Forum logs for 09 Apr 2018

Monday, 16 March, Year 12 d.Tr. | Author:
douchebag: mircea_popescu: I'm talking to a girl right now [00:15]
douchebag: She might be interested [00:15]
mircea_popescu: aite. [00:17]
douchebag: tryna sweet talk her right now [00:17]
hanbot: phf et al: attempted to press latest vtools to the keccak head. v (mod6's) reports vtools_vpatch_newline not in flow, neither its antecedent vtools_fixes_static_tohex, despite both patches and (verified good) sigs present (they neither show up via flow command). v will press to vtools_vpatch.vpatch, but no further. see . [00:25]
hanbot: not sure if this has something to do with the note in phf's accompanying release post re btcbase presser not working quite right.... [00:26]
mod6: ugh [00:27]
mod6: i'll take a look [00:27]
mircea_popescu: hanbot manifest is broken [00:28]
mircea_popescu: o no nm, i had them in reverse order. [00:29]
mircea_popescu: it's actually 6144 -> 7ebf 7ebf -> 154d [00:29]
mircea_popescu: hanbot that is so fucking weird literally greps for the name in order to spit out that error, and the name's right there. [00:33]
mod6: well, 'vtools_fixes_static_tohex.vpatch' is not found in her flow. [00:42]
mod6: which is where the error comes from. im getting all of his patches & sigs and will see wtf [00:42]
mircea_popescu: but it's in the ls. [00:43]
mod6: yeah, but isn't picking it up, for some reason i'll get to the bottom of why. [00:44]
mod6: hanbot: can you tell us what version of you are using? [00:45]
hanbot: 99994 K [00:47]
mod6: ok, update to 99993 K plz. not sure it'll solve ~this~ problem yet. [00:51]
* mod6 is just digging in [00:51]
hanbot: mod6 same results with 99993 [01:00]
mod6: yup, i see the same. [01:01]
mod6: and i've found the issue. [01:02]
mod6: stand by [01:02]
mod6: Before I paste this, lemme describe what I'm doing here: 1) I'm starting fresh, grabbing all the vpatches and sigs referenced in the most recent blog post by phf at [01:03]
mod6: 2) Once I have all the files, I put them in the proper place. Then grab the latest V (99993) and verify that it's correct. [01:04]
mod6: 3) Check the flow, see that vtools_fixes_static_tohex.vpatch is not in the flow, and check to ensure that the seal verifies, and it dows [01:04]
mod6: *does [01:04]
mod6: 4) Check the press paths -- there are ~two~ (phf said this was experimental previously) [01:05]
mod6: 5) Check the origins of the antecedent hashes in 'vtools_fixes_static_tohex.vpatch' to see if we're missing one. [01:06]
mod6: 6) We're not missing an antecedent vpatch however, '98ba7212fafa4a61f6d6096f1a2953a67a70fcf185965ed7199a223f6897c9b9f2996d391a3f363282236889413973d0beada0e36d57068549bea672fd110d8d' matches two antecedents [01:07]
mod6: [01:07]
mod6: ^ my testing [01:07]
mod6: one will notice that these antecedent origins are from two separate press-paths. [01:09]
mod6: I'm not sure how to reconsile this. If you have a different v tool that will help you work around this, by all means. [01:11]
mircea_popescu: mod6 how the heck can both sha fixes and fixes newline have the same hash [01:13]
mircea_popescu: oh, they don't, they just have the same antecedent. why is this a problem ? [01:14]
mircea_popescu: 99994 and 99993 correctly press past this split, you're aware. [01:14]
mod6: 'vdiff_sha_fixes_newline_gcc.vpatch' and 'vdiff_fixes_newline_gcc.vpatch' indeed have the same output hash. [01:16]
mod6: <+mircea_popescu> oh, they don't, they just have the same antecedent. why is this a problem ? << im not sure at this point. could be an edge case im not catching, or could be buried in old rules built into my v. [01:17]
mircea_popescu: hang on wtf. [01:18]
mod6: and a good question, is this a problem for 'theory of v' ? [01:18]
mod6: i'd have to fully debug the problem here, im only showing the symptoms here. [01:18]
mircea_popescu: omf they do : [01:20]
mircea_popescu: phf dude you did the conflict wth is this! [01:20]
mircea_popescu: mod6 well i dun see how we can have collisions and live. i can't even understand how the fuck this was possible, two patches with DIFFERENT antecedents hash-colliding ?! [01:21]
mircea_popescu: i mean, vdiff_sha_fixes_newline_gcc.vpatch sorts off vtools_vdiff_sha, whereas vdiff_fixes_newline_gcc.vpatch sorts right off genesis. [01:22]
mod6: <+mircea_popescu> omf they do : << here I think you inadvertantly curled & diffed the same files. [01:22]
mod6: this is different than what i'm saying. the two distinct vpatches, 'vdiff_sha_fixes_newline_gcc.vpatch' and 'vdiff_fixes_newline_gcc.vpatch', contain the same output, '98ba7212fafa4a61f6d6096f1a2953a67a70fcf185965ed7199a223f6897c9b9f2996d391a3f363282236889413973d0beada0e36d57068549bea672fd110d8d' [01:23]
mod6: oh wait. [01:33]
mod6: there is more going on here. [01:33]
mod6: 'vtools_fixes_static_tohex.vpatch' is not the only one to be dropped out, so is 'vdiff_sha_static.vpatch' i didn't notice on the first pass. [01:34]
mircea_popescu: oh damn i did do the same file. buffer failure. [01:36]
phf: << that was already the case in the previous patchset [01:36]
a111: Logged on 2018-04-09 05:23 mod6: this is different than what i'm saying. the two distinct vpatches, 'vdiff_sha_fixes_newline_gcc.vpatch' and 'vdiff_fixes_newline_gcc.vpatch', contain the same output, '98ba7212fafa4a61f6d6096f1a2953a67a70fcf185965ed7199a223f6897c9b9f2996d391a3f363282236889413973d0beada0e36d57068549bea672fd110d8d' [01:36]
* mircea_popescu is thoroughly confused through the working of his own ineptitude, will need a moment to extract self. [01:36]
mod6: phf: i thought last time we encountered a problem like this we dropped out a vpatch, then it was fine. [01:37]
mod6: but this time, i dunno wtf is going on here. it's a mess. [01:37]
mod6: [01:37]
mod6: here's where two vpatches have the same outputs for 'xalloc.h' [01:38]
mod6: ^ [01:38]
douchebag: Hey is it cool if I invite a friend in here, he's a pretty good chatter and he's a technical dude [01:38]
mod6: then both vdiff_sha_static.vpatch and vtools_fixes_static_tohex.vpatch try to use the same input. [01:38]
phf: mod6: this might've been encountered before, but i'm talking about the vtools patchset that was there before regrind [01:38]
douchebag: He'll join in a moment [01:39]
mircea_popescu: mod6 no, listen, i don't see what the problem you see is. so a number of different patches, which are themselves distinct, nevertheless depend on the same version of a file (here, xaloc). this isn't, nor can be a problem and was not a prtoblem before, either. [01:39]
mod6: oh, im specifically talking about the patch set from your latest post. [01:40]
mod6: umm. well... [01:40]
mircea_popescu: as long as the patches don't collide, ie, have the same hash and as long as they're properly chained and signed they should press. [01:40]
mod6: this violates rules that we've previously put in place then. [01:40]
mircea_popescu: i still don't know why they don't but as far as i can see there isn't an actual problem with his patches or seals. [01:40]
mircea_popescu: mod6 which rules ? [01:40]
mod6: or it's a side effect of some coding [01:41]
mod6: i dunno. ugh. [01:41]
mod6: this is why i don't want to write this thing any more. [01:41]
mod6: so tired of fucking with v. [01:41]
mod6: can't even get anything else done, all i do is V. audit peoples shit. [01:41]
mircea_popescu: mod6 but specifically as to the point, can you see why spits out that error message there ? am i right in reading the script as "if the file is not found by name" ? [01:41]
mod6: etc etc etc. [01:41]
mod6: this is getting SUPER old. [01:41]
mircea_popescu: well the hope is that eventually we iron out all the edges... [01:42]
mod6: i don't think im the right person for this. [01:42]
mod6: someone else now needs to step up and write a V. [01:42]
mod6: im done with this thing. [01:42]
mircea_popescu: death("HEAD: $press[1] not found in flow\n") if !grep /^$press[1]$/, @flow << this specifically. how can it fail if it lists the item in flow ? [01:43]
mod6: it isn't in the flow. that's the problem. [01:43]
mod6: these vpatches are thrown out as they fail a previous check. [01:44]
mircea_popescu: oh oh i see! [01:44]
mod6: I added a debugging line: [01:45]
mod6: [01:45]
mod6: see, "removed" [01:45]
mod6: this was removed in the "ante_check" [01:45]
mod6: *these were removed in the "ante_check" subroutine [01:45]
mircea_popescu: mod6 ok here's what i don't understand : for some reason the "flow" goes from vtools_vpatch, which is in the keccak line, to vdiff_sha_fixes, which is in the other line (sha line). [01:47]
mircea_popescu: this makes no sense. basically it goes 5 steps down the keccak tree and then jumps to step 1 and 2 on the sha tree. [01:47]
mod6: well, i dunno. [01:48]
mod6: i need to call it a night. [01:48]
mircea_popescu: sleep tight. best case, we figure it out by morn. [01:48]
phf: i can only say that i think that btcbase presser is doing the same thing, with the "5 steps down keccak and 2 steps down sha", but the grapher doesn't. i think grapher uses more Graph Theory, but i neither remember what the difference is, nor can i debug it now (was about to go to sleep myself) [01:51]
mircea_popescu: phf it's incomprehensible to me as the manifest.txt varies wildly. [01:51]
mircea_popescu: anyway, it's not an emergency, sleep tight also we see tomorro [01:52]
mircea_popescu: douchebag sure. [01:58]
douchebag: .Alright [02:00]
phf: here's a potentially useful picture for those who want to meditate on the antecedent graph, it shows individual hunk linkages though unlabeled [02:05]
douchebag: !!up ckang [02:15]
deedbot: ckang voiced for 30 minutes. [02:15]
douchebag: This is my friend here [02:15]
douchebag: ckang: introduce yourself [02:15]
ckang: h douchebag [02:15]
ckang: h mircea_popescu [02:15]
douchebag: I've known this guy for awhile now, mainly discuss technical topics and such with him [02:16]
douchebag: He seemed curious to see what this place is about after discussing this [02:17]
ckang: ive heard stories about this place and decided i needed to see it for myself [02:17]
ckang: to an outsider it is a pretty extreme idea, but i dig it [02:18]
mircea_popescu: hello [02:30]
mircea_popescu: phf oh! it tries to press vdiff_sha / etc because they're actually a dependency for tohex ?! why did you write it this way ? [02:31]
mircea_popescu: vtools_fixes_static_tohex shouldn't depend on anything from vdiff_sha_fixes_newline_gcc. [02:31]
mircea_popescu: that's the fucking problem! the vtools_fixes_static_tohex uses xalloc.h 98BA when it should instead use its own line (earlier) version of C89B. [02:34]
mircea_popescu: ckang are you the guy with the gopher stuff / suckless morphing ? [02:35]
ckang: oh, no :) [02:36]
mircea_popescu: so what do you do ? [02:36]
ckang: I have used the suckless irc bot though [02:36]
ckang: i do security research [02:37]
mircea_popescu: ah, liek webstuff and so forth ? [02:37]
ckang: i guess that is a big vague though, i poke things until they break [02:37]
ckang: yup [02:37]
mircea_popescu: aha. [02:37]
ckang: bit* [02:37]
douchebag: he's a bit more into lower level stuff than me [02:37]
mircea_popescu: !!key ckang [02:37]
douchebag: i'm more experienced with web stuff than him [02:37]
deedbot: [02:37]
mircea_popescu: !!rate ckang moar websecs [02:38]
douchebag: he also is more into stuff at the network level [02:38]
mircea_popescu: !!rate ckang 1 moar websecs [02:38]
deedbot: Get your OTP: [02:38]
ckang: yea, I like services over webapps [02:38]
ckang: I guess would explain it [02:38]
douchebag: ckang: you can now up yourself [02:38]
douchebag: using !!up in deedbot pm [02:38]
ckang: same media different vectors [02:38]
ckang: oh, I think I need to be unvoiced, says I cant myself yet [02:39]
mircea_popescu: takes a minute. [02:39]
ckang: douchebag mentioned some hosting you all where setting up [02:40]
ckang: I was wondering if there was any details about that available yet? [02:40]
mircea_popescu: ckang BingoBoingo is in uruguay building the pizarro.isp see and you know, [02:42]
mircea_popescu: !#s "pizarro" [02:42]
a111: 124 results for "\"pizarro\"", [02:42]
