax, and where a business will be operating under a conditional use permit due to parking and traffic considerations, we feel it reasonable that it pays a PILOT (payment in lieu of taxes)," City Administrator Bob Shelton said. "The medical service fees are not taxable but when the practices sell items, sales tax is involved." [03:33]
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BingoBoingo ;;later tell asciilifeform How do you handle an overloaded dosimeter? I've just kind of been ignoring it but the burns and nausea are piling up. [03:35]
gribble The operation succeeded. [03:35]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15366 @#64; 0.00067044 = 10.302 BTC [+] [03:35]
fluffypony lol [03:36]
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BingoBoingo I never new we had a state pie nao http://www.stltoday.com/business/local/illinois-hit-with-downgrades-as-springfield-goes-more-than-days/article_7d32af00-eefb-5234-a698-aaf799ffd8e7.html [03:38]
assbot Illinois hit with downgrades as Springfield goes more than 50 days without a budget : Business ... ( http://bit.ly/1E7UZww ) [03:38]
joecool what's the ideal bitcoind version to run nodes with nowadays? [03:40]
BingoBoingo what's the ideal bitcoind version to run nodes with nowadays? << Either 'stator' with protocol ticked to 99999 or anything with a lulzy version string [03:41]
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joecool !up Vexual [03:46]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11109 @#64; 0.00066925 = 7.4347 BTC [-] {3} [03:47]
danielpbarron !s rotor [03:48]
assbot 176 results for 'rotor' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=rotor [03:48]
danielpbarron joecool, ^ [03:48]
joecool i'm reading already, i remember this announcement in july http://qntra.net/2015/07/most-serene-republic-begins-advertising-public-blockchain-seed-nodes/ [03:49]
assbot Most Serene Republic Begins Advertising Public Blockchain Seed Nodes | Qntra ... ( http://bit.ly/1DtwUjM ) [03:49]
mircea_popescu joecool iirc it was 0.5.4 or whatever you feel like [03:51]
BingoBoingo joecool: With the anticipated spam attacks ideally you will want to bolt the Ophanage amputation and thermonuke modifications to whatever you choose. Also make sure you fix the BDB locks problem in your chose codebase. Anything post 0.3.21 and pre 0.8 should be fine. If you don't have particular things you fuss over 0.5.4'stator/rotor' is probably as close to idea as you will come [04:02]
joecool BingoBoingo: if i have fetched blockchain with a newer version will i need to refetch? [04:04]
joecool or is reindex sufficient [04:04]
mircea_popescu how newer ? [04:07]
BingoBoingo joecool: If your blockchain is later than 0.7-ish you will need to refetch [04:07]
BingoBoingo 0.8 introduced the leveldb bullshit [04:07]
joecool damn, oh well no matter [04:08]
BingoBoingo It's not that big of a deal. Mostly CPU bound anyways so if it is slow you can blame you own machine. [04:09]
danielpbarron http://danielpbarron.com/rotor_quest.txt [04:11]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1J9kLgL ) [04:11]
BingoBoingo brb, time travel [04:13]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20400 @#64; 0.0006879 = 14.0332 BTC [+] {3} [04:25]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 36222 @#64; 0.00067328 = 24.3875 BTC [-] {2} [04:57]
trinque danielpbarron: that appears to be in need of my patch [05:07]
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cazalla !up hk61ocL6zIE [05:13]
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cazalla hk61ocL6zIE, nah not tonight mate [05:13]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 32300 @#64; 0.00068571 = 22.1484 BTC [+] {2} [05:14]
cazalla just a porterhouse and some veg [05:16]
cazalla nah, just pan fry for quick meal once kid is in bed [05:19]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9700 @#64; 0.00066925 = 6.4917 BTC [-] {2} [05:26]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 22478 @#64; 0.00068791 = 15.4628 BTC [+] {2} [05:27]
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punkman http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-08-2015#1246926 I can't even remember all the things I tried to burn with magn. glass [05:34]
assbot Logged on 21-08-2015 04:23:54; *: asciilifeform was mega-cultureshocked when asked colleagues about ants and magnifying glass and no one knew of this [05:34]
punkman Vexual: are they too poor for butane? [05:36]
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punkman http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-08-2015#1246989 << it does rhyme, but only if you pronounce go as "goh" [05:39]
assbot Logged on 21-08-2015 04:56:25; mircea_popescu: now that's what i call genius. that thing actually fucking rhymes, agapou / go are exactly homophonic. [05:39]
* mircea_popescu disagrees with punkman over how greek's supposed to be said. [05:40]
mircea_popescu go is /gəʊ/. ἀγαπῶ is /ʌgʌpəʊ/. [05:42]
mircea_popescu IPA notation's not even exact enough to capture how close the two final vowels ACTUALLY are. [05:43]
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punkman well I dunno if it that was the case 500 years ago, certainly not today [05:45]
mircea_popescu do ἀγαπῶ and "ἀγαπο" sound different, today ? [05:47]
punkman I'm bad at the whole making sounds thing, but I suppose ω would be slightly longer than ο [05:48]
mircea_popescu i guess it simplified huh. [05:48]
punkman simplified a lot [05:49]
mircea_popescu ῶ is obviously supposed to be... long omicron. [05:49]
mircea_popescu omega* [05:49]
mircea_popescu ("sweeter omega", realy, in the words of my very old classics teacher, but that'd be a term of art) [05:50]
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punkman Ancient greek class, at least as I remember it, never focused on the sounds. It was more "here's 150 grammar rules to memorize" [05:55]
mircea_popescu i... skipped that part :D [05:55]
punkman I gotta say though, reading text peppered with 5 diacritics per word, makes my eyes hurt [05:56]
mircea_popescu you ever seen early romanian ? [05:57]
punkman is it even worse? :P [05:58]
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mircea_popescu http://trilema.com/2011/grafia-istorica-a-limbii-romane/#selection-45.0-47.21 [06:02]
assbot Grafia istorica a limbii romane on Trilema - A blog by Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1Ppy4xs ) [06:02]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15450 @#64; 0.00068791 = 10.6282 BTC [+] [06:17]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 24800 @#64; 0.0006722 = 16.6706 BTC [-] [06:55]
punkman http://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/s--SA3BaNl_--/1392562351668837008.png [06:59]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1WIVNxU ) [06:59]
mircea_popescu gross profit = total income now !? [07:00]
mircea_popescu what the fucking omf. [07:00]
mircea_popescu ahahaha 50mn extraordinary on 80mn justified expense bwahahaha o god. [07:01]
mircea_popescu are they in jail yet ? [07:01]
shinohai https://i.imgur.com/UK6wrHU.jpg [07:02]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1WIW5oC ) [07:02]
punkman and snapchat balance sheet http://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/s--7I5hFUuB--/1392562351693364368.png [07:02]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1WIWask ) [07:02]
punkman "Snapchat’s ad rates have declined rapidly. This month the company announced it would start to charge $20 per 1,000 views, a fraction of its earlier price, agencies say." [07:04]
mircea_popescu https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/c8/Secretary_Kerry_Meets_With_Ukrainian_Opposition_Leaders_in_Munich_(12253362394).jpg << dude check them out, they met in a tourist furnished studio thing. [07:04]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1LmXsTz ) [07:04]
punkman $20cpm, a fraction!! [07:04]
mircea_popescu just how broke IS the us these days ? [07:04]
mircea_popescu i don't think i sat that close to people since being about five. [07:04]
scoopbot_revived I killed one, I'm publishing another, who the hell knows what's going on anymore. http://trilema.com/2015/i-killed-one-im-publishing-another-who-the-hell-knows-whats-going-on-anymore/ [07:06]
mircea_popescu and the mcdonalds happy meal diet clearly isn't agreeing with nuland. [07:08]
mircea_popescu wait. tidd ?! da fuck is tidd doing there. and donfried roflmao. omfg this is the elephant funeral already. [07:10]
mircea_popescu best keks pic of today. [07:10]
mircea_popescu punkman 20 cpm is outrageous anyway. they could get maybe 3.5 or something. [07:12]
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punkman http://i.guim.co.uk/img/media/5aa031e05482099726ddf4859a9ee8b3e22a1683/0_141_1988_1192/master/1988.jpg?w=1920&q=85&auto=format&sharp=10&s=5ff30a1fc2a23e14cbe8de8d9b6b4f86 [07:28]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1WIYT5a ) [07:28]
punkman https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CM5xPf_UEAAnfex.jpg [07:29]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1WIZ0NX ) [07:29]
kakobrekla O_o [07:30]
punkman http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/news/meet-deez-nuts-the-teen-presidential-candidate-punking-america-20150819 [07:31]
assbot Meet 'Deez Nuts,' the Teen Presidential Candidate Punking America | Rolling Stone ... ( http://bit.ly/1WIZfZv ) [07:31]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 60394 @#64; 0.00068791 = 41.5456 BTC [+] {2} [07:34]
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punkman for dirigible aficionados http://news.usni.org/2015/08/19/exploring-the-wreck-of-uss-macon-the-navys-last-flying-aircraft-carrier [07:38]
assbot Exploring the Wreck of USS Macon, The Navy's Last Flying Aircraft Carrier - USNI News ... ( http://bit.ly/1WIZDqW ) [07:38]
mircea_popescu trump actually leading clinton dear god. [07:38]
punkman nobody wants the job eh [07:39]
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mircea_popescu i think the woman is deeply insulted. [07:39]
shinohai https://redd.it/3hqo2d [07:47]
shinohai ^ this guy [07:50]
punkman "Creator of The Ideal Reserve with about a decade of experience in applied economics, over a decade of experience in finance, and over two decades of experience in technology." [07:52]
punkman https://www.idealreserve.info/ [07:52]
assbot The Ideal Reserve - a decentralized, instantaneous, price stable, cryptocurrency ... ( http://bit.ly/1HZobAQ ) [07:52]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14662 @#64; 0.00068974 = 10.113 BTC [+] [07:53]
kakobrekla and nine years bitcoin expertience [07:56]
shinohai r/buttcoin laghed at him a few eeks back [07:56]
shinohai it was epic [07:56]
mircea_popescu cumulated experience ? [07:56]
shinohai emphasis on "cum" [07:57]
punkman "By downloading and/or executing the Ideal Reserve Clearinghouse application, you agree to the following terms: You will not attempt to reverse engineer the Ideal Reserve Clearinghouse application." [07:58]
shinohai whatever [08:00]
kakobrekla http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-08-2015#1246723 < assboti is a chukcha and it knows it. [08:00]
assbot Logged on 21-08-2015 03:05:31; asciilifeform: holy fuck is assbot broken. [08:00]
mircea_popescu whatnow ?! [08:00]
punkman lol [08:00]
