Forum logs for 19 Nov 2015

Sunday, 24 November, Year 11 d.Tr. | Author: Mircea Popescu

mircea_popescu	my penis is 12 inches long, fits vaginas up to 11.624 inches !	[00:00]
mircea_popescu	11.6238 actually, to stay in ranges.	[00:00]
asciilifeform	though this is not an abuse if the 45,000 is a measured qty while the 50 is a postulated one	[00:00]
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mircea_popescu	i admit to being a theoreitcal physicist.	[00:01]
asciilifeform	e.g., '101.1234 g of hcn poisons up to 500 wolverines'	[00:01]
mircea_popescu	this notwithstanding, i did spend SOME time in the lab	[00:01]
mircea_popescu	at no point have i measured a ,000. ever, in my life.	[00:01]
*	asciilifeform has	[00:01]
mircea_popescu	more power to you.	[00:02]
mircea_popescu	45kw of it.	[00:02]
asciilifeform	had an analytical balance sold for use with diamonds and rare earths	[00:02]
asciilifeform	($30k, iirc)	[00:02]
asciilifeform	8 places.	[00:02]
*	asciilifeform idly pictures it in its most likely current use: as a doorstop	[00:02]
mircea_popescu	the finest tolerance motors i know of are in the 0.0x% range of consumption.	[00:03]
asciilifeform	typically motor used in, e.g., fine robotics, has optical encoder (think mouse wheel)	[00:03]
asciilifeform	rather than a particularly precisely-wound coil	[00:03]
mircea_popescu	ie, rated for 10 mA, does 10.007 or some shit	[00:03]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 46956 @ 0.00051491 = 24.1781 BTC [+] {2}	[00:04]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: the most likely scenario is that a monkey lifted the nums straight from a datasheet.	[00:05]
asciilifeform	which, in turn, was arrived at in much the same way	[00:05]
asciilifeform	down to some nether space where elephants stand atop of giant turtles.	[00:05]
mircea_popescu	well, seeing how they were supposed to deliver in 2014, the more likely scenario is that this was someone's future kickstarter.	[00:05]
asciilifeform	aha.	[00:06]
mircea_popescu	the cluj museum of geology's analytical balance, ftr, to be used with their 4.1 carat yellow diamond, is actually all mechanical. made in like, 1920.	[00:06]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: we had one of these. stood in the library	[00:06]
asciilifeform	still worked great	[00:06]
mircea_popescu	pretty spiffy thing. yah.	[00:06]
asciilifeform	the kind with the glass doors	[00:06]
asciilifeform	it was a thing of beauty	[00:06]
mircea_popescu	aha.	[00:06]
mircea_popescu	very nice workmanship.	[00:06]
asciilifeform	like clock	[00:07]
*	asciilifeform always wanted just such	[00:07]
mircea_popescu	anyway. i dun see how weighing past 3-4 digits is even meaningful in atmosphere.	[00:07]
asciilifeform	it sat in a sealed cabinet	[00:07]
asciilifeform	and yes, could measure a flask of water evaporating at stp	[00:08]
mircea_popescu	how'd you get things in ?	[00:08]
asciilifeform	it wasn't a hermetic seal, but rather a kind of inverted glass beaker with very small hole for the robopipette	[00:09]
mircea_popescu	i was rooting for a very small ecluse	[00:09]
asciilifeform	l0l	[00:09]
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mircea_popescu	!up Cristina_	[00:10]
-assbot-	You voiced Cristina_ for 30 minutes.	[00:10]
*	assbot gives voice to Cristina_	[00:10]
mircea_popescu	in some ways she reminds me of indian candy. how's life treating ya Cristina_ ?	[00:10]
Cristina_	up!	[00:10]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12500 @ 0.00051827 = 6.4784 BTC [+]	[00:11]
mircea_popescu	!up birdman_	[00:12]
-assbot-	You voiced birdman_ for 30 minutes.	[00:12]
*	assbot gives voice to birdman_	[00:12]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: thing was as seen on left hand of the photo in this link - http://www.ebay.com/itm/METTLER-TOLEDO-BALANCE-SCALE-KIT-Tecan-Gravimetric-Calibration-QC-Analytical-Lab-/230957309812	[00:12]
assbot	Mettler Toledo Balance Scale Kit Tecan Gravimetric Calibration QC Analytical Lab \| eBay ... ( http://bit.ly/1HZW31W )	[00:12]
*	asciilifeform observes how 'cheap' now	[00:13]
asciilifeform	i had it installed to make the machine auto-calibrating (afaik to this day no such thing is offered by the original vendor, or anybody else. but no one wanted it.)	[00:14]
mircea_popescu	http://dpaste.com/3N2HHHT <<< how a "modern" page looks.	[00:14]
assbot	dpaste: 3N2HHHT ... ( http://bit.ly/1HZWdGH )	[00:14]
asciilifeform	ick	[00:14]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 35710 @ 0.0005161 = 18.4299 BTC [-] {3}	[00:14]
asciilifeform	kinda funny usg story - 30k balance? no prob. but when i asked for 20kg of Pb brick for pedestal, so it wouldn't wander at 4th dec place when the lifts went up & down in the hallway - they never happened	[00:17]
asciilifeform	because... not in the catalogue !	[00:17]
asciilifeform	and how dare you.	[00:17]
asciilifeform	etc	[00:17]
mircea_popescu	yup. it's a thing, very ideologically dedicated.	[00:20]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 112350 @ 0.00051874 = 58.2804 BTC [+] {5}	[00:34]
asciilifeform	not sure if 'ideology' is the right word	[00:36]
asciilifeform	would've been familiar to a clerk under peter I	[00:36]
asciilifeform	'fill out the form'	[00:36]
asciilifeform	the strange, imho, part, is that ~outside~ of these constraints - buy from catalogue, or else wait most of a year (i got the motherfucking lisp machine, yes) - can do pretty much whatever	[00:37]
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asciilifeform	(because the commonplace, sane constraint of being economically +ev - isn't there)	[00:38]
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BingoBoingo	From the mines: "	[00:44]
BingoBoingo	So Dr. Oz did a segment about the "dark web" today and an image like this was part of the imagery describing the dangerous stuff going on there: https://i.sli.mg/5mOHmZ.pngPNG Nothing about the drug trade, scams, hacking, killing for hire, etc. The real reason for the existence of the dark web is "bullying" and fat shaming."	[00:44]
assbot	SLiMG - Upload and Share ... ( http://bit.ly/1X9mo4B )	[00:44]
asciilifeform	'content not found'	[00:44]
asciilifeform	https://sli.mg/5mOHmZ.png << this ?	[00:45]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1X9msl4 )	[00:45]
BingoBoingo	Ah, that. I must have fucked up the copypasta	[00:46]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 34981 @ 0.00051145 = 17.891 BTC [-] {2}	[00:47]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12400 @ 0.00051012 = 6.3255 BTC [-]	[00:50]
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deedbot-	[BitBet Bets Bets] 1.40000000 BTC on 'No' - Federal Reserve will raise interest rate at December FOMC meeting - http://bitbet.us/bet/1221/federal-reserve-will-raise-interest-rate-at-december/#b20	[00:55]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 39600 @ 0.00051056 = 20.2182 BTC [+]	[01:08]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16300 @ 0.00051018 = 8.3159 BTC [-] {3}	[01:34]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 26469 @ 0.00051135 = 13.5349 BTC [+]	[01:35]
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punkman	http://www.armstrongeconomics.com/archives/39102	[01:37]
assbot	Police Civil Asset Forfeitures Exceed All Burglaries in 2014 \| Armstrong Economics ... ( http://bit.ly/1SZVqMs )	[01:37]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 30607 @ 0.00051966 = 15.9052 BTC [+] {2}	[01:47]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 54900 @ 0.0005197 = 28.5315 BTC [+] {4}	[02:22]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 30750 @ 0.00052047 = 16.0045 BTC [+] {3}	[02:41]
mircea_popescu	what "killing for hire"	[02:46]
BingoBoingo	Andreas	[02:46]
mircea_popescu	must be great to inhabit reality-free world. as alf says, the commonplace, sane constraint of being economically +ev - isn't there.	[02:47]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16450 @ 0.00052049 = 8.5621 BTC [+]	[02:48]
BingoBoingo	Fuck even neutral ev is rare	[02:49]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 96800 @ 0.00052049 = 50.3834 BTC [+]	[02:56]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 83650 @ 0.0005206 = 43.5482 BTC [+] {3}	[03:08]
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punkman	https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CTxc98nUkAAS7tX.jpg:large	[03:16]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1T08n8S )	[03:16]
BingoBoingo	So qntra's down but there seems to be a law enforcement crackdown on the reddit clearnet markets. "btc is not the future anymore it's really becoming the only option." https://archive.is/Mcerz	[03:18]
assbot	[Source] Gear Heros payment method rant : Steroidsourcetalk ... ( http://bit.ly/1MUIo20 )	[03:18]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13000 @ 0.00052064 = 6.7683 BTC [+]	[03:18]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 50450 @ 0.00052067 = 26.2678 BTC [+] {2}	[03:20]
punkman	BingoBoingo: what's "major mg player"?	[03:39]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 106486 @ 0.00051427 = 54.7626 BTC [-] {5}	[03:49]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 2789 @ 0.00050964 = 1.4214 BTC [-]	[03:56]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 34800 @ 0.00051754 = 18.0104 BTC [+]	[04:06]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4890 @ 0.00051793 = 2.5327 BTC [+] {2}	[04:39]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20347 @ 0.00052092 = 10.5992 BTC [+] {2}	[05:32]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 30400 @ 0.00052093 = 15.8363 BTC [+]	[05:39]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 26050 @ 0.00051919 = 13.5249 BTC [-]	[05:43]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 41442 @ 0.00052093 = 21.5884 BTC [+]	[05:49]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20850 @ 0.00052094 = 10.8616 BTC [+] {2}	[06:00]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 62406 @ 0.00052205 = 32.5791 BTC [+] {3}	[06:10]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 60150 @ 0.00051868 = 31.1986 BTC [-] {3}	[06:13]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 44100 @ 0.00052254 = 23.044 BTC [+] {3}	[06:18]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9400 @ 0.00052266 = 4.913 BTC [+]	[06:32]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 51300 @ 0.0005179 = 26.5683 BTC [-] {3}	[06:39]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 49200 @ 0.00052265 = 25.7144 BTC [+] {2}	[06:50]
davout	salut les assetophiles	[06:50]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9850 @ 0.00052266 = 5.1482 BTC [+]	[06:55]
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jurov	hi davout	[07:47]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 25000 @ 0.00051565 = 12.8913 BTC [-] {4}	[07:55]
jurov	we know refined sugar and other white stuff is evil, but last night I was horrified to see how: http://www.explo.yt.s3.amazonaws.com/William-Dufty-Sugar-Blues.pdf	[07:55]
davout	jurov: tl;dr?	[07:56]
jurov	sorry it's scanned...asciilifeform what ocr do you use?	[07:56]
jurov	tl;dr: it corrupted every civilization that touched it, back since crusades	[07:57]
davout	sugar is eval, better switch to cocaine amirite	[07:57]
jurov	i enjoyed the tidbit about coca-cola being a criminal organization since 120 y ago (as decreed by US judge, it got largely ignored)	[07:58]
davout	evil*	[07:58]
davout	well, eval is also evil	[07:58]
jurov	and not diabetes, but psychical disorders and other problems are correlated with refined sugar/white flour/white rice intake	[07:59]
jurov	*but also	[07:59]
jurov	dude has new age/yin/yang slant but most information is sourced	[07:59]
jurov	basically, capitalism is fueled by sugar addiction, instead of removing sugar we "invent" cures that can be sold - again this is known but to what degree and how long ago it started!	[08:02]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16986 @ 0.00051322 = 8.7176 BTC [-] {2}	[08:02]
adlai	~10kya. agriculture lets the greedy algorithm compound upon itself	[08:03]
jurov	adlai read it. asians who ate brown rice were completely fine. until the "invention" of white rice	[08:04]
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adlai	it's a rather inevitable progression, the only sure way to avoid it is to learn from those who didn't	[08:04]
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jurov	it also got me sceptic about other addictives, like easy credit... we can avoid it individually, mirea can even have his hangings... but barring planetary catastrophe	[08:05]
jurov	the civilization will just get addicted to more and more stuff	[08:05]
adlai	too much money, too much sucrose... so we blaze across the petri dish, gobbling up agar until we smack into plastic	[08:07]
jurov	and then invent expensive 'solutions' to side effects	[08:07]
jurov	i more deeply comprehended why mircea disdains "progress",it's eloquently explained there	[08:09]
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adlai	i'm not sure the thing being fueled here is capitalism. i want to say consumerism, but it seems more towards consumptionism, packaged and sold to the consumer as consumerism	[08:13]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 32150 @ 0.0005096 = 16.3836 BTC [-] {2}	[08:22]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 94013 @ 0.00050948 = 47.8977 BTC [-] {3}	[08:31]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7700 @ 0.00050935 = 3.922 BTC [-]	[08:51]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 40900 @ 0.00051248 = 20.9604 BTC [+] {2}	[09:39]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 34700 @ 0.00050924 = 17.6706 BTC [-] {3}	[09:43]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 62600 @ 0.00051365 = 32.1545 BTC [+] {4}	[09:50]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 21227 @ 0.00051709 = 10.9763 BTC [+] {2}	[09:54]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 27850 @ 0.00051192 = 14.257 BTC [-] {3}	[10:02]
jurov	adlai it's the addiction that enables accumulation of capital and its use in business	[10:09]
jurov	societies where wars are fought on honor instead of satisfying the cravings don't need it, also they scarcely need to manage "delayed consumption" so much	[10:11]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 30262 @ 0.00052218 = 15.8022 BTC [+] {2}	[10:11]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 38950 @ 0.00052135 = 20.3066 BTC [-]	[10:33]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10000 @ 0.00052234 = 5.2234 BTC [+] {3}	[10:40]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 24642 @ 0.00051758 = 12.7542 BTC [-] {2}	[10:42]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9935 @ 0.00051954 = 5.1616 BTC [+] {2}	[10:45]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 43300 @ 0.00052277 = 22.6359 BTC [+] {4}	[10:50]
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kakobrekla	i have been using xylitol instead of the usual sugars lately and i am still kicking	[10:56]
mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=19-11-2015#1326894 < and capitalism ?	[11:00]
assbot	Logged on 19-11-2015 10:55:29; jurov: and not diabetes, but psychical disorders and other problems are correlated with refined sugar/white flour/white rice intake	[11:00]
mircea_popescu	o shit, check it out, next line down.	[11:01]
mircea_popescu	how do i do these things.	[11:01]
mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=19-11-2015#1326903 << until what ? what would you say is the stable solution here ?	[11:02]
assbot	Logged on 19-11-2015 11:02:11; jurov: the civilization will just get addicted to more and more stuff	[11:02]
mircea_popescu	even if you're not a fan of the foundation of rome/end of thebes mythology, even if you don't particularly enjoy the jewish sodomah/gomorrah stories, what do you think would be the stable solution here ?	[11:02]
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adlai	if satoshi cuts down an entire forest to print out leaflets, but nobody reads the whitepaper, did he still make sound money?	[11:39]
