Forum logs for 11 Jan 2015

Sunday, 24 November, Year 11 d.Tr. | Author: Mircea Popescu
thestringpuller !up hermeto [00:02]
* assbot gives voice to hermeto [00:02]
mircea_popescu "MP def lost the intellectual battle by the brag of wealth as his last effort to win." [00:03]
mircea_popescu check out the many ways you can lose "intellectual battles" lol. [00:03]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5850 @ 0.00066308 = 3.879 BTC [-] [00:04]
thestringpuller this has nothing to do with the block size anymore does it? [00:09]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: 'at no point was the FSF an important force on the field.' << though history isn't an experimental science, we are getting a kind of picture of what we may have ended up with much sooner, without rms [00:09]
thestringpuller This is about Gavin proving he can hijack the Bitcoin network to whomever his handler may be. [00:09]
asciilifeform apple's bsd fork is the likely model [00:09]
mircea_popescu thestringpuller more like, proving that he can STILL do it. [00:10]
asciilifeform 'embrace&extinguish' [00:10]
thestringpuller obilteration of legacy... [00:10]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform but listen. just because the tiny nation of romania made the famine at leningrad possible doth not mean romania was an IMPORTANT player in ww2. [00:11]
mircea_popescu and an argument that hitler marginalized antonescu is at best bizarre. [00:11]
asciilifeform see also http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=07-01-2015#967929 [00:11]
assbot Logged on 07-01-2015 04:41:46; asciilifeform: naggum had a piece where he confessed to thinking of 'open source' as a weapon, purpose-built for the destruction of a particular evil (microshit) [00:11]
mircea_popescu yeah, tellingly no mention of gates makes into morozov's thinking. [00:11]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: finland better example [00:11]
mircea_popescu i guess "important" is not the best word, as im discussing size-importance. [00:12]
mircea_popescu not sure how'd that be said better. [00:12]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 18794 @ 0.00067437 = 12.6741 BTC [+] {2} [00:14]
asciilifeform 'Stallman complained that anything of good quality remains...' << rms is a counterweight. [00:17]
asciilifeform he has some rather peculiar and sometimes contradictory logic behind the -why- of what he does, but so did semmelweis. [00:18]
asciilifeform 'gpl' is a weapon. yes, bullet makes bloody holes in things - that's what it was made for. yes, bullet is dumb and goes in whatever direction for no really logical reasons it can explain. big surprise. [00:20]
thestringpuller RMS isn't married is he. [00:21]
asciilifeform not afaik [00:21]
thestringpuller no wonder his eccentricities go unchecked. [00:22]
asciilifeform they go unchecked because he has independent income. [00:22]
thestringpuller an no she-devil at home to suck his life force away [00:23]
thestringpuller good for him tho [00:23]
asciilifeform thestringpuller: these are optional [00:23]
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* mircea_popescu gives voice to BlueMatt [00:47]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform yes, all that's true. [00:48]
mircea_popescu neither of it enacts rms as some sort of Jesus unless im missing a lot ? [00:48]
asciilifeform no jesusen needed [00:51]
mircea_popescu right. [00:52]
mircea_popescu i don't propose that rms "shouldn't have" or that fsf shouldn't have been or anything of the sort. but really, the pretense that at some point the situation seriously was, red pill vs blue pill and o'reilly of all people tricked everyone into getting the wrong pill... [00:53]
mircea_popescu that's rank nonsense, who ever heard of it. [00:53]
asciilifeform see the semmelweis example. it doesn't much matter that he advocated 'wash hands' because the cockroaches and spiders in his head told him to, rather than some better reason. [00:54]
mircea_popescu the situation was microsoft or go hang yourself, to which a lot of people who didn't particularly wish to hang themselves reacted as best they could, [00:54]
mircea_popescu and in the end it killed ms, but then... google was born, and apple was reborn, and here we are. [00:54]
asciilifeform the thing rms was trying to kill in, say, 'right to read', is still alive and well. [00:54]
mircea_popescu right. [00:54]
mircea_popescu and this for structural reasons, really. [00:55]
asciilifeform arguably microshit is reborn in these other devils, much as ibm was reborn in it [00:55]
mircea_popescu if i write something on my slavew's thigh it's none of your damned business wtf. [00:55]
asciilifeform usg dept. of computing. [00:55]
ben_vulpes thestringpuller: http://qntra.net/2015/01/the-hard-fork-missile-crisis/ << wd [00:55]
assbot The Hard Fork Missile Crisis | Qntra.net ... ( http://bit.ly/1w8dGFC ) [00:55]
asciilifeform https://www.gnu.org/philosophy/right-to-read.html [00:55]
assbot The Right to Read [00:55]
asciilifeform ^ about something rather else [00:55]
mircea_popescu is it ? [00:56]
ben_vulpes also hey qntra would you drop gravatar for the "here's my domain, please serve domain/avatar.png" icon model? [00:56]
mircea_popescu holy shit it lives [00:56]
asciilifeform it's about the inevitable war of the state and its shitminions vs. the concept of the general-purpose computer. [00:56]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform in one aspect. now make an ethical distinction / moral rule (really nfi why they keep derping about ethics, its all a moral consideration) that resolves that while preserving my slave's thigh. [00:57]
* asciilifeform is somewhat confused [00:57]
asciilifeform slave's thigh ? [00:58]
mircea_popescu yes. that if i write something on my slave's thigh, it's none of your damned business. [00:58]
mircea_popescu state the rms "ethical consideration" w/e it is. "nobody may forbid anyone's access to written strings" ? [00:59]
asciilifeform rms was speaking of the right to do as you will with things that are physically yours, without gestapo suddenly breaking down the door and demanding to see if you've multiplied unauthorized numbers [00:59]
mircea_popescu but this is a summary instead of the thing. [01:00]
* asciilifeform doesn't go in for the whole 'rights' paradigm and isn't terribly fond of proceeding in that framework [01:00]
mircea_popescu how's this rule sound ? [01:00]
mircea_popescu well he gotta have something. you can't start a "social movement" out of vague descriptions of desired outcomes [01:00]
mircea_popescu there must be some sort of code somewhere. [01:00]
asciilifeform rms might say, 'i'll leave you with your slave, you leave me with my computer' [01:01]
mircea_popescu what if it's my computer ? [01:01]
asciilifeform somethinglikethat [01:01]
asciilifeform yours? [01:01]
asciilifeform as in, lent to him ? [01:01]
mircea_popescu suppose i make computers, and decide to not sell them. what now ? [01:01]
mircea_popescu yes, as in lent to him. [01:01]
asciilifeform then presumably he made some oath in return ? [01:01]
mircea_popescu "but that's bad" [01:02]
mircea_popescu it really doesn't amount to much, if you examine it. [01:02]
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asciilifeform to follow the analogy, rms was offered computer that came with 'strings' - promise not to xxx, etc. went off to make own. [01:02]
mircea_popescu your " without gestapo suddenly breaking down the door and demanding to see if you've multiplied unauthorized numbers" is exactly equivalent i suspect to what i call who are you again ? fuck off, I don't give a shit" sort of approach to third parties of any man owning a computer [01:03]
mircea_popescu but these aren't a moral philosophy. [01:03]
mircea_popescu pretending the contrary is fine, if one so prefers, but it's still mere pretense. [01:03]
asciilifeform i suspect that he spun the whole thing as 'moral philosophy' because if he had readily admitted that gpl was merely a successful hack against usg's 'laws', he would have been killed. [01:04]
mircea_popescu or so he feared, or so he cared. [01:04]
asciilifeform aha [01:04]
mircea_popescu anyway, for whatever reason, things still are what they are. [01:04]
asciilifeform whereas cultivating 'sainthood', lame as it is, appears to have worked - at least for preserving his skin. [01:04]
mircea_popescu not that i think fsf's bad or anything. merely observing that peanuts aren't aeroplanes does not imply a hatred of peanuts. [01:04]
mircea_popescu so let's go further in the fertile soil (hint hint) of female simile [01:05]
asciilifeform as mere aesthetic preference, i'd rather if folks were able to be honest with themselves and others re: their motivations. but i did not fight rms's war, cannot say 'he oughta have....' [01:05]
mircea_popescu if you get married, which is to say, BORROW a woman from her father, and swear an oath [01:06]
mircea_popescu may you have now anal sex ? provided you both agree to it ? [01:06]
mircea_popescu the traditional answer is no. [01:06]
mircea_popescu modernity soundly answered yes. [01:06]
mircea_popescu rms' ideas are a sort of "this is computing so elvis never happened". [01:06]
asciilifeform reminds of that mortmain thing [01:07]
mircea_popescu in a sense. [01:07]
* asciilifeform blew a good 3-4 hours reading about it [01:07]
mircea_popescu hehe not wasted time. [01:07]
mircea_popescu it [01:07]
mircea_popescu s perhaps the most informative avenue into the ACTUAL history of this sphere. [01:07]
mircea_popescu not re-narrated with a view to make contemporary institutions meaningful and appear sensible. [01:08]
mircea_popescu but actually, as it was, with a view to its own self coherence. [01:08]
asciilifeform in one sense, jurists have things easy re: mortmain; they at least have the option of going 'no more' [01:08]
mircea_popescu only recently. [01:08]
asciilifeform go and try reversing, e.g., design space shrinkage in engineering [01:08]
mircea_popescu as late as 1880 it was held that such option is not on the table [01:08]
asciilifeform aha because 'then may as well the breaking of the tablets, all bets off' [01:08]
mircea_popescu and ironically, it seems the old hands were right. it went to shit since then. [01:09]
mircea_popescu yep exactly. [01:09]
mircea_popescu "paper laws" are quite like paper money. [01:09]
asciilifeform sapper - errs once. [01:09]
asciilifeform re: rms: i vaguely recall that gpl was invented (conceptually) by his friend & associate, eben moglen [01:11]
asciilifeform a jurist [01:11]
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mircea_popescu here's a question, btw : what's better, to be running the proverbial taxi in new york ? or to be in a later generation, playing exactly the role of pocahontas to various ngos, "look at this nigger injun, how like our own kids he is, and how pretty in that dress!" ? [01:12]
asciilifeform who wrote, iirc, 'yes, i despise law; yet i practice it; must a doctor love disease?' [01:12]
mircea_popescu lol i recall that. [01:12]
asciilifeform pocahontas << is this the old russian prison quiz, 'fork in yer eye or once up yer arse ?' [01:13]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 21005 @ 0.00066187 = 13.9026 BTC [-] {2} [01:13]
mircea_popescu no, it's simply looking at the life of one evgheny morozov. for you see stan, little zenja was a country boy that got himself mixed up in the high stakes game of anglo propaganda and intenrational diplomacy! [01:15]
asciilifeform rot13 answ: gur cnffvat nafjre vf, nyjnlf, gb gnxr gur sbex. bhtug gb xabj gung gurer ner ab sbexf va gur cevfba. naq rira vs gurer jrer, sne orggre gb ybfr lbhe rlr guna gb or ybjrerq vagb crqrenfgl. [01:15]
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mircea_popescu http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evgeny_Morozov [01:16]
assbot Evgeny Morozov - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ... ( http://bit.ly/1w8f6Ad ) [01:16]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: i somehow lived life and avoided learning that the fellow who prints the (now mostly junk) books with the animal line drawings on the covers is a demented sv sc4mz0r; or that morozov existed at all [01:17]
asciilifeform although [01:17]
asciilifeform come to think of it, orlov may have mentioned him once [01:17]
mircea_popescu see how corrupting an influence assbot is ? [01:17]
asciilifeform identified as a u.s. state dept. muppet [01:17]
mircea_popescu what, they print army manuals too / [01:18]
mircea_popescu "an idiot's guide to cleanning your boots!" [01:19]
asciilifeform wat [01:19]
mircea_popescu i dunno, was asking. [01:19]
mircea_popescu / = ? [01:19]
asciilifeform there are several, afaik independent, lines of 'for idiots' works [01:19]
asciilifeform i actually own a copy of, i shit thee not, 'webtv for dummies' [01:20]
asciilifeform as a result of losing a bet in school [01:20]
mircea_popescu o wow, webtv [01:20]
mircea_popescu that was a bitcoin fork at some point too! [01:21]
mircea_popescu http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digerati [01:27]
mircea_popescu ajhahahaha [01:27]
assbot Digerati - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ... ( http://bit.ly/1y24LwW ) [01:27]
mircea_popescu check this out, the digested. [01:27]
mircea_popescu that's how he fucking confuses thiel and kelly. they're all digested, right ? same thing! [01:27]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform so i follow your link to gnu.org, top of the page ? a very wikipedia-ish request for donations. [01:29]
mircea_popescu sleeker than wikipedia's tho. the definitely web 1.0 look of gnu.org helps. [01:30]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: fsf begs for every coin, aye [01:34]
asciilifeform always has [01:34]
mircea_popescu obviously it will have to, it's a non profit. no issue with the substance. the form struck me tho. [01:34]
mircea_popescu is it that wikipedia has found the bewst way to do this ? or is it that once they did it everyone can follow in that wake ? [01:35]
asciilifeform 'digerati', as i understand, encompasses a set of peculiarly wealthy ('dotcom boom', normally, but often barnacled to this or that mega-corp success of some vaguely computerized sort 1980-2000) [01:35]
asciilifeform who imagine themselves 'lead thinkers' [01:35]
asciilifeform best example i know of, of this animal, is one jaron lanier [01:35]
asciilifeform truly grotesque specimen [01:36]
mircea_popescu never heard of him. [01:36]
asciilifeform strictly zoological interest [01:36]
asciilifeform strike that, entomological. [01:36]
mircea_popescu some musician or something ? [01:37]
asciilifeform not famous for music. but happened to purchase a number of rare instruments, iirc, to pluck at while sitting on golden toilet [01:38]
asciilifeform lanier, in particular, isn't a muppet, and even had a number of public good points (wrote at length re: the degeneracy of pediwikia, etc) - but, while reading his material, i continuously found myself asking 'why does this man have money' [01:44]
mircea_popescu it's not a crime is it ? [01:44]
