Forum logs for 21 Dec 2015

Sunday, 24 November, Year 11 d.Tr. | Author: Mircea Popescu

assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 35450 @ 0.00048597 = 17.2276 BTC [-] {4}	[00:04]
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BingoBoingo	http://www.anandtech.com/bench/CPU/1131	[00:46]
assbot	CPU Benchmarks - Compare Products on AnandTech ... ( http://bit.ly/1YqoO4N )	[00:46]
punkman	no server worthy AMDs in there?	[01:08]
BingoBoingo	for srs	[01:08]
punkman	I mean they have the 50core xeons	[01:08]
punkman	but no opteron?	[01:08]
BingoBoingo	rly	[01:08]
punkman	https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LnqNvtHyWEY	[01:11]
assbot	Victoria's Secret Angels Lip Sync "Hands to Myself" - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1YqqSK7 )	[01:11]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14540 @ 0.00048834 = 7.1005 BTC [+] {2}	[01:11]
punkman	http://i0.wp.com/flowingdata.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/07/Disney-strategy-chart-from-1957.jpg	[01:28]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1YqsmEb )	[01:28]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 31750 @ 0.00049089 = 15.5858 BTC [+] {4}	[01:33]
punkman	"But I'm game. Give me a problem with 1,000,000 lines of C. But don't expect me to read the C, I couldn't. And don't think I'll have to write 10,000 lines of Forth. Just give me the specs of the problem, and documentation of the interface."	[01:36]
punkman	problem is how do you make a spec out of 1mil lines of C	[01:36]
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BingoBoingo	;;ticker --market all	[01:42]
gribble	Bitstamp BTCUSD last: 438.54, vol: 21363.05673128 \| BTC-E BTCUSD last: 435.798, vol: 10133.75385 \| Bitfinex BTCUSD last: 435.18, vol: 58460.49476529 \| BTCChina BTCUSD last: 451.344473, vol: 127964.96260000 \| Kraken BTCUSD last: 437.0, vol: 197.28930119 \| Bitcoin-Central BTCUSD last: 445.411619978, vol: 122.90168725 \| Volume-weighted last average: 445.022930078	[01:42]
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asciilifeform	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-12-2015#1349015 << you know that was kinda why i did the whole libc investigation, recall ?	[02:14]
assbot	Logged on 21-12-2015 00:03:55; mircea_popescu: incidentally the de-glibc-ized trb WILL run on netbsd now! << o hey!	[02:14]
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asciilifeform	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-12-2015#1349020 << i'd like to actually press a cd. with the understanding that everything that will ever happen to the reference implementation, incl. compiler, asm, the whole toolchain shebang, all kernels worth looking at from the past, all trb dependencies, etc. WILL BE ON IT	[02:16]
assbot	Logged on 21-12-2015 00:06:59; mircea_popescu: asciilifeform> pressing of cd was perhaps the ONE good idea in openbsd <<< certainly not a bad one.	[02:16]
asciilifeform	and everything that will ever come later in re: trb, will be vpatches on top of the contents of that cd.	[02:16]
asciilifeform	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-12-2015#1349033 << 'programmers get off on complexity the way weight lifters get off on weight'	[02:18]
assbot	Logged on 21-12-2015 00:27:34; mircea_popescu: nobody cares to look at the root causes. "hey derps ? you're being as inefficient as humanly possible" "well of course, any other course would be an economic disaster" "your idea of economy is like a rat's idea of hygiene : the more sewers the better" "so ?"	[02:18]
asciilifeform	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-12-2015#1349036 << hermaphrodite ?	[02:19]
assbot	Logged on 21-12-2015 00:35:24; mircea_popescu: and in anatomy class news, http://49.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_mdselsxkRs1rqpz2lo1_r1_500.gif	[02:19]
asciilifeform	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-12-2015#1349039 << closest thing i know of to this is that ru ministry where they installed typewriters last year	[02:20]
assbot	Logged on 21-12-2015 00:39:32; ben_vulpes: i don't see a macri coming by to devalue the webstack though. have been struggling to cook up the scenario wherein the world's managers declare technological bankruptcy and completely failing.	[02:20]
asciilifeform	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-12-2015#1349086 << see the thread from 2 wks ago re: benchmarks and intel's 20 year record of elaborate fraud	[02:26]
assbot	Logged on 21-12-2015 03:43:36; BingoBoingo: http://www.anandtech.com/bench/CPU/1131	[02:26]
asciilifeform	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-12-2015#1349091 << not only no opteron, but the benchmark itself is gimmicked - use of magical intel instructions	[02:27]
assbot	Logged on 21-12-2015 04:05:49; punkman: but no opteron?	[02:27]
punkman	for the post-mortem files http://www.buzzfeed.com/arianelange/alma-lawsuit	[02:28]
assbot	The Real Story Of Why One Of LA's Best Restaurants Is In Trouble - BuzzFeed News ... ( http://bit.ly/1Pft3Zm )	[02:28]
asciilifeform	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-12-2015#1349099 << there are NO programming problems which merit a million lines of c. FOR THE SAME REASON as there are no architectural problems which merit a megatonne of tongue depressors.	[02:28]
assbot	Logged on 21-12-2015 04:33:15; punkman: "But I'm game. Give me a problem with 1,000,000 lines of C. But don't expect me to read the C, I couldn't. And don't think I'll have to write 10,000 lines of Forth. Just give me the specs of the problem, and documentation of the interface."	[02:28]
asciilifeform	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-12-2015#1349056 << l0l, iirc this was the self-proclaimed (!) biography of ninjashogun	[02:31]
assbot	Logged on 21-12-2015 00:50:22; mircea_popescu: THEN when that boring shit goes nowhere, he convinces some misfortunate borderlines to... go live in thailand! because totally, shit'll make sense there.	[02:31]
BingoBoingo	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-12-2015#1349114 << Aha. Yes, just this was the first time I saw such fraud on crypto benchmark other than AES	[02:33]
assbot	Logged on 21-12-2015 05:23:54; asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-12-2015#1349086 << see the thread from 2 wks ago re: benchmarks and intel's 20 year record of elaborate fraud	[02:33]
asciilifeform	BingoBoingo: benchmark fraud is precisely as old as benchmarks and is pestilentially pervasive	[02:34]
asciilifeform	to the point of total unsurprise	[02:34]
BingoBoingo	Sure, just never paid attention or just never run into this benchmark used	[02:35]
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pete_dushenski	thestringpuller: see http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=16-12-2015#1344231 and the resultant http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=16-12-2015#1344736	[03:14]
assbot	Logged on 16-12-2015 06:00:51; BingoBoingo: ;;later tell pete_dushenski https://archive.is/L2CGe	[03:14]
assbot	Logged on 16-12-2015 19:09:17; assbot: Successfully added a rating of -1 for coblee with note: plagiarist. shill.	[03:14]
pete_dushenski	Nassim Nicholas Taleb: "Another piece of advice. Use an office only when it is strictly necessary. An office dulls the mind, invites cosmetic and circular work, and allows metastatic projects to take over."	[03:17]
pete_dushenski	George Yazbeck: "This assumes people have a choice or work as private independent contractors. We're not all famous authors...."	[03:17]
pete_dushenski	Nassim Nicholas Taleb: ""We're not all famous authors". This is a type of smart ass easy comment only a bitter loser makes. In addition, it has a logical fallacy. Did it hit you that I have only been a "famous author" part of my life? Did it also hit you that it also applies to employment in general?"	[03:17]
pete_dushenski	^sounds awfully familiar	[03:18]
pete_dushenski	for anyone who reads the #b-a logs	[03:18]
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punkman	http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/263836-paul-nobody-read-the-11-trillion-omnibus-bill	[03:20]
assbot	Paul: Nobody read the $1.1 trillion omnibus bill \| TheHill ... ( http://bit.ly/1QEh4aZ )	[03:20]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 31500 @ 0.00048492 = 15.275 BTC [-] {2}	[03:20]
trinque	were there bills they read?	[03:26]
pete_dushenski	;;later tell mircea_popescu: but what if i took being excommunicated as a badge of merit and distinction ? please, tell me what i have to do to 'go spinoza' or 'go galileo' ;)	[03:26]
gribble	The operation succeeded.	[03:26]
punkman	chukha writer, not reader	[03:28]
pete_dushenski	besides, is not trb news the dominion of mod6 'state of bitcoin addresses' or qntra ? i can certainly qntra, but i guess i'm not equipped to appreciate the significance of glibc-less-netbsd	[03:28]
pete_dushenski	sorry, trb sans glibc on netbsd, to be more precise	[03:29]
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BingoBoingo	pete_dushenski: Works in progress tend to stay in the logs and occasionally get buried there	[03:42]
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pete_dushenski	this being the trb progress ?	[03:43]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 31350 @ 0.00048919 = 15.3361 BTC [+] {3}	[03:47]
pete_dushenski	http://www.cbc.ca/news/business/food-inflation-november-1.3371284 << see comments : canadians are none too pleased when their panem gets pricier. "we wunt moar cheep meet nao !"	[03:50]
assbot	Inflation rate jumps to 1.4% in November on higher food costs - Business - CBC News ... ( http://bit.ly/1QEkw5r )	[03:50]
pete_dushenski	though the number of people who rightly call out the cpi scam is worthy of some mention.	[03:50]
pete_dushenski	i'd be curious to know (and so will endeavour to find out) if there were as many people calling "bullshit" in the late 70s and early 80s when reported inflation was ~10% and loan rates for cars and houses were 20-25%	[03:53]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7288 @ 0.00049002 = 3.5713 BTC [+] {2}	[03:56]
pete_dushenski	even without the internet, you'd figure that there would still be huge swathes of the population (those with brains, pen, and paper) that can figure out that "10% inflation" shouldn't yield a doubling in food prices every 3 years, as we've essentially seen in the last 3 years with only a reported inflation of "under 2%"	[03:57]
pete_dushenski	anyways, looks like the canadians, like americans, are en route to becoming the africans they've so long wished to join.	[03:58]
pete_dushenski	or at least the poor slavic farmers their great-grandparents were back in the old country.	[03:59]
pete_dushenski	(western canada aka the prairies aka the breadbasket of the country has very large ukr, ru, and pl populations)	[04:00]
pete_dushenski	most of whom came here either 100 years ago or 25 years ago.	[04:00]
BingoBoingo	sure trb progress	[04:13]
pete_dushenski	well ya	[04:17]
pete_dushenski	b-a is ground zero for trb-dev	[04:18]
pete_dushenski	and thank god it's only part of b-a because the trb-dev stuff is waywaywayway over my head	[04:18]
pete_dushenski	like so far over my head that i barely have a thread to pull at in sometimes hundreds of consecutive lines	[04:20]
ben_vulpes	funny, it's like 90% of why i'm even here	[04:26]
BingoBoingo	pete_dushenski: As penance you should fire up a trb node to test the new version string patch	[04:28]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13250 @ 0.00049158 = 6.5134 BTC [+] {3}	[04:29]
punkman	https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CWs95AOWIAA411g.jpg:large	[04:30]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1YvgCet )	[04:30]
pete_dushenski	https://www.flexport.com/blog/why-dole-owns-container-ships/ << one for ben_vulpes	[04:33]
assbot	Why Should Dole Own Container Ships? \| Flexport ... ( http://bit.ly/1YvgRGe )	[04:33]
pete_dushenski	http://i.imgur.com/8JdtDmC.jpg << heh.	[04:38]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1S3Qjfr )	[04:38]
punkman	https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nmqAjr0xs04 this guy	[04:44]
assbot	Steve Harvey Announces The WRONG Winner of Miss Universe 2015 - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1S3R1th )	[04:44]
pete_dushenski	i call intentional marketing ploy	[04:45]
punkman	yeah I guess a lot more of this, very viral, such wow	[04:45]
pete_dushenski	specifically in the vein of http://www.contravex.com/2015/02/03/meta-metastasis-or-how-a-dancing-shark-jumped-the-shark/	[04:46]
assbot	Meta-metastasis, or how a dancing shark jumped the shark. \| Contravex: A blog by Pete Dushenski ... ( http://bit.ly/1S3RdZn )	[04:46]
pete_dushenski	"omg did you see that silly fuck-up? haha it was totes cray!"	[04:46]
BingoBoingo	https://archive.is/64TVH	[04:47]
assbot	What we learned about SSDs in 2015 \| ZDNet ... ( http://bit.ly/1S3RnQz )	[04:47]
deedbot-	[BitBet Bets Bets] 2.00000000 BTC on 'No' - Donald Trump gets Republican Nomination - http://bitbet.us/bet/1206/donald-trump-gets-republican-nomination/#b52	[04:50]
*	pete_dushenski to bed.	[04:52]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 21750 @ 0.00049197 = 10.7003 BTC [+]	[04:57]
punkman	https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/3xksss/coinbase_bans_me_after_i_help_them_fix_major/cy5t83p	[05:00]
assbot	coblee comments on Coinbase Bans me After i Help them fix major Exploit ... ( http://bit.ly/1Yvj1Wr )	[05:00]
BingoBoingo	"I believe that soft-fork segwit can help us out of this deadlock and get us going again." - A Negative https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/bitcoin-dev/2015-December/012090.html	[05:00]
assbot	[bitcoin-dev] Capacity increases for the Bitcoin system. ... ( http://bit.ly/1Yvj3xE )	[05:00]
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BingoBoingo	Other derp: In other words, would a deployment of SW involve the creation of new	[05:05]
