Forum logs for 15 Dec 2018

Monday, 16 March, Year 12 d.Tr. | Author:
mircea_popescu: can just deploy it neh ? written already. [00:11]
mircea_popescu: << afaik satellites meanwhile were chinesium'd. "oh, it is broken ? launch another one". [00:30]
a111: Logged on 2018-12-14 19:33 asciilifeform: reportedly items like this are being orbited , as cost-saving measure in place of ye olde saphire semiconductors. but there's ~nuffin publicly written re just how built. [00:30]
mircea_popescu: it all started with the gps -- there, MUST have multiple sats for multiple positions. but "if there -- everywhere", so now the method is "just launch seven". [00:30]
mircea_popescu: what's not being discussed is the problem of space debris. but yes, unsurprisingly enough and predictably enough the end result of "people can now go to space" was "earth now looks like a ball of burata looks once the mold can '''go to space'''. ie, surrounded by a skirting of debris," [00:31]
mircea_popescu: because "people" aren't a thing, it's a catchall phrase including anything and everything, and mostly nothing by mass. [00:31]
mircea_popescu: << if you do, follow hygiene correctly. xraying not unlike ye olde metal foundry technician's job. [00:35]
a111: Logged on 2018-12-14 22:49 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i'ma prolly end up xraying with own hands, i dun trust heathen derps with the jools [00:35]
mircea_popescu: << honestly taking the dram out of it entirely major simplificatory cut of great gain. [00:36]
a111: Logged on 2018-12-14 22:53 asciilifeform: ( and really dun need dram at all, the drams on the daughterboard are all connected through period auto-refresher ic that presents as a sram ) [00:36]
mircea_popescu: << incidentally, if and when this pays off (which i suspect it will), shall be lulzy to see the "oh, didn't happen, we did it first bla bla bla" morons. [00:39]
a111: Logged on 2018-12-14 22:58 asciilifeform: ( didn't exist ~5y ago when i last contemplated doing all of this ) [00:39]
mircea_popescu: << dude just how junkwars are you gonna get lmao. there's a special die, similar in principle, but diff materials, wtf. [00:41]
a111: Logged on 2018-12-15 00:35 asciilifeform: incidentally, i had potentially interesting notion: a modern-day digicam ccd, of e.g. 25 'megapixel', is just about dense enuff that one could take a meaningful xray of the ivory die, if one could be found that responds to xray.. [00:41]
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: you'd want to coat it in luminophore, prolly [00:53]
asciilifeform: << i figure 100metre of 1/d^2 oughta suffice [00:54]
a111: Logged on 2018-12-15 05:35 mircea_popescu: << if you do, follow hygiene correctly. xraying not unlike ye olde metal foundry technician's job. [00:54]
* asciilifeform has a sort of outhouse, for such work [00:55]
asciilifeform: << i won't even be esp. disappointed if result is that the sitters-on-tapes pull heads out of collective arse and post the goods [00:56]
a111: Logged on 2018-12-15 05:39 mircea_popescu: << incidentally, if and when this pays off (which i suspect it will), shall be lulzy to see the "oh, didn't happen, we did it first bla bla bla" morons. [00:56]
mircea_popescu: do me a favour and read "x ray hygiene" as a thing, it's not a one liner. [00:57]
asciilifeform: there's the keV vs mm of xyz penetration curve etc. [01:00]
mircea_popescu: there's also the what to discard, what not to have in there at all (yes there's such a thing as xray mirror, also some plastics are no good, and so on). [01:01]
asciilifeform: grazing-incidence mirror aha [01:01]
mircea_popescu: right. [01:02]
asciilifeform: ( the only kind there is, in that spectrum, sadly, or we'd have microscope ) [01:02]
mircea_popescu: it's a thing. when you're going "meh, ima use a dental kit" you're being one kinda lulzy. when you're going "a-ha, ima make xray out of old tv tube and camera sensor" you're being ANOTHER kind. [01:02]
asciilifeform: my particular setup ( and yes have 1 from ~last~ time this came up ) has somewhat opposite problem of 'shoot self and bystanders' -- it aint a dental kit, but surplus tube the size of finger, orig . was used to measure thickness of au on glass sinter [01:03]
mircea_popescu: no need for another curie. [01:03]
mircea_popescu: or w/e, golania. [01:04]
asciilifeform: i.e. barely detectable output, will need relatively long exposure. [01:04]
mircea_popescu: !#s goiania incident [01:04]
a111: 0 results for "goiania incident", [01:04]
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: it was in trilema piece [01:04]