deedbot-	[BitBet Bets Bets] 3.00000000 BTC on 'No' - Cardano to Ship in 2015 - http://bitbet.us/bet/1100/cardano-to-ship-in-2015/#b16	[11:41]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 41150 @ 0.00052291 = 21.5177 BTC [+] {2}	[11:47]
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asciilifeform	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=19-11-2015#1326860 << uncle joe !!	[11:57]
assbot	Logged on 19-11-2015 06:12:53; punkman: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CTxc98nUkAAS7tX.jpg:large	[11:57]
mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=19-11-2015#1326906 no, no, allow me to give you a grandiose anecdote to go with that! so, mp spends 6-700 euro to get new servers at internoc24.com which is supposedly the flagship of the entire "offshore hosting" "industry". in exchange for which payment, the following conversation ensues : http://dpaste.com/1HP9QY2	[11:58]
assbot	Logged on 19-11-2015 11:05:17; jurov: i more deeply comprehended why mircea disdains "progress",it's eloquently explained there	[11:58]
assbot	dpaste: 1HP9QY2 ... ( http://bit.ly/1NdThhb )	[11:58]
*	btcdrak (uid115429@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-jwyhpappcdgxcqov) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[11:58]
mircea_popescu	so now tell me a little more about ddos and basic bojums and whatnot.	[11:59]
mircea_popescu	the simple point of fact is that the kids are idiots. not some of them. all of them. the class arrives already thrown, and nobody can be arsed to put their foot down/	[11:59]
mircea_popescu	so they just hire the scum, and hope and pray. and hey, if the customers are displeased what ever the fuck, it's "best business practices", ie, "all the other shops intown are hiring from the same group of perambulating monkeys. you want these shoes or not ?"	[12:00]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: how come 'Russia is no good. What else you got' ?	[12:00]
mircea_popescu	what ddos ? what anything ?	[12:00]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform elemetary i was going to turn down his first babble.	[12:00]
mircea_popescu	you ever been in a negotiation before ?	[12:00]
asciilifeform	sure. was wondering if this.	[12:00]
mircea_popescu	yes, this.	[12:00]
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asciilifeform	reads almost like a comic caricature of orc sales, where you bid on a pig, and get offered old stinking rat, 'same!!1111'	[12:01]
*	asciilifeform begins to grasp what mircea_popescu was trying to hammer into his thick head the other day.	[12:02]
mircea_popescu	no dude, let me quote from eulora chan :	[12:02]
mircea_popescu	incidentally mircea_popescu is that Eulora poster available in some format that can be easily printed? guess it can't hurt to get some copies pinned around the uni campus here	[12:02]
mircea_popescu	where is here ?	[12:02]
mircea_popescu	* hanbot has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)	[12:02]
mircea_popescu	uk, reading uni	[12:02]
mircea_popescu	http://www.reading.ac.uk/	[12:02]
mircea_popescu	Title: Discover the University of Reading - study, live and socialise at one of the top 1% universities in the world University of Reading (at www.reading.ac.uk)	[12:02]
mircea_popescu	DianaComan have you met any of these brave young fellows populating reading ?	[12:02]
mircea_popescu	the only thing i'd pay them to do is slit their own throats.	[12:02]
mircea_popescu	save isis the trouble.	[12:02]
mircea_popescu	http://danielpbarron.com/eulora/shop.txt updated prices and some new inventory	[12:02]
mircea_popescu	or, if you prefer the alternative formulation, http://logs.minigame.bz/2015-11-09.log.html#t04:28:25	[12:02]
mircea_popescu	Title: #Eulora log for Monday, 2015-11-09 (at logs.minigame.bz)	[12:02]
mircea_popescu	btw lobbes could it read the log line instead of the page title ?	[12:02]
mircea_popescu	heh, I have some coming to me to figure out some Maths really - about 50% run after a few lessons complaining that it is too hard and I'm happy with that	[12:02]
assbot	Discover the University of Reading - study, live and socialise at one of the top 1% universities in the world – University of Reading ... ( http://bit.ly/1NdTNfl )	[12:02]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1NdTLUD )	[12:03]
assbot	#Eulora log for Monday, 2015-11-09 ... ( http://bit.ly/1NdTOzH )	[12:03]
*	iinaj (sid110431@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-kzdlqwubvllcrcdr) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[12:03]
mircea_popescu	so, yeah. the herd has won through the age old tactic of "we'll just stick together". because you thought that unions and "collective acton" was good.	[12:04]
mircea_popescu	it's not good. it's not even ok. it is HORRIBLE.	[12:04]
mircea_popescu	it makes the world a shittier place.	[12:04]
asciilifeform	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=19-11-2015#1326968 << we have this pestilence. in the maths dept of $uni, there is a gigantic wall of leaflets for 'tutoring' flyers, and half of all the phd candidate folks pay their rent this way: helping victims of usa 'schooling' fail more slowly	[12:04]
assbot	Logged on 19-11-2015 14:59:25; mircea_popescu: heh, I have some coming to me to figure out some Maths really - about 50% run after a few lessons complaining that it is too hard and I'm happy with that	[12:04]
mircea_popescu	soon enough they unionize themselves out of class, then they show up for jobs and "force" the "evil capitalist" to you know, hire them to randi zuckerberg all over the office.	[12:05]
mircea_popescu	helping my foot.	[12:05]
mircea_popescu	it's dumb-dumb : the phds pay the rents, the scum gets to keep the pretense going	[12:05]
asciilifeform	prolongs the agony	[12:05]
asciilifeform	sorta like american 'medicine'	[12:05]
asciilifeform	the 'unionize out of class' thing is horrifyingly real. in usa we have a custom of 'grade on a curve'	[12:08]
asciilifeform	where literally this happens.	[12:08]
*	sinetek (~quassel@114.134.189.22) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[12:09]
asciilifeform	'Some data centers in Ukraine had a raid this week and we dont receive the information in time to set the offers out of stock.' << any idea if this is true ?	[12:09]
mircea_popescu	exactly. so what happens next ? a) they show up for work and b) the only work they can do is star in movies, where unfortunate thirld worlders suffer the horrible fate of having their ancestral knowledge passed down at great expense that "white man good, you scum" married to the fact that deep down in his entrails he feels like this is a great thing!	[12:10]
mircea_popescu	and so now you have the whole planet poisoned.	[12:10]
asciilifeform	not entirely off subj, http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=19-11-2015#1326848 >> i've begun to suspect that most u.s. folk who know about the police looting are ~in favour~. thinkaboutit: they have no assets to steal. ergo 'those bloody kulaks deserve'.	[12:16]
assbot	Logged on 19-11-2015 04:33:59; punkman: http://www.armstrongeconomics.com/archives/39102	[12:16]
asciilifeform	what can a cop take from the typical american, other than anal virginity ?	[12:16]
mircea_popescu	obviously.	[12:16]
mircea_popescu	russia redux.	[12:16]
asciilifeform	(his mortgage? his cc bill ? college debt ?)	[12:16]
punkman	the car	[12:17]
asciilifeform	punkman: the car is typically either an old rust bucket or deeply creditatronic	[12:17]
mircea_popescu	this myth that usians own cars is laughable.	[12:18]
asciilifeform	the linked article mentioned cops searching pockets and taking as little as 100 usd. and this was meant to provoke outrage, but typical reader quite likely went 'what kind of monster walks around with 100 bill'	[12:19]
mircea_popescu	how many usians under 35 own a car ?	[12:19]
mircea_popescu	their budget is < 500 bucks, which barely buys a bike.	[12:19]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: many, but the car is typically a museum piece	[12:19]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform amusingly, EVERYONE in argentina. non 100 bills carry a 5% discount here.	[12:19]
punkman	can they seize leased car?	[12:19]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20350 @ 0.00052291 = 10.6412 BTC [+] {2}	[12:19]
mircea_popescu	they can but the lease co gets it back, fines you.	[12:20]
asciilifeform	punkman: just as a mortgaged house - sure. but then all the victim gets is just another debt collector after him	[12:20]
asciilifeform	not quite same as losing actual asset	[12:20]
thestringpuller	mircea_popescu: so what's eta on qntra?	[12:21]
punkman	maybe 3 weeks? http://www.ripoffreport.com/r/Internoc24com/internet/Internoc24com-Internoc24-Paid-for-hosting-took-3-weeks-to-get-my-server-no-support-tic-1157288	[12:21]
assbot	Ripoff Report \| Internoc24.com Complaint Review Internet: 1157288 ... ( http://bit.ly/1SHQ9Iu )	[12:21]
mircea_popescu	all etas now upgraded to "basic bojum" level.	[12:21]
mircea_popescu	punkman that site is a known blackmail op.	[12:21]
mircea_popescu	iirc there was one on bitbet there too.	[12:21]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 83850 @ 0.00052052 = 43.6456 BTC [-] {2}	[12:21]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 50236 @ 0.00052052 = 26.1488 BTC [-]	[12:22]
punkman	"We dont receive any answer so we have temp. shutdown the VPS. The VPS would be unblocked after the wrong Review is deleted."	[12:23]
punkman	let's see if they ask you take log down	[12:23]
mircea_popescu	the despicable, miserable, filthy truth in here	[12:24]
mircea_popescu	is that i actually make money with these stupid shits.	[12:24]
mircea_popescu	like that's what i want from life ;/	[12:24]
asciilifeform	'They just resell servers from various other datacenters but appear as if they have their own hardware' << this may well be true. very common scamatron, arse-mouth system.	[12:24]
mircea_popescu	i have no idea why this would be a discovery or anythning. this is the business.	[12:25]
mircea_popescu	what the fuck would you expect them do, build dcs ?	[12:26]
mircea_popescu	"this shoe shop just resells shoes from various shoe outlets"	[12:26]
mircea_popescu	REALLY ?!?!?!	[12:26]
mircea_popescu	i thought they shat the shoes out!	[12:26]
asciilifeform	'only the ancients could build temples, all we know how to do is take shits in'em'	[12:26]
mircea_popescu	no but seriously, this is the job, what.	[12:26]
asciilifeform	somebody, somewhere actually runs dc	[12:27]
punkman	could also read as "they pretend they have own hardware"	[12:27]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform not anymore than "Someone somewhere actually runs hydro plant".	[12:27]
kakobrekla	if you dont controll the building , you dont control the server	[12:27]
asciilifeform	for some reason i am reminded of 'farmer's market' sc4mz0rz who load up on monsanto garbage at the big box shop and then resell 'organic tomatoez!!111' to chumpers	[12:27]
mircea_popescu	they run the technical side, marketing has got to be wholesaled out.	[12:28]
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mircea_popescu	punkman in practical terms ownership of capital goods is very messy. you think gm owns the equipment in gm plant ? as what, outright ? mno.	[12:28]
mircea_popescu	whether they bought their own box and colocated it, or rented a precolocated one from dc is a very fine point.	[12:29]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 25350 @ 0.0005234 = 13.2682 BTC [+] {4}	[12:29]
mircea_popescu	for one thing, most everyone works with a list of dc approved suppliers anyway.	[12:29]
asciilifeform	unlike a hydro plant, a dc is this thing that, at its practical minimum, costs what maybe 2 or 3 passenger buses do. serious corps run their own. most of my past employers had their critical infrastructure in some variant of own, non-leveraged in-house dc	[12:29]
mircea_popescu	this is a red herring.	[12:30]
mircea_popescu	you're looking at about 1.5bn investment to make a competitive one.	[12:30]
asciilifeform	they weren't nuke-proof, no. but they ~were~ 'oops, i'm an orc and forgot to pay the bills at the place i secretly resell you'-proof.	[12:30]
mircea_popescu	sure, could also retrofit your garage. so ?	[12:30]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform ANYTHING would be proof that. anything. just as long as done by human.	[12:30]
kakobrekla	its like having money in the bank? is it your bank? no? its not your money.	[12:31]
mircea_popescu	kakobrekla do you own the building you live in ?	[12:32]
kakobrekla	my wot does.	[12:32]
mircea_popescu	this is very good, patrimonially. the drawback however is, it's very bad, sartorially.	[12:32]
adlai	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=19-11-2015#1326964 < logception	[12:32]
assbot	Logged on 19-11-2015 14:59:18; mircea_popescu: or, if you prefer the alternative formulation, http://logs.minigame.bz/2015-11-09.log.html#t04:28:25	[12:32]
mircea_popescu	it just means you don't get out enough.	[12:32]
mircea_popescu	that's the bitch here. there is no closed form solution.	[12:33]
asciilifeform	aha, the good old meatwot problem	[12:33]
asciilifeform	meatwotty enough and you're a peasant working the soil	[12:33]
asciilifeform	the soil of the beloved motherland, aha, but peasant.	[12:33]
mircea_popescu	the very thing of being a merchant is, that you enter into deals.	[12:34]
kakobrekla	i dont pay for it.	[12:34]
mircea_popescu	"i don't own the boat but the merchandise within"	[12:34]
asciilifeform	and closed-form solutions are scarce in our universe, i hear they live in another one where platonic triangles fuck platonic circles	[12:34]
mircea_popescu	that's how commerce works. unavoidably, and to great benefit.	[12:34]
asciilifeform	when works	[12:35]
asciilifeform	when breaks ?	[12:35]
asciilifeform	suddenly it's 1000 ad and you gotta own the castle again, and the staff	[12:35]
mircea_popescu	burn the orcs, rape their women, stgart over.	[12:36]
mircea_popescu	what, you think the redskins got exterminated because people hated niggers ?	[12:36]
*	adlai thought platonic circles fucked abbottic lines	[12:36]
mircea_popescu	you think i'm speaking of westardian genocide + mass rape cause overactive imagination ?	[12:36]
mircea_popescu	historical necessities, brother.	[12:36]
punkman	speaking of boats, "Prices to move a 40-foot container from Rotterdam to Shanghai drop to $300"	[12:37]
deedbot-	[BitBet Bets Bets] 1.00000000 BTC on 'Yes' - Donald Trump gets Republican Nomination - http://bitbet.us/bet/1206/donald-trump-gets-republican-nomination/#b44	[12:38]
mircea_popescu	and then it will be 200, and then 100, and then you simply won't be able to get a container there. at all.	[12:38]
asciilifeform	what moves ~from~ rotterdam to shanghai ?	[12:39]
asciilifeform	gurlz?	[12:39]
mircea_popescu	you'll just get "tech support" at maersk	[12:39]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform warheads.	[12:39]
mircea_popescu	believe it or not there still is some west tecvh they've not fully disassembled yet.	[12:39]
mircea_popescu	chinese hobby.	[12:39]
mircea_popescu	you'd fit right in!	[12:39]
asciilifeform	aha, just gotta paint meself yellow	[12:39]
punkman	and in chinoturkic orc news http://www.khaosodenglish.com/detail.php?newsid=1447905179	[12:40]
asciilifeform	iirc cn still runs hydrazine rockets a la su circa 1965.	[12:40]
assbot	Report: 17 Killed in Chinese Counter-Terrorism Raid ... ( http://bit.ly/1PCbKEB )	[12:40]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform you'd be surprised.	[12:41]
asciilifeform	punkman: i bust my gut from the lulz re: how when cn deals with its vermin there is neverending whine re: 'cruel oppressive dictatorial bootz!11111'	[12:41]
mircea_popescu	in other scientistic news, http://www.telegraph.co.uk/men/health/quarter-of-men-believe-they-have-man-periods/	[12:41]
assbot	Quarter of men believe they have 'man periods' ... ( http://bit.ly/1PCbOEl )	[12:41]
