Forum logs for 09 Feb 2016

Sunday, 24 November, Year 11 d.Tr. | Author: Mircea Popescu
mircea_popescu !up Howdy__ [00:08]
-assbot- You voiced Howdy__ for 30 minutes. [00:08]
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mircea_popescu BingoBoingo " for it's New Madrid, Missouri smelter " [00:10]
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asciilifeform soooo [01:00]
asciilifeform who's for a 'malleus II' that nukes, e.g., idiots spewing ? [01:00]
assbot Satoshi asciilifeform_add_verifyall_option/src/main.cpp ... ( ) [01:00]
asciilifeform and , etc [01:00]
assbot Satoshi asciilifeform_add_verifyall_option/src/main.cpp ... ( ) [01:00]
asciilifeform 'who is not with us, is against us' (tm) (r) (lenin) [01:01]
asciilifeform this would walk the razor's edge of danger, in re splitting trb into own parallel universe, however [01:02]
asciilifeform ergo it ought to be a selectable thing, ideally. [01:02]
asciilifeform but overall it would make sense to have a lenin knob [01:02]
asciilifeform where, say, 0 is maximally permissive (disables malleus, even) and 10 is 'any sign of deviation from trb conventions --> permaban' [01:03]
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asciilifeform if this thing were an actual multithreaded proggy, we could drop the priority of vermin instead of dropping'em entirely, but we have what we have. [01:07]
BingoBoingo BingoBoingo " for it's New Madrid, Missouri smelter " << ty fxd [01:33]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform the definition of "nonstandard tx" is iffy. [01:33]
mircea_popescu so far it'd be a knob connected to not very much. once we have an actually meaningful protocol, then. [01:34]
* BingoBoingo thinks rather than 'malleus II' this would be 'malleus differentpersonium' [01:35]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 28900 @ 0.00056712 = 16.3898 BTC [-] {2} [02:05]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6755 @ 0.00056712 = 3.8309 BTC [-] {2} [02:30]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 26133 @ 0.00056357 = 14.7278 BTC [-] [04:34]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14650 @ 0.00056624 = 8.2954 BTC [+] {4} [05:32]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11350 @ 0.00057179 = 6.4898 BTC [+] {4} [05:59]
deedbot- [Qntra] "Bitcoin Group" Fiat Mining IPO ~70% Under Goal - [06:00]
punkman "At least, if you pay Apple’s premium for Apple design, you do get more design than you get from Microsoft, Google and other laptop manufacturers.  It’s not design created in your interest or for your convenience, but there certainly is plenty of it." [06:06]
punkman [06:10]
assbot SobotkaLeaks: Boiling the Czech Prime Minister » V4Revue ... ( ) [06:10]
punkman [06:17]
assbot ... ( ) [06:17]
deedbot- [BitBet Bets Bets] 1.00000000 BTC on 'Yes' - Bitcoin to top $600 before Jul 2016 - [06:19]
BingoBoingo [06:23]
assbot Image hosted on ... ( ) [06:23]
punkman "-I'm the 38th author... -Wow, that sucks. -I hadn't finished. I'm the 38th author called "Wang" -Oh." [06:26]
assbot Guidelines for the use and interpretation of assays for monitoring autophagy (3rd edition). - PubMed - NCBI ... ( ) [06:26]
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BingoBoingo lol [06:56]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4900 @ 0.00057615 = 2.8231 BTC [+] {2} [07:13]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9800 @ 0.00057661 = 5.6508 BTC [+] {3} [07:48]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6244 @ 0.00057695 = 3.6025 BTC [+] [07:57]
BingoBoingo ANd the AWS cost minimization wank returns [08:25]
assbot Start a Classic node in AWS in under 20 minutes - blockchain included! : btc ... ( ) [08:25]
BingoBoingo In other butthurt chronicles [08:32]
assbot People so upset about the difficulty they are SMASHING their miners to pieces ... ( ) [08:32]
ben_vulpes blockchain inclolded [08:36]
punkman ;;bc,stats [08:37]
gribble Current Blocks: 397535 | Current Difficulty: 1.4411644784734866E11 | Next Difficulty At Block: None | Next Difficulty In: None blocks | Next Difficulty In About: None | Next Difficulty Estimate: None | Estimated Percent Change: None [08:37]
punkman [08:38]
assbot ... ( ) [08:38]
punkman diff only tripled last 12months, bitcoin's dead [08:39]
punkman ETH at 0.0098 btc :/ [08:42]
assbot Logged on 22-01-2016 16:20:52; punkman: terminal: just salty that we didn't buy mp's cheap eth [08:42]
BingoBoingo Brave camho ventures into the bitcointalk cesspool [08:43]
assbot Cryptoqueen - Let's talk about how hot *I* am. [NSFW] ... ( ) [08:43]
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BingoBoingo Spoiler alert, it was a trap. [08:47]
punkman [08:47]
assbot Jolie Holland - Old Fashioned Morphine - YouTube ... ( ) [08:47]
shinohai <<< get her to come put sharpie in pooper for you BingoBoingo [08:50]
assbot Logged on 09-02-2016 11:42:56; BingoBoingo: Spoiler alert, it was a trap. [08:50]
BingoBoingo shinohai: Nah, blew too much money on that when I was drinking. Gotta hodl. [08:53]
shinohai I stay away from the Bitcoin ladies meself. Gotta save and buy new equips. [08:56]
asciilifeform << trivial - if trb marks a tx nonstandard - it is nonstandard!11 [09:06]
assbot Logged on 09-02-2016 04:30:17; mircea_popescu: so far it'd be a knob connected to not very much. once we have an actually meaningful protocol, then. [09:06]
asciilifeform << recall, you can find my aws banhammer on the ml. [09:09]
assbot Logged on 09-02-2016 11:20:54; BingoBoingo: ANd the AWS cost minimization wank returns [09:09]
BingoBoingo asciilifeform: ALready got it deployed and refresh banlist occasionally. Just like the lulz of their image only existing for single AWS site in Oregon. [09:10]
asciilifeform << this may actually be a rational thing to do - scorched earth [09:13]
assbot Logged on 09-02-2016 11:28:25; BingoBoingo: In other butthurt chronicles [09:13]
asciilifeform in light of rumour of usg buying up cheap old asic [09:13]
BingoBoingo Seriously, because fuck Dave who buys old mining equipment at a loss and has his powerbill paid by Satan [09:14]
BingoBoingo Not a rumor [09:14]
asciilifeform aha [09:14]
BingoBoingo Megabigpower is the OP [09:14]
BingoBoingo Dave, lesser partner previous asic scam venture fronts it. [09:14]
BingoBoingo Back in late 2012 there were 4 kinda serious presenting operations promising Asics. Asicminer, Avalon, and BFL. Dave was with the other one. [09:15]
asciilifeform << paulgrahamocalypse??!! [09:18]
assbot ... ( ) [09:18]
BingoBoingo Blame for the failure went to the venture's major partner Tom [09:18]
BingoBoingo Sweet [09:18]
asciilifeform re: 'apple fans coming to hate apple software', this is when folks learn that ~liking~ is optional: you use a sov institution because ~no alternative~ [09:20]
asciilifeform (and note, if, satan help you, you need a laptop comp that ~actually works~, or a pocket terminal that doesn't resemble an infested xp box, there is very much no alternative) [09:27]
punkman except it no longer "actually works"? [09:32]
asciilifeform vs the supposed alternatives - works [09:33]
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asciilifeform if i need a unix box with lid suspend, stuck with crapple. ditto re: sane handling of hotplugged external displays. and 1,01 other items. [09:35]
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asciilifeform << lulzy, full of folks crying over linux circa early 2000s [09:41]
assbot Apple fans are coming to hate Apple software | Hacker News ... ( ) [09:42]
ben_vulpes takes a rather lot to override apple-scale stockholm [10:05]
asciilifeform << what stockholm. It's the only working portable comp vendor. [10:09]
assbot Logged on 09-02-2016 13:01:24; ben_vulpes: takes a rather lot to override apple-scale stockholm [10:09]
ben_vulpes not apple stockholm i suppose nearly so much as usa stockholm [10:12]
ben_vulpes i for instance just bought three of the things, but only because of the Apple Developer Ratchet [10:13]
asciilifeform actually the usa trap is quite similar [10:14]
ben_vulpes o yes? [10:15]
asciilifeform aha, thinkaboutit [10:15]
asciilifeform !s gravity well [10:16]
assbot 38 results for 'gravity well' : [10:16]
asciilifeform incidentally i don't develop for crapple nor ever intend to, and still stuck with it [10:17]
asciilifeform in fact, it is for running & building entirely posixy things [10:18]
ben_vulpes not irc on the train? [10:19]
asciilifeform nah thats what ipnohe is for [10:20]
BingoBoingo NSFL [10:24]
assbot ... ( ) [10:24]
asciilifeform ben_vulpes: i've never met a crapple user who despised it as much as i did. [10:24]
ben_vulpes << great charts [10:24]
assbot Cam Newton Never Had A Chance | FiveThirtyEight ... ( ) [10:25]
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asciilifeform i don't like, need or want the graphics, the idiot skeumorphisms, the 'ease of use', the payware, or the compatibility [10:25]
ben_vulpes preach [10:25]
asciilifeform i just need a motherfucking knapsack unix box that never has to be powered down, hotplugs displays, and '4k' lcd. [10:25]
asciilifeform this is sold by... one vendor. [10:26]
ben_vulpes i need a workstation for doing work, and a comms box for doing comms. [10:26]
asciilifeform i have a workstation, it is for doing things i actually give half a fuck about. [10:28]
asciilifeform and then there is the other box, for work. [10:28]
asciilifeform the aluminum anchor. [10:28]
ben_vulpes macbook macht frei [10:29]
asciilifeform and, speaking of which, bbl. [10:29]
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shinohai Can any asseteers tell me if this is a worthy SSD? [10:44]
mircea_popescu << no, it's just mayogendered. this is the primary cause of butthurt in the obeetus : first year they eat, they increase 10x. [10:44]
assbot Samsung SSD 850 EVO 1TB, MZ-75E1T0B_EU: Computers & Accessories ... ( ) [10:44]
assbot Logged on 09-02-2016 11:35:02; punkman: diff only tripled last 12months, bitcoin's dead [10:44]
* shinohai not having much SSD experience. [10:44]
mircea_popescu but then because of that very increase, ironically, even if they eat 2x as much the 2nd year, they can only maange a measly 3x [10:44]
mircea_popescu and it goes downhill from there [10:44]
mircea_popescu fuck gravity! [10:45]
mircea_popescu !up Steve__ [10:45]
-assbot- You voiced Steve__ for 30 minutes. [10:45]
* assbot gives voice to Steve__ [10:45]
mircea_popescu shinohai << as per teh expert. [10:46]
assbot Logged on 01-02-2016 23:00:43; BingoBoingo: SSD market pretty much consists on Samsung, Intel, and other firms that just use surplus parts from samsung [10:46]
shinohai Good I must be on right track. [10:46]
BingoBoingo shinohai: Should be fine. If used for sensitive purposes RAID it up per alf's advice [10:47]
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mircea_popescu anyway, looking at the graphs bitcoin ~was~ actually dead march to about sept 2015/ [10:48]
shinohai I figured why not go ahead and shop for 1TB drive since I am using it for node purposes, though pricier than I had imagined. [10:48]
mircea_popescu people are fucking late. shoulda derped about how dead it is back then. [10:48]
mircea_popescu shinohai for that reason! 500gb is enough for now. 1tb in a few years, will be cheaper. [10:48]
BingoBoingo shinohai: Check Newegg [10:48]
BingoBoingo Newegg has 500 for about 150 and 1tb a bit over 300 [10:49]
shinohai Will do. Also anyone needing me for menial tasks such as proofreading or Spanish-to-English translations contact me plox [10:49]
BingoBoingo That one's off by too much on price [10:49]
mircea_popescu oh, they're the same price ? nm me then. [10:49]
shinohai 300 for 1 TB O.o wow [10:50]
shinohai not bad [10:50]
mircea_popescu shinohai do you charge a lot and is your spanish very good ? [10:50]
BingoBoingo A bit over, but as cheap as I've seen them [10:50]
shinohai mircea_popescu: nope I'll do my best to undercut anyone. pussyfreak can vouch for my Spanish if he comes back, being from Spain and all lol. [10:51]
mircea_popescu how about you vouch for your spanish. pick any of my articles that discuss argentina and show me! [10:52]
BingoBoingo shinohai: The price amazon is selling the evo for is about the price amazon is selling the pro for. The difference between the two is apparently pro gets bigger warranty, hotter running controller (potential point of failure) and derp about longer write endurance [10:52]
mircea_popescu write endurance is notably not a major point of interest for bitcoin node ssds. the way it works is that most of the files are stable forever, and you have a hot end you keep adding to. this is a match made in heaven for ssds, they can use the spare capacity to compensate for your rewrites and once done it's done. [10:53]
shinohai I was concerned about write endurance because some folks have said ssd's aren't suitable for nodes. :/ [10:53]
mircea_popescu oddly enough, the io constraindness of the bitcoin makes for better ssd fit. [10:53]
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mircea_popescu << our friend tom van dyke, the sweet blood and tears guy ? [10:55]
assbot Logged on 09-02-2016 12:14:06; BingoBoingo: Blame for the failure went to the venture's major partner Tom [10:55]
mircea_popescu << all good things have an end ; shitty things have numerous ends. [10:55]
assbot Logged on 09-02-2016 12:14:00; asciilifeform: << paulgrahamocalypse??!! [10:55]
BingoBoingo mircea_popescu: I believe so. Isn't he the one who did the FPGA thing with BuzzDave and professed to be doing the ASIC thing? [10:56]
mircea_popescu anyway, the winds have pointedly turned against apple. the time when they did that "we'll brick your device if you used other parts in it" thing i'd arbitrarily pick as the jumping the shark moment. but in any case : apple is for the next decade a company to sell, not to hold and CERTAINLY not to buy. [10:56]
mircea_popescu BingoBoingo yeh. course, fpga thing even then counted more like amateur hour than anything. [10:57]
mircea_popescu which i suspect is the proximate reason no blame attached to buzzdave [10:57]
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mircea_popescu <<< i'm with ben and the whole rest of the world on this. you display a very entrenched form of stockholm syndrome. not just here - but in all points of confort. can't move out of dc because it's the only swamp in the world with lid suspension and hotplugging something or the other, gotta use apple because insanoarcana, etc. [10:58]
assbot Logged on 09-02-2016 13:05:21; asciilifeform: << what stockholm. It's the only working portable comp vendor. [10:58]
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mircea_popescu it's all fine and dandy, makes up the very characteristic weird we've come to love under the label alf, but do not expect it's a consideration (or even meaningful) for anyone else. [10:59]
ben_vulpes unrelatedly [11:01]
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ben_vulpes who is john w. wilkinson and is there any reason to keep his json spirit license around? [11:02]
mircea_popescu << this is sold by one vendor in the arbitrary, pointless package you've chosen, and by EVERY SINGLE VENDOR as a desktop. and so on. [11:02]
assbot Logged on 09-02-2016 13:21:54; asciilifeform: this is sold by... one vendor. [11:02]
mircea_popescu ben_vulpes be specific ? [11:02]
ben_vulpes bitcoin/src/json/LICENSE.txt [11:02]
mircea_popescu eh, wipe all licenses. tmsr does not honor agreements between parties not attached to the wot. [11:03]
ben_vulpes in line with my thinking [11:03]
mircea_popescu for the lulz : [11:04]
mircea_popescu [11:04]
assbot Page not found | ... ( ) [11:04]
mircea_popescu :D [11:04]
mircea_popescu you WOULD THINK [11:04]
mircea_popescu but naaaaah [11:04]
mircea_popescu it's just the plastic wanna-be crap, has nothing to do with bitcoin [11:04]
ben_vulpes << also lulzy? [11:04]
assbot 404 Not Found ... ( ) [11:04]
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mircea_popescu ah but this si trivially fixed! [11:06]
mircea_popescu can anyone with privileges plox redirect to thankee [11:06]
assbot 404 Not Found ... ( ) [11:06]
assbot Satoshi ... ( ) [11:06]