asciilifeform not the having-money, but being part of that set, in my mind, is an indelible tarnish [01:44]
asciilifeform the california degenerates. [01:45]
mircea_popescu would you fuck a nazi ? [01:45]
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asciilifeform depends! [01:45]
mircea_popescu hehe. [01:45]
* asciilifeform has the utmost difficulty picturing a female nazi other than proverbial 'ilsa, she-wolf of auschwitz' [01:46]
mircea_popescu generally i think of the girl that poisoned her brood. [01:46]
asciilifeform mrs goebbels ? [01:46]
mircea_popescu kinda surprised there's not more art dedicated to her. i'm unaware of more remarkable women in the xxth century. [01:46]
mircea_popescu yes. [01:46]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: ever see film 'come and see' ('Иди и смотри') ? [01:48]
mircea_popescu nop [01:48]
mircea_popescu nice osunding name huh. [01:48]
mircea_popescu idi-i-smotri [01:48]
mircea_popescu "During WWII, a Belarusian boy is thrust into the atrocities of war, fighting with a hopelessly unequipped Soviet resistance movement against ruthless German forces. Witnessing scenes of abject terror and surviving horrifying situations, he loses his innocence and then his mind." [01:49]
mircea_popescu dude what do they have against bielorussians! it's always them getting fingers caught in doors. [01:49]
asciilifeform one memorable scene. germans waste a village, shown in glorious detail (complete with barns nailed shut, set alight, etc, etc). on their way out, get ambushed and mowed down. including their hot chick nurse, but she's not entirely dead. hero (boy) walks along and finds this. takes a look at the chick, who is bleeding and looking seductively at him. then he sees bandage pack on ground. decides to bandage broken stock of his rif [01:49]
asciilifeform le instead. [01:50]
asciilifeform (why he has rifle? no reason. just found it, while derping his way through the war, miraculously avoiding ending up sausage) [01:50]
mircea_popescu heh. [01:51]
BingoBoingo http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/worldviews/wp/2015/01/07/aggressive-nazi-bred-cows-caused-havoc-on-a-modern-farm/?Post+generic=%3Ftid%3Dsm_twitter_washingtonpost [01:58]
assbot The aggressive Nazi-bred cows that caused havoc on a modern farm - The Washington Post ... ( http://bit.ly/1KxvhSj ) [01:58]
mircea_popescu someone should take a yearling dromedary to a skating rink [02:01]
asciilifeform http://bit.ly/1xQEdwr << for the lazy, the scene described earlier [02:06]
assbot Иди и смотри 2 серия - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1Kxw85c ) [02:06]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 22000 @ 0.00065213 = 14.3469 BTC [-] [02:07]
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ben_vulpes hey mircea_popescu what's the going rate for a box of tampons in bsas? the "tampon shortage" is making the rounds on jezebe [02:24]
ben_vulpes jezebel* [02:24]
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cazalla ben_vulpes: also hey qntra would you drop gravatar for the "here's my domain, please serve domain/avatar.png" icon model? <<< done [02:30]
ben_vulpes speedy delivery eh [02:33]
ben_vulpes https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/blob/master/src/serialize.h#L90, https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/blob/master/src/primitives/transaction.h#L259<< "HAI CAN I JAMZ THESE MEFFUDS IN HERE GUISE" [02:35]
assbot bitcoin/serialize.h at master · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub ... ( http://bit.ly/1AD61nT ) [02:35]
assbot bitcoin/transaction.h at master · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub ... ( http://bit.ly/1AD603e ) [02:35]
ben_vulpes iff [02:37]
ben_vulpes berp nm [02:37]
asciilifeform what is notable re: this particular bit of cpp cruft? [02:41]
mircea_popescu ben_vulpes lol i dunno, 5 bux ? [02:41]
mircea_popescu hanbot hey, what's tampons cost ? inquiring male minds wish to know [02:41]
ben_vulpes mircea_popescu: yeah turns out some source mindlessly subbed "dollars" for "pesos" [02:42]
asciilifeform the unit cost of menstruettes is roughly same as cigarettes (afaik) [02:42]
mircea_popescu heh. [02:42]
mircea_popescu so what, ended up with 70 dollar tampons ? [02:42]
ben_vulpes in the game of retarded telephone that is the us link reposting scam masquerading as 'nooz' [02:42]
artifexd mircea_popescu: can you elaborate on "a pgp-signed document by the for key certifying the validity of the IPs public key with an expiration unixtimev in case the for field differs and a nickname"? [02:42]
asciilifeform 70 dollar tampon << pure win [02:42]
mircea_popescu artifexd i can. what specifically ? [02:42]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10150 @ 0.00064082 = 6.5043 BTC [-] {2} [02:43]
artifexd I don't understand what you mean [02:43]
artifexd All the words make sense but when you put them in that order... [02:43]
asciilifeform artifexd: may help to read a certain thread: [02:43]
asciilifeform !s ephemeral key [02:43]
assbot 13 results for 'ephemeral key' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=ephemeral+key [02:43]
ben_vulpes asciilifeform: consider it an otherwise unremarkable arrowhead from the dig [02:43]
mircea_popescu let A connect to B. let A pass a message to B in the format "A for X, sup". B must find in the hello message through which A connected to it a document where X signs A's privkey, [02:44]
ben_vulpes me i'm just fascinated that the savages can bang such arms together with basalt and obsidian [02:44]
asciilifeform artifexd: generally, one ought not to connect one's wot private key to an automated, net-live apparatus. hence you sign another key with it, and use that. [02:44]
mircea_popescu that document must include a unixtime indicating expiry. [02:44]
artifexd What is the format of said document? [02:44]
mircea_popescu your problme. [02:44]
asciilifeform artifexd: the signature itself will almost certainly start life as a gpg output. [02:45]
ben_vulpes artifexd: formal grammar! [02:45]
ben_vulpes ignore me [02:45]
mircea_popescu formally or merely, ben_vulpes ? [02:45]
asciilifeform ben_vulpes is volunteering to write a backus-naur grammar ? [02:46]
ben_vulpes 'twas an exhortation to make a bnf [02:46]
artifexd I am currently using pointers to exported key files instead of trying to shoehorn keys into config files. [02:46]
mircea_popescu baccus moar like it, amirite. [02:46]
ben_vulpes mircea_popescu knows my format :P [02:46]
mircea_popescu artifexd pointers, what kind ? [02:46]
artifexd filename [02:46]
mircea_popescu seems you're shoehorning the filesystem into it instead ? [02:46]
ben_vulpes asciilifeform: no sir my hands are full with cpp backports [02:46]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 21150 @ 0.00063831 = 13.5003 BTC [-] {2} [02:51]
mircea_popescu o look, somebody ddosed qntra earlier ? [02:51]
BingoBoingo How'd they do it this time? [02:52]
mats fun fact: the python stdlib had an enigma implementation til 2.4 [02:52]
asciilifeform l0l! [02:52]
asciilifeform goes great with 'telefunken' modem and other artifacts from alternate nazi universe [02:53]
mircea_popescu BingoBoingo i dunno, but it's a bw depletion rather than the prev ram/cpu/state depletion. doesn't seem to have done anything. [02:53]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform ynot van W inciudentally ? [02:54]
BingoBoingo Maybe just a compulsive reloader? Perhaps some derp was serving one of our pages in their iframe? [02:54]
mircea_popescu BingoBoingo unlikely, it peaked around 2gpbs or so [02:55]
BingoBoingo Ah [02:55]
asciilifeform van w ? [02:56]
mircea_popescu whatever algol did. waasomething. [02:56]
mircea_popescu van Wijngaarden, google informs us. [02:56]
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asciilifeform nah everybody knows nazi internet runs on konrad zuse's gizmo. [02:57]
mircea_popescu i always liked the "fuck you, they're strings, and concatenation is the only operation" approach. [02:57]
mircea_popescu so did knuth iirc. [02:57]
asciilifeform see also SNOBOL. [02:58]
asciilifeform (which i will always imagine as a 'snob cobol' no matter how many times told that 'snowball') [02:58]
artifexd mircea_popescu: A << in the logs caused http://trilema.com/2015/artifexd-a-better-ircd-rfc/#comment-111384 to get half eaten, so I reposted it without that line. Hence the double post. [02:59]
assbot [Artifexd] A better ircd [RFC] pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1AD9IKd ) [02:59]
mircea_popescu well... it [02:59]
mircea_popescu 's pearlier than perl... [02:59]
mircea_popescu artifexd waitwut? [02:59]
mircea_popescu ends in "mircea_popescu: sure". that seems right neh ? [03:00]
artifexd meh [03:00]
mircea_popescu oh nm i see what you mean [03:00]
* bitxone has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) [03:01]
artifexd Tip to future copy/pasters: Don't include << in the text or everything after it will get routed to /dev/null [03:01]
mircea_popescu yeah html hates < separators. but for some reason they seem the best way to convey the intent here [03:02]
mircea_popescu this , incidentally, is why computer standards are such a royal bitch. [03:02]
mircea_popescu "don't use <" "why not!" "fuck you!" "NO U!" [03:02]
asciilifeform in-band signalling is inevitably lame. [03:03]
asciilifeform recall jurov's turdatron. [03:04]
mircea_popescu and multi band maintenance is inevitably a hassle. [03:04]
asciilifeform not necessarily. a binary signed with pgp is example of out-of-band. [03:04]
mircea_popescu and not a hassle ? [03:04]
mircea_popescu "not for me" "fuck you!" "NO U!" [03:05]
asciilifeform http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-10-2014#901052 http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-10-2014#901055 [03:06]
assbot Logged on 29-10-2014 01:36:19; asciilifeform: because plain ascii is like naked people [03:06]
assbot Logged on 29-10-2014 01:36:30; asciilifeform: everything feels free to manipulate the hanging bits [03:06]
mircea_popescu ;;google nudism is the natural state [03:06]
gribble Naturism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: ; Natural state Synonyms, Natural state Antonyms | Thesaurus.com: ; Nudity - RationalWiki: [03:06]
mircea_popescu o shit, rationalwiki is on it ?! [03:06]
mircea_popescu hide the clitoral hoods, abscond the mounds, science is on the field! [03:07]
asciilifeform the yudkowsky cult is like 'borg' from 'star trek', digest and regurgitate everything. eventually they will annotate #b-a and claim that all of the interesting ideas belong to selves [03:08]
asciilifeform no one will notice except for thiel, who will sign another cheque [03:08]
asciilifeform which mr. y will spend on six concubines fresh in their crates. [03:09]
mircea_popescu by the way : pretty much every kitchen shop here has, along the pots and pans, kitchen aprons. [03:09]
mircea_popescu and inevitably one must represent a naked hot woman. [03:09]
mircea_popescu they';re so common i'm persuaded a good fraction of local women actually go about the house in those things. [03:10]
asciilifeform 'talmudic' cheat, naked without naked [03:10]
mircea_popescu http://blogs.browardpalmbeach.com/pulp/fake%20nudists.jpg << check it out, the little girl has a vulva even! [03:10]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1ADbtqO ) [03:10]
asciilifeform l0l! [03:11]
artifexd One more question: Any objection to adding a timestamp to the trust ratings in gossipd? [03:12]
mircea_popescu See also "Cunt Fatwa Hypnotic breast enlargement" [03:12]
mircea_popescu dude... this rational wiki thing is comedic! [03:12]
BingoBoingo http://www.washingtonian.com/blogs/bestbites/in-the-magazine/was-washingtonian-unethical-to-demote-the-inn-at-little-washington.php [03:13]
assbot Chef Patrick O'Connell Questions Washingtonian's Ethics for Demoting the Inn at Little Washington | In the Magazine | Washingtonian ... ( http://bit.ly/1ADbL10 ) [03:13]
mircea_popescu “All of us at The Inn at Little Washington have much to be grateful for as we enter the new year. The Inn remains the longest-tenured Forbes Five Star and AAA Five Diamond restaurant in America. We possess the highest Zagat rating (29, 29, 29) in the world. Once again, The Inn has received The Washington Post’s highest 4-star rating from restaurant reviewer Tom Sietsema. Most of us understand that, in today’s wor [03:16]
mircea_popescu ld, as print media struggles for survival, creating controversy sells magazines whether it’s ethical or not.” [03:16]
mircea_popescu aahaha [03:16]
mircea_popescu "we're bigger than you, stfu" [03:16]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 34300 @ 0.00062973 = 21.5997 BTC [-] {4} [03:16]
asciilifeform what was the matter, somebody spread rumour that their shitter wasn't chemically-pure gold but engineering-grade ? [03:17]
mircea_popescu i dunno, something about oversalted leberwurst. [03:17]
asciilifeform highest 4-star rating from restaurant reviewer << are there whorehouse reviewers? if not, why not ? [03:19]
mircea_popescu there are, yes. [03:19]
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BingoBoingo i dunno, something about oversalted leberwurst. << Also the shift from a menu one can get full eating to some sort of "trendy" tasting menu based on appetizers. [03:21]
mircea_popescu yeah you're probably right. [03:22]
BingoBoingo Reviewer wants to get full on their per diem [03:22]
mircea_popescu anyone saw "le grand restaurant" ? de funes, he orders... a radish. [03:22]
BingoBoingo Restaurant wants to milk every seat for max profit. [03:22]
* asciilifeform vaguely recalls an article, last year, re: a u.s. restaurant for moneyed fools that served lion, tiger, etc. - which went under supposedly on account of a review site claiming it was open on weekends when in fact not [03:23]
mircea_popescu who'dwant to eat cat ?! [03:25]
asciilifeform a) chinese b) idiots c) who even knows what species they actually cooked [03:25]
mircea_popescu incidentally, anyone saw i vitelloni ? [03:26]
mircea_popescu great fellini film, esp for closing scene. [03:26]
* asciilifeform has wondered why carnivorous sea life is perfectly edible, while land animals, not so much [03:27]
mircea_popescu what's your definition of carnivorous sea life / [03:28]
asciilifeform fish eating fish [03:28]
asciilifeform etc [03:28]
mircea_popescu afaik no sea creature eats venison [03:28]
mircea_popescu well... [03:28]
asciilifeform lol [03:28]
asciilifeform the standard hypothesis for 'why carnivores aren't good for the table' is bioaccumulation [03:28]
mircea_popescu of plant poison [03:29]
asciilifeform which is just as much of a fact in the sea as on land [03:29]
mircea_popescu (really, all plants are pretty much poison standing) [03:29]
asciilifeform aha [03:29]
mircea_popescu no, it's not, because not same poisons., [03:29]
asciilifeform sea plant life less poisonous? that would do it [03:29]
mircea_popescu not less. more, but differently. [03:29]
* asciilifeform recalls pathologically extreme case of this, 'shellfish toxin' [03:30]
mircea_popescu bioaccumulation (heavy metals, etc) is much more a concern for fish eating than otherwise. [03:30]
