Forum logs for 27 Oct 2012

Saturday, 23 November, Year 11 d.Tr. | Author: Mircea Popescu
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4800 @ 0.00047514 = 2.2807 BTC [+] [00:00]
* mrdavis (~mrdavis@d118-75-117-26.try.wideopenwest.com) has joined #bitcoin-assets [00:02]
smickles ;;calc ([bc,24hprc] - 11) / [bc,24hprc]) [00:04]
gribble Error: unexpected EOF while parsing (, line 1) [00:04]
smickles ;;calc ([bc,24hprc] - 11) / [bc,24hprc] [00:04]
gribble -0.0607521697203 [00:04]
smickles ;;calc (11 - [bc,24hprc]) / [bc,24hprc] [00:05]
gribble 0.0607521697203 [00:05]
smickles <@assbot> [MPEX] [O.BTCUSD.P110T] 48 @ 0.0538765 = 2.5861 BTC [+] [00:05]
smickles ;;calc (11 - [bc,24hprc]) / [bc,24hprc] - .0538765 [00:06]
gribble 0.00687566972035 [00:06]
smickles ;;calc ((11 - [bc,24hprc]) / [bc,24hprc] - .0538765) * 48 [00:06]
gribble 0.330032146577 [00:06]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 24274 @ 0.00047514 = 11.5335 BTC [+] [00:27]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 2626 @ 0.0004757 = 1.2492 BTC [+] [00:27]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11400 @ 0.00047471 = 5.4117 BTC [-] [00:53]
mircea_popescu sup ? [00:54]
mircea_popescu mod6 yup :D [00:54]
* BurtW has quit (Quit: Page closed) [00:55]
jurov someone plugged something.. blocks arrive at dizzying speed [00:56]
mircea_popescu ;;tslb [00:56]
gribble Time since last block: 3 minutes and 30 seconds [00:56]
mircea_popescu yah [00:56]
mircea_popescu Network total 24.362 Thash/s [00:56]
mircea_popescu it was 23 earlier today [00:57]
mircea_popescu and 20 last week [00:57]
jurov oh yes, our friends at ETH Zurich: http://blockchain.info/blocks/82.130.102.160 [00:57]
mircea_popescu just relay neh ? [00:58]
jurov no, they really mine with supercomputer..let me dig that.. [00:58]
jurov http://www.syssec.ethz.ch/research/Bitcoin [00:59]
mircea_popescu these are the guys that discovered doublespends and thought they cracked bitcoin iirc [01:02]
mircea_popescu http://beforeitsnews.com/science-and-technology/2012/10/bitcoin-can-topple-the-might-of-banks-say-researchers-but-needs-to-be-more-secure-2475802.html ya ya [01:02]
jurov looks like they want to help their budget [01:03]
mircea_popescu Network total 25.184 Thash/s [01:03]
mircea_popescu dude srsly. someone added 750 gh/s in 10 minutes [01:03]
PsychoticBoy Me ;) [01:04]
mircea_popescu lol wd [01:04]
mircea_popescu there goes gigavps' farm [01:04]
PsychoticBoy Sry mircea, I currently have ~120Gh/s, still less than giga iirc [01:06]
mod6 mircea_popescu: thanks! that's gonna be awesome. [01:06]
mircea_popescu mod6 :D should be! [01:07]
mod6 I've been swammped this last 2.5 weeks... I've still done a bunch of work on bitotter's encryption parts. Got a bit more to do there and then thats nearly it. [01:07]
mircea_popescu a good to hear. [01:07]
mircea_popescu ;;tslb [01:08]
gribble Time since last block: 5 minutes and 27 seconds [01:08]
mod6 Well, the JSONSTAT i'll grab once that's done and i'll be able to use that. the STAT screen is one remaining that I haven't designed yet just because I knew i'd have to just do it line at a time parsing or what not [01:08]
mod6 this speeds that whole thing way up. i have a bunch of reuseable code from the other JSON parsing stuff it does. [01:09]
mod6 :] [01:09]
mircea_popescu :D [01:09]
mircea_popescu you know how they say, if you don't do it today maybe tomorrow it won't need to be done anymore [01:10]
jurov hehe.. like i dreaded how would i accurately distribute interest to users [01:10]
mircea_popescu jurov : that's gonna be in the json :D [01:11]
jurov you plan to pay it again sometime? [01:11]
mircea_popescu yes. [01:11]
mod6 o/ [01:12]
mircea_popescu so hmm... mpoe gains 10%, btc loses 10% the next day [01:12]
mircea_popescu this is eerie [01:12]
mod6 thats like 2 awesome things in under 10 minutes [01:12]
mircea_popescu someone who bought mpoe say thursday has today the same dollar value of btc [01:13]
mod6 yeah -- new all time high yesterday on s.mpoe right? [01:14]
mircea_popescu yea [01:15]
mod6 ever since all of the stuff with nefario and glbse started getting heated up, the volume dropped for btc, and leaving what seemed only good support levels at like 7, 8, 9 [01:15]
mircea_popescu i doubt nefario drama has much impact [01:16]
mircea_popescu it's likely the miners [01:16]
mod6 oh with the difficulty being what is? [01:17]
mod6 what is it? [01:17]
mod6 ;;bc,estimate [01:17]
gribble 3220924.68525896 [01:17]
mod6 is that the right one? [01:17]
mod6 ;;bc,stats [01:17]
gribble Current Blocks: 205120 | Current Difficulty: 3072321.7320208 | Next Difficulty At Block: 205631 | Next Difficulty In: 511 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 3 days, 8 hours, 20 minutes, and 26 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 3220924.68525896 | Estimated Percent Change: 4.83682915397 [01:17]
mircea_popescu supposed to jump 5% but it might be even more [01:17]
jurov ;;bc,tslb [01:17]
gribble Time since last block: 6 minutes and 8 seconds [01:17]
mircea_popescu and another 100 gh/s added [01:18]
mod6 yeah wow. [01:18]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5500 @ 0.0004757 = 2.6164 BTC [+] [01:18]
mod6 less than 5000 blocks left! [01:18]
mircea_popescu http://bitcoinclock.com/ moving earlier into the 29th [01:19]
mod6 cool site :) [01:20]
mod6 aight gotta run for now. talk to you all a bit later! [01:20]
* mod6 is out [01:20]
mircea_popescu http://www.geekosystem.com/hermit-crab-mobs/ lol [01:30]
mircea_popescu Network total 27.649 Thash/s [01:34]
mircea_popescu holy cow [01:34]
mircea_popescu 2500 gh/s added past HALF HOUR [01:35]
PsychoticBoy still growing, would asics really be send in 3 weks? [01:35]
PsychoticBoy weeks* [01:35]
mircea_popescu maybe so [01:35]
mircea_popescu you suppose this is asicminer test run ? [01:35]
PsychoticBoy no more bfl [01:35]
BTC-Mining eh, just people jumping on their computer after dinner and their GPU starting could explain it too... total hashing rate varies a lot during the day [01:42]
BTC-Mining or just more luck finding block [01:42]
thestringpuller ;;ticker [01:42]
gribble BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 9.82206, Best ask: 9.92292, Bid-ask spread: 0.10086, Last trade: 9.93012, 24 hour volume: 95204.70588449, 24 hour low: 9.74000, 24 hour high: 10.95000, 24 hour vwap: 10.33927 [01:42]
BTC-Mining total network is estimated after all. [01:42]
thestringpuller ;;bc,24hprc [01:42]
gribble 10.32 [01:42]
mircea_popescu Network total 27.944 Thash/s [01:42]
mircea_popescu it doesn't vary a lot in the sense of going to 27+, no [01:42]
thestringpuller mr. mircea_popescu good to see you tonight [01:42]
mircea_popescu heya. [01:42]
thestringpuller i want an mpex account we'll talk soon [01:43]
thestringpuller ;;ticker [01:43]
gribble BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 9.82206, Best ask: 9.91787, Bid-ask spread: 0.09581, Last trade: 9.93012, 24 hour volume: 95204.70588449, 24 hour low: 9.74000, 24 hour high: 10.95000, 24 hour vwap: 10.33927 [01:43]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15000 @ 0.00047471 = 7.1207 BTC [-] [01:43]
BTC-Mining eh, about ASICMINER, I hope GLBSE release the information and they start trading again. [01:52]
mircea_popescu it's possible these are their asics we're seeing [01:54]
BTC-Mining But remember that a good part of the network might be from compromised machines/evening users. Users go online and network rate goes up. It's 7 PM now on the east coast [01:57]
BTC-Mining Their GPU starts and hop, 2.5 terahash added [01:57]
BTC-Mining 2.5 terahash is only 3000 - 10000 high end radeon GPU [01:58]
mircea_popescu come on [02:00]
mircea_popescu this was never seen historically. [02:00]
BTC-Mining http://bitcoin.sipa.be/speed-small-lin-2k.png [02:00]
