Forum logs for 01 Apr 2016

Monday, 16 March, Year 12 d.Tr. | Author:
deedbot-: [» Contravex: A blog by Pete Dushenski] Cheep Pete’s Guide To Not Being A Poorfag - [00:26]
ben_vulpes: ten dollar tacos?! [02:31]
ben_vulpes: i grow convinced that wherever pete_dushenski hails from is even weirder than asciilifeform's big gulag [02:31]
ben_vulpes: pete_dushenski: this interest rate claim: are you implying that house prices go up when interest rates go down, ergo the house won't appreciate if you buy when rates are low and so don't? [02:32]
ben_vulpes: 1% interest on checking or savings accounts oh my sides [02:33]
ben_vulpes: canadoes that? [02:33]
ben_vulpes: (and where is the "lease don't buy your car!1" tip?) [02:36]
mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes he has a point re the interest rates. [08:55]
asciilifeform: pete_dushenski: [09:04]
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: interesting gavin-heap [09:10]
* asciilifeform has not fully digested it yet [09:10]
* asciilifeform bbl [09:11]
mircea_popescu: pete_dushenski mixing things like "make a budget" and "pack a lunch / brew your own coffee" seems improper. [09:15]
PeterL: save even more money, brew your own beer! [09:24]
danielpbarron: pretty sure it costs more to make beer than to buy it my brother does that and it's a whole lot of work for not a lot of beer [09:27]
PeterL: pete_dushenski have you ever read the book "the total money makeover" by Dave Ramsey? I recommend the book, makes mostly similar points to your post [09:29]
PeterL: danielpbarron I guess it depends on how you do it, I never did beer, but I made mead, and it was much cheaper than buying an equivalent volume, about an hour of work and a few weeks of waiting [09:30]
danielpbarron: yeah beer is much more involved [09:32]
mircea_popescu: you folks gotta try teh elderberry cordial. [09:32]
PeterL: ben_vulpes> 1% interest on checking or savings accounts oh my sides << at my local credit union you can get 2% interest with a 5 year certificate, does not keep up with inflation but its better than no interest [09:35]
PeterL: but yeah, a "savings account" gets 0.1% APY [09:36]
* shinohai makes a few bottles of wine every fall [09:41]
shinohai: I have elderberries and blueberries. [09:41]
mircea_popescu: nice. [09:41]
deedbot-: [Qntra] Latest Bitcoin Network Difficulty Adjustment ~0.82% - [09:48]
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo hey do you recall the lafond article where he describes some woman taking a cab to escape urban race war and some dudes trying to flag it down to rape her ? [10:05]
BingoBoingo: not offhand [10:06]
mircea_popescu: darn. [10:07]
mircea_popescu: well i guess i grep lafond in log. [10:07]
phf: going to harm city tonight, after lafond articles fully expect packs of roaming black urban youths terrorizing solitary whites all over the place [10:21]
mircea_popescu: god damned it. so half hour's research has produced not the article i was looking for, and the knowledge that decimation actually introduced lafond to the chan. [10:22]
phf: lafond's long been part of collective tmsr unconscious thanks to BingoBoingo [10:23]
mircea_popescu: first link is May 05 23:23:08 <decimation> < baltimore man writes about what he saw [10:23]
mircea_popescu: that's may 2015. [10:23]
phf: huh, well then. i somehow though people were reading him before the riots [10:24]
* phf actually remembers that very log entry [10:24]
mircea_popescu: first i found, mebbe i'm missing something, but no i dun recall him being discussed prior. [10:41]
shinohai: $part [10:52]
mircea_popescu: $sex [10:52]
mircea_popescu: this fembot sucks [10:53]
mircea_popescu: i mean... blows. [10:53]
mircea_popescu: god damned it. [10:53]
shinohai: $part [10:53]
shinohai: finally [10:53]
deedbot-: [Trilema] Outrageous MP's guide to not being a poorfag - [10:58]
ben_vulpes: mircea_popescu: i was actually trying to figure out what that interest rate point /was/ [11:24]
asciilifeform: Apr 01 10:22:12 <mircea_popescu>god damned it. so half hour's research has produced not the article i was looking for, and the knowledge that decimation actually introduced lafond to the chan. << decimation introduced the thread about atomic clocks also. so cesium clock is a sc4m?! [11:26]
mircea_popescu: so huh ? [11:26]
mircea_popescu: how's scam enter into this [11:27]
asciilifeform: nfi, just pointing out that not everything the schmuck did was a work of evil [11:27]
mircea_popescu: i wasn't proposing any such thing ? [11:28]
mircea_popescu: in other morning lulz : argentinian owner of a rental wants to get together to discuss changing rental contract because "inflation has gone up". [11:28]
mircea_popescu: this is a derp who wanted contract in dollars to protect self from inflation, got choice of X in pesos or y in dollars, picked y. [11:28]
asciilifeform: l0l! [11:28]
mircea_popescu: no but this is how they think, srsly. [11:28]
asciilifeform: what does it mean to 'discuss changing rental contract' [11:28]
asciilifeform: whole point of contract is... [11:28]
mircea_popescu: that he wants to unilaterally change teh amounts ? [11:29]
asciilifeform: and not for ~next~ contract but ~now~ ?! [11:29]
mircea_popescu: hahaha. [11:29]
mircea_popescu: no seriously. this is argentinian mind at work. [11:29]
asciilifeform: not even here in the zoo, does this make sense [11:29]
mircea_popescu: ah, what you don't know is that there's but different zoos. [11:29]
mircea_popescu: anywya, it was lulzy, guy wanted 12k pesos i offered 750 usd which he took - at the time ~6 mo ago it came to about 11k pesos on the black market and it looked like it will imminently will cross 12 13 15 etc. [11:30]
mircea_popescu: it... never did. [11:30]
mircea_popescu: to this very day, it's not there. [11:30]
mircea_popescu: meanwhile, dollar liberalized so it's not going up prices soared because they're poor and pretentious. [11:31]
mircea_popescu: lulz of all tim. [11:31]
phf: btw how does voice work here exactly? a whitelist? [11:31]
mircea_popescu: atm yes. [11:32]
asciilifeform: what does 750 usd (per mo?) get mircea_popescu in b-a ? [11:33]
asciilifeform: a garage ? [11:33]
mircea_popescu: 1500 sqft or so. [11:33]
asciilifeform: what would 750 buy a civilian ? [11:34]
mircea_popescu: but yes, rents are utterly outrageous, everything's gotta come down 2x-3x for sanity. [11:34]
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform perhaps 2/3 that ? [11:34]
asciilifeform: and of what? (climate-controlled ? vermin-enabled?) [11:34]
mircea_popescu: normal apt thing. two baths two bedrooms, kitchen, living room, appliances including ac. [11:35]
asciilifeform: neato [11:35]
asciilifeform: where i live, 750 would maybe get you an open air parking. [11:36]
asciilifeform: for small auto. [11:36]
mircea_popescu: i didn't tell you to live there. [11:36]
asciilifeform: tru! [11:37]
mircea_popescu: anyway, it's pretty ridiculous, ro/pl/etc rents are about half that, and that's in the eu. [11:37]
mircea_popescu: no idea wtf is wrong with this particular thirld world nation, but w/e. [11:37]
asciilifeform: too many americans spreading printolade ? [11:38]
mircea_popescu: (actually i do have a pretty good idea - they all live off the govt which is here so much like lice they crowd around) [11:38]
mircea_popescu: nah. [11:38]
mircea_popescu: ba is larger than ny. yet another place the us doesn't actually matter all that much. [11:38]
asciilifeform: i recall chetty mentioned an entire city quarter packed with idiot usaschwitz escapees ? [11:38]
mircea_popescu: yeah. you know what they do all day ? bitch importantly about how the bus fare went up a quarter peso. [11:39]
phf: asciilifeform: this is not a particularly interesting exercise, because rent in DC is significantly above what you could be paying anywhere else in the country (except usual suspects, nyc and sf) [11:39]
mircea_popescu: phf and for the same reason as here : us lives off govt dole, so the lice crowd the capitla. [11:39]
phf: right, there are no other redeeming qualities or reasons for why rent in dc should be this high [11:40]
mircea_popescu: moreover, you can readily add wi/mn/whatever to the ro/pl/etc list. [11:40]
mircea_popescu: $750 gets you a house in iowa. [11:41]
mircea_popescu: or w/e, ten 2015 ford focus electric rentals. [11:41]
phf: uber drivers "mang you pay 1500 for yo plaaaas, should move to upper spring heights mang [20 minutes driving from metro, 10 minutes driving from any semblance of food] pay seven hundraaaayd. is cheap!" [11:42]
mircea_popescu: i guess you have a solid point there - ba is an oldstyle city, eateries on every corner, etc. good reason for rent to be more than what it can be in industrially produced "suburub". [11:43]
mircea_popescu: nevertheless... [11:43]
mircea_popescu: you can't possibly convince me that rents can ever exceed ~half the average per capita income [11:44]
phf: well, right iowa counter example basically loses you all citiness, and you can get that here too [11:44]
mircea_popescu: which is here about 600 bux [11:44]
mircea_popescu: (which is not so terrible, even, considering gdp is like 18k pa) [11:45]
phf: i know nhi couple who own a house in gaithersburg, which is about 40 minute nhi commute (note nhi itself is 30 minutes outside dc center), it's a magnificent place and they put all the toys from their world travels there, englishmen style. [11:46]
phf: but there's literally nothing within 20 minute drive, fields, some new suburbia, that's it [11:47]
mircea_popescu: well... country house has its place. i'm just not old enough to want one. [11:47]
asciilifeform: phf: i dun live in dc [11:48]
phf: having grown up with a dacha, i grok country house/city apartments, but that's not even under consideration for most people here, unless they are boomers, who bought ocean property in the 60s for peanuts [11:48]
asciilifeform: phf: i live in the 'cheap' suburbs next to umd. [11:48]
phf: asciilifeform: my condolences [11:48]
asciilifeform: i could not in a million years afford to live in the dc city walls. [11:49]
mircea_popescu: lol [11:49]
mircea_popescu: old woman! [11:49]
asciilifeform: 11:41 <+mircea_popescu> $750 gets you a house in iowa. << aha and iowa shaves a zero off the salary. [11:49]
mircea_popescu: someone works in iowa ? [11:49]
mircea_popescu: i thought it's for dormitory. [11:49]
mircea_popescu: so what's rent like in the cheap suburbs next to umd ? [11:50]
phf: proper way to deal with iowa is buy a house, get your 800$/mo satellite internet (not even checking what's available, why bother), and do your aerospace/banking/medical it consulting work remote [11:50]
asciilifeform: <+phf> i know nhi couple ... but there's literally nothing within 20 minute drive << my parents live in a place like this. [11:50]
mircea_popescu: phf actually internet in midwest way better than on the coasts. usually run by township. [11:51]