mircea_popescu however, the meat doesn't TASTE bad. [03:30]
mircea_popescu taste being, of course, an evolutionary mechanism. [03:30]
asciilifeform lead, famously, supposedly tastes great. [03:31]
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mircea_popescu http://www.ab.ust.hk/hseo/tips/ch/ch005.htm [03:33]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1ADeMON ) [03:33]
mircea_popescu HF is sickly sweet too. [03:33]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=22-08-2014#804607 [03:35]
assbot Logged on 22-08-2014 02:36:18; asciilifeform: 'The smell of diborane is known to a few experimenters, but they cannot tell us what it is.' [03:35]
mircea_popescu lol [03:35]
mircea_popescu it's not THAT bad is it ? [03:37]
asciilifeform pediwik claims 'sickly sweet smell' [03:39]
asciilifeform wonder if 'sweet' is the default for own-meat-dissolving taste. [03:39]
mircea_popescu hm, it is often reported... seems poisons are either bitter or sweet. rarely you hear "salty" [03:41]
asciilifeform 'best' poison - colourless, tasteless [03:43]
asciilifeform (has anyone, incidentally, described the taste of Po-84 ?) [03:44]
BingoBoingo sweet is probably common in poisons because of the large class of poisons that are almost biologically useful... [03:44]
mircea_popescu BingoBoingo might also be because of particular interference with gustative nerve arrangmenets - many are neurotoxins [03:46]
BingoBoingo Of course, and many of those are almost sugars. [03:47]
mircea_popescu yeah. [03:49]
mircea_popescu diboron's almost ethanol huh :D [03:49]
BingoBoingo Yeah. Also there any number of poisonous alcohols more similar to various sugars than ethanol. [03:52]
mats http://user.informatik.uni-goettingen.de/~fyamagu/pdfs/2014-oakland.pdf [03:53]
assbot 404 Not Found ... ( http://bit.ly/1ADhy6M ) [03:53]
mircea_popescu "MP is such a pompous prick. I hope he chokes on his pansy lemonade flavored pop sickle stick." [04:00]
mircea_popescu bwahaha [04:00]
mircea_popescu isn't it fascinating how deeply i bothar these ppls ? [04:00]
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* mircea_popescu gives voice to gabriel_laddel [04:02]
gabriel_laddel I've shown several people in Silly Con valley the rabits article. Fear flashes through their eyes and they hand the laptop back without reading it all the way through. [04:08]
gabriel_laddel I think, all of the sudden they understand on some level that this era of prosperous morons is coming to a close. [04:09]
mircea_popescu lol interesting. [04:10]
mircea_popescu i guess at some point it'll come to pass that someone makes a tumblr, TFWT. [04:11]
mircea_popescu Their Face When Trilema [04:11]
mircea_popescu same principle, give laptop over but wiht camera on. [04:11]
gabriel_laddel lol. twould be more entertaining than all of the bezzle 'media' output circa 2014 [04:12]
mircea_popescu i guess it'd depend for whom [04:12]
mircea_popescu but i suspect it'd amuse me [04:12]
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undata hehehe TFWT [04:46]
undata due to the random article upon loading the homepage I am careful where I pull up trilema [04:46]
undata could be tits [04:46]
BingoBoingo Or Buttcoin, or fried chicken [04:48]
mircea_popescu gabriel_laddel wait, wasn't the rabbit article in romanian ? what're they to read ?! [04:50]
gabriel_laddel mircea_popescu: this is how I know they've not read it. I tell them it is Romanian and pull up google translate in another tab, show them the keybinding to switch tabs. [04:53]
gabriel_laddel E.G., one fellow sees pictures - hands back. [04:53]
gabriel_laddel some of the luzly ones read... re-read... re-read and eventually ask "Does he hate women or...?" (Not rabbits article) [04:55]
gabriel_laddel people fucking flip over slaves licking up their own vomit. [04:56]
BingoBoingo How else did Rome handle the vomit problem? [04:58]
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gabriel_laddel Har, remembering: Girl tells me she wants to crowdfund art. I link to trilema.com/what-is-art? She never responds. [04:59]
gabriel_laddel Etherum guy tells me that he wants a "Holarchy" instead of an explicit hierarchy cause trilema articles are scary. [05:00]
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gabriel_laddel Me kicked out of place I'm staying - being called "the next hitler" [05:01]
gabriel_laddel Me: "so what do you think of MPEX"? He: "What they do is illegal!! You can't take money from investors in the united states without explicit approval of USG!" [05:06]
gabriel_laddel "but bitcoin isn't money yet?" [05:06]
gabriel_laddel etc. [05:06]
BingoBoingo Money isn't Bitcoin Yet [05:07]
mircea_popescu lol [05:13]
* mircea_popescu is starting to understand why people pay for credit [05:14]
mircea_popescu s [05:14]
mircea_popescu btw, the vomit thing actually happened. girl had to eat catfood, out of bowl, no hands. long hair, one hair ended up in there, she had to eat it, it made her puke, she had to eat that, which she did. one strange half hour. [05:15]
BingoBoingo I honestly don't know what can scare Obama more than that. [05:16]
mircea_popescu why obama specfically ? [05:16]
mircea_popescu and what's holarchy lol [05:17]
BingoBoingo That dedication to task which he can't get from his acolytpes [05:17]
mircea_popescu ah. there's a fine reason to prefer women. if well trained... hard to match. [05:18]
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gabriel_laddel does anyone have recommendations for books on Russia's "roaring nineties"? [05:40]
BingoBoingo http://pipeline.corante.com/archives/2015/01/08/teixobactin_a_new_antibiotic_from_a_new_platform.php [05:43]
assbot Teixobactin: A New Antibiotic From a New Platform?. In the Pipeline: ... ( http://bit.ly/1w8q093 ) [05:43]
mircea_popescu BingoBoingo wow. [05:48]
BingoBoingo Who woulda thunk there's be worthwhile shit in stuff that doesn't culture as cheaply as possible? [05:48]
mircea_popescu as the guy aptly points out, it's never been a better time to be a biochemist. [05:50]
mircea_popescu i am telling you, wetware before any hard physics breakthrough. [05:50]
BingoBoingo I mean the past century has mostly been about refining tools while methods for using tools atrophied. A lot of potential in just... pointing those tools somethere else in an informed way instead of doing the microscope hammer thing. [05:52]
mircea_popescu mhm [05:53]
mircea_popescu As an aside, if you're outside the field, you might wonder why it's worth working so hard to find natural products when we have so many synthetic organic chemists in the world cranking out new compounds. One big reason is the ridiculous, insane hugeness of chemical space: the number of possible compounds at or under the molecular weight of teixobactin defies description, and I mean that in a completely literal sense. T [05:55]
mircea_popescu here are not enough resources on Earth, or in our entire solar system, to do enough organic synthesis to make any noticeable dent in that array. The idea of having compounds that bind to things like Lipid II is a good one, but they're going to have to be large compounds, and exploring that space is daunting. [05:55]
mircea_popescu heh. [05:55]
BingoBoingo It's basically like good number space for Keys. [05:56]
BingoBoingo And why the distributed protein folding stuff is mostly a noisemaking lottery machine. [05:57]
mircea_popescu looks like what, 1.2k - 1.3k molar mass ? [05:57]
BingoBoingo 1242 [05:58]
mircea_popescu say about 1k carbons, each with 4 valences. [05:58]
mircea_popescu wait srsly ?! [05:58]
mircea_popescu ahahahaha! god i win so much. [05:58]
BingoBoingo Yeah. Lighter than Vancomycin's 1449 as a further illustration of the sheer size of the space. [05:59]
mircea_popescu ;;calc 4 ** 1000 [06:00]
gribble Error: The answer exceeded 1.79769313486e+308 or so. [06:00]
mircea_popescu not bad. [06:00]
mircea_popescu very quick and dirty "all carbons" evaluation, but still, as a general hint [06:01]
BingoBoingo Right. Teixobactin prolly isn't going to get used much orally aside from GI tract stuff like c Diff... If it targets c Diff at all. [06:02]
mircea_popescu i think the main point is, you won't be able to take a shit in the forest without hitting one of these chips soon enough [06:07]
thestringpuller holy shit comatose is me [06:07]
BingoBoingo Yeah [06:07]
BingoBoingo Also hard to say when those chips are comming to toilets. [06:08]
mircea_popescu BingoBoingo apparently c diff is particularly vuln [06:08]
BingoBoingo Ah, didn't see that part. [06:08]
mircea_popescu b anthracis also. [06:09]
mircea_popescu check it out, anti-antrhax gel! [06:09]
BingoBoingo Hopefully it holds together well in DMSO [06:09]
mircea_popescu also tb and yes, mrsa. [06:10]
mircea_popescu and pneumonia. they found gold, what. [06:10]
BingoBoingo Pretty much just hooked one of those asteroids full of gold and smashed kansas with it. [06:12]
BingoBoingo And yet farmed morel mushrooms are a pipe dream [06:14]
ben_vulpes does anyone know what precisely the "private key" dumped by bitcoin is? is that the secret that can be used with EC_KEY_regenerate_key to regenerate a key? [06:16]
mircea_popescu apparently very quick clearance tho [06:16]
thestringpuller It's 0 C outside right now, but 28 c in b-a [06:17]
thestringpuller i kinda hate you right now MP [06:17]
mircea_popescu ben_vulpes for lulz : https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/650 [06:18]
assbot CKey::SetSecret BIGNUM leak · Issue #650 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub ... ( http://bit.ly/1wKf8zf ) [06:18]
mircea_popescu thestringpuller i tell you, air conditioning blowing on one's ballsac post coitally is one of those refined pleasures of civilisation [06:18]
mircea_popescu like hot baths. [06:18]
ben_vulpes saw it, was too tired to even muster a chuckle [06:18]
mircea_popescu but otherwise yes, it should be the priv key. [06:19]
mircea_popescu you work it to get the pubkey and then the address. [06:19]
mircea_popescu https://bitcointa.lk/threads/ecdsa-in-python.24166/ also instructive, fro mthe days before btctalk became tardstalk. [06:21]
assbot ECDSA in python | Bitcointa.lk ... ( http://bit.ly/1wKfB4G ) [06:21]
ben_vulpes is there a distinction between "the priv key" vs the "secret" used to regenerate a key? [06:22]
punkman ben_vulpes: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/blob/v0.5.3/src/key.h#L160 [06:23]
assbot bitcoin/key.h at v0.5.3 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub ... ( http://bit.ly/1wKfMwO ) [06:23]
mircea_popescu he has it [06:23]
ben_vulpes https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/blob/v0.5.3/src/key.h#L214 << thanks, punkman [06:24]
assbot bitcoin/key.h at v0.5.3 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub ... ( http://bit.ly/1wKg1b7 ) [06:24]
ben_vulpes *sigh* [06:25]
ben_vulpes how did i not see this until now [06:25]
punkman this c++ is hard to read [06:26]
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punkman anyone looked into that cbitcoin thing? http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=12-02-2014#497342 [06:28]
assbot Logged on 12-02-2014 01:35:50; jurov: prolly i confused it with this: https://github.com/MatthewLM/cbitcoin/ [06:28]
thestringpuller punkman: that's Boost C++ for you. Dunno why Satoshi used it... [06:28]
punkman oh even has a website http://cbitcoin.com/ [06:29]
assbot An Open-Source Bitcoin Library in C [06:29]
thestringpuller it is much easier to read [06:29]
mircea_popescu punkman ancient bitcoin-in-c thing i thought was abandoned cca 2012 ? [06:33]
BingoBoingo http://www.gomerblog.com/2015/01/ativan/ [06:33]
assbot The Pen Is Mightier Than the Sword, But This Ativan Tho | GomerBlog ... ( http://bit.ly/1AKbJH6 ) [06:33]
punkman mircea_popescu: seems recently updated [06:33]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 27900 @ 0.00061546 = 17.1713 BTC [-] {5} [06:33]
mircea_popescu from what i recasll the guy was strugling with memory leaks and other such joyspots. [06:34]
mircea_popescu wasn't at any point ready, looking for help. [06:34]
ben_vulpes !up Vexual [06:34]
* assbot gives voice to Vexual [06:34]
ben_vulpes http://vimeo.com/114761496 << repost? [06:36]
assbot The Cool Kids love Erlang - Gustav Simonsson, Henning Diedrich - Berlin Erlang Factory Lite on Vimeo ... ( http://bit.ly/1wKhG0x ) [06:36]
Vexual really? [06:36]
Vexual who? [06:36]
ben_vulpes couldn't be, it's only three weeks old [06:36]
ben_vulpes and Vexual found it [06:37]
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* gabriel_laddel (~user@unaffiliated/gabriel-laddel/x-9909917) has joined #bitcoin-assets [06:48]
BingoBoingo http://marc.info/?l=openbsd-announce&m=142073477418451&w=2 [06:50]
assbot 'OpenNTPD 5.7p1 Released' - MARC ... ( http://bit.ly/1AKf5d6 ) [06:50]
Vexual yeah boii [06:50]
Vexual also on oil... [06:51]
Vexual ssay you're an opec produced making bank [06:51]
BingoBoingo This Cook fellow finding OpenBSD is one of the best things to happen to linux in a decade. [06:52]
Vexual your secondary business is the world economy, and theres no exceptions [06:58]
Vexual sure as shit cheap oil aint about making exactly 11 texases fit into australia, so whats left over? [06:59]
* assbot removes voice from Vexual [07:05]
BingoBoingo !up Vexual [07:08]
* assbot gives voice to Vexual [07:08]
Vexual https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4tnbcuzQB30 >prolly a repost [07:10]
* Now talking on #bitcoin-assets [13:56]
* Topic for #bitcoin-assets is: http://bitcoin-assets.com || http://log.bitcoin-assets.com || http://bash.bitcoin-assets.com || http://blogs.bitcoin-assets.com [13:56]
* Topic for #bitcoin-assets set by kakobrekla!~kako@unaffiliated/kakobrekla at Wed Mar 5 16:58:12 2014 [13:56]
-assbot- Welcome to #bitcoin-assets. To get voice (ie, to be able to speak), first identify with gribble and then send "!up" to assbot in a private message. If you do not have a WoT account, try politely asking one of the voiced people for a temporary pass. [13:57]
mircea_popescu cazalla that thread's a fine example of why bitcoin "needs to be more accessible". [14:02]
* #bitcoin-assets :Cannot send to channel [14:02]
chanserv OP #bitcoin-assets [14:02]
* ChanServ gives channel operator status to mircea_popescu [14:02]
mircea_popescu cazalla that thread's a fine example of why bitcoin "needs to be more accessible". so that more people who have no business running a computer can tell their friends about how bad bitcoin is. [14:03]
mircea_popescu "Imagine if we poured 1.7 trillion dollars a year into ending aging instead of satiating Tea Party fucks need to bomb brown people?" and stuff. [14:03]
mircea_popescu pretty good. [14:03]
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mircea_popescu http://travisgoodspeed.blogspot.com.ar/2013/07/hillbilly-tracking-of-low-earth-orbit.html << ha cool shit! [14:06]
assbot Travis Goodspeed's Blog: Hillbilly Tracking of Low Earth Orbit Satellites ... ( http://bit.ly/17x9aMz ) [14:06]
* assbot gives voice to decimation [14:06]
decimation that amodem project is interesting [14:08]
punkman decimation, there's also an electrum plugin for it [14:09]