BTC-Mining look at the 8 hour estimate for the last weeks. Goes as low as 15 Terahash and as high as 30 Terahash [02:01]
BTC-Mining It swings all the time [02:01]
mircea_popescu hm [02:01]
mircea_popescu maybe i haven't been paying enough attention [02:01]
BTC-Mining On what period is your network total averaged? [02:01]
mircea_popescu then again, i thought the number im quoting is 24h [02:02]
mircea_popescu http://bitcoincharts.com/charts/ up right there [02:02]
mircea_popescu iirc it was 24h but can't find a reference right now [02:02]
BTC-Mining hmm, well the 1 day estimate does vary by as much as 5 ghash [02:02]
BTC-Mining 5 terhash* [02:02]
mircea_popescu ya but it rarely went over 25 [02:03]
dub ;;bc,stats [02:03]
gribble Current Blocks: 205125 | Current Difficulty: 3072321.7320208 | Next Difficulty At Block: 205631 | Next Difficulty In: 506 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 3 days, 7 hours, 16 minutes, and 24 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 3223285.30550262 | Estimated Percent Change: 4.91366421389 [02:03]
dub ;;bc,diffchange [02:03]
gribble Estimated percent change in difficulty this period | 4.91366421389 % based on data since last change | 5.47811982694 % based on data for last three days [02:04]
BTC-Mining eh, indeed for that [02:04]
dub fucking bfl [02:04]
mircea_popescu dub you think bfl ? [02:05]
dub no, i just want my bfl asic delivered :) [02:05]
mircea_popescu lol [02:05]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 22600 @ 0.00047232 = 10.6744 BTC [-] [02:09]
* Shaded has quit (Quit: Shaded) [02:09]
mircea_popescu soo kinda big announcement : [02:19]
mircea_popescu you can now make your own copies of mpex db [02:19]
mircea_popescu http://polimedia.us/bitcoin/db_dump.php link. [02:20]
mircea_popescu jurov smickles mod6 ^^ [02:21]
jurov already trying to figure out how to decrypt :) [02:23]
mircea_popescu hahaha [02:23]
mircea_popescu i think you kinda need my private key. [02:23]
mircea_popescu hopefully at least. [02:23]
jurov gpg: decryption failed: No secret key [02:24]
mircea_popescu dun dun dun [02:24]
jurov so you want everyone to do you a backup, eh? [02:24]
mircea_popescu hey, why spend my own money you know ? [02:24]
jurov i should preemptively accuse you on btctalk : "MPEx scandal: relies on its users to do backups" [02:26]
mircea_popescu lol [02:27]
mircea_popescu https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=120758.msg1300467 [02:27]
mircea_popescu post there [02:27]
* kakobreklaaa (~T42@89-212-41-49.static.t-2.net) has joined #bitcoin-assets [02:29]
mircea_popescu but seriously jurov i think it adds a significant level of security. [02:29]
mircea_popescu well, unless someone manages to crack gpg [02:29]
* kakobrekla has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) [02:30]
jurov i hope you don't compress the backup prior to export.. heard about CRIME attack [02:31]
jurov ? [02:31]
mircea_popescu i take a number of measures to prevent as much as possible a crack [02:33]
mircea_popescu and no, there's no compression. [02:33]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4700 @ 0.00047242 = 2.2204 BTC [+] [02:34]
mircea_popescu (and also, https is bullshit) [02:35]
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smickles mircea_popescu: :D [02:45]
mircea_popescu hehe [02:46]
thestringpuller ;;bc,nettarget [02:49]
gribble Error: "bc,nettarget" is not a valid command. [02:49]
thestringpuller ;;bc,nethash [02:49]
gribble 23261.246072162205 [02:49]
thestringpuller so what was the net of my option mr. smickles? [02:49]
smickles ;;calc ((11 - [bc,24hprc]) / [bc,24hprc] - .0538765) * 48 [02:51]
gribble 0.77579570428 [02:51]
smickles if done currently [02:51]
smickles you still have a few minutes tho [02:51]
thestringpuller woot [02:51]
smickles ;;bc,24hprc [02:51]
thestringpuller oh really [02:51]
gribble 10.28 [02:51]
smickles ;;ticker [02:51]
gribble BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 10.18009, Best ask: 10.24999, Bid-ask spread: 0.06990, Last trade: 10.18008, 24 hour volume: 99436.59165322, 24 hour low: 9.74000, 24 hour high: 10.95000, 24 hour vwap: 10.31222 [02:51]
thestringpuller my alarm went off [02:51]
thestringpuller last hour [02:51]
smickles isn't it utc 23:51 right now? [02:51]
thestringpuller yea [02:51]
thestringpuller heh [02:51]
thestringpuller ;;bc,24hprc [02:51]
gribble 10.28 [02:51]
smickles thestringpuller: you're staring down the barrel of a 30% profit [02:53]
smickles at mircea_popescu's expense [02:53]
mircea_popescu haha i got bondholders [02:53]
smickles oh yeah [02:53]
mircea_popescu what volume we talkin' about ? [02:53]
smickles <4 btc [02:54]
smickles :D [02:54]
smickles mircea_popescu: i gave thestringpuller a mini-margin thingy [02:54]
mircea_popescu either the bondholders or the shareholders will feel the 30% of 4btc pain [02:54]
thestringpuller hahahah [02:55]
thestringpuller you guys make me happy [02:55]
thestringpuller I do feel like a won a bet though [02:55]
mircea_popescu good for you. [02:56]
thestringpuller /sarcasm lol [02:56]
mircea_popescu ;;ticker [02:56]
gribble BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 10.18025, Best ask: 10.24641, Bid-ask spread: 0.06616, Last trade: 10.18025, 24 hour volume: 99088.49020270, 24 hour low: 9.74000, 24 hour high: 10.95000, 24 hour vwap: 10.31053 [02:56]
thestringpuller mircea_popescu: MPEX is the coolest thing ever [02:57]
thestringpuller to happen to btc [02:57]
mircea_popescu why ty. i am of the same persuasion. [02:57]
thestringpuller Such easy access to options lol [02:58]
BTC-Mining the best thing to happen would be maintstream adoption... [02:59]
thestringpuller 99% of the people only own 1% of the wealth [02:59]
thestringpuller why would wide spread adoption help? [02:59]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16875 @ 0.00047242 = 7.9721 BTC [+] [02:59]
BTC-Mining it's a currency... [02:59]
mircea_popescu haha now that's a point [02:59]
mircea_popescu BTC-Mining any guess as to what % of roman empire subjects ever touched a solidus ? [03:00]
thestringpuller you need like warren buffet and his friends to come in and "adopt it" [03:00]
mircea_popescu like, in their lifetime. [03:00]
BTC-Mining why would they adopt it if there's no market using it? [03:00]
mircea_popescu market != consumer market. [03:00]
thestringpuller consumers don't have a lot of money [03:01]
BTC-Mining They don't own a lot, but they spend a lot of what they have. Those who have a lot stash it. [03:01]
mircea_popescu jurov https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=118551.msg1299839#msg1299839 [03:01]
mircea_popescu BTC-Mining in btc ? [03:01]
BTC-Mining Consumers would help attract large businesses, who would then start accumulating bitcoins [03:01]
jurov mircea yes i saw that. now am trying to explain how i feel about multifactor auth [03:07]
smickles mircea_popescu: what was the official price at maturity for mpex options? [03:07]
* mircea_popescu looks [03:07]
mircea_popescu 10.27 [03:08]
mircea_popescu jurov it's a dilemma you find yourself in there i guess [03:08]
smickles ;;calc ((11 - 10.27) / 10.27 - .0538765) * 48 [03:09]
gribble 0.825807259981 [03:09]
jurov it's either snake oil or expense i can't afford (buying yubikeys or sending sms) [03:09]
smickles thestringpuller: should i use that same address, or do you want me to keep it on account for you? [03:09]
smickles ;;calc ((11 - 10.27) / 10.27) * 48 [03:09]
gribble 3.41187925998 [03:09]
mircea_popescu jurov on the other hand, browser sessions are vulnerable. [03:11]
mircea_popescu but i think a honest rundown of the thing is prolly the best policy. "here is what i can do, here is what i can't do. if you actually handle enough cash that you need what i can't do, talk to mpex directly and problem solved" [03:12]