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ben_vulpes paging mod6 to the preactor control room [11:07]
mircea_popescu as you can see my dear vulpes, it's not that we're BORN any better. it's that we've been doing something about it since then. [11:07]
mircea_popescu in other news of no particular interest, long sloppy blowjob the night before means you'll be picking red hairs out of your crotch for the rest of the morning. [11:08]
ben_vulpes hair splinters for everyone [11:09]
mircea_popescu and speaking of apple users and alf-citizens, [11:11]
ben_vulpes in other news we call this occasionally-accumulating infant smegma "neck cheese" because mothers milk comes back up as ricotta [11:11]
assbot ... ( ) [11:11]
mircea_popescu ben_vulpes ahjahahaha! [11:11]
ben_vulpes ahaha mircea_popescu yours is funny too! [11:11]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 57924 @ 0.0005778 = 33.4685 BTC [+] {2} [11:11]
ben_vulpes ;;seen pete_dushenski [11:11]
gribble pete_dushenski was last seen in #bitcoin-assets 5 days, 13 hours, 38 minutes, and 24 seconds ago: off to pickup new specs. if i'm not back this evening, i'll be around under 'pete_d_out' over the coming days. cheers! [11:11]
ben_vulpes ;;seen pete_d_out [11:12]
gribble pete_d_out was last seen in #bitcoin-assets 3 days, 0 hours, 5 minutes, and 20 seconds ago: well, my clock's running out. i'll check back in soon :) [11:12]
ben_vulpes ;;seen pete_dior [11:12]
gribble I have not seen pete_dior. [11:12]
ben_vulpes wait [11:12]
ben_vulpes pete_d_out? [11:12]
ben_vulpes doesn't that get you on some kind of vile criminal list in canada? [11:13]
mircea_popescu ;;seen fabulous_pete_dolcegrabanya [11:13]
gribble I have not seen fabulous_pete_dolcegrabanya. [11:13]
mircea_popescu ;;seen hot_stuffs_pete_chanel [11:13]
gribble I have not seen hot_stuffs_pete_chanel. [11:13]
mircea_popescu hm. [11:13]
ben_vulpes something is amiss [11:14]
mircea_popescu i never expected him to not show up under his PROFESSIONAL names... [11:14]
ben_vulpes no no i think those are different [11:15]
ben_vulpes ;;seen pete_driver [11:16]
gribble I have not seen pete_driver. [11:16]
ben_vulpes good porn name, that. [11:16]
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mircea_popescu ;;google the mailman always petes the door three times [11:18]
gribble Random Events - Pages :: Tip.It RuneScape Help :: The Original ...: ; Flight of the Phoenix - Arrested Development Wiki - Wikia: ; GOOD FELLAS by Nicholas Pileggi and Martin Scorcese - Daily Script: [11:18]
ben_vulpes this alphabetical sorting of patches in v flow grates on me for some reason i'm struggling to articulate. [11:19]
PeterL they should be in the order they get applied? [11:20]
ben_vulpes and its implicit use in pressing. [11:20]
ben_vulpes PeterL: the list of patches gets alphasorted before toposorting in all implementations i've seen to date. [11:21]
PeterL but why should the alphasort matter? [11:22]
ben_vulpes if a v implementation recurses up from the pressed head, it doesn't. [11:22]
ben_vulpes er [11:22]
ben_vulpes from the desired head to press, it doesn't. [11:22]
ben_vulpes if instead a v implementation presses each patch in the flow... [11:22]
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mircea_popescu so don't sort. [11:33]
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PeterL I guess alphasorting is a cheap way to ensure consistency between presses of equal sets? [11:35]
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mircea_popescu if it is then it's probably hiding a bug or three [11:41]
PeterL meh, I guess thinking about it, I guess if two patches are of equal level, then it does not matter which order they get applied? [11:42]
PeterL sort of by definition of equal level? [11:43]
PeterL or am I totally confused? [11:43]
ben_vulpes draw the graph, it's a useful exercise. [11:43]
PeterL so we should not need to alphasort anything? [11:44]
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ben_vulpes well, "need". [11:44]
ben_vulpes but no, not imho. [11:45]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 32400 @ 0.00057604 = 18.6637 BTC [-] [11:46]
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* ben_vulpes waves at alf's diddling [11:48]
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mircea_popescu artifexd , asciilifeform , ben_vulpes , bingoboingo , cazalla , chetty , danielpbarron , davout , diametric , dignork , fluffypony , hanbot , jurov , kakobrekla , mats , mike_c , mircea_popescu , mod6 , mthreat , nubbins` , pete_dushenski , punkman , thestringpuller , trinque , phf , diana_coman : [11:58]
assbot The Lordship list, third year. on Trilema - A blog by Mircea Popescu. ... ( ) [11:58]
* fluffypony clicks [11:58]
mircea_popescu you can thank ben_vulpes for making work for everyone! [11:59]
fluffypony hah hah, 10/10 [11:59]
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mircea_popescu PeterL> or am I totally confused? << a patch can only be safely applied to its antecedent. two patches at the same level CAN NOT be both applied by definition. [12:01]
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mircea_popescu you pick one per level. [12:01]
PeterL if they affect different files, they could be the same level? [12:02]
mircea_popescu well i have nfi what you mean by "same level", but to my eyes and from graph theory considerations it would mean "patches applied atop the same one patch" [12:02]
PeterL well, trying to decide order of patches to apply, if they affect different files then it does not matter which order you use? [12:03]
mircea_popescu thye chain you see, X is applied on "that patch with hash h1", ie G ; and in turn Y is applied to "that patch with hash h2", ie X [12:03]
mircea_popescu it does, counterintuitively. [12:03]
ben_vulpes ill meaning! [12:04]
ben_vulpes thrice cursed! [12:04]
mircea_popescu lol [12:04]
PeterL so even if different files are affected, you have to specify the order? [12:04]
mircea_popescu you necessarily and always specify the order when you write the patch, because it includes the hash of the thing you want it applied on top of. [12:05]
mircea_popescu understand, this "different files" is flimsy as fuck. for all you know the "same files" are not really the same at all - their content changed. [12:05]
* assbot gives voice to diana_coman [12:05]
ben_vulpes more to the point with artifexd he bit off gossipd, claimed progress, and then vanished. [12:06]
mircea_popescu hey, when richard was gone to the crusades forever they put john on the throne. [12:06]
mircea_popescu good law! [12:06]
mircea_popescu then he came back there was a bit of trouble, but nothing we can't handle. [12:06]
ben_vulpes sure yeah people have been inquiring politely for... [12:07]
ben_vulpes ;;seen artifexd [12:07]
gribble artifexd was last seen in #bitcoin-assets 41 weeks, 5 days, 16 hours, 46 minutes, and 35 seconds ago: I'm comfortable calling it a review. Not just of what it is but what it was and how it got to where it is. [12:07]
ben_vulpes nearly 42 weeks now. [12:07]
ben_vulpes ;;later tell artifexd yo it's going to be much harder to get back in than it will be to preserve your seat now [12:08]
gribble The operation succeeded. [12:08]
mircea_popescu well... much. [12:08]
* ben_vulpes rolls eyes [12:09]
mircea_popescu my doctrine is that it's the simplest thing in the world for a lord to get his seat. [12:09]
mircea_popescu all he has to do is ask. [12:09]
mircea_popescu and if one isn't a lord... well... why would they want it ? fucking milstone around one's neck of the first degree. [12:09]
ben_vulpes hm [12:12]
ben_vulpes i'm not sold on diana_coman [12:13]
diana_coman I am honoured to be proposed to the list; I might add that I am quite likely to be of the silent type indeed at least for the time being [12:14]
deedbot- [Trilema] The Lordship list, third year. - [12:15]
mircea_popescu ben_vulpes next month's filing might clarify. [12:15]
mircea_popescu in any case we're early here, two months til april, and then all of april. [12:15]
ben_vulpes aha! [12:15]
ben_vulpes legendarily long lead time for feedback here, just getting ahead of things. [12:15]
* ben_vulpes is open to being sold, grew up in america after all [12:16]
PeterL only one female on the lordship list? you guys are so sexist! Clearly we need some affirmative action around here? [12:18]
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mircea_popescu either that or more women that went to school for purposes other than talking about boys. [12:19]
mircea_popescu also, i thought kakobrekla was a girl ? no ? because -a ? [12:19]
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ben_vulpes and the tits! [12:19]
mircea_popescu a right, there is that alos. [12:19]
ben_vulpes hey mod6 here's an edge case for you [12:20]
ben_vulpes press a patch without hashes in the headers [12:20]
mircea_popescu thanks got PeterL was confused earlier eh ben_vulpes ? [12:20]
* assbot gives voice to kakobrekla [12:21]
kakobrekla chix with dix [12:21]
ben_vulpes and mats with tits [12:21]
mircea_popescu masTITIS! [12:21]
kakobrekla aha [12:21]
diana_coman ^^^ ftr I can't remember ANY setting later than nursery in which I wasn't in a setup of at least 1:2 female:male [12:21]
mircea_popescu and in more "i married the wrong girl" news, [12:21]
assbot ... ( ) [12:21]
phf shinohai: Can any asseteers tell me if this is a worthy SSD? << i've been using it's precursor, 250gb 830, as my primary drive for three years now, have nothing to complain about it. unless samsung fucked something up, an 850 will be my next purchase [12:22]
PeterL my high school calculus class was 3 boys and about 18 girls [12:22]
mircea_popescu diana_coman as long as you enjoyed it... [12:22]
mircea_popescu PeterL so invite them over. [12:22]
PeterL meh, i don't talk with any of them, that was like 15 years ago [12:23]
ben_vulpes PeterL: public school? [12:23]
PeterL yup [12:23]
mircea_popescu PeterL now you see everyone else's problem [12:23]
mircea_popescu well, everyone else's other than me, but anyway! [12:23]
ben_vulpes i have a completely unbacked theory that the further you go down the american income/class ladder the more girls you'll get in those classes. [12:24]
PeterL actually no, I don't see everybodys problem? [12:24]
mircea_popescu ben_vulpes you know for everyone from europe public school = best school. private school is where people with money send their retarded offspring to keep up the pretense. [12:24]
mircea_popescu PeterL "nobody kept in touch with the smart women they met so they have no proposals to make so the list is mostly guys" [12:24]
ben_vulpes mircea_popescu: and you know that public school in america is just daycare. [12:24]
mircea_popescu aha. [12:25]
phf my highschool class from about grade 8 and on was 16 girls and 5 guys [12:25]
PeterL aha, now I get it [12:25]
diana_coman hm, we were 11 girls: 22 boys precisely in high school (cs class ie maths+physics+programming) [12:25]
ben_vulpes diana_coman: eurozone? [12:25]
diana_coman Romania [12:25]
mircea_popescu diana_coman cluj suprareal cca late 1990s had exactly ONE girl in the set of 8 people that were accepted on merit, and about 14 in the set of 17 others who were accepted to pad the class so it may be made. [12:25]
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mircea_popescu phf where was this ? [12:26]
diana_coman bwahahaha, our class was simply and unashamedly skimmed as "top 33" based on admission exam results [12:26]
phf moscows, naturally [12:27]
mircea_popescu ah. [12:27]
mircea_popescu diana_coman the way this worked was, "gpa over X", which meant 8 people out of the region. then everyone went into the normal-great classes. but THEN it came word from the miniostry that they won't run a class for 8 people [12:27]
diana_coman after which they proceeded to bash us that "you will end up washing the floors in supermarkets" [12:27]
mircea_popescu and so the highschool admitted 17 more people into it, off the end of the list. [12:27]
mircea_popescu which you know... who was going to complain about it. [12:28]
mod6 <+ben_vulpes> press a patch without hashes in the headers << i've actually got that one covered in the patch im about to put out there tonight. [12:28]
phf there was a slightly different ratio in the B class, which was everyone who didn't make the A class. [12:28]
mod6 if/when you can get the new patch applied, give it a try and let me know. thx. [12:28]
ben_vulpes neat [12:28]
* mircea_popescu is vaguely envious of phf's adolescentine paradise. i expect they were all lanky slav coughars with uncharacteristically large tits for that type, and spent a lot of time doing stuff in the nude [12:28]
mircea_popescu AND YOU CAN'T TELL ME ANY DIFFERENT! [12:29]
diana_coman aha, the 8 class thing would've been a great thing though [12:29]
mircea_popescu diana_coman actually the way it played out was imo the best possible outcome. [12:29]
ben_vulpes mod6: what kind of patch are you shipping? ri patch or v patch? [12:29]
shinohai thx phf and congrats to all who have made the Lord's list. [12:30]
mod6 shipping? it'll just be a whole bundle once we do a bit of testing -- but tonights patch will be a squashed patch of the one from last week, and the additional changes here. [12:30]
ben_vulpes it ain't april yet shinohai [12:30]
phf but the school was already selective, was ran by a strong Georgian woman. if you didn't perform would get a visit with the principle. "your child will have a very hard time next year. a ~very~ hard time. we advise you move schools immediately". i know because my parents got the talk once or twice [12:30]
mod6 will basically encompass what will be v99995 [12:30]
mircea_popescu it's funny how good education ~always~ comes down to a woman with a whip. [12:31]
ben_vulpes word [12:31]
mod6 i updated alot of the automate tests, and added a number of them, to ensure that i didn't regress anywhere. so far, seems good. [12:31]
mircea_popescu and little bitches a la orwell whining about it. [12:31]
punkman opinions: +1 to both additions. would be nice to see artifexd return. fluffy and nubbins can keep their lordships unless they wish to abdicate. [12:31]
ben_vulpes ooh [12:33]
* ben_vulpes tries to reconcile 'lord can have seat back for asking' with the booting of fluffypony and nubbins` [12:33]
trinque !rated phf [12:34]
PeterL maybe you need a "lord emeritus" status for people who are not presently active? [12:34]
assbot You have not rated phf. [12:34]
mircea_popescu wasn't "have back", was have at all and in general. [12:34]
mircea_popescu PeterL no such thing! they can self-apply that, easy enough to verify. [12:34]
ben_vulpes !rated phf [12:34]
assbot You rated user phf on 16-Apr-2014, with a rating of 1, and supplied these additional notes: lisper.. [12:34]
ben_vulpes mircea_popescu: ah [12:35]
ben_vulpes perhaps i see a glimmer [12:35]
ben_vulpes PeterL: i was thinking about a deadbot- ! [12:35]
mircea_popescu ben_vulpes wasn't a matter of [person who was once branded a lord] [can have seat back for asking]. it was a matter of [person who was born with the mettle and greatness of being a lord] [can have a seat whether they had one or never did just by basically existing in their grandiose state]. [12:35]
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phf hehe, my +v workhorse rating, ty ben_vulpes [12:36]
trinque !rate phf 2 provided example CL code for next deedbot, made excellent v-patch viewer, intelligent fellow [12:36]
assbot Request successful, get your OTP: [12:36]
thestringpuller trinque: I think you're right about the whole SSD thing. I'm going to resync on my giga-box for more tests, but it seems bootstrapping performance is increased more by adding SSD than adding more CPU's (unless you're adding like 20 cores to the thing but even then) [12:36]
mircea_popescu !rated phf [12:36]
assbot You rated user phf on 24-Jun-2015, with a rating of 2, and supplied these additional notes: Fixed our boxen!. [12:36]
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mircea_popescu nb. [12:36]
trinque !v assbot:trinque.rate.phf.2:5167af628daff6a6257f3d4a95319406f789276d76fa8ef57ca1946b511a5add [12:36]
