Forum logs for 14 Aug 2016

Monday, 16 March, Year 12 d.Tr. | Author:
mod6: $up Bugpowder [00:40]
deedbot: Bugpowder voiced for 30 minutes. [00:40]
mod6: hey Bugpowder, how goes? [00:41]
mircea_popescu: http://archive.is/6oYPy << check it out, it begins! [00:46]
mod6: he probably reads the logs. [00:47]
mircea_popescu: well there's no valid signature... [00:48]
mircea_popescu: fun times. [00:49]
ben_vulpes: oh man if he can throw the vote tracking systems into chaos... [01:08]
ben_vulpes: he could hose so much just by demanding ballots with signatures. [01:08]
ben_vulpes: and if anyone could exclude diebold and friends from the party it'd be him [01:08]
mircea_popescu: yup [01:08]
mircea_popescu: tis teh right strategic move. [01:09]
mircea_popescu: and the more the libtards bitch, the better for him. [01:09]
mircea_popescu: and the less they bitch, the worse for them. [01:09]
mircea_popescu: this is what win-win is. [01:09]
ben_vulpes: not to mention that the left cooked the diebold narrative to begin with. [01:10]
mircea_popescu: aha. [01:10]
ben_vulpes: endless lolz [01:10]
mircea_popescu: oya. [01:10]
ben_vulpes: phf, shinohai, trinque, asciilifeform, mircea_popescu: i elected to nuke the "stale comments" thing, i'd be much obliged if any of y'all have a patch for that. in exchange i've got a patch on wp-comments.php for the suffix trick, not that it's hard or anything [01:12]
mircea_popescu: just take out the <?> part in the form names. [01:13]
ben_vulpes: i r phpbro nao [01:13]
ben_vulpes: but i wanted it to work! [01:13]
mircea_popescu: thats not what nuke means ? [01:14]
mircea_popescu: explain yourself plainly! [01:14]
ben_vulpes: hang on [01:14]
ben_vulpes: pump the brakes there turbo [01:14]
ben_vulpes: mircea_popescu: i pulled out the "comment_checks" [01:15]
ben_vulpes: er, "comment_check" [01:15]
ben_vulpes: and specifically, commented out the line starting with if (((time ... [01:16]
mircea_popescu: that didn't work. [01:17]
ben_vulpes: bad error message lol [01:17]
mircea_popescu: explain yourself vaguely and convolutedly now, maybe that's more practical in your present state of intoxication! [01:17]
ben_vulpes: i am stone cold sober [01:17]
ben_vulpes: SIR [01:17]
mircea_popescu: evidently, it's not working out for you! [01:17]
mod6: heheh [01:18]
mircea_popescu: now then. what are you trying to get and what did you do for it ? [01:18]
ben_vulpes: 1) i commented out the line in wp-comments that checks for the delta between now and the comment time being greater than or less than two magic numbers. [01:18]
mircea_popescu: ok. [01:18]
ben_vulpes: that fixed the comment processor complaining about stale pages or whatever [01:18]
mircea_popescu: well... in the sense that it doesn't check anymore, yes. [01:18]
ben_vulpes: 2) i added the suffix generation routine to the template page, and appended the suffix to the relevant form names. [01:19]
mircea_popescu: 2 would have fixed 1 too i suspect. [01:19]
ben_vulpes: 3) i excised a tril_ from wp-comments.php, replacing it with my db prefix [01:20]
mircea_popescu: yeh, alf reported that too, i recall. [01:21]
ben_vulpes: by jove [01:21]
mircea_popescu: cool, so you're good to go ? [01:21]
ben_vulpes: maybe? vaguely concerned that the thing is subtly broken in other ways not immediately apparent. [01:22]
ben_vulpes: also *zero* clue of what to do to avoid dushensking the instance [01:22]
mircea_popescu: well, you're vulnerable to comment flood and to harvester/spammer pairs, but otherwise should be ok. [01:22]
mircea_popescu: wassat ? [01:22]
ben_vulpes: no, i put the staleness back in [01:22]
ben_vulpes: oh no that was davout [01:22]
mircea_popescu: dude... [01:23]
mircea_popescu: davout put the staleness back in ? [01:23]
ben_vulpes: http://trilema.com/forum-logs-for-07-apr-2016#2074795 [01:23]
a111: Logged on 2016-04-07 22:02 BingoBoingo: later tell davout delete xmlrpc.php from your wordpress install and you will be 95% of the way to securing your blawg [01:23]
mircea_popescu: imagine this guy on acid, if you will. [01:23]
mircea_popescu: ah, that's a pretty stupid idea in that it kills pingbacks, which are a rather important contextualization tool. [01:24]
mircea_popescu: besides, mp wp is already xmlrpc hole-neutered [01:24]
mircea_popescu: it doesn't let randos use your xmlrpc to spam etc LIKE STOCK WP STILL DOES [01:24]
ben_vulpes: ah no, staleness checks still failing for some reason. [01:25]
mircea_popescu: http://trilema.com/2014/o-hai-let-me-wanna-be/#comment-113027 < fix in question. [01:30]
ben_vulpes: aaand it works. [01:37]
ben_vulpes: great! neat mircea_popescu. [01:38]
ben_vulpes: now to muntz the theme. [01:38]
mats: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ts7FQaVULRs [01:42]
BingoBoingo: bc,stats [01:50]
gribble: Current Blocks: 425119 | Current Difficulty: 2.0189321085305896E11 | Next Difficulty At Block: 425375 | Next Difficulty In: 256 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 1 day, 14 hours, 9 minutes, and 41 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: None | Estimated Percent Change: None [01:50]
BingoBoingo: ticker --market all [01:50]
gribble: Bitstamp BTCUSD last: 578.39, vol: 1843.72331891 | BTC-E BTCUSD last: 581.556, vol: 3806.7075 | Bitfinex BTCUSD last: 582.4, vol: 6097.4617757 | GDAX BTCUSD last: 583.83, vol: 2781.51608301 | BTCChina BTCUSD last: 585.25852, vol: 70794.30990000 | Kraken BTCUSD last: 581.78, vol: 417.58616832 | Gemini BTCUSD last: 583.44, vol: 242.497425596 | OKCoin BTCUSD last: 585.80104, vol: (1 more message) [01:50]
BingoBoingo: more [02:00]
gribble: 539691.9271 | Volume-weighted last average: 585.646482735 [02:00]
mircea_popescu: phf http://trilema.com/2016/io-la-conoscevo-bene/#comment-118515 [09:56]
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: that thing really ought to link back to the waterbug piece. [10:04]
mircea_popescu: possibly yeah. [10:04]
asciilifeform: http://trilema.com/2015/prophylaxis << [10:04]
asciilifeform: later tell ben_vulpes http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-14#1521104 << looks like you turned mp-wp into conventional rubbish wp?? congrats ? [10:05]
a111: Logged on 2016-08-14 05:12 ben_vulpes: phf, shinohai, trinque, asciilifeform, mircea_popescu: i elected to nuke the "stale comments" thing, i'd be much obliged if any of y'all have a patch for that. in exchange i've got a patch on wp-comments.php for the suffix trick, not that it's hard or anything [10:05]
gribble: The operation succeeded. [10:05]
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-14#1521093 << can demand whatever he likes. what will get, is another matter entirely. [10:07]
a111: Logged on 2016-08-14 05:08 ben_vulpes: he could hose so much just by demanding ballots with signatures. [10:07]
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-14#1521094 << keep dreamin'. [10:07]
a111: Logged on 2016-08-14 05:08 ben_vulpes: and if anyone could exclude diebold and friends from the party it'd be him [10:07]
asciilifeform: why not also demand to bring back motherfucking literacy test for vote. [10:07]
asciilifeform: diebold ain't leaving any more than literacy test is coming back. [10:08]
asciilifeform: may as well ask tumour to 'leave', nicely. [10:08]
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform so far, he's been getting. [10:13]
asciilifeform: hey if the man can turn shit into gold, i'll clap. [10:14]
mircea_popescu: well, november's close. [10:14]
asciilifeform: lockheed et al 'also want to live.' either diebold, or fella eventually 'eats bad seafood' and keels over, or, etc. and that'll be that. [10:15]
mircea_popescu: yes, yes, i get it : life is a contest for life, and you have your favourite horse. this is fine. the important point here however isn't so much "what trump can accomplish" but "mp is as far as the internet can tell trump's campaign strategist. because no one other has better proof." [10:16]
asciilifeform: my fave horse is the very same 'common man fucked with spiked club of monotonically increasing thickness' as described by mircea_popescu . [10:18]
asciilifeform: other thing - what exactly are 'election observers' supposed to do ? [10:20]
asciilifeform: and from where does one get them ? mars ? [10:20]
mircea_popescu: it's echafaudage. you don't come out with what you want you come out with the principle poorly embodied. op protests, you change it. [10:20]
mircea_popescu: either that or he's just stupid, whatever. [10:21]