mircea_popescu for the record, month close happend on 1351296001 [03:16]
mircea_popescu within the fucken second ALL OF IT [03:16]
* copumpkin moos like a cow [03:16]
thestringpuller jurov: [03:19]
thestringpuller how do we get quick deposits/ [03:19]
thestringpuller ?* [03:19]
mircea_popescu copumpkin now moo like a bull [03:20]
* copumpkin moos like a bull [03:20]
* mircea_popescu hears no difference. [03:21]
mircea_popescu gender equality. [03:21]
thestringpuller lol [03:21]
thestringpuller mircea_popescu: are mpex deposits automated? [03:22]
mircea_popescu nope [03:22]
thestringpuller you do them manually [03:22]
thestringpuller ?* [03:23]
thestringpuller ;;ticker [03:23]
gribble BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 10.15000, Best ask: 10.19996, Bid-ask spread: 0.04996, Last trade: 10.15000, 24 hour volume: 98610.17306644, 24 hour low: 9.74000, 24 hour high: 10.95000, 24 hour vwap: 10.30583 [03:23]
jurov thestringpuller, only possible way i know is to have some reserve (or margin) on MPEx that can be used immediately [03:23]
jurov allocated to your account [03:23]
thestringpuller how long does an mpex deposit usually take? [03:24]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 1225 @ 0.00047242 = 0.5787 BTC [+] [03:25]
jurov iirc it may be more than 6 hours [03:25]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13475 @ 0.00047548 = 6.4071 BTC [+] [03:25]
mircea_popescu thestringpuller the declared limit is 2 days. it usually takes significantly less. [03:25]
jurov i do such "quick deposits" already for those 1btc users but i guess you want more [03:26]
thestringpuller i'm seeing if I want to go direct to mpex [03:26]
thestringpuller or dump a bunch of money into coinbr [03:26]
jurov if you are going to do many transactions, coinbr will help you keep overview [03:28]
jurov otherwise you need to keep it in spreadsheet [03:28]
thestringpuller if I were to generate a high enough volume could I get margin to cover "quick deposits"? [03:29]
mircea_popescu thestringpuller in general the capital is the key criterion. if you plan to do k's of btc you probably want mpex. if you plan to do 10s of btc you prolly want coinbr. if hundreds it's messier. [03:29]
thestringpuller hundreds...: [03:30]
thestringpuller maybe thousands one day [03:30]
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mircea_popescu then i guess you'll have to weigh them [03:31]
thestringpuller if i were to do this longterm what would your reccomendation be? [03:33]
mircea_popescu glbse [03:33]
mircea_popescu wait nm. [03:33]
* matthewh3 has quit (Remote host closed the connection) [03:34]
thestringpuller nice joke [03:34]
thestringpuller :P [03:34]
thestringpuller lol [03:34]
mircea_popescu :p [03:35]
mircea_popescu my sense of humour. [03:35]
jurov you'll be my special customer. I'm going to cater to your whims (no phonesex, tho) [03:36]
thestringpuller LOL [03:36]
mircea_popescu y u no cybersex! [03:36]
thestringpuller So you can be my mini broker jurov ? [03:36]
mircea_popescu thestringpuller ask him to get rid of css on coinbr :D [03:37]
jurov thestringpuller, yes i can [03:37]
thestringpuller hahaha [03:37]
thestringpuller get rid of css [03:37]
thestringpuller I really want the access to the api [03:37]
thestringpuller cause I can make bots easily [03:37]
thestringpuller then my computer is my broker [03:38]
thestringpuller lol [03:38]
jurov as long as you don't expect to do X transactions per second or more, then it's possible [03:39]
thestringpuller Ideally I would like to make trades without a website in honesty [03:39]
thestringpuller if you can make that happen jurov then it'll be worthwhile [03:41]
thestringpuller if not the ~30 btc fee isn't that bad [03:41]
* copumpkin is now known as Michelangelo [03:41]
* Michelangelo is now known as copumpki [03:41]
* copumpki is now known as copumpkin [03:41]
thestringpuller up to you, what you can provide [03:42]
jurov OK, exporting json interface should not be a problem. i planned to do one anyway for mod6's adroid app [03:42]
thestringpuller cool, I won't flood it, i just want bot access because I can't be awake 24/7 [03:42]
jurov so i guess you need to submit order/cancel/exercise, right? [03:44]
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jurov any more data? everything other you'll use via browser? [03:45]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 19651 @ 0.00047232 = 9.2816 BTC [-] [03:50]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 22600 @ 0.00047189 = 10.6647 BTC [-] [03:50]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10336 @ 0.00047171 = 4.8756 BTC [-] [03:50]
* copumpkin is now known as OMARCOMINYO [03:55]
* OMARCOMINYO is now known as copumpkin [04:01]
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jurov good night [04:14]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 44968 @ 0.00047257 = 21.2505 BTC [+] [04:15]
* tbcoin_ (~tbcoin@81.61.86.183.dyn.user.ono.com) has joined #bitcoin-assets [04:16]
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smickles thestringpuller: it turns out that the official number is 10.28, not 10.27 [04:26]
smickles ;;calc ((11 - 10.28) / 10.28) * 48 [04:27]
gribble 3.36186770428 [04:27]
thestringpuller either way i made cash [04:30]
thestringpuller lol [04:30]
smickles thestringpuller: do you have a WoT identity? [04:32]
thestringpuller lol [04:38]
smickles 0_o [04:39]
smickles jurov: https://github.com/jurov/MPExAgent :D [04:39]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 1182 @ 0.00047257 = 0.5586 BTC [+] [04:43]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14518 @ 0.00047171 = 6.8483 BTC [-] [04:43]
mircea_popescu s.mpoe statement is out : http://polimedia.us/trilema/2012/mpoe-october-2012-statement/ [04:44]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] [PAID] 1000000000 @ 0.00000063 = 630.31566629 BTC [04:50]
* mod6 has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) [05:06]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14846 @ 0.00047171 = 7.003 BTC [-] [05:08]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20302 @ 0.00047157 = 9.5738 BTC [-] [05:08]
thestringpuller ;;ticker [05:27]
gribble BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 9.88026, Best ask: 9.96973, Bid-ask spread: 0.08947, Last trade: 9.97986, 24 hour volume: 98509.23509746, 24 hour low: 9.74000, 24 hour high: 10.95000, 24 hour vwap: 10.26302 [05:27]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6898 @ 0.00047157 = 3.2529 BTC [-] [05:35]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20685 @ 0.00047066 = 9.7356 BTC [-] [05:35]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 24217 @ 0.00047 = 11.382 BTC [-] [05:35]
mircea_popescu nighty all! [05:43]
* Now talking on #bitcoin-assets [11:42]
* Topic for #bitcoin-assets is: Bitcoin asset exchanges: http://polimedia.us/mpex || https://coinbr.com || https://cryptostocks.com || https://icbit.se || https://therocktrading.com || https://assets-otc.com || list bot commands: !help || Streaming trades only: #bitcoin-assets-trades || Net Chart: http://bit.ly/RPclBi || a biased message: http://smpake.com || http://bit4x.com [11:42]
* Topic for #bitcoin-assets set by kakobrekla!~T42@89-212-41-49.static.t-2.net at Tue Oct 16 15:58:37 2012 [11:42]
* copumpkin has quit (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.) [11:47]
EskimoBob any ideas what is going on with the BTC price? [11:53]
mircea_popescu bitinstant closed down ; some other service closed down [11:54]
mircea_popescu some people added significant hashpower and are probably selling the btc [11:54]
mircea_popescu Network total 31.378 Thash/s [11:54]
mircea_popescu went up 25% past few days [11:54]
EskimoBob are ASIC test versions coming online? [11:56]
mircea_popescu possibly. [11:57]