ckang: I have a few old supermicro 2u's [02:42]
ckang: once it is up will you all be selling rackspace ? [02:42]
ckang: I wanted some offsite / bulletproof storage, I am moving entirely off the 'cloud' [02:45]
ckang: I have an odd fetish for collecting NDA code/documents [02:49]
mircea_popescu: well, talk to ben_vulpes not enough machines yet, but yes, more being shipped [02:57]
ckang: i have machines, just need ping/power/pipe [02:59]
ckang: and a place that doesn't care about DMCA [03:00]
mircea_popescu: ah, that may work out. talk to ben_vulpes when he wakes. [03:00]
ckang: broadcom lawyers ^.^ [03:00]
mircea_popescu: though getting gear into paraguay is a little finnicky. [03:00]
ckang: import duties ? or shady customs officers ? [03:01]
mircea_popescu: read the log, they had a whole thing recently with like 100kgs worth of various shit. [03:05]
shinohai: <<< read through last night's log, and got same behaviour (unsurprisingly) ... used own personal copy of mod6's V and tested with one from foundation as well, equal results. [09:30]
a111: Logged on 2018-04-09 04:25 hanbot: phf et al: attempted to press latest vtools to the keccak head. v (mod6's) reports vtools_vpatch_newline not in flow, neither its antecedent vtools_fixes_static_tohex, despite both patches and (verified good) sigs present (they neither show up via flow command). v will press to vtools_vpatch.vpatch, but no further. see . [09:30]
shinohai: Will be happy to serve as extra set of eyes if you want to dig further mod6 [09:30]
asciilifeform: mod6: >> i got totally different result, using your : [09:53]
a111: Logged on 2018-04-09 05:04 mod6: 3) Check the flow, see that vtools_fixes_static_tohex.vpatch is not in the flow, and check to ensure that the seal verifies, and it dows [09:53]
asciilifeform: mod6: my old v99, however, gives eggog: [09:55]
asciilifeform: ( it does this for ben_vulpes's most recent key also. i still do not know why. ) [09:55]
phf: << you can see two lines going into vtools_fixes_static_tohex, one from vdiff_fixes_newline_gcc and another from vdiff_sha_fixes_newline_gcc. they are both from 98BA and either should satisfy the requirement. the other two lines in are from vtools_vpatch only for 7EBF and 02A0. [09:56]
a111: Logged on 2018-04-09 06:34 mircea_popescu: that's the fucking problem! the vtools_fixes_static_tohex uses xalloc.h 98BA when it should instead use its own line (earlier) version of C89B. [09:56]
phf: antecedent graph != requirement graph [09:59]
mod6: I have no fucking idea what is going on. alf - that's really weird. im using the following patches/seals, and I'm getting this: [10:10]
mod6: I don't have time to debug this shit now. but at some point I'll have to actually look at this project and try to figure out what the graph is ~supposed~ to look like and why my V chokes on it. [10:11]
mod6: Someone needs to write and maintain a proper V for the republic. [10:12]
mod6: It sucks up way to much of my time. [10:12]
asciilifeform: mod6: it probably does not help that one has to hand-click 22 times to download this set. possibly you missed one? [10:16]
mod6: I'm hoping that phf will look at my latest link and audit that for me. I've pulled everything from : [10:17]
mod6: I could have missed one, indeed. [10:17]
phf: mod6: all are there [10:18]
mod6: yeah, im not sure wtf. [10:18]
asciilifeform: hmm looks like it [10:18]
mod6: there is a reason that those two vpatches are being thrown out. [10:19]
mod6: i need to do a deep debugging session to figure out the root cause. [10:19]
mod6: no time now. [10:19]
mircea_popescu: omg i just pointed out the cause : he links the wrong version of xalloc [10:19]
phf: mircea_popescu: did you see my response [10:20]
mircea_popescu: ? [10:20]
a111: Logged on 2018-04-09 13:59 phf: antecedent graph != requirement graph [10:20]
phf: the one before that [10:20]
mod6: I suspect that is the problem with the rules. [10:21]
mircea_popescu: phf i looked at the patch itself. [10:21]
mod6: Before we said "all antecedents must be present for a descendant to be in the flow". [10:21]
mircea_popescu: lemme reload all this pile of stuff here, i closed it all last night. [10:21]
mod6: So made routines that do just that. There almost certainly is not a built in case where two antecedents have the same output hashes and can use a single in that csae. [10:22]
mod6: If you understand my meaning. I.e. I would need to add an exception to the rule for that. [10:22]
mod6: asciilifeform: out of curiosity, what version of my V are you using? [10:27]
mircea_popescu: well now i can't fucking reproduce it at all. [10:27]
BingoBoingo: <mircea_popescu> textile engineering !? << You know... Applied HAIR THEORY! [10:27]
mircea_popescu: phf what is the vdiff_sha_fixes_newline_gcc link to vtools_fixes_static_tohex ? as now apparently the two patches are entirely disjunct, did you update or something ? [10:28]
phf: mircea_popescu: that's one of the 98BA's [10:29]
phf: you can see here who produces it and who consumes it [10:30]
mircea_popescu: a right. hanbot do me a favour : download ~only~ those patches which are in the leftmost trunk seen on phf's viewer (so exclude vtools_vdiff_sha, and its dependents) and try to flow again ? [10:31]
mircea_popescu: mod6 i suspect we ran into a novel situation : if there's ambiguous file usage in multi-head bundles, v panics. [10:32]
mircea_popescu: (which is not even wrong, as the serial application of patches from different branches can result in a messed up codebase but it could be more verbose about what happened) [10:33]
mod6: yeah, totally. [10:34]
mod6: alf already instructed me a number of months ago to be more verbose about failures. I didn't get that done as much on the last release as I was trying to limit the scope to the last change for the press-paths. [10:35]
mod6: So indeed, better failure messages are needed. And if we're going to allow this type of strange project structures, that'll have to get built into the rules. [10:35]
mircea_popescu: it's not directly clear just ~how~ it could be more verbose here, seeing how it doesn't magically know all the "meanings" we associate to the patches themselves. [10:35]
hanbot: mircea_popescu: on it [10:36]
mod6: mircea_popescu: well, for instance, it would be nice if I'd have put a statement in the release version that yells when it throws a vpatch out for rule breakage. [10:36]
mircea_popescu: wouldn't have gained us anything here, it'd just have pointed to vtools_fixes_static_tohex, but we pretty much knew that one is where it dies anyway. [10:37]
mod6: in this case, it throws out: vdiff_sha_static.vpatch and vtools_fixes_static_tohex.vpatch [10:37]
mod6: yeah, this is true too. [10:37]
mod6: mircea_popescu: i can try the leftmost trunck on phf's viewer, but not right this minute. maybe in a few hours. i'm pinned down in the mud. gotta kill the guy in the pillbox first. [10:38]
mircea_popescu: no, what it should do is yell "alternate paths to press $vtools_fixes_static_tohex.vpatch requirement $x.alloc : $vtools+patch and $vdiff_sha_fixes_newline_gcc." [10:39]
asciilifeform: << apparently : 99995 [10:39]
a111: Logged on 2018-04-09 14:27 mod6: asciilifeform: out of curiosity, what version of my V are you using? [10:39]
mod6: asciilifeform: ahhhh interesting, thanks for reporting. [10:39]
hanbot: mircea_popescu flow thusly shows genesis only: [10:39]
mod6: mircea_popescu: solid plan. i can add something like that perhaps when alternate paths are detected. [10:40]
mircea_popescu: which is a useful warning, because in principle if $1 and $2 could both delivered wanted $file, but the author intended for $1 to be used, $2 might produce different $otherfile than author needed, and then you can't press because your hashes no longer match downstream" [10:40]
mircea_popescu: hanbot you're missing one. [10:40]
mircea_popescu: vdiff_fixes_newline_gcc [10:41]
hanbot: pff sorry. [10:41]
hanbot: right, correct patchset on the left then presses + flows to vtools_vpatch_newline [10:43]
mircea_popescu: aha! [10:44]
phf: fwiw there's no ambiguity in the patchset, the dependency graph _is constrained_. but you can't make that constraint rule based, you can e.g. discover that constraint by walking the graph while keeping the track of the checksums of the press (i suspect there's a smarter graph theoretical way of doing it, but a "press walk" is the easiest). [10:44]
phf: obviously that works because btcbase produces the correct dependency graph [10:44]
mircea_popescu: yeah. so on one hand indeed the problem was as suspected but on the other hand phf is correct and yes the graph IS constrained. [10:44]
mircea_popescu: phf i guess next on your plate is make a prototype proper grapher for all time ? then mod6 can put that in v and avoid further such wtfs. [10:45]
mircea_popescu: the easiest press walk may in principle become very VERY expensive on large enough projects (in terms of the bitcoin blockchain large, 6 digit patches with 1-3 digit files included each it'd be a true unassailable nightmare). but then again it also bakes in some incentive to NOT DO THAT. [10:54]
phf: i suppose that's one way to release btcbase source: slowly rewrite it all in ada [10:55]
mircea_popescu: know a better one ? [10:55]
mircea_popescu: need-driven rewrite, best engineering known to man. it's certainly how i produce trilema. [10:56]
asciilifeform: 'large enough projects' are bug [10:58]
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform i am in horrified awe of the recent realisation that [10:59]
a111: Logged on 2018-04-07 01:25 mircea_popescu: 6mb to get a fucking blog cms going. oh epic world of bits... [10:59]
mircea_popescu: 165 thousand lines! hundreds upon hundreds of files. IT DOES PRETTY MUCH NOTHING! [10:59]
asciilifeform: but not horrified at a half-MB 'diff', lol [10:59]
mircea_popescu: well the genesis is multi-mb isn't it. [10:59]
asciilifeform: aha [11:00]
mircea_popescu: that's what i mean. [11:00]
asciilifeform: ( speaking of entomological horror, today found in the glue trap : one of those chinese shannonized btc-flavoured liquishit items, but this time claiming to be a trilema article ! ) [11:01]
mircea_popescu: but the devil is in the details. consider how this flows : "so mp, do you want a gui ?" "uh ok" "should it have any buttons on it ?" "kinda what a gui is" "every button will have to be specified, as to location, as to..." "just get on with it" "6mb, will that be cash or check on other people's time ?" "motherfucker..." [11:01]
asciilifeform: 'where, sir, wouldja like this put !' [11:01]
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform there's lots of mfa using my name / stuff. apparently i'm a valuable google adwords item. [11:02]
mircea_popescu: anyway, this PARTICULAR item is a chinese forum that actually tracks us / includes (not terrible) translations of trilema pieces for commentary etc. [11:03]
mircea_popescu: (the great win being 注:爱比特.聂意译,翻译的不一定准确,也可能理解的完全相反,欢迎高手指教。~aka attention: my translation is not necessarily accurate, trilema may very well mean the exact opposite. such is the world of experts.) [11:07]
* asciilifeform not currently equipped to distinguish these from the usual shannonolade , sadly [11:12]
mircea_popescu: in other sads : "can install following OS for you: Centos 6 and 7 Debian, 6, 7 and 8 Ubuntu 14.04 and 16.04 Ubuntu Desktop Esxi 5.5 and 6.5 Windows 7 Pro and 10 Pro (trial versions) Windows Server 2008, 2012 and 2016 or we can provide your KVM or IPMI access and you can install your own custom OS like Gentoo e,t,c" [11:16]
mircea_popescu: soo trinque, can i hire you to install your blessed gentoo in there ? [11:16]
trinque: wont be the vtronic portage just yet, but yeah, I can install an entirely usable gentoo for ya. [11:19]
trinque: where's this? [11:19]
* mircea_popescu is commissioning a new server with a 1gbps unmetered port to act as a torrent client, because i've finally decided i wish to keep copies of all the films i review. [11:19]
mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes : is this a contract you folks want, incidentally ? [11:19]
