Forum logs for 10 Apr 2015

Sunday, 24 November, Year 11 d.Tr. | Author: Mircea Popescu

assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 106000 @ 0.00024403 = 25.8672 BTC [-] {4}	[00:03]
[]bot	Bet placed: 3.1 BTC for No on "Silver at or over $22/oz before October" http://bitbet.us/bet/1132/ Odds: 20(Y):80(N) by coin, 22(Y):78(N) by weight. Total bet: 9.955139 BTC. Current weight: 90,058.	[00:12]
[]bot	Bet placed: 2 BTC for No on "Obama Approval Rating over 50% before July" http://bitbet.us/bet/1090/ Odds: 14(Y):86(N) by coin, 20(Y):80(N) by weight. Total bet: 3.13121127 BTC. Current weight: 42,499.	[00:13]
[]bot	Bet placed: 5 BTC for No on "Light Sweet Crude Oil (WTI) to drop under $35 before June " http://bitbet.us/bet/1129/ Odds: 6(Y):94(N) by coin, 7(Y):93(N) by weight. Total bet: 24.21280975 BTC. Current weight: 62,947.	[00:13]
[]bot	Bet placed: 10 BTC for No on "Bitcoin to drop under $150 before July" http://bitbet.us/bet/1133/ Odds: 9(Y):91(N) by coin, 9(Y):91(N) by weight. Total bet: 25.79172615 BTC. Current weight: 85,740.	[00:13]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 29200 @ 0.0002407 = 7.0284 BTC [-] {2}	[00:14]
*	Lycerion_ (~Lycerion@unaffiliated/lycerion) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[00:21]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 19150 @ 0.00023945 = 4.5855 BTC [-]	[00:24]
*	NewLiberty (~NewLibert@2602:304:cff8:1580:cdc8:68ab:7a0a:e5ef) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[00:24]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 60500 @ 0.00025278 = 15.2932 BTC [+]	[00:27]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 91340 @ 0.00025387 = 23.1885 BTC [+] {2}	[01:11]
BingoBoingo	;;later tell cazalla halp	[01:34]
gribble	The operation succeeded.	[01:34]
BingoBoingo	So if Cardinals beat the reda tomorrow I will make the bet Saturday	[01:35]
BingoBoingo	http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2015/04/pepper-spraying-drones-will-be-used-on-indian-protesters/ << Chemical weapins drones for whoever wants	[01:36]
assbot	Pepper-spraying drones will be used on Indian protesters \| Ars Technica ... ( http://bit.ly/1acRXc5 )	[01:36]
*	IHB (7aac2d6d@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.122.172.45.109) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[01:37]
BingoBoingo	!up IHB	[01:39]
*	assbot gives voice to IHB	[01:39]
BingoBoingo	Hello IHB	[01:39]
BingoBoingo	IHB: How goes your newsing?	[01:40]
*	BingoBoingo concedes IhB.io looks better for javascript users	[01:43]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 127300 @ 0.00024417 = 31.0828 BTC [-]	[01:44]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 99940 @ 0.00025888 = 25.8725 BTC [+] {2}	[01:46]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 146510 @ 0.00026566 = 38.9218 BTC [+] {2}	[01:47]
*	The20YearIRCloud has quit (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)	[01:48]
IHB	it was DDos attacked	[01:52]
IHB	last night	[01:52]
IHB	that's why i came on here	[01:52]
IHB	to tell you guys	[01:52]
IHB	BTC GAW fucking scm	[01:52]
IHB	scam	[01:52]
IHB	did qntra call it out?	[01:52]
IHB	sorry in india now	[01:53]
IHB	my internet is shoddy sometimes	[01:53]
BingoBoingo	IHB: Yeah, qntra didn't have anything on them in particular because BTCgaw followed the exact same for as a scam previously called out.	[01:53]
BingoBoingo	No worries about your connectivity	[01:53]
BingoBoingo	Qntra was born in a multi gbp/s DDoS	[01:53]
IHB	Brief due diligence	[01:53]
IHB	There is no Privacy Policy	[01:54]
IHB	There is no Terms of Services Statement	[01:54]
IHB	There is no Team Page	[01:54]
IHB	Laila Risan is listed as the domain contact, She is located in Norway.	[01:54]
IHB	Tony Gaw is quoted as being the founder, no LinkedIn profile or any other presence on the internet.	[01:54]
IHB	There are a lot of red flags, not limited to the “supposed” $1.6 million investment	[01:54]
BingoBoingo	IHB: Would you like to diversify your newsing equity? Qntra is always hungry for posts... If you can offer a BTCgaw post for the qntra you can get a share per word	[01:55]
BingoBoingo	Yeah Tony Gaw likely never was a person	[01:55]
IHB	dude. i would totally get invovled	[01:56]
IHB	but i have never done a key siging	[01:56]
IHB	and my pgp has zero points on WoT	[01:56]
BingoBoingo	IHB: I will just need a fingerprint for your key and a nick to associate it to.	[01:57]
BingoBoingo	IHB: You do good work. I see you have included qntra in your aggregator. I am grateful.	[01:57]
IHB	so how does this work? IHB is shutting down anyway and i am concentrating on an iPhone app and API we have been building.	[01:58]
BingoBoingo	IHB: Is it shutting down entirely or are you keeping the domain>	[01:58]
BingoBoingo	?	[01:58]
IHB	yeah, that aggregator is feedly. will send you the .opml file. i think i have a lot of the good sites to follow. would love it if you see any missing	[01:58]
BingoBoingo	IHB: So what exactly is the catalyst for shutting down? Did DDoS get expensive?	[01:59]
IHB	keeping the domain. not making any rash decsions now. we have some good backlinks. may redirect to new domain	[01:59]
BingoBoingo	Or something else?	[01:59]
IHB	no. IHB costs were minimal. i have been bootstrappping since end of 2013. in the behind been working on an API and now we are finally in the last phase of development. my efforts need to be there	[02:00]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [AM1] 200 @ 0.0089406 = 1.7881 BTC [-] {3}	[02:00]
BingoBoingo	IHB: So if you want to submit email in plaintext to myself and cazalla your piece. Make sure you include a GPG fingerprint and have the GPG key registered to a nick in the assbot wot	[02:02]
BingoBoingo	I will offer the standard disclaimer that s.qntr shares are as volatile as fuck and we have no revenue yet	[02:03]
*	assbot removes voice from IHB	[02:09]
*	DreadKnight has quit (Quit: #AncientBeast - Master Your Beasts ( www.AncientBeast.com ))	[02:10]
BingoBoingo	!up IHB	[02:12]
*	assbot gives voice to IHB	[02:12]
*	IHB has quit (Quit: http://www.kiwiirc.com/ - A hand crafted IRC client)	[02:16]
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*	Lycerion_ is now known as Lycerion	[02:32]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 132350 @ 0.00026741 = 35.3917 BTC [+]	[02:35]
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[]bot	Bet created: "Yandex drop under Google before 2016" http://bitbet.us/bet/1134/	[02:45]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 123990 @ 0.00026791 = 33.2182 BTC [+] {3}	[02:49]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 51710 @ 0.00027089 = 14.0077 BTC [+]	[02:55]
*	danielpbarron has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)	[03:01]
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*	ColinT (~ColinT@69-11-97-130.regn.static.sasknet.sk.ca) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[03:04]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 130919 @ 0.00026919 = 35.2421 BTC [-] {2}	[03:05]
mircea_popescu	!gettrust ihb	[03:12]
assbot	ihb is not registered in WoT.	[03:12]
mircea_popescu	get inb the wot eh.	[03:12]
*	Guest69657 is now known as cazalla	[03:15]
*	cazalla has quit (Changing host)	[03:15]
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*	assbot gives voice to cazalla	[03:24]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 222750 @ 0.00027875 = 62.0916 BTC [+] {2}	[03:26]
*	ColinT has quit (Quit: Linkinus - http://linkinus.com)	[03:37]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 167900 @ 0.00027313 = 45.8585 BTC [-]	[03:48]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 153200 @ 0.00028002 = 42.8991 BTC [+] {3}	[03:53]
*	ColinT (~ColinT@69-11-97-130.regn.static.sasknet.sk.ca) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[03:53]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 67650 @ 0.00027707 = 18.7438 BTC [-]	[03:57]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13350 @ 0.00027752 = 3.7049 BTC [+]	[04:04]
*	hktud0 has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)	[04:11]
*	hktud0 (wq@unaffiliated/fluffybunny) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[04:14]
[]bot	Bet placed: 1 BTC for No on "Bitcoin to drop under $150 before July" http://bitbet.us/bet/1133/ Odds: 8(Y):92(N) by coin, 9(Y):91(N) by weight. Total bet: 26.79172615 BTC. Current weight: 85,528.	[04:25]
[]bot	Bet placed: 2 BTC for No on "BTC to top $700 before 1st July" http://bitbet.us/bet/1128/ Odds: 9(Y):91(N) by coin, 10(Y):90(N) by weight. Total bet: 145.16184834 BTC. Current weight: 65,659.	[04:25]
mircea_popescu	dude if that 700 bet comes out yes...	[04:28]
*	pete_dushenski (~pete_dush@unaffiliated/pete-dushenski/x-8158685) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[04:38]
*	assbot gives voice to pete_dushenski	[04:39]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 158700 @ 0.00027707 = 43.971 BTC [-]	[04:43]
pete_dushenski	;;later tell BingoBoingo qntra sub for your consideration : http://dpaste.com/098PGV3.txt	[04:44]
gribble	The operation succeeded.	[04:44]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1FqrDcp )	[04:44]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 209300 @ 0.00027255 = 57.0447 BTC [-] {3}	[04:44]
pete_dushenski	;;later tell cazalla same but for your key : http://dpaste.com/18Y9W7Z.txt	[04:45]
gribble	The operation succeeded.	[04:45]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1FqrQwf )	[04:45]
mircea_popescu	haha this gpg shit is hot.	[04:45]
pete_dushenski	it's trendy shit for sure	[04:46]
pete_dushenski	soon there'll be smartphone apps and errything	[04:46]
pete_dushenski	and smartwatch apps that use your heartbeat to sign	[04:47]
cazalla	trendy lol, i gotta lug your shit to the other room to decrypt it! nothing trendy about that	[04:47]
Chillum	smartwatches are nice but I prefer my mechanical Omega	[04:47]
pete_dushenski	cazalla: wat do you mean ? walking is the trendiest shit going	[04:47]
*	joecool has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)	[04:47]
pete_dushenski	it's all healthy and progressive and carbon neutral	[04:47]
Chillum	I walk, but only ironically	[04:48]
pete_dushenski	lol	[04:48]
pete_dushenski	so... backwards down the sidewalk ?	[04:48]
*	pete_dushenski does this on occasion	[04:48]
Chillum	backwards up the sidewalk	[04:48]
Chillum	need sleep, must leave computer	[04:49]
pete_dushenski	speaking of up the sidewalk, looks like our little town here is getting its very own funicular in the next couple years	[04:49]
pete_dushenski	Chillum: bon soir, man	[04:50]
pete_dushenski	http://blogs.edmontonjournal.com/2015/04/09/fun-with-funiculars-sliding-into-edmontons-past/ << oh, turns out edmonton already had a funicalar... 100 years ago	[04:52]
assbot	Fun with Funiculars: Sliding into Edmonton’s Past \| Edmonton Journal ... ( http://bit.ly/1Fqt8Y7 )	[04:52]
pete_dushenski	and the old one moved draught horses up and down the river valley	[04:53]
pete_dushenski	fuck me that's cool	[04:53]
mircea_popescu	funicular funiculaaah	[04:54]
mircea_popescu	largo'al factotum de la citta de la citta deeee laaaa ciiiiiittaa!	[04:54]
pete_dushenski	i feel a seinfeld joke coming on	[04:54]
mircea_popescu	https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yTSAZAHiOa8	[04:54]
assbot	Luciano Pavarotti - Funiculì Funiculà - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1FHrkar )	[04:54]
pete_dushenski	hah or that!	[04:55]
pete_dushenski	so today was ram upgrade day at the dushenski residence !	[04:56]
pete_dushenski	my numero uno is now rocking 32 gb of ecc ram	[04:56]
pete_dushenski	which is easily the most i've ever had in a desktop, so i'm quite looking forward to seeing how it performs	[04:56]
mircea_popescu	nb.	[04:57]
pete_dushenski	i was pleasantly surprised at how inexpensive memory is for these older machine.	[05:00]
pete_dushenski	about 1/4 of the newer ones	[05:00]
*	gabriel_laddel (~user@unaffiliated/gabriel-laddel/x-9909917) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[05:01]
*	ColinT has quit (Quit: Leaving...)	[05:01]
mircea_popescu	http://rs1img.memecdn.com/i-hate-it-when-i-sit-down-and-i-suddenly-turn-in-to-a-dog_o_703132.jpg	[05:02]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1FHrXRe )	[05:02]
cazalla	pete_dushenski, http://qntra.net/2015/04/battle-for-the-right-to-play-old-multiplayer-games-take-shape/	[05:05]
assbot	Battle for the right to play old multiplayer games take shape. \| Qntra.net ... ( http://bit.ly/1FHsfYz )	[05:05]
mircea_popescu	an' this one's for fluffypony : http://rs1img.memecdn.com/Dont-Sit-On-The-Keybord-Ok_o_119368.jpg	[05:06]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1FHskeR )	[05:06]
fluffypony	LOL	[05:06]
pete_dushenski	cazalla: nice!	[05:07]
*	gabriel_laddel (~user@unaffiliated/gabriel-laddel/x-9909917) has left #bitcoin-assets	[05:11]
pete_dushenski	http://shop.gluglug.org.uk/product/libreboot-x200/ << can't quite see the sense in a $500 laptop differentiated from its $100 donor by two pieces of free software	[05:13]
assbot	Libreboot X200 \| The Gluglug ... ( http://bit.ly/1FHsUcp )	[05:13]
pete_dushenski	but hey, freedom isn't free, right ?	[05:13]
mircea_popescu	pete_dushenski " Januseque " ?	[05:14]
pete_dushenski	two-faced roman god ?	[05:14]
pete_dushenski	janus ?	[05:14]
mircea_popescu	how about "Janus-esque god of Plasticated Profits" ?	[05:14]
mircea_popescu	you need that s in any case.	[05:15]
pete_dushenski	i have no objection to that improvement	[05:15]
pete_dushenski	mircea_popescu: speaking of tweaks, you have "gullbile" in your last article in footnote v	[05:18]
mircea_popescu	gull ahahaha	[05:18]
mircea_popescu	epic.	[05:18]
cazalla	janus in goldeneye too from memory	[05:20]
pete_dushenski	speaking of which, some buddies and i are convening next weekend to play goldeneye for n64	[05:21]
pete_dushenski	and mario kart	[05:21]
cazalla	ya know ya never could, never will fps on a console regardless of how nostalgic goldeneye may seem	[05:22]
cazalla	mario kart on the other hand..	[05:22]
pete_dushenski	007 was the only fps i ever even tried to learn	[05:23]
pete_dushenski	the newer ones are too... fast	[05:23]
*	The_Shrander (570e8e41@gateway/web/freenode/ip.87.14.142.65) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[05:24]
cazalla	pc master race for fps	[05:24]
pete_dushenski	that an f1 game ?	[05:24]
*	The_Shrander (570e8e41@gateway/web/freenode/ip.87.14.142.65) has left #bitcoin-assets	[05:25]
cazalla	no i mean pc is the master race with quake, n64 fps is the nigger with goldeneye	[05:25]
pete_dushenski	lolk	[05:25]
cazalla	or that halo shit with 640x320 res, aim assist, auto aim etc etc	[05:25]
pete_dushenski	i honestly don't give a shit about any of them	[05:26]
*	wyrdmantis (570e8e41@gateway/web/freenode/ip.87.14.142.65) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[05:26]
pete_dushenski	but it'll be a fun time with the boys	[05:26]
pete_dushenski	allow us to show a little of that competitive spirit we otherwise aim only at jobs and girls	[05:27]
pete_dushenski	and speaking of janus, for any car buffs reading the logs, there was a very limited production car built by german firm zundapp in the mid-1950's by this name	[05:27]
pete_dushenski	i saw it at a motormuseum in berlin 2-3 years ago, just trying to dig up the picture now	[05:28]
mircea_popescu	!up wyrdmantis	[05:29]
-assbot-	You voiced wyrdmantis for 30 minutes.	[05:29]
*	assbot gives voice to wyrdmantis	[05:29]
cazalla	but you can't be competitive on a console	[05:35]
cazalla	anyway, don't pay too close attention, stuck into 3rd beer already	[05:35]
pete_dushenski	http://www.contravex.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/04/1957-Zundapp-Janus-placard.jpg	[05:36]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1FHuURP )	[05:36]
pete_dushenski	http://www.contravex.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/04/1957-Zundapp-Janus.jpg	[05:36]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1FHuV8t )	[05:36]
*	wyrdmantis has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)	[05:37]
pete_dushenski	had mp not written that little article today, i might've posted these on imgur lol	[05:37]
pete_dushenski	cazalla: tis all good, i see what you mean and i don't disagree	[05:37]
*	The_Shrander (570e8e41@gateway/web/freenode/ip.87.14.142.65) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[05:38]
pete_dushenski	my pc gaming was just limited to starcraft and age of empires	[05:38]
pete_dushenski	why be the foot soldier when you can be the general in teh sky ?	[05:38]
mircea_popescu	!up The_Shrander	[05:41]
-assbot-	You voiced The_Shrander for 30 minutes.	[05:41]
*	assbot gives voice to The_Shrander	[05:41]
The_Shrander	thanks MP :)	[05:43]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 104900 @ 0.00027752 = 29.1118 BTC [+]	[05:43]
The_Shrander	hi to all, have you seen this? http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/3213nc/all_trezor_users_should_update_their_firmware_for/	[05:43]
assbot	All TREZOR users should update their firmware for protection against a physical attack - Extracting the Private Key from a TREZOR with a $70 Oscilloscope : Bitcoin ... ( http://bit.ly/1FqDPty )	[05:43]
pete_dushenski	heh. i dun think anyone here really trusted trezors to begin with	[05:44]
pete_dushenski	though i think it was kako who bought a couple of them ? mebbe some others too.	[05:44]
pete_dushenski	they're sort of in the 'yubikey' camp of 'blackbox toy crypto that plugs into usb'	[05:45]
mircea_popescu	The_Shrander no, but it is kinda lulzy. in any case trezor had mixed reviews at best here.	[05:47]
mircea_popescu	!s trezor	[05:47]
assbot	135 results for 'trezor' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=trezor	[05:47]
The_Shrander	very very lulz	[05:50]
*	The_Shrander is now known as wyrdmantis	[05:51]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 96162 @ 0.00027781 = 26.7148 BTC [+] {2}	[05:53]
wyrdmantis	mmm, i've made a mess with nicknames	[05:53]
mircea_popescu	!gettrust wyrdmantis	[05:57]
assbot	Trust relationship from user mircea_popescu to user wyrdmantis: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 1 via 1 connections. \| http://w.b-a.link/trust/mircea_popescu/wyrdmantis \| http://w.b-a.link/user/wyrdmantis	[05:57]
mircea_popescu	should be able to self up anyway	[05:57]
mircea_popescu	in other news, jailbait is jailbait-y. http://41.media.tumblr.com/82e27f84a791f636193e7fca23c634c5/tumblr_nepx0rpWAr1qm6pfzo1_1280.jpg	[05:58]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1FqGzY1 )	[05:58]
*	Now talking on #bitcoin-assets	[11:32]
*	Topic for #bitcoin-assets is: http://bitcoin-assets.com \|\| http://log.bitcoin-assets.com \|\| http://bash.bitcoin-assets.com \|\| http://blogs.bitcoin-assets.com	[11:32]
*	Topic for #bitcoin-assets set by kakobrekla!~kako@unaffiliated/kakobrekla at Wed Mar 5 16:58:12 2014	[11:32]
-assbot-	Welcome to #bitcoin-assets. To get voice (ie, to be able to speak), send me "!up" in a private message to get an OTP. You must have a sufficient WoT rating. If you do not have a WoT account or sufficient rating, try politely asking one of the voiced people for a temporary voice.	[11:32]
*	assbot gives voice to mircea_popescu	[11:33]
mircea_popescu	heh watching that s.mpoe is like daytime drama i swear.	[11:34]
*	PeterL (~peterl@unaffiliated/peterl) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[11:36]
*	assbot gives voice to PeterL	[11:37]
mats	http://www.azimuthsecurity.com/resources/bh2009_mcdonald_valasek.pdf << this and the other link are the best windows heap exploitation papers ive read so far	[11:40]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 35761 @ 0.00028322 = 10.1282 BTC [-]	[11:42]
mats	http://www.randalolson.com/2014/05/24/a-data-driven-exploration-of-the-evolution-of-chess-match-lengths-and-outcomes/ via HN	[11:45]
assbot	Evolution of chess: Game lengths and outcomes \| Randal S. Olson ... ( http://bit.ly/1FulpDd )	[11:45]
mircea_popescu	mats how much have you slept past week ?	[11:47]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [RENT] 85 @ 0.01455797 = 1.2374 BTC [+] {5}	[11:48]
mats	probs 3-4 hours a night	[11:49]
mircea_popescu	why is that ?	[11:50]
mats	work has been hectic	[11:57]
mircea_popescu	you know it's a major sign of early onset schizophrenia among other unsavory things ?	[11:59]
mircea_popescu	go get some sleep.	[11:59]
mats	maybe ill take a nap during lunch	[12:00]
mircea_popescu	how about a nice 12 hour undisturbed window ?	[12:01]
mats	ill give it a go. a couple family members have schizophrenia... no idea if its heritable but i should definitely be more careful	[12:03]
mike_c	<+mircea_popescu> you know it's a major sign of early onset schizophrenia among other unsavory things ? << unsavory things like parenthood..	[12:04]
mircea_popescu	it's not heritable but a weak indicator. and one of the prevailing theories is that it's kindled, ie, you could be fine but then you had to go stress it to all shit. 99% get ptsd, 1% actually gets schizo.	[12:04]
mircea_popescu	just a theory. nobody knows shit about their own head, let alone other peoples' anyway.	[12:04]
mircea_popescu	mike_c no see, it's not a sign of that, it's an effect of that. but yes :p	[12:04]
PeterL	mircea_popescu: you were looking for me?	[12:12]
BingoBoingo	it's not heritable but a weak indicator. and one of the prevailing theories is that it's kindled, ie, you could be fine but then you had to go stress it to all shit. 99% get ptsd, 1% actually gets schizo. << Kindling is the dominant theory among the credible people.	[12:13]
mircea_popescu	PeterL well scoopbot's dead ?	[12:13]
PeterL	I just restarted it, should show up any second now...	[12:13]
mircea_popescu	BingoBoingo im not terribru persuaded myself. but srsly, "get some sleep" is probably the best medical advice ever invented.	[12:13]
mircea_popescu	above even "have a glass of water would you."	[12:14]
mircea_popescu	PeterL kk.	[12:14]
BingoBoingo	Get some sleep, drink some water, is all solid advice	[12:14]
mike_c	and get a less stressful job.	[12:14]
mircea_popescu	up to about 30something, a job no matter how stressful is no big deal as long as you actually sleep and eat.	[12:15]
mircea_popescu	and even skipping a day or two. but when it becomes week-chronic...	[12:15]
*	scoopbot (peterl@unaffiliated/peterl/bot/scoopbot) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[12:16]
*	ChanServ gives voice to scoopbot	[12:16]
BingoBoingo	Cigarettes are my mental health plan.	[12:16]
mircea_popescu	this is the boon of late adolescence/early adulthood : that you can do any stressful job and you'll be fine. what you can't really do is slef-manage tho. which is kind of why i'm indignant over all the wastage sv/the us generally is doing to these eager kids making them "ceos" of "start-ups".	[12:16]
mircea_popescu	worst hr wastage conceivable.	[12:16]
mircea_popescu	but hey, not my country.	[12:17]
PeterL	I just started a new job this week, I am not sure how much time I will be able to spend here	[12:17]
mircea_popescu	PeterL have a preferred wakeup mechanism ?	[12:17]
PeterL	to wake me up?	[12:17]
mircea_popescu	say if scoopbot dies again or w/e.	[12:18]
mircea_popescu	some hot camho shows up wanting your babies.	[12:18]
BingoBoingo	!b 4	[12:18]
assbot	Last 4 lines bashed and pending review. ( http://dpaste.com/2241Z8S.txt )	[12:18]
PeterL	she can have them, they are obnoxious and climb on me all the time	[12:18]
mircea_popescu	she can't have them till you stick it in her yo.	[12:19]
PeterL	oh, you mean unborn babies	[12:19]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 72450 @ 0.0002765 = 20.0324 BTC [-]	[12:19]
mircea_popescu	lol	[12:20]
mircea_popescu	Lieutenant Gary Mandich, who was one of the many attendees and alleged participants in the lewd activities, told media, "Everyone needs to seriously lighten up. What do they expect? This is Vegas baby! They call this symposium 'Tail' hook for a reason!"	[12:20]
mircea_popescu	His statement led to a wave of public outcry which sparked numerous protests and demonstrations at the gates of naval bases across the U.S.	[12:20]
mircea_popescu	these people are nuts.	[12:20]
mircea_popescu	someone seriously had the time to crash gate bases "across the us" because some people hooked up at the hookup convention in vegas ?	[12:20]
mircea_popescu	us needs more jobs stat.	[12:20]
PeterL	maybe they are all retired people living off investment income?	[12:21]
mircea_popescu	protesting soldiers fucking ?	[12:22]
BingoBoingo	The US cattle control system has become too advanced to for any new jobs to exist that make sense.	[12:23]
mircea_popescu	what, from like florida ?	[12:23]
BingoBoingo	Well, between walmart and reddit, what can USian people do to create any value without letting the cows loose?	[12:25]