EskimoBob bitinstant? in google search I can see "BitInstant.com is currently down due to site revisions. All orders placed up to this point will process as normal. If you have any questions or issues feel free to ..." but when I go to the site, it looks OK [11:59]
mircea_popescu yea, i think they may be up already [12:01]
mircea_popescu but the point is, two things take out usd from mkt, one thing adds more btc [12:01]
mircea_popescu price has to plumet. supply and demand. [12:01]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 26700 @ 0.00046754 = 12.4833 BTC [-] [12:06]
mircea_popescu jurov mod6 statjson now includes exercises list too. [12:09]
sgornick mircea_popescu: Is the absense of recallable transaction history strategic, or just "haven't gotten to it"? [12:19]
mircea_popescu what do you mean recallable transaction history ? [12:20]
sgornick Can I right now view all of my October transactions? [12:20]
mircea_popescu if you kept all your october stats responses [12:20]
mircea_popescu or if you never issued a stat in october, issue one and it's there [12:20]
sgornick heh, ya, that's what I mean. [12:20]
mircea_popescu ya, mpex is not doing your accounting, you have to do that part yourself. [12:21]
mircea_popescu (or use a broker that offers that service) [12:21]
sgornick How about transactions showing the exercise of options at expiration? Planned, or DIY? [12:22]
mircea_popescu this was just added in the statjson [12:23]
mircea_popescu the plain stat is scheduled for an overhaul, but this won't happen for a while yet to give people who are using it atm to provide 3rd party services to migrate to statjson first [12:23]
sgornick ok, I'll look at statjson. [12:24]
* Chaang-Noi has quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) [12:25]
mircea_popescu so did they let roger ver go yet ? anyone know ? [12:25]
sgornick Enroute to HK, though may still need to return to JP. [12:26]
mircea_popescu aha [12:26]
mircea_popescu people keep fearmongering re the us government, but my intel shows the chinese govt will be our real enemy. [12:26]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3636 @ 0.00046754 = 1.7 BTC [-] [12:31]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9451 @ 0.00046727 = 4.4162 BTC [-] [12:31]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 22313 @ 0.00046693 = 10.4186 BTC [-] [12:31]
mircea_popescu https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=120758.0 << also worthy of notice. one can now make his own copies of mpex db [12:36]
mircea_popescu sgornick ^^ [12:36]
assbot [MPEX] [O.BTCUSD.C120T] 5 @ 0.1 = 0.5 BTC [-] [12:49]
assbot [MPEX] [O.BTCUSD.C120T] 5 @ 0.09390123 = 0.4695 BTC [-] [12:49]
assbot [MPEX] [O.BTCUSD.P120T] 7 @ 0.26 = 1.82 BTC [+] [12:50]
assbot [MPEX] [O.BTCUSD.C120T] 3 @ 0.09388415 = 0.2817 BTC [-] [12:54]
mircea_popescu ;;ticker [12:55]
gribble BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 10.27935, Best ask: 10.30000, Bid-ask spread: 0.02065, Last trade: 10.27935, 24 hour volume: 99354.61716662, 24 hour low: 9.74000, 24 hour high: 10.79978, 24 hour vwap: 10.20092 [12:55]
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mircea_popescu https://ferroh.com/charts pretty cool [13:03]
* smickles should be asleep already, like 3 hours ago [13:03]
smickles but those darn options [13:03]
mircea_popescu lol what about them ? [13:03]
smickles there fun to look at and think about [13:04]
mircea_popescu ehehe [13:04]
smickles mircea_popescu: you know, i've been wondering, if someone setup a short straddle at the money with something like 20000 contracts on each leg, do you think it would stabilize the exchange rate for a while? [13:08]
assbot [MPEX] [O.BTCUSD.P200T] 1000 @ 0.96946805 = 969.4681 BTC [+] [13:08]
mircea_popescu possibly. [13:08]
mircea_popescu inasmuch as if they would have otherwise sold/bought on the mtgox market for sure. [13:09]
assbot [MPEX] [O.BTCUSD.P190T] 1000 @ 0.87084465 = 870.8447 BTC [+] [13:11]
assbot [MPEX] [O.BTCUSD.P180T] 1000 @ 0.77222124 = 772.2212 BTC [+] [13:11]
smickles woah [13:11]
assbot [MPEX] [O.BTCUSD.P170T] 1000 @ 0.67359784 = 673.5978 BTC [+] [13:11]
smickles those are real? [13:11]
mircea_popescu heh table investor. [13:11]
assbot [MPEX] [O.BTCUSD.P160T] 1000 @ 0.57497444 = 574.9744 BTC [+] [13:12]
mircea_popescu i guess someone figures the btc goes up. [13:12]
assbot [MPEX] [O.BTCUSD.P150T] 1000 @ 0.47635104 = 476.351 BTC [+] [13:12]
assbot [MPEX] [O.BTCUSD.P140T] 1000 @ 0.40221678 = 402.2168 BTC [+] [13:13]
assbot [MPEX] [O.BTCUSD.P130T] 1000 @ 0.33756736 = 337.5674 BTC [-] [13:13]
assbot [MPEX] [O.BTCUSD.P120T] 1000 @ 0.27658406 = 276.5841 BTC [+] [13:13]
assbot [MPEX] [O.BTCUSD.P110T] 1000 @ 0.22015212 = 220.1521 BTC [+] [13:14]
mircea_popescu nice way to start the month [13:14]
mircea_popescu now i can be worried sick for the next five weeks ;/ [13:14]
smickles ;;calc 12 / ((.27658406 * .998) +1) [13:15]
gribble 9.40416104058 [13:15]
smickles ;;calc 11 / ((.22015212 * .998) +1) [13:15]
gribble 9.01852376756 [13:15]
smickles ;;calc 13 / ((.33756736 * .998) +1) [13:16]
gribble 9.72404488124 [13:16]
smickles ;;calc 14 / ((.40221678 * .998) +1) [13:16]
gribble 9.98992197804 [13:16]
mircea_popescu what's that like inverse premium ? [13:17]
smickles ;;calc 15 / ((.47635104 * .998) +1) [13:17]
gribble 10.166745898 [13:17]
smickles should be breakeve numbers (in usd) [13:17]
smickles ;;calc 16 / ((.57497444 * .998) +1) [13:17]
gribble 10.1663178393 [13:17]
smickles ;;calc 17 / ((.67359784 * .998) +1) [13:18]
mircea_popescu these were sales tho [13:18]
gribble 10.1659401704 [13:18]
smickles ;;calc 18 / ((.77222124 * .998) +1) [13:18]
gribble 10.1656044882 [13:18]
mircea_popescu it hit the bid price across the board [13:18]
smickles ;;calc 19 / ((.87084465 * .998) +1) [13:18]
gribble 10.1653041055 [13:18]
smickles ;;calc 20 / ((.96946805 * .998) +1) [13:18]
gribble 10.1650338278 [13:18]
smickles ;;calc 9.40416104058+9.01852376756+9.72404488124+9.98992197804+10.166745898+10.1663178393+10.1659401704+10.1656044882+10.1653041055+10.1650338278 [13:21]
gribble 99.1315979966 [13:21]
smickles so they make btc down to 9.14 [13:22]
mircea_popescu yea, if it doesn't kiss nine they're golden. [13:23]
mircea_popescu then again... month is long. [13:23]
smickles ballzy [13:23]
smickles mircea_popescu: does you bot adjust based on what it has bought and holds? [13:24]
mircea_popescu if it's one of the people who sold a lot in the dump it makes sense [13:24]
mircea_popescu smickles no. [13:24]
smickles wow, shouldn't it? [13:25]
mircea_popescu why ? [13:25]
smickles shouldn't it adjust prices to try to acheive the most time resistant neutral position?, that way you can take advantage of the imbalance in the bot's portfolio and offer better prices to the opposing positions and worse prices to the ones that add more risk to you [13:26]
mircea_popescu how would it know what's more time-resistant neutral position ? [13:27]
smickles the greeks, assuming you have a volatility estimate [13:27]
mircea_popescu i don't want to introduce feedback. [13:27]
mircea_popescu atm i have the capital to anchor. if it becomes a problem and the bot is too often sold out [13:28]
mircea_popescu then i'd prolly prefer adding more capital than following the mkt [13:28]
mircea_popescu what you're saying does make sense, in general. just, btc is yet too low volume and i don't trust half the quant analysis results [13:29]
mircea_popescu and i also don't know which half i don't trust. [13:29]
smickles you wouldn't need to trust either, you should be able to encourage people to buy and sell your bot into a positon that makes btc when the market moves up down or sideways [13:30]
smickles like right now, with this idea, it should offer a worse price for all those puts, and a better price on the related calls [13:31]
mircea_popescu the rational thing for people to do is go in the midmarket imo [13:31]