asciilifeform: 11:50 <+mircea_popescu> so what's rent like in the cheap suburbs next to umd ? << i pay ~2k (if you count electric, gas, etc) for <1k sq ft. [11:51]
mircea_popescu: confirming the age old observation thart socialism works betterf the smaller it is. [11:51]
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform unfurnished also ? [11:51]
asciilifeform: aha, as i insist [11:52]
asciilifeform: the FUCK i need some derp's furniture for. [11:52]
mircea_popescu: so you don't have to haul various pointless ballast ? [11:52]
phf: mircea_popescu: hard to get furnished here, i price it out every time, and it's an extra 1k a month almost always [11:52]
mircea_popescu: that's ridoinculous. 1k buys you the swhit in a coupla months. [11:52]
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i have extremely nonstandard furniture [11:52]
phf: that is if you don't lease it yourself from a third party [11:52]
asciilifeform: because unlike americans, i have books. [11:52]
mircea_popescu: ah right, you're stuck with the mite traps. [11:53]
mircea_popescu: phf such a bizarre place you know, they rent last years' car for 2 bux a day, everyone hauls countertops [11:53]
phf: mircea_popescu: idea is that furnished apartment is for a salariman on remote assignment, like amtrak and services like that, assumption is can jack up a price as much as you want [11:53]
mircea_popescu: i can't help but think it's a mental issue. [11:53]
mircea_popescu: how about never mind teh purposes, stick to the causes! [11:54]
phf: it is expensive to live in this country from causes [11:54]
phf: not that i don't, but my burn rate is significantly higher than a random schmuck [11:55]
mircea_popescu: like everywhere huh. [11:55]
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: not only books. i have nice desk that holds n displays, etc. [11:56]
asciilifeform: srsly why would i want the motherfucking pressed shitboard rental furniture. [11:56]
asciilifeform: WHY. [11:56]
asciilifeform: if i wanted to live in a hotel, i would live in a hotel ! [11:56]
phf: living in a hotel is more expensive still [11:56]
mircea_popescu: rentals are exactly that : correctly priced, multi-room hotels. [11:56]
asciilifeform: i have a motherfucking workshop. [11:56]
asciilifeform: with things like drill press. [11:57]
asciilifeform: where should these go? on rental stools in furnished apt ?! [11:57]
mircea_popescu: ideally, they go in the form of renting time from a workshop wtf is this my garage is my workshop artisan thing. [11:57]
asciilifeform: <+mircea_popescu> rentals are exactly that : correctly priced, multi-room hotels. << only for a theorist like mircea_popescu [11:57]
phf: we've had that conversation before i believe [11:57]
mircea_popescu: this conversation won't die. [11:57]
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: do you have ANY idea what it would cost to 'rent a workshop' within 3 hrs of drive from here ? [11:57]
mircea_popescu: nope. but this is just an argument towards "us is fucking nuts". why the fuck should it cost a lot ? [11:58]
phf: asciilifeform: within 3 hours drive? c'mon. i can find you a workshop within 3 hours drive for less than 500 a month [11:58]
mircea_popescu: first off, that's the #1 a city wants t osponsor. [11:58]
asciilifeform: since when does a city sponsor anything sane ?! [11:58]
asciilifeform: american cities sponsor bum gardens [11:58]
mircea_popescu: since it is in a place you live in. [11:58]
asciilifeform: and dope needles [11:58]
phf: i have friends with workshops in baltimore city, maybe an hour drive from where i am [11:59]
phf: closer from umd [11:59]
mircea_popescu: isn't that the bad place ? [11:59]
asciilifeform: phf: baltimore is mega-cheap [11:59]
asciilifeform: phf: i used to dream of escaping to it. [11:59]
mircea_popescu: o wait - turns out alf is actually closer to lafond's dear friends than to the white house ? [11:59]
mircea_popescu: bwahahahaha [11:59]
mircea_popescu: I THOUGHT YOU DIDN'T LIKE ROACHES YO! [11:59]
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: 11km from whitehouse. [11:59]
phf: if you have any sort of income, you can go to bmore and play believe mp [12:00]
asciilifeform: phf: if i had a NON-COMMUTE income [12:00]
mircea_popescu: phf it also happens to be the right thing to do, other than buying bitbet. [12:00]
asciilifeform: which i don't. [12:00]
mircea_popescu: go to baltiomore, start a gang. [12:00]
asciilifeform: l0l white gang in bmore [12:00]
mircea_popescu: five years in you'll prolly want to hold a conference. if not 3. [12:00]
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform why white ? [12:00]
asciilifeform: if you have to ask... [12:00]
phf: i have burner friends with workshops that you literally drive into a fenced off area with barbed wire on top, go inside a heavily reinforced building and work with your 50k equipment in peace [12:00]
mircea_popescu: if i can talk to anglos, you can talk to niggers. [12:01]
asciilifeform: i will start black gang after mircea_popescu does and i study his. [12:01]
mircea_popescu: oh ffs. [12:01]
mircea_popescu: do you actually believe blacks aren't people or something ? [12:01]
mircea_popescu: i saw the cunts, still same shade of pink. [12:01]
asciilifeform: anyway in alls srsness bmore is a glorious place to live imho. [12:01]
asciilifeform: i tried to get work there, and failed. [12:02]
asciilifeform: to date. [12:02]
mircea_popescu: what did you apply to ? [12:02]
asciilifeform: $firm_that_sells_0days [12:02]
asciilifeform: and $the_other_firm_that_sells_0days [12:03]
mircea_popescu: eh, you know enough chemistry to be useful to meth lab. [12:03]
mircea_popescu: apply to that. [12:03]
asciilifeform: l0l 'hi i'm totally not a usg stooge though i have no street experience' [12:03]
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu is a lulzy fella [12:03]
mircea_popescu: nobody's born with street experience. [12:04]
mircea_popescu: also, gangs aren't exactly intellectual strongholds. by and large they survive by not caring, not by fine-tuning their civ playing strat. [12:04]
asciilifeform: no but the correct brand of anticiv. [12:04]
asciilifeform: pashtun. [12:04]
mircea_popescu: not generally. [12:04]
mircea_popescu: generally it's the very simple "well... here i am". [12:05]
asciilifeform: anyway i don't touch things where i have no leverage. [12:05]
mircea_popescu: the same thing that gets most women knocked up that ever carry to term. [12:05]
asciilifeform: why does mircea_popescu think i could be an ~average~ dope man, much less a heroic one. [12:05]
mircea_popescu: how exactly is this "no leverage" computed ? [12:05]
mircea_popescu: you have immense leverage - you're the only one that can make sense of the entire sea of symbols they don't grok. [12:05]
mircea_popescu: what do you think whiteboy with compuyter habit ends up doing in prison ? [12:06]
asciilifeform: buggered to death ? [12:06]
mircea_popescu: helps the bulked up dudes with their appeals. [12:06]
mircea_popescu: oh gtfo. [12:06]
mircea_popescu: you have any idea how rare fucking is, in human experience ? [12:06]
mircea_popescu: stop flattering yourself. nobody's wasting an erectio0n on your sorry ass. [12:06]
asciilifeform: then perhaps eaten as long pig ? [12:07]
mircea_popescu: helps the bulked up dudes with their appeals. < [12:07]
asciilifeform: i have nfi what they do with useless people in american prison [12:07]
mircea_popescu: you can read. and you can read in such a way as to GUARANTEEDLY never end up in "i dunno man" [12:07]
mircea_popescu: he can't. he's never met someone who can. [12:07]
mircea_popescu: leverage ? you got more leverage in baltimore than you do here. [12:07]
PeterL: <asciilifeform> 11:50 <+mircea_popescu> so what's rent like in the cheap suburbs next to umd ? << i pay ~2k (if you count electric, gas, etc) for <1k sq ft. << my new house is ~1k for 2k sq ft (plus 1k basement, could be used as workshop) [12:08]
asciilifeform: PeterL: and in zimbabwe, can get even cheaper ! [12:08]
PeterL: in the middle of nice town [12:09]
trinque: no everything outside DC is africa [12:09]
trinque: inside DC is also africa [12:09]
asciilifeform: trinque: i was offered work in other africas (e.g., san francisco) [12:10]
asciilifeform: but i don't have any reason to prefer them to this africa. [12:10]
trinque: aw, beating on the left coast folk is a great passtime [12:10]
trinque: just ask ben_vulpes [12:10]
asciilifeform: trinque: in fact, it costs 2x moar to live there LIKE A HUMAN (e.g., MOTHERFUCKING HOUSE WITH OWN 4 WALLS) than here and they only offered 1.5x moar. [12:11]
mircea_popescu: PeterL one place in ro, suburb of supposedly nice town, ran me $2200 per quarter, house on two levels (bout 4k sqft total iirc) + a spot of land, fully furnished. and i mean, natural leather couches and walnut furniture and whatnot. [12:14]
mircea_popescu: but as he says ... no reason to prefer... [12:14]
mircea_popescu: other than that, two-girl furnished apt in town ran 3-400 monthly. [12:15]
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i dun need living LIKE A NATIVE in ro for anything. [12:15]
mircea_popescu: hows like a native ? [12:16]
asciilifeform: well, on ~their~ salary [12:16]
mircea_popescu: heh. i bet. [12:16]
mircea_popescu: go work for alcatel, make 600 a mo :D [12:16]
mircea_popescu: but it is pretty cool living with the natives you know ? girl can pillowtalk tell you about her bf, and how hard he's working for his promotion. [12:16]
mircea_popescu: which yes, from 600 to 635 [12:17]
trinque: asciilifeform: when I moved to portland I told my employer I would either telecommute or quit. [12:17]
trinque: it's afaik a common thing in software [12:17]
asciilifeform: trinque: i tried this in the past, was always told 'go, quit.' [12:18]
trinque: asciilifeform needs an agent [12:18]
trinque: :P [12:18]
mircea_popescu: what is the moral you derive from this experience alf ? [12:18]
asciilifeform: that i'm not 133337 enough ? [12:19]
asciilifeform: i dunno, what else. [12:19]
mircea_popescu: (lemma : the definition of shit job is one where employer says "go, quit.") [12:19]
mircea_popescu: usually reserved to barristas etc. [12:19]
asciilifeform: then i've never seen 'non-shit' job and don't expect ever to. [12:19]
mircea_popescu: almost like a cloud of perpetual brick rain follows you around. [12:19]
mircea_popescu: even people doing shitty webstack dev HAVE. [12:19]
trinque: was exactly what I was doing. [12:20]
trinque: "I made this fucking mess, and fuck you I'm not helping you replace me, so let me telecommute" [12:20]
mircea_popescu: lol. [12:20]
mircea_popescu: i just realised we need a backup for deedbot. [12:20]
trinque: imma publish all the source for the new one [12:21]
mircea_popescu: next thing he's gonna want to telecomute instead of showing up in irc. [12:21]
asciilifeform: l0l [12:21]
trinque: haha [12:21]
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform for my own peace of mind : have you actually said this ? or just fantasized about saying it ? [12:23]