mircea_popescu: no fucking way, we so keked at the blue jool powder [01:04]
mircea_popescu: aaa right. [01:04]
asciilifeform: the co-60 brazilians. [01:04]
mircea_popescu: right ? buncha moron/anal princesses discovered the ultimate precious stones. [01:05]
mircea_popescu: true harccore glitter. [01:05]
asciilifeform: if they'd watched it glitter from 100m, would've lived, lol [01:06]
mircea_popescu: ya well. [01:06]
asciilifeform: btw gedankenexperiment -- given patience, and a rigid, immovable photo subject (e.g. pcb) , can take radiogram... without tube. ( sun. a la the 'erase uv eprom without eraser' method ) . by my napkin calc, 8 or so months of film cassette on rooftop oughta produce an image.. [01:13]
mircea_popescu: yeah, totally what you want is 8 months sunbathing for your bolix. [01:14]
asciilifeform: not given as practical how-to, but 'could or could not' [01:14]
mircea_popescu: (you don't have detectors that fine, you'll get 8 months' worth of noise. but anyway.) [01:15]
asciilifeform: what detectors. photopaper in sealed metallic pouch. [01:16]
mircea_popescu: it's not fine enough. [01:16]
asciilifeform: ( believe or not, this is an actual problem for folx keeping stockpile of photopaper, it fogs even without 'sunbathe' , from background gamma . which is likely why scheme wouldn't work.) [01:16]
mircea_popescu: yes, but ~fogs~. [01:16]
asciilifeform: suppose cassette sat in trough of pb, 2cm or so in thickness. ( i.e. only path for photon onto paper, is through the $object ) [01:18]
asciilifeform: on 2nd thought, will still produce rubbish, from those very same grazing reflects. [01:20]
asciilifeform: you'd need a 'shadow mask', like in ye olde crt ! [01:21]
asciilifeform: 'game not worth candles' . [01:21]
* asciilifeform bbl [01:22]
mircea_popescu: that thickness will filter out signal. [01:23]
mircea_popescu: aaand just in case anyone was missing these, [11:20]
BingoBoingo: Awe [11:28]
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: approx what % pass the 'omfg it's cut off' litmus ? [11:31]
feedbot: << Qntra -- Reports: Anti-Macron French Increasingly Compliant As Tyrant's Gendarmies Intensify anti-Civilian Violence [12:26]
mircea_popescu: not 10%. >90% of them about evenly split between the indolent imbecility of silence and aggressive stupidity of the "wut". [12:34]
mircea_popescu: << sample "makes it". they do exist, just, the english speaking world readily approximates as a small townstead drowned in an ocean's worth of inexplicably voluble & outspoken krill. [12:38]
BingoBoingo: Damn "passed time" time stamping. Though for a second there was a 51 year old cuck involved [12:40]
mircea_popescu: i expect it's another dazed twenty-something. [12:41]
mircea_popescu: this whole "mate within age group" thing the anglos got going is really hurting them. [12:41]
BingoBoingo: And everyone else buying it [12:49]
asciilifeform: 'I come along with a cuck' 'I'm marrying him' << lol!! [12:59]
mircea_popescu: i think her situation is rather typical. [13:03]
mircea_popescu: << thinking of this and the whole sns/hp nonstop etc thing : i suspect a large chunk of the way things went may be driven by a (naive, and not necessarily spoken) "what if machine becomes sentient and you cant' turn it off" phobia. [13:04]
a111: Logged on 2018-12-15 05:31 mircea_popescu: what's not being discussed is the problem of space debris. but yes, unsurprisingly enough and predictably enough the end result of "people can now go to space" was "earth now looks like a ball of burata looks once the mold can '''go to space'''. ie, surrounded by a skirting of debris," [13:04]
mircea_popescu: it's certainly evident in period napkin notations (because yes, stuff like asimov's productions are "the napkin doodles of scientific work") and strictly speaking there is exactly no difference between "sentient machine" and "metastable strange". that's exactly what sentience fucking is, metastable strange. [13:05]
mircea_popescu: look at the fetlife girls as the finest example. [13:05]
mircea_popescu: this may then explain "insane" choices such as boggle naggum. [13:07]
mircea_popescu: Ask him why he thinks he should be able to get away with unsafe code, core dumps, viruses, buffer overruns, undetected errors, etc, just because he wants “speed”. << "i asked him, he shrugged his shoulders and went 'well, at least my machine won't fucking take over the world.'" [13:07]
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i can't say i have ever encountered this phobia outside of the yudkowsky/reddit/etc weirdos [13:08]
mircea_popescu: or "i, robot". [13:08]