decimation in theory it could be used on shortwave, if you had the hardware for it [14:09]
decimation 32 kHz seems excessively wide though [14:09]
punkman probably need to go lower if not using cable [14:11]
mircea_popescu midnightmagic: what is a shadowban? << graham came up with this brilliant "let's ban users but not tell them" on the theory that users are idiots and won't notice anyway. [14:12]
mircea_popescu unsurprisingly, this never worked before reddit, but it works splendidly there. [14:12]
punkman decimation: see also https://github.com/kamalmostafa/minimodem/ [14:12]
* gribble has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) [14:12]
assbot kamalmostafa/minimodem · GitHub ... ( http://bit.ly/17x9Zou ) [14:12]
mircea_popescu probably has to do with how, to quote altman, "It’s interesting to note that during my very brief tenure, reddit added more users than Hacker News has in total." [14:13]
fluffypony it's so that the spammers don't realise they're banned [14:15]
mircea_popescu because nobody has a watcher ip ? [14:16]
decimation minimodem is a much more robust waveform, but would transfer more slowly [14:17]
decimation it ought to work over crap audio channels though [14:17]
mircea_popescu decimation i don't like it, because : as a way to transfer data between the two computers where there's a cable, it's stupid. even serial protocol is better, but we have tcp etc. as an airgapped solution is stupid, because sound. [14:19]
mircea_popescu the correct airgap solution is optics. [14:19]
mircea_popescu anyway, i imagine it's just some "play around with computor" thing, not seriously proposed as a solution to anything [14:19]
decimation agreed. [14:19]
decimation although I would point out that you could use this without cables, but through an air interface [14:20]
kakobrekla qr guns are too limited. [14:20]
mircea_popescu sound is too easy to overhear. [14:20]
* kakobrekla not for sound. [14:20]
mircea_popescu qr guns easier to shield ; you can use an optoelement w/e it's called, if you wish. [14:20]
decimation the 'adult' solution is a one-way fiber link [14:20]
mircea_popescu hack them out of optic mice or w/e. [14:21]
mircea_popescu unrelatedly, /me is still reeling over a shocking ad hoc test where he discovered that a widespread inability to distinguish internet and web does not apparent;y prevent young'uns from commenting on... [14:23]
mircea_popescu well it's not clear what, "either" is improper. "commenting on nothing while misrepresenting themselves as talking about one or the other." [14:23]
* kakobrekla has a serial cable with a buffer with visual confirmation of the data and it does not need to be plugged to both computers at same time [14:24]
decimation mircea_popescu: what was your 'ad hoc test'? [14:24]
mircea_popescu i call it the moruzov discovery. check it out yourself, see what % of authors using both terms in the same text display an awareness of their meaning. [14:24]
mircea_popescu decimation asked a buncha "hackers" [14:24]
mircea_popescu pop quiz lol. [14:24]
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* ChanServ gives voice to gribble [14:25]
decimation are we chatting on the web now? [14:25]
mircea_popescu such q's, right. [14:25]
decimation kakobrekla: yeah, serial works too, and one can clip out the return path if desired [14:27]
decimation plus lots of cheap gear exists to inspect serial connections [14:27]
mircea_popescu "would the web go away if there were no links between websites ?" "no because they'd still be on the internet" prolly the best one. [14:27]
mircea_popescu words are apparently brands, which is to say names. they don't need to mean anything anymore than popescu needs to mean something. (which it does, but who cares) [14:28]
kakobrekla decimation i have put a mcu + lcd screen + sd card mid cable. and some buttons. probably doesnt need an explanation. [14:29]
mircea_popescu kakobrekla but if you could be bothered to make a blogpost like the guy's with the dish... [14:29]
kakobrekla yeah too bad i dont have a blog. [14:30]
decimation there's a guy who is much more advanced in messing around with satellites: http://usa-satcom.com/ [14:30]
assbot USA-Satcom | Monitoring worldwide communications on HF through Microwaves… ... ( http://bit.ly/17xcN5g ) [14:30]
mircea_popescu yeah. [14:31]
decimation he wrote his own software to decode Imarsat streams [14:31]
mircea_popescu is that legal ? [14:31]
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* assbot gives voice to teward [14:31]
decimation more or less. in the us, it is generally safe to listen to anything that isn't encrypted [14:32]
decimation even if you decrypt it, it might not be illegal as long as you don't disclose it [14:32]
mircea_popescu i recall that's how it was for a while [14:33]
mircea_popescu imagined it prolly changed. [14:33]
mircea_popescu (used to be it was legal even if encrypted, if you disclose to the media) [14:33]
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decimation http://www.fcc.gov/guides/interception-and-divulgence-radio-communications << usg provides a useful 'help' page [14:34]
assbot Interception and Divulgence of Radio Communications | FCC.gov ... ( http://bit.ly/17xdgnK ) [14:34]
mircea_popescu decimation so i can't find a stealing the future reference re one jaron lanier. any link or anything ? [14:37]
decimation yeah I think it was from a podcast. let me dig [14:38]
decimation http://spectrum.ieee.org/podcast/computing/networks/jaron-lanier-were-being-enslaved-by-free-information [14:39]
mircea_popescu lol divulgence, like indulgence. regular english flexion! who knew! [14:39]
assbot Jaron Lanier: We’re Being Enslaved by Free Information - IEEE Spectrum ... ( http://bit.ly/17xdQlC ) [14:39]
mircea_popescu aty [14:40]
mircea_popescu "Jaron Lanier is one of the world’s great polymaths. He’s a computer scientist, composer, visual artist, and the author of a new book, Who Owns the Future?, published last month " [14:41]
mircea_popescu perhaps they dunno what polymath means ? [14:41]
mircea_popescu decimation ok this discussion is too retarded to read, i threw up a bunch of warnings but a critical error at "So in terms of networks, what happens is, if you have people all competing for their place to be sorted by a single central hub, then you get a power law." [14:45]
decimation lol yeah [14:45]
mircea_popescu this is exactly incorrect. power laws only result when the group is decentralizedly sorting the group. only then. [14:45]
mircea_popescu which is why the internet is when we firs saw them. [14:45]
mircea_popescu regardless of this, i do agree with the original statement that the particular way in which intellectual property is handled today makes the world richer rather than poorer. [14:45]
decimation his basic point is: if we have free wikipedias, who is going to pay people like me to 'be creative'? [14:46]
mircea_popescu specifically because by buying and selling stuff like watsapp or instagram or whatever as if they were representative of something they're merely SYMBOLIC of (their user's aggregated intellectual work) we're in essence going about carring handles of suitcases [14:46]
mircea_popescu and stories of how great our various wardrobes are [14:46]
mircea_popescu all nude. [14:46]
mircea_popescu decimation it's not as bad an argument as it seems. [14:46]
decimation yeah, it kinda connects with your rms discussion over the last days [14:47]
mircea_popescu it's not necessarily or striclty a matter of "pay" as in, the obvious direct "gimme 20 bux i need for mcdonalds". [14:47]
decimation by they way there's a typo in your RMS article: there is an "RSM" [14:47]
mircea_popescu payment and generally managing capital flux is first and foremost a matter of direction. [14:47]
mircea_popescu suppose nobody bothers to manage (ie, even TELL kids when they're saying something smart or stupid) because everyone that could be that is too busy attenting the teacher's unions meetings where they discuss which class is more valuable. [14:48]
mircea_popescu well... no class will be fucking valuable like that! [14:48]
mircea_popescu why is reddit so fucking stupid ? "because it has stupid people in it" no. not because of that, stupid people are universally present and as inert as dirt. [14:48]
mircea_popescu it's because the smart people that should be scoring them left their spots in the local hierarchy, because "better things to do" and now a retard like altman is left herding them around, as best he can. [14:49]
mircea_popescu it's as if every teacher in the hs left to go attend pravda readings, and the children are now stuck with the cleanning ladies. [14:49]
mircea_popescu how is this not making everyone poorer ? [14:49]
mircea_popescu decimation fixed typo ty [14:50]
mircea_popescu " i do agree with the original statement that the particular way in which intellectual property is handled today makes the world richer rather than poorer." << meant it exactly backwards. poorer rather than richer. [14:51]
decimation so in summary, wikipedia is the result of a bunch of smart people without direction? [14:52]
mircea_popescu no. it's the result of a bunch of stupid people without any sort of feedback or signal. [14:53]
mircea_popescu "everyone can edit it", because "nobody is here to manage it" sounds great only on the surface. but in essence, what it means is that "nobody intelligent agrees this is worth doing" [14:53]
decimation actually, they only get 'positive' feedback in the sense that they have now edited X+1 articles [14:53]
mircea_popescu so they have to backport hierarchy into it under the cover of darkness, so to speak [14:53]
assbot [HAVELOCK] [AMHASH1] 1457 @ 0.00086046 = 1.2537 BTC [-] {24} [14:53]
mircea_popescu decimation but that's not feedback. how is it feedback ? [14:54]
mircea_popescu then they have the problem that "google has so much money, we don't!" well... of course ? [14:54]
mircea_popescu YOUR DECISIONS OF HOW TO ORGANISE MADE YOU POORER! [14:54]
mircea_popescu "well if you all made the same decision you'll be poor too and there wouldn't be a difference to make us sad" [14:55]
mircea_popescu "sure. fuck you." [14:55]
decimation what do you call feedback if it is disconnected from the circuit? [14:55]
mircea_popescu that's pretty much the wikipedia-side of the web2.0 utopia (and it has nothingm to do with o'reilly.) [14:55]
mircea_popescu decimation quite. [14:55]
assbot [HAVELOCK] [AMHASH1] 2138 @ 0.00085012 = 1.8176 BTC [-] {3} [14:56]
mircea_popescu having someone to say "hey, this is great" "omfg that's fucking stupid" is the very essence of economy. you can disagree with them, or pick a different one, or create special methods for their working or measuring or announcing or whatever, it's endless. but if you remove it altogether, creating essentially a flat surface instead of a 3d shape, you WILL be poorer. [14:57]
mircea_popescu unavoidable. you literally chose to be poor, that's strictly it. [14:58]
mircea_popescu contrairiwise, the first step towards not being quite so poor is "giving people control of the fruits of their own work", aka not taxing them 100% (what is social media but an experimental regime of 100% tax ?) [15:00]
mircea_popescu once that happens, people naturally start to control the work, and hierarchy forms, and value springs from it, and prosperity is everywhere. [15:00]
decimation there is some 'backdoor' literature that demonstrates this point in the us [15:01]
mircea_popescu but an imaginary "social media platform" where value is UGS but all work is somehow, magically owned by the name, which is being bought and sold as *the thing it stands for*... well ? [15:02]
mircea_popescu the only possible way that goes is myspace. [15:02]
mircea_popescu people of course like to pretend mysapce is a circumstance rather than a fundamental. [15:02]
decimation http://bowlingalone.com/ [15:02]
assbot Bowling Alone ... ( http://bit.ly/17xhfRu ) [15:02]
mircea_popescu amusingly, this "thing as its name" approach is very much empowered by legal abstractions such the corporation, [15:02]
mircea_popescu however, the mechanisms that ensured value actually moves with the name there aren't present here. [15:03]
mircea_popescu suitcase handles, i tell you. [15:03]
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decimation Charles Murray writes on this topic too: http://www.aei.org/publication/america-isnt-polarized-politics-polarized-responsibility/ [15:07]
assbot America isn’t polarized about politics but responsibility ... ( http://bit.ly/1tX8GE1 ) [15:07]
decimation "So that’s my working hypothesis: it’s not merely that politics is an epiphenomenon and that deeper personal qualities account for what we call political polarization, but that one specific dimension—our respective attitudes toward personal responsibility—accounts for a huge proportion of the polarization all by itself." [15:07]
mircea_popescu that i can see. [15:07]
mircea_popescu fundamentally, some people wish to be told WHAT they did is right and WHAT is wrong. and perhaps why. perhaps. half the time maybe they care. [15:08]
mircea_popescu some people enjoy trying to puzzle this out. WHETHER it is one or the other. [15:08]
mircea_popescu these are very different sorts, and the classical representation of man holds him to be equally both. [15:08]
thestringpuller it's fucking 4 c here while mircea_popescu gets to chill in 32 c [15:08]
mircea_popescu that's what the "voter" is supposed to be. but ... he isn't. [15:08]
thestringpuller i need to burn more shit [15:09]
mircea_popescu decimation the much decried "penitentiary industrial system" doesn't exist because evil white aliens from alpha centauri opress the world into doing it. [15:09]
mircea_popescu it exists naturally, because it provides for a need, and it is an actual social solution to a social problem. [15:09]
mircea_popescu not the best ? perhaps. but a nude statement of unbestness is as useful as an aeroplane made out of air. [15:10]
mircea_popescu gotta have better. [15:10]
decimation indeed. it's a retarded version of classical slavery really [15:10]
mircea_popescu it is. [15:10]
mircea_popescu "oh, lincoln ended slavery" [15:10]
mircea_popescu no lol, he didn't. you can't "end" things that exist. [15:10]
mircea_popescu they'll end, when they run out. [15:10]
mircea_popescu "the civil war was an important fashion battle in the manner of shackles to be used" [15:11]
decimation yes, the religious fanatics went to war to make the government-stamped shackles the fashion [15:12]
mircea_popescu because "centralize all the things" was the fashionable motto at the time of the manifest destiny and so on. [15:13]
mircea_popescu now obviously the opposite is the fashionable motto. [15:13]
mircea_popescu thestringpuller my daiquiri salutes you. [15:14]
decimation it is too bad the french were to fucktarded to keep their lands in north america. it would be interesting to know the history of the Bourbon West [15:14]
mircea_popescu but essentially... they didn't care. [15:15]
assbot [HAVELOCK] [AMHASH1] 1728 @ 0.00083501 = 1.4429 BTC [-] {6} [15:15]
mircea_popescu it's by and large easier to not give a shit. that's why all divorces succeed, and all independence movements succeed, and why imperialism and colonialism and so on are all doomed. [15:15]