BingoBoingo	network message for relaying fraud proofs, a specification that SPV wallet developers can use to validate these messages and so know when to ignore the highest (but invalid) PoW chain...	[05:05]
punkman	any idea wtf are fraud proofs?	[05:07]
BingoBoingo	I'm more worried about the last six words	[05:07]
BingoBoingo	in other coprophlology https://archive.is/amKgQ	[05:10]
assbot	[bitcoin-dev] A new payment address format for segregated witness or not? ... ( http://bit.ly/1S3U3Ob )	[05:10]
deedbot-	[BitBet Bets Bets] 4.00000000 BTC on 'No' - Donald Trump gets Republican Nomination - http://bitbet.us/bet/1206/donald-trump-gets-republican-nomination/#b53	[05:14]
ben_vulpes	highest but invalid pow chain?	[05:15]
ben_vulpes	i guess we don't need baby jebus to save the britneychain if the linux foundation's going to fork the phr33 w0rld off it	[05:16]
ben_vulpes	in other news the incal's a not bad romp	[05:18]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 26600 @ 0.00049241 = 13.0981 BTC [+] {3}	[05:30]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5250 @ 0.00048789 = 2.5614 BTC [-] {2}	[05:37]
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BingoBoingo	And then there were 4 https://bitnodes.21.co/nodes/?q=/therealbitcoin.org:0.9.99.99	[06:07]
assbot	Network Snapshot - Bitnodes ... ( http://bit.ly/1PeJp6j )	[06:07]
BingoBoingo	Also does is anyone else peristently maintaining many more bitcoin connections then they were when the XT spamnodes flooded? Went from 12-19 range to 24-38 range	[06:10]
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mircea_popescu	BingoBoingo 100ish is normal for a nonshit node	[06:11]
punkman	http://40.media.tumblr.com/17f6ddd25f483911f38a960448154790/tumblr_mzajhneDNl1rndm2ho1_1280.jpg 4	[06:12]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1QEB1yg )	[06:12]
mircea_popescu	(ie the sort of thing we run, with its own actual dedicated server, ip, etc. aws instances and similar cloudcrud are more in the dozen range)	[06:12]
BingoBoingo	mircea_popescu: Limited pipe gets allocated here. This is cow country.	[06:12]
mircea_popescu	bandwidth is strangely not a problem per se.	[06:13]
BingoBoingo	Lots of things "aren't really problems" until they are	[06:14]
BingoBoingo	This is basically Africa but with anti-famine	[06:15]
mircea_popescu	heh	[06:15]
mircea_popescu	"their independent 39-seat restaurant in downtown Los Angeles that was a hit in the national food press "	[06:16]
mircea_popescu	motherfucker.... what the fuck is wrong with people ?	[06:16]
mircea_popescu	39 seats IS NOT A RESTAURANT.	[06:16]
BingoBoingo	It's maybe a large diner	[06:17]
BingoBoingo	Or small diner if freestanding and not a trailer	[06:17]
mircea_popescu	not even large. for the same reason a bike's not a bus, nor a fiddler an orchestra. a restaurant means, without exception, a chef, a sauce and a pasta sous, and at the very least 4 apprentice hands. that's 7 people in the kitchen doing the artwork. this is not counting the 3+ busboys, the 6 waiters and the maitre d'hotel in the salon, nor is it counting the people washing dishes, wiping the floors etc.	[06:18]
mircea_popescu	YOU CAN NOT HAVE A RESTAURANT WITH FEWER SEATS THAN STAFF!	[06:18]
mircea_popescu	not because it's inconceivable the shah of iran would pay enough to keep it in business. but because its minuscule size stupidifies it through "reflection off the boundries" effects.	[06:19]
BingoBoingo	No a diner isn't a restaurant. It's one of those trailer things with one stove that barely works	[06:19]
mircea_popescu	right.	[06:19]
BingoBoingo	But 39 seats seems the right size for that	[06:19]
BingoBoingo	Maybe 3-4 people working total	[06:20]
mircea_popescu	which is a restaurant in the same sense two bums with no prior business experience and no technology knowledge are "a tech company".	[06:22]
BingoBoingo	Right	[06:22]
BingoBoingo	A crude form of XTraunt	[06:22]
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mircea_popescu	aymor was just an inexperienced but hardworking 26-year-old when he started Alma as a “pop-up concept” restaurant in early 2012, not long after eating a fateful piece of lamb that, the press has repeated, set him on the path to cooking.	[06:24]
mircea_popescu	god damned...	[06:24]
BingoBoingo	Now that one is clearly a carnival vendor, not a restaurant	[06:26]
mircea_popescu	what the fuck is with these schmucks, "asking for community help" to keep a luxury restaurant afloat ?	[06:26]
mircea_popescu	it's just...	[06:26]
punkman	"Fortunately for us, we’ve had everyone say everything that you can possibly think of about our food, so we are past the point where we need the validation from anybody. I could give a fuck at this point, and we are just happy to try Alma again in the form of a three-month-residency at The Standard hotel in West Hollywood, whether it is critically acclaimed or not."	[06:27]
mircea_popescu	so kickstarter's everyone's mom now amirite.	[06:27]
mircea_popescu	heh, o look at that. they tried and so therefore nobody can criticize them!	[06:27]
*	mircea_popescu braces himself for a flood of young adults with self-reported "experiences" and "validation", and the ensuing tidal wave of women ready to shoot them	[06:27]
mircea_popescu	anyway. maybe time for kickstarter jokes. "yo kickstarter's so fat it wears the css on its javascript!"	[06:28]
BingoBoingo	In other news the Obeast messiah Tess Monster has announced her surrender to FPH using her real name social media accounts https://i.sli.mg/738TTX.jpg	[06:29]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1TZbr52 )	[06:29]
BingoBoingo	Celebration at https://voat.co/v/fatpeoplehate/comments/737437	[06:29]
assbot	In which Tess demands white knights. \| fatpeoplehate ... ( http://bit.ly/1TZbu0T )	[06:29]
mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-12-2015#1349126 << "1. why have a benchmark if you're not trying to tell a story ? 2. why tell a story if you're not making a buck from the telling ?"	[06:30]
assbot	Logged on 21-12-2015 05:31:48; asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: benchmark fraud is precisely as old as benchmarks and is pestilentially pervasive	[06:30]
mircea_popescu	BingoBoingo so scammer gets called out on history of scamming, proceeds to delete all that he can. fattardstalk.org ftw, but what's the relation to pres. bahamas ?	[06:30]
BingoBoingo	Relationship to Bahamas is jsut this past week People and the other supermarket Mass Ragazines were running pieces in defense of her. Actually though she's being hung out to dry now by the cows she scammed	[06:32]
BingoBoingo	Wait, what is the Mayo pronoun?	[06:32]
mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-12-2015#1349132 << the latter two should be the first. an office for work is like a strip club for sex.	[06:32]
assbot	Logged on 21-12-2015 06:14:11; pete_dushenski: Nassim Nicholas Taleb: "Another piece of advice. Use an office only when it is strictly necessary. An office dulls the mind, invites cosmetic and circular work, and allows metastatic projects to take over."	[06:32]
mircea_popescu	specifically : if the strip club actually provides advantages to you, that is a sign of your sexual dysfunction(s). same thing with an office :	[06:33]
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mircea_popescu	if you can't keep a schedule if you don't have an office, your problems are the adolescentine irresponsibility, not the lack of an office. fix the problem, as it's an absolute bar to being a businessman ANYWAY, office or no office.	[06:33]
mircea_popescu	all other perceived advantages flow exactly the same way.	[06:33]
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mircea_popescu	the only time an office is unavoidable is when/IF (and that's a big if) you're actually dedicating your time to squeezing useful work out of lazy stupid drones.	[06:34]
mircea_popescu	i don't advise any man to take this course, but recognize that well... cattle ranching is in point of fact a legitimate line of work, and you don't always get the choices you want.	[06:34]
mircea_popescu	(this happens to be why the government is the largest office consumer.)	[06:36]
mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-12-2015#1349141 << heh, things are only ever that clearly cut a) in retrospect and b) when discussing a cult. such as the catholic church. neither a or b applies here, and so... who's to know ?	[06:38]
assbot	Logged on 21-12-2015 06:23:04; pete_dushenski: ;;later tell mircea_popescu: but what if i took being excommunicated as a badge of merit and distinction ? please, tell me what i have to do to 'go spinoza' or 'go galileo' ;)	[06:38]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 36876 @ 0.00048645 = 17.9383 BTC [-] {3}	[06:41]
*	BingoBoingo pretty sure going "Spinoza" requires beginning from a place of tedium	[06:42]
mircea_popescu	heh im writing a novel here brb.	[06:45]
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BingoBoingo	;;ticker --market all	[06:56]
mircea_popescu	here we go	[06:57]
mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-12-2015#1349144 << this is an interestingly mixed bag.	[06:57]
mircea_popescu	on one hand, the "dominion" approach to thinking isn't particularly useful here, because all it does is provide the limiting (the disadvantageous) part of setting boundries, without delivering any kind of protective (ie, advantageous) offset. Specifically how boundries work is, suppose you have two kids, Amy aged 7 and Adam aged 6. If you set a boundry such as "Adam, never hit Amy!" you are in fact limiting Adam's natu	[06:57]
mircea_popescu	ral agressivity, which will make him less of an Adam, but in exchange you're protecting Amy's identity, which will make her more of an Amy. The argument as to whether this is a good idea or a bad idea hinges on how you value the part of Adam that's lost and the part of Amy that's saved - because yes, wherever spheres touch something's gonna get flattened, that's unavoidable - but in any case an argument can always be b	[06:57]
mircea_popescu	rought and disposed of (either accepting it or rejecting it) because both sides are present. Conversely, if you set a boundry for Amy in the terms of "don't try and think honey, that's for men, just sit there and be pretty" she might listen, especially at 7, but you've set a boundry for her that has no upside. "Men" doesn't even exist per se. So this isn't an argument that can be considered, it only has one side to it.	[06:57]
assbot	Logged on 21-12-2015 06:25:36; pete_dushenski: besides, is not trb news the dominion of mod6 'state of bitcoin addresses' or qntra ? i can certainly qntra, but i guess i'm not equipped to appreciate the significance of glibc-less-netbsd	[06:57]
mircea_popescu	To apply this to b-a affairs : it's not particularly useful to go "I'm not going to X because that's Y's dominion". For one thing, it's not terribly clear if this is even true (people are notoriously poor at communicating things this subtle, and consequently your love for Amy's not Amy's idea of your love for her, not ever, until the day you die). It is perfectly valid to go "i won't be telling X how to Y because Ying	[06:57]
mircea_popescu	is X's thing", or in the more general "I'm not about to go into should mode - that's how you get hanged", but that's not so related.	[06:57]
mircea_popescu	It's also perfectly valid to go "I'm not about to Y, seems X's going to do it and they're probably better than me / I don't want to duplicate the effort". Note however that this is an extremely tenuous argument : if it's true he's better than you then you probably should duplicate the effort - that's exactly the only avenue to learning, duplicating the effort of your betters. If it's the case you're better than him, od	[06:57]
mircea_popescu	ds are you'll end up having to do it later anyway, and once you know this it's always better to do it at a time of choice than at a time of need. Obviously this leaves wide open the "well I just don't care so much about Ying", which is fine, with the caveat that as the reunion of Ys starts approaching the universe, you're getting closer and closer to the nagant ending.	[06:57]
mircea_popescu	on the OTHER hand however, you have to understand biology works on drivers, and b-a is very much a natural system, so biology applies. the whole shebang is driven by need, if you go "I NEED X and Y and Z to be able to do K!" you may or may not get X, Y or Z, or maybe a response as to the usefullness of K, but in any case the b-a itself gains. If you recall a primary driver for historical activity was alf going "I want	[06:58]
mircea_popescu	X so I can Y", for x=printable bitcoin and y=read in bed. He's not gotten it, at least not yet, but you can't say anyone's been the worse for the experience.	[06:58]
mircea_popescu	Thinking in those terms, "Hey, TRB actually running on BSD as opposded to PRB sounds to me like it'd be huge, it must be made a point of public communication, I need datas to support me in discussing this with people, plox to help me here!" is a helluva lot more productive than "this is X's dominion". At the worst this will clarify that "nah, not really", at the best it'll help a lot of idiots understand why it nobody	[06:58]
mircea_popescu	gives a shit about the PRB.	[06:58]
mircea_popescu	750 words, what's that eh.	[06:58]
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BingoBoingo	If only you had a trilema to put that in	[07:00]
mircea_popescu	lol ironically, i wouldn't have.	[07:00]
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mircea_popescu	it's to date the largest reply i ever had to make in an irc conversation, but it is in fact a reply in an irc conversation.	[07:00]
mircea_popescu	some problems more verbose than others.	[07:00]
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mircea_popescu	!up nickeeem	[07:01]