douchebag: trinque: One of the girls is wondering when the transactions from last night will go through [11:20]
trinque: get to them both in a bit. doing some surgery. [11:24]
trinque: typically I run them in 24hrs or fewer. [11:25]
douchebag: That's what I told them, but you know how women are [11:25]
mircea_popescu: the good news for you mod6 being that you don't really have to do anything is fine as it is, for now, and once phf has a prototype walker you can just move on to that and it'll be cheaper. continue work on your ada guy in the meanwhile at your leisure, seems we're converging that way. [11:25]
mircea_popescu: douchebag he doesn't know how women are. [11:26]
mircea_popescu: he's from texas, they don't have them there. [11:26]
douchebag: He doesn't have any cousins? [11:26]
douchebag: Haha [11:26]
trinque: I was gonna say "make you pie, agreeable, what" [11:26]
trinque: dunno what to grasp foar here [11:26]
mircea_popescu: and in today's funny spanish lesson : pie, in spanish, means foot. this, of course, does not prevent the uppity coffee house i favour from being all international and offering pie de manzana. [11:27]
mircea_popescu: i've been eating lots and lots of apple feet. [11:27]
douchebag: Apple feet? Fuck yeah [11:28]
trinque: lol [11:28]
mircea_popescu: yup. with icecream between the toes [11:29]
mircea_popescu: "a la mode" [11:29]
trinque: girlfriend's pop is from east texas, where the coon-ass leaks over from louisiana. any time he cooks something tasty, it's "I put my foot in that!" [11:29]
trinque: guy makes good stuff, so I never questioned his technique [11:29]
douchebag: Your dad? [11:29]
douchebag: Lol, just fucking w/ you [11:30]
douchebag: Honestly, Texas seems like a pretty nice place to live [11:31]
mircea_popescu: incidentally, anyone looked into the guts of vmware's esx (now "esxi") see how exactly it does the hardware driving (ie which bsd it lifted from) ? [11:33]
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: their src iirc leaked in 2012 [11:33]
mircea_popescu: aha. [11:33]
asciilifeform: there's a number of variously-working clones nao, e.g. 'virtualbox' [11:34]
mircea_popescu: just thought it a pretty lulzy item. [11:34]
asciilifeform: and the only iron trickery in virtualizers is re: the amd64( and intel's clone ) vmization extensions [11:35]
asciilifeform: which are ~100% documented in amd's datashits [11:35]
asciilifeform: (y'know, the thing that swaps registers in and out, traps i/o for simulating disk/nic, etc) [11:36]
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform there was also that hellvig lawsuit (which afaik went exactly the same place all other "rule of law" challenges to notes-from-stalin ever went) [11:42]
mircea_popescu: speaking of yest's [11:42]
a111: Logged on 2018-04-06 20:58 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: it is not even clear to me that eben moglen (note, not rms) gpl experiment , i.e. 'use copyrasty against itself', worked for a short while ( to naked eye it would seem that it did, bsd routines got subsumed into microshit, gnu -- not , but there ~are~ alternative plausible explanations that don't involve 'fear of gpl violation' ) [11:42]
asciilifeform: what even was this, i missed it [11:42]
mircea_popescu: they lifted most of the linux kernel (the expensiuve parts, anyway. then [11:43]
asciilifeform: aa yea there's 9000 of these. all evaporated. [11:43]
mircea_popescu: no because germany is not a handpuppet. it has like, courts and shit. respek the sovereign cumrag! [11:44]
asciilifeform: ( various router makers, internet-of-shit vendors, etc. all piss on gpl, with impunity ) [11:44]
asciilifeform: lol [11:44]
asciilifeform: the ways these typically end : a) (most common) simply evaporates, no record of wtf happened to the case b) violator supposedly kowtows, 'complies' -- which 100% of the time in practice consists of putting up a tarball ~with the lifted orig turd~, none of the 'viral' provisions of gpl are given any attention at all , but hilariously the plaintiff ~eats this~ [11:46]
asciilifeform: and 'declares victory for gpl' naturally. [11:46]
asciilifeform: 'и волки сыты и овцы целы'(tm) [11:46]
mircea_popescu: the motivations are transparently unprincipled. i mean -- they published "support" at the bottom, which 100% consists of cheap linkbait by assholes a la "" and so forth. support my foot. [11:46]
asciilifeform: ( how does that even go in engl. ? ) [11:47]
mircea_popescu: it's all an exercise in paper-over, and their only incentive is to claim surface. [11:47]
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform i dunno, something about how "my delicious cake is in the fridge" [11:48]
asciilifeform: ( orig . 'the wolves are fed, but the sheep are whole' , i.e. all parties walk away content ) [11:50]
mircea_popescu: speaking of which, ckang do you have a account ? [11:50]
asciilifeform: example of typical 100%-certifiably-worthless gpl compliance -- google's 'chromebook' www [11:51]
asciilifeform: ^ and for that matter ~every 'we sell linux-based machine' vendor on the fucking planet [11:51]
ckang: I dont, never heard of it, looking now [11:51]
asciilifeform: 'here you can have a stock kernel tarball' 'here have a stock gcc' 'but can i rebuild the contents of $box?' '...' [11:51]
mircea_popescu: how about mastodon ? [11:51]
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform myeah. [11:52]
mircea_popescu: << i take this as a pretty reliable counter-signal. after all it's in fucking wired. [11:54]
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: at one point i wanted to run the client for 1 of these ( i forget which, maybe 'mastodon' ) and barfed : GB of ruby [11:56]
mircea_popescu: (this is whart you get if you permit chelsea barabas and other knitters into "tech" : inept articles about how "my ass is really really fat and the couch is really really comfortable".) [11:56]
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform so let him do it, what. [11:56]
asciilifeform: aa it wasn't a 'noo, dun do it!11', but a 'i tried, never got even helloworld' [11:57]
mircea_popescu: not a good fit for your strengths :D [11:57]
asciilifeform: these opensores folx seem to exist to make ye olde microshit look compact, bug-free, runnable [11:57]
asciilifeform: funnily enuff ~nobody alive knows how to actually build a ruby interpreter from src [11:58]
* asciilifeform spoke with several folx who make a living in it, they all 'wtf go download prebuilt vm' [11:58]
mircea_popescu: it's a means of expression, you udnerstand this ? emo mostly died because it was evidently pointless, to the poor misunderstood darlings themselves, "all this '''poetry''' that does nothing, not even rhyme." [11:58]
mircea_popescu: so they came up with the emo spew of the next decade : github contributions! [11:58]
mircea_popescu: it's just as nonsensical, pointless and useless. but it meets much better standards of self-expression as subjectively perceived. [11:59]
mircea_popescu: there's millions of eyes on it, don't you know ?! [11:59]
asciilifeform: nuffing new under the sun : obscurantist claptrap with 'arcane tech' flavouring was hip in 16th c ! consider the court alchemists. [11:59]
mircea_popescu: (fun fact : installing security cameras increases the chances of sex act occuring in the space like 30x) [11:59]
mircea_popescu: ("oh mp, that's racis, it just went unreported before" "your mother went unreported.") [12:00]
asciilifeform: 'Tick off Facebook and you may be unable to work, date, or listen to music.' << lolwaat [12:01]
mircea_popescu: the funny thing is the cocksuckers aren't even PAID for the fluff pieces. [12:01]
mircea_popescu: it's just what they do, born fluffers. [12:01]
mircea_popescu: phf ben_vulpes Framedragger any one of you want to add a gopher service to teh logotron ? [12:02]
phf: lulz [12:03]
mircea_popescu: lobbes ^ [12:03]
mircea_popescu: phf exactly! [12:03]
phf: fwiw i have it, i'll put mine online in the next day or two [12:03]
mircea_popescu: works. [12:03]
mircea_popescu: all these fucktards, you know. oh, "smashing success". dude, it's an off the cuff item gets done if it even needs any doing over a weekend. [12:04]
mircea_popescu: "technology we've been working at for five years" "because you're retarded, and your tooling sucks" [12:04]
phf: << man sometimes you just say stuff. [12:06]
a111: Logged on 2018-04-09 15:58 asciilifeform: funnily enuff ~nobody alive knows how to actually build a ruby interpreter from src [12:06]
mircea_popescu: i was waiting for that. [12:06]
asciilifeform: phf: i looked in my notes, this was mistake : story concerned actually 'rails', a library for same [12:06]
asciilifeform: rather than ruby per se [12:06]
* asciilifeform was waiting for somebody to 'i was waiting for that' [12:06]
mircea_popescu: orly! [12:07]
asciilifeform: '... But managing public keys is hard for most users ... The reality is that most people do not want to run their own web servers or social network nodes. They want to engage with the web through friendlier platforms' << sop prikokeism , snoar [12:13]
mircea_popescu: let's preserve here, because it's as fine example of the "euler quaternions" idiotic bullshit. [12:22]
a111: Logged on 2016-12-27 18:18 mircea_popescu: oh, hey, I KNEW this was gonna be in there. a) "I recommend using quaternion variables to represent two things: an object's rotation, and/or a rotation which you'd like to apply to some object." b) "You cannot represent rotations of greater than 180 degrees with Quaternions, and when doing a Slerp() or MoveTowards() rotation with Quaternions, the rotation always take the shortest path. So if you need to rotate more than 180 [12:22]
mircea_popescu: imo definitive explanation of why rubylang rots brain and you're better off learning perl before you start doing 5.days.ago.days.days.ago [12:24]
ben_vulpes: << sadly don't actually have the hardware or pipe for this atm [12:25]
mimisbrunnr: Logged on 2018-04-09 15:10 mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes : is this a contract you folks want, incidentally ? [12:25]
asciilifeform: as i understand this even is brainrot from 10y ago present-day rubyists do not even see the x.y.ago.ago.ago , but 'program' in 'libraries' written by same ( or perhaps even by a generation of 2 of 'programmers in libraries' ) [12:25]
mircea_popescu: yawell. [12:26]
mircea_popescu: you can't paper over brainrot. [12:26]
asciilifeform: quite the opposite, in fact [12:26]
mircea_popescu: if dentists were programmers they wouldn't have any need for drills, just cement over cavities and then cement over that. [12:26]
asciilifeform: ^ this is what american dentists do much of the time [12:27]
mircea_popescu: purple screen of tooth pain [12:27]
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform not just usian disease anymore. i had some work done recently, very pretty girl, quite competent (sadly, being a good dentist requires the steady hand only a properly developed brain can produce. retards can't ever be sharpshooters, dentists, surgeons etc because dubious genetics -> dubios fenotype -> too ungaitly assymetric to perform) [12:28]
mircea_popescu: anyway, and she wanted to put me under! and i was naw, go ahead. took some convincing, and by the time she was halfway through she was sweating profusely and had the shakes. "but doesn't it hurt ?!?!" [12:29]
mircea_popescu: "well... apparently it hurts you ? i've seen women go through gangbangs with less extrapyramidal effects" [12:29]
asciilifeform: my local drmengele is, believe or not, the opposite : 'you dun need it' -- proceeds to drill without painkiller. asciilifeform -- used it it by nao [12:29]
asciilifeform: *used to [12:29]
mircea_popescu: good. [12:30]
mircea_popescu: one day when you really need it -- it'll work for you. [12:30]
asciilifeform: was exactly asciilifeform's thought [12:30]
mircea_popescu: al schwartz's "believe it or not ketamine dun work" has a lot to do with "well... you've been to the dentist all these many years ?" [12:31]
mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes it's a low spec computer (mostly, two huge disks, otherwiuse modest) but anyway, something to grow into. [12:36]
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: if you want to include a mechanical hdd or 2 in the cargo, it is not too late [12:36]
asciilifeform: we dun have 1G/s yet, tho. [12:36]
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform bonus, whole thing costs me <.1 [12:37]
ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: do you have mechanicals in stock? needs procuring? [12:37]
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: i can procure, if you say which but gotta have concrete plan . [12:37]
ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: please to spec it out, yr the hardware guy. would this get attached to one of the rockchips? [12:39]
asciilifeform: btw folx, today is absolute last day for 'i want $custom-iron' [12:39]
mircea_popescu: holy shit they're expensive now. i just bought a 4tb toshiba for ~100 bux locally seems item is like 120 or so online ? [12:39]
phf: don't need fat pipe to torrent for backups, will just take long time. my torrent box is on a very thin line, and i just set the upload/download max clients seed ratio etc. appropriately [12:39]
mircea_popescu: phf suppose tomorrow you decide you want to see $item you read on trilema. should it take you a week ? [12:40]
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: 113bux on lolazon [12:40]
phf: mircea_popescu: it has been [12:40]
mircea_popescu: it blows my mind i got a discount for being in latinoland. [12:40]
mircea_popescu: phf so now it will be streaming speed. [12:40]
ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: and what machine to hook it to? [12:41]
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: this was a q for ben_vulpes , who has seen what's in the rack and knows if any empty holes [12:42]
phf: (but also this is a thin pipe for 2-9gb customary torrent sizes, i know mircea_popescu is partial to 750mb prints) [12:43]
lobbes: Added to my hopper >> [12:43]
a111: Logged on 2018-04-09 16:03 mircea_popescu: lobbes ^ [12:43]
mircea_popescu: phf do you genuinely see a problem with cd-size movies ? [12:43]
mircea_popescu: because i also intend to re-encode everything. [12:43]
mircea_popescu: lobbes you added gopher to your hopper ?! what did grace say ? [12:44]
lobbes: Lol [12:45]
ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: all of the machines in the rack are being used i was asking if one of the rockchips can handle this kind of duty. [12:46]
phf: mircea_popescu: well, sometimes quality does suck, when you do e.g. a wall projection. those 9gb prints are usually done by obsessive people. but main reason is that i'm pulling from slav sources, where 800mb version is slav audio track only. "original audio track" is a bonus on those "archival" prints [12:46]
mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes mechanical poor fit for rockchip. [12:46]
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: rockchip can drive a single usb3 disk, with appropriate cable. [12:46]
mircea_popescu: phf i can't fucking STAND dubs. [12:46]
mircea_popescu: kinda why i have 0 interest in teh ruworld torrents, nfi who told these folks it's ok to hire some tolomak to do say richard burton. wtf. [12:47]
ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: i don't think we have a machine that is even free for this purpose and so don't understand why we'd ship hdds down without a machine to put 'em in, although i could be being thick and not seeing something [12:48]
asciilifeform: btw i oughta say a word re how rockchiptron reproduces. i wrote a bit of script, ./ /dev/sd_whatever_cardreader_with_card_in_it -- produces copy of the boot card ./ /dev/large_enuff_disk copies the root partition contents onto a new part on said disk [12:48]
phf: well, i download the 9gb versions, and have a script that keeps only one specific audio track. the whole thing is a semi manual process though, since i have to select the right track by ear, etc. [12:48]
asciilifeform: and thus the box can breed copies of self [12:48]
phf: i don't at present recode them because space is cheap [12:49]
phf: but yeah dub world is funny. heated debates over whether translation by say borodinsky or kozlov are better [12:50]
mircea_popescu: curl | wc -l > 481 [12:51]
mircea_popescu: 481 * 9 = 4329, ie more than the hd i bought. not cheap. [12:51]
mircea_popescu: phf the notion that you'll have a local capable of the delivery of any arbitrary actor... really ? kozlov gonna sound like marylin ? slim ? etcetera ? [12:51]
mircea_popescu: scandal! [12:52]
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: traditional ru dub is either 1 voice, or ('classy!') 2, male/female [12:53]
asciilifeform: so, even worse. [12:53]
mircea_popescu: no, i know. terrible orcism. [12:54]
mircea_popescu: what, russkis can't read subtitles like sane fucking people ? [12:54]
asciilifeform: i suspect there's su-era nostalgia keeping the thing alive. sorta how in jp old farts are ~100% of whale meat market, because mcarthur fed it to'em back in the day [12:55]
asciilifeform: su underground film translators simply had no access to subbing gear [12:55]
mircea_popescu: i guess. it's not even that good! [12:55]
asciilifeform: aha, is the point [12:55]
mircea_popescu: phf what are you using btw ? i'm thinking deluge, apparently has a web interface can just get the girlies set up with. [12:56]
phf: aria2, i think it has a web interface even, but the whole thing is entirely automatic. cron to hoover up torrents from ~/Downloads, ssh them into a box folder, sleep based script picks it up on other end, feeds it to aria, when finished downloading writes it to an rss and also to a directory that's expose through apache [12:59]
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform incidentally, here's an idea : think sokoban, but extended so that 1. there's enemies, which can kill you, and 2. you can actually shoot projectiles at them. take advantage of diagonal/straight piercing/exploding and of course destroyable/nondestroyable movable/non movable environment. [12:59]
mircea_popescu: phf i intend to use the box as the center. [12:59]
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: 'supaplex', msdos [13:00]
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform nah, there's no firing. [13:00]
asciilifeform: hmm. [13:00]
mircea_popescu: but the bonus gravity is a good idea. [13:00]
mircea_popescu: this'd be like... the definitive platformer. [13:00]
asciilifeform: verily [13:01]
mircea_popescu: also, sokoban is an achieve-structure game supaplex more of a reach-x [13:01]
phf: deluge looks workable, but i've never used it. i used but not their web interface [13:01]
mircea_popescu: phf the spec here is "have a library of good films accessible to friends" rather than "i want to watch something between blowjobs" [13:01]
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform "move that crate to the left, but NOT YET or else that weird plant shoots you as it's exactly diagonal" [13:02]
mircea_popescu: PLUS you get for the first time now the best thing ever : your guy can a) learn (say, spells) and b) equip, items. because there's meaningful effects to have. [13:03]
mircea_popescu: ima fucking spec this. [13:04]
trinque: rtorrent's pretty good for "run as service" [13:09]
ben_vulpes: the transmission web interface is fine [13:11]
mircea_popescu: it turns on i'm not the first one to have done this then ?! [13:15]
deedbot: << Qntra - Jews Bomb Syrian Airbase [13:50]
phf: << actually i'm not experiencing the same in the dc area, i wonder if tmobile has some sort of 3g wind down thing going [14:46]
a111: Logged on 2018-03-26 07:31 phf: << i've discovered similar, my 3g phone barely has signal and doesn't last more than a day in san francisco. presumably because the number of 3g supporting towers is significantly lower here [14:46]
phf: s/not experiencing/now experiencing/ [14:46]
asciilifeform: phf: supposedly tmobile keeping 2g alive for another 2y [14:46]
asciilifeform: ( afaik no plans to abolish 3g ) [14:47]
phf: i wonder if it's the phone itself though, but i fail to see how the reception quality would degrade :o [14:47]
asciilifeform: in city, your connection depends ~100% on the particular tower you're standing ~next to [14:48]
mircea_popescu: maybe it's all those republican fake towers. [15:12]
asciilifeform: opposite, those make for great reception where there ought have been none [15:17]
mircea_popescu: right. [15:29]
deedbot: << Trilema - Boboban [15:52]
mircea_popescu: ^ anyone wanna work on that ? [15:56]
mircea_popescu: anyway, re earlier discussion : i find it fucking hilarious that the webtards are actually trying to rebuild bulletin boards. "great improvement over php, ruby!". douchebags, php only exists because of your shit-headed "web" hallucination! [16:15]
douchebag: php sucks [16:17]
douchebag: trust me [16:17]
mircea_popescu: it only exists because a group of idiots that had no business touching computers nevertheless got some, and their only "idea" was "hey... we should try and control how people display data on their own machines" [16:17]
mircea_popescu: and i include greenspun in the idiots pile. along with the rest of the "luminaries". [16:17]
douchebag: well, it's always fun pwning that group of idiots [16:18]
douchebag: amirite? [16:18]
mircea_popescu: in the sense that spending your life going through battlefields looking for sellable scrap metal is fun. africa's fulla this fun. [16:18]
mircea_popescu: << this tard just spent 5k words to dance about "solutions" to a problem he imagines, and somehow magically never landing on "pop up a server and put mp-wp on it it'll do pingbacks and that's that." [16:21]
mircea_popescu: the "problem" of "social media" isn't that people lack the place, methods and mechanisms whereby to communicate their interesting, valuable etcetera verbiage. [16:21]
mircea_popescu: the problem is that people have absolutely nothing to say to anyone. [16:21]
asciilifeform: '...a re-implementation of the GNU Social codebase, which itself is ... an implementation of the OStatus protocol, originally forking from the GNU FM project and later merging with the StatusNet and FreeSocial projects, from the same people behind, which was later folded into, which uses the ActivityStreams spec along with protocols like PubSubHubBub, Salmon, WebFinger, and Atom syndication to deliver a federated, o [16:22]
asciilifeform: pen-source Twitter-like experience for the masses' << ahahahawaat [16:22]
mircea_popescu: and it's exactly the reason "sex trafficking" is a problem, also. >99% of females have entirely no value whatsoever, as pigs are cheaper to butcher. of those, 14% or so have some resale value as fucktoys, generally in the bitcent to 0.1 btc range. [16:22]
mircea_popescu: it's not a fucking problem outside of "holy shit i'm old and i can't deal with reality". [16:23]
douchebag: lmfao [16:23]
douchebag: I know some people who pwned gnu social awhile back with an XSS worm [16:23]
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform what REALLY happened was that rms got in everyone's way with his usual "i'm dumb and slow" routine, so they took a decade to route around him [16:24]
mircea_popescu: 100% hurd-linux thing. [16:24]
douchebag: lol [16:24]
asciilifeform: douchebag: and i know some people who pwned ants with magnifying glass. incl. myself. i was 4 y.o., wat. [16:24]
douchebag: I'm not saying it was impressive what they did, but it was rather comical [16:25]
mircea_popescu: im sure it was. [16:26]
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform there's also an endless supply of the "totally not the same thing as this" "platforms", medium, that shitty thing with "i made $0.05 with this post" reddit tip bot extension and so on. [16:27]
mircea_popescu: and they're all there because a bunch of business school majors truly imagine they can compete for gatekeeping and "content will come" [16:27]