mircea_popescu i mean, if you believe this you can go put your own CALL offers in there, neh ? [13:32]
smickles well, it doesn't work so well if you run out of capital to hedge with :( [13:33]
mircea_popescu so start a fund :p [13:33]
* guruvan_ has quit (Remote host closed the connection) [13:33]
smickles well, i suppose i do already have half of the code for just such a bot already written [13:34]
smickles what's this statjson i heard mentioned? [13:34]
mircea_popescu you know... stat in json [13:34]
Diablo-D3 so [13:36]
Diablo-D3 whatsup [13:36]
smickles mircea_popescu: so i could parse the stat easily? [13:36]
smickles i might make this bot then [13:36]
smickles how do i get at it? [13:37]
smickles Diablo-D3: hiya [13:37]
Diablo-D3 anything interesting happen? [13:38]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 1971 @ 0.00046693 = 0.9203 BTC [-] [13:39]
smickles mircea_popescu: check out these lovely formulas http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Greeks_(finance)#Formulas_for_vanilla_option_Greeks [13:40]
smickles Diablo-D3: a bitinstant guy was detained [13:41]
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jurov lol, it went out of scale: http://bitcoin.sipa.be/speed-lin-2k.png [13:41]
Diablo-D3 smickles: er, why? [13:42]
smickles Diablo-D3: a stamp was in the wrong place, apparently [13:42]
Diablo-D3 wtf? [13:42]
smickles jurov: awesome [13:42]
Diablo-D3 smickles: the hell? [13:43]
smickles Diablo-D3: srsly [13:43]
Diablo-D3 a stamp for what? [13:44]
smickles some sort of international travel thing [13:44]
* smickles sleep, must sleep [13:46]
kakobreklaaa ;;bc,diff [13:48]
gribble 3072321.7320208 [13:48]
kakobreklaaa ;;bc,stats [13:48]
gribble Current Blocks: 205220 | Current Difficulty: 3072321.7320208 | Next Difficulty At Block: 205631 | Next Difficulty In: 411 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 2 days, 15 hours, 14 minutes, and 54 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 3265289.61742921 | Estimated Percent Change: 6.28084889018 [13:48]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11900 @ 0.00046734 = 5.5613 BTC [+] [14:04]
mircea_popescu smickles you go STATJSON lol [14:05]
mircea_popescu ;;later tell btc-mining http://bitcoin.sipa.be/speed-lin-2k.png check this out going out of scale :D [14:05]
gribble The operation succeeded. [14:05]
mircea_popescu Diablo-D3 roger ver was detained in macau airport. apparently is on his way to hk atm [14:06]
mircea_popescu spent about a day and a half in airport detention. maybe he pulled a nefario, it's unclear yet. [14:06]
Diablo-D3 heh [14:10]
assbot [MPEX] [O.BTCUSD.P200T] 1000 @ 0.96946805 = 969.4681 BTC [+] [14:11]
assbot [MPEX] [O.BTCUSD.P190T] 1000 @ 0.87084465 = 870.8447 BTC [+] [14:11]
mircea_popescu o boy round 2 [14:11]
assbot [MPEX] [O.BTCUSD.P180T] 1000 @ 0.77222124 = 772.2212 BTC [+] [14:11]
assbot [MPEX] [O.BTCUSD.P160T] 1000 @ 0.57497444 = 574.9744 BTC [+] [14:12]
assbot [MPEX] [O.BTCUSD.P170T] 1000 @ 0.67359784 = 673.5978 BTC [+] [14:12]
assbot [MPEX] [O.BTCUSD.P150T] 1000 @ 0.47635104 = 476.351 BTC [+] [14:12]
assbot [MPEX] [O.BTCUSD.P140T] 1000 @ 0.40206278 = 402.0628 BTC [-] [14:12]
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assbot [MPEX] [O.BTCUSD.P130T] 1000 @ 0.33741273 = 337.4127 BTC [-] [14:13]
assbot [MPEX] [O.BTCUSD.P120T] 1000 @ 0.27643033 = 276.4303 BTC [-] [14:13]
assbot [MPEX] [O.BTCUSD.P110T] 1000 @ 0.22000167 = 220.0017 BTC [-] [14:13]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10916 @ 0.00046693 = 5.097 BTC [-] [14:38]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7784 @ 0.00046665 = 3.6324 BTC [-] [14:38]
jurov hmmmm https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=120759.0;topicseen [14:41]
jurov SEC needs you [14:42]
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mircea_popescu Maybe Phil will even sign up and answer your questions (but that may be a conflict of interest for him). [14:48]
mircea_popescu what da fuck ?! [14:48]
* Cory (~Cory@unaffiliated/cory) has joined #bitcoin-assets [14:49]
rg hm [14:55]
rg that's the guy who messaged me on bitcointalk [14:55]
mircea_popescu "I also just got off the phone with Philip Moustakis. Nice guy. We chatted for about an hour." [14:56]
mircea_popescu i find it incredible the guy finds the time. [14:57]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12400 @ 0.00046734 = 5.795 BTC [+] [15:04]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20635 @ 0.0004697 = 9.6923 BTC [+] [15:04]
mircea_popescu ;;ticker [15:04]
gribble BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 10.41001, Best ask: 10.44000, Bid-ask spread: 0.02999, Last trade: 10.41000, 24 hour volume: 104809.98028766, 24 hour low: 9.74000, 24 hour high: 10.70000, 24 hour vwap: 10.20577 [15:04]
* Now talking on #bitcoin-assets [19:31]
* Topic for #bitcoin-assets is: Bitcoin asset exchanges: http://polimedia.us/mpex || https://coinbr.com || https://cryptostocks.com || https://icbit.se || https://therocktrading.com || https://assets-otc.com || list bot commands: !help || Streaming trades only: #bitcoin-assets-trades || Net Chart: http://bit.ly/RPclBi || a biased message: http://smpake.com || http://bit4x.com [19:31]
* Topic for #bitcoin-assets set by kakobrekla!~T42@89-212-41-49.static.t-2.net at Tue Oct 16 15:58:37 2012 [19:31]
FabianB_ my guess was that with C100 and 10 usd strike break even would be 0.1 [19:32]
FabianB_ but i guess that's way off [19:32]
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jurov no, call option profits when price *rises*... when BTCUSD price is X, you will get (X-10)/X when exercising one C100 option [19:39]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 900 @ 0.00046707 = 0.4204 BTC [+] [19:40]
jurov so if you buy now at 0.277 , the price must be larger than ~13.7 for you to profitably exercise [19:42]
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FabianB_ ok, so for C110 it would be (x-11)/x [19:43]
jurov yes [19:44]
jurov and exact breakeven for calls is at strike/(1-buyprice) [19:45]
FabianB_ trying to figure out if it makes sense to buy options if i buy something with btc today (at a usd price), but in the end don't want to have less btc in my wallet, so buyin new btc few days later [19:46]
FabianB_ but expect price between now and in 4 days to rise [19:46]
mircea_popescu if you expect price to rise then you want either long puts or short calls [19:47]
FabianB_ hmm.. what if i dont care which way prices go, i just want to have same amount of btc in the end [19:48]
FabianB_ but since fiat -> mtgox takes a while, i don't know how much fiat i have to send to mtgox [19:48]
FabianB_ so buying an insurance for price change would make sense [19:49]
mircea_popescu but in what you say is implicit you do care which way prices go. that's why buying insurance for price changes makes sense. [19:49]
FabianB_ hmm.. ur right [19:50]
FabianB_ price falling would be nice for me anyway, rising price would get me less btc if i don't hv options [19:50]
mircea_popescu right. [19:51]
sgornick mircea_popescu: Anticipating an "October results" post: in "Investing in Mircea Popescu's Options Emporium" http://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=64962.msg1230888#msg1230888 [19:51]
FabianB_ if i have 100 btc now, spend 10 btc now and coz current price is 10 usd i send 100 usd to mtgox which will arive in a few days [19:52]
jurov mircea, why long puts in this case? they will get cheaper if btcusd rises, no? [19:52]
mircea_popescu sgornick but the results are out since this morn ? [19:52]
mircea_popescu jurov bah i fucked up. [19:52]
mircea_popescu FabianB_ you want long calls/short puts [19:52]
mircea_popescu dyslexia >< [19:52]
mircea_popescu http://polimedia.us/trilema/2012/mpoe-october-2012-statement/ << sgornick [19:53]