asciilifeform	wut	[12:41]
asciilifeform	'5pc of respondents even reported suffering from "menstrual cramps"' << this has gotta be a gag	[12:42]
mircea_popescu	unlike what, exactly ?	[12:42]
mircea_popescu	what the fuck isn't a fucking gag.	[12:42]
BingoBoingo	BingoBoingo: what's "major mg player"? << A "MoneyGram" agent	[12:42]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: 'do not believe those who say 'all the world is shit.' for there also exists piss.' -- my grandfather	[12:43]
*	pete_dushenski (~pete_dush@unaffiliated/pete-dushenski/x-8158685) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[12:44]
*	assbot gives voice to pete_dushenski	[12:45]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 52680 @ 0.00051638 = 27.2029 BTC [-] {3}	[12:47]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 73550 @ 0.00051539 = 37.9069 BTC [-] {4}	[12:48]
pete_dushenski	https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9I5WylWtkaE << have kulak, will problem.	[12:48]
assbot	Tesla Model S problem with the police - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1SHWzHR )	[12:48]
BingoBoingo	so now tell me a little more about ddos and basic bojums and whatnot. << Fuck there isn't even a business of datacenter	[12:48]
pete_dushenski	"officer, those bad people put CHILDREN in their car's TRUNK!"	[12:48]
pete_dushenski	(tesla model s has two rear-facing 'jump' seats)	[12:49]
pete_dushenski	(complete with 5-point racing harnesses)	[12:50]
mircea_popescu	BingoBoingo and understand, we're not even talking "server" aka 10 bux a month. or "cheap vps". or even dedicated. we're talking guy who walks in, orders 3 boxes, pays cash. and there they sit babbling.	[12:50]
pete_dushenski	tesla copied mercedes w123/w124, obviously	[12:51]
pete_dushenski	http://static1.consumerreportscdn.org/etc/designs/news-archive/cars/2013/03/Tesla-Model-S-third-row-seat.jpg << tesla 'jump' seats, for kulak children up to age ~9.	[12:52]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1PCcOIw )	[12:52]
asciilifeform	;;later tell jurov http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=19-11-2015#1326888 << i don't actually ocr my scans, ever.	[12:53]
assbot	Logged on 19-11-2015 10:52:57; jurov: sorry it's scanned...asciilifeform what ocr do you use?	[12:53]
gribble	The operation succeeded.	[12:53]
mircea_popescu	in other news, trilema is back on, believe it or not.	[12:53]
pete_dushenski	'The seat is only suitable for children greater than 37 inches tall, weighing between 35 and 77 pounds'	[12:53]
asciilifeform	holy shit	[12:53]
asciilifeform	nsa gave it back ?!!	[12:53]
pete_dushenski	hoorah !	[12:53]
mircea_popescu	in a sec ima recount the story of this	[12:54]
asciilifeform	right after you put on a new tape bobbin & back up, no ?	[12:54]
BingoBoingo	BingoBoingo and understand, we're not even talking "server" aka 10 bux a month. or "cheap vps". or even dedicated. we're talking guy who walks in, orders 3 boxes, pays cash. and there they sit babbling. << I know seriously what the fuck is these people's allergy to money	[12:54]
punkman	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=19-11-2015#1326888 << might interest you https://github.com/jflesch/paperwork	[12:54]
assbot	Logged on 19-11-2015 10:52:57; jurov: sorry it's scanned...asciilifeform what ocr do you use?	[12:54]
assbot	jflesch/paperwork · GitHub ... ( http://bit.ly/1SHXZSt )	[12:54]
punkman	also, is there anything other than tesseract?	[12:54]
asciilifeform	only thing i ever really tried was t	[12:55]
asciilifeform	problem is that ocr is not so hot for maths	[12:55]
asciilifeform	or just about anything technical	[12:55]
pete_dushenski	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=19-11-2015#1326937 << i thought this sorta said it all.	[12:55]
assbot	Logged on 19-11-2015 14:54:55; mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=19-11-2015#1326906 no, no, allow me to give you a grandiose anecdote to go with that! so, mp spends 6-700 euro to get new servers at internoc24.com which is supposedly the flagship of the entire "offshore hosting" "industry". in exchange for which payment, the following conversation ensues : http://dpaste.com/1HP9QY2	[12:55]
punkman	asciilifeform: even if not for reading, still handy for grepping	[12:56]
*	Xuthus (~x@unaffiliated/xuthus) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[12:56]
asciilifeform	punkman: aha, i had the doug lenat scans OCR'd on some weird proprietary shitware	[12:57]
asciilifeform	sorta worked	[12:57]
asciilifeform	(for grepping)	[12:57]
pete_dushenski	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=19-11-2015#1327028 << sad sounding farmer's markets. must be an american thing. or non-breadbasketlandia thing.	[12:58]
assbot	Logged on 19-11-2015 15:24:00; asciilifeform: for some reason i am reminded of 'farmer's market' sc4mz0rz who load up on monsanto garbage at the big box shop and then resell 'organic tomatoez!!111' to chumpers	[12:58]
asciilifeform	pete_dushenski: it isn't sop by any means. but happens occasionally.	[12:58]
pete_dushenski	the joys of 'unregulated' markets	[12:59]
punkman	pete_dushenski: not same profits to be made around here, but people do try to pass of shitty imports as local produce	[12:59]
asciilifeform	iirc cazalla had a tale about chinese strawberries in australia	[12:59]
asciilifeform	re: same	[13:00]
mircea_popescu	ok so. the story, after what was it, 4 days downtime, once the dude finally came back, is, and i quote, "ok I fixed it. give it about 20 minutes". whereupon at my inquiry trhat what was wrong wit hit ?! the response came that "it was turned off for some reason".	[13:00]
mircea_popescu	fancy that!	[13:00]
pete_dushenski	accidents happen !	[13:00]
asciilifeform	l0l looks like mr plug puller from phuctor finally found his way there	[13:00]
mircea_popescu	meanwhile, i could confirm the story that there've been a bunch of stolen servers all through ukr / poland / baltics, "opperation	[13:00]
*	whaack (~whaack@18.111.7.166) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[13:01]
mircea_popescu	"operation we're losing relevancy storm" or whatever.	[13:01]
pete_dushenski	"operation pushing wet noodle up hill"	[13:01]
*	kakobrekla gets meat, eggs, many fruits and most veggies straight from source	[13:01]
kakobrekla	could also get milk but i dont use it that much.	[13:01]
*	sinetek has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)	[13:01]
asciilifeform	^ this is sop and it is how they typically bust 1,001 'tor onion' boxes after popping ~one~	[13:01]
asciilifeform	walk in and cart off whole dc	[13:01]
pete_dushenski	kakobrekla: same here, save milk, for which the raw unpasteurised variety is de facto illegal here	[13:02]
kakobrekla	legal here.	[13:02]
kakobrekla	which reminds me, i might get some to try to make kefir at home	[13:03]
*	pete_dushenski sat in on 'public health' court hearing re: raw milk consumption off 'farm land'	[13:03]
kakobrekla	i used to get invited to slaughtering, attended once.	[13:03]
pete_dushenski	some german priestish dude defending the 'rights' of some moo-eyed folks who at the time i took for unrepentant hippies	[13:04]
pete_dushenski	government denied 'rights' in the end. raw milk cannot be taken off of farm it was produced	[13:04]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform get a load of this : boxen weren't rebooted.	[13:05]
pete_dushenski	kakobrekla: what sound does a kefir make as it dies ?	[13:05]
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kakobrekla	"pssst" ?	[13:05]
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asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: wai wut ?!!	[13:06]
asciilifeform	unplugged but running on internal reactors, or what.	[13:06]
*	mircea_popescu has accidentally kefir, throuygh leaving the milk out overnight. it turned, was quite good.	[13:06]
kakobrekla	thats just sour milk, which is great, but for kefir you need them grains.	[13:07]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform well, whatg, someone is good enough to make it appear continuous while at the same time inept enough to give 4 days' worth of gestapo click tone ?	[13:07]
mircea_popescu	kakobrekla aok. ianae.	[13:07]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: most plausible, from the story thus far, is that the switch got yanked	[13:08]
mircea_popescu	who and why the fuck would steal a switch.	[13:08]
asciilifeform	and how many days' worth of gestapo click tone did phuctor get.	[13:08]
mircea_popescu	anyway, i'm not even'd for today.	[13:09]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: botched installation of mitm crapola.	[13:09]
mircea_popescu	for days ?!	[13:10]
mircea_popescu	wtf, trilema is http! whart mitm ?	[13:10]
mircea_popescu	it's called "relaying".	[13:10]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: they have this obsession with 'logging ips'	[13:11]
asciilifeform	(and planting 'ferret cannon')	[13:11]
mircea_popescu	!s ferret cannon	[13:11]
assbot	0 results for 'ferret cannon' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=ferret+cannon	[13:11]
asciilifeform	l0l, mostly vanished from google	[13:12]
asciilifeform	was the official usg/leaked term for their db of browser exploits and automated sprayer for same	[13:12]
asciilifeform	aka 'foxacid' iirc	[13:13]
asciilifeform	(if the names are nonsensical, complain to hitler, not me)	[13:13]
mircea_popescu	"This cost-benefit analysis doesn't end at successful exploitation. According to Snowden, the TAO—that’s Tailored Access Operations—operators running the FOXACID system have a detailed flowchart, with tons of rules about when to stop. If something doesn't work, stop. If they detect a PSP, a personal security product, stop. If anything goes weird, stop. This is how the NSA avoids detection, and also how it takes m	[13:13]
mircea_popescu	id-level computer operators and turn them into what they call "cyberwarriors." It's not that they're skilled hackers, it's that the procedures do the work for them."	[13:13]
mircea_popescu	herp. nsa can't hire either.	[13:13]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 148118 @ 0.00050951 = 75.4676 BTC [-] {4}	[13:13]
mircea_popescu	the difference being that nsa has nothing worth doing.	[13:13]
asciilifeform	hey they're burglars, not soldiers	[13:14]
asciilifeform	and the 0days are typically worth far more than whatever crapola is being stolen at any given time	[13:14]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform english words don'\t denote anymore. they aspire.	[13:15]
asciilifeform	not even certain that anybody, outside of hitler's general staff, 'aspires'	[13:15]
asciilifeform	instead they show up and warm the chair, collect cheque	[13:15]
mircea_popescu	http://sluggy.wikia.com/wiki/Ferret_Cannon	[13:17]
assbot	Ferret Cannon - Niftypedia - Wikia ... ( http://bit.ly/1PCfg1M )	[13:17]
mircea_popescu	let the logs reflect.	[13:17]
mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=19-11-2015#1326916 << the hope is that this point is overstated.	[13:23]
assbot	Logged on 19-11-2015 13:06:00; jurov: adlai it's the addiction that enables accumulation of capital and its use in business	[13:23]
mircea_popescu	specifically, that there are two kids of people : the addicts, who aren't people, and the actual people.	[13:23]
mircea_popescu	or in the words of the old guard sicilians, "sell the dope to the niggers, they're animals anyway"	[13:24]
pete_dushenski	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=19-11-2015#1327066 << why not have price go back over $1k per container ? why have no freight industry at all after price crash and shucking off of excess capacity and firms who can't handle dumping ?	[13:25]
assbot	Logged on 19-11-2015 15:35:04; mircea_popescu: and then it will be 200, and then 100, and then you simply won't be able to get a container there. at all.	[13:25]
mircea_popescu	you don;'t understand how the world works.	[13:25]
pete_dushenski	no shit. i'm not 70 yo.	[13:26]
BingoBoingo	pete_dushenski: It's alright at 90 you'll start forgetting again	[13:26]
mircea_popescu	lol	[13:27]
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pete_dushenski	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=26-07-2015#1213241	[13:27]
assbot	Logged on 26-07-2015 17:19:54; thestringpuller: pete_dushenski: Contravex got Circle of Life stuck in my head.	[13:27]
pete_dushenski	round and round we go !	[13:27]
mircea_popescu	are you complaining about your own blog to yourself ?!	[13:28]
pete_dushenski	lmao	[13:28]
pete_dushenski	thestringpuller's quote. not mine.	[13:28]
pete_dushenski	i wish i was talented enough to 'incept' myself	[13:29]
pete_dushenski	or forgetful enough	[13:29]
mircea_popescu	by 90...	[13:29]
*	pete_dushenski can't imagine a blog with 75 years of content	[13:29]
pete_dushenski	mind boggling	[13:30]
BingoBoingo	Oh pete started blawging at 25?	[13:31]
pete_dushenski	22. but that was on old 'car blog' for the first 5-6 years.	[13:33]
pete_dushenski	http://www.contravex.com/2015/01/25/a-retrospective-on-six-years-in-the-car-blogosphere/ << started in '08	[13:34]
assbot	A retrospective on six years in the car blogosphere \| Contravex: A blog by Pete Dushenski ... ( http://bit.ly/1WzHhWo )	[13:34]
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BingoBoingo	Ah, I though pete_dushenski was going to make me feel really old there.	[13:35]
pete_dushenski	http://www.gq.com/story/president-obama-bill-simmons-interview-gq-men-of-the-year << for anyone who wants to test efficacy of their emergency gasmask.	[13:38]
assbot	Obama and Bill Simmons: The GQ Interview \| GQ ... ( http://bit.ly/1Yiw4MO )	[13:38]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 37900 @ 0.00051411 = 19.4848 BTC [+]	[13:39]
pete_dushenski	"It’s an alpha-male trick—put someone off-balance, flatter them and bust their chops at the same time. A few minutes later, he was grabbing control of the interview with measured responses, knowing that he didn’t have to perform without cameras or podcast equipment. And so he took his time. And it worked. I mean, how do you interrupt the most powerful man on earth? It felt like the way Federer repeatedly j	[13:39]
pete_dushenski	umped Novak Djokovic’s second serve in the 2015 U.S. Open Final—a savvy trick to disrupt someone’s flow, a seemingly harmless way to gain an edge. It’s what the great competitors do."	[13:39]
jurov	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=19-11-2015#1326929 no stable solution in sight. still,there are always dreams like installation of chip to "fix" "disordered" reward neural pathways to keep the bezzle going	[13:39]
assbot	Logged on 19-11-2015 13:58:26; mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=19-11-2015#1326903 << until what ? what would you say is the stable solution here ?	[13:39]
mircea_popescu	either that or "chosen nation" emerges, butchers pharaoh.	[13:40]
jurov	look what happened to jews or anyone when they touched sugar	[13:40]
jurov	that's the whole point	[13:40]
pete_dushenski	inb4 moses_popescu parts the red data centre	[13:40]
jurov	they may have butchered, but quickly succumbed to same	[13:41]
deedbot-	[Qntra] Larcenous Winkelvii Exchange Hits $2200/BTC, Recants - http://qntra.net/2015/11/larcenous-winkelvii-exchange-hits-2200btc-recants/	[13:42]
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mircea_popescu	lol	[13:43]
BingoBoingo	look what happened to jews or anyone when they touched sugar << They heard there was honey over there, went native and chased it	[13:44]
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pete_dushenski	and dipped apple slices in it	[13:45]
BingoBoingo	For maximum beetus	[13:49]
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BingoBoingo	This is why some Jewish groups support the whole SJW/SEW thing, because they believe that in his old age Moses transcended to the Mayo Gender and was healthy at all his sizes. Even his terminal one.	[13:51]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14106 @ 0.00051411 = 7.252 BTC [+]	[13:53]