asciilifeform: which [12:23]
asciilifeform: i lost track [12:23]
mircea_popescu: "i tried this in the past, was always told 'go, quit.'" [12:23]
* asciilifeform is on the spin cycle of the day's stake, when the barbs come out [12:23]
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i did precisely once, with my last employer. there was much gnashing of teeth, and ill feeling from the other slaves (there were only a handful of us, and no one was actually replaceable) [12:25]
mircea_popescu: was this a concern ongoing or winding down at the time ? [12:25]
asciilifeform: the latter. [12:25]
mircea_popescu: a sole attempt in a drowning boat does not constitute a valid basis for the response you presented. [12:25]
mircea_popescu: should have made demands before the thing went south. [12:26]
asciilifeform: i started out largely tele [12:26]
asciilifeform: but was summoned back in as the shop was in dire straits [12:26]
asciilifeform: 'we must all grunt on the stake!111 for victory111' [12:26]
mircea_popescu: lmao [12:26]
mircea_popescu: you remind me of that joke of the young slut. [12:26]
asciilifeform: which? [12:27]
mircea_popescu: "mommy, mommy, i made five dollars!" [12:28]
mircea_popescu: "how did you do that ?" [12:28]
mircea_popescu: "this old guy said he'd give me five dollars if i climb up in that tree!" [12:28]
mircea_popescu: "you slut, you. he only wanted to see your panties." [12:28]
mircea_popescu: next day [12:28]
mircea_popescu: "mommy, mommy, i made twenny dollars!" [12:28]
mircea_popescu: "what now ?" [12:28]
mircea_popescu: "old guy came by told me he'd give me five if i climb up that tree" [12:28]
mircea_popescu: "didn't i tell you..." [12:28]
mircea_popescu: "ha! joke's on him, i took them off first." [12:29]
asciilifeform: l0l [12:29]
asciilifeform: my last move was even a switch of profession, i'm no longer a reverser. turned out not to be a smart idea. [12:31]
asciilifeform: turns out, there were worse things. [12:32]
phf: what do you do now? [12:32]
phf: (i mean, by name) [12:32]
asciilifeform: phf: i was hired originally to (yes) calculate runtimes of gnarly algos [12:33]
asciilifeform: (why anyone would pay for this is a very long story) [12:33]
phf: that sounds a like a very respectable, if very narrow specialization [12:34]
phf: is that pen and paper by hand? [12:34]
asciilifeform: mostly. [12:34]
mircea_popescu: then eminently commutable ? [12:36]
phf: how gnarly? 3sat, tsp heuristic solutions? [12:36]
phf: or gnarly as in "we wrote this over past 5 years, need to have upper bounds noa!!1" [12:36]
asciilifeform: gnarly in the sense where the working set is a meg of cpp code. [12:36]
asciilifeform: written by academics. [12:37]
phf: ah, the second kind [12:37]
asciilifeform: doing megatonnes of linear algebra. [12:37]
asciilifeform: and bignum [12:37]
mircea_popescu: actually thast should ber the easy part neh ? [12:37]
mircea_popescu: i'd imagine it's the control structures / branching that's problematic [12:37]
phf: oh, i grok the "go pound pavement" reason now [12:37]
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: actually bignum is a nightmare because of algo transitions [12:38]
mircea_popescu: ah [12:38]
mircea_popescu: hey, hidden branching! [12:38]
asciilifeform: (e.g., gmp uses 4+ different mult algos) [12:38]
phf: academic offshoots treat their engineers the way they do grad students, because the two are usually the same and equally replaceable [12:38]
asciilifeform: and there was also to be reversing, of juicy things, but turned out that (apparently) i could only be used for it if i agreed to usgrasty [12:39]
phf: i once interviewed for an interesting problem shop, that was a upenn spinoff of some ph.d. thesis work, results could be immediately applied in oil refinery optimizations [12:39]
phf: the offer was so ridiculous, i couldn't even consider it. the woman in charge thought she was being generous! [12:40]
mircea_popescu: clearly the downdraft of "phd work" [12:40]
mircea_popescu: it's incredible what the grads will take, [12:40]
mircea_popescu: and given that, it's incredible the females aren't actively pursuing prostitution. [12:41]
phf: and the shop itself was how i imagine alf shop is, a small group of math/compsci grads doing peanut work under inhumane conditions [12:41]
asciilifeform: phf: there are much worse conditions! [12:41]
phf: asciilifeform: there are also much much better conditions [12:42]
asciilifeform: at least here it's only 2 blokes to a 8x8 cell [12:42]
asciilifeform: phf: aha, in mircea_popescu's harem [12:42]
asciilifeform: on dirigible. [12:42]
phf: you're silly [12:42]
mircea_popescu: you think ?! [12:42]
asciilifeform: anyway better conditions exist. for better peoplez. [12:42]
phf: ok, ~now~ i'm grokking [12:43]
phf: this is all academia mentality [12:43]
asciilifeform: i've never done 'honest work' in my whole life, phf . [12:43]
mircea_popescu: so ? [12:43]
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu has a spiffy article, about folks 'worth their weight in frozen pork' [12:44]
mircea_popescu: these are unrelated considerations. [12:45]
asciilifeform: how so ? [12:45]
mircea_popescu: do you know any women who've never fucked a black guy in their life ? [12:45]
asciilifeform: 100% [12:45]
mircea_popescu: how would this circumstance influence their capacity to in the future conceive a baby with their putative black lover ? [12:46]
asciilifeform: count me as thick, i dun see the connection. [12:46]
mircea_popescu: me either. because there isn't one. [12:46]
asciilifeform: obviously i will make passable pork when finally processed. [12:46]
mircea_popescu: cunt works. you don't have to keep priming it with all sorts of cocks it could work with [12:46]
asciilifeform: and ok soap. [12:46]
mircea_popescu: so as to maintain it's capacity to work with them in the future. [12:46]
asciilifeform: and perhaps a reasonable set of lampshades. [12:47]
mircea_popescu: so : whether cunt works or not is a separate and distinct consideration from whether cunt ever did it with black cock before. [12:47]
phf: the mentality here is "i'm fucking all kinds of scum, but at least it's not a black fella" [12:47]
mircea_popescu: which is why no sterility clinic makes woman fill out formulary, "have you done guy like your present so, in your teens ?" [12:47]
mircea_popescu: <asciilifeform> how so ? << answered ? [12:48]
asciilifeform: well as i gather mircea_popescu's answer was 'you could start doing 17 yo work for shit wage' and i answer 'why the fuck should i a single day earlier than forced to.' [12:48]
mircea_popescu: i guess we collectivelly just lost the past 5 minutes huh. [12:49]
asciilifeform: << pete_dushenski [12:55]
asciilifeform: the 'make a budget' and 'don't drink through your whole wage' thing is REASONABLE as 'how to not GO IDIOT BROKE' advice [12:56]
asciilifeform: but 'how to get rich' ?? [12:56]
phf: buy dirty potato, clean it, sell it, buy two dirty potatoes, clean them, sell them, then your father dies and leaves you the estate [12:57]
asciilifeform: ^ [12:57]
mircea_popescu: go to baltimore, start gang, keep it cheap, effective and lean. under the pressure of all the other idiots nobody can afford to engage you, too painful bite for the calories contained, in twenty years trade the president his life in exchange for his daughter. [12:58]
mircea_popescu: sorry folks, there never was nor ever will be another way. [12:58]
mircea_popescu: review henry teh fifth. [12:58]
mircea_popescu: "A very attractive couple enters and begins shopping with a basket. She is tall, elegant, and white, not busty enough to pose in playboy, and not thin enough to model clothes. She is beautiful in the very high heels she can barely stand on, doing the dopefiend lean as she is. Her date is a short muscular black man with his pants actually buckled around his waist. They are in their late twenties and he can’t keep his hands o [12:59]
mircea_popescu: ff of her as she staggers and drools in the aisle. He has a powder blue hat. She carries a finely stitched black leather purse about the size of one of her shoes. They cannot decide who should be pushing the cart. They head back to the women’s room and have sex standing up, between the stall doors and the sink, with the door wide open. She is bent over the sink and he is having a hard time getting his pelvis level with her [12:59]
mircea_popescu: rather remarkable Caucasian ass. She is spreading her legs to get lower for him. When I pass again coming back from the cooler he has had the decency to push her up against the wall so that she is not exposed to passersby. After their ten minute tryst they shop for another 20 minutes and then leave hand-in-hand." [13:00]
mircea_popescu: apud lafond. fucking beautiful! [13:00]
asciilifeform: incidentally where in bmore do you get folks for your gang with >bathwater iq ? [13:00]
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform you fight the war with the army you get. [13:00]
asciilifeform: this is why the jail is full of the idiots aha [13:00]
mircea_popescu: jail is your home. [13:01]
asciilifeform: 'big zone', 'little zone' [13:01]
asciilifeform: i am left to wonder, clearly mircea_popescu has a very high opinion of orc scum, why doesn't he recruit ~them~ to write his softs, run his companies, etc. ? [13:05]
mircea_popescu: you keep making these whole insane jumps. first you went from "cunt works or doesn't work" to "cunt has or hasn't previous experience with black cock". now you went from "you want to not be poor, gotta act like it" to "why is mp not storing cheese in bottles and shoes on hooks". [13:06]
mircea_popescu: wtf is this [13:06]
asciilifeform: this in re 'bmore gang' recipe [13:07]
mircea_popescu: yes. [13:07]
asciilifeform: i don't even recall mentioning cunt. [13:07]
mircea_popescu: or cheese or hooks, yes. [13:08]
asciilifeform: possibly i do not have sufficient lsd to properly do this thread.. [13:08]
mircea_popescu: is lsd like, superman vitamins ? [13:08]
asciilifeform: aha! [13:08]
mircea_popescu: if only. [13:13]
mircea_popescu: but anyway, let us elaborate, not like anything better to do on rainy day. [13:13]
asciilifeform: 0l holy shit i just read a trilema where mircea_popescu agreed with me?! [13:13]
asciilifeform: i think i'ma get on my pig and fly around a bit ? [13:14]
mircea_popescu: part one. you said "i've never done 'honest work' in my whole life, phf." and "mircea_popescu has a spiffy article, about folks 'worth their weight in frozen pork'". this equivocates experience with capacity. [13:14]
mircea_popescu: in the illustration used, the cunt has the CAPACITY to procreate, with whatever man, as a function of whether it works or does not work. if it has the capaqcity to procreate, it will procreate. if it doesn't procreate, it's because IT didn't work, NOT because the cock was black. [13:15]
asciilifeform: i have capacity ! worth about 80 kg of pork. [13:15]