asciilifeform: the only kind i'm familiar with is when orc land 'opposition party' 'calls in observers' so that usg-favoured output can be hardcoded in. [10:21]
mircea_popescu: in any case, it's not reactive to this low level "i shall now examine cracks" approach. [10:21]
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform yes. for instance - i could supply observers, working on this principle. [10:22]
mircea_popescu: it will result in ~6% for hillary. make it sting. [10:22]
mircea_popescu: in other words - the us became an orcland during obama's tenure. sad but tru. [10:23]
asciilifeform: phun phakt: the last time i went to a voting booth, i took out driver license to give to the clerk, to be checked off the list (there is a list of townspeople with tickyboxes next to names) and clerk turned around in horror, 'put it away!' -- turns out it was (or at least thought to be) now illegal for clerk to LOOK AT such a thing, in many states incl. md. [10:25]
mircea_popescu: eh ? [10:27]
asciilifeform: never heard of the 'voter buses' ? [10:28]
asciilifeform: where dem party trucks 'undocumented' folk from town to town, to 'vote early, vote often' ? [10:29]
mircea_popescu: i never heard of this "illegal to see" thing [10:29]
asciilifeform: well, it is a talmudic wall [10:29]
asciilifeform: it is not in fact illegal to see, afaik. [10:29]
asciilifeform: but it is - in md - illegal to ~ask~ for it. [10:29]
mircea_popescu: ah [10:29]
asciilifeform: and muppet dun wanna risk being seen 'asking'. [10:29]
mircea_popescu: mass/nh actually don't require citizenship at all iirc. [10:30]
asciilifeform: ditto here. [10:30]
asciilifeform: and so dem party sends bus. [10:30]
asciilifeform: folks on bus - have names of dead or elderly folk memorized (when this is even needed) [10:30]
mircea_popescu: "Every male person, being twenty-one years of age, and resident in any particular town in this Commonwealth for the space of one year next preceding, having a freehold estate within the same town, of the annual income of three pounds, or any estate of the value of sixty pounds, shall have a right to vote in the choice of a Representative or Representatives for the said town." [10:31]
mircea_popescu: sounds pretty reasonable. [10:31]
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu read this off a parchment or wat. [10:31]
mircea_popescu: aha. mass constitution. [10:31]
asciilifeform: guessed as much. [10:31]
mircea_popescu: anyway seems a fine principle, and i see no other available. [10:31]
mircea_popescu: "resident show income of one bitcoin or holdings of twenty bitcoin may vote" [10:32]
asciilifeform: http://trilema.com/2016/gangs-of-new-york << see also. [10:34]
mircea_popescu: a million or two votes should be enough for this entire planet. [10:34]
mircea_popescu: and in other boobs, http://67.media.tumblr.com/e9aaef655de4fdd1acb633b5da3088e7/tumblr_n37638gj1x1sitnino1_500.gif [10:36]
asciilifeform: ^ rerun!! [10:37]
mircea_popescu: o is it ? [10:37]
asciilifeform: $s http://67.media.tumblr.com/e9aaef655de4fdd1acb633b5da3088e7/tumblr_n37638gj1x1sitnino1_500.gif [10:37]
a111: 1 results for " http://67.media.tumblr.com/e9aaef655de4fdd1acb633b5da3088e7/tumblr_n37638gj1x1sitnino1_500.gif", http://btcbase.org/log-search?q=%20http%3A%2F%2F67.media.tumblr.com%2Fe9aaef655de4fdd1acb633b5da3088e7%2Ftumblr_n37638gj1x1sitnino1_500.gif [10:37]
asciilifeform: hm [10:37]
asciilifeform: definitely saw this very same item 2 or so wks ago. [10:37]
mircea_popescu: aww. [10:37]
mircea_popescu: http://66.media.tumblr.com/d39182b4713e575f0e6d95e20a4f0115/tumblr_n37638gj1x1sitnino5_250.gif << fine, admire her silky hair then. [10:38]
mircea_popescu: (the astute reader has no doubt long ago figured out that by jiggling the last figure before the _ one can see the rest of any set) [10:38]
asciilifeform: in other noose, a new ( to me at least ) type of scamola : http://www.sifive.com << metallization mask level (minor tweaks to EXISTING design) thing, which dates to the late 1980s even, fraudulently being pushed now as 'custom silicon for all', lulzy. [10:46]
asciilifeform: expect to see it at your friendly local 3dprinterist, makemagazine, kickstartertronic, 'THE BEOBLE can MAEK anything!111' convention. [10:46]
asciilifeform: $s hardcopy fpga [10:47]
a111: 6 results for "hardcopy fpga", http://btcbase.org/log-search?q=hardcopy%20fpga [10:47]
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform in principle if you make "generic" silicone you can then "fpga" it out of metal mask cuts [10:50]
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: my 1986 symbolics 3620 was made out of this. [10:51]
asciilifeform: it is ancient tech. [10:51]
mircea_popescu: aha [10:51]
asciilifeform: and is in fact what, until recently, was sold as 'miner asic'. [10:51]
asciilifeform: thing is, you get the clock rate of fpga. and same energy consumption. (~same propagation delays). [10:51]
asciilifeform: because it is in fact fpga. [10:51]
asciilifeform: just with hard wires instead of LUTs. [10:52]
asciilifeform: think 'bunch of misc. logical units, adders, shifters, etc. with plugboard' and you're 99% there. [10:52]
mircea_popescu: yeah [10:52]
mircea_popescu: thing is, given the tiny process now used, this is actually not such a terrible approach, for many projects. [10:53]
asciilifeform: you still can't meet ddr timing spec with it. [10:53]
asciilifeform: unless vendor supplied a 'ddr module'. ditto pci, unless 'pci module'. etc. [10:54]
asciilifeform: ever see manual for, e.g., xilinx fpga? it is simply a mass of these turds. [10:54]
asciilifeform: and designer is asked to pay 'license' for EACH. [10:54]
mircea_popescu: sure. but xilinx competition is first step. [10:55]
asciilifeform: there is less now, rather than more, than decade ago [10:56]
asciilifeform: (intel bought, and is killing, altera) [10:56]
mircea_popescu: yes. but the process itself is cheap, and the chinese will proceed to pirate. as per above. [10:56]
asciilifeform: we had this thread. [10:56]
asciilifeform: chinese have 0 incentive to sell fpga. [10:56]
asciilifeform: it isn't a mass-market item. [10:56]
asciilifeform: and if it were, they are happy to clone xilinx and ship pirate copy of the binary turdchain with it. [10:57]
asciilifeform: this implies ~0 logical reversing. [10:57]
asciilifeform: of the kind we might find interesting. [10:57]
asciilifeform: just a sov-style copy of the silicon. [10:57]
mircea_popescu: look : we keep "having these threads" where you keep sprouting nonsense about how you think the world works. we'll have them until either you give up on thinking you have a clue on these things or i get tired of it. [10:58]
mircea_popescu: there's no way out which consists of "the world alligning to alf fantasy". [10:58]
asciilifeform: thing is that i actually have a clue here. [10:58]
mircea_popescu: the bar for having a clue is owning and operating foundry, not being one of the monkeys foundry may at its leisure employ [10:59]
mircea_popescu: but generallty doesn't. [10:59]
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu operates foundry ? [10:59]
mircea_popescu: mircea_popescu does not operate foundry. [10:59]
asciilifeform: or even so much as bought 1 unit of fpga, and designed whatever, helloworld. [10:59]
mircea_popescu: this being the problem : those aren't valid substitutes. [10:59]
asciilifeform: but somehow still asciilifeform 'spouts nonsense' and mircea_popescu 'has clue' ? [10:59]
asciilifeform: i need moar lsd or wat. [10:59]
mircea_popescu: again with this. one doesn't migrate into the other. [11:00]
mircea_popescu: whether you have or don't have a clue as to the economic process involved isn't related to my having or not having one. you can't simply run around turning any statement into any random converse, what sort of javascript is this! [11:00]
asciilifeform: well i have the elementary clue re what device is used for, who buys, where it is a physico-economical win and where - not, etc. [11:01]
mircea_popescu: o you do ? [11:01]
asciilifeform: yes. [11:01]
asciilifeform: re fpga. [11:01]
mircea_popescu: so who buys 30w diode ? [11:01]
asciilifeform: it is largely used inside larger laser, as pump. [11:01]
asciilifeform: presently looking to see exactly ~whose~, the part is new. [11:02]
mircea_popescu: "who buys" != "what it is used for" [11:02]
asciilifeform: re fpga, largest buyer (not a mega-seekrit) is usg. [11:02]
asciilifeform: largely used for, or so all of the available clues suggest - deep-packet inspection iron. [11:03]