mircea_popescu punkman by reading this you agree not to agree with the ideal herp derp whateverthefuck. [08:00]
shinohai !b 2 [08:01]
assbot Last 2 lines bashed and pending review. ( http://dpaste.com/0Y1CSXG.txt ) [08:01]
fluffypony lol [08:01]
fluffypony by continuing to read this sentence you acknowledge and agree to the aforementioned terms, if you do not agree with them you should have stopped reading like 3 sentences back [08:02]
mircea_popescu by blinking you agree milk is better than soy sauce. [08:03]
shinohai isn't this the same genius that tried to sell bible coin or some shit by issuing fake shares? [08:03]
kakobrekla thats pretty much the standard [08:03]
kakobrekla shitload of pages has this in their tos ... ' if you came here, you agree with all what we say below: you are a dick. ' [08:04]
yang kakobrekla: hi [08:07]
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kakobrekla heya sup [08:16]
yang kakobrekla: nothing special [08:18]
cazalla http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-08-2015#1246340 <<< jesus christ, put the poor bastard out of his misery instead [08:20]
assbot Logged on 21-08-2015 00:08:02; ag3nt_zer0: seen this anyone? pretty fucking miraculous that power of music https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fyZQf0p73QM [08:20]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8350 @#64; 0.00068426 = 5.7136 BTC [-] {2} [08:20]
shinohai Euthanasia, it's whats for dinner. [08:20]
fluffypony shinohai: why would we want to eat the youth in Asia? [08:21]
shinohai >.> [08:21]
* fluffypony giggles [08:21]
mircea_popescu https://www.reddit.com/r/Buttcoin/comments/3hrum5/degenerate_gambler_mircea_popescu_muses_about_how/cuagfoj << in an improbable twist of win, /r/buttcoin moves from proitesting bitcoin because "unlike fiat currency IT IS NOT BASED ON ACTUAL VALUE" to protesting eulora. because... [08:23]
assbot Mycelium_Running comments on Degenerate gambler Mircea Popescu muses about how female monkeys love their rapists but will attack beta males: "No female monkey that's been raped, even if regularly and consistently, ever attacks the rapist." ... ( http://bit.ly/1JmBegE ) [08:23]
mircea_popescu unlike REAL activity it is not based on... ACTUAL VALUE!!11 [08:23]
mircea_popescu but enough laughs for today. tomorrow is another lolday! [08:32]
* Now talking on #bitcoin-assets [14:11]
* Topic for #bitcoin-assets is: http://bitcoin-assets.com || http://log.bitcoin-assets.com || http://bash.bitcoin-assets.com || http://blogs.bitcoin-assets.com [14:11]
* Topic for #bitcoin-assets set by kakobrekla!~kako@#64;unaffiliated/kakobrekla at Wed Mar 5 16:58:12 2014 [14:11]
-assbot- Welcome to #bitcoin-assets. To get voice (ie, to be able to speak), send me "!up" in a private message to get an OTP. You must have a sufficient WoT rating. If you do not have a WoT account or sufficient rating, try politely asking one of the voiced people for a temporary voice. [14:11]
* assbot gives voice to mircea_popescu [14:11]
ascii_field 'There's going to be a shitload of stuff going down. The hacker said they were going to release. If it were me, I'd had come clean immediately to my wife. I had a TS clearance at Lockheed, and you have no idea what questions they asked. "Have you ever fucked a sheep?". When the OPM hack happened, I wrote an article where I came clean to everything.' [14:12]
mircea_popescu ascii_field "seems to be " [14:13]
mircea_popescu you know what, you seem to be in favour of obama, as reported by cnn. [14:13]
mircea_popescu laissez. [14:13]
mircea_popescu they've been in favour of preferably nobody remembering they exist until this goes away. [14:14]
ascii_field re: which [14:14]
mircea_popescu only got one gribble. [14:14]
ascii_field ah that. [14:15]
* ascii_field doesn't write these, just pulls them out of the sewer manhole [14:15]
mircea_popescu https://medium.com/@#64;spair/increasing-the-block-size-limit-85ff236fc516 << read the source at any rate. [14:15]
assbot Increasing the Block Size Limit — Medium ... ( http://bit.ly/1EIrBI0 ) [14:15]
mircea_popescu guy's prolly laboured for two weeks to make that thing, which he perhaps sees as "in the best us civilisation tradition". [14:16]
mircea_popescu anyway. "TTM" lol. srsly. [14:17]
ascii_field 'I don't have a preference (LTC/BTC/ETC). A company in Uraguay has improperly used my name....' (mcaffee) [14:18]
ascii_field ... does he pgp? [14:18]
mircea_popescu does he spellcheck ? [14:18]
ascii_field we already know answer to that [14:18]
mircea_popescu to both. he pcps. [14:18]
* assbot removes voice from ascii_field [14:19]
asciilifeform !up ascii_field [14:19]
* assbot gives voice to ascii_field [14:19]
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thestringpuller enjoy [14:21]
thestringpuller oops lag [14:22]
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mats he keeps talking about the proxyham wtf [14:28]
ascii_field mats: the man smokes dope [14:28]
ascii_field (likely - daily) [14:28]
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mircea_popescu dope would be one thing, but this guy smokes the carpeting. [14:31]
ascii_field the linoleum [14:31]
mircea_popescu "Late Friday, the Twitter feed for Rhino Security, the consultancy run by the project’s creator Ben Caudill, announced that Caudill’s talk was being pulled from the DefCon line-up, and that the ProxyHam project was being called off. “Effective immediately, we are halting further dev on #proxyham and will not be releasing any further details or source for the device,” the message read. “Existing #proxyham unit [14:32]
mircea_popescu s will be disposed of and no longer be made available at [DefCon]”" [14:32]
mats proxyham can be built by a teenager with a day of research [14:33]
mircea_popescu you don't understand how america works. [14:33]
ascii_field it was pretty lame, too [14:33]
ascii_field wifi card plugged into a 900MHz (cordless telephony band in usa) modem [14:34]
ascii_field fiddybux for the whole thing [14:34]
mats >The old arts of spying has really disappeared, my favorite is Android, for ease-of-use. The first thing I do is root it with towelroot to remove update capabilities, then remove bloatware, then unroot it of course. [14:34]
mats g-genius [14:34]
ascii_field mats: the man runs winblowz. by own admission. [14:34]
BingoBoingo dope would be one thing, but this guy smokes the carpeting. << likely smokes dope from a pipe carged out of a crack rock [14:36]
mircea_popescu ascii_field yes, lame. but the thinking seems to be, it's no big deal if special people have machine guns, it's a big deal if common people have slingshots. [14:36]
ascii_field mircea_popescu: the basic thread is that usg is understandably unhappy about violations of the 'diddlable sop standard' [14:37]
mircea_popescu maybe [14:37]
ascii_field even something so humble as switching radio bands [14:37]
ascii_field all of sudden, $maxint snoop machine has to be rebuilt [14:37]
ascii_field forms in triplicate... [14:38]
ascii_field alternatively, disinfo to make idiots dig up the 900Mhz thing and use it [14:38]
ascii_field 'stand up to the establishment!' [14:38]
ascii_field the next multicolourphone. [14:39]
ascii_field it is even possible for both hypotheses to be true simultaneously [14:39]
ascii_field (two separate departments of muppetronics. as in tor.) [14:39]
mircea_popescu i have nfi who these guys are, they didn't have the modicum of a clue to make contact or anything. for all i know the whole thing's an orchestrated attempt to shore up the notion that anyone still gives a shit about the usg inside the us. [14:40]
mircea_popescu whoever knows. [14:40]
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mircea_popescu "The Islamic State of Iraq and Syria (ISIS) and American college campuses share a deplorable commonality: high frequencies of rape." [14:48]
mircea_popescu ajhahaha wut the fuck already. [14:48]
mircea_popescu these people are an insult to humanity. [14:48]
mircea_popescu "Survival Hunters and Gatherers Above the Arctic (SHGAA) and American college campuses share a deplorable commonality: they both walk on thin ice." [14:49]
* assbot removes voice from ascii_field [14:50]
mircea_popescu "The Federadion of Mosquitoes, Lice and Ticks (FMLT) and American college campuses share a deplorable commonality: they both suck" [14:50]
mircea_popescu "This Nonsensical Linguistic Construction (NLC) and American college campuses share a deplorable commonality: they both confuse referents" [14:50]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13712 @#64; 0.000691 = 9.475 BTC [+] [14:52]
asciilifeform !up ascii_field [14:55]
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mircea_popescu you know looking back... i remember a time when anglo web produced a lower proportion of articles that don't crash and burn in the first paragraph. [14:58]
mircea_popescu i think it was even under 80% at some point this millenium. [14:58]
mircea_popescu but at some time, back when the stupid parents of the current generation were yet illiterate, english was a pleasure to read. [14:59]
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mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-08-2015#1247216 << i lolled :D [15:16]
assbot Logged on 21-08-2015 12:52:10; fluffypony: mats: do you serve it with flied lice? [15:16]
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mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-08-2015#1247230 << well, on the good news front, they never had any military capability to begin with [15:17]
assbot Logged on 21-08-2015 13:04:29; mats: ouch [15:17]
mircea_popescu a 2nd league hockey team could probably beat up the argentine armed forces. [15:17]
mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-08-2015#1247256 << emergent behaviour ? why, BECAUSE GLOBAL WARMING ? [15:19]
assbot Logged on 21-08-2015 14:15:56; asciilifeform: at this may be an emergent behaviour.' [15:19]
mircea_popescu reminds me of the scientist and the flea joke. [15:19]
ascii_field ask'em [15:19]
mircea_popescu i am asking them. [15:20]
* mircea_popescu chuckles at the thought of some [not so ?] distant time in the future when various derps will discover that "nobody could have predicted" they had a lengthy record of shit to answer for in the logs. [15:20]
danielpbarron btw I got stator to build with the rotor toolkit and it is currently syncing and up to 153k blocks [15:20]
mircea_popescu wd. [15:20]
ascii_field danielpbarron: congrats! [15:21]
danielpbarron also, on a gentoo install created with trinque's script thingy [15:21]
mircea_popescu this is starting to maybe coallesce huh. [15:21]
thestringpuller dunno if the buttcoiners hate or love #b-a [15:21]
thestringpuller hard to tell [15:22]
danielpbarron rotor feels like a "safe space" to borrow some redditard terminology [15:22]
ascii_field waaaht [15:22]
ascii_field ?!1 [15:22]
mircea_popescu ascii_field the motherboard article you linked says "satoshi" exactly once, ands that is to claim "and Satoshi showed with some basic calculations that hardware improvements were very likely to outpace Bitcoin growth for decades into the future." [15:23]
mircea_popescu somehow they never heard about more recent events. [15:23]
ascii_field naturally [15:23]
mircea_popescu not so naturally. why is the thing still getting links i don't get it ? [15:23]
