Forum logs for 04 Dec 2013

Sunday, 24 November, Year 11 d.Tr. | Author: Mircea Popescu

mircea_popescu	what bar is that ?	[00:00]
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kakobrekla	thats their market cap prolly	[00:00]
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*	Vexual has eggs	[00:01]
Vexual	choocks finally started laying	[00:02]
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truffles	what kind	[00:03]
dub	you are that guy from wolf creek right?	[00:03]
Vexual	i dunno what kind, theyre brown, got them from the market	[00:04]
truffles	u mean a real chicken ..	[00:05]
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Vexual	four of your finest pullets please sir	[00:05]
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mike_c	not pullets any more	[00:07]
truffles	http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1LK9JIVUHaM	[00:07]
ozbot	aussie chook laying egg - this one's a cracker! - YouTube	[00:07]
ThickAsThieves	so basically designers should be round up and shot. <<<< in some regards, yes, but in the end a designer is paid to solve a "problem" and more often than not, in a way they would not prefer	[00:07]
truffles	tramatized now	[00:07]
ThickAsThieves	clients cause oodles of depression and frustration for that field	[00:08]
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KRS\|gotyawallet	1 bitbar = .0979 BTC ~ $100 https://bter.com/trade/btb_btc	[00:09]
KRS\|gotyawallet	what in the fuhhh	[00:09]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 209 @ 0.00274 = 0.5727 BTC [+]	[00:10]
Vexual	ahh so thats why i baby talk to my vw bettle	[00:11]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 40 @ 0.00274 = 0.1096 BTC [+]	[00:11]
ThickAsThieves	come to think of it, i kinda disagree with the premise that designers create things to look babyish	[00:12]
benkay	the cloaca blooms	[00:12]
Vexual	your little fuely wuely pump is so inaccesible and ALWYAS FUCKING BREAKIN!	[00:13]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 2100 @ 0.00081427 = 1.71 BTC [-]	[00:13]
BingoBoingo	KRS\|gotyawallet: Well, with especially failed altcoins there is not uncommonly just one holder and setting the exchange rate so arbitrarily involves a minimal amount of actual money.	[00:13]
mike_c	bitbars are "rare", so the price of one doesn't mean much. market cap of all them is only $600k	[00:14]
mike_c	http://coinmarketcap.com/	[00:14]
ozbot	Crypto-Currency Market Capitalizations \| Bitcoin Litecoin Peercoin Namecoin QuarkCoin Megacoin Proto	[00:14]
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ThickAsThieves	there's $50m in quarkcoinz?	[00:15]
ThickAsThieves	lol	[00:15]
jurov`	Sooo dude from fortune just asked me if he can fund coinbr account with credit card...	[00:15]
ThickAsThieves	litecoin almost $1b	[00:15]
ThickAsThieves	not so fortunate he can afford real mpex i guess	[00:16]
ThickAsThieves	or maybe he emailed them to	[00:17]
ThickAsThieves	too	[00:17]
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BingoBoingo	Lol jurov`	[00:18]
Vexual	company card?	[00:18]
KRS\|gotyawallet	a lot of people are going to receive teh proverbial "sore anus" at some distant future.	[00:18]
jurov`	Dunno what card, i rejected. But maybe i can actually sell the card for btc and use that to fund the acct?	[00:19]
mircea_popescu	ThickAsThieves sucks for the designers.	[00:19]
BingoBoingo	http://metro.co.uk/2013/12/03/katana-kitsao-gona-kenya-goat-sex-attacker-faces-victim-in-court-4211564/	[00:19]
ozbot	Katana Kitsao Gona: Kenya goat sex attacker faces victim in court \| Metro News	[00:19]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [HIF] 3000 @ 0.00048972 = 1.4692 BTC [-]	[00:20]
mircea_popescu	litecoin almost $1b <<< do you realise most fiat companies are worth less than the lauighingstock altcoin ?	[00:20]
jurov`	Oh and he wants to really short bitcoins not just buy/sell some options.	[00:21]
jurov`	Anyone wants to lend him for lulz?	[00:21]
Vexual	then cry to visa when he fails?	[00:21]
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mircea_popescu	jurov` if he can't readily buy bitcoin how would he sell it ?	[00:21]
mircea_popescu	inb4 he ends up with 7k of mtgox usd he can't actually get sent to his acct and we get a forbes bitcointalk thread	[00:22]
benkay	why do the traditional short instead of playing options?	[00:22]
jurov`	Hmmmm.. that's where the lulz come.	[00:22]
BingoBoingo	... So the Fortune editor is basically Bakewell 2.0? Can he even ident with gribble?	[00:22]
ThickAsThieves	he wants to short?	[00:22]
mircea_popescu	benkay maybe because the plan is to short enough to move the price ?	[00:22]
ThickAsThieves	how much?	[00:22]
ThickAsThieves	send him in here	[00:22]
ThickAsThieves	he'll probly find a deal	[00:23]
mircea_popescu	why so mean ThickAsThieves	[00:23]
jurov`	Dunno. Not in mood to investigate.	[00:23]
benkay	BingoBoingo: he hit irc from a web client.	[00:23]
ThickAsThieves	mean?	[00:23]
ThickAsThieves	i guess bulls are mean	[00:23]
BingoBoingo	benkay: Still doesn't preclude getting in the WoT	[00:23]
ThickAsThieves	and I am a Taurus after all	[00:23]
mircea_popescu	ha.	[00:23]
benkay	BingoBoingo: implies insufficient familiarity with the toolchain to get in the WoT.	[00:23]
jurov`	So should i just write him i have friends on irc and they will loan you?	[00:24]
mircea_popescu	anyway, i would imagine guy got a good enough starter to figure what's what. at this point either he's on a deadline for the next article and well, just drops the entire thing,	[00:24]
mircea_popescu	or else embarks on the 6 mo to a year of lurking, reading and so on.	[00:24]
BingoBoingo	benkay: He's a senior editor. I'm pretty sure he can bully one of his help desk dorks into loaning him the coins.	[00:24]
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mike_c	nah, his help desk dork with btc is worth more than him now	[00:24]
mircea_popescu	BingoBoingo and then he gets davout to whitelist him on btc central or what ?	[00:24]
Vexual	maybe they gonna out satoshi	[00:24]
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benkay	BingoBoingo: his help desk dorks don't have enough btc to short and move the price anywhere	[00:25]
BingoBoingo	mircea_popescu: I imagine he does an OTC trade in a rest stop bathroom?	[00:25]
mircea_popescu	well... of course they don't.	[00:25]
benkay	;;market sell 1000	[00:25]
gribble	A market order to sell 1000 bitcoins right now would net 1115751.6083 USD and would take the last price down to 1100.0000 USD, resulting in an average price of 1115.7516 USD/BTC. \| Data vintage: 0.0702 seconds	[00:25]
ThickAsThieves	mega-slippage	[00:25]
benkay	;;market sell 1000000	[00:25]
gribble	A market order to sell 1000000 bitcoins right now would net 34063873.7035 USD and would take the last price down to 0.0017 USD, resulting in an average price of 34.0639 USD/BTC. \| Data vintage: 16.7910 seconds	[00:25]
jurov`	ThickAsThieves: can I kindly refer him to bitcoin powerhouse of TAT Investments?	[00:25]
ThickAsThieves	not hanks	[00:26]
mircea_popescu	benkay to quote one of the better lines in city hall, "You ever seen a journalist with a million dollars in cash ?"	[00:26]
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ThickAsThieves	unless he wants to a secret shadowy silhouette article on me	[00:26]
Vexual	are bloggers journalists?	[00:26]
benkay	all journalists are bloggers now.	[00:26]
truffles	lol TAT's a baller	[00:26]
mircea_popescu	truffles tat shorted the difficulty, i'll have you know.	[00:26]
truffles	subject im unfamiliar with	[00:27]
mike_c	and he is gunna lose	[00:27]
benkay	mircea_popescu, ThickAsThieves how'd shorting the difficulty work out?	[00:27]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 115 @ 0.002735 = 0.3145 BTC [-]	[00:27]
mircea_popescu	shorting the difficulty never works out	[00:27]
mircea_popescu	the difficulty is a very long difficulty indeed.	[00:27]
benkay	"the market can remain irrational far longer than you can remain solvent"	[00:28]
ThickAsThieves	i shorted diff?	[00:28]
mike_c	bitbet	[00:28]
ThickAsThieves	well that aint settled yet	[00:28]
mircea_popescu	benkay it can remain rational for even longer than you can remain irrational, is the catch	[00:28]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 1085 @ 0.00273959 = 2.9725 BTC [+] {3}	[00:28]
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ThickAsThieves	;;nethash	[00:28]
gribble	6400549.04237	[00:28]
ThickAsThieves	stahp!	[00:28]
mircea_popescu	!b 7	[00:29]
ThickAsThieves	he wait	[00:29]
assbot	Last 7 lines bashed and pending review. (http://dpaste.com/1491849/plain/)	[00:29]
mircea_popescu	totally.	[00:29]
ThickAsThieves	it did stop	[00:29]
BingoBoingo	;;ident BingoBoingo	[00:29]
gribble	Nick 'BingoBoingo', with hostmask 'BingoBoingo!~BingoBoin@unaffiliated/bingoboingo', is identified as user BingoBoingo, with GPG key id 309BB8D7F3251143, key fingerprint ADD7A9A28F85E5EF1F51904F309BB8D7F3251143, and bitcoin address None	[00:29]
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mircea_popescu	funniest thing i read all day.	[00:29]
ThickAsThieves	thats the same diff from this morning?	[00:29]
mircea_popescu	nethash ! what r u doing! nethash! STAHP!!!	[00:29]
ThickAsThieves	sorry, nethash	[00:29]
ThickAsThieves	not diff	[00:29]
benkay	.d	[00:29]
ozbot	707408283.05150 \| Next Diff in 1256 blocks \| Estimated Change: 24.1215% in 6d 14h 35m 14s	[00:29]
ThickAsThieves	;;bcstats	[00:30]
gribble	Current Blocks: 272919 \| Current Difficulty: 7.074082830514966E8 \| Next Difficulty At Block: 274175 \| Next Difficulty In: 1256 blocks \| Next Difficulty In About: 6 days, 9 hours, 47 minutes, and 45 seconds \| Next Difficulty Estimate: 880424029.301 \| Estimated Percent Change: 24.45769	[00:30]
benkay	i'm intrigued by the bitbet about difficulty falling	[00:30]
BingoBoingo	This blogger is willing to offer the Senior Editor a 2,500,000 Satoshi Grant to study shorting Bitcoin or a 5,000,000 Satoshi loan	[00:30]
mircea_popescu	interestingly enough, any arrangement wherein you borrow bitcoin and then sell it is, in fact, an option.	[00:31]
BingoBoingo	If he is serious he can find my email address embedded here http://www.thedrinkingrecord.com/pgp/ or I'll probably still be lurking	[00:31]
mike_c	well, that is the definition of a short	[00:31]
mike_c	borrow and sell	[00:31]
mircea_popescu	yes.	[00:31]
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Vexual	http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iL-3VLXNqAI	[00:32]
ozbot	porsche using EMP device on Mullet Ride (to keep from being passed @ thunderhill) - YouTube	[00:32]
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mircea_popescu	mike_c but your contract has an implicit strike (established by the interest you pay on the borrow and the price you get on the sale)	[00:32]
mircea_popescu	and it has an expiration (established by the borrow)	[00:33]
mircea_popescu	thus, it's exactly an option.	[00:33]
benkay	ha!	[00:33]
benkay	dat topological identity.	[00:33]
mircea_popescu	well yeah	[00:33]
mircea_popescu	how do you think options ended up existing in the first place,	[00:34]
benkay	i was wondering the other night how likely bitbet would be to displace formal options trading	[00:34]
mircea_popescu	it's not like i was bored one day and invented a new thing/	[00:34]
mircea_popescu	benkay not too likely, it's kinda clunky	[00:34]
mike_c	ah, i see your point. got it.	[00:34]
benkay	well yeah and the whole otc lubrication of trade	[00:34]
mircea_popescu	yeah	[00:34]
benkay	er otc -> contract standardization i mean	[00:34]
ThickAsThieves	where are the new Yes bets? http://bitbet.us/bet/519/btc-network-difficulty-to-top-1b-before-2014/	[00:38]
BingoBoingo	stephengandel: Do you have a bitcoin client of you own running yet?	[00:41]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9200 @ 0.0008094 = 7.4465 BTC [-]	[00:41]
mircea_popescu	ThickAsThieves if you look at it, the yes side is few and mostly large bets, the no is mostly many small bets	[00:42]
mircea_popescu	this to me looks definitely like miners are dominating the yes side.	[00:43]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 883 @ 0.00274 = 2.4194 BTC [+] {2}	[00:43]
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assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 125 @ 0.00274973 = 0.3437 BTC [+]	[00:46]
mircea_popescu	http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8ZWn2AaJoZo << here, because you're all nuts.	[00:47]
ozbot	Animaniacs: Macadamia Nut Lyrics in Description - YouTube	[00:47]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 141 @ 0.00274982 = 0.3877 BTC [+] {2}	[00:49]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 7400 @ 0.0001099 = 0.8133 BTC [-]	[00:50]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 87 @ 0.00276 = 0.2401 BTC [+]	[00:50]
ThickAsThieves	did Havelock skip having a forum thread for the new IPOz?	[00:51]
Duffer1	the 7c thing?	[00:51]
ThickAsThieves	yeah	[00:51]
Duffer1	i didn't even look, i read the email then deleted it when i read the 3rd quarter 2014 part	[00:52]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 1190 @ 0.00010995 = 0.1308 BTC [+]	[00:52]
ThickAsThieves	https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=354208.msg3791494;topicseen#new	[00:53]
ozbot	SENIGMA a way forward?	[00:53]
ThickAsThieves	look at those poll questions	[00:53]
ThickAsThieves	hehe	[00:53]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.NSA] 1250 @ 0.00012 = 0.15 BTC [+]	[00:54]
Duffer1	i like voteing	[00:54]
Duffer1	7c IPOing soon, won't get anything done for a year (while btc price triples in the meantime) sounds like another VTX	[00:55]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 6032 @ 0.00011017 = 0.6645 BTC [+] {4}	[00:57]
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assbot	[HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 5699 @ 0.00011966 = 0.6819 BTC [+] {4}	[01:00]
mircea_popescu	didn't vtx also get hacked ?	[01:01]
Vexual	7c would be a lot cooler if they were building a town in antarctica	[01:01]
mircea_popescu	"For a few months now, Whilst I hold my share prices at 0.012, When I started, This was nothing, Now it is starting to be something, Whilst this is good for early adopters who have got the value back already, Is this too high for anyone else to come in?	[01:01]
mircea_popescu	Your thoughts here."	[01:01]
mircea_popescu	what ?	[01:01]
mircea_popescu	what part of the "i hold my share prices" do i woefully misunderstand ?	[01:02]
ThickAsThieves	i think it's a PMB and/or scam	[01:03]
ThickAsThieves	but i aint gonna dig deeper	[01:03]
mircea_popescu	so is it an actual bond, as in, with a principal and everything ?	[01:04]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [VTX] 1 @ 0.156 BTC [-]	[01:04]
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Vexual	yep, he buys mining equipment. dividends exist. the end	[01:05]
mircea_popescu	so then how does he hold the shares at whatever	[01:05]
ThickAsThieves	http://www.coindesk.com/btc-e-exchange-banking-issues/	[01:05]
mircea_popescu	"for many weeks" ?	[01:06]
assbot	[MPEX] [O] [O.USD.C095T] 320 @ 0.04412653 = 14.1205 BTC [-]	[01:06]
Vexual	I will set a buy back out at 20% ???	[01:06]
ThickAsThieves	the dude has colleted less than 10btc	[01:06]
ThickAsThieves	https://cryptostocks.com/securities/45	[01:06]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 2000 @ 0.00278701 = 5.574 BTC [+] {7}	[01:07]
ThickAsThieves	good day for neo	[01:07]
mircea_popescu	“I’ve sent large amounts by wire and it’s always worked within 24 hours. Check your deposit "	[01:07]
mircea_popescu	retardds. obviously wires in would work fine.	[01:07]
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ThickAsThieves	so does btc-e carrying litecoin prevent the Gox effect here?	[01:10]
snackman	which one of you is mircea_popescu ?	[01:10]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 1292 @ 0.00278768 = 3.6017 BTC [+]	[01:10]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.33676818 BTC [-]	[01:10]
mircea_popescu	snackman kakobrekla.	[01:10]
mircea_popescu	i'm really jurov, who is ThickAsThieves.	[01:10]
mircea_popescu	it's complicated, because finance.	[01:10]
snackman	pathethic piece of romanian scum	[01:10]
snackman	or whatever post-communist shithole you come from	[01:11]
truffles	didnt see that one coming	[01:11]
ThickAsThieves	now taking bets on how long before snakcmna is banned or run out of here	[01:11]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [AM1] 11 @ 0.33586098 = 3.6945 BTC [-] {8}	[01:11]
mircea_popescu	the dazzling variety of irc.	[01:11]
snackman	this gypsy owes me 1,000,000 US-dollar cents	[01:11]
truffles	0,0	[01:12]
mircea_popescu	(which, i will have you know, somalis pronounce irtz)	[01:12]
Vexual	http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FE0XcdM22Yo	[01:12]
ozbot	Scatman John - I'm A scatman - YouTube	[01:12]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 1440 @ 0.00278768 = 4.0143 BTC [+]	[01:12]
kakobrekla	lol	[01:12]
snackman	no, but seriously guys	[01:12]
ThickAsThieves	ok sorry	[01:12]
mircea_popescu	snackman http://trilema.com/2013/the-strange-case-of-the-delusionist-and-later-stories/ << check out the cartoon.	[01:12]
mircea_popescu	it's about you.	[01:12]
snackman	mircea_popescu: ok hold on	[01:12]
ThickAsThieves	the oglaf guy has some good stuff	[01:13]
snackman	mircea_popescu: nice cartoon, also nice post btw	[01:14]
snackman	is that you in the header picture?	[01:14]
mircea_popescu	yes.	[01:14]
ThickAsThieves	it's jurov of course	[01:14]
mircea_popescu	aw shit. caught in my own web of lies	[01:14]
mircea_popescu	ThickAsThieves it's a woman!	[01:15]
ThickAsThieves	it's just a pyramid	[01:15]
ThickAsThieves	calm down	[01:15]
mircea_popescu	no i mean the oglaf GUY. it's a girl.	[01:15]
ThickAsThieves	ah ha!	[01:15]
ThickAsThieves	that explains a lot	[01:15]
mircea_popescu	so rarely women do anything worth the mention. why rob them of the little they do.	[01:16]
snackman	well, mircea_popescu, sorry but i can't get it out of my head: why do you not want to pay me my 10btc back. please just explain it to me in a calm and rational way	[01:16]
ThickAsThieves	i was just like wow this dude is very progressive with these gay frames	[01:16]
mircea_popescu	snackman actually, there was a post about that, too. didja read that ?	[01:16]
snackman	mircea_popescu: i did.	[01:16]
mircea_popescu	well that's about it.	[01:17]
snackman	mircea_popescu: i'm listening to what you have to say. that post developed into a bashfest	[01:17]
kakobrekla	as all the roads lead to rome, all the questions lead to trilema	[01:17]
mircea_popescu	the trirome!	[01:17]
kakobrekla	and the roastions	[01:17]
ThickAsThieves	trirome, pronounced like tyranny	[01:18]
mircea_popescu	no, like tryrammy.	[01:18]
mircea_popescu	like thrice rammed.	[01:18]
ThickAsThieves	when in rome	[01:18]
snackman	mircea_popescu: i'm still listening. you are wasting my precious time	[01:18]
mircea_popescu	you got that a little backwards neh ?	[01:19]
ThickAsThieves	we're all wasting each other precious time, dont give him all the credit	[01:19]
