Forum logs for 02 Dec 2017
| phf: | “MacOS Update Accidentally Undoes Apple's “root” Bug Patch (wired.com)” | [00:05] |
| ben_vulpes: | best part is that it only undoes the patch, doesn't re-break macs with root passwords manually set. | [00:07] |
| ben_vulpes: | and in other hn headlines: "five ways to fix statistics" (nature.com) huh fascinating! i hadn't realized that /statistics/ was broken, i was laboring under the impression that it was the /heads/ that were broken. | [00:10] |
| BingoBoingo: | !~ticker --market all | [00:31] |
| jhvh1: | BingoBoingo: Bitstamp BTCUSD last: 10719.65, vol: 16844.80278042 | Bitfinex BTCUSD last: 10676.0, vol: 86283.87155316 | Kraken BTCUSD last: 10760.0, vol: 4619.59952465 | Volume-weighted last average: 10686.4254292 | [00:31] |
| deedbot: | http://www.thedrinkingrecord.com/2017/12/02/the-boingo-isp-tbi-november-2017-statement/ << Bingo Blog - The Boingo ISP (TBI) November 2017 Statement | [02:56] |
| BingoBoingo: | ^ Bring the comments and beatings | [02:57] |
| BingoBoingo: | In other news it turns out "language exchange" websites of miniscule size feature better user engagement and higher user activity than Okcupid or the other IAC swaps | [03:00] |
| mircea_popescu: | ben_vulpes statistics can produce toxic facts. it is broken like bitcoin, needs "payment protocol" | [05:40] |
| mircea_popescu: | BingoBoingo everything that's not run by usg runs better than anything that's run by usg. you've got a better chance to manage an airplane bombing strike by talking to some obscure black bloc than the dod. | [05:41] |
| deedbot: | http://trilema.com/2017/integration-is-bad-for-bitcoin/ << Trilema - Integration is bad for Bitcoin. | [06:43] |
| asciilifeform: | meanwhile, in deaths, http://m.linuxjournal.com/content/linux-journal-ceases-publication | [08:14] |
| * ben_vulpes | bbl in a few days | [09:19] |
| asciilifeform: | meanwhile, in alert readers, http://www.loper-os.org/?p=1913&cpage=1#comment-18378 | [10:29] |
| asciilifeform: | but meanwhile in world of entomology, https://i.imgur.com/SJMeCBU.jpg | [10:35] |
| asciilifeform: | meanwhile, trotskyite and buharinite wreckers on trial, https://archive.is/Hc6QT >> http://wotpaste.cascadianhacker.com/pastes/kPHNg/?raw=true >> 'A former U.S. National Security Agency employee pleaded guilty on Friday to illegally taking classified information outside the spy agency that an intelligence official said was later stolen from his home computer by Russian hackers' etc | [10:40] |
| asciilifeform: | ^ d00d 'pleabargained' | [10:42] |
| asciilifeform: | http://wotpaste.cascadianhacker.com/pastes/o5rrg/?raw=true << ocr of indictment etc. | [10:44] |
| mircea_popescu: | how many whiles! | [10:44] |
| asciilifeform: | many!1 | [10:44] |
| asciilifeform: | and meanwhilemeanwhile, another trotskyitewrecker, flynn, also pleabargained | [10:45] |
| asciilifeform: | !#s flynn | [10:45] |
| a111: | 27 results for "flynn", http://btcbase.org/log-search?q=flynn | [10:45] |
| mircea_popescu: | awww | [10:46] |
| mircea_popescu: | asciilifeform by now ~90% or so of us "law enforcement" consists of "asset forfeiture". totally not bankrupt empire. | [10:51] |
| asciilifeform: | as i understand it is a traditional punishment in incastans. ye olde su had it. | [10:52] |
| asciilifeform: | '...с конфискацией имущества' was the verdict formulation. | [10:52] |
| mircea_popescu: | yes but by now it is counteradvisable to work for eg nsa if you're not poor from a purely wealth management perspective. | [10:53] |
| asciilifeform: | what sort of 'asset' can a civil servant have, even | [10:53] |
| asciilifeform: | ( as i understand quite uncommon for them to actually own house or land etc. tho this was an older d00d, possibly -- owned something ) | [10:54] |