assbot Successfully added a rating of 2 for phf with note: provided example CL code for next deedbot, made excellent v-patch viewer, intelligent fellow [12:36]
trinque thestringpuller: yes, it's quite IO hungry [12:37]
mircea_popescu thestringpuller it still mostly uses one core no matter what you do [12:37]
shinohai Is there an official court jester post? [12:37]
mircea_popescu notrly... [12:37]
ben_vulpes they usually get shitcanned shinohai [12:38]
BingoBoingo shinohai: Just wait for vexual to hit your pm's [12:38]
ben_vulpes haha BingoBoingo has it [12:38]
ben_vulpes entertaining feller. [12:38]
shinohai I used to get pm's from Vexual EVRY GODDAMNED SATURDAY [12:38]
mod6 ben_vulpes: here's a peek at the squshed beta 1 & beta 2 vpatches - unless something changes between now and tonight, i'll be sending this one to the ML. All you need to do to apply is get V [v99996], copy `' to ``, then place this patch in the same dir and do: `patch -p0 < V_v99995_beta2.vpatch` and give it a go [12:38]
mod6 [12:38]
assbot ... ( ) [12:38]
thestringpuller mircea_popescu: yea, my P4 that's overclocked has had the best performance in bootstrapping. [12:39]
thestringpuller 64-bit 3.4 ghz OC [12:39]
fluffypony shinohai: hah hah, me too [12:39]
ben_vulpes mod6: V in V! [12:39]
* shinohai pets fluffypony [12:40]
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ben_vulpes nifty mod6 [12:40]
ben_vulpes doubt i'll get to it today tho [12:40]
asciilifeform finally my lazy arse has 'irc bounce' [12:40]
mod6 anyway, will re-walk through this all again tonight, etc. then will sign and send to ML. [12:41]
BingoBoingo Congrats asciilifeform [12:41]
* ben_vulpes falls over [12:41]
shinohai mod6: new trb is at height 284171 [12:41]
shinohai *trb node [12:42]
mircea_popescu ben_vulpes> doubt i'll get to it today tho << "there's all this delicious administrative shit to fuck around with early, who has time for codings!!!" [12:42]
ben_vulpes hey i was hacking all am [12:42]
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mircea_popescu asciilifeform congratulations! [12:42]
asciilifeform << l0l, mircea_popescu must think that my lunch money alone keeps crapple alive ? [12:42]
assbot Logged on 09-02-2016 13:55:09; mircea_popescu: it's all fine and dandy, makes up the very characteristic weird we've come to love under the label alf, but do not expect it's a consideration (or even meaningful) for anyone else. [12:42]
asciilifeform ty mircea_popescu [12:42]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform dude wtf are you channeling jwz ? [12:43]
mircea_popescu "shitting i nthe soup is not a problem, not all the floating turds are mine!" [12:43]
BingoBoingo !b 1 [12:43]
assbot Last 1 lines bashed and pending review. ( ) [12:43]
mircea_popescu who the fuck cares about the effects! [12:43]
mircea_popescu the discussion is whether the cause is problematic or not. [12:43]
diana_coman mircea_popescu> ben_vulpes you know for everyone from europe public school = best school. private school is where people with money send their retarded offspring to keep up the pretense. <- +1 to that; I might add the only exception to this rule I found in northern Italy where "private" meant in fact province (autonomous, German-speaking-and-doing province) funded [12:43]
mircea_popescu aha. there are pockets like that yeah [12:44]
asciilifeform just observing that neither i nor the other million chumps are enthusiastic coprophagics, we were simply given a menu of shit and broken glass, and picked shit [12:44]
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BingoBoingo Also got broken glass [12:44]
asciilifeform in the end, everybody gets both [12:44]
mircea_popescu and this matters in the sense that ximenez of spain really was interested in whether the witch had or hadn't orgasmed with the devil. [12:44]
ben_vulpes i hate this thread [12:44]
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mod6 <+shinohai> mod6: new trb is at height 284171 << good deal, thanks for reporting :] [12:45]
asciilifeform l0l ben_vulpes, how is your rusting aluminum anchor [12:45]
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ben_vulpes it has *chips* out of it asciilifeform, thank you for asking. [12:45]
asciilifeform whaddayado with it? hammer nails? [12:45]
ben_vulpes nfi [12:45]
asciilifeform or does it start coming apart by its lonesome after a few yrs [12:45]
ben_vulpes pretty standard decomposition pattern i think now [12:46]
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* asciilifeform has an original 'air' that is still pristine [12:46]
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ben_vulpes leading edge just torso-ward of the hands starts chipping after some time [12:46]
ben_vulpes i am a barbarian though and it must be my fault somehow for expecting my tools to be robust [12:46]
ben_vulpes i give precisely zero fucks about lightweight laptops. [12:46]
ben_vulpes if it's made of METAL i want to HIT PEOPLE WITH IT [12:47]
ben_vulpes and not worry about the delicate internals [12:47]
trinque that thinkpad is dead. [12:47]
trinque DEAD [12:47]
BingoBoingo Aluminum D cell maglite I've used as hammer does not have chips out of it. [12:47]
asciilifeform << this goes to the ancient turd, still has, e.g., irc in it!!111111 [12:47]
assbot Logged on 09-02-2016 14:02:49; mircea_popescu: can anyone with privileges plox redirect to thankee [12:47]
asciilifeform no good ^ [12:47]
asciilifeform ( [12:47]
thestringpuller asciilifeform: is it blizzarding like dairy queen up there [12:47]
asciilifeform thestringpuller: where [12:47]
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BingoBoingo It' snuffling snow here [12:47]
BingoBoingo Shoveled at about 4 am and brined concrete. Now snow has doubled, concrete still clean. [12:48]
asciilifeform ben_vulpes: a good chunk of the weight of all of these is 1) battery 2) cpu heat pipes -- for all of which, you can thank idiot intel/x86. [12:49]
shinohai I have snow here as well, just strong flurries nothing to write home about. [12:49]
asciilifeform fuck x86. with red hot bayonet. [12:49]
mod6 <+mircea_popescu> can anyone with privileges plox redirect to thankee << yup, np. will resolve later today. [12:49]
assbot 404 Not Found ... ( ) [12:50]
assbot Satoshi ... ( ) [12:50]
BingoBoingo thestringpuller: Roads here are clusterfuck because no one could anticipate 2nd round of snow coming this morning [12:50]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform aha, it is the source of where it starts. [12:50]
asciilifeform << and you would rather have what ? [12:50]
assbot Logged on 09-02-2016 14:17:35; ben_vulpes: PeterL: the list of patches gets alphasorted before toposorting in all implementations i've seen to date. [12:50]
mircea_popescu like it or not, part of us, like the iliterate mother part of napoleon. [12:50]
asciilifeform sorted by file handle # ? [12:50]
asciilifeform random ? [12:50]
mircea_popescu "unspecified" [12:50]
asciilifeform fuck unspecified. [12:50]
mircea_popescu why specify what needn't be [12:50]
thestringpuller BingoBoingo: I'd expect midwesterners to know how to drive in snow belt weather... Here we get 2 inches, the roads freeze and everyone freaks out like its The Walking Dead or some shit. [12:50]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: because anything that can be deterministic, should be. [12:51]
asciilifeform because otherwise heisenbugs. [12:51]
mod6 to asciilifeform's point tho, i'm not too sure what even exists in the lxr thing, and if is congruent with what's in the V mirror [12:51]
BingoBoingo thestringpuller: Problem is water under snow. Dept of Roads does not brine as generously as I do. [12:51]
asciilifeform lxr has a several month-old bleeding edge v. [12:51]
asciilifeform but imho linking to the ancient 0.5.3 by default is lunacy. [12:51]
asciilifeform it is relevant to nobody anywhere. [12:51]
asciilifeform other than archaeologists. [12:52]
thestringpuller BingoBoingo: aha. so even there you'll see cars in ditches with people telling cops "i dunno what happened, i just slippped and ended up in here" [12:52]
BingoBoingo thestringpuller: Yes. Very little snow, but enough to cull weakest drivers. [12:52]
BingoBoingo If alarm was raised in time those drivers would have normally stayed home, but because they were not explicitly told road is slick all suffer [12:53]
PeterL this morning we had a bit of snow, I slid about 10 yards past the entrance to work, antilock brakes kicked in, had to shift to reverse and go back to turn into parking lot [12:54]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform this is nonsense. by that rule you should hang. [12:55]
asciilifeform hows that [12:55]
mircea_popescu so you be deterministic too. [12:55]
asciilifeform i don't ~want~ my computer alive. [12:56]
asciilifeform do you ? [12:56]
mircea_popescu trb is alive whether you want it or not. [12:56]
shinohai ^ [12:56]
asciilifeform if wanted alive, would buy a cow. [12:56]
asciilifeform trb is alive, v is a knife. [12:56]
mircea_popescu cow doesn't give limited milk. [12:56]
asciilifeform i do not want knife with a will of its own. [12:56]
mircea_popescu hm. you ever seen modern knives as used on people ? [12:57]
asciilifeform and i can't fathom why mircea_popescu would. [12:57]
mircea_popescu practically, will of own. [12:57]
mircea_popescu i don't want anything, whatsoever. and i still don;t care what the effects would be. [12:57]
mircea_popescu the notion itself, of the basis you propose, seems to me problematic. [12:57]
asciilifeform the notion is that a tool ought to behave maximally predictably. [12:57]
asciilifeform otherwise we call it something else, wtf, mechanical girlfriend [12:58]
mircea_popescu why should a tool become a means by which you may pretend to enact determinism out of absent such ? [12:58]
mircea_popescu it'll just lie to you. [12:58]
asciilifeform because it isn't absent if i nail it down. [12:58]
mircea_popescu by protocol or by promise ? [12:58]
asciilifeform by protocol. [12:58]
mircea_popescu this nailing down... stick to nailing the mechanical gfs. reality has no holes. [12:58]
mircea_popescu i don't see where this is in the protocol ? [12:59]
shinohai BingoBoingo: this might be worth paying to see, drunk or no: [12:59]
assbot ... ( ) [12:59]
mircea_popescu what specifically would prevent me from later making a non-alpha-sorting V ? [12:59]
asciilifeform where i wrote the routine, which sorts by ascii and then by flow. [12:59]
mircea_popescu that is not hte protocol, that is the spec of one implemen tation among many [12:59]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: nothing at all. this feature isn't even interesting. [12:59]
BingoBoingo shinohai: lol [12:59]
mircea_popescu and if you want everyone to change his, you are basically building on promise. [12:59]
mircea_popescu well the feature isn't interesting in itself, other than for this discussion. [13:00]
asciilifeform i see mircea_popescu's point here [13:00]
asciilifeform 'thou shalt not rely on the splinters on the chair legs being just-so' [13:00]
asciilifeform or somethinglikethat. [13:00]
mircea_popescu pretty much. [13:00]
asciilifeform << 'levels' have no useful meaning here. any two patches that don't take a file with hash H and try to transform it into two disparage H' and H'', can be pressed together. [13:03]
assbot Logged on 09-02-2016 14:57:13; mircea_popescu: PeterL> or am I totally confused? << a patch can only be safely applied to its antecedent. two patches at the same level CAN NOT be both applied by definition. [13:03]
asciilifeform *disparate [13:03]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform my idea of "level" was "all patches taking a certain hash as input" [13:03]
asciilifeform likewise, they must not attempt to transform X' and disparate X'' into a Y [13:03]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: in that case yes. [13:03]
asciilifeform but this is not what level normally means when looking at a DAG. [13:04]
mircea_popescu im not sure what his idea of level was, prolly not too strictly defined. [13:04]
mircea_popescu no, but it would be if you're looking at a tree [13:04]
* mircea_popescu confesses to still thinking of v tron in terms of tree not exactly dag. [13:04]
asciilifeform only if the tree were specially drawn this way [13:04]
mircea_popescu even if trees are necessarily dag's rite ? [13:04]
asciilifeform aha [13:04]
asciilifeform but note, this is not strictly speaking a tree [13:04]
mircea_popescu i also confess to mentally having an imaginary pre-G as a master node for all the various G's such as shiva's bitcoins v's etc. [13:05]
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mircea_popescu or you meant somethign else ? [13:05]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: specifically in that it does not have uniform levels [13:06]
* assbot gives voice to jurov [13:06]
mircea_popescu what's uniform ? [13:06]
asciilifeform e.g., i can submit a patch which depends only on genesis, and it will be among the current leaves [13:06]
asciilifeform this is not permissible in a strict tree, definitionally [13:06]
assbot Logged on 09-02-2016 15:43:16; asciilifeform: << this goes to the ancient turd, still has, e.g., irc in it!!111111 [13:06]
jurov If they can come to unanimous agreement, which one is the longest, praps. [13:06]
mircea_popescu how would it be among "Current" leaves. we don't have a notion of time. [13:06]
asciilifeform current being the last pressable, strictly [13:07]
mircea_popescu but this is not really a cogent consideration. as far as levels are concerned, this "current" one would be just qas much l1 as all the other direct-G descendants. [13:07]
jurov and to press the "last pressable" I do what command? [13:08]
mircea_popescu there is no last. [13:08]
* samO has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) [13:08]
jurov alf said there is!!!!11 [13:08]
deedbot- [Qntra] US Department Of Education Driving Tuition Increases - [13:08]
mircea_popescu he doesn't know what he's talking about!!1 [13:08]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: there is 'longest chain' but none of the current vtrons know how to find it [13:08]
asciilifeform nor is it clear that it is a useful thing to do [13:08]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform note that longest per se is meaningless. [13:08]
mircea_popescu so what if someone made 5000 patches in a row. [13:08]
mircea_popescu i say it is not useful or even meaningful. [13:08]
asciilifeform i would say that it is meaningful to 'press latest known unorphaned chain signed by x' [13:09]
mircea_popescu there is no "latest" [13:09]
asciilifeform this is, after all, what i do when developing. [13:09]
asciilifeform again, latest means last-known. [13:09]
mircea_popescu there is no time sorting whatever. [13:09]
asciilifeform it isn't about time! [13:09]
BingoBoingo V like everything else only exists in the present [13:10]
mircea_popescu do you mean longest then ? [13:10]
asciilifeform it is about a->b->c and we don't yet have a d. [13:10]
asciilifeform then c is 'latest'. [13:10]
mircea_popescu so by latest you really mean something like "virgin nodes" [13:10]
mircea_popescu fillies, something. pure and untouched by man. [13:10]
asciilifeform aha. [13:10]
asciilifeform let's use the term. [13:10]
mircea_popescu aite, i see. really should drop the latest it's confucksing [13:11]
asciilifeform << this is invalid format and ought to barf [13:11]
assbot Logged on 09-02-2016 15:16:19; ben_vulpes: press a patch without hashes in the headers [13:11]
asciilifeform if not barfs, then broken vtron. [13:11]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform consider this problem for a moment if you will : have people a, b and c ; have nodes as follows : G(a,b,c) -> N1 (a, b, c) -> N2 (a, b, c) -> N3 (a, b) / N3' (c) -> N4 (a,b) / N4' (c) -> N5 (c) -> N6 (c). [13:13]
BingoBoingo [13:13]
assbot ... ( ) [13:13]
mircea_popescu in this situation, "longest chain signed by ab) is 4, longest chain signed by c is 6. what is longest chain signed by abc ? 6 too ? [13:14]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: what means slash ? [13:14]