mircea_popescu	no homo.	[01:19]
snackman	mircea_popescu: you might wanna look up megalomania then	[01:19]
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ThickAsThieves	surely he has it tatooed on his penis	[01:20]
mircea_popescu	i was thinking... this guy's theory is that i simultaneously invented the thing and also don't know what it is ?!	[01:20]
dub	megalomania is an awesome old RTS game	[01:21]
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ThickAsThieves	snackman, why did you bet so late	[01:21]
snackman	mircea_popescu: so then tell me, why are your genes contaminated by sub-human east european scum parents?	[01:21]
mircea_popescu	o.o	[01:21]
dub	fast bux are the best bux derp	[01:21]
snackman	ThickAsThieves: because i wanted to make the most out of it	[01:21]
snackman	yeah	[01:21]
mircea_popescu	don't they teach debate in school anymore ?!	[01:21]
ThickAsThieves	make the most loss out of it?	[01:22]
dub	did he just call mp a nigger?	[01:22]
snackman	mircea_popescu: at least we have schools here :)	[01:22]
Duffer1	cancelled due to budget cuts mp :P	[01:22]
mircea_popescu	i think i should be insulted by being related to the hottest chicks on planet earth or something	[01:22]
snackman	for everybody, not just the overprivileged party members	[01:22]
snackman	mircea_popescu: nah, i don't think that	[01:22]
mircea_popescu	where's that mit video	[01:22]
Duffer1	if it's not football it's not funded	[01:22]
jamespeerless	does bitbet have a minimum bet? seems like they'd lose money on transaction fees if I don't bet much?	[01:23]
*	truffles doesnt understand what the drama is about	[01:23]
snackman	mircea_popescu: tbh, it's kinda hard to debate an online nickname that has taken 10btc from you and tries to keep it using "arguments"	[01:23]
mircea_popescu	jamespeerless no minimum bet so far.	[01:23]
mircea_popescu	http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8ve23i5K334 <<	[01:23]
ozbot	MIT genuises with lightbulb - YouTube	[01:23]
snackman	truffles: he took my btcs	[01:23]
Bunnyh	is the NO on bitbet charts really gray? seems teal to me	[01:23]
mircea_popescu	Bunnyh im colorblind.	[01:23]
truffles	why'd he take em snackman?	[01:23]
Bunnyh	ok,i thought i am	[01:24]
mircea_popescu	snackman it's not a nickname dood. that's my name.	[01:24]
mircea_popescu	jamespeerless the reason is that we're oldfags, which means rich, which means with a lot of old coinbases, which means tx are free. or something.	[01:25]
jamespeerless	what do you mean? why would they be free	[01:25]
mircea_popescu	the prioritization of txs takes into account the concept of "bitcoin days destroyed"	[01:26]
mircea_popescu	that's the product of a coinbase's volume with its age.	[01:26]
*	zboralski (~az@176.27.243.189) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[01:26]
snackman	truffles: because my transaction was not confirmed in time	[01:26]
mircea_popescu	so if you have 1k btc that weren't moved for 3 years, you get about 1mn times the priority of a 1btc that was moved yest.	[01:26]
snackman	truffles: it was placed on the correct bet though	[01:26]
jamespeerless	got it	[01:27]
jamespeerless	makes sense	[01:27]
truffles	snackman gotta read fine prints	[01:27]
mircea_popescu	in principle it's good for the network to keep moving coins around, i suspect.	[01:27]
mircea_popescu	or at least satoshi thought so for some reason.	[01:27]
kakobrekla	imo just bigger chain	[01:27]
kakobrekla	why	[01:27]
kakobrekla	where	[01:27]
mircea_popescu	it's one of the points i don't quite grasp tbh	[01:27]
snackman	truffles: they weren't, they were FAQs, and i never agreed to them, also this particular clause was surprising, therefore not applicable for yet another reason	[01:28]
mircea_popescu	kakobrekla well because of the particular design, seems implicit in it.	[01:28]
ThickAsThieves	Hey MP, how bout a compromise, put "Late Bets Will Be Retained" or such on the Send Bitcoins page of bitbet	[01:28]
snackman	mircea_popescu is only not returning them because he assumes that it is unlikely that i will sue him in romania	[01:28]
truffles	so ur situation was outside of terms ?	[01:28]
mircea_popescu	ThickAsThieves the problem with this approach is that 1. it empowers nonsense and 2. it bloats pages.	[01:28]
Vexual	faqs are accepted to form contract	[01:28]
snackman	truffles: yet, because the txn was sent before, it only arrived later because nobody confirmed it	[01:29]
dub	interestingly educatoin in .us and .ro sucks somewhat equally	[01:29]
mike_c	i always took the priority the opposite, that is - it is discouraging moving coins too much by giving recently spent coins lower priority	[01:29]
kakobrekla	mircea_popescu not like you can mitigate it	[01:29]
snackman	Vexual: yes, if they explicitely ask you to confirm them, which they didnt	[01:29]
dub	though dumb romanians are smarter than dumb americans	[01:29]
snackman	Vexual: also only if there are no surprising clauses	[01:29]
mircea_popescu	mike_c when i say move coins around i mean, not have very old coinbases.	[01:29]
ThickAsThieves	so you dont think "reasonable man" is a concept to consider?	[01:29]
snackman	?	[01:29]
ThickAsThieves	a reasonable man would likely assume his bet would either be valid at the time of sending, or refunded at a fee	[01:29]
Vexual	a reasonable man reads the contract	[01:30]
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snackman	mircea_popescu has forgotten the current btc price, making my loss around 12000 usd, making it more than worth pursing a lawyer. also for the satisfaction of seeing this bastard lose in court	[01:30]
truffles	snackman i get what ure saying, id already have refunded u if it were my biz though, gl	[01:30]
ThickAsThieves	a reasonable contract typically wouldnt have snares	[01:30]
mircea_popescu	ThickAsThieves a reasonable man would not send bitcoin on the basis of his assumptions.	[01:30]
*	tbcoin (~tbcoin@81.61.86.183.dyn.user.ono.com) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[01:30]
snackman	truffles: thanks.	[01:30]
mircea_popescu	otherwise the reasonable man can start sending to random addresses.	[01:30]
snackman	mircea_popescu: nice non sequitur	[01:30]
snackman	mircea_popescu: and nice attempt derailing his point	[01:31]
ThickAsThieves	do what you want, i;m just sayin youll likely have this problem continually	[01:31]
mike_c	seriously, if it is such an important amount of money why didn't you do a little research first? doesn't that seem wrong to you at all?	[01:31]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 200 @ 0.00278768 = 0.5575 BTC [+]	[01:31]
snackman	mike_c: there was not much time left	[01:31]
mircea_popescu	ThickAsThieves well, i'm doing what i think is right, and in so doing i'm preventing others from having the same sort of problem all the time.	[01:31]
mike_c	right.. so you should not have done it.	[01:31]
snackman	mike_c: also, i followed the basic rules: bet on what you think will win	[01:31]
mircea_popescu	the space in which bitcoin busienss will happen is primarily shapen by what sort of precedent we create for it.	[01:32]
ThickAsThieves	ThickAsThieves well, i'm doing what i think is right, and in so doing i'm preventing others from having the same sort of problem all the time. <<< fair enough	[01:32]
snackman	mircea_popescu: you are a scum to the bitcoin economy and community	[01:32]
snackman	mircea_popescu: you are but a leach, you are what is disgraceful in human beings	[01:32]
mircea_popescu	snackman im the largest thing in it ya klutz.	[01:32]
ThickAsThieves	snackman you would be a good diplomat	[01:32]
snackman	ThickAsThieves: why?	[01:32]
mike_c	snackman: can you settle a bet for me. have you placed any more bets on bitbet yet?	[01:32]
ThickAsThieves	you have a way with words	[01:32]
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snackman	mircea_popescu: then why would 10btc matter to you?	[01:32]
ThickAsThieves	he just said why	[01:33]
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mike_c	cmon snack, fess up. you've place more bets haven't you :)	[01:33]
ThickAsThieves	because he feels his policy helps create the kind of world he wants to live in	[01:33]
snackman	ThickAsThieves: why would i be a good diplomat?	[01:33]
ThickAsThieves	you wouldnt	[01:33]
ThickAsThieves	it's a joke	[01:34]
ThickAsThieves	you suck at convincing people to help you	[01:34]
truffles	i dont think u want him to be more convincing	[01:34]
mike_c	i will send you 0.001 btc if you answer me. it will help you recover.	[01:34]
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truffles	thats a general you	[01:35]
Duffer1	whats all this drama now?	[01:35]
Duffer1	someone lost money.. on bitbet?	[01:35]
*	tbcoin (~tbcoin@81.61.86.183.dyn.user.ono.com) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[01:35]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3950 @ 0.00081266 = 3.21 BTC [+]	[01:35]
ThickAsThieves	yeah they sent money after the answer was known	[01:35]
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turbo_ac100	Namworld, I can't get my S.BBET and S.BBET redeemed. That's still possible right?	[01:35]
Duffer1	interesting	[01:36]
ThickAsThieves	turbo_ac100, jurov`can help you, via coinbr.com	[01:36]
snackman	mike_c: of course i have placed more bets afterwards on bidbet	[01:36]
snackman	ThickAsThieves: lie	[01:37]
turbo_ac100	ThickAsThieves, thanks	[01:37]
dub	lol	[01:37]
snackman	Duffer1: they are lying to keep my ONE MILLION cents	[01:37]
mike_c	awwww, sweet, i win. post address and i will send the donation	[01:37]
snackman	my address?	[01:37]
*	ThickAsThieves is now known as ThickAsThieves`	[01:37]
mike_c	if you want the 0.0001 btc i promised	[01:37]
mike_c	er, 0.001	[01:38]
Duffer1	i don't believe they would have to lie to keep your money, there must be something i'm missing	[01:38]
dub	mike_c: make sure you pay the fee	[01:38]
mircea_popescu	Duffer1 a 10 page forum thread	[01:38]
mike_c	lol	[01:38]
Duffer1	not like my opinion matters at all in this anyways, i was just curious	[01:38]
Duffer1	erf, i'll pass, hehe	[01:38]
dub	mike_c: might want to also check if snackman is the 1 person that doesnt require confirmations	[01:39]
snackman	mike_c: 16TNs3DYjkGZrnEW4KV7ust6sWU3Esk7eW	[01:39]
*	dub sends some stolen bitcoinica funds	[01:39]
mircea_popescu	in 2020 mike_c will be all like "well sonny, i remember back in the old days, mp was there, and i sent this kid a whole bitcent on a lark"	[01:39]
mike_c	hehe	[01:39]
dexX7	Duffer1: problem was actually that the bet was already resolved when his tx/bet was confirmed which - according to bitbet's faq - entitles bitbet to keep the coins	[01:39]
mircea_popescu	"yeap. that's how it was back then..."	[01:39]
Vexual	and the lawyer got paid a three yeart retainer on that one case...	[01:40]
jamespeerless	mircea_popescu: do you know if sendmany only charges one transaction fee regardless of # of recipients?	[01:40]
Vexual	one tx, one fee	[01:41]
mircea_popescu	jamespeerless i knowandit does.	[01:41]
mircea_popescu	andineed a newspacebar	[01:41]
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jamespeerless	what about the 'per kb' rules? i think i read somewhere that 5 recipients is about 1kb? any merit to that?	[01:42]
dub	looking back on how much a trilemna page view cost should be fun	[01:42]
mircea_popescu	jamespeerless the recipients aren't the problem. it's about 60 bytes per	[01:43]
mircea_popescu	your inputs are often the problem, because 1 btc could be made out of 100 mn inputs, aka 10gb	[01:43]
snackman	mircea_popescu: do you have a larger version of your avatar https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?PHPSESSID=5rlspco75dem9q993n3gh96j90&topic=350342.msg3752137#msg3752137	[01:43]
snackman	?	[01:43]
mircea_popescu	you know that's not actually me ?	[01:43]
Duffer1	dexx7 i see, thanks	[01:43]
snackman	mircea_popescu: your avatar	[01:44]
mircea_popescu	...	[01:44]
mircea_popescu	it's not my account dood. it's my pr chick.	[01:44]
snackman	mircea_popescu: yes, i know. it's not her either, just a random pic from the internet	[01:45]
Vexual	http://neogrotesque.net/wp-content/uploads/avatar-3.jpg	[01:45]
ThickAsThieves`	snackman, mircea is schizophrenic	[01:45]
snackman	ThickAsThieves`: i know right	[01:45]
ThickAsThieves`	common in the colorblinded	[01:45]
mircea_popescu	sigh	[01:45]
ThickAsThieves`	lol	[01:45]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 262 @ 0.00278768 = 0.7304 BTC [+] {3}	[01:45]
mircea_popescu	snackman http://trilema.com/2013/the-stuff-all-good-conspiracy-theories-start-with/ scroll down	[01:45]
snackman	LOL	[01:46]
snackman	This article is available for a fee.	[01:46]
snackman	megalomania at its finest :D	[01:46]
dub	bloggin aint easy	[01:46]
mircea_popescu	seems you read a bunch. get a proxy.	[01:46]
dexX7	lol	[01:46]
dexX7	this was telling	[01:46]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 286 @ 0.00278769 = 0.7973 BTC [+]	[01:46]
dexX7	what's the amount of free articles again?	[01:46]
mike_c	http://trilema.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/04/further-image.jpg	[01:47]
snackman	no, i scrolled through a bunch of them to see if this counter was real or trolling	[01:47]
dub	yea, dude is running around telling everyone not to use bitbet and avoid mp. all the while still useing bitbet and hanging on mp's every blog	[01:47]
snackman	mike_c: where are the horses?	[01:47]
ThickAsThieves`	thats not mp in that table pic	[01:47]
mike_c	bottom right is mpoe-pr	[01:47]
Vexual	counting and reading all on the same day?	[01:47]
snackman	dub: i literally just explained to you why the counter was 0	[01:47]
mircea_popescu	dexX7 5/week	[01:48]
ThickAsThieves`	oh that reminds me of that joke	[01:48]
snackman	Vexual: i klicked on 6 articles to see if the fee counter was a troll, which would have been funny indeed, if not, retarded as fuck	[01:48]
mircea_popescu	...	[01:49]
ThickAsThieves`	It's hard to explain puns to kleptomaniacs because they always take things literally.	[01:49]
mike_c	mircea_popescu: are company reports exempt from fee?	[01:49]
mircea_popescu	anyway, the guy on the right there with the dorky hairdue is actually the lawyer you'll probably end up having to argue with	[01:49]
mircea_popescu	mike_c yes, if you don't need to read more than 20 a month.	[01:49]
snackman	mircea_popescu: who doesn't have a dorky haircut in the picture?	[01:49]
snackman	mircea_popescu: also, what picture is this?	[01:49]
mircea_popescu	snackman well you're poor and so can't afford the context.	[01:50]
snackman	mircea_popescu: let the king explain to the peasant then	[01:50]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 85 @ 0.0028 = 0.238 BTC [+] {2}	[01:50]
mircea_popescu	just use mike's cent to buy some credits	[01:51]
mircea_popescu	I GET ALL THE COINS	[01:51]
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snackman	mircea_popescu: how many do you own?	[01:51]
kakobrekla	wait for a month so it matures first	[01:51]
benkay	.d	[01:51]
ozbot	707408283.05150 \| Next Diff in 1243 blocks \| Estimated Change: 24.4964% in 6d 12h 14m 26s	[01:51]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 200 @ 0.0028 = 0.56 BTC [+]	[01:51]
snackman	mircea_popescu: also, if you happen to get any higher resolution pix of your PR chick, let me know.	[01:52]
mircea_popescu	i'll see if google turns anything up.	[01:53]
Duffer1	ya that doesn't sounds creepy dude	[01:53]
snackman	mircea_popescu: i'd happily wank to a girl that's into bitcoins	[01:53]
snackman	mircea_popescu: it didn't	[01:53]
snackman	mircea_popescu: oh sorry, misunderstood you	[01:53]
snackman	mircea_popescu: please do	[01:53]
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snackman	mircea_popescu: also, if you would be willing to return even, let's say 10% of the money, that would save both of us lots of stress and i would not bother you again	[01:55]
snackman	seeing that i probably will really have to contact a lawyer...	[01:55]
*	[\] has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)	[01:55]
mircea_popescu	use your noggin for thinking : if my return from hanging out here were actually negative, i wouldn't or else i'd have you sent off.	[01:55]
ThickAsThieves`	that sentence	[01:56]
snackman	make no sense	[01:56]
mircea_popescu	what srsly ?	[01:56]
mircea_popescu	i'm just saying, talking to random peeps on irc isn't stressing me, it's mildly enjoyable.	[01:57]
BingoBoingo	mircea_popescu: Clarification on a much earlier point of yours. No lawyers presentinga criminal defense, but lawyers are fine arguing in civil cases?	[01:57]
mircea_popescu	BingoBoingo sure. the worst they can do is lose you some money.	[01:57]
BingoBoingo	Fuck, I think I've been doing this legal shit backasswards.	[01:57]
mircea_popescu	that's no different from hiring a plumber.	[01:57]
dub	the guy donated $12k to you, might sa well hang out on irc	[01:57]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 148 @ 0.0028 = 0.4144 BTC [+]	[01:58]
mike_c	well, to the shareholders	[01:58]
dub	shit, throw him some blog credits, he earned it	[01:58]
mike_c	he also drummed up a lot of new business	[01:58]
mircea_popescu	no cause he insultged my megalomania by claiming my troll counter is megalomaniac	[01:59]
dub	mp is 80% of shareholders tho	[01:59]
mike_c	nah	[01:59]
mircea_popescu	dub no i'm not, im under 50%	[01:59]
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dub	orly	[01:59]
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snackman	mircea_popescu: bets are weighted, so late bets do not disturb the force field	[01:59]
mircea_popescu	yesrly. kako and i have ~35% + w/e didn't sell of the 30% put on sale.	[01:59]
jamespeerless	why do you even have share holders? why not just run it yourself?	[01:59]
mircea_popescu	snackman except if the bet closes early, cause that means the weight was out of whack.	[01:59]
mircea_popescu	jamespeerless i'm trying to build bitcoin into an actual thing.	[02:00]
jamespeerless	by running a gambling website?	[02:00]
mircea_popescu	by running all sorts of things correctly.	[02:00]
BingoBoingo	jamespeerless: A great gambling website. I've won moar there than I lost on Satoshidice.	[02:00]
turbo_ac100	prediction market. please!	[02:00]
ThickAsThieves`	maybe bitbet should have a setting for each bet for rate of weight loss	[02:00]
ThickAsThieves`	a curve	[02:00]
mircea_popescu	ThickAsThieves` it was in the original spec	[02:01]
mircea_popescu	we cut it out, because curve notation is more than the average person can grok mentally	[02:01]
snackman	mircea_popescu: are you satoshi?	[02:01]
mircea_popescu	and having it graphical turned out to be insanely difficult.	[02:01]
ThickAsThieves`	so use gfx	[02:01]
snackman	mircea_popescu: if you are, i take everything back, the megalomania is justified	[02:01]
ThickAsThieves`	make 3 options	[02:01]
mike_c	same rationale as 3-way resolutions	[02:01]
mircea_popescu	snackman no, i'm nick szabo.	[02:01]
snackman	mircea_popescu: so that's a yes	[02:01]
ThickAsThieves`	fast regular slow	[02:01]