asciilifeform: they cost ~0 to birth. like shitcoins. [16:27]
mircea_popescu: what fucking content, hackernoon is pompously "where hackers give a shit" except omitting to discuss how slashdot sold to spammers for exactly the sex traffic value above, and slashdot ACTUALLY WAS a place hackers gave a shiot about, unlike hackernews, say, idle pretense aside. [16:28]
mircea_popescu: their top stories being... "i grepped reddit for a string", "here is some shannonized nonsense about a topic too large for enric durany to touch", "how a kid from sf started a school in india" and ON AND ON. [16:29]
mircea_popescu: why exactly is this needed, vice couldn't handle the volume of all the useless crap fat ugly whores spewed out for $5 a title ? [16:29]
mircea_popescu: << this isn't content. [16:30]
a111: Logged on 2018-03-31 16:58 mircea_popescu: "Four years ago this month, I found out that Jane Pratt — the editor that had made me want to be an editor since I was 12 years old — had chosen me to be the beauty director of her new xoJane beauty spinoff, xoVain. OK, so I was actually her second choice — her first had fallen through — but that was OK. I had previously not even pitched to xoJane because I was so intimidated and sure I'd be rejected, so getting hired [16:30]
mircea_popescu: i mean, if i bother to pick it up and mock it it maybe becomes content, on a slow day. but there's one of me and at last count >50mn of the idiots. [16:30]
mircea_popescu: and no, "anything is content for someone" dun fucking hold. this is the direct equivalent of the "dating site" fallacy, whereby "eveyone has a special someone matching them put on this earth by our infantile protestant notion of god" becomes a "scientific blabla" (ie, ). bullshit. most people are broken, and the idea that they'll be "harmoniously broken togeth [16:35]
mircea_popescu: er" is exactly like having two broken cars on your front lawn. gimme the porsche and let me be, wtf. [16:35]
asciilifeform: !!up cassidy3 [17:34]
deedbot: cassidy3 voiced for 30 minutes. [17:34]
cassidy3: hello p [17:34]
cassidy3: I am looking for mircea_popescu [17:34]
cassidy3: I am here per reference by douchebag [17:35]
asciilifeform: cassidy3: this is in fact where mircea_popescu lives. you might have to wait a few hrs for him to wake up, however. meanwhile there is a log, , and you can read it or even speak 'into' it, he will read later at his leisure. [17:35]
cassidy3: :) [17:36]
mircea_popescu: ello. [17:36]
cassidy3: The infamous! [17:36]
cassidy3: I was told about a # game here, if that makes sense? [17:37]
mircea_popescu: cassidy3 a86941f3 [17:37]
cassidy3: Thx darling, give me a minute. [17:37]
hanbot: and in today's leet media outlets,'s phone # goes to voicemail (via googlevoice! state your name and it'll "try to connect you"!) to Emily Zeller, Certified Massage Therapist. [17:50]
asciilifeform: to what does a 'We create content that ranks and helps you rank' 'SEO ROI' spamatronics specialist's phone ~usually~ go ? [17:51]
mircea_popescu: lol [17:51]
mircea_popescu: i thought the web was an industry. [17:52]
mircea_popescu: you telling me it's just a squeaky toy for the pets of masseusses to pass the time with ?! [17:52]
* jurov miserad Certified Message Therapist, thought oddly fitting [17:53]
hanbot: dunno til you try, eh? lol message therapist [17:53]
mircea_popescu: actually a certificate massagist might be useful... [17:53]
hanbot: sshiatsu? [17:54]
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform by the way, saw an add somewhere which went like "hello, this is massage therapist. no seriously, not sex whatsoever. this is medical. please don't wink wink nudge nudge." [17:54]
mircea_popescu: somehow the longer the plaintive wail of the "went to college! independent professional woman!" went, the pornier it sounded. [17:55]
BingoBoingo: The big brainfuck in this country is that "Thai Massage" is how they refer to the thing without the happy ending [17:59]
BingoBoingo: Whereas the hooker massages are just massages [18:01]
cassidy3: [18:02]
douchebag: !!up cassidy3 [18:05]
deedbot: cassidy3 voiced for 30 minutes. [18:05]
douchebag: !!up ckang [18:11]
deedbot: ckang voiced for 30 minutes. [18:11]
douchebag: !!up ckanggirl [18:11]
deedbot: ckanggirl voiced for 30 minutes. [18:11]
ckanggirl: hi [18:12]
ckang: Hey trish [18:15]
douchebag: mircea_popescu: you around? [18:15]
ckang: just give him a bit, he was just here [18:15]
ckang: cassidy3: wow o.o [18:15]
deedbot: << Qntra - Viktor Orbn Wins Supermajority In Hungarian Parliament: Pantsuit Whines [18:16]
mod6: << ok cool. sounds good. the ada part here is to phf right? or do you mean my not-yet-fully-baked ada vtron? [18:17]
mimisbrunnr: Logged on 2018-04-09 15:16 mircea_popescu: the good news for you mod6 being that you don't really have to do anything is fine as it is, for now, and once phf has a prototype walker you can just move on to that and it'll be cheaper. continue work on your ada guy in the meanwhile at your leisure, seems we're converging that way. [18:17]
mircea_popescu: douchebag aha [18:30]
mircea_popescu: !!pay cassidy3 0.02 [18:31]
deedbot: Get your OTP: [18:31]
mircea_popescu: what's what tattoo anyway ? [18:31]
mircea_popescu: mod6 i meant your not-yet-baked. it's getting baked eventually neh ? [18:32]
ckanggirl: hi mircea_popescu [18:32]
mircea_popescu: hello ckanggirl. [18:33]
ckanggirl: tits4bits? [18:33]
mircea_popescu: aite. [18:33]
ckanggirl: [Xi] [18:33]
mircea_popescu: c91fb263 [18:33]
mod6: mircea_popescu: yeah, would like to do that one. main reason i stuffed it in a drawer for the time being was that I was getting some really crumby performance with the manual string handling I was doing. [18:34]
mircea_popescu: ckang do you know how to self-voice ? [18:34]
mod6: I suspect, that there are others in the Republic now that could help me overcome that a bit whether, phf, asciilifeform, or diana_coman. [18:35]
douchebag: i explained how earlier [18:35]
douchebag: !!up cassidy3 [18:35]
deedbot: cassidy3 voiced for 30 minutes. [18:35]
mircea_popescu: mod6 well, which way do you want to go ? i assumed that was kinda your plan, bake ada vtron, meanwhile maintain perl one functional but not really ugprade or anything. or ? [18:35]
cassidy3: mircea_popescu: Its just a broken heart, kind of a sad story [18:35]
mircea_popescu: you wanna share ? [18:35]
mod6: I've been digging in here for about 15 minutes, and I've found the spot where we eject out those two vpatches. And the reason is that I do a kinda shitty check. Where I just compare that the number of node edges is equal to the number of expected. [18:35]
cassidy3: Lost my first fiance at 19 [18:36]
mircea_popescu: poker ? [18:36]
cassidy3: Had been dating since 6th grade [18:36]
mircea_popescu: mod6 aha. [18:36]
mod6: And in the case here, we have 1 more for each vpatch, where the extra one matches one already in the set. If I were to check each one to the other, then I think it'd be better, and avoid this problem. So I'm kinda working on a solution now. [18:36]
mircea_popescu: is the story in the log even ? [18:36]
cassidy3: I do regret all the tats now, but I went though a period and went a bit nuts [18:37]
mircea_popescu: cassidy3 so what do you do, besides tits and poetry ? [18:37]
mod6: I shouldn't call it a 'set', it's a simple array. but, anyway, yeah. [18:37]
cassidy3: Gogo dance (not nude) and bartend currently. [18:37]
mircea_popescu: why not nude ? [18:38]
cassidy3: Its a licensing issue, nudity + alcohol is harder for owner to get permission for. [18:38]
mircea_popescu: ah. yeah. [18:38]
mircea_popescu: << "One day a student came to Moon and said: "I understand how to make a better garbage collector. We must keep a reference count of the pointers to each cons." Moon patiently told the student the following story: "One day a student came to Moon and said: ‘I understand how to make a better garbage collector..." [18:39]
a111: Logged on 2018-04-09 22:36 mircea_popescu: SIMPLE REFERENCE COUNT GARBAGE COLLECTOR!!! [18:39]
cassidy3: Also much different style of dance, I am a raver [18:40]
cassidy3: When it comes to moving sexy and coordinated, I was not blessed :( [18:40]
mircea_popescu: lol [18:41]
mod6: mircea_popescu: hahah. [18:41]
mod6: fair enough. [18:41]
mircea_popescu: !!up ckanggirl [18:42]
deedbot: ckanggirl voiced for 30 minutes. [18:42]
ben_vulpes: heavy drug use will fry your cns, kids. be careful out there. [18:42]
mircea_popescu: do ravers still do drugs anymore ? [18:42]
ben_vulpes: are there drugs for sale at raves anymore? [18:42]
mircea_popescu: eh, even in the 90s most girlies couldn't afford to BUY their acid, wut is this, the future ? [18:43]
cassidy3: Yes, still fairly common [18:43]
ben_vulpes: i'm particularly fond of the scawwy stowies about how the funsies will just sit in your spinal fluid forever [18:43]
cassidy3: Even getting safer now with on site testing [18:43]
cassidy3: Although thats a touchy subject many places. [18:43]
mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes the who ? [18:43]
ben_vulpes: who tests the testers [18:43]
cassidy3: Science I suppose :) [18:44]
ben_vulpes: mircea_popescu: scary stories for spooking noobs [18:44]
mircea_popescu: cassidy3 does burning man count as a rave iyo ? [18:44]
cassidy3: Places could be considered that yeah, but I would equate it more to a festival with art installations. [18:45]
mircea_popescu: o, yeah, do you know any good drawers ? [18:46]
cassidy3: Its fun, but by the end you are ready to get far away and into a shower. [18:46]
cassidy3: tattoo artist? [18:46]
mircea_popescu: no, no, [18:47]
a111: Logged on 2018-03-29 05:42 mircea_popescu: i'm toying with the idea of sponsoring a comic. you ever seen oglaf ? [18:47]
cassidy3: Oh hmm, I know a few people that do tattoo work but I am not sure how that translates, linework is similar maybe [18:48]
mircea_popescu: possibly similar dunno. [18:49]
cassidy3: What did you have in mind? My best GF does sketches all the time for tattoos I can see what she comes up with. [18:49]
mircea_popescu: well, have her drop by [18:50]
cassidy3: Certainly, she may be interested in the picture stuff as well, I am going to dinner tonight with her I will see if shes interested [Xii] [18:51]
ckanggirl: h mircea_popescu [18:52]
ckanggirl: [18:52]
mircea_popescu: hey there. [18:52]
ckanggirl: hi [18:52]
mircea_popescu: are you ckang 's girl btw ? [18:53]
mircea_popescu: !!pay ckang 0.02 [18:53]
deedbot: Get your OTP: [18:53]
ckanggirl: yes, we are discord friends [18:53]
mircea_popescu: what's that ? [18:53]
ckanggirl: discord is similar to this irccloud [18:54]
mircea_popescu: well... when are you coming to costa rica ? [18:54]
ckanggirl: but with more stuff, like pictures and audio [18:54]
ckanggirl: when are you inviting me? :) [18:54]
mircea_popescu: umm... say next week ? [18:55]
ckanggirl: lol move fast, unfortunately I let my passport lapse, would need to get it renewed. [18:55]
mircea_popescu: so get it renewed. you never know when you need it. [18:56]
ckanggirl: but def. something i would consider [18:56]
ckanggirl: could I bring a another girl friend? [18:56]
mircea_popescu: haha. well, depends who, neh ? [18:56]
ckanggirl: traveling alone makes me very anxious [18:56]
mircea_popescu: you ever lived in a bdsm environment before ? [18:57]
ckanggirl: lived in no lol, but ive seen some shows on bsdm relationships [18:57]
ckanggirl: never had a boy willing to do that sort of stuff [18:57]
mircea_popescu: ikr! [18:58]
ckanggirl: not that im opposed, its just never come up [18:58]
mircea_popescu: contrary to unexamined belief, male doms are rare enough. [18:58]
ckanggirl: yea lol, all the shows the men have wanted to be the submissive it seems [18:59]
ckanggirl: reverse roles compared to 'real world' i suppose [18:59]
mircea_popescu: so what do you do, other than going to bdsm shows ? [18:59]
ckanggirl: haha, tv shows lol [18:59]
mircea_popescu: o fuck me! i accidentally paid... ckang. nuts. [19:00]
ckanggirl: but I work with my mother's law firm [19:00]
mircea_popescu: !!pay ckanggirl 0.02 [19:00]