mircea_popescu not like they have an actual perspective or anything to say [15:24]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 24495 @#64; 0.000691 = 16.926 BTC [+] [15:24]
mircea_popescu the only thing that matters re propaganda is whether it gets repeated. that's 100% of it. [15:24]
* assbot removes voice from ascii_field [15:25]
mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-08-2015#1247281 << yeah, because numbers can be anything. for instance by this procedure motherboard has a readership. which fallacy gets a strangely memory-holed alf toi keep linking to it as if it were a thing, somehow. [15:25]
assbot Logged on 21-08-2015 15:19:42; BingoBoingo: Not even wrong: "However, the question of whether miners and pools will support that increase in the form of XT, a fork of Bitcoin Core, remains. It currently has 13.7% of bitcoin's hashing power behind it." << https://archive.is/41s4u [15:25]
mircea_popescu !up ascii_field [15:25]
-assbot- You voiced ascii_field for 30 minutes. [15:25]
* assbot gives voice to ascii_field [15:25]
mircea_popescu i have no idea why patent nonsense read by fewer people than are involved in writing it keeps somehow creeping into the conversation. but this sort of masochism of the intellectual is both ridiculous and overplayed already. [15:26]
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mircea_popescu I had a TS clearance at Lockheed, and you have no idea what questions they asked. "Have you ever fucked a sheep?" << to which the only acceptable answer is, "does your mother count". [15:31]
mod6 :D [15:33]
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ascii_field mircea_popescu: was digging for traces of sanity in there [15:43]
ascii_field mircea_popescu: but easier to get uranium from the sea. [15:43]
ascii_field mircea_popescu: i confess, began reading this crud linked from bci's www, where i looked for block guts [15:46]
ascii_field mircea_popescu: but have, i think, eaten all that i can stomach. [15:46]
phf i use to like vice do's&don't's, they were mean and funny. i always thought vice was magazine version of the whole terry richardson, merlin bronques "glam trash" photography, but that was still cool in 2004-2006. i guess it would make sense that they would be faux edgy tech articles, no better or worse then any other online rag, but i can't get over the image of hipsters on heroin writing that shit [15:48]
ascii_field http://git.savannah.gnu.org/cgit/patch.git/tree/src << what a pile of shit! [15:52]
assbot patch.git - GNU patch ... ( http://bit.ly/1PDTGqy ) [15:52]
* assbot gives voice to trinque [15:56]
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trinque danielpbarron: glad it worked out for ya [15:56]
trinque this weekend I'm going to put together a rudimentary site for trinque.org and gather a few of the tools I've built there [15:56]
trinque that script for example could do with an operator's manual; it's less a cake and more a kitchen [15:57]
trinque I've changed it since to dump out a working musl system [16:02]
trinque and I think I'll continue to just make all the decisions rather than offer options, and then describe how one might proceed from there on their own, if they so desire [16:03]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 29684 @#64; 0.000691 = 20.5116 BTC [+] [16:06]
asciilifeform !up ascii_field [16:09]
* assbot gives voice to ascii_field [16:09]
ascii_field trinque: spiffy [16:09]
ascii_field ;;later tell mats http://www.rtl-sdr.com/rtl-sdr-tutorial-analyzing-gsm-with-airprobe-and-wireshark [16:14]
gribble The operation succeeded. [16:14]
assbot RTL-SDR Tutorial: Analyzing GSM with Airprobe/GR-GSM and Wireshark - rtl-sdr.com ... ( http://bit.ly/1PDWV1h ) [16:14]
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trinque http://abcnews.go.com/US/slender-man-stabbing-teens-enter-pleas-adult-court/story?id=33225373 << wasn't it 4chan or the like that invented "slender man" ? [16:23]
assbot 'Slender Man' Stabbing: Not Guilty Pleas Entered for Teens - ABC News ... ( http://bit.ly/1Lpxy4p ) [16:24]
trinque ideas, man... they're powerful [16:24]
trinque ah it was Something Awful [16:24]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16700 @#64; 0.00069469 = 11.6013 BTC [+] {3} [17:22]
punkman https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EvfLPXUHfVc [17:28]
assbot MWRC 2011 - Fascism and Faux-pen Source - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1UYf38X ) [17:28]
danielpbarron mod6, http://danielpbarron.com/v0.5.4-TEST1.txt << you want I should run this one rather than the result of my rotor_quest? [17:29]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1UYfeRJ ) [17:29]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 21250 @#64; 0.00070162 = 14.9094 BTC [+] [17:32]
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cazalla http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-08-2015#1247400 <<< the guy who founded it (gavin mccines) got shoved out by the sjw who now operate it [17:49]
assbot Logged on 21-08-2015 18:46:15; phf: i use to like vice do's&don't's, they were mean and funny. i always thought vice was magazine version of the whole terry richardson, merlin bronques "glam trash" photography, but that was still cool in 2004-2006. i guess it would make sense that they would be faux edgy tech articles, no better or worse then any other online rag, but i can't get over the image of hipsters on heroin writing that s [17:49]
cazalla http://www.abc.net.au/news/2015-08-21/gst-to-be-applied-to-all-products-services-sold-by-vendors/6715582 <<< yet another reason australia sucks [17:52]
assbot GST to be applied to more products, services sold by vendors into Australia from July 1, 2017 - ABC News (Australian Broadcasting Corporation) ... ( http://bit.ly/1UYjmRu ) [17:52]
cazalla retail is rightfully dying here, so i guess they think this will shore up the taxes they're losing from that sector.. i am more curious to find out if it'll be applied to steam games and in-game purchases [17:58]
trinque how do we increase our national wealth? [17:59]
cazalla "We are going to have taxation officials travel around the world visiting these companies asking them to register for GST purposes," federal Treasurer Joe Hockey said. [17:59]
trinque by slowing down all economic activity, of course! [17:59]
asciilifeform !up ascii_field [17:59]
* assbot gives voice to ascii_field [17:59]
ascii_field mod6, ben_vulpes, mircea_popescu, et al: here is an experiment: change ' print $0 " " o ' in vdiff.sh to ' print $1 " " $2 " " o '. this results in timestamp amputation. the patches work fine, except that gnupatch is no longer aware of preexisting files and will happily create the same file twice, if so run, glomming on top of itself. [17:59]
ascii_field but the resulting vpatches work, when applied with conventional gnupatch [18:00]
ascii_field for both from-vacuum creation of files (as in 'genesis') and the later patches. [18:00]
thestringpuller danielpbarron has a computer named naomi [18:01]
thestringpuller sexy [18:01]
ascii_field also i recommend changing the last line of the script to LC_ALL=C ./vdiff.sh a b > genesis.vpatch [18:01]
ascii_field the result of these two changes should be BITWISE IDENTICAL GENESIS FOR ALL [18:01]
ascii_field ;;later tell mircea_popescu ^ [18:01]
gribble The operation succeeded. [18:01]
ascii_field if folks are happy with this result, i will re-create and sign the entire shebang tomorrow. [18:03]
* assbot gives voice to hdbuck [18:04]
hdbuck http://kernelmag.dailydot.com/issue-sections/staff-editorials/13910/sox-browser-history-obstruction-justice/?fb=ss&prtnr=hackingnews [18:05]
assbot Deleting your browser history could land you in prison ... ( http://bit.ly/1UYliK1 ) [18:05]
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ascii_field 'The absence of evidence shouldn’t be viewed as proof of guilt, but tell that to the U.S. federal court—where Khairullozhon Matanov received a 30-month sentence in mid-June, in part for deleting his browser history. Though he wasn’t an accomplice in the Boston bombing, the FBI charged that the friend of the Tsarnaev brothers with obstructing justice by destroying evidence in the case. That evidence inc [18:06]
ascii_field ludes now-deleted entries in his browser history, along with certain videos. [18:06]
ascii_field Matanov isn’t the first person to be sentenced under such circumstances.' [18:06]
trinque and furthermore [18:06]
trinque "Under the law, people are required to preserve any evidence they knowingly believe could be used in future investigations, even if no such investigation has been launched." [18:06]
trinque presumably any piece of information can be used in any imaginary investigation of the future [18:07]
trinque so we go from the 5th amendment directly to "you must investigate yourself on behalf of the all powerful state" [18:07]
ascii_field the one law that nobody ever cancelled is 'not caught, not thief' [18:08]
ascii_field poor schmuck failed to destroy the evidence of destroying the evidence.. [18:08]
hdbuck question why would usg need our browzer history via our computer since they already have it all via google [18:09]
trinque coke machine indeed. [18:09]
ascii_field see also: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=26-07-2014#770468 [18:09]
assbot Logged on 26-07-2014 18:48:15; asciilifeform: this is why i simply don't get people who continue to think of their relationship with the u.s. court system in legal, rather than military, terms. [18:09]
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hdbuck hello btw [18:10]
* assbot gives voice to pete_dushenski [18:10]
trinque hdbuck: good afternoon [18:11]
trinque pete_dushenski: and to you as well [18:11]
pete_dushenski howdy! [18:11]
trinque ascii_field: it is abundantly clear to anyone thinking that this is a runaway bureaucratic process with no clear intentions/goals/etc, just *must feed* [18:11]
thestringpuller pete_dushenski: i'm migrating my blog to wordpress [18:12]
pete_dushenski ;;later tell ben_vulpes and how is the lovely lady v these days ? staying active i trust ? [18:12]
gribble The operation succeeded. [18:12]
thestringpuller i hate it [18:12]
pete_dushenski thestringpuller worse than tmmlr ? [18:12]
ascii_field trinque: it is in the initial stage, of cementing the precedent, via jailing an already unpopular fella [18:12]
trinque which is why today's cock-tease of a market slump does me no good. come on baby, lets have the full rip [18:12]
thestringpuller no better than tumblr. i just don't like making themes [18:12]
thestringpuller i also bought thestringpuller.com [18:14]
thestringpuller so as soon as I figure out the wp thing, i'll have a dedicated blog [18:14]
pete_dushenski beauty [18:15]
pete_dushenski thestringpuller who are you hosting with ? [18:15]
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thestringpuller pete_dushenski: AWS [18:19]
thestringpuller courtesy of jurov lol [18:19]
thestringpuller well i'm paying him but still. credit where credit due. [18:19]
assbot Logged on 21-08-2015 03:25:47; asciilifeform: iirc hanbot also had the out-of-order thing with genesis [18:20]
ascii_field hanbot: see http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=20-08-2015#1245518 + http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-08-2015#1246540 + http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-08-2015#1247434 [18:21]