BingoBoingo	ThickAsThieves`: What's next? Allowing bet creators to specify elliptic curves the bet weight passes through as it degrades over time?	[02:01]
mircea_popescu	ThickAsThieves` what's wrong with just setting the weight end point to 80k or w.e ?	[02:01]
ThickAsThieves`	yes, thats what we are talking about	[02:01]
dub	appears we are past acceptance and into the dick slurping phase of grief	[02:02]
ThickAsThieves`	i think maybe i misunderstood end weight all along	[02:02]
ThickAsThieves`	which now seems obvious	[02:02]
mircea_popescu	ThickAsThieves` and you wanteds me to implement splines.	[02:02]
snackman	mircea_popescu: admit it dude	[02:03]
snackman	mircea_popescu: this entire escapade of mine was to test your style	[02:03]
mircea_popescu	o, there was deeper meaning ?	[02:03]
snackman	mircea_popescu: lol of course	[02:03]
mircea_popescu	i like it when there's deeper meaning	[02:03]
ThickAsThieves`	admit what snackman did mp	[02:03]
*	mike_c has quit ()	[02:03]
*	[\] has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)	[02:03]
snackman	and what i assumed was confirmed beyong expectation	[02:04]
snackman	beyond*, as typos are made when you're excited	[02:04]
Duffer1	if true then your actions are too meta for me to grock..	[02:04]
mircea_popescu	Duffer1 it probably has something to do with post communism.	[02:05]
Duffer1	oh lawd you're not helping mp lol	[02:05]
BingoBoingo	snackman: The simple answer is to get your bets in much earlier. As close to opening as possible. Just draw a bullseye on a piece of paper and jack off. If more cum is on the right bet yes. On the left bet no.	[02:05]
snackman	mircea_popescu: not being engrained into mainstream economics by birth certainly helped you	[02:05]
snackman	BingoBoingo: the conversation moved on, screw the play money, i have a much bigger fish to catch	[02:06]
mircea_popescu	BingoBoingo do you have a bitbeteratorium ?	[02:06]
benkay	snackman: fishing for buttcorns?	[02:06]
ThickAsThieves`	sending an email to wikimedia re: donation request pop-up:	[02:06]
ThickAsThieves`	No bitcoin option? Fairweather friends get no shine.	[02:07]
BingoBoingo	mircea_popescu: Maybe? Maybe instead of the paper bullseye though I hire a pair of tits. I'm trying to imagine snackman's budget though.	[02:07]
snackman	benkay: i have enough, thank you. i got in early	[02:07]
benkay	snackman: your aggro over 10 seems unwarranted then	[02:07]
mircea_popescu	it's incredible how many people that got in early showed up late.	[02:07]
mircea_popescu	we'd have never guessed in like, 2012.	[02:07]
BingoBoingo	snackman: Actually in IRC everything is roughly on topic for at least 24 hours after it was last mention provided you scroll up	[02:07]
benkay	snackman holds all the buttcorns. it's his private pre-mined altcoin, mircea_popescu, not actual bitcoins.	[02:08]
snackman	benkay: please read the last 5 minutes. the entire thing was an act, carefully orchestrated, and mircea_popescu fell for it graciously	[02:08]
benkay	that's what he means by "got in early"	[02:08]
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BingoBoingo	mircea_popescu: To be fair before you showed it was pretty much just the dev circle jerk and the Silk Road honey pot	[02:08]
mircea_popescu	then mp said "let there be tits1	[02:09]
mircea_popescu	and lo tits rain galoare.	[02:09]
BingoBoingo	snackman: I'll give you 5,000,000 Satoshis for a sharpie in the pooper pic with BB written on your asscheeks	[02:10]
snackman	BingoBoingo: the address is up there	[02:10]
snackman	it's not mine btw	[02:10]
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BingoBoingo	snackman: It honestly is seeming now like nothing is yours, but the cold embrace of nothingness. How is the void?	[02:11]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 10090 @ 0.0001011 = 1.0201 BTC [-] {2}	[02:12]
dub	ThickAsThieves`: considering half of wikimedia corp is gmaxwells sausage wallet, they've probably consdired it	[02:12]
snackman	he who own's the keys owns the coins. and he who own's the void owns...	[02:12]
snackman	shit	[02:12]
dub	clearly it didnt rustle jimmies jimmies	[02:13]
snackman	i have found satoshi	[02:13]
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assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 936 @ 0.00278769 = 2.6093 BTC [-] {2}	[02:14]
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BingoBoingo	snackman: Nah, for that you'd have to check someone's freezer	[02:14]
snackman	BingoBoingo: why do you think that?	[02:15]
snackman	BingoBoingo: why actually kill him to prevent his coins from crashing the market? why not just delete his keys?	[02:15]
BingoBoingo	snackman: Dude invented a cryptocurrency and was paranoid as fuck? Satoshi is probably mooching off of pizza rolls someone else's mom bought	[02:16]
snackman	BingoBoingo: i thought you meant in someone's freezer meant dead	[02:16]
BingoBoingo	snackman: Who the fuck are you Jeffery Damer?	[02:16]
dub	he certainly eats some penus	[02:17]
snackman	BingoBoingo: sorry, pills	[02:17]
snackman	BingoBoingo: work both ways	[02:17]
mircea_popescu	you're too young to be taking pills.	[02:17]
BingoBoingo	mircea_popescu: Moar like not ratchet enough...	[02:18]
BingoBoingo	;;ud ratchet	[02:18]
gribble	http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=ratchet \| A diva, mostly from urban cities and ghettos, that has reason to believe she is every mans eye candy. Unfortunately, she's wrong. Typical signs to ...	[02:18]
ozbot	Urban Dictionary: ratchet	[02:18]
snackman	mircea_popescu: i lived long enough to witness your birth	[02:18]
snackman	;;ud subhuman romanian nigger scum	[02:19]
gribble	http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=kike&defid=1479218&page=2 \| ... Europe (Poland, Romania or Russia), whose family names often ended with "ki " ... Neo-Nazi scum claim that "kikes" control both major US political parties and ...	[02:19]
ozbot	Urban Dictionary: kike	[02:19]
mircea_popescu	snackman http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=22-11-2013#389001	[02:20]
snackman	mircea_popescu: haha where did you get that pic?	[02:21]
mircea_popescu	S.NSA	[02:21]
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BingoBoingo	S.NSA is gunna kill SnapChat	[02:22]
jamespeerless	mircea_popescu: why have separate addresses for each bet instead of just a single address that holds bets for YES and NO?	[02:22]
kakobrekla	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=22-11-2013#389017	[02:22]
ozbot	#bitcoin-assets log	[02:22]
kakobrekla	o yeah fuck alomost forgot!	[02:22]
mircea_popescu	jamespeerless how do you identify who sent which ?	[02:22]
BingoBoingo	jamespeerless: So people can continue betting on the same position	[02:23]
mircea_popescu	there's numerous advantages.	[02:23]
jamespeerless	mircea_popescu: can't you read the from address in the transaction block?	[02:23]
mircea_popescu	you can but you don't want to, because this way people can send from webwallets or w/e	[02:23]
BingoBoingo	Sometimes you wanna hedge. Sometimes you wanna take all of the position.	[02:23]
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jamespeerless	why can't they send from web wallets if you did a single address per bet option	[02:24]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [AM1] 45 @ 0.33513812 = 15.0812 BTC [-] {3}	[02:24]
mircea_popescu	cause if 5 peopel sent from the same wallet to the same bet your identifiocation scheme would fail	[02:24]
mircea_popescu	also because if i sent the winnings to the address that sent the bet people would end up fucked if they sent from a wallet.	[02:24]
mircea_popescu	(as most wallets don't have any way to associate their payment system to their users)	[02:25]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 2539 @ 0.0028 = 7.1092 BTC [+]	[02:25]
snackman	nice	[02:25]
snackman	everything here is a scam	[02:25]
jamespeerless	hm I guess I don't understand "wallets" enough then.. i thought an address was an address	[02:25]
snackman	even mike_c didn't send his promised coins	[02:25]
ThickAsThieves`	lol	[02:25]
mircea_popescu	not practical for a web wallet to allocate addresses to users	[02:25]
mircea_popescu	because it has to coldstore its btc	[02:25]
jamespeerless	ah got it	[02:26]
jamespeerless	makes sense	[02:26]
mircea_popescu	snackman maybe he didn't include a tx fee ?	[02:26]
jamespeerless	seems like most wallets let you generate receiving addresses though	[02:26]
snackman	mircea_popescu: bahahhaahah	[02:26]
mircea_popescu	receiving yes. but they pay from wherever is convenient.	[02:26]
ThickAsThieves`	i like that setup	[02:26]
snackman	mircea_popescu: what a jew indeed	[02:26]
Vexual	i just went to my local casino and tried betting after the bell. Apparently the chips go to the house.	[02:26]
snackman	maybe i will meet him in the synagoge on saturday	[02:26]
ThickAsThieves`	very convenient when you have coins in 10 diff places	[02:26]
mircea_popescu	it dioes have its advantages	[02:27]
BingoBoingo	ThickAsThieves`: Who doesn't spread their coins over at least 7 places?	[02:27]
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assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 250 @ 0.00288 = 0.72 BTC [+]	[02:27]
ThickAsThieves`	Jesus doesn;t	[02:27]
mircea_popescu	bitcoin jesus ?	[02:27]
ThickAsThieves`	which one?	[02:27]
mircea_popescu	Pietilla Maxwell Von Ver ?	[02:28]
BingoBoingo	stephengandel, that Bitcoin Jesus	[02:28]
ThickAsThieves`	whatever happened to IceDrill anyway?	[02:30]
snackman	mircea_popescu: btw, how much did you cash out?	[02:30]
snackman	when btc hit 1kusd?	[02:30]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 76 @ 0.00289 = 0.2196 BTC [+]	[02:30]
kakobrekla	lol	[02:30]
benkay	"cave early"	[02:30]
BingoBoingo	Unless we get into some weird gnostic Bitcoin theology where Amir Taaki was Satoshi/Jesus and then gave himself downs syndrome to hide his secret.	[02:30]
snackman	benkay: ?	[02:31]
mircea_popescu	BingoBoingo satoshi wasn't a virgin.	[02:31]
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BingoBoingo	mircea_popescu: At some point he/she/monkeyfuckingapig was...	[02:31]
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Vexual	vd in the orginal code?	[02:32]
mircea_popescu	well at that point satoshi wasn't satoshi yet.	[02:32]
benkay	well gosh snackman read the log for the past 10 days then you might have a clue as to the references	[02:32]
BingoBoingo	Considering earlier references in this channel has anyone seen Amir's hair yet?	[02:33]
ThickAsThieves`	http://www.icedrill.io	[02:33]
ozbot	IceDrill.ASIC: a DigiMex project	[02:33]
ThickAsThieves`	digital mexicoins!	[02:33]
mircea_popescu	what's with the .io stuff anyway ?	[02:33]
mircea_popescu	they're all scams!	[02:33]
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ThickAsThieves`	mexicoin, possibly the best name for a nationcoin?	[02:34]
ThickAsThieves`	vaticoin	[02:34]
kakobrekla	i liked the .io a lot cause of the jupiters moon	[02:34]
asciilifeform	sovcoin.	[02:34]
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mircea_popescu	kakobrekla ya but then they went and inputsio'd all over it	[02:34]
mod6	i used Io once as a a scabble word and was rejected :(	[02:34]
kakobrekla	yea :(	[02:34]
mircea_popescu	(dunno if that cognate works in somalian. to enstinken)	[02:35]
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mircea_popescu	chococoin	[02:35]
mircea_popescu	backed by vanilla.	[02:35]
BingoBoingo	Well, we will know when we've hit forbidden territory when .Europa happens.	[02:35]
*	OneFixt_ is now known as OneFixt	[02:36]
ThickAsThieves`	so icedrill has oodles of hardware, just none that mines?	[02:36]
ThickAsThieves`	http://www.icedrill.io	[02:36]
ozbot	IceDrill.ASIC: a DigiMex project	[02:36]
ThickAsThieves`	oops	[02:36]
ThickAsThieves`	https://plus.google.com/photos/100533316768811011163/albums/5946837483879253265	[02:36]
ozbot	IceDrill.ASIC DC visit	[02:36]
ThickAsThieves`	ethere they are https://plus.google.com/photos/100533316768811011163/albums/5946837483879253265/5946840121426110546?pid=5946840121426110546&oid=100533316768811011163	[02:37]
ThickAsThieves`	what a nightmare	[02:37]
dexX7	nono	[02:37]
dexX7	they only have a space here afaik: https://plus.google.com/photos/100533316768811011163/albums/5946837483879253265/5946838391947548818?sort=1&pid=5946838391947548818&oid=100533316768811011163	[02:37]
dexX7	and are waiting for hashfast units	[02:37]
ThickAsThieves`	i heard hashfast is scamming	[02:38]
asciilifeform	what part of this couldn't have been filmed by a bored sysop anywhere on the planet?	[02:38]
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kakobrekla	hehe BingoBoingo :)	[02:38]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform the girl.	[02:39]
BingoBoingo	I know you got the reference kakobrekla	[02:39]
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mircea_popescu	o wait, nm. wrong webpage.	[02:39]
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kakobrekla	yeah, teh avatar is dead giva away	[02:39]
kakobrekla	giveaway	[02:40]
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BingoBoingo	The only problem with HAL is that the contractor's specs insisted he be programmed to run on a Java Virtual Machine	[02:40]
kakobrekla	:D	[02:40]
Kleeck_	ThickAsThieves`, are you joking about HashFast scamming?	[02:41]
asciilifeform	maybe i'm just behind the times. but, picture some bozo: 'i'ma build a skyscraper. here's lots of pictures of my bulldozers, cranes! here's some cement mixers!'	[02:41]
Kleeck_	No. You are current with the times.	[02:42]
ThickAsThieves`	Kleeck I am not joking	[02:42]
Kleeck_	I could walk into my datacenter and snap a bunch of awesome pictures. It doesn't mean I'm mining a damn thing.	[02:42]
Kleeck_	ThickAsThieves`, any data that lead you that direction? I have no skin in that game, but I've wondered. It's just a hunch.	[02:43]
ThickAsThieves`	a friend is considering legal counsel against Hashfast	[02:43]
asciilifeform	the sane people version: 'built a skyscraper. here's what it'll cost ya per sq. m. come in?'	[02:43]
mike_c	snackman: have some faith! my wallet is sync'ing. you'll have it soon.	[02:43]
ThickAsThieves`	that's all i know	[02:43]
Kleeck_	Due to the delays?	[02:43]
ThickAsThieves`	i didnt ask for details	[02:43]
ThickAsThieves`	he was looking for a referral	[02:43]
mike_c	transactions aren't instantaneous you know ;)	[02:43]
Kleeck_	I see.	[02:43]
Kleeck_	Not YET, mike_c	[02:44]
snackman	mike_c: hope dies last	[02:44]
dexX7	hashfast is not shipping/delayed more than a month now	[02:44]
Kleeck_	Don't they have a compensation program?	[02:44]
dexX7	they have some strange refund policies, if you mean that	[02:45]
snackman	ThickAsThieves`: why is hashfast scamming?	[02:45]
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ThickAsThieves`	same reason as all scammers i assume	[02:45]
ThickAsThieves`	it was the plan, or it became the plan	[02:45]
asciilifeform	man jumps in front of moving bus. considers legal action against bus.	[02:46]
Kleeck_	The cost of being legit is far less appealing than the old "cut and run" I'd assume.	[02:46]
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mircea_popescu	asciilifeform originally this started as a hobbyst project.	[02:48]
mircea_popescu	people don't have 10k laying around the house.	[02:49]
mircea_popescu	consequently, the first fpga's were pretty much a potluck affair	[02:49]
mircea_popescu	that system worked	[02:49]
mircea_popescu	(everyone delivered, even bfl)	[02:49]
mircea_popescu	it was stretched past its usability into insanity by a desperate desire and need for stability. bitcoin doesn't offer much of that,	[02:49]
mircea_popescu	so people naturally tried to stick to what works	[02:49]
mircea_popescu	that's pretty much the story of how we ended up with the insanity.	[02:50]
mircea_popescu	Kleeck_ people fail to correctly value reputations.	[02:51]
Kleeck_	There is some truth to that, mircea_popescu.	[02:51]
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mircea_popescu	there's a lot of truth to it. let's lay it out : bozo comes in when bitcoin is 1 year old, can start a reputation within a week and be doing business within am onth.	[02:52]
mircea_popescu	he imagines the value of this is 1 month.	[02:52]
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mircea_popescu	two years later, he needs to be 1 year+ old to be even considered, because now bitcoin is 4 years old.	[02:52]
BingoBoingo	Seems for Litecoin devotees this insanity is going to be magnified as CoinDesk has just reprinted so many people's "press releases" about impending litecoin ASICs and if a single manufacterer delivers it will have meant Litecoin skipped that awkward FPGA adolescence while still staying a fraction of a fraction of bitcoin	[02:52]
mircea_popescu	he goes on forum as a week old and is shocked at how mean people are, telling him to do 6 motynhs + of reading before he opens his mouth again	[02:53]
mircea_popescu	somewhere in there he failed to account for the fact that having kept his reputation intact for those two years is just about as valuable as having kept his bitcoins for two years.	[02:53]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 830 @ 0.00289 = 2.3987 BTC [+]	[02:54]
mircea_popescu	in fact, everyone evaluates their bitcoin exposure in terms of what their bitcoin holdings are. this is about half the story.	[02:54]
mircea_popescu	the other half is your wot account.	[02:54]
Kleeck_	I agree.	[02:54]
mircea_popescu	BingoBoingo i dunno that anyone will ever deliver ltc asics. putting all that memory on a chip is not trivial.	[02:55]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 568 @ 0.00289784 = 1.646 BTC [+] {3}	[02:56]
mircea_popescu	ironically because of scrypt, fpgas are actually a much better choice for ltc than asics	[02:56]
mircea_popescu	unless, of course, you're sony or something.	[02:56]
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BingoBoingo	mircea_popescu: Well I figure for some unknow n^th announcement one person or group will inevitably be crazy enough to produce the asics	[02:56]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 294 @ 0.0029 = 0.8526 BTC [+]	[02:57]
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mircea_popescu	if such things were a function of people's crazyness...	[02:57]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 78 @ 0.0029 = 0.2262 BTC [+]	[02:58]
mircea_popescu	things like "some chick is crazy enough to produce a pic of a large wooden object stuck in her snatch" is one thing	[02:58]
mircea_popescu	"some guy makes an airplane" is altogether different	[02:58]
BingoBoingo	For all we know the person bankrolling LTC ASICs could be Curt Schilling and the Engineer could be some kid he picked on in highschool who merely has to fulfill the objective of making any LTC capable scrypt ASIC at all. Not necessarily anything close to a profitable scrypt asic.	[02:59]
mircea_popescu	for all we know i'm satoshi, and you're snackman	[02:59]
BingoBoingo	Of course. Maybe I'm Usagi?	[02:59]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 392 @ 0.0029 = 1.1368 BTC [+]	[03:00]