mircea_popescu: which is the problem with your clue - it is an anticlue, fed by delusional notions of design purism with no practical exposure whatsoever. in meta-world "nobody buys" metallization fpga for miner asic. in real world, it makes a billion dollars in sales over 5 years, ie, more than ~any "proper" chip class. [11:03]
asciilifeform: hey i actually nailed that prediction [11:03]
asciilifeform: it is in the l0gz. [11:03]
mircea_popescu: i get it why you think it's beneficial to be narrow minded. get it that this virtually never works to any sort of useful or interesting conclusion. [11:03]
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform yes, but acting out of character. [11:04]
asciilifeform: lel so when asciilifeform nails an item years in advance, he is 'out of character' aha. [11:04]
mircea_popescu: look, it's not a value judgement on you. i'm interested in the process. [11:04]
asciilifeform: anyway metal fpga is great, i'll take ten right now if it's a dime. [11:05]
mircea_popescu: do you see where the "oh i know how these assholes are cheating their customers" and "oh chinese have no economic incentive" do not communicate in your head ? [11:05]
asciilifeform: point was not 'it is rubbish', but that you cannot build, e.g., trinary comp, with it. [11:05]
mircea_popescu: well it's unclear what the fuck it'll be, but it's pretty evident, at least to me, that the chinese ARE trying to erode the whole xilinx tower of ip. [11:05]
mircea_popescu: so then the correct statement would have been "it's not clear yet if it'll ever be useful", with which i agree, not "it can't happen". [11:05]
asciilifeform: other point was that it is quite rare to see fpga deployed in mass produced product, because it has inescapably large per-unit cost compared to classical asic. it makes economic sense for small runs (<100,000) and for items which actually need the reconfigurability. [11:06]
asciilifeform: none of this, i thought, is controversial. [11:06]
mircea_popescu: yes but it also depends what the product actually is. [11:06]
mircea_popescu: for instance, if the product is nato-free comms drone, then yes it might well be [11:06]
asciilifeform: fpga is quite like the semiconductor equiv. of '3d printer'. [11:06]
mircea_popescu: that's suddenly millions of units, potentially. [11:06]
asciilifeform: the real 'killer app' of fpga is 'specificity of diddling' [11:07]
asciilifeform: (in fact it was the example i gave in the original thread concerning it, re a 'final solution' to subj.) [11:07]
mircea_popescu: hence why i say drones. you recall the thread ? with "air fence"| for olympics ? [11:07]
asciilifeform: aha. [11:07]
mircea_popescu: so yeah. there's all sorts of things at play here. [11:07]
asciilifeform: recall, i ~like~ fpga, and if it were my will, it would be the only logic chip produced, and anyone who 'needs' ddr3 clock can get phucked [11:08]
asciilifeform: my chinese contention was about ~current~ markets. [11:08]
mircea_popescu: well, it is possible on the basis of the observable data the chinese are coming to your view. [11:08]
mircea_popescu: the one thing that never can exist is the current market. [11:08]
mircea_popescu: (pro tip : when management starts talking about "current market" it's time to sell. they've lost all contact.) [11:09]
asciilifeform: this ^ even i can see, and i am 'management expert' like i am concert violinist. [11:09]
mircea_popescu: anyway. the big thing with this faux fpga thing is that it's very cheap. the much more important smaller thing is that it makes it god damned easy to steal usian ip. [11:11]
mircea_popescu: these forces may well combine into a major trend. [11:11]
asciilifeform: it was pretty easy earlier. [11:12]
asciilifeform: other trend is that quite soon no one will want american design, stolen or not. [11:12]
mircea_popescu: the us is weak it has already proved its unwillingness to pursue in the field their only response ("we'll ban the faux items at border") is exceptionally inadequate here : you'll get left behind by tech train if oyu do. [11:12]
asciilifeform: recall the ftdi incident ? [11:12]
mircea_popescu: the us already proved it's willing to do anything for sv lobby, and so the chinese are drip feeding the "capitalists" and waiting. [11:13]
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform also quite possible. [11:13]
asciilifeform: ( http://btcbase.org/log/2014-10-23#891851 << thread, for whoever missed ) [11:14]
a111: Logged on 2014-10-23 22:49 asciilifeform: https://marcan.st/transf/ftdi_evil.png [11:14]
mircea_popescu: (but yes, the fact that the dos did NOT put into obama's files the observation that the "labour" dispute in silicon valley was chinese driven test run is exactly the sort of thing that feeds my spite for the whole of usg as a "state". it's a state like a collection of mahjongg players is a state.) [11:14]
asciilifeform: hey, if they can also ignore chinese subs having rocket target practice off california beach, in sight of tourists [11:15]
asciilifeform: why not also this. [11:15]
asciilifeform: and that. [11:15]
mircea_popescu: sure, but... [11:15]
shinohai: ben_vulpes: i didn't have to do anything to get it all to work besides diff and apply phf 's patch and directions [11:17]
mircea_popescu: o yeah how's that monster project coming along shinohai ? [11:17]
shinohai: it's a juggernaut for sure [11:18]
shinohai: I decided to stuff the whole thing in an .img file so you don't have to reinvent the whole server wheel every time [11:19]
mircea_popescu: wait [11:19]
mircea_popescu: you're bundling it with lamp and os ? [11:19]
shinohai: for personal use yeah [11:20]
mircea_popescu: ok... [11:20]
mircea_popescu: it's a much larger and more complex task like that best get the small discrete tip sorted out first. [11:20]
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: to briefly revisit thread, one interesting tidbit you might not know about 'hardcopy fpga' is that it stands on same toolchain as the respective vendor's 'ordinary' fpga (on which one prototypes for the 'hard' variant.) [11:40]
mircea_popescu: sure. [11:41]
asciilifeform: the sheer 'lock-in' of the niche, is mind-boggling to the uninitiated [11:41]
mircea_popescu: it's not expected this iteration will yield "better pci". merely - pci that you don't pay the license for. [11:41]
mircea_popescu: sure. it'll take a while to dissolve. maybe even... a coupla decades ? [11:42]
asciilifeform: they already pay 0 license (in most cases, there are idiots in china also) [11:42]
mircea_popescu: but htey'll sell this. to you. for 20 bux. [11:42]
asciilifeform: but the cost is - using american design. which is subtly braindamaged in 1,001 ways, not all of them even deliberate. [11:42]
asciilifeform: not to mention pulling in a multi-GB closed turdball x86 toolchain. [11:43]
asciilifeform: this is the thing i'd dearly like to see die [11:43]
asciilifeform: but so far know of no signs of impending death. [11:43]
mircea_popescu: yeah well, this is chinese restaurant. they don't do al a carte, they just bring you stuff. [11:43]
mircea_popescu: you ever been in one of these btw ? [11:43]
asciilifeform: yes. [11:44]
mircea_popescu: god it pissed me off. [11:44]
mircea_popescu: "you want food, yes ? hang on we bring!" [11:44]
asciilifeform: thing is, i know a bit about orcish 'ip theft' business, father spent most of his life doing just it. [11:44]
mircea_popescu: aite! [11:44]
mircea_popescu: heh, i guess my father also. [11:44]
asciilifeform: so mircea_popescu is familiar with the process. and output. [11:45]
mircea_popescu: i wouldn't go as far as that. but not entirely unfamiliar. [11:45]
asciilifeform: $s when you care enough to steal the very best [11:45]
a111: 1 results for "when you care enough to steal the very best", http://btcbase.org/log-search?q=when%20you%20care%20enough%20to%20steal%20the%20very%20best [11:45]
asciilifeform: hm [11:45]
asciilifeform: https://micro.magnet.fsu.edu/creatures/pages/russians.html [11:45]
asciilifeform: ^ atrocious and nearly indecipherable 'dictionary translation' [11:46]
mircea_popescu: the problem is russians are, for all their ridiculous orcishness, still white people. [11:46]
mircea_popescu: the chinese are stranger still. [11:46]
asciilifeform: i am familiar with some of the ways in which 'stranger.' [11:47]
mircea_popescu: moreover, this is exactly their first run in with first world problems. there's no history to go by. [11:47]