mircea_popescu	you know, free ranging is a thing.	[12:25]
mircea_popescu	"After his return to the USS Midway, in port in Seattle for Seafair, then Tailhook president Captain Rick Ludwig pulled all air wing commanding officers, staff, and flag staff officers and debriefed them on initial reports of misbehavior and incidents of fisticuffs in the hallways and on the patio by the pool."	[12:25]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 44056 @ 0.0002765 = 12.1815 BTC [-]	[12:25]
mircea_popescu	ok, nm, it doesn't seem like what i had in mind after all.	[12:26]
PeterL	so I started this week at Perrigo, the company stock jumped up 25%, therefore investors must like me, right?	[12:26]
mircea_popescu	PeterL was your name in a pr ?	[12:26]
PeterL	ummm, no, I guess not	[12:26]
BingoBoingo	mircea_popescu: Once you set the cows free they stop going to Walmart	[12:26]
mircea_popescu	notheywon't. and fuck walmart anyway, let it come up with its own business.	[12:26]
mircea_popescu	PeterL :p	[12:26]
PeterL	darn correlation / causation	[12:26]
mircea_popescu	had you said yes i'd have said "put it in your cv"	[12:26]
mircea_popescu	PeterL do they pay you in fourleaf clovers ?	[12:27]
PeterL	what?	[12:27]
mircea_popescu	isn't it an irish outfit ?	[12:27]
BingoBoingo	PeterL: You work for leprechauns	[12:27]
PeterL	no, but a perk is access to the company store to get cheap drugs	[12:28]
mircea_popescu	so when's the rave ?	[12:28]
PeterL	you rave with ibuprofen?	[12:28]
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mircea_popescu	i actually knew a 15yo set that did.	[12:28]
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PeterL	well, the company is "Irish", the CEO is here in michigan	[12:29]
BingoBoingo	PeterL: So he's a muslim leprechaun?	[12:29]
PeterL	muslims are all on the other side of the state, western MI is about as white as they come	[12:30]
mircea_popescu	women have no race either, that's a male thing.	[12:30]
PeterL	why don't women have race?	[12:31]
mircea_popescu	cuz men will fuck anything ?	[12:31]
PeterL	that makes no sense to me	[12:33]
mircea_popescu	it makes no sense to me either!	[12:34]
mircea_popescu	so check it out, Barbara Spyridon Pope, some woman briefly in a desk job at pentagon, refused Duvall McClellan Williams, Jr's whitewashing report on the tailhook thing. because this is a thing now, derpy bureaucrats can tell read admirals no. hey, "civil control of military".	[12:35]
mircea_popescu	after which her career abruptly ended and the guy resigned.	[12:35]
mircea_popescu	seems an extremely illuminating case to trace gender wars in us politics, this.	[12:35]
mircea_popescu	"Upon leaving government service, Pope joined Sunrise Senior Living as Director of Special Needs Assisted Living " << i wonder if they make her change adult diapers for the rest of her life now because of that incident.	[12:37]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 108389 @ 0.00028322 = 30.6979 BTC [+]	[12:42]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 69455 @ 0.00028426 = 19.7433 BTC [+] {2}	[12:45]
Adlai	fluffypony: your turd is even fatter than satoshi's	[12:45]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 48186 @ 0.00027226 = 13.1191 BTC [-]	[12:46]
mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-04-2015#1094644 << ah that they seriously intend to "release"...	[12:46]
assbot	Logged on 10-04-2015 12:49:45; mike_c: this is from the ethereum github repo. and have no fear buddy, they took your code.	[12:46]
mod6	!t m s.mpoe	[12:57]
assbot	[MPEX:S.MPOE] 1D: 0.00023945 / 0.00027016 / 0.00029109 (7922185 shares, 2,140.28 BTC), 7D: 0.00023945 / 0.00027154 / 0.00031364 (18190603 shares, 4,939.59 BTC), 30D: 0.0001443 / 0.00027992 / 0.00040484 (113178735 shares, 31,681.21 BTC)	[12:57]
mod6	;;bc,stats	[12:57]
gribble	Current Blocks: 351544 \| Current Difficulty: 4.944639068824144E10 \| Next Difficulty At Block: 352799 \| Next Difficulty In: 1255 blocks \| Next Difficulty In About: 1 week, 1 day, 17 hours, 10 minutes, and 0 seconds \| Next Difficulty Estimate: 48128497535.2 \| Estimated Percent Change: -2.6653	[12:57]
mod6	;;ticker	[12:57]
gribble	Bitfinex BTCUSD ticker \| Best bid: 233.49, Best ask: 233.5, Bid-ask spread: 0.01000, Last trade: 233.5, 24 hour volume: 31840.36691804, 24 hour low: 231.0, 24 hour high: 245.44, 24 hour vwap: None	[12:57]
mircea_popescu	nuts.	[13:09]
*	PeterL has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)	[13:09]
mod6	ya	[13:11]
*	Pierre_Rochard has quit (Quit: Pierre_Rochard)	[13:18]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [RENT] 200 @ 0.01468924 = 2.9378 BTC [+] {6}	[13:21]
kakobrekla	nuts > bitcoin	[13:21]
mod6	mircea_popescu et al: http://www.loper-os.org/pub/pogos.jpg << cool! bringing these with you?	[13:22]
mircea_popescu	lol	[13:22]
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BingoBoingo	!up ascii_field	[13:37]
*	assbot gives voice to ascii_field	[13:37]
ben_vulpes	yeah? you claiming to be gandhi now :) << mike_c gets it	[13:38]
ascii_field	now who wants to tell me why it took so long to do to 'trezor' what i suggested doing to it immediately upon learning of the circuit ?	[13:39]
ascii_field	'for the love of god, montrezor!' (TM)	[13:39]
mike_c	um. obvious retort is obvious?	[13:40]
ben_vulpes	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-04-2015#1094362 << how so?	[13:41]
assbot	Logged on 10-04-2015 01:04:50; asciilifeform: because it declares war on microshit and unix, 'a pox on both their houses'	[13:41]
mike_c	(as i patiently wait for cardano)	[13:41]
ascii_field	ben_vulpes: it carries own stdlib	[13:41]
ascii_field	ben_vulpes: and even has own threading mechanism, scheduler.	[13:42]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 100300 @ 0.00028657 = 28.743 BTC [+]	[13:42]
ascii_field	ben_vulpes: as a result, it is actually much easier to - usably - plant ada on 'bare metal' (sans os) than nearly anything else	[13:42]
mircea_popescu	ascii_field because idiots are empowered now.	[13:42]
ascii_field	mircea_popescu: wai wat	[13:42]
mircea_popescu	they don't have to do anything! they're dragons!	[13:43]
mircea_popescu	i guess re-reading this is ambiguous. did you mean "do to trezor" as in, fixing ? or as in, exploiting ?	[13:44]
ascii_field	the latter	[13:44]
*	The20YearIRCloud (uid38883@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-fpvktsxqwvfnvhwu) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[13:44]
mircea_popescu	my bad then	[13:44]
ascii_field	(it is braindamaged in several fundamental ways, and it is foolish to speak of 'fixing')	[13:44]
mike_c	oh, me too. I retract my retort.	[13:44]
mircea_popescu	(of course, but then again...)	[13:45]
mircea_popescu	http://trilema.com/2015/sooo-fetlife-is-butthurt/#comment-113588 << there.	[13:45]
assbot	Sooo... FetLife is butthurt. on Trilema - A blog by Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1Jwji5H )	[13:45]
ascii_field	mircea_popescu: this is the boon of late adolescence/early adulthood : that you can do any stressful job and you'll be fine. what you can't really do is slef-manage tho. which is kind of why i'm indignant over all the wastage sv/the us generally is doing to these eager kids making them "ceos" of "start-ups". << hence, >> http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=09-04-2015#1094083	[13:47]
assbot	Logged on 09-04-2015 20:13:46; ascii_field: can't speak for mats, but basic idea is that once you leave your meatwot, you are a fungible machine. this is a situation that, as mats put it, 'resets you to entry level' - and overwhelmingly favours the very young	[13:47]
*	NewLiberty (~NewLibert@2602:304:cff8:1580:c047:8aeb:b953:a993) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[13:52]
ben_vulpes	apropos only of teakettles, trinque told me about some POS hardware returning a 418 TEAPOT in production	[13:53]
ascii_field	point of shit ?	[13:53]
ascii_field	piece of sale ?	[13:53]
ben_vulpes	piece of shit point of sale	[13:53]
mircea_popescu	lol	[13:54]
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mircea_popescu	ascii_field expound on the linkage ?	[13:56]
ascii_field	mircea_popescu: that it is not unreasonable to say 'i will not compete with 16 y.o. if i have any choice in the matter'	[13:58]
mircea_popescu	certainly.	[13:59]
ascii_field	microscope does not want to be a hammer	[13:59]
mircea_popescu	depends, really. i readily compete with 16yo boys over 16yo girls.	[13:59]
ascii_field	and isn't much good as one	[13:59]
mircea_popescu	doesnt go over that badly, either.	[13:59]
mircea_popescu	https://blog.qwant.com/loi-sur-le-renseignement/ << apparently the frenchies have their own search engine, and stuff.	[13:59]
assbot	Blog Qwant \| Notre décryptage de la loi sur le renseignement ... ( http://bit.ly/1JwlGJq )	[13:59]
ascii_field	mircea_popescu: the boys are biologically equipped only to be cannon fodder, really	[14:01]
mircea_popescu	hence, depends.	[14:03]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 32850 @ 0.00028657 = 9.4138 BTC [+]	[14:04]
*	assbot removes voice from ascii_field	[14:08]
mircea_popescu	!up ascii_field	[14:12]
-assbot-	You voiced ascii_field for 30 minutes.	[14:12]
*	assbot gives voice to ascii_field	[14:12]
ascii_field	!s breathe vacuum	[14:13]
assbot	4 results for 'breathe vacuum' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=breathe+vacuum	[14:13]
mircea_popescu	omg wai so cryptic!	[14:15]
wyrdmantis	lol, Wence Cesares called “Patient Zero” of Bitcoin in Silicon Valley	[14:17]
wyrdmantis	http://www.entrepreneur.com/article/244859	[14:17]
assbot	Why Billionaire Investor Reid Hoffman Is Betting Big on Bitcoin ... ( http://bit.ly/1JwoFli )	[14:17]
mircea_popescu	is this for a new thing or still zappo ?	[14:19]
ascii_field	which, iirc, doesn't even work in usa...	[14:20]
mircea_popescu	ascii_field guy is very talented at basically anna nicole smith's job.	[14:20]
ascii_field	pr0n ?	[14:20]
mircea_popescu	more like entertaining lonely rich gentlemen.	[14:21]
ascii_field	l0l	[14:21]
mircea_popescu	i thought reid hoffman is the original model for that forever alone figurine no ?	[14:21]
ascii_field	he oughta do something more stimulating with the money. like have a golden toilet cast.	[14:21]
mircea_popescu	http://specials-images.forbesimg.com/imageserve/550af91ee4b096f94fa577cf/620x434.jpg <> http://vignette3.wikia.nocookie.net/meme/images/9/91/4char-forever-alone-guy-high-resolution.png/revision/latest?cb=20110905121935	[14:22]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1JwpkTR )	[14:22]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1JwpkTV )	[14:22]
mircea_popescu	a) it's not really as much money as you imagine and b) i forget.	[14:22]
ascii_field	i mean, wtf. i actually tried to put some chumpatronium in the hopper and all i got was 'eggog'	[14:22]
mircea_popescu	wait wut ?	[14:23]
ascii_field	https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/1/10/Elektronika_MK_52_with_ERROR.jpg/400px-Elektronika_MK_52_with_ERROR.jpg	[14:23]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1JwpxGq )	[14:23]
mircea_popescu	lol	[14:24]
mircea_popescu	can you be specific ?	[14:24]
mircea_popescu	oh, tried to use the site ?	[14:24]
ascii_field	aha	[14:24]
ascii_field	(a while ago)	[14:24]
ascii_field	https://2ch.hk/pr/src/416689/14185641139150.jpg	[14:25]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1JwpQB3 )	[14:25]
ben_vulpes	what. is. that.	[14:26]
ascii_field	ben_vulpes: elektronika mk-61	[14:26]
ascii_field	legendary programmable pocket calculator	[14:26]
ben_vulpes	but the dick and spear?	[14:26]
ascii_field	like i knew.	[14:26]
ascii_field	ben_vulpes: icon from forum, https://2ch.hk/pr/res/416689.html	[14:27]
assbot	Программирование - Решил на досуге заебенить ... ( http://bit.ly/1Jwq2Ak )	[14:27]
ben_vulpes	every photo in b-a is like this. "here's this sort of illustrative image relevant to our conversation." "what lead to that photo being taken?" "like i could fucking know..."	[14:27]
mircea_popescu		[14:27]
mircea_popescu	herp. what is it ?	[14:27]
mircea_popescu	Why do I have to complete a CAPTCHA?	[14:28]
mircea_popescu	Completing the CAPTCHA proves you are a human and gives you temporary access to the web property.	[14:28]
mircea_popescu	motherfucker corpspeak. they ask the questions, they fail to fucking answer.	[14:28]
mircea_popescu	that's not "why", motherfuckers.	[14:29]
mircea_popescu	that's "what do i get for". why is something entirely the fuck else, mentally stunted bunch of business school rejects.	[14:29]
mircea_popescu	ben_vulpes here's one for you : http://38.media.tumblr.com/43f59756875c7c25d3f5eb69d51486ad/tumblr_nfi5h5II0v1t6aip4o1_500.gif	[14:30]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1IzTfwM )	[14:30]
mircea_popescu	subplot : why the fuck is the dude wearing pink panties.	[14:30]
ascii_field	https://2ch.hk/pr/src/416689/14186615103850.jpg (cpu) ; https://2ch.hk/pr/src/416689/14185751153750.png (sram close-up)	[14:31]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1IzTjfY )	[14:31]
ascii_field	all photos taken by enthusiasts	[14:31]
ascii_field	original design was lost in the collapse of su	[14:31]
ascii_field	and had to be laboriously restored, by folks who loved the machine to death	[14:31]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 93200 @ 0.00028657 = 26.7083 BTC [+]	[14:32]
ascii_field	the purpose of this was to create a bug-compatible emulator	[14:32]
ascii_field	(many beloved proggies, passed around on grid paper, used the cpu bugs)	[14:32]
ben_vulpes	mircea_popescu: yeah, sure. 'zactly.	[14:32]
mircea_popescu	wait, there's more. http://40.media.tumblr.com/70c01db6e1107493d666d370769b6552/tumblr_n9yjs0ADuM1rhnc6uo1_1280.jpg	[14:32]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1IzTvMa )	[14:32]
ben_vulpes	amusingly, both of these can be pretty readily reasoned about	[14:32]
ben_vulpes	much more so than the calculator with dick and spear	[14:33]
ben_vulpes	people shooting pr0n, girl likes attention	[14:33]
ben_vulpes	panties are a great touch tho lol	[14:33]
ascii_field	https://2ch.hk/pr/src/416689/14188936319390.jpg	[14:33]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1JwqPkZ )	[14:33]
mircea_popescu	i thought the dickspear idea is pretty pervasive.	[14:33]
ascii_field	left hand: 'most popular prog. langs.' bottom left: 'but how about mk-61?'	[14:34]
mircea_popescu	http://41.media.tumblr.com/31696eea7ab39fcbb93e43d3acda9be6/tumblr_nevt3bs2mS1tejsb9o1_1280.jpg ?	[14:34]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1JwqX3J )	[14:34]
ascii_field	the font face is roughly cyrillic's equivalent of german 'blackletter'	[14:34]
mircea_popescu	(yes, yes, pr0n. but why the derpy teens in polo shirts!)	[14:34]
ben_vulpes	mis en scene?	[14:35]
ben_vulpes	*mise-en-scéne, i mean to say	[14:35]
mircea_popescu	one of those derpy "dating seminars" gone awry	[14:35]
ascii_field	mircea_popescu: https://2ch.hk/pr/res/416689.html#454485 << translation exercise	[14:36]
assbot	Программирование - Решил на досуге заебенить ... ( http://bit.ly/1JwrjYn )	[14:36]
mircea_popescu	ascii_field i can't get that site.	[14:36]
ascii_field	but it could almost have been written by mircea_popescu ...	[14:36]
ascii_field	l0l wut	[14:37]
mircea_popescu	cloudfail.	[14:37]
mircea_popescu	see above.	[14:37]
ascii_field	mircea_popescu: http://dpaste.com/19C1P7K.txt << here ya go	[14:37]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1JwrrHe )	[14:37]
mircea_popescu	heh it couldn't be written by mp. i never signed anon in my lyf.	[14:37]
ascii_field	other than it.	[14:37]
mircea_popescu	lol subhuman larvae!	[14:38]
mircea_popescu	ahahaha wretched parodies!	[14:38]
mircea_popescu	ah no. i don't despise prostitutes.	[14:39]
mircea_popescu	moreover, i hold actual whores in higher regard than most other professions. certainly i give social precedence to a whore over a us college professor.	[14:39]
mircea_popescu	i guess hating on hos kinda comes with russian culture huh.	[14:40]
mircea_popescu	быдлокодинга < ? bydlo-kodinga!	[14:41]
mircea_popescu	ajhahaha	[14:41]
mircea_popescu	perfect word this. "dude, stop with the bydlokodinga!" "did someone bydlokodinga libnss ?"	[14:41]
*	assbot removes voice from ascii_field	[14:42]
mircea_popescu	!up ascii_field	[14:42]
-assbot-	You voiced ascii_field for 30 minutes.	[14:42]
*	assbot gives voice to ascii_field	[14:42]
mircea_popescu	and btw ascii_field, is быдло ukr or ru ?	[14:43]
ascii_field	ru	[14:43]
mircea_popescu	also polish bydlo, same usage.	[14:43]
ascii_field	originally, roughly 'cattle' but archaicism and means something like what 'redneck' in usa	[14:43]
mircea_popescu	it means more like what redneck should mean.	[14:44]
mircea_popescu	nowadays redneck simply means "someone who doesn't think transexuals have a special gender and gay marriage is a thing"	[14:45]
mircea_popescu	http://33.media.tumblr.com/cecc3c213c49633eba86ba638a56c311/tumblr_my65023EFp1s5egydo1_400.gif << this is like, THE picture of fucking societal decay. chick's having a lulzfit at guy who's too absorbed in gadget to do anything.	[14:46]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1JwsNl9 )	[14:46]
Chillum	I think that law should not consider "gender" at all, leave it as a social construct	[14:46]
mircea_popescu	Chillum why would society consider law at all ?	[14:47]
mircea_popescu	i mean your proposal sounds sensible, but only if one (mistakenly) imagines law can exist sorta out of itself. it can't.	[14:47]
mircea_popescu	once law ceases to be an instrument of convenient social oppression, it ceases to matter.	[14:47]
mircea_popescu	yes, it shouldn't inconveniently oppress. but that does NOT mean it should not oppress at all. tho i see how that mistake is easy to make.	[14:48]
Chillum	What I mean is that just as the religion of two people is irrelevant for marriage in the eyes of the law, so should be gender	[14:48]
mircea_popescu	i know what you mean .do you know what i mean ?	[14:48]
Chillum	without some form of oppression humans will descend into violent anarchy	[14:48]
Chillum	not really	[14:48]
mircea_popescu	aha.	[14:48]
mircea_popescu	see, law is in and of itself meaningless and powerless. if it reflects deeply held societal beliefs, it is powerful. which is why it was powerful in the old christian days, pre 1000 ad.	[14:49]
mircea_popescu	it lost that pillar of support. but it reconstructed some sort of balance around the remainder.	[14:49]
mircea_popescu	then it lost gender. it's teetering, and i don't think it's any longer sustainable at all.	[14:49]
mircea_popescu	why would anyone obey the law ? it says nothing about their beliefs, it fails to make the world meaningful.	[14:50]
mircea_popescu	could as well obey this law as any other, and in the end none at all.	[14:50]
mircea_popescu	the entire "we're obeying the law because the law produces foodstamps" and "keeps the terrorists at bay" doesn't really look too functional at any rate.	[14:52]
mircea_popescu	certainly wasn't the last time this was tried.	[14:52]
ascii_field	--- translation. mega-paste warning ----	[14:53]
ascii_field	3, 2, 1...	[14:53]
ascii_field	'But what, specifically, remains for the poor students and wankers, who took up the notion that there is such a profession - "programmer" ? Yes, there is, but not in the sense that these larval untermenschen conceive of it. Some see in this role something just short of the demiurge, crafting the future; others see a good way to set up their life, secure their future, a stable income and career growth.	[14:53]
ascii_field	But the pathetic parody of a human does not grasp that it is not enough to have a cock's crest bachelor degree or to spoodge out a few pages of code at an olympiad, to become a programmer. In the course of this revelation, the lame abortus, reject of evolution, slowly begins to comprehend that the world is very much not as he imagined it.	[14:53]
ascii_field	The apprehension of one's inadequacy begins, of the futility of one's existence, the principal impossibility of fulfilling one's idiotic desires. But there is always a choice. If the first variant prevails, he will press on with self-improvement, the study of genuinely worthy technologies, on which there can be foundations for the creation of something better. And he will understand that no one needs him as a smart-arse.	[14:53]
ascii_field	Or what remains - the other variant - to dive into the common flow of the sewers, and take hold of a passing piece of shit and feed upon it for the rest of one's pathetic life. Some are satisfied with this, just as many are satisfied with the profession of the prostitute, the cleaner of latrines, a waiter in MacDuck, etc. But a more or less normal person begins to experience breakage in his value system, worldview;	[14:53]
ascii_field	thoughts concerning the futility of his existence begin to intrude upon him, of futility; old complexes sharpen, and flower into a full-blown psychological crisis...	[14:53]
ascii_field	Yes, once upon a time, the "programmer" was a serious engineering profession with a shade of elite status. In those years, genuine mastery of certain technologies was demanded from him, and this was not attainable by all. Whereas today any Downs-syntrome-autist can call himself a programmer, because he has mastered the basics of redneck-coding and will work for food. As for genuine professionals - like in many other	[14:53]
ascii_field	related fields - they are no longer in demand today. Therefore there is not much choice: sign for your supper by the latrine [ru prison parlance - transl. note] or silently rot in full consciousness of your total bankruptcy and futility of existence.'	[14:53]
mircea_popescu	ascii_field you know you really should blog/link these things. srsly.	[14:54]
ascii_field	it's just a fscking translation	[14:54]
mircea_popescu	so ?	[14:54]
ascii_field	and i blogged about more or less same thing for 7+ yrs, to no effect	[14:55]
mircea_popescu	dude, let's burn the library of alexandria because nobody ever read it. i bet that's how it actually went down.	[14:55]
ascii_field	(in case this was not clear, the ru original was not mine, and was found by accident)	[14:55]
mircea_popescu	whjat the fuck difference does it make to the book how many read it?	[14:55]
mircea_popescu	just put it there so it can be found conveniently and forget about it.	[14:55]
mircea_popescu	there's no "higher purpose" or anything	[14:55]
ascii_field	mircea_popescu: don't get me wrong, i shall write again. and yes - for the archaeologists, as before. but presently cut among 1) dayjob 2) s.nsa 3) sleep,eat,...,write	[14:56]
mircea_popescu	my point is softer than that. specifically, it is that simply having put this there would not have tarnished your blog, but been smart an' convenient.	[14:57]
mircea_popescu	it's an article just fine.	[14:57]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 250300 @ 0.00028501 = 71.338 BTC [-] {2}	[14:57]
ascii_field	mircea_popescu: feel free to recycle it into your next mega-article if you feel like	[14:58]
mircea_popescu	"here's some shit i stole off a guy i know".	[14:58]
mircea_popescu	what am i, a sf writer ?	[14:58]
ascii_field	which he stole from some anon...	[14:59]
ascii_field	l0l	[14:59]
mircea_popescu	is this true btw ? i am sensing this trendwhere people go "real professionals are not in demand"	[14:59]
mircea_popescu	meanwhile, this seems untrue ?	[14:59]
ascii_field	i cited that thing merely because it is a compact statement of essentials of naggumism.	[14:59]
ascii_field	mircea_popescu: it is not untrue, unfortunately	[14:59]
ascii_field	for the reason which i tried to explain last night	[15:00]
ascii_field	about meat-wots	[15:00]
mircea_popescu	i am unconvinced. there must be more to it.	[15:00]
ascii_field	don't take my word for it.	[15:00]
ascii_field	!s deskilling	[15:01]
assbot	4 results for 'deskilling' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=deskilling	[15:01]
ascii_field	(not sure if the phenomenon is presently discussed under than name, or discussed at all for that matter. but it does have a name.)	[15:01]
*	ColinT (~ColinT@69-11-97-130.regn.static.sasknet.sk.ca) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[15:02]
mircea_popescu	i suppose to the degree this phenomenon exists, it is driven by the feminization of the internet (the sort of retarded behaviour illustrated by that comment i quoted earlier).	[15:02]
ascii_field	nope. it is driven by perfectly legit economics	[15:03]
mircea_popescu	if this is true, which i still doubt but perhaps just as an artefact of my limied circle, then the pill is simply destruction of the legal protections.	[15:03]
ascii_field	same as the 'wriggleys gum' and plastification of industry	[15:03]
mircea_popescu	if a company can either secure its network or lose its ass... then the professional will be in demand.	[15:03]