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jurov	heh	[13:54]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 33200 @ 0.00051689 = 17.1607 BTC [+]	[13:55]
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pete_dushenski	the vast majority of jooz are seriously braindamaged. tikkun olam is the original papering over of differences between people. as if looking the other way will finally allow the jooz to 'integrate' because standing out for your successfulness is awkward and shameworthy or something.	[13:56]
pete_dushenski	it's most self-loathing, i figure.	[13:56]
jurov	honey comes complete with other nutrients needed to burn it, unlike refined sugar. hence it does not cause such "hunger" for more	[13:56]
asciilifeform	pete_dushenski: this goes way back.	[13:57]
mircea_popescu	it also comes with built in child protection.	[13:57]
BingoBoingo	straight glucose from monsanto burns just fine. Marathon runners consume gelled satches of it which they litter their ritual grounds with.	[13:57]
BingoBoingo	*satchets	[13:57]
jurov	rly, they do binge on it?	[13:59]
BingoBoingo	jurov: They do during races.	[13:59]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 28370 @ 0.00051846 = 14.7087 BTC [+]	[13:59]
jurov	only	[13:59]
BingoBoingo	Sugar+water+gelling agent+chemical flavor also from monsanto	[14:00]
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BingoBoingo	Occasionally flavor from Mallinkrodt	[14:00]
jurov	so, marathon runner during race is fine example of median modern homo sapiens. oooookay	[14:00]
BingoBoingo	Well, seriously look at all they work they do to justify their addiction	[14:01]
pete_dushenski	asciilifeform: to the very first tangent out of circular egypt, presumably	[14:01]
BingoBoingo	They are just in denial and keep justifying their addict brain to themselves	[14:01]
pete_dushenski	mircea_popescu: 'it' is the honey or the jews ?	[14:01]
punkman	nothing wrong with a bit of sugar. if you are going to binge on sugar, you will also binge on honey.	[14:01]
asciilifeform	http://ic.pics.livejournal.com/kenigtiger/503961/73043/73043_original.jpg << lulzy	[14:01]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1kHPH2G )	[14:01]
asciilifeform	(to aficionados)	[14:01]
mircea_popescu	obama ? alpha male ?	[14:02]
mircea_popescu	what the fuck is this nonsense.	[14:02]
asciilifeform	neutrino male	[14:02]
kakobrekla	jurov honey still gets converted into fat it you dont burn it quickly	[14:02]
mircea_popescu	since when droning bureaucrat droning on because too petrified of shutting up is "powerful" in any sense ?	[14:02]
pete_dushenski	asciilifeform: wheat power	[14:02]
mircea_popescu	jesus, all the wasted spin.	[14:02]
mircea_popescu	dear "the press" : no matter what pig lipstick you try to put on the current iteration of hruschev, he's still uncomfortable wearing shoes.	[14:03]
jurov	punkman, kakobkrekla honey contains multitude of vitamins and other stuff that helps to digest it	[14:03]
jurov	when you take sugar, body has to take it out of somewhere else	[14:03]
kakobrekla	'krekla'? come on, is not that bad.	[14:04]
jurov	and damages itself and you feel hungry	[14:04]
BingoBoingo	jurov: I mean the marathon runner is so far in the throes of addiction he will shave his nipples off with synthetic fabric to justify his high https://i.imgur.com/IzbKH9T.jpeg	[14:04]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1kHQ4u1 )	[14:04]
punkman	jurov: what I don't put other food in my sugar? I just scoop it out the box?	[14:04]
jurov	yes, like in the morning	[14:04]
mircea_popescu	mircea_popescu: 'it' is the honey or the jews ? << the honey. feed it to infant, watch infant become really quiet./	[14:04]
BingoBoingo	dat botulism	[14:04]
pete_dushenski	lol my thought exactly	[14:04]
pete_dushenski	https://i.imgur.com/IzbKH9T.jpeg << band-aids on nips are a thing.	[14:05]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1kHQ4u1 )	[14:05]
kakobrekla	anyway, i recommend to anyone who is interested in the sugary topic, to look up xylitol	[14:05]
jurov	i don't say honey diet is not dangerous. just you don't feel so starved	[14:05]
kakobrekla	a sugar that is actually good for your teeth. yes, not a joke.	[14:05]
kakobrekla	among other things.	[14:06]
pete_dushenski	xylitol = dentist recommended, yes.	[14:06]
punkman	also fun https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Synsepalum_dulcificum	[14:06]
assbot	Synsepalum dulcificum - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ... ( http://bit.ly/1YiyN8T )	[14:06]
BingoBoingo	among other things. << Like dog/cat/generalcarnivore poison	[14:07]
kakobrekla	yes, lucky im not a dog.	[14:07]
jurov	well, some dentist recommend fluorine, too. which is rather suspicious.	[14:07]
asciilifeform	the other thing that these faux sugars won't do, is,	[14:07]
asciilifeform	running your brain.	[14:07]
kakobrekla	yes, xylitol wont spike your blood with sugar.	[14:07]
kakobrekla	will release slowly.	[14:07]
asciilifeform	two-edged sword, this.	[14:08]
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kakobrekla	but if all suger would be used for brain activity, this world would be a different place.	[14:08]
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asciilifeform	brain demands glucose.	[14:08]
asciilifeform	where it comes from, is another matter	[14:08]
kakobrekla	most people eat every day but never think.	[14:09]
kakobrekla	eat sugar	[14:09]
asciilifeform	see also the meth thread	[14:09]
jurov	we have enzymes to convert misc stuff to glucose, but they need plenty of vitamines to work	[14:09]
mircea_popescu	most people eat every day but never think. << newton's 4th law of thermodumbnamycs.	[14:10]
jurov	if they aren't supplied, then it goes havoc	[14:10]
asciilifeform	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=25-08-2014#808005	[14:10]
assbot	Logged on 25-08-2014 03:08:03; asciilifeform: busy as a bee << funny that they show an idiot sow scrubbing, and not, e.g, paul erdos crapping out theorems	[14:10]
asciilifeform	an idiot with sugar, meth, bulldozer, or computer, is a higher-powered idiot	[14:11]
asciilifeform	a non-idiot - higher-powered non-idiot.	[14:11]
jurov	btw, another funny point from $book: lung cancer is correlated to... sugar in cigarettes	[14:11]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 66500 @ 0.00051555 = 34.2841 BTC [-] {4}	[14:11]
jurov	if tobacco is dried slowly, it loses natural sugar and it's fine to smoke	[14:11]
mircea_popescu	next you're gonna say samuel clemens smoke ten cigars a day for seventy years and all it did was to preserve him	[14:12]
mircea_popescu	like salami.	[14:12]
jurov	but obv, it's not dones lowly, and they even add sugar	[14:12]
jurov	whch burns nastily	[14:12]
BingoBoingo	related http://dpaste.com/1GRWSAE.txt	[14:12]
asciilifeform	BingoBoingo: the ghost of alt.tasteless pines for you	[14:13]
BingoBoingo	asciilifeform: Seriously	[14:14]
asciilifeform	y'know, the place where i found 'the spittoon'	[14:14]
mircea_popescu	well... the hopeful moral in there is that the man STREUGGLES to eat the damned mcflurries	[14:14]
mircea_popescu	so all is well in tardworld.	[14:14]
asciilifeform	STREUGGLES to eat the damned mcflurries << Ohne Kampf kein Sieg (tm) (r)	[14:15]
asciilifeform	('without struggle, no victory')	[14:16]
trinque	remote host certainly did not close the deedbot connection...	[14:17]
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pete_dushenski	mircea_popescu: most people eat every day but never think. << newton's 4th law of thermodumbnamycs. << "We thought . . ." "That's what the turkey thought! Think less and you'll be better off." (tm) (comrade solzhenitsyn)	[14:19]
asciilifeform	pete_dushenski: the history of the saying 'the turkey also thought...' is possibly interesting	[14:20]
pete_dushenski	conversation followed gulag prisoners voluntarily giving up tobacco, bacon, tea, sugar, money, etc to 'staff' in exchange for 'receipt', never to see it again	[14:20]
asciilifeform	the full version is 'turkey also thought, but ended in the soup anyway'	[14:20]
pete_dushenski	turkey also thought butcher was his friend. until thanksgiving came.	[14:21]
pete_dushenski	butcher fed turkey every day for years, reinforcing friendly sentiment	[14:22]
asciilifeform	the anecdote is that once upon a time, a peasant was selling a turkey, a rarity at the time; and that he knew that a parrot sells for 15 talers, he asked for 30, given as 'turkey is twice the size.' buyer asked, 'but parrot can talk, can your bird?' peasant replied: 'doesn't talk, but thinks 2x as much'	[14:22]
pete_dushenski	l0l	[14:22]
trinque	lol	[14:22]
trinque	simultanelol	[14:22]
jurov	heh	[14:23]
asciilifeform	butcher was his friend. until thanksgiving came << h. c. andersen had same story, at some length elaborated, but with a pig and christmas	[14:23]
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*	pete_dushenski checks hardbound illustrated hc anderson volume next to him	[14:24]
pete_dushenski	'taschen'	[14:25]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17850 @ 0.00052036 = 9.2884 BTC [+]	[14:26]
asciilifeform	pete_dushenski: hardbound illustrated hca << getting son started on 'little matchgirl' et al early ?	[14:29]
mircea_popescu	trinque huh ?	[14:30]
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trinque	mircea_popescu: could just be freenode being a pain. I notice that deedbot- will say on this end that "Remote host closed the connection" and on the deedbot- end that he looks like he was disconnected by the server.	[14:32]
mircea_popescu	imo the VERY best story of thanksgiving friends is made by pretty much the only thing worth the mention culturally to come out of the bit of romania currently stranded as an "independent state" because russians.	[14:32]
pete_dushenski	asciilifeform: you know it !	[14:32]
mircea_popescu	here it is : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aerj4qXPHJc	[14:32]
assbot	Prikoke (fabulă animată) - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1YiBKGD )	[14:32]
trinque	I've got a common lisp version of the bot baking which phf helped on, handles all this much better.	[14:32]
mircea_popescu	but generally their (planeta moldova) work should be pretty hysterical to a russian speaker with ro knowledge	[14:33]
mircea_popescu	as it is vice-versa.	[14:33]
asciilifeform	l0l i think i saw this one!	[14:33]
pete_dushenski	#bitcoin-lispettes	[14:34]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 22261 @ 0.00051969 = 11.5688 BTC [-] {2}	[14:35]
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jurov	http://www.nytimes.com/2015/11/22/magazine/the-doomsday-scam.html?_r=0	[14:36]
assbot	Log In - The New York Times ... ( http://bit.ly/1NedC67 )	[14:36]
jurov	‘‘Red mercury has a red color, and there is mercury that has the color of dark blood,’’ he said.	[14:37]
jurov	‘‘And there is green mercury, which is used for sexual enhancement, and silver mercury is used for medical purposes. The most expensive type is called Blood of the Slaves, which is the darkest type. Magicians use it to summon jinni.’’	[14:37]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12640 @ 0.00050964 = 6.4418 BTC [-]	[14:37]
asciilifeform	!s red mercury	[14:37]
assbot	0 results for 'red mercury' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=red+mercury	[14:37]
asciilifeform	could've sworn we did a length thread re: this philosopher's stone in 2013	[14:37]
asciilifeform	*lengthy	[14:37]
jurov	yes. but this is so funny	[14:38]
jurov	"Identifying such cheats was easy, the smugglers said, because real red mercury is attracted to gold but repelled by garlic."	[14:38]
kakobrekla	irc is a pain. you would not believe what idiocies i had put in assbot to keep it as stable as it is.	[14:38]
asciilifeform	and these are the folks mircea_popescu tells us are the alternative to decaying west.	[14:38]
asciilifeform	run moar jihadcrypt (tm) (r) on winblowz, take more gps selfies, eat moar redmercury...	[14:39]
asciilifeform	i forget, does magical red mercury convert goats to houri prior to fucking ?	[14:40]
jurov	it does everything	[14:40]
asciilifeform	and what is the required dose.	[14:40]
jurov	‘‘It is not only about getting the red mercury,’’ he said. ‘‘The very small box needs special equipment to open it, and special reactors to work with it. If you open this box, a radius of eight kilometers around you will be destroyed.’’	[14:40]
asciilifeform	'Another time, a French jihadist hired him to find a Turkish domestic cat; Syrian cats, it seemed, were not the friendly sort.' << l0l!!	[14:41]
kakobrekla	trinque is that lisp bot going to be decoupled?	[14:41]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 30280 @ 0.00050964 = 15.4319 BTC [-] {2}	[14:43]
jurov	"Russians safeguarding the stock late in the Cold War cached tiny reservoirs of red mercury in sewing machines and radios bound for export" ahahahaha	[14:43]
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asciilifeform	'‘‘Specific machines,’’ he said, ‘‘with a butterfly logo on them.’’ He said he knew this from experience because the red mercury used in the jihadists’ chlorine experiment in Ras al-Ain had come from his grandmother’s machine.' << l0lzy	[14:50]
asciilifeform	'In southern Africa, it has cost lives. According to a regional and especially cruel variation of the legend, the substance is found in conventional military munitions, particularly land mines, there to be claimed by anyone daring enough to take them apart and extract the goods.' << brilliant and ought to be encouraged	[14:53]
asciilifeform	and how come nobody ever placed small qty of gold or other valuable into mines ?	[14:53]
asciilifeform	let'em ~attract~ idiots instead of leaving matters to chance	[14:53]
pete_dushenski	even place large quantity of gold in land mines. hell, make the land mines ~entirely~ out of gold. not like the yellow stuff has any better uses.	[15:03]
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pete_dushenski	https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CUHr_6_UwAAlZai.png:large << california water reservoir levels.	[15:06]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1kHZNk9 )	[15:06]
asciilifeform	pete_dushenski: and watering lawns is mandatory there.	[15:07]
pete_dushenski	https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CUHOW_HUYAAm3tb.jpg:large << http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/11/19/us-egypt-crash-islamicstate-photo-idUSKCN0T725Q20151119#J2WXdJYzb5xbmsoH.97	[15:07]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1kHZXb3 )	[15:07]
assbot	Islamic State says 'Schweppes bomb' used to bring down Russian plane	[15:07]
pete_dushenski	sorta like molotov, but fizzier	[15:07]
asciilifeform	pete_dushenski: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=18-11-2015#1326494	[15:07]
assbot	Logged on 18-11-2015 18:02:54; ascii_field: pete_dushenski: supposedly isis supposedly released supposed photo of the thing a few hrs ago.	[15:08]
asciilifeform	ru rags had photo.	[15:08]
pete_dushenski	well, for teh log readers then	[15:08]
asciilifeform	one thing i don't get	[15:08]
pete_dushenski	and not sure it's 'lawns' so much as golf courses that are sucking up cali's water.	[15:08]
asciilifeform	so, sure, the claim implied by photo is that the can was filled from the bottom	[15:09]
asciilifeform	but why was it necessary to cut the whole bottom off and glue back?	[15:09]
asciilifeform	why not one hole ?	[15:09]
trinque	kakobrekla: yep, same core + services approach	[15:09]
mircea_popescu	irc is a pain. you would not believe what idiocies i had put in assbot to keep it as stable as it is. << i have a vague idea.	[15:09]
*	pete_dushenski checks stats : there are 1`151 golf courses in the state of california	[15:10]
pete_dushenski	average area of ~150 acres each	[15:10]