asciilifeform: in order to suffer from it, afaik it is necessary to have never worked at any length with actual comp. [13:08]
mircea_popescu: or the foundation. or everywhere you turn in the 70s literate production. [13:09]
mircea_popescu: guess what -- people in the 70s hadn't. [13:09]
asciilifeform: rright, mostly yarns by folx who pre-dated microcomp. [13:09]
mircea_popescu: but last night's fairytales inform this morning's breakfast design! [13:09]
asciilifeform: it's rather like to say 'sailors, they fear krakens' 'mmno? what century yer posting from?' [13:10]
mircea_popescu: i thought we previously agreed last time any actual design work went into computing the year was 1979 [13:10]
asciilifeform: moar like '89 [13:11]
mircea_popescu: btw, you ever met one of those athletes who never changed their socks this month [13:11]
mircea_popescu: because complex superstition ? [13:11]
asciilifeform: i thought it was mostly pokerists, and shirts rather than socks [13:11]
mircea_popescu: there's a lot of variety out there, "i have a cuck, i'm marrying him" doesn't even top the scale. [13:11]
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform it's all sorts. specifically included, "thinking" folk. [13:11]
* asciilifeform under no illusion that said specimen 'tops scale' [13:12]
mircea_popescu: i've yet to encounter, this fabled wonder of the ages, the thinking man. [13:12]
asciilifeform: people think (if at all) 'part-time' [13:12]
asciilifeform: sorta how i've met runners, even competition-grade ones, but they did not run all day, erry day, to kitchen, to toilet, etc [13:13]
mircea_popescu: precisely. i have regular bowel movements that do not tend to interfere with my daily life but even so i still spend most of the day doing other things. [13:13]
asciilifeform: exactly like-so [13:14]
feedbot: << Bimbo.Club -- TMSR Log Summary - 11/23/2018 [16:12]
asciilifeform: in other noose, phf , mircea_popescu , et al, the bolix is here. dks packs a++ , princely, all parts on manifest , and kilometre of bubbles. will post photos as soon as i wrap up my albatross of this week, ch14 [18:50]
mircea_popescu: cool [18:50]
asciilifeform: ( this makes for ~3~ original bolix cd sets in asciilifeform's torture room. anybody in l1 want one ? ) [18:51]
asciilifeform: thing also came complete with a bolix-encharactered 1980s crapple kbd. [18:52]
asciilifeform: and the infamous 1button mouse [18:52]
asciilifeform: ( it also came with the nic, so i'ma run it through x11. but will keep these around for later ) [18:53]
a111: Logged on 2014-01-19 19:38 asciilifeform: as a boy, i read about an 18th c. book, 'Triple Power over the Forces of Hell' [18:53]
asciilifeform: d00d even gives '30 day guarantee', which is quite atypical for museum irons. [18:54]
* asciilifeform smoke-tested just nao runs... [19:03]
asciilifeform: clock, interestingly, set. [19:09]
* asciilifeform wonders where dks gets the oddball bios batteries the ancient crapples took [19:09]
phf: neat, did you get crapple way ahead, or had it from before? [19:15]
asciilifeform: phf: came as complete kit [19:15]
asciilifeform: for 4k orcbux it'd better, lol [19:16]
asciilifeform: ( iirc the crapple box per se is worth about a hundy on junkmarkets ) [19:16]
phf: ah, huh, he's an experienced showman, could've probably sold as a board, without anything else and still fetched the same price [19:21]
asciilifeform: interestingly nobody but asciilifeform bid [19:21]
asciilifeform: possibly i'm the last archaeologist who didn't have 1 yet, lol [19:22]
phf: or it was always the same 5 people bidding [19:23]
asciilifeform: already missed 1 last yr for, iirc, 3k, didn't want to wait until it's 5,6,9000 (or entirely extinct) [19:23]
asciilifeform: phf: damned if i know. in as far as i can tell, the entire 'user komyoonity' consists of asciilifeform , phf, and a dozen 's [19:25]
a111: Logged on 2017-08-03 03:38 asciilifeform: << in other lulz. [19:25]
phf: asciilifeform, that's entirely my impression. the xl that i bought went at asking price, because ^ wasn't bidding, the rest of them were bought by the same guy, and he was bidding against a handful of desperados. i suspect that the whole thing was a fluke, or rather the Rembrandt market was a combination of luck and skill on the part of dks [19:27]
trinque: wahahah "completed: made some icons" [19:28]
asciilifeform: i suspect it's moar like the high prices of illicit cell pnoje in jail. i.e. not high because megatonnes of money circulating, but because supply so thin. [19:28]