ascii_field	mircea_popescu: not if 'arse covering' works as well as 'secure'	[15:03]
mircea_popescu	if women have it, and "do what i mean" and "i should be safe whether im naked drunk or not", then yes, semiskilled shanonizers in microsoft garb everywhere.	[15:04]
mircea_popescu	ascii_field yes, because evolutionary pressure.	[15:04]
mircea_popescu	makes no difference for a bankrupt corp why it's bankrupt. still out of sight.	[15:04]
ascii_field	evolutionary pressure knows how to lead to two places	[15:04]
ascii_field	adaptation	[15:04]
mircea_popescu	in any case, this would present excellent cause to disallow acces of women trying to appear as women in this field. either they learn how to be men or learn to live without participating in technology.	[15:04]
ascii_field	or extinction.	[15:04]
mircea_popescu	i must say im still broadly unconvinced by the entire thing.	[15:05]
mircea_popescu	chetty ^ give the foregoing a read would you.	[15:05]
ascii_field	let's narrow down -which- particular thing mircea_popescu is unconvinced by, before i answer	[15:05]
mircea_popescu	ascii_field that there is no serious demand for highly skilled computerizers	[15:05]
ascii_field	there -is- demand, but it is -extremely- meat-wot-gated	[15:06]
mircea_popescu	so it should be.	[15:06]
ascii_field	because of the sheer pressure of orcs at the gate and the paucity of the positions	[15:06]
mircea_popescu	this simply reflects stuff discussed all over trilema. why would it not be.	[15:06]
mircea_popescu	no, not because of that at all.	[15:06]
mike_c	i don't understand. maybe you are saying there is no demand for exactly what you want to do? there is plenty of demand for smart programmers.	[15:06]
ascii_field	but so narrowly tight to the extent that the practitioners have lost all negotiating leverage.	[15:06]
mircea_popescu	mike_c i thought so too.	[15:07]
mircea_popescu	wut ?!	[15:07]
mike_c	you could walk into google tomorrow and command an absurd salary	[15:07]
mike_c	or a dozen other companies. very limited wot necessary.	[15:07]
ascii_field	mike_c: entirely not the profession i was speaking of.	[15:07]
mircea_popescu	mike_c it's very dissonant for me because he seems to come from this place where exactly the opposite of what i see is true. backwards world of alf.	[15:07]
ascii_field	as different as 'wife' and 'prostitute'	[15:07]
ascii_field	even more so, arguably.	[15:07]
mircea_popescu	can't quite pin down wtf this is.	[15:07]
mircea_popescu	ascii_field specifically ?	[15:08]
mike_c	so be clear about the position you are looking for that doesn't exist?	[15:08]
ascii_field	mike_c: roughly, 'problem solver'	[15:08]
mike_c	what's an example of a problem you would be asked to solve in this position.	[15:09]
ascii_field	i can say quite securely that no one at 'google' is employed in this capacity.	[15:09]
ascii_field	mike_c: 'we have xxxxx and have not the slightest idea what to do about it'	[15:09]
ben_vulpes	ascii_field: doesn't want to "work". he wants to "think".	[15:09]
mircea_popescu	"problem solver" is either a) cocky bs major from minessotta (we had examples ridiculed in here) or else b) collin powell.	[15:09]
mike_c	that's not an example :) what's a xxxxx.	[15:10]
mircea_popescu	which did you mean ? and neither of these are programmers.	[15:10]
ascii_field	or, more related to my current gig, 'we have yyyyyy and wish to know why it was made, by whom, what it does, it fell out of flying saucer'	[15:10]
mike_c	ok, so this is.. a circuit board?	[15:10]
ascii_field	mike_c: occasionally	[15:10]
mircea_popescu	ascii_field "here's this binary, find out what it does" ?	[15:10]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 144250 @ 0.00028731 = 41.4445 BTC [+] {3}	[15:10]
ascii_field	^ most of it, in my particular case	[15:10]
mircea_popescu	ascii_field so this would be in demand either a) by the nsa or else b) independent work a la s.nsa	[15:11]
mircea_popescu	why is this counterintuitive ?	[15:11]
mike_c	seems also flavors of this job would be present at security firms.	[15:11]
mircea_popescu	except he doesn't want tyo compete with the 16yos those guys hire.	[15:11]
mircea_popescu	and i understand WHY they hire the way they do, with contests etc.	[15:11]
ascii_field	mircea_popescu: it will make more sense if i reveal that	[15:11]
mircea_popescu	whole security profession is done on a shoestring	[15:12]
ascii_field	the fact that most of what i do is not brute labour	[15:12]
mircea_popescu	recall trhe $100 top prize.	[15:12]
mike_c	not whole, just most. like any other field.	[15:12]
ascii_field	but invention of tools to speed up the process	[15:12]
mircea_popescu	ascii_field your problem is that you're premarket in that.	[15:12]
ascii_field	and enable particular flavours of reverse engineering which are otherwise impossible	[15:12]
mircea_popescu	like invention of tools to make aeroplanes safer in 1915	[15:12]
*	assbot removes voice from ascii_field	[15:12]
mircea_popescu	!up ascii_field	[15:12]
-assbot-	You voiced ascii_field for 30 minutes.	[15:12]
*	assbot gives voice to ascii_field	[15:12]
ascii_field	i'm afraid that i cannot say more without breaking oath to the personal friends for whom i carry out this work.	[15:12]
mircea_popescu	...	[15:13]
mircea_popescu	did he just bitch about meatbased wots FROM INSIDE ?	[15:13]
mike_c	it sounds like you've got the job you want. so what's the problem? you need more jobs?	[15:13]
mircea_popescu	alf needs a beating.	[15:13]
ascii_field	mike_c: say you have a boat	[15:13]
ascii_field	nice, aye ?	[15:13]
ascii_field	but what if it goes down	[15:13]
mike_c	money pit, but ok.	[15:13]
mike_c	see, i told you it was a money pit.	[15:13]
mircea_popescu	lmao	[15:13]
mircea_popescu	you considered it, eh mikey!	[15:13]
ascii_field	and if mast breaks off in the storm	[15:14]
ascii_field	it is a small boat.	[15:14]
mircea_popescu	for your peace of mind : the last time a mast broke off in a storm the year was 1715.	[15:14]
mike_c	idk.. you are looking for a very specialized type of job. I don't think you'll get far complaining there aren't a lot of them.	[15:14]
ascii_field	mike_c: what i did before, was entirely else - high-performance computing for chemical modelling	[15:15]
mircea_popescu	ascii_field btw, how about you get them personal friends in the wot and start a something.	[15:15]
ascii_field	mircea_popescu: diametric is in wot	[15:15]
mircea_popescu	the sluts are not gonna fuck themselves.	[15:15]
ascii_field	mircea_popescu: the other fella lost his key	[15:15]
mike_c	yeah, build your next boat.	[15:15]
ascii_field	i think	[15:15]
ascii_field	but they're the kind of folks with offspring, mortgages, etc.	[15:16]
mircea_popescu	incidentally : if your boat breask "by itself" nudge nudge grin grin, you can go back to biochem.	[15:16]
mircea_popescu	you have any fucking idea how desperate those guys are ?	[15:16]
ascii_field	mircea_popescu: actually	[15:16]
mircea_popescu	sheeet, they even took bugpowder in.	[15:16]
ascii_field	mircea_popescu: why do you suppose i'm not there	[15:16]
ascii_field	the field died.	[15:17]
mircea_popescu	no it didn't. it's back.	[15:17]
ascii_field	most of the pharma folks closed down r&d entirely.	[15:17]
ascii_field	it is 'obama-back' not back.	[15:17]
mircea_popescu	it's back, baby.	[15:17]
mike_c	but the safety net is still there. regardless of that, you could get a high paying job in software. just not one you want.	[15:17]
mike_c	so work on your own goddamn boat with the confidence you won't end up on the street.	[15:17]
mircea_popescu	tbh i suspect he uses this as a motivator,	[15:17]
mircea_popescu	so...	[15:18]
ascii_field	high-paying job that kills the mind is a suicide.	[15:18]
mike_c	right, which is why you should build your own boat...	[15:18]
mircea_popescu	hey, lemme tell you something.	[15:18]
mircea_popescu	list of things slavegirls think aforehand "kill the mind" ? 559876985975 items.	[15:18]
mircea_popescu	list of things actually killing the mind ? 0, so far.	[15:18]
mircea_popescu	i haven't found any.	[15:18]
mike_c	i think you are unqualified in that field. the wrong job is pretty mind numbing, especially if you don't see the path away from it.	[15:19]
mircea_popescu	intelligent person can not stay unqualified.	[15:19]
ascii_field	i spent ~3 yrs, fresh from school, actually honest-programming-for-money	[15:19]
mircea_popescu	ever. no matter the field.	[15:19]
ascii_field	will never get the iq points back.	[15:19]
ascii_field	it is palpable.	[15:19]
mircea_popescu	no it's not.	[15:19]
mike_c	s/unqualified/inexperienced/	[15:19]
ben_vulpes	that's just aging, asci	[15:19]
mircea_popescu	and as nubbins would point out, not doing enough whippets.	[15:20]
mircea_popescu	or doing too many. i forget which.	[15:20]
ascii_field	ben_vulpes: how much did you age from 22-25 ?	[15:20]
ben_vulpes	about 3 years	[15:20]
ben_vulpes	did applied thermofluids during that time. could feel the slowdown hit.	[15:20]
mircea_popescu	im i the only guy too absorbed in self-love to notice this phenomenon ?	[15:21]
ascii_field	mircea_popescu sleeps ad libitum	[15:21]
mircea_popescu	i was fucking dumb at 22, and less dumb but still fucking dumb at 25.	[15:21]
ascii_field	i - age two weeks every time my alarm clock rings.	[15:21]
mircea_popescu	not by "normal" terms, but retrospectively it grates.	[15:21]
ben_vulpes	mircea_popescu: is there a difference between how smart/dumb one is and how quickly or slowly one learns?	[15:22]
mircea_popescu	depends ben_vulpes. the problem chiefly is that as the mental models get much better, learning speed collapses.	[15:23]
ben_vulpes	"this notion is strongly similar to these other notions i'm already familiar with, so i'll integrate it more quickly"?	[15:23]
mircea_popescu	of course this could be backed in my case by a solid wall of "i don't have to do anything i don' want to do"	[15:23]
mircea_popescu	ben_vulpes much deeper than that. like "i readily see THE REAL REASON this is so, so i can skip eighteen paragraphs worth of confused "explicatory" nonsense	[15:24]
mircea_popescu	that a lesser brain would have fucked with for eight weeks"	[15:24]
mircea_popescu	and yes, probably the 22 me would have gotten through the fucking with phase in seven weeks and it'd take me 9 now if i tried it.	[15:24]
mircea_popescu	but im not going to because i see wtf that is freom a mile away, including the gender of the author and her parenting errors in her own kids.	[15:25]
mircea_popescu	anyway. i wouldn't want to go back to being 20 anymore than i'd want to re-take kindergarten.	[15:29]
ascii_field	'knowing what parts to skip' is -the- wunderwaffen.	[15:33]
ascii_field	but this is a rather separate component of effective intelligence	[15:34]
mircea_popescu	for sure.	[15:35]
ascii_field	like the tires of a car	[15:35]
ascii_field	the spiffiest tires will not turn 'trabant' into 'mazerati'	[15:35]
ascii_field	though opposite - sure.	[15:35]
mircea_popescu	that's a good approach to explain it : imagine you can disqualify bad teachers earlier. well... that's definitely saving time.	[15:35]
*	gabriel_laddel (~user@unaffiliated/gabriel-laddel/x-9909917) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[15:35]
ascii_field	'the eagle never lost so much as when studied from the crow' or what was it	[15:35]
mircea_popescu	exactly.	[15:35]
mircea_popescu	another approach to it is to point out that human brains leak like a fucking sieve.	[15:36]
mircea_popescu	as you tighen things up, you crash less often	[15:36]
mircea_popescu	if you crash less often, you need less computer time to do the same work.	[15:36]
mircea_popescu	so : better mental models, less domain lossage - > mega shrinkage of time and effort required.	[15:36]
mircea_popescu	perhaps the cpu also gets tired, but the rate of loss due to that has not yet been apparent, at least to me.	[15:37]
ascii_field	'notation is worth 80 iq point' (TM)	[15:37]
mircea_popescu	quite.	[15:37]
ascii_field	and to this well-known maxim i will add mine, 'giving a fuck about the problem is worth 100 iq points'	[15:37]
mircea_popescu	hence the earlier "solid wall"	[15:37]
mircea_popescu	see, and this is a FINE example of what i mean by "leak like a sieve". your observation was in fact accounted for in my model. because i hadn't leaked it. because it doesn't leak there.	[15:38]
ascii_field	the real reason i will not compete with the 16 y.o. is not stamina per se, but that i cannot trick my brain into actually caring	[15:38]
mircea_popescu	ascii_field that gets extremely easier once you fuck his gf. you notice the subtle difference between the same object as he perceives it, and as it is.	[15:38]
mircea_popescu	then it suddenly becomes fascinating, like a puzzle of sorts.	[15:39]
ascii_field	this is why i often say that in buenos aires i would have to learn shoemaking or the like	[15:39]
ascii_field	some sort of work that does not demand too much mental presence	[15:39]
mircea_popescu	get a bike sharpen knives.	[15:39]
ascii_field	aha that was what i was thinking of	[15:39]
ascii_field	as in that photo.	[15:39]
ascii_field	i'm not yet sold on the fact of that boy's existence being more fun than american jail.	[15:40]
mircea_popescu	!up gabriel_laddel	[15:40]
-assbot-	You voiced gabriel_laddel for 30 minutes.	[15:40]
*	assbot gives voice to gabriel_laddel	[15:40]
mircea_popescu	wha happened to your key yo	[15:40]
gabriel_laddel	thank you	[15:40]
gabriel_laddel	it isn't handy atm	[15:40]
gabriel_laddel	ascii_field: it is palpable. << Yep. Let's say, for example that you learn perl. Nothing you learn has any use outside of... writing perl. If you learn javascript, java, C++, scala etc. idem. The web and these related "technologies" are going away. All of the effort poured into learning them is wasted.	[15:40]
mircea_popescu	but he never learned any of them in THAT sense.	[15:41]
mircea_popescu	there's a guy who learns and his learning is wasted effort. there's a different guy who learns for sport.	[15:41]
gabriel_laddel	Urbit is probably a good example for what I think stas is discussing. You can get paid very well so long as you are very active doing nothing.	[15:41]
mircea_popescu	da fuck do i care latin's dead ?	[15:41]
ascii_field	gabriel_laddel: there is also such a thing as the mental equivalent of stretched arse-rape sphincter	[15:41]
mircea_popescu	ascii_field doubt it	[15:41]
mircea_popescu	for one thing, contrary to common belief, well used holes get better, not worse. woman is not made out of soap.	[15:41]
mircea_popescu	for the other thing, the brain truely is plastic.	[15:42]
gabriel_laddel	mircea_popescu: learning latin is very different from learning $random-african-grunt-lang	[15:42]
ascii_field	what i am speaking of is the effect i observed where folks learn to like fundamentally uninteresting concepts.	[15:42]
mircea_popescu	gabriel_laddel how do you know this ?	[15:42]
ascii_field	because they get off on the flourishes.	[15:42]
ascii_field	e.g., c++.	[15:42]
*	DreadKnight has quit (Quit: #AncientBeast - Master Your Beasts ( www.AncientBeast.com ))	[15:42]
mircea_popescu	but these might have been broken before	[15:42]
gabriel_laddel	because some of the $random-african-gruntlangs don't have any means to describe the future or past.	[15:42]
gabriel_laddel	mircea_popescu: ^	[15:42]
mircea_popescu	gabriel_laddel you're on very slippery ice sheet there. i'll save you the egg and point out that you can't form an apriori representation of why X model is no good.	[15:43]
*	assbot removes voice from ascii_field	[15:43]
mircea_popescu	!up ascii_field	[15:43]
-assbot-	You voiced ascii_field for 30 minutes.	[15:43]
*	assbot gives voice to ascii_field	[15:43]
*	ascii_field is a believer in sapir-whorf to the extent that he very much observed the braindamage caused by imprinting on certain programming concepts, in a great many people.	[15:43]
mircea_popescu	"imprinting" is pre-speech learning.	[15:43]
mircea_popescu	one really should take control of that stuff.	[15:44]
gabriel_laddel	mircea_popescu: nonsene. We know any programming language that doesn't allow the operator to manipulate its own ast programmatically is going to waste the operator's time.	[15:44]
gabriel_laddel	mircea_popescu: ascii is discussing knowns.	[15:44]
ascii_field	'imprinting' not in the strict zoological sense, but in that of having encountered a concept during 'formative years' when a fella is figuring out wtf 'a computer is'	[15:44]
gabriel_laddel	^ I never would have thought of presentation systems unless I happened upon ascii_field's blog.	[15:45]
gabriel_laddel	HTML/CSS/SWING/AWT ruined me.	[15:45]
ascii_field	i've been fighting a largely losing battle for many years, attempting to convince folks to imagine - in their spare time - that a computer is not necessarily von neumann and the 50 yrs of shit soup	[15:46]
gabriel_laddel	mircea_popescu: actually, re-reading your last message - isn't that really an argument against abstraction period?	[15:47]
gabriel_laddel	which...	[15:47]
ascii_field	i will confess that it took me retardedly long time to understand that my hypothetical rebellion against the soup cannot be funded or organized for some very fundamental reasons	[15:47]
gabriel_laddel	ascii_field: nonsense.	[15:47]
ascii_field	(short version - it is too much like the proverbial 'mars voyage' - counter-economic leap.)	[15:47]
gabriel_laddel	ascii_field: Sometime in the next 48 hours I'm going to drop some information in here regarding the #b-a distro, and when finished with that move on to finding funding again.	[15:49]
ascii_field	gabriel_laddel: the type of funding necessary cannot be 'found'	[15:49]
ascii_field	it isn't hiding somewhere in the jungle	[15:49]
gabriel_laddel	ascii_field: we've already discussed this. I'm for doing it piecemeal because there are no other options.	[15:50]
ascii_field	gabriel_laddel: don't delude yourself that you are doing 'it'	[15:50]
ascii_field	you are doing another thing, spray-painted to resemble 'it'.	[15:50]
gabriel_laddel	ascii_field: yep.	[15:50]
ascii_field	because 'it' does not come into pieces.	[15:50]
ascii_field	and it cannot be done under the thumb of vc sc4mz0rz	[15:51]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 144647 @ 0.00028761 = 41.6019 BTC [+]	[15:51]
gabriel_laddel	I can't remember your exact words, but I think you said in here once "my time would have been better spent putting together a demo than blogging"	[15:51]
ascii_field	gabriel_laddel: to avoid rehashing ancient thread for a fifth time, stuck at the realization that reversing xilinx is futile.	[15:52]
ascii_field	interested readers can find the threads.	[15:52]
mircea_popescu	gabriel_laddel for one thing, natural languages can not be modelled in terms of computer langs.	[15:53]
mircea_popescu	the latter are computable.	[15:53]
gabriel_laddel	ascii_field: iirc your argument was "it isn't worthwhile because if you succeed you'll not have enough of them to do anything interesting with"	[15:53]
mircea_popescu	and no, it's not an argument against abstraction period. it's an argument against using abstractive methods outside of their domain of definition	[15:54]
mircea_popescu	which is what "not leaking" is, in mathematical terms.	[15:54]
ascii_field	gabriel_laddel: not exactly. even if you could secure an infinite supply of the particular fpga, it turns out that they are not actually very general. in that you cannot efficiently implement muller c-gates in them.	[15:54]
gabriel_laddel	ascii_field: o. I thought that you could if they have an entirely known design?	[15:55]
ascii_field	(before anyone spits back the old paper re: the fact of c-gates implemented on xilinx fabric - go and see how many of them you can fit. and how much room left for interconnects.)	[15:55]
ascii_field	gabriel_laddel: could do -something- but not -something worth doing-	[15:55]
ascii_field	nor am i especially interested in building yet another computer with passive memory.	[15:56]
ascii_field	memory as a device that just sits there, is a 20th c. idiocy.	[15:57]
mircea_popescu	what'd you have it do ?	[15:57]
ascii_field	bits expensively stored as charge on si ought to be available for computing asynchronously.	[15:58]
ascii_field	mircea_popescu: what'd you have it do << a number of things, which resolve to 'the contents ending up where needed by dependency-graph without being asked every time'	[15:59]
mircea_popescu	if you do that the current addressing schemes would never work	[15:59]
ascii_field	the current addressing schemes are retarded	[15:59]
mircea_popescu	ie, you'd end up with half the space or more taken up by indexes	[15:59]
mircea_popescu	but i have no doubt this is correct, chiefly because that';s how the brain works.	[15:59]
mircea_popescu	incidnetally - would you also have the selective inhibition design ?	[16:00]
ascii_field	certainly	[16:00]
ascii_field	most of it does not need to be addressible at all	[16:00]
mircea_popescu	aha.	[16:00]
mircea_popescu	yeah, for none of this is any of the current toolchain useful, from plant to emacs.	[16:01]
mircea_popescu	maybe the emacs.	[16:01]
mircea_popescu	but this is good news : new stuff is cheaper to build than retooling old stuff.	[16:01]
ascii_field	only 'useful' to the extent a lathe from newton's time was useful to creating today's.	[16:01]
ascii_field	and i could have easily built all of this by 25 y.o. if martians had landed and given me the means.	[16:03]
ascii_field	but that's not how it works	[16:03]
mircea_popescu	i have my doubts.	[16:04]
ascii_field	sure, could have tripped and fell to death in the bath.	[16:04]
mircea_popescu	your first estimates are horrid, historically :D	[16:05]
ascii_field	mircea_popescu: largely because i am not mircea_popescu and not in control of the variables.	[16:05]
mircea_popescu	im just saying, alt-universes aren't much of a guide for anything.	[16:06]
mircea_popescu	be happy if you manage to ever actually make it, or at least nudge towards it. 25 or 55.	[16:06]
ascii_field	did not say that it is a definite guide (to what? l0l)	[16:06]
ascii_field	but that i knew precisely what must be done to make a computer a tolerable thing, most of a decade ago.	[16:07]
mircea_popescu	ascii_field> and i could have easily built all of this by 25 y.o. <<	[16:07]
mircea_popescu	well... maybe. practice has a theory all of its own	[16:07]
mircea_popescu	in other news, here's a ben_vulpes scene. http://36.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_letr2hFxlq1qe3i9to1_1280.jpg	[16:07]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1IAak9P )	[16:07]
mircea_popescu	my question is, where did the guy find condoms that small.	[16:08]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 94300 @ 0.00028789 = 27.148 BTC [+]	[16:08]
Chillum	I predict that in 25 years computer software will be full of bugs and vulnerabilities	[16:09]
Chillum	and for all eternity until computers cease to exist	[16:09]
*	wyrdmantis has quit (Quit: wyrdmantis)	[16:09]
ascii_field	^ which could be sooner than expected	[16:09]
ascii_field	the gurl's expression !!!	[16:10]
Chillum	well I have a stash of low wattage computers and some solar panels	[16:10]
ascii_field	she is thinking, so intently	[16:10]
Chillum	so unless they are taken away or destroyed I will have something	[16:10]
ascii_field	'is goldbach's conjecture true ???'	[16:10]
*	assbot removes voice from gabriel_laddel	[16:10]
mircea_popescu	http://33.media.tumblr.com/350a2def4fc98d6a2ac1c3e2ddb2aa86/tumblr_nb9gz1n6B21rnlorio1_500.gif << have another one then alf. sorry about the one you had to return.	[16:10]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1ax3YcE )	[16:10]
mircea_popescu	!up gabriel_laddel	[16:10]
-assbot-	You voiced gabriel_laddel for 30 minutes.	[16:10]
*	assbot gives voice to gabriel_laddel	[16:10]
mircea_popescu	Chillum is a prepper !?	[16:10]
gabriel_laddel	ascii_field: I'll note that without comprehensive design documents others have to retrace your steps entirely and anyone who is a fan of your work is running on grey goo pipe dreams.	[16:10]
Chillum	mircea_popescu: gold, silver, equipment	[16:11]
mircea_popescu	seriously ?	[16:11]
Chillum	not prepared to live in the forest or anything	[16:11]
Chillum	I expect currency failure	[16:11]
mircea_popescu	wouldn't just keeping a bunch of drug dealers (actual kind, not the derps) on your rolodex work better for the purpoise ?	[16:11]
ascii_field	i call ^ this style of prep 'tomb goods'	[16:11]
Chillum	which will result in a desperation for any trade unit	[16:11]
ascii_field	as what egyptians did.	[16:11]
mircea_popescu	ascii_field same idea.	[16:12]
ascii_field	leaving goodies for one's killers to pick up.	[16:12]
Chillum	the only drugs I am stocking are antibiotics	[16:12]
mircea_popescu	not items. people.	[16:12]
Chillum	I prefer to deal with other types of people	[16:13]