mircea_popescu this may turn out to be a fucking problem. [13:14]
mircea_popescu alt node in same position in tree [13:14]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: trivial case of tie [13:15]
asciilifeform if i understand correctly [13:15]
asciilifeform tie - is to be broken by the operator. always. [13:15]
mircea_popescu of what ? no, it's not a tie, is c running off with the count [13:15]
asciilifeform c has 'longest chain with c' [13:15]
asciilifeform what's the problem ? [13:15]
asciilifeform don't want it? don't ask for c [13:16]
mircea_popescu does he have longest chain with abc ? [13:16]
asciilifeform nope [13:16]
punkman i'd say longest by abc is N2 [13:16]
asciilifeform with a|b|c [13:16]
mircea_popescu like that it works. [13:16]
asciilifeform punkman: has it [13:16]
asciilifeform punkman has it, rather. [13:16]
mircea_popescu this gets to the core of what i was asking of phf to do with those lists. [13:16]
mircea_popescu which im still not sure if it's clear or not. [13:16]
phf it's not, i need to reread relevant threads, and this one [13:18]
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mircea_popescu what i said then phf was, i must be able to tell a) which people in total contributed and b) on what sets of people does the present press depend. [13:18]
asciilifeform the 'longest chain sans orphans having sigs S1,S2...Sx' is quite essential. [13:19]
mircea_popescu this is the counterposed thing. in this case, i would wish for N6 to know that a) abc and b) c ; whereas for N4 that a) abc and b) a OR b and finally for N2 that a) abc and b) a Or B or C [13:19]
asciilifeform it lets folks actually press a release, for example, without requiring 'papal infallibility' for the release signers; and, likewise importantly, it lets developer press 'i want a thing will all of my shit but not the discarded erroneous crud' [13:20]
mircea_popescu i could hash out a more complex example if it may help, since this NOTATIONAL FORMALISM (see that alf!!!) actually solves the problem of saying graphs. something i wasn't going to do before not because you can't display them, but because im too lazy to draw em. [13:20]
mircea_popescu brb [13:20]
asciilifeform i will also note that all of this was part of my original concept for vtron [13:21]
BingoBoingo In other news... Do these "storage cups" look a lot like baffles to anyone else? [13:21]
assbot : JMPF (8) .995" Maglite C-Cell Preformed Aluminum Storage Cup Non Freeze Plug : Sports & Outdoors ... ( ) [13:21]
asciilifeform but did not make its way into the prototype [13:21]
* diana_coman has quit (Quit: Leaving) [13:22]
mircea_popescu the situation is : [13:22]
mircea_popescu G (a, b, c, d, e, f, g) -> N1 (a, b, c, d) / N1` (e) / N1`` (f, g) -> N2 (a, c, d, e, f) / N2` (b, g) -> N3 (f, c) / N3` (a, b, c) / N3`` (a, d, f, g) -> N4 (a) / N4` (b, c) / N4`` (a, c, d, e) / N4``` (a, f) [13:22]
asciilifeform BingoBoingo: wtf are those [13:23]
mircea_popescu the task is : to compute a) and b) for N2`, N3`` and all N4s. [13:23]
asciilifeform holy shit is mircea_popescu's example hard to read [13:23]
mircea_popescu hater. [13:23]
asciilifeform srsly, trees as 1liners, l0l [13:23]
mircea_popescu it's easy if you know what you're doing (r) (tm) (fy) [13:23]
BingoBoingo asciilifeform: "storage cups" that go into tubular aluminum flashlight body... Come with replacement end cap featuring drilled hole. [13:24]
asciilifeform BingoBoingo: why??? [13:24]
mircea_popescu because there's a humongo market of ... flashlights, of all things, in the us. and trying to invent value for it so the assburger'd males keep buying them [13:24]
asciilifeform holy shit wut [13:24]
mircea_popescu it boggles the mind, what the fuck people are doing with flashlights over there these days. [13:24]
mircea_popescu they're insane. [13:24]
BingoBoingo asciilifeform: Homebrew silencer for people without machine shop or work ethic [13:25]
* diana_coman (~diana_com@unaffiliated/diana-coman/x-8319396) has joined #bitcoin-assets [13:25]
mircea_popescu actually to risk going on a limb : the us is an ex-industrial pwoerhouse, made pseudo-rich by uninspired finalcial arrangements. the degeneracy that necessarily came from that picked a tiny topic and is making the glory of past days play out all over it. that topic is flashlights. [13:26]
mircea_popescu they can't make a plane or maintain the roads, but by god have you seen how superior their flashlights are over the orcs' ? [13:26]
BingoBoingo seriously [13:26]
asciilifeform now that i think about it, i even own one of those cast iron monsters [13:26]
* assbot gives voice to diana_coman [13:26]
asciilifeform 'tis what they had at the shop. [13:27]
mircea_popescu it took me a while to buy one that wasn't uv-led powered. [13:27]
BingoBoingo But flashlight are the only thing US does, so now cottage industry around making them into other things [13:27]
mircea_popescu fucktards. [13:27]
asciilifeform you can easily bludgeon a man, or break a door, with such [13:27]
asciilifeform uv?! [13:27]
mircea_popescu you know, blue leds [13:27]
asciilifeform they use white led here [13:27]
mircea_popescu worse. [13:27]
mircea_popescu yellow, bitch. [13:27]
asciilifeform perfectly usable white here. [13:28]
mircea_popescu well i never ran into one, but anyway. [13:28]
asciilifeform i have both kinds, from same maker, the krypton incandescent one is a club now [13:28]
asciilifeform 1/5th the brightness of the diode [13:28]
phf i thought police carries those oversized maglites for the purpose of using them as batons in a pinch [13:29]
* BingoBoingo put cheap led in club [13:29]
asciilifeform and wtf, i don't read with these, would happily buy even red led [13:29]
asciilifeform phf: aha [13:29]
BingoBoingo i thought police carries those oversized maglites for the purpose of using them as batons in a pinch << yes. For this 4, 5, or 6 D cell models [13:29]
BingoBoingo Also thinner C cell model for people concerned about weapon retention [13:30]
asciilifeform i thought we were thinking specifically of the 6 'd' [13:30]
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BingoBoingo asciilifeform: There's a full range of them [13:30]
* adnn_ has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) [13:32]
mircea_popescu so d is for anal, c is for normal ? [13:32]
asciilifeform 'c' is for ansi standard police broomstick [13:33]
asciilifeform d - extended!111 [13:33]
BingoBoingo But seriously these things are useful for beating down most things. Better made for that than some hammers I've seen [13:35]
phf extended version usually deployed by short and fat female cops in american tv shows. "sir, SIR, sir. sir!" [13:35]
BingoBoingo They also make AA and AAA versions likely for nostril fucking [13:37]
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mircea_popescu i'm apparently missing a lot of culture [13:38]
asciilifeform << i will admit that i am not certain i have ever met in the flesh, other than chetty, a woman who wrote software [13:38]
assbot Logged on 09-02-2016 15:20:58; diana_coman: hm, we were 11 girls: 22 boys precisely in high school (cs class ie maths+physics+programming) [13:38]
asciilifeform saw female bulldozer, crane operators, [13:38]
asciilifeform but this - no [13:38]
mircea_popescu you should get out more! [13:38]
jurov "nor is it clear that it is a useful thing to do" but lxr must show it!!1 lmao. [13:39]
asciilifeform where? antarctica ? [13:39]
mats you callin me fat, ben_vulpes [13:39]
mats its on nao [13:39]
asciilifeform jurov: all i said what what it must ~not~ show [13:39]
asciilifeform which is ancient crudcoin [13:39]
asciilifeform borrowing a page from mircea_popescu's 'this is WRONG now find a non-WRONG thing to do' book. [13:40]
* BingoBoingo actually rather surprised mircea_popescu doesn't already have 6D club in his dungeon, for appearances if nothing else. [13:40]
jurov the last trb release is a WRONG thing nao? [13:40]
asciilifeform surely that was not the last release ? [13:41]
asciilifeform had irc.cpp ? [13:41]
jurov 0.5.4 is out yet? [13:41]
asciilifeform and in fact it is wrong, because guess what, that turd WON'T SYNC [13:41]
asciilifeform without db locks patch at the least [13:42]
asciilifeform ergo is wrong. [13:42]
mircea_popescu i'm glad i said something. [13:42]
jurov ok, i'll look into -test2 [13:42]
asciilifeform ty jurov [13:42]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform> where? antarctica ? << no, atomic diriglandia. it's a wonderful place! [13:43]
asciilifeform i very much believe mircea_popescu . [13:43]
ben_vulpes asciilifeform: re: codebabez you should totally come visit sometime [13:43]
asciilifeform visit what [13:43]
mircea_popescu anyway, how about you know, downtown. afaik dc is about 60% female by mass [13:43]
mircea_popescu most capitols are, anyway [13:43]
ben_vulpes me! [13:44]
* mircea_popescu would pay money for snapshot of alf awaken at 6:30 am by baby ; after having slept on guest bed over @ portland. [13:44]
asciilifeform l0l [13:45]
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* asciilifeform generally doesn't leave home if it can be at all helped [13:46]
ben_vulpes i am offend [13:46]
mircea_popescu BingoBoingo i chastise, yes, but i don't believe in destroying the woman. canes, not clubs. [13:46]
ben_vulpes we have /electricity/ [13:46]
mircea_popescu off which end ben_vulpes ? [13:46]
BingoBoingo mircea_popescu: What about for penetration? [13:46]
ben_vulpes and our covered wagons aren't even hauled by oxen any more but horse [13:46]
mircea_popescu penis is for penetration, that's good enough for me! [13:46]
* ben_vulpes hums [13:46]
BingoBoingo Also to chase away wild Obeasts who happen to glomp in [13:46]
asciilifeform ben_vulpes: poppycock, everybuddy knows wagon don't move 'less an-'orse move't. [13:47]
* ben_vulpes looks sideways at asciilifeform [13:47]
asciilifeform ... or wife [13:47]
mircea_popescu o look, he's doing my fair lady! [13:47]
ben_vulpes hoo-ers. [13:47]
ben_vulpes unrelatedly, it took 12 (!) tugs to get the HK boat ungrounded from the elbe [13:48]
mircea_popescu name the thugs ? [13:49]
ben_vulpes you name the sucks? [13:49]
ben_vulpes individual licks even? [13:49]
mircea_popescu lol shucks! [13:49]
ben_vulpes atypically punny day [13:50]
ben_vulpes not even raining [13:50]
mircea_popescu wait this hk boat / elbe thing was a sexual innuendo item ? [13:50]
mircea_popescu my foreskin generally retracts on the first pass, just how wide IS this woman ? [13:50]
ben_vulpes nono not at first [13:50]
mircea_popescu fist ? [13:51]
ben_vulpes fisting first?! [13:51]
ben_vulpes fisting is for closers [13:51]
asciilifeform waiwut [13:51]
asciilifeform boat?! [13:51]
ben_vulpes aha [13:51]
asciilifeform ungrounded ? [13:51]
ben_vulpes mega container ship grounded in the elbe for FIVE DAYS [13:51]
asciilifeform and thought stuck cock [13:52]
ben_vulpes i am now renaming my cock to CSCL Indian Ocean [13:52]
ben_vulpes "baby i need a tug!" [13:53]
ben_vulpes grounded in the river elbe [13:53]
mircea_popescu tug&plug, it's a legitimate thing. [13:53]
ben_vulpes ehuehueahuehueh [13:53]
BingoBoingo Just deserts from the mines "With an ax rather than a scalpel, Australia's federal science agency last week chopped off its climate research arm in a decision that has stunned scientists and left employees dispirited. Why? Because the science is settled, there is no need for more basic research, the government says. No doubt many will experience a case of schadenfreude as they see those who have long claimed "the science is settle [13:54]
BingoBoingo d" face the inevitable and logical consequence of that stance." [13:54]
ben_vulpes HAHAHA [13:54]
ben_vulpes rich. [13:55]
mircea_popescu lol. [13:55]
ben_vulpes christ that's entertaining [13:55]
mircea_popescu well, the science is setled alright : there is no science in "climate blabla, back to more productive uses. [13:55]
mircea_popescu such as i dunno wtf these schmucks did before becoming "scientists", but i imagine revolutionizing keyboards and inventing better paper clips [13:55]
ben_vulpes how about disrupting the blowjob? [13:56]
ben_vulpes i guess that'd be sv [13:56]
BingoBoingo how about disrupting the blowjob? << picking the long hairs out of the short hairs? [13:57]
ben_vulpes subject of sv, it looks like i'll be on hold with intuit until the halvening [13:58]
mircea_popescu and in further "who the fuck runs away in heels" news, [13:58]
assbot ... ( ) [13:58]
mircea_popescu which one was inuit again ? the useless one ? [13:59]
ben_vulpes they're all useless [13:59]
ben_vulpes but intuit goes so far as to lobby against simplifying the american taxtuation so they can do 'ez' taxes for derps [13:59]
mircea_popescu lol [14:00]
ben_vulpes all i want is a form for hours and a button that remits appropriately [14:00]
ben_vulpes and apparently i have to go through intuit for this [14:00]
ben_vulpes small biz is worst biz [14:01]
mircea_popescu move to romania, run it from there ; small biz costs you a few % in taxes and you get a person to do all your filings + basic legal support for a coupla hundred dollars/month. [14:01]
ben_vulpes that is precisely the plan next time. [14:02]
ben_vulpes also not taking fucking fiat. [14:02]
mircea_popescu you can take fiat just fine. [14:02]
mircea_popescu SEPA member, even easier than in the us. [14:02]
mircea_popescu also free. [14:02]
ben_vulpes huh [14:04]
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danielpbarron << hah, she blocked me on twatter a month ago [14:16]
assbot Logged on 09-02-2016 11:42:56; BingoBoingo: Spoiler alert, it was a trap. [14:16]
danielpbarron << i had to double check the list, surprised she wasn't already a lord, but we're off in another world this channel isn't always aware of, with quite another perspective it seems [14:16]
assbot Logged on 09-02-2016 15:10:58; mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes next month's filing might clarify. [14:16]
ben_vulpes "The cybercriminal reached out to Motherboard through an apparently compromised DOJ email account earlier last week, and claimed to have obtained the stolen data by compromising that account and then using it to access a DOJ portal." [14:18]
ben_vulpes danielpbarron: i mean how am i supposed to know what's going on in the far-flung provinces [14:18]
ben_vulpes have been following the public feedz, yes, but much happens below the surface [14:19]
shinohai <<< was also banned from btctalk for 5 days for "trolling" according to het twitter danielpbarron [14:19]
assbot Logged on 09-02-2016 17:11:50; danielpbarron: << hah, she blocked me on twatter a month ago [14:19]
ben_vulpes 5 days lol they do timeouts now? [14:20]
ben_vulpes "go sit in the corner! you've been bad." [14:20]
shinohai kek [14:20]
asciilifeform << where wut [14:20]
assbot Logged on 09-02-2016 17:14:13; ben_vulpes: "The cybercriminal reached out to Motherboard through an apparently compromised DOJ email account earlier last week, and claimed to have obtained the stolen data by compromising that account and then using it to access a DOJ portal." [14:20]
asciilifeform and srsly what's with this habit of linkless quote [14:20]
asciilifeform we feed google now ? [14:20]
ben_vulpes scusi, scusi [14:21]
ben_vulpes [14:21]
assbot Hacker Publishes Personal Info of 20,000 FBI Agents | Motherboard ... ( ) [14:21]
asciilifeform ty ben_vulpes [14:21]
asciilifeform also what part of this is seeekrit [14:21]
asciilifeform who works for usg is public record [14:21]
ben_vulpes their eeeemailz! [14:21]
ben_vulpes iono man [14:21]
ben_vulpes i had a pertinent question before the payroll people distracted me [14:22]
* ben_vulpes is considering a new irc client [14:23]
jurov kakobrekla dang you completely filter unicode on bitbet? my translation now looks like abortion :( [14:24]
assbot BitBet - Parties SMER-SD and SNS to win supermajority in Slovak parliament :: 0.37 B (46%) on Yes, 0.43 B (54%) on No | closing in 3 weeks 2 days | weight: 84`005 (100`000 to 10`000) ... ( ) [14:24]
asciilifeform ben_vulpes: try 'irssi' [14:26]
jurov it's not going to be v-ified or somesuch [14:26]