| mircea_popescu: | asciilifeform "linux journal" advertises "puppet" and some "in their words" about "becoming a cloud native organisation". | [10:54] |
| mircea_popescu: | better this way. | [10:54] |
| asciilifeform: | mircea_popescu: lived as zombie for some years, aha | [10:55] |
| mircea_popescu: | but let's see #linuxjournal | [10:55] |
| mircea_popescu: | * Topic for #linuxjournal is: Welcome to the Social Channel for Linux Journal | www.linuxjournal.com | Ops (@) are LJ Staff | Harmful commands *must* have a disclaimer or you will be banned permanently. | Hateful/prejudicial language/slurs = Kickban | http://pastebin.com/ | https://www.linuxjournal.com/content/linux-journal-ceases-publication | [10:56] |
| asciilifeform: | ahahahahahahahaha | [10:56] |
| asciilifeform: | let the cement mixer, tip. | [10:57] |
| mircea_popescu: | to quote from myself, "just wanted to let you folks know it's great fucking news your sad zombie finally croaked. | [10:58] |
| mircea_popescu: | let it be clear for everyone that pushing "cloud" and pushing "Hateful/prejudicial language/slurs = Kickban" and generally pushing the ustardian aggenda = death. | [10:58] |
| mircea_popescu: | now go be ashamed of yourselves." | [10:58] |
| asciilifeform: | re the vietnamese (lol!) nsa d00d, oblig. http://btcbase.org/log/2017-11-30#1744668 . | [11:02] |
| a111: | Logged on 2017-11-30 16:00 asciilifeform: reminds of : ''I was such a pure and terrifying Aryan that they even put me in a special detachment. Its mission was to find out how the Jews always knew what the S.S. was going to do next There was a leak somewhere, and we were out to stop it' He looked bitter and affronted, remembering it, even though he had been that leak. 'Was the detachment successful in its mission?' I said. 'I'm happy to say,' said Arpad, 'that fourteen S.S. m | [11:02] |
| mircea_popescu: | asciilifeform i think your response to apeloyee is correct actually, when you call with the same item you're fucking yourself. BUT! | [11:02] |
| asciilifeform: | somebody oughta get order-of-lenin for these caught wreckerz. | [11:02] |
| mircea_popescu: | i can't conceive how this can occur. how can it occur ? | [11:02] |
| asciilifeform: | mircea_popescu: my current understanding is that , having banned pointers, it can only occur with an explicit call foo(X, X) , visible to naked eye hamfistmistake in src. | [11:03] |
| asciilifeform: | if pointers were permitted -- it could occur in a foo(A, B) when A turns out to point to same thing as B | [11:04] |
| mircea_popescu: | but, it wouldn't happen if foo(4,4) nor when foo(x,y) where the VALUES of x=y=4. it'd strictly happen when foo(x,x) ie, same variable_name | [11:04] |
| asciilifeform: | normally you would have to call it like foo(X.all, Y.all) . | [11:06] |
| asciilifeform: | (if X and Y were pointers ) | [11:06] |
| mircea_popescu: | he has a good nose sniffing it out, but i don't believe your sicilian's "if thumbs hurt, cut arm at elbow to be sure" approach is warranted. next patch put a warning in the comments an' let 'em be. | [11:06] |
| asciilifeform: | but. but i can think of one scenario where they are not pointers, explicitly, but can still have'em point to same place. (though i also banned it!) --- if there were an allocator pool that somehow put X and Y, conventional nonpointerolade items, in the same exact place in memory. | [11:07] |
| asciilifeform: | but observe, i banned heaps. | [11:07] |
| mircea_popescu: | right. | [11:07] |
| asciilifeform: | (that elbow -- cut!1) | [11:07] |
| mircea_popescu: | also should be a comment there, after the pragma "if you unban these careful about wswap) | [11:07] |
| mircea_popescu: | nah, no heap is more like ombelicum cut. | [11:08] |