deedbot: Get your OTP: [19:00]
ckanggirl: im working on a paralegal [19:00]
mircea_popescu: that's a pretty sweet setup huh. [19:00]
ckanggirl: i am sorta OCD about paperwork and organization [19:01]
mircea_popescu: aren't you worried mom reads trilema ? [19:01]
ckanggirl: so its an outlet [19:01]
mircea_popescu: !!rate ckanggirl 1 paralegal [19:01]
deedbot: Get your OTP: [19:01]
ckanggirl: i would be more embarrassed if she knew what this irccloud was tbh [19:01]
ckanggirl: this is the first time ive ever heard of it [19:02]
mircea_popescu: lol. [19:02]
ckanggirl: what do you do mr mircea_popescu ? [19:02]
mircea_popescu: anyway, i rated you, so now you can voice yourself say !!up to deedbot in a pm. [19:02]
mircea_popescu: and stick around, this collection of drunks gets in legal trouble ALLLL the time. [19:02]
ckanggirl: besides collect boobs p [19:02]
mircea_popescu: ckanggirl i'm a bitcoin billionaire / vap. [19:03]
ckanggirl: oh wow, ive heard about some very eclectic types like that, i must say im envious they can pursue what they enjoy [19:03]
mircea_popescu: ckanggirl here : buncha moar travelpics in that category. [19:04]
ckanggirl: but as they say, hindsight is always 20/20 [19:04]
mircea_popescu: yo ckang , voice yourself baby. [19:04]
ckanggirl: wish i had 20/20 foresight haha [19:04]
mircea_popescu: ckanggirl i find your fore...sight perfectly acceptable. [19:05]
ckanggirl: he stepped out for a bit to get some dinner i think [19:05]
mircea_popescu: !!up cassidy3 [19:05]
deedbot: cassidy3 voiced for 30 minutes. [19:05]
mircea_popescu: ckang what's ecclectic mean, anyway ? [19:06]
ckanggirl: omg, i love the turtles! [19:06]
ckanggirl: so cute [19:06]
mircea_popescu: very! [19:06]
ckanggirl: eclectic as in, taste that doesnt necessarily fall in line with the rest of society [19:07]
mircea_popescu: i thought that was simply having any taste whatsoever. [19:07]
ckanggirl: subjective ) [19:07]
mircea_popescu: anyway, eclectic is an english calc of the greek word for "choosing". it's a selection of the best of everything. [19:08]
ckanggirl: is that you at the top of the page? love beards [19:08]
mircea_popescu: yeah, that's me. changes every day though. [19:09]
ckanggirl: most boys ive gone out with, couldn't get close to being able to grow such a thing [19:09]
mircea_popescu: somehow i've been blessed with an epic beard. [19:10]
mircea_popescu: must be teh wisdom. [19:10]
ckanggirl: one tried and it just looked like his face was constantly dirty lol, i made him shave it [19:10]
mircea_popescu: yeah, not a good look, the boyish beard. [19:11]
ckanggirl: i cant stop looking at the little turtles [19:11]
ckanggirl: adorable [19:11]
mircea_popescu: you know i actually had them in my hands! they're the cutest thing, sorta lift head to see where water is, then lower it again and push push push. evidently hard work. [19:12]
mircea_popescu: anyway, it's one of those few things where nothing beats being there. [19:12]
mircea_popescu: ckanggirl try it now, say !!up to deedbot [19:12]
mircea_popescu: hey check you out! [19:14]
mircea_popescu: are you like smart or something ? [19:14]
ckanggirl: had to ask douchebag for help p [19:14]
ckanggirl: I wouldnt have figured that out [19:14]
mircea_popescu: amusingly, a guy named douchebag is like, one of the most noob-helping guys around! misleading name! [19:15]
ckanggirl: yea douchebag is around some of the same places, seems like a good guy [19:15]
douchebag: haha [19:15]
ckanggirl: with as big as the internet is, funny how we run across the same people so much [19:16]
mircea_popescu: it's not really that big. [19:16]
douchebag: ^ [19:16]
ckanggirl: i suppose areas of interest kind of dictate the little 'cliques' [19:17]
mircea_popescu: i thought he was only interested in breaking shit up. and i guess nowadays a newfound interest in tits. [19:18]
ckanggirl: ive never heard of such a thing [19:18]
mircea_popescu: which ? [19:18]
ckanggirl: bitcoin billionaires, paying for #s written on boobs lol [19:19]
mircea_popescu: years ago some guy made 10 bitcoin for shoving a sharpie up his butt [19:19]
ckanggirl: i wouldnt have believed it until douchebag vouched [19:19]
ckanggirl: lol, ive had guys do that free hah [19:19]
ckanggirl: silly boys [19:19]
douchebag: like I always said, "big ass titties" [19:20]
mircea_popescu: it was all an elaborate in-joke, there was this pantsuit collective (something awful) calling it "buttcoin" [19:20]
mircea_popescu: so... well... [19:20]
ckanggirl: i bet that 'yhbt' felt good in the end [19:20]
mircea_popescu: depends for whom lol. [19:21]
mircea_popescu: afaik they're still butthurt over the whole thing. [19:21]
ckanggirl: he may have enjoyed it a little too [19:21]
mircea_popescu: i'm sure. [19:21]
douchebag: must have been an awfully big sharpie if they're still butthurt [19:21]
ckanggirl: i remember the whole butt sharpie phase [19:22]
ckanggirl: now i guess kids are back to snorting condoms [19:22]
mircea_popescu: [19:22]
ckanggirl: full circle, as they say [19:22]
mircea_popescu: jesus christ, it's been five years already. [19:22]
ckanggirl: did they ever figure out the tide pod thing? [19:25]
ckanggirl: i still dont understand how that started [19:25]
mircea_popescu: i dunno honestly, i've not been keeping that close a track. [19:25]
ckanggirl: yea it just fell out of the news one day, not heard about it since [19:25]
mircea_popescu: !#s jenkem [19:28]
a111: 9 results for "jenkem", [19:28]
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: see also^ uncleal's AFRICA2.AMS [19:29]
mod6: Well, I've implemented a better check there in the 'ante_check' subroutine. And I was gonna mess with it a bit more, but when I went to press the shorter of the two paths (visible at ), I ran into a press problem. [19:29]
mircea_popescu: aha. [19:29]
mod6: Then I went ahead and tried to manually patch these files together, first 'vtools_genesis.vpatch', then 'vtools_vdiff_sha.vpatch', then 'vdiff_sha_fixes_newline_gcc', and this is what I'm seeing: [19:30]
mod6: Then I went ahead and tried to manually patch these files together, first 'vtools_genesis.vpatch', then 'vtools_vdiff_sha.vpatch', then 'vdiff_sha_fixes_newline_gcc', and this is what I'm seeing: [19:30]
mod6: oops [19:30]
mircea_popescu: lol you seeing oops ? [19:30]
mod6: [19:30]
mod6: heheh, sorry for the double post. This tho ^ [19:30]
mircea_popescu: not directly evident why this is problematic ? [19:31]
mircea_popescu: ah manifest fails [19:31]
mod6: no! not even using vtronics at all. just a good ole fashion by hand patch application. [19:31]
mod6: i believe that I am patching in the correct order. not only validated by the link to above, but also the same press path is given from my v. [19:32]
mod6: phf: what am I missing here? [19:32]
mod6: anyway, my apologies for the interruption. please continue. [19:33]
mircea_popescu: lmao. [19:33]
* mircea_popescu is slightly disappointed nobody asked what "vap" stands for. [19:33]
ben_vulpes: what, and interrupt teh fun and games? [19:34]
douchebag: what does vap stand for [19:35]
douchebag: i was actually wondering [19:35]
douchebag: but didn't want to interrupt [19:35]
mircea_popescu: very annoying person. DUH [19:36]
douchebag: lol [19:36]
ckanggirl: mircea_popescu: i have to run out for a bit, thanks for the chat and ill see whats involved in getting my passport renewed if you are serious :O [20:03]
ckanggirl: bye yall! [20:05]
phf: << you can't press vdiff_fixes_newline_gcc on top of vtools_vdiff_sha, because there's a bunch of patches in between. manifest is getting rejected, because manifest specifically enforces order. if you try pressing them in order, i.e. the left column from genesis it will work [20:06]
a111: Logged on 2018-04-09 23:30 mod6: [20:06]
phf: e.g. [20:23]
* asciilifeform confesses to not yet grasping the mechanics of this [20:24]
asciilifeform: how was phf's v9995-choking patch set , created ? [20:25]
phf: by diffing two folders together, there's no magic there [20:25]
asciilifeform: then why does mod6's vtron barf [20:25]
phf: is that a rhetorical question? [20:28]
asciilifeform: nope [20:29]
asciilifeform: trying to eat that log presently [20:29]
mod6: woah. wait. [20:50]
douchebag: wot [20:51]
mod6: phf: so the graph at is incorrect then? [20:51]
mod6: i've put in a little fix for my 'check_ante' subroutine, but by what you're saying, this isn't correct then either (for press-path): [20:54]
mod6: [20:54]
mod6: ok here's the graph I generated: [21:02]
mod6: this is a megapuzzler. [21:07]
phf: mod6: the graph is correct. you have a patch chain A B C D E, you're trying to apply A B E. E is going to fail because you didn't apply C D [21:10]
mod6: what i'm trying to get at is, if I follow the patch order in here (the first pp command), it is incorrect, for some reason: [21:11]
mod6: if I press either path, i blow up on the manifest. [21:12]
* mod6 scratches head [21:15]
spyked: mircea_popescu, crap, apologies for the mess on trilema, I have no idea why it gets cut off. I'll try to repost the comment tomorrow [21:18]
phf: mod6: the graph on btcbase vtools is the only way it can possibly press. either the left branch or the right branch. changing the order, or introducing the patches from left into right, or right into left is going to break manifest. [21:21]
mod6: phf: i patched by hand in the order shown on the right path of your graph: [21:23]
phf: mod6: are you trying to press the left hand or the right hand? [21:24]
mod6: right hand [21:24]
mod6: vtools_genesis.vpatch -> vtools_vdiff_sha.vpatch -> vdiff_fixes_newline_gcc.vpatch [21:25]
phf: then instead of vdiff_fixes_newline_gcc you should be applying vdiff_sha_fixes_newline_gcc [21:25]
mod6: err crap [21:26]
mod6: ok the damn file names are so similar im getting confused. [21:26]
mod6: ok, so in that case: vtools_genesis.vpatch -> vtools_vdiff_sha.vpatch -> vdiff_sha_fixes_newline_gcc [21:26]
mod6: lemme do that quick. [21:26]
mod6: << ok that works. but my vtron chokes on this patch set -- mis-orders the press path, for some reason I still don't understand yet. [21:31]
mircea_popescu: spyked prolly it included < [21:31]
ckang: *waves* [21:34]
ckang: I saw trisha came though earlier, did you send me something by mistake or gift? mircea_popescu [21:35]
mircea_popescu: o hey there. how's the whole mastodon / whatnot thing coming along ? [21:35]
ckang: hmm you may be thinking of something else, not familar with mastodon [21:35]
ckang: yet anyways [21:36]
mircea_popescu: < [21:36]
a111: Logged on 2018-04-09 15:51 ckang: I dont, never heard of it, looking now [21:36]
ckang: I may have another girl if you are still accepting submissions [21:36]
ckang: ohh the api, yea I couldnt quite figure out what it does outright [21:37]
mircea_popescu: anyway, to answer your question : i wanted to ask you to make a "federated social media" server to pump out the #trilema log anyway. if you're making it you can consider the 2 bitcents an advance. [21:37]
ckang: ah yea the, didnt know it by the other name [21:37]
mircea_popescu: and sure, more girls welcome. [21:37]
mircea_popescu: douchebag i thought this guy's more low level networking than you are! [21:38]
ckang: shes on a phone give me a minute to get her connected [21:38]
ckang: !!up sarah443 [21:43]
deedbot: sarah443 voiced for 30 minutes. [21:43]
ckang: hey doll [21:43]
sarah443: hi [21:43]
ckang: mircea_popescu is the man you need to talk to [21:43]
ckang: you can go ahead and register ill pm you the instructions [21:44]
sarah443: OK [21:44]
mircea_popescu: << this is actually a respectable protest. this would be a fine place for name space sorting, call the damn thing sha_y and keccak_x or somethign, rather than mix-and-mishmash. [21:47]
a111: Logged on 2018-04-10 01:26 mod6: ok the damn file names are so similar im getting confused. [21:47]
mircea_popescu: most significant word first. [21:47]
mircea_popescu: << is trisha the lawyer spawn chick then ? [21:48]
a111: Logged on 2018-04-10 01:35 ckang: I saw trisha came though earlier, did you send me something by mistake or gift? mircea_popescu [21:48]
