Forum logs for 12 Mar 2013

Saturday, 23 November, Year 11 d.Tr. | Author: Mircea Popescu
jurov no they're all about bahts, have you seen the symbol? [00:00]
mircea_popescu anyway, things are getting pretty much wrapped up, im upgrading back online from "this week" to "today". [00:00]
jurov yup, congrats [00:00]
mircea_popescu youtube being fags : < does not need flash ; does need flash [00:03]
jurov have you seen ? [00:03]
mircea_popescu howly fuck [00:03]
mircea_popescu it just never ends does it [00:04]
mircea_popescu wait. this is asicminer pool ? [00:04]
dub this DrG idiot [00:04]
gesell mircea_popescu: thanks for the link [00:05]
jcpham yeah mircea_popescu [00:05]
jcpham the op of the asicminer pool decided to fork his pool for a few minutes [00:05]
mircea_popescu so basically asicminer made a shitton [00:05]
jcpham accidentally [00:05]
mircea_popescu and there's going to be drama ? [00:05]
dub not commiserate with teh ideals of bitcoin, kind of person bitcoin does not need.. The person is blatantly and willfully violating the trust of Bitcoin network and for that he/she should be reprimanded. [00:06]
jcpham so while bitcoind was running with no db [00:06]
dub what is this shit [00:06]
gesell mircea_popescu: are you seriously considering a gmail protocol? this seems nuts. maybe you should consider first [00:06]
jcpham i assume the miners were doing diff 0 shares [00:06]
mircea_popescu dub da fck is this ?! [00:06]
jcpham until the hot wallet was empty [00:06]
mircea_popescu gesell mail is not nuts. mail is the strongest, oldest and in general best service ever implemented on the internet. [00:06]
dub I didn't think bitcoind offered work until it was synced [00:07]
mircea_popescu in the worst case scenario, mail is the backstop. [00:07]
jborkl_ I think it would have been network diff at the point of the blockchain download you were mining [00:07]
gesell mircea_popescu: yes mail is but using google as a trusted host gate, not sure [00:07]
mircea_popescu dub it was prolly bugged. [00:07]
jcpham i upgraded bitcoind today [00:07]
jcpham it resyncs [00:07]
mircea_popescu gesell just had that as an arbitrary name [00:07]
dub yeah new db [00:07]
jcpham dunno how a pool handles the resync [00:07]
jborkl_ at block 195000 it was i think 1.95 m for example [00:07]
mircea_popescu it wouldn't certainly be a case of trusting google. [00:07]
mircea_popescu the discussion was anyway an "in principle" thing. [00:07]
gesell mircea_popescu: okay [00:08]
FabianB MPEx.rb 0.5.0 released ( includes irc convo logging and a new 'portfolio' command with prediction of your total portfolio value [00:08]
jborkl_ so while he was dl, blocks would have been synching fast- but mining at 200k diff [00:08]
FabianB maximian: ^^ [00:08]
FabianB mircea_popescu: also proxy discovery included now :) [00:08]
jborkl_ for example [00:08]
mircea_popescu FabianB :D [00:09]
mircea_popescu irc logging is a good idea. include a ticker to bold my lines ? :D [00:09]
mircea_popescu i mean a tickbox [00:09]
mircea_popescu "If bank places by mistake 10k into your account, and you cash it out, your will probably rot in jail.." [00:09]
mircea_popescu what world do these people live in, seriously ?! [00:10]
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dub thats true, at least here [00:10]
pigeons if you dont give it back you will [00:10]
FabianB mircea_popescu: it's just the conversation of MPEx.rb with the irc bots, not of this channel [00:10]
jcpham if the pool with the most hashrate is mining on a non -up-to-date copy of the blockchain [00:10]
mircea_popescu FabianB :p [00:10]
jcpham that's an issue [00:10]
mircea_popescu dub they will have to sue for unjust enrichment. they may win it, [00:11]
mircea_popescu but then again they may not. [00:11]
pigeons they always will [00:11]
gesell mircea_popescu: why not use google spreadsheets for graphs and orderbook review? [00:11]
pigeons which is why mp lost in his own hand picked rota [00:11]
gesell in that scenerio you would script updates (not pull from an api, as this might overrun google apps limits) [00:11]
mircea_popescu pigeons not really true. they always will try to convince the person to return it [00:12]
mircea_popescu but afaik such claims are rare. usually cost more to sue than they'd get [00:12]
pigeons really, absoulutely trye. give me one example where its not [00:12]
mircea_popescu gesell you can go right ahead, or what are you asking ? [00:12]
kakobrekla i have seen it happen here and the bank gets the money back one way or another [00:12]
pigeons ive seen plenty where it is true, none where it isnt [00:12]
mircea_popescu pigeons you've seen a case where a bank sued the recipient of an error for unjust enrichment ? [00:12]
pigeons yes [00:13]
pigeons more than one [00:13]
mircea_popescu link or docket or anything ? [00:13]
dub pretty sure its straight up law here [00:13]
assbot [BTCTC] [B.YABMC] 1 @ 0.01401 BTC [-] [00:13]
assbot [BTCTC] [B.YABMC] 1 @ 0.01401 BTC [-] [00:13]
dub bank fucks up, give it back or the police come get you [00:13]
gesell mircea_popescu: well i would be happy to make some spreadsheets to pull the order books but this would require some sort of mpex api (json or xml or whatever) for that and again, leave you open to ddos. but if you pushed the data onto your own public spreadsheet you would avoid any ddos on your public facing graphs and orderbooks [00:13]
mircea_popescu not an expert but iirc it was rare shit. [00:13]
pigeons dont have my lexisnexis here [00:13]
mircea_popescu gesell you seen the faq ? [00:13]
pigeons but sure, i'll remember [00:13]
gesell mircea_popescu: not in bit. checking again [00:13]
mircea_popescu specifically, [00:13]
gesell oh didnt see the sierra chart feed [00:14]
gesell and json [00:14]
mircea_popescu json been there for a while. sierra recent addition [00:14]
mircea_popescu also kakobrekla has a websocket feed he's been selling people. [00:14]
gesell mircea_popescu: are those feeds not effected by the ddos? [00:15]
mircea_popescu nothing's affected other than the website which people somehow get fixated on. [00:16]
gesell mircea_popescu: it's the face. but is interesting to contemplate what that means and reshaping it. [00:18]
mircea_popescu let's think together what that means. [00:18]
mircea_popescu domain gets "confiscated", somehow. [00:18]
mircea_popescu nobody cares. moving on. [00:18]
mircea_popescu that's what it means. [00:18]
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gesell mircea_popescu: well its also strange that the proxy seems to be a mirror. as apposed to it being it's own form of interface. [00:20]
pigeons it proxies [00:20]
FabianB well stock trading volume went down, but never stopped; options as usual [00:20]
gesell if the face effects trades then, well, recovery should be monitored. and hopefully there is recovery [00:21]
pigeons or, the face can go away [00:22]
pigeons and people can learn to trade anyway [00:22]
mircea_popescu gesell say what ? i don't follow [00:22]
mircea_popescu the proxy mirror part [00:22]
smickles so the ddoser's name is "the face"? [00:23]
smickles nice [00:23]
deadweasel lol. the face [00:24]
mircea_popescu << most likely to be agreed with forum person. [00:24]
mircea_popescu you'd never guess it. [00:24]
mircea_popescu another one [00:24]
mircea_popescu wtf is going on over there [00:24]
smickles '... or else nazi and nazi' [00:25]
mircea_popescu she called him thermos too [00:25]
gesell mircea_popescu: for lack of a better comparison... say for instance that some brokerage firm was had their own interface to nyse showing trades and tickers. this would "feel" decoupled from the excchange itself so people would not associate the two. if nyse decided to change how they present themselves that brokerage face would not be percieved as, i dont know, a quick crutch to fill the gap. where as when it is mirroring nyse so closely [00:25]
mircea_popescu gesell are you a web developer by any chance ? [00:26]
gesell mircea_popescu: hobby web dev for aesthetics. serious code and hardware hacker for the $ [00:26]
mircea_popescu okay. [00:26]
pigeons basically, mircea_popescu does not care how it "feels" [00:26]
gesell hacker meaning reverse engineer (meaning, f;ing serious) [00:27]
mircea_popescu aha. [00:27]
gesell pigeons: even if he doesnt care. it is still interesting to consider what the market effects of change of face are, and where the middle ground is, and where there is space to innovate in a intuitive way. or maybe there isnt really [00:27]
pigeons not interesting [00:27]
smickles gesell: did you notice that my mpexbot has a direct line into mpex, yet doesn't look like a mirror? [00:28]
mircea_popescu pigeons that is exactly the opposite of reality. i very much care how it feels. which is why the proxy doesn't have spurious dongles, but feels just like the real tihng. [00:28]
gesell pigeons: if change of face did effect trade volume, that is interesting to explore [00:28]
smickles ;D [00:28]
mircea_popescu what i don't care about is appearance bullshit. there's a very good reason for that : unlike the web, the retail market for plastic figurines and fake fags, [00:28]
mircea_popescu i actually have a business. [00:28]
gesell smickles: yeah mpexbot... so it could be that just as mpex forces people to understand that the odd security model is better (and forces people to learn why and learn what pgp is) maybe it is of value to force them to use a different interface in a similar way. but the cause and effect is not as clear with the Web vs Mpexbot, as it was with the gpg protocol [00:29]
mircea_popescu for some reason i have a lot of trouble following this guy. [00:30]
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smickles mircea_popescu: that mpex gui i'm developing is nearly functionally complete [00:30]
mircea_popescu 0.0 [00:30]
mircea_popescu what do they feed you over there, uppers in speedball sauce ? [00:30]
pigeons it better have minecraft [00:30]
FabianB gesell: in both cases you need gpg to trade [00:30]
smickles pigeons: not minecraft, but opengl like was discussed yesterday [00:31]
gesell mircea_popescu: not sure. i think i just dont explain abstract thoughts well. [00:31]
pigeons i want bricks of some sort then [00:31]
smickles i have a screenshot of it [00:31]
pigeons lego mpex [00:31]
mircea_popescu totally. opengl. [00:31]
pigeons zork mpex too [00:31]
smickles [00:31]
mircea_popescu pigeons lemme quote a person familiar with the matter, for your benefit : [00:32]
gesell smickles: is that QT based? [00:32]
smickles nope [00:32]
gesell gtk? [00:32]
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smickles nope [00:32]
gesell tcl/tk?? [00:32]
mircea_popescu "i get the feeling ima wake up one of these days and like there will be a little mpex anthill, and mpex transaction wallpaint and i can order a stat from the magazin alimentar" [00:32]
mircea_popescu it's uppers in speedball sauce based. [00:32]
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da-art-o-peas [00:33]
pigeons hopped up on goofballs [00:33]
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gesell then i hope the buy button creates a buy event on button down and not button released ;) [00:33]
smickles gesell: it's a toolkit which uses opengl, i don't know too much about it [00:33]
smickles i just know how to use it [00:34]
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smickles and that i should be able to make binaries for win, mac, linux and android with it [00:34]
mircea_popescu what are you using like allegro ? [00:34]
smickles kivy [00:35]
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smickles gesell: aw, i picked button released, is that bad? [00:35]
mircea_popescu it is yeah. [00:35]
gesell smickles: yes, they people on upper speedball sauce will have to click for each buy whereas on button down they could just Hooooooold and buy shit loads [00:35]
dub lol [00:36]
smickles lol, well, the buy button goes to a detailed asset page with price and quantity inputs [00:36]
gesell aaaah [00:36]
smickles yeah, i'd figure you'd want to know the best ask if you planned to buy [00:37]
dub why? [00:37]
dub this is mpex, we invest for the future, regardless of price [00:38]
mircea_popescu sutmm ? [00:38]
pigeons [00:38]
smickles i have that one drawn up right now. left side full depth (scrollable) right 2/3's has details up at top and input middle, confirmation button at bottom [00:38]
gesell smickles: sounds good [00:38]
gesell kivy is interesting. new to me [00:38]
dub if you care about price you are the wrong kind of investor [00:38]
dub remember that [00:38]
mircea_popescu intrade news is old! [00:38]
smickles also, the thing is proxy aware and checks for updated proxy lists [00:38]
mircea_popescu smickles almost like a botnet. [00:39]
smickles shhh :P [00:39]
smickles that is how botnets work tho, isn't it? [00:39]
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smickles i think i've lost every bitbet bet i've made [00:40]
assbot [BTCTC] [CRYPTO-TRADE] 1 @ 0.19999 BTC [-] [00:40]
smickles except the ufo ones [00:40]
kakobrekla i can make you a special 'yes and no is switched' interface [00:41]
mircea_popescu lol [00:41]
mircea_popescu kakobrekla you know this may be a workable idea ? [00:41]
mircea_popescu put a link on main page, "Bad luck lately ?" [00:42]
kakobrekla ahah [00:42]
mircea_popescu if person clicks it site is color switched (everything) [00:42]
smickles lol, what an idea [00:42]
mircea_popescu and yes/no also switched in menus but not in actual effect. [00:42]
mircea_popescu so they go for yes but it bets no [00:42]
mircea_popescu and we see how many people actyually use that. [00:42]
kakobrekla first get your email working [00:42]
mircea_popescu dude i'm asking you for the difficult, you're asking me for the impossible. [00:43]
kakobrekla :D [00:43]
mircea_popescu email is too hard. i can get finger working this week [00:43]
mircea_popescu and maybe gopher [00:43]
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mircea_popescu maybe i should upgrade the php proxies to also forward mail. [00:43]
mircea_popescu tux will just die. [00:43]
pigeons i'm down with finger instead of this twitter stuff [00:44]
smickles haha, come to mpexbot to check your email ! [00:44]
mircea_popescu totally. [00:44]
mircea_popescu hey smickles! implement an $email command [00:44]
mircea_popescu it just returns "No new emails received" [00:44]
mircea_popescu to mess with noobs. [00:45]
ThickAsThieves lol [00:45]
smickles $mail
3 ways to a larger PENIS
mircea_popescu lol [00:45]
mircea_popescu it should have a list. if person is not on that list, "You're not cool enough for this service sorry." [00:45]
mod6 need a mutt plugin [00:45]
smickles $markov [00:45]
mpexbot and if you can, hire a group to make it happenj [00:45]
mircea_popescu you can charge like .01 btc for lifetime membership or something [00:46]
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mircea_popescu and it's spelled PEN1S anyway [00:47]
assbot [BTCTC] [BTC-BOND] 6 @ 0.00999 = 0.0599 BTC [+] [00:47]
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dub you goddamn hacker how did you get my password [00:49]
assbot [BTCTC] [CRYPTO-TRADE] 1 @ 0.19999 BTC [-] [00:49]
ThickAsThieves lol [00:49]
mircea_popescu ;;slab puq [00:49]
gribble Error: "slab" is not a valid command. [00:49]
kakobrekla how do you mean no slab? [00:50]
kakobrekla nano should fix this [00:50]
mircea_popescu is of no comprehension his. [00:50]
ThickAsThieves ;;ticker [00:50]
gribble BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 48.16000, Best ask: 48.18310, Bid-ask spread: 0.02310, Last trade: 48.16000, 24 hour volume: 41803.52824419, 24 hour low: 45.47100, 24 hour high: 48.46900, 24 hour vwap: 47.48502 [00:50]
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dub no this is fucking logo [00:52]
dub now* [00:52]
gesell its a shame geocities is down. mpex hosted via geocities would just be perfect [00:52]
dub I swear its synergy throwing away half my keystrokes [00:53]
mircea_popescu dub ahaha totally all the gimp effects [00:53]
smickles $email [00:54]
mpexbot smickles: No new messages received. [00:54]
ThickAsThieves $email [00:55]
mpexbot ThickAsThieves: To sign up for this service, contact smickles. Cost will be 0.01 BTC. [00:55]
ThickAsThieves lol [00:55]
smickles $list SupyMPEx [00:55]
mpexbot smickles: depth, email, post, proxies, and vwap [00:55]
assbot [BTCTC] [CRYPTO-TRADE] 1 @ 0.2 BTC [+] [00:56]
ThickAsThieves i assume all email revenue goes to making mpex aesthetic improvements [00:56]
smickles the list just keeps growing. In two weeks, we'll have something like nano's gribble on our hands [00:56]
mircea_popescu $email [00:56]
mpexbot mircea_popescu: No new messages received. [00:56]
mircea_popescu omg im so cool [00:56]
mircea_popescu eat that hat3rs [00:56]
mod6 smickles: nice! [00:57]
mircea_popescu kakobrekla as you can see, i received no mail. [00:57]
kakobrekla fu :P [00:57]
ThickAsThieves check ur spam folder [00:57]
kakobrekla $spam [00:57]
ThickAsThieves spam detected [00:58]
mircea_popescu Intel X25-E Extreme SSDSA2SH064G1GC [00:59]
mircea_popescu go me. [00:59]
assbot [BTCTC] [BITVPS] 1 @ 0.00401 BTC [-] [00:59]
assbot [BTCTC] [BITVPS] 50 @ 0.004 = 0.2 BTC [-] [00:59]
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FabianB ;;ticker [01:03]
gribble BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 48.19322, Best ask: 48.19341, Bid-ask spread: 0.00019, Last trade: 48.19322, 24 hour volume: 41895.49680393, 24 hour low: 45.47100, 24 hour high: 48.46900, 24 hour vwap: 47.48907 [01:03]
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FabianB thank you maximian, if that was you [01:04]
assbot [BTCTC] [CRYPTO-TRADE] 1 @ 0.19999 BTC [-] [01:04]
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gesell what tha, btc24 now second largest exchange? that was fast [01:09]
mircea_popescu whos btc24 even ? [01:10]
gesell beh, they got their own bots on the exchnage not that it matters [01:10]
gesell [01:10]
mircea_popescu i see bitstamp at 150k [01:11]
mircea_popescu or you meant eur ? [01:11]
mircea_popescu ya ok [01:11]
gesell not sure how bitdata compiled that chart. it isnt eur specific [01:11]
assbot [MPEX] [O.BTCUSD.C470T] 192 @ 0.19228973 = 36.9196 BTC [+] [01:12]
gesell puts bitstamp and btc24 at %2 behind mtgox both [01:12]
gesell sorry #2 not %2 [01:12]
gesell i swear to god they have their own bots running on the exchange. not sure what the objective is but see some bots responding with <200ms timing [01:13]
mircea_popescu marketmaking neh ? [01:13]
mircea_popescu ;;ticker [01:14]
gribble BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 48.10003, Best ask: 48.19000, Bid-ask spread: 0.08997, Last trade: 48.19000, 24 hour volume: 41520.07762161, 24 hour low: 45.47100, 24 hour high: 48.46900, 24 hour vwap: 47.51308 [01:14]
gesell perhaps. just mapped their bots edges and it tends to push it's own reserve volume over other bids that it thinks are too low [01:14]
gesell up to a certain limit, perhaps set based on numbers of averages on other exchnages [01:15]
gesell maybe its an arbitrage protection bot, or not sure [01:15]
mircea_popescu this is probably a recipe for disaster [01:15]
mircea_popescu have everyone entering fake trades based on the other people's fake trades averages [01:15]
kakobrekla bitstamp is fucked and ran by idiots [01:15]
mircea_popescu in fact it's probably the main source of volatility atm [01:15]
assbot [BTCTC] [CRYPTO-TRADE] 4 @ 0.19999 = 0.8 BTC [-] [01:16]
gesell mircea_popescu: what do you mean by fake trades? I think on btc24, unlike mtgox, if you buy your fiat gets locked and you cant make another order. same on sell. of course their own local bots could fake, but i could not prove this. and actually they wouldnt have to fake, if all they really want to do is some moderate protection from arbitrage [01:16]
mircea_popescu gesell if the exchange is running it's own bot, [01:16]
mircea_popescu and it is feeding it from the trades on other exchanges [01:17]
mircea_popescu except everyone does this [01:17]
mircea_popescu the net result is a positive feedback loop of great danger [01:17]
assbot [BTCTC] [CRYPTO-TRADE] 2 @ 0.2 = 0.4 BTC [+] [01:18]
gesell mircea_popescu: i cant wrap my head around how that would all play out. just assume before running any bot one would make comfortable limits, and some way to guage when things are getting out of control so you know when to turn off [01:18]
mircea_popescu heh. [01:19]
mircea_popescu i hear that, i'm thinking bitcoinica. [01:19]
gesell other than being hacked dont remember bitcoinica gaming the market [01:21]
mircea_popescu did you read their leaked emails ? [01:21]
benkay where find ^^? [01:21]
gesell mircea_popescu: havent no [01:22]
mircea_popescu [01:23]
benkay tempted to pause timer and read [01:24]
mircea_popescu what timer is that [01:24]
benkay billing. [01:24]
benkay but also would like to close out workblock, make commits, email people "yay" and go play with dog and lady [01:26]
benkay so [01:26]
benkay balancing priorities. [01:26]
mircea_popescu such balance is apparent in the sorting of the [dog ; lady] set. [01:27]
benkay oh you [01:27]
mircea_popescu lol [01:27]
benkay maybe i alpha sort everything on the outfeed, huh? [01:28]
benkay in reality, dog needs tiring first [01:28]
benkay otherwise [01:28]
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mircea_popescu heh [01:31]
mircea_popescu PSA : starting yest MPEx is adding 0.001 fee to all txs, whether needed or not (it's almost never actually needed). Support teh network! [01:32]
benkay wat. [01:33]
benkay oic. [01:34]
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assbot [BTCTC] [S.DICE-PT] 30 @ 0.00557 = 0.1671 BTC [-] [01:56]
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mircea_popescu reading a digest of the bitcoin-dev chan, i am struck by how incredibly pompous these people are. [01:59]
mircea_popescu seriously know. who told them they know shit and when exactly ?! [01:59]
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assbot [BTCTC] [GSDPT] 20 @ 0.00524 = 0.1048 BTC [+] [02:00]
assbot [BTCTC] [B.YABMC] 1 @ 0.01987 BTC [+] [02:04]
assbot [BTCTC] [B.YABMC] 11 @ 0.01988 = 0.2187 BTC [+] [02:05]
assbot [BTCTC] [BTC-TRADING-PT] 2 @ 0.1796 = 0.3592 BTC [-] [02:06]
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smickles mircea_popescu: [02:26]
smickles $depth s.mpoe [02:26]
mpexbot smickles: Bids: ['5 @ 73163', '5539 @ 73162', '4961 @ 72543', '10000 @ 71102', '10000 @ 70102'] [02:26]
mpexbot smickles: Asks: ['502 @ 76717', '12095 @ 76718', '1399 @ 77988', '54540 @ 77999', '500000 @ 78000'] [02:26]
mircea_popescu that;'s not bad actually [02:28]
mircea_popescu here's a tricky thing : [02:28]
mircea_popescu would it be possible for the bot to keep a count of the chat lines during past 5 minutes and send that response by pm if value > 50 ? [02:29]
mircea_popescu and also send it by pm if it's been sent to the main chat during the past 1 hr [02:29]
kakobrekla basically just send it to pm. [02:30]
mircea_popescu lol [02:30]
mircea_popescu not EXACTLY [02:30]
smickles it would be easist to just send it to pm [02:30]
mircea_popescu well i guess it would, yeah. [02:30]
mircea_popescu up to you [02:30]
smickles do you think it's spammy as is? [02:31]
mircea_popescu as is no [02:31]
mircea_popescu but it has the potential to become. [02:31]
kakobrekla also side note, pm is short for 'picku mater' which roughty translates for 'mothers cunt' [02:31]
kakobrekla to* [02:31]
mircea_popescu pizda ma-tii. [02:31]
mircea_popescu eastern europe is firmly decided on pm = yo momma's. [02:31]
kakobrekla :) [02:32]
smickles well, kakobrekla if you think people are using it too often, let me know and I will switch it to pm response [02:32]
kakobrekla aha [02:32]
kakobrekla lets see what happens then [02:32]
* smickles imagines kakobrekla adding 'use $depth s.mpoe 5 times an hour or be banned!' to the topic [02:34]
kakobrekla wait so one must use it 5 times an hour ? [02:34]
mircea_popescu lol totally. [02:35]
kakobrekla mkay better get started [02:35]
smickles yup, also, i added email service to mpexbot [02:35]
kakobrekla $depth s.mpoe [02:35]
kakobrekla $depth s.mpoe [02:35]
mpexbot kakobrekla: Bids: ['5 @ 73163', '5539 @ 73162', '4961 @ 72543', '10000 @ 71102', '10000 @ 70102'] [02:35]
kakobrekla $depth s.mpoe [02:35]
kakobrekla $depth s.mpoe [02:35]
kakobrekla $depth s.mpoe [02:35]
mpexbot kakobrekla: Asks: ['502 @ 76717', '12095 @ 76718', '1399 @ 77988', '54540 @ 77999', '500000 @ 78000'] [02:35]
mpexbot kakobrekla: Bids: ['5 @ 73163', '5539 @ 73162', '4961 @ 72543', '10000 @ 71102', '10000 @ 70102'] [02:35]
mpexbot kakobrekla: Asks: ['502 @ 76717', '12095 @ 76718', '1399 @ 77988', '54540 @ 77999', '500000 @ 78000'] [02:35]
mpexbot kakobrekla: Bids: ['5 @ 73163', '5539 @ 73162', '4961 @ 72543', '10000 @ 71102', '10000 @ 70102'] [02:35]