asciilifeform: e.g., considerably less reluctant to sell you product that will actually slowly kill you. [11:47]
mircea_popescu: hey, krakadil. [11:47]
mircea_popescu: that's hardly a problem anywhere. [11:47]
asciilifeform: hey krok does exactly what is printed on the box. [11:47]
mircea_popescu: ie, kills you slowl.y [11:47]
asciilifeform: whereas food with melamine mixed in is labeled 'food' not 'die slowly' [11:48]
mircea_popescu: maybe you misread the labels. [11:48]
* asciilifeform pictures scene, nearly falls down [11:48]
asciilifeform: 'it said right on the box...'! [11:48]
mircea_popescu: 餐飲 definitely means "die slowly" [11:48]
asciilifeform: ever meet somebody with hilariously 'wrong' chinese tattoo ? [11:49]
mircea_popescu: oya. [11:49]
mircea_popescu: anyway. a large part of the problem with "i think better in symbols" is exactly evident here : sure, you think you do, much like dude in bathtub feels he's going faster. nevertheless YOU CANT FUCKING EXPLAIN WHAT YOU THOUGHT. [11:53]
mircea_popescu: was it "food" or was it "kills you slowly" ? [11:53]
asciilifeform: well sorta why they invented language, to explain the symbols with. [11:54]
asciilifeform: set up, if you like, the huffman table. [11:54]
mircea_popescu: mno. to kill the symbologists, rather. [11:54]
mircea_popescu: in any case it is much better to have food, kill you slowly and the quod me nutrit bridge than just repeat 餐飲 until you fall down and then be worshipped as a very wise man - hey, 5k yo wisdom "directly applicable" today. [11:54]
mats: i've never been to the chinese restaurant where they just bring you stuff [12:22]
mats: are you describing dim sum carts? [12:22]
* covertress waves hello to mircea_popescu [12:26]
covertress: here is some news for TMSR, before it hits the press > https://docs.google.com/document/d/1WuZNZ2uPB2kFPzzQ-e3vBfJIP2bT8Gu1--6UxWepxCg/edit?usp=sharing [12:27]
covertress: :) [12:27]
mircea_popescu: mats no. you sit down, they ask what kind of WINE you want if any and then they bring you 30 plates [12:40]
mircea_popescu: there's a hot plate built in the table to cook your own meat [12:40]
mircea_popescu: you never saw this ? [12:40]
covertress: mircea_popescu, ala Mongolian bbq? [12:40]
mircea_popescu: yeah [12:41]
mats: no lol [12:41]
mats: this is in .ar? [12:41]
mircea_popescu: this is everyfucking where heh. but sure, in the coupla blocks of ba that constitute the "china town", between a kitchy gate and two dragon statues. [12:42]
covertress: Japanese do this also, with a central-table soup pot everyone shares. [12:42]
mircea_popescu: that's saner. [12:42]
mats: weird. [12:43]
mircea_popescu: granted, more of a yi thing. [12:43]
covertress: traditional Japanese dinner cooking > https://files.tofugu.com/articles/japan/2015-02-19-nabe-hot-pot/nabe-making-party-at-table.jpg [12:44]
mats: 'hot pot' is a thing, but i've not seen a chinese place with hot plates unless they're also korean fusion or something [12:44]
mats: or mongolian [12:45]
mircea_popescu: you distinguish between these ? [12:45]
mats: yeah. more flavors in hot pot, in my experience, like 麻辣 [12:47]
mircea_popescu: well, i'm new. [12:47]
covertress: contemporary Mongolian hot pot > http://www.thetabletopcook.com/images/thetabletopcook-korean-barbecue-at-hee-been.jpg [12:47]
mats: which is chinese peppercorn [12:47]
mircea_popescu: isn't that overcrowded ? [12:48]
mircea_popescu: ~the only thing i liked about it was that the meat was cut very thin and you could hold-cook it to a very fine degree. [12:48]
covertress: it certainly can be... depends on how hungry everyone is. lol [12:48]
mircea_popescu: though in general this is the job of the god damned cook, which is why i don't eat just anywhere. [12:48]
covertress: mircea_popescu, you never eat this way at home? always go out? [12:49]
mircea_popescu: covertress yeah ok, but say shrimp needs 40 seconds veal maybe 70 ? whereas the mushrooms five fucking minutes or w/e. [12:49]
mircea_popescu: covertress i on occasion cook, but euro dishes. i do eat most everything at home, i even have sushi expert chick nao! [12:49]
covertress: mircea_popescu yes, there is an art to timing the meal. comes with practice. [12:49]
covertress: sashimi is my fav [12:50]
covertress: fash-seared ahi w sesame seeds <3 [12:51]
covertress: *flash [12:51]
covertress: mircea_popescu, which are your fav euro dishes? [12:53]
mircea_popescu: ah, not so simple as all that. depends what mood i wake up in et all. [12:53]
mircea_popescu: i just don't like cooking the barbarian stuff. [12:53]
covertress: what? no haggis? lol [12:54]
covertress: don't blame you [12:54]
mircea_popescu: eh it's not as bad as it sounds. [12:55]
mircea_popescu: tho i couldn't be arsed to make it anymore than cazu marzu. [12:55]
covertress: ahhh... fine cheese is another weakness of mine [12:56]
covertress: the more flavorful, the better [12:56]
mircea_popescu: heh. [12:57]
mircea_popescu: you should see these people. i bought two hot peppers, they sold them with nuclear warhead warnings. [12:57]
covertress: lately, I've been enjoying Irish, grass-fed varieties. Can distinguish regions sometimes. [12:57]
mircea_popescu: delicious things, not even hot. barely flavoured one pot. [12:57]
covertress: ahh. <3 hot peppers also. [12:58]
covertress: I grow my own Japapenos next to Jabaneros, so they cross-polinate and become hotter. [12:58]
mircea_popescu: that's a thought. [12:59]
covertress: *jalapenos [12:59]
covertress: try a trad red bell pepper next to a ghost chili. ) [12:59]
mircea_popescu: nah, i'm a very mild hotness sort of guy. [13:00]
covertress: have you tried Ancho Chili? wonderful flavor yet mild. [13:01]
covertress: *the secret ingredient in most good Mexican food [13:02]
mircea_popescu: aha. yeah, with mexican. [13:03]
mircea_popescu: and in other lulz, "I am here to help you become rich and famous.. If you are not serious in becoming a member please don't even think of adding me or sending me a message because I won't be happy with you.but if you know you are serious and ready to become a member just add me now let's talk and let's get to know each other more better. If you wanna be famous like rihanna, jazzy, Eminem,rick Ross, Lil Wayne, bey once and so [13:03]
mircea_popescu: on just add and message me..and if you are in Kenya, south Africa, Tanzania,India,Zambia, Ghana, don't add me... Because I can't help you. I can't help you if you are from those country. But if you are in the USA, UK, Saudi Arabia, Switzerland, NIGERIA,Nether land, Poland, and if you are in European and Asia country and so on you can also add me let's talk and I will help you be a member... Once again if you are not serious d [13:03]
mircea_popescu: on't add me. Thanks for your corporation.. Your satisfaction is what we want. I will be expecting your reply. Just add and inbox me and I will help you to become a member of the great Illuminati.Thanks once again I am Bella Wilfred and your happiness is what we want." [13:03]
mircea_popescu: country of africaman, has internet, has not map, has not perl, has not way to make lists, has no countrylist datastructure, has nothing. [13:03]
mircea_popescu: modern poverty. [13:03]
mircea_popescu: Bey Once. you know, the singin' an' bootyshaking lord of the lordship of once. [13:04]
mircea_popescu: in an alliance with bey campreamult. [13:04]
asciilifeform: and holy shit, i broke a chinese centerpunch. [13:05]
mircea_popescu: see ? no clue! [13:05]
asciilifeform: didjaknow this was possible. [13:05]
mircea_popescu: well... EVERYTHING IS POSSIBLE! [13:05]
covertress: mircea_popescu, do you believe in a multiverse? [13:06]
mircea_popescu: you mean, in everett's gun sense so dear to alf's heart ? [13:06]
asciilifeform: covertress: what does this question even mean? believe-in as a place to which you can walk in, via some yet-undiscovered magic door ? [13:07]
danielpbarron: multiverse is a contradiction in terms. a universe is already one everything. whatever you call a "multi"-verse is really the whole "uni"-verse redefined [13:08]
covertress: in this sense > http://s2.quickmeme.com/img/af/afec866f59e4c60209e0c3ef8a5ad25be8038bcec717a1d5f7a759f6f857c832.jpg [13:08]
covertress: belief in the theory that multiple universes exist [13:08]
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform check it out, i get a pictogram response. [13:08]
covertress: :) [13:08]
mircea_popescu: covertress traditionally theories are not believed or disbelieved that's more of a religious practice. [13:09]