mircea_popescu	i am perhaps the only one here that has actually gone through a collapse, and if that's worth for anything - goods aren't helpful.	[16:13]
Chillum	or none at all if it is an option	[16:13]
mircea_popescu	they CAN be, but they can also not be, and it's hard to know aforehand.	[16:13]
ascii_field	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=07-04-2015#1090204	[16:13]
*	assbot removes voice from ascii_field	[16:13]
assbot	Logged on 07-04-2015 00:10:01; mircea_popescu: just like having a car doesn't alow having gasoline. it's true that often people who have cars also independently have gasoline, but the two are fundamentally unrelated, and there is such a thing as the fool's breakdown, ie, car's outta gas on the side of hte road.	[16:13]
mircea_popescu	wots on the other hand... can only be helpful.	[16:13]
Chillum	I know during the collapse in Zimbabwe people went to the rivers to collect gold dust and pooled it to have food flown in from out of country	[16:13]
Chillum	though a global collapse would be a different story	[16:14]
mircea_popescu	Chillum did you read about it on wikipedia ?	[16:14]
Chillum	it was a documentary	[16:14]
mircea_popescu	but you see what i mean ?	[16:14]
Chillum	I have not personally experienced such a situation	[16:14]
mircea_popescu	nor have you read stuff written by people outside of this particular cultural space.	[16:15]
Chillum	I read a journal from a woman in Germany when they had their hyperinflation. She was selling the links from her gold chain one at a time	[16:15]
mircea_popescu	there is such a thing as group delusion. that's how the french ended up with the urinals.	[16:15]
Chillum	trading that is	[16:15]
mircea_popescu	oh, the weimar stuff ? yeah that was incredibly disciplined.	[16:15]
mircea_popescu	no "snipers in street" type of situation.	[16:16]
*	gabriel_laddel (~user@unaffiliated/gabriel-laddel/x-9909917) has left #bitcoin-assets ("Killed buffer")	[16:16]
Chillum	I read that the banks stopped serving accounts but still operated safe deposit boxes	[16:16]
Chillum	not that I trust SDBs for more than a backup stash	[16:16]
mircea_popescu	anyway, ima bbl.	[16:16]
asciilifeform	!up ascii_field	[16:17]
*	assbot gives voice to ascii_field	[16:17]
ascii_field	Chillum: consider the question of what kind of social structure has to be in place for the gold chain, etc. to remain yours to trade	[16:18]
ascii_field	rather than ripped from your fresh corpse by whoever.	[16:18]
ascii_field	or the absurdity you were asked to believe, that villagers could have 'food flown in' in exchange for collectively 'picking up gold flakes'	[16:19]
Chillum	the idea behind broken bits of jewellery is that instead of coins that make you look rich it seems like you are selling petty amounts of scrap	[16:19]
Chillum	I have a bag of damaged rings, half a pair of earrings, links that sort of stuff	[16:20]
Chillum	the fact is that anyone with enough resources to survive will be a target	[16:20]
Chillum	regardless of how they can afford those resources	[16:20]
ascii_field	Chillum: the entire exercise is what i call a 'bear suit'	[16:21]
ascii_field	there was once an engineer who occupied himself with the design of a kind of bathyscaph, a sort of 'mecha' suit in which one could survive being beaten and bitten by bears.	[16:21]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 163100 @ 0.00028789 = 46.9549 BTC [+]	[16:21]
Chillum	I don't know why you think it is absurd for a large number of people to be able to pull enough gold out of the ground to get an air drop	[16:21]
Chillum	you can make decent bank panning by hand if you work all day long for a week	[16:22]
ascii_field	Chillum: it is quite plausible to a large group of people to pull gold out of the ground	[16:22]
ascii_field	except that it is done in gulag	[16:22]
ascii_field	and not for airdrop, but for a little gruel and another day of not being shot and thrown to the dogs.	[16:22]
Chillum	I am not sure that happened during the Zimbabwe collapse	[16:23]
Chillum	it was for wheat mostly	[16:23]
Chillum	I suppose you can make gruel from wheat	[16:23]
Chillum	though traditionally it is hemp seeds, and is actually really good food	[16:23]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 133930 @ 0.00028993 = 38.8303 BTC [+] {2}	[16:23]
ascii_field	Chillum: point being that collapse leads to a trade in slaves without necessarily pausing for long at gold chains.	[16:24]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 379270 @ 0.00029122 = 110.451 BTC [+] {5}	[16:24]
ascii_field	slaves after much preliminary culling via natural processes	[16:25]
Chillum	my point is the historically having gold has helped people in bad times	[16:25]
ascii_field	Chillum: familiar with the fact that jars of roman gold, silver are often found even now ?	[16:25]
ascii_field	they did not help their owners.	[16:25]
Chillum	unless people find out you have it... I really shgould not be telling you guys about my gold!	[16:25]
ascii_field	this is the universal explanation for buried treasure, incidentally	[16:26]
Chillum	even today people bury treasure and die without recovering it	[16:26]
*	assbot gives voice to trinque	[16:26]
ascii_field	Chillum: mandatory 'buried treasure' thread on #b-a >> http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=30-08-2014#816402	[16:26]
assbot	Logged on 30-08-2014 20:46:17; asciilifeform: but, as every treatise on the subject invariably begins with, first try to understand what is to be hidden - and from whom	[16:26]
Chillum	people get rich enough that they don't need to delve into their stash then they die without telling anyone	[16:26]
*	trinque reaches the top of the logs	[16:26]
ascii_field	^ reqd. reading	[16:26]
Chillum	I wish I had a satoshi for everything in the channel that was required reading	[16:27]
trinque	ascii_field: re: earlier thread, seems like it calls for a lab attached to a (perhaps unrelated) other business	[16:27]
ascii_field	Chillum: read it. and understand that the amount of gold that is -yours- is the amount that fits in your body cavities - and, with modern techonology, not even this.	[16:27]
trinque	google is an ad company, gets to work on self driving cars and whatever else	[16:27]
ascii_field	trinque: this fails because the subject of the thread is - as i firmly believe - necessarily the work of -one mind.-	[16:28]
ascii_field	it does not corporatize.	[16:28]
Chillum	well as far as compact wealth that is fungible goes it cannot be beat. Bitcoins are great if there is still an internety	[16:28]
trinque	ascii_field: so corporatize the "chumpatron", not the lab, and own both	[16:28]
Chillum	it traverses changes in currencies	[16:29]
Chillum	you can go from nation to nation and it have value	[16:29]
Chillum	you can only carry so much survival supplies with you	[16:29]
Chillum	pure gold can be tested by a blowtorch, if you make it glow red any alloys will result in bluing, pure gold will not change color	[16:30]
Chillum	(bluing is the discoloration metals show when heated)	[16:31]
trinque	ascii_field: my observation is that very intelligent people often overlook lower hanging fruit because it's uninteresting	[16:31]
trinque	to pull an example out of my ass, there are loads of these "managed firewalls" in american businesses	[16:32]
trinque	restaurants, shops etc	[16:32]
trinque	they're all rubbish, and all certainly horribly insecure	[16:32]
trinque	you could build a product that's an order of magnitude better than what they offer in your sleep	[16:33]
Chillum	I love low hanging fruit	[16:33]
ascii_field	trinque: so corporatize the "chumpatron", not the lab, and own both >> see my comment to mircea_popescu >> http://trilema.com/2015/on-owning-things/#comment-113503	[16:34]
assbot	On owning things on Trilema - A blog by Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1axaWOZ )	[16:34]
ascii_field	the last paragraph.	[16:34]
ascii_field	trinque: i can't speak for you, but i cannot build anything whatsoever in my sleep.	[16:35]
trinque	only so many hours in a day	[16:35]
*	funkenstein_ (~josed@31.55.127.253) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[16:35]
ascii_field	trinque: i presently do something very vaguely similar to what you suggested, working for something that could be described as an antivirus firm. and it eats most of my stamina.	[16:36]
trinque	still going after weak enemies first seems a good way to start anything	[16:36]
trinque	ascii_field: yeah, plus maybe signing away certain rights to what you produce? (I'd hope not, but it's common)	[16:36]
*	assbot gives voice to funkenstein_	[16:36]
ascii_field	trinque: not like i need any of it for anything elsewhere	[16:37]
Chillum	anti-virus: https://xkcd.com/463/	[16:38]
assbot	xkcd: Voting Machines ... ( http://bit.ly/1axcbxu )	[16:38]
ascii_field	aha.	[16:39]
ascii_field	the basic idea of the thread is that no one is willing to pay - as in, -really- pay - for non-retarded things	[16:39]
ascii_field	it's rather like being a doctor who caters specifically to alcoholics	[16:40]
Chillum	retarded sells, just look at the state of movies	[16:40]
ascii_field	but he is not permitted to tell them to stop drinking.	[16:40]
funkenstein_	and the payee decides what that means i suppose?	[16:40]
ascii_field	and now imagine that this is the only kind of doctor there is.	[16:41]
funkenstein_	good evening tips hat	[16:41]
trinque	ascii_field: sounds like the kind of thing you'd need an arms race and a benefactor on one side to produce	[16:43]
trinque	if you can't create the product yet maybe the task is to create the customer?	[16:44]
ascii_field	trinque: arms races don't necessarily create long-term thinking.	[16:44]
ascii_field	benefactor would need a time horizon of 500 years at least.	[16:44]
ascii_field	trinque: again can't speak for you, but i can't create the customer any more than can create the weather.	[16:44]
trinque	ascii_field: dunno the answer, but the question would be how you increase the visibility of the problem to those that have resources to fund the thing, but don't currently care	[16:47]
trinque	say I'm the firewall company, I'd not only make my thing, I'd spend money punching holes in everyone else's products all day	[16:48]
*	assbot removes voice from ascii_field	[16:48]
asciilifeform	!up ascii_field	[16:48]
*	assbot gives voice to ascii_field	[16:48]
ascii_field	trinque: the normal paradigm of investment and return fails here	[16:48]
ascii_field	because the only approach that i believe to be correct, will result in something tangible only long after we are all dead.	[16:48]
ascii_field	the only extant analogue of this is the multigenerational starship concept	[16:49]
funkenstein_	seven generations is said to be goal for those who would claim to think long term	[16:50]
ascii_field	the actual number is uninteresting	[16:50]
ascii_field	and unknowable.	[16:50]
trinque	eh, how do you make anyone care about what happens in 7 generations?	[16:50]
funkenstein_	we all care	[16:50]
ascii_field	you need, essentially, fanatics.	[16:50]
trinque	^	[16:50]
Chillum	yup	[16:51]
Chillum	It would be nice to be born into a society that had spent the last 20 generations engaging in long term planning to make life easy	[16:51]
funkenstein_	you might as well ask how you make anyone care about what happens to themselves	[16:51]
Chillum	then just leach off of it	[16:51]
ascii_field	Chillum: where do i leech 50 yrs of free time and a semiconductor plant ?	[16:52]
mats	buying gold for a crisis is a bet that civilization will collapse this far -- and no further.	[16:52]
ascii_field	mats has it.	[16:52]
ascii_field	!s lead standard	[16:52]
assbot	10 results for 'lead standard' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=lead+standard	[16:52]
mats	a ridiculous idea, really.	[16:52]
funkenstein_	try seeds mats	[16:52]
Chillum	mats: historically civilizations do collapse so far, and no further. Even after the fall of the roman empire gold had value	[16:52]
ascii_field	http://cluborlov.blogspot.com/2011/04/financial-totalitarianism.html << obligatory orlov	[16:53]
assbot	ClubOrlov: Financial Totalitarianism ... ( http://bit.ly/1Nm3asW )	[16:53]
trinque	funkenstein_ \| you might as well ask how you make anyone care about what happens to themselves << no, this is automatic for me	[16:53]
trinque	I give ample shits about what happens to my own hide	[16:53]
Chillum	I agree it does not prepare for some unprecedented level of collapse	[16:53]
ascii_field	'And so, the answer to the perennially annoying question “How do I invest my money for it to survive financial, political and commercial collapse?” is this: “There is no answer to your question. Try asking a different question, to which there might be an answer.”'	[16:53]
*	NewLiberty has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)	[16:53]
funkenstein_	trinque, so it is automatic to care about all times then	[16:53]
mats	the only thing i'd ever bother to stockpile are bullets and natural gas	[16:53]
trinque	funkenstein_: no	[16:53]
ascii_field	Even after the fall of the roman empire gold had value << aha, very valuable, but nothing in particular attaches it to your earthly carcass.	[16:53]
trinque	funkenstein_: you're making giant leaps	[16:53]
trinque	if I care about anything at all how could I not care about being able to continue to care?	[16:54]
Chillum	ascii_field: same goes for food and other supplies	[16:54]
mats	i've got some food here in case of emergency but realistically i'll be eaten before i get to that store... too many humans per sq ft in boston.	[16:54]
trinque	in 7 generations my "caring" will have long since extinguished	[16:54]
Chillum	they may just grab you for your sweet ass	[16:54]
Chillum	at least with gold you could buy a gun	[16:54]
funkenstein_	that depends on what you mean by "my" doesn't it	[16:55]
mats	what makes you think anybody would sell you a gun for some shiny?	[16:55]
ascii_field	^	[16:55]
mats	they'll just put a knife in your chest and take it.	[16:55]
ascii_field	srsly this is not a secret, there is ample literature on what actually happens to idiot schmucks who think that money is magical	[16:55]
ascii_field	and somehow can turn into goodies by itself	[16:55]
trinque	funkenstein_: sure if we substitute my tangible feeling of "being" for some abstract soul which the society may chain to popular groupthink, we can make people do all kinds of things	[16:55]
Chillum	not magical, a tool	[16:55]
Chillum	if you don't act like a tool then you can use the tool	[16:55]
Chillum	idiot schmucks will always go the way of idiot schmucks	[16:56]
Chillum	an idiot can screw up any opportunity, means nothing	[16:56]
ascii_field	Chillum: markets do not disappear in a collapse, but become 'seller's markets' very quickly. the cost of a ticket on schindler's train was a bag of diamonds. the cost of a ticket on same train after it left - $infinite.	[16:56]
Chillum	well if I am in a nazi camp I would probably not benefit much from gold	[16:57]
mats	this kind of thinking is indicative of soft living	[16:57]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 43500 @ 0.00029153 = 12.6816 BTC [+]	[16:57]
trinque	funkenstein_: I'm not saying long term projects can't exist; however, I think they're doomed if they do not benefit the participants all along the way	[16:57]
funkenstein_	very true	[16:57]
Chillum	don't think poverty will protect you from the violent marauders	[16:57]
Chillum	being poor does not bring protection	[16:58]
ascii_field	trinque: which is why i said 'fanatics'. folks who understand that they are human rocket stages and accept this.	[16:58]
funkenstein_	one has to inherently weight the present as more important, it's an endless problem	[16:58]
Chillum	and any protection it does bring could be gained by someone able to pretend they are poor	[16:58]
ascii_field	Chillum: 'pretend you are poor' works until 'poor' means 'ribs showing'	[16:59]
ascii_field	or dead	[16:59]
Chillum	constant travel would be your best bet	[16:59]
Chillum	gladly I live in an area where you could live off the land if you wanted to	[17:00]
trinque	ascii_field: slaves, sure	[17:00]
ascii_field	actually farting sarin gas and spitting bullets at your enemies would be your best bet.	[17:00]
Chillum	though it may get crowded	[17:00]
trinque	but their masters are going to want something from having allocated them	[17:00]
ascii_field	but constant travel is a close second.	[17:00]
ascii_field	the amount of useful information contained in either advice is nil.	[17:00]
trinque	why would any powerful man use himself as another's rocket fuel?	[17:00]
Chillum	ascii_field: I honestly think keeping a low profile would offer a higher chance of survival than using a lot of force. I would carry a weapon but try my hardest not to reveal it, and use it if I do	[17:00]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 179250 @ 0.00029153 = 52.2568 BTC [+]	[17:01]
ascii_field	Chillum: the only further comment i have for this is that you will be well-served to read up on actual scenarios resembling your hypothetical. rather then using 'zombie apocalypse' 3d shooters as a mental model.	[17:02]
ascii_field	trinque: why would any powerful man use himself as another's rocket fuel? << in so long as this is phrased this way in his head - never.	[17:02]
trinque	ascii_field: also how do you get someone who's sufficiently fanatical to do the project yet rational enough to do it correctly?	[17:02]
Chillum	I have read of Zimbabwe, Germany, Argentina	[17:02]
ascii_field	it would have to be 'will of allah' or whatnot.	[17:02]
trinque	I have my doubts that a mind which believes in the will of allah produces anything of long term value	[17:03]
trinque	fuck it; god will solve the problems.	[17:03]
Chillum	a lot of great discoverers and inventors believed in god	[17:03]
ascii_field	trinque: are you able to see value in the truth as an abstract ?	[17:03]
Chillum	they could not wait for god to do it for them	[17:04]
Chillum	people believe all kinds of stupid shit, even the brilliant ones	[17:04]
funkenstein_	something i found for alf	[17:06]
funkenstein_	http://dpaste.com/3EVMY9K.txt	[17:06]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1Nm5sZi )	[17:06]
ascii_field	'that the protection stuff like checking array boundaries and pointer validity can be handled by the compiler just as effectively as it can in hardware, with the running product a lot faster and a lot simpler to build.' << imbecilic garbage	[17:07]
ascii_field	when 'in software' - can and -will- be stripped out.	[17:07]
ascii_field	for 'speed'	[17:07]
ascii_field	as described, e.g., here: http://www.xach.com/naggum/articles/3244575386963745@naggum.no.html	[17:08]
assbot	Re: Lisp advocacy misadventures - Naggum cll archive ... ( http://bit.ly/1Nm5Kzl )	[17:08]
ascii_field	stockholm syndrome sufferer, justifying status quo so he can avoid fellating his pistol	[17:08]
*	Pierre_Rochard (~Pierre@unaffiliated/pierre-rochard/x-3593157) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[17:09]
ascii_field	citing the failures that he and his ilk were responsible for, as proof that problems cannot be solved.	[17:09]
ascii_field	i assume that the discussion concerned my www site, but my points stand even if not.	[17:09]
funkenstein_	el oh fucking el	[17:10]
*	assbot gives voice to Pierre_Rochard	[17:10]
Chillum	I just got an ESP8266, a $4 chip that has a microcontroller that can run either C or Lua with 512kb memory 8GPIOs and a wifi card with a high level interface. All the size of a SD card and running off 300ma(peak) at 3.3v	[17:10]
ascii_field	funkenstein_: if you know the organism in question, link him to my answer.	[17:10]
Chillum	it can create an access point and run a web server all by itself	[17:10]
ascii_field	Chillum: what some folks will do, just to get nsa into an automatic plant waterer.	[17:11]
funkenstein_	will do	[17:11]
ascii_field	or whatever you were going to do originally with 555 timer, that you are now using 'web server' for	[17:11]
ascii_field	merely because 'it is cheap'	[17:11]
funkenstein_	what do you mean 'in software' will be stripped out?	[17:12]
ascii_field	read the link.	[17:12]
Chillum	one of these and a small battery could record wifi SSIDs and signal strength and time for days	[17:12]
Chillum	later it could be used against googles SSID database to triangulate movement	[17:13]
Chillum	it can fit in almost anything	[17:13]
Chillum	very sacry	[17:13]
Chillum	at least little brother has it too	[17:13]
Chillum	I am sure big brother has something better though	[17:13]
ascii_field	funkenstein_: i am always entertained by folks commenting 'he does not know history of computing', when themselves they do not even know most of it, because it happened on the wrong side of the atlantic	[17:15]
ascii_field	and doesn't exist in english	[17:15]
*	zooko (~user@c-75-70-204-109.hsd1.co.comcast.net) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[17:15]
ascii_field	see, idiot derps who do not know the state of the art and say that they do not need to, because taiwan isn't making it and their corner computer store isn't selling it - belong in africa.	[17:16]
funkenstein_	can't we build up from simple small parts?	[17:17]
ascii_field	funkenstein_: depends	[17:17]
ascii_field	funkenstein_: go and see how much physical space 1kb of memory takes up in a way you can -personally- construct from discrete transistors.	[17:18]
trinque	ascii_field \| trinque: are you able to see value in the truth as an abstract ? << I had the opportunity to work for a guy that thought the relational database should be central to operating system design	[17:18]
*	assbot removes voice from ascii_field	[17:18]
asciilifeform	!up ascii_field	[17:18]
*	assbot gives voice to ascii_field	[17:18]
funkenstein_	a lot of the "failures" .. are pretty fucking impressive	[17:18]
trinque	had me wiring up process tables, things in /etc via parsers, everything up into postgresql	[17:19]
ascii_field	bullet molded from shit.	[17:19]
ascii_field	'fly to the moon by stacking chairs'	[17:19]
funkenstein_	can i use photolithography?	[17:19]
ascii_field	funkenstein_: whatcha waiting for	[17:19]
ascii_field	go, use.	[17:20]
trinque	it was "true" that the system he wanted is far more robust than sed/awk-ing /etc	[17:20]
trinque	all these "puppets" and "chefs" exist because that which holds state on unix is flimsy shit	[17:20]
ascii_field	funkenstein_: wake us up when you get something like intel 4004.	[17:20]
funkenstein_	lol	[17:20]
funkenstein_	so what's wrong with the 801 tell it straight up	[17:20]
mats	16:04:57 <+Chillum> I just got an ESP8266, a $4 chip that has a microcontroller that can run either C or Lua with 512kb memory 8GPIOs and a wifi card with a high level interface. All the size of a SD card and running off 300ma(peak) at 3.3v	[17:21]
mats	you're not seriously going to run wifi or a webserver on it are you?	[17:21]
ascii_field	funkenstein_: expecting an answer to this question in a sentence is the height of folly	[17:21]
ascii_field	but, fundamentally, it is this:	[17:21]
funkenstein_	good point	[17:21]
ascii_field	the tech level to allow -one individual who can hold the design in his mind- to attempt it - wasn't there yet.	[17:22]
Chillum	mats: I am going to hook it to a serial gps chip and make a tiny super low power war walker	[17:22]
trinque	ascii_field: the company of course folded because he let a mundane consulting business die because this relational userland he was after was "obviously where computing should go"	[17:22]
Chillum	but if you ever wanted to add a webserver to your lamp, this is the device	[17:22]
mats	no. its not.	[17:22]
ascii_field	trinque: and where is the man? also dead ?	[17:22]
trinque	ascii_field: drunk at least, mostly dead	[17:22]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 75119 @ 0.00029157 = 21.9024 BTC [+] {2}	[17:22]
ascii_field	at least consistent.	[17:22]
trinque	lol	[17:22]
mats	can't securely access the thing	[17:23]
*	kushed is now known as kushed_AFK	[17:23]
trinque	ascii_field: I bring this up because this was a far more incremental change to the stack than you propose, and it still failed miserably	[17:23]
trinque	and failed imo because of refusal to do the mundane	[17:23]
ascii_field	-because- incremental.	[17:24]
trinque	perhaps	[17:24]
ascii_field	there is no incremental path from -committee of crud- to -individual fits-in-head-	[17:24]
Chillum	not all applications call for security. I am making a device that uses a laser to detect a falling drop of water and triggers my camera just as it is impacting in a pool	[17:24]
mats	er s/access/use	[17:24]
Chillum	adding a webserver interface is actually cheaper than a display and buttons	[17:24]
ascii_field	Chillum: not all applications call for security << ?!?!!!!	[17:24]