mpexbot kakobrekla: Asks: ['502 @ 76717', '12095 @ 76718', '1399 @ 77988', '54540 @ 77999', '500000 @ 78000'] [02:35]
mpexbot kakobrekla: Bids: ['5 @ 73163', '5539 @ 73162', '4961 @ 72543', '10000 @ 71102', '10000 @ 70102'] [02:35]
mpexbot kakobrekla: Asks: ['502 @ 76717', '12095 @ 76718', '1399 @ 77988', '54540 @ 77999', '500000 @ 78000'] [02:35]
mpexbot kakobrekla: Bids: ['5 @ 73163', '5539 @ 73162', '4961 @ 72543', '10000 @ 71102', '10000 @ 70102'] [02:35]
mpexbot kakobrekla: Asks: ['502 @ 76717', '12095 @ 76718', '1399 @ 77988', '54540 @ 77999', '500000 @ 78000'] [02:35]
mircea_popescu i still think my idea was the most elegant [02:35]
smickles T_T [02:35]
kakobrekla no spam. [02:35]
dub ;;echo $depth s.mpoe [02:36]
gribble $depth s.mpoe [02:36]
mpexbot gribble: Bids: ['5 @ 73163', '5539 @ 73162', '4961 @ 72543', '10000 @ 71102', '10000 @ 70102'] [02:36]
mpexbot gribble: Asks: ['502 @ 76717', '12095 @ 76718', '1399 @ 77988', '54540 @ 77999', '500000 @ 78000'] [02:36]
smickles i might need to fiddle with the 'abuse' configs [02:36]
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kakobrekla o looky. [02:36]
smickles $depth s.dice [02:36]
mpexbot smickles: Bids: ['100 @ 530012', '81 @ 530011', '800 @ 530000', '500 @ 520000', '10 @ 520000'] [02:36]
mpexbot smickles: Asks: ['9299 @ 569996', '1000 @ 569997', '2000 @ 570000', '148 @ 599990', '48346 @ 600000'] [02:36]
mircea_popescu lol [02:37]
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mircea_popescu evoorhees good thinking on upping the you lost returns. [02:37]
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mircea_popescu [02:42]
mircea_popescu totally qualified to give advice. [02:42]
Troic fork drama next [02:42]
pigeons yeah be careful with the big bucks till the fork is resolved [02:43]
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mircea_popescu how long is it yet ? [02:44]
pigeons looks like about 5 blocks [02:46]
mircea_popescu fleshwound [02:47]
dub yuss [02:47]
dub inb4 $2 [02:47]
smickles dub: i called 2 hours ago [02:47]
pigeons satoshi dice pausing till resolved [02:47]
smickles er, i called $2, hours ago [02:47]
smickles curse you ambiguity [02:48]
assbot [BTCTC] [BTC-TRADING-PT] 8 @ 0.1796 = 1.4368 BTC [-] [02:48]
mircea_popescu ;;ticker [02:48]
gribble BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 47.75902, Best ask: 47.83005, Bid-ask spread: 0.07103, Last trade: 47.83005, 24 hour volume: 42125.00556719, 24 hour low: 45.54000, 24 hour high: 48.46900, 24 hour vwap: 47.65497 [02:48]
dub now would be a great time to dos guild [02:51]
dub any kids watching? :) [02:51]
mircea_popescu is this fork in any way related to the two asic miners ? [02:52]
mircea_popescu ie, is one avalon sponsored and the other am sponsored ? [02:52]
BitHub is this a scam? [02:52]
dub no its a block size issue affecting BDB in 0.7 [02:53]
dub according to -dev [02:53]
mircea_popescu so basically they fucvked up the upgrade. [02:53]
dub 0.8 is unaffected so 0.7 and 0.8 miners have forked [02:53]
mircea_popescu as in, "it's a blocksize issue we've introduced with 0.8" [02:53]
dub fix is to move majority hashing back to 0.7 [02:53]
jcpham anyone want to help me with a e-poll [02:53]
mircea_popescu these pompous assholes. [02:54]
dub so if guild went down now it would be teh bitpocalypse [02:54]
jcpham it has real world results [02:54]
dub mircea_popescu: no [02:54]
mircea_popescu oh ? [02:54]
jurov ;;bc,convert eur [02:54]
gribble 1 BTC = 47.70000 U.S. dollars = 36.6923077 Euros [02:54]
kakobrekla mircea_popescu switch dns? :p [02:54]
mircea_popescu kakobrekla lol. [02:54]
dub mircea_popescu: its a previously unheard of issue with BDB, the block size triggered it [02:54]
mircea_popescu dub SO THEY FUCKED UP THE UPGRADE. [02:54]
mircea_popescu jesus passing the buck is like a tradition in bitcoin-devtalk [02:55]
dub mircea_popescu: well no, dice fucked up the blockchain [02:55]
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mircea_popescu yaya [02:55]
dub by creating blocks too big for 0.7 [02:55]
mircea_popescu "let's hide the fact that we suck at coding by falsely accusing someone else of doing things such as trying to externalise their costs on others" [02:55]
dub we only know about it because half the network is on 0.8 [02:55]
mircea_popescu "which happens to be exactly what we're doing" [02:55]
assbot [BTCTC] [ASICMINER-PT] 2 @ 0.774998 = 1.55 BTC [-] [02:55]
mircea_popescu tell them i expect an apology for this idiocy. [02:56]
mircea_popescu fuckwits need to learn some humility presto. [02:56]
assbot [BTCTC] [CRYPTO-TRADE] 4 @ 0.2 = 0.8 BTC [+] [02:56]
ThickAsThieves seems like they could really fuck things up from this point still [02:56]
jcpham vote for "good love" [02:56]
jcpham top three bands get to play [02:56]
jcpham trying to make sure my frind's band plays [02:56]
jcpham its a big venue for him [02:56]
mircea_popescu mkay. [02:56]
dub fixing the network to make dice fit is the trigger [02:56]
jcpham do it or die [02:56]
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mircea_popescu dub would you stop already ? [02:57]
mircea_popescu their mommies made them do it ? [02:57]
mircea_popescu jcpham done. they owe me a bra now. [02:57]
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jcpham k [02:57]
dub mircea_popescu: big blocks are the problem here [02:58]
mircea_popescu dub no. [02:58]
mircea_popescu they did not know what their own code did. [02:58]
mircea_popescu that is the problem here. [02:58]
mircea_popescu they pushed an unsafe upgrade, without a clue. [02:58]
mircea_popescu that is the problem. [02:58]
mircea_popescu they only discovered it once it blew up. [02:58]
mircea_popescu that is the problem. [02:58]
dub well, no [02:58]
mircea_popescu how no ? [02:58]
dub but I can see you are decided [02:58]
mircea_popescu i'm askin. [02:58]
dub because the problem is increasing teh blocksize not 0.8 [02:59]
mircea_popescu ... [02:59]
mircea_popescu dude. [02:59]
mircea_popescu how is the problem "increasing the blocksizer" [02:59]
mircea_popescu this is the same coolaid of saying "sd is hte problem" [02:59]
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dub because 0.7 nodes can't handle them [02:59]
mircea_popescu no dood. the problem is bad code, not the real world constraints that expose it sucks. [02:59]
mircea_popescu WHY NOT [02:59]
dub because the database sucks [03:00]
mircea_popescu orly [03:00]
mircea_popescu it;'s the db now right ? [03:00]
dub no [03:00]
mircea_popescu why not jesus ? jesus sucks so devs can't code. [03:00]
pigeons because the bug in BDB wasn't encountered before because the number of transactions in a block that trigger it wasnt valid before [03:00]
mircea_popescu dun dun dun [03:00]
dub Okay SatoshiDice is on pause now. Receiving bets but not processing anything. [03:00]
dub fyi [03:00]
mircea_popescu so what, we write bugs and that's ok if nobody forces our nose in it "? [03:00]
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mircea_popescu cause we're too busy acting the knowful shitheads on -dev ? [03:01]
mircea_popescu fuck that. [03:01]
mircea_popescu dub so ? [03:01]
dub I think its too early to know if its bdb itself or bitcoins implementation [03:01]
mircea_popescu how about bitcoin implementing something that failed is on the devs [03:01]
mircea_popescu period. [03:01]
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mircea_popescu it's not tested enough to release yet, do not release it. [03:02]
mircea_popescu what is this, 1955, we're discovering software engineering ? [03:02]
BitHub heh [03:02]
dub im just annoyed that we're not at $2 yet [03:03]
dub come on guys, its panic time if ever there was [03:03]
mircea_popescu i'm sick and tired of the young cocks circlejerk attitude. [03:03]
mircea_popescu a. they know shit ; b. they don't even know a. wtf. [03:03]
jcpham let's see how this plays out [03:05]
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assbot [HAVELOCK] [SDICE] 5 @ 0.56 = 2.8 BTC [+] [03:07]
dub speakign of circlejerk [03:12]
dub fucking assholes now want to talk about my offer after a week of bullshit [03:12]
ThickAsThieves sooo what happens if i do this [03:13]
dub and I'm now ready to buy a different house [03:13]
ThickAsThieves ;;bc,stats [03:13]
gribble Current Blocks: 225435 | Current Difficulty: 4367876.000842196 | Next Difficulty At Block: 225791 | Next Difficulty In: 356 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 2 days, 5 hours, 24 minutes, and 0 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: None | Estimated Percent Change: None [03:13]
ThickAsThieves ;;estimate [03:13]
gribble Next difficulty estimate | None based on data since last change | 5496120.07656 based on data for last three days [03:13]
dub 0 diff would be neat [03:14]
ThickAsThieves so if they are forked, then anyone mining the dropped fork is fukt [03:15]
ThickAsThieves right? [03:15]
mircea_popescu yes. [03:15]
mircea_popescu also an issue of doublespends. [03:15]
mircea_popescu (incoming) [03:15]
ThickAsThieves and anyone helping to push the old fork gets super low diff [03:15]
ThickAsThieves ? [03:15]
mircea_popescu nah both ends are same diff [03:16]
ThickAsThieves oh cuz it wont change til the specific block [03:16]
mircea_popescu if one forks gets to actually the diff block [03:18]
mircea_popescu then they will have divergent difficulty [03:18]
mircea_popescu luckily there's still a ways to go [03:18]
dub gox better not stop this crash [03:19]
ThickAsThieves you know they will [03:19]
mircea_popescu ;;ticker [03:19]
gribble BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 45.50110, Best ask: 45.60134, Bid-ask spread: 0.10024, Last trade: 45.00000, 24 hour volume: 55914.86095949, 24 hour low: 45.00000, 24 hour high: 48.46900, 24 hour vwap: 47.30466 [03:19]
mircea_popescu heh. [03:19]
ThickAsThieves gox didnt halt trading? [03:20]
mircea_popescu i imagine they only halted payouts [03:21]
mircea_popescu trading can in principle continuewith what they have deposited in btc and freely on usd. [03:21]
mircea_popescu payins i mean. people paying them. [03:21]
dub whois defunctzombie? [03:23]
dub he'so offering to halt trading if gox does [03:23]
pigeons and halted processing deposits [03:23]
Chaang-Noi crash? [03:23]
mircea_popescu Chaang-Noi more like momentary panic. [03:23]
Chaang-Noi :) [03:24]
dub blockchain is firked [03:24]
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Chaang-Noi litecoin is moving on up, crazy [03:24]
dub and forked [03:24]
dub and fucked [03:24]
Chaang-Noi what is the news with gox, just woke up? [03:24]
Ukto update regarding effects of blockchain issues on bitfunder. [03:24]
dub bitcoin forked into 0.7 and 0.8 chains [03:24]
Ukto pools were todl to increase blocksize [03:25]
dub pools are rolling back to 0.7 to fix [03:25]
Ukto someo made them too big [03:25]
mircea_popescu [03:25]
Chaang-Noi it forked? oh fuuuuck [03:25]
Ukto and olrder clients shat themselves [03:25]
Ukto end of story. [03:25]
Ukto nothing malicious [03:25]
Chaang-Noi so coins in our new clients are they gone? [03:25]
mircea_popescu no, just stupid. [03:25]
mircea_popescu nah chang [03:25]
mircea_popescu you just shouldn't credit payments for a bit. [03:26]
Ukto Chaang-Noi: that depends on what happens after blockchain merger [03:26]
Ukto mircea_popescu is correct [03:26]
Ukto you SHOULD be fine [03:26]
Chaang-Noi oh fuck me [03:26]
Ukto but put things on hold [03:26]
pigeons everyone go take a walk and get some food and come bac in a few hours [03:26]
Chaang-Noi glad i has 150,000 as a back up crypto currancy [03:26]
Chaang-Noi LTC [03:26]
Ukto you have 150k ? [03:26]
Ukto x.x [03:26]
mod6 heh you sold 50k 'eh [03:27]
dub mircea_popescu: loving the WTC ref [03:27]
mircea_popescu dub heh. [03:27]
pigeons yeah ltc could never get this bug because that many transactions in litecoin would never propogate quickly enough to get included in a block [03:27]
Chaang-Noi i have not made a btc payment for about 12 hours, will this make me saffer even if i use the new client? [03:27]
pigeons Chaang-Noi: just wait [03:27]
Chaang-Noi is there a link with more info on the forum or something? [03:28]
pigeons [03:28]
Chaang-Noi thanks [03:28]
mircea_popescu Chaang-Noi your outgoing payments are safe [03:28]
davos meh - its only down 4, less than 10% [03:28]
mircea_popescu crediting incomingpayments may be unsafe, if they are doublespent across the forks [03:28]
davos not a crash [03:28]
mircea_popescu and then they merge into one that doesn't include you being paid. [03:29]
davos and wrong chat. =D [03:29]
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Chaang-Noi mp i sold 50k ltc yesterday for btc, odds on this being accepted? [03:33]
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smickles ;;ticker [03:33]
gribble BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 43.12000, Best ask: 44.50000, Bid-ask spread: 1.38000, Last trade: 43.12000, 24 hour volume: 62664.75566320, 24 hour low: 43.12000, 24 hour high: 48.46900, 24 hour vwap: 46.92695 [03:33]
Bowjob Meow [03:34]
Bowjob All right, what the fuck is going on [03:34]
smickles SELL SELL SELL !!! [03:34]
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kakobrekla hm 1k sold and price went down 3$ [03:36]
Bowjob This is a huge blow to bitcoin. WTF I thought its supposed to be secure [03:36]
the-bucket-shop my guess miner hardware related. total wild guess [03:36]
ThickAsThieves why do they even need to change the code [03:37]
BitHub bitcoin been failing a bit lately [03:37]
BitHub alot of flaws being exposed [03:37]
dub this is glorious [03:37]
smickles BitHub: [03:37]
BitHub ? [03:37]
Ukto btw [03:37]
Ukto this will rpolyl drive ltc prices up [03:37]
Ukto ;) [03:37]
mircea_popescu BitHub they've been doing this shit since day one [03:37]
Chaang-Noi :) [03:37]
mircea_popescu wallet was plaintext for like 2 years [03:38]
mircea_popescu it's just that now btc is worth half a bn dollars [03:38]
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Ukto almost done with my mini ltc project [03:38]
BitHub mircea do you think the bitcoin foundation will pay out a compensation? lul [03:38]
smickles reparations! [03:38]
BitHub damn straight [03:38]
mircea_popescu BitHub i'd be more than happy if the usual pompous idiots came out with an apology. [03:38]
Chaang-Noi Ukto tell me more, i heart ltc [03:38]
BitHub mircea who's fault is it? [03:39]
dub mircea_popescu: you know the answer right [03:39]
mircea_popescu dub yes. [03:39]
dub mircea_popescu: because 'not ready for primetime' [03:39]
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mircea_popescu BitHub i'm not going to go into that level of detail. [03:39]
dub mircea_popescu: its obvious they don't want adoption [03:39]
Bowjob wow.. what will the institutional investors think [03:39]
mircea_popescu dub yes, they want it forever this niche toy where they matter. [03:39]
dub mircea_popescu: at least for the next 100 years [03:39]
mircea_popescu when i told them they'll be pushed aside coupla months ago i guess they groked it [03:39]
BitHub all good, but yeah, makes me think they could just do this sort of stuff on purpose just to manipulate the price [03:40]
mircea_popescu BitHub they're for the most part not intelligent enough to understand the point or value of money. [03:40]
mircea_popescu they just want dorks admiring them. [03:40]
BitHub to be honest i have noticed the lack of like really really god like programmers [03:40]
dub oh this is gettgin good [03:41]
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kakobrekla what is getting good [03:41]
kakobrekla where is the url [03:41]
dub you cant downgrade to 0.7 [03:41]
kakobrekla feed us [03:42]
pizzaman1337 or getting bad [03:42]
mircea_popescu [03:42]
dub without prev blkindex [03:42]
Bowjob satoshi, save us [03:42]
mircea_popescu dub obviously ? [03:42]
BitHub yeah where is Lord Satoshi? [03:42]
kakobrekla mistebigg again [03:42]
kakobrekla someone stab him in teh face [03:42]
BitHub he needs to come in and fix these n00bs mistake [03:42]
mircea_popescu the only way is basically foer the people who upgraded to downtime [03:42]
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mircea_popescu let the smarter folks merge it [03:42]
mircea_popescu then pay for a blk [03:42]
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dub and no reindex in 0.7 so you have to download and validate the chain [03:42]
mircea_popescu da fuck did you think tho ? [03:42]
dub which workd REALLY WELL [03:42]
BitHub lul @ In re Bitcoin Devs are idiots [03:43]
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dub BitHub: they kinda are [03:43]
smickles i've got an uptodate .7 chain for s2cm funds [03:43]
BitHub ima have to read this :) [03:43]
* Chaang-Noi (~j@ has joined #bitcoin-assets [03:43]
* Tritonio (~Tritonio@ has joined #bitcoin-assets [03:43]
mircea_popescu smickles see if anyone wants to pay you 50 btc for it [03:44]
Bowjob ;;ticker [03:44]
gribble BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 45.00000, Best ask: 45.10989, Bid-ask spread: 0.10989, Last trade: 45.00000, 24 hour volume: 66465.70498496, 24 hour low: 43.11000, 24 hour high: 48.46900, 24 hour vwap: 46.77472 [03:44]
Bowjob hey [03:44]
Bowjob wtf [03:44]
Bowjob 45 [03:44]
smickles ;;sell 1 "0.7 blockchain" @ 50 btc [03:45]
gribble Order id 13963 created. [03:45]
gesell Bowjob: see [03:45]
Bowjob what bullshit is this [03:45]
Bowjob this actually scares me.. that bitcoin can be compromised like this [03:45]
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mod6 there you go smickles [03:45]
Bowjob I thought we're supposed to be unhackable and shit [03:45]
kakobrekla lol [03:45]
mircea_popescu ahaha [03:45]
BitHub yeah bowjob [03:45]
BitHub its getting scammy hey [03:45]
BitHub the pyramid is being exposed [03:45]
kakobrekla btc is fragile as a cracked egg [03:45]
* pgp has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) [03:45]
Bowjob Everyone move to lite coin! [03:45]
mod6 i've got a chain that was last updated dec 29th... [03:46]
kakobrekla i mean bitcoind [03:46]
BitHub just email your wallet.dat to the bitcoin foundation tell them they've won and then hang yourself [03:46]
mod6 heheh [03:47]
Bowjob Umm I'm using electrum does it run ot 0.08 [03:47]
Bowjob .. [03:47]
Bowjob wtf [03:47]
evoorhees Bowjob don't be a fool. If you actually saw the devs react to this and remedy it, you'd be very impressed [03:47]
evoorhees people should expect bugs [03:47]
evoorhees it's how resilient btc is in the face of them that matters [03:47]
mircea_popescu Bowjob the design is very strong. [03:48]
mircea_popescu the implementation is very poor. [03:48]
pizzaman1337 mircea_popescu: have you considered hiring people to work on it? [03:48]
mircea_popescu pizzaman1337 suppose bitcoin was written by mpex devs. [03:48]
mircea_popescu would you use it ? [03:49]
pizzaman1337 if everyone else did [03:49]
dub bitcoin is so resilient it only took one satoshidice to break it [03:49]
mircea_popescu that's no way to go about things. [03:49]
Bowjob btc-e trollbox is celebrating [03:49]
pizzaman1337 so what's the best solution? [03:49]
mircea_popescu there's a lot of intrinsic strength in the open and independent dev model. [03:49]
BitHub hand the code over to bill gates [03:49]
mircea_popescu the problem is that much like anything else of the kind, it depends on keeping politics low. [03:49]
mircea_popescu wikipedia for instance is similar, and failed for similar reasons. [03:49]
gesell mircea_popescu: shorting possitions on mpex? [03:49]
BitHub politics, emotions, egos [03:49]
mircea_popescu gesell not so far. [03:49]
gesell ack [03:50]
vampireb well not a bitcoin issue, the old db was a problem [03:50]
mircea_popescu go ahead [03:50]
gesell no, just curious [03:50]
mircea_popescu vampireb don't you start. read up a little eh. [03:50]
smickles gesell: you want to short s.mpoe? [03:50]
BitHub why doesn't the bitcoin foundation use all that money to actually hire proper programmers [03:50]
BitHub with resumes and stuff [03:50]
* pgp_ has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) [03:50]
vampireb hmm? start what? i read pleter's explanation, what isnt clear? [03:50]
Bowjob are asics safe and compatible after this? [03:51]
mircea_popescu vampireb read up the context in the channel you're talking. [03:51]
BitHub isn't that the foundation job? or not really? [03:51]
gesell will this spill over into the discussion of soft limits and sdice foo? [03:51]
mircea_popescu Bowjob doesn't have much to do with asics this [03:51]
mircea_popescu BitHub well... i have no idea. [03:51]
Bowjob k thats all i care about [03:51]
Bowjob lol [03:51]
mircea_popescu gesell prolly. [03:51]
benkay lol@ bithub resumes [03:51]
dub gesell: this will spill over into all manner of discussion [03:51]
mircea_popescu this will probably be the foundation of all further discussions [03:51]
mircea_popescu dja see what i did there ? [03:51]
smickles well, if anyone want's to short s.mpoe, i have a fair amout of shares available [03:51]
BitHub what is the point of the foundation [03:52]
mircea_popescu smickles i think op was discussing shorting btc [03:52]
smickles oh [03:52]
dub BitHub: they supply the biscuit [03:52]
smickles poo [03:52]
vampireb i dont have the context, but ok [03:52]
smickles buy puts :P [03:52]
benkay dub: biscuit? [03:52]
mircea_popescu vampireb mkay. who put the db in there ? [03:52]
dub the one in the middle [03:52]
vampireb who? i dont know, satoshi? [03:53]
vampireb bdb has issues, not 0.8 [03:53]
mircea_popescu right. [03:53]
dub ;;goxlag [03:53]
gribble 38.016469 seconds [03:53]
mircea_popescu you make an upgrade that fucks up the network, it's not the db, it's not satoshi, it;s you. [03:53]
dub ;;ticker [03:53]
mircea_popescu that's how things work. [03:53]
gribble BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 45.01000, Best ask: 45.90277, Bid-ask spread: 0.89277, Last trade: 46.50000, 24 hour volume: 70342.96544144, 24 hour low: 43.11000, 24 hour high: 48.46900, 24 hour vwap: 46.71424 [03:53]
benkay hurr. [03:53]
kakobrekla again [03:53]
kakobrekla untradable [03:53]
benkay did testnet testing not catch this due to atomic transaction size blah blah? [03:53]
kakobrekla 38 seconds [03:53]
kakobrekla and no ddos afaik [03:53]
dub its only 38 man [03:54]
kakobrekla fuckin lame [03:54]
vampireb well guess what, that's why when I last time I met gavin he was looking to hire QA [03:54]
kakobrekla tards. [03:54]
dub it was over 2000 last night [03:54]
dub with no volume at all [03:54]
kakobrekla over 9k really pisses me. [03:54]
pizzaman1337 kakobrekla: gotta fix it :) [03:54]
dub I've only seen it >9000 once [03:54]
kakobrekla myea. [03:55]
dub but today would be a good candidate [03:55]
dub if the 20k failsafe is still there [03:55]
smickles "an easy way to do it is to go to home depot with 5 usd, buy stuff to make it happenj" [03:55]
smickles ;;proxies [03:56]
gribble Error: "proxies" is not a valid command. [03:56]
gesell dub: 20k failsafe means what? [03:56]
smickles $proxies [03:56]
mpexbot smickles: [""] [03:56]
vampireb !ticker mpex s.dice [03:56]
assbot [MPEX:S.DICE] 1D: 0.00530001 / 0.00552804 / 0.0059998 (11830 shares, 65.40 BTC), 7D: 0.00300001 / 0.00514724 / 0.006 (228107 shares, 1,174.12 BTC), 30D: 0.00300001 / 0.00614247 / 0.0069 (2518785 shares, 15,471.58 BTC) [03:56]
smickles $depth s.dice [03:57]
mpexbot smickles: Bids: ['100 @ 530012', '81 @ 530011', '800 @ 530000', '500 @ 520000', '10 @ 520000'] [03:57]
mpexbot smickles: Asks: ['9299 @ 569996', '1000 @ 569997', '2000 @ 570000', '148 @ 599990', '48346 @ 600000'] [03:57]
smickles :) [03:57]
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pizzaman1337 smickles: nice [03:57]
Bowjob now lucif is gonna make some bullshit up how he calculated this could happen [03:57]
Bowjob and we're gonna look like emperors with no clothes [03:57]
mircea_popescu vampireb so he was looking to hire a qa. good for him. [03:58]
benkay too bad he never got around to it. [03:58]
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benkay egg -> face [03:58]
vampireb well devs dont wanna do qa, and u can't really qa your own shit [03:58]
benkay [03:58]
mircea_popescu vampireb so ? [03:59]
Bowjob meanwhile, LTC is surging [03:59]
mircea_popescu Bowjob it would. [03:59]
vampireb so what? it isn't the end of the world. a minor hiccup [03:59]
smickles "Every be very careful about accepting any transactions for the the next few hours" << what is that supposed to mean :P [03:59]
benkay i'd take a bearish position on ltc, settled next month... [04:00]
smickles how is one to be careful? [04:00]
the-bucket-shop never let a tragedy go to waste fellas. Plaster Satoshi Dice's name all over the news and posts if you can. [04:00]
vampireb the result: bitcoin foundation would be promoted as a saviour [04:00]
BitHub it not the end of the world? [04:00]
* BitHub unties his family [04:00]
mircea_popescu smickles that incoming txs might be wiped on fork merge [04:01]