-assbot-	You voiced nickeeem for 30 minutes.	[07:01]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 23500 @ 0.00048843 = 11.4781 BTC [+]	[07:01]
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mircea_popescu	!up kcud_dab	[07:09]
-assbot-	You voiced kcud_dab for 30 minutes.	[07:09]
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BingoBoingo	!up STRML	[07:09]
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mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-12-2015#1349167 << lulzy obit. odd that no BSDO mentioned.	[07:09]
assbot	Logged on 21-12-2015 07:27:38; punkman: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CWs95AOWIAA411g.jpg:large	[07:09]
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mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-12-2015#1349175 <	[07:10]
assbot	Logged on 21-12-2015 07:42:06; pete_dushenski: i call intentional marketing ploy	[07:10]
mircea_popescu	full frontal nudity miss america or get off the cables.	[07:11]
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BingoBoingo	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-12-2015#1349167 << lulzy obit. odd that no BSDO mentioned. << Holy shit, how did I miss this in paper newspaper	[07:12]
assbot	Logged on 21-12-2015 07:27:38; punkman: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CWs95AOWIAA411g.jpg:large	[07:12]
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mircea_popescu	"I won't comment on the account ban for privacy or regulatory reasons. But I can say that the ban has nothing to do with this person's hackerone reporting. And unfortunately, we cannot be more lenient on him just because he has previously helped us. The 2 issues are independent. And plus, the team that works with banning has no access or knowledge of the hackerone cases. This separation protects our customers' privacy."	[07:12]
mircea_popescu	what the fuck is all this fucktardation supposed to accomplish ?	[07:13]
mircea_popescu	the FACT still is as the guy described. who the fuck cares what your internal functioning is like ? "regulatory reasons" are no reasons.	[07:13]
mircea_popescu	if you promise me a banana and fail to deliver the banana as promised, whether this is related or unrelated, intentional or unintentional, for regulatory reasons or to protect the privacy, I'M SHORT A FUCKING BANANA.	[07:13]
mircea_popescu	so i guess it's not merely "don't help coinbase, they'll fuck you up" as yesterday, but moreover, "don't help coinbase - they'll fuck you up and then display the unmitigated gall of pretending that it didn't happen, or if it did it shouldn't matter or if it does it has nothing to do wit hthem". herp.	[07:14]
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mircea_popescu	next time you have the opportunity to hurt coinbase - hurt coinbase. secure in the knowledge that you're not only hurting some 3rd removed assholes, but a whole system of evil.	[07:15]
mircea_popescu	(that said, this particular fellow couldn't actually hurt coinbase, which is exactly why he didn't. but anyway._	[07:16]
mircea_popescu	in other news, "Shouldn’t we be surprised to learn that an importer owns and operates its own ships? It’s probably not the comparative advantage for even the largest importers. And here’s the thing: Dole isn’t one of the country’s top three importers of containerized cargo. Instead it’s the fifth, after Walmart, Target, Home Depot, and Lowe’s. But you won’t see boxes or ships owned by these companies. I	[07:17]
mircea_popescu	nstead, they depend on carriers like Maersk, CMA CGM, and Evergreen to ship their freight."	[07:17]
mircea_popescu	derps.	[07:17]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12927 @ 0.00049334 = 6.3774 BTC [+]	[07:17]
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mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-12-2015#1349192 << inching towards war. by now, it's inevitable.	[07:22]
assbot	Logged on 21-12-2015 08:04:49; BingoBoingo: I'm more worried about the last six words	[07:22]
mircea_popescu	consumers chose to revolt, will be raped, perhaps they learn (fat chance).	[07:22]
BingoBoingo	Stop being polite. The appropriate word selection is "Morbidly Obese Chance"	[07:23]
mircea_popescu	lol @ that bitnodes.21.co thing not listing all my 0.6 nodes etc	[07:25]
mircea_popescu	herpitty derp, gotta get prb appear over irrelevancy no matter what.	[07:26]
BingoBoingo	It'll list them if you change the version string	[07:26]
mircea_popescu	why should i ?	[07:26]
mircea_popescu	fuck em, whose job it is to list, theirs or mine ?	[07:26]
BingoBoingo	No reason at all	[07:26]
BingoBoingo	that list is just still fighting the move to 0.8 war it always has since it was born	[07:26]
mircea_popescu	just pointing out that you know, "here's prb showing 35% (of 40% of the actual network)". which happens to be exactly the mtgox approach to lyf.	[07:27]
mircea_popescu	BingoBoingo exactly.	[07:27]
mircea_popescu	ohv, hetzner and amazon. heh.	[07:27]
BingoBoingo	But the alf experiment of see how many nodes trb needs before being censored is worth at least two chuckles	[07:28]
mircea_popescu	i guess yeah	[07:28]
BingoBoingo	Because what non answer will the give for nodes using maxint versions being censored	[07:29]
mircea_popescu	"it didn't happen, or if it did it shouldn't matter or if it does it has nothing to do wit them"	[07:30]
mircea_popescu	pretty much batting 100% as far as memory sees.	[07:31]
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mircea_popescu	did buffett have the audacity to claim no shorts could be found with millions riding against him in publicly visible ledger ? sure. ever fixed that ? no.	[07:32]
mircea_popescu	did phuctor happen ? did msm derps steal off qntra ? etc.	[07:32]
mircea_popescu	did the "well we wanted to do xt but mp nixed it so i guess no xt" comunique appear as the last entry on bitcoinxt ?	[07:33]
mircea_popescu	soonish we'll need a dedicated index just to keep track of the various smackdowns we delivered.	[07:34]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 50989 @ 0.00048609 = 24.7852 BTC [-] {5}	[07:36]
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BingoBoingo	;;ticker --market all	[07:42]
gribble	Bitstamp BTCUSD last: 438.45, vol: 23641.45647734 \| BTC-E BTCUSD last: 434.27, vol: 11346.57082 \| Bitfinex BTCUSD last: 438.25, vol: 62541.61995173 \| CampBX BTCUSD last: 428.0, vol: 0.2 \| BTCChina BTCUSD last: 452.487836, vol: 138361.54340000 \| Kraken BTCUSD last: 437.99, vol: 193.80572256 \| Bitcoin-Central BTCUSD last: 444.219971989, vol: 170.15857314 \| Volume-weighted last average: (1 more message)	[07:42]
BingoBoingo	;;more	[07:44]
gribble	446.421248884	[07:44]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7300 @ 0.00049333 = 3.6013 BTC [+] {2}	[08:01]
BingoBoingo	https://archive.is/LElDU << Why reddit can't ever bitcoin	[08:02]
assbot	TIFU by giving up my wife's parents to the Feds : tifu ... ( http://bit.ly/1PfROEL )	[08:02]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 70300 @ 0.00049334 = 34.6818 BTC [+]	[08:04]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11600 @ 0.00049334 = 5.7227 BTC [+]	[09:42]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 18250 @ 0.00048508 = 8.8527 BTC [-] {2}	[09:46]
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punkman	"SPV clients can connect to multiple full nodes in the hope that at least one of the nodes is honest and will provide them with the best valid chain, however situations may arise where the non-compliant chain contains more proof of work than the compliant chain. In this situation, there is no way for the honest full node to signal to an SPV client that it should disregard the chain with more	[09:55]
punkman	proof of work. Fraud proofs are a technique which provide honest full nodes the capability to conclusively demonstrate that chain is invalid regardless of the amount of proof of work backing the invalid chain."	[09:55]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 54700 @ 0.0004848 = 26.5186 BTC [-] {3}	[10:34]
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shinohai	https://ryanxcharlestimes.com/10-gb-blocks-e7ed69e54a66#.wez1ap2lb <<	[11:06]
assbot	10 GB Blocks — Ryan X. Charles Times — Medium ... ( http://bit.ly/1OhGFQv )	[11:06]
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mircea_popescu	punkman aka "we want to redefine honest to mean 'honest' please play along".	[11:08]
mircea_popescu	signatures don't matter ain't good enough, pow don't matter either now. idjits.	[11:08]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 27800 @ 0.00049334 = 13.7149 BTC [+]	[11:24]
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liquidassets	MORNING ASSETERS!	[11:57]
liquidassets	https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YZyLyKYnLoE	[11:58]
assbot	NOFX - Thank God Its Monday - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1RAkOdP )	[11:58]
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liquidassets	And Mondays?	[12:04]
punkman	https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CWmjEXeXIAQaVn9.jpg:large	[12:06]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1RAmGTU )	[12:06]
mircea_popescu	punkman so ?	[12:07]
punkman	good theme	[12:08]
mircea_popescu	oh	[12:08]
mircea_popescu	lolk	[12:08]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12800 @ 0.0004871 = 6.2349 BTC [-] {2}	[12:21]
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asciilifeform	gentlement, please welcome (back) bucephalus: 216.15.33.203:8333 - a trb node, now running asciilifeform's bleeding-edge (on musl-rotor)	[12:28]
asciilifeform	*gentlemen	[12:28]
asciilifeform	this build is ~4MB incidentally	[12:28]
asciilifeform	;;later tell VariaVarietatis please ask all trb questions in #bitcoin-assets	[12:29]
gribble	The operation succeeded.	[12:29]
shinohai	GG asciilifeform	[12:29]
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asciilifeform	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-12-2015#1349190 << l0l!!	[12:32]
assbot	Logged on 21-12-2015 08:01:58; BingoBoingo: network message for relaying fraud proofs, a specification that SPV wallet developers can use to validate these messages and so know when to ignore the highest (but invalid) PoW chain...	[12:32]
mircea_popescu	you know ?	[12:32]
mircea_popescu	usg gotta split the muppets off bitcoin chain. one way or another, but IT GOTTA BE DONE!!1	[12:32]
mircea_popescu	"hands off our cattle!"	[12:32]
asciilifeform	just when i thought this couldn't get any lulzier	[12:32]
asciilifeform	'ignore highest PoW'	[12:32]
mircea_popescu	anyway, i happen to agree. there's absolutely no reason usg.jwz has any business touching bitcoin at any point.	[12:32]
mircea_popescu	it's just not for him.	[12:33]
asciilifeform	anyway i predicted usgcoin shortly after i first logged in here	[12:33]
asciilifeform	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-12-2015#1349203 <<>> http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=19-12-2015#1347639	[12:35]
assbot	Logged on 21-12-2015 09:07:36; BingoBoingo: Also does is anyone else peristently maintaining many more bitcoin connections then they were when the XT spamnodes flooded? Went from 12-19 range to 24-38 range	[12:35]
assbot	Logged on 19-12-2015 20:08:33; asciilifeform: so at this point i'm pretty certain where 'black hole' comes from.	[12:35]
asciilifeform	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-12-2015#1349209 << not strangely. cpu and disk i/o is the bottleneck, i determined this to arbitrary precision.	[12:36]
assbot	Logged on 21-12-2015 09:09:56; mircea_popescu: bandwidth is strangely not a problem per se.	[12:36]
asciilifeform	and this is reflected in connection count as per earlier link	[12:36]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform you would expect, from a very high on view, that bw is the bottleneck in p2p anything, and especially anything dealing with 200gb worth of stored data.	[12:36]
asciilifeform	it ~would~ be the bottleneck if the thing were not written by tards	[12:37]
asciilifeform	and didn't block on blockverify	[12:37]
asciilifeform	and used multiple cpu, etc	[12:37]
mircea_popescu	o btw, didja happen to notice teh speed raid arrangement on phuctor's new server ? :D	[12:37]
asciilifeform	aha it is very spiffy	[12:37]
*	asciilifeform spent a good chunk of the last 2 days getting the multiprocessor phuctor werker into shape	[12:38]
shinohai	nosuchlabs will b back soon?	[12:38]
asciilifeform	shinohai: reasonably soon	[12:38]
asciilifeform	shinohai: trb node is already there, see thread	[12:38]
shinohai	I saw that ppart, thrilled to have node back	[12:39]
shinohai	*part	[12:39]
asciilifeform	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-12-2015#1349291 << ahahahaha! RULE OF LAWWWWWW !?!?!!!!!11111	[12:41]
assbot	Logged on 21-12-2015 10:09:53; mircea_popescu: "I won't comment on the account ban for privacy or regulatory reasons. But I can say that the ban has nothing to do with this person's hackerone reporting. And unfortunately, we cannot be more lenient on him just because he has previously helped us. The 2 issues are independent. And plus, the team that works with banning has no access or knowledge of the hackerone cases. This separati	[12:41]
asciilifeform	that is the face of the beast.	[12:41]
asciilifeform	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=20-11-2015#1328022 << see also	[12:41]
assbot	Logged on 20-11-2015 02:04:44; asciilifeform: the scam is not in hitler's ability to 'cut off your lips if he doesn't like your face' but in the ~pretense~ at this strange 'rule of law' fiction	[12:41]
mircea_popescu	amusingly, it's exactly what we'll say as they get impaled.	[12:41]
mircea_popescu	heck, it's EXACTLY what isis is saying right now.	[12:41]
asciilifeform	wai wut, 'we won't comment on this impalement for regulatory reasons' ??	[12:42]
mircea_popescu	well no, who the fuck needs the formalism.	[12:43]