assbot Logged on 20-08-2015 16:56:49; ascii_field: and is our latest discovery that 'diff' is UNFATHOMABLY retarded ?! [18:21]
assbot Logged on 21-08-2015 01:22:45; asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: try this on for size: [18:21]
assbot Logged on 21-08-2015 20:57:40; ascii_field: mod6, ben_vulpes, mircea_popescu, et al: here is an experiment: change ' print $0 " " o ' in vdiff.sh to ' print $1 " " $2 " " o '. this results in timestamp amputation. the patches work fine, except that gnupatch is no longer aware of preexisting files and will happily create the same file twice, if so run, glomming on top of itself. [18:21]
ascii_field mod6, ben_vulpes, mircea_popescu, et al: for extra lulz, here is a vdiff of the change, taken using the new vdiff, of vdiff.sh ! >>>>> http://dpaste.com/10CMS6H [18:28]
assbot dpaste: 10CMS6H ... ( http://bit.ly/1JqAcEV ) [18:28]
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* assbot removes voice from ascii_field [18:30]
mod6 !up ascii_field [18:30]
* assbot gives voice to ascii_field [18:30]
mod6 I can say that your change to vdiff.sh `diff -uNr $1 $2 | awk 'm = /^(---|+++)/{s="sha512sum "" $2 "" 2>/dev/null " | getline x; if (s) { split(x, a, " "); o = a[1]; } else {o = "false";} print $1 " " $2 " " o} !m { print $0 }'` certainly removes the timestamps from the output hashes. [18:38]
mod6 err, output diff [18:38]
ascii_field now, fire the diff [18:38]
ascii_field should work as before. [18:39]
ascii_field just be sure not to do it twice. [18:39]
mod6 and try this without LC_ALL=C ? [18:39]
ascii_field with!! [18:39]
ascii_field or you'll get ubuntud [18:39]
mod6 yup, ok. and when I have my own genesis.vdiff, should compare with `diff -u` to the one you posted in your original email? or compare with vdiff? [18:40]
ascii_field vdiff [18:40]
mod6 ok [18:40]
ascii_field ~and~ original [18:40]
ascii_field (which won't match because it has timestamps, but ~order~ will match) [18:41]
mod6 yup: http://thebitcoin.foundation/misc/mod6.genesis-cmp-20150821.txt [18:45]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1JqBP5z ) [18:45]
ascii_field aha. [18:46]
ascii_field now make an empty space and fire the diff [18:46]
mircea_popescu thin priviledge is hanging out with friends, pointing out that i'd be more sensible to not give citizenship to children of fat people than to children of illegal immingrants, and not offending anyone. [18:46]
ascii_field then compare result with 'chicken' [18:46]
mod6 err, so, use my newly created genesis.vdiff, apply to pulled original v0.5.3 ? [18:47]
ascii_field nononon [18:48]
ascii_field to EMPTY dir [18:48]
ascii_field genesis pulls 'chicken' out of ~air~ [18:48]
mircea_popescu mod6 the entire idea is it creates it de novo [18:49]
ascii_field ^ [18:49]
mod6 ah! [18:49]
* ascii_field thought this was obvious from the recipe! [18:49]
mod6 im dumb [18:49]
mircea_popescu stop thinking stuff is obvious! [18:49]
mircea_popescu obvious is an offensive term and it triggers people! [18:50]
mod6 haha. [18:50]
pete_dushenski really, if this wasn't obvious to mod6, ppl like hanbot and i have no chance [18:50]
mod6 it worked ascii_field [18:50]
ascii_field congrats mod6 ! [18:51]
ascii_field pete_dushenski: do try the new recipe [18:51]
mod6 thanks :] [18:51]
mod6 just ran the `patch -p1 < genesis.vpatch` in an empty dir, and then volla, bitcoin source exists [18:51]
ascii_field ^ as it should. [18:51]
mircea_popescu i kept meaning to do a statement explaining the major importance of that thing but i didn't really find my words with the deed. [18:51]
pete_dushenski ascii_field as it happens, i've been doing just that. [18:51]
mircea_popescu ima try to a signing statement once i put it to the ml [18:51]
mircea_popescu speaking of which, who wants to hold my retarded hand while i do that again ? i forget, what do i do, send an email with the plaintext as body and the detached sigfile as attachment ? [18:52]
jurov you mean to btc-dev? [18:53]
ascii_field mircea_popescu: to use jurov's thing, you need 3 things: a clearsigned readme (1st attachment) [18:53]
ascii_field mircea_popescu: the actual patch (optional, if the message concerns a patch) - 2nd attach [18:53]
mod6 <+pete_dushenski> really, if this wasn't obvious to mod6, ppl like hanbot and i have no chance << this probably should have been obvious to me. but sometimes, hard to see the forest through all of the trees. i've been looking at the compare diff a lot lately, and forgot that /all/ is contained in the genesis.diff. [18:53]
ascii_field mircea_popescu: third, if the second exists - a detached .sig for it [18:53]
mod6 *genesis.vdiff [18:54]
pete_dushenski mod6 aha. so there's hope for us yet ! [18:54]
mod6 ofc! [18:54]
pete_dushenski :D [18:54]
mod6 *genesis.vpatch [18:54]
mod6 wth is wrong with me this afternoon. [18:54]
mircea_popescu thanks. [18:55]
mod6 hanbot is testing out my i686 changes for buildroot/rotor.sh - even got a script for it. so that's p-cool. [18:55]
mircea_popescu and the actual email body - empty ? [18:55]
jurov mircea_popescu: only clearsigned text is mandatory, there can be none or any number of further attachments(not necessarily only patches), each with detached attachment.name.ext.sig [18:55]
mircea_popescu jurov cool, ima try this and bitch more if i can find a way to. [18:56]
jurov if your email client is known not to mutilate text, put clearsigned text into the body instead of first attachemnt [18:56]
ascii_field mircea_popescu: the importance of the thing i intended, roughly, is that ~everything is either a vdiff or a sig~ [18:56]
ascii_field in 'v' [18:56]
jurov otherwise, left body empty [18:56]
danielpbarron i noticed today that you don't need to rename the files in order for them to verify; you can sha1sum and gpg --verify the downloaded attachments as they come, and go straight to extracting the tar afterwards [18:57]
ascii_field both vdiffs and sigs (the former by virtue of having one or more of the latter matching) are immediately attributable to an l1 pubkey [18:57]
ascii_field and, for the first time ever in history of versionatrons, you can take a tree of unknown constitution and determine what patch set it corresponds to (if any) [18:58]
mircea_popescu incidentally, i'd like to remind the esteemed readership, especially those people who would like to make their non-stem degrees useful to the future of this world, that http://trilema.com/2013/so-whos-running-the-courts-circus/ is still open. a significant amout of work has already been put in, help me reward it by completing the task. [18:58]
assbot So who's running the Courts circus ? on Trilema - A blog by Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1JqCG6a ) [18:58]
punkman ascii_field: why L1? doesn't ml use L2? [18:58]
ascii_field punkman: perhaps it does? but iirc the only contributors thus far live in l1 [18:59]
jurov yes it uses l2 [18:59]
mircea_popescu iirc it accepts l2 but no one but l1 used it yet [18:59]
ascii_field ah [18:59]
punkman phf is L2 [18:59]
danielpbarron PinkPosixPXE would be the exception to that l1 only theory [18:59]
mircea_popescu aok [18:59]
* ascii_field notices that he has been using 'vdiff' and 'vpatch' interchangeably. this is not really an error. [19:01]
* assbot removes voice from ascii_field [19:01]
asciilifeform !up ascii_field [19:01]
* assbot gives voice to ascii_field [19:01]
danielpbarron http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=13-08-2015#1236853 << did nobody mention Rocko's Modern Life in this thread? That was one of my favorites growing up [19:02]
assbot Logged on 13-08-2015 05:04:30; pete_dushenski: mircea_popescu: i'm taking notes here on cartoonz for kidz, so keep 'em comin. [19:02]
pete_dushenski haha mine too! [19:02]
* pete_dushenski hums the theme song to himself [19:02]
danielpbarron and I "wasn't allowed" to watch ren and stimpy (had to sneak it) [19:03]
ascii_field btw here's another thing to add to the 'gpg is mega-retarded' list: gpg sig does not contain a sig of self !! [19:04]
ascii_field so it is quite impossible to verify that it is valid per se, without having the payload [19:04]
pete_dushenski danielpbarron the only show i wasn't allowed to watch was wwf wrestling [19:05]
pete_dushenski lest i try to piledrive my younger brother into the concrete sidewalk or something [19:05]
ascii_field (i could explain why one may wish to do this, but will leave it as an exercise) [19:05]
trinque danielpbarron: heh me too re: ren & stimpy [19:05]
trinque ascii_field: maybe in the case where the payload was munged in regards to whitespace or the like ? [19:06]
jurov sailor moon [19:06]
jurov jkjk [19:06]
ascii_field trinque: sometimes one wishes to eat the sig prior to the payload [19:07]
ascii_field say, a public www where these can be dropped in a hopper [19:07]
punkman ascii_field: well you can sign the detached sig if you please [19:07]
trinque ah yep. [19:07]
ascii_field 'take any sig and then see' creates a ddos vector [19:07]
ascii_field punkman: whereas 'sign the sig' again means that you can't take a single file at a time. [19:07]
trinque I mean were www sane it would work precisely that way [19:07]
jurov yes, if petabyte payload [19:07]
ascii_field or this [19:07]
trinque sig comes over as part of header, then body [19:07]
ascii_field header ?!!#$$ [19:08]
punkman ascii_field: wrong [19:08]
punkman --armor --sign [19:08]
ascii_field punkman: didja miss all the 'clearsigning is retardedly broken' threads ? [19:08]
trinque ascii_field: yeah, why not? you send me a GET, I first tell ya how many bytes to expect, then signature, then body? [19:08]
punkman not clearsign, --sign [19:08]
jurov punkman and how does that help with verifying the sig as soon as posible? [19:10]
punkman you --sign --armor the detached sig :P [19:10]
trinque what I mean by header is perhaps no more than: -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- [19:11]
trinque just put the sig immediately following [19:11]
trinque with maybe the hash used and byte length preceding, actually [19:12]
ascii_field what if i don't want to hear so much as one byte if sig isn't from l1 ? [19:12]
ascii_field (beyond the sig) [19:12]
trinque you must at least know what hash to try, yeah? [19:12]
trinque and then yes, perhaps the sig validates that information [19:12]
trinque makes total sense [19:12]
trinque I mean in the case of the hash, implicitly so [19:12]
trinque or barring that seems like one must simply be chosen and that's that [19:13]
ascii_field thing is, read rfc2440 [19:14]
ascii_field pgp sig doesn't carry the whole hash. [19:14]
ascii_field only the lowest order 16 bits of it. [19:14]
ascii_field (for fast rejection of entirely off sig) [19:15]
ascii_field who the FUCK thought that this was sane. [19:15]
punkman demo: this contains a signed detached sig for asciilifeform's genesis.vpatch: http://dpaste.com/18YW8WF [19:15]
trinque "Good" "Enough" (TM) [19:15]
assbot dpaste: 18YW8WF ... ( http://bit.ly/1JqDQhY ) [19:15]
ascii_field i mean, i can maybe see a case where this is strategically necessary [19:15]
ascii_field but as sop ? [19:15]
trinque I think it's becoming clear that as mentioned already, none of this shit was ever used in battle. [19:16]