mircea_popescu	you got too big tits and too much beard to be usagi.	[03:00]
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cazalla	thought Curt Schilling was bankrupt after his no show mmorpg	[03:01]
BingoBoingo	I may have plenty of beard, but I'll be damned if my tits are bigger than a grown man named Oliver's.	[03:01]
mircea_popescu	cazalla me too actually.	[03:01]
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BingoBoingo	cazalla: Bankruptcy is just a fresh start	[03:01]
mircea_popescu	BingoBoingo well one's enough.	[03:01]
snackman	mircea_popescu: i'm snackman	[03:01]
benkay	no i'm snackman	[03:01]
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cazalla	i don't know if any of you played EQ but Curt Schilling was a regular on fohguild forums	[03:02]
ManSnack	cazalla: That dork probably plays WoW too.	[03:02]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 47 @ 0.0029 = 0.1363 BTC [+]	[03:03]
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snackman	mike_c: you scammed me out of 1000 uBTC	[03:06]
snackman	what is this shit	[03:06]
mike_c	naw, hang on	[03:06]
snackman	i'm getting scammed left and right	[03:06]
mike_c	1 minute	[03:06]
snackman	mkay	[03:06]
ThickAsThieves`	is this ltc asic news why it's rallying?	[03:07]
ThickAsThieves`	or a diff change?	[03:07]
ThickAsThieves`	or just cuz litecoin	[03:07]
Vexual	coz cant launder 10000 btc on one chain	[03:08]
snackman	mike_c: hilarious, it worked! thanks!	[03:08]
mike_c	double the promised sum because i loved your answer	[03:08]
snackman	mike_c: which one?	[03:08]
*	ManSnack is now known as BingoBoingo	[03:08]
mike_c	the "yes, i placed more bets on bitbet"	[03:08]
snackman	mike_c: :D	[03:08]
snackman	mike_c: but i did!	[03:08]
mike_c	i believe you	[03:09]
BingoBoingo	.d	[03:09]
ozbot	707408283.05150 \| Next Diff in 1231 blocks \| Estimated Change: 24.8029% in 6d 10h 9m 7s	[03:09]
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snackman	the first time i actually got some money out of bitbet	[03:12]
snackman	hilarious	[03:12]
snackman	thanks mike_c	[03:12]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 103 @ 0.0029 = 0.2987 BTC [+]	[03:12]
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assbot	[HAVELOCK] [VTX] 10 @ 0.1558366 = 1.5584 BTC [-] {4}	[03:12]
mike_c	i'm not bitbet, but you're welcome.	[03:13]
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assbot	[HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 8176 @ 0.00012548 = 1.0259 BTC [+] {5}	[03:14]
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mircea_popescu	twist : snackman scammed mike_c by falsely claiming to have placed more bitbets	[03:21]
BingoBoingo	Also scammed mike_c's betting counterparty	[03:22]
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Vexual	legals will be disproportinally large on 0.001	[03:25]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [AM1] 3 @ 0.34796684 = 1.0439 BTC [+] {3}	[03:25]
mike_c	i sent him 0.002, so it will be worth litigating in a year.	[03:25]
Vexual	just have your lawyer do the photocopying at your office	[03:26]
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*	Now talking on #bitcoin-assets	[13:28]
*	Topic for #bitcoin-assets is: http://bitcoin-assets.com \|\| http://log.bitcoin-assets.com - most days worth reading \|\| http://bash.bitcoin-assets.com - all days worth reading	[13:28]
*	Topic for #bitcoin-assets set by kakobrekla!~kako@unaffiliated/kakobrekla at Wed Nov 27 22:34:53 2013	[13:28]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 1597 @ 0.00010121 = 0.1616 BTC [-] {2}	[13:29]
mircea_popescu	sooo... some sr contender nobody heard of had ~100k btc in its wallets ?	[13:29]
KRS\|gotyawallet	wallet? where?	[13:31]
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mircea_popescu	;;google bitcoin sheep markety	[13:32]
gribble	Online black market members hunt down $100 million in bitcoins ...: ; Huge bitcoin heist: Black market drug shop Sheep Marketplace ...:	[13:32]
mircea_popescu	bbc has it at 5mn (ie, 5k btc, which seems reasonable)	[13:33]
mircea_popescu	verge, computerworld and the rest of the trade rags quite 100mn	[13:33]
dub	http://samy.pl/skyjack/	[13:34]
ozbot	SkyJack - autonomous drone hacking	[13:34]
mircea_popescu	ha	[13:35]
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mircea_popescu	dub:	[13:42]
mircea_popescu	true to form the usual tard brigade took the bait, gmax and phantomcircuit << lawl.	[13:42]
mircea_popescu	dub i suppose someone should tell them my henchman snackman was jus' trolling them	[13:42]
mircea_popescu	kakobrekla : http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=04-12-2013 check it out, all lines by KRS\|gotyawallet are blank.	[13:43]
mircea_popescu	BingoBoingo lol that got her well fuming. apparently it's some scammy thing that is trying to pretend like they're less scammy because they're associated with credible people, by the procedure of giving those people free shares they never asked for.	[13:44]
kakobrekla	blank?	[13:44]
kakobrekla	can you link to a particular blank line	[13:45]
mircea_popescu	ytes, and his name is misquoted	[13:45]
KRS\|gotyawallet	can you describe the blank line, sir.	[13:45]
mircea_popescu	shit	[13:45]
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kakobrekla	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=04-12-2013#405107	[13:45]
mircea_popescu	i misread a blank line because your name is so long it bumps the table	[13:45]
ozbot	#bitcoin-assets log	[13:45]
kakobrekla	works?	[13:45]
dub	did they get piped to yr wallet	[13:45]
kakobrekla	a	[13:45]
mircea_popescu	my bad.	[13:46]
KRS\|gotyawallet	see	[13:46]
mircea_popescu	dub who ?	[13:46]
KRS\|gotyawallet	the magic behind my method is teh pipe	[13:46]
mircea_popescu	lol. i kept reading KRS : blabla, gotyawallet: blank line	[13:46]
KRS\|gotyawallet	and I have a big pipe.	[13:46]
kakobrekla	hm it breaks at \| eh	[13:46]
kakobrekla	stupid \|.	[13:47]
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pankkake	there are some css options for tables to avoid it IIRC	[13:47]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform actually, the application where you generate all bitcoin addresses whose private key is an ascii string	[13:47]
mircea_popescu	is probably going to make someone a few bitcoin down the road.	[13:48]
mircea_popescu	dub:	[13:49]
mircea_popescu	bonus points for firing acetone charged magnets at the sun to generate extra gamma particles <<< bwhaahahajh omfg	[13:49]
mircea_popescu	;;rated dub	[13:49]
gribble	You rated user dub on Wed Dec 19 17:11:23 2012, with a rating of 1, and supplied these additional notes: he's been around a while..	[13:49]
mircea_popescu	well i ain't changing that, but you should start your own troll school./	[13:49]
KRS\|gotyawallet	i lost my gpg key..should have known better than to create it on a company computer =/	[13:50]
mircea_popescu	never create on company computers	[13:50]
mircea_popescu	they're paying you not to.	[13:50]
KRS\|gotyawallet	you'd think i'd know better being in IT 14+ years..did it on my laptop..just too lazy.	[13:51]
pankkake	can you change your OTC GPG key?	[13:51]
mircea_popescu	not really.	[13:51]
KRS\|gotyawallet	i dont work any more..i just do this stuff now..ty btc	[13:51]
pankkake	that sucks	[13:51]
mircea_popescu	no it doesn't.	[13:51]
mircea_popescu	suppose i show up one day to find my gpg key was helpfully changed.	[13:52]
pankkake	actually, you can. changekey command	[13:52]
KRS\|gotyawallet	i've got 20 btc on a hard drive around here somewhere but i'm just too lazy to find it.. meh	[13:52]
mircea_popescu	um	[13:52]
pankkake	I'm thinking of changing mine to a stronger one	[13:52]
mircea_popescu	;;changekey	[13:52]
gribble	(changekey ) -- Changes your GPG registered key to . is a 16 digit key id, with or without the '0x' prefix. We look on servers listed in 'plugins.GPG.keyservers' config. You will be given a random passphrase to clearsign with your key, and submit to the bot with the 'verify' command. You must be authenticated in order to use this command.	[13:52]
mircea_popescu	well ya but this presumes you have the old one.	[13:52]
KRS\|gotyawallet	oh kickass	[13:52]
KRS\|gotyawallet	=/	[13:53]
pankkake	of course	[13:53]
mircea_popescu	a nm then	[13:53]
mircea_popescu	i was thinking fo the other case.	[13:53]
mircea_popescu	as he had said he lost his.	[13:53]
pankkake	yeah…	[13:53]
pankkake	didn't save a revocation stuff either?	[13:53]
KRS\|gotyawallet	i quit and told them they could keep their fucking laptop..think they'll let me get my shit off it?	[13:54]
mircea_popescu	ask nicely the chick in hr with the big boobs	[13:54]
KRS\|gotyawallet	she's more petite and has braces..Mmmm..	[13:54]
San1ty	saulimus Scrat sgnb` skinnkavaj smickles smidge stephengandel	[13:55]
mircea_popescu	;;later tell benkay http://trilema.com/2013/the-art-of-making-friends-and-influencing-people-versus-stockholm-syndrome/#comment-96511	[13:56]
gribble	The operation succeeded.	[13:56]
jamespeerless	micea_popescu: continuing discussion from yesterday.. since you have a new address per user per bet, don't you end up with a ton of addresses with a tiny amount of coin in them? what do you do with them once the bet is over?	[13:57]
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mircea_popescu	jamespeerless not moreso than the average site taking bitcoin	[13:58]
mircea_popescu	if you look at the stats, Confirmed bets: 7123 Confirmed total: 9,728 BTC	[13:58]
mircea_popescu	that means the avg bet is > 1btc	[13:58]
jamespeerless	good point	[13:58]
mircea_popescu	bitpay wishes it could say the same thing	[13:58]
jamespeerless	:P	[13:59]
mircea_popescu	what are you gonna do, you know ? consolidate them.	[13:59]
mircea_popescu	there is some discussion on this topic over at	[14:00]
mircea_popescu	;;google bitcoind not ready for prime time	[14:00]
mircea_popescu	meh no gribs ?	[14:00]
gribble	Western Union Says Bitcoin Not Ready For Primetime – Bitcoin ...: ; Bitcoin's New All-time High: Exploring the Latest Bubble – Bitcoin ...: ; Western Union Says Bitcoin Not Ready For Primetime - Kitco (1 more message)	[14:00]
mircea_popescu	http://trilema.com/2013/bitcoind-not-quite-ready-for-prime-time/	[14:00]
Duffer1	has bitcoin already surpassed western union in terms of value transmitted?	[14:01]
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ozbot	Bitcoind : not quite ready for prime time pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.	[14:01]
mircea_popescu	Duffer1 it's impossible to accurately calculate the value bitcoin transmits	[14:01]
jamespeerless	wow just sad that	[14:04]
jamespeerless	sounds pretty crappy	[14:04]
jamespeerless	read*	[14:04]
mircea_popescu	well... it's a prototype.	[14:04]
mircea_popescu	not intended to be put into production.	[14:04]
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jamespeerless	so because of these limitations sounds like you need to do some manual work to resolve payouts	[14:06]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 344 @ 0.0029 = 0.9976 BTC [+]	[14:06]
mircea_popescu	well 1. payouts are done with a lot of human supervision anyway ;	[14:09]
mircea_popescu	2. i doubt anyone uses unpatched bitcoin code anymore.	[14:09]
mircea_popescu	as best as i can determine everyone is on some trunk from .4 to .6 with a bunch of in house patches	[14:10]
mircea_popescu	it's possible that a significant chunk of users (by headcount) are on .7/.8 or w/e	[14:10]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 500 @ 0.0029 = 1.45 BTC [+] {2}	[14:11]
mircea_popescu	however, wallets made by those versions won't see a significant chunk of actual bitcoins... likely ever.	[14:11]
jamespeerless	by the newer versions? why not?	[14:11]
mircea_popescu	cause the credibility of the dev team is somewhere between nil and epsilon	[14:11]
jamespeerless	heh	[14:11]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 300 @ 0.0029 = 0.87 BTC [+] {2}	[14:12]
jamespeerless	so your outlook on the future of bit coin protocol is bleak?	[14:12]
mircea_popescu	im not sure what you're asking.	[14:12]
mircea_popescu	but anyway, rather than have you shoot in the dark, here's the story :	[14:12]
jamespeerless	if you're saying the current dev's contributing to bit coin are no good and its clear bit coin will require more work to be 'production ready' then without some change the future is bleak	[14:13]
jamespeerless	is what i meant	[14:13]
mircea_popescu	1. bitcoin was released as a prototype. that means something specific, and what it means doesn't include "to be used for any actual purpose". prototypes are there to test.	[14:13]
mircea_popescu	2. people started using it anyway, because it was there. this is how things usually work.	[14:13]
mircea_popescu	3. once satoshi left the dev team never recovered. it's roughly what the linux dev team would be if linus left.	[14:13]
mircea_popescu	basically a collection of people with poor iq and worse skills, hanging on because they perceive this as sexy, and imagine hanging on makes them somehow important.	[14:14]
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mircea_popescu	4. at the right time (ie 2012) i pointed out to them that their only chance to maintain any semblance of relevance is to fully specify the code.	[14:15]
mircea_popescu	this, obviously, is a very hard task. they, aware of their intellectual limitations, eschewed this task.	[14:15]
mircea_popescu	5. the situation has evolved in the exact direction i was expecting : absent a specification everyone is using their own in house concoctions.	[14:15]
ThickAsThieves	i smell a blog post coming on	[14:16]
mircea_popescu	this will aggravate over time, with miners and large merchants all pushing on the code,	[14:16]
jamespeerless	how can it work if everyone is using their own in-house modified version yet they all need to communicate together	[14:16]
mircea_popescu	and with "the network accepts it" as pretty much the only measure of good or evil.	[14:16]
mircea_popescu	well that's just it, the network blindly decides.	[14:16]
mircea_popescu	this will be a major resource black hole in the coming years, but it does not threaten the system itself.	[14:17]
mircea_popescu	if anything, it makes the system stronger.	[14:17]
KRS\|gotyawallet	the anatomy of a blog post	[14:17]
mircea_popescu	it DOES however threaten any one actor, and ESPECIALLY actors acting on deluded presumptions,	[14:17]
mircea_popescu	such as the snackman kid.	[14:17]
jamespeerless	doesn't this lend itself to a couple big corps from releasing their own widely adopted forks.. similar to os x and the 5000 flavors of linux?	[14:18]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13545 @ 0.00081026 = 10.975 BTC [-]	[14:18]
mircea_popescu	no.	[14:18]
mircea_popescu	because, again, bitcoin is about money.	[14:18]
mircea_popescu	as long as those big corps don't actually have big btc, they aren't big corps	[14:18]
mircea_popescu	they just thing themselves big.	[14:18]
ThickAsThieves	how does one "release" a "widely adopted" fork?	[14:18]
mircea_popescu	exactly.	[14:18]
mircea_popescu	0.8 is a widely adopted fork.	[14:18]
mircea_popescu	so ?	[14:18]
pankkake	see web browsers and web servers	[14:19]
mircea_popescu	i've had people spend 1000s of hours modelling this point, as it's the one most important point in all bitcoin	[14:19]
jamespeerless	yeah guess as long as they don't have any way to make money off of it, it won't happen	[14:19]
mircea_popescu	i'm not seeing anything particularly worrisome	[14:19]
pankkake	or, in p2p, the most popular networks: ed2k and bittorrent	[14:19]
pankkake	so many implementations talking to each other	[14:19]
mircea_popescu	ThickAsThieves i suppose i should put this up ion trilema too, even out the chances of teh populous a little.	[14:20]
ThickAsThieves	plus you need to have any new predictions in published record :)	[14:20]
ThickAsThieves	so i can scowl with happiness at you in the future	[14:20]
mircea_popescu	lol this is more like predictions of the past	[14:20]
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ThickAsThieves	yes, but you can apply your thought to the current state of things, allowing for new more appropriate predictions	[14:21]
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ThickAsThieves	like the disbandment of the dev team maybe?	[14:22]
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ThickAsThieves	i suppose theyll claim the title long afte rthey cease work	[14:22]
mircea_popescu	why should they be disbanded ? let the kids have fun.	[14:23]
mircea_popescu	foundations, conferences, is how discoveries are made in sciences too neh ?	[14:23]
ThickAsThieves	well if you count "outreach" maybe	[14:24]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 150 @ 0.0029 = 0.435 BTC [+]	[14:24]
ThickAsThieves	;;ticker	[14:28]
gribble	MtGox BTCUSD ticker \| Best bid: 1191.00001, Best ask: 1198.0, Bid-ask spread: 6.99999, Last trade: 1191.0, 24 hour volume: 17070.52954069, 24 hour low: 1105.0, 24 hour high: 1209.989, 24 hour vwap: 1157.24439	[14:28]
ThickAsThieves	;;nethash	[14:28]
gribble	6400549.04237	[14:28]
ThickAsThieves	that hasnt moved in like a day or two	[14:28]
ThickAsThieves	like, exactly the same number	[14:28]
ThickAsThieves	seems broken	[14:29]
mircea_popescu	;;ticker --bitstamp	[14:29]
gribble	(ticker [--bid\|--ask\|--last\|--high\|--low\|--avg\|--vol] [--currency XXX] [--market \|all]) -- Return pretty-printed ticker. Default market is Mtgox. If one of the result options is given, returns only that numeric result (useful for nesting in calculations). If '--currency XXX' option is given, returns ticker for that three-letter currency code. It is up to you to make sure (1 more message)	[14:29]
mircea_popescu	meh	[14:29]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [AM1] 2 @ 0.33318358 = 0.6664 BTC [-]	[14:29]
mircea_popescu	;;ticker --market bitstamp	[14:29]
gribble	Bitstamp BTCUSD ticker \| Best bid: 1095.66, Best ask: 1097.0, Bid-ask spread: 1.34000, Last trade: 1097.0, 24 hour volume: 10080.51725385, 24 hour low: 1037.5, 24 hour high: 1100.0, 24 hour vwap: 1065.90371392	[14:29]
ThickAsThieves	.d	[14:29]
ozbot	707408283.05150 \| Next Diff in 1153 blocks \| Estimated Change: 23.7524% in 6d 2h 27m 16s	[14:29]
ThickAsThieves	.b	[14:29]
ThickAsThieves	.q	[14:29]
ThickAsThieves	;;estimate	[14:30]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 200 @ 0.0029 = 0.58 BTC [+]	[14:30]
gribble	Next difficulty estimate \| None based on data since last change \| 894132728.373 based on data for last three days	[14:30]
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KRS\|gotyawallet	anyone know if these guys are legit? https://asic-market.com/product/blue-fury-usb-miners/	[14:32]
ThickAsThieves	if you have to ask	[14:35]
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KRS\|gotyawallet	=/	[14:35]
ThickAsThieves	then you know the answer	[14:35]
ThickAsThieves	;)	[14:35]
KRS\|gotyawallet	haha come on one must question almost everything in bitcoin	[14:35]
KRS\|gotyawallet	f'n sharks out there	[14:35]
KRS\|gotyawallet	in here..everywhere.	[14:36]