mircea_popescu	prolly something more in line with "you don't get to comment on his impalement because who the fuck are you"	[12:43]
mircea_popescu	same principle anywya.	[12:43]
asciilifeform	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-12-2015#1349296 >> http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=20-12-2015#1348495	[12:44]
assbot	Logged on 21-12-2015 10:12:40; mircea_popescu: next time you have the opportunity to hurt coinbase - hurt coinbase. secure in the knowledge that you're not only hurting some 3rd removed assholes, but a whole system of evil.	[12:44]
assbot	Logged on 20-12-2015 18:03:24; asciilifeform: now if camel fucker army had brains and used pgp and gave half a shit, one could send 0day to them and have at least the pleasure of knowing that it will be used to deal max damage.	[12:44]
asciilifeform	afaik the fella in question did not really have a chance. he had a bullet, but not the gun.	[12:46]
asciilifeform	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-12-2015#1349306 << explicit cutoff on that site is 0.8 iirc	[12:47]
assbot	Logged on 21-12-2015 10:22:53; mircea_popescu: lol @ that bitnodes.21.co thing not listing all my 0.6 nodes etc	[12:47]
asciilifeform	an echo of the old derpwarz	[12:47]
asciilifeform	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-12-2015#1349319 << l0l, modernized ver. of http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=21-05-2015#1142233 ?	[12:48]
assbot	Logged on 21-12-2015 10:27:34; mircea_popescu: "it didn't happen, or if it did it shouldn't matter or if it does it has nothing to do wit them"	[12:48]
assbot	Logged on 21-05-2015 21:54:14; ascii_field: shitgnomes and their 'it didn't happen. if it happened, it doesn't matter. if it matters - one of -our- people did it first, of course!'	[12:48]
mircea_popescu	that's if it's good.	[12:49]
asciilifeform	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-12-2015#1349331 << i wonder if these folks know the story of pavlik morozov	[12:49]
assbot	Logged on 21-12-2015 10:59:18; BingoBoingo: https://archive.is/LElDU << Why reddit can't ever bitcoin	[12:49]
asciilifeform	in other lulz, http://imgur.com/utXv9EY	[12:59]
assbot	Imgur: The most awesome images on the Internet ... ( http://bit.ly/1S4ZXia )	[12:59]
mircea_popescu	BingoBoingo http://qntra.net/ << older backuped version back online. feel free to log in as per normal, update it, etc. everything should still work as b4, if not lemme know.	[13:13]
mircea_popescu	trilema also scheduled to be back online later today.	[13:15]
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asciilifeform	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-12-2015#1349134 << i like taleb's www and find it hard to disagree with his conclusions, but i simply cannot stomach his books. tried many times. reading his b00kz feels quite like having a titanic atomic cock shoved in your mouth; of such gargantuan proportions that it blots out the sun, moon, stars.	[13:43]
assbot	Logged on 21-12-2015 06:14:47; pete_dushenski: Nassim Nicholas Taleb: ""We're not all famous authors". This is a type of smart ass easy comment only a bitter loser makes. In addition, it has a logical fallacy. Did it hit you that I have only been a "famous author" part of my life? Did it also hit you that it also applies to employment in general?"	[13:43]
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*	assbot gives voice to gabrielradio	[13:47]
mircea_popescu	how's that metaphor work asciilifeform ?	[13:55]
asciilifeform	the man has problems reeling his monster ego even partly onto a spool	[13:55]
mircea_popescu	hahahaha	[13:56]
asciilifeform	even if he stuck to describing own victories, he'd be readable. but i don't need 40 pages about how well-pedigreed his lebanese family tree	[13:56]
mircea_popescu	and this doesn't bother you on his www ? or, for that matter, my www ?!	[13:56]
asciilifeform	nope.	[13:56]
mircea_popescu	i got more ego than taleb damnit.	[13:57]
asciilifeform	aha but mircea_popescu has a cable spool for the cock	[13:57]
asciilifeform	reels it out as necessary	[13:57]
*	mircea_popescu always thought that nonsense was between patently insane and alienly endearing.	[13:57]
mircea_popescu	seriously, you're a proud scion of a mightly lebanese line of kings and aviators ?	[13:57]
asciilifeform	'whatcha doing in the bowels of the reich then'	[13:57]
mircea_popescu	not just that, but... lebanese ? seriously ?	[13:58]
mircea_popescu	i suppose what saves it for my benefit is that romanian-ness has a humongous tradition in playing this for laughs	[13:58]
mircea_popescu	so it registers in my head as a merely not very good attempt at that.	[13:58]
asciilifeform	taleb makes wolfram look sane	[13:59]
*	BashCo (~BashCo@unaffiliated/bashco) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[13:59]
asciilifeform	at least herr w. merely brags about ~own~ imaginary triumphs	[13:59]
mircea_popescu	that's what i;m saying. somewhere between patently insane and alienly endearing. "he can'rt be fucking serious".	[14:00]
*	BashCo_ (BashCo@gateway/vpn/mullvad/x-rbntkhcyxajbivpw) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[14:00]
asciilifeform	also i am grossly underequipped to even venture to guess to what extent t. is a meatspace success	[14:00]
mircea_popescu	he's done okay.	[14:00]
mircea_popescu	or what, you mean with the ladies ?	[14:01]
asciilifeform	nah commercial	[14:01]
asciilifeform	specifically, how far did his theories take him	[14:01]
mircea_popescu	his theories took him no far, seeing how he created theories after going places./	[14:02]
asciilifeform	(and if not, why not. as a deservedly obscure crackpot i give a fuck, perhaps nobody else does)	[14:02]
asciilifeform	generally i find 'this is why i won' literature insufferably boring.	[14:02]
asciilifeform	ever try reading, e.g., edison ?	[14:02]
asciilifeform	or worse yet, bill gates.	[14:03]
mircea_popescu	edison was a total nitwit tho.	[14:03]
asciilifeform	aha.	[14:03]
mircea_popescu	bill gates idem.	[14:03]
mircea_popescu	this guy is cultivated.	[14:03]
asciilifeform	hence boring	[14:03]
*	BashCo has quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)	[14:03]
asciilifeform	but i'm not convinced that the cultivated had anything to do with the win	[14:03]
mircea_popescu	these points are always extremely hard to establish. even in the golden age of cultivated, the argument never was causation, but mere correlation. "lucy, sit like a lady" "why!" "because sitting like a lady correlates with not marrying a bum"	[14:04]
mircea_popescu	that's why the entire progressive bs even caught on in the first place. no causation.	[14:04]
mircea_popescu	anyway, i imagine trying to read taleb to judge paths to success/create a path to success would be ungodly unnerving. i mostly like him because he provides an unalligned datapoint, by some definitions of unallignation.	[14:06]
asciilifeform	it feels like reading brezhnev's 'Малая Земля'.	[14:07]
asciilifeform	like somebody's jacking off into your skull.	[14:07]
mircea_popescu	i like the wesleyan fellow for the same reason, weirdass right wing fundamentalism notwithstanding	[14:07]
asciilifeform	y'know, the mega-ghostwritten backbreaker about how b. won ww2 with own two hands	[14:08]
mircea_popescu	i never read that	[14:08]
asciilifeform	virtually nobody read it	[14:09]
asciilifeform	incl. brezhnev	[14:09]
asciilifeform	(by all accounts he never showed the slightest symptom of having read 'his' b00k)	[14:09]
mircea_popescu	also not particularly cultivated.	[14:09]
mircea_popescu	this is what makes the differece from, say, proust.	[14:10]
mircea_popescu	huge books, utterly meaningless drivel, but nevertheless...	[14:10]
asciilifeform	there is such a thing as the drivel of a cultivated man.	[14:13]
shinohai	https://bitco.in/forum/threads/gold-collapsing-bitcoin-up.16/page-184#post-6654 "In my opinion, someone like Gavin Andresen is a genuine Bitcoin expert." <<< LOLOL	[14:14]
mircea_popescu	to try and formalize this, imagine the question in terms of wallpaper. now you, being a sane individual, would never have wallpaper in the house. but, admitting for the sake of argument that you own a slavegirl together enough to be allowed to run her own household, and admitting she inexplicably wants some wallpaper, the difference between "whatever" and "you can't have that" mostly rests on whether the 900 dpi thing	[14:14]
mircea_popescu	is composed of one inch squares repeating ad infinitum (edison, gates, the us generally) or is actually a pattern as large as the wall itself (ie, cultivated)	[14:14]
mircea_popescu	ofcoursethereis!	[14:14]
mircea_popescu	you ever read du cote de chez swann ?	[14:15]
asciilifeform	nein	[14:15]
mircea_popescu	fine. how about newton's approach to alchemy ?	[14:15]
asciilifeform	aha	[14:16]
mircea_popescu	drivel. cultivated man.	[14:16]
asciilifeform	aha and even serious newtoniana aficionados rarely dwell on his alchemical labours.	[14:17]
mircea_popescu	and the list could continue. there's piles of patristics, all the way to the divine doctor himself, doing nothing else. what's plotinus exactly ?	[14:17]
mircea_popescu	well i suspect the reason for that disinterest is simple fear.	[14:17]
mircea_popescu	"oh my god what if i read it and it makes sense to me".	[14:17]
asciilifeform	i'd guess it'd be boredom	[14:17]
asciilifeform	recently i went on an alchemical archaeology kick, motivated partly by desire to distinguish the 'good drivel' (the kind that actually made meaningful context-reference) from the straight drivel	[14:18]
asciilifeform	that is to say, the labours of thinking and honest men, albeit working on pre-scientific priors, from the 'climatologists' of their day	[14:19]
mircea_popescu	yet another theme one can lose an entire team of engineers in	[14:19]
asciilifeform	i never get especially far with this, because the good sfuff is generally not on the net	[14:20]
asciilifeform	and i can't be arsed to get on a plane just for this	[14:20]
asciilifeform	the alchemical matter is of interest to me because i do not (and afaik nobody does) adequately have a handle on the phase transition, if you will, between voodoo and science, of a young field	[14:21]
*	Newar (~Newar@199.21.149.49) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[14:22]
gabrielradio	!up Newar	[14:25]
*	assbot gives voice to Newar	[14:25]
asciilifeform	https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/3xdv9z/what_is_user_agent_btcwire_and_why_is_it_grabbing << lulzy	[14:27]
assbot	What is user agent btcwire and why is it grabbing so much data from my full node? : Bitcoin ... ( http://bit.ly/1PgtXoq )	[14:27]
asciilifeform	this fella is soaking up the lion's share of the bandwidth of my nodez fleet	[14:27]
asciilifeform	and can anybody give me a good reason not to DROP all the aws/cloud crapola ?	[14:28]
*	justanotheruser (~Justan@unaffiliated/justanotheruser) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[14:28]
Newar	IIRC btcwire is from the btcd in GO https://github.com/btcsuite/btcd	[14:35]
assbot	btcsuite/btcd · GitHub ... ( http://bit.ly/1Oj6ki9 )	[14:35]
asciilifeform	incidentally, imho accepting multiple simultaneous pipes from a single ip is a bug	[14:35]
asciilifeform	(or at least, doing so by default and to an unlimited degree, is)	[14:36]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8150 @ 0.00048718 = 3.9705 BTC [+] {2}	[14:41]
*	justanotheruser has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)	[14:53]
*	assbot removes voice from Newar	[14:56]
mircea_popescu	the latter, yes.	[14:58]
mircea_popescu	and there's really no rule on what a node owner does to maintain his own network. you want to cut off aws, cut off aws.	[14:58]
mircea_popescu	i can see the argument in favour of isolating all "cloud" crapolade anyway, from everything.	[14:59]
asciilifeform	;;later tell mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-12-2015#1349033 << see also >> https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%97%D0%B0%D0%BA%D1%80%D1%8B%D0%B2%D0%B0%D1%8E%D1%89%D0%B0%D1%8F_%D1%82%D0%B5%D1%85%D0%BD%D0%BE%D0%BB%D0%BE%D0%B3%D0%B8%D1%8F (no, afaik there is no engl. discussion of this)	[14:59]
gribble	The operation succeeded.	[14:59]
assbot	Logged on 21-12-2015 00:27:34; mircea_popescu: nobody cares to look at the root causes. "hey derps ? you're being as inefficient as humanly possible" "well of course, any other course would be an economic disaster" "your idea of economy is like a rat's idea of hygiene : the more sewers the better" "so ?"	[14:59]
assbot	Закрывающая технология — Википедия ... ( http://bit.ly/1OGBQ3S )	[14:59]
asciilifeform	ah there he is	[14:59]
mircea_popescu	hola	[14:59]
asciilifeform	i'ma translate, brb	[15:00]
mircea_popescu	what do you mean not mentioned ?	[15:00]
mircea_popescu	all marxism is built on this.	[15:00]
asciilifeform	not exactly	[15:00]
*	Birdman has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)	[15:02]
asciilifeform	'A 'closing technology' - is a category of innovation, where as a result of its advent the need for a resource (including human resource) shrinks. A closing technology leads to the disappearance of an entire profession or branch of industry without creating a similarly resource-intensive profession or industry in its place. If one is speaking only of a replacement of a technology with a new one (or of a field, or market niche)	[15:06]
asciilifeform	to replace an obsolete one, then the subject in question is merely 'disruptive innovation.'	[15:06]
asciilifeform	The first mention in the scientific literature of such a phenomenon is in K. Marx's discussion regarding the invention of the weaving mill, after which a great many weavers in Great Britain and India perished, having outlived their usefulness. In M. Delyagin's opinion, closing technologies are unprofitable to market economies and are thereby relegated to postindustrial and preindustrial nations.	[15:06]