trinque not even lowly diff [19:16]
ascii_field everybody with a unix box lives & dies by 'diff' [19:17]
ascii_field (even if he doesn't know it) [19:17]
trinque https://c2.staticflickr.com/4/3522/3239361178_66b92e397b_b.jpg << I suppose a battlefield given some artistic license, but.. [19:17]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1JqDYhr ) [19:17]
trinque who will lose his job (or life) if diff fails to work? [19:22]
jurov dunno if it's right question [19:23]
trinque jurov: what would be? [19:23]
trinque I don't see anyone on earth who owns diff [19:23]
jurov i can imagine someone fearing their job if diff isn't locale-aware [19:23]
trinque I was about to discuss that aspect; it's not that no one cares about diff; it's that everyone has conflicting reasons for caring [19:23]
ascii_field trinque: can't build so much as a kernel w/out 'diff' [19:24]
trinque and nothing focuses them coherently [19:24]
trinque so every single piece of open source is compromized to the degree it was ever used at all [19:24]
trinque *compromised [19:24]
mircea_popescu jurov subject ? leave empty ? [19:25]
ascii_field it needs a subject, if only for reference [19:25]
jurov it is shown in archives, so yes [19:26]
mircea_popescu ok, sent it. do i wait for it to show ? [19:29]
ascii_field mircea_popescu: http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/2015-August/000151.html << worx [19:29]
assbot [BTC-dev] V-genesis signed, with comment ... ( http://bit.ly/1I0DysO ) [19:29]
phf amusingly i tried looking for plan9's diff for some insight. they use a ported gnu version. [19:29]
ascii_field (these really oughta be scoopbotted) [19:29]
mircea_popescu win [19:29]
mircea_popescu it's really painless, once one's clear on the process. [19:30]
* ascii_field glad that mircea_popescu liked the concept, but noticed that he signed the old patch [19:30]
ascii_field the one with timestamps [19:30]
mircea_popescu mhh [19:30]
ascii_field we'll need to do this again. starting with me, optionally [19:30]
ascii_field can be any of you [19:30]
ascii_field just re-create the genesis by the new recipe [19:30]
ascii_field and sign [19:30]
ascii_field no reason to wait for me [19:30]
mircea_popescu yeah, mod you have teh honor. [19:31]
mircea_popescu mod6 * [19:31]
* assbot removes voice from ascii_field [19:31]
asciilifeform !up ascii_field [19:31]
* assbot gives voice to ascii_field [19:31]
ascii_field 'For the first time in the century or so of history of this particular human endeavour, text was deliberately structured with due consideration given not only to its meaning, but also to its source, and to its context. Prior attempts at structuring software, at first consisting of a naive approach focused on meaning only, over time added a half-hearted consideration of context, very unequally and rather haphazardly. The [19:31]
ascii_field change the V-genesis introduced is exactly like the move from understanding and controlling movement in terms of mass and somewhat velocity, such as it occurs in the mind of a monkey throwing rocks, to understanding and controlling movement in terms of mass, impulse and energy, such as it occurs in the launching of satellites. The proposition that there is still room for improvement in the endless march of human thought, [19:31]
ascii_field on this topic as on any other, is absolutely indubitable. The proposition that the sum total of what came before can be compared with this particular advance is strictly ridiculous.' << mega-summary, quoted here for logz readers [19:31]
punkman genesis_2cba721ced8108cf65ab7d045081237ecda4602a_2cba721ced8108cf65ab7d045081237ecda4602a.vpatch << eh [19:34]
mircea_popescu hmmm [19:35]
mircea_popescu more mangling ?! [19:35]
mircea_popescu the files i sent over definitely only had it once. [19:35]
ascii_field ;;later tell jurov can we PLEASE dispense with the mutilated filenames ?! [19:37]
gribble The operation succeeded. [19:37]
mircea_popescu ps, i'm cracking a champagne bottle. [19:38]
mod6 <+mircea_popescu> yeah, mod you have teh honor. << thanks. I've confirmed that what I get from genesis.vpatch out of thin air is the same manifest as `bitcoin-0.5.3-no-crud.sha256.manifest`. [19:38]
jurov :/ yes i'm on it [19:38]
mod6 This make sense? [19:38]
ascii_field congrats mod6 [19:38]
pete_dushenski hearn spills guts : "i would actually like to see less consensus in bitcoin development and more authoritarianism" [19:38]
mircea_popescu yes it is what'd be expected mod6 [19:38]
ascii_field now post the output, sign [19:38]
pete_dushenski https://youtu.be/RIafZXRDH7w?t=10m30s << reference [19:38]
assbot CoinScrum: QA with Gavin Andresen and Mike Hearn - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1JqF4tF ) [19:38]
mircea_popescu pete_dushenski he's more then welcome to read the logs. [19:38]
mod6 Alright, lemme fireup the ole gpg-o-matic. [19:38]
ascii_field mod6: from here on, everyone who carries out a vdiff on the same inputs shall get the same output. [19:39]
mircea_popescu if what he truly means is he wants to SEE it. [19:39]
pete_dushenski mircea_popescu heh. he probably does when he can't sleep at night [19:39]
ascii_field unless we discover yet another 'locale'-like idiocy, in which case it will go on my chopping block [19:39]
cazalla http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-08-2015#1247569 <<< same deal here and same deal with astroboy, had to sneak that one yet tmnt was ok for some reason [19:41]
assbot Logged on 21-08-2015 22:01:13; danielpbarron: and I "wasn't allowed" to watch ren and stimpy (had to sneak it) [19:41]
pete_dushenski http://www.contravex.com/2015/08/21/blackout/ [19:43]
assbot Blackout | Contravex: A blog by Pete Dushenski ... ( http://bit.ly/1JqFksx ) [19:43]
cazalla cop a flogging for having x-men trading cards but smashing windows in construction sites got a pass, i swear my old man liked to keep us walking around on egg shells [19:43]
pete_dushenski automated scooping, what's that ? [19:43]
* ascii_field bbl [19:47]
* ascii_field has quit (Remote host closed the connection) [19:48]
* joshbuddy has quit (Quit: joshbuddy) [19:50]
* Guest96476 has quit (Remote host closed the connection) [19:59]
mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-08-2015#1247400 < yeah well, the us altogether was to some degree still cool in early 2000s. [20:07]
assbot Logged on 21-08-2015 18:46:15; phf: i use to like vice do's&don't's, they were mean and funny. i always thought vice was magazine version of the whole terry richardson, merlin bronques "glam trash" photography, but that was still cool in 2004-2006. i guess it would make sense that they would be faux edgy tech articles, no better or worse then any other online rag, but i can't get over the image of hipsters on heroin writing that s [20:07]
mircea_popescu water under the bridge by now [20:07]
mod6 http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/2015-August/000152.html << here we go! [20:07]
assbot [BTC-dev] V-genesis signed, with comment ... ( http://bit.ly/1JqGvYY ) [20:07]
mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-08-2015#1247407 << worx. [20:08]
assbot Logged on 21-08-2015 19:01:28; trinque: and I think I'll continue to just make all the decisions rather than offer options, and then describe how one might proceed from there on their own, if they so desire [20:08]
mircea_popescu To deploy this vpatch file [20:08]
mircea_popescu from ~thin air~ do the following: [20:08]
mircea_popescu patch -p1 < genesis.vpatch [20:08]
mircea_popescu that sounds so great in its laaconism. [20:08]
* TheRealJohnGalt (uid29986@#64;gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-nlnyofdmvxtbxjjt) has joined #bitcoin-assets [20:10]
mircea_popescu "A Wisconsin court today entered not guilty pleas on behalf of the two teen defendants in the "Slender Man" stabbing case after their lawyers declined to do so." [20:10]
mircea_popescu what the fuck is this bullshit. [20:10]
mircea_popescu since when the fuck do defense lawyers have agency in court. [20:10]
mircea_popescu did the schmucks get disbarred ? [20:10]
mircea_popescu oh never mind, my bad. they held silence in protest over jurisdiction. [20:11]
mircea_popescu i take it back. [20:11]
mircea_popescu fucking abcnews. the defense didn't "decline to do so". the defense DECLINED TO RECOGNISE THE COURT! [20:12]
mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-08-2015#1247431 << derp can save the gas money. S.MG is never collecting any tax for anyone, including teh republic. [20:13]
assbot Logged on 21-08-2015 20:57:09; cazalla: "We are going to have taxation officials travel around the world visiting these companies asking them to register for GST purposes," federal Treasurer Joe Hockey said. [20:13]
mats asciilifeform: neat [20:16]
mircea_popescu lol buttcoin engaging danielpbarron over gpg etc was pretty lulzy to read. [20:23]
mircea_popescu "Welcome, kiddo, to how the real world works. You go ahead and place your crazy protest bids way off in the bottom of the sociological order book and scream that someday, SOMEDAY, the market will come down to meet you, and you will be vindicated. [20:23]
mircea_popescu The rest of us who actually make shit happen in the front lines of consensus back on planet earth will continue to be unaffected by your efforts apart from their modest value as chuckle fuel over beers and sushi." [20:23]
mircea_popescu apparently someone drinks beer with sushi. [20:23]
punkman what's wrong with that [20:24]
mircea_popescu ... [20:24]
mircea_popescu what's next, coffee and blue cheese ? [20:24]
mircea_popescu toothpaste and lobster, why not, i would like some veal in sauce chantilly and a dollop of cream on my cigar. [20:25]
mats brutal week for fiat markets [20:26]
mats DJIA down ~500 points [20:26]
mats http://www.wsj.com/articles/no-end-in-sight-for-oil-glut-1440113703 [20:27]
assbot No End in Sight for Oil Glut - WSJ ... ( http://bit.ly/1JmWEui ) [20:27]
mircea_popescu https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LQi2vLlporA [20:28]
assbot Louis de Funès - Les grandes vacances (1967) - English taste - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1JmWFhJ ) [20:28]
mircea_popescu mats obama's only actual initiative. fucked in the ass. [20:28]
mircea_popescu (ps "c'est etonnant" is no good, in french. "delicious" is worse.) [20:33]
mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-08-2015#1247577 << because of the gay danger ? [20:39]
assbot Logged on 21-08-2015 22:04:36; jurov: sailor moon [20:39]
jurov phew [20:39]
mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-08-2015#1247592 << it must be made to work. [20:40]
assbot Logged on 21-08-2015 22:06:28; ascii_field: punkman: didja miss all the 'clearsigning is retardedly broken' threads ? [20:40]
jurov mostly cuz it was on rtl2 when we had tv allowed [20:40]
mircea_popescu so ? [20:40]
mircea_popescu oh, pronz ? [20:40]
jurov and least derpy of them [20:40]
punkman clearsigning mostly works. the problem is everything else the clearsigned message will pass through. [20:41]
mircea_popescu myea [20:41]
punkman the worst thing off the top of my head is the lack of a full fingerprint in signed message [20:46]
mircea_popescu ^ [20:47]
mircea_popescu https://www.reddit.com/r/againstmensrights/comments/3c1pry/all_of_the_nopes_there_is_no_such_thing_as_the/ dude i;m all over fucking reddit already. [20:47]