asciilifeform: not grade-a tho. [13:15]
mircea_popescu: the cunt's experience in fucking whatever penis is not related to this in any sense. [13:15]
mircea_popescu: more importantly, since you won't let go : what you wish your asshole to be used for and what it is used for are also divorced. [13:15]
mircea_popescu: infantine equivalencies you propose to the world notwithstanding, as they have no standing. [13:16]
asciilifeform: well no shit, i will have no say in who eats the pork. [13:16]
mircea_popescu: moving on. [13:16]
mircea_popescu: part two. how one proceeds to not be poor is unrelated to what mp does. [13:17]
mircea_popescu: ~fin~. [13:17]
asciilifeform: my original point is that it is also not related to pete_dushenski's peculiar cargo cultisms [13:18]
asciilifeform: (mortification of the flesh, saving pennies, etc.) [13:18]
mircea_popescu: i think on that we're all agreed [13:19]
mircea_popescu: possibly pete_dushenski himself as well. [13:19]
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu's advice, 'become a pirate!1111' is ~practical and mega-useful~ by comparison ! [13:19]
asciilifeform: i admit that i wonder if pete_dushenski's misconceptions came to him from his ancestors, for whom saving sorta worked. [13:20]
asciilifeform: (because sound - relatively - money) [13:20]
PeterL: does saving in bitcoin work? Or not stable enough yet? [13:22]
asciilifeform: PeterL: ask this after you buy a bunch today, and mircea_popescu drops the nuke in the great phorkwarz of july [13:23]
mircea_popescu: saving never worked. [13:24]
PeterL: does investing work? [13:24]
mircea_popescu: efficiency works, in the sense that the more efficient corporation will drive the others out. but this is a business, not a household concern. [13:25]
asciilifeform: i suspect that 'sound money' is a fantasy [13:25]
asciilifeform: at least in the mythical sense of 'i put value in and arbitrarily later i get at least this much out NO MATTER WHAT HAPPENS' [13:25]
mircea_popescu: PeterL it works for the group. a society with better investment policies will have more intensive usage of capital and thus drive other societies out [13:25]
mircea_popescu: it doesn't do much for the individual. [13:25]
mircea_popescu: investing is, by and large, the capitalist equivalent of honorable in fedualism. the country with more honorable barons had a better footing in war. [13:26]
mircea_popescu: same headcount of cattle, weirs and lands to distribute as squires, stronger army nevertheless. [13:26]
asciilifeform: this is why i always had sympathy with the folks who pete_dushenski enjoys feeling superior to. [13:26]
asciilifeform: because the ONLY THING no one can ever take from you is the icecream you ATE YESTERDAY [13:26]
asciilifeform: this is basic animal wisdom. [13:27]
mircea_popescu: (also more intensive use of capital : took 5 swings of the sword before running away, instead of 4. sword-on-battlefield is the eminent capital of feudalism) [13:27]
asciilifeform: (and yes, eventually it leads to the pork shop) [13:27]
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i understand why you pick example of feudal battlefield, rather than red army, but the latter was actually the state of the art afaik. [13:28]
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform the reason "no one can take from you" is because it's been taken already. sorta like nobody can burn water or steal the intelligence of mongoloids. [13:28]
asciilifeform: in terms of most recent success of 'seppuku honour' [13:28]
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform mostly didn't pick because marginal and not so interesting. what about it ? [13:29]
asciilifeform: interesting in that it refuted orwell's argument in re how folks renouncing their 'i'm a precious snowzflake!111 individual!' thing and dying with hounour have to buy into supernatural claptral [13:30]
asciilifeform: *claptrap [13:30]
asciilifeform: he gnashed his teeth at length about this, recall. [13:30]
mircea_popescu: but they did buy into supernatural claptrap. [13:30]
mircea_popescu: what, you think just because xtianity pretended to quarrel with itself, socialism is anything other than catolicism now ?! [13:31]
mircea_popescu: same stupid shit, from the same roots, by the same people. [13:31]
pete_dushenski: back! [13:32]
pete_dushenski: << asciilifeform [13:32]
pete_dushenski: << mircea_popescu [13:32]
ben_vulpes: april, may, july [13:32]
ben_vulpes: not a lot of time to get keccak into the hairball. [13:32]
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: whatchawaitinfor ? [13:33]
asciilifeform: go, get. [13:33]
ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: who said anything about waiting [13:33]
pete_dushenski: ben_vulpes: not saying you should rent a car and "win" "points", but you recall our earlier discussion of tco ? [13:33]
ben_vulpes: btw, where is the epic mp asciilifeform thread about tuning the nonce shifting to ensure nodes have a market for their digests? [13:34]
pete_dushenski: hard to beat $81/mo with another few bucks for leccy. [13:34]
asciilifeform: pete_dushenski: how many of these do you have now ? [13:34]
asciilifeform: i personally have 1 arse [13:34]
asciilifeform: and so never was tempted to keep >1 auto. [13:34]
ben_vulpes: i'll take the odd thousand dollar charge over a car lease. [13:34]
ben_vulpes: mostly because i intend to own the thing for over a decade, and not drive it a whole lot. [13:35]
pete_dushenski: asciilifeform: cars ? just two, soon to be whittled back down to 1, but then perhaps back to two. [13:35]
asciilifeform: pete_dushenski: does the woman drive ? [13:35]
pete_dushenski: sure, with own car. three in house atm. [13:36]
ben_vulpes: pete_dushenski's wife's car is not on pete_dushenski's books? [13:36]
pete_dushenski: ben_vulpes: what you'll take and what's more economical are different considerations [13:37]
* asciilifeform has ancient and uninteresting auto and will have it for so long as parts can be had for it [13:37]
pete_dushenski: ben_vulpes: mnope [13:37]
ben_vulpes: microelectric shitmobile is economical in the same way that ersatz american cheese is economical [13:37]
pete_dushenski: asciilifeform: for the automologists, mind sharing make, model, and year ? [13:38]
asciilifeform: 'acura', almost old enough to drive itself, 6 cyl. [13:38]
asciilifeform: i forget which model exactly [13:38]
pete_dushenski: 4 door ? tl ? [13:38]
mircea_popescu: is that a toyota ? [13:38]
asciilifeform: early 2000s [13:38]
pete_dushenski: honda [13:38]
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: a type of honda [13:38]
mircea_popescu: i thought honda made motorbikes. [13:39]
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: they make even chainsaws [13:39]
pete_dushenski: toyota makes lexus as 'lux brand' [13:39]
pete_dushenski: asciilifeform: snowplows too [13:39]
asciilifeform: generators! [13:39]
ben_vulpes: generators! [13:39]
ben_vulpes: heh [13:39]
mircea_popescu: hitachi wands ? [13:40]
mircea_popescu: new from honda : the combination hitachi-tamaguchi [13:40]
asciilifeform: petrol-powered! [13:40]
asciilifeform: (or, a diesel diddler!) [13:40]
ben_vulpes: now /those/ are some good vibrations. [13:40]
mircea_popescu: im surprised these don't exist, ftr. [13:40]
* ben_vulpes hums [13:40]
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: there ~were~ steam diddlers in 1880s [13:40]
mircea_popescu: nono, the pet dildo. [13:41]
asciilifeform: ah [13:41]
asciilifeform: l0l [13:41]
asciilifeform: mega-concept [13:41]
asciilifeform: i almost want to build. [13:41]
mircea_popescu: gotta ride it or it dies. [13:41]
mircea_popescu: can develop personality, may end up wanting to fuck your friends etc. [13:41]
asciilifeform: and if it is unhappy, it burps, sputters [13:41]
pete_dushenski: ben_vulpes: how does leased electricmobile that will work hummingly and economically for three years until returned to mothership compare to plastic food that becomes part of one's body ? [13:41]
mircea_popescu: MY DILDO BROKE UP WITH ME WAAAHHH [13:41]
asciilifeform: dildogocchi! [13:42]
mircea_popescu: this is really not a bad idea [13:42]
pete_dushenski: should be in every elementary shcool [13:42]
mircea_popescu: can make $$$ out of attachables, too, apple style. [13:42]
mircea_popescu: nipple clamps, you name it. [13:42]
ben_vulpes: 'tis an ersatz auto [13:42]
pete_dushenski: ben_vulpes: you ever buy that suv btw ? [13:43]
mircea_popescu: "I’m over six miles from the city line, among townhomes that go for 400K, walking through a park that is a slice of solitude during the day and a gauntlet at night a park where I have seen two gangs parley in a formal manner as I pretended to be some homeless slob on the next bench, and where, this time last year, I saw a white stoner in his 20s trying to talk his girl into getting into a van full of black guys as she crie [13:43]
mircea_popescu: d and gasped." [13:43]
mircea_popescu: ima end up moving to baltimore for reals. [13:43]
mircea_popescu: this guy sure knows how to entice. [13:43]
ben_vulpes: pete_dushenski: mhm [13:43]
asciilifeform: bmore is valhalla, at least in american terms [13:43]
asciilifeform: i enjoy taking day trips there [13:43]
asciilifeform: the sea even stinks correctly, per my lights [13:44]
asciilifeform: the fauna, strangely, never bothered me. [13:44]
mircea_popescu: eh the fear is always overstated. [13:44]
mircea_popescu: maidenly tremors. [13:44]
asciilifeform: srsly they never even so much as said a rude word. [13:44]
mircea_popescu: aqnd yet you are convinced you'll get buttloved in prison. [13:45]
asciilifeform: prolly just bored to death. [13:45]
mircea_popescu: or maybe bored to new life! [13:45]
asciilifeform: (perhaps i am already in prison?) [13:45]
asciilifeform: l0l we just had a man publicly quit in disgust [13:46]
ben_vulpes: lol over what? [13:47]
asciilifeform: pay. [13:47]
mircea_popescu: how much was he making ? [13:48]
asciilifeform: i have nfi! [13:48]
asciilifeform: but i dun think anyone, even janitor, taks home less than 6fig usa [13:49]
mircea_popescu: heh. guy won't even share what he's making when quitting in disgust. teh bars run deep. [13:49]
asciilifeform: fella thought, as they often do, that 'deserved moar!1111' [13:49]
mircea_popescu: "The NEWS will depict this violence as a protest gone out of control. However, as of 11:00 a.m. black female cashiers at the Shoppers supermarket at Mondawmin mall knew through social media that riots were being planned by high school students—an attack from students at one school [Frederick Douglas high School] on the very shopping center their parent's patronized." << this actuallyt is very illustrative of the whole "spyi [13:50]
mircea_popescu: ng/datamining" thing. [13:50]
asciilifeform: now he can have fun, likely, incinerating his savings while looking for shop that pays his old wage. [13:50]