ThickAsThieves	you missed my point	[14:36]
ThickAsThieves	i'll rephrase	[14:36]
KRS\|gotyawallet	oh because there isnt enough to find out out which is making me ask	[14:36]
ThickAsThieves	if they have no rep, how could you trust them	[14:36]
KRS\|gotyawallet	right..gotcha.	[14:36]
KRS\|gotyawallet	thanks dude	[14:36]
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mircea_popescu	http://trilema.com/2013/the-future-in-the-past/	[14:45]
ozbot	The future in the past pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.	[14:46]
pankkake	that's a lazy one… and you made me pay a few satoshi for it!	[14:47]
mircea_popescu	totally.	[14:47]
mircea_popescu	if you ain't cheatin' you ain't tryin'.	[14:47]
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ThickAsThieves	http://finance.yahoo.com/news/bitcoin-alternative-quark-qrk-increases-072503725.html	[14:52]
ozbot	Bitcoin Alternative Quark (QRK) Increases In Value 500% In The Last Week - Yahoo Finance	[14:52]
ThickAsThieves	so basically altcoins make ponzis legal'	[14:52]
ThickAsThieves	we'll have altcoins sponsoring football teams n shit	[14:53]
ThickAsThieves	celebrity "endorsements" etc	[14:53]
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KRS\|gotyawallet	HAH	[14:55]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [HIF] 500 @ 0.00048971 = 0.2449 BTC [+]	[14:55]
pankkake	most of that "increase" is already gone	[14:56]
pankkake	welcome to the endless pump and dump	[14:56]
pankkake	by the way it was on the list: http://www.theguardian.com/technology/2013/nov/28/bitcoin-alternatives-future-currency-investments	[14:57]
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pankkake	same for this infinitecoin actually	[14:58]
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assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 177 @ 0.0029 = 0.5133 BTC [+]	[15:01]
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mircea_popescu	lol yahoo nao pumping altchains ?	[15:21]
ThickAsThieves	http://www.newyorker.com/online/blogs/currency/2013/11/why-regulate-bitcoin.html	[15:21]
ozbot	Why Regulate Bitcoin? : The New Yorker	[15:21]
ThickAsThieves	"There may, however, be good cause for regulation. There have been several high-profile thefts of bitcoins recently, including a hacker attack last week on a Czech exchange called Bitcash.cz that emptied four thousand digital wallets belonging to customers. Also this month, an eighteen-year-old man in Australia who was running a Bitcoin “bank” announced that more than four thousand	[15:22]
ThickAsThieves	bitcoins had been stolen from his Web site, most of them belonging to users. In any industry, one of the strongest arguments in favor of regulation is the need for consumer protection—something bitcoin currently lacks."	[15:22]
ThickAsThieves	lol so US regulation will also help the Czech and Aus?	[15:22]
mircea_popescu	if one of the strongest arguments in favour of regulation really is the perceived need for consumer protection,	[15:22]
pankkake	I wasn't aware regulation prevented stealing	[15:22]
mircea_popescu	regulation has very poor chances.	[15:23]
ThickAsThieves	regulation can protect the whole internet guys	[15:23]
ThickAsThieves	cmon	[15:23]
mircea_popescu	adding to the amusement in romanian that verb basically means "to fuck"	[15:23]
mircea_popescu	a polite way of saying it, as "he set her straight, sexually speaking" would be in english	[15:24]
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pankkake	un bon coup de bite	[15:24]
ThickAsThieves	i still worry that eventually the only answer will be scary loss of net neutrality	[15:25]
ThickAsThieves	but maybe that will spur better internets	[15:25]
pankkake	many new censorship laws lately :/	[15:25]
pankkake	and without much protest either	[15:25]
pankkake	france wants to censor "tax evasion" next	[15:26]
pankkake	before that it was unregistered gambling	[15:26]
pankkake	http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2013/nov/27/ministers-order-isps-block-terrorist-websites	[15:27]
ozbot	Ministers will order ISPs to block terrorist and extremist websites \| UK news \| The Guardian	[15:27]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 125 @ 0.00288 = 0.36 BTC [-]	[15:29]
Duffer1	not getting robbed would be nice, but i fail to see how regulation would prevent that in any way	[15:29]
Duffer1	first exchange to offer insurance wins	[15:30]
pankkake	I believe services could escrow a part of their funds	[15:31]
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pankkake	(i.e. like delivery bets but more generic)	[15:31]
mircea_popescu	ThickAsThieves amusingly, bitcoin resolves definitively the issue of net neutrality.	[15:31]
pankkake	and namecoin!	[15:32]
mircea_popescu	whatever anyone could possibly throw at hte problem, bitcoin has billions soon to be trillions of vested interest.	[15:32]
mircea_popescu	nobody can fight that and win.	[15:32]
Duffer1	not necessarily mp	[15:32]
mircea_popescu	i guess we shall see.	[15:32]
Duffer1	at least in america the net neutrality issue also involves isp bandwidth limiting and paywalling	[15:32]
Duffer1	pay x more to access premium sites like x,y,z	[15:33]
mircea_popescu	any isp is free to issue you whatever contract they want, and you don't have to take it.	[15:33]
mircea_popescu	as long as there's ppl holding bitcoins, there will be a market to provide them with internet.	[15:34]
Duffer1	i don't see that happening in america, major monopolies are protected state to state	[15:34]
Duffer1	startups are sued into the ground or bought outright	[15:34]
Duffer1	exclusivity contracts are the norm	[15:35]
mircea_popescu	well conversely, i don't see the us as much of a point of interest anyway, it's on its last legs as is.	[15:35]
Duffer1	i agree, i just hate to see it happening	[15:35]
mircea_popescu	i mean a similar argument could be brought that in somalia internet access is difficult, what with all the armed bandits	[15:35]
mircea_popescu	nevertheless...	[15:35]
*	KableKiB_ (~KableKiB@24.114.85.150) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[15:35]
mircea_popescu	on the brighter side, from what i hear in the larger cities you can already get point to point internet	[15:36]
mircea_popescu	what with all the wireless everywhere	[15:36]
pankkake	http://online.wsj.com/news/articles/SB10001424052748704608104575220570113266984	[15:36]
ozbot	Telecom Firms Thrive in Somalia - WSJ.com	[15:36]
Duffer1	all provided by at&t, comcast, or time warner	[15:37]
KRS\|gotyawallet	Whats that got to do with Serbia	[15:37]
mircea_popescu	the other somalia	[15:37]
KRS\|gotyawallet	oh right	[15:37]
pankkake	amateur (in the good sense) wireless networking is easy in a city. but how do you go further?	[15:38]
mircea_popescu	you can get satellite links anywhere.	[15:38]
pankkake	so we just need spacex to accept bitcoins!	[15:38]
mircea_popescu	the virgin thing already does	[15:39]
truffles	why is it america has such good internet connections	[15:39]
truffles	europe sucks with this!I!	[15:39]
mircea_popescu	for that matter, we'll probably be launching our own satellites before there's any serious challenge to net neutrality.	[15:39]
Duffer1	i'll miss my mmos if i'm forced to satellite :( hehe	[15:39]
mircea_popescu	truffles are you kidding ?	[15:39]
pankkake	most of europe is pretty well served	[15:39]
mircea_popescu	actually that's what i'd like to ipo : a telecom satellite launcher corp.	[15:39]
mircea_popescu	it can't be THAT hard.	[15:40]
Apocalyptic	mircea, I thought you had him on ignore	[15:40]
truffles	i feel like its intermittent or something	[15:40]
mircea_popescu	Apocalyptic http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=03-12-2013#402974	[15:40]
truffles	http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2464131/Britain-facing-high-risk-blackouts-5-years.html	[15:43]
ozbot	Britain facing 'high risk of blackouts over next 5 years' \| Mail Online	[15:43]
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ThickAsThieves	actually that's what i'd like to ipo : a telecom satellite launcher corp. <<< I'm so in	[15:45]
Duffer1	no doubt	[15:46]
*	AndrewJackson (~AndrewJac@117.10.233.220.static.exetel.com.au) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[15:46]
Duffer1	need cable grade ping time or better though	[15:47]
ThickAsThieves	just put the internet in the blockchain	[15:47]
ThickAsThieves	bitcoin solves everything!	[15:48]
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assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 414 @ 0.0029 = 1.2006 BTC [+] {2}	[15:48]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 597 @ 0.00288 = 1.7194 BTC [-]	[15:50]
Apocalyptic	lul	[15:51]
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ThickAsThieves	If anyone is interest Danny Brewster, Neo, is tweeting from the Cyprus Investor Show, lotsa pics, including the POS unit https://twitter.com/BtcDanny	[15:52]
ThickAsThieves	interested*	[15:53]
kakobrekla	shiny black fetish bags	[15:53]
kakobrekla	GIMMESUM!	[15:53]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.34865856 BTC [+]	[15:53]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [VTX] 1 @ 0.153 BTC [+]	[15:53]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.34867853 BTC [+]	[15:57]
ThickAsThieves	An estimated 70 percent of the nearly 11,000 silent films produced in the US have been lost, according to a landmark study from the Library of Congress.	[15:58]
ThickAsThieves	https://twitter.com/BtcDanny/status/407128229208940544/photo/1/large	[15:59]
ozbot	Twitter / BtcDanny: I'm famous now http://t.co/8jkmO48yn4	[15:59]
ThickAsThieves	hehe	[15:59]
truffles	just read that one	[15:59]
truffles	he's a brit?	[15:59]
ThickAsThieves	originally, yes	[16:00]
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truffles	hairstyle/face combo is typical	[16:00]
truffles	colors and bags look nice	[16:02]
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ThickAsThieves	it's an interesting choice of brand colors	[16:02]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [HMF] 12 @ 0.02591675 = 0.311 BTC [-] {2}	[16:02]
ThickAsThieves	black and yellow	[16:02]
*	davout_ is now known as davout	[16:02]
ThickAsThieves	not very common	[16:03]
truffles	http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UePtoxDhJSw	[16:03]
ozbot	Wiz Khalifa - Black And Yellow [Official Music Video] - YouTube	[16:03]
ThickAsThieves	i hat ethat song so much	[16:03]
truffles	hahaha	[16:03]
truffles	never watched vid before	[16:04]
ThickAsThieves	i do like a few Wiz songs tho	[16:05]
ThickAsThieves	that chorus though	[16:05]
ThickAsThieves	so bad	[16:05]
truffles	song feels like its 20mins long..	[16:06]
ThickAsThieves	Jay Z & Beyonce have gone vegan	[16:06]
truffles	for 22 days	[16:06]
truffles	*	[16:06]
ThickAsThieves	thats all it takes	[16:06]
jcpham	http://i.imgur.com/rnQZJcz.jpg	[16:06]
jcpham	faulty pens	[16:06]
truffles	lmao	[16:07]
truffles	massive cocks	[16:07]
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ThickAsThieves	the comments on that youtube page kinda show that google's switch to using google+ to clean comments didnt work	[16:08]
jcpham	my pens never do that	[16:08]
ThickAsThieves	"i don't know wtf this black cunt is singing"	[16:09]
truffles	google just keeps making utube worse..	[16:09]
ThickAsThieves	"Alex Robinson you are a nigga lover. and you trying to make me just like you. shame that."	[16:09]
truffles	oh i didnt even look at comments this time	[16:09]
truffles	i often do, i blame google	[16:10]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.3486 BTC [-]	[16:11]
truffles	saw at least 3 women in that phot, 1 guy looks arab, 1 black guy hmm	[16:11]
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truffles	http://t.co/0WzwpkMD5O	[16:12]
ozbot	Twitter / BtcDanny: Good turnout http://t.co/0WzwpkMD5O	[16:12]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 81 @ 0.0029 = 0.2349 BTC [+]	[16:13]
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truffles	it wasnt a black guy nm	[16:17]
thestringpuller	truffles has to be french	[16:19]
thestringpuller	that's the only place they grow	[16:19]
truffles	i just ate the last one	[16:19]
thestringpuller	ThickAsThieves hate's Wiz Khalifa too.	[16:19]
thestringpuller	ThickAsThieves have you heard the Kanye-Sway interview?!?!?	[16:19]
thestringpuller	YOU AIN'T GOT THE ANSWERS ThickAsThieves YOU AIN'T GOT THE ANSWERS!!!!	[16:20]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.34 BTC [-]	[16:21]
thestringpuller	https://soundcloud.com/halonyc/you-aint-got-the-answers - YES	[16:21]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [AM100] 46 @ 0.00330215 = 0.1519 BTC [+] {4}	[16:22]
pankkake	"Despite many assuming the song is a reference to the colors of Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania's NFL team, the Pittsburgh Steelers, the song is actually about Khalifa's black-and-yellow striped car"	[16:22]
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pankkake	and here I thought that would be an interracial love song	[16:22]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [AM100] 55 @ 0.00337039 = 0.1854 BTC [+]	[16:23]
thestringpuller	i don't think Wiz has the capacity to write a love song, or music at all...	[16:23]
thestringpuller	He plagarized Chrono Trigger!	[16:24]
pankkake	so skinny	[16:24]
thestringpuller	https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=phWoiyfA8ls#t=23 - it's like "really?"	[16:25]
truffles	i was going to say he wasnt wearing enough yellow in song	[16:25]
ThickAsThieves	lol at that soundcloud song	[16:26]
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truffles	omg never been part 2?	[16:27]
truffles	there was a part 1	[16:27]
truffles	..	[16:28]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 1002 @ 0.00294304 = 2.9489 BTC [+] {5}	[16:31]
thestringpuller	;;bc,24hprc	[16:34]
gribble	Error: Failed to retrieve data. Try again later.	[16:34]
thestringpuller	;;calc (108 - 50) / 108	[16:37]
gribble	0.537037037037	[16:37]
thestringpuller	oh man whoever wrote those options is over exposed	[16:37]
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assbot	[HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.343 BTC [+]	[16:49]
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assbot	[HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.3439 BTC [+]	[16:56]
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nubbins`	morning	[17:03]
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truffles	good evening	[17:04]
davout	afternoon	[17:04]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6500 @ 0.00081266 = 5.2823 BTC [+]	[17:08]
jcpham	http://i.imgur.com/NVaWlme.jpg	[17:09]
jcpham	http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/1s2qym/bitcoin_santa_on_good_morning_america/	[17:09]
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jborkl	https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=350732.msg3775469#msg3775469	[17:22]
ozbot	COINTERRA IS REAL -> NO SCAM!!	[17:22]
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pankkake	being "real" is having an address and people behind it?	[17:23]
pankkake	how about delivering	[17:23]
pankkake	who cares if they are aliens from the moon	[17:24]
jborkl	well, I was reading how the Ravi is/might be a escort	[17:24]
pankkake	:D	[17:24]
jborkl	very interesting - I will be back in 20 minutes to tell you if they are at work in suite 303	[17:25]
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assbot	[HAVELOCK] [AM1] 3 @ 0.34384666 = 1.0315 BTC [-] {3}	[17:30]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 100 @ 0.00294943 = 0.2949 BTC [+] {2}	[17:32]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 50 @ 0.00294988 = 0.1475 BTC [+]	[17:33]
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mod6	screen in a screen, ho ho!	[17:41]
*	Evolyn_ (~Evolyn@p4FDCEF42.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[17:41]
mod6	now maybe i can lurk on the dl. hehe.	[17:42]
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pankkake	screen in a screen is the norm for me	[17:46]
nubbins`	do any of you guys bake bread?	[17:46]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 872 @ 0.00294988 = 2.5723 BTC [+]	[17:46]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [HMF] 10 @ 0.02591 = 0.2591 BTC [-]	[17:46]
nubbins`	trying to troubleshoot a loaf	[17:46]
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assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 333 @ 0.00294999 = 0.9823 BTC [+]	[17:52]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.34541456 BTC [+]	[17:53]
jborkl	Well, they are there	[17:54]
jborkl	in suite 303	[17:54]
nubbins`	great	[17:55]
davout	nubbins`: yup	[17:55]
nubbins`	ah, re: bread?	[17:57]
nubbins`	so i'm making sourdough	[17:57]
nubbins`	the dough rises in the bowl and again in the pan, but when i place the loaves in the oven, they don't rise any further	[17:57]
jborkl	ah, I thought you were having trouble taking a dump	[17:58]
nubbins`	HAHA	[17:58]
nubbins`	no trouble there ;(	[17:58]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.34541456 BTC [+]	[17:59]
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assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 115 @ 0.00294998 = 0.3392 BTC [+] {2}	[18:01]
ThickAsThieves	neumann studio monitor system ... heaven	[18:02]
ThickAsThieves	breaking them in with Fuckin' Problems - ASAP/Drake/Kdot :)	[18:03]
ThickAsThieves	thestringpuller might preciate that	[18:03]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 198 @ 0.00290002 = 0.5742 BTC [-] {2}	[18:05]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3184 @ 0.00081379 = 2.5911 BTC [+]	[18:06]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4830 @ 0.00081614 = 3.942 BTC [+]	[18:07]
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davout	nubbins`: i'm not sure they're supposed to rise a lot anyway in the oven	[18:09]
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nubbins`	i mean, i know traditional loaves should	[18:10]
nubbins`	just not sure about sourdough	[18:10]
davout	nubbins`: hm, i'll confess complete ignorance	[18:10]
nubbins`	heh	[18:10]
nubbins`	i also don't add any store-bought yeast	[18:10]
nubbins`	only sourdough starter	[18:11]
davout	nubbins`: you know, we french people, we just bake bread, it's in our blood xD	[18:11]
nubbins`	:D	[18:11]
davout	i do it with store-bought yeast	[18:11]
nubbins`	j'aime le pain!	[18:11]
davout	le pain c'est bien	[18:11]
nubbins`	yeah, i'm stubborn	[18:11]
nubbins`	i birthed this sourdough starter last september	[18:11]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.34541456 BTC [+]	[18:11]
nubbins`	have been baking with it for over a year now	[18:12]
davout	gross mental image	[18:12]
nubbins`	HEH	[18:12]
nubbins`	shouldn't use "birthed" for yeast colonies	[18:12]
nubbins`	i created this sourdough starter last september	[18:12]
nubbins`	anyway, the bread is fucking delicious, which is what matters, i guess	[18:12]
davout	haha, yeah. you designed it man, you engineered it	[18:13]
nubbins`	anyway, gonna go eat a bunch	[18:13]
davout	bon appétit	[18:14]