mircea_popescu vampireb it's hopefully the end of a certain misplace attitude. [04:01]
gesell the-bucket-shop: what do you mean? [04:01]
mircea_popescu in the devteam. [04:01]
mircea_popescu aka "we know shit". [04:01]
vampireb attitudes? yea. [04:01]
* davout has quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) [04:01]
the-bucket-shop I mean satoshidice can get famous off of this news [04:01]
gesell also, what effect would this split have on hash/mining opporutunities? [04:02]
mircea_popescu gesell it's a temporary thing. [04:02]
gesell brief opportunities if that [04:02]
mircea_popescu if it's not temporary then there's no mining oportunities [04:02]
smickles mircea_popescu: i know, but how would you be careful about it. seems binary to me [04:02]
mircea_popescu just stall them [04:02]
mircea_popescu im not processing incoming on mpex till its resolved for instance. [04:02]
gesell mircea_popescu: even if it is, it will take time for everyone to get on the proper chain, no... since apparently some versions will have to upgrade [04:02]
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benkay i'm out. this shit's boring. [04:03]
mircea_popescu (course i have the advantaghe that my system is designed so such things don't affect me) [04:03]
mircea_popescu gesell it seems downgrade moreover. [04:03]
Bowjob ;;ticker [04:03]
gribble BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 43.50000, Best ask: 44.00000, Bid-ask spread: 0.50000, Last trade: 43.10000, 24 hour volume: 75255.63737110, 24 hour low: 43.10000, 24 hour high: 48.46900, 24 hour vwap: 46.55735 [04:03]
* benkay has quit (Quit: benkay) [04:03]
vampireb ah good that i sold at 47. need to figure when to rebuy [04:03]
smickles 2 [04:04]
kakobrekla ltc crossed 1 [04:04]
gesell so, just trying to understand this. how is mtgox processing tx's now. this effects minders and merchants, not exchanges? [04:04]
dub im buying at $10 [04:04]
vampireb they dont process tx now? [04:04]
smickles gsi don't think they are processing deposits/withdrawals [04:04]
vampireb you can trade with existing funds [04:04]
dub they dont process tx [04:04]
dub unless you fund or withdraw [04:04]
dub which is frozen iirc [04:05]
gesell dub: perhaps i got the wrong term. if miners and merchants are told to wait, why not exchanges? [04:05]
vampireb miners need to switch to 0.7? [04:05]
smickles echanges != merchant? [04:05]
Chaang-Noi ltc now at all time high to btc, and well over its old all time high to fiat [04:05]
mircea_popescu gesell nobody is crediting incoming txs atm [04:05]
gesell im trying to guage if there will be a queu of sells waiting to flood through exchanges once things get back to speed [04:06]
mircea_popescu withdrawals are fine, but prolly people aren't doing it just to be safe. [04:06]
mircea_popescu gesell its possible. [04:06]
dub gesell: there will, and wait till it hits the press [04:06]
mircea_popescu yeah, outlook is a little bearish i guess [04:06]
dub I think $10 might be a bit bullish [04:06]
pizzaman1337 ;;ticker --last [04:06]
gribble 44.15000 [04:07]
* pgp has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) [04:07]
Bowjob I'm dropping down 200 BTC [04:07]
pizzaman1337 well, I can't wait to get myself some cheap coins if it drops [04:07]
gesell so its a selfish question now but ive always invested long term. and now im wondering if its time to pull and wait [04:07]
mod6 pizzaman1337: same [04:07]
Bowjob pull put. i'll sell 200 BTC for 8k [04:07]
the-bucket-shop still 25 coins every 10 minutes as far as I know. long term should be good gesell [04:08]
mircea_popescu so far options aren't moving at all. [04:08]
gesell the-bucket-shop: the long term is great. but the bible says to be a good steward with your money so im just wondering if im being a total idiot just holding at this point [04:09]
gesell ;) [04:09]
mircea_popescu im guessing people don't judge major drop likely. [04:09]
smickles ;;view [04:09]
gribble #13963 Mon Mar 11 18:45:10 2013 smickles SELL 1.0 0.7 blockchain @ 50 btc (None) [04:09]
mircea_popescu got any offers yet ? [04:09]
smickles yup [04:09]
kakobrekla r u srs? [04:09]
kakobrekla ill sell for 25 [04:09]
smickles nope [04:10]
smickles ;D [04:10]
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gesell what are you selling smickles, dont get it [04:10]
kakobrekla lol [04:10]
kakobrekla :D [04:10]
gesell just selling the dat files? huh [04:10]
smickles gesell: because of the current situation, people who are on .8 and want .7 need to redownload the chain [04:10]
Bowjob heck ill sell for $13.29 [04:10]
pizzaman1337 ;;ticker --last [04:10]
gribble 43.49999 [04:10]
Bowjob what i paid for [04:10]
Bowjob lol [04:10]
smickles a direct transfer from me to them would be a lot faster [04:10]
gesell heh, okay [04:10]
gesell im on 0.7 with last update 25 days ago [04:11]
Chaang-Noi bit is 42 [04:11]
Chaang-Noi ;;ticker [04:11]
gribble BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 43.20000, Best ask: 43.20758, Bid-ask spread: 0.00758, Last trade: 43.20000, 24 hour volume: 81127.52521536, 24 hour low: 42.00000, 24 hour high: 48.46900, 24 hour vwap: 46.26895 [04:11]
Chaang-Noi or was lol [04:11]
mircea_popescu heh. [04:11]
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kakobrekla [04:12]
smickles !ticker ^OIX [04:12]
assbot You cannot stop the clouds by the building of a ship. [04:12]
kakobrekla book aint problematic [04:12]
the-bucket-shop hold on if I'm still not upgraded I can sell something? [04:12]
smickles $vwap ^oix [04:12]
mpexbot smickles: {u'7d': {u'cnt': u'', u'min': u'4086787592', u'max': u'5325215905', u'vsa': u'954675808260', u'vsh': u'no', u'avg': u'5157005239'}, u'30d': {u'cnt': u'', u'min': u'', u'max': u'', u'vsa': u'', u'vsh': u'', u'avg': u''}, u'1d': {u'cnt': u'', u'min': u'', u'max': u'', u'vsa': u'', u'vsh': u'', u'avg': u''}} [04:12]
the-bucket-shop I'm trying to catch up [04:12]
kakobrekla but its impossible to trade [04:12]
kakobrekla with 30 sec lag [04:12]
dub its just a correction [04:12]
smickles ;;goxlag [04:12]
gribble 157.044926 seconds [04:12]
mircea_popescu ahahaha [04:12]
kakobrekla or 157 [04:12]
mircea_popescu bejaysus [04:12]
mod6 :/ [04:12]
Bowjob we need to summon satoshi [04:13]
Bowjob Earth! [04:13]
gesell does delay translate to some meaningful guage of load on gox? [04:13]
smickles the OIX is at 51? [04:13]
mod6 yea [04:13]
smickles wtf? [04:13]
toffoo help me satoshi nakamoto, you're our only hope [04:14]
smickles ;;bc,24hprc [04:14]
gribble 46.31 [04:14]
mod6 only options today were 192 CALL @ 47 [04:14]
mircea_popescu smickles nothing moved. [04:15]
mircea_popescu yet at least. [04:15]
dub gesell: it translates to 'gox is incapable of handling moderate load' [04:15]
smickles ;;calc 41/1.11 [04:15]
gribble 36.9369369369 [04:15]
mircea_popescu dub for some values of moderate such as [04:15]
smickles ;;calc 43/1.14 [04:15]
gribble 37.7192982456 [04:15]
gesell hmm, any predictions on bit bets effected by this [04:15]
dub gesell: alternatively 'bitcoin is a joke' [04:15]
mircea_popescu "what the average metro payment terminal in tokyo processes" [04:15]
smickles ;;calc 75/1.62 [04:15]
gribble 46.2962962963 [04:15]
smickles woops [04:16]
smickles ;;calc 75/1.79 [04:16]
gribble 41.8994413408 [04:16]
Bowjob ;;ticker [04:16]
gribble BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 42.00000, Best ask: 42.99000, Bid-ask spread: 0.99000, Last trade: 42.99000, 24 hour volume: 82087.73745767, 24 hour low: 42.00000, 24 hour high: 48.46900, 24 hour vwap: 46.19856 [04:16]
pizzaman1337 $1 spread [04:16]
mircea_popescu oh i see the girl is adequately incensed [04:16]
mircea_popescu paying her in btc was the best move ever. [04:16]
dub lol [04:17]
mircea_popescu she's like "they did what" [04:17]
mircea_popescu and im like "yes. here's pike bring heads" [04:17]
dub no rly? [04:17]
dub No cause we're too cool for testnet and elbow grease, gotta spend 16 hours a day on -dev talking about what we think of Satoshi Dice and how many whales fatass Gmaxwell could swallow whole. [04:17]
assbot [MPEX] [O.BTCUSD.P750T] 10 @ 0.79079695 = 7.908 BTC [-] [04:17]
mircea_popescu lol [04:18]
mod6 bunch of cock-meat sandwiches [04:18]
dub man, if those ddos kids were on to it [04:19]
dub they could REALLY fuck shit up right now [04:19]
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mircea_popescu ya let's keep that part a little quieter shall we. [04:19]
kakobrekla :D [04:19]
dub but I want $2 [04:19]
mircea_popescu nevertheless. [04:19]
smickles i see that as a goos ~8 btc spent [04:20]
smickles *good [04:20]
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gesell this one might get closer [04:20]
ThickAsThieves so in a situation like this, where the usd/btc may fall on confidence, am i safer being mostly invested in assets? [04:20]
* pgp has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) [04:20]
ThickAsThieves or more exposed? [04:20]
mircea_popescu ThickAsThieves possibly. hard to gauge [04:20]
davout why are you guys even here [04:20]
mircea_popescu we have very little mkt history to go by [04:20]
davout all the cool kids are on bitcoin-dev [04:20]
mircea_popescu davout urmom was on the rag. [04:20]
gesell davout: to take advantage of fallouts? [04:21]
mircea_popescu no, only the dubiously metrosexual are on -dev [04:21]
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smickles ThickAsThieves: if a significat amount of investors view their assets in terms of usd, then mebbe [04:21]
mircea_popescu smickles this is the time to buy eskimoblobs thing! [04:21]
smickles else: no [04:21]
ThickAsThieves i spent all day buying ltc assets [04:21]
grubles where da ltc assets at [04:21]
smickles mircea_popescu: no, this was clearly the time to <@assbot> [MPEX] [O.BTCUSD.P750T] 10 @ 0.79079695 = 7.908 BTC [-] [04:21]
mircea_popescu grubles btcto ? [04:21]
ThickAsThieves [04:22]
davout bitcoin just became fun again [04:22]
mircea_popescu smickles short puts ? [04:22]
smickles well, from your end [04:22]
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the-bucket-shop I think s.dice and bitvps would benefit. except that s.dice money faucet is turned off. [04:22]
the-bucket-shop because of a bad btc price [04:22]
grubles mircea_popescu: link? [04:22]
gesell davout: totally [04:22]
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gesell ;;goxlag [04:23]
gribble 199.519792 seconds [04:23]
smickles mircea_popescu: i bought them, if the bc,24hprc moves to the current spot, they break even [04:23]
kakobrekla ... [04:23]
kakobrekla go gox. [04:23]
pizzaman1337 ;;ticker --last [04:23]
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gribble 41.40000 [04:23]
smickles wasn't it over 1500 goxlag the other day [04:23]
* Josh_Rossi has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) [04:23]
pgp2 coinbr down again? [04:24]
gesell by all intents and purposes this is most definitely a crash [04:24]
* B0g4r7 has quit (Client Quit) [04:24]
dub this is early days [04:24]
smickles lol, coinbr down. mpex.coinbr up [04:25]
vampireb imo a crash is good [04:25]
davout is mtgox even still trading ? [04:25]
dub crash comes when the media wakes up [04:25]
smickles mircea_popescu: i also have those p310t's i bought a while back [04:25]
davout dub: not necessarily if it was taken care of quickly [04:25]
Bowjob All right, I'm not panicking. Stay frosty [04:25]
gesell Bowjob: don't panik, just buy when it all settles [04:26]
gesell well [04:26]
dub ;;goxlag [04:26]
gesell i shouldnt give any advice. i dont know jack. but i will hedge a little when it bottoms out anyway, for myself [04:26]
gribble 256.034339 seconds [04:26]
smickles best thing to do now is buy beer with bitcoin [04:26]
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kakobrekla ;;ticer [04:26]
gribble Error: "ticer" is not a valid command. [04:26]
kakobrekla ;;ticker [04:26]
gribble BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 41.21110, Best ask: 41.40000, Bid-ask spread: 0.18890, Last trade: 41.40000, 24 hour volume: 86823.51454120, 24 hour low: 41.20000, 24 hour high: 48.46900, 24 hour vwap: 45.94411 [04:26]
smickles possibly free beer [04:26]
dub gox is trying to trade as always [04:26]
Bowjob actually, I could sell a few coins and buy back cheaper [04:27]
Bowjob mhm [04:27]
dub the little trading engine that could [04:27]
dub ('nt) [04:27]
mircea_popescu sorry grubles link for what ? [04:27]
Chaang-Noi odd 12 ours oga this chan was dead as dead, wake up to panic, ahhh btc :) [04:28]
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mircea_popescu ;;ticker [04:29]
gribble BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 40.60269, Best ask: 41.20000, Bid-ask spread: 0.59731, Last trade: 41.20000, 24 hour volume: 91789.11504056, 24 hour low: 40.01110, 24 hour high: 48.46900, 24 hour vwap: 45.66073 [04:29]
mircea_popescu holy. [04:29]
Bowjob lol [04:29]
Bowjob Brb, panicking now [04:29]
kakobrekla ;;ticker [04:30]
gribble BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 40.37260, Best ask: 40.50000, Bid-ask spread: 0.12740, Last trade: 40.50000, 24 hour volume: 91802.34794623, 24 hour low: 40.01110, 24 hour high: 48.46900, 24 hour vwap: 45.65939 [04:30]
Chaang-Noi gox cant fall to far..people cant send gox coins to sell :) [04:30]
wiggzz so what're the running odds that puts on mpex actually pay out if btc crashes very low? [04:30]
mircea_popescu that's a point. [04:30]
mircea_popescu wiggzz 100%. [04:30]
wiggzz are they hedged? [04:31]
pizzaman1337 Chaang-Noi: but when they open it up, there could be a selloff [04:31]
mircea_popescu yes, the only way to write them is by depositing capital [04:31]
Chaang-Noi after 6 trasactions could be a sell off yes... but people seeing it is fixed will be like, cheap coinz!!!!!!! [04:31]
mircea_popescu pizzaman1337 very likely actually. [04:31]
Chaang-Noi im pretty sure i know how this drama will play out [04:31]
wiggzz but, on a put required capital is not as great as they can fall [04:31]
Chaang-Noi fiat in the gox will beat the 6 confirm sell off [04:32]
gesell something that really disturbs me right now is the number of way overpriced buy bids still sitting on (a p2p exchange with pretty high volume) [04:32]
assbot [MPEX] [O.BTCUSD.C490N] 10 @ 0.1721919 = 1.7219 BTC [04:32]
Chaang-Noi even if we go to $25 we will bounce right back up if this shit gets sorted quickly [04:32]
Chaang-Noi btw eta on this being fixed? [04:32]
gesell mtgox price is at 31eu but you could still sell on for 36 [04:32]
Bowjob should be a few hours [04:32]
pizzaman1337 Chaang-Noi: as soon as the 0.7 chain is longer, I think. Not sure how far behind it is. [04:32]
the-bucket-shop gesell what time is it in de 4 am? [04:33]
gesell yeah 3:30 [04:33]
kakobrekla ;;goxlag [04:33]
gribble 299.836034 seconds [04:33]
Chaang-Noi yeah id like to know the leanth of the chains [04:33]
mircea_popescu wiggzz puts are bounded by fiat value [04:33]
kakobrekla ;;ticker [04:33]
mircea_popescu you can't make more than 50 bucks on a 50 struck put [04:33]
gribble BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 40.01000, Best ask: 40.50000, Bid-ask spread: 0.49000, Last trade: 40.01000, 24 hour volume: 92084.38009144, 24 hour low: 40.01000, 24 hour high: 48.46900, 24 hour vwap: 45.64045 [04:33]
kakobrekla we are at 35 or 45 imho [04:33]
mircea_popescu kakobrekla likely 35-37 ya [04:33]
gesell im a bit worried selling on though because if the buyer doesnt care to loose a bit of reputation they could just backout [04:33]
mircea_popescu Chaang-Noi i would guess it will be solved within a couple of hourd. [04:34]
gesell 35, really? what, end of the month or just tomorrow or something? [04:34]
Chaang-Noi okay, ill go pay insurance for my truck.. and ship off some wild honey... i need to get afk anyway:) [04:34]
gesell the thing with the bitcoin market is the reaction extends over a long period. so what you see happening now will continue in a similar manner with the EU wakes up [04:34]
kakobrekla hey, EU is awake [04:35]
gesell nope [04:35]
kakobrekla well we are up [04:35]
kakobrekla me mircea_popescu and jurov [04:35]
kakobrekla is there some one else relevant? [04:35]
wiggzz right, but in BTC the required collateral was only strike / spot [04:35]
gesell ive watched it happen. a lul for a few hours then around 10am de time (8 9 whatever UK) a lot of activity [04:35]
Bowjob ;;eightball Is this the end for bitcoin? [04:35]
gribble No chance. [04:35]
mod6 :] [04:35]
Bowjob The eightball has spoken! [04:36]
pizzaman1337 kakobrekla: I'm not really relevant, but most of the time I'm over there [04:36]
Bowjob Everyone quit panicking, its just a few blocks. Tomorrow, we shall see $50 [04:36]
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mod6 i <3 gribble [04:36]
Chaang-Noi davout> Chaang-Noi: approx 12 blocks difference [04:36]
kakobrekla pizzaman1337 i was just messing with gesell [04:36]
pizzaman1337 :) [04:36]
gesell Bowjob: im not paniking. just aknowledging that the market is filled with a significant number of people investing more short term that will panik [04:36]
dub ;;ticker [04:37]
gribble BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 39.00000, Best ask: 40.00000, Bid-ask spread: 1.00000, Last trade: 40.00000, 24 hour volume: 99762.92721491, 24 hour low: 38.01051, 24 hour high: 48.46900, 24 hour vwap: 45.12452 [04:37]
pizzaman1337 ;;ticker --last [04:37]
gribble 40.00000 [04:37]
kakobrekla a round number! [04:37]
pizzaman1337 quick, take a screenshot! [04:37]
kakobrekla quick play SD [04:37]
dub shit is broken? [04:37]
kakobrekla prolly [04:37]
smickles wiggzz: the additions funds needed would probably come from mpbor [04:37]
kakobrekla ;;goxlag [04:37]
gribble 355.023263 seconds [04:37]
wiggzz say you write a put at 21, with USDBTC at 40, required collateral is 0.525 BTC? [04:37]
kakobrekla so does lag go only up? [04:38]
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wiggzz but if USDBTC drops to 1, payout is 20 USD which would be 20 BTC... way more than required collateral? [04:38]
kakobrekla imma go long on lag [04:38]
smickles wiggzz: the mpbor assumes the risk of mpex options [04:38]
kakobrekla who can help me out? [04:38]
assbot [MPEX] [O.BTCUSD.P430T] 1000 @ 0.14725493 = 147.2549 BTC [+] [04:38]
smickles kakobrekla: help with what? [04:38]
pigeons i'll take the over on lag [04:39]
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mircea_popescu heh there we go [04:39]
kakobrekla smickles to go long on lag [04:39]
pizzaman1337 we need an MPSIC for goxlag [04:39]
mircea_popescu !ticker m ^oix [04:39]
assbot [MPEX] [O.BTCUSD.P450T] 1000 @ 0.17572879 = 175.7288 BTC [+] [04:39]
assbot [MPEX:^OIX] 1D: 0 / 0 / 0 (0 shares, 0 BTC), 7D: 40.86787592 / 51.57005239 / 53.25215905 (no shares, 9,546.76 BTC), 30D: 0 / 0 / 0 (0 shares, 0 BTC) [04:39]
kakobrekla ;;ticker [04:39]
gribble BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 37.90000, Best ask: 38.00000, Bid-ask spread: 0.10000, Last trade: 38.00000, 24 hour volume: 101521.68067860, 24 hour low: 37.90000, 24 hour high: 48.46900, 24 hour vwap: 45.00561 [04:39]
smickles woo [04:40]
kakobrekla deep. [04:40]
mircea_popescu wiggzz that issue is taken care of by a little insurance premium on oputs issuance [04:40]
smickles ;;bids 31 [04:40]
mircea_popescu and in exchange i settle puts in fiat in case of utter collapse [04:40]
gribble There are currently 33593.186 bitcoins demanded at or over 31.0 USD, worth 1149514.37586 USD in total. | Data vintage: 0.0061 seconds [04:40]
assbot [MPEX] [O.BTCUSD.P430T] 1000 @ 0.15522008 = 155.2201 BTC [+] [04:40]
assbot [MPEX] [O.BTCUSD.P450T] 1000 @ 0.18486613 = 184.8661 BTC [+] [04:40]
wiggzz ok, good to know [04:41]
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assbot [MPEX] [O.BTCUSD.P390T] 1000 @ 0.1040628 = 104.0628 BTC [+] [04:41]
assbot [MPEX] [O.BTCUSD.P410T] 1000 @ 0.12826263 = 128.2626 BTC [+] [04:41]
mircea_popescu heh. [04:41]
mircea_popescu !ticker m ^oix [04:41]
assbot [MPEX:^OIX] 1D: 0 / 0 / 0 (0 shares, 0 BTC), 7D: 40.86787592 / 51.57005239 / 53.25215905 (no shares, 9,546.76 BTC), 30D: 0 / 0 / 0 (0 shares, 0 BTC) [04:41]
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mircea_popescu no srsly ? [04:42]
Chaang-Noi i should have shorted btc :) [04:42]
smickles mircea_popescu: is that unchanged on the 7day? [04:42]
Bowjob ;;ticker [04:42]
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kakobrekla ;;goxlag [04:43]
gribble 365.309178 seconds [04:43]
gribble BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 37.80000, Best ask: 38.00000, Bid-ask spread: 0.20000, Last trade: 38.00000, 24 hour volume: 101597.26956421, 24 hour low: 37.80000, 24 hour high: 48.46900, 24 hour vwap: 45.00044 [04:43]
mircea_popescu smickles yeh. i wonder wtf. [04:43]
smickles $vwap ^oix [04:43]
mpexbot smickles: {u'7d': {u'cnt': u'', u'min': u'4086787592', u'max': u'5325215905', u'vsa': u'954675808260', u'vsh': u'no', u'avg': u'5157005239'}, u'30d': {u'cnt': u'', u'min': u'', u'max': u'', u'vsa': u'', u'vsh': u'', u'avg': u''}, u'1d': {u'cnt': u'', u'min': u'', u'max': u'', u'vsa': u'', u'vsh': u'', u'avg': u''}} [04:43]
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smickles ;;bc,24hprc [04:43]
gribble 45.11 [04:43]
wiggzz down... [04:45]
mircea_popescu heh [04:46]
Bowjob $45.51 [04:47]
Bowjob according to coinlab [04:47]
Bowjob lol [04:47]
dub ;;goxlag [04:47]
gribble 564.66904 seconds [04:47]
Bowjob damn [04:47]
kakobrekla 37 on bitstamp [04:47]
Bowjob 89 min ago [04:47]
dub nicely scaling there gox [04:47]
dub linear even [04:48]
gesell ;;goxlag [04:48]
gribble 584.930613 seconds [04:48]
kakobrekla so gox is turning in historcial btc chart reading site [04:48]
mircea_popescu lol [04:48]
Bowjob how much will BTC drop by do you think [04:48]
Chaang-Noi block races website [04:48]
kakobrekla this is a serious problem [04:48]
gesell to $25 [04:48]
kakobrekla even if you guys find it funny [04:49]
kakobrekla serious tranders dont suffer shit like this [04:49]
kakobrekla traders [04:49]
kakobrekla you want to bring wall street to btc? [04:49]
pigeons [04:49]
kakobrekla kill gox [04:49]
assbot [MPEX] [O.BTCUSD.C410T] 7 @ 0.12612881 = 0.8829 BTC [-] [04:50]
gesell kakobrekla: first, im sorry this is all happening. im sure it is ruining some peoples day. but why do you see it as a mtgox problem? [04:50]
Chaang-Noi pigeons see my link, i found that helpful [04:50]
smickles gesell: traditional markes shut down at times like these [04:50]
kakobrekla lol [04:50]
kakobrekla tell me something [04:50]
kakobrekla when you go to a foregin country [04:51]
kakobrekla and you need some of their currecny [04:51]
kakobrekla do you go to your FX broker to get it? [04:51]
pizzaman1337 I wish [04:51]
kakobrekla or to buy phycal gold? [04:51]
mircea_popescu kakobrekla you're telling me ? [04:51]
kakobrekla im telling gesell [04:51]
mircea_popescu yeah. [04:51]
mircea_popescu fuycking painful shit. [04:51]
dub whats a time like this for traditional markets? [04:51]
kakobrekla or if you trade stocks [04:51]
kakobrekla do you have a broker [04:51]
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mircea_popescu pigeons are we merged ? [04:52]
kakobrekla or do you go on the trading floor yourself [04:52]
kakobrekla and yell there [04:52]
smickles dub: movements over x% [04:52]
mircea_popescu halelujah [04:52]
assbot [MPEX] [O.BTCUSD.C450T] 1 @ 0.17769942 BTC [-] [04:52]
gesell kakobrekla: sorry, im not following [04:52]
assbot [MPEX] [O.BTCUSD.C450T] 9 @ 0.12120114 = 1.0908 BTC [-] [04:52]
kakobrekla : [04:52]
mircea_popescu 11 blocks [04:52]
pizzaman1337 ;;ticker --last [04:52]
gribble 36.80000 [04:52]
assbot [MPEX] [O.BTCUSD.P390T] 1000 @ 0.10590572 = 105.9057 BTC [+] [04:52]
assbot [MPEX] [O.BTCUSD.P430T] 1000 @ 0.15775711 = 157.7571 BTC [+] [04:53]
assbot [MPEX] [O.BTCUSD.P410T] 1000 @ 0.13044382 = 130.4438 BTC [+] [04:53]
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Bowjob ;;ticker [04:53]
gribble BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 36.68160, Best ask: 38.00000, Bid-ask spread: 1.31840, Last trade: 38.00000, 24 hour volume: 105824.64907266, 24 hour low: 36.65000, 24 hour high: 48.46900, 24 hour vwap: 44.68534 [04:53]
Bowjob Are we allowed to do transactions [04:53]
Bowjob ? [04:53]
smickles yea [04:54]
smickles it might be risky on the chain tho [04:54]
gesell i dont know, im not a fan of kill switches so i'd like to see bitcoin-dev's learn from this so that similar bugs in the future can be handled without shutting anything down [04:54]
gesell ;;goxlag [04:55]
gribble 444.693169 seconds [04:55]
Bowjob I can sell coins now at 38.50 now [04:55]
Bowjob before this shit blows out of proportions [04:55]
smickles goxlag is dropping? [04:55]
smickles it was over 600 a moment ago [04:55]
gesell ;;goxlag-but-make-it-intersting-please [04:55]
gribble Error: "goxlag-but-make-it-intersting-please" is not a valid command. [04:55]
gesell ;;goxlag [04:56]
gribble 369.036619 seconds [04:56]