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mircea_popescu	"Russians safeguarding the stock late in the Cold War cached tiny reservoirs of red mercury in sewing machines and radios bound for export" ahahahaha <<< there is a very popular east european scam where "german collector" announces he is paying very high sums for "old german sewing machines".	[15:11]
asciilifeform	and, for that matter, why not fill the can with trotyl, squib, and radio, ~at the bottling plant~ ?	[15:11]
asciilifeform	(how to break the gaussian contour of the can so radio works, is exercise for the reader)	[15:12]
mircea_popescu	as in make the can plastic.	[15:12]
asciilifeform	one variant.	[15:12]
pete_dushenski	each golf course in california use 400k - 800k gallons of fresh water per day	[15:12]
mircea_popescu	even place large quantity of gold in land mines. hell, make the land mines ~entirely~ out of gold. not like the yellow stuff has any better uses. <<< this is for sure how i'd be running the vault.	[15:13]
mircea_popescu	pete_dushenski now check stats on agriculture area.	[15:14]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 40550 @ 0.00052002 = 21.0868 BTC [+] {3}	[15:14]
*	pete_dushenski recalls something about 1 litre of fresh water per SINGLE ALMOND in california	[15:16]
mircea_popescu	and the 800k gallons figure is nonsense. 3.2 cubic meters of water srsly ? 150 acres is what, half a square km ? so you're supposedly doing 4 * 8 * 10^5 * 365 / .5 / 10^6 = 2336mm rainfall a year ?	[15:16]
mircea_popescu	what exactly survives this deluge, algae ?	[15:16]
jurov	why it's so unbelievable so much water can evaporate in cali?	[15:17]
mircea_popescu	you familiar with rainfall levels in teh world ?	[15:17]
jurov	2 meters per year is nto so remarkable	[15:18]
BingoBoingo	Here we had one decimeter of rain over Monday and Tuesday	[15:19]
mircea_popescu	it's not remarkable for the fucking monsoon season.	[15:19]
jurov	it's almost one meter/year here. and here's much cooler	[15:20]
mircea_popescu	where i'm from it's ~500	[15:20]
*	pete_dushenski off for walk. will check maths.	[15:21]
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mircea_popescu	anyway, i guess maybe ? strikes me as fucking insane, but then again i guess that's their point	[15:21]
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deedbot-	[Qntra] Paris Mass Shooters Used Plaintext SMS to Coordinate - http://qntra.net/2015/11/paris-mass-shooters-used-plaintext-sms-to-coordinate/	[15:26]
phf	BingoBoingo: tend to involve more typically involve	[15:27]
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funkenstein_	it's all gonna be fine in cali golfcourses because now we have schnurloser duschkopfen	[15:28]
punkman	wait, didn't mp use cubic meter of water per shower. 3 cubic meters of water for golf course sounds reasonable	[15:28]
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phf	BingoBoingo: has responded to the mass shooting has responded to the mass shooting	[15:29]
phf	hot off the press	[15:29]
BingoBoingo	phf: fxd ty	[15:30]
adlai	also Holland vs Hollande	[15:31]
shinohai	https://www.reddit.com/r/Buttcoin/comments/3tfog1/a_bitcoin_intellectual_has_some_ideas_on_how_to/cx5t3uk mircea_popescu keks	[15:31]
assbot	Zotamedu comments on A "Bitcoin intellectual" has some ideas on how to make it more popular, especially with women ... ( http://bit.ly/1XbzPkI )	[15:31]
BingoBoingo	adlai: fxd, though I shouldn't have. If he wanted attention paid to his name he should have opted out of government and identified as a public key.	[15:33]
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punkman	"There are the things we need to work on to get more women into bitcoin and then the guys will just come as iron dust to a magnet... Porn and cam-shows are good to get some men but they are not enough to form relationships. After all we need a bitcoin women finding a bitcoin man, marry eachother and make a baby. That baby will be born in a bitcoin generation with bitcoin knowledge!"	[15:40]
kakobrekla	sure ladies, line up here.	[15:41]
punkman	gabriel_radio will impregnate for free	[15:41]
mircea_popescu	shinohai summary ?	[15:41]
punkman	or was that someone else	[15:41]
asciilifeform	'Я по радио влюбилась, я по радио женилась, а потом по радио дочка родилась' (tm) (r) (song)	[15:41]
jurov	gotta ask pete and ben about their bitcoin generation	[15:42]
mircea_popescu	punkman i am not a plant!	[15:42]
mircea_popescu	what, they enameled the courses ?	[15:42]
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mircea_popescu	in other news, touchpad unergonomic. http://36.media.tumblr.com/988526e5be129553f39bb433bf36d041/tumblr_n5bjykaDov1rl2t88o2_1280.jpg	[15:47]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1XbDwqp )	[15:47]
jurov	well this needs purpose-designed peripheral	[15:48]
punkman	it's called a cockpit	[15:48]
punkman	http://www.metafetish.com/2008/04/10/too-much-information-about-the-interactive-fleshlight/	[15:49]
assbot	Metafetish - Too Much Information about the Interactive Fleshlight ... ( http://bit.ly/1lx4ahS )	[15:49]
mircea_popescu	Peshawar was known in Sanskrit as Puruṣapura (पुरूषपुर), literally meaning "city of men".	[15:49]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 46695 @ 0.00052038 = 24.2991 BTC [+] {2}	[15:50]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 39250 @ 0.00051704 = 20.2938 BTC [-] {3}	[15:51]
shinohai	summary: reddit thinks mircea_popescu is little more than misogynist.	[15:57]
mircea_popescu	me ?	[15:58]
mircea_popescu	then again i guess it makes sense, reddit's collectively at that enchanted age when kid walks into bedroom unexpectedly, thinks dad's "beating the shit out of mom". because wut is fuck anyway.	[15:59]
*	mircea_popescu http://49.media.tumblr.com/b2e46ced831ad974b0896116a5a365f9/tumblr_n5bjykaDov1rl2t88o1_500.gif	[16:00]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1lx53Hn )	[16:00]
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ben_vulpes	buenos dias	[16:33]
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ben_vulpes	on the lisp ui thread, a mcclim contributor of yore has started work on clim3, spec and impl: climatis: https://github.com/robert-strandh/CLIMatis	[16:37]
assbot	robert-strandh/CLIMatis · GitHub ... ( http://bit.ly/1I1Rcxm )	[16:37]
asciilifeform	ben_vulpes: tried it?	[16:38]
phf	http://www.metafetish.com ... << https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D1sXuHnf_lo	[16:42]
assbot	Metafetish ... ( http://bit.ly/1I1RVi4 )	[16:42]
assbot	Deldo - Vibration Control and Teledildonics Mode for Emacs - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1I1RVi7 )	[16:42]
*	punkman was interested in doing complicated gui recently, looked like slim pickings outside Qt	[16:42]
asciilifeform	there used to be 'wx' but afaik - dead	[16:43]
asciilifeform	if you want anything like native-looking gui, it's qt with gasmask, or nothing at all	[16:43]
punkman	yes reading qt docs makes implement-everything-yourself-over-opengl attractive	[16:44]
punkman	I don't really care about native-looking	[16:45]
asciilifeform	if it doesn't matter what it looks like, at all, can use the horrendous x11 'athena' widgets	[16:46]
asciilifeform	as featured in clim.	[16:46]
trinque	commonqt wasn't a terrible gasmask	[16:47]
*	trinque used it	[16:47]
punkman	I'd like to make some peculiar widgets	[16:47]
asciilifeform	the impedance mismatch between all the idiot crud qt expects (own lists, hashes, etc.) and anything sane, is atrocious	[16:47]
trinque	gasmask, we were saying	[16:47]
trinque	but yes, you're just feeling around inside C++ with lisp	[16:48]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 38250 @ 0.00051596 = 19.7355 BTC [-]	[16:48]
asciilifeform	may as well go in the opposite direction, embed, e.g., 'tinyscheme', in a cpp turd.	[16:48]
*	asciilifeform tried this roughly a decade ago, gave up in disgust	[16:48]
phf	can use http://shinmera.github.io/qtools/ for Qt work from common lisp. adds a thin protective layer	[16:49]
assbot	QTOOLS ... ( http://bit.ly/1I03DiH )	[16:49]
asciilifeform	and say i want to populate a listbox with a lisp list	[16:49]
asciilifeform	what happens ?	[16:50]
asciilifeform	oh and 'Smoke' doesn't work	[16:50]
punkman	any good examples of apps made with mcclim?	[16:50]
ben_vulpes	asciilifeform: not yet, not likely soon.	[16:50]
asciilifeform	at least not of a few yrs ago when i last saw	[16:50]
asciilifeform	motherfucker built on NO machine i could find.	[16:50]
trinque	nah I've got it all built over here	[16:50]
ben_vulpes	punkman: climacs sort of works. beirc is one of those 'look i wrote a thing in clim and oop now i'm working for someone else and have no time to maintain it'	[16:50]
trinque	but can't speak for years ago	[16:50]
asciilifeform	trinque: neato	[16:50]
asciilifeform	trinque: post recipe at some point ?	[16:51]
trinque	just whatever's in current gentoo for qt 4.8	[16:51]
asciilifeform	ben_vulpes: last i tried climacs, i barfed from 1) PALPABLE keypress delays 2) athena	[16:51]
asciilifeform	if i wanted to feel keypress delay, i'd install ms-office.	[16:51]
phf	punkman: mcclim itself has a handful of examples, but https://common-lisp.net/project/climacs/ and https://common-lisp.net/project/gsharp/	[16:51]
assbot	Climacs - a Common Lisp Emacs implementation ... ( http://bit.ly/1I1T8Wy )	[16:51]
assbot	The Gsharp interactive score editor ... ( http://bit.ly/1I1TaxN )	[16:51]
trinque	legend has it that if you say climacs three times gabriel_laddel appears	[16:52]
ben_vulpes	climacs	[16:52]
ben_vulpes	climacs	[16:52]
asciilifeform	if you say it five time, he... climacses ?	[16:52]
trinque	lol!	[16:52]
phf	punkman: it's really experimental technology. ~giant~ multilevel spec, implemented by a handful of enthusiasts. only worthwhile if you're prepared to spend large fraction of your time on improving and debugging the gui code itself.	[16:53]
asciilifeform	i think the technical term for this, is	[16:53]
asciilifeform	'turd'	[16:53]
punkman	klyemax	[16:53]
punkman	phf, confirms my suspicions, nobody actually makes apps with it, just masturbation	[16:54]
ben_vulpes	you call it masturbation, i call it a dalliance with what might have been.	[16:55]
phf	^	[16:55]
asciilifeform	ben_vulpes: go straight to the symbolics emulator for that	[16:55]
asciilifeform	(there even is a mac port, i have not tried it)	[16:55]
phf	punkman: it's a free version of clim, which is a standard. if you're trying to release actual applications on top of climacs your better bet is to buy a lispworks license and use their clim implementation	[16:56]
phf	*on top of clim	[16:56]
ben_vulpes	asciilifeform: i, like the fool i am, retain hope of putting lispy gui crud places, and so would rather burn the time hacking through mcclim than running the symbolics vms.	[16:57]
phf	(http://www.lispworks.com/products/clim.html)	[16:57]
asciilifeform	phf: i can't fathom why any sane person would voluntarily use a proprietary compiler today	[16:57]
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punkman	"intel makes my c++ goes faaaast"	[16:59]
phf	asciilifeform: i enjoyed working with lispworks team in the past. i don't think it's proprietary in the same sence as msvs or such. you have to buy into a relationship, but once you have a contract with them, they are accommodating. you can ask them for source if you actually want to inspect it for lizard hitler traces and compile it yourself	[16:59]
asciilifeform	i did this	[16:59]
asciilifeform	and still wouldn't do it again today.	[16:59]
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asciilifeform	certainly not for a project with my name attached.	[17:00]
phf	yeah, i'm leaning that way myself, but i'm not fully convinced yet. i'm for example trying to build sufficient knowledge of cmucl right now, to be able to take full responsibility for the behavior of my deployed system, and it's a ~slow process~. it's handy to have paid professionals assist you	[17:01]
phf	i wouldn't even attempt to replicate the feat with, say, gcc	[17:01]
asciilifeform	why cmucl rather than sbcl ?	[17:01]
phf	the internals are more similar then not, and to fully grok sbcl you have to know cmucl anyway.	[17:02]
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asciilifeform	i've arrived at the point where i believe any system where any such thing is necessary, to be braindamaged beyond redemption	[17:03]
phf	also there's less eyes on cmucl, i'm not at all convinced that the politics around sbcl are to my liking, where's cmucl is essentially abandonware. it generates code, it has a nice interpreter, the runtime is smaller, it already has treeshaker, it's got History, etc.	[17:03]
*	asciilifeform did not know about politics of sbcl	[17:04]
asciilifeform	phf: care to elaborate ?	[17:04]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 188150 @ 0.00052009 = 97.8549 BTC [+] {7}	[17:08]
phf	it's just impressions. i've been looking at a lot of high traction common lisp code (top quicklisp packages) and there's a lot of senseless turd polishing in the past few years. broken interfaces for the sake of "cleanliness", half baked code, needless macros, dependency hell etc. and then you look at the code and it's the same set of aggressive, google employed queergenders.	[17:08]
asciilifeform	ahahahahahaha	[17:09]
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asciilifeform	the mistake here is 'there are maggots in this corpse, they killed the poor fella'	[17:09]
phf	yeah :/	[17:09]
asciilifeform	the maggots only come when the corpse is already a corpse.	[17:09]
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*	ben_vulpes is seeing the rot in webtech takeover of cl	[17:13]
phf	(read the asdf3 code and ioup or whatever that package is called in your spare time and wheep)	[17:13]
ben_vulpes	i found a "webserver" recently whose instantiation blocked the REPL.	[17:13]
asciilifeform	!	[17:13]
ben_vulpes	some gevent bullcrap iirc	[17:14]
asciilifeform	and the thing about tardation is that it is highly contagious	[17:14]
ben_vulpes	http://wookie.lyonbros.com/	[17:15]
assbot	Wookie: An asynchronous HTTP server for Common Lisp \| Wookie ... ( http://bit.ly/1I06qs0 )	[17:15]
asciilifeform	'Cl-async has swapped its backend from libevent to libuv. Please see the v0.6.x upgrade guide if you have not already. There are a number of reasons for swapping out libevent: Libuv is more actively maintained......'	[17:16]
*	asciilifeform stopped reading after that	[17:16]
*	ben_vulpes has wandered into a 'temple', most of the gems are missing and the walls are covered in graffiti	[17:16]
asciilifeform	gotta love the let's-embed-moar-weird-c-turds-in-cl folks	[17:16]
ben_vulpes	there is a local in the corner selling finely sculpted figurines of knuth that appear to be made of poop	[17:17]
asciilifeform	wut	[17:17]
phf	oh, that's coconuts, but you still don't want to touch them, since the sanitation no longer works	[17:17]
trinque	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=20-03-2015#1059454 << time to sell common lisp?	[17:17]
assbot	Logged on 20-03-2015 04:43:54; mircea_popescu: anyway, you know those stories about how rich guy heard the paupers / shoeshine boys discuss stocks and bailed ?	[17:17]
trinque	was this JP Morgan?	[17:18]
asciilifeform	trinque: or could stick to writing in actual common lisp	[17:18]
asciilifeform	as in, what's in guy steele's 'common lisp the language' 2nd ed.	[17:18]
asciilifeform	and the ansi standard.	[17:19]
trinque	sure sure, was a joke	[17:19]
asciilifeform	for n00bz: it is an actual standard. as in, it will be possible to run code written in 1985 in 2085, should something like a computer still exist, if it adhered to the standard.	[17:19]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 34750 @ 0.00051323 = 17.8347 BTC [-] {2}	[17:19]
phf	yeah, can pick up any code from cmu's ai repository and run on modern cl unchanged	[17:20]
asciilifeform	aha.	[17:21]
asciilifeform	just one of the many, many benefits of having something where tards are kept OUT	[17:21]
phf	well, in that respect cmucl is a decent litmus test. every single package that fails to load from quicklisp (named-readtables is the recent offender) turns out to be a turd on a closer inspection	[17:23]