mircea_popescu because it is in all times and places cheaper to NOT carry other people's actions in your mind than to do so. [15:15]
decimation yeah that's a good point [15:16]
mircea_popescu this is why it's cheaper to "publish" if you're twitter than if you're the [classical] new york times, and why the current nyt is twitter in another color scheme. [15:16]
mircea_popescu it's... damned... cheaper. [15:16]
mircea_popescu obviously that means it's not better, because that's how it gets to be cheaper. [15:16]
thestringpuller d00d, just read updates on this thread [15:16]
thestringpuller how did hanbot not have an anurism?!? [15:17]
mircea_popescu "but people have a voice". orly ? turns out people don't want a voice, especially not in a fucking void. they really want signal and feedback more than they want voice. [15:17]
thestringpuller 2-3 years of this? [15:17]
mircea_popescu thestringpuller ask her lol. i dunno. [15:17]
mircea_popescu women are resilient ? boobage amortises ? [15:17]
thestringpuller ;;later tell hanbot how did you not have a stroke while in the trenches of super retardism? [15:18]
gribble The operation succeeded. [15:18]
decimation perhaps that's another good replacement phrase for "chronic kinglessness": "the people want for feedback" [15:18]
mircea_popescu "so they want signal and feedback that's ok, we'll add some buttons and call them feedback" herp. [15:18]
thestringpuller "We want free things. Make it all free! We don't want to pay for nice things! We are entitled to the world cause our parents told us so!" [15:18]
mircea_popescu "Some people have to have a world of evidence before they can come anywhere in the neighborhood of believing anything; but for me, when a man tells me that he has "seen the engravings which are upon the plates," and not only that, but an angel was there at the time, and saw him see them, and probably took his receipt for it, I am very far on the road to conviction, no matter whether I ever heard of that man before or n [15:19]
mircea_popescu ot, and even if I do not know the name of the angel, or his nationality either." [15:19]
mircea_popescu clemens, centuries ago. "i don't care what people say that i don't know". duh. [15:19]
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mircea_popescu reddit has to shadowban users because spam. bitcoin-assets does not. because wot works and "Feedback" doesn't ? awww, who knew. [15:20]
decimation who could have predicted? [15:20]
mircea_popescu experiment can be carried out in absolutely any class. start marking the papers accurately. [15:21]
mircea_popescu out of 30 kids, 27 will fucking riot, 3 will buckle down and do fucking homework. that they don't strictly have to do. [15:21]
mircea_popescu don't do that, all 30 kids are undistinguishable. up until, of course, they run against feynman's nature, that which can't be fooled. [15:22]
mircea_popescu at which point, suddenly, yes. "who could have predicted". [15:22]
mircea_popescu (accurately, of course, means nothing objective. accurately in this context strictly means "so nobody gets a full A half the time". because you're looking for flaws, not to prop self esteem.) [15:23]
thestringpuller well reddit wants more users without having to pay for anything [15:24]
thestringpuller if user makes too many post too soon, they lose money [15:24]
thestringpuller wihtout them the users* [15:24]
mircea_popescu they lose jack. i suspect it's merely a fetish. [15:25]
thestringpuller perhaps. reddit does have a ridiculously hard time paying the bills with their own money. [15:25]
thestringpuller they need big brothers and parents to help pay their way. [15:25]
mircea_popescu wonder why. lol. [15:26]
thestringpuller this is why I think the ycombinator "seed funding" thing is a bit non-sensical. [15:26]
mircea_popescu why ? [15:26]
thestringpuller it gets this young people thinking "Yo, if I have a good idea people will pay for me to live, even if it makes no money" [15:26]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 23500 @ 0.00059946 = 14.0873 BTC [-] {2} [15:26]
mircea_popescu how's it a good idea then ? [15:26]
thestringpuller "good idea" [15:26]
thestringpuller lets say "good idea that's really bad idea, but is dressed up to look like good idea somehow and fools people" [15:27]
thestringpuller :P [15:27]
mircea_popescu a good idea that makes no money is a bit like a norwegian blue that's pining for the fjords. beautiful plumage... [15:27]
thestringpuller it's just mind boggling these children in suits feel so entitled. [15:29]
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thestringpuller maybe it's how hanbot put it, its "Due to a horrible accident involving, perhaps, various radioactive equipment including a twinkie" [15:31]
mircea_popescu suits comingback in fashion ? [15:31]
mircea_popescu i thought it was all tshirts and how do you call those african footwear things ? [15:31]
thestringpuller crocs? [15:31]
thestringpuller LOL [15:31]
mircea_popescu flip flops [15:32]
thestringpuller ;;google homeless entrepreneurs san francisco [15:32]
gribble Maker Movement Rescues San Francisco Tech Entrepreneur: ; Homeless In San Francisco Get Marketing Makeover, Clever Signs ...: [15:32]
thestringpuller i read a story somewhere that there is a whole slew of entrepreneurs in SF that are homeless [15:32]
thestringpuller running their business out of their cars and stuff [15:33]
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midnightmagic lol @ shadowban [15:35]
mircea_popescu thestringpuller i wonder if there's many whores working out of their car in sf. [15:36]
thestringpuller whores do real work, so I'm pretty sure they have housing [15:38]
mircea_popescu it's quite common in yurp actually. [15:40]
mircea_popescu girl and her wv beetle or w/e. [15:40]
asciilifeform kakobrekla's serial buffer shuttle << good project. and he said enough such that anyone who wants, can build! [15:48]
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mircea_popescu https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I95gITtKgwU [15:50]
assbot Silent Farewell - BIZARRE Sketch with John Byner - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1AMguzS ) [15:50]
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thestringpuller lol jon matonis randomly followed me on twitter [15:55]
thestringpuller dunno if I'm a target now... [15:55]
danielpbarron me too [15:56]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 72100 @ 0.00059655 = 43.0113 BTC [-] {2} [15:59]
mircea_popescu "i have to tell you miss lopez, you seem to have caught the egyptian flu." [16:01]
mircea_popescu "what ?!" [16:01]
mircea_popescu "you're going to be a mommy." [16:01]
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thestringpuller danielpbarron: "keep your enemies closer?" lol [16:02]
danielpbarron he also followed davout, cazalla, saifedean, BingoBoingo [16:04]
thestringpuller oh boi. the lines are being drawn. [16:05]
thestringpuller my first gig as a war profiteer! [16:06]
thestringpuller i wonder if he'll make some kind of contact, "Yo guise, stop stirring up the pot. You're making our hijacking job too hard." [16:06]
mircea_popescu kinda lulzy he wasn't following none of these b4 ? [16:09]
mircea_popescu derp. [16:09]
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danielpbarron https://twitter.com/BarryShilbert/status/554281218590904320 [16:21]
assbot I’ve now been unbanned from reddit. The drama is over. [16:21]
danielpbarron .@aantonop Being banned by Reddit is almost as worse as @rogerkver not being allowed in the US [16:21]
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mircea_popescu "Good permission-less distribution of coins is not possible without some inflation, that's exactly what's happening. Only private and semi-private systems have all shares distributed to stakeholders in one go, money don't work that way, sorry." [16:22]
mircea_popescu derp. [16:22]
mircea_popescu people with no money expressing views asa to how money works. because clearly... they;'d know. [16:23]
mircea_popescu danielpbarron almost as worse ? wtf is wrong with these college grads! [16:23]
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thestringpuller it's like a secretary telling me I need a heart transplant because he saw it on TV [16:24]
thestringpuller guess we still haven't left the ages of people wanting to play bitcoin banker [16:25]
thestringpuller d00d this shadowban drama is nuts [16:27]
thestringpuller people are like "Yo he broke the rules but didn't know. Don't punish him too hard, just give him a warning." [16:27]
mircea_popescu danielpbarron "This whole hard fork drama is part of the bigger brain-damaged notion that Bitcoin isn't about money." << you actuyally have an excellent point here. [16:28]
thestringpuller What the fuck happened to ignorance of the law is no excuse for breaking it. [16:28]
mircea_popescu the way "embrace, extend and extinguish" is dressed up in foundation/power ranger internal communication is, "to maximize bitcoin the ideal approach is to not define bitcoin any particular way". this neatly matches their refusal to specify the protocol, and its direct implication is [16:28]
mircea_popescu that should tomorrow tide agree to rebrand its detergent as "bitcoin", then it will be okay if there's n omore bitcoin. because bitcoin has no identity but is merely a name, and since the empty name is "more widely used" the project is nominally "more successful" [16:29]
mircea_popescu this directly dovetails into the "going around naked holding just the handles of missing suitcases, telling each other stories about wonderous wardrobes" point discussed earlier. [16:30]
mircea_popescu and as to the question of "how was gavin turned", the answer is obvious : cultural immersion. he happens to be part of the problem, much like if you put ximenez in charge of the supreme court you'll get burnings at the stake out of the legal process irrespective what the laws say. [16:30]
thestringpuller what is the other side of the problem? [16:33]
thestringpuller its like the CIA turning jihadist into CIA assets. [16:33]
thestringpuller his early posts are relatively sane [16:33]
mircea_popescu Confirmed total: 21122 BTC sheeit it crossed 20kdidn't evne notice. [16:39]
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mircea_popescu ;;calc 21122 / 13347 [16:40]
gribble 1.58252790889 [16:40]
mircea_popescu still over 1btc o.o [16:40]
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mircea_popescu http://globalvoicesonline.org/2013/08/05/hong-kong-sex-workers-forced-to-pay-for-good-reviews-online/ [17:16]
assbot Hong Kong Sex Workers Forced to Pay for Good Reviews Online · Global Voices ... ( http://bit.ly/1BWlpv7 ) [17:16]
mircea_popescu heh. airbnb is good, and the cab thing is good, but this is bad. the difference ? [17:16]
mircea_popescu well... silicon valley got ED. [17:16]
mircea_popescu someone should 'revolutionize' whoredom. [17:16]
ben_vulpes disrupt the whore-er-archy! [17:17]
* mircea_popescu never thought much of the average pimp [17:19]
mircea_popescu there's something about that market that always selects for ineptitude [17:20]
mircea_popescu maybe because a pimp's essentially an actor playing the cuckold role, i dunno. [17:21]
assbot [HAVELOCK] [AMHASH1] 5164 @ 0.00083504 = 4.3121 BTC [-] {7} [17:28]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13549 @ 0.00062311 = 8.4425 BTC [+] [17:32]
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danielpbarron no private key, no coin :p [17:46]
kakobrekla https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/550297212769402881 ; http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=16-02-2014#506252 [17:49]
assbot Btw, we are actually working on a charger that automatically moves out from the wall & connects like a solid metal snake. For realz. [17:50]
assbot Logged on 16-02-2014 00:31:00; asciilifeform: 2 yrs. ago i figured out how to flex a fairly ordinary multi-conductor cable in an arbitrary spot, at an arbitrary angle, purely electrically. [17:50]
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thestringpuller http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/2s2utx/the_hard_fork_missile_crisis/cnlqcd1 << dunno if semantics or what? [18:01]
thestringpuller cazalla: i'll submit revision to article if we can vet what he's saying. [18:02]
cazalla thestringpuller, sure, just need to get a few cuppas into me, look at all this drama i've woken up to because of you! [18:03]
cazalla just approved a couple of comments on your article as well [18:03]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 24609 @ 0.00059181 = 14.5639 BTC [-] {5} [18:04]
thestringpuller Ah. Didn't know everyone was gonna go Xbox live on each other - "I FUCKED YOUR MOM" and shit. [18:05]
thestringpuller ;;ident [18:05]
gribble Nick 'thestringpuller', with hostmask 'thestringpuller!~leflor@unaffiliated/thestringpuller', is not identified. [18:05]
thestringpuller ;;ident [18:06]
gribble Nick 'thestringpuller', with hostmask 'thestringpuller!~leflor@unaffiliated/thestringpuller', is identified as user 'thestringpuller', with GPG key id 0FF2943DA179E169, key fingerprint 6ACE36E786F39A4ADC4506DE0FF2943DA179E169, and bitcoin address None [18:06]
thestringpuller cazalla: this is my proposed edit (place at bottom of article) [18:07]
cazalla thestringpuller, email it or pm [18:07]
thestringpuller kay [18:07]
danielpbarron ;;rate railzand 1 https://twitter.com/railzand/status/553942112677691393 [18:07]
gribble Error: For identification purposes, you must be authenticated to use the rating system. [18:07]
assbot https://t.co/2iVjWSBkxs [18:07]
* danielpbarron stabs gribble [18:07]
adlai http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=11-01-2015#973353 << grammar pls [18:08]
assbot Logged on 11-01-2015 19:18:11; danielpbarron: .@aantonop Being banned by Reddit is almost as worse as @rogerkver not being allowed in the US [18:08]
adlai so being a little anal retentive here... http://bitbet.us/bet/1093 is really just asking "does blockchain.info switch to gigacoin" [18:14]
assbot BitBet - Bitcoin main net block size to increase in 2015 :: 0.03 B (3%) on Yes, 1.07 B (97%) on No | closing in 10 months 1 week| weight: 97`257 (100`000 to 1) ... ( http://bit.ly/1BWtIam ) [18:14]
adlai a better phrasing might talk about the block size of the highest difficulty chain at the resolution date [18:15]
kakobrekla i agree. [18:16]
* adlai can see himself holding opposite sides of such bets, depending on the exact timing of shenanigans [18:19]
adlai oh, this wording also leaves unspecified what happens if bc.i serve up both chains [18:20]
* adlai goes back to studying lojban [18:20]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4186 @ 0.00062311 = 2.6083 BTC [+] [18:22]
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decimation adlai: are you going to try to speak lojban? [18:27]
adlai ie [18:27]
decimation heh [18:29]
danielpbarron Advertised sites are not endorsed by the Bitcoin Forum. They may be unsafe, untrustworthy, or illegal in your jurisdiction. Advertise here. [18:30]