smickles gesell: i think most btc exchanges are anti-killswitch [04:56]
smickles ;;bc,24hprc [04:57]
gribble 44.92 [04:57]
gesell ;;goxlag [04:58]
smickles ;;calc 45/1.18 [04:58]
gribble 38.1355932203 [04:58]
gribble 338.887145 seconds [04:58]
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assbot [MPEX] [O.BTCUSD.P370T] 1000 @ 0.08420338 = 84.2034 BTC [+] [04:59]
kakobrekla ;;ticker [04:59]
gribble BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 39.01138, Best ask: 40.00000, Bid-ask spread: 0.98862, Last trade: 40.00000, 24 hour volume: 107876.01377001, 24 hour low: 36.65000, 24 hour high: 48.46900, 24 hour vwap: 44.55733 [04:59]
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kakobrekla this somehow reminds me of [04:59]
dub lol [05:00]
gesell question... so just curious would the initial errors that 0.7 clients were reporting ( that sipa mentions, would those just be bug reports to bitcointalk or to sourceforge bug tracker or? just curious where alerts of such issues before its plastered everywhere would come from [05:01]
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gesell did anyone see where this first started and was coming to the surface? [05:01]
the-bucket-shop is still scrolling satoshidice bets. I wonder which blockchain [05:02]
dub they only disabled payouts [05:03]
dub (obv) [05:03]
kakobrekla ;;goxlag [05:03]
gribble 483.195032 seconds [05:03]
gesell i wonder if apart from the discussion about soft limits, we will also start to see features that give more oversight and regulation, even if more symbolic than bernanke like. such letting bitcoin-dev patch or blacklist more quickly or perhaps at will [05:04]
assbot [MPEX] [O.BTCUSD.P750T] 23 @ 0.86122741 = 19.8082 BTC [+] [05:04]
Bowjob Aight, I guaratneed 75 BTC to be sold at.. $2799 [05:05]
Bowjob for the next 3 hours [05:05]
Bowjob lets see what happenes [05:05]
dub gesell: the attitude of the dev team has always been that bitcoin is their little science experiment and its not intended for production [05:05]
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Uglux I'm back to save the day [05:06]
Uglux lol [05:06]
kakobrekla no no [05:06]
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* kakobrekla is now known as digiJesusSatoshi [05:06]
digiJesusSatoshi must be liek dat. [05:07]
gesell dub: i dont think my statement disagress with that at all. just looking at new horizons for the experiment [05:07]
digiJesusSatoshi Luke-Jr YOU MUST BEHAVE U HEAR ME [05:07]
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* digiJesusSatoshi is now known as kakobrekla [05:07]
dub you're going to have a hard time selling these guys oversight [05:07]
gesell dub: i agree. if it comes though it would be slowly and with a different label [05:08]
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pigeons gesell: [05:09]
gesell saw it [05:09]
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Bowjob ;;ticker [05:10]
gribble BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 42.60000, Best ask: 42.65559, Bid-ask spread: 0.05559, Last trade: 42.60000, 24 hour volume: 109984.04612509, 24 hour low: 36.65000, 24 hour high: 48.46900, 24 hour vwap: 44.45198 [05:10]
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Bowjob hey did we recover [05:10]
gesell this event is fascinating actually [05:10]
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kakobrekla nature is amazing. ~ ron swanson [05:10]
vampireb not recovered, there still a fork. [05:10]
vampireb ;;ticker [05:12]
gribble BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 42.60000, Best ask: 42.72770, Bid-ask spread: 0.12770, Last trade: 42.60000, 24 hour volume: 109893.67866310, 24 hour low: 36.65000, 24 hour high: 48.46900, 24 hour vwap: 44.44885 [05:12]
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dub ;;goxlag [05:13]
gribble 482.005774 seconds [05:13]
ThickAsThieves ;;bc,stats [05:13]
gribble Current Blocks: 225452 | Current Difficulty: 4367876.000842196 | Next Difficulty At Block: 225791 | Next Difficulty In: 339 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 1 day, 21 hours, 12 minutes, and 0 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: None | Estimated Percent Change: None [05:13]
dub ;;bc,price [05:14]
gribble Next Price Estimate: 46.86 | Next Price In About 3 days, 1 hour, 50 minutes, and 34 seconds [05:14]
ThickAsThieves lies [05:14]
Bowjob ;;eightball How's LTC [05:15]
gribble One would be wise to think so. [05:15]
Bowjob erm, i shoulda asked a yes or no q [05:16]
Bowjob lol [05:16]
gesell blacklistblock = regulation. though peer agreed. which is fascinating because we do not have such language in traditional finance [05:16]
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gesell or we do but a bit more abstracted and not so clear as it is here [05:16]
kakobrekla [05:17]
kakobrekla looks like flipper. [05:17]
gesell that is a huge spread [05:17]
kakobrekla pres B for left side and S for right side [05:17]
kakobrekla play! [05:17]
Line_ In gaven we trust [05:17]
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Bowjob Maybe Satoshi is looking from afar [05:18]
Bowjob ;;ticker [05:19]
gribble BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 44.00000, Best ask: 44.03000, Bid-ask spread: 0.03000, Last trade: 44.00000, 24 hour volume: 111563.57296537, 24 hour low: 36.65000, 24 hour high: 48.46900, 24 hour vwap: 44.44028 [05:19]
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gesell just for the record the drop started at 2:41am GMT+1 (had some logs) [05:21]
davos Bowjob: I'd rather put money on satoshi being 2 or 3 people over in -dev [05:21]
ThickAsThieves ;;eightball Buy! Buy! Buy? [05:22]
gribble _I_ don't know. [05:22]
Bowjob ;;eightball Is Satoshi Nakamoto 1 person? [05:22]
gribble What are you asking me for? [05:22]
Bowjob >_> [05:22]
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ThickAsThieves ;;eightball Sell all BTC for LTC? [05:23]
gribble The outlook is good. [05:23]
gesell "(04:04:59) gmaxwell: jeffgarzik is /msging me telling me that jgarzik is an imposter." --- heh, and people still have the heart to troll. oh internets [05:23]
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mircea_popescu !ticker m ^oix [05:24]
assbot [MPEX:^OIX] 1D: 0 / 0 / 0 (0 shares, 0 BTC), 7D: 0.00000039 / 0.00000053 / 0.00000053 (50897 shares, 0.00 BTC), 30D: 0 / 0 / 0 (0 shares, 0 BTC) [05:24]
* FabianB has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) [05:24]
smickles mircea_popescu: what's up with that? [05:25]
ThickAsThieves oix killed bitcoin [05:25]
mircea_popescu smickles i just dug up oix to see wtf. [05:25]
gesell ;;ticker --last [05:26]
gribble 45.00000 [05:26]
gesell ;;goxlag [05:26]
gribble 559.099063 seconds [05:26]
mircea_popescu but basically nothing is wrong with it [05:26]
mircea_popescu just... the weight of the calls sold is so much heavier than the weight of the puts bought just now [05:26]
mircea_popescu that the oix still points to high btc [05:26]
mircea_popescu so it is working as intended, be that useful or not [05:26]
Bowjob so its still bullish btc? [05:27]
ThickAsThieves devs dont seem to be using public chat now [05:27]
ThickAsThieves btc always bullish (in betweeen crashes) [05:27]
smickles mircea_popescu: isn't it off by about 8 digits? [05:27]
mircea_popescu !ticker m ^oix [05:28]
assbot [MPEX:^OIX] 1D: 0 / 0 / 0 (0 shares, 0 BTC), 7D: 39.89104856 / 0.00000053 / 53.27237035 (50897 shares, 0.00 BTC), 30D: 0 / 0 / 0 (0 shares, 0 BTC) [05:28]
Bowjob okay everything fixed [05:28]
mircea_popescu heh yeah 1 sec [05:28]
mircea_popescu bad cache [05:28]
smickles [05:29]
mircea_popescu !ticker m ^oix [05:29]
assbot [MPEX:^OIX] 1D: 0 / 0 / 0 (0 shares, 0 BTC), 7D: 39.89104856 / 53.82025731 / 53.27237035 (50897 shares, 0.00 BTC), 30D: 0 / 0 / 0 (0 shares, 0 BTC) [05:29]
smickles yay:D [05:29]
mircea_popescu wait volume went away nao lo; [05:30]
smickles $markov [05:30]
* BTCTrader2 ( has joined #bitcoin-assets [05:30]
mpexbot mircea_popescu: your blog fails to load [05:30]
smickles lol [05:31]
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mircea_popescu lol [05:32]
BitHub how many hours till next asicminer divy? [05:35]
BitHub 48? [05:35]
gesell ;;goxlag [05:36]
gribble 166.108439 seconds [05:36]
pizzaman1337 ;;ticker --last [05:37]
gribble 44.90000 [05:37]
topace_ jesus whats going on with the blockchain?? [05:39]
pizzaman1337 [05:39]
smickles know waht? pps pool are boned [05:39]
kakobrekla bitcoin split, price crashed all while you were takign a piss [05:40]
kakobrekla all well now. [05:40]
BitHub safe to recieve payments again? [05:40]
smickles nope [05:40]
smickles you ought to wait until the .7 (short) chain grows longer than the main chain [05:41]
smickles and some miners are still adding to the main chain [05:41]
* Chilca ( has joined #bitcoin-assets [05:41]
ThickAsThieves Schrödinger's BitBet - This bet will have more total BTC bet on Yes than on No before it closes. [05:41]
smickles and there is still confusion among the devs [05:41]
ThickAsThieves good? [05:41]
pizzaman1337 ThickAsThieves: awesome [05:42]
ThickAsThieves i had a few ideas for meta bets [05:42]
ThickAsThieves had to submit one [05:42]
BitHub hmmm [05:43]
kakobrekla dunno if those are approved [05:43]
BitHub so if someone sends me coins now they're gone for good? [05:43]
* pgp2 has quit () [05:44]
ThickAsThieves the bet has a fault, or a bonus depending on how you look at it [05:44]
kakobrekla imho they will be respendable with the longer chain not containing that tx [05:44]
ThickAsThieves people will bet til it closes ... and after [05:44]
the-bucket-shop ThickAsThievs - you just blew my mind [05:45]
kakobrekla which mean a few bitbets will have to be invalidated [05:45]
kakobrekla or something [05:45]
kakobrekla dunno [05:45]
kakobrekla >The risk is small because this is not a network split-- transactions are being sent to both sides of the chain split, and it is unlikely (but possible) that somebody could get two versions of the same transaction into the two sides of the chain. [05:46]
kakobrekla ah [05:46]
kakobrekla apparently not a real problem [05:46]
smickles < BitHub> so if someone sends me coins now they're gone for good? << no, it's up to which chain it's included in [05:46]
* TradeFortress (~TradeFort@ has joined #bitcoin-assets [05:47]
BitHub mmk [05:47]
smickles basically, it's just risky [05:47]
kakobrekla totoally oposite of bitcoin in general. [05:47]
smickles yup [05:48]
kakobrekla fuckin keboard fails [05:48]
mircea_popescu and it is unlikely (but possible) <><< yeah. they know. [05:48]
mircea_popescu because it's just a prototype, right ? [05:48]
mircea_popescu what is the barrier to entry to this, make two txs,b roadcast it to two diff nodes. [05:49]
kakobrekla the version is below 1 right? [05:49]
kakobrekla so don fuck around. [05:49]
gesell ;;goxlag [05:50]
gribble 17.295316 seconds [05:50]
Bowjob ;;ticker [05:50]
gribble BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 45.01000, Best ask: 45.89900, Bid-ask spread: 0.88900, Last trade: 45.00000, 24 hour volume: 119265.24377758, 24 hour low: 36.65000, 24 hour high: 48.46900, 24 hour vwap: 44.50395 [05:50]
topace_ how can you tell if your bitcoin daemon is on the right chain? [05:50]
topace_ (on the 0.7 chain) [05:50]
smickles topace_: as a regualr user, i dunno. but it'll switch over automatically when the .7 chain is longer [05:51]
kakobrekla by the block height [05:51]
kakobrekla ? [05:51]
mircea_popescu topace_ you can't [05:51]
mircea_popescu bsically. [05:51]
mircea_popescu cause it's not a matter of your daemon [05:51]
mircea_popescu you just emit txs. the miners add them on their mempools [05:52]
mircea_popescu you have no idea what they run [05:52]
smickles right now, you can 'bitcoind getinfo' and look at the height. current 'wrong' chain is at 225453, .7 is at 225442 [05:53]
kakobrekla what i said. [05:53]
smickles kakobrekla: but the differenc will be more and more difficult to tell soon [05:54]
kakobrekla yep [05:54]
mircea_popescu good luck getting the miners to accept a 14 block loss [05:54]
mircea_popescu that's like 350 btc [05:54]
kakobrekla pool are gonna hurt [05:54]
smickles mircea_popescu: some arn't, the largest pools are [05:54]
* robocoin has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) [05:55]
smickles only pps pools are fucked [05:55]
mircea_popescu smickles explain why the "wrong" one is longer then. [05:55]
kakobrekla good day for not to be a pool op [05:55]
mircea_popescu kakobrekla it prolly destroyes those unfortunate fucks that paid out on the 0 diff [05:55]
smickles mircea_popescu: it mined a block sized larger than 250k [05:55]
smickles funny, no? [05:55]
mircea_popescu no i meant blocvk height [05:55]
mircea_popescu the wrong chain is lionger yet you're telling me the miners are moving. [05:56]
mircea_popescu proof ? [05:56]
smickles the wrong one mined a block which .7 clients couldn't see [05:56]
mircea_popescu yeah... [05:56]
dub good day for not being the guild pool op [05:56]
smickles mircea_popescu: look at, the major pools are mining an orphaned chain [05:56]
dub double whammy there [05:57]
mircea_popescu EXACTLY [05:57]
mircea_popescu and my point is, they will continue to do so. [05:57]
mircea_popescu because they have no incentive not to. [05:57]
mircea_popescu and if they move back in they're 400 btc out. [05:57]
smickles you've got it backwards tho [05:57]
mircea_popescu have i ? [05:57]
kakobrekla well bitbet seems to be on the right one [05:57]
smickles the orphaned chain is the 'right' one [05:57]
smickles it's just not long enough yet [05:57]
mircea_popescu ah [05:57]
mircea_popescu this makes sense. [05:57]
mircea_popescu let me guess... so the longer chain is the wrong one. because that's why it's longer [05:58]
mircea_popescu cause nobody mines on it. [05:58]
mircea_popescu wtf ?! [05:58]
smickles yeah, gotta love all those peeps encouraging the pool ops to mine blocks larger than 250k b/c of SD [05:58]
gesell the crash and recovery in ascii glory [05:58]
smickles they mined on the 'wrong' one for some time b/f peeps realized there was a problem [05:58]
smickles now the 'right' one is trying to catch up [05:59]
Bowjob i thoguht its solved already [05:59]
mircea_popescu i love the various people on bitcointalk trying to move the conversation [05:59]
mircea_popescu anywhere but away from the point that devs fucked up [05:59]
smickles Bowjob: they have a band=aid fix, revert to the old chain [05:59]
mircea_popescu anything and everything shall be discussed, but god forbid someone gets bitchslapped [05:59]
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Bowjob and i hope everyone is actually mining on the 0.72 chain [06:00]
mircea_popescu Bowjob we see their rate of gain [06:00]
mircea_popescu if in an hour the "werong" one is +2... [06:00]
smickles Bowjob: some are, some arnt [06:00]
ThickAsThieves ;;bc,stats [06:00]
gribble Current Blocks: 225453 | Current Difficulty: 4367876.000842196 | Next Difficulty At Block: 225791 | Next Difficulty In: 338 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 1 day, 21 hours, 4 minutes, and 0 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: None | Estimated Percent Change: None [06:00]
smickles 225453 is the 'wrong' chain [06:00]
smickles 225443 is the .7 chain [06:01]
kakobrekla from now on ill be runing 0.1 legacy [06:01]
smickles if i had enough coins to justify it, i might run one of each [06:01]
smickles it's only 8 right now [06:02]
smickles ya know, there's a chance this band-aid fix won't work, the .8 chain looks like it might be going faster than the .7 [06:03]
error4733 BFL_Josh : 11 March 2013 Update : Say what you want about BFL, but we make ASICs look good. [06:03]
error4733 best joke ever [06:04]
Bowjob They make Avalon look good [06:04]
Bowjob heck, Avalons come with gloves [06:04]
mircea_popescu smickles aha [06:05]
assbot [MPEX] [O.BTCUSD.P730T] 15 @ 0.81355 = 12.2033 BTC [-] [06:06]
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Bowjob mhm.. [06:07]
Bowjob watching this is entertaining as fuck [06:07]
PeterL The 'right' chain is definately catching up to the 'wrong' one [06:07]
PeterL I think in the past hour the 'right' chain has gone up 5 blocks, the 'wrong' one has gone up 2 [06:08]
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mircea_popescu PeterL they're even now or am i on delayed data ? [06:08]
smickles ah, i think i screwed up my look at it then [06:09]
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smickles they're still 9 blocks from forcing the switch [06:09]
smickles 8 blocks to be even [06:10]
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PeterL how will this outage affect satoshiDice share price? [06:11]
Bowjob bt we're winnign at least [06:11]
mircea_popescu is the wrong one taller than 445 ? [06:11]
mircea_popescu !ticker m s.dice [06:11]
smickles 453 [06:11]
assbot [MPEX:S.DICE] 1D: 0.00530001 / 0.00551785 / 0.00569996 (11580 shares, 63.90 BTC), 7D: 0.00300001 / 0.0051045 / 0.006 (200407 shares, 1,022.98 BTC), 30D: 0.00300001 / 0.00614247 / 0.0069 (2518785 shares, 15,471.58 BTC) [06:11]
* Chilca has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) [06:11]
mircea_popescu PeterL so far doesn't seem to have affected it [06:12]
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* Guest00001 is now known as error4733 [06:12]
smickles PeterL: it was the anti-SD'ers who forced this issue [06:12]
mircea_popescu smickles the 250k arbitrary limit had to go anyway [06:12]
mircea_popescu it had no point being there in the first place [06:12]
smickles yeah, but not now. it could've undergone more testing [06:13]
mircea_popescu not putting bullshit in the codebase takes no testing [06:13]
mircea_popescu it just takes some firm adherence to coding principle. [06:13]
smickles so you think there should be no limit? [06:13]
mircea_popescu the 1mb limit is THE limit. [06:13]
kakobrekla why a souch arbitrary number [06:14]
mircea_popescu they need to go through the whole code and take out all the bs of the sort. [06:14]
kakobrekla its no better than 250k [06:14]
kakobrekla really [06:14]
mircea_popescu yeah, but [06:14]
mircea_popescu the 1mb is baked in now [06:14]
Bowjob If we hit 1mb limit [06:14]
Bowjob then what [06:14]
Bowjob lol [06:14]
mircea_popescu the (undocumented) limit to client tx size for instance, is not. [06:15]
smickles txfees rise [06:15]
Bowjob Satoshi envisioned 100 GB per day [06:15]
gesell jesus multiplied 7 fishes [06:17]
Bowjob he had fishes under the table [06:17]
smickles btcguild gunning for 5 in a row now [06:17]
* BTCTrader2 has quit (Quit: BTCTrader2) [06:18]
mod6 << my gf sends her regards [06:18]
mod6 : [06:20]
smickles ya know, it's quite possible that there is only one electron in the whole universe [06:21]
jborkl_ better not tell the protons [06:21]
smickles the protons can't tell one electron from the other anyway [06:23]
smickles they all look alike [06:23]
mod6 depends on the scale. at the plank scale everything is a different [06:23]
mod6 s/a// [06:24]
mod6 so there is a 1mb limit now? [06:24]
dub no theres a 250k limit [06:24]
* Thinker has quit (Quit: Client exiting) [06:25]
smickles mod6: i thought all electrons were indistinguishable as far as our best tech can tell [06:26]
* thepok has quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) [06:26]
smickles and the wiki says that electrons can't be distinguished even in principle [06:27]
mod6 uhhh, i dunno [06:27]
mod6 if its on the internet it must be true [06:27]
smickles it's stuff i recall from studying science tho [06:27]
gesell ;;goxlag [06:28]
gribble 0.802029 seconds [06:28]
dub PeterL: it was the anti-SD'ers who forced this issue [06:28]
dub wat [06:28]
mod6 im not trying to troll, i don't know srsly. [06:28]
ThickAsThieves ;;ticker [06:28]
gribble BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 44.64974, Best ask: 44.87125, Bid-ask spread: 0.22151, Last trade: 44.88000, 24 hour volume: 126419.84432523, 24 hour low: 36.65000, 24 hour high: 48.46900, 24 hour vwap: 44.49347 [06:28]
smickles dub: this would not have happened now if people were not encouraging pool ops to raise the soft limit on block size because of 'satoshiDice spam' [06:29]
dub uh they had to raise it [06:29]
mircea_popescu no [06:29]
mircea_popescu it would have happened later [06:29]
dub because of the dice spam [06:29]
mircea_popescu when it'd have been worse. [06:29]
smickles or after it got caught in testing [06:30]
smickles and had no issue at all [06:30]
smickles who knows [06:30]
mircea_popescu yeah. right. [06:30]
dub the soft limit was hit [06:30]
mircea_popescu because bitcoin is tested. [06:30]
mircea_popescu mod6 there always was a 1mb limit [06:31]
smickles mircea_popescu: they do do a little on the testnet, it's just that the queue of stuff to test is long, and noone want's to help out [06:31]
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smickles dub: the soft limit was raised [06:31]
mircea_popescu ;;tslb [06:31]
gribble Time since last block: 1 hour, 3 minutes, and 12 seconds [06:31]
smickles that's the offending block [06:31]
jurov uff, coinbr back online [06:32]
dub smickles: yes it was raised to accomodate dice [06:32]
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mircea_popescu france [06:32]
mircea_popescu should have known [06:32]
smickles mircea_popescu: 23 minutes on the .7 chain [06:32]
smickles dub: we weren't hitting the softcap that offten [06:32]
mircea_popescu smickles maybe they'll merge then [06:33]
dub smickles: yes we were, there was 4000 unconfirmed txn when the call went out to up the limit [06:33]
dub smickles: it became a problem when dice increased their fee [06:33]
dub pushing everyone else out of the way [06:33]
mircea_popescu right [06:33]
smickles hmm, i recall there being thousands of unconfirmed txns for months and months [06:33]
dub smickles: yeah dice txns [06:34]
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mircea_popescu size 980kb nice block lol [06:34]
dub which everyone was used to living with, when it suddenly turned into mom and pop's txns taking days to confirm somethign had tobe done [06:34]
mircea_popescu dub mom and pop need to stfu and pay for tx [06:35]
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dub yes but they didn't know that [06:35]
mircea_popescu right. [06:35]
dub had no forewarning [06:35]
mircea_popescu its on the interwebs so its free etc. [06:35]
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mircea_popescu not like iot says right there, "put a little tx fee, it helps the network" etc [06:35]
dub so sayign teh anti-dice crew are responsible is wrong [06:35]
smickles dub: i can see that we disagree, but i don't think the limit should be raised until the necessary txfee is unreasonably high [06:36]
mircea_popescu the idiots are responsible. [06:36]
mircea_popescu !ticker m ^oix [06:36]
assbot [MPEX:^OIX] 1D: 0 / 0 / 0 (0 shares, 0 BTC), 7D: 39.76255342 / 44.74483325 / 53.27237035 (65320 shares, 22,376.48 BTC), 30D: 0 / 0 / 0 (0 shares, 0 BTC) [06:36]
mircea_popescu heh 44 [06:36]
smickles dub: and i don't think i said they were responsible, i said they forced the issue [06:36]
dub anti-dice would be work to exclude their tsn not increas the limit [06:37]
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smickles some were saying that, some were saying raise the limit [06:37]
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benkay what's the mtgox lag command? [06:39]
dub ;;goxlag [06:39]
benkay ;;lag [06:39]
gribble 0.156882 seconds [06:39]
gribble Error: "lag" is not a valid command. [06:39]
benkay ;;goxlag [06:39]
gribble 1.148831 seconds [06:39]
benkay cool thanks. [06:39]
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benkay "antifragility" [06:43]
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benkay what was the delay between blockchain fork and broadcast? [06:46]
benkay i bet < 5 minutes [06:46]
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dub broadcast? [06:47]
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smickles $mpexlag [06:48]
* toffoo has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) [06:48]
mpexbot smickles: 0.0727469921112 seconds [06:48]
* toffoo_ is now known as toffoo [06:48]
smickles mircea_popescu: ^^ [06:48]
dub was there an alert sent to 0.8? I don't see it in .7 [06:49]
mircea_popescu haha [06:49]
mircea_popescu $mpexlag [06:49]
mpexbot mircea_popescu: 0.103024959564 seconds [06:49]
smickles benkay: it was less than 6 block according to one claim by someone in -dev [06:49]
mircea_popescu dude this will be so humiliating to mtgox [06:49]
mircea_popescu thing about it, you're getting it through 2 proxies [06:49]
benkay naw man [06:49]
benkay rubes don't care [06:49]
benkay they have a fancy website [06:49]
mircea_popescu heh. [06:50]
benkay oh wait, you said "humiliating" [06:50]
mircea_popescu and they're bringing the clap to wallstreet [06:50]