mircea_popescu: usg would like to know as much as black min wage workers but it can't ask them [13:50]
mircea_popescu: why can't it ask them ? ha! because it's made up of pasty white boys. it can't ask them for the same reasonh the pasty ass white boys individually can't ask the cashiers for a blowjob. [13:51]
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: there are entire office bldgs where they do nothing but hear out stoolies of all colours [13:51]
asciilifeform: usg ~knows~ but it is impolitic to ~do~ anything. [13:51]
mircea_popescu: so ? [13:51]
mircea_popescu: knows my foot. [13:52]
asciilifeform: what would it have done differently, in mircea_popescu's view, if it knew ? [13:52]
mircea_popescu: what, there's a relation between knowledge and action now ? [13:52]
mircea_popescu: what'd you do differently if you knew what ? [13:52]
asciilifeform: let's rephrase, how did mircea_popescu become convinced that usg did ~not know~ ? [13:53]
mircea_popescu: by its attempts to find out. [13:53]
asciilifeform: ~all of which~ he is privy to ?? [13:53]
mircea_popescu: looky : there's many kinds of know. couple lives across the hall from you. you "know" they're probably fucking now and again. this is very different from teenager spying through door cracks to catch glimpses. [13:53]
mircea_popescu: which latter category the whole "datamining/surveillance" crap is all about. [13:54]
mircea_popescu: the white people like it because it certifies their interesting-ness, just like a neglected housewife is flattered by the attention of pubescent makes. the government engages in the behaviour because it is a pubescent male. win-win as they say. [13:55]
pete_dushenski: << mircea_popescu [14:06]
pete_dushenski: bbl [14:06]
phf: so a grep through an entire log takes 1.5s (testing with grep lsd), same thing done in a log thingy takes 3s [14:07]
phf: anyone remember that article about grep doing some weird tricks to speed itself up? [14:07]
mircea_popescu: aha! [14:08]
mircea_popescu: specifically "selling out the general case to favour the common case" [14:08]
phf: oddest things using #'= in a search across numeric vectors instead of #'eql slows things down by 1.3 seconds... [14:13]
mircea_popescu: sounds like poorly implemented whatever, lisp ? [14:15]
phf: yeah.. [14:17]
mircea_popescu: i tell you : store the thing as trees. [14:20]
mircea_popescu: waste the ram, save the cpu. [14:20]
phf: but that means some tokenization algo, which presumably breaks ascii's "want search like grep!!!1" requirement [14:24]
mircea_popescu: tokenize by space [14:24]
mircea_popescu: if he doesn't like space as a tokenizer he has other issues. [14:24]
phf: yeah, that's what i'm thinking, and then things like $#434 will just have whatever own buckets that they want [14:25]
mircea_popescu: specifically, $-#-4-3-4 and you found it 5 nodes down. [14:25]
mircea_popescu: this is the golden means between the abaccus of filling the log with #twitter #dumb #shit and the insanity of string-searching gb of material each pageload. [14:27]
mircea_popescu: like it or not, we, or at least i, actually DO tokenize by space. [14:27]
mircea_popescu: phf how much is the actual log incidentally ? i see well over 600mb here. [14:31]
phf: So kako's dump which is only idtimestampnickmessage adds up to ~~150mb [14:43]
phf: I think joins and quits add a lot of extra noise [14:44]
phf: Room on a running cmu instance gives 168mb. Peanuts [14:45]
PeterL: how many gigabits of ram you working with? [14:47]
phf: My assumption is always +inf but I like to keep heap minimal out of sportsmanship [14:48]
phf: (Erm `room' on a lisp says how much you're using rather than how much is left) [14:56]
jurov: deedbot-: [15:12]
deedbot-: accepted: 1 [15:12]
jurov: deedbot-: [15:12]
deedbot-: accepted: 1 [15:12]
asciilifeform: 'It is improper. Enumerations must always be made of items of the same kind. It's not enough that the items answer to the same purpose. They must actually be of the same kind.' << aaaaand this is how we learned that mircea_popescu , under the cover of darkness, programs! in ada !1111 [15:13]
shinohai: <<< cia goes rogerkver [15:16]
asciilifeform: in other nyooz, [15:20]
asciilifeform: 'Social networking forum reddit on Thursday removed a section from its site used to tacitly inform users it had never received a certain type of U.S. government surveillance request, suggesting the platform is now being asked to hand over customer data under a secretive law enforcement authority.' [15:20]
asciilifeform: what is there even to surveil on reddit. [15:22]
asciilifeform: whole thing is public, like city sewer. [15:22]
asciilifeform: afaik. [15:22]
danielpbarron: ben_vulpes> btw, where is the epic mp asciilifeform thread about tuning the nonce shifting << [15:31]
danielpbarron: mircea_popescu, << but it any case / but ~in~ any case ? [15:32]
asciilifeform: ^ notably i was not involved with this iirc. [15:32]
trinque: asciilifeform: there are direct messages on reddit [15:49]
trinque: prolly those [15:49]
trinque: and 1337 terrorists in private subreddits [15:49]
danielpbarron: and ip addresses [15:49]
asciilifeform: l0l [15:49]
asciilifeform: prolly danielpbarron has it [15:49]
danielpbarron: there are 'dark market' 'subreddits' [15:50]
asciilifeform: not to mention, gotta plant flash 0days in selected folks' reddit hose [15:50]
asciilifeform: though i have nfi why this needs to happen with cooperation of reddit per se [15:50]
asciilifeform: they could as easily do it on isp end. [15:50]
danielpbarron: i recall the original silk road had it's own .onion web forum, but i guess this was too hard for the kids who showed up after it was cool [15:51]
trinque: asciilifeform: smells like a general trend of making companies get used to acting as part of law enforcement [15:51]
asciilifeform: yeah but why reddit, vs isp. [15:51]
asciilifeform: thin end of the funnel. [15:51]
trinque: already has isp [15:51]
trinque: why not reddit too [15:51]
asciilifeform: sure. [15:52]
danielpbarron: and general trend of "oh ~now~ reddit plays ball with USG (implication that it hadn't been already)" [15:52]
trinque: outsource as much "law enforcement" as possible [15:52]
trinque: danielpbarron: yup, apple, google et al [15:52]
phf: when's gabriel_laddel going to join us [15:57]
PeterL: just outsource law enforcement all the way and make it illegal for people to break the laws! [15:57]
asciilifeform: win. [15:58]
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: [15:58]
phf: from the world of lisp rot, asdf, the `make' of common lisp, has been gaining features for a while now to the point that it contains all kinds of crazy shit, like a fullblown cross-lisp compatibility layer for various file operations, etc. so i pulled version 1.369, last one before faré took over the operations, it is 75kb vs current 560k (which is itself packed from a large repo). not surprisingly it works, but when it doesn't it exposes cockroa [16:05]
phf: ches in the walls. dodgy/clever hacks, "modern ecosystem" "improvements", etc. etc. [16:05]
asciilifeform: 'quicklisp' sorta workx [16:06]
phf: quicklisp depends on asdf, in fact hard depends on asdf3. it takes exactly three places to patch it to support 1.369 and it continues working [16:07]
asciilifeform: it does. [16:07]
phf: i mean, 75kb or readable lisp vs. 560kb or crazy "with-upgradability" macros that break cross-referencing, etc. [16:07]
asciilifeform: and so i marvel that it worx. [16:07]
phf: ah ah [16:07]
asciilifeform: but increasingly i am convinced of mircea_popescu's point, 'ecosystem' of cockroaches is worse than none [16:08]
asciilifeform: which is one of the resons thinking folk so often succumb to the temptation of 'let's make a lang' [16:08]
phf: i'd read it to figure out what the "improvements" are, but i can't, because the new code is ~insane~ [16:08]
asciilifeform: but roaches show up as quickly as they come to a newly-built block of flats in nyc [16:08]
pete_dushenski: in other dirigible news, [16:09]
phf: fare had to make "hacking on asdf" videos just to get people to read the damn thing [16:09]
pete_dushenski: "The Local Dirigible Manufacturing requirement is expected to kickstart a nascent aerospace industry in Alberta, furthering government’s effort to diversify the economy. " << kek [16:09]
asciilifeform: pete_dushenski: this is hilarious [16:09]
asciilifeform: pete_dushenski: consider, a litre of hydrogen lifts ~1 gram. [16:09]
asciilifeform: helium - less. [16:09]
pete_dushenski: hehe [16:10]
PeterL: use atomic instead of molecular hydrogen - half the mass, so lifts twice as much! [16:22]
asciilifeform: l0l!! [16:22]
asciilifeform: let's go straight to davinci's vacuum balloon . [16:23]
PeterL: but nature abhors a vacuum, would be like inciting the wrath of God [16:23]
PeterL: what if you heat the hydrogen? [16:25]
asciilifeform: heat, heat ! [16:25]
PeterL: mix dirigible and hot air baloon into one sweet machine! [16:25]
phf: [16:29]
asciilifeform: later tell mircea_popescu [16:33]
gribble: The operation succeeded. [16:33]
jurov: phf you're really saying 2x slowdown factor of lisp vs. C is bad and should be further optimized? [16:35]
trinque: phf: hey how do you deploy a lisp thing? [16:35]
trinque: I might just ship new deedbot with swank attached [16:36]
phf: jurov: i can often get slightly better performance out of cmucl than out of c on critical paths, so that was purely algorithmic question under the assumption that i can easily get within same ballpark with the right algo [16:37]
phf: trinque: rsync, tmux, asdf, really nothing smarter than that [16:37]
asciilifeform: phf: remind me again why cmucl and not sbcl [16:38]
phf: swank is pretty useless on prod, unless you jump through all hoops ahead of time and get it to a casual state. you want ssh files to work and trump is still slow for that, so you have to do fusefs [16:38]
trinque: yes but what about dumber !1!11 [16:38]
asciilifeform: does cmucl even support ACTUAL threads yet [16:38]
phf: trinque: so just deploy the way you would normally deploy and write a simple set of operator commands (or even a menu driven thing) for repl, that you can control things over. "press 1 to asdf reload :FOO package, press 2 to reinitilize data, etc." [16:40]
jurov: phf, as a lisp newbie i wondered why asdf is so consistently tagged "obsolete" everywhere [16:41]
phf: i played with swank on live webserver setup (back when marco's UnCommonWeb was a thing) and quickly gave up on it, when i was hit with a bug that 100+ people triggered [16:41]
pete_dushenski: [16:41]
pete_dushenski: "Drivers may notice a decrease in fuel efficiency of between 5 and 32 percent, depending on climate, engine model year, and driving habits. Some drivers may also notice a decrease in power under certain conditions, such as full-throttle driving or highway operation. In some tests, the power rating of the VW TDI engine was affected by as much as 26 percent during full-throttle operation in cold climates. Finally, the increas [16:41]