assbot All of the Nopes: "There is no such thing as the crime of 'rape'" and that's arguably not the worst part : againstmensrights ... ( http://bit.ly/1JmXd7o ) [20:47]
mircea_popescu and they all stick on the same thing, too. [20:47]
mircea_popescu dear reddit : have more sex. seriously, it halps. [20:48]
punkman also, if have some automated system that works with gpg messages and you aren't running one of the latest 1.* version, messages can be crafted that will DoS/hang your system [20:49]
punkman inb4 mp's custom gpg for mpex? [20:51]
mircea_popescu heh. [20:53]
mircea_popescu gpg as-is is at best a duct tape solution. [20:53]
punkman I'd say shitshow [20:54]
mircea_popescu or that. [20:55]
punkman "oh yeah let's be compatible to PGP 4, because that matters" [20:56]
* ahmed_bodi is now known as Multicoin-Announ [20:56]
* Multicoin-Announ is now known as Multicoin-Co [20:56]
* Multicoin-Co is now known as ahmed_ [20:57]
punkman http://multicoin.co/scm/ [20:57]
assbot Index of /scm ... ( http://bit.ly/1JmXtTM ) [20:57]
punkman http://multicoin.co/scm/configs/mail.toml [20:57]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1JmXuHs ) [20:57]
punkman poor ahmed [20:58]
asciilifeform l0l!!! [20:58]
mircea_popescu heh [20:59]
asciilifeform http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/2015-August/000152.html << congrats mod6 on signing the ~correct~ genesis [20:59]
assbot [BTC-dev] V-genesis signed, with comment ... ( http://bit.ly/1JqGvYY ) [20:59]
asciilifeform http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-08-2015#1247726 << it's concept-broken, not implementation-broken [20:59]
assbot Logged on 21-08-2015 23:37:54; mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-08-2015#1247592 << it must be made to work. [20:59]
mircea_popescu http://40.media.tumblr.com/577fe863827da014163fd6511b94adaa/tumblr_nqdekbl9Cn1rzdkezo1_1280.jpg [20:59]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1JmXyqy ) [20:59]
punkman http://multicoin.co/scm/configs/others.toml [20:59]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1JmXyH4 ) [20:59]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform the concept of me being able to read the singed thing with my eyes is not broken. [21:00]
mircea_popescu or else computing's a pointless activity. [21:00]
asciilifeform can read detach-signed document. [21:00]
* mircea_popescu is still working through this mental mire. [21:00]
mircea_popescu im noit yet persuaded that's good enough. [21:01]
asciilifeform the only way to sign without imposing structure on the matter signed, is detach. [21:01]
mircea_popescu if the signed thing is not a thing, or if the signed thing is not available fgor my eyes, no problem has in fact been solved. [21:02]
asciilifeform i spoke of this earlier today; [21:02]
asciilifeform where a pgp signature is so retardedly structured that it cannot be verified at all without the original matter [21:03]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 31350 @#64; 0.00068843 = 21.5823 BTC [-] {2} [21:03]
asciilifeform (it lacks the complete hash!) [21:03]
asciilifeform incidentally there is an implication of this, which ought to be obvious [21:03]
asciilifeform and terrifying. [21:03]
mircea_popescu deep restructuring of the pgp implementation is required anyway. [21:03]
asciilifeform http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-08-2015#1247703 << court did not impose peine forte et dure ?! that's how it used to work.. [21:03]
assbot Logged on 21-08-2015 23:09:56; mircea_popescu: fucking abcnews. the defense didn't "decline to do so". the defense DECLINED TO RECOGNISE THE COURT! [21:03]
mircea_popescu 1. full rsa. 2. proper signature encapsulation. 3. sane structuring of the keys. 4. etfc. [21:04]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 47150 @#64; 0.00066787 = 31.4901 BTC [-] {2} [21:04]
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asciilifeform since nobody said it... [21:06]
asciilifeform rfc4480 sayeth, '5.2.3. Version 4 Signature Packet Format.... [buncha crud snipped] ... Two-octet field holding the left 16 bits of the signed hash value. One or more multiprecision integers comprising the signature. ...' [21:07]
asciilifeform obvious yet? [21:07]
asciilifeform or do i have to draw the picture here. [21:07]
mircea_popescu heh. [21:07]
mircea_popescu who the fuck specs like this for crying out loud [21:07]
asciilifeform WE'VE BEEN SIGNING 16-BIT HASHES [21:07]
mircea_popescu "two octet" [21:08]
asciilifeform motherfuckers. [21:08]
mircea_popescu because why, because youyr mother had two abortions ? [21:08]
asciilifeform in effect. [21:08]
asciilifeform sit and think about this for a minute. [21:08]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform the LEFT 16 bits ? [21:08]
mircea_popescu omfg this whole thing is useless. [21:08]
* asciilifeform brainmelt [21:09]
mircea_popescu bwahahahaah [21:09]
mircea_popescu no, see, reddit was right [21:09]
mircea_popescu we're fucking idiots over here :D [21:09]
mircea_popescu i guess the next top priority in making cardano which was making bitcoin which was making vdiff is now making gpg. [21:09]
asciilifeform i will wait for one of you lot to point out where i somehow am mistaken. [21:09]
asciilifeform but yes, you can guess how i arrived at this tidbit. [21:10]
* mircea_popescu off to read rfc4480 for the expecterd comedic value [21:10]
asciilifeform i've been walking around with a bound hardcopy of that thing for most of a year [21:10]
asciilifeform slowly scribbling on it, laying out out [21:10]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform i guess by being spurred by my recent statement and going into a "let's verify this" mode ? [21:10]
asciilifeform in my head, with pencil [21:10]
asciilifeform actually coincident [21:10]
mircea_popescu 5.2.3. Version 4 Signature Packet Format [21:12]
punkman "The concatenation of the data being signed and the signature data from the version number through the hashed subpacket data (inclusive) is hashed. The resulting hash value is what is signed. The left 16 bits of the hash are included in the Signature packet to provide a quick test to reject some invalid signatures." [21:13]
mircea_popescu The concatenation of the data being signed and the signature data from the version number through the hashed subpacket data (inclusive) is hashed. The resulting hash value is what is signed. The left 16 bits of the hash are included in the Signature packet to provide a quick test to reject some invalid signatures. [21:13]
punkman asciilifeform: so... no, it's not THAT bad. [21:13]
mircea_popescu it is not THAT bad [21:13]
mircea_popescu ahaha mkay. [21:13]
mircea_popescu it is still not how i'd do it. [21:13]
* mircea_popescu expects to live in a world where everything is done EXACTLY as he would do it. failure of perceptible world to conform to this expectation is a crime, more serious than any other, and to be punished by destruction. [21:14]
mircea_popescu steal, fine. suck at stealing -> go die in a fire. [21:15]
mircea_popescu competent thieves should be convicted to jail. incompetent thieves should be broken apart with a small hammer. [21:16]
asciilifeform punkman: think. [21:17]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: think. [21:17]
mircea_popescu yes ? [21:17]
mats Fun fact: the first Minuteman missiles ran off a hard disk as the only available memory. Reads/writes/jumps had to be scheduled to avoid pipeline stalling for a full rotation. [21:17]
asciilifeform mats: see also: [21:17]
asciilifeform !s minuteman [21:18]
assbot 14 results for 'minuteman' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=minuteman [21:18]
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mats If subroutines were used, they were implemented by writing the return address to their end then jumping. [21:18]
asciilifeform mats: and this is still done in mechanical hdd design, see 'elevator' algo. [21:18]
asciilifeform punkman, mircea_popescu: can you think of any ~legit~ reason to store only 16 bits of the hash that was signed ? [21:19]
mircea_popescu nope. [21:19]
asciilifeform me neither. [21:19]
mats asciilifeform: I didn't know that. cool. [21:19]
asciilifeform but i can think of a pretty good illegitimate one. [21:19]
mircea_popescu but still, the situation is not equivalent to "singatures are trivially defeated in the field" [21:19]
mircea_popescu me too, but nevertheless. [21:19]
asciilifeform not trivially, no. [21:19]
mircea_popescu right. [21:19]
mircea_popescu hence the comments i an i presume him, made. [21:19]
asciilifeform but can now formulate the equation. [21:19]
mircea_popescu do. [21:20]
punkman you'll have to spell it out for me [21:21]
* asciilifeform retreats to the mathematical room [21:21]
mircea_popescu anyway, there's no question left that a usable extant pgp implementaton exists. this should be redone. [21:23]
phf asciilifeform: maybe hash size is variable where's they wanted to go with fixed size headers. so no matter size of hash you only store first two octets [21:23]
mircea_popescu phf so what does that help ? [21:23]
punkman phf, it is variable indeed [21:23]
mircea_popescu collision on 16 bits of sha512 is trivial. [21:23]
punkman and what does collision get you [21:24]
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mircea_popescu nothinmg, but by this principle let;'s stick to md5/ [21:24]
mircea_popescu moreover, it's just miserable product design. [21:24]
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phf mircea_popescu: i ~assume~ the intent is to speed up failure [21:25]
mircea_popescu i do not wish to eat in the restaurant where they piss in the beer, irrespective of any other consideration. [21:25]
mircea_popescu phf people without wot presence may not have intent. [21:25]
mircea_popescu the intent is to rape and pillage, for all orcs, by virtue of being orcs. [21:25]
phf if the first two octets don't match you don't have to go through the rest of the signature verification process, since at that point you already know that the signature is invalid [21:25]
mircea_popescu and why two. [21:26]
mircea_popescu and why is it that all the phuctor bad sigs we see are two octet mirrors. [21:26]
asciilifeform fingerprint collision diddles, entirely other castle wall scaled by orcs [21:27]
asciilifeform (with some success, as i gather) [21:27]
mircea_popescu must be. [21:27]
asciilifeform 'The concatenation of the data being signed and the signature data from the version number through the hashed subpacket data (inclusive) is hashed. The resulting hash value is what is signed. The left 16 bits of the hash are included in the Signature packet to provide a quick test to reject some invalid signatures.' [21:28]
mircea_popescu ;;google "N-ai fost acolo s-auzi tot ce-am auzit. N-ai fost acolo sa vezi tot ce am vazut. N-ai fost acolo sa vezi tot ce am facut. N-ai fost acolo sa vezi prin tot ce am trecut." [21:28]
gribble Pânza de minciuni. | Scriu pentru ca nimeni nu asculta..: ; Dan Necşa | Trăieşte, iubeşte, respectă, ai grijă, dar nu te ataşa!: ; La mormantul lui ARSENIE BOCA. Parintele a lasat cu limba de ...: [21:28]
mircea_popescu derp google. [21:28]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform is thgat the most likely to be quoted snippet ? [21:29]