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asciilifeform	mega-unsurprise	[17:23]
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trinque	!up whaack	[17:25]
*	assbot gives voice to whaack	[17:25]
trinque	whaack: what do you say you get a bouncer or set your client to not autojoin if you're going to come and go often?	[17:25]
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whaack	trinque: apologies didn't realize I was spamming. I'll fix my settings.	[17:29]
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trinque	whaack: thanks!	[17:29]
asciilifeform	anybody else's therealbitcoin node behaving strangely?	[17:31]
asciilifeform	socket no message in first 60 seconds, 1 0	[17:32]
asciilifeform	disconnecting node 62.210.127.113:43928	[17:32]
asciilifeform	accepted connection 148.251.151.71:36265	[17:32]
asciilifeform	socket closed	[17:32]
asciilifeform	disconnecting node 148.251.151.71:36265	[17:32]
asciilifeform	accepted connection 62.210.127.113:43947	[17:33]
asciilifeform	...	[17:33]
asciilifeform	classic blackhole, now that i think about it.	[17:33]
asciilifeform	nm.	[17:33]
jurov	something like that happened when i tried it to connect to 0.11	[17:33]
phf	i think maybe it's worthwhile to patch the logger so it doesn't report until the client actually does a read/write. if you do a port scan on yourself, will have same effect	[17:33]
asciilifeform	phf: aha, ditto telnet host 8333	[17:34]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 47650 @ 0.0005241 = 24.9734 BTC [+] {4}	[17:39]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 39350 @ 0.00052411 = 20.6237 BTC [+] {3}	[17:43]
shinohai	asciilifeform: mine kept connecting/disconnecting all night finally shut it down	[17:50]
*	gabriel_laddel (~Brucio-85@unaffiliated/gabriel-laddel/x-9909917) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[17:51]
asciilifeform	shinohai: if the 'power-rangerism' continues, these will eventually connect only to each other.	[17:51]
punkman	"Should you find yourself in a chronically-leaking boat, energy devoted to changing vessels is likely to be more productive than energy devoted to patching leaks."	[17:52]
shinohai	I have only tried connecting to listed nodes on the wiki ... was connecting to mp's node before that Ukranian bs	[17:52]
*	assbot gives voice to gabriel_laddel	[17:53]
*	gabriel_laddel WOOSH	[17:53]
asciilifeform	shinohai: thing is, the protocol has neither crypto nor authentication (and the former is meaningless without the latter) and so neither you nor i have the foggiest notion of what we ACTUALLY connect to. ever.	[17:53]
gabriel_laddel	you called?	[17:53]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 59550 @ 0.00052418 = 31.2149 BTC [+] {3}	[17:54]
deedbot-	[Qntra] Current Bitcoin-XT Incompatible with BIP-65 - http://qntra.net/2015/11/current-bitcoin-xt-incompatible-with-bip-65/	[17:55]
trinque	gabriel_laddel: good afternoon	[17:55]
*	assbot removes voice from whaack	[17:55]
phf	gabriel_laddel: you should make a bunch of cool masamune screenshots :)	[17:55]
gabriel_laddel	phf: sort of related - I put together a new McCLIM website with fancy screenshots	[17:55]
gabriel_laddel	it has yet to go online	[17:56]
gabriel_laddel	trinque: how goes the move-in? I saw that you're still living with family?	[17:56]
phf	it needs more "totally not staged doing serious bidness" shots	[17:56]
trinque	yeah taking it easy, haven't seen them in about two years; I'm in no rush	[17:56]
gabriel_laddel	phf: for that: video.	[17:56]
gabriel_laddel	phf: which works fine without slowdown etc	[17:57]
gabriel_laddel	in other masamune news - I'm working on automating the entire build right now.	[17:57]
trinque	gabriel_laddel: I've been making excellent use of conkeror for a while now	[17:57]
gabriel_laddel	trinque: did you ever end up parenscripting it?	[17:57]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7470 @ 0.00052431 = 3.9166 BTC [+]	[17:58]
trinque	nah, I'm not convinced I'd gain anything from that	[17:58]
trinque	but then, if you already have it's not as though I wouldn't look at it	[17:59]
gabriel_laddel	I sunk a lot of time into it (and got it working) only to realize that I don't want to javascript no matter how s-expressiony it is.	[17:59]
asciilifeform	first step on the road to where i am.	[18:00]
punkman	http://i.imgur.com/lFOj8oz.jpg	[18:00]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1MXAe4r )	[18:00]
gabriel_laddel	asciilifeform: lol, I've put off learning ternary specifically so I don't end as one of those "homeless math people".	[18:02]
asciilifeform	gabriel_laddel: there are worse thing to end up	[18:02]
ben_vulpes	fed and bored, for one.	[18:03]
asciilifeform	or richpoor	[18:03]
asciilifeform	or whatever word describes the sort of chimera i am	[18:03]
gabriel_laddel	Rather than die of hunger, I'd sooner eat a roast!	[18:03]
*	Duffer1 (~Duffer1@c-24-20-11-92.hsd1.or.comcast.net) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[18:04]
ben_vulpes	subject of newtardation, is smartparens vile or am i doing it wrong?	[18:08]
gabriel_laddel	ben_vulpes: I used to use parenscript, but cannot speak to smart parens.	[18:09]
asciilifeform	'In smartparens, when you input a pair-able character: the matching pair gets inserted, too, and point is positioned inside the pair:...' << FOR FUCKS SAKE WHY	[18:09]
gabriel_laddel	CLIMACS (ugh, needs a new name) has "structure editing" facilities, but I've not bound them yet.	[18:09]
trinque	ben_vulpes: I tend to swing like a monkey on the enclosing characters with evil's % and add/remove them myself	[18:10]
BingoBoingo	http://www.indystar.com/story/news/crime/2015/11/18/jared-fogle-subway-prison-child-pornography-russell-taylor/75934522/?from=global&sessionKey=&autologin=	[18:11]
gabriel_laddel	asciilifeform: what exactly are you objecting to?	[18:11]
gabriel_laddel	asciilifeform: e.g., interlisp had a structure editor	[18:11]
gabriel_laddel	twas nifty from what I've heard	[18:11]
ben_vulpes	asciilifeform: do you not use paredit?	[18:12]
BingoBoingo	http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_slatest/2015/11/19/female_terrorist_hasna_aitboulahcen_apparently_upset_about_police_assumption.html	[18:14]
assbot	Female terrorist Hasna Aitboulahcen apparently upset about police assumption. ... ( http://bit.ly/1MXBDbj )	[18:14]
BingoBoingo	Three police officials have told the Associated Press that a woman who died in the police raid was Abaaoud's cousin. One said the woman, Hasna Aitboulahcen, is believed to have detonated a suicide vest Wednesday in the building after a brief conversation with police officers.	[18:15]
BingoBoingo	The official confirmed an audio recording, punctuated by gunshots, in which an officer asks: "Where is your boyfriend?" and she responds angrily: "He's not my boyfriend!" Then loud bangs are heard.	[18:15]
gabriel_laddel	!s the translator did not miss them, they were not there	[18:17]
assbot	0 results for 'the translator did not miss them, they were not there' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=the+translator+did+not+miss+them%2C+they+were+not+there	[18:17]
*	NewLiberty has quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)	[18:18]
gabriel_laddel	ben_vulpes: I said "parenscript" earlier and meant "paredit". Time for coffee.	[18:20]
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*	assbot gives voice to ag3nt_zer0	[18:25]
*	adlai doesn't understand why anybody building 'professional' (as in http://www.loper-os.org/?p=861 ) tools would even want to use CLIM... maybe he's just a sucker for text	[18:28]
assbot	Loper OS » Engelbart’s Violin ... ( http://bit.ly/1QwZdlY )	[18:28]
ag3nt_zer0	seems like some pretty dark statistics here... shouldn't "we" be concerned? or am i missing something? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cjvPj7WAX7A	[18:29]
assbot	The Truth About The Paris Terrorist Attack - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1QwZjtJ )	[18:29]
gabriel_laddel	adlai: imagine for a moment that you're writing a program which abstracts over a lab instrument's controls and does a visualization of the information it reads. The requirement is that people who use it will be intelligent, but not necessarily programmers.	[18:29]
gabriel_laddel	They'll need to "export" the data to .csv, in a button press have an email drafted for them with the attached file using data selected using a slider etc	[18:30]
gabriel_laddel	adlai: if you think computer graphics are in anyway useful -> CLIM. Else, have fun trying to map the notion of a "presentation" to emacs text (see the magit and org-mode sources).	[18:32]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 23200 @ 0.00051432 = 11.9322 BTC [-] {3}	[18:53]
*	whaack has quit (Remote host closed the connection)	[18:54]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 31450 @ 0.00051906 = 16.3244 BTC [+] {2}	[19:09]
mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=19-11-2015#1327460 << today as in 2008, because hey. PROGRE-SS.	[19:10]
assbot	Logged on 19-11-2015 19:39:55; asciilifeform: if you want anything like native-looking gui, it's qt with gasmask, or nothing at all	[19:10]
mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=19-11-2015#1327472 << afaik this is how the dilemma is resolved in any shop that ever tries it.	[19:11]
assbot	Logged on 19-11-2015 19:44:35; asciilifeform: may as well go in the opposite direction, embed, e.g., 'tinyscheme', in a cpp turd.	[19:11]
asciilifeform	tbh there is no sane way of doing it because it is a contradiction in terms - 'sane' and 'os native' together would require... sane os	[19:11]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: correct. e.g., 'gimp'	[19:11]
mircea_popescu	i don't mean hobbist projects, owned and managed by the v ery enthusiast in question. i mean shops. with management	[19:12]
asciilifeform	and there. scripting engines for games (e.g., 'abuse')	[19:12]
mircea_popescu	which is why pre-ba, all people i knew that knew what lisp was knew it was "oh, scripting language. pretty nifty."	[19:13]
asciilifeform	pretty much the only widespread public mention, if you go by 'what's in the bookstore' metric, was autodesk's 'autolisp'	[19:13]
mircea_popescu	"lua with weird syntax" har har	[19:13]
asciilifeform	(the ext lang in autocad)	[19:13]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 51200 @ 0.00052114 = 26.6824 BTC [+] {5}	[19:13]
asciilifeform	which is about on par with emacs lisp in terms of 'it is FOREVER 1972 and not in any good sense'	[19:13]
mircea_popescu	because check it out, once it needed to open up an interface autocad did exactly what gimp did.	[19:13]
mircea_popescu	har har #2.	[19:14]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform odd that the idiot horde can keep SOME things frozen in time.	[19:14]
mircea_popescu	just so happens none of the things we want it to.	[19:14]
asciilifeform	actually it is an artifact of the fact that a schoolboy implementing a 'simple lisp' ends up bringing long-solved problems (e.g., 'the funarg problem', 'lisp is interpreted ergo slow', etc) back from the grave	[19:15]
asciilifeform	without exception.	[19:15]
mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=19-11-2015#1327484 << so you mean, "open source".	[19:15]
assbot	Logged on 19-11-2015 19:47:01; ben_vulpes: punkman: climacs sort of works. beirc is one of those 'look i wrote a thing in clim and oop now i'm working for someone else and have no time to maintain it'	[19:15]
asciilifeform	open sores.	[19:16]
mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=19-11-2015#1327499 << is multilevel here meaning something like it does in "multilevel marketing" ?	[19:16]
assbot	Logged on 19-11-2015 19:49:28; phf: punkman: it's really experimental technology. ~giant~ multilevel spec, implemented by a handful of enthusiasts. only worthwhile if you're prepared to spend large fraction of your time on improving and debugging the gui code itself.	[19:16]
BingoBoingo	open sore ass	[19:17]
mircea_popescu	random lulz : sorana (almost spoken as sore-anna) is a perfectly legit ro name.	[19:17]
*	julmae has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)	[19:18]
mircea_popescu	inexplicably, not really popular as working girl working name. for some reason.	[19:18]
*	julmae (~kamak@s247.ip5.netikka.fi) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[19:18]
asciilifeform	generally 'multilevel' in software is kinda like the multiple layers of dodgy wallpaper in a communist flat	[19:18]
mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=19-11-2015#1327501 << for a moment i thought you were going to say "operating system".	[19:19]
assbot	Logged on 19-11-2015 19:50:00; asciilifeform: 'turd'	[19:19]
mircea_popescu	or you know, gcc.	[19:19]
mircea_popescu	or...	[19:19]
mircea_popescu	wait for it...	[19:19]
mircea_popescu	OPEN SOURCE	[19:19]
mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=19-11-2015#1327504 << what is this, the 70yo to the next generation ?	[19:20]
assbot	Logged on 19-11-2015 19:51:15; ben_vulpes: you call it masturbation, i call it a dalliance with what might have been.	[19:20]
BingoBoingo	Dietary protein goes monsanto http://www.fda.gov/AnimalVeterinary/DevelopmentApprovalProcess/GeneticEngineering/GeneticallyEngineeredAnimals/ucm466214.htm	[19:20]
assbot	AquAdvantage Salmon Approval Letter and Appendix ... ( http://bit.ly/1XchRi0 )	[19:20]
mircea_popescu	" and then you look at the code and it's the same set of aggressive, google employed queergenders." << there's more than one ways to go about fucking over the competition.	[19:21]
mircea_popescu	i suspect the google hiring of turds a la hearn and a whole raft of others to be specifically intetional.	[19:22]
mircea_popescu	let bezos headhunt them and die, sort of logic.	[19:22]
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mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=19-11-2015#1327547 << if you look through the logs, i hit alf/others over the head about 3-4 times with the "you only perceive lisp as so because not yet popular".	[19:24]
assbot	Logged on 19-11-2015 20:14:05; trinque: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=20-03-2015#1059454 << time to sell common lisp?	[19:24]
mircea_popescu	they usually faint and lose any memories from the past hour.	[19:24]
mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=19-11-2015#1327554 << by this criteria it is still possible to fly buran to space!	[19:25]
assbot	Logged on 19-11-2015 20:15:45; asciilifeform: for n00bz: it is an actual standard. as in, it will be possible to run code written in 1985 in 2085, should something like a computer still exist, if it adhered to the standard.	[19:25]
*	trinque will forever imagine soviets riding a vacuum cleaner into space	[19:26]
trinque	one name good enough for all glorious soviet product	[19:26]
mircea_popescu	ehehehe	[19:27]
mircea_popescu	now you know what populared my imagination coupla decades ago.	[19:27]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 41050 @ 0.00051324 = 21.0685 BTC [-] {2}	[19:29]
phf	multilevel as in specs out from framebuffer up, rather then single slice, which is what x11 widget libraries are. clim is more like framebuffer+x11+xlib+qt+"a kind of application"	[19:30]
BingoBoingo	;;google buran powered dildo	[19:30]
gribble	Luxury Line of Vibrators, Vibrator Accessories & Sex Toys by OhMiBod: ; The Steam-Powered Vibrator and Other Terrifying Early Sex ...: ; The Bizarre History of the Vibrator: From Cleopatra's Angry Bees to ...:	[19:30]
mircea_popescu	aha	[19:30]
shinohai	;;more	[19:31]
gribble	Error: You haven't asked me a command; perhaps you want to see someone else's more. To do so, call this command with that person's nick.	[19:31]
BingoBoingo	;;more	[19:32]
gribble	of-the-vibrator-from-cleopatras-angry-bees-to-steam-powered-dildos>	[19:32]
mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=19-11-2015#1327585 ips should be good enough for everyone	[19:36]