asciilifeform	Closing technology leads to technical progress, which in this particular case disrupts the workings of an economic system, upsetting the balance of production and creating structural unemployment. From this point of view, closing technology is both a boon and an evil.'	[15:06]
asciilifeform	^ rough transl.	[15:06]
*	asciilifeform does not endorse the crackpottery as written, but the concept is not useless	[15:06]
thestringpuller	hmm i can't reach qntra	[15:26]
thestringpuller	Wait wait for it	[15:26]
thestringpuller	YAAAAAAAAAY	[15:26]
jurov	asciilifeform: isn't it same thing as "disruptive innovation" before derps ran off with the term?	[15:28]
mircea_popescu	not really. disruptive simply means that the industrial pathways have to be reconstructed. not different from war in this sense.	[15:30]
mircea_popescu	tbh the best example of closing technology to date would be organised atheism.	[15:31]
jurov	how so? it removed some of clergy, but replaced it with humanities "scientists"	[15:34]
mircea_popescu	well no, removed the entire religion thing, from the "must build cathedral" to "tithe" - speaking of which, you ever seen l'avare with de funes ? epic tithing scene in there - and on and on. review the literature of the 1800s, about half the drivel printed was various clerics opiniong self importantly on matters they thoroughly ignored.	[15:36]
mircea_popescu	now, it's true that the self important ignoramus has not been discontinued by this ;' and it's true that he's found new crevices to hide and be gavin andersen in. nevertheless, this is not part of the definition.	[15:36]
thestringpuller	gavin doesnt even deserve to have his last name spelled correctly, cause who cares?	[15:37]
jurov	what is "organised atheism" then?	[15:37]
jurov	if not various branches of philosophy and humanities?	[15:37]
mircea_popescu	there's nothing atheistic about either of those.	[15:38]
jurov	what is "organised atheism" then?	[15:38]
mircea_popescu	a middle aged woman in queens going "when you die you die. that's it. you don't go anywhere." as overheard in "the conversion" seinfeld episode.	[15:40]
jurov	as i hardly know any such person, i suspect hard atheism is actually very rare thing.	[15:41]
mircea_popescu	what is "organised terrorism" ? a large enough group of people who think there's absolutely nothing wrong with setting things on fire if they were government things.	[15:41]
mircea_popescu	well... the thing about rat poison is that the rats don't need to know about it for it to work.	[15:42]
mircea_popescu	it may be rare or common in your environment, but the church sure as hell doesn't dare try and impose a tax, but instead fell back on the b-a taxation model.	[15:42]
jurov	heh, you wish. they learned bo bezzle instead.	[15:45]
jurov	*to bezzle	[15:45]
mircea_popescu	(organised here is used as a psych term of art - same way "organised delusion" works)	[15:45]
jurov	so, if we break organized delusion and now there's 1000s of individual ones, we have released human resources and unleashed immense potential, etc.?	[15:46]
mircea_popescu	huh ?	[15:46]
jurov	i just don't make sense to apply the concept on church. did anyone perish due to church being displaced? no? then wtf we are having such virtual concepts?	[15:51]
punkman	many perished	[15:51]
mircea_popescu	why is "someone perished" the criteria ?	[15:52]
mircea_popescu	it's just that at some point some % of gdp went into researching pewter alloys and making dumbass candlesticks and now it doesn't.	[15:53]
mircea_popescu	this may not be the case in marginal, primitive lands, but then again technology diffuses on a gradient.	[15:53]
jurov	i suspect it isn't the case. let's say in middle ages 95% was the agriculture and 5% the religion ... and now the 5% remains under whatever guises (new age, dianetics, angelology, you name it) just the 95% moved on	[16:03]
mircea_popescu	religion actually caried 80%+.	[16:04]
jurov	of what?	[16:04]
mircea_popescu	hence back when president bahamas of 1400 ran into "a crisis", what they did was a crusade	[16:05]
jurov	certainly not the GDP	[16:05]
mircea_popescu	not fucking bahamascare	[16:05]
mircea_popescu	yes gdp	[16:05]
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jurov	but they did not have million-armies. just gathered few thousands of derps, maybe 1% of pop... that could not have made a dent in gdp	[16:06]
mircea_popescu	you're kidding right ?	[16:07]
jurov	no	[16:07]
mircea_popescu	this is exactly counterfactual. the us is fighting the largest battle of a generation, fails to get ANY soldiers over at tikrit.	[16:07]
mircea_popescu	meanwhile the crusades touched pretty much every able bodied male	[16:07]
mircea_popescu	heck, they sent boatloads full of children.	[16:07]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12338 @ 0.00049273 = 6.0793 BTC [+]	[16:11]
jurov	still, if it really was big % of population, the outcome would look like after wave of pestilence&co, which it did not	[16:24]
jurov	in that line, medicine is really the 'closing technology' that unleashed rivers of meat	[16:25]
mircea_popescu	not really medicine. people keep going to "medicine", but this is nonsense. for one thing, medicine is in no better shape than it was during classical times, with one major exception : traumatology. which is what unleashed rivers of black athlete, it's true.	[16:26]
mircea_popescu	but other than that : the rivers of meat spawn from the generalized sanitation, and are fed by generalized refrigeration	[16:26]
mircea_popescu	medicine has ~0 to do with all this (as does democracy).	[16:27]
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ben_vulpes	yo trinque why did deedbot- miss this one? http://cascadianhacker.com/blog/2015/12/21_development-costs-of-user-interface-development-and-mitigating-them-with-clojurescript.html	[16:33]
assbot	Development Costs of User Interface Development (and mitigating them with Clojure/Script) ... ( http://bit.ly/1RBbIxw )	[16:33]
*	ben_vulpes vanishes	[16:33]
trinque	because it was gone.	[16:35]
trinque	sometimes fleanode issues cause the poor guy to say things to no one but himself.	[16:36]
trinque	my best people are on it	[16:37]
mircea_popescu	lol	[16:40]
jurov	ben_vulpes: do you have publicly available sample outcome of the glorious process?	[16:48]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 82767 @ 0.00049318 = 40.819 BTC [+] {2}	[16:52]
jurov	https://groups.google.com/forum/m/#!msg/boring-crypto/48qa1kWignU/o8GGp2K1DAAJ << where djb secretly desires ada	[16:56]
assbot	Google Groupes ... ( http://bit.ly/1RBefrj )	[16:56]
jurov	As a boring platform for the portable parts of boring crypto software, I'd like to see a free C compiler that clearly defines, and permanently	[16:56]
jurov	commits to, carefully designed semantics for everything that's labeled "undefined" or "unspecified" or "implementation-defined" in the C "standard".	[16:57]
mircea_popescu	heh	[16:58]
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*	silvaedium (~asfahjkj@ip24-253-204-109.ok.ok.cox.net) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[17:29]
deedbot-	[Qntra] Chain Fork Reveals BIP Process Broken - http://qntra.net/2015/07/chain-fork-reveals-bip-process-broken/	[17:40]
deedbot-	[Qntra] French TV Venture CANAL+ Hacked, Suppresses News with DMCA - http://qntra.net/2015/07/french-tv-venture-canal-hacked-suppresses-news-with-dmca/	[17:40]
deedbot-	[Qntra] Greek Finance Minister Varoufakis Resigns in Failure - http://qntra.net/2015/07/greek-finance-minister-varoufakis-resigns-in-failure/	[17:40]
deedbot-	[Qntra] Another Post BIP 66 Fork Dies after 3 Blocks - http://qntra.net/2015/07/another-post-bip-66-fork-dies-after-3-blocks/	[17:40]
deedbot-	[Qntra] Most Serene Republic Begins Advertising Public Blockchain Seed Nodes - http://qntra.net/2015/07/most-serene-republic-begins-advertising-public-blockchain-seed-nodes/	[17:40]
deedbot-	[Qntra] Transaction Fee Market Develops Amid Surge in Transaction Volume - http://qntra.net/2015/07/transaction-fee-market-develops-amid-surge-in-transaction-volume/	[17:40]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10850 @ 0.00049448 = 5.3651 BTC [+]	[17:58]
*	pete_dushenski (~pete_dush@manascmail.com) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[17:58]
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*	assbot gives voice to pete_dushenski	[17:59]
pete_dushenski	is it just me or is the latest qntra from july 10, 2015 ?	[17:59]
pete_dushenski	looks like the last 5 months of archives vanished in the last reboot ?	[18:00]
pete_dushenski	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-12-2015#1349416 << ahok	[18:01]
assbot	Logged on 21-12-2015 16:10:22; mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo http://qntra.net/ << older backuped version back online. feel free to log in as per normal, update it, etc. everything should still work as b4, if not lemme know.	[18:01]
pete_dushenski	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-12-2015#1349421 << i've never understood this rather commonplace criticism of taleb as being anything other than "ow my fee-fees hurt. that's not nice and it's certainly not how we do things in usistan where being successful and coming from somewhere other than the sewers is bad because reasons mkay"	[18:02]
assbot	Logged on 21-12-2015 16:52:46; asciilifeform: the man has problems reeling his monster ego even partly onto a spool	[18:02]
trinque	weird.	[18:03]
pete_dushenski	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-12-2015#1349426 << lol it's definitely a close contest.	[18:03]
assbot	Logged on 21-12-2015 16:53:56; mircea_popescu: i got more ego than taleb damnit.	[18:03]
trinque	deedbot- knows what date/time it is... did someone touch the entropy dial?	[18:04]
trinque	oh wow, that's what's actually on qntra.net at the moment.	[18:07]
pete_dushenski	mircea_popescu: "with the caveat that as the reunion of Ys starts approaching the universe, you're getting closer and closer to the nagant ending." << can you expand on this point ? is it that being overwhelmed on account of previous complacency and previous failures to eat the elephant one bite at a time, as those bites appeared, can only lead to suicide ?	[18:07]
pete_dushenski	and prb = pseudorealbitcoin/pretendrealbitcoin/powerrangerbitcoin ?	[18:08]
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mircea_popescu	power ranger bitcoin. how about that!	[18:12]
mircea_popescu	in other lulz, http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/628524/Climate-change-shock-Burning-fossil-fuels-COOLs-planet-says-NASA	[18:13]
pete_dushenski	and after actually reading up a bit on glibc instead of telling myself "oh that's nice, alf's done another miraculous thing, which'd be the third this week, each of which is so miraculous that idkwtf it is, if it even applies to anything in my universe", i found that one of the glibc maintainers is florian weimar of http://qntra.net/2015/09/many-network-appliances-leak-master-tls-private-keys-through-forward-secrecy/	[18:13]
pete_dushenski	e. also, that glibc is advertised as an 'essential' component of unix osen, but that it's very much something of a flying spaghetti monster	[18:13]
assbot	Climate change shock: Burning fossil fuels COOLS planet, says NASA \| UK \| News \| Daily Express ... ( http://bit.ly/1S5VLyH )	[18:13]
assbot	Page not found \| Qntra ... ( http://bit.ly/1S5VOua )	[18:13]
mircea_popescu	!up silvaedium	[18:16]
-assbot-	You voiced silvaedium for 30 minutes.	[18:16]
*	assbot gives voice to silvaedium	[18:16]
pete_dushenski	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-12-2015#1349278 << sorta hard to play the other side of the conversation when you simultaneously take every possible rebuttal or objection, pin it down, and kill it, like some kind of laboratory experimenter playing with a mouse in a hall of mirrors with no exit ;/	[18:19]
assbot	Logged on 21-12-2015 09:57:30; mircea_popescu: it's to date the largest reply i ever had to make in an irc conversation, but it is in fact a reply in an irc conversation.	[18:19]
mircea_popescu	lol	[18:19]
mircea_popescu	Закрывающая разговор or what was alf saying.	[18:21]
pete_dushenski	mircea_popescu: but your controlling point about whose dominion is a thing is well taken. the boundaries here are very loosely defined, and yet so broad that i'm bound to miss important things, but mostly as these important things relate to trb development, an area where my only experience was debian testing and v-verification this summer	[18:24]
mircea_popescu	aha.	[18:26]
*	pete_dushenski unwraps abdy's 'lectures on feudalism', herlihy's 'the history of feudalism', lessing's 'laocoon', and 'the world according to clarkson'	[18:28]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform remind me, where's teh instructions for pressing a trb ?	[18:28]
pete_dushenski	this set of newly delivered readings is just some of the competition for my time that retards my learnings of trb and related subjects	[18:29]
BingoBoingo	is it just me or is the latest qntra from july 10, 2015 ? << New backup being loaded nao	[18:29]
pete_dushenski	BingoBoingo: neato	[18:29]
pete_dushenski	glanville's and blackstone's commentaries and treatises are also on their way from bookstores around the world.	[18:30]
pete_dushenski	THERE'S JUST TOO MUCH TO READ!	[18:31]
pete_dushenski	though 15 minutes of reading was all it took to appreciate the enormity of alf's glibcless netbsd.	[18:31]
*	pete_dushenski tips cap	[18:32]
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pete_dushenski	from bottom of express uk 'climate' article: "Can we trust existing climate change predictions based on this new research?"	[18:39]
pete_dushenski	86% of respondents: "No, I have never heard before that fossil fuels can cool area - it all needs looking at again."	[18:39]
mircea_popescu	what else "have i never heard of before" ? medieval ice age ? volcano eruption driving cool summers ?	[18:40]
mircea_popescu	nuttin ?	[18:40]