punkman plenty of success with that "Scallion was used to find collisions for every 32bit key id in the Web of Trust's strong set demonstrating how insecure 32bit key ids are." [21:29]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: l0l, i get this: http://webkind.ru/text/989416971_946024927p581069957_text_pesni_n-ai-fost-acolo.html [21:29]
assbot Слова песни N-ai fost acolo, текст песни ... ( http://bit.ly/1NAUI7A ) [21:29]
asciilifeform punkman: aha, old nyooz [21:30]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform quite. [21:30]
mircea_popescu slova pesni = text pesni lol [21:31]
punkman https://github.com/coruus/cooperpair/tree/master/pgpv4 key collision for v4, scallion attack was for v3 I think [21:32]
assbot cooperpair/pgpv4 at master · coruus/cooperpair · GitHub ... ( http://bit.ly/1NAUUnm ) [21:32]
mircea_popescu basically we're uncovering a decade old, very fragile rube goldberg machine [21:33]
mircea_popescu to subvert thew pgp i npractice. [21:33]
mircea_popescu hey hayden... you sucked lol [21:34]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 43800 @#64; 0.00070518 = 30.8869 BTC [+] {3} [21:35]
* menahem has quit (Quit: Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com) [21:36]
asciilifeform 'Most OpenPGP software use 64-bit keyids internally, and rely on 64-bit keyids present in issuer id packets.' < ahaha. [21:37]
* asciilifeform always, always regrets what he finds. [21:37]
asciilifeform this is likely why so few with the shovels [21:38]
asciilifeform nobody wants to see what is under that garden. [21:38]
punkman might as well repost this too, if you've never edited your gpg config, start here: https://github.com/coruus/cooperpair/blob/master/saneprefs/gpg.conf [21:40]
assbot cooperpair/gpg.conf at master · coruus/cooperpair · GitHub ... ( http://bit.ly/1KB5DZF ) [21:40]
punkman "# Use a real encryption algorithm to protect the secret keyring, rather than CAST5." << relevant to certain folks that didn't mind posting their encrypted keyrings to keybase.io [21:41]
mircea_popescu "a" is bullshit. [21:41]
mircea_popescu what do we say, twofish ? [21:42]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: weren't you the one with the 'why do we need block cipher at all' concept ? [21:42]
mircea_popescu yes. but meanwhile. [21:42]
mircea_popescu in principle, i will say "block cipher" is exactly, EXACTLY, provably as retarded as "reusable otp via prng"., [21:43]
asciilifeform while we're at it, copying in from my handwritten 'pgp is retarded' notebook, [21:43]
asciilifeform 'why the fuck is there no provision for multilayer use of multiple blockciphersystems' [21:43]
mircea_popescu because that doesn't help anything. [21:43]
asciilifeform it helps in precisely the same way as multiple parachutes [21:44]
mircea_popescu no. [21:44]
mircea_popescu it helps in precisely the same way as multiple surgical interventions. [21:44]
mircea_popescu if one didn't help, ten won't eiother. [21:44]
asciilifeform (knowing weak keys in aes does not break the message if under it is, e.g., twofish, with DISTINCT KEY) [21:44]
mircea_popescu fuck or get off the woman. [21:44]
asciilifeform tards use same key, yes [21:44]
asciilifeform (for separate layers) [21:45]
mircea_popescu no dude, spare me. either this problem is solved or woirked on. [21:45]
mircea_popescu chaining is for the brothel. [21:45]
asciilifeform block cipher gets 'solved' no more than steel girders can be 'solved.' [21:46]
asciilifeform can make thicker, or thinner [21:46]
mircea_popescu not so. [21:46]
phf could it also increases known-plaintext attack possibilities? [21:46]
asciilifeform but not infinitely rigid. [21:46]
mircea_popescu phf it necessarily would. [21:46]
mircea_popescu and other issues. [21:46]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform either you make me an infinitely rigid girder or i don;'t want anything to do with you. [21:46]
asciilifeform phf, mircea_popescu: how, if the layers use distinct keys, each en-rsa'd separately ? [21:46]
mircea_popescu it's computing for a reason. THIS is the reason. [21:46]
* asciilifeform reminds mircea_popescu that factoring has not been proven np-hard much less np-complete [21:47]
asciilifeform hence we have no mega-magicalgirder. [21:47]
asciilifeform even in rsa. [21:47]
* asciilifeform has searched for such a girder for quite some time. [21:47]
asciilifeform the closest thing we have is the vernam pad. [21:47]
mircea_popescu that's actually weaker than rsa in practice. [21:48]
asciilifeform (otp, or however it is called in each of our kindergarten textbooks.) [21:48]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: practice, fortunately, is not hard to fix. [21:48]
asciilifeform use a bit once, then blow the antifuse it lived in. [21:48]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform do not ask me "how". this question is pointedly forbidden in this context. [21:48]
asciilifeform problem solved. [21:48]
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asciilifeform call it, if you like, 'read-once' ram. [21:49]
phf should start mailing each other cloned harddrives with random bits on them [21:49]
asciilifeform unless operator is a moron, and uses it other than as prescribed, device is a true otp. [21:49]
asciilifeform phf: mailing, wtf [21:49]
asciilifeform why not mail straight to hitler. [21:50]
asciilifeform to complete this story, i will add a diode on each antifuse and a collective rail to blow'em all [21:50]
asciilifeform plugged into the 'grenade pin' of course. [21:50]
asciilifeform !s antifuse [21:51]
assbot 26 results for 'antifuse' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=antifuse [21:51]
phf conversation really an excuse for asciilifeform to build a subversive analogue circuit [21:51]
mircea_popescu forget all that already. [21:51]
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asciilifeform otp has precisely three weaknesses even in principle: generation of key (solved by civilized rng); reuse of key (solved by erasing each bit immediately after it is used in a xor); capture of key by enemy (in common with any other cipher! and solved with grenade pin) [21:54]
asciilifeform that it is not aesthetically pleasing is not a weakness. [21:54]
punkman and distribution of key? [21:54]
phf (that's the last point in asciilifeform's list) [21:55]
asciilifeform not a weakness. generated by two units connected together in sealed, grounded copper container. [21:55]
asciilifeform then separated. [21:55]
mircea_popescu pfff. [21:56]
mircea_popescu look, im not going to give back the major advantage of asym crypto keys just because nsa sponsored implementation and useful rms-ian idiots made a mess of things. [21:57]
asciilifeform this is the 'infinitely rigid girder.' in practice, all girders meaningfully differing from this one have provably finite rigidity. [21:57]
mircea_popescu i might as well go back to woodstove heating. [21:57]
asciilifeform nobody said 'go back to latrine', aha. [21:57]
asciilifeform but it is worth understanding what the cost of 'infinitely rigid girder' is. [21:57]
mircea_popescu measurable my foot. [21:57]
mircea_popescu measure rsa rigidity. [21:57]
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asciilifeform could, if could prove np-hard. [21:57]
mircea_popescu myeah [21:58]
mircea_popescu course you said provable. i'll take that to. prove., [21:58]
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asciilifeform (and would be picking up fields medal or whatever remaining civilized equivalent is) [21:58]
mircea_popescu no you wouldn't. [21:58]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu is of course right. snowdenball's chance in hell [21:58]
mircea_popescu "it was already announced by some researches without a name in a paper without a back copy" [21:58]
asciilifeform aha, this. [21:58]
mircea_popescu meanwhile on another front, http://36.media.tumblr.com/cf0be6b45983b05c2ff5e4529958595f/tumblr_ncsy3gJdZY1u0tf07o1_500.jpg [21:59]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1NAWKVl ) [21:59]
asciilifeform spiffy bunker [22:00]
asciilifeform to round off the thread, imho the 'holy grail' of asymmetric crypto is to demonstrate ~provably measurable strength~ - that is, prove np-completeness of inverting the transform. [22:04]
asciilifeform while also proving that none of the 'practical' aspects of employing the transform, leak key. [22:04]
mircea_popescu no. [22:05]
asciilifeform (most academitards neglect the second part!) [22:05]
mircea_popescu the holy grail is this situation where nothing's demonstrated at all. [22:05]
asciilifeform ?? [22:05]
asciilifeform how;s that work [22:05]
mircea_popescu the field of unknown unknowns always favours the people against the state. [22:05]
asciilifeform does mircea_popescu remember what means 'np-complete' ? [22:06]
mircea_popescu yea/ [22:06]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8755 @#64; 0.00070779 = 6.1967 BTC [+] [22:06]
mircea_popescu if anyone had the proof, i'd ask them to not publish it, for that matter. [22:06]
asciilifeform l0l! [22:06]
mircea_popescu yes. [22:06]
* asciilifeform 's throat is not big enough for this pill [22:06]
mircea_popescu it is ACTUALLY preferable for teh republic that whether rsa is or is not np-complete is not known. [22:07]
asciilifeform hitler rediscovers the proof. then what [22:07]
mircea_popescu then nothing. [22:07]
mircea_popescu hitler had reports re the fucking wtc bombings on his own desk. [22:07]
asciilifeform how does this beat 'proven np-complete and the lowliest amoebic scum knows' ? [22:07]
mircea_popescu how does "not clear what bitcoin is" beat "bitcoin is IT" ? [22:08]
mircea_popescu i lived my entire life cloaked in a shadow of "nobody saw him coming". i like it. [22:08]
asciilifeform is the idea that enemy wastes resources on cryptoanalytic derp vs setting up coke machine dungeon ? [22:08]
mircea_popescu not even. [22:08]
asciilifeform see, i could even agree re: ~provably unknowable~ (i.e. godelian) unknowns. if these could be had. but 'unknown uknowns' inescapably shed the first 'unknown' [22:10]
asciilifeform i would like an asymmetric transform whose complexity were provably unknowable. that would be spiffy. [22:10]
mircea_popescu heh. no they don't. [22:10]
mircea_popescu what, you think strella is a directional weapon ? [22:10]
asciilifeform can't rule out that even 20 yrs ago hitler knew that factoring is np-complete. [22:11]
asciilifeform based on available evidence. [22:11]
mircea_popescu the less you can rule out, the easier it gets for me. [22:12]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 24945 @#64; 0.0007078 = 17.6561 BTC [+] {2} [22:12]
mircea_popescu and in other news, http://40.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lxsrj48uuz1r4hwowo1_1280.jpg [22:13]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1PqZQJS ) [22:13]
asciilifeform how does it help anybody (other than hitler), including mircea_popescu, when hitler knows for certain, but everybody else is left to mathematicize fruitlessly (or, worse, work on faith) [22:13]
mircea_popescu your notion that hitler's ahead of the curve is spurious. [22:13]
asciilifeform why? [22:13]
mircea_popescu never, inb the entire history of reichs, was this the case. not once. [22:13]