covertress: I *do specialize at K.I.S.S. [13:09]
mircea_popescu: covertress also, your image depicts a collapsed eigenstate. [13:09]
covertress: yes lol [13:09]
covertress: I'm of the opinion that there is only one universe [13:10]
mircea_popescu: is where ? [13:11]
danielpbarron: i don't even care for the term universe it's usually used as a replacement for God, personified and everything ala "the universe did X" [13:11]
covertress: at the same time, I think that everyone is within their own universe [13:11]
covertress: this is why blue to me is green to you [13:11]
danielpbarron: pass me the bong when you're done babysitting it, wouldja? [13:12]
covertress: danielpbarron: the only time I hear "universe" confused with 'god' is from AA members. [13:12]
danielpbarron: pantheists and other new-agey stuff too [13:13]
mircea_popescu: well aa folks are kinda stuck with this god-but-its-not-god thing... [13:14]
covertress: not everyone is ready to be the center of their own universe, this is true [13:14]
mircea_popescu: anyway, i shall go festejar el dia de "lxs ninxs" con las trabajadoras sexuales in constitucion, "barrio donde por la niche muchos no desean transitar". [13:15]
mircea_popescu: catch you all later! [13:15]
covertress: nos vemos más tarde [13:16]
* covertress waves goodbye to mircea_popescu and leaves also [13:16]
Framedragger: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-14#1521460 << this to me seems to be a confusion between metaphysical and epistemological relativism. "what green is to me" is more to do with the latter, and cannot be used to support full-blown idealism (as in berkeley), or "there are multiple universes", or anything else which has specific *metaphysical* commitments. [13:21]
a111: Logged on 2016-08-14 17:11 covertress: this is why blue to me is green to you [13:21]
Framedragger: </interjection> [13:21]
danielpbarron: unmatched trailing end tag detected [13:21]
Framedragger: implied tags will bring us satan, true, but eh [13:22]
Framedragger: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-13#1520649 && https://www.reddit.com/r/btc/comments/4xj6uw/bitcoin_previously_had_all_the_properties_that/d6fwloo && http://btcbase.org/log/2016-04-04#1445489 << ...soo, has anyone an idea how hawala-like exchange structures for say bitcoin could be encouraged? i've read and liked http://thestringpuller.com/2016/06/bitcoin-in-wakanda/ which is more of a vision of course.. [13:29]
a111: Logged on 2016-08-13 19:28 thestringpuller: more ver-ified lulz: https://www.reddit.com/r/btc/comments/4xj6uw/bitcoin_previously_had_all_the_properties_that/d6fw4ns [13:29]
a111: Logged on 2016-04-04 16:22 phf: given the state of things, i'm not convinced that hawala is the worst we can do [13:29]
Framedragger: $s hawala [13:35]
a111: 49 results for "hawala", http://btcbase.org/log-search?q=hawala [13:35]
Framedragger: $s "in the log" [13:36]
a111: 653 results for "\"in the log\"", http://btcbase.org/log-search?q=%22in%20the%20log%22 [13:36]
deedbot: http://danielpbarron.com/2016/choose-your-government-wisely/ << Daniel P. Barron - Choose your government wisely. [13:42]
BingoBoingo: http://oglaf.com/ellipse/ [14:24]
BingoBoingo: later tell covertress You gotta get other parties WoT'd up for your press releases to make it to media distribution. [14:30]
gribble: The operation succeeded. [14:30]
mats: i'd be disappointed if that made its way into qntra [14:44]
phf: Framedragger: i was saying hawala as an alternative to bitcoin. that was when we were looking closely at the implementation and finding all kinds of insanity. hawala is a system for tracking long term exposure, and you forego collateral because you have "fuck same woman" wot (i suspect there's still collateral involved when exposure is too high). you don't need hawal when you have near instant calls. [14:47]
phf: probably what thestringpuller means is that "we" (he's speaking to a bunch of reddit anons, so i assume it's purely rhetorical) don't have a wot based market. [14:48]
BingoBoingo: mats: Well gotta explain the problem in layers. First is people. Next is substance. Then... [14:49]
phf: well, there is the wot, though nobody here as far as i know is buying/selling. there was also bitcoin-otc, which from what i hear died. i actually tried buying 10btc from a guy that was in bitcoin-otc wot, but we were l3, and he understandably bulked [14:50]
shinohai: mats: not even if it gets my usual ETH treatment? [14:51]
phf: but if the question is, why can't reddit produce hawala, the answer is so obvious it's kind of a "no shit". you need http://glyf.org/socdarw.jpg for hawala, which reddit doesn't have, can't produce and wouldn't recognize when given. [14:52]
BingoBoingo: shinohai: It's not there yet. [14:52]
shinohai: >.> [14:53]
asciilifeform: phf et al: did i ~and~ the log somehow get netsplit, and miss a thread, or is the hawala thing a continuation of pm or whatever [14:57]
asciilifeform: (in the latter case - can haz context ?) [14:57]
phf: asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-14#1521475 i was responding to this [14:58]
a111: Logged on 2016-08-14 17:29 Framedragger: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-13#1520649 && https://www.reddit.com/r/btc/comments/4xj6uw/bitcoin_previously_had_all_the_properties_that/d6fwloo && http://btcbase.org/log/2016-04-04#1445489 << ...soo, has anyone an idea how hawala-like exchange structures for say bitcoin could be encouraged? i've read and liked http://thestringpuller.com/2016/06/bitcoin-in-wakanda/ which is more of a vision of course.. [14:58]
asciilifeform: ah ty phf . [14:59]
mats: shinohai: I don't want to read about ethereum or ethereum-likes unless it is about holders being herded into cattle cars and gassed [15:07]
asciilifeform: ^ [15:07]
* shinohai gets the zyklon canisters out of storage [15:07]
mats: i was tired of reading about ripples by december 2013 [15:10]
phf: main reason i avoided bitcoin news for years, because it was altcoins mixed with a bunch of ~obviously~ idiotic ventures. [15:10]
ben_vulpes: bitcoin? [15:11]
ben_vulpes: news? [15:11]
asciilifeform: phf: same [15:11]
ben_vulpes: later tell gabriel_laddel i'm not keeping interns at the moment [15:11]
gribble: The operation succeeded. [15:11]
phf: it's like if bloomberg terminals were spewing "news" about some guy opening a pizza joint for $5k that he borrowed from his friends, like wtf [15:12]
asciilifeform: phf: ever read my ancient piece - http://www.loper-os.org/?p=939 ? [15:12]
ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: oh pish and tosh. the only thing i threw out while banging on mp-wp was the comment time-sensitivity, and i even got around to fixing that. [15:12]
phf: asciilifeform: yes, that's the first bitcoin article i read end to end. i read satoshi's paper immediately after [15:14]
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: i thought ~whole point was the spam filter. [15:16]
asciilifeform: phf: neato [15:16]
phf: i like the first comment, "How many years has ThePirateBay been up? They’re not going to shut down the bitcoin network". [15:19]
phf: i was trying to figure out when i started reading your blog, and found this lulzy post http://www.loper-os.org/?p=18 [15:20]
* danielpbarron on edge of seat for a +v znort987 .. [15:21]
asciilifeform: $up znort987 [15:21]
deedbot: znort987 voiced for 30 minutes. [15:21]
danielpbarron: znort987, can you voice yourself? [15:22]
znort987: danielpbarron: I think I've managed to do that in #bitcoin-assets [15:22]
znort987: but not sure how to pull it off on #trilema [15:23]
danielpbarron: type /msg deedbot $up [15:23]
znort987: is deedbot the assbot of #trilema [15:23]
znort987: ? [15:23]
danielpbarron: yes [15:23]
znort987: I gues that's a yes. will try [15:23]
danielpbarron: ok, I'll down you till then [15:23]
danielpbarron: $down znort987 [15:23]
ben_vulpes: what's all this about a bridge loan, znort987 ? [15:24]
deedbot: http://danielpbarron.com/2016/my-favorite-jerkcity/ << Daniel P. Barron - My favorite Jerkcity [15:25]
mats: $gettrust znort987 deedbot [15:26]
deedbot: L1: 0, L2: 0 by 0 connections. [15:26]
danielpbarron: wrong direction [15:27]
mats: $gettrust deedbot znort987 [15:27]
deedbot: L1: 0, L2: 1 by 1 connections. [15:27]
mats: o [15:27]
asciilifeform: meanwhile, http://www.loper-os.org/pub/control.jpg [15:27]
asciilifeform: ^ not quite done [15:27]
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes probably has one ^ . [15:28]