pete_dushenski: ty cycle brought on by changes in engine programming may significantly reduce the time between major services for TDI engines coupled to a manual transmission." << /me falls off chair [16:41]
phf: the whole swank debug on error thing is just not as good as Squeak/smalltalk [16:41]
trinque: hm, could also use unix signals for reload and whatever else maybe [16:42]
* pete_dushenski called out the fact that "fixed veedubs" will be worth ~more~ than their unneutered counterparts on the used market. this confirms it. [16:43]
phf: pretty much all lisps are picky about signals [16:43]
trinque: for now I'll just turd out a save-lisp-and-die and go from there [16:43]
jurov: and i wondered whether it's me or swan is really so cranky [16:44]
asciilifeform: pete_dushenski: april1? [16:44]
phf: slad is brittle unless you have identical lisps (version/os) on dev machine and server [16:44]
phf: i don't on account of mac/linux [16:44]
pete_dushenski: asciilifeform: lololol. i've been mega-had [16:44]
phf: also proper slad should be smart about resource handling on fork, like sockets. i think this is all somehow handled by the vm, but you still want to explore it [16:44]
phf: really, asdf lets you do "load all my source" quite trivially as long as you packed it into a package ahead of time [16:45]
phf: jurov: i've not seen where asdf is deprecated, you looking at this guy [16:46]
phf: jurov: also i agree as far as swank being piece of shit, it's just that it supports a certain development style that you can't get anywhere else, except smalltalk [16:47]
jurov: "Do NOT use asdf-install anymore, for it is both obsolete and unmaintained." [16:47]
phf: ah, "asdf-install" is an old really hacky way of install lisp packages, that would pull things from it was very broken [16:48]
pete_dushenski: bbl. apologies for fool's day spam. [16:48]
jurov: and "(obsolete)" markers at many places like [16:48]
phf: so you generally have two problems, one is "how do i group together multiple source code files in order to indicate they are part of same codebase", second is "how do i indicate dependency of this codebase on this other codebase" and third is "how do i autodownload things from internet" [16:50]
asciilifeform: phf: does this remind you of anything ? [16:51]
phf: two problems, fear, surprise and a most ruthless [16:51]
asciilifeform: if only tmsr had a thing that solves all 3... l0l [16:52]
asciilifeform: i seem to recall.. [16:52]
phf: jurov: so asdf solves first two, asdf-install used to solve third one, now superseded by quicklisp [16:52]
phf: asciilifeform: to be fair v doesn't solve third one [16:55]
asciilifeform: the third one is not a problem ! [16:57]
asciilifeform: it is solved by ~not doing it~ [16:57]
asciilifeform: 'how do i remove the alligator from my bath' [16:57]
phf: woo [17:16]
phf: boyer-mooring brought it down to 0.34s [17:17]
asciilifeform: neato [17:18]
pete_dushenski: later tell PeterL haven't read ramsey, no. [17:52]
gribble: The operation succeeded. [17:52]
pete_dushenski: later tell ben_vulpes it may well be that i hail from narnia, but yes, interest rates and house prices are inversely correlated. furthermore, and i forget sometimes that americans lock in rates for entire mortgages, but canadians typically renegotiate their rates every 5 years. longer terms are available, but it's been +ev to take shorter terms for so long that i don't know of a single homeowner who doesn't do 5-year term [17:56]
gribble: The operation succeeded. [17:56]
asciilifeform: pete_dushenski: being the pig is also +ev until christmas. [17:57]
BingoBoingo: <phf> proper way to deal with iowa is buy a house, get your 800$/mo satellite internet (not even checking what's available, why bother), and do your aerospace/banking/medical it consulting work remote << In Iowa you can probably get fiber internet unless you conciously decide to farm or hermit [17:57]
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo, phf: ever actually connect over satellite ? the lag is atrocious [17:58]
pete_dushenski: asciilifeform: with 10-year MAX for mortgage rates in canada, even if amortization is 30 years, it's be a pig, buy house for cash, or rent. [17:58]
asciilifeform: and forget about 'all you can eat' bandwidth [17:58]
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Which is why I suggest if choosing Iowa choose fiber internet. No Verizon needed. [17:59]
pete_dushenski: " With only 7% of Canadians having mortgage terms between six and 10 years, long terms are not a popular choice in Canada. They are even less popular amongst younger age groups at only 3% uptake in ages 18-34." [17:59]
phf: good for mp internet, lynx, batch email u/d, git pull/push. basically all you need to do work (all i need anyway) [17:59]
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: if you can do iowa, you can do timisoara, no ? [17:59]
pete_dushenski: it's no wonder everyone is screaming "canada has a housing bubble" [17:59]
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Only people I know from timisoara left there. [18:00]
pete_dushenski: phf: you forgot tumblr gifpr0n [18:00]
asciilifeform: hell, if you can do remote, why even live on land and pay rent like an idiot. live on a motherfucking ship. [18:01]
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: how many you know in iowa ? [18:01]
phf: boat living is kind of rough [18:02]
pete_dushenski: asciilifeform: piracy is, after all, easier than bagging a lunch [18:02]
* shinohai buys a boat and starts a bitcoin privateer business with pete_dushenski [18:02]
asciilifeform: phf: if i could choose between rent and seasickness, i would choose the latter. [18:02]
pete_dushenski: shinohai: we'll be consultants! like dogbert's bit wherein he sells $1k books on how to become a millionaire. inside book it suggests "sell 1k books for $1k!" [18:03]
phf: in other news, [18:04]
pete_dushenski: << from same series [18:04]
pete_dushenski: [18:04]
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: 5, but my dick has been inside 1 of them so 20% interesting rate. [18:05]
BingoBoingo: <mircea_popescu> ideally, they go in the form of renting time from a workshop wtf is this my garage is my workshop artisan thing. << Arises from the idea that public tools are icky [18:05]
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: incidentally you can't actually rent time ~in someone else's~ workshop in usa - liability!1111 [18:06]
phf: asciilifeform: grep search, so lsd matches rtlsdr or "woulsdn't" AS REQUESTED [18:06]
asciilifeform: what one ~can~ do is participate in 'hackspaces' but i tried it and it sucked [18:06]
asciilifeform: i dun wanna talk to people. [18:06]
pete_dushenski: << relatedly, stan as dogbert [18:06]
asciilifeform: when i'm trying to tool [18:06]
asciilifeform: phf: neato [18:06]
asciilifeform: phf: toggleable whitespace word boundaries would be useful but i argue that if we can only have one thing, we oughta have the thing you linked to. [18:07]
asciilifeform: ideally i oughta be able to search for " lsd " tho. [18:07]
asciilifeform: AS IN GREP [18:08]
phf: that doesn't match bol and eol of course [18:08]
phf: [18:09]
asciilifeform: sure. [18:09]
asciilifeform: neato [18:10]
phf: it's also not as useful for freeform searching like [18:12]
phf: assbot: 1 results for 'meth lsd lisp' : [18:12]
phf: which returns 29-08-2015 14:14:55 <mircea_popescu> maybe you're right, and it's incidentals. or maybe lisp to the young mind is like meth-lsd [18:12]
pete_dushenski: << pre-fools nooz [18:14]
phf: should probably call this search grep, and have that as first thing, eventually to be replaced by proper search-a-tron [18:14]
asciilifeform: pete_dushenski: what's the exciting part? this happens allt he fucking time [18:15]
phf: the one where people can tokenize and write queries and shit [18:15]
phf: replaced/augmented [18:15]
pete_dushenski: asciilifeform: oh ? [18:16]
asciilifeform: pete_dushenski: li battery recalls are a snore [18:18]
phf: a side effect of all things being interconnected, searching for bitcoind includes annotations, which in this case take you to correct follow ups [18:21]
trinque: damn that's cool [18:23]
trinque: nicely done [18:23]
asciilifeform: very spiffy [18:23]
asciilifeform: when can we use1111 [18:24]
ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: nevermind that the tools in 'hackerspaces' are invariably so completely out of true as to be useless [19:14]
ben_vulpes: later tell pete_dushenski interesting! so one can either borrow at a low rate and expect no return, or borrow at a high rate and pray for a return? [19:14]
gribble: The operation succeeded. [19:14]
deedbot-: [Ossasepia] The Coolest Guide to Coolness, Riches, Ginger and Spice - [19:21]
BingoBoingo: ben_vulpes: I class that under "icky" [19:21]
mircea_popescu: onoes, lengthy log [19:33]
mircea_popescu: is there website yet ? ?? ????! [19:33]
mircea_popescu: phf> So kako's dump which is only idtimestampnickmessage adds up to ~~150mb <<< when does this start ? [19:34]
mircea_popescu: danielpbarron aha! [19:35]
mircea_popescu: PeterL> mix dirigible and hot air baloon into one sweet machine! << self heating, and also propelling! [19:40]
mircea_popescu: phf> so you generally have two problems, one is "how do i group together multiple source code files in order to indicate they are part of same codebase", second is "how do i indicate dependency of this codebase on this other codebase" and third is "how do i autodownload things from internet" <<< all of which are really "how do i install v" [19:42]
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform> pete_dushenski: being the pig is also +ev until christmas. << he has a point. "renegotiable" when your side of the negotiation is pack it and leave and their side is "take it or leave it" is insanity on a stick. [19:44]
mircea_popescu: phf> it's also not as useful for freeform searching like << why not ? reunion! [19:47]
mircea_popescu: diana_coman "Ha, wouldn’t you say that’s how it happens really?" << hey what's this mean ? [19:49]
diana_coman: don't millionaires really get there by reading guides? [19:50]
diana_coman: no? [19:50]
diana_coman: as in my pretty picture? [19:50]
diana_coman: and doing all the exercises in the guides, ofc, not "just reading" [19:51]
mircea_popescu: i read it like 3 times still dun know which one are you saying [19:52]
mircea_popescu: you saying they are or you saying they aren't ? [19:53]
diana_coman: heh, was I having so much fun that it's unclear whether I am serious or having fun? lolz [19:53]
diana_coman: hmm, let me try to make it clearer maybe [19:54]
diana_coman: 2 min [19:54]
mircea_popescu: "At the very least, they need to do what they can do, as it were" << but this is not ~specific~. [19:54]
diana_coman: nope, nor can it be my observation for what it's worth is that people interact with reality at different levels basically, as they can [19:55]