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assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 200 @ 0.00290002 = 0.58 BTC [-] {2}	[18:19]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4086 @ 0.00081785 = 3.3417 BTC [+]	[18:21]
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assbot	[HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.34878471 BTC [+]	[18:23]
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stephengandel	Hi. I am a reporter trying to understand bitcoin futures. Anyone willing to help?	[18:39]
jurov`	hello stephengandel, you mailed to coinbr support yesterday?	[18:40]
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ThickAsThieves	Ask questions openly, answers will come	[18:41]
Azelphur	stephengandel: best way is to ask in the channel. It's the cultural norm on IRC, and you'll get the best possible answers as others can correct inaccuracies.	[18:42]
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ThickAsThieves	http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/2013/12/swartz-video/?cid=15264324	[18:47]
ozbot	This Is the MIT Surveillance Video That Undid Aaron Swartz \| Threat Level \| Wired.com	[18:47]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [COG] 4 @ 0.05799996 = 0.232 BTC [+]	[18:49]
stephengandel	jurov, yes.	[18:49]
stephengandel	azelphur, what do you mean by ask the channel?	[18:50]
Azelphur	stephengandel: this is the channel, so just ask questions in here	[18:50]
Azelphur	they don't need to be aimed at anyone specific	[18:50]
ThickAsThieves	there are several competent and experienced people here that may be able to answer different questions best	[18:52]
stephengandel	OK. On ICBIT there is a BTC/USC 12.13 contract that has a range of prices all above the current price of a bitcoin to USD. So I am guessing these are the strike prices? I was told that a contract costs $10. But that can't be the same for all the strike prices. I am trying to figure out what it costs to sell futures contract.	[18:54]
ThickAsThieves	ah, one thing I can tell you is you will find more ICBIT users in #bitcoin-analysis	[18:55]
ThickAsThieves	it is not trusted by some in here	[18:55]
stephengandel	OK, Can I find the same info for coinbr?	[18:55]
ThickAsThieves	youre in the right room for coinbr	[18:56]
ThickAsThieves	jurov runs it	[18:56]
jurov`	stephengandel: i'm the owner of coinbr	[18:56]
ThickAsThieves	and mircea_popescu runs MPEx, the exchange it brokers with	[18:56]
jurov`	All options are priced in bitcoins, and the prices are publisjed on http://mpex.co	[18:57]
stephengandel	OK. On MPEx, what does it mean that the price of o.usd.co50T is 0.785	[18:57]
stephengandel	sorry, 0.0785?	[18:57]
stephengandel	Is that of a bitcoin?	[18:57]
jurov`	it's call to buy 0.1btc for $50	[18:58]
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jurov`	(that means price per 1BTC would be $500)	[18:58]
jurov`	and on exercise, you will get (in bitcoins) the difference between intrinsic value and current 24h weighed price	[18:59]
jurov`	or nothing, if price is <=500	[18:59]
stephengandel	intrinsic value is 500 for this contract.	[18:59]
stephengandel	And that'	[18:59]
stephengandel	that's if I buy.	[19:00]
stephengandel	what if I sell the contract?	[19:00]
ThickAsThieves	you can sell it for any price you like	[19:00]
ThickAsThieves	if you are trying to write and sell options that's a bit different	[19:01]
stephengandel	Yes. Trying to bet on a drop in the price of bitcoins.	[19:01]
ThickAsThieves	you might need to talk to Mircea	[19:02]
Apocalyptic	then you would buy put contracts	[19:02]
Apocalyptic	not calls	[19:02]
ThickAsThieves	not sure if jurov facilitates writing via coinbr	[19:02]
stephengandel	or sell calls?	[19:02]
ThickAsThieves	yes	[19:02]
jurov`	https://www.bitcoinforum.com/coinbr-com/call-option-calculation/msg2445/#msg2445 see this, section "Going short"	[19:02]
ozbot	Call option calculation - Bitcoin Forum - The Unofficial Bitcoin Forum	[19:02]
stephengandel	Is it the same if I go through coinbr as MPEx?	[19:04]
ThickAsThieves	I think you would need an MPEx account, and to negotiate margin with mircea_popescu	[19:04]
ThickAsThieves	he might even have details in the FAQ	[19:04]
jurov`	stephengandel: yes it's the same, unless you get margin form mircea_popescu	[19:05]
ThickAsThieves	an MPEx account is 30btc, or 25btc with referral	[19:05]
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jurov`	but even then, you'll be doing the saem MKOP/SPPLIT requests with loaned funds	[19:05]
ThickAsThieves	if you join you should probly connect with jurov for the referral, since he got you here :)	[19:05]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 100 @ 0.00294 = 0.294 BTC [+]	[19:06]
stephengandel	So to do this on coinbr. I would have to open an account for 30 BTC, $30,000?	[19:07]
jurov`	No	[19:07]
jurov`	30BTC is account directly on MPEx.	[19:07]
stephengandel	I don't understand.	[19:07]
jurov`	CoinBr offers account for free, only with small monthly fees	[19:07]
jurov`	because it's a broker that enables users to use one shared mpex account	[19:07]
ThickAsThieves	wouldnt mircea require a direct account for margin users?	[19:08]
jurov`	Yes, if you insist on margin, it's probably best to talk to mircea_popescu directly.	[19:08]
stephengandel	Can you do this without margin?	[19:09]
jcpham	https://www.bitrated.com/	[19:09]
ozbot	Bitrated	[19:09]
jcpham	arbitration escrow	[19:09]
ThickAsThieves	write options? No	[19:09]
jcpham	m-of-n	[19:09]
ThickAsThieves	buy options? Yes	[19:09]
jurov`	You can write option only when you provide the collateral yourself.	[19:10]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 146 @ 0.00294 = 0.4292 BTC [+] {2}	[19:10]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 1379 @ 0.00294999 = 4.068 BTC [+]	[19:11]
*	robocoin_ is now known as robocoin	[19:13]
ThickAsThieves	stephengandel, when will bitcoin crash, do you think?	[19:14]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 331 @ 0.00294999 = 0.9764 BTC [+]	[19:15]
jurov`	that's okay, it will crash, burn, whatever	[19:15]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [HIF] 390 @ 0.00048971 = 0.191 BTC [+]	[19:16]
jurov`	there's much deeper misunderstanding at work	[19:16]
ThickAsThieves	do i have someone on ignore?	[19:16]
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jurov`	people like him want to speculate on btc without being exposed at all	[19:16]
ThickAsThieves	oh	[19:16]
*	Dimsler_ (~dimsler@dhcp-20-aa-4b-fd-a4-ce.cpe.sourcecable.net) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[19:16]
jurov`	and that's the piece that aint gonna work	[19:16]
*	iamnot_ (~iamnot_@c-98-242-90-82.hsd1.ga.comcast.net) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[19:16]
jurov`	because loaning bitcoins is too risky	[19:16]
ThickAsThieves	indeed	[19:17]
Apocalyptic	jcpham, why are you promotting this ill-conceived service ?	[19:17]
stephengandel	No idea. Just trying to find out if it is possible to bet against it. But really don't know. Doing math now.	[19:17]
ThickAsThieves	I love that MPEx costs $35k now	[19:17]
ThickAsThieves	well if you want to "bet" against it	[19:18]
ThickAsThieves	that's much easier	[19:18]
ThickAsThieves	www.bitbet.us	[19:18]
ThickAsThieves	:)	[19:18]
*	mois (~chatzilla@95-91-246-142-dynip.superkabel.de) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[19:18]
ThickAsThieves	you can join existing bets or make your own	[19:18]
ThickAsThieves	www.bitbet.us?ref=1NfXM69erAWPDdNrZ2k2UkuV7HDPc6Ebwk	[19:19]
ThickAsThieves	better link	[19:19]
ThickAsThieves	:)	[19:19]
jcpham	Apocalyptic i'm not sure copying and pasting a link is promotion	[19:19]
jcpham	it's also run by someone	[19:20]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 187 @ 0.00294999 = 0.5516 BTC [+]	[19:20]
jcpham	rumor is plans to tie into -otc gpg keys	[19:20]
ThickAsThieves	just make sure you read the BitBet FAQ fully	[19:20]
stephengandel	OK. But if I bought a put on the 0.USD.C050T on coinbr, I would have to put up .44 of a BTC as collateral?	[19:22]
ThickAsThieves	no	[19:23]
jurov`	They have recently changed the lot to 0.1BTC, so it should be 0.044	[19:23]
jurov`	$avg	[19:23]
mpexbot	jurov`: An error has occurred and has been logged. Please contact this bot's administrator for more information.	[19:23]
stephengandel	why no?	[19:24]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 102 @ 0.00294999 = 0.3009 BTC [+]	[19:24]
jurov`	;;calc 50/1097.74	[19:24]
gribble	0.0455481261501	[19:24]
stephengandel	why 50, and not 500?	[19:25]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 125 @ 0.00295 = 0.3688 BTC [+]	[19:25]
jurov`	because it's for 0.1btc	[19:25]
stephengandel	gotcha	[19:25]
ThickAsThieves	well also you dont need collateral to buy puts	[19:25]
jurov`	no, buying puts/calls goes normally	[19:25]
stephengandel	and the current price of that contract is 0.07919108 BTCs.	[19:25]
nubbins`	hm, re: bitrated	[19:26]
jurov`	yes, hefty risk preminum	[19:26]
stephengandel	what do you mean by that?	[19:26]
nubbins`	https://www.bitrated.com/u	[19:26]
stephengandel	that was the price to sell a call. Is it the same to buy a put?	[19:26]
nubbins`	see how the site modified all the double-dashes into hyphens?	[19:26]
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ThickAsThieves	no	[19:26]
nubbins`	——-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE——-	[19:26]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 875 @ 0.00295 = 2.5813 BTC [+]	[19:27]
stephengandel	where can I see the price of a put? Or am I not understanding this correctly.	[19:27]
jurov`	for buying or selling you either match the orders published by MPOE	[19:27]
jurov`	they are on mpex.co	[19:27]
jurov`	puts as O.USD.P***	[19:28]
ThickAsThieves	you can only sell options two ways: If you write them (margin), or if you buy them and resell them	[19:28]
jurov`	or you place the buy/sell order at another price and it will also get published at mpex.co	[19:28]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 1540 @ 0.00299693 = 4.6153 BTC [+] {3}	[19:29]
stephengandel	OK. spread on the p050 contract appears to be huge	[19:29]
ThickAsThieves	that's because a bot algo manages constant orders	[19:29]
ThickAsThieves	currently the risk is high	[19:30]
ThickAsThieves	and thus so is the spread and premium	[19:30]
jurov`	yes. all these 1000's are MPOE offers. but anyone can make their own offers.	[19:30]
jurov`	!t m ^OIX	[19:32]
assbot	[MPEX:^OIX] 1D: 0 / 0 / 0 (0 shares, 0 BTC), 7D: / 112.71463735 / 112.71463735 (3170 shares, 119.21 BTC), 30D: 0 / 0 / 0 (0 shares, 0 BTC)	[19:32]
Apocalyptic	OK. spread on the p050 contract appears to be huge // market makers make money from spread	[19:34]
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stephengandel	So for the p080 contract, it would cost me roughly $1.70 to but the contract., with bitcoins at a current 1100. What would I make if bitcoins go down to 1000 or 900?	[19:38]
ThickAsThieves	you would lose money	[19:39]
stephengandel	But I bought a put?	[19:39]
ThickAsThieves	last i checked all the options require extreme price movement to profit	[19:39]
ThickAsThieves	10-15% wont even be close	[19:40]
stephengandel	Do bitcoins have to go down to 800 for the p080 contract to be worth something, or below 800?	[19:40]
ThickAsThieves	they have to offset your premium	[19:41]
stephengandel	Is it different if I was selling a call vs. buying a put?	[19:42]
ThickAsThieves	Namworld, is your calculator still functional?	[19:42]
stephengandel	Seems like selling a call I could make money even if they went down a little bit?	[19:42]
stephengandel	But then I would need margin? Correct?	[19:42]
ThickAsThieves	yes	[19:42]
jurov`	If anyne buys it	[19:42]
ThickAsThieves	well the bot might	[19:43]
ThickAsThieves	but the price would still need to move a decent amount	[19:43]
ThickAsThieves	and you'd be shaving small %	[19:43]
jurov`	yes, if you sell to bot, you need large price movement	[19:43]
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stephengandel	And also I have the problem that all of this would be settled in bitcoins, so any money I made on the futures bet against bitcoins would be offset by the fact that I own bitcoins, which would be worth less in dollars.	[19:44]
stephengandel	Just trying to figure out the calculation. Anyway you could run me through the transaction?	[19:44]
ThickAsThieves	well you'd be buying the bitcoins at a lower price than the current value if you surpass your premium	[19:45]
ThickAsThieves	so you could then sell them at a profit	[19:45]
stephengandel	what if bought a p110, which is essentially where the price is now right? It would cost me $6.19 a contract. Is that right?	[19:46]
jurov`	;;calc 0.04537758*1079	[19:47]
gribble	48.96240882	[19:47]
stephengandel	So if the price of a bitcoin went down to 1000 when the contract settled, I would make $10 minus the cost of the contract, or $3.80	[19:48]
jurov`	^ it's $49	[19:48]
ThickAsThieves	juriv is showing you that you have your cost wrong	[19:48]
stephengandel	but that's the price to sell. I am buying a put.	[19:49]
stephengandel	So I have to pay the selling price to buy a put?	[19:49]
ThickAsThieves	there are puts for sale with their own prices	[19:49]
ThickAsThieves	of course	[19:49]
jurov`	SELL QTY means mpex is selling to you	[19:50]
mike_c	ThickAsThieves: you don't need margin to write/sell options on mpex. you just put up btc as collateral.	[19:50]
jurov`	hence, price 0.0453775 applies	[19:50]
ThickAsThieves	I see	[19:50]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 735 @ 0.00299944 = 2.2046 BTC [+] {3}	[19:51]
stephengandel	OK so it would cost me $49, and if a bitcoin drops to 1000, then I lose $39. For me to start making bitcoins have to drop to $610. Is that right?	[19:51]
ThickAsThieves	sounds right	[19:51]
jurov`	yes	[19:51]
stephengandel	And then I have the problem that I have to convert that back to dollars, and in doing that I will have lost money on my bitcoins because they will have dropped in value.	[19:52]
jurov`	no you will get the $49 back in bitcoins at current rate	[19:52]
jurov`	so you'll be even	[19:53]
stephengandel	Not at the rate on the day the contract settles?	[19:53]
jurov`	they are american, so you can exercise them anytime	[19:53]
stephengandel	even in bitcoins, but not in dollars?	[19:53]
jurov`	and current rate at exercise time applies	[19:53]
jurov`	what do you mean?	[19:54]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 84 @ 0.003 = 0.252 BTC [+] {4}	[19:54]
mike_c	no, even in dollars, that's the point. It's a hedge against bitcoin dropping	[19:54]
ThickAsThieves	hence Buying the Put	[19:55]
ThickAsThieves	rather than selling it	[19:55]
mike_c	thestringpuller:oh man whoever wrote those options is over exposed << not if they aren't speculating. if it is a miner hedging, then they aren't over-exposed.	[19:55]
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stephengandel	from the beginning, I buy my 0.1 bitcoin to open the account, which currently costs $110. Then I buy the put for $49, or 0.04537758 of a bitcoin, and then I have 0.05468842 left in my account. Let say the price of a bit coin drops to $500, and I exercise the option. I will get 0.12 bit coins when I exersize.	[20:00]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 286 @ 0.0031181 = 0.8918 BTC [+] {2}	[20:00]
ThickAsThieves	gogogo NEOBEE!	[20:01]
stephengandel	add that to what I had left in my account, and I will have a total of 0.17468842 BTCs.	[20:01]
jurov`	;;calc (110-50)/50	[20:01]
gribble	1.2	[20:01]
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ThickAsThieves	;;ticker	[20:02]
gribble	MtGox BTCUSD ticker \| Best bid: 1201.00001, Best ask: 1207.0, Bid-ask spread: 5.99999, Last trade: 1200.75001, 24 hour volume: 15003.00562735, 24 hour low: 1131.72718, 24 hour high: 1219.94333, 24 hour vwap: 1172.45435	[20:02]
jurov`	yes, $60 will be 0.12 btc then	[20:02]
stephengandel	Now when I convert that back to dollars at the now btc rate of $1/500 BTCs, I would get $87. Meaning I still lost money!	[20:02]
pankkake	can't you buy neobees for 0.003 direct from lmb holdings?	[20:02]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [AM1] 11 @ 0.33150768 = 3.6466 BTC [-] {5}	[20:02]
nubbins`	hey, wow	[20:03]
nubbins`	that's the firt time neobee has been > ipo for a while, i think?	[20:03]
nubbins`	*first	[20:03]
pankkake	yeah. because IPO was never finished before that	[20:03]
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stephengandel	jurov, is that right?	[20:03]
stephengandel	Something I am missing?	[20:04]
ThickAsThieves	pankkake, yes, but the investor site is not fully functional it seems	[20:04]
ThickAsThieves	so some shares are locked but not purchased	[20:04]
pankkake	I wonder if this is a "must have shares now" or not knowing	[20:04]
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ThickAsThieves	i dont even know how many are actually sold now :/	[20:04]
ThickAsThieves	waiting for access	[20:04]
jurov`	stephengandel: you buy the option for $49 and exercise them to get $60 back	[20:05]
jurov`	don't mix the bticoin you are holding long into there	[20:05]
stephengandel	I know but I will get it back in bitcoins, not dollars, correct?	[20:05]
ThickAsThieves	why does that matter	[20:05]
ThickAsThieves	sell them	[20:05]
jurov`	you will bet B0.12 *500 = $60	[20:05]
jurov`	*get	[20:05]
ThickAsThieves	obv you need to be doing higher volume than one option to make money anyway, so exchange fees wont be an issue	[20:06]
*	NormDePloome has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)	[20:06]
stephengandel	what are the exchange fees?	[20:06]
ThickAsThieves	check your exchange	[20:07]
stephengandel	on coinbr?	[20:07]
ThickAsThieves	coinbr is not an exchange	[20:07]
jurov`	coinbr does not touch fiat	[20:07]
stephengandel	ok on mpeX	[20:07]
ThickAsThieves	them either	[20:07]
mike_c	Buy 0.1 BTC for $110. Buy two P110T for 0.09 BTC. price drops to 500. Excercise for .24 btc. total btc is now 0.25 btc worth $125. go party with $15 gain.	[20:07]
jurov`	mpex either	[20:07]
ThickAsThieves	you want coinbase or campbx or mtgox or bitstamp	[20:07]
ThickAsThieves	etc	[20:07]
jurov`	you neex fiat-to-bitcoin exchange, like mtgox	[20:07]
ThickAsThieves	etc	[20:07]
stephengandel	yes, that's my point. since all of this will be done in bitcoins, when I exchange back, won't I lose money, but maybe I have this wrong?	[20:08]
Namworld	Is it me or is the breakeven on calls in the 15000+ USD/BTC?	[20:08]
mike_c	see my example.	[20:08]
mike_c	you make $15	[20:08]
ThickAsThieves	do it 100 times and you make $1500 :)	[20:09]
ThickAsThieves	less exchange fees	[20:09]
ThickAsThieves	typically in the 1% range	[20:09]
stephengandel	OK.	[20:09]
jurov`	yes. in your example you will get $60 worth of bitcoins	[20:09]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 45 @ 0.00322253 = 0.145 BTC [+] {3}	[20:09]
ThickAsThieves	gotta say though, be careful shorting bitcoin...	[20:10]
jurov`	such small amount is best to sell to colleague or so	[20:10]