danielpbarron: yay! welcome back znort987 [15:29]
znort987: ben_vulpes: never been on irc before. i'm actually here to explain [15:30]
znort987: yahoo email account was hacked. hacker used it to email kako, davout and pete begging for coinz [15:30]
znort987: thing is: I never, ever sent an email to either of these 3 that wasn't a) encrypted b) signed [15:31]
znort987: whereas hacker just sent plain old text [15:31]
znort987: should have been a hint. [15:31]
danielpbarron: aha [15:32]
znort987: anyways ... spent the day chasing the damage he's wrecking in various accounts that were linked to that email [15:32]
deedbot: http://qntra.net/2016/08/the-your-loss-playbook/ << Qntra - The "Your Loss" Playbook [15:32]
phf: danielpbarron: jerkcity just came up in a conversation with some oldfags. it doesn't really translate and is part of a now dead culture. there's also http://yellow5.com/pokey/ and some others that i will probably go "oh man i remember thaaat one." if i were to see it. it's back when absurd non sequiturs typed in all caps was a thing, somehow it's part of hacker culture, which i think goes back to zippy the pinhead [15:32]
danielpbarron: what damage? it got you in here. Should help get more customers if anything [15:32]
znort987: including a doxx threat if I didn't pay 5 BTC lol [15:32]
asciilifeform: znort987: kako, notably, said nothing publicly. [15:33]
znort987: asciilifeform: correct. and I sent him a private email (properly gpg'd) this morning. he said he had smelled something funny. [15:34]
danielpbarron: all news is good news when it's about the most serene republic and its citizens [15:34]
mats: besides the ol' 'mp is a scammer!1', of course [15:34]
asciilifeform: mats: i think at this point he has an emacs macro that craps this string out, or sumthing [15:34]
mats: never mind the bit where he tried to take coins that didn't belong to him, used to seed bets... [15:34]
mats: kako is blameless in the divorce, in his mind [15:35]
mats: the o-noes-i'm-a-victim bit is played out. [15:36]
znort987: so anyhoo ... reason I'm here is simply to make a statement: bitbet is whole, not a cent of customer funds is ever accessible from the internet, and bitfinex was *never* used (nor were any other online wallets / exchanges / etc ...) [15:36]
mats: good to hear [15:36]
phf: danielpbarron: it's essentially bash rendered with microsoft comic chat [15:36]
asciilifeform: znort987: iirc original rumblings came from a recent payout delay, co-inciding with bitfinex incident [15:36]
znort987: second statement, likely not needed for this crowd bu has to be in the log: znort987@yahoo.com is a compromised email, please ignore anything coming from there unless gpg-signed [15:37]
asciilifeform: phf: 'ложечки—то нашлись, но осадок остался!' (tm) (r) [15:37]
znort987: asciilifeform: correct. a bet was paid 72 hours late. RL got in the way. Unfortunate, but nothing to do with solvency. [15:38]
phf: asciilifeform: was that for me? [15:39]
asciilifeform: phf: pertinent to thread, possibly [15:39]
asciilifeform: znort987: ty for putting this on record. [15:39]
znort987: wrt bitbet solvency in general ... not an easy problem. would love to be able to provide a crypto-hard "proof-of-solvency", but ... [15:40]
mats: if coins dun move, that's proof of solvency imo [15:40]
asciilifeform: mats: mircea_popescu will drill you a new arse for this contention (though i still do not grasp why) [15:41]
znort987: mats: yeah, agreed, but easier said than done. assembling payout tx's by hand from deposit addies exclusive to bet is a PITA [15:41]
znort987: mats: the second, and slightly more perverse issue is the whole coinbase debacle. [15:42]
BingoBoingo: https://www.reddit.com/r/Buttcoin/comments/4xpoy2/the_your_loss_playbook_sorry/ [15:42]
asciilifeform: znort987: which debacle ? [15:42]
znort987: coinbase threatens their customers with account closure if they are caught either sending to or receiving from bbet [15:43]
phf: oh wow [15:43]
znort987: and given that all addies are published on the site, bbet is making their life easy [15:43]
znort987: coinbase's life I mean [15:43]
asciilifeform: znort987: coinbase, as you probably already know, is owned and operated by enemies of bitcoin and the free world at large, from its first day. [15:44]
danielpbarron: znort987, no proof is required of you. see: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-12#1520179 [15:44]
a111: Logged on 2016-08-12 23:14 mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-12#1519996 << this is altogether unclear. this "the people have the right to trace the coins" is a) still nonsense, bitcoin is not traceable b) still nonsense, forget the "dao" bullshit c) still nonsense, you trust the operator or you don't trust the operator. [15:44]
znort987: asciilifeform: yeah, but that's not the issue [15:44]
znort987: danielpbarron: understood but ... crypto-hard proof of solvency would be a very nice feature I think. [15:45]
danielpbarron: znort987, that coinbase bans you should be seen as a feature rather than a bug [15:45]
danielpbarron: they are helping you select for decent customers [15:45]
asciilifeform: znort987: what, then, is the issue? if you ran a winery that took btc, and found out that saudi arabia chops off noses of folks who were found with tx buying your wine, you would do what? [15:45]
mats: my understanding of his point is that proof-of-solvency is a monkey patch that attempts to paper over defects in human relations with technical solutions [15:45]
mats: and i see that [15:46]
znort987: asciilifeform, danielpbarron: coinbase is not the issue. the core issue is that by making addies public, it affects coinz fungibility. [15:46]
danielpbarron: mats, there's also the point that bitcoin taint is only a thing when it can be used against the USG and other enemies of the republic [15:46]
asciilifeform: mats: as i understand, his contention was that the heuristic ~does not work~, rather than 'should not be relied on' [15:46]
danielpbarron: znort987, see ^ [15:46]
znort987: if we keep publishing addies on bbet, we create exposure for our users. [15:47]
asciilifeform: znort987: and if you stop, you turn into clone of 'fairlay' [15:47]
znort987: on the other hand, if we hide them behind - say - a user account, or hash, or encrypt them with a user public key, we remove transparency [15:47]
asciilifeform: not my place to say 'you should' or 'should not.' [15:47]
asciilifeform: but - fact. [15:47]
znort987: asciilifeform: exactly [15:47]
mats: does new bbet have new promise that coins will originate from address 1X...Y? [15:47]
asciilifeform: znort987: i'd say that getting out of coinbase, and similar insanity, or at the very least 'washing' their coinz, if they insist on using usgbase, is the responsibility of the affected users, not of bbet. [15:48]
znort987: mats: nope. wallet used to send payouts has all kinds of addies in it. it has a lot of 1X* because when I rebuild the cold wallet I pumped 20K addies in it at once, and they all came out that way. [15:48]
znort987: asciilifeform: yeah but I'm a sucker for making user's life easier/better, my bias I guess. [15:49]
* danielpbarron imagines the lulz one might farm from laundering bitcoin first through ethereum or a similar scam, as a step between coinbase and bitbet, to see if someone else gets stuck with the 'blacklisted' coinz [15:50]
znort987: danielpbarron: working around coinbase policies is not hard, but 90% of users aren't savvy enough to pull it off [15:51]
znort987: anyhoo ... gotta jet. will be back now that I've actually managed to get on irc properly. ta. [15:51]
danielpbarron: cool [15:52]
danielpbarron: $v 2CC0A436A5EF94E5B31CC5A52FAC36AAD54EEE99C710B9BE2EC02C85529C030D [15:55]
deedbot: danielpbarron rated znort987 1 << bought BitBet after it was delisted and put into receivership [15:55]
mats: danielpbarron: i don't follow this bit about taint only being a thing when used against usg [16:00]
mats: something prevents them from mixing? [16:00]
mats: exchanging for services rendered? [16:01]
danielpbarron: nothing prevents [16:01]
danielpbarron: see: http://btcbase.org/log/2015-03-23#1064420 and continued in the next line http://btcbase.org/log/2015-03-23#1064421 [16:06]
a111: Logged on 2015-03-23 00:23 mircea_popescu: but yes, the entire "taint" bullshit does not work. the correct avenue is exactly the reverse : require to be paid only in "proper" bitcoin, that is to say, bitcoin traceable to X or Y or Z purchase, from agent of the crown, which fictitiously has title. [16:06]