assbot	Logged on 19-11-2015 20:49:39; asciilifeform: shinohai: thing is, the protocol has neither crypto nor authentication (and the former is meaningless without the latter) and so neither you nor i have the foggiest notion of what we ACTUALLY connect to. ever.	[19:36]
mircea_popescu	!!1	[19:36]
shinohai	>.>	[19:37]
asciilifeform	if you're speaking unsigned plaintext, you're speaking to hitler first and only then to the intended destination.	[19:38]
asciilifeform	if he feels like passing your bits unmolested that day.	[19:38]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3318 @ 0.00051784 = 1.7182 BTC [+] {2}	[19:40]
asciilifeform	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=19-11-2015#1327682 << the thing about the two lisps having STANDARDS (commonlisp and scheme) is that the shit ~washes off~ - because the actual language is not open for amendment	[19:43]
assbot	Logged on 19-11-2015 22:20:08; mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=19-11-2015#1327547 << if you look through the logs, i hit alf/others over the head about 3-4 times with the "you only perceive lisp as so because not yet popular".	[19:43]
asciilifeform	and can be used, with some effort, sans any of the attempts at 'improvement'	[19:43]
mircea_popescu	ahahahahaha	[19:43]
mircea_popescu	oh let me be back after i've laughed this one.	[19:43]
asciilifeform	phf was not exaggerating when he wrote that one can take ai lab algos from 1980s and use UNCHANGED	[19:44]
*	asciilifeform has done this and intends to do in the future	[19:44]
asciilifeform	but if you want i/o, other than console - you're stuck, aha.	[19:44]
asciilifeform	write your own i/o.	[19:45]
mircea_popescu	for the i guess 6th time :	[19:45]
mircea_popescu	this is only the case for as long as nobody uses it.	[19:45]
trinque	browser <- standardized to hell and back	[19:45]
trinque	SQL	[19:45]
asciilifeform	what's wrong with my pressure hose with which i wash off the 'users' like birdshit from my car ?	[19:45]
mircea_popescu	once it becomes the c, your flimsy "federalist papers" won't protect you any more than yes, what trinque said.	[19:45]
asciilifeform	unlike c-on-unix, i can use cl without any libs	[19:46]
asciilifeform	and get useful work done	[19:46]
mircea_popescu	i wonder why this is so hard to grasp.	[19:46]
asciilifeform	but it is true, 'consumer has come to expect' idiot gui etc.	[19:46]
asciilifeform	possibly because we have differing 'this'es.	[19:46]
mircea_popescu	we can't.	[19:46]
mircea_popescu	this is the substance of the misunderstanding. you imagine that if you take a picture of a pile of objects, you now have a SPECIAL pile of objects, that does other things.	[19:47]
mircea_popescu	this is exactly how 3 yos fall over.	[19:47]
asciilifeform	let's take concrete system?	[19:47]
mircea_popescu	it is also how idiot brits/everyone sunk the entire culture of the west after the war :	[19:47]
mircea_popescu	they took a snapshot of the way educating the young worked, imagined that it's held in place by forces from mythology, and proceeded to "give kids a say"	[19:48]
asciilifeform	the last time i did serious work in cl, it was to run a set of laboratory machines. the only i/o i needed was rs-232.	[19:48]
mircea_popescu	because clearly this is a good thing, not like they'll now be more powerful than whatever force is "opressing" them into education.	[19:48]
asciilifeform	which i implemented using a unix fd callout.	[19:48]
mircea_popescu	next thing you know teaching hasn't happened in 2o years. wow of wow.	[19:48]
asciilifeform	other than this - total self-containment	[19:48]
asciilifeform	as in EVERY MOTHERFUCKING LINE was ansi-compliant cl.	[19:48]
mircea_popescu	it's as if he reads his own text with a different part of the brain.	[19:49]
mircea_popescu	yo!\	[19:49]
asciilifeform	..?	[19:49]
asciilifeform	how was ~my particular pile~ not a counterexample to 'when surrounded, your magic will be powerless' from earlier ?	[19:50]
mircea_popescu	let's take an imaginary walk together.	[19:50]
*	asciilifeform takes	[19:50]
mircea_popescu	so we go into this room, where there's all sorts of furniture.	[19:50]
mircea_popescu	you snap out your camera, and take a picture of some objects in this room.	[19:51]
mircea_popescu	this is nice and good.	[19:51]
mircea_popescu	nevertheless, if i lean on the pile just the right way, whether you took the picture or not, they will fall down.	[19:51]
mircea_popescu	this happens irrespective of whether they ALSO fell down in your picture or not.	[19:51]
asciilifeform	this is true for everything in the universe other than software. where a picture IS in effect a second, identical pile	[19:52]
asciilifeform	the collapse of the original does nothing to my copy.	[19:52]
mircea_popescu	oh i see, this is true for everthing other than.	[19:52]
*	mircea_popescu off to ammend the rule, 0 , 1, infitnity MINUS ONE, infinity.	[19:52]
mircea_popescu	my bad.	[19:52]
asciilifeform	when mircea_popescu cooked his koran, did bin laden's koran also burn ?	[19:52]
asciilifeform	ditto software	[19:52]
mircea_popescu	it did.	[19:52]
mircea_popescu	when mircea_popescu burned a koran, bin laden's koran also burned.	[19:52]
*	asciilifeform low on lsd	[19:52]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 50700 @ 0.00051784 = 26.2545 BTC [+] {2}	[19:53]
mircea_popescu	why THE FUCK do you suppose they throw a fit ? "because towelheads" ?	[19:53]
asciilifeform	which monastery do i need to train for 20 years in to understand how this works ?	[19:53]
mircea_popescu	a 3 yo's head!	[19:54]
mircea_popescu	you fell through a crack here apparently.	[19:54]
trinque	the koran is not some book; it's an arrangement of ideas in the world	[19:54]
trinque	common lisp too	[19:54]
trinque	I in point of fact cannot use common lisp in the same manner someone might've back whenever	[19:54]
trinque	maybe never will	[19:54]
trinque	the standard existing for whatever value of existing doesn't put a symbolics next to my desk	[19:55]
asciilifeform	trinque: depends what means 'in the same manner.' if you, say, want to be ~employable in it like a 20yo chick was in 1985~ - then no	[19:55]
asciilifeform	if you want the motherfucking code to execute and return same outputs for same inputs - then yes!	[19:55]
BingoBoingo	http://blogs.sciencemag.org/pipeline/archives/2015/11/19/nematodes-and-your-compounds	[19:55]
mircea_popescu	and yet you write in python.	[19:55]
assbot	Nematodes And Your Compounds \| In the Pipeline ... ( http://bit.ly/1kIPuw9 )	[19:55]
asciilifeform	i even write in fortran.	[19:55]
mircea_popescu	anyway, there's nothing wrong with taking pictures, as a memory aid.	[19:56]
asciilifeform	(which one, incidentally, could do on a symbolics box...)	[19:56]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 19049 @ 0.00051463 = 9.8032 BTC [-]	[19:56]
mircea_popescu	but it's fucking insane to expect they work magic.	[19:56]
trinque	I'm reminded of the idea that whichever fighter jet is not just itself, but the vast complex which sustains it	[19:56]
trinque	why not ideas as well?	[19:56]
mircea_popescu	trinque that's why i say "it's as if he reads his own text with a different part of the brain."	[19:56]
asciilifeform	trinque: if it were no longer physically possible to run the code, i would agree	[19:56]
*	trinque nods	[19:57]
asciilifeform	and we may well be approaching this point	[19:57]
mircea_popescu	random arbitrary measure is irrelevant in this discussion.	[19:57]
mircea_popescu	maybe it's possible to paint it green. so what if it is.	[19:57]
BingoBoingo	Also typical Vice.com reporting http://blogs.sciencemag.org/pipeline/archives/2015/11/18/antibiotics-not-as-easy-as-they-say#comment-263278	[19:57]
assbot	Antibiotics: Not As Easy As They Say \| In the Pipeline ... ( http://bit.ly/1X1u6TJ )	[19:57]
mircea_popescu	anyway. the lure of the superman.	[19:58]
mircea_popescu	in truth and honestly, humanity has produced one single great idea since the beginning,	[19:58]
asciilifeform	if mircea_popescu is speaking of the ~ecosystem~ (can you get people who will maintain the project? at what cost? where? will they be sane? etc) then everything he said makes sense 100%.	[19:58]
mircea_popescu	and it goes "wouldn't it be great if.... THIS".	[19:58]
mircea_popescu	yeah, it would be.	[19:58]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform im speaking of the thing. what were you speaking of ?	[19:59]
mircea_popescu	don't tell me we accidentallied into a public-private corssover where i was discussing public matters and you were recounting your sex life.	[19:59]
asciilifeform	of whether a lone wolf like gabriel_laddel or yours truly can put a lisp system inside a black box and produce a working widget that solves $problem, just like ancestors could.	[19:59]
mircea_popescu	...	[20:00]
asciilifeform	but in re: ecology, i must not only agree with mircea_popescu, but go further still	[20:00]
asciilifeform	... you can't hire folks to write sane, reasonable 'c' either	[20:00]
asciilifeform	nor just about anything	[20:00]
mircea_popescu	the problem is not what you call it, but the bizarre notion that there is a switch somewhere.	[20:00]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: it is necessary to draw this imaginary line, in order to engineer anything without going mad. sorta like the field lines of faraday.	[20:01]
mircea_popescu	in the immortal words of that short, brunette scion of the wealthy dreyfuss fambly (hey, almost like the rothschilds, ok ?) "Ohh.. right. Cause if we're dating, what everyone saw was just a beautiful moment between two lovers."	[20:01]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu does not personally (per own admission) engineer anything and has the luxury of forgoing the line.	[20:01]
mircea_popescu	yea, this is the thing with psychic defenses : they are not optional, but necessary.	[20:02]
mircea_popescu	to stave off going mad.	[20:02]
mircea_popescu	nevertheless, do not expect they operate IN THE WORLD!	[20:02]
asciilifeform	going mad is great fun but tends to interfere with paying the bills	[20:02]
mircea_popescu	obviously.	[20:02]
trinque	aw come now, I go mad twice daily	[20:02]
mircea_popescu	yeah but you're not married yet.	[20:02]
trinque	true enough	[20:02]
asciilifeform	now it ~is~ possible to engineer something while being at the same time concerned with where the parts to build $item will come from in the year 2115.	[20:03]
mircea_popescu	anyway, asciilifeform, the objection is not to the "word problem" abstraction cast over the world. it's with the apparent expectation this does something to the world. that's all.	[20:03]
asciilifeform	(but the result will likely resemble usg's aviation design bureaus circa 1970s)	[20:04]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 37350 @ 0.00051556 = 19.2562 BTC [+] {3}	[20:04]
asciilifeform	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=19-11-2015#1327681 << l0l, meta-google has the real people ?	[20:07]
assbot	Logged on 19-11-2015 22:18:34; mircea_popescu: let bezos headhunt them and die, sort of logic.	[20:07]
asciilifeform	(does it subcontract for meta-nsa...?)	[20:07]
BingoBoingo	aw come now, I go mad twice daily << Gotta up the duration and intensity. If you aren't spending at least a week in an insane state you aren't doing it right	[20:07]
BingoBoingo	... << l0l, meta-google has the real people ? << Meta Google actually seems to exist	[20:08]
BingoBoingo	http://qntra.net/2015/11/current-bitcoin-xt-incompatible-with-bip-65/#comment-75969	[20:11]
assbot	Current Bitcoin-XT Incompatible with BIP-65 \| Qntra ... ( http://bit.ly/1X1vkyg )	[20:11]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 35117 @ 0.00051784 = 18.185 BTC [+] {2}	[20:12]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 23534 @ 0.00051784 = 12.1868 BTC [+] {2}	[20:18]
mircea_popescu	it IS the meta-nsa	[20:20]
mircea_popescu	old jewish discovery - there can only be one.	[20:20]
asciilifeform	mno it has to be a reservation of 1950-quality human	[20:21]
asciilifeform	y'know, the folks who pop rsa, plant rf bugs in cpu masks, etc.	[20:21]
*	funkenstein_ (~bowler@unaffiliated/funkenstein) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[20:22]
asciilifeform	and certainly not a gaggle of pederasts in palo alto.	[20:22]
deedbot-	[Trilema] Eulora auction, Sunday the End Of November! - http://trilema.com/2015/eulora-auction-sunday-the-end-of-november/	[20:23]
mircea_popescu	OP_HODL	[20:23]
mircea_popescu	oops	[20:23]
asciilifeform	wai wut	[20:23]
mircea_popescu	OP_HODL < always good for a chuckle.	[20:23]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 45200 @ 0.00051901 = 23.4593 BTC [+] {2}	[20:27]
shinohai	Shout out to btcdrak who was shilling for OP_HODL a few days back	[20:34]
asciilifeform	wai wut	[20:34]
*	assbot gives voice to btcdrak	[20:35]
*	btcdrak high fives shinohai	[20:35]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform http://qntra.net/2015/11/current-bitcoin-xt-incompatible-with-bip-65/ first line	[20:36]
assbot	Current Bitcoin-XT Incompatible with BIP-65 \| Qntra ... ( http://bit.ly/1X1ykee )	[20:36]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 29250 @ 0.00052471 = 15.3478 BTC [+] {3}	[20:36]
shinohai	I wasn't impressed or anything, just ftr	[20:36]
asciilifeform	Ah!	[20:36]
asciilifeform	ph0rk??	[20:36]
mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=19-11-2015#1327604 << lol.	[20:37]
assbot	Logged on 19-11-2015 20:55:55; gabriel_laddel: I sunk a lot of time into it (and got it working) only to realize that I don't want to javascript no matter how s-expressiony it is.	[20:37]
btcdrak	fun fact: Mike claims there is no consensus for a softfork of BIP65, yet, a week after release of 0.11.2 which has the deploy code in it, 36% of the hashrate has upgraded to the softfork https://data.bitcoinity.org/bitcoin/block_version/5y?c=block_version&r=week&t=a	[20:37]
assbot	Bitcoinity.org ... ( http://bit.ly/1X1yAcW )	[20:37]
btcdrak	3 months after release of XT, there 1 block out of 1000 mined.	[20:38]
mircea_popescu	btcdrak next we're going to follow what the solidcoin guy says ? who's next, atlas ? taaki ?	[20:38]
mircea_popescu	gimme a break.	[20:38]
btcdrak	Much lolworthy reading in this thread today about Mike's employment at R3CEV: https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/3tftas/mike_hearn_now_working_for_r3cv_blockchain/	[20:40]
assbot	Mike Hearn now working for R3CV Blockchain Consortium : Bitcoin ... ( http://bit.ly/1X1yRwt )	[20:40]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform i suspect the thing with js is like so : it has two eigenstates. js.1 is "well, kinda useful to do some tasks browsewr side". as exemplified by say the trilema text select thing. way cheaper to do that client side than server side. js.2 however is "deploy code you can update yourself". ie, no need to ask people to update it for you.	[20:40]
mircea_popescu	now, js.1 is how it's sold to users ; but js.2 is why it's appealing to business. and for a long time - really, as long as rsm seemed to have teeth - this appeared to them (understandably) as a required pontoon bridge to have, jic.	[20:40]
mircea_popescu	i can follow the logic.	[20:41]
mircea_popescu	ironially, "programmers themselves" play exactly no part in all of this.	[20:41]
asciilifeform	why would they	[20:41]
asciilifeform	zey are ooonly foolllowing oorderz	[20:41]
mircea_popescu	exactly. sort-of like trying to achieve military results by "asking the troops".	[20:41]
phf	seems like conversation goes back to tomb raiding for books thread. can go and write code according to hyperspec, or vhdl a lispmachine, or whatever, but from b-a perspective the symbolics world of professional men deliberately solving problems with their lisp repl does not exist outside of the log, is superseded by the log. ultimately it's pretty pointless to point at a handful of sources and specs and expect others to share your	[20:42]
phf	castle in the sky visions.	[20:42]
mircea_popescu	armies move because of the interplay of production and consumption. talk to the traders.	[20:42]