asciilifeform: iirc in early 2000s, 'american express' unplugged its bolix cluster ( handled fraud detection thingie ) , and surplussed coupla hundred machines. wonder where they went. [19:29]
asciilifeform: couldn't have all gone to the au recyclers, i dun think. [19:30]
asciilifeform: for comparison, is identical to the document i got from dks in '07. quotes 3.2k for the exact box i uncrated today. [19:32]
phf: i bought a barely used eizo cg243w from a russian guy. it was one of his last possessions (no work and didn't want to become a "corporate whore"), and he talked about how quality of everything went down and keeps going down and that you really only can trust 2009 hardware at the latest. i wonder if there are more people like that hoarding their prized bolix, but without yet hitting the necessity to sell one. [19:34]
asciilifeform: phf: i got 1 of those here, lol [19:34]
asciilifeform: a+++ panel [19:34]
asciilifeform: phf: quite possibly, hoarders [19:35]
asciilifeform: also so happens also that the most recent piece of iron in the torture room , excluding FG, is from '09. ( the opterons in the box i'm sitting on nao. ) [19:36]
asciilifeform: well, also excluding ssd [19:36]
* asciilifeform possibly has laboratory instrument from later date, but can't immediately think which specifically [19:37]
phf: well, he's not wrong [19:38]
asciilifeform: imho moar or less exactly right. [19:38]
asciilifeform: trinque: 'lisp engineer' (picture) is simply the most publicly-egregious example i know of . prolly there are others, similar, but with fewer lolcatpics [19:39]
asciilifeform: at one time i actually went through his entire www, thinking to find even 1 shot of PAL/GAL with the sticker off, to identify the part. found 0. [19:41]
phf: i think he took a bunch of macro photos of random parts, and wrote a zmachine version 0 emulators, which in itself can be noted, if the rest of it wasn't so obnoxious [19:43]
asciilifeform: he wrote something ?! i had nfi [19:43]
asciilifeform: he reminds me of that kanzure d00d, who 'look, i spent $2mil on microscope parts' 'so what didja micrograph?' '...' [19:44]
asciilifeform: asciilifeform's purchase of 3620 back in the day may've been a dead end, but at least only wasted a handful of posts on subj. [19:46]
asciilifeform: ( and also didn't pompously 'lisp engineer' title blog... ) [19:46]
mircea_popescu: some dead ends take walking to eliminate. [19:46]
asciilifeform: sure do. [19:46]
mircea_popescu: qatar eminent example, nothing one ~said~ could've done it. [19:47]
phf: asciilifeform, and [19:47]
phf: (there are some other hacks in genera-src, but i don't want to investigate at the moment) [19:47]
asciilifeform: phf: the 2nd link contains dks patches [19:48]
asciilifeform: the 1st, lol, port of 'zork' to bolix... [19:49]
asciilifeform: iguess that's sumthing. [19:49]
asciilifeform: ( at the very least, is moar than i've written for it ) [19:49]
phf: asciilifeform, yeah i just included the patches in case there's something interesting there (i don't know what the overlap of patchsets is between machines) [19:49]
asciilifeform: funny how this thing boots faster than 'modern' microshits. [19:53]
asciilifeform: ( 3620 was approx on part with winblowz for boot time ) [19:54]
mircea_popescu: meanwhile in heathen lulz, "Unity Web Player games are no longer playable on Chrome, Firefox, or Edge browsers." [22:04]
mircea_popescu: what the fuck are they thinking, keks. [22:04]
asciilifeform: wassat? [22:28]
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform "unity" was a wanna-be proprietary alt-flash. [23:11]
mircea_popescu: << vaguely interesting to the entomologist, i guess. 100% vaporware, shit never worked nor was it ever useful. yet for reasons unclear it received the microsoft treatment, where started throwing money at it for no reason, rather than the usual pump-and-dump scam treatment. [23:18]
mircea_popescu: ~why~ exactly the robohitler chose to act as if this piece of shit is "the future" for a decade starting cca 2010 is the faint interesting bit in here. [23:18]
mircea_popescu: and before "conspiracy theory", as in "they have a mailing list, style, talked it over there in secret and consensused to pick this" : the idiots forked legacy eulora codebase from also famously "decided to switch to unity". [23:22]
mircea_popescu: anyone with even cursory qualifications in software project management could have pointed out they have 0 chances of managing the switch before their chosen platform dies (they took 12+ years to fuck up the original codebase, glacial foss devcycles as only gnu can exemplify). [23:23]