trinque	ascii_field: the idea was you get everything modeled relationally, and then user can reason about schema rather than myriad other representations of structure	[17:24]
ascii_field	what else do 'not all applications' call for	[17:24]
ascii_field	is it all right if device spontaneously catches fire ?	[17:25]
Chillum	mats: through the serial port you can completely rewrite the firmware... though I suppose on the wire it may be running some spyware, but then so could anything	[17:25]
mats	feature.	[17:25]
Chillum	it runs C code on the processor	[17:25]
Chillum	no OS even	[17:25]
mats	its not the firmware that's the problem	[17:25]
mats	same reason why pogo is only accessible over serial	[17:26]
mats	or whatever the physical arrangements therein	[17:26]
Chillum	well if you want the same thing without wifi just use an arduino	[17:26]
mats	loled	[17:26]
*	ascii_field head-desks	[17:26]
trinque	ascii_field: doesn't seem that nature takes these massive leaps	[17:27]
Chillum	ascii_field: my point was if someone hacks my camera trigger device they can take pictures and then I will unplug it	[17:27]
ascii_field	nature doesn't build cpu.	[17:27]
trinque	yeah it does	[17:27]
ascii_field	or even the shirt on your back.	[17:27]
*	trinque knocks on noggin	[17:27]
Chillum	nature builds CPUs that build CPUS	[17:27]
trinque	^	[17:27]
ascii_field	Chillum will get his next cpu from a tree.	[17:27]
trinque	lol	[17:27]
ascii_field	mankind - makes leaps.	[17:28]
ascii_field	everything worth talking about a generation up - is a leap.	[17:28]
Chillum	we are leaping more often	[17:28]
ascii_field	no cow that lived so much as 50 years ago is worth discussing	[17:28]
ascii_field	unless it was used in a medical experiment	[17:28]
trinque	not a good representative of the solutions nature comes up with	[17:29]
trinque	cows are more our fault	[17:29]
ascii_field	even in so much as it was necessary so that paul erdos could have a glass of milk.	[17:29]
ascii_field	the blade of grass the cow ate is not 'our fault' at all	[17:29]
ascii_field	and even less worthy of discussion, as an individual.	[17:29]
Chillum	Babe the Blue Ox?	[17:29]
trinque	having bred together the most docile, drooling morons of the cow-ancestor is	[17:29]
Chillum	not really a cow	[17:29]
trinque	ascii_field: say you burn a trillion dollars on this thing and it simply never works	[17:30]
ascii_field	trinque: that is virtually guaranteed	[17:30]
trinque	so then this sounds like soviet economics at best :D	[17:30]
ascii_field	the only thing i can promise for the $trillion is: more material for the next fella to work with	[17:30]
ascii_field	than otherwise.	[17:30]
ascii_field	trinque: 'soviet economics' was the kind of fool who is the only kind who can make sufficiently long bets.	[17:31]
trinque	didn't seem to work out for them	[17:32]
ascii_field	excepting perhaps ancient egyptians, or medieval christendom	[17:32]
funkenstein_	i'm not sure i get this "hold it all in your mind" fascination	[17:32]
trinque	funkenstein_: that I get 100%	[17:32]
ascii_field	funkenstein_: until you grasp it, we have nothing to discuss	[17:32]
ascii_field	read the logs.	[17:32]
Chillum	no society works out on a big enough scale	[17:32]
funkenstein_	protons	[17:32]
ascii_field	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=25-02-2015#1033665	[17:33]
assbot	Logged on 25-02-2015 21:13:46; mircea_popescu: the entire "act from cause not towards purpose" thing on trilema is exactly a vaccine against that.	[17:33]
ascii_field	^ mandatory	[17:33]
funkenstein_	the car is a common example	[17:33]
trinque	ascii_field: are there not smaller discoveries which would be useful independently which would build towards the final product?	[17:34]
ascii_field	trinque: certainly	[17:34]
trinque	well that'd be the thing to do then	[17:34]
trinque	chart a course towards the smallest of them, and towards selling it as well	[17:34]
trinque	not "burn a kingdom"	[17:35]
trinque	if it's right you should be able to get rich doing each bit of it	[17:35]
ascii_field	trinque: the only unsolved problem that would make a palpable difference is the home ic fab. which makes home satellite launch look trivial.	[17:35]
ascii_field	trinque: wake me up when you solve this	[17:35]
ascii_field	without being killed by usg	[17:35]
ascii_field	but -don't wake me up- if you want to be 'the delusionist'	[17:35]
funkenstein_	fpga not good enough for you?	[17:35]
ascii_field	http://oglaf.com/delusionist	[17:36]
ascii_field	NO	[17:36]
assbot	Delusionist ... ( http://bit.ly/1FBB3jX )	[17:36]
ascii_field	fuck, none of you read logs, do you	[17:36]
trinque	funkenstein_: he's already talked at length about FPGA	[17:36]
ascii_field	!s xilinx	[17:36]
assbot	62 results for 'xilinx' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=xilinx	[17:36]
trinque	ascii_field: I do indeed read the logs	[17:36]
mats	poor ascii, beset on all sides	[17:36]
trinque	I'm stating obvious facts about business which will still be true in 2198	[17:36]
funkenstein_	seeing as the same shit keeps coming up.. a certain amount of accepting what we have might be in order	[17:37]
ascii_field	trinque: nothing about electricity made 'business sense' in 1810.	[17:37]
funkenstein_	and using it to fix shit	[17:37]
mats	there is not always commercial value in incremental science	[17:37]
trinque	mats: I think scientists might just tend to think themselves above commerce	[17:37]
ascii_field	the only reason you are reading this by electric light, instead of mumbling to yourself in a field, is that someone had the freedom to counter-economically pull his mental dick by experimenting with strange.	[17:37]
ascii_field	the economic actors came second.	[17:38]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 70100 @ 0.00029162 = 20.4426 BTC [+]	[17:38]
trinque	sure	[17:38]
funkenstein_	if you are in it for the money you are an amateur	[17:38]
trinque	funkenstein_: oh come on	[17:38]
trinque	iirc the house that invented the light bulb made a great deal of money selling them	[17:38]
funkenstein_	quoting	[17:38]
trinque	this is anticapitalist nonsense	[17:38]
funkenstein_	no it is common sense	[17:38]
ascii_field	trinque: lodygin didn't make terribly much from light bulb.	[17:39]
mats	there is such a thing as frictional force business you know	[17:39]
mats	er, in business.	[17:40]
trinque	ascii_field: was he permitted to benefit from the fruits of his own labor, or did this belong to some all-owning state? I am not familiar enough with Russian history to say.	[17:40]
ascii_field	thing is, you don't get to make herr lodygin not exist, just so your ideology can make sense.	[17:40]
ascii_field	or lilienfeld's transistor.	[17:41]
ascii_field	or, or, or	[17:41]
ascii_field	or farnsworth's television	[17:41]
funkenstein_	the interesting bit is what you guys actually do with your lives, not who says they have what in which accounts	[17:41]
trinque	I am not questioning whether people solve problems simply because of the satisfaction of doing so	[17:41]
ascii_field	^ lived in usa	[17:41]
ascii_field	funkenstein_: aha let's change subject, sure	[17:42]
ascii_field	no.	[17:42]
ascii_field	it is germane.	[17:42]
trinque	I think it's fine to say the capitalist and the scientist are different men	[17:42]
funkenstein_	here's a possibly unrelated query for you	[17:43]
Chillum	batman was both	[17:43]
trinque	but also that if you're talking about projects that span any considerable length of time, you're gonna need a capitalist	[17:43]
ascii_field	trinque: who was korolev's capitalist ?	[17:43]
trinque	armies run on food	[17:43]
trinque	and boots	[17:43]
trinque	and so on	[17:43]
trinque	oil, metal, w/e	[17:43]
funkenstein_	oh never mind :P i'm off for a drink	[17:43]
trinque	the guy that discovers a thing is not the only part of the process	[17:43]
trinque	how bout producing more than one of the thing	[17:44]
trinque	ascii_field: looks like his capitalist was the soviet state	[17:44]
ascii_field	trinque: interestingly, there are quite a few technologies which, in the popular mind, 'don't exist' because you cannot get them at the corner store.	[17:45]
ascii_field	e.g., doped diamond semiconductor	[17:45]
ascii_field	but they exist nevertheless.	[17:45]
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trinque	ascii_field: ah, I am not also saying that because something's not at walmart it doesn't really exist. the market being skewed towards morons is a separate problem which needs to be solved	[17:46]
ascii_field	trinque: consider an example:	[17:46]
ascii_field	P. Ya. Ufimtsev, Method of Edge Waves in the Physical Theory of Diffraction, Soviet Radio, Moscow, 1962.	[17:46]
ascii_field	does this ring a bell?	[17:46]
ascii_field	it should.	[17:46]
ascii_field	the (meanwhile obsolete today but that is another conversation) 'stealth' airplane - lives and dies by this paper	[17:47]
ascii_field	a fact not disputed by its makers	[17:47]
ascii_field	note that herr ufimtsev did not go to a venture capitalist and ask for money to live on so he could study mathematics and live a long life of possibly not amounting to anything that could be cashed in to pay it back.	[17:48]
trinque	well the soviet state was the patron of these scientists, yes?	[17:48]
ascii_field	aha	[17:48]
ascii_field	like a demented old woman who invests in pyramid scams ten times a day	[17:49]
trinque	ultimately consumed by the rot of central economic planning?	[17:49]
*	assbot removes voice from ascii_field	[17:49]
asciilifeform	!up ascii_field	[17:49]
*	assbot gives voice to ascii_field	[17:49]
trinque	how does that thing run long enough for your zealots to produce the computer?	[17:49]
ascii_field	trinque: same question will be asked of usa	[17:49]
ascii_field	and every other mega-empire	[17:49]
ascii_field	how did aztecs stay in business long enough to build their pyramid temples?	[17:49]
ascii_field	egypt?	[17:49]
trinque	bizarre obsession with a single topic coupled with sort of living in an undisturbed bubble for long enough	[17:50]
ascii_field	empires - age. and die. like people.	[17:50]
chetty	same answer for all of the above, believers	[17:50]
trinque	chetty: yeah but "believers in bubble" I think	[17:50]
chetty	well a bubble holds the belief together for longer	[17:51]
ascii_field	in what bubble did mr newton live ?	[17:51]
trinque	wasn't it wealth?	[17:51]
ascii_field	arguably in christendom, but he did write 'i do not need that hypothesis' when asked where the place of the creator was in 'principia'	[17:51]
ascii_field	ditto ussr	[17:52]
chetty	even in bubbles you get a few ...	[17:52]
ascii_field	what particular state religion is in use, is unimportant so long as ufimtsev et al can do their thing.	[17:52]
Chillum	trinque: he was born to a farming family	[17:52]
*	chetty points at ascii_field	[17:52]
trinque	right so what arrangement produces the longest-term supply of wealthy, educated, cultured patrons?	[17:53]
ascii_field	in bubbles, you sometimes get visitors from older, long-popped bubbles	[17:53]
Chillum	his mom wanted him to stop school to go back to farming when he was a teenager	[17:53]
chetty	right so what arrangement produces the longest-term supply of wealthy, educated, cultured patrons?// afaik feudalism	[17:53]
ascii_field	trinque: this is not a question that anyone has any use for the answer of, even if i could convincingly answer it. but otherwise - chetty has it.	[17:54]
Chillum	it was a good system, if you were in charge	[17:54]
trinque	Chillum: or could demonstrate value to someone who was	[17:54]
ascii_field	Chillum: and if not. i spend a vastly larger fraction of my waking hours working to pay tax than any medieval peasant in europe did.	[17:54]
Chillum	I try not to work too hard	[17:55]
chetty	second that ascii_field	[17:55]
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ascii_field	to wrap up the thread, when i spoke of 'fanatic' i was referring precisely to mircea_popescu's 'act from cause not towards purpose' maxim.	[17:58]
trinque	I don't see the connection to fanaticism there	[17:58]
trinque	a fanatic has a purpose	[17:58]
trinque	"I will bring about the glorious it"	[17:58]
ascii_field	trinque: that is a formulation for the simple	[17:59]
ascii_field	in actuality, there are two kinds of human activity. 'i will do this because my cock will be sucked, or to avoid whipping', and the other being 'i will do this because it is right'	[17:59]
ascii_field	1 is 'purpose'; 2 - 'cause'.	[17:59]
trinque	I am skeptical of the "right" used there, but that's an entirely other thread	[18:00]
ascii_field	virtually anyone worth speaking to, is, upon examination, motivated by some (2) and not merely (1).	[18:00]
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ascii_field	think of the partizan who dies under torture rather than rat out comrades	[18:02]
ascii_field	or whatever equivalent exists in your particular culture (and if your culture doesn't have such heroes, it is moribund and time to gtfo)	[18:02]
trinque	person in question doesn't want to live in a world where comrades are ratted, or at least not his	[18:03]
*	ColdStorage (60ffb86f@gateway/web/freenode/ip.96.255.184.111) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[18:03]
trinque	that can be entirely rational	[18:03]
trinque	doesn't require a zealot in service to something imaginary	[18:03]
ascii_field	the world that exists after your death is imaginary.	[18:03]
trinque	yeah but there are perhaps circumstances less appealing than death	[18:04]
ascii_field	if you don't see this, you are playing mental gymnastics, but whatever rocks your boat.	[18:04]
trinque	ascii_field: no that was precisely my point earlier	[18:04]
trinque	considering 7 generation projects	[18:04]
asciilifeform	!up diametric	[18:05]
*	assbot gives voice to diametric	[18:05]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 114433 @ 0.00028772 = 32.9247 BTC [-]	[18:05]
diametric	http://yro.slashdot.org/story/15/04/10/1541258/florida-teen-charged-with-felony-hacking-for-changing-desktop-wallpaper	[18:05]
assbot	Florida Teen Charged With Felony Hacking For Changing Desktop Wallpaper - Slashdot ... ( http://bit.ly/1CD6wwh )	[18:05]
trinque	infrequently I experience extreme headaches	[18:05]
funkenstein_	ascii_field wut?	[18:05]
trinque	the dehumanizing, laughing at nothing, vomiting kind	[18:06]
funkenstein_	you trollin bro	[18:06]
trinque	since they are infrequent I do not feel this way, but if they were daily I'd gladly end my life rather than continue in those conditions	[18:06]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 187471 @ 0.00028093 = 52.6662 BTC [-] {2}	[18:06]
trinque	has nothing to do with the situation after death	[18:06]
trinque	ratting comrades might make a person feel the same way about himself, so he choses death	[18:06]
funkenstein_	the world that exists after your birth is imaginary <-- makes more sense	[18:07]
ascii_field	'A 14-year-old middle school student in Holiday, Florida, was arrested this week and charged with "an offense against a computer system and unauthorized access," which is a felony. The student reportedly used an administrator password to log into a teacher's computer and change the background image to a photo of two men kissing. The student also revealed his secrets after he was caught – the password was the teacher'	[18:07]
ascii_field	s last name, and the teacher had typed it in in full view of the students. The student said many other students used these administrators' passwords (their teachers' last names) so they can screen-share and video chat with other students. The student was briefly held in a nearby detention center, and the county Sheriff warned that other teenagers caught doing the same thing will "face the same consequences."'	[18:07]
*	kushed_AFK is now known as kushed	[18:07]
*	trinque has to run, will pick up the thread upon return	[18:08]
ascii_field	'Kids need to learn the consequences of embarrassing powerful people. That is one of the golden rules of modern society; thou shalt not embarrass thy superiors. Snowden forgot that, and this little punk forgot that. You respect your betters, or you get tossed in a cage. That's the law. Ingrain that into your kid's brains before puberty hits, or they will wind up in a cage too.' << from commentz	[18:08]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 61158 @ 0.00027974 = 17.1083 BTC [-]	[18:15]
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*	assbot removes voice from ascii_field	[18:19]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 140300 @ 0.00027864 = 39.0932 BTC [-]	[18:19]
*	joecool (~joecool@no-sources/joecool) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[18:20]
asciilifeform	!up ascii_field	[18:20]
*	assbot gives voice to ascii_field	[18:20]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 215200 @ 0.00028284 = 60.8672 BTC [+] {3}	[18:22]
*	assbot removes voice from diametric	[18:36]
*	DreadKnight (~DreadKnig@unaffiliated/dreadknight) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[18:39]
funkenstein_	no public key - can't apply revocation certificate <--- gpg --import spits this out. what does it mean?	[18:41]
ascii_field	funkenstein_: likely means that there is a revocator packet in there for some key you don't have in your collection	[18:41]
ascii_field	should not be a fatal error	[18:41]
funkenstein_	thanks.. but it seems it is not taking the public key which was given to me	[18:42]
funkenstein_	it's a new public key someone sent me	[18:42]
funkenstein_	a shady character as it happens	[18:45]
funkenstein_	no matter i'll ask for a new one, thanks again	[18:45]
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mircea_popescu	prolly key was revoked already	[18:50]
*	assbot removes voice from ascii_field	[18:51]
asciilifeform	!up ascii_field	[18:51]
*	assbot gives voice to ascii_field	[18:51]
*	DreadKnight has quit (Quit: #AncientBeast - Master Your Beasts ( www.AncientBeast.com ))	[18:51]
mircea_popescu	hm did qntra hit a truly major spike or something ?	[18:53]
ascii_field	mircea_popescu: if i had to guess, it'd be http://qntra.net/2015/04/battle-for-the-right-to-play-old-multiplayer-games-take-shape	[18:54]
assbot	Battle for the right to play old multiplayer games take shape. \| Qntra.net ... ( http://bit.ly/1O0cEoK )	[18:54]
mircea_popescu	hm	[19:05]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 29637 @ 0.00028698 = 8.5052 BTC [+]	[19:19]
*	zooko (~user@c-75-70-204-109.hsd1.co.comcast.net) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[19:24]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 92813 @ 0.00028698 = 26.6355 BTC [+]	[19:26]
*	NyanAlucard is now known as shinohai	[19:36]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 216393 @ 0.00028333 = 61.3106 BTC [-] {2}	[19:38]
mircea_popescu	!up shinohai	[19:40]
-assbot-	You voiced shinohai for 30 minutes.	[19:40]
*	assbot gives voice to shinohai	[19:40]
Chillum	ultima online, good times	[19:40]
Chillum	heck Ultima IV good times	[19:43]
shinohai	o/ mircea_popescu	[19:50]
mircea_popescu	which one is ultima ? the one with vi domina etc ?	[19:50]
mircea_popescu	ello shinohai	[19:50]
shinohai	are we going to defeat the bitcoin foundation and build a real btc wallet?	[19:51]
mircea_popescu	who's we. for that matter, who are you.	[19:51]
mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-04-2015#1095266 << you know, people have direct contact with this : beggars in every major town are run by organized crime.	[19:52]
assbot	Logged on 10-04-2015 19:13:36; ascii_field: or the absurdity you were asked to believe, that villagers could have 'food flown in' in exchange for collectively 'picking up gold flakes'	[19:52]
mircea_popescu	nevertheless, same people actually believe the equivalent of beggars in a river somewhere are... a communal co-op!	[19:52]
mircea_popescu	talk about a memory hole.	[19:52]
mircea_popescu	what exactly would prevent me from beating the shit out of the 'villagers' each day, having them digging out gold nuggets till they drop so i can have more guns flown in ?	[19:53]
mircea_popescu	it's how fucking africa runs since... oh i dunno, 1500 ?	[19:53]
shinohai	I am no one. Just a person that wants to secure the future of this tech	[19:53]
shinohai	not interested in picking up gold flakes. If i was i'd still get my bitcoin from faucets	[19:55]
mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-04-2015#1095282 << gruel is actually made out of oats, traditionally. rye, in some places. it also expanded to mean figuratively "any cheap unpretentious bland boiled stuff"	[19:55]
assbot	Logged on 10-04-2015 19:18:17; Chillum: though traditionally it is hemp seeds, and is actually really good food	[19:55]
mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-04-2015#1095298 << yeah that's a good goal.	[19:56]
assbot	Logged on 10-04-2015 19:21:41; Chillum: I wish I had a satoshi for everything in the channel that was required reading	[19:56]
shinohai	Wish in one and shit in the other. See which fills up quicker.	[19:57]
shinohai	I have actually quoted you before mircea_popescu	[19:57]
shinohai	How if we wish to have nice things, we need to pay for them	[19:57]
shinohai	ad naseum	[19:58]
mircea_popescu	aha.	[19:58]
mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-04-2015#1095315 << and run into the 17th standard problem ? the reason they're horribru is because they're stuck working for dwim users who are very diverse.	[19:59]
assbot	Logged on 10-04-2015 19:27:44; trinque: you could build a product that's an order of magnitude better than what they offer in your sleep	[19:59]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 93165 @ 0.00028866 = 26.893 BTC [+]	[19:59]
shinohai	I work for no one at this point.	[19:59]
shinohai	So lol	[19:59]
shinohai	I just like stirring pots	[20:00]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 381900 @ 0.00027835 = 106.3019 BTC [-] {4}	[20:00]
mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-04-2015#1095326 << people certainly understand problems stated in terms of sex a fuckload better than they understand the same problems stated in "abstract" terms huh.	[20:01]
assbot	Logged on 10-04-2015 19:33:25; Chillum: anti-virus: https://xkcd.com/463/	[20:01]
shinohai	touche	[20:02]
mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-04-2015#1095340 << so eat more beans :D	[20:02]
assbot	Logged on 10-04-2015 19:39:27; ascii_field: trinque: again can't speak for you, but i can't create the customer any more than can create the weather.	[20:02]
trinque	heh!	[20:02]
mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-04-2015#1095342 << yeah. or in simpler terms : suppose you're the foreign kid in class that not only throws everyone's curve to the point where most of them flunk	[20:03]
assbot	Logged on 10-04-2015 19:42:35; trinque: say I'm the firewall company, I'd not only make my thing, I'd spend money punching holes in everyone else's products all day	[20:03]
mircea_popescu	but also makes fun of them all day for it.	[20:03]
mircea_popescu	how'd that conceivably go ?	[20:03]
*	WolfGoethe has quit (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)	[20:03]
shinohai	meh I've been made fun of before	[20:03]
shinohai	ask TradeFortress how that wen	[20:04]
shinohai	*went	[20:04]
Chillum	I had this job and we had to get our site certified for some credit card standard. They required anti-virus software, but we run linux. So we installed an anti-virus scanner designed to find windows viruses in attachments for e-mail servers	[20:04]
mircea_popescu	shinohai dawg you're trying too hard. how about you get in the wot, settle down to some reading ?	[20:04]
Chillum	it passed	[20:04]
mircea_popescu	lol	[20:04]
shinohai	idc	[20:05]
mircea_popescu	im sure someone somewhere had a chuckle.	[20:05]
trinque	Chillum: PCI is a joke	[20:05]
*	veeminer_ (~quassel@kos.paskuli.cz) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[20:05]
Chillum	indeed it is	[20:05]
shinohai	if i make wot so be it	[20:05]
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shinohai	if not im doing my thing	[20:05]
Chillum	wow you are so independent!	[20:05]
mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-04-2015#1095355 << ironically, you are.	[20:06]
assbot	Logged on 10-04-2015 19:46:18; Chillum: It would be nice to be born into a society that had spent the last 20 generations engaging in long term planning to make life easy	[20:06]
mircea_popescu	do you love it ?	[20:06]
Chillum	that is only part of what I said	[20:06]
Chillum	I then said "Then I can leach off of it"	[20:06]
Chillum	yes I do	[20:06]
mircea_popescu	aha.	[20:06]
trinque	central planning eh?	[20:06]
mircea_popescu	imo it's kinda dweeby, but hey. one doesn't get to choose the times	[20:07]
shinohai	may iask mircea_popescu what u think i try so hard at ?	[20:07]
trinque	that was the thread with alf earlier	[20:07]
mircea_popescu	shinohai that part is unclear.	[20:07]