| asciilifeform: | iirc i did note that i found that fz_swap is actually used nowhere . | [11:08] |
| asciilifeform: | fz_mux however is fundamental ~everywhere. | [11:08] |
| mircea_popescu: | yes | [11:09] |
| asciilifeform: | this is the kind of situation for which 'precondition' item was made. | [11:09] |
| asciilifeform: | it wouldn't, naturally, go in w_mux, but in fz_mux. can prove that if the latter has it, so does the former, elementarily | [11:12] |
| mircea_popescu: | anwyay, revisiting an ancient conversation re http://btcbase.org/log-search?q=mining+is+a+bug : i have to thoroughly concede this point to asciilifeform . the model is as follows : if a) a PoW system exists in which b) a participating entity can recognize work done by itself as opposed to work done by others then it NECESSARILY follow that entity can, and therefore it ALSO follows that it eventually will c) impose further con | [11:22] |
| mircea_popescu: | ditions on the matter being PoW than originally agreed upon, through d) the direct avenue of refusing to continue "non-compliant" chains. | [11:22] |
| mircea_popescu: | this then gives incentive to those eternal "powerful groups with economic interests antithetical to competitors and consumers" from http://trilema.com/2012/in-re-hein-hettinga-et-al-v-usofa/#selection-39.349-39.463 to drive integration of PoW with the predictable result. | [11:24] |
| asciilifeform: | mining-is-a-bug(tm)(r) | [11:24] |
| mircea_popescu: | the bricking-of-extant-asics moment edges ever closer. | [11:24] |
| asciilifeform: | iirc buncha derps already proclaimed 'pow-only' forkola | [11:25] |
| asciilifeform: | ( i fughet for when scheduled, and by whom, mostly slept through this ) | [11:25] |
| asciilifeform: | it isn't even clear to asciilifeform that there is any such thing known as a good pow | [11:26] |
| mircea_popescu: | not as it stands. | [11:26] |
| asciilifeform: | so what if sha2 chinese die, if fpga-chinese immediately take their place. | [11:26] |
| mircea_popescu: | but there's definitely TWO known bugs in bitcoin now. to the ancient and oft discussed here node-miner split, we are to add this new one, pow-centralization. | [11:27] |
| asciilifeform: | not really new , was already quite painfully there in '14 | [11:27] |
| mircea_popescu: | asciilifeform the bricking was never contemplated outside of something like http://trilema.com/2016/the-necessary-prerequisite-for-any-change-to-the-bitcoin-protocol/ | [11:27] |
| mircea_popescu: | asciilifeform well yes, all bugs are in the pie since the baking. | [11:28] |
| * asciilifeform | brb,meat | [11:28] |
| mircea_popescu: | asciilifeform http://p.bvulpes.com/pastes/w7yTY/?raw=true | [11:39] |
| asciilifeform: | mircea_popescu: worx!! | [12:38] |
| mircea_popescu: | http://btcbase.org/log/2017-11-04#1732934 << re this entire discussion, helpful graybeard points out that throughout the 1991 A-10s/F15s patrolled iraq trying to spot the scud TELs, but ~never managed. | [12:38] |
| a111: | Logged on 2017-11-04 15:47 asciilifeform: incidentally, rf 'fox hunting' is at this point a traditional sport in ru, and the 'fox' is always found . | [12:38] |
| mircea_popescu: | too much like normal trucks, too burried into em background. | [12:38] |
| mircea_popescu: | and we're talking 100s of airborne detectors, latirn, synthetic aperture radars, the works. | [12:39] |
| mircea_popescu: | (amusingly, pentagon went in with the same expectations but never actually managed to land a hit) | [12:39] |
| asciilifeform: | pretty 'small' target tho. | [12:39] |
| mircea_popescu: | a 12 meter rocket + the semi truck carrying it x3 + tankers + c&c + meteo etc ? | [12:40] |
| asciilifeform: | not really comparable to what iirc prev thread was about, hypothetical kW sw transmitter in usa suburbia wastescape | [12:40] |