asciilifeform recall who had rsa transform in 1976 ? [22:13]
asciilifeform or what, was disinfo ? [22:14]
mircea_popescu who ? [22:14]
* asciilifeform did not watch mr cocks discover it, so cannot say that it is a fact [22:14]
asciilifeform clifford cocks. [22:15]
mircea_popescu define "had". [22:15]
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mircea_popescu that dumbfuck rice "had" the airplane thing, too. [22:15]
asciilifeform no one 'had' in the modern sense until the cheap micro, sure. [22:15]
mircea_popescu pfff. [22:16]
asciilifeform but for cryptoanalyst, it is actually not useless to 'have' a paper-and-pen unimplementable algo [22:16]
mircea_popescu no. that wasn't their problem. [22:16]
asciilifeform can begin to think of attack, without ever actually modularly exponentiating anything [22:16]
mircea_popescu pfff #2. [22:16]
asciilifeform ?#1, ?#2 ? [22:17]
mircea_popescu hm ? [22:17]
asciilifeform what am i missing [22:17]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 209273 @#64; 0.00066783 = 139.7588 BTC [-] {8} [22:18]
asciilifeform either the legend of mr cocks is disinfo (i cannot rule this out at all) or usg had rsa before rivest, shamir, adelman. [22:18]
mircea_popescu i dunno dood. but once i figure it out i'll make the computer do what you mean. [22:18]
asciilifeform l0l [22:18]
mircea_popescu it "had" it. suppose there's madonna burried in your back yard [22:19]
mircea_popescu do you "Have" her ? [22:19]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 75627 @#64; 0.00065566 = 49.5856 BTC [-] {5} [22:19]
asciilifeform so no 'have' until firing on the battlefield ? [22:19]
mircea_popescu no. not have until have. [22:20]
mircea_popescu you "have" a horse. your dad bought youy it, except you may not ride it. what "have" ? [22:20]
mircea_popescu only some may have. government's not on the list. [22:20]
asciilifeform what would a counterexample to hypothesis http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=22-08-2015#1247994 look like ? [22:20]
assbot Logged on 22-08-2015 01:11:30; mircea_popescu: never, inb the entire history of reichs, was this the case. not once. [22:20]
phf so for the curious it doesn't look like 1.4.19 uses the two-byte hash value anyway. it reads it from disk, it populates it during sign and it can write it to disk, but no actual logic done using it [22:21]
phf *anywhere rather [22:21]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform something like "fructidor" [22:21]
phf (grep for digest_start) [22:21]
mircea_popescu phf yeah it's not actually as bad as it seemed on the basis of the snippet. still crud. [22:22]
asciilifeform phf: am i catastrophically missing something, (i didn't sleep much), or is this an even greater clusterfuck than if the 16bit were used ?!! [22:22]
mircea_popescu "let's do things to things for reasonds" [22:22]
asciilifeform it would mean that an existential signature forgery is trivial [22:22]
* asciilifeform prepares vivisection table [22:23]
phf asciilifeform: i'm failing to see the clusterfuck part [22:25]
phf i'm mostly curious if my guess about the purpose of the field was correct, but no insight from gpg [22:25]
phf logic looks like "read a bunch of things", "hash data", "put relevant bits into an in memory copy of the header", "hash in memory copy", "compare" [22:26]
asciilifeform it isn't 'compare' though [22:26]
phf asciilifeform: ah, you caught my hand wave :> [22:27]
asciilifeform 'well, one could devise methods for signing long messages that don't involve hashing, such as splitting up the message into small segments, tie each segment together with an identifier and a segment sequence number, and sign each individually. However, hashing works so much easier that no one ever considers an alternative.' << quoted verbatim from shit-overflow [22:27]
asciilifeform for the record. [22:27]
asciilifeform because lulzy. [22:27]
mircea_popescu wtf is that [22:27]
mircea_popescu since when hash input size is a concern [22:28]
asciilifeform in the rfc? [22:28]
asciilifeform to know how many bytes to read ? [22:28]
mircea_popescu no in the quote., [22:29]
asciilifeform he says 'long messages' on account of the impossibility of signing an integer longer than the public modulus [22:30]
asciilifeform using naked rsa. [22:30]
asciilifeform hence how hash came to be used in asymmetric signing [22:30]
asciilifeform and someone asked, 'but do we ~have~ to rely on hash' [22:30]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20400 @#64; 0.00070727 = 14.4283 BTC [+] [22:30]
asciilifeform and quoted interlocutor answered, 'no but stfu' [22:31]
mircea_popescu aok [22:32]
asciilifeform (but, how many folks would accept signatures that are 2x the length of the payload !) [22:32]
mircea_popescu actually. is there a 4096 bit hash function of any merit ? [22:33]
asciilifeform not as such. [22:33]
mircea_popescu make the damned thing match throughout. bapg = 4096 rsa, 4096 hash, etc. [22:33]
asciilifeform gotta leave some room for 'pad' [22:34]
mircea_popescu why ? [22:34]
asciilifeform (that is, permutation of the item to be signed) [22:34]
mircea_popescu hash is also the pad [22:34]
asciilifeform 'pad' is a bit of a misnomer in the parlance [22:34]
* joecool has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) [22:34]
asciilifeform !s rsa padding [22:34]
assbot 1 results for 'rsa padding' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=rsa+padding [22:34]
mircea_popescu no. rsa encryption = a succession of individually encrypted blocks. [22:36]
asciilifeform easily. [22:36]
mircea_popescu so it's not actually a concern [22:36]
mircea_popescu i wasn't at any point contemplating "rsa encryption = rsa run once over the message herp" [22:37]
mircea_popescu (and i maintain that in all context hybrid encryption is retarde dwithout exception. either fuck or get off the woman.) [22:37]
asciilifeform the purpose of 'padding' is to a) never have transform of known input deterministically give same output b) prevent arbitrarily flipped bits of ciphertext from yielding a valid (attempt to eat) message [22:38]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 2100 @#64; 0.00070787 = 1.4865 BTC [+] [22:38]
mircea_popescu yes. but none of these actually requires a hybrid scheme [22:39]
asciilifeform 'course not. [22:39]
asciilifeform just pointing out that you can't stuff n bits of payload into signature (or encipherment) with modulus length n. [22:39]
asciilifeform in practice, on account of a+b - fewer. [22:40]
asciilifeform (depending on what method of 'padding' - fucking hate this name! - is used) [22:40]
mircea_popescu and if youy for some incomprehensible reason MUST use a hybrid scheme, use the following : 1. generate random 4096 hash ; 2. cut your message up into N chunks of size up to 2048 ; 3. xor the chunks with 1; encrypt each chunk via rsa [22:40]
asciilifeform btw i am still trying to figure out why the existing 'padding' algos are so asininely complex [22:40]
asciilifeform then again, i'm not winning any prizes for knowing the answer to this. [22:41]
mircea_popescu quite. [22:41]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 35050 @#64; 0.00070835 = 24.8277 BTC [+] {2} [22:42]
* asciilifeform has been living with all of this, in today's thread, and more, while working on the inevitable ada bignumtron and rsatron. [22:43]
asciilifeform for use in a certain little device, yes. [22:43]
asciilifeform but does ~everything~ have to break into dust in my hands. [22:44]
asciilifeform srsly, fucking 'diff'. [22:44]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12132 @#64; 0.0007095 = 8.6077 BTC [+] {2} [22:44]
mircea_popescu ;;google "pentru ca esti o vita spastica si te uraste soarta" [22:45]
gribble No matches found. [22:45]
mircea_popescu pfff [22:45]
asciilifeform approximately. [22:46]
mircea_popescu https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TUhBH13qMM4 [22:46]
assbot RObotzi.S02.Ep22.Pornache - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1MDMR8r ) [22:46]
asciilifeform ;;later tell mod6 if you regenerate the 'orchestra' patches with new vdiff, i will sign'em. otherwise might have to wait a while [22:49]
gribble The operation succeeded. [22:49]
asciilifeform or hanbot, or mircea_popescu, et al [22:49]
asciilifeform at this point anybody can turn the handle [22:49]
phf (so it's not compare. they run a digest on payload while reading (or separately if detached), then they run digest on own reconstruction of header, then they finalize the digest and do sig verification of provided signature against the digest that they calculated) [22:50]
asciilifeform aha [22:50]
mircea_popescu it could be more complicated. [22:51]
phf incidentally after bitcoind gnupg source is pleasure to read [22:51]
asciilifeform phf: naturally, no cppism [22:52]
mircea_popescu or graffiti in foreign languages [22:52]
asciilifeform though i would disagree re: 'pleasure' [22:52]
asciilifeform just a duller pain [22:52]
asciilifeform reading c is more like being beaten with telephone books, vs cpp's bicycle chains [22:52]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 18800 @#64; 0.00070727 = 13.2967 BTC [-] [22:54]
phf one can buy "PGP Source Code and Internals." from amazon for $289 [22:54]
asciilifeform phf: zimmerman ? [22:54]
asciilifeform realize that this has nothing at all to do with modern gpg... [22:54]
phf yes, trying to see what he was doing with signatures there [22:54]
phf oh? pre-standard? [22:55]
asciilifeform this item was published by mit press to get around clinton's export laws [22:55]
phf aah [22:55]
asciilifeform and famously subject of a court proceeding [22:55]
phf also '95 vs '98 [22:55]
asciilifeform the book came with instructions re: how to ocr the thing back, and build! [22:56]
asciilifeform i thought this was well-known. [22:56]
asciilifeform http://www.ka9q.net/export/zimm.html << on the subject. [22:56]
assbot Zimmermann declaration ... ( http://bit.ly/1PESq6m ) [22:56]
* tripleslash has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) [22:57]
asciilifeform http://www.openresource.com/news/P/PGPSCI.shtml << notice how mit's site no longer contains it. [22:57]
assbot PGP Source Code ... ... ( http://bit.ly/1PEStiy ) [22:57]
phf of course [22:57]
phf surprisingly hard to get a copy [22:58]
asciilifeform it is not a secret, i think, that i am working on a somewhat similar book. [22:59]
asciilifeform two, in fact. [22:59]
phf oh? i missed that, i think that's before i started to read closely [22:59]
* asciilifeform off for a spell, to play with pet. [23:00]
phf i actually forgot that you were working on gnupg source for cardano [23:00]
phf hah http://www.ozon.ru/context/detail/id/5964408/ [23:01]
* joecool (~joecool@#64;no-sources/joecool) has joined #bitcoin-assets [23:14]
thestringpuller dunno if asciilifeform is talking about human female, or some random puppy he has. [23:16]
* King_Rex has quit (Remote host closed the connection) [23:17]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 42108 @#64; 0.00069951 = 29.455 BTC [-] {3} [23:34]
* asciilifeform only has 1 pet [23:48]
mod6 asciilifeform: ... if you regenerate the 'orchestra' patches with new vdiff, i will sign'em. otherwise might have to wait a while << hey, no problem. I'll start in on this sometime tomorrow probably. [23:58]
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