FabianB_ so if usd price is at 12 in 4 days i could calculate what kind of long call i should buy to insure that [19:53]
sgornick A good place for the results to also be posted would be in that thread. [19:53]
jurov FabianB_, i guess none of currently offered mpoe calls will be profitable at 12 [19:54]
FabianB_ so options only make sens with big price changes? [19:54]
jurov unless there's some gentlemen who creates some for you ar such price [19:54]
mircea_popescu sgornick i guess you have a point. i recently switched my blog from romanian to english, so i kinda intend to make it the source for results. but i guess a link can't hurt anything. [19:55]
jurov fabian, i'd rephrase it so that nobody dares to offer them at better price [19:56]
mircea_popescu ;;ticker [19:57]
gribble BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 10.46505, Best ask: 10.51980, Bid-ask spread: 0.05475, Last trade: 10.46502, 24 hour volume: 96030.81201998, 24 hour low: 9.74000, 24 hour high: 10.83883, 24 hour vwap: 10.18519 [19:57]
FabianB_ ok, many ppl expect it to go towards 12 again [19:57]
mircea_popescu ;;calc 8 / 12 [19:57]
gribble 0.666666666667 [19:57]
mircea_popescu sell 1 O.BTCUSD.P200T for 0.96946805 atm [19:57]
mircea_popescu at 12 they're only worth .66, meaning a 50% profit [19:57]
mircea_popescu well, ~50 anyway [19:59]
mircea_popescu but in general : big price swings are better served by long positions. fine price movements are better served by short positions. [19:59]
FabianB_ hmm [20:00]
FabianB_ ic [20:00]
FabianB_ so i guess on traditional forex options have smaller price differences, coz e.g. usd<->eur price changes are smaller [20:03]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4900 @ 0.00046597 = 2.2833 BTC [-] [20:06]
* Chaang-Noi has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) [20:06]
mircea_popescu yes volatility is a large consideration [20:06]
mircea_popescu you don't often see eur gaining 5% over usd in 24 hours [20:07]
mircea_popescu this has happened like i dunno, a dozen time in btc this year [20:07]
jurov i'm in a bit of a risky mood and don't think price will be back at 12 in 4 days, would create approriate options for you as a proper broker would... but my head is spinning already [20:07]
FabianB_ yeah [20:07]
mircea_popescu an important point tho is that you don't HAVE to take the bot offers [20:07]
mircea_popescu you can put your own bids/asks in the midmarket too [20:08]
FabianB_ hehe, jurov, it was just an example now [20:08]
FabianB_ but maybe i'll get back to that jurov if i really need it [20:08]
mircea_popescu so baked in is a convenience cost too. people don't seem to be doing nearly enough of their own offering, much prefering the instant execution of bot offer. [20:09]
FabianB_ thinking about if btc would be worth if i'm a producer of some goods e.g. in china, for shippment to eur/us, e.g. payment in btc now, shippment in europe arives 40 days later, btc price in that time probably moved a lot [20:10]
jurov someday i ought to do myself few cups of extra strong coffee and do the maths... [20:10]
mircea_popescu FabianB_ would most definitely be worth it in that scenario. [20:10]
mircea_popescu cutting out the (significant) bank fees for letters of credit [20:11]
FabianB_ mircea_popescu: yeah, that's cutting the bank fees, but introduces the risk of volatility, if i don't use option insurance [20:11]
mircea_popescu but out of the bank savings you can buy a lot of options insurance. [20:12]
mircea_popescu and you get all the other advantages of btc [20:12]
FabianB_ probably [20:12]
mircea_popescu (such as, for instance, if the company goes bankrupt you can't be clawbacked [20:12]
mircea_popescu as the simplest and most common example) [20:12]
FabianB_ and instant transaction etc., can send the goods next day and not in 10 days when international wire arives.. [20:14]
mircea_popescu most int'l commerce isn't paid by wire. [20:14]
FabianB_ mircea_popescu: what's the usual? [20:15]
mircea_popescu letters of credit [20:15]
FabianB_ and then they do bulk transfer? [20:16]
mircea_popescu what do you mean bulk transfer? [20:16]
FabianB_ well, credit needs to be executed some time [20:16]
mircea_popescu ;;google letter of credit [20:17]
gribble Letter of credit - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: ; Letter Of Credit Definition | Investopedia: ; Letter of Credit - How Letters of Credit Work: [20:17]
mircea_popescu it's a system sorta similar to an escrow deal [20:17]
* FabianB_ 's reading. [20:17]
FabianB_ so the 3rd party (bank) just hands it over to some other bank, or buys currency at the forex market for it or something [20:21]
mircea_popescu something like that [20:22]
FabianB_ probably has big fees too [20:23]
mircea_popescu kinda, ya/ [20:24]
mircea_popescu it's inconvenient and really mostly a relic from the pre ww2 days [20:24]
mircea_popescu one of the first things bitcoin will be killing. [20:24]
mircea_popescu provided, of course, the fucking chinese stop hussling people at macau. [20:25]
FabianB_ yeah, traditional banks suck at international money transfer [20:25]
FabianB_ is there more to read on that macau story? [20:25]
mircea_popescu not afaik [20:26]
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FabianB_ macau is like hong kong an SAR, so the chinese central gov shouldn't have much to do with it [20:27]
mircea_popescu heh that's just a theory. in practice, they're very involved. [20:28]
FabianB_ well, depends on which kind of question [20:28]
mircea_popescu https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=81939.msg902620#msg902620 teh bitcoin history... [20:29]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 1608 @ 0.00046548 = 0.7485 BTC [-] [20:32]
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mircea_popescu sgornick https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=120758.msg1301670#msg1301670 what do you mean ? [20:36]
sgornick mircea_popescu: If I used for trading on MPEx my main GPG key that I use for WoT (and has my e-mail address), can someone figure out what assets I own? [20:38]
mircea_popescu not unless either some servers are seriously broken into or someone cracks gpg [20:39]
mircea_popescu (or pgp) [20:39]
mircea_popescu on the other hand, if you use a properly set up anon key nobody can ever figure it out, even if they owned all the servers in the world. [20:41]
mircea_popescu (also, you can link to specific sections in the faq by c/p ing the question number link) [20:42]
sgornick > you can link to specific sections in the faq <-- Fixed. [20:44]
mircea_popescu more like an "in general". that thing's monstrously large by now [20:45]
mircea_popescu i'd much prefer something a page or two long but it doesn't seem possible [20:45]
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mircea_popescu lol [20:50]
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sgornick mpex.py needs an option to specify which key to sign with -- for gpg.encrypt( , , sign=signer_fingerprint) [20:55]
mircea_popescu add it :D [20:56]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 30430 @ 0.00046548 = 14.1646 BTC [-] [20:57]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14270 @ 0.00046529 = 6.6397 BTC [-] [20:57]
jurov sgornick, python-gnupg does not support that, sorry [20:59]
mircea_popescu you can't select key ?! [21:00]
jurov nope [21:00]
mircea_popescu so if you have two which one does it pick ? [21:00]
jurov the default one [21:00]
mircea_popescu so then bash script to cyhange the default [21:00]
mircea_popescu i hax! [21:00]
mircea_popescu actually there was a nightmare situation with one customer who somehow changed his default key in between having it registered and sending the first payment [21:01]
mircea_popescu and subsequent orders [21:01]
mircea_popescu took a coupla days to figure out wtf. [21:01]