pete_dushenski	what do you expect from brits edumacated in the post-beatings era.	[18:42]
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*	asciilifeform back from dentist	[18:51]
asciilifeform	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-12-2015#1349614 << using whose vtron ?	[18:51]
assbot	Logged on 21-12-2015 21:24:59; mircea_popescu: asciilifeform remind me, where's teh instructions for pressing a trb ?	[18:51]
asciilifeform	the instructions for mine are in the ml	[18:51]
asciilifeform	mod6's also iirc	[18:51]
asciilifeform	http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/2015-August/000161.html << mine	[18:51]
assbot	[BTC-dev] V examples. ... ( http://bit.ly/1MXJGZq )	[18:51]
*	mircea_popescu is going to send noob into this, see what happens.	[18:51]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6800 @ 0.00049448 = 3.3625 BTC [+] {2}	[18:52]
asciilifeform	http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/2015-November/000179.html << mod6's far spiffier vtron	[18:52]
assbot	[BTC-dev] mod6's V [in perl] version 99998 K with Cucumber Tests & Testing Guide Included ... ( http://bit.ly/1XYf1zx )	[18:52]
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asciilifeform	and ben_vulpes also had one (haven't tried) and punkman also (ditto)	[18:52]
asciilifeform	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-12-2015#1349603 << l0l pete_dushenski we're talking about ~6 month old newz by now	[18:53]
assbot	Logged on 21-12-2015 21:09:58; pete_dushenski: and after actually reading up a bit on glibc instead of telling myself "oh that's nice, alf's done another miraculous thing, which'd be the third this week, each of which is so miraculous that idkwtf it is, if it even applies to anything in my universe", i found that one of the glibc maintainers is florian weimar of http://qntra.net/2015/09/many-network-appliances-leak-master-tls-priv	[18:53]
asciilifeform	(the de-glibc-ation)	[18:54]
pete_dushenski	for some kids, the existence of bitcoin is still news.	[18:54]
pete_dushenski	in trblandia, i'm the 30 iq kid	[18:54]
asciilifeform	jurov: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-12-2015#1349578 << this is not as simple as it sounds, there are machine and os braindamages baked in	[18:55]
assbot	Logged on 21-12-2015 19:53:52; jurov: commits to, carefully designed semantics for everything that's labeled "undefined" or "unspecified" or "implementation-defined" in the C "standard".	[18:55]
BingoBoingo	No, you're pantagruel in the bouncy harness pete_dushenski	[18:55]
pete_dushenski	BingoBoingo: lol if pantagruel's my boy, then i'm gargantua ;)	[18:55]
jurov	asciilifeform: twas just djb citation	[18:56]
asciilifeform	aha	[18:56]
BingoBoingo	Not necessarily. Maybe gargantua in legend was actually cuckolded, and pantagruel's real father was the Jew boy.	[18:56]
mircea_popescu	http://thebitcoin.foundation/v/V-20151108.tar.gz.mod6.sig << da fuyck ?	[18:57]
assbot	404 Not Found ... ( http://bit.ly/1NyZQrR )	[18:57]
asciilifeform	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-12-2015#1349591 << pointedly ~not~ what it is about. see thread re: brezhnev's book. the latter is not loathesome because i cry from failing to live up to brezhnev's imaginary heroism	[18:57]
mircea_popescu	mod6 any idea ?	[18:57]
assbot	Logged on 21-12-2015 20:59:48; pete_dushenski: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-12-2015#1349421 << i've never understood this rather commonplace criticism of taleb as being anything other than "ow my fee-fees hurt. that's not nice and it's certainly not how we do things in usistan where being successful and coming from somewhere other than the sewers is bad because reasons mkay"	[18:57]
asciilifeform	but because it is tedious and repetitive	[18:57]
asciilifeform	whereas, e.g., mircea_popescu's site, is neither	[18:57]
mircea_popescu	that may have a lot to do with the age of the mammals.	[18:58]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: quite likely jurov's filename munger	[18:58]
asciilifeform	i still wanna know what he was smoking when he did that one	[18:58]
jurov	no, the mailinglist has nothing to do with /v/	[18:59]
asciilifeform	then nfi	[18:59]
mircea_popescu	not related to mailing list no	[18:59]
asciilifeform	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-12-2015#1349603 << wait till pete_dushenski remembers about drepper	[18:59]
assbot	Logged on 21-12-2015 21:09:58; pete_dushenski: and after actually reading up a bit on glibc instead of telling myself "oh that's nice, alf's done another miraculous thing, which'd be the third this week, each of which is so miraculous that idkwtf it is, if it even applies to anything in my universe", i found that one of the glibc maintainers is florian weimar of http://qntra.net/2015/09/many-network-appliances-leak-master-tls-priv	[18:59]
mircea_popescu	http://thebitcoin.foundation/v/V-20151129.tar.gz.mod6.sig << correct url	[19:00]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1l0HBCj )	[19:00]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5621 @ 0.00049373 = 2.7753 BTC [-]	[19:00]
pete_dushenski	asciilifeform: lol i remember ulrich, musta glanced over his name when skimming for recognisables. now i see him there too.	[19:01]
asciilifeform	pete_dushenski: afaik he is the (in so far as is publicly known) ~the~ wrecker	[19:01]
asciilifeform	with the single most... illustrious record	[19:02]
asciilifeform	there are drepperisms on your box, whatever it might be, virtually guaranteed.	[19:02]
pete_dushenski	do you have a poster of drepper's face on your wall with a hitler stache, devil eyes, and a horns carved in ?	[19:02]
asciilifeform	iirc he is even responsible for the retardation of gnu diff	[19:02]
asciilifeform	the one i had to kludge around to get 'v' to work reasonably	[19:03]
asciilifeform	pete_dushenski: no but don't let it stop you	[19:03]
asciilifeform	i don't even have my own shooting gallery	[19:03]
asciilifeform	(betcha mircea_popescu does)	[19:03]
pete_dushenski	i only copy from my betters	[19:03]
*	pete_dushenski wonders where bounty on drepper's head is if wuille is worth the trouble	[19:05]
asciilifeform	anyway drepper was drepper 20 yrs ago. today there are new dreppers. tomorrow there will be yet other dreppers.	[19:05]
pete_dushenski	bbiab	[19:06]
asciilifeform	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-12-2015#1349605 << libc. there are multiple usable implementations thereof	[19:06]
assbot	Logged on 21-12-2015 21:09:59; pete_dushenski: e. also, that glibc is advertised as an 'essential' component of unix osen, but that it's very much something of a flying spaghetti monster	[19:06]
asciilifeform	pete_dushenski: see also http://www.etalabs.net/compare_libcs.html	[19:07]
assbot	Comparison of C/POSIX standard library implementations for Linux ... ( http://bit.ly/1DMQi5O )	[19:07]
asciilifeform	all 3 of my currently operating trb nodes are using a rotor-on-musl build	[19:08]
asciilifeform	(at some point i may or may not do a dietlibc and uclibc variant)	[19:09]
mircea_popescu	so /me gives new girl task to press v, half hour ago. other than the url issue above, "hey what sigs should i put in here ?"	[19:18]
mircea_popescu	"ascii and mod6". "ok, here's what I get :	[19:18]
mircea_popescu	WARNING: genesis.vpatch.mircea_popescu.sig is an INVALID seal for genesis.vpatch!	[19:18]
mircea_popescu	Check that this user is in your WoT, and that this key has not expired.	[19:18]
mircea_popescu	Otherwise remove the invalid seal from your SEALS directory.	[19:18]
mircea_popescu	----------------------------------------------------------------------------------	[19:18]
mircea_popescu	Died at ./v.pl line 112.	[19:18]
mircea_popescu	at which point /me grins	[19:18]
mircea_popescu	seriously mod6, VERY nice job with this. 19 yo can use it!	[19:18]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: where did you get the sigs and patches ?	[19:19]
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asciilifeform	trb site ?	[19:19]
mircea_popescu	pubkeys yo umean ? i have my own copies!	[19:19]
asciilifeform	nono	[19:19]
asciilifeform	the seals	[19:20]
asciilifeform	and vpatches	[19:20]
asciilifeform	(a seal, recall, is a signature of a particular patch)	[19:20]
mircea_popescu	apparently it has a mirror list and then an init command.	[19:20]
mircea_popescu	so far the mirror list consists of trb site.	[19:21]
asciilifeform	can take the patches & seals from my tarball, which is self-contained	[19:21]
asciilifeform	see what differs from trb site	[19:21]
asciilifeform	(nothing ought to)	[19:21]
asciilifeform	http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/2015-August/000160.html	[19:21]
assbot	[BTC-dev] V. (ver. 99K) ... ( http://bit.ly/1fQt08V )	[19:21]
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mircea_popescu	hmm, so this produces a press directory, which contains a bitcoin src, but there's no autogen.sh and how do you make this thing ?	[19:32]
asciilifeform	aha so far this is strictly bitcoin	[19:32]
asciilifeform	for the rest, you need rotor or stator (your choice)	[19:32]
asciilifeform	(rotor is a superset of stator that builds own compiler with - in my latest ver. - musl)	[19:33]
mircea_popescu	damn it.	[19:33]
mircea_popescu	why's it not in teh patch tree ;/	[19:33]
asciilifeform	'cause it isn't specific to trb	[19:33]
mircea_popescu	so ?	[19:33]
asciilifeform	(it'll be building, e.g., gossipd, later)	[19:34]
mircea_popescu	the idea here is to get a certain result through a certain process	[19:34]
mircea_popescu	obviously just dumping it in as a node isn't right, but we gotta have it somehow	[19:34]
asciilifeform	mod6 had a set of instructions up for cooking rotor ab initio, but it apparently wasn't in the ml	[19:35]
*	asciilifeform digs in logz	[19:35]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform besides the point tho.	[19:35]
mircea_popescu	when one executes v-magic upon the genesis patch one must end up with a ready-to-go bitcoin.	[19:35]
asciilifeform	once mod6 and ben_vulpes shrinkwrap a buildroot, gcc, et al. this will be possible	[19:35]
asciilifeform	and will go on the magic cd	[19:36]
asciilifeform	presently buildroot fetches crud from the net	[19:36]
mircea_popescu	i suppose we'll have to restate the genesis huh	[19:36]
mircea_popescu	VARDFORK!	[19:36]
asciilifeform	parallel tree	[19:36]
asciilifeform	as discussed about a day ago	[19:36]
mircea_popescu	exactly.	[19:36]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 21050 @ 0.00048714 = 10.2543 BTC [-] {3}	[19:36]
asciilifeform	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=20-12-2015#1348564	[19:36]
assbot	Logged on 20-12-2015 18:46:10; asciilifeform: (ergo, has its own 'genesis' somewhere)	[19:36]
mircea_popescu	must say it's endearingly light, this bitcoin press.	[19:37]
asciilifeform	out of curiosity what did mircea_popescu expect ?	[19:37]
mircea_popescu	i expect nothing, thus i live longer.	[19:37]
mircea_popescu	does your rotor live anywhere ?	[19:38]
asciilifeform	in the ml	[19:38]
*	asciilifeform digs	[19:38]
*	mircea_popescu digs as well	[19:38]
asciilifeform	http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/2015-July/000133.html	[19:39]
assbot	[BTC-dev] Rotor! ... ( http://bit.ly/1InQxW4 )	[19:39]
mircea_popescu	http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/2015-July/000136.html ?	[19:39]
assbot	[BTC-dev] Rotor! ... ( http://bit.ly/1hbPG4Q )	[19:39]
mircea_popescu	ah ok	[19:39]
asciilifeform	aha may need trinque's correction on some damaged systems	[19:40]
*	mircea_popescu passes this along and goes to eat.	[19:40]
mircea_popescu	ah what a pleasant day in the resistance.	[19:40]
asciilifeform	warning - this takes FUCKING FOREVER	[19:40]
asciilifeform	as it builds gcc, toolchain, et al	[19:40]
*	asciilifeform sings along, 'Доказали не раз они, что один в поле воин...'	[19:41]
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asciilifeform	;;later tell mircea_popescu if you do musl rotor correctly, after stripping the elf you get a roughly 4M bin.	[19:44]
gribble	The operation succeeded.	[19:44]
asciilifeform	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-12-2015#1349545 << now it goes to fund klimate reeeesearch!!1111	[19:49]
assbot	Logged on 21-12-2015 18:50:08; mircea_popescu: it's just that at some point some % of gdp went into researching pewter alloys and making dumbass candlesticks and now it doesn't.	[19:49]
asciilifeform	nobody cancelled the church, it just morphed into 'hjooooman rightz' crapolade	[19:50]
asciilifeform	every bit as virulent and pestilential	[19:50]
asciilifeform	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-12-2015#1349525 << usg's vaguely quakerist state religion eats considerably more than 10%	[19:51]
assbot	Logged on 21-12-2015 18:32:56; mircea_popescu: well no, removed the entire religion thing, from the "must build cathedral" to "tithe" - speaking of which, you ever seen l'avare with de funes ? epic tithing scene in there - and on and on. review the literature of the 1800s, about half the drivel printed was various clerics opiniong self importantly on matters they thoroughly ignored.	[19:51]
asciilifeform	(30 to 100 percent depending on how you count)	[19:51]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15550 @ 0.0004871 = 7.5744 BTC [-] {2}	[19:56]
asciilifeform	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-12-2015#1349611 << if pete_dushenski is interested in the trb affair, prolly best bang for his buck will be to learn ~why~ various things were done, rather than the agonizing particulars of ~how~	[19:56]
assbot	Logged on 21-12-2015 21:21:34; pete_dushenski: mircea_popescu: but your controlling point about whose dominion is a thing is well taken. the boundaries here are very loosely defined, and yet so broad that i'm bound to miss important things, but mostly as these important things relate to trb development, an area where my only experience was debian testing and v-verification this summer	[19:56]