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kakobrekla no but only butt. [18:41]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5950 @ 0.00062342 = 3.7093 BTC [+] {2} [18:43]
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adlai there are butts, this is not how the bet is worded... but this is the pot calling the kettle empty [18:47]
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mircea_popescu jurov i wasn't planning anything on that line [19:00]
mircea_popescu thestringpuller if you mean todd's comment, he is correct. [19:00]
mircea_popescu there never was a hard fork before. the march event was an observed fork which was resolved by abandoning the new chain. [19:01]
jurov would be quite a perk for mpex users... "liquidate" positions according to last month report and allow to withdraw all the gigacoin [19:01]
jurov but i see, it can't be predicted in advance [19:02]
mircea_popescu i was thinking more along the lines of a publicly accessible splitter service [19:02]
mircea_popescu pay some pool to provide it [19:02]
mircea_popescu "I agree a big discussion is necessary before changes are made, but we shouldn't act like a hard fork is somehow inherently an issue." [19:02]
mircea_popescu derp. [19:03]
mircea_popescu gavin does NOT have the authority to create a hard fork. [19:03]
mircea_popescu a hard fork that's not been ok'd by the bitcoin foundation (the real one, not vessenes' scam) is automatically an issue fort the obvious reason : [19:03]
mircea_popescu it's an attempt of unrelated third parties to run away with bitcoin. [19:03]
mircea_popescu "If the community can't hardfork today we could stop using bitcoin now and look for the better suited alt coin. If bitcoin can't fork-update it has no value." [19:04]
mircea_popescu yeah, get lost. obviously bitcoin HAS NO VALUE TO YOU, [19:04]
mircea_popescu but that;'s because you were expecting to defraud the faith others put in bitcoin by inflating it. [19:04]
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mircea_popescu bitcoin does not do that, specifically, and so yeah, pack it and get lost. [19:04]
mircea_popescu "we" my fucking foot. [19:04]
mircea_popescu bejesus reddit is practically full of fake accounts with a party line. [19:05]
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kakobrekla this 'this foundation can and the other cant' i very arbitrary except for one being 'us' and one 'them'. [19:05]
kakobrekla s/i/is [19:05]
* mircea_popescu shrugs. [19:06]
mircea_popescu "you can't fuck her unless she agrees" "that seems arbitrary, why her and not me ?" [19:06]
mircea_popescu "i know what you agree to, fucker" [19:06]
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mircea_popescu meh this'll have to be a post. [19:09]
assbot [HAVELOCK] [AMHASH1] 8396 @ 0.00080503 = 6.759 BTC [-] {20} [19:10]
davout mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=11-01-2015#973151 <<< kind of what i figured when reading "The machine handling encryption and decryption on the MPEx side never connects to the Internet" from mpex's faq [19:10]
assbot Logged on 11-01-2015 17:15:59; mircea_popescu: the correct airgap solution is optics. [19:10]
* mircea_popescu gives voice to benjamindees [19:11]
mircea_popescu enjoy. [19:11]
benjamindees thank-you, sir [19:11]
BigBitz optics are not an airgap solution - if you mean fibre optics - or do you mean actual optics as in vision/eyes? [19:12]
benjamindees Mircea, no one is going to inflate Bitcoin... where do you get that idea? [19:12]
mircea_popescu benjamindees how much of this discussion have you read ? [19:13]
adlai http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=11-01-2015#973445 << "with a timestamp in 2015 and at least 50 confirmations" [19:13]
assbot Logged on 11-01-2015 21:48:31; jurov: and how else it is worded? do say [19:13]
davout kakobrekla: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=11-01-2015#973163 <<< the visual confirmation of transferred data sounds pretty neat too [19:13]
assbot Logged on 11-01-2015 17:20:51; *: kakobrekla has a serial cable with a buffer with visual confirmation of the data and it does not need to be plugged to both computers at same time [19:13]
benjamindees well, I was under the impression it was quite a bit, but I may have missed some things [19:13]
mircea_popescu define inflation ? [19:14]
davout BigBitz: yeah sure, but ethernet-over-optical-fiber isn't really the idea [19:14]
benjamindees I agree that perhaps some people might secretly like to continue block rewards forever [19:14]
benjamindees but that's not going to happen [19:14]
mircea_popescu BigBitz optics as the element that goes over the airgap. rather than sound. [19:14]
mircea_popescu benjamindees can ye answer the question ? [19:15]
jurov adlais so the issue is not about cockchain.info publishing or not? i'm confused now [19:15]
benjamindees inflation is an increase in the money supply, of course [19:15]
davout i don't think sound is inherently flawed, as long as you are in a controlled environment [19:15]
BigBitz ethernet-over-optical-fibre lolwut. [19:16]
BigBitz do you even network bro. [19:16]
davout because if you manage to put some microphone somewhere and sniff audio, nothing theoretically prevents you from sniffing optic signal leaks as well, guess it all depends on the implementation specfics [19:16]
decimation optical ethernet is quite common in large installations [19:16]
* adlai is just pointing out possible corner cases in the wording, and that it's not measuring exactly "is a hardfork successful" [19:16]
BigBitz optical ethernet. wut. [19:17]
BigBitz There is no such thing as optical ethernet. [19:17]
davout BigBitz: "do you even network bro." <<< the point is precisely not to [19:17]
mircea_popescu benjamindees inflation is the increase in the supply. whatever it is. [19:18]
mircea_popescu if suddenly there's a lot of noobs here, there'll be an inflaiton of noobs. [19:18]
kakobrekla "is a hardfork successful" < since this is bb, hf successful only if mp submits. [19:18]
mircea_popescu where originally the occasional noob might be something people want to help, if there's a lot of them that well will be run dry. which is what happened in 1993. [19:18]
adlai the point, if i follow correctly, is to establish a channel for conveying specific data across the airgap, as opposed to ethernet-over-fiber, which would defeat the purpose of the airgap [19:18]
mircea_popescu adlai that bet doesn't measure "successful" was discussed before, and i said "well, yeah, but it's better to err this way, give the bet a chance" [19:19]
* adlai leaves dead horses to rot [19:19]
mircea_popescu davout optics easier to shield. [19:20]
decimation adlai: generally 1000Base-LX or similar have a physical laser for transmitting and some kind of photodetector for receive [19:20]
mircea_popescu was the statement when that was discussed. [19:20]
benjamindees mircea_popescu, lol, okay, listen I think you're over-reacting a bit. It'll work out. [19:20]
mircea_popescu benjamindees of course it will. [19:20]
davout adlai: ethernet-over-fiber being merely the image of 'unsupervised permanently connected automatic optical transmission device' [19:20]
mircea_popescu that's never been in contention. [19:20]
davout mircea_popescu: i agree, it's a difference in degree not in kind though [19:20]
mircea_popescu just, it will work out my way. not mtgox's way, not pirate's way, not reddit's way or the forum's way or vessenes' way [19:20]
mircea_popescu like it ALWAYS has to date, mind you. [19:21]
davout benjamindees: inflation of block space supply doesn't count as inflation to you? [19:21]
mircea_popescu davout it's a very hard problem this, spying on light. [19:21]
decimation adlai: my point being that one can physically disconnect a link end, if one wishes to prevent two-way transfer [19:21]
adlai davout, decimation, i know you guys understand this, i think i understand it, the person who seemet to be confused is BigBitz [19:21]
BigBitz confused... [19:22]
BigBitz I don't think so. [19:22]
BigBitz I'm au fait with optics. [19:22]
adlai then i misunderstood you, sorry [19:22]
BigBitz Don't apologise. [19:22]
BigBitz :) [19:22]
adlai don't tell me what not to do! [19:23]
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kakobrekla imo the blockchain size would ideally be set so that we get most tx fees. the answer to that is not simple. [19:23]
kakobrekla but on that i think we are still way under limit. [19:23]
* adlai tends to avoid apologies although misunderstandings can lead to lots of strife so they're worth avoiding [19:24]
adlai somewhere... there was a comparison of this to the laffer curve [19:24]
adlai although it may have been in my head [19:24]
adlai blocksize limit + tx fees as the taxation apparatus of bitcoin's decentralized regulatory body [19:25]
adlai with the economic issues that arise from optimizing a tax system [19:25]
davout adlai: what BigBitz was saying is that an optic fiber isn't a proper airgap, which i concurred with saying that the idea of the airgap is definitely not to have some sort of permanent connection like ethernet over optical fiber should such a thing exist [19:26]
kakobrekla anyway think of the poor miners. [19:26]
adlai mircea_popescu: ever thought you'd find yourself leading the charge for higher taxation? :P [19:26]
benjamindees davout, no, it doesn't. Bitcoin isn't ultimately equivalent to debt-issued currencies in the way velocity is measured, or in the way it impacts the value. it just appears to be at the moment because inflation (issuance) is high. [19:26]
mircea_popescu but on that i think we are still way under limit. << and i think women are overweight, by and large. what do we do ? [19:27]
adlai risperidone in the stratosphere [19:27]
mircea_popescu that's a valid point from benjamindees [19:27]
kakobrekla mircea_popescu start a foundation? [19:28]
mircea_popescu no, i just let 'em be. [19:28]
adlai if we look at the blocksize limit as a parameter of the tax system, this isn't inflation, it's a tax cut - which we may wish to reverse in the future [19:28]
mircea_popescu adlai nobody asked "we" anything. [19:28]
mircea_popescu "we" are not in charge of things just because pelosi likes to pretend so. [19:29]
davout benjamindees: i may be thick here, but i fail to see how this relates, as a miner i might not one someone forcing a scarce resource that i sell, such as space in a block, to be inflated away [19:29]
adlai if we the people having this discussion look at the ... which we the people cutting the taxes may wish to... [19:29]
* assbot gives voice to joecool [19:29]
davout s/i might not/i might not agree with some/ [19:30]
benjamindees davout, well, the thing is, by the time it even matters, mining may be irrelevant anyways. I wouldn't bank on having a mining oligopoly twenty years from now. Mining is mostly a means of distribution. [19:31]
kakobrekla and network will be secured how ? [19:32]
adlai if you think mining is primarily a means of distribution, you should consider studying the problems with systems that preceeded bitcoin [19:32]
decimation pelosi will take care of the mining. [19:33]
adlai "systems" may be an exaggeration, a better word: "proposals" [19:33]
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decimation !up rootstat [19:34]
* assbot gives voice to rootstat [19:34]
davout does anyone know if current bitcoin nodes would actually blacklist/disconnect from nodes broadcasting >1m or otherwise invalid blocks? [19:34]
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davout would transactions still propagated accross fork branches in the event of a hard fork scenario? [19:35]
BingoBoingo !up rootstat [19:35]
* assbot gives voice to rootstat [19:35]
davout trying to figure out how easy/hard it would be to actually split coins reliably accross forks [19:36]
danielpbarron all it takes is anyone watching both chains and telling each about the other's transactions; all the ones that aren't doublespends should get accepted by both chains [19:36]
adlai nodes get penalized for relaying junk [19:36]
davout danielpbarron: yeah, that's a good point [19:36]
adlai i'm not certain if they'd get disconnected right away, but a node sending invalid-to-you blocks won't last long in your node's connection list [19:36]
kakobrekla how do other envision the future when reward goes towards 0. either a btc is worth half a planet or the fees amount per block go up a few orders of magnitude or network is dead [19:36]
kakobrekla which? [19:36]
davout adlai: yeah, but danielpbarron has a point, there only needs to be one node bridging transactions for a double-spend to be harder to pull off, obviously not impossible, but it would be harder than trivial [19:38]
benjamindees Just consider that, when Satoshi said "gain a new territory of freedom for several years," he had a reason. Bitcoin is not the end-all-be-all of systems. Mining may not be a long-term solution. But inflation is non-negotiable, regardless. [19:38]
adlai you can broadcast transactions on both chains, miners could even be incentivized to scan both chains for transactions valid in the chain they're mining on - but p2p broadcast probably won't work on its own, once the network has forked properly [19:38]
danielpbarron "confirming blocks for just the transaction fee is a losing venture, but we intend to make up for it in volume" [19:38]
adlai double spends are easy today, they'll be far easier in such a situation [19:38]
danielpbarron davout, if you can probably beat them to it if it's your intention to doublespend [19:38]
decimation well, if the network is dead, no one cares. If bitcoin can be traded for half a planet, the implication is that mining is costly [19:39]
kakobrekla no, but you cant secure a network on 0.05 if its not half a planet each. [19:39]
mircea_popescu would transactions still propagated accross fork branches in the event of a hard fork scenario? <>< hard to tell, but mostly yes. [19:39]
mircea_popescu Just consider that, when Satoshi said "gain a new territory of freedom for several years," he had a reason. Bitcoin is not the end-all-be-all of systems. << that's not the reason he had. here is the reason he had : http://trilema.com/2013/digging-through-archives-yields-gold/ [19:40]
assbot Digging through archives yields gold pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1w94ErX ) [19:40]
decimation kakobrekla: if mining is costly, the miners won't relay dust [19:40]
mircea_popescu "The big and easy government attacks on money target a single central money issuer, as with the first of the modern political attacks, the French Assignat of 1792, but in the late nineteenth century political attacks on financial networks began, as for example the Federal reserve act of 1913, the goal always being to wind up the network into a single too big to fail entity, and they have been getting progressively bigg [19:40]
mircea_popescu er, more serious, and more disastrous, as with the most recent one. Each attack is hugely successful, and after the cataclysm that the attack causes the attackers are hailed as saviors of the poor, the oppressed, and the nation generally, and the blame for the the bad consequences is dumped elsewhere, usually on Jews, greedy bankers, speculators, etc, because such attacks are difficult for ordinary people understand. I [19:40]