ben_vulpes (vil-ified!) [14:26]
ben_vulpes asciilifeform: the suggestions continue to stack up [14:26]
ben_vulpes an appealing thing about irssi is that it has a solarized light mode [14:27]
ben_vulpes i could get my whole experience into solarized light [14:27]
* danielpbarron also recommends irssi [14:28]
danielpbarron been using it off and on for a decade [14:28]
danielpbarron highly customizable, simple, runs on command line, in screen [14:28]
asciilifeform wtf, what light mode, it's a tty proggy [14:29]
ben_vulpes i like my colors to match! [14:29]
ben_vulpes i motherfucking hate switching over to a dark terminal after using a light text editor [14:29]
ben_vulpes mother [14:29]
ben_vulpes fucking [14:29]
ben_vulpes hate [14:29]
danielpbarron you can color it however you like; I color nicknames based on my rating of them in the WoT [14:29]
ben_vulpes no i want the whole screen tan-ish [14:29]
ben_vulpes switching from light to dark and back is very painful for my head. [14:30]
BingoBoingo It's a shame no one still connects to IRC by touching two wires together rhythmically [14:30]
asciilifeform ben_vulpes: so set light terminal ? or dark text editor ?? [14:30]
ben_vulpes light terminal, yes. specific color scheme at that. and no no fucking dark text editor because i have to pull up web pages and am right back at the original problem! [14:30]
phf ben_vulpes: what's wrong with erc! [14:31]
kakobrekla jurov will change that at some point [14:31]
ben_vulpes phf: it's fine, great, doesn't bouncer well though. [14:31]
jurov kakobrekla: please remove it completely, it's completely misleading [14:31]
ben_vulpes phf: the best erc setup i've come up with is to run it through mosh in a terminal [14:31]
jurov it changed "ÁNO" to "NO" which is the opposite [14:32]
kakobrekla not a single comment ever got removed and i dont think we will start now [14:32]
kakobrekla cant you elaborate it differently with a subsequent comment? [14:32]
BingoBoingo jurov: Which side of the election are we rooting for? [14:32]
phf ben_vulpes: if you're using znc, then might help [14:32]
assbot ... ( ) [14:32]
ben_vulpes phf: this means i have to maintain a mental map for "emacs on my server" and "emacs on my desktop [14:32]
ben_vulpes oh god i tried znc [14:32]
* ben_vulpes looks [14:32]
asciilifeform ben_vulpes: tried? it broke ? [14:33]
phf i don't have an opinion on it. i have znc, bitlbee and erc all very lightly configured to work together, and i basically don't use anything else for comms [14:33]
BingoBoingo ben_vulpes: Give up and just open up your NIC buffer in ed to irc [14:33]
ben_vulpes i think i even did erc-znc mode at one point [14:33]
jurov BingoBoingo: I listed the biggest douches, rooting against them [14:33]
BingoBoingo jurov: Aha. So like the local version of the Trump-Clitler alliance [14:34]
ben_vulpes bitlbee huh [14:35]
ben_vulpes asciilifeform: i have a *million* complaints against znc [14:36]
asciilifeform ben_vulpes: say moar ? [14:36]
ben_vulpes let us start with the completely fucking retarded web admin panel [14:36]
asciilifeform nobody forces you to use it [14:36]
asciilifeform can config with bare teeth [14:36]
jurov Interesting there are some bets despite I have not advertised it yet. Local bitcoiners do follow bitbet :) [14:36]
ben_vulpes then there's some default password implementation the specifics of which i forget but was miserably bad [14:37]
ben_vulpes what else [14:37]
ben_vulpes oh can't edit conf files and reload iirc [14:37]
asciilifeform wai wut [14:37]
asciilifeform or what, you want it to reload itself somehow ? [14:37]
ben_vulpes do i misremember? [14:37]
asciilifeform should it also massage the wife for you ? [14:37]
mats lol [14:38]
kakobrekla ofc you can edit conf [14:38]
ben_vulpes o.O [14:38]
asciilifeform aha [14:38]
BingoBoingo jurov: How do you know that those bets aren't all from a degenerate like myself who just wants betting action? [14:39]
jurov you dream shatterer, you! [14:39]
BingoBoingo But no, I don't have any bets on that yet [14:39]
phf kill -hup presumably works [14:40]
jurov znc indeed is prone to overwriting conf, best to stop it and then edit if you must [14:42]
phf somebody here i believe sponsored otp for znc plugin [14:43]
jurov kek. but it's true somebody here sponsored otp for znc plugin [14:43]
phf ah, right [14:44]
* punkman1 is now known as punkman [14:45]
BingoBoingo jurov: Ok, now I've bet on it [14:46]
* assbot gives voice to punkman [14:47]
punkman where is this znc otp plugin? [14:47]
phf punkman: [14:48]
assbot GitHub - mmilata/znc-otr: OTR encryption plugin for ZNC IRC bouncer ... ( ) [14:48]
punkman ah otr [14:48]
jurov iirc it went into official distribution [14:48]
jurov heh somebody read otc? [14:48]
asciilifeform ;;later tell mircea_popescu i was looking at generalizing the 'oracle' resistance from cramer-shoup to other systems [14:48]
gribble The operation succeeded. [14:48]
trinque my setup was much like phf's, had a few znc crashes/freezes and trashed the lot for weechat in a tmux somewhere [14:49]
trinque tried weechat.el, will probably end up using that when I bother to do something sensible around hightlight notifications [14:50]
punkman [14:50]
assbot Ghostface Killah Says “Shithead" Martin Shkreli Should Release One-of-a-Kind Wu-Tang Album | News | Pitchfork ... ( ) [14:50]
trinque I'll have this done just in time to switch to gossipd [14:50]
trinque along with the new deedbot, lol [14:50]
jurov gossipd will have irc interface? [14:53]
phf dbus to adium [14:53]
PeterL just needs a bot here and listening to gossipd to transmit messages between platforms, right? [14:53]
trinque jurov: naw, just in time to rewrite [14:55]
asciilifeform jurov: my unreleased prototype is driven using (local) irc listener, yes [14:55]
trinque oh, how bout that [14:55]
phf asciilifeform: it actually speaks a subset of irc then? [14:55]
asciilifeform phf: only for frontend [14:55]
jurov count on alf to have unreleased prototypes for everything :D [14:55]
asciilifeform jurov: they are usually unreleased for ~reason~ [14:56]
asciilifeform and irc frontend makes sense, thinkaboutit, nobody wants to use a cruddy ui hacked up for the occasion, everyone already has something reasonable that is irctronic [14:57]
phf asciilifeform: is the whole thing in c? [14:57]
asciilifeform phf: presently [14:58]
mircea_popescu << i wonder if all teh people that are into this stuff realise that the only reason a woman's skin is soft is specifically that she doesn't go around barefood & naked in chains. [14:59]
assbot ... ( ) [14:59]
asciilifeform l0l must be like the fingers of guitarist ! [15:00]
mircea_popescu aha [15:00]
jurov rly? i thought it's cuz of the lotions they use to tan the hide [15:01]
mircea_popescu i suspek the only effectiveness of the lotioning is that it keeps them from doing stuff / touching the spot for a while [15:01]
deedbot- [Qntra] Steam Legacy Demolished - [15:01]
mircea_popescu not that anyone agrees with me on the topic in teh household(s) [15:01]
phf as demonstrated by outside-bombai indian woman feet, walking around barefoot all the time doesn't do your skin any sort of justice [15:02]
mircea_popescu depends if treebark is your notion of foot justice. [15:03]
mircea_popescu << interesting idea [15:04]
assbot Logged on 09-02-2016 17:25:39; danielpbarron: you can color it however you like; I color nicknames based on my rating of them in the WoT [15:04]
danielpbarron wow BingoBoingo the most clickbaity title you ever qntra'd. I was very confused to find it wasn't about the game company 'Steam' [15:05]
BingoBoingo danielpbarron: What, guy can't spend 28 words on a joke? [15:05]
BingoBoingo In news from out Nigerian prince [15:05]
assbot DPRK Launches Satellite Into Space | Qntra ... ( ) [15:05]
mircea_popescu BingoBoingo yeah seriously, none of that. it's ok for blogs but not q [15:06]
BingoBoingo Alright [15:06]
BingoBoingo Take it down? [15:06]
mircea_popescu can stay, just as a policy [15:06]
PeterL you could put it on your personal blog? [15:06]
BingoBoingo I keep forgetting that thing exists. [15:06]
danielpbarron i've seen the game thing pop up on social media, something about they are or might be accepting bitcoin [15:06]
mircea_popescu and in other "strange cargo cult worshippers of incomprehensible machine-god" news, [15:07]
assbot ... ( ) [15:07]
BingoBoingo Something derping about them and Bitpay. Been spending much of the morning looking for stories of steam explosions or other disasters. [15:07]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform not a bad idea. did it get anywhere ? [15:12]
mircea_popescu << quite. [15:13]
assbot Logged on 09-02-2016 17:53:11; asciilifeform: and irc frontend makes sense, thinkaboutit, nobody wants to use a cruddy ui hacked up for the occasion, everyone already has something reasonable that is irctronic [15:13]
mircea_popescu cheat as much as humanly possible [15:13]
mircea_popescu then turn into your wolf form and cheat some more. [15:13]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: was trying to figure out if it is separable from his use of the diffie hellman decision problem as the basis for the system [15:15]
asciilifeform also interesting property, in c-s, you lose the chosen-ciphertext attack resistance if you split the message. [15:15]
asciilifeform gonna have to cheat in wolf form, somehow. [15:16]
asciilifeform see, i'm unwilling to entirely discount the 'quantum' calculator thing. [15:17]
mircea_popescu soit [15:18]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 64350 @ 0.00056847 = 36.581 BTC [-] [15:18]
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asciilifeform mircea_popescu: which is why i'd rather not live and die solely by the discrete log problem. [15:21]
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asciilifeform (or, for that matter, integer factorization. which, for n00bz, i will point out that rsa has never actually been formally reduced to!) [15:22]
deedbot- [Qntra] Dotcom Extradition Appeal Set To Begin August 29 - [15:22]
BingoBoingo << alright, who's the troll [15:23]
assbot US Department Of Education Driving Tuition Increases | Qntra ... ( ) [15:23]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 75897 @ 0.00057458 = 43.6089 BTC [+] [15:28]
PeterL don't you collect commenters' emails, do you have to ask? [15:29]
BingoBoingo PeterL: We do, but it would be bad journalism to disclose such things. And really how often are we actually going to test emails anyways. [15:29]
BingoBoingo As long as the email hasn't been used in spam, email isn't going to be the thing that makes or breaks a comment's journey past the spam filter [15:31]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform i on the other hand am more than willing to die by this imaginary "quantum" computing. [15:31]
PeterL how is that comment troll-y? [15:31]
mircea_popescu it has exactly 0% chances to exist. if it did exist, however, the changes would be far reaching enough to render any present arrangements void anyway. [15:32]
mircea_popescu so... [15:32]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: the latter is demonstrably false [15:32]
asciilifeform and yes, it is an inflatable tank [15:32]
asciilifeform presently - imaginary [15:32]
mircea_popescu huh ? [15:33]
BingoBoingo PeterL: It mentioned the Bern, just kinda assumed it was. Didn't read too closely. [15:33]
asciilifeform but speeding up factoring is quite physically plausible in a variety of ways [15:33]
mircea_popescu ah that. sure. [15:33]
mircea_popescu was specifically discussing "quantum" as the literary fanon concept [15:33]
PeterL BingoBoingo but the comment agrees with your article [15:34]
mircea_popescu it is pointedly NOT a scientific notion, for the record, not anymore than communism is ; and in no danger of ever becoming one, such as occasionally sf items did become. [15:34]
mircea_popescu it belongs in the same heap as the audible / visible lasers, the bullets that spark off rock walls & al. [15:34]
BingoBoingo Ah. I guess a point could be made that if Obama's Hope and Change didn't fix the problem Bernie's isn't likely to either. [15:34]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: atomic bullet!1111 [15:35]
mircea_popescu and so no, i'm not paying anyone anything to add "lightsaber armor" to my clothing. [15:35]
asciilifeform l0l! [15:35]
BingoBoingo PeterL: Maybe It's just getting late. My troll/humor doesn't seem to be calibrated right. [15:36]
BingoBoingo BRB meat downtime [15:36]
PeterL noon is late now? [15:36]
mircea_popescu i wouldn't per se object to girl wearing "lightsaber armorer" cocktail dress, if that's the fashion, as long as it grabs her tits and waist right etc. [15:36]
thestringpuller lightsaber armorer? [15:36]
thestringpuller !s lightsaber armorer [15:37]
BingoBoingo PeterL: I woke up at 22:00 local time. Hazard of working Internet full time. [15:37]
mircea_popescu "quantum computing proof" [15:37]
assbot 0 results for 'lightsaber armorer' : [15:37]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: didja ever read feynman's original paper on the subj ? [15:37]
mircea_popescu yes. [15:37]
asciilifeform so why specifically can we rule the thing out physically [15:37]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3831 @ 0.00057244 = 2.193 BTC [-] {2} [15:38]
mircea_popescu it is not a bad paper. it is also not a bad thing to look for. unlike "cold fusion" and like "dark energy extraction", it has no actual merit for fundamental reasons. [15:38]
mircea_popescu "we" can't. i, for my own needs, do, is all. [15:38]
asciilifeform also, i will defend the notion that crypto - composes. usefully. the contrary notion is due 100% to retarded implementers, who belong in fermenting vat [15:39]
mircea_popescu crypto MAY compose usefully. assuming composition is a solution is in itself braindamage. [15:39]
asciilifeform if the composed elements are FULLY independent - composes. [15:39]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: it is useful the way that the rng xor is useful [15:39]
asciilifeform you are ~guaranteed~ the strength of the strongest. [15:39]
mircea_popescu also asuming that A USEFUL WAY TO COMPOSE is always available is nonsense. and certainly asuming that the obvious composition is correct. [15:39]
asciilifeform not always available - you gotta build it. [15:40]
asciilifeform and, again, if the ciphertrons are INDEPENDENT, you can't do any damage by adding a damaged link downstream. [15:40]
mircea_popescu just as long as this a) doesn't invalidate assumptions required by one in a way operator couldn't verify and b) they are actually independent, as opposed to "i thought they were" [15:41]
asciilifeform well no shit [15:41]
mircea_popescu no, but this is important. [15:41]
asciilifeform see the 'implementer belongs in fermentation vat' point [15:41]
mircea_popescu on the strength of the record to date. [15:41]
asciilifeform !s cut abdomen open [15:42]
assbot 1 results for 'cut abdomen open' : [15:42]
mircea_popescu sure. just, the bleeding here is hidden. [15:42]
asciilifeform all crypto bleeds hidden. [15:42]
asciilifeform sapper is a better job, at least you're dead right away [15:42]
asciilifeform instead of walking around buzzing with maggots for 20 years without knowing [15:42]
mircea_popescu aha [15:43]
* liquidassets has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) [15:47]
mircea_popescu hmm looks like qntra ate my comment [15:58]
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asciilifeform [16:41]
assbot US Department Of Education Driving Tuition Increases | Qntra ... ( ) [16:41]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 42400 @ 0.00056825 = 24.0938 BTC [-] [17:05]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 82400 @ 0.00057415 = 47.31 BTC [+] {6} [17:13]
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jurov !up guest7187 [17:25]
* assbot gives voice to guest7187 [17:25]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform < if you care about the curios. spam filter had them before. [17:33]
assbot B,TMSR~ Block Cipher Competition on Trilema - A blog by Mircea Popescu. ... ( ) [17:34]