jurov`	and buying too, jusr meet some bitcoin anthusiast and buy by cash	[20:11]
jurov`	*enthusiast.. kbd fail	[20:11]
mike_c	agree with ThickAsThieves. while we had this conversation it went up another 1% :)	[20:11]
thestringpuller	hey jurov` you get the pm?	[20:11]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 230 @ 0.00323999 = 0.7452 BTC [+] {2}	[20:11]
jurov`	thestringpuller: a bit of patience, maybe>	[20:12]
jurov`	?	[20:12]
thestringpuller	no the link i sent last night	[20:12]
thestringpuller	nm pm	[20:12]
stephengandel	But mike	[20:15]
iamnot_	whatever happened to XBOND? I don´t see it on Havelock anymore...	[20:15]
pankkake	iamnot_: recalled :(	[20:15]
mike_c	scam!	[20:15]
mike_c	(j/k)	[20:15]
stephengandel	mike_c, if I just do one contract. I lose money, right? Because I was sitting with bitcoins, or because of the leverage? Maybe both?	[20:16]
mike_c	right, if you are shorting you want to only buy as many bitcoins as it takes to buy the number of options you want	[20:16]
mike_c	otherwise you are exposed with the leftover btc	[20:16]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 47 @ 0.00323999 = 0.1523 BTC [+] {2}	[20:17]
iamnot_	pankkake: ´recalled´ sounds bad. does that mean TAT bought back everyone´s bonds?	[20:17]
jurov`	so, fund the account just to buy 3 options. problem solved	[20:17]
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jurov`	you will invest 3$49 equivalent, you will get back (if $500) 3$60 equivalent	[20:17]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [AM1] 6 @ 0.33000024 = 1.98 BTC [-] {3}	[20:18]
pankkake	iamnot_: yes. but it's not bad, anyone buying it at ip(v)o benifited heavily from divs + early 105% recall	[20:18]
stephengandel	And if I buy two contracts and instead the price goes up by 54% or to $1694, then I lose what?	[20:18]
stephengandel	Just what it cost me to buy the puts or more?	[20:18]
jurov`	everything. the option becomes worthless.	[20:18]
mike_c	your options expire worthless, so you just lose what you paid.	[20:18]
iamnot_	pankkake: hmm i see. yes, i miss daily dividends. hopefully something else will come along.	[20:18]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.33 BTC [-]	[20:19]
stephengandel	I guess that's the advantage of buying a put rather than selling a call. Because if I sold a call I could lose an unlimited amount.	[20:19]
jurov`	no, you will at most lose the collateral	[20:19]
mike_c	right, selling has higher risk profile.	[20:19]
pankkake	I hope so; I have not invested elsewhere really	[20:19]
jurov`	if you wrote the option	[20:19]
stephengandel	But again, to sell a call I would have to open a MPEx account?	[20:19]
stephengandel	is wrote an option the same as selling a call?	[20:20]
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jurov`	stephengandel: no, coinbr allows you to write options under the same conditions as mpex	[20:20]
mike_c	jurov`: is that true? i would expect that if the loss was higher than collateral the difference would come out of your mpex account.	[20:20]
jurov`	only thing we won't do, is to provide margin	[20:20]
jurov`	you understand the difference between collateral and margin?	[20:20]
stephengandel	Not really. How much collateral would I have to put up?	[20:21]
stephengandel	strike / spot BTCUSD + some MPEx-proprietary padding	[20:21]
jurov`	yes	[20:21]
jurov`	if the exercise requires more, that's up for MPEx to pay	[20:21]
ThickAsThieves	pankkake: hmm i see. yes, i miss daily dividends. hopefully something else will come along. <<<< Don't hold your breath, no one serious and not scammy enjoys providing daily divs	[20:22]
jurov`	but that would also mean bitcoin falling catastctphically	[20:22]
jurov`	so it isn't hard for mpex to buy more of them	[20:22]
stephengandel	is this what you guys use for the spot price: http://preev.com/	[20:22]
ThickAsThieves	no	[20:22]
jurov`	http://bitcoincharts.com/markets/currencies/	[20:22]
ozbot	Bitcoin Charts / Markets	[20:22]
jurov`	24h price is used	[20:22]
ThickAsThieves	$avg	[20:22]
mpexbot	ThickAsThieves: An error has occurred and has been logged. Please contact this bot's administrator for more information.	[20:22]
ThickAsThieves	whats the other way to pull it?	[20:23]
mike_c	;;bc,24hprc	[20:23]
gribble	Error: Failed to retrieve data. Try again later.	[20:23]
ThickAsThieves	hehe	[20:23]
thestringpuller	okay we need another cross exchange	[20:23]
thestringpuller	ticker	[20:23]
thestringpuller	cause the bot isn't even quoting...	[20:23]
nubbins`	;;ticker --market all	[20:23]
gribble	MtGox BTCUSD last: 1210.0, vol: 15442.99754919 \| Bitstamp BTCUSD last: 1150.01, vol: 12582.57372365 \| BTC-E BTCUSD last: 1059.9, vol: 11463.51851 \| Bitfinex BTCUSD last: 1150.01, vol: 2621.40917063 \| CampBX BTCUSD last: 975.55, vol: 94.01568371 \| BTCChina BTCUSD last: 1126.0836, vol: 49103.04600000 \| Volume-weighted last average: 1135.7963542	[20:23]
assbot	123!	[20:23]
nubbins`	796!	[20:24]
assbot	123!	[20:24]
pankkake	;;ticker --market btcavg	[20:24]
gribble	BitcoinAverage BTCUSD ticker \| Best bid: 1146.52, Best ask: 1150.44, Bid-ask spread: 3.92000, Last trade: 1145.43, 24 hour volume: 42611.77, 24 hour low: None, 24 hour high: None, 24 hour vwap: 1094.27	[20:24]
ThickAsThieves	I'll IPO an indexing website	[20:24]
ThickAsThieves	at 750000btc valuation	[20:24]
thestringpuller	how would that even bring in revenue?	[20:24]
ThickAsThieves	you guys in?	[20:24]
ThickAsThieves	from the IPO	[20:24]
thestringpuller	i'm in lets do it	[20:24]
ThickAsThieves	duh	[20:24]
nubbins`	good buy, can i pre-purchase all the shares?	[20:24]
mike_c	jurov`: I don't see anywhere that you are at risk for max of collateral. not to nag, but what's your confidence on that?	[20:24]
thestringpuller	IPO it on btctco	[20:24]
pankkake	I'd just make the IPO on a BTC address	[20:25]
pankkake	tell them it's colored coins	[20:25]
ThickAsThieves	yep, itll be dutch style	[20:25]
jurov`	mike_c just do the maths. you write one P100	[20:25]
ThickAsThieves	send me coins, you get your proportion	[20:25]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 260 @ 0.00292551 = 0.7606 BTC [-] {2}	[20:26]
jurov`	mpex asks , say, 0.91 btc collateral for it	[20:26]
jurov`	then bitcoin falls to $10	[20:26]
mike_c	derp. got it.	[20:27]
jurov`	and you exercise, getting 90 BTC	[20:27]
stephengandel	prices appear to have disappeared on mpex	[20:27]
thestringpuller	stephengandel: bot isn't quoting due to broken pipes	[20:27]
ThickAsThieves	the data source for the spot price is down	[20:27]
thestringpuller	yea	[20:27]
ThickAsThieves	so the bot pulled its orders	[20:27]
thestringpuller	the weightedprice is going up tho so good time for calls	[20:28]
mike_c	ThickAsThieves: sentiment is moving against you. http://bitbet.us/bet/519/btc-network-difficulty-to-top-1b-before-2014/	[20:29]
ThickAsThieves	obv	[20:29]
ThickAsThieves	;;nethash	[20:30]
gribble	6400549.04237	[20:30]
ThickAsThieves	;;estimate	[20:30]
gribble	Next difficulty estimate \| 872182330.638 based on data since last change \| 894132728.373 based on data for last three days	[20:30]
ThickAsThieves	;;bcstats	[20:30]
pankkake	don't worry, BFL will save you!	[20:30]
gribble	Current Blocks: 273061 \| Current Difficulty: 7.074082830514966E8 \| Next Difficulty At Block: 274175 \| Next Difficulty In: 1114 blocks \| Next Difficulty In About: 6 days, 5 hours, 21 minutes, and 47 seconds \| Next Difficulty Estimate: 872182330.638 \| Estimated Percent Change: 23.29264	[20:30]
thestringpuller	wow one more 23% change and it's on	[20:30]
ThickAsThieves	well the next change might only need to be 13%	[20:31]
iamnot_	ThickAsThieves: Graet and Ukyo loans paid daily dividends. Do you know if those are still around in the form of direct shares?	[20:31]
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ThickAsThieves	haha	[20:31]
pankkake	they are kinda defaulting	[20:31]
zoinky	are they?	[20:31]
pankkake	well, not sure yet	[20:31]
ThickAsThieves	well Graet.loan was largely debt consolidation	[20:31]
pankkake	but for sure you can't redeem right now	[20:31]
ThickAsThieves	so good luck with that one	[20:31]
ThickAsThieves	and Ukyo.loan is in limbo	[20:32]
iamnot_	thanks for the heads up. i will read up on them.	[20:32]
ThickAsThieves	for about a month+	[20:32]
thestringpuller	ThickAsThieves is the only one to have large debt repaid	[20:32]
zoinky	havent been keeping up to date with them	[20:32]
zoinky	since i walked away	[20:32]
thestringpuller	well and namworld	[20:32]
pankkake	Namworld too	[20:32]
ThickAsThieves	Namworld is not fully paid	[20:32]
zoinky	nuts	[20:32]
pankkake	:/	[20:33]
ThickAsThieves	if the next diff is 89, then that means about 830 more TH will push me to lose	[20:34]
ThickAsThieves	well mor ethan that	[20:34]
ThickAsThieves	depends on depeloyment rate	[20:34]
ThickAsThieves	deployment*	[20:34]
ThickAsThieves	about 1400TH was added so far in this diff period	[20:34]
mike_c	how many erupters is that?	[20:34]
ThickAsThieves	lol	[20:35]
ThickAsThieves	usb erupters?	[20:35]
ThickAsThieves	:)	[20:35]
ThickAsThieves	I think the AM cubes are like 30GH?	[20:35]
mike_c	wow, 1400t this period. crazy.	[20:35]
ThickAsThieves	they have about 3000 left to sell i think	[20:35]
thestringpuller	damn son	[20:35]
ThickAsThieves	so not even a dent	[20:35]
Ukyo	[12:34] due to the situation with weex, i stopped issueing dividends on the loan for now. I am setting up a seperate claim/management system where users will either a. begin to get daily divs again, or b. be able to get all missed divs with payoff	[20:36]
nubbins`	weex 4 prez	[20:36]
ThickAsThieves	i assume back divs are paid in either case	[20:36]
thestringpuller	So Ukyo isn't defaulting....	[20:37]
ThickAsThieves	oh, they are locked in Weex	[20:37]
ThickAsThieves	the repayment rate is unknown though	[20:37]
thestringpuller	lololol	[20:38]
ThickAsThieves	wasnt meant to be a joke	[20:38]
ThickAsThieves	just a factor	[20:38]
thestringpuller	http://i.imgur.com/STdRfL5.png	[20:39]
mike_c	^ hah! awesome	[20:39]
ThickAsThieves	hehe	[20:39]
pankkake	you should be ashamed to have that first link in purple though	[20:40]
ThickAsThieves	I get one of these per month: "I have been studying your website and funds but I don't see information on how to invest in those funds. Is there information posted that tells how to invest in the funds?"	[20:41]
ThickAsThieves	uhh	[20:41]
ThickAsThieves	so you were viewing Havelock	[20:41]
ThickAsThieves	and couldnt figure out what to do?	[20:41]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [COG] 3 @ 0.05699979 = 0.171 BTC [-]	[20:42]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [COG] 2 @ 0.05699979 = 0.114 BTC [-]	[20:43]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 597 @ 0.00302999 = 1.8089 BTC [-] {3}	[20:43]
thestringpuller	lemme guess from the forums?	[20:43]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [COG] 4 @ 0.05699979 = 0.228 BTC [-] {3}	[20:44]
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nubbins`	STEVIE	[20:45]
ThickAsThieves	no thats email	[20:46]
mod6	;;bc,stats	[20:46]
gribble	Current Blocks: 273064 \| Current Difficulty: 7.074082830514966E8 \| Next Difficulty At Block: 274175 \| Next Difficulty In: 1111 blocks \| Next Difficulty In About: 6 days, 3 hours, 18 minutes, and 53 seconds \| Next Difficulty Estimate: 873500484.877 \| Estimated Percent Change: 23.47897	[20:46]
nubbins`	we printed some nice garment tags on some linen the other day	[20:48]
nubbins`	http://imgur.com/pYS9z0W	[20:49]
ozbot	imgur: the simple image sharer	[20:49]
pankkake	that looks like an inverted black cock?	[20:50]
thestringpuller	nubbins`: that's my name don't wear it out :P	[20:50]
pankkake	dumb me, it's named black hen	[20:50]
nubbins`	;)	[20:50]
nubbins`	to both of you	[20:50]
ThickAsThieves	neat, have you ever worked with dye-sublimation?	[20:50]
nubbins`	nope, not set up for that atm	[20:50]
ThickAsThieves	I used to run and maintain ESTAT machines	[20:51]
ThickAsThieves	then moved to Mimaki	[20:51]
ThickAsThieves	and solvent too	[20:51]
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nubbins`	we don't have the ventilation for solvent inks 8)	[20:51]
nubbins`	some day	[20:51]
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ThickAsThieves	i still prefer screen-printed stuff anyway	[20:52]
nubbins`	nod	[20:52]
ThickAsThieves	it's the teen punk in me	[20:52]
nubbins`	you can get additives for printing on polyester	[20:52]
nubbins`	so the ink doesn't migrate	[20:52]
thestringpuller	ThickAsThieves: grinds every rail ever	[20:53]
ThickAsThieves	i never skated	[20:53]
nubbins`	nah	[20:53]
ThickAsThieves	i was too cool for that shit	[20:53]
nubbins`	bet you were pretty good at tony hawk, tho	[20:53]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 50 @ 0.00302 = 0.151 BTC [-]	[20:53]
ThickAsThieves	nope, mario kart	[20:53]
jamespeerless	anyone know how my bet weight works if I bet multiple times on same bet?	[20:53]
nubbins`	heh, i've been playing lots of mario kart wii lately	[20:53]
nubbins`	couple weeks ago my wife and i ate a bunch of acid and played it for hours	[20:54]
ThickAsThieves	i was too busy rocking out to skate anyway	[20:54]
nubbins`	really intense	[20:54]
pankkake	jamespeerless: it will have a new, lower weight	[20:54]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 331 @ 0.00302 = 0.9996 BTC [-]	[20:54]
kakobrekla	jamespeerless new bets will appear seperatley	[20:54]
kakobrekla	payout is merged	[20:54]
kakobrekla	in a single tx	[20:54]
nubbins`	ThickAsThieves: ever listened to Metz? you might like em	[20:55]
jamespeerless	so they're basically independent? and then it just adds the payouts together	[20:55]
ThickAsThieves	i havent nubbins, will check em out	[20:55]
kakobrekla	they are independed bets yes , but if you win you will get 1 tx only	[20:55]
jamespeerless	k	[20:55]
kakobrekla	to account for all of them	[20:56]
nubbins`	http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=krGDNbT4CSE	[20:56]
ozbot	METZ - Wet Blanket [OFFICIAL VIDEO] - YouTube	[20:56]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 134 @ 0.0030225 = 0.405 BTC [+] {2}	[20:57]
KRS\|gotyawallet	Wow..this is sobering http://www.offgridminds.com/misinformation-blog/2013/12/1/bitcoin-rise-to-the-dead-end.html	[20:58]
jurov`	;;market sell 1000	[21:01]
gribble	A market order to sell 1000 bitcoins right now would net 1200802.9202 USD and would take the last price down to 1200.0200 USD, resulting in an average price of 1200.8029 USD/BTC. \| Data vintage: 0.0629 seconds	[21:01]
pankkake	isn't it named misinformation-blog?	[21:01]
jurov`	KRS\|gotyawallet: ^ here is the answer	[21:01]
jurov`	and it won't be much different at $10k	[21:01]
nubbins`	he seems to be operating under the assumption that exchanges aren't a place where buyers and sellers meet	[21:01]
nubbins`	i mean, in order to convert x btc into $50m, other users have to put that $50m into the exchange	[21:02]
jurov`	;;market sell 10000	[21:02]
KRS\|gotyawallet	idk	[21:02]
gribble	A market order to sell 10000 bitcoins right now would net 10975877.1390 USD and would take the last price down to 960.6000 USD, resulting in an average price of 1097.5877 USD/BTC. \| Data vintage: 98.6026 seconds	[21:02]
nubbins`	because if they don't, the seller doesn't have any buyers	[21:02]
nubbins`	or am i missing something	[21:02]
KRS\|gotyawallet	i think	[21:03]
KRS\|gotyawallet	thats the main point of the article, nubbins..as i read it	[21:03]
nubbins`	this guy seems to think that each time you buy 1 btc, it's the exchange that had them and is selling to you	[21:03]
KRS\|gotyawallet	more like ;;market sell 140000	[21:03]
ThickAsThieves	that seems to have trouble forming coherent sentences and concepts	[21:04]
KRS\|gotyawallet	;;market sell 140000	[21:04]
gribble	A market order to sell 140000 bitcoins right now would net 36115590.7219 USD and would take the last price down to 8.9066 USD, resulting in an average price of 257.9685 USD/BTC. \| Data vintage: 171.1354 seconds	[21:04]
nubbins`	"Where would the exchanges ... get 10 million dollars?"	[21:04]
ThickAsThieves	guy*	[21:04]
KRS\|gotyawallet	ooofuh	[21:04]
nubbins`	from the people buying the btc	[21:04]
nubbins`	what a fuckin dummy	[21:04]
nubbins`	haha, first comment.	[21:04]
pankkake	he must think bitcoins are "backed" by things	[21:04]
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ThickAsThieves	I thought he was gonna make a decent point,	[21:05]
pankkake	gold bug? not that there's anything wrong with that	[21:05]
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ThickAsThieves	that in the regulated world such providers must have a lot of their own capital	[21:05]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 126 @ 0.0030225 = 0.3808 BTC [+]	[21:05]
ThickAsThieves	this would help with losses caused by the exhcnage	[21:05]
ThickAsThieves	errors, hacks, etc	[21:06]
nubbins`	luckily, here in btc-land, exchanges don't need to cover shit, because fuck it	[21:07]
pankkake	history of bitcoin tells us you can lose up to 90% of your bitcoins a year and still be a winner!	[21:08]
nubbins`	it's true, i lost my shirt twice and i'm still laughing	[21:08]
pankkake	you just printed it again	[21:08]
nubbins`	^	[21:08]
KRS\|gotyawallet	point #1, big chunks of btc are moving around after being dormant since apr 2013 (our last all time high), point #2 one of these "chunks" of btc could market-sell 140,000 btc down to $8.	[21:08]
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pankkake	yeah, but for how long?	[21:09]
nubbins`	okay, but why would you chase the price all the way down to $8?	[21:09]
nubbins`	rather than cashing out slowly to maximize profit	[21:09]
KRS\|gotyawallet	right	[21:09]
nubbins`	i mean, i know we're all irrational actors	[21:09]
nubbins`	but there are limits to the insanity	[21:09]
KRS\|gotyawallet	or give up your position alltogether?	[21:09]
KRS\|gotyawallet	if YOU have the btc, OTHERS dont	[21:09]
benkay	;;market sell 140000	[21:09]
gribble	A market order to sell 140000 bitcoins right now would net 36138416.0754 USD and would take the last price down to 8.9066 USD, resulting in an average price of 258.1315 USD/BTC. \| Data vintage: 187.7440 seconds	[21:09]
pankkake	that's only on mtgox too	[21:10]
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pankkake	but I'm sure many people would come to get those bitcoins	[21:10]
KRS\|gotyawallet	the article questions..why are these big chunks moving at all? maybe because people are realizing they are there and to shuffle them around a bit? idk	[21:10]
nubbins`	when you win the lotto, you can get a lump sum payment of much lesser value, or you can get yearly/monthly payments that total a greater amount	[21:10]
nubbins`	this is similar to a whale cashing out btc	[21:11]
nubbins`	he can take all at once	[21:11]
nubbins`	and get much less	[21:11]
nubbins`	or he can spread it over months/years	[21:11]
nubbins`	and get much more	[21:11]
KRS\|gotyawallet	I think so too..the most positive article I read is how countries like china and countries in africa will be hoarding them because they are a perfect financial vessle for financial freedom	[21:11]