mircea_popescu: so, dorks with no connections and no resources somehow nevertheless managed to schelling on this. why the fuck ? what ? cuz it's got a cube-like "icon" and 2010 was all about cube-like icons, gotta kubinetes on unity ? [23:24]
asciilifeform: apparently yes had connections? [23:25]
asciilifeform: or how else. [23:26]
asciilifeform: or do they literally draw'em from hat. [23:26]
mircea_popescu: hm ? [23:27]
asciilifeform: in re [23:27]
a111: Logged on 2018-12-16 04:24 mircea_popescu: so, dorks with no connections and no resources somehow nevertheless managed to schelling on this. why the fuck ? what ? cuz it's got a cube-like "icon" and 2010 was all about cube-like icons, gotta kubinetes on unity ? [23:27]
asciilifeform: evidently they're cousins of somebody or else. or else why picked by hitler. [23:28]
mircea_popescu: the idiots forked legacy eulora codebase from << this is a group of random morons, hardly together enough to find which side of the wall it's raining on. [23:28]
asciilifeform: a aaa [23:28]
asciilifeform: i misread , thought was re 'unity' [23:28]
mircea_popescu: no what i'm saying is : poor & stupid kids in peripheral village somehow picked same bit of entirely indistinct and utterly useless&dysfunctional flotsam as ibm. [23:29]
asciilifeform: btw 'unity' seems to be pestilentially common on the various 3dvisor boxen [23:29]
mircea_popescu: if this is the result of some kind of signalling, i'd like to know what the fuck. [23:29]
mircea_popescu: i suppose the question might be a little like "why are they all in flip flops, terrible design, utterly inconvenient, how the fuck is every dumbass on fetlife amange to pick em". ie, "pick nothing, it's what they had at the store. ALL they had at the store." [23:31]
asciilifeform: 'crossplatform lib'isms that even half-work (e.g. 'qt') end up wildly popular, on acct of how much sweat they save if condition 'must run on microshit AND crapple' is a given for $product [23:34]
mircea_popescu: yes, but qt is very fucking different from this unity thing. [23:35]
asciilifeform: they dun need to not suck to be taken up, only to suck less than the 'native' variant, which is surprisingly easy [23:35]
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: seems similar enuff in concept [23:35]
mircea_popescu: not at all. qt a) actually works and b) isn't going anywhere. [23:35]
mircea_popescu: unity is three dorks and a shoe string. not working, never will work, won't be here in another few years. [23:36]
asciilifeform: didnt nokia buy it? so ~could~ vanish [23:36]
asciilifeform: qt that is [23:36]
mircea_popescu: eh, qt will outlive nokia. like those old hydro plants in europe, went through 20+ "owners" that went bankrupt. [23:36]
asciilifeform: entirely possible [23:36]
mircea_popescu: which is my point here. you're comparing a hydro plant built on rhine cca 1880 with a franchised "fries on pizza!" extruded plastic truck [23:37]
mircea_popescu: that hydro plant is NEVER going anywhere. if there's 5000 people left total, it'll still run. [23:37]
* asciilifeform wrote a fairly substantial ( tho unpublished and long ago retired ) proggy with qt, rewritten from wx but never so much as touched 'unity' [23:38]
mircea_popescu: my point exactly. [23:38]
mircea_popescu: (let's take a moment for a libration in thanking the gods satoshi didn't fucking writer bitcoin in unity) [23:38]
asciilifeform: lol [23:38]
mircea_popescu: one bullet we dodged. [23:38]
asciilifeform: recall 'freenet' btw ? [23:39]
asciilifeform: notbad algo, but released in... java [23:39]
asciilifeform: so stillborn. [23:39]
mircea_popescu: myeah. [23:39]
mircea_popescu: but all this said, i see the "multiplatform" angle. [23:40]
mircea_popescu: qt is "not graphics friendly" so to speak. [23:40]
asciilifeform: qt ( of last i saw it ) had a thin shim for opengl but iirc hat was all the '3dism' offered therein [23:41]
asciilifeform: it's mostly used for ordinary boring guism, rather than game [23:41]
mircea_popescu: aha [23:42]
asciilifeform: ( phunphakt to tie this into prev thread -- seems as if the bolix 3d engine, 1 of the 1st to be sold as such, still exists as commercial product, owned by some jp firm. naturally cppized and renamed. ) [23:44]
asciilifeform: !#s mirai [23:45]
a111: 1 result for "mirai", [23:45]
asciilifeform: hm [23:45]
asciilifeform: possibly misspelled.. [23:45]
asciilifeform: grr perhaps phf will recall when wakes up. [23:45]
asciilifeform: << subj. [23:47]
asciilifeform: << the most well-known item produced with subj, afaik [23:59]
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