sarah443: OK im registered, do I need to do something to get the #? [21:49]
ckang: mircea_popescu: ah thought that was the case, has it been voided or do I need to do anything on my end? [21:51]
mircea_popescu: sarah443 you here to show us your tits then ? [21:51]
mircea_popescu: ckang has what been voided ? [21:52]
sarah443: Yes sir ! [21:52]
mircea_popescu: sarah443 87a1f8ad [21:52]
mod6: phf: ahh, ok now im looking at your graph, my graph, and my press path. your right path does ~NOT~ contain 'vdiff_fixes_newline_gcc.vpatch'. My press path does. [21:52]
sarah443: [Xiii] [21:52]
mod6: I believe what might be happening here is that my traversal follows all edges, where as yours does something different perhaps [21:53]
mircea_popescu: phf any chance logotron might replace unicode barf with the "unicode name" ? [21:53]
mod6: my vtron pulls in 'vdiff_fixes_newline_gcc.vpatch' because it is an antecedent of 'vdiff_sha_static.vpatch' : [21:54]
mircea_popescu: mod6 i thought you didn't want to fuck with this anymore, in which case could just wait for him to finish and publish his grapher. or is it fun ? [21:54]
mod6: lol, well i don't wanna have to fuck with it. and it's not exactly fun. but i really can't stop either. [21:55]
mod6: i think i have dane bramage. [21:55]
mircea_popescu: eh, relax, for all practical purposes we have this in hand, hanbot managed to press her press. it's not an emergency. [21:55]
mod6: alright, i have a drive to get to the bottom of things. will back off. [21:56]
mircea_popescu: it's nice and good, if it's pleasurable, or needful. but if it's neither don't drive yourself batty out of sheer masochism. [21:56]
mod6: no worries. thanks Mr. P. [21:56]
phf: mircea_popescu: i believe the only way to identify unicode barf is by maintaining or downloading explicit lists. we have legitimate unicode barf, so blanket replacement isn't going to work [21:57]
mircea_popescu: darn. [21:58]
mircea_popescu: look at this shit, they have "skin tones" futa-i dumniezo sa-i futa. [21:58]
phf: [21:59]
phf: "woman judge: medium-dark skin tone" [21:59]
phf: [Xiv][Xv]‍⚖️ [22:00]
mircea_popescu: is this a lizard re female mediocrity ? [22:00]
phf: all kinds of stuff in there [22:01]
mircea_popescu: this thing is so fucking stupid... [22:02]
phf: merperson: dark skin tone, man fairy: light skin tone [22:02]
mircea_popescu: phf could we maintain explicit lists of permitted unicrap, such as arabic and chinese ? and rape the rest ? [22:02]
mircea_popescu: half my googling today has been "wtf did she just say to me ?" [22:03]
phf: i think i'm going to add a replacement engine instead, where various words get replaced with emoji [22:04]
phf: modern btcbase [22:05]
mircea_popescu: is phf gonna be "black-and-blue corpse" ? [22:05]
phf: "right-facing fist: medium-dark skin tone" [22:06]
mircea_popescu: face-facing fist more like it. [22:06]
mircea_popescu: who the fuck told these idiots fists have faces anyway. [22:06]
mircea_popescu: where the fuck is the "queer" modifier anyway. you can say "nigger washingmachine judge" but you can't say "faggot judge" ? what's this, fellow traveller disenfranchisement ? [22:08]
phf: jeez i don't even know how to work with this soup in sbcl, that woman judge entry translates to, i shit you not, the following sequence of sbcl character names: ("WOMAN" "U1F3FE" "ZERO_WIDTH_JOINER" "SCALES" "VARIATION_SELECTOR-16") [22:08]
mircea_popescu: uifefe, plain enough. what is the problem you encounter ? [22:09]
mircea_popescu: don't tell me you're not fluent in swahili. [22:09]
phf: swahili is out, it's wakandan these days [22:10]
mircea_popescu: a right. [22:10]
phf: i like the subgroup animal reptile, "turtle, snake, dragon, t-rex" [22:11]
mircea_popescu: i can not even. [22:11]
phf: there's probably enough stuff there to make a very dull roguelike though. [22:12]
mircea_popescu: and spend the rest of your life dealing with obscure samsung driver errors. [22:13]
mircea_popescu: !!up sarah443 [22:13]
deedbot: sarah443 voiced for 30 minutes. [22:13]
mircea_popescu: anyway, i thought dragons were palmipedes. hence drake. wtf "reptile". [22:15]
phf: no see you don't understand taxonomy, it is also green [22:17]
mircea_popescu: jesus christ you're probably right. [22:18]
mircea_popescu: phf here's a perhaps useful summa of all this : add the name as a tooltip ? so if i hover it shows it, and if it's useless well, so be it. [22:21]
mircea_popescu: trilema does this for footnotes by setting the "title" attribute on a tag, but i imagine same can be done with a div ? [22:23]
phf: hmm, interesting, i could put a title where everything above a ascii is decomposed into names [22:25]
mircea_popescu: something like that. [22:26]
mircea_popescu: trinque [22:26]
phf: not sure how annoying that's going to make hovering though [22:26]
mircea_popescu: no idea also not clear if it's actually worth phf time. [22:27]
phf: i'm mostly afraid of having to download any more unicode information into my brain [22:28]
mircea_popescu: i can see it. [22:28]
mircea_popescu: in any case it was nice having someone to complain to. shit gets infuriating. [22:28]
phf: the infamous spitoon [22:29]
sarah443: [22:30]
sarah443: [22:31]
sarah443: Sorry I did it on paper and ckang had me redo it and my pen didnt want to write on skin too easily [22:31]
mircea_popescu: lipstick! [22:31]
sarah443: Is that bad? :x [22:32]
mircea_popescu: !!pay sarah443 0.02 [22:32]
deedbot: Get your OTP: [22:32]
mircea_popescu: so what do you do other than writing on your chest, sarah443 ? [22:32]
sarah443: Take care of my child currently. [22:33]
sarah443: Im at a point I need to decided, school or _____ [22:33]
mircea_popescu: is it foon ? [22:33]
sarah443: decide* [22:33]
sarah443: heh foon = fun ? [22:33]
mircea_popescu: yeah [22:34]
sarah443: Boring would be a better term lol [22:34]
sarah443: But I love him and he would be in daycare otherwise [22:34]
mircea_popescu: how old are you, if i may be so bold ? [22:34]
sarah443: 24 [22:34]
mircea_popescu: well... school kinda costs serious dough don't it ? [22:35]
sarah443: You? [22:35]
mircea_popescu: i'm 37, i'm not old. [22:35]
sarah443: It does, but my problem is, I don't want to commit to something since I can't think of anything that I can see myself doing forever. [22:36]
sarah443: If that makes sense. [22:36]
mircea_popescu: that's one way of looking at it. [22:36]
sarah443: Ive just never done something I have been super passionate about. [22:36]
mircea_popescu: well... why not ? [22:37]
sarah443: Its always out of necessity. [22:37]
sarah443: When you have to keep a baby fed and the lights on, it limits things a bit. [22:37]
mircea_popescu: i guess it must. [22:38]
ckang: I kind of wanted to do investigative stuff online, like the catch a predator style shows. [22:39]
ckang: Deep dives into odd fields [22:39]
mircea_popescu: that whole jerry springer stuff is not very enjoyable from what i hear. [22:40]
phf: check dat shit out, however on and [22:40]
a111: Logged on 2018-04-10 01:52 sarah443: [Xvi] [22:40]
a111: Logged on 2018-04-10 02:00 phf: [Xvii][Xviii]‍⚖️ [22:40]
a111: Logged on 2015-02-22 06:28 asciilifeform: комсомольская правда! [22:40]
a111: Logged on 2015-02-22 06:29 asciilifeform: ☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭ [22:40]
phf: *hover [22:40]
ckang: mircea_popescu: I was thinking more deep web [22:41]
mircea_popescu: phf pretty good neh ? [22:41]
ckang: Not really love drama [22:41]
mircea_popescu: ckang hey, if you ever find anything interesting i'm all ears. [22:42]
phf: yeah i like it, 9 lines of code [22:42]
ckang: As far as hidden sites go? [22:42]
mircea_popescu: splendid. [22:42]
mircea_popescu: ckang the republic's always looking for folk that aren't out and out imbeciles. [22:42]
mircea_popescu: iirc douchebag ended up here as a result of danielpbarron saying something in some what was it, free radio movement chat ? [22:43]
ckang: !!up sarah443 [22:44]
deedbot: sarah443 voiced for 30 minutes. [22:44]
sarah443: ty ) [22:44]
sarah443: ckang is always finding some nasty snuff sites and linking them [22:45]
mircea_popescu: !#s from:mircea "tumblr" [22:45]
a111: 2417 results for "from:mircea \"tumblr\"", [22:45]
sarah443: I would like to do more like offensive sort of research [22:45]
mircea_popescu: sarah443 how's offensive research go ? [22:46]
ckang: yea the child predator stuff is kind of odd IMO [22:46]
ckang: since it seems like they sorta bait people [22:46]
ckang: ive only seen a few eps though, not sure how they actually do it [22:46]
sarah443: They actually use bots to troll people into talking with them and chat analysis [22:47]
mircea_popescu: ckang structure determines content and all that. once you try to go in the "i can't believe" bla bla format, you'll be producing the repsective content. [22:48]
sarah443: mircea_popescu: I guess a more proactive approach, most stuff is counter active, post mortems [22:48]
sarah443: If that makes sense? [22:48]
mircea_popescu: not exactly. got an example ? [22:48]
sarah443: Well say a site is hacked, the group leaves their tag somewhere. [22:49]
mircea_popescu: not usually. [22:49]
sarah443: I want to be in these groups, not as law enforcement. [22:49]
sarah443: but more so boots on the ground for the industry [22:49]
sarah443: Whichever it may be, counterfieting stuff has always seemed interesting [22:50]
sarah443: China is incredible at some of the stuff they do with that [22:50]
ckang: lol, I got a chinese knife [22:50]
mircea_popescu: umh. counterfeiting as in, pucci bags and whatnot ? [22:50]
ckang: it was 1/10th the price of the original [22:50]
ckang: same materials, box, etc [22:51]
mircea_popescu: [22:51]
a111: Logged on 2017-07-13 18:42 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform incidentally : the pineapple hacking device is this chinese blade i bought on a lark. turns out it's the best steel i own / have seen in a long while. [22:51]
mircea_popescu: they improved significantly. [22:51]
ckang: having owned the fake & original you could barely tell the difference [22:51]
ckang: the good mfgs will use D2 steel and such [22:51]
ckang: but yea agreed most stuff is 100% garbage [22:52]
sarah443: There are whole portions of the internet that are pretty much China only. ecommerce wise. [22:53]
mircea_popescu: sarah443 ok, and it's a living, tenuous and marginal as it may be, buy shit in china resell it in the states. but how's this relate to website defacing ? [22:53]
ckang: the lengths they go through to counterfeit is pretty wild [22:54]
sarah443: mircea_popescu: It depends on the attack [22:54]
sarah443: Remember back during the anon/lulzsec days? [22:54]
mircea_popescu: yes ? [22:55]
sarah443: That was all about being vocal, "we did it, so what?" [22:55]
mircea_popescu: mmm [22:55]
mircea_popescu: this is a very... perception-driven approach to the events. [22:55]
sarah443: The social justice hackers, that was a bad example [22:55]
sarah443: But I don't want to just look over past things and try to figure things out, I want to be there before anything happens [22:56]
mircea_popescu: well, are you familiar with computer arcana ? [22:56]
sarah443: Just for a journalistic point, I can't work for law enforcement [22:57]
sarah443: Im not, arcana is like magic? [22:57]
mircea_popescu: well, technically arcana denotes finnicky, complicated and not directly obvious points. [22:58]
mircea_popescu: anyway, if you don't understand computers, how would you "be there" "before anything happens" ? [22:58]
sarah443: I was thinking arcane :) [22:58]
mircea_popescu: sure, arcana is the noun of arcane. [22:58]
sarah443: Well theres movements taking place that eventually will become bigger deals [22:59]
mircea_popescu: or become nothing at all. [22:59]
sarah443: In the political communities [22:59]
mircea_popescu: but do you then have a journalistic platform, like, working relationships with many/most publishers ? [23:00]
sarah443: You have 2 extremes [23:00]
mircea_popescu: yes. [23:00]
mircea_popescu: i'm an extremist after all. gotta keep up the standards. [23:00]