asciilifeform	unfortunately this is described nowhere but the logz	[19:56]
asciilifeform	incidentally this is something a fella like pete_dushenski, who is very much fond of writing reviews/expositions/etc. could make a dent in	[19:57]
kakobrekla	ideally should be in the wiki imo	[19:58]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 33206 @ 0.00048933 = 16.2487 BTC [+] {3}	[20:04]
mircea_popescu	prolly.	[20:08]
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mircea_popescu	!up butts	[20:10]
-assbot-	You voiced butts for 30 minutes.	[20:10]
*	assbot gives voice to butts	[20:10]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform "6) in it, set up a stator dir, e.g., /home/luser/rotor/stator and fill distfiles with tarballs, etc. as before." << what the fuck do you think this means ?	[20:10]
mircea_popescu	no more passing by reference!	[20:10]
asciilifeform	it means the instructions from stator	[20:10]
mircea_popescu	pfff.	[20:10]
asciilifeform	(which, when i wrote this, everybody had going)	[20:10]
mircea_popescu	http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/2015-June/000102.html this ?	[20:11]
assbot	[BTC-dev] (EXPERIMENTAL) Static Builder for TheRealBitcoin. ... ( http://bit.ly/1COYtUn )	[20:11]
asciilifeform	aha	[20:11]
mircea_popescu	yes yes. the idea being : no reference!	[20:11]
mircea_popescu	so basically, the entirety of work of interest here is : go to http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/attachments/20150627/stator_7447d6ad798179d04e9d277acb72799b3c7d0eae.tar.gz ; In 'distfiles', read 'MANIFEST' and place the tarballs found therein in said dir.	[20:12]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1MoCeri )	[20:12]
mircea_popescu	the rest of the discussion in http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/2015-June/000102.html being irrelevant	[20:12]
assbot	[BTC-dev] (EXPERIMENTAL) Static Builder for TheRealBitcoin. ... ( http://bit.ly/1COYtUn )	[20:12]
mircea_popescu	right ?	[20:12]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 24400 @ 0.00049407 = 12.0553 BTC [+] {3}	[20:12]
asciilifeform	correct	[20:12]
mircea_popescu	aaaand where doth one find openssl-1.0.1g.tar.gz	[20:18]
asciilifeform	trb www	[20:18]
mircea_popescu	god damned half filled manifest.	[20:18]
mircea_popescu	why the fuck should i need to ask questions AFTER i read it. how am i better off than one who didn't bother reaqding it, for my effort ? and how's this encouraging people to rtfm already.	[20:19]
asciilifeform	sorta why i wanted a cd	[20:19]
mircea_popescu	cd is not what's keeping you from providing path!	[20:19]
mircea_popescu	;;google openssl-1.0.1g.tar.gz site:thebitcoin.foundation	[20:19]
gribble	No matches found.	[20:19]
mircea_popescu	right-o.	[20:19]
asciilifeform	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=06-02-2015#1009833	[20:20]
assbot	Logged on 06-02-2015 02:52:08; asciilifeform: 66ebbad3c8ad98a07b486d39d0c3ae62b00133f8f2877cf8b97c461e7c7f40b29cf9c3cae82cf73a92dcf1daa63d33aa76c910fbcbe60158589fc7cb48f41e6d openssl-1.0.1g.tar.gz	[20:20]
asciilifeform	http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/2015-March/000067.html also has a 1) hash 2) link to original vendor www	[20:20]
assbot	[BTC-dev] UPDATED v0.0.5: Patching The Reference Implementation: A Guide ... ( http://bit.ly/1PjMQbV )	[20:20]
asciilifeform	which is presumably where everybody's been getting the turdz	[20:20]
mircea_popescu	curl http://thebitcoin.foundation/ \| grep "openssl" comes back empty also!	[20:20]
assbot	..::[ The Bitcoin Foundation ]::.. ... ( http://bit.ly/1JZPY9X )	[20:20]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform that style of presumption is 150% of what's wrong with foss.	[20:21]
asciilifeform	looks like mod6's script actually fetches it from openssl site	[20:21]
mircea_popescu	can't fucking use the thing.	[20:21]
asciilifeform	quite	[20:21]
mircea_popescu	oddly the script i'm using as a guide to hack this together uses boost="http://sourceforge.net/projects/boost/files/boost" curl -L "$boost/1.52.0/boost_1_52_0.tar.gz" for some reason, unlike in the other two cases.	[20:25]
mircea_popescu	because nonhomogenuous code ftw.	[20:25]
*	airgapped has quit (Quit: leaving)	[20:25]
mircea_popescu	61mb boost. lord have mercies.	[20:25]
mircea_popescu	sha256sum boost_1_52_0.tar.gz	[20:26]
mircea_popescu	eea637a4ce9f9b45a0d5e00bb9462c9f084086264d85d63133dd6d240398b28f boost_1_52_0.tar.gz	[20:26]
mircea_popescu	and this differs from fc512d3bfa6a39a60fee548775c97239271cf757587b8df7ed739c800844a819a359dca172be0e69ad7752753753139bf11f0813d650066d58386662fe32842d boost_1_52_0.tar.bz2 in the manifest	[20:27]
mircea_popescu	oh the manifest is sha512.	[20:27]
mircea_popescu	listen we really gotta pick one of these and stick to it.	[20:27]
asciilifeform	222b6afd7723f396f5682c20130314a10196d3999feab5ba920d2a6bf53bac92 distfiles/boost_1_52_0.tar.bz2	[20:27]
asciilifeform	^ mine	[20:27]
asciilifeform	(sha256)	[20:27]
asciilifeform	what givez	[20:27]
mircea_popescu	holy shit sha512sum doesn't match either.	[20:27]
mircea_popescu	i get 8de651beb9a48f91f8a797f44966b8f25c3351d6893c1d79969aeb2ded3adeaf8fc14aa9b8a4410081dde9ef155330b41a4982a62b55adde40bb73f0066c74a2 boost_1_52_0.tar.gz	[20:28]
mircea_popescu	they changed the archive.	[20:28]
asciilifeform	fc512d3bfa6a39a60fee548775c97239271cf757587b8df7ed739c800844a819a359dca172be0e69ad7752753753139bf11f0813d650066d58386662fe32842d distfiles/boost_1_52_0.tar.bz2	[20:28]
asciilifeform	l0l	[20:28]
mircea_popescu	bzwut	[20:28]
mircea_popescu	oh ffsake	[20:28]
mircea_popescu	nonhomogenous manifests, also. do you hate me ?	[20:29]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: post diff ?	[20:29]
mircea_popescu	your manifest has .bz2 for boost, .gz for everything else	[20:29]
mircea_popescu	http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/2015-March/000067.html script uses .gz throughout	[20:29]
assbot	[BTC-dev] UPDATED v0.0.5: Patching The Reference Implementation: A Guide ... ( http://bit.ly/1PjMQbV )	[20:29]
mircea_popescu	im going to proceed on the grounds that i match that sha256 but srsly...	[20:30]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 26848 @ 0.00049447 = 13.2755 BTC [+] {2}	[20:30]
mircea_popescu	ok, so i have /rotor/stator/stator/distfiles/boost_1_52_0/ ; db-4.8.30/ ; openssl-1.0.1g/	[20:32]
mircea_popescu	that it, is the distfiles loaded and i can proceed ?	[20:32]
asciilifeform	distfiles has the tarballs	[20:32]
mircea_popescu	it does yes.	[20:33]
asciilifeform	boost_1_52_0.tar.bz2 db-4.8.30.tar.gz openssl-1.0.1g.tar.gz	[20:33]
mircea_popescu	uh.	[20:33]
mircea_popescu	no, all .gz	[20:33]
asciilifeform	odd	[20:33]
mircea_popescu	what could possibly be odd about it. i had to gather them by hand, which i did.	[20:34]
asciilifeform	anyway there is also an 'ourlibs' dir where all of the built crud will go. empty at the start.	[20:34]
mircea_popescu	i have to make this ?	[20:34]
asciilifeform	aha	[20:34]
asciilifeform	http://dpaste.com/2CNDJ6Y << my rotor.sh	[20:34]
assbot	dpaste: 2CNDJ6Y ... ( http://bit.ly/1PjN7vE )	[20:34]
asciilifeform	incidentally do you have the toolchain built ?	[20:35]
mircea_popescu	god damned it.	[20:35]
mircea_popescu	listen to me : TWO HOURS ago i gave a girl a task.	[20:35]
mircea_popescu	she returned with an error, after going very smoothly throughout everything mod6 made, hour and a half ago.	[20:35]
mircea_popescu	i fixed that and went to eat. she returned with an hour within minutes, and i've been spending my time debugging your inept shit.	[20:35]
mircea_popescu	it is unconscionable, this.	[20:35]
*	asciilifeform did not write the build script on trb site	[20:36]
*	asciilifeform wrote strictly what appears in http://dpaste.com/2CNDJ6Y	[20:36]
assbot	dpaste: 2CNDJ6Y ... ( http://bit.ly/1PjN7vE )	[20:36]
mircea_popescu	the moment we go off mod6 instructions and into alf instructions we suddenly need a rear admiral and five airline pilots.	[20:36]
mircea_popescu	so lettuce see if this thing can be made to work sanely once and for all.	[20:36]
mircea_popescu	i have exactly nothing anywhere. the disk is fucking empty. this is deliberate.	[20:37]
mircea_popescu	no "as before" ; no "mine", none of the bs.	[20:37]
asciilifeform	somehow i thought that mod6 et al had something like a build system	[20:37]
mircea_popescu	it doesn't appear so.	[20:37]
asciilifeform	apparently !	[20:37]
trinque	he does. I have run it and am syncing a bitcoind from its product.	[20:37]
mircea_popescu	trinque link ?	[20:38]
*	trinque looks	[20:38]
pete_dushenski	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-12-2015#1349766 << indeed.	[20:40]
assbot	Logged on 21-12-2015 22:53:29; asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-12-2015#1349611 << if pete_dushenski is interested in the trb affair, prolly best bang for his buck will be to learn ~why~ various things were done, rather than the agonizing particulars of ~how~	[20:40]
*	assbot removes voice from butts	[20:40]
trinque	mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=30-11-2015#1333964 << I had to dos2unix the script before running.	[20:40]
assbot	Logged on 30-11-2015 04:08:01; mod6: trinque, et. al: The updated [version 99997 K] rotot v054-TEST2 (via `V') script: http://dpaste.com/3J5SA2V.txt	[20:40]
mircea_popescu	holy shit it's in a dpaste in the logs ?	[20:41]
pete_dushenski	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-12-2015#1349859 << /me recalls many hours spent on this exact back-and-forth and hack-and-saw over the summer	[20:41]
trinque	did output a usable product thereafter, and it's running on a debian, was built on a gentoo where it also ran.	[20:41]
assbot	Logged on 21-12-2015 23:33:24; mircea_popescu: the moment we go off mod6 instructions and into alf instructions we suddenly need a rear admiral and five airline pilots.	[20:41]
*	mircea_popescu goes to punch out baby seals	[20:41]
trinque	definitely needs to be released on the site..	[20:41]
mircea_popescu	trinque mind dpasting your fixed version then ?	[20:41]
trinque	sure	[20:41]
trinque	hell I'll put it on deedbot.org	[20:41]
mircea_popescu	ok.	[20:41]
trinque	so it is not lost to the sands of dpaste	[20:42]
mircea_popescu	and fwiw i'm on rotor 99998 iirc.	[20:42]
*	pete_dushenski also recalls this particular dpaste, even having tried it on fresh os!, and failing for reasons i shamefully didn't have time to delve into further	[20:43]
pete_dushenski	that it was only in logs was a bit odd	[20:43]
mircea_popescu	mod6 as a purely aesthetic point, i hate that your v puts its files/dirs straight under ~. it would be much better if it made them under current dir.	[20:45]
mircea_popescu	as it is i put .wot in /trb/.wot but the .seals are still up one level ;/	[20:45]
trinque	http://deedbot.org/build-bitcoind-99997K.sh	[20:47]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1MslfyQ )	[20:47]
trinque	http://deedbot.org/build-bitcoind-99997K.sh.asc	[20:47]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1Msldar )	[20:47]
*	butts has quit (Quit: Page closed)	[20:47]
mircea_popescu	Peter Korsgaard and his 1024D bullshit	[20:51]
mircea_popescu	this is what we're hinging on ;/	[20:51]
mircea_popescu	how the fuck is 0xAB07D806D2CE741FB886EE50B025BA8B59C36319 even worth loading into a system in 2015.	[20:51]
mircea_popescu	anyway, rm -rf rotor and let's see this script	[20:52]
mircea_popescu	trinque am i expecting any particular output ?	[20:53]
trinque	the first output is it verifying signatures of various curl downloads, as I see it running it again.	[20:55]
mircea_popescu	right. so i now notice it made a rotor dir	[20:55]
mircea_popescu	V-20151129.tar.gz	[20:55]
mircea_popescu	../ V-20151129.tar.gz.mod6.sig	[20:55]
mircea_popescu	buildroot-2015.05.tar.gz v.pl*	[20:55]
mircea_popescu	buildroot-2015.05.tar.gz.sign v.pl.mod6.sig	[20:55]
mircea_popescu	rotor.tar.gz v_quick_start.txt*	[20:55]
mircea_popescu	rotor.tar.gz.sig v_quick_start.txt.mod6.sig	[20:55]
mircea_popescu	TEST2/ v_users_manual.txt*	[20:55]
mircea_popescu	toolchain/ v_users_manual.txt.mod6.sig	[20:55]
mircea_popescu	polimedi@polimedia.us [~/trb/rotor]#	[20:55]
mircea_popescu	pointedly absent, an autogen.sh or any sort of obvious make target.	[20:55]
trinque	yes, and after building the binary will be buried at rotor/TEST2/bitcoin/src/bitcoind	[20:56]
trinque	I would say that the file tree here needs some work.	[20:56]
mircea_popescu	building what ? how ?	[20:56]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: we don't use automake, it is of the heathens	[20:57]
trinque	it is running the rotor/TEST2/rotor.sh ...	[20:57]
mircea_popescu	so what do we do ?	[20:57]
trinque	yes but this is seriously layered and needs to be smashed into one script.	[20:57]
mircea_popescu	my test2 is empty.	[20:58]
asciilifeform	(my rotor.sh would have been a standard makefile, but gnumake has problems invoking makes recursively)	[20:58]
trinque	mircea_popescu: the build script ought to be making all this	[20:58]
trinque	it blew up?	[20:58]
mircea_popescu	it finished without error, created the dir quoted above and thats it	[20:58]
mircea_popescu	/home/polimedi/.wot directory does not exist. Refer to help.	[20:59]
mircea_popescu	o god damned it.	[20:59]
mircea_popescu	i can't choose where to put anything, right ?	[20:59]
mircea_popescu	ima wipe this entire thing and start over. god damned tis frustrating.	[20:59]
trinque	also would be good to have curl output some progress info when downloading. it otherwise appears hung when pulling down boost, or did to me.	[21:02]
mircea_popescu	currently spewing stuff in terminal, seems ok.	[21:02]
mircea_popescu	yeah seems to be building boost.	[21:03]
mircea_popescu	i just downloaded the linux kernel...	[21:06]
mircea_popescu	yup there's musl too. aaaite, ima let it be for a bit then	[21:06]
deedbot-	[Qntra] Pirate Bay Four Acquitted Of Charges - http://qntra.net/2015/07/pirate-bay-four-acquitted-of-charges/	[21:15]