shinohai	naturally	[20:07]
Chillum	The danger of planning tasks beyond your lifetime is instead of grand stabilizing projects they turn into welfare	[20:07]
Chillum	like social security	[20:07]
mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-04-2015#1095365 << gold had value in the sense prostitutes are pleasant. sure, in general.	[20:08]
trinque	Chillum: or it falls apart because the narrative keeping people doing it is bullshit	[20:08]
assbot	Logged on 10-04-2015 19:47:23; Chillum: mats: historically civilizations do collapse so far, and no further. Even after the fall of the roman empire gold had value	[20:08]
mircea_popescu	not to you.	[20:08]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 146500 @ 0.00029023 = 42.5187 BTC [+] {2}	[20:08]
mircea_popescu	books also had meaning. all through the dark ages.	[20:08]
mircea_popescu	the arabs collected them.	[20:08]
Chillum	that worked out well	[20:09]
mircea_popescu	sure, in general it did.	[20:09]
mircea_popescu	for that matter, politicians are pliable, policemen respectful and judges amenable. in all times and places. that's what these do.	[20:09]
mircea_popescu	doctors cure diseases.	[20:10]
mircea_popescu	you however... you got cancer. what now ?	[20:10]
shinohai	books haz moar value than gold	[20:10]
*	assbot removes voice from shinohai	[20:10]
Chillum	I used to sell books for a living, they really don't	[20:10]
mircea_popescu	so did orwell.	[20:10]
trinque	assbot has it	[20:11]
mircea_popescu	came to the same conclusion, apparently.	[20:11]
Chillum	by that I mean I wrote repricing scripts that set the prices on millions of books	[20:11]
mircea_popescu	oh that bit.	[20:11]
Chillum	some people are so dumb they insist on pricing their book at 1 cent below the lowest price every hour when we have told them that other people are doing that	[20:11]
Chillum	then they complain that their books cost 1 penny	[20:11]
mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-04-2015#1095371 << or to put it in actual cannonical form, "how do i ensure my personal relevance transcends gaps which specifically annull the relevance of things existing prior ???". get in line, every old guy since afanti wanted to figure this one out.	[20:12]
assbot	Logged on 10-04-2015 19:47:50; ascii_field: 'And so, the answer to the perennially annoying question “How do I invest my money for it to survive financial, political and commercial collapse?” is this: “There is no answer to your question. Try asking a different question, to which there might be an answer.”'	[20:12]
Chillum	a lot of people priced their books by weight because they bought them by the ton	[20:12]
Chillum	buy @ 5 cents per kilo sell at 10 cents per kilo	[20:12]
Chillum	except they used pounds because they were american sigh	[20:12]
mircea_popescu	Chillum this is how it worked in belle epoque paris rly.	[20:12]
Chillum	naturally the books that sell by weight tend to be the ones that don't sell	[20:13]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 68544 @ 0.00029162 = 19.9888 BTC [+]	[20:13]
mircea_popescu	books as a product kinda died a decade or two prior.	[20:13]
mircea_popescu	i used to have a huge library, i wouldnt buy a book today.	[20:13]
Chillum	yes, online sales is essentially liquidation for a lot of sellers	[20:14]
mircea_popescu	better ways to grow fungi and afids on your walls if you're really into that.	[20:14]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 60556 @ 0.00029249 = 17.712 BTC [+] {2}	[20:14]
Chillum	people would arbitrage book auctions compared to known prices and then ship it all to Amazon for them to handle the shipping. Pencil pushers buying us dying companies and selling with least effort possible	[20:14]
Chillum	s/us/up/	[20:15]
Chillum	a lot of online book sellers never handle a book	[20:15]
Chillum	we call them "widgets"	[20:16]
mircea_popescu	his is pretty common.	[20:17]
mircea_popescu	whitelabelling and dropshipping and all that is how the "service economy" operates.	[20:17]
Chillum	very very stupid people	[20:17]
Chillum	introverted, antisocial, stupid bookseller	[20:17]
Chillum	s	[20:17]
*	veeminer (~quassel@kos.paskuli.cz) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[20:18]
mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-04-2015#1095388 << about the same that happens to people who thing their feelings are important.	[20:18]
assbot	Logged on 10-04-2015 19:50:13; ascii_field: and somehow can turn into goodies by itself	[20:18]
mircea_popescu	they get pregnant and then used to it.	[20:18]
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mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-04-2015#1095398 << "goal-oriented" has appeared in literature recently. there is a reason for this.	[20:19]
assbot	Logged on 10-04-2015 19:52:08; trinque: funkenstein_: I'm not saying long term projects can't exist; however, I think they're doomed if they do not benefit the participants all along the way	[20:19]
mircea_popescu	most of human history, and the vast majority of everything nice and good, came out of cause-oriented. so common in fact it didn't even have a name.	[20:19]
mircea_popescu	what motivates the monkey to pick up the rock isn't some sort of contorted dream about becoming a rockthrowing revolutionary ceo.	[20:20]
Chillum	any long term project will be cannibalized the moment it become inconvenient not too	[20:20]
mircea_popescu	it is a much simpler "here is a rock."	[20:20]
Chillum	the pyramids used to have a lovely limestone cover	[20:20]
mircea_popescu	Chillum and kept it, until napoleon showed up.	[20:20]
mircea_popescu	the locals didn't. you know ?	[20:20]
trinque	mircea_popescu: right, this seems directly at odds with the multigenerational, self-sacrificial quest for truth	[20:20]
Chillum	actually there are very old towns build from the pyramids limestone	[20:21]
Chillum	in ruins	[20:21]
mircea_popescu	you're thinking the modern villages in england built out of their various ancient druid stuff.	[20:21]
Chillum	not all of it	[20:21]
Chillum	nope that is not what I am thinking of	[20:21]
mircea_popescu	i been to egypt, never seen these towns.	[20:22]
trinque	mircea_popescu: is this idea of the colossal project a russian thing?	[20:22]
Chillum	I don't see how I could confuse such different things	[20:22]
Chillum	I have been to Kenya, I did not see a giraffe	[20:22]
Chillum	they still exist	[20:22]
mircea_popescu	point.	[20:22]
Chillum	I saw an elephant though	[20:22]
mircea_popescu	i saw a giraffe but it wasn't kenya.	[20:22]
mircea_popescu	trinque um, why russian ?	[20:22]
Chillum	the elephant was very far away, but I saw it	[20:22]
trinque	mircea_popescu: stan likes to bring up russian scientists	[20:23]
mircea_popescu	im kinda sorrty we don't have an ukr alf here, it'd be fun to watch the two.	[20:23]
Chillum	At this forest like park I was drinking(they have bars in parks there!) and there were these little monkeys everywhere	[20:23]
mircea_popescu	"you no say ukraine is weak!"	[20:23]
Chillum	some fool at another table fed them and suddenly they had like 20 monkeys	[20:23]
mircea_popescu	heh	[20:23]
mircea_popescu	practically street urchins, huh.	[20:24]
Chillum	then a freaking baboon walked by our table and gave us a nod as it went by	[20:24]
mircea_popescu	lol!	[20:24]
Chillum	the people I was with said they don't normally live in that area but that one lives in the park	[20:24]
mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-04-2015#1095407 << this has historically not been the case.	[20:25]
assbot	Logged on 10-04-2015 19:54:15; Chillum: constant travel would be your best bet	[20:25]
Chillum	this guy: http://kenya-2011.highinbc.com/images/e7c2268a5c8227eb4a7d4f973f500b9f-600.jpg	[20:25]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1IS5Ub3 )	[20:25]
mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-04-2015#1095416 << actually being a woman, especially if young, and very very easy is what offers the best chance of survival.	[20:26]
assbot	Logged on 10-04-2015 19:55:32; Chillum: ascii_field: I honestly think keeping a low profile would offer a higher chance of survival than using a lot of force. I would carry a weapon but try my hardest not to reveal it, and use it if I do	[20:26]
mircea_popescu	being a man is already such a bad deal very little you'll do can possibly compensate.	[20:26]
mircea_popescu	pretty cool.	[20:27]
Chillum	just imagine being a baboon living in a people park	[20:27]
mircea_popescu	what's the big deal ? animals are versatile. pigeons do it, why wouldn't monkeys.	[20:28]
mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-04-2015#1095419 << quite exactly.	[20:28]
assbot	Logged on 10-04-2015 19:57:02; ascii_field: trinque: why would any powerful man use himself as another's rocket fuel? << in so long as this is phrased this way in his head - never.	[20:28]
mircea_popescu	dude i missed a buncha good lines!	[20:28]
Chillum	All I remember thinking is that this animal has super human strength and speed	[20:28]
trinque	I enjoyed that thread	[20:28]
trinque	mircea_popescu: what is the alternate phrasing?	[20:28]
mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-04-2015#1095423 << nonsense, this. the arabs produced the fucking algorithm.	[20:29]
assbot	Logged on 10-04-2015 19:57:55; trinque: I have my doubts that a mind which believes in the will of allah produces anything of long term value	[20:29]
*	Adlai shares another one of his ideas that require more rocket fuel than he has to offer - something which inputs log.b-a, and outputs actual threads	[20:29]
mircea_popescu	and chemistry.	[20:29]
mircea_popescu	Adlai heh. so make a forum out of it?	[20:29]
Chillum	they invented zero	[20:29]
Chillum	that is like half of computer	[20:29]
trinque	been a while since eh?	[20:29]
Chillum	one being the other half	[20:29]
Chillum	s/computer/computing/	[20:29]
mircea_popescu	trinque "a man that does what he can and takes pleasure in it will do what he can and take pleasure in it".	[20:29]
trinque	looks like they got as much as they could out of allah a while ago	[20:29]
Adlai	mircea_popescu: no! envision a secretary, lurking in-channel, tagging each message with the 'thread' to which it belongs	[20:29]
Adlai	now lock the secretary in a room with no internet and logs	[20:30]
mircea_popescu	think in terms of impregnating women, trinque. why don't you do it ? because what it... means, what it implies. but imagine it implied exactly nothing. well then ? why not ?	[20:30]
trinque	sure, all over the place	[20:30]
Chillum	trinque: religion isn't about getting something, it is about people taking from you	[20:30]
mircea_popescu	Chillum argument was "enduring"	[20:30]
Adlai	"war isn't about who's right, it's about who's left"	[20:30]
trinque	mircea_popescu: alf says the guy needs to burn all his women to make the computer	[20:30]
trinque	or that's my understanding	[20:30]
mircea_popescu	i doubt the guy cares what alf says.	[20:31]
mircea_popescu	Adlai ahaha excellent.	[20:31]
Adlai	mircea_popescu: excellent the quote, or the thread-annotator concept?	[20:31]
mircea_popescu	the quote.	[20:31]
mircea_popescu	yes, war is about how the women will be left, and they'll reform society into an imbecillic construction that'll require the next war.	[20:32]
mircea_popescu	seems improbable for anyone to manage to ever break this cycle.	[20:32]
Adlai	the disadvantage of having a threader is that it saves newbies the valuable educational work of thinking while they read	[20:32]
Chillum	we could send women to war and the guys stay home	[20:32]
Chillum	it is their turn anyways	[20:32]
mircea_popescu	why not tax the rich and help the poor, while at it.	[20:32]
mircea_popescu	or piss upstream or w/e.	[20:32]
Chillum	we could hold the war in a really inconvenient location so that nobody shows up	[20:32]
Chillum	on a tuesday	[20:33]
mircea_popescu	all fine ideas that never work. and in any case : i was discussing gender not sex.	[20:33]
mircea_popescu	whoever you send to war is gonna be the male.	[20:33]
mircea_popescu	'cuz they went.	[20:33]
Chillum	lol guess which one I am: http://kenya-2011.highinbc.com/images/f46e7a7dc6d8f3b10a0877aa1a3bb4b2-600.jpg	[20:35]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1IS6ANE )	[20:35]
Chillum	"one of these guys is not like the others..."	[20:35]
trinque	Chillum: kid in the pink jumpsuit, clearly	[20:35]
Chillum	yup	[20:35]
Chillum	hint, I am not from Kenya	[20:36]
Adlai	the child was clearly adopted from inner-city parents who couldn't afford to raise it	[20:36]
Adlai	eg detroit	[20:36]
Chillum	while it may look like detroit is it in fact not	[20:36]
*	whaack (cda404a6@gateway/web/freenode/ip.205.164.4.166) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[20:36]
Chillum	notice the trees	[20:36]
mircea_popescu	is Chillum hotter than nubbins` ?	[20:37]
trinque	that building's too sturdy for detroit	[20:37]
Chillum	not sure, I am pretty hot	[20:37]
mircea_popescu	lol	[20:37]
mircea_popescu	Chillum what do they call the djalabeya in kenya ?	[20:37]
Chillum	I don't know that word	[20:37]
mircea_popescu	the jumpsuit as the fellow put it	[20:38]
Chillum	I don't know	[20:38]
mircea_popescu	everyone wears the same thing and calls it sopmething else.	[20:38]
Chillum	but I will say even in the poor areas people were pretty well dressed	[20:38]
mircea_popescu	apparently the english canonical form is jalabiya	[20:38]
Chillum	it must be a cultural thing	[20:38]
Chillum	particularly when they were in town	[20:39]
mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-04-2015#1095441 << this is pretty interesting.	[20:41]
assbot	Logged on 10-04-2015 20:04:58; Chillum: I just got an ESP8266, a $4 chip that has a microcontroller that can run either C or Lua with 512kb memory 8GPIOs and a wifi card with a high level interface. All the size of a SD card and running off 300ma(peak) at 3.3v	[20:41]
mircea_popescu	are they available in qty ?	[20:41]
Chillum	yes	[20:41]
Chillum	they are mass produced	[20:41]
Chillum	got mine on ebay	[20:41]
mircea_popescu	what's it power the wifi from ?	[20:41]
mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-04-2015#1095442 << dude, why so disdainful ? if you don't trust people you don't know on the basis of what they write, "warm smile and handshake" smarm, why would you despise people you also don't know on the basis of six lines ? what are you, mazarin ?	[20:42]
assbot	Logged on 10-04-2015 20:05:18; ascii_field: funkenstein_: if you know the organism in question, link him to my answer.	[20:42]
Chillum	It says +25dBm on it	[20:42]
Chillum	there are several models, a few have external antenna ports	[20:42]
mircea_popescu	whats that like 1/3 W ?	[20:43]
Chillum	not sure	[20:43]
mircea_popescu	pretty decent iirc 15ish is the norm. mebbe 20.	[20:43]
Chillum	the esp-07 version is the small one with more memory and gpios and external antenna port	[20:43]
Chillum	$3.88 each	[20:44]
Chillum	and that is to buy one, I am sure there are bulk discounts	[20:44]
Chillum	This guy: www.ebay.ca/itm/291335888282	[20:44]
mircea_popescu	Chillum something's amiss, actually. the +25dBm needs to output >320 mW. your thing can't eat 300mW peak and also output 320. but anyway, usual commercial puffery.	[20:44]
Chillum	ya, just reading what the website says	[20:45]
Chillum	I may have misread too	[20:45]
Chillum	These guys field test them: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7BYdZ_24yg0	[20:45]
assbot	ESP8266 Wifi Range/Distance Tests (Wi07C) - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1IS7CJx )	[20:45]
Chillum	they get over a kilometer without an ext ant, more with	[20:46]
mircea_popescu	yah pretty impressive.	[20:46]
mircea_popescu	esp for how tiny it is.	[20:46]
Chillum	indeed. Its impressive features include its tiny price, tiny size, and tiny power usage(even if it is over 300ma)	[20:47]
Chillum	the old version was C only and that was great, now they have a lua interpreter which makes handling network connections so much easier	[20:47]
Chillum	the lua interpreter is of course just C	[20:48]
mircea_popescu	i'd imagine.	[20:48]
Chillum	about 140k of C, very efficient	[20:48]
*	assbot gives voice to whaack	[20:48]
Chillum	If you ever want to include a scripting language in an embedded device but don't have a lot of resources to spare, that is what lua was made for	[20:49]
Chillum	it has very good sandboxing	[20:49]
mircea_popescu	i gather. used extensively in gaming for this reason.	[20:49]
whaack	Is there a way to prevent NickServ from dropping my account? It says I'm not registered now	[20:49]
mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-04-2015#1095470 << lol. so russian :D	[20:49]
assbot	Logged on 10-04-2015 20:14:35; ascii_field: go, use.	[20:49]
mircea_popescu	whaack why would nickserv drop an account ? i never heard of this.	[20:49]
mircea_popescu	but should prolly ask in #freenode.	[20:50]
whaack	well I try to identify and it says I'm not registered	[20:50]
Chillum	did you perhaps have 1 or 3 "a"s in your last username?	[20:50]
mircea_popescu	wrong name ?	[20:50]
Chillum	wrong irc network?	[20:50]
mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-04-2015#1095482 << wait, that's legal where you live ? Terroristia ?	[20:51]
assbot	Logged on 10-04-2015 20:16:42; Chillum: mats: I am going to hook it to a serial gps chip and make a tiny super low power war walker	[20:51]
whaack	nope definitely 2 a's, I'll pop in freenode	[20:52]
Chillum	all it does is listen	[20:52]
Chillum	there is nothing illegal about listening to radio transmission on public bands	[20:52]
*	WolfGoethe (~textual@65.209.61.114) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[20:52]
Chillum	in fact it sends nothing so it is very hard to detect	[20:52]
Chillum	(anything electical can technically be detected)	[20:52]
mats	you know there are war driving communities that have likely already mapped your entire region, right	[20:53]
Chillum	mats: what fun is that?	[20:53]
Chillum	I walk anyways	[20:53]
Chillum	my raspberry pi gets 9 hours from a small battery, the ESP8266 with a low power gps receiver will run off a small battery for days	[20:54]
Chillum	it has a 2ms wake-up time so it can be in low power sleep mode and just check every 10 seconds	[20:54]
Chillum	or 5 seconds	[20:54]
mats	whatever gets you hard i guess	[20:55]
Chillum	it does, really hard	[20:55]
Chillum	I once made a "boss detector" with a raspberry pi. The bosses cell phone sent out wifi pings constantly, this told me if he was in wifi range by turning on a red light	[20:56]
mircea_popescu	Chillum you blogging this ?	[20:56]
Chillum	If I get it working I will	[20:56]
mircea_popescu	plz blog this. pics, schematics, how tos, the works.	[20:56]
Chillum	for sure	[20:56]
Chillum	source code even	[20:56]
mircea_popescu	and none of those "public blog service" shits either,	[20:56]
Chillum	I use S3 for anything I host	[20:57]
Chillum	and I use vim to make my pages	[20:57]
Chillum	that is why they are so ugly	[20:57]
Chillum	one day I will learn style sheets	[20:57]
mircea_popescu	i use vi half the time.	[20:59]
mircea_popescu	"The core problem is that C programmers think they can get away with doing much less than the Common Lisp programmer causes the computer to do. But this is actually wrong. Getting C programmers to understand that they cause the computer to do less than minimum is intractable. They would not /use/ C if they understood this point, so if you actually cause them to understand it in the course of a discussion, you will o	[20:59]
mircea_popescu	nly make them miserable and hate their lives. People are pretty good at detecting that this is a likely outcome of thinking, and it takes conscious effort to brace yourself and get through such experiences. Most people are not willing even to /listen/ to arguments or information that could threaten their comfortable view of their own existence, much less think about it, so when you cannot answer a C programmer's "arg	[20:59]
mircea_popescu	uments" that his way of life is just great the way it is, it is a pretty good sign that you let him set the agenda once he realized that his way of life was under threat. Since you have nothing to defend, your self-preservation instinct will not activate hitherto unused parts of your brain to come up with reasons and rationalizations for what you have done, you will not be aware that you have been taken for a ride befo	[20:59]
mircea_popescu	re it is over and you "lost"."	[20:59]
mircea_popescu	this is actually some prime rib right there.	[20:59]
mircea_popescu	i wonder if it's also actually correct.	[20:59]
Chillum	I know I am not thorough enough to use C	[20:59]
BingoBoingo	ascii_field: actually farting sarin gas and spitting bullets at your enemies would be your best bet. << Greatest challenge is storing it in the colon without absorbing it.	[21:00]
Chillum	I wish others did	[21:00]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 80996 @ 0.00029272 = 23.7091 BTC [+]	[21:00]
mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-04-2015#1095484 << this actually sounds like you could make a company.	[21:01]
assbot	Logged on 10-04-2015 20:16:59; Chillum: but if you ever wanted to add a webserver to your lamp, this is the device	[21:01]
asciilifeform	what exactly would prevent me from beating the shit out of the 'villagers' << i did try to point this out, l0l	[21:02]
mircea_popescu	create a corp to market interruptors with a standard apache.	[21:02]
Chillum	mircea_popescu: there is a youtube video of a guy making a wifi controllable lamp	[21:02]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform so you did. i parse rather than compile, admittedly.	[21:02]
Chillum	now someone can find a Lua code injection attack on your lamps webserver and use it to sniff your home network	[21:02]
Chillum	because the chip can do runtime interpreting of code	[21:02]
mircea_popescu	Chillum so make them secure.	[21:02]
Chillum	and rewrite itself while running	[21:03]
Chillum	good advice	[21:03]
mircea_popescu	i seriously think you have a marketable product here.	[21:03]
Chillum	Though embedded products are not well known for security	[21:03]
mircea_popescu	exactly.	[21:03]
Chillum	wifi lamps? Its been done	[21:03]
mircea_popescu	no. aftermarket web-accessible switches.	[21:04]
mircea_popescu	dyi type of item	[21:04]
Chillum	I am working on a 8 channel wifi relay board	[21:04]
asciilifeform	i used to have a huge library, i wouldnt buy a book today. << i still do, but it is shrinking, shrinking...	[21:04]
Chillum	for general purpose	[21:04]
Chillum	xmass lights and such	[21:04]
Chillum	home automation etc	[21:04]
Chillum	8x mechanical relays that can each handle 30 amps 220v	[21:04]
mircea_popescu	only vaguely related, i wonder how well a "bid for this space in bitcoin" display advertising thing would work.	[21:05]
Chillum	with an API, at least that is my goal	[21:05]
mircea_popescu	completely decentralize media buying.	[21:05]
Chillum	mircea_popescu: that is an interesting idea. How does bidding work? People just send their bid, then what happens when someone outbids them	[21:05]
mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-04-2015#1095494 << imo not because incremental, but because poorly managed.	[21:05]
assbot	Logged on 10-04-2015 20:18:35; ascii_field: -because- incremental.	[21:05]
Chillum	it could sell specific time slots and the bidding could happen right up until it is chosen, then the losing bids sent back	[21:06]
trinque	mircea_popescu: indeed; that job was a shitshow	[21:06]
mircea_popescu	Chillum specify bitmap and time interval. goes to highest bidder. like adsense	[21:06]
Chillum	but you would need a deposit to make sure bids are real	[21:06]
asciilifeform	... actually being a woman, especially if young, and very very easy is what offers the best chance of survival. << 'how to avoid drowning at sea?' 'be water'	[21:06]
mircea_popescu	yeah.	[21:06]
mircea_popescu	exactly alf.	[21:06]
asciilifeform	or the old 'choose your parents carefully' (TM)	[21:07]
Chillum	so refund bids to losers may work, or they could apply the credit to another ad	[21:07]
mircea_popescu	not sure that'd help. choice problem	[21:07]
mircea_popescu	the sorts of parents you'd choose are the problem in the firsat place.	[21:07]
mircea_popescu	if you could be trusted to choose parents correctly doom wouldn't be upon us.	[21:07]
mircea_popescu	Chillum just have people keep an acct with you.	[21:07]
mircea_popescu	"if you don't have > 1 btc with me you can't bid at all, fu."	[21:08]
Chillum	I see	[21:08]
mircea_popescu	you ever see that film, wtf was it called. "GET SOME FUCKING MONEY"	[21:08]
*	ChanServ removes voice from whaack	[21:08]
Chillum	one of the great things about bitcoin services is that accounts are not strictly needed. For example you could send a request to a service without any authentication, it could respond with a price and address	[21:08]