asciilifeform interesting [17:35]
mircea_popescu << this is marginally lulzy. [17:36]
assbot [bitcoin-dev] BIP proposal: Increase block size limit to 2 megabytes ... ( ) [17:36]
polarbeard I've doxygened trb, [17:36]
assbot trb: trb/release/bitcoin/src/init.cpp File Reference ... ( ) [17:36]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: i don't see what is so hot about the composition thing [17:37]
asciilifeform anybody can do that, it was actually the first thing i suggested [17:37]
mircea_popescu i don't think anything'sd so hot. [17:37]
asciilifeform ah. [17:37]
asciilifeform what i was wondering is how the author of the comment came to think that this fits the specs given [17:37]
asciilifeform srsly, classic example of 'cryptographers' playing confusion mind games with own selves [17:38]
asciilifeform i think i will go to a racing competition; and submit an 'enchilada cipher' car, a junkyard carcass of old ferrari welded to remnants of a crashed mazerati. [17:39]
asciilifeform FASTER THAN EITHER!11111 [17:39]
mircea_popescu << why the fuck does redditard have 300 dollars. [17:41]
assbot Western Union Scam -$300 : Scams ... ( ) [17:41]
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PeterL asciilifeform re hasty pudding cypher: didn't you say key tables are evil? [17:46]
asciilifeform absolutely. [17:47]
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asciilifeform and srsly, i don't even see the point in thinking about that one. [17:48]
asciilifeform it is junk, plain and simple. [17:48]
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mircea_popescu !up minzie_ [17:49]
-assbot- You voiced minzie_ for 30 minutes. [17:49]
* assbot gives voice to minzie_ [17:49]
PeterL hi minzie_ who are you? [17:49]
minzie_ hi [17:50]
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minzie_ looking for some brokerage in btc [17:50]
thestringpuller minzie_: jurov is your guy [17:51]
minzie_ he isnt online at the moment, is he? [17:51]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: << slightly less retarded [17:52]
assbot ... ( ) [17:52]
asciilifeform 's✏ø✪ü❒ý✠❞öÒó✍☎✗ö●✏➉✝❞ò✦ó❙ô✺✝✬❄✦ñ❞÷➃ýó♦✂ [17:52]
asciilifeform ñ✚✖Þô❙ñ✛õ✗ö➍÷➃ø❊ò❖✂✛ôÖô❙ö➍ó✦÷➃ý➴þ❜ÿ✁❞ö✄✂ [17:52]
mircea_popescu ... [17:52]
asciilifeform þ➍ýù✆☎✪ö➍÷➃ò❵➔✘✦☞ýó✍☎❵ó✍☎✪öÑø✪ñ❞ó✍✝➸û➵üö➒ö✱✰✛þ❨ö➍ù✪ó✟ý❒ñ②ø✪ò✾ñ✚✖✵qðó [17:52]
asciilifeform s ✳ ✈❈✝❞ø✪õ❧qðt❧s✉➢✻✈✘➣✔✓■✴✰ú✗÷✟ó✟ü❒ö❐✝❞ø➵õt❉✗✝➸÷➃ö✩✝➸÷✟ö❵þ❨ñ②ø✪þ❨ö➍ù✪ó✟ú✆✝❞ü❒ü✠✂ì✏❞ö➍÷✥✂✤ò✟ý➴ô❙ù➵üö✚✜ú✴✾☎✗ö➍÷✟ö✩✝➸÷✟ö ø✪ñ þ❨ñ②ø✪ò✦ó✍✝❞ø●ó✟ò✄✓❀û➵ýó [17:52]
asciilifeform ù❛ö➍÷➃ô✾ú✗ó✍✝➸ó✟ýñ②ø✪òÞñ❞÷■☎✆✝➸÷➃õ✛ÿ➜þ❨ñ✛õ✗ö➶õáó✍✝➸û➵ü❒ö➶ò✄✜✵✴✰ú✗÷✟ó✟üö✚◗ ò☞÷✟ö➶þ➍ú✗÷➃ò➃ý✠✏❞ö❏ò✦ó✦÷➃ú➵þ❨ó✟ú✗÷✟ö❏ù➵÷✟ñ✽✏✛ý❒õ✗ö➶ò✶✝ßø✎✝➸ó✟ú✪÷✥✝❞ü✝ôÖö➶þ✥☎✎✝❞ø [17:52]
mircea_popescu god ima have to kick him again aren't i. [17:52]
polarbeard there we go [17:52]
asciilifeform ✪ý➴ò✟ô➩✖❭ñ❞÷ [17:52]
asciilifeform aargh [17:52]
asciilifeform wtf [17:52]
* asciilifeform kicks terminal [17:53]
mircea_popescu you need a better macbook. [17:53]
asciilifeform better hands. [17:53]
polarbeard I'm evaling that just in case [17:53]
minzie_ xD [17:53]
mircea_popescu ➃ << i didn't even know slut brands were a html character. [17:53]
asciilifeform nah that is clearly a billiard ball [17:54]
mircea_popescu "Bath Salts: As of July 22, 2011 possession of Bath Salts is a Class 4 Felony with the same sentencing as above." ahahaha wut. [17:55]
mircea_popescu us-plebs not allowed soft skin aha [17:55]
PeterL it's a drug name [17:55]
polarbeard just rebrand it to butt salts [17:55]
* assbot removes voice from guest7187 [17:56]
asciilifeform anyway mircea_popescu , m. blaze's 'turtle' is, afaik, the only ~claimed~ provably-hard block cipher (non-otp) that i was able to track down. [17:57]
mircea_popescu PeterL what drug is that in sane people speak ? [17:57]
PeterL methylenedioxypyrovalerone [17:58]
mircea_popescu so my sal inglesa bath salts are immune ? [17:58]
PeterL sort of like a bulkier version of amphetamine [17:58]
mircea_popescu (magnesium sulphate) [17:59]
PeterL nah mag sulphate got demoted from the name, it's fine to use [17:59]
mircea_popescu ah ok then :D [18:00]
PeterL isn't it great when people take one word with a definite meaning and slap it onto something completely unrelated? [18:00]
asciilifeform he also came up with a hash algo, 'tortuga' [18:01]
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mircea_popescu PeterL basically the us' main export product. [18:01]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform aha. was looking into this. [18:01]
minzie_ anyone know some good bitcoin trading software?? [18:02]
asciilifeform or hm, not him [18:02]
asciilifeform but based on 'turtle' [18:02]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: ah, you found it before ? [18:02]
mircea_popescu minzie_ can you be specific ? what are you trying to do ? [18:02]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform well no, just now [18:03]
asciilifeform ah [18:03]
minzie_ want to trade in exchanges [18:03]
mircea_popescu remarkably undocumented online. [18:04]
mircea_popescu minzie_ iirc adlai was peddling in that water. [18:04]
mircea_popescu << if this is to be believed it was introduced by a dude named blaze at upenn, and it's a feistel derivative. [18:06]
assbot ... ( ) [18:06]
mircea_popescu "Most modern publickey ciphers are designed to reduce or at least relate closely to some long­ [18:07]
mircea_popescu studied problem that is believed to be difficult, such as factoring or finding discrete logarithms of [18:07]
mircea_popescu large integers. Modern symmetrickey ciphers, on the other hand, can rarely be reduced to widely­ [18:07]
mircea_popescu studied hard problems and so are frequently designed specifically to resist known cryptanalytic" [18:07]
mircea_popescu absolute paydirt. WHY "can rarely be". who told you ? etc. [18:07]
asciilifeform not 'rarely'; never. [18:08]
asciilifeform to date. [18:08]
asciilifeform anyway, took me most of a week to dredge this up, [18:09]
asciilifeform and it had to be by looking at ancient sci.crypt crud [18:09]
asciilifeform fwiw. [18:09]
mircea_popescu there's a difference between "can rarely be" and "never is". they do not speak of the same world. [18:10]
asciilifeform well yes. [18:10]
mircea_popescu what i wish to know is how did he establish his ought. [18:10]
asciilifeform prolly oughta have said 'have never.' [18:10]
mircea_popescu but it isn't what he actually said. [18:10]
* asciilifeform reads, again [18:10]
mircea_popescu when people go all scholarly and shit on me, and start with the "We show" bullcrap i fucking expect them to use the words they mean to use. [18:11]
asciilifeform anyway i don't give a fuck what he said, i want to know if the proof actually proves anything of interest. [18:11]
asciilifeform if there were 1,001 alleged proofs, i'd throw out this one perhaps, because annoying [18:12]
asciilifeform but there is 1 alleged proof. [18:12]
asciilifeform and a whole lot of silence. [18:12]
mircea_popescu btw, how's the "ethereum ecosystem" doing these days ? all the shit they were going to launch months ago... just around the corner! [18:12]
mircea_popescu are the brick and mortar ethereum things in yet ? [18:13]
* asciilifeform has nfi [18:13]
asciilifeform interestingly, blaze uses the term 'cryptovariable' in his code [18:16]
asciilifeform this is traditional, archaic nsa term for... key [18:16]
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asciilifeform it has been a very long time since i saw this. [18:16]
mircea_popescu well this item is from mid 90s, sat buried for the interval. [18:17]
asciilifeform and wtf is with the character encoding in that pdf. [18:17]
asciilifeform martian. [18:17]
mircea_popescu smells to me like long dead bait job some 3rd line derp is trying to spring back to life on us, but hery. [18:17]
asciilifeform remarkably stale for bait [18:17]
mircea_popescu i'd almost be mildly insulted, if it weren't for the fact that my fucking spam filter identified it correctly on the first pass. [18:18]
asciilifeform but interesting nonetheless, if i were hitler i would order 10,001 'provably np-hard' ciphers to be created. [18:18]
mircea_popescu next year's crop of openbazaars [18:18]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: to be clear, i'm discussing the 'turtle' paper [18:18]
mircea_popescu hey, btw, did THAT vc powered bs mix ever come to anything ? [18:18]
asciilifeform vs the two linked [18:18]
asciilifeform (or did this, too, come up in the spam filter) [18:19]
mircea_popescu myeah. [18:19]
* assbot removes voice from minzie_ [18:19]
mircea_popescu wait... i never published this item [18:20]
mircea_popescu uh... [18:20]
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asciilifeform i found 'turtle' by hand [18:20]
asciilifeform from ancient crud pile [18:20]
mircea_popescu i thought you had just went from a comment i just published. except i hadn't. [18:20]
asciilifeform as explained earlier [18:20]
asciilifeform note, i have not gone over the proof! [18:20]
mircea_popescu me either as i just saw it. [18:20]
mircea_popescu so you were independently looking at this and from before ? [18:21]
mircea_popescu what linked it ? where ? [18:21]
asciilifeform [18:22]
assbot Google Groupes ... ( ) [18:22]
asciilifeform ^ not linked as such, but mentioned [18:22]
asciilifeform and no, i don't have a vintage copy of this thing on dead tree, or the like [18:23]
asciilifeform i dug up this old luger in the forest, aha. and i've no idea whether it fires forwards or backwards, of yet. [18:24]
asciilifeform further dig reveals that it was mentioned in a few places, fwiw. [18:25]
asciilifeform << herr blaze himself, apparently. ask him. [18:26]
assbot Matt Blaze / ... ( ) [18:26]
mircea_popescu nice domain, you know ? [18:27]
asciilifeform oh hey [18:27]
asciilifeform he's the one who broke randi's cipher [18:27]
asciilifeform [18:27]
assbot Matt Blaze: Exhaustive Search Goes to Law School ... ( ) [18:27]
asciilifeform and the rest of his blog, lulzy [18:27]
mircea_popescu [18:28]
assbot Matt Blaze: How Law Enforcement Tracks Cellular Phones ... ( ) [18:28]
asciilifeform i see nothing that sets off my allergies, astonishingly [18:32]
asciilifeform on blaze's www [18:32]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: consider inviting him here ? [18:35]
mircea_popescu you do it! [18:35]
asciilifeform i'm not a famous k00l d00d [18:35]
asciilifeform oh and now i'm curious what the spam said [18:38]
mircea_popescu im sure that he had his fill of those. talk of interesting things to him instead. [18:38]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform just that, "look into turtle" [18:38]
asciilifeform i'ma write to herr blaze, then. [18:39]
asciilifeform let the man speak for himself. [18:39]
mircea_popescu re hasty pudding : 2^120 weak keys. heh. [18:44]
asciilifeform massive turd [18:44]
asciilifeform and when i first saw it mentioned, some years back, i actually thought it was named for shitting oneself [18:44]
asciilifeform and that it might be called 'to make hasty pudding' [18:44]
asciilifeform but apparently this is not a thing [18:44]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform incidentally, another thought occurs : maybe the way to go is make the key a matrix and go for something like the maximum volume submatrix problem somewhere in there. [18:45]
mircea_popescu have the message specify the conditionation, and then how the fuck are you going to extract it if you don't know what you're starting from [18:46]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: i actually started with this [18:46]
mircea_popescu ha! [18:46]
asciilifeform it is tricky. [18:46]
mircea_popescu listen this is getting ridiculous lol. [18:46]
asciilifeform impossible to say ~average case~ complexity [18:46]
mircea_popescu well... yeah i dunno how you'd do that. [18:46]
asciilifeform hey maths are the same for everybody. [18:46]
asciilifeform can't fault if mircea_popescu and i come up with same arithmetic. [18:47]
mircea_popescu what we want is some actual methods to calculate the difficulty curve over the space [18:47]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 78900 @ 0.00056769 = 44.7907 BTC [-] [18:47]
asciilifeform (lulzier when we get ~different~ arithmetic!11 as in the otp mega-thread) [18:47]
mircea_popescu lol [18:47]
mircea_popescu rare, luckily. [18:47]
mircea_popescu anyway, the more i think about this tyhe more im convinced our problems are really one problem : the absence of a proved mechanism to create the difficulty graph of a primitive. [18:48]
mircea_popescu and this should NOT in general be as hard as to actually break any one key. [18:48]
asciilifeform incidentally, i suppose that this is when i confess that this is actually my day job [18:48]
mircea_popescu ie the problem could be reducxible [18:49]
mircea_popescu hahaha [18:49]
asciilifeform ... judging algorithmic complexities of various algos [18:49]
mircea_popescu but you know what i want ? i want it to output a fucking graph! [18:49]
mircea_popescu looking exactly like this :,FF9900,FFFFFF&chd=t:100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,1 [18:50]
mircea_popescu 00,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100,100|43,49,55,55,57,64,67,65,65,65,65,66,74,74,74,74,74,74,74,75,75,73,73,73,73,73,73,73,73,73,76,76,76,76,76,76,76,76,76,76,75,75,75,75,75,74,74,73,73,73,73,73,73,72,72,72,72,72,71,71,71,71,71,73,73,73,73,73,73,73,73,73,73,73,73,73,73,72,73,71,65,64,65,63,63,63,63,62,62,62,55,55,54,54,55,64,64,64,64,64,64|14,15,17,17,18,22,24,24, [18:50]
mircea_popescu 24,24,24,25,33,33,33,34,34,34,34,35,35,36,36,36,36,36,36,36,36,36,42,42,42,42,42,42,42,42,42,42,43,43,43,43,43,43,43,44,44,44,44,44,44,44,44,44,44,44,45,45,45,45,45,50,50,50,50,50,50,50,50,50,50,50,50,50,50,51,55,57,63,64,65,68,68,68,68,69,69,69,78,78,78,79,80,99,99,99,99,99,99&chls=1|1|1&chm=B,3699a3,0,0,0|B,d01135,1,0,0|D,555555,2,0:0,2 [18:50]
assbot ... ( ) [18:50]
mircea_popescu holy shit what the fuck happened [18:50]
asciilifeform ahahahaha [18:50]
mircea_popescu oh wow, bitbet uses google charts, i forgot. anyway. likew one of the bitbet charts! [18:50]
mircea_popescu you know, so this algo has N keys, fine, the space is N. caqlculate the complexity for all of them, sort the weakest to the left, draw it for me. [18:51]
mircea_popescu in principle, at 100% granularity this would then result in an image 2^256 or however many pixesl wide. fine. [18:52]
mircea_popescu let me zoom out. [18:52]
mircea_popescu show me the 1024kb graph of arbitrary scheme. [18:52]
asciilifeform << see also [18:52]
assbot Logged on 07-03-2015 18:12:58; asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: 'for your convenience we have packaged the defective transistors separately' ? (famous) [18:52]
asciilifeform if you ~know~ the class of weak keys, you can define them not-keys and have no weak keys ! [18:53]
asciilifeform like we do for rsa [18:53]
mircea_popescu aha! [18:55]
mircea_popescu but currently, a box wherein you input code on one end, and it outputs this peculiar graph at arbitrary zoom level is the most valuable computer i can think of. [18:55]
mircea_popescu yes, it may take a while to zoom you in. ok! [18:55]
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asciilifeform mircea_popescu loves his ulam spirals, l0l [19:00]
mircea_popescu :D [19:01]
mircea_popescu hey, some of us are visual thinkers. [19:01]
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asciilifeform in all seriousness, i mathematicize mentally more or less wholly geometrically. [19:04]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 70305 @ 0.00056331 = 39.6035 BTC [-] {2} [19:33]
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asciilifeform << vintage lulz [19:36]
assbot This sort of thing is a recurring theme in cryptography: [19:36]
asciilifeform '1. Someone proposes a scheme based on Hard Problem X. X looks strong, but the resulting scheme either is too slow or has gigantic keys. 2. Someone else comes along and proposes a related scheme based on Hard Problem Y which, having more structure, allows for either smaller keys or faster computation. 3. Later turns out this extra structure also helps the attacker.' [19:36]