benkay yeah maybe. [06:50]
benkay i hope morgan and co drop the ball hard [06:50]
benkay be a shame to see the us consolidate under their iron grip [06:51]
topace_ bitcoind listtransactions bitches abotu safe mode, is there a way to tell it to just show me the transactions anyways? [06:51]
ThickAsThieves i cant see wall st investing in something that is controlled by devs in IRC [06:51]
benkay "wall st" != jp [06:51]
mircea_popescu $mpexlag [06:52]
mpexbot mircea_popescu: 0.104865074158 seconds [06:52]
pigeons topace_: bitcoind -disablesafemode [06:52]
mircea_popescu topace_ careful with that one [06:52]
BingoBongo ;;wallstreet [06:53]
gribble Error: "wallstreet" is not a valid command. [06:53]
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Ukto topace: at least you didnt freeze trading :D [06:53]
topace_ yea, no need to do that :p [06:53]
Ukto i found that funny >,> [06:53]
smickles who freezed trading? [06:54]
assbot [MPEX] [O.BTCUSD.P370T] 1000 @ 0.08731834 = 87.3183 BTC [+] [06:54]
Ukto i suppose its an okay response to kneejerk reaction [06:54]
Ukto btct [06:54]
assbot [MPEX] [O.BTCUSD.P390T] 1000 @ 0.10970785 = 109.7079 BTC [+] [06:54]
mircea_popescu hm [06:55]
smickles geez, we're still 9 blocks from a re-org [06:55]
Ukto having tie-ins with ozco's systems, and others, my system keeps a close eye on all transactions lol [06:55]
mircea_popescu ;;calc 39 / 1.109 [06:55]
gribble 35.1668169522 [06:55]
mircea_popescu 35 ? srsly ? [06:55]
Ukto pools offline [06:55]
Ukto and/or miners [06:55]
Ukto only those pools who were properly setup/unefected continue [06:55]
smickles mircea_popescu: we had a double top and a crisis. we're going to 2 [06:55]
Ukto like.. ozco :P [06:55]
Ukto who didnt set their block size to 1bazillion [06:56]
benkay mircea_popescu: what are you calculating there? [06:56]
smickles benkay: break even of a put [06:56]
topace_ 225445 still the top of the 0.7 ? my 0.8 client still shows 225453 [06:56]
benkay what's the 1.109? interest rate? [06:56]
benkay oh, cost? [06:56]
smickles topace_: yeah [06:56]
benkay shit this is embarrassing. [06:57]
mircea_popescu benkay what those puts imply pricewise [06:57]
smickles benkay: 1+cost [06:57]
topace_ smickles:so the 0.8 clients wont switch until the height is more? [06:57]
smickles topace_: yea [06:57]
smickles 1 more [06:57]
topace_ cool im going to bed then, lol [06:57]
smickles er, 1 more than the current [06:58]
benkay thanks you two [06:58]
smickles so , 9 more blocks to go [06:58]
mircea_popescu still at 8 ? [06:59]
smickles yeah, still 8 blocks different [07:00]
mircea_popescu ;;tslb [07:00]
gribble Time since last block: 1 hour, 31 minutes, and 55 seconds [07:00]
mircea_popescu at least that didn't move. [07:00]
assbot [MPEX] [O.BTCUSD.P550T] 1000 @ 0.38403908 = 384.0391 BTC [+] [07:01]
assbot [MPEX] [O.BTCUSD.P530T] 1000 @ 0.34210801 = 342.108 BTC [+] [07:01]
assbot [MPEX] [O.BTCUSD.P510T] 1000 @ 0.30194268 = 301.9427 BTC [+] [07:01]
assbot [MPEX] [O.BTCUSD.P490T] 1000 @ 0.26374232 = 263.7423 BTC [+] [07:01]
mircea_popescu shorts covering [07:01]
assbot [MPEX] [O.BTCUSD.P470T] 1000 @ 0.22771516 = 227.7152 BTC [+] [07:01]
mircea_popescu smickles maybe you're right [07:01]
mircea_popescu !m ^oix [07:01]
mircea_popescu !ticker m ^oix [07:01]
smickles mircea_popescu: i only have a self taught understanding of technicals and i see it, so people who trade on technicals probably see it too and are taking action [07:02]
assbot It says some pelt-wearin' trapper, some stinkin' bean-suckin' possum skinner, he's gonna collect that reward money. [07:03]
pizzaman1337 $mpexlag [07:03]
mpexbot pizzaman1337: 0.0712060928345 seconds [07:03]
the-bucket-shop peter - if satoshi dice can land some press out of this, then probably there will be some more betting next few weeks. [07:04]
mircea_popescu "s.dice grows too large for bitcoin" [07:04]
mod6 omg she is just gloating over here lol, she's been calling 'em mario coins since day one. [07:04]
mircea_popescu who lol [07:05]
mod6 she's like, "oh gonna go play more dungons and dragons 'eh...." [07:05]
mod6 my gf [07:05]
mod6 she's a btc hater [07:05]
mod6 and now shes gloating [07:05]
mod6 :/ [07:06]
mircea_popescu lo [07:06]
mircea_popescu l [07:06]
the-bucket-shop mp s.dice grows too large for bitcoin sounds way better than "bitcoin is forked" btc people who talk to the press have no option but to blame satoshidice very loudly. [07:07]
the-bucket-shop I'm an s.dice shareholder btw [07:07]
mircea_popescu heh [07:07]
* Eduard_Munteanu has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) [07:08]
mircea_popescu sure, blame canada why not. [07:08]
maximian good thing this happened now and not when the market cap is $5B [07:08]
mircea_popescu maximian if the idiots hadn't put in the 250k limit it would have jhappened and been resolved in 2011 [07:08]
Chaang-Noi nice to see the gap getting shorter [07:08]
mircea_popescu when you know... 1 single block would have caused it, it'd have been immediately noticed but no forking [07:08]
* BTCTrader2 ( has joined #bitcoin-assets [07:08]
the-bucket-shop I'm sure this stuff will happen at $5B too. that's like the size of the New York School district [07:08]
assbot [HAVELOCK] [SDICE] 1 @ 0.5949999 BTC [+] [07:09]
* sgornick (~steve@unaffiliated/sgornick) has joined #bitcoin-assets [07:09]
Chaang-Noi mp the idots was satoshi, he just assumed we would change it later [07:09]
smickles 8 blocks to go [07:09]
mircea_popescu the-bucket-shop basically it will happen indefinitely for as long as we have a devteam that mostly works at trying to play government. [07:09]
Chaang-Noi they did it to protect from spamming [07:09]
mircea_popescu Chaang-Noi i don't care what the excuse is. [07:09]
mircea_popescu they did it because their heads don't work. [07:09]
mod6 he's not an idiot. he was very smart, if these new idiots can't hack their way out of a wet paper sack, thats not really his fault. [07:09]
* mircea_popescu rage [07:10]
Chaang-Noi in the frist few months someone could ahve attacked it with spam and killed it, who is to say that would not have happened? [07:10]
mircea_popescu dude first frw months [07:10]
mircea_popescu it is 2013 have some mercy [07:10]
Chaang-Noi i agree it should ahve been changed by now [07:10]
mircea_popescu long by! [07:10]
Chaang-Noi but having it in the first place was a good idea [07:10]
mircea_popescu jesus i'm clueless about bitcoin internals. [07:10]
mircea_popescu if it gets to the point where i am raising objections and they make sense [07:10]
mircea_popescu IT IS WAY TOO LONG [07:10]
Chaang-Noi honestly this issue is one of the reasons i went so hard core into ltc [07:10]
Chaang-Noi and that was over a year ago... [07:11]
kakobrekla how does ltc fix that ? [07:11]
* chippewa-adm ( has joined #bitcoin-assets [07:11]
Chaang-Noi faster blocks can fit more transactions [07:11]
Chaang-Noi also i have more faith in the ltc pools to change this cuz it is a small network now [07:12]
Chaang-Noi we can fix it with out too much issue, and i ahve been trying to get peole to move [07:12]
pigeons well the bdb index lock bug isnt only triggered by pure # of transactions [07:12]
* chippewa-adm has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) [07:12]
Chaang-Noi pigeons it is size of the blocks right? [07:12]
* chippewa-adm ( has joined #bitcoin-assets [07:12]
pigeons no [07:12]
Chaang-Noi what is it then? [07:12]
pigeons not directly [07:12]
Chaang-Noi well indirectly then [07:13]
Bowjob ;;ticker [07:13]
gribble BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 45.01200, Best ask: 45.35277, Bid-ask spread: 0.34077, Last trade: 45.42658, 24 hour volume: 129864.74982214, 24 hour low: 36.65000, 24 hour high: 48.46900, 24 hour vwap: 44.47226 [07:13]
pigeons to say that litecoin is in anyway better on this issue is ridiculous [07:14]
assbot [MPEX] [O.BTCUSD.P550T] 275 @ 0.38399185 = 105.5978 BTC [-] [07:14]
assbot [MPEX] [O.BTCUSD.P530T] 275 @ 0.34205951 = 94.0664 BTC [-] [07:14]
mircea_popescu hm. [07:14]
assbot [MPEX] [O.BTCUSD.P510T] 275 @ 0.30189328 = 83.0207 BTC [-] [07:14]
assbot [MPEX] [O.BTCUSD.P490T] 275 @ 0.26369245 = 72.5154 BTC [-] [07:14]
mircea_popescu perhaps things are actually settling down ? [07:14]
mircea_popescu ;;ticker [07:14]
assbot [MPEX] [O.BTCUSD.P470T] 275 @ 0.22766534 = 62.608 BTC [-] [07:14]
gribble BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 45.01200, Best ask: 45.42580, Bid-ask spread: 0.41380, Last trade: 45.42600, 24 hour volume: 129868.46652021, 24 hour low: 36.65000, 24 hour high: 48.46900, 24 hour vwap: 44.47196 [07:14]
benkay how are the chain size and this recent fork related? [07:14]
pigeons benkay: not chain size, block size [07:15]
benkay okay [07:15]
Chaang-Noi pigeons you have not explained what you think the issue is yet you say what i said is silly... it is hard to attack a point you wont state [07:16]
benkay what's this referring to: mircea_popescu: maximian if the idiots hadn't put in the 250k limit it would have jhappened and been resolved in 2011 [07:16]
mircea_popescu benkay the presence of a 250k arbitrary block limit [07:17]
mircea_popescu prevented the underlying problem of the db from being discovered [07:17]
mircea_popescu until that moment when a perfect storm composed out of a db upgrade and the limit removal [07:17]
mircea_popescu created two almost equal miner bases [07:17]
benkay oh i see, chain size and this fork i are idiots [07:18]
mircea_popescu this could have easily been avoided by simply not relying on magic numbers. [07:18]
benkay heh [07:18]
mircea_popescu and it will ever be the case that whenever code contains a number based on an assumption [07:18]
benkay developers hate unconstrained systems [07:18]
mircea_popescu that code wuill break spectacularly. [07:18]
Bowjob 3.00% fee of CaVirtex [07:18]
Bowjob thats steep [07:18]
assbot [MPEX] [O.BTCUSD.C410T] 3 @ 0.15129407 = 0.4539 BTC [+] [07:18]
kakobrekla it can be constrained to 2tb for start [07:19]
mircea_popescu it's just not how you code. [07:21]
mircea_popescu 0, 1, infinity. [07:21]
mircea_popescu that's the motherfucking rule. [07:21]
topace_ Bowjob: cavirtex is only 3% to start with, its volume based... pretty easy to get down tto 1% [07:21]
topace_ or even 0.5% [07:21]
smickles $mpex lag [07:22]
smickles $mpexlag [07:22]
mpexbot smickles: 0.10756111145 seconds [07:22]
Bowjob dont i get charged per trade? [07:22]
Bowjob so I have to keep trading until I bring it down to 1% [07:22]
pigeons yeah it was .5% for its first couple years but couldnt make any money + scammers [07:22]
pigeons that interac email transfer thing was a mistake [07:23]
Chaang-Noi some trolling fun if you are up for it [07:23]
Bowjob mhm yah thevolume isnt that high on virtex [07:23]
mircea_popescu Chaang-Noi the something bawwwfull crowd... btc goes 15 to 45, they're like whelp [07:24]
mircea_popescu bitcoin goes 45 to 40 for 15 minutes... omg MUST MAKE ALL THE POSTS [07:24]
smickles pigeons: check your $mail [07:24]
mircea_popescu tomorrow it'll be like... what, nothing happened. so what if it's 50. doesn't prove anything [07:24]
smickles pigeons: check your $email [07:24]
smickles imean [07:24]
Chaang-Noi mp yeah 15 to 45, then a short dip to 38 and they are like, told you its over, lulz [07:25]
smickles uh oh, badchain got longer [07:26]
Bowjob whos mining on badchain [07:26]
mircea_popescu ;;tslb [07:26]
gribble Time since last block: 9 minutes and 53 seconds [07:27]
mircea_popescu whoa [07:27]
* Now talking on #bitcoin-assets [07:33]
* Topic for #bitcoin-assets is: || CAN'T ACCESS MPEX.CO : [07:33]
* Topic for #bitcoin-assets set by kakobrekla!~T42@unaffiliated/kakobrekla at Sun Mar 10 20:50:43 2013 [07:33]
* [freenode-info] channel trolls and no channel staff around to help? please check with freenode support: [07:33]
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mod6 ;;tslb [07:42]
gribble Time since last block: 25 minutes and 29 seconds [07:42]
mircea_popescu so what's best case scenario here, something like 16 blocks chain orphaned ? [07:43]
mod6 oh looks like btcguild got another [07:44]
mod6 ;;tslb [07:44]
gribble Time since last block: 27 minutes and 9 seconds [07:44]
mod6 oh wtf [07:44]
ThickAsThieves ;;bc,stats [07:44]
mircea_popescu mod6 this is the bad chain gribble sees [07:44]
gribble Current Blocks: 225454 | Current Difficulty: 4367876.000842196 | Next Difficulty At Block: 225791 | Next Difficulty In: 337 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 1 day, 23 hours, 34 minutes, and 35 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 4838985.15316 | Estimated Percent Change: 10.78577 [07:44]
Chaang-Noi back to 27, oh lulz btc. how you troll us [07:44]
mircea_popescu ;;ticker [07:45]
gribble BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 46.46002, Best ask: 46.75436, Bid-ask spread: 0.29434, Last trade: 46.93566, 24 hour volume: 134874.62479342, 24 hour low: 36.65000, 24 hour high: 48.46900, 24 hour vwap: 44.53366 [07:45]
Chaang-Noi us this [07:45]
Chaang-Noi use* [07:45]
Chaang-Noi it has been 44 mins [07:45]
ThickAsThieves [07:45]
Bowjob im not sure how to interpret the data [07:46]
* benkay has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) [07:46]
Bowjob so.. are we all good then? [07:46]
ThickAsThieves we want the "orphaned" one to win I believe [07:46]
Bowjob oh god [07:46]
ThickAsThieves it'll be a few hours i guess [07:47]
mircea_popescu [07:47]
Bowjob who is mining on 0.8 then? [07:47]
mircea_popescu consensus emerges. [07:47]
* benkay ( has joined #bitcoin-assets [07:47]
mircea_popescu bitcoin devs to stop all development of new versions, work on bitcoin specification exclusively, then release one cleanned up bitcoin version. [07:47]
mircea_popescu an' take it from there. [07:48]
mircea_popescu $mpexlag [07:49]
mpexbot mircea_popescu: 0.110903978348 seconds [07:49]
Bowjob BFL should atone for their sins and mine with the ASICs if they have them and help save the network [07:49]
ThickAsThieves overall this still lowers difficulty next round a little right? [07:50]
maximian Bowjob the network is being saved right now…. it's just taking some time because hashing power is split between two chains. [07:50]
ThickAsThieves they had to remine blocks right? [07:50]
ThickAsThieves and a portion of the hashing is still going to dead blocks [07:50]
mircea_popescu ThickAsThieves yes it does [07:50]
Bowjob yeah but who is mining on 0.8 still? [07:50]
mircea_popescu diff shall have a hole in it [07:50]
Bowjob they have no clue? [07:51]
ThickAsThieves people sleep [07:51]
mircea_popescu Bowjob prolly p2pool [07:51]
ThickAsThieves i wanna sleep [07:51]
Bowjob sleep? [07:51]
Bowjob whats that [07:51]
ThickAsThieves but i also wanna watch the fireworks [07:51]
ThickAsThieves so this is good for asicminer(s), they get an extra day of lower diff, maybe more [07:53]
BitHub whens the nev div due? [07:53]
BitHub 40 hours? [07:53]
ThickAsThieves wed/thu [07:53]
BitHub sweeet [07:53]
ThickAsThieves ;;bc,stats [07:53]
gribble Current Blocks: 225454 | Current Difficulty: 4367876.000842196 | Next Difficulty At Block: 225791 | Next Difficulty In: 337 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 1 day, 23 hours, 34 minutes, and 35 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 4838985.15316 | Estimated Percent Change: 10.78577 [07:53]
mircea_popescu ThickAsThieves they are the largest losers mining on dead chain [07:53]
BingoBongo Interesting how p2pool was supposed to "prevent network centralization" seems to be doing the job... [07:54]
ThickAsThieves asicminer is on the main chain, btcguild [07:54]
Bowjob so basically if i get this right, those mining on 0.8 are wasting their time [07:54]
ThickAsThieves yes [07:54]
ThickAsThieves their blocks will never get confirmed [07:54]
Bowjob by "main" you mean 0.7 [07:54]
ThickAsThieves unless they fork intentionally... [07:54]
ThickAsThieves yes [07:55]
BitHub any press conference release statements from the devs yet? [07:55]
ThickAsThieves the one with majority hashing power [07:55]
mircea_popescu BingoBongo exactly. [07:55]
ThickAsThieves essentially btcguild and the other big ones are doing a 51% attack [07:55]
ThickAsThieves to go back to the .7 chain [07:55]
mircea_popescu ThickAsThieves and it's not trivial to get the fuck off .8 [07:56]
mircea_popescu because you'll need old chain [07:56]
kakobrekla eleuretheria or whatever wants his coins back [07:56]
mircea_popescu kakobrekla that poor guy you know ? [07:56]
mircea_popescu fucked by .8 x2 [07:56]
kakobrekla yea [07:56]
Bowjob skip the 0.8 [07:56]
Bowjob next release should be 0.9 [07:56]
mircea_popescu NEXT TIME devs want ppl to upgrade ppl will be like [07:56]
mircea_popescu "sure, got escrow ?" [07:56]
ThickAsThieves too bad for him, but maybe now he'll have better protocol for changing his software [07:56]
mircea_popescu yea. as in, not change it. [07:57]
mircea_popescu perfect protocol. [07:57]
ThickAsThieves sdice can support the forked chain for bet processing [07:57]
kakobrekla im lucky bitbet runs 0.72 [07:57]
ThickAsThieves i assume my bet was rejected [07:58]
Bowjob gah btc is very complicated lol [07:58]
ThickAsThieves bet idea* [07:58]
kakobrekla no idea [08:00]
kakobrekla a [08:00]
BingoBongo !ticker m ^oix [08:00]
kakobrekla not processed yet [08:00]
assbot [MPEX:^OIX] 1D: 0 / 0 / 0 (0 shares, 0 BTC), 7D: 39.70080218 / 44.63179932 / 53.27201335 (66598 shares, 22,713.19 BTC), 30D: 0 / 0 / 0 (0 shares, 0 BTC) [08:00]
kakobrekla but dunno if it fits the rules [08:00]
mircea_popescu ThickAsThieves give bets a day or so [08:00]
mod6 i have 0.7.1 ... [08:00]
kakobrekla mircea_popescu he wants to do these meta bets [08:01]
ThickAsThieves np, just interested to see if it fits within rules [08:01]
mircea_popescu well whatever he wants, if you don't see it in a day it's prolly been rejected [08:01]
rodeo Once the ophaned chain take over again BTCguild will get > 10 blocks I wounder how they will credit it [08:02]
ThickAsThieves proportionally, like always? [08:03]
mircea_popescu ironic that the end result of the Luke-Jr & co group of idiots starting their little jihad on s.dice [08:03]
mircea_popescu will be the extinction of their c++ only "refernece" implementation and in general the end of their centralist chokehold on bitcoin [08:04]
mircea_popescu i guess the lesson here is that programmers have no business arguing with financiers. [08:04]
mircea_popescu won't be learned tho, i bet. [08:04]
ThickAsThieves almost done [08:06]
ThickAsThieves ;;tslb [08:06]
gribble Time since last block: 49 minutes and 1 second [08:06]
* topace_ has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) [08:06]
Chaang-Noi last 3 blocks were prphaned, ??? not good? [08:11]
assbot [MPEX] [S.BBET] 100 @ 0.00181 = 0.181 BTC [+] [08:11]
Chaang-Noi last 3 blocks? wtf? [08:11]
maximian they're part of the 0.7 chain [08:12]
maximian it's catching up [08:12]
maximian just two more blocks and it'll be the main chain [08:13]
ThickAsThieves tied now [08:14]
Bowjob yay. go 51% attack [08:14]
* BingoBongo throws all my 11mH/s on the 0.8 chain, because principle [08:16]
* LiquidBits has quit (Quit: LiquidBits) [08:16]
ThickAsThieves well i see one problem [08:16]
ThickAsThieves my balance on btc-e [08:16]
ThickAsThieves -18 [08:16]
ThickAsThieves should be about 0 [08:17]
Bowjob ah.. btc-e. I lose my mind on that trollbox [08:17]
ThickAsThieves same on other exchanges [08:17]
Bowjob its bad for my health [08:17]
ThickAsThieves negative balance [08:17]
ThickAsThieves whoa [08:17]
ThickAsThieves a bunch of incoming deposits [08:18]
* paci has quit (Quit: paci) [08:20]
maximian so it's all over [08:22]
kakobrekla at least we had some good drama ya know [08:24]
Bowjob so thats it? crisis averted? [08:24]
maximian yep [08:25]
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BingoBongo Crisis averted, drama unleased. [08:25]
maximian now come the personal attacks, panic selling, etc [08:25]
maximian but bitcoin marches on [08:25]
rodeo I thought the ending was a bit anti climatic [08:25]
Bowjob Aight, preparing fiat [08:26]
ThickAsThieves ;;ticker [08:26]
gribble BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 45.05186, Best ask: 45.05187, Bid-ask spread: 0.00001, Last trade: 45.05187, 24 hour volume: 136276.60628425, 24 hour low: 36.65000, 24 hour high: 48.46900, 24 hour vwap: 44.54592 [08:26]
maximian big forks have happened before, not really a big deal [08:26]
BingoBongo It's not the ending. It is the opening chapter in the Latest DLC. BitCoin: Mission Standardization [08:26]
Bowjob I printed an order page for topace, but then hes like nope. dont transact [08:26]
Bowjob so my free option didnt work out [08:27]
Bowjob lol [08:27]
maximian the tech blogs will have a field day with this. orgasming over the opportunity to spread some FUD [08:27]
maximian I think we can expect the exchange rate to be depressed for a while. [08:27]
Ukto well, as I stated before.. weex wallet is the perfect example of correctnes [08:27]
ThickAsThieves here it goes [08:28]
Ukto wonder what other sites are like :P [08:28]
mircea_popescu ;;tslb [08:29]
gribble Time since last block: 1 minute and 50 seconds [08:29]
ThickAsThieves so will there be a mass selloff afte rpeople get their btc to gox? [08:30]
ThickAsThieves yes [08:30]
maximian yeah, lots of nervous nellies out there [08:30]
ThickAsThieves ;;ticker [08:30]
gribble BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 43.99646, Best ask: 44.00000, Bid-ask spread: 0.00354, Last trade: 44.00000, 24 hour volume: 137786.72229724, 24 hour low: 36.65000, 24 hour high: 48.46900, 24 hour vwap: 44.54643 [08:30]
maximian people who don't understand the system… pure speculators [08:30]
Bowjob I'm watching from coinlab [08:31]
ThickAsThieves me too [08:31]
pigeons you're at coinlab? or coinlab has an actual product out? [08:31]
ThickAsThieves a fancy ticker [08:31]
ThickAsThieves and a working goxwall [08:31]
* Ukto tickers ThickAsThieves [08:32]
* Diablo-D3 has quit (Quit: This computer has gone to sleep) [08:32]
ThickAsThieves and of course the Buy $1m button [08:32]
pigeons cant be fancier than clarkmoody? [08:32]
Bowjob [08:32]
Bowjob mhm [08:32]
Bowjob 45 [08:32]
Bowjob Bulls fighting back? [08:32]
ThickAsThieves lol [08:32]
ThickAsThieves it wont last [08:32]
Bowjob I'd let the bears have a go at it for now [08:32]
ThickAsThieves people just waiting for confirms [08:32]
Bowjob oh [08:32]
Bowjob lol [08:32]
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* BitOTTer655 has quit (Remote host closed the connection) [08:36]
BingoBongo I imagine there's a large low information"Investor" population that through inertia or ignorance recognizes what a small hiccup this should have been... When they start looking for people to inform them though.... [08:36]
Chaang-Noi so did we fix yet? [08:39]
Bowjob yeah [08:39]
pigeons just waiting for you to reboot [08:39]
Bowjob wheres that gif of this anime chick drinking coffee [08:39]
Chaang-Noi awesome thanks [08:39]
BingoBongo I'm making a trip to the Pawn Shop tomorrow and loading up on fiat for the opportunity that should arise these next few weeks. The DFI I use is indicating a "correction" to $15-$35 within 2 or 3 weeks, confidence interval of 66.7% [08:39]
pigeons partly cloudy, chance of rain [08:40]
BingoBongo EH, its just the Drama FUD Index [08:40]
pigeons omg! bitcoin didnt die! buy! [08:40]
Chaang-Noi :) [08:42]
mircea_popescu ;;ticker [08:42]
gribble BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 44.16000, Best ask: 44.43000, Bid-ask spread: 0.27000, Last trade: 44.54000, 24 hour volume: 137292.69111752, 24 hour low: 36.65000, 24 hour high: 48.46900, 24 hour vwap: 44.50843 [08:42]
ThickAsThieves i'm not sure if gox is fully open yet [08:43]
mircea_popescu so 24 blocks in the end. [08:43]
mircea_popescu ;;calc 24 * 25 * 48.47 [08:43]
gribble 29082 [08:43]
mircea_popescu heh. [08:43]
mircea_popescu we just blew somalia's current week budget. [08:44]
BingoBongo That's about a used VW Phaeton [08:44]
Chaang-Noi mp lol [08:49]
BingoBongo Appear to be roughly the ask for this real estate [08:52]
mircea_popescu << [08:53]
mircea_popescu anybody here actually interested in this btw ? [08:53]
BitHub lulz mircea [08:53]
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BingoBongo Lulz Jeff G, How many support threads on that forum have ended in essentially: export your private keys and import into X software other than what you have been using [08:57]
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Bowjob If felt that we would have a tremendous rally today this bug didnt happen [09:03]
Bowjob oh well. i'll take what i can [09:03]
BingoBongo A software neutral specification has been needed for too long [09:03]
mircea_popescu i am starting to see that. [09:06]
* AndroUser512 has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) [09:06]
BingoBongo I give it probably 3 years for a full move from code control to stardardized and documented. [09:07]