jurov i needed the second key to be used in chroot anyway so i did not hax around it [21:01]
sgornick jurov: Any guess why the doc shows it? http://packages.python.org/python-gnupg/#using-signing-and-encryption-together [21:03]
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jurov i don't remember, it was months ago... but as you see, at least on decryption you don't have any parameter there [21:04]
mircea_popescu i think that's a new version of a diff branch jurov [21:04]
jurov to choose the key [21:04]
mircea_popescu iirc the pympex uses prev python [21:04]
mircea_popescu 2.2 vs 2.4 or 3.2 vs 3.4 or w/e something like that [21:05]
jurov the you can answer here if you want some karma: http://stackoverflow.com/questions/10681563/how-to-choose-encryption-decryption-key-in-python-gnupg [21:05]
mircea_popescu actually... it might be time someone makes a pympex port for the latest python [21:06]
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* Guest71211 is now known as Gladamas [21:07]
assbot [MPEX] [S.DICE] 29630 @ 0.003375 = 100.0013 BTC [-] [21:08]
BTC-Mining Hmm... I see a pirate [21:10]
BTC-Mining Oh wait, no, it's just Gladamas disguised for Halloween. [21:10]
mircea_popescu did pirate release the list of depositor names and emails yet ? [21:11]
Gladamas heh [21:11]
mircea_popescu no wait, that was the ppt i mean eh... [21:11]
mircea_popescu BITCOIN WAS WRITTEN BY THE US SIT-COM CONSPIRACY [21:11]
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BTC-Mining The Universe was created by The Conspirator. It's just one huge conspiracy. [21:14]
BTC-Mining Everything is conspiracy. [21:15]
Gladamas http://phys.org/news/2012-10-real-physicists-method-universe-simulation.html [21:15]
mircea_popescu your conspiratorial attempts to fool me into believing your conspiracies fail. [21:16]
BTC-Mining Worry not, for it make no difference whatsoever because everything is nothing and nothing is everything and nothing. It's all in your head. Be sure to keep it in there! Here, take a tinfoil hat. [21:19]
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mircea_popescu is it certified ? [21:20]
BTC-Mining Yes, by self-certifying conspirators. [21:20]
mircea_popescu sounds legit. [21:21]
BTC-Mining Everyone are self-certifying conspirators. All truths are different and contradictory, but all truths nevertheless. [21:21]
BTC-Mining [14:15] http://phys.org/news/2012-10-real-physicists-method-universe-simulation.html [21:23]
BTC-Mining "Of course, any conclusions resulting from such work would be limited by the possibility that everything we think we understand about quantum chromodynamics, or simulations for that matter, could be flawed." [21:24]
BTC-Mining That... we basically can't prove if what we see is a simulation or not while testing and measuring from inside the simulation based on our knowledge of simulations. [21:25]
mircea_popescu this is old as dirt. [21:25]
BTC-Mining We wouldn't know how things work outside the simulation. [21:26]
BTC-Mining And even if it's not a simulation... It's a universe with particles and a set of rules how they interact... It's basically the same as a simulation, but in more complex. [21:30]
BTC-Mining Simulation or not, seems like the same thing... [21:31]
rdponticelli Welcome to agnosticism [21:32]
BTC-Mining Godammit [21:34]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15030 @ 0.00046529 = 6.9933 BTC [-] [21:34]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20900 @ 0.00046499 = 9.7183 BTC [-] [21:34]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9500 @ 0.00046477 = 4.4153 BTC [-] [21:34]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8412 @ 0.00046475 = 3.9095 BTC [-] [21:34]
BTC-Mining But I guess that would most closely define myself. [21:35]
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BTC-Mining hmm, Windows 8 looks like THE shit. ("shit" being used pejoratively) [21:42]
BTC-Mining Thank you for spamming my Live inbox, Microsoft. [21:42]
BTC-Mining Seriously... what good is an OS where I can't have a clusterfuck of icons on a desktop? [21:45]
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Diablo-D3 ACHIEVEMENT UNLOCKED: NO ICONS [21:49]
BTC-Mining ahahahah [21:49]
mircea_popescu hmm, Windows 8 looks like THE shit. << that means great. [21:50]
mircea_popescu you say "like shit" if you want it to be pejorative [21:50]
BTC-Mining No, THE shit, litteral meaning [21:50]
BTC-Mining I have to use THE, meaning it's THE one. [21:51]
mircea_popescu i dun think english works that way [21:52]
Diablo-D3 seriously, I have icons turned off [21:52]
Diablo-D3 its fucking baus [21:52]
mircea_popescu i don't even use the desktop [21:52]
BTC-Mining Unfortunatly it conflicted with an idiom. [21:52]
mircea_popescu since i dunno, the 90s [21:52]
BTC-Mining How do you sort your files... [21:52]
Diablo-D3 well, that, and my desktop background is http://miotd.com/images/20120604.jpg [21:52]
Diablo-D3 so extra bausness [21:53]
Diablo-D3 mircea_popescu: well [21:53]
Diablo-D3 to be fair [21:53]
Diablo-D3 X exists to display multiple terms concurrently [21:53]
mircea_popescu BTC-Mining by NAME [21:53]
mircea_popescu and by date and by size and by their mother's pedigree [21:53]
mircea_popescu desktops are for people who use like... smartphones and shit like that. [21:53]
BTC-Mining Yeah, but I mean, how do you find specific files? [21:54]
mircea_popescu find ? [21:54]
Diablo-D3 find. [21:54]
mircea_popescu or else history [21:54]
mircea_popescu mostly history really. [21:54]
Diablo-D3 its like a 40 year old command [21:54]
BTC-Mining Assuming you can't remember the name for every thousand files you have... [21:54]
mircea_popescu its older than most girls i fucked. [21:55]
mircea_popescu i run a file i can't remember the name of ?! [21:55]
Diablo-D3 find -iname with globs. [21:55]
mircea_popescu what am i! [21:55]
BTC-Mining Find is only useful when you know the filename. [21:55]
mircea_popescu why am i running it if i don't know its filename! [21:55]
BTC-Mining I have that problem all the time. Web files, old game I want to play again, web images I want to get back editing on. [21:56]
mircea_popescu i dont remember when i last saw the desktop [21:57]
mircea_popescu and tbh i couldn't tell you what my image is [21:57]
BTC-Mining Eh. Well I order things on my desktop for easy access. [21:58]
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mircea_popescu diff people, diff styles [21:59]
mircea_popescu and some feet http://polimedia.us/dtng/c/src/135136436045.jpg [21:59]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11610 @ 0.00046475 = 5.3957 BTC [-] [22:00]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 25738 @ 0.00046474 = 11.9615 BTC [-] [22:00]
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BTC-Mining Well the problem with the desktop is files moving around when the screen resolution changes or moving files displacing other icons. [22:00]
BTC-Mining That and the desktop only have so many space... [22:00]
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BTC-Mining But there's fixes for that. Windows is quite customizable. [22:01]
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BTC-Mining Actually, let me get a screenshot of my desktop [22:12]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.DICE] 20000 @ 0.003375 = 67.5 BTC [-] [22:16]
BTC-Mining Damn image sharers... [22:19]
mircea_popescu BTC-Mining use dtng :D [22:20]
BTC-Mining I ended up using imgur. It managed not to freeze near the end. [22:20]
BTC-Mining http://i.imgur.com/xzx1y.jpg [22:20]
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mircea_popescu too much shit [22:23]
BTC-Mining eh, but easy to access everything [22:24]
BTC-Mining I never really have to look around for what I want [22:24]