Chillum	pay it and get your service	[21:08]
Chillum	I know. You accept bids from everyone at any time. You get the amount of ad-time relative to the size of what you paid to the whole	[21:09]
Chillum	that way no need for accounts or refunds	[21:09]
mircea_popescu	Chillum this is what i said.	[21:09]
trinque	and my ad runs for 3 seconds, lol	[21:09]
mircea_popescu	"specify bitmap and time interval. goes to highest bidder."	[21:10]
asciilifeform	... dude, why so disdainful ? if you don't trust people you don't know on the basis of what they write << because i can see the hallmarks of educated mendacity. the man, whoever he is, knows that i know the history. and pretends otherwise, and that he has some sort of 'lesson' for old ignorant me. i know the type, they infest (or once did) my comments section.	[21:10]
mircea_popescu	i guess it's not what i said. ITS WHAT I MEANT!	[21:10]
mircea_popescu	like bitbet does it.	[21:10]
Chillum	you said people would have an account, goes to the highest bidder	[21:10]
Chillum	I said no account everyone gets some ad time	[21:10]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform methinks you might be seeing too much in there.	[21:10]
Chillum	ah what you meant...	[21:10]
mircea_popescu	Chillum dwim damnit!	[21:10]
Chillum	glad I was able to help you put your ideas into works	[21:10]
mircea_popescu	:)	[21:10]
Chillum	that could work	[21:10]
mircea_popescu	i am fortunate in that having been here a while, my ideas are already facts, so i can fall back on that lol.	[21:10]
Chillum	too bad advertising is one of the greatest evils going	[21:11]
mircea_popescu	yeah, too bad.	[21:11]
mircea_popescu	is that a reference to the rape article ?	[21:11]
asciilifeform	i wonder if it's also actually correct. << it doesn't -get- much more correct.	[21:11]
asciilifeform	i'll sign under every word of it, fwiw.	[21:12]
mircea_popescu	i can still wonder can't i!	[21:12]
asciilifeform	aftermarket web-accessible switches << sold...	[21:12]
asciilifeform	there are several vendors	[21:13]
mircea_popescu	yeah but how much ?	[21:14]
trinque	my end of that thread was that they're all shit	[21:14]
trinque	and "they're all shit" is seen in many other parts of the US economy	[21:14]
mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-04-2015#1095500 << he gave you a fine example tho. so someone hijacks his idle camera ? whatevs.	[21:15]
assbot	Logged on 10-04-2015 20:19:28; ascii_field: Chillum: not all applications call for security << ?!?!!!!	[21:15]
asciilifeform	at the very least, it becomes a ddos drone	[21:15]
asciilifeform	and we so much need more of these.	[21:15]
mircea_popescu	:)	[21:16]
mircea_popescu	so WE would need his app to security ?	[21:16]
asciilifeform	aha	[21:17]
mircea_popescu	problem.	[21:17]
asciilifeform	or, in world of tomorrow - he, to avoid beatings.	[21:17]
mircea_popescu	but if he's forced to enforce your interest	[21:17]
mircea_popescu	what of his freedom!	[21:17]
asciilifeform	i live in the lands of beautiful freedom, where folks throw trash from moving cars etc	[21:18]
asciilifeform	in celebration of it.	[21:18]
mircea_popescu	myeah.	[21:18]
asciilifeform	but in ip-over-gossip net, yes, pwned machine is solely the owner's grief, like his stolen bicycle.	[21:19]
mircea_popescu	which is why that is a better design.	[21:19]
asciilifeform	the only reasonable design.	[21:19]
mircea_popescu	but i wouldn't sign off on him being beaten because tcp/ip sucks.	[21:19]
asciilifeform	old net was gated. gossipnet - likewise gates. we, today - a perverse interregnum.	[21:19]
asciilifeform	*gated	[21:19]
asciilifeform	ad bid board << i had this idea, probably like everybody else	[21:20]
asciilifeform	the fact of the matter appears to be (ben_vulpes and his experiment, etc) that the folks who pay for ads are largely the old cargo cultists and have very little to do with bitcoin, for perfectly logical reasons of it being a bugspray against their species	[21:21]
mircea_popescu	myeah.	[21:21]
*	asciilifeform (~asciilife@unaffiliated/asciilifeform) has left #bitcoin-assets ("Leaving")	[21:22]
*	asciilifeform (~asciilife@unaffiliated/asciilifeform) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[21:22]
*	assbot gives voice to asciilifeform	[21:23]
BingoBoingo	mircea_popescu: whaack why would nickserv drop an account ? i never heard of this. << They drop registrations after just a few weeks of disuse, because Freenode	[21:26]
mircea_popescu	ianae	[21:26]
*	asciilifeform is presently wondering whether, if mircea_popescu's prescription 'be young and female' were an actual algorithm that folks could -execute- - how many would	[21:28]
mircea_popescu	probably all those that are really female deep down.	[21:29]
mircea_popescu	ie, the ones that actually give a shit.	[21:29]
asciilifeform	and it isn't as if all the currently existing ones are pets in good homes. e.g, http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=07-05-2014#663930	[21:30]
assbot	Logged on 07-05-2014 03:02:32; mircea_popescu: if you have 20 bux spare you'll get a manicure, maybe you find some guy that's not an asshoel.	[21:30]
mircea_popescu	incidentally, it occurs to me : clearly the femspeak for male being "sociopath", ie, one who does not care about the consequences (this is the basis of the rape debate - men will fuck women for a cause, women wish to fuck towards a purpose), and the problem with "women in tech" being the aridity of the field to the femstyle,	[21:31]
asciilifeform	and, also pertinently, http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=07-05-2014#663922	[21:31]
assbot	Logged on 07-05-2014 03:00:40; mircea_popescu: this is like having a 40 yo chick come to you for dancing lessons and you telling her "missing ingredient is you being 20". why tyvm, mr expert guy!	[21:31]
mircea_popescu	how long before the current processor (that acts from cause) is replaced with a new architecture, more femfriendly ?	[21:31]
mircea_popescu	a processor that looks at what the EFFECTS of a computation would be	[21:31]
mircea_popescu	rather than proceed from an imperative cause towards a computation	[21:32]
mircea_popescu	you know, alligned with the entire irigaray " e = mc^2 is a sexed equation"	[21:32]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu is ahead of the game as usual:	[21:32]
asciilifeform	this -was made-	[21:32]
mircea_popescu	lacan & co efforts to build an alt-physics didn't manage to do much, but mebbe it works in alt-cs?	[21:32]
asciilifeform	it is called 'lazy evaluation' and is sop in the academiplague languages	[21:32]
mircea_popescu	ah i c.	[21:32]
asciilifeform	haskell, ml, the shebang	[21:32]
mircea_popescu	well good for them!	[21:32]
mircea_popescu	all is right with the world then.	[21:32]
asciilifeform	urbit, incidentally.	[21:33]
*	assbot gives voice to whaack	[21:33]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform incidentally, all the proper females ARE pets in good homes. the remainder are like unemployed "employees" that are not so much unemployed as wilfully unemployable.	[21:33]
mircea_popescu	not that admission is likely forthcoming.	[21:33]
asciilifeform	it is a uniquely mind-destroying paradigm, also, because it makes reasoning about actual cost of execution on actual hardware virtually impossible.	[21:33]
mircea_popescu	cost is a figment of the scarcity world.	[21:34]
mircea_popescu	they transcended that.	[21:34]
asciilifeform	aha.	[21:34]
mircea_popescu	enter the world of abundance!	[21:34]
asciilifeform	next step is 'breatharian diet.'	[21:34]
asciilifeform	i wish them a speedy arrival at this step.	[21:34]
Chillum	"all the proper females ARE pets in good homes"... ever had a wife?	[21:34]
mircea_popescu	are you saying the emperor's naked ?	[21:34]
mircea_popescu	Chillum nope.	[21:34]
mircea_popescu	you married ?	[21:34]
Chillum	well I do, and she is proper and not a pet	[21:34]
asciilifeform	wai wat	[21:34]
mircea_popescu	do you get along with her ?	[21:34]
Chillum	yup	[21:35]
asciilifeform	who, then, is the pet	[21:35]
mircea_popescu	meets my definition of proper pet in good home.,	[21:35]
Chillum	we have 2 cats	[21:35]
Chillum	so getting along with someone makes them a pet? I think you skipped some logical steps there	[21:35]
mircea_popescu	you think the cats are your pets ?!	[21:35]
asciilifeform	Chillum: why do you describe her as 'not a pet' ?	[21:35]
whaack	BingoBoingo: I actually just never got the email that I needed to verify with. Reregistered and I still don't have the email.	[21:35]
mircea_popescu	Chillum likely you just use the term in a particular way i don't.	[21:35]
Chillum	asciilifeform: she contributes to the household, our cats do not	[21:35]
Chillum	possibly	[21:36]
Chillum	never known a cat to help pay the rent	[21:36]
mircea_popescu	a pet doesn't have to be idle.	[21:36]
Chillum	work animals != pets	[21:36]
mircea_popescu	what about hamster with wheel ?	[21:36]
BingoBoingo	asciilifeform: she contributes to the household, our cats do not << Do they neglect their anti-vermin duties?	[21:36]
Chillum	barely aware of its own existence	[21:36]
mircea_popescu	everyone is barely aware of their own existence.	[21:36]
mircea_popescu	that's par for the course.	[21:36]
Chillum	sometime on LSD I am acutely aware	[21:37]
mircea_popescu	so they claim.	[21:37]
Chillum	so I claim	[21:37]
Chillum	though it is well established that nobody can prove their own self awareness	[21:37]
mircea_popescu	so if i feed lsd to a cat it's gonna make a good wife ?	[21:37]
Chillum	if you are desperate enough	[21:37]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 263450 @ 0.00027756 = 73.1232 BTC [-] {2}	[21:38]
asciilifeform	perhaps this was done, and i am lsd cat	[21:38]
mircea_popescu	methinks your theory may have some holes in it.	[21:38]
Chillum	if she is a pet then so am I	[21:38]
mircea_popescu	good for you. what of it ?	[21:38]
trinque	asciilifeform \| perhaps this was done, and i am lsd cat << LOL	[21:38]
Chillum	I suppose your advantage in this debate comes from your failure to define what you think pet means	[21:38]
mircea_popescu	but i did, above.	[21:38]
mircea_popescu	"do you get along with her ?"	[21:38]
asciilifeform	Chillum: a tame creature you keep around because enjoy its company.	[21:38]
Chillum	that is a very wide definition	[21:39]
mircea_popescu	i wouldn't subscribe to alf's definitino.	[21:39]
mircea_popescu	Chillum so it's wide.	[21:39]
mircea_popescu	it happens to exactly match the earlier female survival discussion.	[21:39]
Chillum	the thing is	[21:39]
Chillum	my wife is not tame	[21:39]
Chillum	she is very wild	[21:39]
mircea_popescu	ever showed her this place ?	[21:39]
asciilifeform	then perhaps Chillum is the pet ?	[21:39]
Chillum	mircea_popescu: she would not get it	[21:40]
Chillum	I don't get it	[21:40]
Chillum	I am not tame either. I am insidious	[21:40]
Chillum	I play tame	[21:40]
asciilifeform	my pet is following along this thread.	[21:40]
mircea_popescu	aha. well, ima eat, but brb.	[21:40]
asciilifeform	speaking of eating...	[21:40]
Chillum	on the internet, nobody knows you are a dog	[21:40]
*	asciilifeform goes to eat things	[21:40]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 272500 @ 0.00027614 = 75.2482 BTC [-] {4}	[21:42]
whaack	/msg NickServ VERIFY REGISTER whaack aiufgzrktdck	[21:42]
whaack	/msg NickServ VERIFY REGISTER whaack aiufgzrktdck	[21:42]
mats	go on	[21:42]
whaack	sry	[21:42]
trinque	lol	[21:43]
Chillum	fail	[21:44]
trinque	ahahahaha	[21:44]
Chillum	good password though	[21:44]
Chillum	did you memorize it?	[21:44]
trinque	hanbot: all I see over here is *******	[21:44]
Chillum	there are 26 letters and 10 numbers. Number have less entropy	[21:44]
trinque	whaack: so I might have a theory on why you can't keep your nicks	[21:45]
Chillum	10^26 = 1.1447546×10²⁸ enough entropy for a remote service	[21:45]
Chillum	using numbers only adds entropy when you randomly selecty them from the same set as the letters	[21:45]
whaack	that's not a password	[21:46]
whaack	that's the verification code for my email	[21:46]
Chillum	oh lol	[21:46]
mats	jesus, reading your text makes my face hurt Chillum	[21:46]
Chillum	been so long since I registered	[21:46]
Chillum	well, you could move your face away from me if that helps	[21:46]
whaack	i use word lists for passwords, i have a decent understanding of information theory	[21:46]
Chillum	good to know	[21:47]
Chillum	given that the code in question was a machine generated e-mail verification code I would say you should start eating someones pet	[21:47]
BingoBoingo	mats: Did you sleep yet?	[21:48]
mats	about to	[21:48]
Chillum	though the vowel consonant grouping is a bit suspicious	[21:48]
BingoBoingo	hanbot: Entropy logic is patent GBBG by Google Images of AusieDude and GrumpySpamLady. License available with Founder shares, pls buy...	[21:49]
Chillum	I saw a nice talk about a password creator that created small sentence fragments from very long lists of words. The user could enter the words in any order and with known mispellings and it would still pass. All while making sure you get the requested entropy	[21:50]
Chillum	the idea is that humans can remember more entropy when it is in a story form	[21:50]
Chillum	we can remember concepts at much higher information levels than random strings	[21:50]
trinque	neat concept	[21:51]
whaack	I'm sure you've seen https://xkcd.com/936/	[21:51]
assbot	xkcd: Password Strength ... ( http://bit.ly/1JxAY0J )	[21:51]
Chillum	I thought so	[21:51]
Chillum	correct horse battery staple	[21:51]
Chillum	the bitcoin brain wallet with a lot of deposits and withdrawls	[21:51]
BingoBoingo	Chillum: Probably could be stronger if you take a sentence from Kritik de Rheinen Vernuft and replace 10 of he words in sentence with diceware determined words.	[21:51]
Chillum	it could be stronger if you asked it for more entropy. It creates the password with the entropy you request	[21:52]
BingoBoingo	Sentence from kritik provides structure to remember words with.	[21:52]
Chillum	I suppose "search space" is more accurate than entropy	[21:52]
Chillum	I see	[21:52]
Chillum	so you could remember more	[21:52]
BingoBoingo	full sentence not typed into box, just the dice words.	[21:52]
BingoBoingo	Sentence can go on for pages i Kritiq so password box would hate you over full sentence.	[21:53]
Chillum	the amount of information someone and relay to a sketch artist about a persons face is in the hundreds of Kb, but our brain has hardware acceleration for faces and we can't normalize the data ourselves	[21:53]
Chillum	any password system with a character limit should die	[21:53]
BingoBoingo	Sure, but do you really want to make poor password checker hash all of that German?	[21:54]
Chillum	It would be neat if we could hack our face detection brain hardware to do something else like we have hacked graphics cards for hashing	[21:54]
BingoBoingo	Graphics cards were never really "hacked for hashing" Bitcoin just came along on the exact time AMD graphics cards came into their own as massively parallel compute devices	[21:55]
Chillum	like a computer shows something similar to a face while monitoring your brainwaves and harvesting your computational data	[21:55]
Chillum	umm long before bitcoin they were hashing passwords with them	[21:55]
BingoBoingo	Sure	[21:56]
Chillum	and it was a hack	[21:56]
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Chillum	they had to rewrite the hashing algos to use the available features	[21:56]
BingoBoingo	Hah, a hack is when you use a pck of dragonfly brains in parallel to acelerate the search for good porn.	[21:57]
Chillum	I love how many cheap used GPUs are being sold by miners who got on the bus late	[21:57]
Chillum	makes password hashing cheaper	[21:57]
Chillum	a lot of ebay auctions for top of the line video cards saying "Bought it for bitcoin mining, asics came out"	[21:58]
Chillum	though you roll the dice on used cards	[21:58]
whaack	I'm confused as to why anyone would care about using GPUs to hash passwords	[21:59]
BingoBoingo	whaack: To search for passwords against a lsit of hashes of course	[21:59]
whaack	ah :D	[21:59]
BingoBoingo	whaack: GPUs to password has is the solution when you don't have access to person with password and an anthill	[22:00]
BingoBoingo	http://thebulletin.org/does-going-%E2%80%9C-grid%E2%80%9D-actually-help-climate8191 << I wonder if Tesla is going to market sane NiFe to homeowners or instead going to create the greatest national fire hazard in history. Basement is probably the worst place for a massive battery bank and lithium worst way to do it.	[22:02]
assbot	Does going “off the grid” actually help the climate? \| Bulletin of the Atomic Scientists ... ( http://bit.ly/1JxCZKj )	[22:02]
mircea_popescu	Chillum so do you ever pet her ?	[22:06]
Chillum	I don't pet and tell	[22:06]
Chillum	but we are married, you do the math	[22:06]
mircea_popescu	i suppose we could put the string through teh entropy tests... but no, doesn't look like it's 8/8.	[22:06]
mircea_popescu	anyway, re narrative pws : that's how wikileaks managed to lose control of a db, innit.	[22:07]
mircea_popescu	humans are great at telling stories and horrible at telling anything but the same ones.	[22:07]
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Chillum	"I went out the door and got my mail" <-- terrible... "If I went to the market I would buy bananas and then go south to the dry cleaner" much better	[22:08]
mircea_popescu	Chillum re face etc : pretty sure future is in wetware.	[22:08]
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mircea_popescu	and no, not much better.	[22:08]
Chillum	wetware is an interesting idea but the further we go in technology the less likely it seems to be	[22:09]
mircea_popescu	something off trilema, somewhat better. otherwise... recall that klingon line pw that got got ?	[22:09]
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mircea_popescu	how do you reason ?	[22:09]
Chillum	I doubt you could guess it	[22:09]
mircea_popescu	well i don't hack pws, so that's a safe bet.	[22:09]
Chillum	I do	[22:09]
Chillum	by wetware do you mean human brains assisting computers, or do you mean biological computers?	[22:10]
Chillum	early in computer science it was believed that computers were like brains and that with enough resources they could simulate one. As we progress it becomes more and more clear that brains are nothing like a computer	[22:10]
Chillum	and that the best way to simulate a brain with a computer is to simulate atoms, ie not very efficient	[22:11]
mircea_popescu	i mean biological compouters	[22:11]
mircea_popescu	the ancient thread is re dragonflies	[22:11]
Chillum	oh well that is another story	[22:11]
Chillum	bilogocial computers are on the way	[22:11]
mircea_popescu	myeah.	[22:11]
Chillum	probably memory first	[22:11]
mircea_popescu	perhaps.	[22:11]
mircea_popescu	but yeah, brain nothing like computer.	[22:11]
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Chillum	Amazon web services just announced cloud machine learning	[22:12]
Chillum	so skynet is basically here	[22:12]
Chillum	it seems skynet is mostly interesting in the status quo	[22:12]
mircea_popescu	"Basement is probably the worst place for a massive battery bank and lithium worst way to do it." << word.	[22:13]
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Chillum	I am wracking my brain to think of a good use for machine learning, I like to play with all the new AWS toys	[22:13]
mircea_popescu	ESPECIALLY in shitty vinyl siding and "insulation" concotions on "light" (= cheap wood and glue pressboard) frames.	[22:13]
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samO	scoopbot shesek shinohai SirJacket so SquirtPrincess starsoccer Stellarflip STRML	[22:13]
mircea_popescu	!up SquirtPrincess	[22:13]
-assbot-	You voiced SquirtPrincess for 30 minutes.	[22:13]
*	assbot gives voice to SquirtPrincess	[22:13]
BingoBoingo	mircea_popescu: I mean fire's favorite direction is up. That and Lithium batteries have a shit lifetime anyways.	[22:13]
mircea_popescu	yeah you can prolly get some pretty major combustihouse events.	[22:14]
Chillum	lith-ion batteries are electrical, chemical and metal fires	[22:14]
Chillum	you do not want to try to smother them or throw anything on them at all	[22:14]
Chillum	they provide their own oxygen	[22:15]
*	BingoBoingo imagines NiFe in shitty rusted file cabinets in the shed with the lawnmower is a much better place	[22:15]
Chillum	very toxic fumes too	[22:15]
Chillum	basically just run	[22:15]
mircea_popescu	Chillum im not so sure the aws "machine learning" works much better than sussman's tic tac toe machine	[22:15]
Chillum	it is the same thing they use in house	[22:15]
Chillum	to market to people	[22:15]
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Chillum	it has its limits but it find patterns in a way not other computer technology can	[22:16]
mircea_popescu	BingoBoingo still, will need a lot.	[22:16]
Chillum	it is really good at recognizing suspicious transactions once it has seen enough good and bad ones	[22:16]
mircea_popescu	Chillum from what i hear it's the same process they use to "detect terrorism" nowadays.	[22:16]
mircea_popescu	not so sure it does anything, but hey.	[22:17]
Chillum	the tech has improved only a little(mostly optimizations) since machine learning was invented	[22:17]
Chillum	but the resources it has are enormous	[22:17]
Chillum	it gives you a score which you take with a grain of salt. It is designed to be better than random, not perfect	[22:17]
mircea_popescu	right.	[22:17]
mircea_popescu	"ascii_field: the only thing i can promise for the $trillion is: more material for the next fella to work with" << oddly, this sounds exactly like social studies.	[22:18]
mircea_popescu	and you're not even black!	[22:18]
Chillum	say you have sent out 10,000 spams to people and 200 answered. You put all the info about those people into it and who answer and who did not. It can then be given a list of other people with the same kind of information and figure out who is more likely to respond	[22:19]
Chillum	and all with no concept of what the information actually means	[22:19]
Chillum	there are probably less evil applications too	[22:19]
mircea_popescu	your list is too small to work.	[22:19]
Chillum	that depends on how clear the pattern is	[22:19]
BingoBoingo	mircea_popescu: Sure. but even place with indications of value can hold a lot.	[22:20]
Chillum	when it comes to responding to spam you are probably right	[22:20]
mircea_popescu	besides, 2% response rate ? web advertising does a lot of fraud to come up to 0.1-0.3% CTR.	[22:20]
mircea_popescu	that would be 10-20 people in the 10k.	[22:20]
mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-04-2015#1095558 << at this rate he's gonna start work on cardano any day now!	[22:20]
assbot	Logged on 10-04-2015 20:29:20; trinque: chart a course towards the smallest of them, and towards selling it as well	[22:21]
Chillum	it was an example	[22:21]
Chillum	the number were chosen for simplicity	[22:21]
mircea_popescu	jus' sayin'.	[22:21]
Chillum	I thought that was obvious	[22:21]
BingoBoingo	Chillum: Lithium batteries are like forest fires. You can try to contain the damage by keeping them from spreading. Also sand is an extinguishing option.	[22:21]
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mircea_popescu	does sand do anything even ?	[22:21]
Chillum	BingoBoingo: the sand is mostly about preventing molten metal from flying out. It does not smother it because it has its own oxygen	[22:22]
BingoBoingo	mircea_popescu: It turns into a crude glass and absorbs heat energy in the course of that. Worthless if on wooden desk, pretty useful if on bare concrete	[22:22]
Chillum	my dad was a fireman so he is always talking about this stuff	[22:22]
mircea_popescu	aha	[22:22]
Chillum	yes it does absorb heat too	[22:23]
Chillum	which contains but does not extinguish	[22:23]
mircea_popescu	phase transition, makes sense.	[22:23]
*	BingoBoingo wants to acquire firetruck and not sound like an idiot, reads so that when day somes will not seem like complete idiot.	[22:23]
mircea_popescu	hey, you should volunteer	[22:23]
mircea_popescu	i hear they get free sex shows.	[22:23]
Chillum	you just need a reason for the big tank	[22:23]
Chillum	those things are so massive when full of water	[22:24]
BingoBoingo	mircea_popescu: I need to get in far better shape. Volunteers get Illinois "pensions" so very competive.	[22:24]
Chillum	they need to plan their stops	[22:24]
Chillum	some have two steering wheels, on in the front and another in the back for the rear driver	[22:24]
Chillum	rear wheel	[22:24]
mircea_popescu	yup	[22:25]
mircea_popescu	actually so dangerous to drive half full they never do	[22:25]
mircea_popescu	every usage is a full empty.	[22:25]