*	dbclk has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)	[21:18]
deedbot-	[Qntra] Mining Difficulty Reaches New High - http://qntra.net/2015/07/mining-difficulty-reaches-new-high/	[21:19]
trinque	BingoBoingo: are you loading data back into qntra?	[21:21]
trinque	if so perhaps I should turn off the feeds until you're done.	[21:21]
BingoBoingo	in a way you could say that	[21:21]
trinque	feeds are off.	[21:21]
*	sinetek (~quassel@sinet3k.com) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[21:22]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 31478 @ 0.0004871 = 15.3329 BTC [-]	[21:23]
mod6	woah	[21:24]
*	mod6 reads	[21:24]
*	mod6 reads again	[21:31]
mod6	<+mircea_popescu> seriously mod6, VERY nice job with this. 19 yo can use it! << sarc?	[21:32]
*	trinque out to dinner, will turn feeds back on when I return.	[21:33]
mod6	<+asciilifeform> mod6 had a set of instructions up for cooking rotor ab initio, but it apparently wasn't in the ml << no. it "works" as far as I and others have tried it -- it relies upon haveing my, alf's, mp's, ben's, and trinque's keys in a ~/.wot dir iirc.	[21:34]
mod6	but until we wrap up the final parts as discussed yesterday, i wont clutter up the ml	[21:34]
trinque	oh and btw, linked the script to say "I have used this and it works" not "this is a release according to mod6"	[21:35]
mod6	+asciilifeform> looks like mod6's script actually fetches it from openssl site << yes. for now, for testing. i haven't actually put up the stuff yet because until yesterday, wasn't finalized, wasn't signed etc.	[21:36]
*	NewLiberty has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)	[21:36]
*	pete_dushenski to dinner	[21:36]
*	pete_dushenski has quit (Remote host closed the connection)	[21:36]
mod6	<+mircea_popescu> mod6 as a purely aesthetic point, i hate that your v puts its files/dirs straight under ~. it would be much better if it made them under current dir. << alright	[21:37]
mod6	<+mircea_popescu> as it is i put .wot in /trb/.wot but the .seals are still up one level ;/ << noted.	[21:37]
mod6	so where are you at now, and how can I help you accomplish your goal.	[21:37]
trinque	mircea_popescu │ currently spewing stuff in terminal, seems ok.	[21:38]
mod6	and yah, btw, you can tell V where to put .wot .seals and your patchdir.	[21:39]
mod6	this is all in the doc.	[21:39]
mod6	if you don't tell it where to put them it creates ~/.wot ~/.seals and then drops the patchdir in your pwd.	[21:39]
*	dbclk (~dbclk@190.83.235.218) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[21:43]
danielpbarron	WARNING: asciilifeform-kills-integer-retardation.vpatch.asciilifeform.sig is an INVALID seal for asciilifeform-kills-integer-retardation.vpatch!	[21:47]
mod6	Who/What/Where/When DPB	[21:48]
danielpbarron	that's where it ends for me when using trinque's script 'build-bitcoind-99997K.sh'	[21:48]
mod6	is that with my 'V', or post the log line where he gave you that.	[21:49]
danielpbarron	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-12-2015#1349889	[21:50]
assbot	Logged on 21-12-2015 23:44:06; trinque: http://deedbot.org/build-bitcoind-99997K.sh	[21:50]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8550 @ 0.0004903 = 4.1921 BTC [+]	[21:51]
mod6	Ok mircea_popescu asciilifeform ben_vulpes trinque : The latest version of my rotor+V+TEST2 script is here: http://dpaste.com/1R04312.txt : All you should need to do before hand is create a ~/.wot dir and add; "asciilifeform.asc", "mircea_popescu.asc", "mod6.asc", "ben_vulpes.asc", "trinque.asc", and "punkman.asc" into that directory.	[21:51]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1PjOV7T )	[21:51]
mod6	Then if you take that paste, chmod +x it, run it, it /should/ pull down all of the deps (still not complete, grabs stuff over the web), pull down V, press a 'TEST2', then build rotor, and then finally bitcoind inside of it.	[21:53]
mod6	danielpbarron: do you have "asciilifeform.asc" in your .wot directory?	[21:53]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5750 @ 0.00048803 = 2.8062 BTC [-] {2}	[21:56]
danielpbarron	ah, that was the problem. I had named it asciilifeform.key	[21:57]
mod6	yeah, the manual says about ".asc"	[21:57]
mod6	sall good now	[21:58]
mod6	?	[21:58]
danielpbarron	yeah appears so	[21:59]
mod6	ok	[21:59]
mod6	I am following my exact instructions above ^^^ nearly done building a rotor+V+TEST2.	[22:00]
mod6	If anyone else wants to do this tonight, to replicate my thing, I am here.	[22:00]
mod6	Let's do it.	[22:00]
*	asciilifeform increasingly certain that his magic rotolinux cd will have to be... a bootable one	[22:11]
asciilifeform	there is no other way to flamethrower the ubiquitous braindamage that prevents every single thing i ever publish from building on half the boxes	[22:11]
mod6	<+mircea_popescu> listen we really gotta pick one of these and stick to it. << will sort this out with the manifest/file-o-hashes	[22:18]
mircea_popescu	# ./bitcoind	[22:19]
mircea_popescu	************************	[22:19]
mircea_popescu	EXCEPTION: St13runtime_error	[22:19]
mircea_popescu	locale::facet::_S_create_c_locale name not valid	[22:19]
mircea_popescu	bitcoin in AppInit()	[22:19]
mircea_popescu	terminate called after throwing an instance of 'std::runtime_error'	[22:19]
mircea_popescu	what(): locale::facet::_S_create_c_locale name not valid	[22:19]
mircea_popescu	Aborted (core dumped)	[22:19]
mircea_popescu	but other than that, latest script was pretty spiffy mod6	[22:20]
asciilifeform	LC_ALL="C"	[22:20]
mod6	^	[22:20]
asciilifeform	prefix when starting bitcoind	[22:20]
asciilifeform	this is necessary when running a musl executable on a heathen (glibc) linux	[22:20]
mircea_popescu	wut sarc	[22:20]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform waitwut ?	[22:21]
asciilifeform	you gotta put that envir var there	[22:21]
asciilifeform	or it will croak as pictured above	[22:21]
asciilifeform	one of these days i will saw out the locale idiocy from gcc	[22:21]
mircea_popescu	yteaH srsly	[22:21]
mircea_popescu	so export LC_ALL="C" ?	[22:22]
mod6	i think i usually execute this like: `LC_ALL=C ./bitcoind -myip=1.2.3.4 ... ect`	[22:22]
mircea_popescu	a ok	[22:22]
asciilifeform	aha what mod6 said	[22:22]
asciilifeform	sample from one of my boxes,	[22:23]
asciilifeform	LC_ALL="C" /home/bitcoin/bin/bitcoind -datadir=/home/bitcoin/.bitcoin -myip=$wanip -addnode=195.211.154.159 2>&1 &	[22:23]
mircea_popescu	yeah, seems to work actually.	[22:23]
mircea_popescu	sweet!	[22:23]
asciilifeform	(replace $wanip with yours)	[22:23]
mod6	nice!	[22:23]
asciilifeform	congrats mircea_popescu !	[22:23]
mircea_popescu	Error: To use bitcoind, you must set a rpcpassword in the configuration file	[22:23]
mircea_popescu	trhis sounds like home.	[22:23]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: how big's your stripped bin ?	[22:23]
kakobrekla	im not saying congrats arent in order but the fact they are is sad.	[22:24]
mod6	this is a good point kako.	[22:24]
mircea_popescu	4884832 Dec 22 00:14 bitcoind	[22:24]
mircea_popescu	kakobrekla word.	[22:24]
mod6	it /will/ get easier. it's our mission.	[22:25]
mircea_popescu	but in fairness the stack has improved HEAPS and bounds from its state pre-mod6-99997 release, so ima not say anything more	[22:25]
asciilifeform	4884896 <<< asciilifeform's	[22:25]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform EXTRA DWORD!	[22:25]
mod6	hehhe, we went through that once didn't we.	[22:25]
mod6	about the offsets	[22:25]
mircea_popescu	lol	[22:26]
mircea_popescu	anyway, i could in principle put up ~60 of these overnight	[22:26]
mircea_popescu	it's really not so bad, <1hr whole script	[22:26]
mod6	yeah mine just finished.	[22:26]
mircea_popescu	and, most importantly, script works.	[22:26]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: gcc embeds local paths (aha quite retarded) in the elf	[22:26]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: so it's a marvel we're only off by a dword	[22:26]
mod6	mine took ~30 minutes.	[22:26]
mod6	on an old ass core2duo too :]	[22:27]
asciilifeform	'cause mine has strings like /home/stas/br-super/stator/ourlibs/lib/engines in the stripped elf	[22:27]
mircea_popescu	mod6 one thing to consider : rather than a wd to set the wot dir, simply have it put stuff under current dir ?	[22:27]
mod6	yeah, noted. i think the design decision there was "if i put it in pwd, someone might not know where it is, they may just check ~/ first."	[22:27]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: 60 actual physical boxes would be mighty spiffy	[22:28]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform im not sure it'd actually do anything useful.	[22:28]
asciilifeform	it'd fill some pants i bet	[22:28]
mod6	ofc it could be helpful and spit that stuff out to stdout and let a fella know.	[22:28]
mircea_popescu	im not in the business of filling pants tho!	[22:28]
asciilifeform	also would be interesting to spot the octopi	[22:28]
asciilifeform	(the boxes that are simply out to hog sockets)	[22:29]
mircea_popescu	anyway. the only congrats that are in order go to teh foundation. well done peeps.	[22:29]
mod6	mircea_popescu: I'll reflect on this conversation and your trials/tribulations and use it to guide us going forward to the finish line here.	[22:29]
mircea_popescu	mod6 in fairness 99% of tribulation was because i wasn't using 99997	[22:29]
mircea_popescu	sorta went at it obliquely. but definitely gotta make it a release.	[22:29]
mod6	ah, ok. It's not super easy to follow unless you've been keeping up with all the testing. I'm trying to keep the ML clean so people don't get tripped up later.	[22:30]
mircea_popescu	yes but a "here's where you start" pointer must exist.	[22:30]
mircea_popescu	prolly should exist on the main page of trb site, at that.	[22:30]
mod6	yea, we need a "get your TEST2 up and going" section.	[22:31]
mod6	I've got a short week this week. I'll get some of that cleaned up.	[22:31]
mod6	There's a bunch of loose ends. We're getting there...	[22:32]
asciilifeform	at any rate even if mircea_popescu doesn't feel like making 60, it would be great if you lot came up with another dozen or so. take some of the load off my poor junkers	[22:32]
*	asciilifeform uncrates brand new half-TB ssd for zoolag	[22:33]
kakobrekla	its a fast moving targer	[22:34]
kakobrekla	target	[22:34]
mod6	<+mircea_popescu> wut sarc << oh thought you had sarc tag on about the seals warning your 19yo got. :]	[22:37]
mircea_popescu	what's that ?	[22:37]
mod6	<+mircea_popescu> seriously mod6, VERY nice job with this. 19 yo can use it! << this	[22:38]
mod6	cause it died right then. heh.	[22:38]
mod6	anyway nm.	[22:39]
mod6	<+trinque> yes but this is seriously layered and needs to be smashed into one script. << this is a good point there a bunch of gyrations in the current script that could be folded all into one better script.	[22:42]
mod6	one thing at a time though.	[22:42]
mircea_popescu	of course... "blocks" : 0, "connections" : 0,	[22:46]
mircea_popescu	thius dun seem right.	[22:46]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: didja -addnode=1.2.3.4 ???	[22:46]
asciilifeform	gotta breath'o'life it	[22:47]
mircea_popescu	o right	[22:47]
mircea_popescu	-addnode=195.211.154.159 << this ours ?	[22:47]
asciilifeform	replace with one of the currently-live nodez	[22:48]
asciilifeform	(one or more! can have multiple -addnode)	[22:48]
asciilifeform	iirc 195* belongs to mircea_popescu	[22:48]
mod6	also -verifyall should be an option for you with TEST2	[22:49]
mircea_popescu	!s zoolag	[22:50]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9100 @ 0.00049028 = 4.4615 BTC [+]	[22:50]
assbot	69 results for 'zoolag' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=zoolag	[22:50]
mircea_popescu	!s bucephalus	[22:50]
assbot	20 results for 'bucephalus' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=bucephalus	[22:50]
asciilifeform	fastest sync is prolly from dulap	[22:50]
asciilifeform	with zoolag a close second	[22:50]
asciilifeform	(Gb fiber)	[22:50]
mircea_popescu	what's the rush.	[22:51]
mircea_popescu	dja see me ? 46.166.170.208	[22:51]
asciilifeform	on which	[22:51]
mircea_popescu	zoolag / bucephalus	[22:51]
mircea_popescu	"blocks" : 2034, "connections" : 10, << we're in bidnis.	[22:52]
asciilifeform	i see a 46.166.160.36	[22:53]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15000 @ 0.00049002 = 7.3503 BTC [-] {3}	[22:54]
mircea_popescu	sounds like gateway aha.	[22:54]
asciilifeform	and there you are on dulap.	[22:54]
asciilifeform	and on bucephalus.	[22:54]
asciilifeform	not on zoolag tho	[22:54]
mircea_popescu	cool beans.	[22:55]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3811 @ 0.00049029 = 1.8685 BTC [+] {2}	[22:57]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: out of curiosity, what didja press ?	[23:02]
mod6	<+trinque> http://deedbot.org/build-bitcoind-99997K.sh << If Mr. P. used this, then it does this (in the script): ./v.pl p verbose TEST2 asciilifeform_add_verifyall_option.vpatch	[23:03]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1MslfyQ )	[23:03]
asciilifeform	was wondering if he has the programmable verstring	[23:04]
asciilifeform	( http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/2015-December/000185.html )	[23:04]
assbot	[BTC-dev] Programmable Version Strings. ... ( http://bit.ly/1mdvdyY )	[23:04]
mod6	that would have had to have been placed in the local pdir (patch dir) and sdir (seals dir) manually - it's not in http://thebitcoin.foundation/v/ yet	[23:05]
assbot	Index of /v ... ( http://bit.ly/1KTlXJl )	[23:05]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 30046 @ 0.00048901 = 14.6928 BTC [-] {2}	[23:11]
*	gabrielradio has quit (Quit: Leaving)	[23:19]
*	BashCo_ has quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)	[23:32]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12400 @ 0.00048806 = 6.0519 BTC [-] {3}	[23:55]

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