mircea_popescu have trouble understanding your proposal - ordinary users will be easily bamboozled by a government sponsored security update. Further, when the crisis hits, to disagree with the line, to doubt that the regulators are right, and the problem is the evil speculators, becomes political suicide, as it did in America in 2007, sometimes physical suicide, as in Weimar Germany." [19:40]
kakobrekla decimation from miners perspective they would include everything and their mother if she has half a dime. [19:41]
mircea_popescu the slowly creeping usg-isation of bitcoin has to be nipped in the bud. [19:41]
kakobrekla "if im not picking this cent up, next miner will in next block." [19:42]
decimation kakobrekla: by that logic, airlines would fly a bum for five bux if there were an empty seat [19:42]
mircea_popescu kakobrekla this is a point. all the people derping about "economy" fail to have read that old mpoe-pr article about buffett and textile industry on the forum. [19:42]
kakobrekla yes but miners arent airplane liners. [19:42]
mircea_popescu hanbot got a link ? [19:42]
davout decimation: they totally would if they had to bear the costs of flying empty airplanes anyway [19:42]
mircea_popescu ^ [19:43]
mircea_popescu they ... actually do. [19:43]
mircea_popescu there's a system where you only fly if they have empty seats, costs bupkiss [19:43]
decimation in the us, most airlines have done away with that [19:43]
decimation not sure about the rest of the world [19:43]
mircea_popescu ah k. [19:44]
decimation the reason being, the 'airline system' is running at capacity [19:44]
davout my favourite pilot joke: "see this baby? that's a C-130. I fly a C-150" [19:44]
adlai !b 1 [19:45]
assbot Last 1 lines bashed and pending review. ( http://dpaste.com/1YVPVS8.txt ) [19:45]
decimation at any rate, this is a problem for actual miners to solve in the future, and they will likely despise any actions taken today on their behalf [19:45]
davout trying to solve other people's problems that don't exist yet, the recipe for success :D [19:47]
davout !up hanbot [19:47]
* assbot gives voice to hanbot [19:47]
davout hanbot: so, how's the tampon market in bsas? [19:48]
assbot BITBOND update and request for feedback | Page 2 | Bitcointa.lk ... ( http://bit.ly/1ANb1c9 ) [19:49]
mircea_popescu hanbot a there we go. [19:49]
hanbot davout lol, i don't know what the hubub's about. they're like two bux a box'a 16. [19:50]
mircea_popescu ^ benjamindees read that. [19:50]
hanbot ^^ ben_vulpes [19:50]
mircea_popescu trying to solve other people's problems that don't exist yet, the recipe for success :D <<< kinda the meat and potatoes of socialist government eh. [19:50]
davout also product managers [19:51]
hanbot they come with a sanity tax tho', box waxes on unpoetic about how you the buyer are a unique woman whose dreams become reality etc. [19:51]
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decimation mircea_popescu: the unborn make the perfect socialist workers. they never complain and always eager for the next five year plan [19:53]
mircea_popescu quite. [19:54]
adlai i like how the idf doesn't put the number in the name (though they are planned for five), calling them just "multi-year plans", as though resigned in advance to the inevitable delays [19:54]
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mircea_popescu that's exactly it, in the quest to "we promise to over-react, please re-elect us" the socialist politicians are stuck moving the goalposts in the future. their ideal pov is to resolve problems for which no being alive can now hang them [19:54]
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decimation this phenomenon is demonstrated in obamacare, for instance. the 40% tax on "cadillac" health plans will start in 2018, presumably after a republican president takes office [20:00]
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[\] hi kids [20:01]
joecool hi nick, are you still mad at me? [20:03]
benjamindees mircea_popescu, you understand that the next, "bigger" too-big-to-fail entity is China, right? It's not Bitcoin... bankers don't take non-inflationary currency seriously. [20:03]
davout benjamindees: it's not really as if bitcoin was taking banking too seriously either [20:04]
mircea_popescu benjamindees heh. [20:05]
mircea_popescu how many "bankers" do you know ? [20:05]
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benjamindees just one, personally [20:07]
mircea_popescu http://trilema.com/2015/lets-address-some-of-the-more-common-pseudo-arguments-raised-by-the-very-stupid-people-that-like-the-gavin-scamcoin-proposal/ [20:07]
assbot Let's address some of the more common pseudo-arguments raised by the very stupid people that like the Gavin scamcoin proposal pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1w961XS ) [20:07]
mircea_popescu fresh offa da presses. [20:07]
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mircea_popescu benjamindees an' he doesn't take bitcoin seriously [20:08]
benjamindees not as a currency [20:09]
benjamindees as an asset, sure, assets are easy to control with conventional means -- threats, taxation, theft, etc [20:10]
[\] "All readers are entitled to five free articles each week." <-- How do I go about getting my five free articles? [20:10]
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adlai by not using the proxy [20:10]
mircea_popescu [\] simply load the site. [20:11]
* assbot gives voice to asciilifeform [20:11]
adlai proxies socialize away your free articles [20:11]
[\] it redirected to the http://trilema.com/2013/paid-content/ page [20:11]
assbot Paid content pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1ANg3Wb ) [20:11]
[\] I had to go back to the original and refresh [20:11]
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mircea_popescu lol adlai [20:12]
[\] adlai, I'm not using a proxy. I have no such need. [20:13]
mircea_popescu not behind seven proxies ?!!? [20:14]
mircea_popescu the internetity! [20:14]
[\] It'd just route to North Korea anyway. [20:15]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14650 @ 0.00059589 = 8.7298 BTC [-] [20:16]
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decimation !up hanbot [20:18]
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scoopbot New post on Trilema by Mircea Popescu: http://trilema.com/2015/lets-address-some-of-the-more-common-pseudo-arguments-raised-by-the-very-stupid-people-that-like-the-gavin-scamcoin-proposal/ [20:29]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10200 @ 0.00059202 = 6.0386 BTC [-] [20:32]
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scoopbot New post on Qntra.net by cazalla: http://qntra.net/2015/01/yet-another-silk-road-marketplace-launches/ [20:34]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 76800 @ 0.00059589 = 45.7644 BTC [+] [20:35]
davout sgornick: as danielpbarron points out "Yes, that's why it will be so dangerous to accept payments from anyone that includes coins tainted with post-fork coinbases." is not completely accurate [20:36]
davout since you would be able to split coins, ie. even if your incoming tx isn't tainted with a post-fork coinbase you could receive funds that aren't spendable on both chains [20:36]
sgornick Why? 100% of those will be rejected on the side of the fork from nodes without the hard-fork implemented. [20:37]
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davout i'm not sure i follow what you're saying [20:38]
sgornick Oh, ... I think I see -- you are saying I didn't go far enough? Not only are trxs with post-fork taint worthless, but there could be trxs with no taint that would confirm on one side but would be invalid as they were already spent on the other side? [20:40]
davout exactly [20:41]
adlai cazalla: "Schzultz" [20:42]
sgornick First, gotta get some vocabulary simplified. When we had the unplanned hard-fork March 2013, we had the protocol "pre-v0.8' and "v0.8" . What do we call this protocol with the hard fork implemented vs. that without the hard fork (i.e., unchanged? ) [20:42]
cazalla adlai, ty [20:43]
sgornick Or .. maybe daniel's works best ... "bitcoin" vs. "gavincoin" [20:43]
davout sgornick: it wasn't a hard fork in the sense that no rule was changed [20:43]
sgornick Sure was ... v0.8 changed the rule in allowing more than the pre-v0.8 side did. [20:44]
adlai and there wasn't a well-defined set of nodes that would prefer one block over another - the pre-v0.8 side would nondeterministically reject certain valid blocks [20:44]
davout sgornick: it was a hard fork in the sense that not all implementations behaved the same way, not in the sense that a rule was changed [20:45]
sgornick The (bdb) rule wasn't (widely) known before v0.8 caused the fork, but it was coded into v0.8.1. [20:48]
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davout sgornick: an implementation detail in some older client does not count as a protocol rule in my book, if proof was needed that the 'teh-code-is-teh-spec' approach is fundamentally braindamaged, well, look no further [20:53]
mircea_popescu First, gotta get some vocabulary simplified. When we had the unplanned hard-fork March 2013, we had the protocol "pre-v0.8' and "v0.8" . What do we call this protocol with the hard fork implemented vs. that without the hard fork (i.e., unchanged? ) << bitcoin vs gavincoin. [20:53]
mircea_popescu obviously. [20:53]
mircea_popescu inasmuch as the old thing is bitcoin, and the new thing some shit gavin made. [20:53]
artifexd Have we already passed the point of separation? Is it possible that I have bitcoins that are actually gavincoins? [20:54]
mircea_popescu The (bdb) rule wasn't (widely) known before v0.8 caused the fork, but it was coded into v0.8.1. << it is technially correct to say that the 8.1. version is in fact more restrictive than the pre 8.0 version. [20:54]
mircea_popescu what people knew about it was important then, but is not really germane [20:55]
mircea_popescu artifexd nope. [20:55]
assbot [HAVELOCK] [AMHASH1] 7222 @ 0.00084836 = 6.1269 BTC [+] {4} [20:55]
mircea_popescu davout if proof was needed that the 'teh-code-is-teh-spec' approach is fundamentally braindamaged, well, look no further <>< clearly. not to mention the recent ecdsa openssl debacle, which is pretty much exactly a replay of the bdb stuff. "oh, we included code but we had no idea what it does" sort of approach to code-is-spec specwork [20:56]
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davout mircea_popescu: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=134318.msg1435904#msg1435904 <<< hearn, in reply to me: "because some parts of the protocol are directly exposed to underlying libraries like OpenSSL, you have to match their behaviour exactly as well, including all their bugs." https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=134318.msg1435904#msg1435904 [21:02]
assbot Formalised Bitcoin Protocol Standard ... ( http://bit.ly/1y8H9n1 ) [21:02]
assbot Formalised Bitcoin Protocol Standard ... ( http://bit.ly/1y8H9n5 ) [21:02]
davout whoops, double link [21:02]
davout who could have predicted? [21:03]
mircea_popescu heh. [21:03]
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mircea_popescu "This is how the max block size will be increased, hopefully with the same 2-year delay. By the time the change actually happens, everyone will be using a client with the new rules because that's the only type of client that will have been advertised on bitcoin.org and elsewhere for 2+ years. You'd have to go massively out of your way to download a version without the new rules." [21:05]
mircea_popescu derp. [21:05]
mircea_popescu the fake bitcoin foundation is going to make it for two years ? bwahahaha gimme a break. [21:06]
mircea_popescu Gavin educates, make his points and tries convince community without antagonizing anyone. Popescu is probably the biggest jerk in the community, and his flock are such a dickheads that I'd be happy to see them using separate chain just so they can circlejerk and pretend they are the kings of the crypto-word in their own sandbox. Anything they write is so repugnant, that it's just impossible to argue with them. It's fun [21:11]
mircea_popescu ny how they define "THE community" linking between blogs of handful of people. [21:11]
mircea_popescu dude, reddit really likes being educated, provided the "education" in question consists of telling them how great and important they are. [21:11]
mircea_popescu "However, I also expect Bitcoin to become a) more forgetful and think that b), there could be a systems that puts the burden of validating a transaction on the sender of the transaction instead of the network. So that maybe, maybe, in the more distant future, all that needs to be kept of the decentralized blockchain are the headers, which is less than a CD-ROM full of data for 100years." [21:13]
mircea_popescu :D [21:13]
mircea_popescu ahh all this exposure to that other community. [21:13]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 33986 @ 0.00062101 = 21.1056 BTC [+] {3} [21:15]
adlai what if satoshi sells on the original chain [21:15]
adlai (directed by m night shamalayan) [21:15]
mircea_popescu "Dude that runs Mpex is a crazy narcissist that happened to get rich (if he cashed out) from being an early adopter. I think the MPEX buy-in was 10k coins just for a seat at the table even after the price hit $30. He also just consented to a $50k fine from the SEC for selling unregistered securities." [21:16]
mircea_popescu o.O [21:16]
mircea_popescu adlai yeah, all this "satoshi this satoshi that" will be heard until the 1mn hoard quietly splits one night. [21:16]
mircea_popescu then it sudden;y won't ever be a topic mentioned again by the ~500 or so fake reddit accounts working at creating "consensus" of "the community" [21:17]
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kakobrekla no he didnt cash out, he is still poor. [21:17]
kakobrekla o wait this isnt the forum [21:17]
mircea_popescu ima ask the sec to give me 50k i apparently paid them ? [21:18]
BigBitz SEC. lol. [21:18]
mircea_popescu brb where's that email address... [21:18]
mircea_popescu "This guy owns enough BTC to crash the price to 0 on the fork if it develops. Basically imagine launching an altcoin that starts out with the current blockchain as genesis. Then imagine a huge holder acting to destroy this altcoin to protect the original Bitcoin." [21:18]
BigBitz in Romania. LOL. [21:18]
mircea_popescu "This is one of the shittiest pieces of fear mongering I've ever read. Hard forking is and should be a natural and regular occurance and never has any hard fork ever threatened the block chain. It's called natural selection. Have a little faith in the educated masses" [21:19]
mircea_popescu dude... [21:19]
mircea_popescu reddit is actually pretty great lulz [21:20]
cazalla easter eggs on shelves here in australia and it's only 2nd week of january lol [21:23]
mircea_popescu ew [21:23]
mircea_popescu how long are those supposed to keep [21:23]