mircea_popescu: quite. [19:55]
diana_coman: it's not a matter of doing X or Y, but rather HOW one does X or Y [19:55]
mircea_popescu: well no. it's a matter of being what they are. hence the ancient "you can't just power cycle a box with no idea of what you are doing". [19:55]
mircea_popescu: the same exact action, in the hand of the idiot is an idiocy and in the hand of the millionare, millionarcy. hence the ancient "there's no such thing as your idea" thread [19:56]
diana_coman: hm: a. people change who they are all the time really (think dementia for a clear example, not that all are through illness or that radical) [19:57]
diana_coman: and b. this thing is quite circular as you say it or as I read what you say [19:58]
diana_coman: so I don't quite see the point to expressing circles (other than they are satisfying) [19:58]
mircea_popescu: this "people change" thing is very dubious. [19:58]
mircea_popescu: people turn to shit as they age, and that's all. [19:59]
mircea_popescu: some quicker than others. [19:59]
diana_coman: except some actually improve as they age [19:59]
mircea_popescu: to quote marsellus "the punk" wallace, " You see, this profession is filled to the brim with unrealistic motherfuckers. Motherfuckers who thought their ass would age like wine. If you mean it turns to vinegar, it does. If you mean it gets better with age, it don't. " [20:00]
diana_coman: and if people don't change, then get yourself a newborn and tell me how is s/he the millionaire [20:00]
mircea_popescu: children aren't people. [20:01]
diana_coman: by that measure old people aren't people and idiots aren't people and non-millionaires aren't people and yeah, sure, there's nothing left to discuss either [20:01]
diana_coman: certainly [20:01]
mircea_popescu: whether other items are or aren't people has no bearing on the fact that children aren't however. [20:02]
diana_coman: mk define people then [20:02]
mircea_popescu: it'll have to be argued on its own merits, not collective-bargained for. [20:02]
diana_coman: so that we know what we are talking about [20:02]
mircea_popescu: adults of the hs species. [20:03]
diana_coman: it's not about collective-bargaining, it's about the fact that all of a sudden it seems we are talking about different entities, so we need to set the definitions somehow [20:03]
mircea_popescu: juveniles aren't the animal in any other consideration or context. they WILL be the animal at some point, sure. but the very point of juvenility is they aren't. [20:03]
mircea_popescu: not just yet. [20:03]
diana_coman: mhm, so biologically adults or what? [20:04]
mircea_popescu: whatever way you please. [20:04]
diana_coman: mk, so an adult is set then to whatever s/he is is that your position above that people don't change? (I still don't see how is this really reconciled with "they turn to shit as they age!!" - if they change, they can't turn to anything ) [20:07]
diana_coman: if they don't change* [20:07]
mircea_popescu: they turn to corpses. [20:08]
mircea_popescu: life isn't "whatever we make of it", but a rather well constrained biological process. [20:08]
mircea_popescu: similarly a string doesn't "turn into anything". and main section stars don't turn into really large conglomeration of bathroom rubber duckies. [20:08]
diana_coman: so let me see this: child-adult-corpse-dead [20:09]
diana_coman: right? [20:09]
mircea_popescu: something like that. [20:09]
diana_coman: but things don't turn into anything, so how is this child turns into adult? [20:09]
mircea_popescu: huh ? [20:09]
diana_coman: and for that matter what is learning exactly if not change [20:10]
mircea_popescu: you're not about to try and parlay the fact that the space of possibility is narrower than the space of representations into some sort of dilemma ? [20:10]
mircea_popescu: the things that can happen are fewer than the things that can be said. [20:10]
diana_coman: not sure I follow [20:11]
mircea_popescu: when i broadly reject your proposition of "change" understood in representational terms, i do not by that rejection also somehow reject actual change understood in actual terms. [20:11]
mircea_popescu: children turn to adults. this does not mean adults can turn into "millionaires". [20:12]
diana_coman: adults are adults or is now millionaire some other thing in there in between child-adult-corpse-dead? [20:12]
mircea_popescu: i have no idea what it is, and i don't see that it is very much at all. [20:12]
mircea_popescu: the whole point is that you can "be" a millionaire in the exact sense you can "be" a wife or a tree can "be" yours. [20:13]
diana_coman: so no, adults do not turn into anything other than corpse by the previous definition, but they do not remain immutable really, precisely as they were, precisely what they will always be [20:13]
mircea_popescu: depends in what terms. [20:14]
mircea_popescu: as far as this aspriational "being X" is concerned, yeah, they're closer to immutable than anything else. [20:14]
mircea_popescu: in purely atomic terms they're incredibly mutable, and a rather good approximation of "random pile of carbon nuclei". [20:15]
diana_coman: I suppose the difference comes at heart from defining millionaire as a state of being and thus an inevitable characteristic of the essence of a person (that's my understanding of your position) [20:15]
mircea_popescu: mno. at best it is a state of vision, and thus entirely unrelated to the object, [20:15]
mircea_popescu: much like any other psychosis. [20:15]
diana_coman: and my view of it as a stage basically [20:16]
mircea_popescu: being "a millionaire" is much like "being really scary". it's not something the thing IS, it's something the subject perceives. [20:16]
mircea_popescu: the object is just the object. [20:16]
diana_coman: mk, a state of vision so then what does this have to do with "being better" at all? [20:16]
mircea_popescu: no idea ? [20:16]
mircea_popescu: which is why i didn't approach the matter in ethical terms at all much to pete's displeasure. [20:17]
diana_coman: uhm, didn't you write "people who are better are better" [20:17]
mircea_popescu: would you prefer "seen as better" ? [20:18]
diana_coman: I read that as an implied millionaire=better otherwise why not right it as such: people who are millionaires, are millionaries [20:18]
diana_coman: ugh, write! [20:19]
diana_coman: millionaries like missionaries now, can't spell [20:19]
mircea_popescu: because i have no confidence the million is in any way related. it would seem to me the better is truly at issue. [20:19]
diana_coman: well, going back to the "interact with reality on different levels" thing might make it perhaps clearer: would this "millionaire vision" be basically a superior level of interaction? [20:23]
mircea_popescu: unrelatedly, this theory that baltimore riots is directly resulting from john hopkins hospital/uni buying gangland, much like flooding of a spot of floor is directly resulting from broom pushing on the other side of puddle is rather interesting. [20:24]
diana_coman: or just something in the eyes of the beholder? [20:24]
diana_coman: she's a beauty and he's a millionaire? lol [20:24]
mircea_popescu: diana_coman i believe it's not so different from any other simplified approach, such as johnny bravo seeing hot mammas all around or else orc warrior seeing world in terms of threats etc. [20:25]
diana_coman: I increasingly get the impression that you are trying to answer in that post to what you perceive to be people's actual ideas of the thing, but [20:26]
diana_coman: but it's not really clear what that is in itself anyway and then it gets mingled with what is actually said [20:26]
diana_coman: or maybe I just don't get it [20:26]
mircea_popescu: hey, if i didn't know better i'd think you're discussing a trilema article. [20:26]
diana_coman: lol [20:27]
diana_coman: anyway,at this level of haziness I don't think there's much that I can say further [20:34]
mircea_popescu: "The white men that were visible were all driving either cop cars or luxury sedans and SUVs. One SUV-load of stoned and drunk white men were shadowing a group of three black girls, calling out the window asking about prices, assuming they were hookers. A young guy standing at the stop next to me yelled to the insane looking Eastern European drunk that was hanging out the window, “Yo fool, they either givin’ it away or ki [20:36]
mircea_popescu: ckin’ yo ass. Nobody pays fo pussy anymore up in dis joint." << bwahahahaha [20:36]
mircea_popescu: see alfie, erections are scarce now that they have a cure for it. [20:36]
asciilifeform: waiwut [20:42]
asciilifeform: i still wish i knew what mircea_popescu means by 'erection is scarce' [20:43]
mircea_popescu: what is usually meant ? [20:43]
asciilifeform: because if taken literally, it is absurd [20:43]
mircea_popescu: you get 9 tools type A to 10 tools type B all the B's work, about half the A's work and while Bs are always on As are on 1% of the time or so. [20:44]
asciilifeform: erection is cheapest thing in the world [20:44]
mircea_popescu: what part of fucking scarcity needs explaining ? [20:44]
asciilifeform: the sort where it is wholly imaginated? [20:44]
mircea_popescu: erection is "cheapest thing in the world" in the sense "sword in battlefield is cheapest thing in the world". in yo dreams. [20:44]
asciilifeform: even a tard can muster erect [20:44]
mircea_popescu: hardly. [20:45]
asciilifeform: even beggar [20:45]
mircea_popescu: even old women can get wet. [20:45]
asciilifeform: well no, not symmetrical [20:45]
diana_coman: fwiw my understanding of that is simply that there are a whole lot of women around who can't get enough [20:45]
asciilifeform: but they want enough-mp [20:45]
diana_coman: so kind of more demand than supply [20:45]
asciilifeform: not enough-genericbloke [20:45]
mircea_popescu: the supply is utterly constrained, no matter how you dish it [20:45]
asciilifeform: 'erection is scarce' is a laugh [20:46]
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform average whore still works 4 an hour for 6 hours. do i sign you up for 24 fucks a day ? [20:46]
asciilifeform: yes? [20:46]
mircea_popescu: lolk. [20:47]
mircea_popescu: ima start s.malebrothel [20:47]
asciilifeform: but plox call things as they are, it is not erections that are scarce, but that mircea_popescu has only 1 cock afaik [20:48]
asciilifeform: and the chix can't all ride [20:48]
mircea_popescu: why do you think everyone'd want me specifically ? [20:48]
asciilifeform: who wants reddit cock? [20:49]
mircea_popescu: i have nfi, reddit people ? [20:49]
diana_coman: well, they don't seem to be adults there really, hence not people :D [20:49]
asciilifeform: afaik not [20:49]
asciilifeform: typical cunt wants nothing to do with typical cok [20:50]
mircea_popescu: i dunno that there's that many sexually active womenz on reddit. seems mostly BingoBoingo's mayogenders & weirdo bois. [20:50]
mircea_popescu: twitter im sorry [20:50]