BTC-Mining I keep off the programs I don't use often but can at least remember the names for the start menu/search box. [22:28]
BTC-Mining For the rest, I just like to have organized folders, searching for files is too tedious. [22:28]
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kakobrekla sup [22:33]
BTC-Mining Not much [22:35]
BTC-Mining Waiting for Nefario to release assets data... [22:35]
kakobrekla hehe, love how mpex makes their dump public while people wait for nefario to wake up [22:37]
kakobrekla maybe he doesnt give a fuck anymore [22:37]
BTC-Mining He wants all double payments back and then processing payments before proceeding with releasing information I get it. [22:39]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 33278 @ 0.00046479 = 15.4673 BTC [+] [22:41]
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JWU42 yep - called him last week and he said the same... [22:47]
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mircea_popescu i suspect he just wants the attention at this point. [22:57]
kakobrekla http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/adapteva/parallella-a-supercomputer-for-everyone [22:59]
kakobrekla darn im really tempted, 2 hrs to go [22:59]
mircea_popescu 5k backers and 70k over target in 2 houyrs ? [23:03]
kakobrekla hm [23:04]
kakobrekla 120k over target [23:04]
kakobrekla twas 100k short just the other day [23:04]
mircea_popescu why does it say 117 minutes ? [23:06]
mircea_popescu is that like time left or something ? [23:06]
Diablo-D3 yes [23:07]
Diablo-D3 it clearly says MINUTES TO GO [23:07]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6622 @ 0.00046479 = 3.0778 BTC [+] [23:07]
Diablo-D3 I dont really see a point in this though [23:07]
Diablo-D3 parallel computing is already accessable to the masses [23:07]
mircea_popescu Diablo-D3 i cnat raed [23:07]
Diablo-D3 mircea_popescu: APPARENTLY NOT [23:07]
Diablo-D3 TOO MUCH MASTURBATION IS BAD FOR THE EYES [23:07]
mircea_popescu zero tolerence [23:07]
mircea_popescu resses is my roll modal [23:08]
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BTC-Mining Once completed, the 64-core version of the Parallella computer would deliver over 90 GFLOPS of performance and would have the the horse power comparable to a theoretical 45 GHz CPU [23:17]
BTC-Mining 1500$ for 2 x 64 cores board... [23:18]
BTC-Mining Seems cheap... [23:18]
Diablo-D3 yeah uh [23:19]
Diablo-D3 I do that on my 7970. [23:19]
kakobrekla accually its 99$ [23:19]
kakobrekla burning like 2 watts [23:19]
Diablo-D3 they make GCNs that small [23:19]
BTC-Mining That sounds cheaper [23:19]
Diablo-D3 well, maybe not that low of wattage [23:20]
Diablo-D3 but high performance memory burns watts [23:20]
kakobrekla jeez, who are you talking to Diablo-D3 [23:20]
BTC-Mining They're going to be 100$? [23:20]
kakobrekla ye [23:20]
kakobrekla 99$ [23:20]
kakobrekla i pasted a link so you can read this shit [23:20]
BTC-Mining 100$ for 90 GFLOPS? Sounds cheap. [23:20]
Diablo-D3 kakobrekla: you have btc-mining on ignore? [23:20]
kakobrekla no [23:21]
Diablo-D3 then Im talking to him [23:21]
kakobrekla what does memory has to do with anything here [23:21]
Diablo-D3 and you [23:21]
Diablo-D3 kakobrekla: oh, watts [23:21]
Diablo-D3 the $100 gcn is more powerful, but uses more watts [23:21]
Diablo-D3 I imagine parallella has shit for memory [23:21]
BTC-Mining I don't really know cheap tho. Just stating compared to standalone consumer CPU/GPU specs and price. [23:22]
Diablo-D3 also, parallella sounds like a food [23:22]
Diablo-D3 BTC-Mining: cheap isnt magically good [23:22]
Diablo-D3 not when people can buy parallel hardware already [23:22]
Diablo-D3 and may even have it and not know it [23:22]
BTC-Mining and dev boards tending to be incredibly more expensive compared to consumer grade hardware. [23:22]
Diablo-D3 parallel doesnt magically fix shit either [23:23]
kakobrekla did anyone claim that? [23:23]
Diablo-D3 okay so, they're claiming 26 gigaflops on $99 [23:23]
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Diablo-D3 a 7750, the smallest GCN, using the ddr3 model, does 819 gflops and has 55 max watts and costs $109 [23:24]
Diablo-D3 the smallest still in production 5xxx/69xx is a Cedar, the 7350, 104 gflops, 20 watts [23:25]
Diablo-D3 no price avail because its OEM only [23:25]
mircea_popescu Diablo-D3 you know these ipos tend to be a lot of hype. [23:26]
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Diablo-D3 Im just saying here, cheap parallel hardware is already here [23:26]
BTC-Mining But can you really do everything you can do on a dev board on those? [23:26]
Diablo-D3 yes. [23:26]
Diablo-D3 I wrote a bitcoin miner, after all. [23:26]
BTC-Mining Yes... but not all good GPU are good at that. Basically only Radeon. [23:27]
BTC-Mining Because they're designed to do specific calculatations... [23:27]
BTC-Mining Would they be as performant for any task? Doesn't seem so. Aren't dev boards more like generic CPU for performing a larger variety of tasks? [23:29]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16237 @ 0.00046474 = 7.546 BTC [-] [23:32]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 33763 @ 0.00046446 = 15.6816 BTC [-] [23:32]
mircea_popescu BTC-Mining i don't imagine parallella chips do so well at parallelizing "a variety" of tasks anyway [23:32]
BTC-Mining Well it would do a variety of tasks... [23:34]
BTC-Mining So a more generic processor would be preferable. Unless you want to do tasks a GPU is good for. [23:35]
BTC-Mining Then consumer grade GPU are pretty performant and cheap. [23:35]
mircea_popescu im sure it's better than a radeon vidcard in that sense [23:35]
mircea_popescu but reasonably if i wanted to do parallel processing i'd still just rent out a rack of boxes and use that. [23:36]
BTC-Mining Well yeah. Renting is cheaper and you don't need to buy the whole hardware. [23:36]
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BTC-Mining But if you need to share it and use it all the time, a cheap one wouldn't be bad. [23:37]
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BTC-Mining Wouldn't for example students benefit from having cheap dev board available? [23:39]
smickles OMG, mircea_popescu that statjson will make things so much easier, and the md5, but what exactly is the md5 of for each secton? [23:42]
mircea_popescu the previous part of the section [23:42]
smickles with ',' included? [23:42]
mircea_popescu yes and mind the /n's [23:42]
mircea_popescu jurov ran into the same thing yest [23:42]
smickles oh, fing windows, i can't test it with /n's in mind [23:43]
mircea_popescu BTC-Mining maybe. who knows what students need... [23:43]
smickles i'll have to get back to my main macine [23:43]
mircea_popescu basically the point of the md5 is precisely to allow *some* armor hardening of the thing while still allowing it to be read like plain text [23:44]
mircea_popescu a sort of cabbage-eggplant. [23:44]
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BTC-Mining Well it's purely guesses and speculation on my part anyway. I don't really know anything about development and the need for dev boards. [23:44]
smickles well, seems like it can be utilized as a very quick and simple check for differences [23:45]
mircea_popescu smickles and also, seen the mpex db dump ? good insurance for customers, if they put a big order in also save a db dump :p [23:45]
mircea_popescu smickles and yes, that too, allows you to see fast which sections changed if you store prev hashes [23:45]
mircea_popescu it doesn't look like so much but a lot of work went into this thing actually. [23:46]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9478 @ 0.00046478 = 4.4052 BTC [+] [23:57]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 22600 @ 0.0004655 = 10.5203 BTC [+] [23:57]
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