nubbins`	heh, thought you said "countries like africa" for a moment	[21:11]
KRS\|gotyawallet	haha a lot of people do	[21:12]
benkay	;;ticker	[21:12]
gribble	MtGox BTCUSD ticker \| Best bid: 1216.0, Best ask: 1222.0, Bid-ask spread: 6.00000, Last trade: 1215.99001, 24 hour volume: 15013.43553127, 24 hour low: 1131.72718, 24 hour high: 1225.0, 24 hour vwap: 1177.82055	[21:12]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 260 @ 0.00293127 = 0.7621 BTC [-] {2}	[21:14]
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assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 430 @ 0.00293005 = 1.2599 BTC [-] {3}	[21:15]
*	Vexual (~Vexual@46.165.251.69) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[21:16]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 172 @ 0.00292658 = 0.5034 BTC [-] {2}	[21:16]
Vexual	nubbins, try a hotter oven re:sourdough	[21:17]
KRS\|gotyawallet	This was the most positive article about bitcoin I think I ever read, and it just came out	[21:19]
KRS\|gotyawallet	http://www.forbes.com/sites/quora/2013/12/03/what-is-beijings-rationale-for-promoting-bitcoin/	[21:19]
ozbot	What Is Beijing's Rationale For Promoting Bitcoin? - Forbes	[21:19]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 2466 @ 0.00291761 = 7.1948 BTC [-] {6}	[21:20]
ThickAsThieves	"China’s economy is too slanted"	[21:20]
Vexual	thats racist	[21:21]
ThickAsThieves	hehe	[21:21]
ThickAsThieves	he's Chinese, it's ok	[21:21]
KRS\|gotyawallet	HAHA	[21:21]
pankkake	> referring to countries by their capital	[21:22]
Namworld	America is a country apparently. Black people are African-american. Then Africa must be a country too!	[21:22]
Namworld	re nubbins/KRS	[21:22]
Vexual	what about "China does tech, it's what they do."	[21:22]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 249 @ 0.00300909 = 0.7493 BTC [+] {2}	[21:26]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [AM1] 25 @ 0.34634842 = 8.6587 BTC [+] {11}	[21:26]
KRS\|gotyawallet	right, but they need financial freedom and btc gives them that	[21:26]
KRS\|gotyawallet	Namworld I didnt think of that. I should tell my black friend he too must be a country..hmm.	[21:26]
nubbins`	Vexual: it's already at 450, :(	[21:27]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 118 @ 0.003 = 0.354 BTC [-]	[21:27]
nubbins`	Namworld: America isn't a country	[21:27]
nubbins`	you must mean the united states of america	[21:27]
Namworld	I know...	[21:27]
KRS\|gotyawallet	What about Somalia	[21:27]
kakobrekla	i hear dat.	[21:27]
nubbins`	anyway, i think "african-american" is a silly phrase	[21:27]
nubbins`	nobody says "african-canadian" here	[21:28]
jurov`	stfu, you have french-canadians	[21:28]
KRS\|gotyawallet	America needed something to divert attention from the word Nigger which worked fine for me..Worked fine for them so why not.	[21:28]
Vexual	nubbins, perhaps less fisting b4 the first rise?	[21:28]
nubbins`	jurov`: they speak french!	[21:28]
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jurov`	oui?	[21:29]
nubbins`	Vexual: i was worried about not kneading enough	[21:29]
Vexual	you can push it past that peak eleasticity	[21:29]
nubbins`	french-canadians = french-speaking canadians	[21:29]
nubbins`	you can be goddamn sure that they're not identifying with the country of france	[21:29]
jurov`	but it's a term	[21:29]
*	DefectiveNu1 has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)	[21:30]
nubbins`	i knead for about 10 minutes, bowl and cover, punch down and form loaves after 4-6 hours, proof in the pans for another 4-6 hours, then bake	[21:30]
jurov`	i'm not implying that afroamericans speak african	[21:30]
nubbins`	sure	[21:30]
nubbins`	it's just a silly term	[21:30]
jurov`	maybe you don't kned hard/long anough?	[21:30]
Vexual	got a doughmixer?	[21:30]
nubbins`	no mixer	[21:30]
nubbins`	all hand work	[21:30]
jurov`	it needs to start resisting	[21:30]
nubbins`	see, it rises fine, just not in the oven	[21:31]
Vexual	try a batch of smaller laves with different kneads to troubleshoot	[21:31]
nubbins`	hmm, yeah	[21:31]
nubbins`	i tried adding a bit more water this time, no difference	[21:32]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 106 @ 0.0030091 = 0.319 BTC [+] {2}	[21:32]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [AM1] 3 @ 0.34878314 = 1.0463 BTC [+] {2}	[21:32]
nubbins`	although the crumb is a bit nicer	[21:32]
nubbins`	jurov`: maybe it's just me, but i think it's a bit silly to call yourself african-anything if you were born in north america	[21:32]
nubbins`	like	[21:33]
Vexual	you could cheat and chuck some more yeast in	[21:33]
nubbins`	i'm not irish-canadian or british-canadian	[21:33]
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nubbins`	i was born here	[21:33]
nubbins`	i'm just canadian	[21:33]
jurov`	nope, you're eurocanadian	[21:33]
jurov`	:DDDD	[21:33]
nubbins`	european-canadian	[21:33]
Vexual	trasheh?	[21:33]
KRS\|gotyawallet	Cheers, we are all millionaires http://www.businessinsider.com/hugh-hendry-bitcoin-could-hit-1-million-2013-12	[21:33]
nubbins`	Vexual: i can't bring myself to add store yeast	[21:33]
KRS\|gotyawallet	meh	[21:33]
nubbins`	the flavor is just too good as it is	[21:34]
jurov`	what about bitbetting the meeeelion?	[21:34]
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jurov`	would you?	[21:34]
nubbins`	srsly, today's loaves are SO GODDAMN SOUR	[21:34]
KRS\|gotyawallet	We should all meet in Prague for food and feast..Prague has the women and leet secks too.	[21:34]
nubbins`	i just had a tuna sandwich	[21:34]
nubbins`	and i was in ecstasy	[21:34]
nubbins`	honestly, i'm more than a bit surprised that i haven't managed to kill my starter yet	[21:35]
Vexual	The party is going after corruption among Chinese officials. Even though the party needs to clean up, it needs to give its own members an exit plan, as too much prosecution would make the people think that the party is completely corrupt.	[21:36]
Vexual	Not chinese, just very stoned	[21:36]
jurov`	The reason Hendry doesn't own Bitcoin is because it's not available on a regular exchange, the report said.	[21:36]
jurov`	roflol	[21:36]
nubbins`	"showing everyone that the party is completely corrupt would make people think the party is completely corrupt"	[21:37]
nubbins`	i can see why the party wouldn't want that	[21:37]
nubbins`	lel	[21:37]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [VTX] 25 @ 0.15017479 = 3.7544 BTC [-] {6}	[21:39]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [AM1] 2 @ 0.34878472 = 0.6976 BTC [+]	[21:40]
*	stephengandel (9da69fe6@gateway/web/freenode/ip.157.166.159.230) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[21:42]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [HMF] 4 @ 0.02592 = 0.1037 BTC [+]	[21:42]
stephengandel	Hi. Had to leave for a bit. Do the prices on mpex go down a lot?	[21:42]
stephengandel	jurov, you still here?	[21:43]
Vexual	basement; ladies underwear	[21:43]
ThickAsThieves	if you are referring to options, they premium has been generally very high since last Summer	[21:43]
stephengandel	Sorry, not go down as in price, but not available, as in right now?	[21:44]
ThickAsThieves	of course the rise from 150 to 1200 cerrtainly presented opportunity to profit	[21:44]
Vexual	https://js.gg/bitcoin-becoming-a-standard-part-of-lawsuit-discovery-requests/	[21:44]
ThickAsThieves	ah	[21:44]
ozbot	Bitcoin becoming a standard part of lawsuit discovery requests \| Jeff Steinport	[21:44]
ThickAsThieves	yes it does	[21:44]
stephengandel	And the collateral I would have to post to sell a $500 call would be .45 of a bitcoin?	[21:45]
ThickAsThieves	Vexual, bitcoin will be great for divorces	[21:45]
ThickAsThieves	hehe	[21:45]
stephengandel	strike / spot BTCUSD + some MPEx-proprietary padding.	[21:45]
stephengandel	or $495	[21:46]
ThickAsThieves	i dont know that one, i assume the collateral is the full value	[21:46]
ThickAsThieves	.1	[21:46]
ThickAsThieves	but you need to ask someone else for sure	[21:46]
asciilifeform	simple test of your security arrangements. if your PC were to fall into enemy hands, would he know how much BTC you have? (or where.)	[21:47]
jurov`	stephengandel: the info on the forum is obsolete, as the lot changed from 1BTC into 0.1BTC	[21:47]
asciilifeform	if the answer is yes, consider it to already belong to the enemy.	[21:47]
jurov`	so just divide the collateral by 10	[21:47]
*	DefectiveNu (~Henry@pool-173-54-1-90.nwrknj.fios.verizon.net) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[21:47]
asciilifeform	why do you suppose the 'legit' exchanges want your government id? precisely to simplify confiscation.	[21:48]
asciilifeform	'aha, you bought 100btc. where is it now? we have this here soldering iron, and you have an arse...'	[21:48]
stephengandel	OK. So only 0.045 of a bitcoing. And it says the last price on a call for 050 is 0.05232243. So that's what someone would pay me if I could write a call?	[21:48]
Vexual	TAT, there might be a market for some satoshi dust for petty jilted lovers	[21:49]
jurov`	oh and people, i'm still searching a decent writer to put the stuff together.. there really isn't anyone who can make the time for some btc?	[21:49]
jurov`	stephengandel: if you actually sell that for 0.05m, you'll be damned lucky	[21:50]
Vexual	tehcneciel riting? i canod et	[21:50]
stephengandel	OK. but the collateral piece is right. Only 0.045. That seems doable.	[21:50]
jurov`	it needs not be technical.. just that poor fortune redactor can inderstand it	[21:50]
stephengandel	You're trying to pay freelance writers in bitcoins. Is that what you are saying?	[21:52]
stephengandel	If I took that contract I would have to hedge, right?	[21:52]
stephengandel	How do I do that? Just kidding.	[21:53]
*	DefectiveNu has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)	[21:53]
jurov`	hedge what?	[21:53]
Vexual	tounge in cheek? eds and sics?	[21:53]
nubbins`	asciilifeform: the real rub is that the soldering iron can create new arses	[21:54]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 50 @ 0.003 = 0.15 BTC [-]	[21:54]
nubbins`	the obvious defence is to say you lost it all on asicminer shares.	[21:54]
stephengandel	I could open a bitcoin account on coinbr for 0.1 and then if I could get someone to take it write a call option. Right? Sounds like 0.1 is enough collateral.	[21:55]
jurov`	yes, should be (also depending on which option you want)	[21:56]
*	NormDePloome (43f9593d@gateway/web/freenode/ip.67.249.89.61) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[21:57]
stephengandel	Do you have any idea how much I would make if I sold a call and bitcoins went to $500. I don't know how to do that math.	[21:58]
nubbins`	at the risk of being cheeky, you might wish to learn the math before you start moving money around :)	[21:58]
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nubbins`	although i guess that's one of the reasons why you're here, hey?	[21:59]
stephengandel	Yes. Call option pricing more than just regular math	[21:59]
ThickAsThieves	to add to the cheekiness, are suuuuure you wanna bet on BTC falling that much?	[21:59]
nubbins`	heh	[21:59]
ThickAsThieves	and then who's gonna buy your call?	[21:59]
nubbins`	i don't bet anymore, or even invest	[22:00]
nubbins`	i just hold	[22:00]
stephengandel	But was able to figure out put price so half way there.	[22:00]
stephengandel	Is that the same with the put, or do you think I would find someone that would sell me a put with 1100 strike price	[22:00]
nubbins`	#bitcoin-assets: cheekier than an ass calendar	[22:00]
KRS\|gotyawallet	heh	[22:00]
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stephengandel	If I wanted to buy that contract. I think so, right seems like I would be paying a lot for it	[22:01]
jurov`	stephengandel: what about if i sell you P110Ts at 0.0033 per?	[22:03]
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jurov`	you can buy 3 of them for 0.1	[22:03]
jurov`	and once on coinbr account, you'll be free to odo with them as you please	[22:03]
ThickAsThieves	nice	[22:04]
jurov`	*er.. fix: 0.033	[22:04]
stephengandel	so you are saying I could get a better price than the 0.045 we were talking about before?	[22:11]
jurov`	yes. instead of the bot, i will write the options and sell to you	[22:11]
stephengandel	So the prices on mpex aren't real?	[22:11]
jurov`	there's a bot a marketmaker, and her prices are real	[22:12]
jurov`	but anyone can offer other price	[22:12]
jurov`	also real	[22:12]
*	DefectiveNu has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)	[22:12]
stephengandel	And I could get a better price from you?	[22:12]
kakobrekla	is this real life?	[22:12]
stephengandel	What's the price if I wanted to sell the 050 call?	[22:13]
stephengandel	I guess what would you pay me?	[22:13]
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stephengandel	Still don't understand how to figure out what that would be worth if the price of a bitcoin drops	[22:13]
ThickAsThieves	kakobrekla, no this is IRC	[22:13]
ThickAsThieves	just take the value you want it to settle at	[22:14]
ThickAsThieves	and subract your premium	[22:14]
jurov`	current intrinsic value of C050 is about $650 = B0.565	[22:15]
jurov`	oh sry that would be for 10 of them	[22:16]
jurov`	one is B0.0565	[22:16]
jurov`	mhm...i'd pay 0.06. i'm not so sure it will go up so much.	[22:17]
pankkake	IRC is real life to me. the world outside is useless and boring	[22:18]
pankkake	"and then who's gonna buy your call?" ghostbusters?	[22:18]
jurov`	no i'll exercise it	[22:19]
Vexual	megabyte blocks everywhere	[22:24]
pankkake	scammers mixing coins!	[22:25]
jurov`	mircea_popescu mia or just lurking and having fun?	[22:25]
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assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 126 @ 0.00282733 = 0.3562 BTC [-] {7}	[22:30]
*	benkay has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)	[22:32]
*	gesell1 (~user@p200300454E139201A90D8C05FB9FB375.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[22:33]
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assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 95 @ 0.00260466 = 0.2474 BTC [-] {5}	[22:48]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 1098 @ 0.00011989 = 0.1316 BTC [+] {2}	[22:50]
*	AusBitBank (~adam@eth491.qld.adsl.internode.on.net) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[22:56]
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assbot	[HAVELOCK] [HMF] 14 @ 0.02590714 = 0.3627 BTC [-] {5}	[23:01]
*	Kushedout (~Kushedout@adsl-69-227-110-178.dsl.irvnca.pacbell.net) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[23:02]
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assbot	[HAVELOCK] [HMF] 11 @ 0.02580909 = 0.2839 BTC [-] {2}	[23:06]
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assbot	[HAVELOCK] [HMF] 24 @ 0.02289291 = 0.5494 BTC [-] {6}	[23:07]
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Namworld	wanted to buy that contract. I think so, right seems like I would be paying a lot for it	[23:10]
Namworld	[15:03] stephengandel: what about if i sell you P110Ts at 0.0033 per?	[23:10]
Namworld	[15:03] you can buy 3 of them for 0.1	[23:10]
Namworld	[15:03] and once on coinbr account, you'll be free to odo with them as you please	[23:10]
Namworld	[15:04] nice	[23:10]
Namworld	[15:04] *er.. fix: 0.033	[23:10]
Namworld	what?	[23:11]
stephengandel	hey, jurov, the fee for buying a put is 1%. Is that for buying and sell?	[23:11]
Namworld	Arg, stupid mIRC	[23:11]
stephengandel	Meaning I would pay 1% of my 0.1 when I buy and 1% of what it is worth when I exercize the contract if I do.	[23:11]
Namworld	this not be right at all. Why did it put that in the clipboard	[23:12]
stephengandel	Or is it just the 1% when I buy the put	[23:12]
Namworld	darn	[23:13]
TomServo	Namworld: I assume you're aware highlighting copies to clipboard?	[23:13]
Namworld	Yes	[23:13]
Namworld	I don't think I ever highlighted that part	[23:14]
ThickAsThieves	lies	[23:14]
Namworld	Obviously	[23:14]
*	lnostdal has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)	[23:14]
Namworld	Human errors > computer errors by quite a large margin.	[23:14]
Namworld	Sometimes I miscopy something and paste an old clipboard item instead. mIRC sends all lines at once when pasting...	[23:15]
Namworld	I've just changed my settings so it ask before sending multiple lines	[23:15]
Namworld	That way I should be able to review	[23:15]
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assbot	[HAVELOCK] [CFIG] 1 @ 0.101 BTC [-]	[23:19]
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assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 49 @ 0.002681 = 0.1314 BTC [+]	[23:24]
*	ozbot has quit (Remote host closed the connection)	[23:25]
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assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 208 @ 0.002681 = 0.5576 BTC [+]	[23:32]
*	Luke-Jr (~luke-jr@unaffiliated/luke-jr) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[23:32]
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assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 51 @ 0.00289985 = 0.1479 BTC [+] {4}	[23:33]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 444 @ 0.00299728 = 1.3308 BTC [+] {2}	[23:34]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 50 @ 0.0029975 = 0.1499 BTC [+]	[23:35]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 131 @ 0.0029975 = 0.3927 BTC [+]	[23:36]
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thestringpuller	mm	[23:39]
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assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 83 @ 0.0029975 = 0.2488 BTC [+]	[23:41]
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jurov`	hey, jurov, the fee for buying a put is 1%. Is that for buying and sell?	[23:49]
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jurov`	^^ from where you got this?	[23:49]
jurov`	CoinBr has 0.5% both for buying and selling	[23:50]
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*	stephengandel (9da69fe6@gateway/web/freenode/ip.157.166.159.230) has left #bitcoin-assets	[23:55]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 50 @ 0.00299 = 0.1495 BTC [-]	[23:55]
*	stephengandel (9da69fe6@gateway/web/freenode/ip.157.166.159.230) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[23:56]
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stephengandel	hi, does anyone remember if we were talking before about buying puts contracts with a strike price of 65 or 80. Thanks.	[23:57]
stephengandel	i lost the feed from earlier	[23:58]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.349499 BTC [+]	[23:58]
stephengandel	no wait. I remember it was 1100. never mind. Thanks.	[23:59]
nubbins`	stephengandel: just search via log.bitcoin-assets.com	[23:59]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [AM100] 45 @ 0.0033 = 0.1485 BTC [+]	[23:59]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [AM1] [PAID] 27.55189305 BTC to 13`849 shares, 198945 satoshi per share	[23:59]
stephengandel	how do I do that?	[23:59]

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