cazalla forever i think [21:23]
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mircea_popescu sounds unappetizing [21:29]
kakobrekla you dont actually eat them. [21:30]
davout cazalla: not very surprising coming from a people that sells oysters already opened [21:30]
davout oysters. they're opened. right. [21:31]
mircea_popescu lol [21:31]
mircea_popescu plenty of restaurants bring them open to the table tho [21:31]
davout that's even a worse offense to humanity than vegemite and the australian accent combined [21:32]
mircea_popescu da fuck is vegemite [21:32]
decimation yeah in the us it is common to get oysters seved open [21:32]
decimation it's the shit at the bottom of a beer barrel after fermentation is done [21:33]
davout mircea_popescu: of course, i'm speaking about stores, where the oysters are presented like that [21:33]
mircea_popescu o lordy. [21:33]
mircea_popescu davout ever showed you the alleged "salmon" that was jet black ? [21:33]
davout god forbid you confuse vegemite for nutella. YOU'RE GONNA HAVE A BAD TIME [21:33]
davout mircea_popescu: that sort of rings a bell, was that in bsas? i kind of remember you mentioning some sort of cheese too [21:34]
mircea_popescu yeah it was [21:34]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 27650 @ 0.00062835 = 17.3739 BTC [+] {3} [21:34]
decimation https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vegemite << [21:34]
decimation Vegemite (/ˈvɛdʒɨmaɪt/ VEJ-ə-myt)[2][3] is a dark brown Australian food paste made from leftover brewers' yeast extract with various vegetable and spice additives developed by Cyril P. Callister in Melbourne, Victoria, in 1922.[4] A popular spread for sandwiches, toast, crumpets and cracker biscuits as well as a filling for pastries, Vegemite is similar to British, New Zealand and South African Marmite, Australian Promite, [21:34]
assbot Vegemite - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ... ( http://bit.ly/1A6ooio ) [21:34]
decimation Swiss Cenovis and German Hefeextrakt. [21:34]
decimation mmm bread with yeast shit on top [21:35]
davout a filling. for pastries. [21:35]
davout wtf [21:35]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 28950 @ 0.0006145 = 17.7898 BTC [-] [21:36]
decimation in france they fill pastries with almond paste; in australia, with yeast shit [21:36]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 91686 @ 0.00058866 = 53.9719 BTC [-] {10} [21:37]
davout decimation: tbh the almond pastry thing is usually bakeries recycling yesterday's pastries [21:38]
mircea_popescu i think that may actually be required for people with no better source of b complex / colon flora [21:38]
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davout "oh that croissant from yesterday is hard? let's just soak it in that delicious milk+almonds thing and sell it under a different name" delicious nonetheless [21:38]
mircea_popescu well either that or shit transplant from europeans [21:38]
decimation heh interesting, didn't know that [21:39]
decimation mircea_popescu: yeah that's a good theory [21:39]
decimation gut flora are probably more important than we know [21:39]
davout https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=919629.msg10119424#msg10119424 "Devs, Miners, Traders: they are the three branches of Bitcoin Government. They check and balance each other. Traders and miners have ruled too long. Their power is waning. It's time for devs to bring hope and change to the Bitcoin community. Then we can come back stronger." [21:40]
mircea_popescu we kinda know... [21:40]
assbot Fork off ... ( http://bit.ly/17yejE3 ) [21:40]
mircea_popescu lolwut [21:40]
davout the interesting in this bit is that if you s/devs/power rangers/ it works just as fucking well, if not better [21:42]
mircea_popescu quite stable this abstract grammar. [21:42]
davout what ? [21:44]
mircea_popescu whatever bitcointalk speaks, it's very stable. [21:46]
mircea_popescu resists transforms. [21:46]
asciilifeform 'It's time for devs to bring hope and change to the Bitcoin community' << trololol! [21:46]
asciilifeform can any of these really be 'for real' ? [21:46]
davout oic [21:46]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform no but see ? lol [21:46]
mircea_popescu i doubt it was ever in history the case that idiots supporting something did so much damage to it by its attempts at supporting it. [21:47]
assbot [HAVELOCK] [AMHASH1] 2100 @ 0.00081098 = 1.7031 BTC [-] {10} [21:47]
mircea_popescu kinda a resplendent showcase of why one does not really want to be on the side of idiots. [21:48]
mircea_popescu s/its/their/ [21:49]
asciilifeform "oh, we included code but we had no idea what it does" sort of approach to code-is-spec specwork << this is actually a very serious boojum, beyond what most realize. i'll give example. [21:50]
mircea_popescu i kinda think we realise... [21:51]
asciilifeform if you're doing crypto-whatever (e.g., 'gossipd') and you're gonna process signatures from pgp [21:51]
asciilifeform now have to decide 'OAEP' or 'PKCS#1' ? [21:51]
asciilifeform and how does your $library actually implement this [21:52]
asciilifeform etc [21:52]
asciilifeform imho this is the crevice where the remaining mice live, for the record. [21:52]
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oglafbot http://oglaf.com/panacea/ [21:52]
assbot panacea ... ( http://bit.ly/17ygd7L ) [21:52]
* oglafbot is now known as BingoBoingo [21:52]
asciilifeform idiotically complex solution to a quite simple problem, and there is no opting out if you want compatibility with anything [21:52]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform nah, all code statically linked. [21:54]
mircea_popescu everything gossipd uses is thereby forked and frozen. [21:54]
asciilifeform naturally [21:55]
mircea_popescu and that's that. [21:55]
asciilifeform that doesn't solve the mystery meat problem [21:55]
mircea_popescu it specifies the mystery meat is all. [21:55]
* asciilifeform was answering 'we included code but we had no idea what it does' [21:56]
asciilifeform do artifexd, mircea_popescu, (who else in there?) understand the 'oeap' or 'pkcs#1' routine that is to be used in 'gossip' ? [21:57]
asciilifeform just as one example [21:57]
mircea_popescu https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=919629.msg10118626#msg10118626 << fwiw, cooler heads seem to have caught on and are in danger of prevaling. which'll make this play out exactly as a mtgox 2.0 (i asked for tux' head on a platter in april, "community" protected him for a few months, i got head delivered february next. wonder if gavin makes it that long)_ [21:57]
assbot Fork off ... ( http://bit.ly/17ygYxt ) [21:57]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform the original complaint was more of a "we include names, do not know what code they stand for" [21:58]
asciilifeform hm. [21:58]
mircea_popescu slighjtly more egregious violation of same principle. [21:58]
mircea_popescu bvut the recent openss; ecdsa library issue ? it's because they pulled "ecdsa" [21:58]
mircea_popescu not specified code, just a name [21:58]
mircea_popescu code had changed. [21:58]
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asciilifeform that kind of behaviour is more or less the same as asking for a, e.g., 'ld_preload attack' or the like. [21:59]
mircea_popescu quite. [21:59]
mircea_popescu but it's how they're bringing "hope and change" to bitcoin, or w/e it was they were bringing. [22:00]
cazalla cazalla: not very surprising coming from a people that sells oysters already opened <<< ever had Sydney rock oysters? [22:00]
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davout cazalla: never. been to sydney only a couple of days, lived in melbourne for a while tho, where i witnessed the unspeakable horror of these oysters being sold already opened [22:03]
cazalla davout, well agreed there, i won't buy and eat them from fish market in melbourne but while living near Sydney, happy to shove as many down my gullet as possible [22:04]
davout they look pretty different from what i'm used to, pretty fat and appealing :D [22:04]
decimation asciilifeform: re: tieteixobactin << My outsider view is that microbiology has been more busy derping with 'computing dna' rather than actually studying microbes [22:04]
BingoBoingo decimation: And that's why the people who made the jump to culturing forest organisms in dirt found a useful. [22:06]
cazalla davout, in fact, Melbourne is all round pretty shit for seafood besides king george whiting [22:06]
davout no trouble beliebing that [22:08]
danielpbarron they are starting to call the real bitcoin "MPcoin" [22:09]
mircea_popescu lol [22:10]
mircea_popescu flattering huh. [22:10]
mircea_popescu "mp got bitcoin renamed in his honor by not doing things! now that's the true entrepreneurial spirit!" [22:11]
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BingoBoingo !b 1 [22:17]
assbot Last 1 lines bashed and pending review. ( http://dpaste.com/1T25PP9.txt ) [22:17]
cazalla ;;rate -100000 davout__ doesn't like vegemite, attacks vegemite [22:19]
gribble Error: 'davout__' is not a valid integer. [22:19]
mircea_popescu no really this shit is beautiful. so, libertards that think they're part of bitcoin come up with the idea to fork bitcoin to make it moar libertardcoin. mp says "fu and your gavincoin". now, they do understand that leaving the issue as bitcoin vs gavincoin pretty much settles the propaganda angle. [22:20]
cazalla i'm not sure if there is anything better than butter soaked bread topped with an inch of vegemite [22:20]
davout ;;rate -10000 cazalla__ lives upside down [22:20]
gribble Error: 'cazalla__' is not a valid integer. [22:20]
mircea_popescu so they'd rather it be mpcoin vs "bitcoin". except... if the gavincoin chain fails, this in effect renames bitcoin after me. [22:20]
mircea_popescu so their attempt to fork bitcoin escalated, because before they can in earnest get to that, they have to resolve a namefork [22:20]
mircea_popescu holy shit is postmodernity amusing. [22:20]
BingoBoingo It really is. [22:21]
mircea_popescu i wonder which way they end up solving it. [22:21]
BingoBoingo I'm surprised it took so long for the coin name for issue to resolve [22:21]
mircea_popescu ie, how soon do they concede defeat. [22:21]
mircea_popescu cuz it's hard! [22:21]
BingoBoingo Well, they are going to stop saying MP coin soon I imagine, because... They still base their idea of MP wealth on that dorky tortilla chart from god knows how long ago. [22:22]
BingoBoingo Not the handlers, but the muppets. [22:23]
BingoBoingo Or maybe the handlers too. [22:23]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 40150 @ 0.00053706 = 21.563 BTC [-] {3} [22:23]
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BingoBoingo !up soypirate [22:32]
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BingoBoingo https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/2s2yp1/is_bitpay_spending_too_much_9_employees_were_laid/cnlzirx << lol [22:32]
assbot zomg_pwn comments on Is Bitpay spending too much? 9 employees were laid off last week. ... ( http://bit.ly/1DzeWui ) [22:32]
artifexd ;;later tell nubbins` Do you have an common casascius coins you want to sell? I sold a dozen and would like to replace them. [22:35]
gribble The operation succeeded. [22:35]
kakobrekla how much? [22:36]
artifexd Me? [22:36]
kakobrekla yes [22:36]
artifexd 2BTC each [22:36]
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artifexd If I can replace them for 1.35BTC each (or less), I will. [22:37]
kakobrekla the brass is .35 when btc is 100 or 1000. [22:37]
kakobrekla pure brass. [22:38]
artifexd Yep [22:38]
kakobrekla or 1 btc for idijots. [22:38]
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artifexd Pretty much. [22:39]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 26265 @ 0.00053217 = 13.9774 BTC [-] {3} [22:40]
decimation ;;ticker [22:40]
gribble Bitstamp BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 266.89, Best ask: 267.49, Bid-ask spread: 0.60000, Last trade: 267.49, 24 hour volume: 12512.85539594, 24 hour low: 262.08, 24 hour high: 280.94, 24 hour vwap: 0 [22:40]
kakobrekla 266, previous top. [22:41]
kakobrekla gonner. [22:41]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 22669 @ 0.00050355 = 11.415 BTC [-] {4} [22:41]
* jborkl (~jborkl@unaffiliated/jborkl) has joined #bitcoin-assets [22:47]
cazalla lulz, poor krebs https://twitter.com/notchF/status/554433535579545600 [22:50]
assbot Don't get smoked http://t.co/GtXDUyOpCx [22:50]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16200 @ 0.00050323 = 8.1523 BTC [-] [22:50]
BingoBoingo Retard, that's not a bullet with the name on it that's just a fucking casing. [22:54]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 26768 @ 0.00050323 = 13.4705 BTC [-] [22:57]
mircea_popescu BingoBoingo seems qntra is doing pretty well these days huh [22:58]
kakobrekla lots of 'impressions' ? :) [22:58]
BingoBoingo mircea_popescu: Yeah. It really does. It's been a fight getting credibility from people on the fence. Took a few days for people to realize the BitPay layoff article wasn't bullshit. [22:59]
mircea_popescu aha [23:00]
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BingoBoingo f3d1b8ad2e31887ad33695f3e58a4df946cf8020e6f98ce598528ba5d6583bd3 [23:01]
* assbot removes voice from soypirate [23:03]
* assbot removes voice from sinetek [23:03]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 23600 @ 0.00054405 = 12.8396 BTC [+] {2} [23:03]
* sinetek (~quassel@modemcable152.213-56-74.mc.videotron.ca) has left #bitcoin-assets [23:05]
assbot [HAVELOCK] [AMHASH1] 1243 @ 0.0008275 = 1.0286 BTC [-] {6} [23:08]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8800 @ 0.00054411 = 4.7882 BTC [+] [23:10]
mircea_popescu $depth s.qntr [23:11]
empyex mircea_popescu: [S.QNTR] Bids: 2000 @ 0.00015000 7089 @ 0.00013514 20000 @ 0.00012995 100000 @ 0.00009995 [23:11]
empyex mircea_popescu: [S.QNTR] Asks: 50 @ 0.00017400 550 @ 0.00017500 50 @ 0.00030000 [23:11]
mircea_popescu dat imbalance O.o [23:11]
assbot [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 20 @ 0.10513001 = 2.1026 BTC [-] [23:12]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10000 @ 0.00054411 = 5.4411 BTC [+] {2} [23:13]
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BingoBoingo Wax sealing, making a comeback http://bitcoinwaxstamp.com/?product=the-pawn [23:22]
* Blazedout419 is now known as Guest77706 [23:22]
assbot The Pawn | Bitcoin Wax Stamp ... ( http://bit.ly/1xetcjA ) [23:22]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 23993 @ 0.00050323 = 12.074 BTC [-] [23:38]
* Guest77706 is now known as Blazedout419 [23:40]
* Blazedout419 is now known as Guest91330 [23:40]
BingoBoingo https://twitter.com/BBoingo/status/554465983768039424 [23:43]
assbot . /btc_feed Really you aren't going to cite the source http://t.co/j5ClkrUzCo you quote in your layoffs article http://t.co/firoaZwLPP [23:43]
BingoBoingo ^ San Francisco Ethics [23:43]
mircea_popescu BingoBoingo shameful. [23:49]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11700 @ 0.00051462 = 6.0211 BTC [+] [23:55]
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