BingoBongo There's the long fight over what the spec is, and then theres the awkward grace period until the spec forces people to leave the old code controlled version (unless crisis compells it earlier) [09:10]
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midnightmagic Probably not going to happen. People like mystical chains-of-heredity. [09:11]
midnightmagic It's in their nature--right beside the part that thinks god talks directly to them. [09:11]
BingoBongo Some things are more powerful than heredity [09:13]
Bowjob [09:13]
midnightmagic The magic Satoshi? You think the huge number of sociopaths running bitcoin are interested in an outside non-mystic taking the reins? [09:15]
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kakobrekla that bottle looks almost like a gun [09:16]
kakobrekla pointed at him [09:16]
BingoBongo Happier bottle [09:17]
mircea_popescu BingoBongo so five years ain't that bad. [09:27]
mircea_popescu midnightmagic i wouldbn't bet on "people" mattering [09:28]
mircea_popescu we are discussing money. [09:28]
midnightmagic people who use bitcoin are the people I'm talking about. [09:28]
midnightmagic they are who create the economy which bitcoin encompasses. [09:28]
mircea_popescu people who use bitcoin have not a fucking clue. [09:28]
mircea_popescu allow me to quote : [09:29]
mircea_popescu I think this means that bitcoin is in jeopardy. [09:29]
mircea_popescu and they hate mpex shares! [09:29]
mircea_popescu WHY ARENT the bitcoin police doing anything about these DDOS attacks? [09:29]
midnightmagic correct, they don't. the thing is a lot of them know that, so what do they do? social proof. and they pick a guy (like satoshi) and decide he is the nearest thing to god. [09:29]
mircea_popescu problem is the god is gone [09:30]
mircea_popescu and it left behind a coven of idiots. [09:30]
midnightmagic And he left a minor southern deity in charge. [09:30]
mircea_popescu the way things play out is popemassacre [09:30]
midnightmagic You know for someone who complains about it so much I'm surprised you're taking such an interest in leading a takeover.. :-) [09:30]
midnightmagic (and by surprised, I mean, "not very surprised") [09:31]
Ukto btw, bitfunder is 100% online. withdraws/ deposits [09:31]
Ukto you guys do okay? :) [09:31]
midnightmagic course. [09:31]
midnightmagic god talks to me. :) [09:31]
BingoBongo mircea_popescu Not at all. Maybe tie the definitive switch to standards only to the next halving? God is gone so let's send things to committee. [09:31]
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mircea_popescu midnightmagic im not leading anything, but i'm not standing for nonsensical crap either. [09:32]
midnightmagic You're trying to suggest you could be the lead of a Real bitcoin replacement. :) [09:33]
midnightmagic Or rather.. boob lady is. :) [09:33]
mircea_popescu not really. but i am saying that the current stuff has to go. [09:34]
mircea_popescu actually, i said it months ago. [09:34]
midnightmagic Yes I read that. [09:34]
mircea_popescu i said the moment devs try to act like priests and leverage the obscurity of their bad code into political theosophy... they're screwed. [09:35]
mircea_popescu i guess they don't read english any better than they read their own code. [09:35]
midnightmagic Actually, the reference implementation was never meant to be the end-all canonical version. Satoshi always hoped someone would write a properly-funded, properly engineered client and it would become the canonical client. [09:35]
midnightmagic (sort of [09:35]
mircea_popescu i am aware. [09:36]
midnightmagic I see no examples of political theosophy. You clearly have something in mind: out with it. :) [09:36]
mircea_popescu if you recall, this all started with people knowing which transactions are good. [09:36]
mircea_popescu and which usecases are acceptable. [09:36]
mircea_popescu and on and on. [09:36]
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midnightmagic I don't see how a rationale (which Satoshi himself started, btw, by requesting that Wikileaks not use bitcoin yet,) is the snowball accretion of full-blown theosophy. [09:38]
BingoBongo And mircea_popescu many will probably try to sweep it under the rug as LevelDB is broken, because it isn't BerkelyDB. You're on the right track, but I think this was probably the wrong error... [09:38]
mircea_popescu BingoBongo does it make much of a difference ? [09:39]
mircea_popescu midnightmagic wrong step on satoshi's part. let it be broken, rebuild. why protect it ? [09:39]
midnightmagic Currently, the best choice is sipa's blacklist patch, as it allows us to remain on the faster 0.8 while still mining. [09:39]
mircea_popescu if it's good it will prevail. if it sucks it will just crack and something else will come out of it [09:39]
BingoBongo mircea_popescu the difference is probably how much they will try to reiforce their canon against sense... [09:40]
midnightmagic mircea_popescu: blockchain-destroying events tend to set back adoption progress amongst people who are afraid of what everyone else will think. [09:40]
mircea_popescu midnightmagic so ? [09:40]
midnightmagic mircea_popescu: the bootstrapping itself is still going on. [09:40]
BingoBongo "Good" bitcoin will probably have to overtake old by 51% As worse overtook bad tonight [09:40]
mircea_popescu look, like it or not, for this reason or for some other reason, bitcoin is at a point where you can't reasonably pour more moneuy into it [09:40]
mircea_popescu before it's been specified. [09:41]
mircea_popescu if it can't be specified that's a dealbreaker [09:41]
mircea_popescu not such a huge notion this, is it ? [09:41]
midnightmagic BingoBongo: it will overtake depending on its technical and UX merits. [09:41]
mircea_popescu BingoBongo have you read the girl's explanation of why multiforks resolve and aren't a problem economically ? [09:41]
BingoBongo mircea_popescu I might have, I'll recheck her post history. [09:42]
midnightmagic BingoBongo: Think about it this way. uTorrent killed everything else on Windows. [09:42]
mircea_popescu in short : suppose chain forks into 3 different chains today, a b and c [09:42]
midnightmagic mircea_popescu: On the same network? [09:42]
mircea_popescu if you had 10 bitcoins today prefork, you will have 10 a 10b and 10 c bitcoins after the fork. [09:42]
mircea_popescu if you sell b and buy a the price of all will go up and the price of b down. [09:42]
mircea_popescu eventually the fork resolves economically simply because mining costs money. [09:43]
mircea_popescu end of story. money itself is a centralising factor, and as such the slightest flicker amplifies [09:43]
midnightmagic bleah.. the crosschatter would be ridiculous.. [09:43]
mircea_popescu so ? [09:43]
mircea_popescu more drama, more market cap. [09:44]
BingoBongo Ah, this is kind of what I was thinking. I must have read without expressing the sentiment. I believe I've read similar on Trilema as well. [09:44]
mircea_popescu i think so. [09:44]
mircea_popescu to be perfectly candid, many people involved in bitcoin are good honest and well meaning individuals, who know about things. usually those things are coding. [09:44]
mircea_popescu there's a lot more to know than coding in thsi world. [09:45]
midnightmagic crosschatter and high-bandwidth reorg battles would hurt individual consensus. presume the forks are all equal hashrate to begin with: due to the nature of POW, it would be far, far worse in terms of strength against attack. [09:45]
midnightmagic (like way less than 1/3) [09:45]
mircea_popescu midnightmagic no. because attacker wouldn't know which to attack. [09:45]
BingoBongo midnightmagic Win32 killed everything on Windows... Crosschatter happened before, some altcoin late last year did it (no halving fork) and had to be euthanized. [09:45]
midnightmagic that's not the case. [09:45]
mircea_popescu or even... why. [09:45]
midnightmagic you must presume technical acumen on the part of the attacker. [09:45]
mircea_popescu technical yes. [09:46]
mircea_popescu but selecting the coin to attack is not a technical problem. [09:46]
mircea_popescu and you must never presume political acumen on the part of anyone. [09:46]
midnightmagic also economical savvy (as all attackers I have seen have been extremely insightful economically) [09:46]
midnightmagic you must when modelling attack. [09:46]
mircea_popescu here's a bomb for you midnightmagic : [09:46]
mircea_popescu if the devs were a little looser in the ass, would the sort of econ savvy attackers stay that side or join this side ? [09:46]
midnightmagic not godlike power, but intellectually perfect decisions, plus funded by $x dollars. [09:47]
midnightmagic I don't know what that means. [09:47]
mircea_popescu looser in the ass ? it means being used with being fucked in that orrifice. [09:47]
midnightmagic Yeah but what has that to do with anything? Is this your way of saying you're done arguing? [09:48]
midnightmagic "Argument stopper man!" [09:48]
mircea_popescu nah. [09:48]
midnightmagic You could just say so, I'd stop. [09:48]
mircea_popescu i guess it doesn't convey, let me try another way. [09:48]
midnightmagic Okay. [09:49]
mircea_popescu suppose buttcoin has some devs that think all usecases are equally valid, and dorkcoin has some devs who believe using the coin for gambling is spam. [09:49]
mircea_popescu suppose there is one attacker such as you've modeled him. [09:49]
Anduck selling ASICMINER @ 0.76 [09:49]
mircea_popescu which chain is getting attacked ? [09:49]
Anduck pm if interested [09:49]
pigeons by the way people dont think using bitcoin for gambling is spam, they think using bitcoin transactions to signal a lost bet is spam [09:50]
midnightmagic I'd preferentially attack the ones who appeared to be more philosophically aligned with the notion of attack. [09:50]
mircea_popescu same thing pigeons. as long as you're making that call your ass is too tight. [09:50]
midnightmagic Also, if the money is on the side of the all-use-cases-are-valid (i.e. gambling and drugs, hypothetically) then obviously the money is where the attacker goes. [09:50]
mircea_popescu live a little. [09:50]
pigeons ok maybe we should just encode files and upload them to the blockchain ala namecoin too [09:51]
mircea_popescu midnightmagic not so. you will be surprised to find attackers routinely forego hitting higher payoff cooler targets [09:51]
mircea_popescu to focus on the uncool ones. [09:51]
mircea_popescu pigeons if we shouldn't, there should not be call for doing it. [09:51]
midnightmagic mircea_popescu: Well, not in my personal experience. But perhaps that's out-of-date these days. [09:51]
midnightmagic The gambling servers at least are very popular targets. Extorting them is almost a Russian pastime. [09:52]
mircea_popescu that;s brancing the discussion off the germane path tho [09:52]
pigeons alpaca socks can only pay so much ransom [09:52]
midnightmagic ^^ this [09:52]
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midnightmagic Even btcexpress preferred to leave his attacks on the altcoins. [09:53]
mircea_popescu sure, irrelevant ventures aren't part of the discussion, if bitcoin stays alpacca we're wasting our time with these concerns/ [09:53]
midnightmagic .. but you defined the two choices earlier. I'm not agreeing that the choices match reality. I'm just hanging out in your hypothetical land because you invited me. [09:54]
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mircea_popescu midnightmagic that's fine, but you pervert the choices when you add riders such as "one is really vanishingly small" [09:54]
mircea_popescu or "neither are payment systems, but gaming servers" [09:54]
mircea_popescu etc. [09:54]
midnightmagic Well if that's not what you meant, perhaps you should define things more narrowly. :) [09:55]
mircea_popescu just leave it stand as it is. the theoretical response to a 51% attack is that the attacker would make more by mining. [09:55]
mircea_popescu the same applies ideologically too. the network won't get attacked for as long as it manages to not stupidly offend. [09:55]
mircea_popescu keeping money ideologically neutral, implementing the old pecunia non olet [09:55]
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mircea_popescu is the main strategic purpose of having a devteam in the first place. [09:56]
midnightmagic I think gpumax is the counterexample to that assertion (that they'd make more by mining) [09:56]
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mircea_popescu i don't think so. gpumax dissapeared with pirate, as the sane people were saying back in february 2012. [09:56]
mircea_popescu completely unrelated topic, gpumax [09:56]
midnightmagic nah it's not. It's an example of hashrate for sale, and successfully for sale for that matter. [09:57]
mircea_popescu yes, for the purpose of covering a side attack [09:57]
mircea_popescu ie, pirate's confidence scam. [09:57]
midnightmagic I don't know why you say that. [09:58]
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mircea_popescu ... [09:58]
mircea_popescu what, this is still disputed ? [09:58]
assbot [BTCTC] [CRYPTO-TRADE] 5 @ 0.2 = 1 BTC [+] [09:58]
midnightmagic More likely it was a side-business for coin laundry, but none of the miners could ever (far as I know) figure out where the coins were coming *from*. [09:58]
midnightmagic That is, none of them were ever tainted. [09:59]
mircea_popescu be that as it may [09:59]
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assbot [BTCTC] [SYNERGY] 1 @ 0.076 BTC [-] [10:02]
assbot [BTCTC] [GSDPT] 4 @ 0.00524 = 0.021 BTC [+] [10:04]
Ukto looks like trading on btct is back [10:04]
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assbot [BTCTC] [COGNITIVE] 3 @ 0.18 = 0.54 BTC [-] [10:08]
assbot [BTCTC] [CRYPTO-TRADE] 1 @ 0.2 BTC [+] [10:14]
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assbot [BTCTC] [S.BBET-PT] 25 @ 0.00193 = 0.0483 BTC [+] [10:16]
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Bowjob Massive sell off occuring [10:17]
mircea_popescu ;;ticker [10:18]
gribble BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 42.50000, Best ask: 43.00000, Bid-ask spread: 0.50000, Last trade: 43.00000, 24 hour volume: 143829.74796654, 24 hour low: 36.65000, 24 hour high: 48.46900, 24 hour vwap: 44.38319 [10:18]
mircea_popescu 10k, not so massive. [10:19]
Bowjob well, i watched it from 45, drop to 42.5 .. i see each cent dropping [10:19]
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Ukto now live [10:28]
Ukto Native LTC deposit/withdraw supported. "And as always. Has good day." [10:28]
kakobrekla unaffection comes to bitbet so naturally i wont be posting any signes. [10:28]
kakobrekla ;;ticker [10:29]
gribble BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 41.51000, Best ask: 41.99900, Bid-ask spread: 0.48900, Last trade: 41.99900, 24 hour volume: 146092.87031245, 24 hour low: 36.65000, 24 hour high: 48.46900, 24 hour vwap: 44.35230 [10:29]
kakobrekla ;;goxlag [10:29]
gribble 23.174488 seconds [10:29]
mircea_popescu $mpexlag [10:32]
mpexbot mircea_popescu: 0.147304058075 seconds [10:32]
mircea_popescu no srsly [10:32]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5 @ 0.00073163 = 0.0037 BTC [-] [10:42]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5539 @ 0.00073162 = 4.0524 BTC [-] [10:42]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 456 @ 0.00072543 = 0.3308 BTC [-] [10:42]
mircea_popescu In Australia, IPv6 adoption is almost non-existent, reports Josh Taylor. [10:54]
mircea_popescu "It's about as bad as everywhere else on the planet, I guess, with the single exception of Romania," Asia Pacific Network Information Centre's chief scientist, Geoff Huston, said in an interview with ZDNet Australia. [10:54]
mircea_popescu heh. [10:54]
Anduck selling ASICMINER @ 0.76, pm me if interested (at ASICMINER-PT asks are at 0.7699) [10:57]
mircea_popescu Anduck you know about the tradebook ? [10:57]
Anduck no. [10:57]
Anduck ....yeeees [10:57]
* Now talking on #bitcoin-assets [18:17]
* Topic for #bitcoin-assets is: || CAN'T ACCESS MPEX.CO : [18:17]
* Topic for #bitcoin-assets set by kakobrekla!~T42@unaffiliated/kakobrekla at Sun Mar 10 20:50:43 2013 [18:17]
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Namworld I offer 0.03% daily on funds here. [18:21]
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Namworld I'll be back later [18:27]
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mircea_popescu ;;ticker [18:29]
gribble BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 43.41654, Best ask: 43.41666, Bid-ask spread: 0.00012, Last trade: 43.50000, 24 hour volume: 166958.61630911, 24 hour low: 36.65000, 24 hour high: 48.46900, 24 hour vwap: 43.77197 [18:29]
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smickles We're Going Down! [18:30]
jcpham twss [18:30]
jborkl_ It is holding up well considering what a collosal fuck up this was [18:30]
jborkl_ colossal [18:31]
Namworld It wasn't that colossal... just a little forking [18:31]
Namworld The miners voted which would be used going forward [18:32]
smickles yeah, and it's not likely that many lost btc due to incidental double spends [18:32]
Troic_ it could have been colossal, if the pool ops weren't so cooperative [18:32]
jborkl_ That they encouraged people to change the block size and not knowing it was going to break BDB was a big fuck up [18:32]
MJR_ Namworld: what is your bonds URL again? [18:32]
smickles Troic_: beauty of the system, they have a financial incentive to cooperate [18:32]
Namworld [18:32]
deadweasel smickles: that's what keeps me sane [18:33]
mircea_popescu lol [18:33]
smickles jborkl_: I do wish they had tested .8 better. tis could've been caught [18:33]
mircea_popescu jborkl_ the idea is strong, the implementation horrible [18:33]
Namworld they can still mass object to changes and refuse... but the longest chain will be the one with most miners. [18:33]
mircea_popescu in a sense this backhandedly proves how strong the idea is [18:33]
Namworld The issue is not in .8 at all... [18:33]
smickles gavin had admitted to testing 500k blocks [18:34]
smickles but not 1m blocks [18:34]
mircea_popescu smickles heh. [18:34]
Namworld It's in .7 [18:34]
Namworld No amount of testing would have found the issue. .7 would have needed to be tested. [18:34]
mircea_popescu Namworld would you stop ? [18:34]
mircea_popescu any statement that claims "no amout of testing" is a lie by its nature [18:34]
jcpham red light. [18:34]
smickles Namworld: depends how you look at it no? the iss presented with the interaction of .8 and .7 [18:34]
smickles something gavin was testing, just not toroughly enough [18:35]
Namworld The issue was in .7, if they tested .8 forever, they'd never have found the issue if they didn't use .7 in the testing. [18:35]
mircea_popescu obviously not the amount of testing they were willing to do in between chat session and harassinfg the userbase found it [18:35]
jborkl_ I ran .7 and .8 versions, If I had run testnet and made a 1mb block I would have most likely broken .7 [18:35]
mircea_popescu still, more testing WOULD have eventually found it. [18:35]
smickles Namworld: gavin said he would've caught it if he had tested a larger block on the testnet [18:35]
Namworld aye [18:36]
mircea_popescu smickles gotta give props to gavin, he's one of the few that are actually contrite enough. [18:36]
mircea_popescu he might be the only pro in the bunch, too. [18:36]
smickles he only tested 500k blocks, and it happened on a 900k block [18:36]
mircea_popescu 967 or some shit [18:36]
Namworld I'm not saying it couldn't have been found, I'm just refuting that doing more testing on .8 would have given any result. [18:36]
mircea_popescu unauthoritatively my it says berkley seems to choke in this case over about 10k records [18:37]
mircea_popescu Namworld the "on .8" is a meaningless constraint. [18:37]
mircea_popescu who and why would be testing on .8 only ?! [18:37]
jborkl_ really, only test a part of the code against itself? [18:37]
mircea_popescu jborkl_ for great lulz. [18:37]
Namworld I know... but people everywhere say that .8 should have been tested more so the issue would have been found. [18:38]
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mircea_popescu well yes. that is correct, it should have been, [18:38]
mircea_popescu nobody is saying "shouldhave been tested more by itself in a vacuum" [18:38]
jborkl_ I just solo mined on .72 again last night until it was all figured out- I knew I kept .72 around and running for a reason [18:38]
Namworld ARGH [18:38]
smickles Namworld: i believe they do test for interaction with older versions [18:39]
mircea_popescu jborkl_ i've always been slow to upgrade, specifically for lack of faith. [18:39]
MJR_ Namworld: I think what they mean is that part of testing a new release is testing it's interactions with other versions for backward compatiblity [18:39]
smickles they certainly outta now [18:39]
Namworld Don't you get it? I'm trying to refute people who think the issue is with .8 and that .8 alone should have been tested more... [18:39]
jborkl_ Yeah, me too- I don't like being the first to change- bit me too many times [18:39]
Namworld Not that more proper testing would not have found the issue (proper with many versions). That more testing of .8 alone would have not changed anything. [18:39]
Namworld This is the only thing I'm trying to say. [18:40]
smickles personall, i include previous version interaction in the testing of one version [18:40]
smickles so it's a silly argument :P differences in definitions [18:40]
Namworld ah, I see. [18:40]
mircea_popescu Namworld a, the issue isn't with .8 [18:41]
mircea_popescu the issue is with berkley db, which was on the way out [18:41]
jborkl_ people were all up in arms about having 80 to 1000 unconfirmed transactions waiting. with NO testing, people made larger blocks - that broke BDB [18:42]
jborkl_ 800 [18:42]
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Namworld >.< [18:42]
mircea_popescu yes well, you went about it in a broken way. [18:43]
Namworld I'm talking about people making such claims... not about me making the same claims =/ [18:43]
jborkl_ It could have been handled and implemented properly [18:44]
mircea_popescu No amount of testing would have found the issue. [18:44]
Namworld @smickles: some people even claimed they sticked to an old version specially because of potential such issues with new versions when .8 wasn't the source of the problem. If they had switched it would have been an non-issue. We've reverted to accomodate the bug in .7 and not to leave people behind. [18:44]
jborkl_ .8 should be used, but we are holding back so poor people with shitty connections and shitty hardware can still be here [18:45]
Namworld mircea: I was referring to testing of .8 alone. I'm made an omission in it. I've been trying to correct myself for like the last few minutes =/ [18:46]
mircea_popescu Namworld no! rabble! rabble! [18:46]
mircea_popescu lol [18:46]
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imsaguy did someone say b00bies? [18:46]
mircea_popescu booties. [18:47]
MJR_ lol, you know people can run either version and change the size of blocks they can accept or mine [18:47]
mircea_popescu MJR_ not accept. just mine. [18:47]
imsaguy .. [18:47]
ThickAsThieves so good [18:47]
imsaguy the problems is that other people accepted it [18:47]
imsaguy and then it got mined in [18:47]
Namworld I hate it when I forget something in a sentence and I'm getting argued against for 10 minutes when I have the same point of view as the one arguing against me. [18:47]
imsaguy so even if you didn't allow it, someone else did [18:47]
imsaguy and then your client chokes [18:47]
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imsaguy and you get stuck and don't get any new blocks [18:47]
mircea_popescu Namworld does it happen often ? [18:47]
imsaguy mircea_popescu: Namworld is usually arguing with himself. [18:48]
Namworld That's new. I don't recall that. [18:48]
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Namworld No. Maybe every month or the other. [18:48]
jborkl_ They have identified it as .BDB has a limit and can be broken. .8 does not have a limit and seems fine. Lets move back to the broken [18:48]
mircea_popescu i enjoy arguing with him mostly because he seems to go about things in a totally different way than anyone else [18:48]
Namworld When typing fast. [18:48]
mircea_popescu which is a great way to become a laughingstock, sure, but also a great way to find obscure bugs. [18:49]
Namworld Actually I find you go about things in a different way than anyone else... [18:49]
mircea_popescu of course i do. [18:50]
MJR_ can't you change your code in .7 to accept larger blocks? [18:50]
imsaguy no [18:50]
imsaguy its bdb [18:50]
imsaguy .7 can already accept larger blocks [18:50]
imsaguy bdb can't handle the locking [18:50]
imsaguy too many tx in the block [18:50]