sarah443: Working with publishers, but I was thinking about maybe doing web editorials. I like the quick turn around time on that media and distribution [23:01]
sarah443: like Motherboard puts out some interesting reads sometimes [23:01]
mircea_popescu: it doesn't help your cause that online media is just about dead. [23:01]
sarah443: The entire darknet market thing was something I really wanted to delv into [23:02]
sarah443: Super interesting but its being forced further underground [23:02]
lobbes: not much there, I reckon. usg honeypots [23:02]
sarah443: Some of the research they did on them was pretty interesting, like quality of drugs for example [23:03]
sarah443: Was typically way better [23:03]
mircea_popescu: nobody's forcing anything anywhere the "darknet" bla bla is "being forced underground" in the exact sense the previous emo generation was "being forced into the closet". [23:03]
sarah443: Well, its more so the government cracking down and people get spooked I suppose [23:03]
sarah443: I folllow deepdotweb on twitter and they have some good articles sometimes [23:04]
mircea_popescu: spooked my foot, when we looked through the smoldering pile left after that idiot ross, it came to light ~nobody was using rsa. [23:04]
sarah443: Yeah amazing how others repeat the mistakes the previous iteration. [23:05]
sarah443: Its almost like planning the perfect murder lol [23:05]
sarah443: You see those shows and think, "oh, I wouldnt screw that up" [23:05]
mircea_popescu: eh. the quality of police work has so terribly degraded in the past half century, if anyone does ANY PLANNING AT ALL it's a murder that'll never get solved. [23:06]
mircea_popescu: half the ones with 0 planning also make the cut. [23:06]
sarah443: The police are a joke, if you have ever seen that show 'First 48' [23:06]
sarah443: Its pretty obvious how little they know but try to make people think they do. [23:06]
mircea_popescu: i don't really watch tv. [23:07]
sarah443: Same, don't have cable anymore, got to the point where I didn't even use it. [23:07]
mircea_popescu: but i do get court report summaries and all sorts of other things. [23:07]
sarah443: I love PACER [23:08]
sarah443: Can get lost for hours looking through stuff sometimes. [23:08]
mircea_popescu: so why not make a blog, publish summaries ? [23:09]
sarah443: I follow little niche stories and try to keep the respective communities up to date on the happenings. [23:09]
sarah443: They dont see the mainstream media or any other outlet so they would go undocumented otherwise [23:10]
mircea_popescu: yes, but your problem is that if you don't build either your skill or your platform, you will get absolutely nowhere. [23:10]
sarah443: My skills are more in sleuthing than writing [23:11]
mircea_popescu: there's a fundamental difference between "i am sarah and i have a kid to feed" and "i am sarah, and i can put your words before 1mn social media nobodies" or "i'm publish weekly in every porn mag there is" or whatever. [23:11]
sarah443: Yea that would be a good gig, writing interesting short but digestible articles. [23:12]
mircea_popescu: sarah443 that's unfortunate, very bright minds were on the record complainign there's no good market for sleuthing for fundamental reasons. like [23:12]
a111: Logged on 2015-08-13 16:38 asciilifeform: the point i was trying to make is that: i hypothesize that the '0day market' consists very largely of folks who are sitting on 0day and not 'marketing' at all [23:12]
danielpbarron: << l0de radio hour, i called in and donated 0.054 via deedbot which was 800 USD at the time, which has become a sort of meme on his show now [23:12]
a111: Logged on 2018-04-10 02:43 mircea_popescu: iirc douchebag ended up here as a result of danielpbarron saying something in some what was it, free radio movement chat ? [23:12]
sarah443: Im pretty ADD [23:12]
mircea_popescu: i did not necessarily agree with him, but that dun make his words go away [23:12]
mircea_popescu: danielpbarron a right, i recall now. [23:13]
mircea_popescu: pretty cool huh. [23:13]
sarah443: The 0day market is very interesting too [23:13]
sarah443: I wish I had a company paying me to buy that stuff for research, that would be a fun job :) [23:14]
lobbes: sarah443, have you checked out Qntra, btw? you may enjoy [23:14]
lobbes: !!up sarah443 [23:14]
deedbot: sarah443 voiced for 30 minutes. [23:14]
danielpbarron: the mtw guy who handled the money for him is currently in huge legal trouble, something about stealing millions of USD from dell computers i think [23:14]
mircea_popescu: "i wish there were someone paying for what i want to do" is a terrible way to waste a life. [23:14]
sarah443: I haven't, what is it? Googling now, on phone [23:14]
mircea_popescu: danielpbarron o.O link or something ? [23:15]
mircea_popescu: sarah443 [23:16]
sarah443: I like the twitter feed [23:16]
mircea_popescu: qntra has a twitter feed ?! [23:16]
sarah443: The content I mean, its interesting [23:17]
sarah443: Oh, was that a different qntra? [23:17]
sarah443: [23:17]
mircea_popescu: holy shit look at that. wtf, twitter's going to the dogs, they've not banned BingoBoingo ?! [23:18]
lobbes: oh hey, I think that was shinohai >> [23:18]
a111: Logged on 2016-09-08 00:54 shinohai: Also fixed Qntra bot on twitter until next time it breaks [23:18]
mircea_popescu: ah! [23:18]
mircea_popescu: iiincredibru [23:18]
sarah443: I like twitters delivery, short blips + pic/video [23:19]
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo "This leaves the question who ha a motive very open." << This leaves the question of who had a motive very open. [23:19]
sarah443: I hate the site and interface though [23:20]
danielpbarron: mircea_popescu, [23:20]
mircea_popescu: dark web. pastebin plox ? [23:21]
sarah443: Wow, that guy was part of this chat? [23:23]
mircea_popescu: !#s from:MTW [23:23]
a111: 26 results for "from:MTW", [23:23]
sarah443: Oh lol, hes here now [23:23]
mircea_popescu: !!up MTW [23:23]
deedbot: MTW voiced for 30 minutes. [23:23]
mircea_popescu: yo MTW! [23:24]
mircea_popescu: lol [23:24]
sarah443: He must be doing okay if hes out. [23:24]
phf: that's a right and proper bouncer, if you can do 10 years or whatever, come out, and get your logs out of it [23:24]
mircea_popescu: mirccloud ? [23:25]
phf: hehe [23:25]
mircea_popescu: anyway, it all revolves on whether they can steal the money back or not. if they can't, they're on their knees begging. with some limited negotiation ability can get to keep a third or so and walk. [23:26]
mircea_popescu: if they can steal it back however, you're fucked. [23:26]
sarah443: Yeah, crimes of this nature they want restitution not jail. [23:26]
sarah443: Spend X a year keeping someone locked up, or bleed them dry of everything they own... [23:27]
mircea_popescu: brings us right back to [23:27]
sarah443: Gov loves the later, sometimes both [23:27]
danielpbarron: maybe these work: aaand the first one dun wanna archive so .. [23:28]
sarah443: Whats your opinion on universal basic income? (UBI) [23:28]
mircea_popescu: ty danielpbarron [23:28]
mircea_popescu: sarah443 terrible. [23:28]
trinque: ah man, dark web and UBI [23:28]
sarah443: Its incredible the range of answers I get on that ) [23:29]
lobbes: btw phf I'm digging the unicode hovers in btcbase [23:29]
trinque: sarah443: you should just go strip in the valley, marry some startup cuck, end up with half his shares in nothing. ah nevermind. [23:29]
mircea_popescu: that's a point. where do you live sarah443 ? [23:30]
trinque: mircea_popescu: ack on msg [23:30]
sarah443: Lol, at my age I wouldnt be a hot commodity. [23:30]
sarah443: Way more/willing 18 year olds [23:30]
phf: sarah443: you haven't been in the valley have you [23:30]
mircea_popescu: you would be, yes. ever read the camwhore article ? [23:30]
sarah443: mircea_popescu: Florida [23:30]
sarah443: Most of my friends in Cali are trying to leave though so that should tell me something [23:31]
mircea_popescu: it's not a bad plan, go to SF for a week, join all the events, from bdsm munches to apple hackathon day, and just doe eye one or two dweebs per. then suck cock like your life depends on it, and then get married. [23:31]
phf: lobbes: ty, i'm messing with it, i added proper romanization for cyrillic, since it comes up so much. e.g. комсомольская правда! becomes "komsomol'skaja pravda!" [23:31]
mircea_popescu: sarah443 it should tell you this : they're idiots. gotta do the work. [23:32]
sarah443: Haha :) Ive done that for free [23:32]
mircea_popescu: sarah443 yes, but you did it stupidly. as marylin points out : it tastes the same when it comes out of a multi-mn cock. [23:32]
sarah443: Guess im the idiot [23:32]
trinque: I'm just saying, similar word salad seems to have swallowed Framedragger whole [23:33]
mircea_popescu: the key elements are a) high net worth dweebs, not the sorta guys you meet at raves and b) utter abjection, none of that "i'm a person and i have rights" bullcrap. [23:33]
trinque: arguably bright dood, even [23:33]
mircea_popescu: the time for that is in divorce court. [23:33]
sarah443: mircea_popescu: a lot of them, are hard to 'bond' with [23:33]
sarah443: Very shelled/walled off [23:33]
mircea_popescu: everyone's easy to bond with if you don't think you're about anything else than bonding. [23:33]
mircea_popescu: that's how puppies got so popular. [23:34]
sarah443: Yeah, some chemical confidence may help them too [23:34]
mircea_popescu: anyway, sure there may be one or two 16yo 's out there. but there's well over 100k dweebs worth over 1mn in paper. out of the money they waste on rent you can buy a farm in the transvaal and enjoy free weekly gangbangs for the rest of your life. [23:36]
mircea_popescu: "His notariety began seven years ago when he was arrested at a video game convention in Boston and accused of pirating $6 million in game code that was derived from a system used to train CIA agents for combat. May agreed to a Boston judge’s offer for pretrial probation in exchange for a dismissal of his case." << equivalency degree spelling aside, check out this guy! [23:37]
mircea_popescu: why don't people say THAT when BingoBoingo goes "who's yo daddy" ? one helluva intro. [23:37]
sarah443: Im really curious to see what comes out of the newly found crypto wealth kids [23:37]
sarah443: Every week you see a news story about that happening to some kid [23:38]
mircea_popescu: lol. [23:38]
sarah443: Potential is there to do great or horrible things [23:38]
mircea_popescu: you're seeing it, arent you ? [23:38]
mircea_popescu: i mean... just look at your tits. [23:38]
sarah443: Its going to be an interesting time ahead though, either way [Xix] [23:40]
mircea_popescu: TOOLTIP FAIL! [23:40]
phf: bah [23:41]
sarah443: Did I do something wrong? [23:41]
mircea_popescu: nah. [23:41]
phf: parallel conversation [23:42]
mircea_popescu: DARK conversation underneath! [23:42]
ckang: wow sarah443 is still blogging, dont think ive ever seen her type so much [23:49]
ckang: !!up sarah443 [23:49]
deedbot: sarah443 voiced for 30 minutes. [23:49]
trinque: mircea_popescu: [23:54]
sarah443: [Xx] Hey ckang was brushing my teeth about to turn in for the night. mircea_popescu great talking to you, I have more questions than answers now but it has me thinking about what I want to do a bit more [Xxi] [23:55]
ckang: lol sarah443 those emojiis arent something you should use on irc [23:56]
trinque: all I got are boxes over here. [23:56]
ckang: most clients dont render them right [23:56]
ckang: yea [23:56]
trinque: I"m projecting my own feelings into them [23:56]
trinque: they look the same [23:56]
phf: trinque: try hovering on that line on btcbase though! [23:56]
ckang: its a unicorn and a moon [23:57]
* trinque looks [23:57]
ckang: i never realized how many new ones they added [23:57]
ckang: like they have 6 different skintones [23:57]
trinque: holy shit phf, it's like google translate for the kids [23:57]
phf: courtesy of extra 150mb of sbcl memory usage [23:58]
ckang: jesus its really that large? [23:59]
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