mircea_popescu	phf except people on a regular basis DO share others' castles in the sky. it's just that they don't happen to be the very castles people hold most dear.	[20:42]
mircea_popescu	obviously, one's emotion has no public value.	[20:42]
mircea_popescu	(this, incidentally, is the aspirational 2nd eigen state for "art", as hoped-for by various [failed, necessarily] artistes throughout the ages.)	[20:45]
*	asciilifeform does not expect or want anybody to ~move into~ his delusional castle, but enjoys having phriends, incl. a number of the folks here, who occasionally 'drop by for tea' in it	[20:45]
asciilifeform	the castle of it-is-possible-to-have-a-sanely-designed-computer, for instance	[20:46]
mircea_popescu	ironically, my foray into bitcoin was started by random guy on the internet [at the time hadn't used irc at all in decade +] insisting i move into his "GPG" castle.	[20:46]
mircea_popescu	and i was like, wow, srsly ? they got a castle ?	[20:46]
mircea_popescu	possibly all the trouble since then entirely rests on mp's pathologically complex misunderstanding of what that original guy actually meant.\	[20:47]
mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=19-11-2015#1327611 << reminds me of the "fathin", the guy who's only fat in the belly, skinny arms.	[20:50]
assbot	Logged on 19-11-2015 20:59:26; asciilifeform: or richpoor	[20:50]
asciilifeform	aha the grotesque parallel is deliberate	[20:50]
mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=19-11-2015#1327616 << in this brothel when yo utake off your pants, so does a harlot.	[20:50]
assbot	Logged on 19-11-2015 21:05:11; asciilifeform: 'In smartparens, when you input a pair-able character: the matching pair gets inserted, too, and point is positioned inside the pair:...' << FOR FUCKS SAKE WHY	[20:50]
mircea_popescu	as well as a well built man	[20:50]
mircea_popescu	and somewhere in the horse, you can hear a distance squeal.	[20:51]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform does "Hasna" mean anything in russian ?	[20:52]
mircea_popescu	romanians took it from turkic, made it be "shittery"	[20:52]
asciilifeform	nope	[20:52]
mircea_popescu	;;google haznaua politica	[20:52]
gribble	Legea lustratiei - Revista 22: ; mancare \| locuri comune: ; Urmările Primului Război Mondial - Wikipedia:	[20:52]
BingoBoingo	What USia runs on https://imgur.com/a/lEsGf	[20:52]
assbot	CPS - Album on Imgur ... ( http://bit.ly/1X1zZQY )	[20:52]
mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=19-11-2015#1327635 << i think this idea was buried cca 1962.	[20:55]
assbot	Logged on 19-11-2015 21:26:05; gabriel_laddel: adlai: imagine for a moment that you're writing a program which abstracts over a lab instrument's controls and does a visualization of the information it reads. The requirement is that people who use it will be intelligent, but not necessarily programmers.	[20:55]
mircea_popescu	mostly because it had been dead so long it was stinking up the place.	[20:55]
mircea_popescu	the last time someone could be useful in a professional capacity but not a programmer was perhaps 1935 ?	[20:56]
mircea_popescu	this is like proposing to make a book for "intelligent people that aren't necessarily literate" cca 1215. orly ?	[20:56]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 42100 @ 0.00051693 = 21.7628 BTC [-] {3}	[20:57]
mircea_popescu	but speaking of programming, http://49.media.tumblr.com/3b0a1a986a03880e92824966aa78d1b3/tumblr_mzv4a5cmSh1rmytn5o1_500.gif	[20:58]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1MqhXj4 )	[20:58]
mircea_popescu	first!	[21:08]
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BingoBoingo	re: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=16-11-2015#1325040 see https://archive.is/XY2Gy "Yeah no orals this go around unless mid cycle bloods are good then I'm gonna throw in some superdrol for super masturbation 01f60f"	[21:25]
assbot	Logged on 16-11-2015 04:02:53; mircea_popescu: do they take it with tylenol ?	[21:25]
assbot	Bloodwork... Don't drink on orals. : steroids ... ( http://bit.ly/1kJ2vFU )	[21:25]
BingoBoingo	And I thought my drinking was really testing the liver's hitpoints	[21:32]
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BingoBoingo	https://i.imgur.com/7JhnCfc.jpg	[21:48]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1kJ4H0h )	[21:48]
shinohai	dafuq	[21:49]
BingoBoingo	https://i.imgur.com/RbdGsiU.gif	[21:49]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1kJ4Pg5 )	[21:49]
BingoBoingo	shinohai: You've never seen a powered pepper grinder?	[21:53]
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shinohai	I have a powered pepper grinder, just not of the drill attachment sort	[22:01]
asciilifeform	l0l i assumed the cock goes in the right end	[22:01]
asciilifeform	and the pepper is agitated by the drill chuck	[22:02]
shinohai	must be 2 1337 4 me	[22:03]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 42320 @ 0.0005154 = 21.8117 BTC [-] {2}	[22:09]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20200 @ 0.00051522 = 10.4074 BTC [-]	[22:12]
BingoBoingo	http://petapixel.com/2015/11/18/reuters-issues-a-worldwide-ban-on-raw-photos/	[22:18]
assbot	Reuters Issues a Worldwide Ban on RAW Photos ... ( http://bit.ly/1Oi5E9h )	[22:18]
asciilifeform	ok this is lulzy enough to be worth a monologue	[22:23]
asciilifeform	goes straight to:	[22:23]
asciilifeform	!s what color are your bits	[22:23]
assbot	0 results for 'what color are your bits' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=what+color+are+your+bits	[22:23]
asciilifeform	!s color bits	[22:23]
assbot	7 results for 'color bits' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=color+bits	[22:23]
asciilifeform	!s colour bits	[22:23]
assbot	14 results for 'colour bits' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=colour+bits	[22:23]
asciilifeform	http://ansuz.sooke.bc.ca/lawpoli/colour/2004061001.php << obligatory megaclassic	[22:24]
asciilifeform	what can be inferred from BingoBoingo's link is that reuters has bought into some software sc4mz0r's idiocy where there is, presumably, a proggy which claims to distinguish between jpeg that was crapped out by a camera vs one that was downconverted from 'raw'	[22:25]
asciilifeform	(the latter being a bitwise dump of raw ccd output)	[22:26]
asciilifeform	'RAW photos do allow for a greater degree of post-processing flexibility, so based on the new policy, it appears that Reuters found that photos processed from RAWs are more likely to distort the truth.' << as if one could not easily produce whatever jpeg is expected	[22:27]
ben_vulpes	i thought bitwise dumps went out forever ago.	[22:27]
asciilifeform	ben_vulpes: not in $maxint dslr land	[22:27]
asciilifeform	iirc even ipnohe saves 'raw' internally	[22:28]
asciilifeform	(so that your flash fills faster, and goads you to buy $next phone)	[22:28]
ben_vulpes	when you say 'latter' do you mean the raw or the jpeg produced by the camera?	[22:28]
asciilifeform	raw	[22:28]
ben_vulpes	asciilifeform: aha per http://cascadianhacker.com/blog/2015/11/03_inside-apples-perfectionism-machine-adnotated.html#fn.16	[22:29]
assbot	Inside Apple's perfectionism machine, adnotated ... ( http://bit.ly/1O72gzJ )	[22:29]
asciilifeform	aha	[22:29]
asciilifeform	precisely as described there	[22:29]
ben_vulpes	ah, i thought you meant the jpegs were some simple transform from ccd to jpeg	[22:29]
asciilifeform	mno	[22:29]
asciilifeform	jpeg is a lossy compress thing	[22:29]
ben_vulpes	right	[22:30]
*	ben_vulpes is appropriately shamefaced	[22:30]
asciilifeform	back to the story,	[22:30]
asciilifeform	seems like reuters bought into some idiocy where a huckster promised to distinguish one stream of bits, having the correct 'colour' (as in the essay, nothing to do with optics, but politics) from another, identical stream, having undesirable colour.	[22:31]
asciilifeform	or, alternatively, no one bought into it, but is a cynical fraud with the public as the mark	[22:32]
asciilifeform	cheap credibility-spray.	[22:32]
kakobrekla	reality is shit therefore your pics must be shit as well.	[22:32]
asciilifeform	'hey, our photos couldn't possibly be doctored, we perform $ritual !!'	[22:32]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 53168 @ 0.00052552 = 27.9408 BTC [+] {4}	[22:33]
asciilifeform	BingoBoingo: there could be enough detail here for a qntra piece, if you like.	[22:33]
BingoBoingo	asciilifeform: I'll likely produce one in the morning. Got some scribbles of directions to wake up to.	[22:34]
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asciilifeform	;;later tell mircea_popescu gotta revisit http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=19-11-2015#1327881 . wondering now if turk 'hazine', which we have as 'казна' -- 'treasury' -- has any relation to your toilet	[22:42]
assbot	Logged on 19-11-2015 23:48:20; mircea_popescu: asciilifeform does "Hasna" mean anything in russian ?	[22:42]
gribble	The operation succeeded.	[22:42]
mircea_popescu	it does.	[22:44]
mircea_popescu	it's what it means in turkish.	[22:44]
asciilifeform	there we go!	[22:44]
asciilifeform	one man's treasure is another's ...	[22:44]
mircea_popescu	cazna, however, is romanian for... torture.	[22:44]
mircea_popescu	because lo and behold! romanians invented coke machine before you did.	[22:44]
asciilifeform	казнь	[22:44]
mircea_popescu	aok	[22:45]
asciilifeform	^ execution, but originally any serious punishment	[22:45]
asciilifeform	incl. the 3rd degree	[22:45]
asciilifeform	e.g., казни египетские == Plagues of Egypt (bib.)	[22:45]
mircea_popescu	it survives in romanian as a flavourful reflexive verb. to belabour oneself.	[22:46]
asciilifeform	казниться	[22:46]
asciilifeform	(to punish self, typ. anguish with remorse)	[22:47]
asciilifeform	reflexive.	[22:47]
mircea_popescu	i have nfi what that reuters retardation is supposed to be.	[22:48]
*	asciilifeform proposed a hypothesis, see logz	[22:48]
mircea_popescu	so if i have footage that's valuable reuters aims not to buy it because of bureaucratic considerations ?	[22:48]
mircea_popescu	or is this a tacit admission that they don't have any valuable footage anyway.	[22:49]
asciilifeform	it's a totem	[22:49]
asciilifeform	faced with perfectly valid accusation of doctored photos (what lizard media mouthpiece hasn't these?) there is, naturally, a ritualistic defence	[22:49]
mircea_popescu	i guess.	[22:50]
asciilifeform	i suppose i ought to share the reasoning behind my hypothesis	[22:50]
asciilifeform	i follow (on and off) academiwanker pubs	[22:50]
asciilifeform	and the 'distinguish type of camera / detect photoshitting / by jpeg compression artifacts' is a trendy idiocy atm	[22:51]
asciilifeform	we are seeing the end product of a very particular variety of lysenkotron here	[22:51]
mircea_popescu	that i know.	[22:51]
mircea_popescu	seems more likely they want to be able to identify people/cameras , which raw does not allow	[22:52]
mircea_popescu	(as the processing is usally done in gimp on a linux box)	[22:52]
asciilifeform	were sold by some huckster 'identify people and cameras'	[22:52]
mircea_popescu	whereas if done on camera, much less rng, much less variation	[22:52]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform you can already fingerprint "smart"phones by the grav detector things	[22:52]
asciilifeform	only if you're a process running on the thing	[22:53]
asciilifeform	nothing to do with photo	[22:53]
asciilifeform	incidentally 'raw' offers trivial fingerprinting, as it carries sensor defects	[22:53]
asciilifeform	like soviet typewriter fp.	[22:53]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform not after it's been put through the blender.	[22:53]
asciilifeform	no shit	[22:53]
asciilifeform	as if one could not rasterize jpeg, 'blender', then rejpegize	[22:54]
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asciilifeform	which is why i believe that we are seeing the product of a theatrical voodoo production, rather than mathematical reasoning (however flawed)	[22:55]
mircea_popescu	mayhap	[22:55]
asciilifeform	credibility-spray	[22:55]
asciilifeform	sorta like merit-spray and security-spray	[22:55]
asciilifeform	'we used it and ergo credible so stfu'	[22:56]
asciilifeform	'only a terrorist would operate a colour printer without yellow dot watermark, ergo either this page came out of yours, or you are accusing a loyal servant of the crown of terrorism'	[22:56]
asciilifeform	'your fp was on this pistol, step this way sir'	[22:57]
mircea_popescu	heh	[22:57]
asciilifeform	or, more recently, 'this nmr box proves that the accused has seen this knife before'	[22:58]
mircea_popescu	lmao	[22:58]
asciilifeform	all exactly the same scam	[22:58]
mircea_popescu	all scam are exactly the same scam	[22:59]
asciilifeform	also has another element, 'due process'	[22:59]
asciilifeform	'you got due process, now stfu and sizzle in the electric chair' -- scalia	[22:59]
asciilifeform	(where? http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=11-10-2015#1296444 )	[23:00]
assbot	Logged on 11-10-2015 20:16:50; asciilifeform: it was, iirc, 'innocence is not a constitutional bar to punishment'	[23:00]
mircea_popescu	he has a point.	[23:00]
asciilifeform	of course.	[23:00]
asciilifeform	just not a point that 'rule of law' folks like to think about, at least publicly	[23:01]
mircea_popescu	myeah.	[23:01]
asciilifeform	all usg vermin like to prattle re: how the law has a 'spirit' and the authors have 'intent' ~when it suits them~	[23:02]
asciilifeform	but it is also a mechanical thing that 'due processes' you, when likewise suits'em	[23:02]
asciilifeform	as per mircea_popescu's gold coins article	[23:03]
asciilifeform	or the one where 'iou' is legal for usg->chump bond repay, but not for chump->usg tax receipt	[23:04]
asciilifeform	etc.	[23:04]
mircea_popescu	this is inescapable.	[23:06]
mircea_popescu	the alternative being cold equations.	[23:06]
asciilifeform	aha how else!	[23:06]
mircea_popescu	either you have people in charge or you do not.	[23:07]
asciilifeform	the scam is not in hitler's ability to 'cut off your lips if he doesn't like your face' but in the ~pretense~ at this strange 'rule of law' fiction	[23:08]
asciilifeform	the fiction specifically where it is not hitler but a faceless and indestructible (or at least, 'no reasonable person would try to destroy'...) thing that is doing the lip-cutting	[23:11]
*	eamonnw (eamonnw@iceland.sdf.org) has left #bitcoin-assets	[23:11]
asciilifeform	see also http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=05-03-2014#546880 .	[23:11]
assbot	Logged on 05-03-2014 02:05:11; asciilifeform: 'american does not believe the man in the uniform to be a bandit, with whom one can come to an understanding. he believes him to be a robot, who must be feared. american law enforcers are able to, by pressing on the keyboard of a multitude of laws and regulations, 'transmute' the most insignificant peccadillo into a monstrous deed. FBI did not need to beat up Monica or toss into her pu	[23:11]
mircea_popescu	a pretense isn't a scam. it's just a pretense.	[23:15]
mircea_popescu	(for the curious minds reading logs : the reason innocence CAN NOT, in any system, no matter how devised, ever be a bar to punishment is that innocence is a metaphysical concept, whereas punishment is physical. no matter what happens, the former will have to be processed, which is the name for moving across realms. no matters what happens this process will be lossy.)	[23:38]
mircea_popescu	at some point the question moves from "whether this man ought to be punished" to "whether this man will be punished".	[23:39]
mircea_popescu	no gallows can be built on an ought.	[23:39]
*	soiled has quit (Quit: Leaving)	[23:45]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 31350 @ 0.00052521 = 16.4653 BTC [-]	[23:52]
*	sinetek (~quassel@114.134.189.64) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[23:52]

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