mircea_popescu and yet we deeply wonder why would anyone fix a large key and block requirement! [19:37]
mircea_popescu stupidity of this caliber can't be naturally produced, has to be learned. [19:37]
mircea_popescu but herein we find the elixir of my tolerance of orcs that perhaps bedazzles you alf. this is it : they may be stupid, but at least they're not TRAINEDLY dumb. [19:38]
asciilifeform neither is the dirt under my feet. [19:38]
asciilifeform let's talk to it, too ? [19:38]
asciilifeform and i fully understand why mircea_popescu is fond of orcs. [19:38]
asciilifeform prolly same reason why i and many folks like tame animals more than most people. [19:39]
asciilifeform or even wild, man-eating animals [19:39]
mircea_popescu heh [19:39]
asciilifeform also i will note that orcs are, where typically found, trained-dumb in a number of easily identifiable ways. [19:40]
asciilifeform (e.g., allah-snackbar) [19:41]
mircea_popescu eh, if only. [19:41]
* mircea_popescu recalls how friendly arabs were once it was established he has whiskey and doesn't mind sharing. [19:41]
asciilifeform everybody's quite friendly 'in group of less than three' [19:42]
asciilifeform even chechen. [19:42]
mircea_popescu so i hear yeah [19:42]
mircea_popescu but this ran up to the dozen. [19:42]
asciilifeform must've been mega-whiskey [19:43]
mircea_popescu mubarak days. better times. [19:45]
asciilifeform mu fell off, now we only have barak. [19:46]
mircea_popescu heh [19:47]
mircea_popescu but in other news, i shall brb, for duty calls. ( duty is the one wearing white) [19:49]
assbot ... ( ) [19:49]
asciilifeform << nifty bernstein l0ltr0n [19:52]
assbot [19:52]
asciilifeform [19:59]
thestringpuller asciilifeform: today from the mines. I'm setting up puppet which uses openssl [19:59]
assbot fail0verflow :: plaidCTF 2014 - graphs (crypto200) ... ( ) [19:59]
asciilifeform ^ lulzy problem [20:00]
thestringpuller the thing ships with it's own libcrypto library [20:00]
asciilifeform and apparently the man died yesterday, and his site is gone. [20:00]
thestringpuller but apparently it doesn't know how to find the right .so to link [20:00]
thestringpuller so I get this error " EC_GROUP_new_curve_GF2m symbol not found at runtime link blah blah" [20:00]
thestringpuller so I run readelf on all the libcrypto***.so's [20:00]
thestringpuller the one that shipped with the product that uses it doesn't even have the symbol in it?!?!? [20:01]
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thestringpuller like wtf are these people doing when the put together package management [20:01]
thestringpuller "we're gonna ship you a broken library. have fun!" [20:01]
asciilifeform wai wut [20:02]
asciilifeform why did this even ship with a binary ? [20:02]
thestringpuller exactly my question!!!1 [20:02]
thestringpuller puppet really shit the bed on their open source project [20:03]
thestringpuller "Don't wanna deal with this bullshit? Buy puppet enterprise today!" [20:03]
asciilifeform i have nfi what is 'puppet.' [20:03]
thestringpuller a configuration management tool for devops [20:05]
thestringpuller removes itops out of the equation in lieu of developers slowly losing sanity to ruby [20:05]
asciilifeform ;;later tell mircea_popescu mega-l0ltr0n from ages gone by, [20:07]
gribble The operation succeeded. [20:07]
assbot The Value of Cryptanalysis ... ( ) [20:07]
mircea_popescu wait, bernstein died ?! [20:11]
asciilifeform nonono [20:12]
asciilifeform this other bloke [20:12]
asciilifeform fail0verflow [20:12]
asciilifeform though it won't surprise me if bernstein dies of mystery 'accident' [20:12]
asciilifeform$gal$ << l0ltr0nic [20:13]
assbot The Value of Cryptanalysis ... ( ) [20:13]
mircea_popescu ah ok [20:13]
asciilifeform 'What I don't [20:13]
asciilifeform like is the spying on Americans for political reasons that will [20:13]
asciilifeform someday make what the Soviet Union had look like a dream of a long [20:13]
asciilifeform lost freedom.' [20:13]
asciilifeform ^ '98 [20:14]
asciilifeform massive lulzmine. [20:15]
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asciilifeform e.g., [20:16]
assbot The Value of Cryptanalysis ... ( ) [20:16]
jurov mod6: ben_vulpes got an email " expires in 60 days" [20:28]
jurov should i renew it? [20:28]
ben_vulpes nah man dns a fuck [20:32]
ben_vulpes stop paying lizard hitler for entries in his global lookup table [20:32]
jurov lolk [20:41]
mircea_popescu " everything looks like a boolean satisfiability problem. This problem, also called SAT, is NP-complete, which means that every instance of any problem in NP can be efficiently reduced to a SAT instance. And, importantly, there are SAT solvers out there which are very efficient for many problems encountered in practice." [20:57]
mircea_popescu uh. i had no idea sat is solved now ? [20:57]
mircea_popescu oh he just gets lucky. ok. [20:57]
mircea_popescu hanbot 464 * 8824 * 1.54 * 1.25 = 7881596.8 [21:00]
mircea_popescu 597 * 262 * 1.35 = 211158.9. 7670437.9 net [21:00]
mircea_popescu oops. [21:00]
mircea_popescu 1998-10-18 W T Shaw: "In Bruce's work, there are sinful omissions and comissions, but the subject is so large that this would always be a surity in some form. To judge his character, we will see if he mentions in the future any things he has previously ignored and have been pointed out directly to him." << no. as confirmed throughout and including 18 years later. [21:01]
mircea_popescu "1998-10-18 "Part of the NSA job is to keep the world in the dark about real ctypto. Think about it. What better way to do it than by creating crypto preists for people to whorship."" and apparently this was well understood 18 years ago, also. [21:06]
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mircea_popescu "1998-10-26 Terry Ritter: "We *never* know that a cipher is strong. Ever." "Now, we might 'consider' a cipher strong when all *our* guys have looked at it and found no break. But, quite frankly, the *other* guys have more training, more experience, more resources, more time, and they may even be smarter than our guys." "I claim it is more important to have many different ciphers than to have a few which are 'considered [21:11]
mircea_popescu strong.' Why? Because we *can't* know how strong our ciphers *really* are to the other guy. But we *can* -- guaranteed -- make The Opponent pay dearly to keep up."" [21:11]
mircea_popescu terry ritter actually understands quite al ot. [21:12]
mircea_popescu meanwhile notice that EVERYONE is on aes to the degree people are treating it like windows. [21:12]
mircea_popescu ditto ecc. [21:12]
mircea_popescu fuck this stupid shit already omfg. [21:12]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 84450 @ 0.00056296 = 47.542 BTC [+] {4} [21:19]
mod6 <+jurov> mod6: ben_vulpes got an email " expires in 60 days" << yeah, we've got '' until like 2020 iirc. we're good. [21:21]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: whole thing is a riot, worth reading on rainy day. [21:27]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 64267 @ 0.00056222 = 36.1322 BTC [-] {2} [21:29]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7050 @ 0.00056698 = 3.9972 BTC [+] {2} [21:30]
asciilifeform << solved in the same way travelling salesman is 'solved' [21:31]
assbot Logged on 09-02-2016 23:53:09; mircea_popescu: uh. i had no idea sat is solved now ? [21:31]
asciilifeform by brute force, when very very small. [21:31]
asciilifeform and by cheating in your wolf form, when larger (e.g., simulated annealing, eldritch magic such as evolutionary compute, genetic algo, etc) [21:31]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11173 @ 0.00056222 = 6.2817 BTC [-] {2} [21:41]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 108635 @ 0.00056073 = 60.9149 BTC [-] {4} [21:42]
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asciilifeform !up pete_d_out [21:52]
* assbot gives voice to pete_d_out [21:52]
pete_d_out cheers alf! [21:52]
asciilifeform hola pete_d_out [21:53]
pete_d_out hola! [21:53]
mircea_popescu lol i see you like the wolf form idea! [21:53]
asciilifeform very. [21:53]
asciilifeform i'ma quite definitely be spending moar time in wolf form. [21:54]
pete_d_out << also (in the last few weeks) first time the market cap of qntra has breached 100 btc. to both of which, bravo bravo bravo [21:55]
assbot Logged on 07-02-2016 17:35:13; BingoBoingo: In other news, Qntra just passed 1000 posts. was number 1000 [21:55]
pete_d_out << and further felicitations are due to ben v ! [21:56]
assbot Logged on 07-02-2016 11:15:33; ben_vulpes: happy second birthday, cascadianhacker [21:56]
pete_d_out contravex turns two years old on february 22nd :) [21:57]
pete_d_out in other gendarmerie news, [22:05]
assbot Den of corruption: FBI arrests all but one local official in Texas town — RT USA ... ( ) [22:05]
pete_d_out start with the small towns, then the mid-size towns, then the bigger towns ? [22:05]
mircea_popescu howly shit, a 7500 town worth 2mn, and the bribes going to mayor ~ part of a used car ? [22:11]
mircea_popescu in "what's in store for america" news, [22:12]
assbot ... ( ) [22:12]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: i wrote to blaze. [22:12]
asciilifeform fwiw. [22:12]
mircea_popescu cool. [22:12]
asciilifeform will admit that i'll be a little surprised if he answers. [22:12]
asciilifeform now who wants to try bernstein! [22:13]
mircea_popescu "1998-10-29 "It is obvious that mixinf three different types of ciphers would be better than Triple DES...." << well, it's CERTAINLY obvious that mixing TWO types is better than double-des [22:13]
asciilifeform l0l! double des! [22:13]
mircea_popescu and there DOES exist such a technique as mathematical induction [22:13]
asciilifeform surely [22:14]
mircea_popescu in case any noobs be wondering why it even is triple-DES : doubleDES(plaintext)=plaintext. [22:14]
asciilifeform well, if same key [22:15]
asciilifeform which is the case for virtually all symmetric ciphers [22:15]
mircea_popescu right [22:16]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu's point re: orcs is well-illustrated in the mega-compendium. observe how the crackpots who can barely string coherent words together, actually sit closer to the dirty truth than the 'educated' folk [22:18]
mircea_popescu quite so. [22:18]
mircea_popescu apparently all the stuff i proposed as common sense was in point of fact common sense plainly said on public list 20 years ago. [22:19]
asciilifeform and earlier. [22:19]
mircea_popescu yet somehow the decades passed for no benefit and idiots still pretend like it's never happened. outrageous. [22:19]
asciilifeform 'never happened' (tm) (r) [22:19]
mircea_popescu anyway. aes and des should be excommunicated out of everything asap, there's no two ways about it. [22:20]
asciilifeform it helped a little that google 'lost' the dejanews archive [22:20]
asciilifeform (at least large portions thereof) [22:20]
mircea_popescu also i should like to propose a lemma : that chaining should always proceed TOWARDS SMALLER BLOCKS [22:20]
mircea_popescu and never the other way around. [22:20]
asciilifeform explain? [22:20]
asciilifeform (and there is still des somewhere?!! where?) [22:21]
mircea_popescu if you have ciphers A B C with block lengths lA lB lC, then the chaining should be applied in such order that l1 > l2 > l3. [22:21]
asciilifeform this 'feels right in my gut' but how to justify this? [22:22]
mircea_popescu 1998-10-30 Douglas A. Gwyn: "...I can exhibit the design for a block cipher that is demonstrably secure according to the rules of the game, although it wouldn't be *practical*." << you should write to him, too. [22:22]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform i don't. it is intuition. [22:22]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: now that i think about it, it is elementary [22:23]
* assbot removes voice from pete_d_out [22:23]
asciilifeform a break in the larger-blocked cipher is likely to rely on known structure [22:23]
asciilifeform !up pete_d_out [22:23]
* assbot gives voice to pete_d_out [22:23]
shinohai !up pete_d_out [22:23]
* assbot gives voice to pete_d_out [22:23]
shinohai kek [22:23]
pete_d_out cheers :D [22:24]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: deny the enemy the known structure, when possible. [22:24]
asciilifeform by using the smaller-unit meatgrinders. [22:24]
mircea_popescu i suspect it goes deeper than that. something something entropy/and/bandwidth [22:24]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform incidentally ... what about the set of ultra np ? [22:25]
mircea_popescu mentions it. [22:26]
* AaronvanW has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) [22:27]
mircea_popescu man fucking schneier is intolerable. i can pick out his lines even without looking at attribution. his entire output comes out of a tiny fucking word grinder. [22:28]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: he says right there, garey & johnson [22:28]
* shinohai L'chaim pete_d_out ! [~]D [22:28]
asciilifeform !s garey johnson [22:28]
assbot 1 results for 'garey johnson' : [22:28]
asciilifeform ^ [22:28]
asciilifeform [22:28]
assbot Logged on 06-02-2016 02:49:24; asciilifeform: i actually hit garey & johnson's mega-encyclopaedia 'intractability' and dug [22:28]
mircea_popescu aha. [22:29]
pete_d_out shinohai even a few weeks early, i'll take it. cheers ;) [22:29]
pete_d_out actually working a "news" piece that i'd give to qntra but i... don't have my keys. so to contravex it goes. [22:29]
* linton_s_dawson has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) [22:29]
asciilifeform see also: [22:30]
assbot Complexity Zoo ... ( ) [22:30]
asciilifeform ^ megaclassic [22:30]
mircea_popescu expspace for instance. everyone's fixated on exponential run time [22:30]
mircea_popescu well... [22:30]
mircea_popescu expspace doesn't parallelize as well. [22:30]
mircea_popescu take for instance the berman real numbers thing [22:31]
mircea_popescu iirc all exp- are proven not in P. which is better than what is known for np. [22:32]
pete_d_out << heh. ok so now i see that this 'news' was already in the logs. but does 'motherboard' actually publish the contact lists ? nah. do i ? you bet. [22:33]
assbot Logged on 09-02-2016 17:16:54; ben_vulpes: [22:33]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: also schneier used to be mostly sane [22:33]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform come to think of it : take a matrix, set it to go pieces, calculate the value of the position. [22:33]
asciilifeform till about 2000 [22:33]
* mius (~mius@unaffiliated/mius) has joined #bitcoin-assets [22:34]
* mius has quit (Client Quit) [22:34]
mircea_popescu (note that "beating a human" is not equivalent to solving this. if it were...) [22:34]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: this is actually a bitch, but by no means np-hard [22:34]
* mius (~mius@unaffiliated/mius) has joined #bitcoin-assets [22:34]
asciilifeform somewhere below O(N^3) iirc. [22:34]
mircea_popescu it's not NP, it's EXPTIME [22:34]
asciilifeform supposing 'value' means 'what it means to go player', as in score if the game were declared to end [22:35]
asciilifeform rather than the minimax value ! [22:35]
asciilifeform which is, now that i think about it, what mircea_popescu prolly meant [22:35]
asciilifeform you did, didntcha. [22:35]
mircea_popescu myeah [22:35]
asciilifeform l0lz [22:35]
asciilifeform forget go, nobody ever full-depth minimax even for, e.g., checkers. [22:36]
mircea_popescu and take Stearns-Hartmanis, you know for a fact that all EXPs are actually NOT in P [22:36]
asciilifeform just not done on this planet. [22:36]
mircea_popescu something you don't know about NP itself. [22:36]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform go is convenient tho because so close to a matrix. [22:36]
mircea_popescu it is, in point of fact, a TERNARY NUMERIC SYSTEM MATRIX [22:36]
asciilifeform aha. [22:36]
mircea_popescu or to get back to exponential space problems : "decide first order logic propositions with real numbers, adition and comparison" is a very hard problem. [22:38]