a111: Logged on 2015-03-23 00:24 mircea_popescu: in this view of Bitcoin, only Draper has any, or whoever bought it from USG. [16:06]
BingoBoingo: bc,stats [16:22]
gribble: Current Blocks: 425222 | Current Difficulty: 2.0189321085305896E11 | Next Difficulty At Block: 425375 | Next Difficulty In: 153 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 22 hours, 23 minutes, and 24 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: None | Estimated Percent Change: None [16:22]
mircea_popescu: Framedragger [,,,] .soo, has anyone an idea how hawala-like exchange structures for say bitcoin could be encouraged? << yes. http://trilema.com/2014/what-the-wot-is-for-how-it-works-and-how-to-use-it/ [16:30]
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-14#1521487 << this is like "bycicle as alternative to combustion". really ? [16:31]
a111: Logged on 2016-08-14 18:47 phf: Framedragger: i was saying hawala as an alternative to bitcoin. that was when we were looking closely at the implementation and finding all kinds of insanity. hawala is a system for tracking long term exposure, and you forego collateral because you have "fuck same woman" wot (i suspect there's still collateral involved when exposure is too high). you don't need hawal when you have near instant calls. [16:31]
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-14#1521490 << this just means you aren't, really. if you were youd know. [16:32]
a111: Logged on 2016-08-14 18:50 phf: well, there is the wot, though nobody here as far as i know is buying/selling. there was also bitcoin-otc, which from what i hear died. i actually tried buying 10btc from a guy that was in bitcoin-otc wot, but we were l3, and he understandably bulked [16:32]
mircea_popescu: balked* [16:32]
phf: sick gains [16:32]
BingoBoingo: Hail Brodin! [16:33]
phf: right, exactly, the sentiment was "these cars consistently kill the driver and a dozen of people on the roade, bicycles sound not half bad now" [16:35]
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-14#1521510 << nowadays they ... just about do. [16:35]
a111: Logged on 2016-08-14 19:12 phf: it's like if bloomberg terminals were spewing "news" about some guy opening a pizza joint for $5k that he borrowed from his friends, like wtf [16:35]
mircea_popescu: in other news i had drinks with the dominicans running the official bar of the hos do kids' day event will put pics up as soon as im done with this log [16:36]
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-14#1521544 << how did that happen ? [16:39]
a111: Logged on 2016-08-14 19:30 znort987: yahoo email account was hacked. hacker used it to email kako, davout and pete begging for coinz [16:39]
mircea_popescu: oh i guess he's gone now is he ? [16:39]
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-14#1521579 <<< ahahaha lol! [16:43]
a111: Logged on 2016-08-14 19:43 znort987: coinbase threatens their customers with account closure if they are caught either sending to or receiving from bbet [16:43]
mircea_popescu: check out who suddenly grew a pair of balls! the perambulating dickhead "entrepreneur" [16:44]
mircea_popescu: really, time usg got a brian armstrong v2.0, this one's stale. [16:52]
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-14#1521589 << it's ridiculous anyway, you're not supposed to use usg.scam as a fucking wallet in any case. withdraw funds to own wallet first, problem solved. [16:53]
a111: Logged on 2016-08-14 19:45 danielpbarron: they are helping you select for decent customers [16:53]
mircea_popescu: "oh but i don't want to run a node" "fu" [16:53]
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-14#1521604 << alf has it. [16:55]
a111: Logged on 2016-08-14 19:48 asciilifeform: znort987: i'd say that getting out of coinbase, and similar insanity, or at the very least 'washing' their coinz, if they insist on using usgbase, is the responsibility of the affected users, not of bbet. [16:55]
mircea_popescu: the notion of catering to consumer is rather orthogonal to the notion of being in bitcoin. this breach must be addressed early and cleanly, lest management of any project spends all its time hopping up and down aimlessly. [16:56]
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-14#1521615 << you familiar with the original source of the phrase "vae victis" ? [16:57]
a111: Logged on 2016-08-14 20:01 mats: exchanging for services rendered? [16:57]
mircea_popescu: you can put literally anything in the balance. "they killed my auntie". fuck them. [16:57]
asciilifeform: meanwhile mircea_popescu , i have a http://www.loper-os.org/pub/saw.jpg to match your http://trilema.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/05/periplus-2.jpg . [17:38]
mircea_popescu: dude what the fuck. [17:39]
asciilifeform: china. [17:40]
asciilifeform: is what. [17:40]
mircea_popescu: all this wasted material. we'll never get it back. [17:40]
asciilifeform: bonus fact is that it crumbled ~while sitting on a shelf~ [17:40]
asciilifeform: not in use. [17:40]
asciilifeform: and yes, 'let's make this part that takes 100kg of tension out of plastic' is a specifically chinese practice. [17:42]
asciilifeform: 'let's also sputter-metallize it to look like at least pot metal' is also chinese. [17:43]
asciilifeform: i bet actual, e.g., aluminum, would have cost ~less~ [17:43]
asciilifeform: but it wouldn't result in chumper buying saw after saw... [17:43]
asciilifeform: so no go. [17:43]
mircea_popescu: duralumin actually is perfect for that application. and yes, cheapest than just about anything, incl the plastic. [17:47]
asciilifeform: ergo вредительство. [17:48]
asciilifeform: poor sad ru orcs never knew how to correctly wreck 'rotten capitalist' west. [17:50]
asciilifeform: chinese - know. [17:51]
asciilifeform: one motherfucking broken hand tool at a time. [17:51]
asciilifeform: one melamine biscuit at a time. [17:51]
asciilifeform: and GO an just TRY selling duralumin saw. [17:52]
asciilifeform: bankrupt in a week. [17:52]
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: bonus fact, i finished $job with angle grinder, also chinese, which overheated and began to smoke. [17:55]
mircea_popescu: heh [17:55]
znort987: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-14#1521634 << unfortunate combo of yahoo security model flaw (they claimed they "obsoleted" security questions when in fact the "obsoleted" part means they can't be changed but can still be used for account recovery) and my being careless/lazy (security question/answers were weak and I never bothered to fix while I could). [18:04]
a111: Logged on 2016-08-14 20:39 mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-14#1521544 << how did that happen ? [18:04]
mircea_popescu: nuts. [18:05]
mircea_popescu: pro tip : set up your own mailserver if you're going to use email as a security token. [18:06]
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: great till your dns is jacked. [18:06]
asciilifeform: (or not even.) [18:07]
mircea_popescu: hey, there's good reasons not to use email as "security" [18:07]
znort987: mircea_popescu: that's how info@bitbet.us is setup. and asciilifeform is right: email is lame for auth. [18:07]
mircea_popescu: znort987 anyway, so no bitfinex losses, goot for you. [18:07]
znort987: like I said earlier, the fact I had never sent email that wasn't encrypted nor signed during the bitbet auction should have been a dead giveaway that it wasn't me talking. [18:08]
mircea_popescu: ftr, you understand how deeds work ? that'd be the cannonical application for stuff like http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-14#1521562 [18:08]
a111: Logged on 2016-08-14 19:36 znort987: so anyhoo ... reason I'm here is simply to make a statement: bitbet is whole, not a cent of customer funds is ever accessible from the internet, and bitfinex was *never* used (nor were any other online wallets / exchanges / etc ...) [18:08]
znort987: mircea_popescu: cant say that I do. gotta go read up on it I guess. pointerz ? [18:09]
mircea_popescu: http://deedbot.org/ < should be pretty self-explanatory. [18:09]
mircea_popescu: you call it with $deed url [18:09]
znort987: reading ... [18:11]
znort987: so IIUC this is a unalterable log of "things stated by GPG key owners" that are somehow shoehorned into the blockchain ? How does the shoehorning actually work ? Do it cost coinz ? [18:16]
mircea_popescu: it costs very little. it actually works, yes. [18:17]