Namworld Almost all misunderstandings on Bitcoin IRC are with you. I usually go about quite well with almost everyone else. [18:50]
mircea_popescu Namworld almost everyone else doesn't have much to say. [18:50]
MJR_ ah I see [18:51]
imsaguy I'm glad I'm not almost everyone else [18:51]
imsaguy I have a shitton to say [18:51]
MJR_ lol [18:51]
mircea_popescu imsaguy should i grep log for imsaguy ? :D [18:51]
imsaguy don't forget [\] [18:51]
jborkl_ The problem glaring from this, now a obvious major problem is here and can be exploited again. [18:51]
imsaguy and pirateat40 [18:51]
imsaguy oops [18:51]
imsaguy just [\] [18:52]
MJR_ has anyone ever said "bitcoin-assets is great but I just wish it had as much drama as" [18:52]
mircea_popescu kik [18:52]
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mircea_popescu MJR_ it has moar. [18:52]
Namworld I think you are very literal on what sentences mean and interpret as little as possible. You avoid making too many inferences during a conversation so even small omissions can result in misunderstandings. [18:52]
imsaguy MJR_: they didn't have to [18:52]
mircea_popescu Namworld certainly. this way misunderstandings are found early. [18:52]
mircea_popescu at least ideally. [18:53]
imsaguy ;;seen usagi [18:53]
gribble usagi was last seen in #bitcoin-assets 6 days, 23 hours, 17 minutes, and 59 seconds ago: do it [18:53]
imsaguy aww [18:53]
imsaguy does he still owe people coins? [18:53]
imsaguy she/it* [18:53]
mircea_popescu imsaguy i think he's doing something with silver atm [18:53]
Namworld If it was a written text, I might make less omissions. When chatting tho, I type fast and usually omit things. [18:53]
imsaguy uh oh.. [18:53]
mircea_popescu actually... what if usagi and eskimo bob joined forces [18:53]
mircea_popescu and created the world's first [18:54]
mircea_popescu silver easybake oven ? [18:54]
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imsaguy sounds like a methlab waiting to happen [18:54]
mircea_popescu when they get older. [18:54]
imsaguy how old is bob? [18:54]
Namworld bob? The eskimo? [18:55]
jborkl_ put both of their ideas on how to make money together? 1+1=still is 0 [18:55]
mircea_popescu should be like twentysomething i would guess [18:55]
Namworld Only bob I know around these parts. [18:55]
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mircea_popescu [18:56]
mircea_popescu some of the funniest shit i read all day. [18:56]
mircea_popescu this seems to be the contemporary brain disease, people reading stuff they don't understand here and there, mashing it into a sort of compound [18:56]
jcpham bitcoin is the worst [18:56]
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Namworld I think being heavily dependant on miners is actually what Satoshi wanted... miners vote with their hashing power... That's exactly how the system is supposed to work. [18:58]
mircea_popescu yeah. [18:58]
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jborkl_ I like Death and Taxes response [18:58]
Namworld and devs can consult with mining pool when changing limits and send a warning so everyone upgrades directly to the client, should they want to make a change to allow scaling. [18:58]
ThickAsThieves they will still need to hard fork us again at some point, no? [18:58]
Namworld yes, they'll need to. [18:59]
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ThickAsThieves so does that not give malicious people a specific time in the future to plan for? [18:59]
Namworld But with proper warning and support from the community for the change, only the few not switching are left behind. [18:59]
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mircea_popescu ThickAsThieves yes, it does. [18:59]
mircea_popescu it really is a catastrophe, strategically [19:00]
ThickAsThieves this time they werent prepared [19:00]
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ThickAsThieves next time they will be [19:00]
mircea_popescu just the puppy eyed idiots don't quite get what happened so raw raw we love devteam [19:00]
Namworld what kind of malicious stuff might there be? [19:00]
ThickAsThieves planning to double spend? [19:00]
mircea_popescu Namworld you're proceeding on the wrong path. [19:00]
mircea_popescu that's not how this works, "o, what bad stuff could happen?" [19:00]
jborkl_ Well, first of all they need to plan the change sooner than later [19:01]
Namworld No, I mean malicious stuff from knowing ahead of time about a fork. [19:01]
Namworld Other than double-spend attacks [19:01]
mircea_popescu how would i know ? [19:01]
mircea_popescu we'll find out if we're unfortunate enough. [19:02]
Namworld But really, merchants/miners can plan ahead if they know. It's better if it's known in advance than not. [19:02]
mircea_popescu even if we don't know that doesn't make the issue ok. [19:02]
benkay ra ra go devbs [19:02]
mircea_popescu knowing in advance there will have to be a hard fork is a weakness of the system. [19:02]
mircea_popescu it may be reduced rto almost no cost, maybe [19:02]
benkay centralize us on a single buggy broken blatform [19:02]
mircea_popescu but it still costs > 0 [19:02]
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mircea_popescu and incidentally, i wonder what OTHER exploits are there for berkley [19:03]
Namworld Well there will be forks... [19:03]
mircea_popescu that were illustrated by this but aren't limited to lage blocks [19:03]
benkay and for people who have trouble keeping up with the technical times, the costs are going to be higher next time [19:03]
assbot [BTCTC] [PAJKA.BOND] 20 @ 0.1 = 2 BTC [+] [19:03]
Namworld That's pretty much unavoidable. [19:03]
mircea_popescu benkay the top pool is pretty much bankrupt now, is it ? [19:03]
mircea_popescu courtesy of idiotteam doublewhammy-ing them [19:03]
benkay market dominance is never an indicator of technical competence [19:03]
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mircea_popescu be that as it may. [19:03]
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Namworld look at MtGox... [19:04]
Namworld good example [19:04]
mircea_popescu good point [19:04]
mircea_popescu ;;goxlag [19:04]
gribble 2.062621 seconds [19:04]
benkay heh/. [19:04]
mircea_popescu $mpexlag [19:04]
mpexbot mircea_popescu: 0.116768121719 seconds [19:04]
mircea_popescu win. [19:04]
mircea_popescu o boy will i be having fun with this. [19:04]
benkay what is mpexlag calculating? [19:04]
Namworld MtGox is pretty much constently lagging. [19:04]
mircea_popescu the lag to talk to mpex, through a remote and a local proxy [19:04]
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benkay to the order-parsing system? [19:04]
mircea_popescu benkay the bot just measures the proxy response [19:05]
ThickAsThieves so i know they me seem ignorant, but just thinking out loud, is there not a way to make the bitcoin software part of the blockchain itself? [19:05]
benkay so to web server. [19:05]
ThickAsThieves to allow propagation of new versions? [19:05]
mircea_popescu it takes .11 seconds for an order to go from bot to remote proxy -> to local proxy -> to trade engine and back [19:05]
benkay oh okay [19:05]
mircea_popescu no that's not correct. [19:06]
mircea_popescu it takes .11 seconds for an order to go from bot to remote proxy -> to local proxy and back [19:06]
mircea_popescu you can't measure the trade engine from outside [19:06]
benkay what kind of volume would your trade engine have to see before it started lagging? [19:06]
mircea_popescu benkay i've seen > 10 orders per second irl [19:07]
mircea_popescu i've seen > 100 on testnet with the future config [19:07]
benkay *grins* [19:07]
benkay assuming you don't mean btc testnet? [19:07]
mircea_popescu (this has to be sustained at that level for an hour or so for things to start feeling it) [19:08]
mircea_popescu benkay no, my own. btc don't enter into it [19:08]
smickles benkay: i could have it place an order, to test, but the problem would be cancelling that order later [19:08]
benkay *nods* [19:08]
mircea_popescu mpex could trade on beenz if i wanted to, it's completely btc agnostic. [19:08]
benkay i get it man i get it [19:08]
mircea_popescu smickles actually the expansion on that is [19:08]
benkay namespace conflict [19:08]
benkay just resolving [19:08]
smickles mircea_popescu: would a better measure be sending a bunk order? [19:09]
mircea_popescu once i get the rest online, can you measure the lag for the entire $proxies list ? [19:09]
mircea_popescu smickles i think it's a fine measure as it is really. [19:09]
smickles i suppose i could [19:09]
mircea_popescu the way mpex works you get the trade engine lag printed rioght on each stat [19:09]
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ThickAsThieves any thoughts on somehow tying the bitcoin software to the blockchain itself? dumb idea? [19:18]
Namworld yes [19:18]
smickles ThickAsThieves: what purpose would it serve? [19:19]
ThickAsThieves propgation of new versions [19:19]
ThickAsThieves forced [19:19]
Namworld Would be catastrophic... no more voting on what changes you want [19:19]
Namworld Basically, someone controls Bitcoin [19:19]
ThickAsThieves how is that different [19:19]
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smickles yeah, right now, users 'vote', miners 'vote' [19:20]
imsaguy Namworld: not true [19:20]
imsaguy you can always compile your own bitcoin software [19:20]
ThickAsThieves i know *I* can't contol what devs and pools do [19:20]
ThickAsThieves voted or not [19:20]
imsaguy you vote with your hash [19:20]
smickles ThickAsThieves: but you don't have to go along with them [19:21]
imsaguy you vote with what you use [19:21]
Namworld Yeah. But almost the same if software upgrade is forced through the blockchain itself. Not sure how that could even work tho [19:21]
imsaguy well for example [19:21]
Namworld Anyway, I'm out. [19:21]
imsaguy you take the reference software [19:21]
imsaguy and they say 'this version isn't good after block X' [19:21]
imsaguy you've just put an expiration date on the software [19:21]
imsaguy I'm not advocating they do this [19:21]
smickles where's the statics on what version people are running, i think there are a bunch still on .3 [19:22]
imsaguy Luke-Jr has a graph page [19:22]
imsaguy but I don't know how often it updates [19:22]
Luke-Jr it's realtime [19:22]
ThickAsThieves its just lame that people can be left in the void [19:22]
imsaguy url? [19:22]
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Luke-Jr [19:22]
imsaguy ThickAsThieves: Its on the of problems with Microsoft [19:22]
imsaguy they keep trying to support the morons that refuse to update [19:22]
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imsaguy if they cut people off cold turkey, they could cut a lot of hackjobs added to make old software work with the new stuff [19:23]
ThickAsThieves they have an obligation to their product [19:23]
smickles Luke-Jr: updated reasonably well? [19:23]
Luke-Jr [17:22:20] it's realtime [19:23]
imsaguy smickles: he said realtime [19:23]
imsaguy lol [19:23]
smickles oh, i should read [19:23]
smickles sry Luke-Jr [19:23]
imsaguy is realtime reasonably well? [19:23]
imsaguy NO! [19:23]
imsaguy MOAR! [19:23]
Luke-Jr [13-03-12 17:24:00] 1784/529458 available (520270 tried in 61095s, 9164 new, 24 active), 177 banned; 1692328 DNS requests, 112840 db queries [19:24]
smickles ThickAsThieves: look, about 2.45% of the network is using .3 still [19:24]
imsaguy Luke-Jr: could you make one that's futuretime? [19:24]
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Luke-Jr imsaguy: draw a big circle and write 1.0 in the middle? [19:24]
imsaguy yay! [19:24]
imsaguy no more beta [19:24]
imsaguy <.< [19:24]
imsaguy >.> [19:24]
ThickAsThieves betacoin [19:24]
smickles imsaguy: compile your own from .8 but modify it to say that it is 1.0 [19:25]
smickles :D [19:25]
ThickAsThieves i'm just stuck on meta thoughts lately, i think its lack of sleep [19:25]
smickles .5 just gets no love [19:25]
ThickAsThieves make bitbets about bitbet! put bitcoin software on blockchain! [19:26]
imsaguy lol smickles [19:28]
imsaguy I am one of the unidentifieds [19:28]
ThickAsThieves we're all martian immigrants [19:29]
assbot [BTCTC] [CRYPTO-TRADE] 10 @ 0.2 = 2 BTC [+] [19:37]
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iz ThickAsThieves: *picture of xibit holding a picture of xibit* [19:42]
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ThickAsThieves while looking in the mirror with a mirror behind him [19:47]
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kakobrekla is the chain back to normal? [19:52]
kakobrekla anyone having any txes hanging in the air? [19:52]
ThickAsThieves everything is legit for me in all accounts [19:52]
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mircea_popescu kakobrekla should be fine. [19:54]
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kakobrekla hm [19:54]
mircea_popescu until someone figures out how to trigger the berkley bug with a smaller block [19:54]
kakobrekla i have some oldish txes [19:54]
mircea_popescu such as including 10k 160 byte txs [19:55]
kakobrekla still no confirm [19:55]
kakobrekla kinda worrying [19:55]
deadweasel ;;ticker [19:55]
gribble BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 45.01770, Best ask: 45.01771, Bid-ask spread: 0.00001, Last trade: 45.01771, 24 hour volume: 171261.27579910, 24 hour low: 36.65000, 24 hour high: 48.46900, 24 hour vwap: 43.77026 [19:55]
deadweasel back to 45! [19:55]
deadweasel a hard fork bounce :) [19:56]
ThickAsThieves btcguild at 13k [19:56]
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mircea_popescu ThickAsThieves sorry ? [19:57]
Anduck any admins online? [19:57]
mircea_popescu burnside ^ [19:57]
ThickAsThieves sry, [19:58]
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assbot [BTCTC] [ASICMINER-PT] 10 @ 0.7 = 7 BTC [-] [20:03]
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mircea_popescu [20:07]
mircea_popescu "o, it was a bug in berkely db" [20:07]
mircea_popescu fucking idiots. [20:07]
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MJR_ ;;seen Josh_Rossi [20:12]
gribble Josh_Rossi was last seen in #bitcoin-assets 1 day, 16 hours, 7 minutes, and 19 seconds ago: pretty sweet [20:12]
MJR_ that is cool [20:12]
pigeons today I downloaded .7 and have been patiently waiting for my blockchain to download, im not sure if I will continue refunds or just buy a big crack rock and smoke it in a cave some where but I am totally offended by this scammer tag [20:17]
mircea_popescu you got a scammer tag ?! [20:18]
pigeons tom [20:18]
mircea_popescu lol totally offended okay. [20:19]
pigeons [20:19]
mircea_popescu so he couldn't do refunds all through february because the devs borked transition to .9 [20:19]
pigeons yeah [20:19]
mircea_popescu .8*. in march. [20:19]
pigeons "if I was a scammer I could be living it up easy some place warm instead of braving the same upstate new york winters I have been for 30+ years" [20:20]
mircea_popescu well... let's just hope gavin sends him the correct lists then [20:20]
pigeons "If anyone has any idea how I can buy a large amount of bitcoins please message me. The largest amount I can buy from bitinstant is $500 worth ive looked and looked and its near impossible to make a large bitcoin purchase anywhere." [20:21]
mircea_popescu oh i see yeah [20:21]
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mod6 to everyone else .... PEACE AND LOVE [20:22]
mod6 lol [20:22]
mircea_popescu so here's the lol of today : [20:23]
mircea_popescu devs say berkeley is broken. it is fine. they forgot to configure it. [20:23]
pigeons yeah we know [20:23]
mircea_popescu this is possibly the worst case of "hi i am calling to report a bug" bungled tech support ever. [20:23]
ZedsterX the college? [20:23]
ZedsterX jk [20:23]
mircea_popescu pigeons i fear it'll take me a little to digest this one [20:23]
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pigeons you can configure it to use more locks, so far that seems to work just uses a lot more ram but works [20:24]
mircea_popescu the proof of something awful's general cluelessness/irrelevance is the low level mock articles they're pushing out. [20:25]
mircea_popescu there's material here to scathe. [20:25]
mod6 yeah BDB has been a thorn in dev's side for a decade. but sounds like this time they forgot about a landmine they already stepped on once before. [20:26]
mircea_popescu for people into sdice graphs : [20:27]
mircea_popescu mod6 bring me up to speed, what exactly is the objection ? it is widely deployed and consequently well debugged by now [20:27]
mod6 BTC needs a CVE or something or some sort of post mortum. [20:27]
assbot [HAVELOCK] [SDICE] 5 @ 0.57575758 = 2.8788 BTC [-] [20:28]
mircea_popescu [20:29]
mircea_popescu this particularly is illustrative. [20:29]
mod6 mircea_popescu: its not really an objection. [20:30]
mod6 its just something to be cautious of [20:30]
mircea_popescu ya but i mean, why ? [20:30]
mod6 it escapes me dude [20:31]
mod6 its been too long [20:31]
mircea_popescu lol kk [20:31]
mod6 so many problems over the years [20:31]
mircea_popescu just trying to get smarter over here :p [20:31]
mod6 i couldn't possibly remember them all [20:31]
mod6 im just depressed about this shit [20:31]
mircea_popescu i imagine a number of people are. [20:31]
mod6 i was thinking about the gox issue... [20:33]
mod6 and perhaps what we need is something like rootservers for fiat->btc exchanges [20:33]
mircea_popescu what are those ? [20:34]
mod6 dns has root servers worldwide to resolve requests. thinking that maybe btc could do well to have like 10-13 worldwide exchanges all independant of eachother. [20:35]
MJR_ like DNS ? [20:35]
mod6 not that all the code should be the same. [20:35]
MJR_ but also...those root servers have children [20:36]
pizzaman1337 kakobrekla wants something like the way fx is setup [20:36]
mod6 root servers don't keep the same code either, not exactly anyway, this way it prevents a simutaious attack against all [20:36]
mircea_popescu mod6 it would be good to have many exchanges, but there's problems with getting that to work in p[ractice [20:36]
mircea_popescu because exchanges concentrate liquidity and people chase liquidity [20:36]
mod6 this will help distrbute the load of exchange, and then btc wont have 1 place to look for price signals. [20:36]
MJR_ well, one thing is that instant settlement is going to be harder and harder to scale [20:36]
mircea_popescu personally i think the solution is fixing, but [20:37]
mircea_popescu few people involved actually have enough finance knowledge to get it going yet. [20:37]
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kakobrekla true [20:37]
MJR_ fix protocol? [20:37]
kakobrekla gox mus die [20:37]
kakobrekla fix is shit [20:37]
mircea_popescu MJR_ no gais. fixing. [20:38]
MJR_ you lost me [20:38]
mircea_popescu Mar 11 09:18:00 ok, it's like this. suppose the three main dealers are A, B and C. [20:38]
mircea_popescu Mar 11 09:18:13 chair X calls the meeting. X proposes price, say 47.5 [20:38]
mircea_popescu Mar 11 09:18:27 a, b and c go through their books, see what customers want, see what they want on their own account [20:38]
mircea_popescu Mar 11 09:18:45 then they say. a buys 50k usd. b sells 25k usd. c sells 70k usd. [20:38]
mircea_popescu Mar 11 09:18:52 25 + 70 > 50k so its not fixed [20:38]
mircea_popescu Mar 11 09:18:58 x has to call a lower price now [20:38]
mircea_popescu Mar 11 09:19:00 ah that kind of meeting you mean [20:38]
mircea_popescu Mar 11 09:19:01 say 47.3 [20:38]
mircea_popescu Mar 11 09:19:08 now a b and c review their books [20:38]
mircea_popescu Mar 11 09:19:14 think i just need to add some sleep time.... [20:38]
mircea_popescu Mar 11 09:19:14 42 12 40 [20:38]
mircea_popescu Mar 11 09:19:15 etc [20:38]
mircea_popescu Mar 11 09:19:27 this process is called fixing, it's widely used to obtain a price. [20:38]
mod6 and fixing this block size thing is kinda crazy. its like you know when you get a UDP request to your DNS server and the reply from the Zone is > than the max size of UDP, it rolls over to tcp [20:38]
MJR_ well, again I think that could happen on a larger scale... [20:39]
pgp credit lines between exchanges to allow cross exchange arb would be an important start... [20:39]
MJR_ yes exactly [20:39]
mod6 i don't think im smart enough for this stuff. [20:39]
MJR_ pgp: again instant settlement is not sustainable [20:40]
kakobrekla the first important step, realizing that. [20:40]
pgp this would also require something akin to DTCC (depositiory trust clearing corp) where every exchange is a member and keeps money on deposit... [20:40]
MJR_ or even wise...since cold storage == instant [20:40]
mircea_popescu pgp that could easily be implemented using the mpex push for isntance [20:41]
mircea_popescu or independently, but pgp is a good solution to keep it safe. [20:41]
pgp indeed [20:41]
mircea_popescu problem is every exchange wants to act as if in a vacuum, because [20:41]
mircea_popescu they perceive they lack any distinguishing features [20:41]
kakobrekla the problem is exchange ops are retarded [20:41]
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mircea_popescu kakobrekla basically. [20:42]
mircea_popescu the problem with bitcoin in general is the userbase is dumb. [20:42]
MJR_ well not educated financially [20:42]
mircea_popescu devteam, miners, pool ops, exchange ops, everyone is... you know... draftees [20:42]
mircea_popescu people picked off the street [20:42]
MJR_ tech savvy [20:42]
MJR_ you would be surprised how many financial wizards have trouble using email [20:43]
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mod6 :( [20:43]
pgp yes - with the exception of bitfloor, it doesn't seem that these exchanges are run by anyone familiar with how "real" exchanges (and clearing operations) actually work... [20:43]
kakobrekla bitlol [20:43]
mod6 i got trolled so hard by my gf for this shit yesterday [20:43]
MJR_ so you need people who are tech AND finance savvy [20:43]
kakobrekla guy got fucked a comple of times no? [20:43]
MJR_ he did [20:43]
mod6 we're the laughing stock [20:43]
kakobrekla over confidend [20:43]
kakobrekla nt [20:43]
mircea_popescu pgp bitfloor, the guys currently owinfg like 900x what they'll ever make ? [20:43]
MJR_ well...last I checked there was only one exchange that hasn't been hacked [20:44]
pizzaman1337 so what is the "proper" way to run an exchange? where can I read about this? [20:44]
kakobrekla The book of Kako [20:44]
kakobrekla Kako accually means how [20:44]
mircea_popescu pizzaman1337 this ain't knitting we're discussiong here man. [20:44]
kakobrekla so it makes sense. [20:44]
MJR_ well, paranoia does not an efficient market make [20:44]
kakobrekla lol mp [20:44]
mircea_popescu you read about it in school, which costs dough [20:44]
kakobrekla anywho brb [20:45]
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pizzaman1337 schoool... that's what the internet is for [20:45]
mircea_popescu pizzaman1337 no but srsly, this is the sort of thing people pay in the 100's of k's for, [20:45]
mircea_popescu it's not exactly "go to wikipedia" sort of thing [20:45]
MJR_ it is pretty sad that the biggest exchange can't handle orders in less than 5 min [20:46]
pizzaman1337 well, there must be some info on it somewhere that I could get access too [20:46]
mircea_popescu MJR_ mpex doesn't do fiat tho, so it's kinda moot for this problem [20:46]
kakobrekla s/5min/30min [20:46]
MJR_ don't know of anyone getting hacked for fiat [20:46]
pigeons heh [20:46]
pigeons no? [20:46]
mircea_popescu what's sad is that they take ~5k a month in hardware costs to process 8k trades in 30 minutes [20:46]
pigeons look harder [20:46]
mircea_popescu if we scale this liniarly we discover it'd cost more than it's worth to have ti trade [20:46]
MJR_ I meant the bitcoin exchanges [20:47]
pigeons yes [20:47]
pgp for starters, most all exchanges today pay you to add liquidity to their book - the so called "maker-taker" fee model. [20:47]
MJR_ exactly what pgp said [20:47]
mircea_popescu pgp the reason is they're mixing bizdev with the fee schedule. [20:48]
pigeons mjr_ where have you been? bitininstant lost usd a few days ago [20:48]
pigeons what about bitcoinica? what about every single one? [20:48]
MJR_ ... [20:48]
MJR_ they stole usd from the servers [20:49]
MJR_ ? [20:49]
pigeons yes [20:49]
pgp moreover, because like asset exchanges belong to the same "clearing clubs", they can route orders to one another to ensure "best execution" for their customers (while, of course, charging for that convenience)... [20:49]
mircea_popescu yeah ? [20:49]
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mircea_popescu pigeons wait. didn't bitinstant lose the BTC on vircurex ? [20:50]
MJR_ front page hackers used DNS to steal 12000 worth of BITCOINS [20:50]
pigeons mircea_popescu: usd [20:50]
mircea_popescu um [20:50]