mircea_popescu by which i mean, known to be harder than p. this is proven. [22:39]
mircea_popescu and know to be harder than p is a more valuable proof for our interest than known to be in np. [22:39]
asciilifeform hey i don't even own an instrument that deals in the reals !11111 [22:39]
asciilifeform (and nobody else does either) [22:39]
mircea_popescu again and again we come to the "will need nre hardware" thing [22:40]
* PaulCapestany (~PaulCapes@ has joined #bitcoin-assets [22:40]
mircea_popescu !up PaulCapestany [22:40]
-assbot- You voiced PaulCapestany for 30 minutes. [22:40]
* assbot gives voice to PaulCapestany [22:40]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: if you can design hardware that deals in ~reals~ i will take off my hat. [22:41]
mircea_popescu you got one in your fucking car. [22:41]
asciilifeform mno. [22:41]
asciilifeform contrary to popular notion, analogue comp does ~not~ [22:41]
mircea_popescu it's not programmable quite to your taste, but it does deal in reals. [22:41]
asciilifeform made of what, pfff, quantized matter. [22:41]
mircea_popescu lol [22:41]
asciilifeform piss-poor reals. [22:42]
mircea_popescu note that position is not quantized. [22:42]
asciilifeform planck length!111 [22:42]
mircea_popescu just unknowable. [22:42]
mircea_popescu haha [22:42]
mircea_popescu but anyway, we digress. [22:42]
asciilifeform anyway contrary to the other popular notion, this is not why we don't have analogue pc [22:42]
asciilifeform (really because noise floor) [22:42]
mircea_popescu aha. it's exactly the same thing. "unknowable" [22:43]
* adnn has quit (Remote host closed the connection) [22:43]
asciilifeform noise in analogue machine is multiplicative. [22:43]
asciilifeform which is kiss of death. [22:43]
asciilifeform and actually how my rng worx. [22:43]
mircea_popescu but getting back to it, the point i want made is that EXP-* inclusion beats NP inclusion. [22:43]
asciilifeform yes, but to what planet should i go to, to get one ? [22:44]
mircea_popescu hm. [22:44]
mircea_popescu what don't you like about the go above ? [22:45]
asciilifeform just like mircea_popescu, to help folks working on a historic and unsolved mathematical problem by replacing with unfathomly harder one, l0l [22:45]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: that it isn't a cryptoscheme ? [22:45]
asciilifeform (please wake me up if you can convert it into one) [22:45]
* _flow_ has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) [22:47]
deedbot- [Contravex: A blog by Pete Dushenski » Contravex: A blog by Pete Dushenski] Pro-palestinian hackers leak FBI and DHS database. Here it is. - [22:47]
pete_d_out speaking of 'sensitive material', what ever came of that little dispute with your hosting co. over the sipa hit, mircea_popescu ? [22:48]
shinohai "Nigerian prince schemes" <<< lol pete_d_out [22:49]
asciilifeform pete_d_out: you do know that the lowliest monkey in each usg ministry has access to the microshit 'outlook' phonebook seen in the link, aha ? [22:51]
asciilifeform even contractors [22:51]
asciilifeform (all the way down to visiting chinese grad students) [22:52]
pete_d_out but you didn't and neither did i [22:53]
pete_d_out 'more just' now [22:54]
* assbot removes voice from pete_d_out [22:54]
shinohai !up pete_d_out [22:54]
* assbot gives voice to pete_d_out [22:54]
pete_d_out or to quote dr. zhivago, 'it's more just this way' [22:55]
pete_d_out cheers shinohai :) [22:55]
pete_d_out asciilifeform and chinese grad student mighta had a few hundred contacts even, but tens of thousands ?? [22:55]
pete_d_out what kind of silos are these ? [22:56]
asciilifeform all of them [22:59]
asciilifeform this is a mega-unsurprise. [23:00]
pete_d_out weird. [23:01]
asciilifeform iirc the list of folks who work for fbi and dhs is not even classified 'sensitive' (usg legal term, the thing below 'secret') [23:02]
asciilifeform wake me up when nsa list, sorted by directorate, leaks. [23:02]
asciilifeform (phun phakt: even they are permitted to openly admit to working for nsa) [23:03]
asciilifeform i once turned up at a party full of'em [23:03]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 35417 @ 0.00056468 = 19.9993 BTC [+] {2} [23:04]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 48898 @ 0.00056506 = 27.6303 BTC [+] [23:05]
pete_d_out asciilifeform was schutzstaffel any different ? [23:06]
asciilifeform idk, never went to ~their~ party [23:07]
pete_d_out just another example of you being born too late ! [23:09]
pete_d_out << i lollered at 'attended butterbeast community college' [23:09]
assbot Logged on 09-02-2016 09:19:11; BingoBoingo: [23:09]
mod6 [23:11]
mod6 haha wat [23:11]
* assbot removes voice from PaulCapestany [23:11]
TomServo Is there a better way to do this: ? [23:12]
* mod6 has rather enjoyed the crypto discussion in the last number of days. [23:12]
assbot dpaste: 0V93852 ... ( ) [23:12]
* mod6 looks [23:12]
TomServo Like trimming the last entry, or checking for consecutive hours? [23:12]
mod6 whacha tryin to do? [23:13]
TomServo Just looking at avg blocks per hour on a syncing node [23:13]
pete_d_out <--> "My body is not something that can be sold. I can sell my time, attention, etc but my body always belongs to me. And I think shame is more your area than mine, otherwise why would you respond to such a non-threatening post with such violence?" [23:14]
assbot Logged on 09-02-2016 11:39:22; BingoBoingo: Brave camho ventures into the bitcointalk cesspool [23:14]
mod6 ah [23:14]
pete_d_out << /me always wondered what alf used for 'smartphone' [23:17]
assbot Logged on 09-02-2016 13:16:19; asciilifeform: nah thats what ipnohe is for [23:17]
pete_d_out << haha best 538 yet [23:18]
assbot Logged on 09-02-2016 13:20:50; ben_vulpes: << great charts [23:18]
asciilifeform pete_d_out: for what did you think. [23:19]
asciilifeform also for 'радио звезда' when commuting, what else. [23:20]
pete_d_out i toyed with the idea of dumbphone mebbe [23:20]
asciilifeform didja also toy with idea of chewing rusty nails ? [23:20]
pete_d_out i did ! [23:20]
* phf uses dumbphone [23:20]
pete_d_out asciilifeform you're a bit of a masochist of nothing else. [23:21]
pete_d_out if* [23:21]
pete_d_out phf same here [23:21]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10798 @ 0.00056505 = 6.1014 BTC [-] {2} [23:21]
asciilifeform fwiw, the 'dumb'/'smart' distinction is a sham [23:22]
asciilifeform or rather, from user's pov, it exists; [23:22]
asciilifeform while it makes not a lick of difference to usg deathsquad [23:22]
asciilifeform worth remembering that the ~original~ (in as far as publicly known) case of pwned phone with always-on mic was a 'dumb' [23:23]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 116450 @ 0.00056725 = 66.0563 BTC [+] {2} [23:23]
phf well, that's not a reason i use mine. i spend so much time on technology, i require explicit and often prolonged periods of disconnect to stay healthy [23:23]
pete_d_out ^^^^ [23:23]
pete_d_out and, hell, ergonomics [23:24]
asciilifeform l0l, wut?! [23:24]
asciilifeform pete_d_out actually talks ~into~ the thing ? [23:24]
pete_d_out huh ? [23:24]
pete_d_out nonono [23:24]
asciilifeform headset exists [23:24]
pete_d_out but using as 'internet device' [23:24]
* assbot removes voice from pete_d_out [23:25]
asciilifeform !up pete_d_out [23:25]
* assbot gives voice to pete_d_out [23:25]
pete_d_out standing there or sitting there, hunched over with the stupid i-thing 12" in front of your face because it's 'convenient' instead of walking over to desktop or laptop or god forbid waiting until you get home. ~that's~ the killer. [23:26]
* nubbins` (~leel@unaffiliated/nubbins) has joined #bitcoin-assets [23:26]
asciilifeform pete_d_out clearly does not spend much time stuck in cars [23:27]
asciilifeform or trains [23:27]
kakobrekla pete_d_out how about some prehistoric nokia [23:27]
kakobrekla also works as hammer [23:27]
* assbot gives voice to nubbins` [23:28]
asciilifeform kakobrekla: pretty sure these won't even work, where i live, today [23:28]
* kakobrekla likes phones that work as hammers [23:28]
nubbins` as a lord of bitcoin, tmsr~, cognizant of the responsibilities that my words thusly carry, i hereby solemnly rebuke any attempt to strip me of my lordship. [23:28]
asciilifeform american telcos phased out analogue band [23:28]
shinohai "Damn, we're 1 brick short of finishing this house" "I have a Nokia!" [23:28]
nubbins` speak now if you believe a lord that has contributed TRB patches, who owns the second-largest stock warrant, who trades in the only physical collectibles that are priced solely in BTC, who pays the bill for, who is the republic's de facto minister of letters awaiting with bated quill the whittling-down of a codebase fit to publish, should be stripped of his title; speak your treason now, that all may witness it. [23:28]
kakobrekla im sure something like nokia 3210 still works here just fine [23:28]
asciilifeform fwiw i agree with nubbins` [23:28]
nubbins` lords care not whether their presence "confuses the noobs"; such reasoning is unfit for discourse [23:28]
pete_d_out asciilifeform i walk or cycle 4/7 days per week. 'saddam' sits in heated parkade. blessedly for both and neither of our constitutions could bear more roadtime. [23:28]
phf i thought cars are typically books-on-tape territory [23:29]
pete_d_out kakobrekla razr isn't a great hammer, admittedly [23:30]
asciilifeform phf: i actually ran out (!) of book tape warez of tolerable quality [23:30]
asciilifeform from many years of this. [23:30]
phf pimsleur? :) [23:30]
kakobrekla pete_d_out yeah that phone is garbage [23:31]
phf could be speaking french and iranian by now [23:31]
asciilifeform phf: nah, that sort of thing needs attention span not available in car [23:31]
* pete_d_out isn't caught up on logs, isn't sure what nubbins` is referring to. [23:31]
pete_d_out kakobrekla i quite like it. [23:31]
asciilifeform pete_d_out: [23:31]
assbot The Lordship list, third year. on Trilema - A blog by Mircea Popescu. ... ( ) [23:31]
nubbins` don't worry pete, just keep linking trilema on your blog [23:31]
asciilifeform kakobrekla: funnily, my brother uses 'razor' for decade+ now, it looks entirely pristine [23:32]
phf that's the phone that i use i guess it's discontinued, since the only available option is same for $250 :o [23:32]
assbot Samsung GT-E1182L E1182 DUOS Unlocked Quad-Band Dual SIM GSM Phone with Dual SIM Standby Support, FM Radio and Organizer - US Warranty - Silver: Cell Phones & Accessories ... ( ) [23:32]
pete_d_out nubbins` ok ? [23:32]
kakobrekla we are talking about this 'razr' ? [23:33]
assbot ... ( ) [23:33]
asciilifeform kakobrekla: yes, it! [23:33]
pete_d_out ^^ [23:33]
kakobrekla odd. [23:33]
asciilifeform why? [23:33]
phf biggest issue with razr, screen guaranteed to crack if you sit down with it in back pocket [23:33]
* mitch_callahan has quit (Quit: mitch_callahan) [23:34]
asciilifeform so never put it in back pocket. [23:34]
asciilifeform i've never in my whole life used a back pocket. [23:34]
nubbins` my back pockets are empty [23:34]
nubbins` why sit on a thing? [23:34]
asciilifeform anything therein will either be destroyed or worm its way up your arse [23:34]
asciilifeform aha! [23:34]
kakobrekla i havent heard nothing but 'it stopped working' from the owners if memory serves [23:34]
nubbins` even a wallet -- your cards will all crack in half [23:34]
phf i like to freeclimb abandoned buildings when i'm drunk, i have very specific requirements for my cellphones. i've destroyed 4 iphones so far, unfixable mechanical damage [23:35]
asciilifeform kakobrekla: perhaps these were the dropping, drowning, back-pocketing kind of folk [23:35]
asciilifeform against whom nothing, not even cast iron crowbar, is safe [23:35]
kakobrekla i dont know but if i cant hammer nails with it its not a phone for me [23:36]
kakobrekla i mean wtf now i have to take care of it!? [23:36]
kakobrekla fuck that. [23:36]
phf ^^ [23:36]
asciilifeform 'leave the microscope at home??' 'no!!!111' [23:36]
kakobrekla but its not a precision device. [23:37]
kakobrekla its like youd need to 'take care' of a tank. [23:37]
kakobrekla puhlease. [23:37]
asciilifeform << here we go. [23:38]
assbot ... ( ) [23:38]
kakobrekla first day i got my last phone it fell about 5 meters to concrete floor [23:38]
kakobrekla put the battery back in still works to this very day [23:39]
asciilifeform << moar! [23:39]
assbot ... ( ) [23:39]
pete_d_out << pretty much this. /me sold aapl in 2013, mostly uses 06-08 hardware now. no steve, no apple. [23:39]
assbot Logged on 09-02-2016 13:52:37; mircea_popescu: anyway, the winds have pointedly turned against apple. the time when they did that "we'll brick your device if you used other parts in it" thing i'd arbitrarily pick as the jumping the shark moment. but in any case : apple is for the next decade a company to sell, not to hold and CERTAINLY not to buy. [23:39]
kakobrekla if it was an 'iphone' it be broken to 100 pieces [23:39]
asciilifeform btw what was mircea_popescu speaking of there [23:39]
asciilifeform what did apple brick 'if you used other parts in it' [23:40]
nubbins` nothing [23:40]
kakobrekla tank should be able to take a beating. so should phones. [23:41]
asciilifeform nubbins`: aha! afaik [23:41]
kakobrekla there is no good reason not to. [23:41]
nubbins` you can use 100% "other parts" if you like. [23:41]
phf asciilifeform: perhaps this [23:41]
assbot Apple says iPhone 'Error 53' is to protect customers' security | Technology | The Guardian ... ( ) [23:41]
kakobrekla relatedly kindle wont boot with unofficial battery afaik [23:42]
asciilifeform kakobrekla: this is SOP on most new laptops [23:42]
asciilifeform ditto for power bricks, for perhaps a decade now [23:42]
asciilifeform (won't brick, but machine won't charge) [23:42]
asciilifeform this is called 'revenue leakage prevention' believe or not. [23:42]
kakobrekla my tp charges just fine as long as the voltage is right [23:43]
asciilifeform '90s ? [23:43]
kakobrekla recent [23:43]
kakobrekla must be an apple thing. [23:43]
kakobrekla what you are describing [23:43]
asciilifeform anyway chinese don't do it yet. [23:43]
asciilifeform l0ltr0n from phf's link : [23:45]
assbot US intelligence chief: we might use the internet of things to spy on you | Technology | The Guardian ... ( ) [23:45]
asciilifeform '“In the future, intelligence services might use the [internet of things] for identification, surveillance, monitoring, location tracking, and targeting for recruitment, or to gain access to networks or user credentials,” Clapper said.' [23:45]
pete_d_out recruitment !!!1 [23:45]
asciilifeform pete_d_out: aka blackmail [23:46]
pete_d_out i'm sure that'll work a solid 2/3 times. [23:46]
pete_d_out unfortunately, 1/3 'recruits' looking for every possible way to bring down their 'employer' is a lot of angry worker bees stinging anywhere and everywhere [23:47]
asciilifeform most 'angry' bees don't know anything interesting. [23:47]
asciilifeform or we would be sitting here and discussing how aes leaks key bits. [23:48]
asciilifeform and how magic packet enables intel remote admin via nic. [23:48]
pete_d_out << no one got the 'pete(r)ed out' angle eh. hm. maybe bb's right, my jokes do need work :( [23:48]
asciilifeform etc [23:48]
assbot Logged on 09-02-2016 14:09:06; ben_vulpes: doesn't that get you on some kind of vile criminal list in canada? [23:48]
pete_d_out << no one could've predicted ! [23:49]
assbot Logged on 09-02-2016 14:10:08; mircea_popescu: i never expected him to not show up under his PROFESSIONAL names... [23:49]
* Howdy__ has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) [23:50]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 78650 @ 0.00056769 = 44.6488 BTC [+] [23:52]
* assbot removes voice from pete_d_out [23:56]
shinohai !up pete_d_out [23:56]
* assbot gives voice to pete_d_out [23:56]
pete_d_out thx [23:56]
shinohai And with that I am off to the loving arms of my Mistress for the night. Ciao! [23:57]
* Kushedout ( has joined #bitcoin-assets [23:59]
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