mircea_popescu: uh no nm, you said reddit [20:50]
mircea_popescu: im fucking confused, reading lafond on one screen, talking to you here, and you don't use the same word for websocialmedia [20:51]
asciilifeform: at this point i'm not even sure whether most reddit userz are even made of meat [20:51]
asciilifeform: lol im also konphyoosed, i'm in a room full of chinese [20:52]
mircea_popescu: in other news, "Chamicka, age 14, says she accepted Hot Pockets frozen toaster sandwiches for sex and would gladly do it again.Nicole, age 15, says her and her 14 year old sister had sex with a man for a double cheeseburger. Whether it was the cheeseburger meal, and if it was supersized, was not made clear. And Chiquanna, age 14, says she had sex for a lobster buffet dinner." [20:52]
asciilifeform: bbl [20:52]
mircea_popescu: check it out, ten bitcents buys you all four. [20:52]
phf: mircea_popescu: 26-04-2013 [20:55]
mircea_popescu: **** BEGIN LOGGING AT Thu Apr 12 23:03:54 2012 < i have them earlier [20:56]
mircea_popescu: but of course they're only while i personallt was on [20:56]
phf: If you can pack&upload from 2012 to date above, I can integrate them [20:57]
mircea_popescu: yeah ima do that tomorro. [20:57]
phf: Unless somebody steps forward who had a bouncer instance running since the early days [20:57]
mircea_popescu: but yes a proper bouncer log would be better, save you the gaps you know ? [20:58]
phf: I'm not sure of a reasonable way of integrating it though. Main issue, and general with canonical log approach taken so far is each entry has an id, starts at 1, and incremented by assbot database [20:59]
mircea_popescu: mod6 hey man do you have bouncer logs of historical b-a ? [21:00]
mircea_popescu: phf no negative numbers on your planet ? [21:00]
phf: Hacky [21:00]
mircea_popescu: why ?! [21:00]
phf: Maybe not, I should think about it [21:03]
mircea_popescu: there's nothing inherently inferior about black oops i mean negative numbers, is there ? [21:03]
phf: You get a lot of nice properties if all your data has a positive fixnum ids [21:04]
mircea_popescu: such as ?\ [21:04]
phf: Can put it all in array, index things by ids [21:05]
mircea_popescu: there's a rule you can't index by negative numbers ? [21:05]
phf: Could add an offset to your references [21:07]
mircea_popescu: sure if you're going to do that might as well rebase your indexes in db, but anyway. [21:07]
phf: Then going to lose all old links [21:08]
mircea_popescu: you mean implicit array such as nth element of A as opposed to A[-5] sorta references ? [21:08]
phf: Right now there's a nice property of clicking old links in log and being redirected to new logger [21:08]
mircea_popescu: why, not able to also rebase the links in question ? [21:08]
phf: Well you can't do a[-1] because array indexing don't go that way. Can write two arrays a and b and make [n] access one or the other depending on the value [21:09]
mircea_popescu: it huh ? [21:10]
mircea_popescu: why the fuck not ? [21:10]
phf: You have to allocate underlying memory in which case a[n] is a claim about where in memory you are reading [21:11]
mircea_popescu: these are associative arrays, key ai, value bi. [21:11]
mircea_popescu: o this is in c ? [21:11]
phf: Nah, universally. A significant property of arrays shared across languages is that they give you some guarantees about access time, space utilization [21:12]
phf: There are dodgy array like things, that are not actually arrays. Like php that has dictionaries, and uses those to emulate arrays using something they call associative arrays [21:13]
mircea_popescu: if an array is not a key-value datastore, wtf is it ? [21:13]
mircea_popescu: a string ? [21:13]
phf: A key value data store is a dictionary [21:13]
phf: An array is a superset of string [21:14]
mircea_popescu: or otherwise : why the fuck would i use anything but strings if the only way to access elements is through a n-th reference. [21:14]
mircea_popescu: why even call this "an array". it's not an array it's a string. [21:14]
phf: You can store other things in arrays that are not chars, like pointers [21:14]
mircea_popescu: so you can store things in strings that aren't characters [21:14]
mircea_popescu: like utf abominations. [21:14]
mod6: <+mircea_popescu> mod6 hey man do you have bouncer logs of historical b-a ? << sadly, no. :/ [21:15]
mircea_popescu: aw! [21:15]
mod6: irk [21:15]
mircea_popescu: pigeons is gone, rg is gone [21:15]
mircea_popescu: look at that patrickharnett etc [21:15]
phf: That's fair, but mostly because the whole thing is a fiction [21:15]
phf: My logger thing stores log messages as arrays for example [21:16]
mod6: its a cryin' shame. i /used/ to log shit like a long time ago when it was #bitcoin-otc [21:16]
mod6: but stopped iirc once it was #b-a [21:16]
mircea_popescu: well seems i am actually the only one with the logs. [21:16]
mod6: ya, i'd give you a coin to bundle them up for me -- i'll store 'em somewhere for safe keeping. [21:17]
phf: Upload em and I will implement mp-array that can be indexed with negatives [21:17]
mircea_popescu: phf now i much better understand your reluctancy to tree [21:17]
mircea_popescu: let me guess, trees also can't be hash-indexed or some such bs [21:17]
phf: There's no reluctance to tree [21:18]
mircea_popescu: ah k [21:18]
phf: There's a fact that this code is written for my own amusement, so figuring out how to make memory grep fast is a priority [21:18]
phf: But implementing proper search is also a good direction [21:19]
mircea_popescu: the other fact is that i really don't do much coding (mostly because whenever i try i start throwing things out of displeasure of the sort seen above) [21:19]
phf: Since it's all written without use of any third party libraries I basically just take knuth and code it from scratch [21:19]
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: what means 'historical b-a' here ? [21:30]
asciilifeform: i have ~98% logz from 2013 up [21:30]
asciilifeform: **** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sat Oct 6 11:29:23 2012 [21:32]
asciilifeform: but i was a late-comer [21:32]
asciilifeform: <mircea_popescu> check it out, ten bitcents buys you all four. << i bet it buys a good bit of hot air. 14yos ~lie~... [21:46]
asciilifeform: also in usa 'sex' (esp among teenage scum) often refers to cock suction or otherwise cuntless pasttimes [21:47]
asciilifeform: in other nyooz, [21:50]
asciilifeform: [21:50]
asciilifeform: ^ 'Soft Rotten Meat Flavour' [21:51]
asciilifeform: Fat is not Greasy, Lean not Wood!111 [21:51]
asciilifeform: <phf> Upload em and I will implement mp-array that can be indexed with negatives << phun phakt, c will ~happily~ permit you to index with negatives. [21:53]
asciilifeform: at one rupturefarm where i applied to work, there was a notebook of 'pwn this proggy' underhanded-c questions, and one of them relied on this fact. [21:53]
asciilifeform: (yes you can walk up the stack - or heap, as the case may be - with a negative/overflowing array index) [21:53]
mod6: this is your fav. isn't it? [21:54]
mod6: haha [21:54]
asciilifeform: mod6: which this [21:54]
mod6: foo[-1] [21:54]
asciilifeform: nah it's a kind of pons asinorum of underhanded c [21:54]
asciilifeform: pretty basic. [21:54]
mod6: yah, we've discussed a bunch. [21:55]
* asciilifeform comes home and finds business card from woman, 'special investigator, diplomatic security service, u.s. dept of state', is momentarily puzzled, notices hand-written note on the back, asking for a fella who lives 2 houses DOWN THE STREET [21:56]
mod6: :) [21:57]
asciilifeform: such disappoint. [21:58]
asciilifeform: momentarily though, CLASSY gassing, sawn to pieces in a motherfucking EMBASSY, my limbs carried out in DIPLOMATIC BAGZ!11111 [21:58]
asciilifeform: but no. [21:58]
asciilifeform: mere illiteracy. [21:58]
asciilifeform: *thought [21:58]
mod6: let us hope not. [22:05]
BingoBoingo: [22:55]
asciilifeform: holy shit, 74b? [22:59]
asciilifeform: half an nsa? [22:59]
BingoBoingo: Yeah. Obesity ain't cheap [23:00]
trinque: it lives [23:01]
asciilifeform: congrats trinque [23:02]
trinque: takes the usual commands, among them: !register, !up, !down, !rate, !unrate, !rated, !gettrust, and !deed [23:02]
asciilifeform: so wot finally forked? [23:03]
trinque: yep. [23:03]
trinque: and I have not imported the old wot [23:04]
asciilifeform: woah [23:04]
asciilifeform: why's that [23:04]
trinque: matter for the forum to discuss it's not a decision to not, but haven't. [23:07]
asciilifeform: imho this will just lead to buckets of pointless sweat [23:08]
asciilifeform: regrunting the old ratingz [23:08]
trinque: mircea_popescu: ^ ? [23:09]
asciilifeform: not to mention when folks show up from outside, they still have their keyz, their histories, nobody cancelled them [23:09]
trinque: !register FC66C0C5D98C42A1D4A98B6B42F9985AFAB953C4 [23:12]
gribble: (register <nick> <keyid>) -- Register your GPG identity, associating GPG key <keyid> with <nick>. <keyid> is a 16 digit key id, with or without the '0x' prefix. We look on servers listed in 'plugins.GPG.keyservers' config. You will be given a random passphrase to clearsign with your key, and submit to the bot with the 'verify' command. Your passphrase will expire in 10 minutes. [23:12]
deedbot: FC66C0C5D98C42A1D4A98B6B42F9985AFAB953C4 registered as trinque. [23:12]
BingoBoingo: Seems like WOT fork bots are always unveiled on Fridays [23:13]
trinque: I'll properly package the source, clean shit up a bit, then post for asciilifeform, ben_vulpes, phf to give a beating. [23:15]
trinque: then appropriate to make a genesis v-patch and deed [23:15]
asciilifeform: << holy fuck, nightmare fuel [23:16]
asciilifeform: that mug. [23:16]
asciilifeform: in other nyooz, 'ALEXANDRIA, Va. – The hacker "Guccifer," alleged to be Marcel Lehel Lazar, 44, of Arad, Romania, made his initial appearance today here in federal court on charges relating to unauthorized access of protected computers. According to the indictment, from December 2012 to January 2014, Lazar hacked into....' [23:17]
trinque: old deedbot- will handle feeds til I make an rsstron for the CL guy [23:19]
mircea_popescu: trinque> and I have not imported the old wot << why not ?! [23:33]
mircea_popescu: by all means, import, import. [23:34]
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform shame on you for intimating indignities on the angelic character of children. do you not know they be pure as teh driven snot ?! [23:39]
trinque: man... who uses mysql [23:51]
deedbot-: [Qntra] US Spy Agency To Demolish Low Income Housing - [23:52]
mircea_popescu: You will be given a random passphrase to clearsign with your key <<< this is the wrong way to proceed. how about "we'll encrypt a random string to your key, which you must send back". [23:54]
mircea_popescu: o nm, lol gribble. [23:55]
trinque: yeah, that's what I'm doing [23:55]
mircea_popescu: cool. [23:55]
Category: Logs
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