mircea_popescu usure ? cause i wrote about this and iirc shrem was saying btc [20:50]
pigeons via paypal from vircurex [20:50]
mircea_popescu i'll add it to research list cause wtf. [20:51]
pgp they weren't using two factor auth with that exchange... [20:51]
pizzaman1337 [20:51]
pizzaman1337 "Overall, due to major choke points and redundancies in our system, the hacker was only able to walk away with $12,480 USD in BTC, and send them in 3 installments of 333 BTC to bitcoin addresses." [20:51]
pigeons sorry i meant virwox [20:51]
pgp you can lead a horse to water [20:51]
MJR_ they listed the loss in dollars, but you can't send cash over a wire [20:53]
MJR_ BTC was stolen [20:54]
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MJR_ anyway I think there is a ton of room for competition to mt gox [20:55]
mod6 yeah [20:56]
mod6 there needs to be at least 3 [20:56]
mod6 all independant of eachother that aren't scams [20:56]
MJR_ but even better opportunity for someone to route flow between exchanges [20:56]
MJR_ lol, not being scams is key [20:57]
mod6 and security [20:57]
mod6 if they were modeled after mpex, that'd be a start [20:57]
MJR_ I really think a gpg based order system would be nice [20:57]
mod6 not the SAME code, but similar to avoid attacks upon a weakness found in one [20:57]
mod6 similar to rootservers [20:58]
MJR_ I agree [20:58]
mircea_popescu mod6 one of the key reasons why i keep the code closed. [20:58]
mod6 *nod* [20:58]
mircea_popescu people would just mindlessly replicate it (see bitfinex) then we'll be well fucked [20:58]
MJR_ but also...I really think node and branch will be needed [20:58]
mod6 and really... the UDP (TCP when needed) is a model that the guys should be looking at to solve this blocksize issue [20:58]
mircea_popescu in a sense mpex is constructed exactly opposite of how bitcoin is constructed. [20:59]
mod6 any thoughts on that? anyone know what I'm referring to? [20:59]
mircea_popescu keep the specification open and the implementation proprietary [20:59]
mircea_popescu versus the keep the specification equal to the unreadable codebase. [20:59]
MJR_ know exactly what you are talking about [20:59]
jcpham you access mpex through open standards [20:59]
MJR_ I wrote a program to monitor how often we need to fail over to TCp for our data feeds [20:59]
jcpham how it works is not your concern [20:59]
mircea_popescu mod6 originally i thought it was udp p2p [21:00]
jcpham unicorns are definitely walking in hamster wheels though [21:00]
mircea_popescu [21:00]
mircea_popescu it is after all 2004s stuff [21:00]
mircea_popescu but apparently... [21:00]
MJR_ I think it's multicast tcp? [21:00]
mircea_popescu MJR_ im not even sure at this point. [21:01]
* mod6 reads [21:01]
MJR_ I think bitcoin-assets is the bleeding edge of the bleeding edge [21:02]
jurov mod6, how would UDP help in blocksize issuie? [21:03]
MJR_ when you think that people on coinbase are probably still in the innovators (before 18%) [21:03]
pigeons really? its second to -otc in stupid [21:03]
pigeons all your fancy exchange routing will be done via ripple [21:04]
MJR_ I can't remember your exact quote mircea_popescu but something like "if you want to use crypto currency but don't understand cryptography..." [21:04]
mod6 jurov: not UDP [21:04]
mircea_popescu MJR_ something like that. [21:04]
mircea_popescu pigeons why isn't it now ? [21:05]
mod6 jurov: we can learn a thing or two, perhaps, about how DNS solves the issue. UDP is meant to be fast, and arbitrarily large since forward/reverse zones can contain an large amount of entries. [21:05]
assbot [BTCTC] [B.YABMC] 1 @ 0.00755 BTC [+] [21:05]
mircea_popescu mod6 of course, the blockszie issue wasn't hitting the transport layer [21:05]
MJR_ I think a central clearing corp, that only needs to transfer the diff between exchanges will be the best way [21:05]
mircea_popescu MJR_ except on the day it gets attacked. [21:06]
mircea_popescu i don't even mean government necessarily. [21:06]
mircea_popescu look what happened in ny when the clearing corp got flooded [21:06]
mod6 but when the size of UDP gets over 65,535 bytes (need to double check), it simply converts it to TCP and sends it that way. something can be learned from this, nothing more. [21:06]
pigeons mircea_popescu: cause people are transitioning from doing it via the private standalone django app to the new ripple but it is being done now [21:06]
mod6 im not saying about the transport, or anything [21:06]
mod6 im simply saying, look at how this problem was solved [21:06]
MJR_ true [21:06]
mircea_popescu pigeons on superficial analysis ripple seems just the place where the curerent bitcoindev rats will sucrry to [21:06]
mircea_popescu once they get their altar broken for reals. [21:06]
pigeons yes perhaps, but currency liquidity flowed throug it before and will continue too, [21:07]
mod6 i dunno, i guess i'd have to spend some time in there. and the client needs to be combed through [21:07]
mod6 and hacked [21:07]
jurov mod6, maximal packet size (or MTU) is hard fact baked into ethernet from the beginning, not some broker earlier implementation [21:07]
mod6 slice and dice shit out of there that needs to be replaced. [21:08]
jurov *broken [21:08]
mircea_popescu mod6 actually once you're done with the iphone app, a very good use of someone's time is to go through the codebase and summarize it [21:08]
mircea_popescu that;s usually a good step towards specification. [21:08]
MJR_ mircea_popescu: what iphone app? [21:08]
mod6 i never wanted to touch bitcoin's client or anything else because the #bitcoin-dev is filled with pompus retards [21:08]
mod6 so i'll just my retard ass out of there [21:08]
mircea_popescu MJR_ the bitotter thing he's working on [21:08]
MJR_ ah cool [21:08]
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jurov mod6 good for ya. i did touch it and it didn't hurt. [21:09]
jurov but maybe i'm just crazy, going into anything [21:09]
jurov without such considerations [21:09]
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mod6 i'd love to take the time to audit that shit, but who wants to fight with LukeJr and the others? [21:09]
mod6 aint noone got time for that [21:10]
mircea_popescu mod6 i don't know who's listening to them. [21:10]
mircea_popescu a summary of the codebase is definitely useful. [21:10]
kakobrekla oh i read that "in summary the coinbase is defenetly useful" and got a heart attack almost [21:11]
mircea_popescu lol [21:11]
kakobrekla need more coffee. [21:11]
MJR_ ain't no one got time for that indeed [21:11]
mod6 yeah. its way out of hand [21:12]
jcpham [21:12]
jcpham i'm doing much better in the poll today [21:12]
jurov mod6 i'm not interested in arguing. if i had time, i'll do a fork with some very useful function and wait for them to come [21:12]
mod6 ^^^ [21:13]
jurov like my two independent wallets prototype: [21:13]
mod6 nice dude [21:13]
mod6 any reason CPP? [21:13]
jurov cuz it's fork of bitcoind [21:14]
mod6 or you just cloned and went forward? [21:14]
mod6 ok [21:14]
jurov wasn't hard... couldn't understand why that function isn't exposed already [21:14]
mod6 yeah, its WAY too large imho [21:14]
jurov prolly they don't have time to test properly xD [21:15]
mod6 thats obvious to everyone in the world who pays attention [21:15]
mod6 they should back away after this [21:15]
jurov well, they preferred to entagle themselves in multisig txs at the time [21:16]
jurov incidentally, they still don't have sane interface, too [21:16]
mircea_popescu pretty much everything about it is kludge. [21:17]
mircea_popescu i am still steaming over the fact that i can't create abitrary size txs [21:17]
jurov let's get to budapest for buncha asics and outmine them [21:18]
jurov lmao DUE TO OVERWHELMING REQUESTS we had to remove PayPal & Local Pickup options. [21:18]
mircea_popescu that thing stil around ?! [21:18]
mircea_popescu lolok [21:18]
mircea_popescu btc only rite ? [21:19]
jurov yes, only nonreversable nonpersonal means. fyr maximum security. [21:19]
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mircea_popescu due to overwhelming miner vote. [21:20]
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mod6 for starters who does this? Dbc* pcursor = db.GetCursor(); [21:24]
mod6 i just hate looking at the client code. maybe its just their style. [21:25]
mod6 its like: Dbc *pcursor = db.GetCursor(); [21:26]
mod6 wtf [21:26]
mod6 lol [21:26]
assbot [BTCTC] [BASIC-MINING] 1 @ 0.3449 BTC [-] [21:26]
assbot [BTCTC] [BASIC-MINING] 2 @ 0.345 = 0.69 BTC [+] [21:26]
mod6 at least the SSL code they copied looks to be better: BN_CTX *ctx = NULL; [21:27]
pigeons cross-posting for mircea_popescu cause he'll love it [21:27]
mircea_popescu bah. [21:27]
mod6 ok i gotta walk away for a bit and think about this some more. [21:28]
mod6 i still <3 you guys tho :) [21:29]
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MJR_ :) [21:30]
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benkay mircea_popescu: what do you mean by arbitrarily-sized transactions? [21:49]
benkay actual kb on disk? [21:49]
benkay or in mem i suppose [21:49]
mircea_popescu i want to make a 750kb tx. [21:50]
mircea_popescu you know, 5000 inputs, 7000 outputs. my business. [21:51]
assbot [BTCTC] [SYNERGY] 1 @ 0.076 BTC [-] [21:52]
assbot [BTCTC] [SYNERGY] 1 @ 0.076 BTC [-] [21:52]
benkay mhm. [21:52]
benkay but noooooooo [21:52]
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Anduck mircea_popescu: lol? [21:53]
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Anduck and pay a huge fee of.. 0.1 btc!! [21:53]
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mircea_popescu that's my problem. [21:54]
mircea_popescu if the block can take it i can make it. [21:54]
mircea_popescu nobody gets to say i can't, [21:54]
mircea_popescu and more importantly bitcoind doesnt die with "failed to create transaction" [21:55]
mircea_popescu this sort of shit belongs in onboard code for vibrating dildoes at the most. [21:55]
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Lyspooner what about those of us who have been running 0.9 [21:56]
Lyspooner ? [21:56]
benkay now now. [21:57]
benkay it's a transient state. frustrating to be sure. [21:57]
benkay especially to those of us accustomed to flushing idiots out of systems with economics. [21:58]
mircea_popescu heh. [21:58]
benkay you mentioned something about the dev team starting work on a spec? [21:58]
benkay would you point me at that? [21:58]
assbot [BTCTC] [CRYPTO-TRADE] 3 @ 0.2 = 0.6 BTC [+] [21:58]
mircea_popescu i mentioned something about how they;'d better [21:58]
mircea_popescu or else. [21:59]
mircea_popescu latest installment of bitchslapping [21:59]
assbot [BTCTC] [ASICMINER-PT] 1 @ 0.724999 BTC [+] [22:00]
mircea_popescu sipa jgarzik: have we seen a block which affected 5000 transaction index entries? [22:00]
mircea_popescu jgarzik sipa: I don't think so [22:00]
mircea_popescu so much for testing [22:00]
mircea_popescu motherfucking... [22:00]
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assbot [BTCTC] [COGNITIVE] 1 @ 0.18 BTC [-] [22:02]
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Lyspooner The Church of Bitcoin and the Vatican Bitcoin Foundation have met Luther Popescu [22:03]
mod6 so can we rewind the tape just a bit... [22:05]
mod6 didn't this happen or something very similar to it before? [22:05]
mod6 like on upgrade from version 4 to 5 or something? there was a night where they did an upgrade and the similar thing happened. [22:05]
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assbot [BTCTC] [S.DICE-PT] 87 @ 0.00559 = 0.4863 BTC [+] [22:06]
mod6 i gotta look through btctalk for that *sigh* [22:07]
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mod6 awe fuck it, i guess that's long ago anyway. [22:09]
mod6 i hate that site [22:09]
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jurov mircea_popescu one thing i don't understand, you aren't going to hire any devs yourself cause it isn't worth the conflict and drama? [22:11]
jurov what do you plan to do, then? [22:11]
mircea_popescu jurov atm the plan ios to push for spec [22:11]
mod6 it shouldn't be up to one dude to pay for all this shit... [22:11]
mircea_popescu and ideally remove the current devteam's license to release new clients. [22:11]
mircea_popescu past this point. [22:11]
jurov and who will do the spec? have any allies to do it together? [22:12]
mircea_popescu then once we have spec they can fix their fucked codebase and release a proper client [22:12]
mircea_popescu jurov : perhaps. one sec [22:12]
mircea_popescu [22:13]
mod6 i just feel like, this should be like a HACK THE PLANET type thing, and people who want this to work will make it work. [22:13]
mod6 im not sure what planet these guys are on, but if this is their baby and they have commitbits to the most widely used full-node base, they aught to make sure it functions correctly. [22:14]
mod6 anyway, drives me up a wall, I'll tell you. :) [22:14]
mircea_popescu heh. [22:14]
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assbot [HAVELOCK] [SDICE] 2 @ 0.574 = 1.148 BTC [-] [22:17]
mircea_popescu jurov anyway, the problem isn't as much the drama, but moreover that a single-source codebase is both non-bitcoiny and suspect. [22:18]
mircea_popescu but i think if we can get one (or ideally multiple) people to summarize the code [22:18]
mircea_popescu we can pretty much derive a spec from there. [22:18]
mircea_popescu this wouldn't take much longer than a few weeks for a first draft, which can then be argued and refined [22:19]
mircea_popescu in my experience any devteam resists such an effort like cats resist washing, because coders love to write but hate having to read code. [22:19]
mircea_popescu hiowever, once it's complete there's a few day's worth of facepalming and going "wait, we are doing W?HAT ?!" [22:20]
assbot [HAVELOCK] [SDICE] 1 @ 0.57577575 BTC [+] [22:20]
mircea_popescu after which everything's much better. [22:20]
mod6 this is a solid plan. [22:20]
assbot [HAVELOCK] [SDICE] 1 @ 0.57999999 BTC [+] [22:21]
mircea_popescu mod6 in experience it tends to work. [22:21]
mircea_popescu of course it has to first get the cat into the washing machine. [22:21]
assbot [HAVELOCK] [SDICE] 6 @ 0.58 = 3.48 BTC [+] [22:22]
mod6 :} [22:22]
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jurov well, i'd love to and have no problems to read others code.. just that i'm neck deep elsewhere atm. [22:22]
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mircea_popescu i understand [22:22]
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mircea_popescu why it's called open source after all, sits there and waits for when / who has time for it [22:23]
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jurov oh, that happens with all opensource without paid devs [22:23]
mircea_popescu here are the problems that i don't know how to solve. [22:24]
mircea_popescu a. i hire someone. well... this opens the political problem of "oh, he's mp's puppet". [22:24]
mircea_popescu b. i set up a prize which anyone may claim. well... this opens the idiocy problem of "oh, I don'tneed his money, what does me take for, a starving artist????" [22:25]
mod6 right. no, this needs to be something that is adopted by the users of the system. [22:25]
mircea_popescu + "it's not enough" drama + trying to get the pruize with as little work as possible etc [22:25]
mircea_popescu i'm kinda stuck to just talking atm because a and b. [22:25]
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jurov just hire someone. this muppet argument will ensue but code/doc will remain in the end [22:25]
mircea_popescu perhaps. [22:26]
jurov i remember something like with linux and redhat [22:26]
mircea_popescu it's in any case not something i have to call today. [22:26]
mircea_popescu jurov certainly. [22:26]
jurov maybe i'll hire amir taaki.. he'll do gladly for food and shelter [22:27]
mod6 well, i think this bitcoin project is again an "ALL YOUR BASE ARE BELONG TO US." type of thing. [22:27]
jurov mod6 what outer space metaphors are you onto again.... [22:27]
mod6 the best kind [22:28]
dub so this fucking agent calls me in yesterday to show the same offer as last week, only on paper [22:28]
mircea_popescu jurov i bet you i can tell you have just by reading his output [22:28]
dub because numbers look different than they sound obviously [22:28]
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mircea_popescu ban them. [22:29]
benkay what are you taking offers on, dub? [22:31]
mircea_popescu russian bride [22:31]
jurov lol the vride isn't up to specs [22:32]
jurov *bride [22:32]
dub benkay: houses [22:32]
mircea_popescu jurov she's a little worn i nplaces. [22:32]
mircea_popescu and there's a crack [22:32]
mod6 So, what I'm saying is, I think it's a really good thing to create a spec, and then everyone can punch eachother in the nuts over it until its perfect. This is the way to go. [22:33]
mircea_popescu more like a gash really. [22:33]
mircea_popescu mod6 werd. [22:33]
benkay there will eventually be an incentive for the miners to disregard devsquad [22:33]
benkay in retrospect, i'm a little surprised they didn't this time [22:33]
mod6 I think, at least for myself, every time I had to write a paper, or have written some code; I've gone back the next day or at some later date and done a `wtf?' [22:34]
mircea_popescu benkay exactly. [22:34]
benkay ^^ erryday. [22:34]
mod6 even the other night, i wrote that code quick that worked. i mean, it kinda worked, in the way that it fucked a donkey. [22:34]
mircea_popescu the btcguild people got fucked for ~2k btc because of it. [22:34]
mircea_popescu this keeps up, soon enough idiots will not have the dough to keep going [22:34]
mircea_popescu much like btc finance was cleanned up. [22:34]
mod6 but then you know, you review, you think about it, you make changes and it gets better. [22:34]
benkay it's a painful process [22:35]
mircea_popescu good. [22:35]
benkay dunno if i agree about that. [22:35]
jurov mod6 yea but if you don't painstakingly document it it just won't go past some threshold [22:35]
benkay i don't optimize for pain. [22:35]
benkay rather the opposite. [22:35]
mircea_popescu i do. [22:35]
benkay heh. [22:35]
mircea_popescu it delivers superb results. [22:35]
mircea_popescu the more people are hurt, the better stuff comes out. [22:35]
mod6 i beat dead horses [22:35]
Lyspooner where'd the 2k btc figure come from? [22:36]
mod6 i've said that before. but usually my code works too. [22:36]
mod6 ;] [22:36]
jurov yes bitcoind usually works, too [22:36]
mircea_popescu Lyspooner they lost ~1.2k because the new .8 redownloaded the chain and they autopaid miners submitting as if low diff [22:36]
mod6 haha [22:36]
benkay i optimize for pleasure within my in-group, and i let the rest of the world experience their own mistakes. [22:36]
mircea_popescu they lost a further however much cause of discarded blocks [22:36]
Lyspooner mircea_popescu were they auto-paying miners with coins older than 120 blocks since mined? [22:37]
mircea_popescu yes, the op was quite clear about having lost the 1.2k [22:37]
Lyspooner isn't that the op's fault then? [22:37]
mircea_popescu cause they did what tho ? upgraded ? [22:37]
mircea_popescu sure, it's their fault. [22:38]
Lyspooner anything faster than 120 blocks is the ops fault [22:38]
mircea_popescu because why ? [22:38]
Lyspooner they are paying miners with fresher coins than is safe [22:38]
mircea_popescu i don't think you understand the problem. [22:38]
mircea_popescu as the blockchain was being downloaded, the difficulty was corresponding to very old blocks, ie, very low. [22:39]
jurov Lyspooner pools attract noobs on fast payouts, is that surprising for you? [22:39]
mircea_popescu as miners submitted current work, they were paid for their share of contribution to that low difficulty [22:39]
mircea_popescu ie, very much. [22:39]
Lyspooner maybe i misunderstand mining pools' payouts. but if i do work now, i shouldn't be paid until t+120 [22:40]
mircea_popescu yea well it's not how it works out in practice. [22:40]
mircea_popescu and speaking of that 120... YET MORE MAGIC NUMBERS FUCKING HELL [22:41]
Lyspooner but that's the risk that mining pool ops assume [22:41]
jurov kakobrekla you didn't got doublespended on [22:41]
mircea_popescu Lyspooner not detachedly from the general "trusting devteam" risk [22:41]
kakobrekla smpake is not operating since jan [22:41]
jurov ah smpake is down [22:41]
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mod6 (13:35) < jurov> mod6 yea but if you don't painstakingly document it it just won't go past some threshold << documentation is amazing [22:43]
mod6 i've read tons of technical manuals. i quite like the strangely. [22:44]
mod6 *them [22:44]
mod6 but... it doesn't have to be 50 volumes to be helpful either. [22:44]
mod6 cause the source speaks volumes itself [22:45]
mod6 but there can always be a little guidence on how it is designed, why something is implemented the way it is, etc. [22:45]
mod6 i feel like we need a bitcoin RFC [22:46]
Namworld !ticker [22:46]
assbot Quest for vision is a great blessing. [22:46]
Namworld hmm, assbot is there [22:47]
assbot sup mah niggah [22:47]
maximian assbot thinks its people [22:47]
maximian ;;ticker [22:47]
gribble BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 45.97092, Best ask: 46.00000, Bid-ask spread: 0.02908, Last trade: 46.00000, 24 hour volume: 179859.80684158, 24 hour low: 36.65000, 24 hour high: 48.39999, 24 hour vwap: 43.75220 [22:47]
mircea_popescu lol [22:48]
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maximian market doesn't seem terribly concerned about about all this [22:49]
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maximian at least for now [22:50]
jurov and seeing evoorhees, "blockchain forks. satoshi dice not affected" i guess [22:50]
maximian SatoshiDice bet sizes not being affected by the exchange rate is a nice surprise [22:51]
mircea_popescu github down ? [22:52]
mircea_popescu jurov he had processing turned off for a little. [22:52]
jurov that would be funny if satoshidice kept functional on both sides of the fork [22:56]
mircea_popescu jurov it would be trivial to implement [22:57]
mircea_popescu idiot parade is lucky that evoorhees is a sweetheard, even if they treat him like dirt. [22:57]
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mod6 (12:08) < mircea_popescu> mod6 actually once you're done with the iphone app, a very good use of someone's time is to go through the codebase and summarize it [23:05]
mod6 (12:08) < mircea_popescu> that;s usually a good step towards specification. [23:05]
assbot [BTCTC] [S.DICE-PT] 20 @ 0.00559 = 0.1118 BTC [+] [23:06]
mod6 maybe bitotter can wait [23:06]
mod6 cause i feel like i want to clone and start going through this thing again. last year, I made a shit load of my own changes to get it working on freebsd properly. [23:06]
mod6 anyway, I'll pull to linux and go through the code. [23:07]
mod6 i wont start by making any changes to the source, just review it as I can. [23:07]
mod6 yall should be doing the same thing. [23:07]
mircea_popescu mod6 but listen [23:09]
mircea_popescu you gotta finish projects too [23:09]
mircea_popescu if you only start them, work for some, then start new one... lot of wasted work man. [23:10]
mod6 well, fair enough. [23:10]
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assbot [BTCTC] [PAJKA.BOND] 20 @ 0.1 = 2 BTC [+] [23:13]
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assbot [BTCTC] [LTC-MINING] 1 @ 0.39 BTC [+] [23:19]
assbot [BTCTC] [CRYPTO-TRADE] 1 @ 0.2 BTC [+] [23:21]
mircea_popescu pigeons [23:24]
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mircea_popescu for your pleasure. [23:24]
assbot [BTCTC] [BTC-TRADING-PT] 2 @ 0.1987 = 0.3974 BTC [+] [23:25]
Lyspooner what's a spec [23:26]
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Lyspooner [23:30]
mircea_popescu a specification [23:30]
mircea_popescu spec stands to code in the same relationship contract stands to trade. [23:30]
mircea_popescu you can have trade without contracts but it's a recipe for disaster. [23:31]
Lyspooner i understand it only metaphorically now [23:31]
mircea_popescu that puts you muchly ahead of bitcoin-dev people. [23:32]
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mircea_popescu they don't understand it at all. [23:32]
Lyspooner sweet [23:33]
Lyspooner i'm going to start a foundation [23:33]
assbot [BTCTC] [BTC-BOND] 24 @ 0.00999 = 0.2398 BTC [+] [23:33]
mircea_popescu cool. [23:34]
mircea_popescu P T Barnum's Magical Trading Cards & Bitcoin Esoteric Foundation ? [23:35]
Lyspooner I was thinking: The Bitcoin Best Guess Foundation [23:36]
Lyspooner or Whatever Kinda Works [23:36]
mircea_popescu or that yeah [23:37]
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assbot [BTCTC] [PAJKA.BOND] 5 @ 0.1 = 0.5 BTC [+] [23:57]
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