mircea_popescu: see the faq, it includes sample code even [18:17]
thestringpuller: Framedragger: in regards to http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-14#1521475 << I was trying to make a point in regards to Ver's idealism. Currently if 1993 AOL "mass adoption" occurs, the underbanked will inevitably be left out due to lacking infrastructure of the sovereign nature. Ver despite calling himself an anarchist is still willing to suck the USG dick, which helps no one. The fact he responded with "You found a new business opportun [18:19]
a111: Logged on 2016-08-14 17:29 Framedragger: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-13#1520649 && https://www.reddit.com/r/btc/comments/4xj6uw/bitcoin_previously_had_all_the_properties_that/d6fwloo && http://btcbase.org/log/2016-04-04#1445489 << ...soo, has anyone an idea how hawala-like exchange structures for say bitcoin could be encouraged? i've read and liked http://thestringpuller.com/2016/06/bitcoin-in-wakanda/ which is more of a vision of course.. [18:19]
znort987: lo and behold, the third line on the page actually says "Frequently Asked Questions" lol [18:19]
mircea_popescu: znort987 sorry, republic is poor can't currently afford rounded corners. [18:22]
znort987: mircea_popescu: was just pointing out that I ought to actually look at what I'm looking at. Re bitfinex: neve understood why people would want ever leave their coinz in other people's pockets. pretty much negates everything bitcoin is about. [18:25]
mircea_popescu: for interest. [18:26]
mircea_popescu: and ftr people routinely leave bitcoin in other people's pockets. just, in other PEOPLE's pockets. not every walker is people now. [18:27]
thestringpuller: turns out the FED physically delivers cash without KYC everyday. who'd of thought? [18:33]
mod6: So in test-land news I've created a working totally off-line build for trb. [19:01]
mod6: essentially, i've taken all the buildroot deps (typically collected from the wan), along with the trb deeds, placed them in a local dir with the build script (modified to suit this process) and launched. [19:02]
mod6: with some additional work (encoding & signing the buildroot deps) and a simple guide, this could be a thing shortly. [19:03]
mod6: speaking of which [19:03]
mod6: later tell danielpbarron You wanna help the Foundation test the latest V99994 incantation? [19:03]
gribble: The operation succeeded. [19:03]
mod6: later tell pete_dushenski You wanna help the Foundation test the latest V99994 incantation? [19:06]
gribble: The operation succeeded. [19:06]
mircea_popescu: nice work mod6 [19:16]
shinohai: o7 mod6 just got pm too [19:18]
mod6: thanks :] [19:18]
mod6: this is mainly a learning device anyway. as now I can take what i've learned here and apply it to the makefiles. [19:19]
thestringpuller: mod6: you got a min? [19:39]
asciilifeform: later tell trinque deedbot rss is broken ?? [19:51]
gribble: The operation succeeded. [19:51]
asciilifeform: ^ e.g., mircea_popescu last 2 pieces did not show. [19:52]
mircea_popescu: spot test : what's patibulaire mean to teh lordship ? [20:02]
mircea_popescu: "ghostly" or "fit to be hanged" ? [20:02]
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: 'jailbird' ? [20:04]
mircea_popescu: hm. [20:04]
asciilifeform: or what do you call it. [20:04]
mircea_popescu: meanwhile in other dongs, http://66.media.tumblr.com/e8288199e7e976609832a18973b02d92/tumblr_n173tsKLcH1t55va3o5_400.gif [20:04]
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: didja ever explain the 'Ni Una Menos' thing ? [20:05]
asciilifeform: what the hell exactly ~is~ it [20:05]
mircea_popescu: derpy govt movement purporting to priviledge murders involving females ("femicidio") over murders in general. [20:05]
asciilifeform: generic derpatron a la 'occupy' ? [20:06]
asciilifeform: hm. [20:06]
deedbot: http://trilema.com/2016/lxs-ninxs/ << Trilema - Lxs ninxs [20:06]
asciilifeform: hah there it is. [20:06]
mircea_popescu: out of ~50 or so dead hookers in the past 20 years, the police "solved" 3 cases. [20:06]
trinque: asciilifeform: was just looking at it [20:06]
trinque: seems like it's just running quite slow [20:06]
mircea_popescu: this is about on par with their performance generally. [20:06]
asciilifeform: trinque: what've you got on that box ? [20:07]
asciilifeform: (aside from deedbot) [20:07]
asciilifeform: in unrelated nonnews, looking at what is in bbet today, folks who a) willing to use it b) follow mircea_popescu's logic re clitler - stand to make some coin, possibly: https://bitbet.us/bet/1256/donald-trump-will-win-the-2016-united-states [20:13]
asciilifeform: at this moment, standing at 49.37 BTC ('no') 33.30 BTC ('yes'). [20:14]
mircea_popescu: lol @ comments. [20:16]
trinque: asciilifeform: nothing heavy. I will probably give in and write my own RSS thing this week. [20:16]
trinque: appears to be the only way to have working items [20:16]
asciilifeform: 'Ya I wont be betting on this site until they pay the winners for the original trump nominee bet, very shady behaivor.' << holy mother of fuck. [20:24]
* asciilifeform was recently reading vintage trilema, and happened upon http://trilema.com/2014/the-basics-of-banking-a-discussion - which is quite pertinent to the recent inflation thread, [20:27]
asciilifeform: 'Once the organised thieves started their attack on prosperity, inflation was redefined to "mean" something meaningless, to wit "a disparity between the increase in means of payment and the increase in available goods and services". This is poppycock, primarily because if on a wharf somewhere there's ten yachts which each cost one million, then you and your nine friends are THE ten people with yachts. If tomorrow the wharf is chock-f [20:27]
asciilifeform: ull, sporting one hundred yachts, the fact that the monetary inflation is matched by corresponding inflation of yacht volumes doesn't help you any : you're now stuck with ninety more fuckwits on your wharf, and yachting shall never be the same. This is definitely inflation.' [20:27]
mircea_popescu: myeah [20:28]
asciilifeform: imho very palpable dimension, that is usually not mentioned. [20:28]
mircea_popescu: finance discussion, like most discussion as well as practice in "civilised society" suffers from a pruned-middle problem. [20:29]
mircea_popescu: idiotic nonproblems and extremely advanced problems are discussed but there's no discussion of anything to bridge that gap. [20:29]
asciilifeform: well no mega-seekrit as to why - middle is where the actionable meat lives, and you wouldn't want ~that~ openly discussed... [20:30]
mircea_popescu: the pruned-middle being a reference to buffett and that fiscal discussion, "in which you become grain" [20:30]
asciilifeform: aha. [20:30]
mircea_popescu: it'd seem, to my naive intuition, that the interest alone couldn't explain this weird. [20:31]
asciilifeform: thinking about it again, does it actually make sense to roll resource depletion (of empty space around yacht, of molybdenum, etc) into 'inflation' metric ? [20:32]
mircea_popescu: what now ? [20:34]
asciilifeform: well hm, i'd say it does, but the deception is that there are now '100 yachts' for same value of 'yacht' as when there were 10 [20:34]
mircea_popescu: i'm not following. [20:34]
asciilifeform: nm, it makes sense. [20:35]
asciilifeform: no reason to follow this, it ends where it started. [20:35]
mircea_popescu: k [20:35]
asciilifeform: http://trilema.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/08/lxs-ninxs-17.jpg << mircea_popescu - pigeon, yes, but window made from 'scotch tape' is now unremarkable ? it is almost like we are in 18th c again, but in place of fish bladder, this. [21:54]
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Best to ignore "store brands" unless you are getting consumables. 2.5 gallons of 41% glyphosate concentrate, HDX is fine. Tool, probably not fine. [22:16]
BingoBoingo: Store brands are where china's finest corners get cut. [22:17]
covertress: ever wanted to hear my voice? > https://twitter.com/covertress/status/764980607390736384 [22:30]
covertress: sorry to spam n dash... but, I'm pooped... cu tomorrow ) nn - Steph [22:31]
thestringpuller: mod6: hitman has taught me that a lot of accidents in the world may not have been accidents [23:20]
deedbot: http://www.contravex.com/2016/08/14/wot-loans-haxxing-emails-and-fishy-smells/ << » Contravex: A blog by Pete Dushenski - WoT loans, haxxing emails, and fishy smells. [23:34]
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