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Chillum	I was 12 when my dad invited me to come along to a fire. When we got there he made me get out fo the truck then pushed a car away from a fire hydrant with the truck	[22:25]
Chillum	he was _NOT_ gentle	[22:25]
Chillum	so cool	[22:25]
Chillum	the parking breaks were on, it moved anyways. lotta smoke	[22:26]
mircea_popescu	srsly, im all for this. no more "park by hydrant" laws, but put those old train pusher things on firetrucks.	[22:26]
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mircea_popescu	you park next to one, you take your chances.	[22:26]
BingoBoingo	Both Parents were EMTs at various points in their careers	[22:26]
Chillum	they will either ram your car with their truck, harder than they need to of course	[22:26]
Chillum	or they will break your windows and put the fire hose through your car	[22:26]
Chillum	fire hoses of course pour water out every surface so they don't burn	[22:27]
Chillum	which fills the car	[22:27]
mircea_popescu	tbh, in many european towns it's unheard of to leave brake on when parked.	[22:27]
mircea_popescu	because people WILL NEED TO PUSH YOU AROUND	[22:27]
mircea_popescu	eight billion dints on every car.	[22:27]
Chillum	lol so you get to your parking spot and start search ing the area?	[22:27]
mircea_popescu	yup	[22:27]
mircea_popescu	sometimes find car two streets over.	[22:27]
BingoBoingo	In present vehicle's previous life as rental car parking break cable became welded in engaged position. Mechanic corrected situation with bolt cutters.	[22:29]
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Chillum	buttslol - creamy01 - a1b2c3d4 - christ people use stupid passwords	[22:29]
*	Chillum loves nummy low hanging fruit	[22:30]
mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-04-2015#1095609 << stalin. don't play coy alf!	[22:30]
assbot	Logged on 10-04-2015 20:38:00; ascii_field: trinque: who was korolev's capitalist ?	[22:30]
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*	BingoBoingo more attracted to firetruck as giant toolbox than as firefighting implement. Also water cannon	[22:30]
mircea_popescu	BingoBoingo you could just get one of those garden party water cannons	[22:31]
Chillum	lol, the Victoria fire department(different than my dads) got a water canon. First fire they took it out they fired it at a window, missed and knocked down the wall	[22:31]
Chillum	I saw it, so funny	[22:31]
BingoBoingo	mircea_popescu: Nah, I want serious "get off my lawn" power. Also tilling the garden hydraulicly would be pretty sweet.	[22:32]
mircea_popescu	buts	[22:32]
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mircea_popescu	i mean nuts.	[22:32]
Chillum	BingoBoingo: I saw a device that automatically sprayed water at birds and deer. Modify it a bit and it will work against humanbs	[22:32]
Chillum	replace hose with water canon]	[22:32]
mircea_popescu	have the pets wear chiffon, even better.	[22:33]
Chillum	nutslol	[22:33]
*	assbot gives voice to decimation	[22:33]
Chillum	the "buttslol" password is from a lulu lemon show, they sell the spanks that make girls ass look good when they are not	[22:33]
Chillum	s/show/shop/	[22:33]
Chillum	false advertising	[22:33]
Chillum	you take them home, get the spanks off and WTF?!	[22:34]
decimation	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-04-2015#1095344 http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-04-2015#1095345 < note this this is how singapore was built, more or less	[22:34]
assbot	Logged on 10-04-2015 19:43:08; ascii_field: trinque: the normal paradigm of investment and return fails here	[22:34]
assbot	Logged on 10-04-2015 19:43:33; ascii_field: because the only approach that i believe to be correct, will result in something tangible only long after we are all dead.	[22:34]
BingoBoingo	Chillum: Edging back garden with peppers handles deer/birds usually. As do the coyotes/feral cats. Getting drunk and pissing in yard handles coyotes.	[22:34]
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BingoBoingo	!up propumpkin	[22:34]
*	assbot gives voice to propumpkin	[22:34]
mircea_popescu	decimation the guy only died recently.	[22:35]
Chillum	I used to do a bit of deep forest gardening. I would use capsicum liquid all over to keep the deer away	[22:35]
Chillum	also piss everywhere	[22:35]
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BingoBoingo	Chillum: This is a rural/Suburban border town. Deer cull very effective here. Now when I lived in Carbondale... Deer raided the garbage dumpsters more than the raccoons did.	[22:36]
Chillum	city deer are nothing like forest deer	[22:36]
BingoBoingo	;;google SIU Deer attacks	[22:37]
gribble	SIU warns campus about deer attacks - The Daily Illini : News: ; Three Injured In Deer Attack On SIU's Carbondale Campus \| ksdk.com: ; Deer attacking students at SIU - tribunedigital-chicagotribune:	[22:37]
Chillum	cities really fuck animals up	[22:37]
BingoBoingo	Chillum: Most of Carbondale IS forest	[22:37]
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Chillum	ever seen a seagull out in the wild? They are majestic. The city seagulls are vermin	[22:37]
decimation	mircea_popescu: I would note that singapore exhibits all the signs of burning through their 'stored fuel'	[22:37]
Chillum	BingoBoingo: I see	[22:37]
mircea_popescu	myeah, seems they do.	[22:38]
mircea_popescu	Chillum pets included.	[22:38]
Chillum	they behave a lot differently when they become town scavengers	[22:38]
mircea_popescu	yup.	[22:38]
mircea_popescu	jefferson's only major point.	[22:38]
Chillum	humans too	[22:38]
mircea_popescu	"the city sucks"	[22:38]
Chillum	the manner in which a city treats you is directly related to how savvy you are	[22:39]
mircea_popescu	which... it does. they tell legends of women that could suck a golf ball through a garden hose, but new york regularly sucked the jew riding a camel through the eye of a needle.	[22:39]
Chillum	the eye of the needle was a crowded market in a narrow alley	[22:39]
Chillum	it is a very idiomatic saying	[22:39]
BingoBoingo	Chillum: Center of the University campus there is a forest. with nothing more than dirt trails and occasional bridge. Fastest way to get from one side to the other is traversing the woods. Because of USian automobile-subdivision town planning outside of downtown most residential areas are separated by virgin-ish woods	[22:40]
mircea_popescu	it is.	[22:40]
Chillum	The island I am on has logging everywhere but with a 30 year recovery period. So there are logging roads everywhere that are abondoned for the last 10-29 years	[22:41]
Chillum	it is all new growth but there are so many ways away from people if you pick one at random you won't see anyone	[22:41]
decimation	the thing that struck me as weird about the eu (comparied to the us) was how compact little towns are, and how rural the countryside is	[22:41]
Chillum	you just have to be okay with driving over 1 inch this trees	[22:41]
mircea_popescu	this sounds like a grandiose arrangement Chillum	[22:41]
decimation	in the us it's quite normal for shit to be spread out across the countryside	[22:41]
mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-04-2015#1095683 << holy shit is this the onion ?!	[22:42]
Chillum	to forest gardeners love those roads	[22:42]
assbot	Logged on 10-04-2015 21:00:17; diametric: http://yro.slashdot.org/story/15/04/10/1541258/florida-teen-charged-with-felony-hacking-for-changing-desktop-wallpaper	[22:42]
Chillum	unauthorized access	[22:42]
mircea_popescu	charged with "an offense against a computer system"	[22:42]
mircea_popescu	orly ?	[22:42]
mircea_popescu	friend computer, fuck you.	[22:42]
trinque	hang him!	[22:42]
decimation	heh	[22:42]
Chillum	if he broke into the staff office to change the blackboard it would still be breaking and enetering	[22:42]
Chillum	same thing	[22:42]
mircea_popescu	hardly.	[22:43]
mircea_popescu	for one thing, the computer still works. the broken lock does not.	[22:43]
Chillum	using an admin password to log in and changing nothing would be just as illegal	[22:43]
Chillum	you don;'t have to break anything for breaking and entering charges	[22:43]
mircea_popescu	not discussing the legality. discussing the nonsensicality.	[22:43]
Chillum	well don't expect sense in law	[22:43]
mircea_popescu	i do.	[22:43]
Chillum	well prepare to be regularly disappointed	[22:44]
decimation	it would be interesting to know exactly what they are charging him with	[22:44]
*	assbot removes voice from SquirtPrincess	[22:44]
decimation	being as how the journalist is likely retarded	[22:44]
Chillum	decimation: probably unauthorized access	[22:44]
decimation	trespass?	[22:44]
Chillum	it is from some computer law from the 80s or 90s	[22:44]
Chillum	still used today, meant to be a catch all for something too complex to put any thought into	[22:44]
mircea_popescu	aha.	[22:45]
Chillum	capturing a WPA packet legal, cracking password from that packet legal, logging into the network - criminal unauthorized access	[22:45]
trinque	so how about this is a teenage male pulling a prank	[22:46]
Chillum	I would hope that the sentence reflect the seriousness of the crime... 48 hours probation and a stern "Don't do it again!"	[22:46]
trinque	yeah, or just someone smack him and move on	[22:46]
mircea_popescu	they're not allowed to.	[22:46]
Chillum	just like if he snuck into the office at night and changed the blackboard, a silly prank, still illegal, light sentence appropriate	[22:46]
mircea_popescu	Chillum when i was about that age kids got all uppity ran lard all over blackboard.	[22:47]
mircea_popescu	(old style, actual chalk)	[22:47]
Chillum	I think defendants should be allowed to permit the offended party to smack them in lue of charges	[22:47]
mircea_popescu	teacher throw a fit. culprit could never be found.	[22:47]
mircea_popescu	different people.	[22:47]
mircea_popescu	it's in lieu.	[22:47]
Chillum	ah thanks	[22:47]
*	propumpkin is now known as copumpkin	[22:48]
Chillum	https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/lue	[22:48]
assbot	lue - Wiktionary ... ( http://bit.ly/1FuJD5o )	[22:48]
Chillum	a "flame" or a "tuque"	[22:48]
Chillum	not what I meant	[22:48]
Chillum	that is why my spell checker did not warn me	[22:49]
Chillum	at least I did not say "loo"(british for toilet)	[22:49]
Chillum	I am feeling a little hyper today	[22:49]
Chillum	too much coffee	[22:49]
decimation	http://www.pascoclerk.com/ < has no information	[22:50]
trinque	florida's public school system is skewed by the number of criminals in the state generally	[22:50]
assbot	PASCOCLERK.COM - Home ... ( http://bit.ly/1I0P21v )	[22:50]
*	assbot gives voice to Apocalyptic	[22:52]
Apocalyptic	http://rt.com/usa/248657-commerce-restricts-intel-china/	[22:52]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1I0Pkpc )	[22:52]
decimation	for one thing, I doubt he's being charged for a felony as a juvenile	[22:54]
*	zooko has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)	[22:56]
*	contrapumpkin (~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[22:56]
decimation	Pasco County Clerk Dr. O'Neil holds a Doctorate in Philosophy in Applied Management and Decision Sciences, and is a Certified Public Manager,	[22:56]
trinque	holy shit decision sciences.	[22:57]
decimation	heh	[22:57]
trinque	guy's a decider	[22:57]
decimation	she's a woman, her mug is plastered on the webpage	[22:57]
*	zooko (~user@c-75-70-204-109.hsd1.co.comcast.net) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[22:58]
trinque	man, that's a smile headed for mediocre state bureaucracy someday	[22:59]
*	propumpkin (~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[23:00]
*	copumpkin has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)	[23:00]
*	propumpkin has quit (Client Quit)	[23:00]
decimation	!up zooko	[23:01]
*	assbot gives voice to zooko	[23:01]
*	contrapumpkin has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)	[23:03]
zooko	Oh hey, thanks.	[23:04]
mircea_popescu	a...what	[23:05]
zooko	I discovered this channel because of http://vixra.org/pdf/1504.0072v2.pdf	[23:06]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1FuMTOg )	[23:06]
mircea_popescu	ahahaha wut	[23:08]
mircea_popescu	teaches me to bitch at dwarves for their dubious tech choices.	[23:08]
mircea_popescu	speaking of which yo funks! can i rewad that yet ?	[23:08]
asciilifeform	... oddly, this sounds exactly like social studies. << astronomy/astrology. note how useful -legit- astronomy was for most of its history.	[23:16]
*	trouper001 has quit (Quit: Page closed)	[23:18]
mircea_popescu	heh.	[23:18]
mircea_popescu	very. VERY.	[23:18]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: ... stalin << aha, who else	[23:19]
*	zooko has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)	[23:21]
decimation	asciilifeform: by "nobody solves problems at google" I assume you mean in the "from first principles" sense?	[23:22]
mircea_popescu	its not altogether clear what all happens at google.	[23:22]
*	Cummerbund (~Thunderbi@cpc65609-newt33-2-0-cust1010.19-3.cable.virginm.net) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[23:23]
mircea_popescu	on one hand, their patent inability to come up with anything worth the mention since adwords would be concerning. on the other hand, naggum's observation that you wouldn't know smarter than you if it hit you on the head holds a lot of water.	[23:23]
mircea_popescu	!up Cummerbund	[23:23]
-assbot-	You voiced Cummerbund for 30 minutes.	[23:23]
*	assbot gives voice to Cummerbund	[23:23]
decimation	I suspect what happens at google: many people write and re-write the same bits of software	[23:25]
Cummerbund	In three different stacks	[23:25]
mircea_popescu	dude... somewhere there must be a lawyer who legally changed his name to	[23:25]
mircea_popescu	Best Lawyers von Court	[23:25]
decimation	heh	[23:26]
mircea_popescu	Cummerbund who're you ?	[23:26]
decimation	are you from the uk?	[23:26]
Cummerbund	William Dunne, I embarrassed myself here previously.	[23:26]
Cummerbund	Yes	[23:26]
mircea_popescu	o i c.	[23:27]
decimation	it's a bit late there isn't it?	[23:27]
Cummerbund	Yes, I typically work Australian hours	[23:28]
Chillum	it is not hard to embarrass yourself here, everyone here is always right	[23:28]
Chillum	it has happened to me several times	[23:28]
Cummerbund	It was more naivety before learning what needs to be learned, so rightly I was embarrassed (As opposed to just wrong)	[23:29]
whaack	I interned at Google in NYC	[23:30]
decimation	whaack: did you write in go?	[23:31]
whaack	Nope	[23:31]
mircea_popescu	malbolge ?	[23:31]
asciilifeform	decimation: i did not say that nobody solves problems at 'google.' merely that no one is hired to 'solve problem.' rather, folks are hired as fungible meat robots.	[23:32]
whaack	Googlified javascript	[23:32]
decimation	asciilifeform: right, meat robot is given perimeter in which to work	[23:33]
asciilifeform	more to the point, anyone hired with a public advertisement in reference to particular programming languages is hired as meatrobot	[23:33]
asciilifeform	regardless of the pay	[23:33]
whaack	(It's javascript with static type checking)	[23:34]
asciilifeform	'hired to solve problem' means that you are theoretically free to do it with a computer made of trained squirrels pushing trinary equations, so long as this fits the constraints set by the client.	[23:34]
decimation	asciilifeform: by that definition, nearly everybody working 'in tech' today is a slave	[23:35]
asciilifeform	decimation: it is all a matter of what constraints you are willing to work in	[23:36]
asciilifeform	see last paragraph of http://www.xach.com/naggum/articles/3181075346296330@naggum.net.html for instance.	[23:37]
assbot	Re: On comparing apples and oranges (was: Q: on hashes and counting) - Naggum cll archive ... ( http://bit.ly/1PuT8UV )	[23:37]
decimation	asciilifeform: what fascinates me is the fact that even the higher management who is nominally 'free' find themselves enslaves to apple's paradigm (for example, making iphone clones)	[23:38]
asciilifeform	'Using such inferior languages is like asking a chef who could have done wonders with any kind of raw materials, to use a dirty kitchen, a broken refrigerator with food that is about to die a second time, broken tools, and brownish tap water that tasted of swamp land. His first task would be to clean up the place. Creating food in there would be the furthest from his mind. That's how I feel about Perl and C++. I prefer to	[23:38]
asciilifeform	call it "good taste", not "tunnel vision".'	[23:38]
*	funkenstein_ (~josed@host86-187-203-49.range86-187.btcentralplus.com) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[23:39]
asciilifeform	decimation: the brass are among the least-free	[23:39]
asciilifeform	decimation: they answer to the lizards.	[23:39]
asciilifeform	or - worse - to the chump market.	[23:40]
*	assbot gives voice to funkenstein_	[23:40]
decimation	well, to be clear, the chump market as represented by wall street fund managers	[23:40]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform ehg for all you know working at google is essentially having to report on this private irc server twice a week	[23:41]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: i have (or rather had) a mole there.	[23:41]
mircea_popescu	i meant meta-google	[23:42]
*	mircea_popescu gets last chuckle.	[23:42]
asciilifeform	meta-google - aha.	[23:42]
decimation	yeah who are the lizards who run google?	[23:42]
mircea_popescu	but srsly, i can't for the life of me imagine a different way to run a tech corp these days.	[23:42]
asciilifeform	(consists, naturally, of a miniature google circa 2001 preserved in amber)	[23:42]
mircea_popescu	totally ruined for "VC" bs.	[23:42]
mircea_popescu	(vc here means videoconf)	[23:42]
mircea_popescu	funkenstein_ yo.	[23:43]
mircea_popescu	!up funkenstein_	[23:43]
-assbot-	You voiced funkenstein_ without time-limit.	[23:43]
*	assbot gives voice to funkenstein_	[23:43]
asciilifeform	eh, video is not the innermost circle of hell	[23:43]
funkenstein_	yo :)	[23:43]
decimation	funkenstein_: congrats on getting groupies	[23:43]
mircea_popescu	so when do i get to read your pdf ?	[23:43]
funkenstein_	haha	[23:43]
funkenstein_	http://frass.woodcoin.org/the-majority-is-enough/	[23:43]
assbot	“The Majority is Enough” \| Free your Frass ... ( http://bit.ly/1PuUaQP )	[23:44]
mircea_popescu	aha!	[23:44]
funkenstein_	much hullabaloo over not much content	[23:45]
funkenstein_	but hey i learned .. thanks ::)	[23:45]
mircea_popescu	usually how it goes.	[23:46]
funkenstein_	since vixra comes up again here's one of the other great things you can find there	[23:46]
funkenstein_	http://vixra.org/pdf/1502.0039v1.pdf	[23:46]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1PuUDm8 )	[23:46]
funkenstein_	oh crap pdf again	[23:46]
asciilifeform	'One of the reasons I stayed at JPL for twelve years was that I was appalled at what the software industry had become. The management world has tried to develop software engineering processes that allow people to be plugged into them like interchangeable components. The "interface specification" for these "components" usually involves a list of tools in which an engineer has received "training." (I really detest the use of the	[23:47]
asciilifeform	word "training" in relation to professional activities. Training is what you do to dogs. What you should be doing with people is educating them, not training them. There is a big, big difference.) To my mind, the hallmark of the interchangeable component model of software engineers is Java. Without going into too many details, I'll just say that having programmed in Lisp the shortcomings of Java are glaringly obvious, and pro	[23:47]
asciilifeform	gramming in Java means a life of continual and unremitting pain. So I vowed I would never be a Java programmer, which pretty much shut me out of 90% of all software engineering jobs in the late 90's. This was OK since I was managing to put together a reasonably successful career as a researcher. But after Remote Agent I found myself more and more frustrated, and the opportunity to work at Google just happened to coincide with	[23:47]
asciilifeform	a local frustration maximum. ... One of the reasons I decided to go work for Google was that they were not using Java. So of course you can guess what my first assignment was: lead the inaugural Java development at the company, what eventually became Google AdWords. ... And that was the end of Lisp at Google. In retrospect I am not convinced that he made the wrong decision. The interchangeable component model of software engin	[23:47]
asciilifeform	eers seemed to work reasonably well there. It's just not a business model in which I wish to be involved, at least not on the component-provider side. So after a year at Google I quit and returned to JPL.' << the once well-known erann gatt, aka ron garrett.	[23:47]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu ^	[23:47]
asciilifeform	re: fungible engineers.	[23:47]
asciilifeform	(classic piece)	[23:47]
Cummerbund	You guys' all remind me how terrible my writing skills are. Nice post funkenstein_	[23:48]
mircea_popescu	bad writing is just the outside manifestation of a dysfunctional mind.	[23:49]
decimation	asciilifeform: but does working as a usg employee at jpl really free him from java hell?	[23:49]
asciilifeform	decimation: it did. for a while, anyway.	[23:49]
asciilifeform	decimation: i have no idea what kind of hell he is presently roasting in. ask'im.	[23:50]
funkenstein_	thanks mate	[23:50]
mircea_popescu	someone should write a sf piece about a deranged capitalist who deliberately buys up software outfits to torture the engineers.	[23:50]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: this was written already, in a parallel universe where this was not the actuality.	[23:50]
mircea_popescu	lol	[23:50]
decimation	mircea_popescu: of course, most of the actual slave driving is directly done by.. engineers in management	[23:50]
Cummerbund	mircea_popescu: Do you mean if the subject matter is poor? I'm merely referring to sentence structure. I would at least like to pretend that the subject matter is okay	[23:50]
BingoBoingo	http://qntra.net/2015/04/bitcoin-baron-vigilante-vandal-caught/	[23:51]
assbot	"Bitcoin Baron" Vigilante Vandal Caught \| Qntra.net ... ( http://bit.ly/1PuVljm )	[23:51]
mircea_popescu	Cummerbund just tweaking your chain a little.	[23:51]
asciilifeform	in reality, the whole thing is a game-theoretical boojum	[23:51]
asciilifeform	men-as-fungible-parts ends up 'winning', at least in the short term.	[23:51]
*	BingoBoingo has quit (Quit: Leaving)	[23:51]
mircea_popescu	a vigilante vandal ? v is prolly very jealous.	[23:51]
decimation	asciilifeform: just like 'first-to-market-crapware' is also a short term winning strategy	[23:51]
mircea_popescu	i don;t think "men as parts" is actually all that good.	[23:52]
scoopbot	New post on Qntra.net by Bingo Boingo: http://qntra.net/2015/04/bitcoin-baron-vigilante-vandal-caught/	[23:52]
asciilifeform	'On April 9, a search warrant was served at Tucker's home and a computer had an operating system used by hackers, DPS said.'	[23:52]
mircea_popescu	^ ubuntu.	[23:52]
asciilifeform	terroruntu.	[23:53]
mircea_popescu	unto-u	[23:53]
*	assbot removes voice from Cummerbund	[23:54]
decimation	I suspect the 'men-as-parts' strategy is primarily implemented by the aforementioned engineer managers with poor social skills	[23:54]
*	ColinT has quit (Remote host closed the connection)	[23:55]
*	ColinT (~ColinT@69-11-97-130.regn.static.sasknet.sk.ca) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[23:56]
asciilifeform	naggum's 'managing an unskilled labor force means easy access to people who are skilled in whatever is needed right now, not an investment in people -- which leads to the conclusion that a programmer is only as valuable as his ability to get another job fast.'	[23:57]
asciilifeform	( http://www.xach.com/naggum/articles/3140985758772364@naggum.no.html , mega-classic )	[23:57]
assbot	Re: Is LISP dying? - Naggum cll archive ... ( http://bit.ly/1PuWt6x )	[23:57]
decimation	asciilifeform: yeah, in general tech seems to be managed on a 'what have done for me lately' basis	[23:58]
asciilifeform	but the basic idea is as old as the industrial nunneries of the 19th c.	[23:58]
*	funkenstein_ can't wrap head around node.js program flow	[23:58]
asciilifeform	or the replacement of slavery with wage slavery in general.	[23:58]
asciilifeform	why invest in people when you can catch them in the wild, use them until spent, throw out.	[23:59]
funkenstein_	sounds like an investment	[23:59]
asciilifeform	when any approach other than arbeit macht frei is made countereconomic, don't be surprised when you get arbeit macht frei.	[23:59]

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