| mircea_popescu: | if that is small there is no big,. | [12:40] |
| asciilifeform: | small rfwise i mean. | [12:40] |
| mircea_popescu: | but huge thermalwise. | [12:40] |
| mircea_popescu: | you decided infrared is not em ? | [12:40] |
| mircea_popescu: | (lantir = infared targetting and navigation item) | [12:41] |
| asciilifeform: | mention of 'fox hunt' thread led me to think that the iraq memory were re rf triangulation, rather than search for ir-glowing truck engines from aerial camera | [12:42] |
| mircea_popescu: | that was one aspect of it. | [12:42] |
| mircea_popescu: | SAR, another aspect of it. | [12:43] |
| mircea_popescu: | if there was something to try, it was tried. | [12:43] |
| asciilifeform: | the ho chi minh truck search iirc worked better because smaller background. | [12:44] |
| mircea_popescu: | maybe also much shittier trucks. | [12:44] |
| asciilifeform: | similar trucks | [12:44] |
| mircea_popescu: | this was you know, the desert. what's in the desert. | [12:44] |
| mircea_popescu: | anyway. the general point here being that fox hunt a LOT more difficult than everyone ever expects, be it alf, pentagon, etcetera. | [12:45] |
| asciilifeform: | errythingdepends, i'd expect, on the relative 'sizes' of fox vs forest trees. | [12:46] |
| mircea_popescu: | 9 truck convoy > sand dune. | [12:46] |
| mircea_popescu: | (teh carrier, 8x8 artillery truck uses a 40-L diesel engine or somesuch) | [12:47] |
| asciilifeform: | also depends on wavelength. uhf (10s of GHz) line-of-sight beams behave muchly like laser, you gotta know exactly where it is and sit down into the path through air, no bigger than train tunnel, to listen | [12:48] |
| asciilifeform: | whereas most of what folx think of as traditional radio spectrum, goes around corners, terrain, moar omnidirectional flavour | [12:48] |
| mircea_popescu: | but the fox is still big. | [12:49] |
| diana_coman: | asciilifeform, in fz_type.ads: why is word_count range 1..Indices'Last and not 1..Indices'Last/Word'Size ? | [12:50] |
| mircea_popescu: | the "think of it as heat" mental experiment imo has the great advantage of clearing the mind of all sorts of bizarro world "nsa is cool" assumptions about "electromagnetic signature", a magical property of radiation to "know who its daddy is" or somesuch | [12:50] |
| asciilifeform: | diana_coman: why would you divide ? i dun get it | [12:50] |
| asciilifeform: | 1 .. Indices'Last is simply a way to say 'exactly same as Indices, but 0 is forbidden' | [12:51] |
| asciilifeform: | theoretically a word count of a number equal to the number of words in machine's memory, is legal | [12:52] |
| asciilifeform: | what does dividing it by word bitness ( Word'Size ) accomplish ? | [12:52] |
| diana_coman: | uhm my understanding is that Indices is in essence the type for bit-level indexing sure some values overlap but you can't have in same fz same number of words as of bits unless wordsize is 1 | [12:54] |
| asciilifeform: | Indices is the root type for ~all~ possible indices, of anything. | [12:55] |
| asciilifeform: | diana_coman's observation would make sense for narrowing the type of FZBit_Index . | [12:56] |
| asciilifeform: | i did not do it because it adds runtime overhead ( the bounds get checked , and even in inner loops ) without preventing any kind of problem that can happen in reality | [12:56] |
| diana_coman: | k, thanks | [12:57] |
| asciilifeform: | a value of type FZBit_Index cannot be assigned a value greater than machineaddressspace/wordsize without 9,000 other things being unfathomably broken | [12:57] |
| asciilifeform: | now for the sad: | [12:58] |
| asciilifeform: | readers may recall that originally ffa was a 'generic unit' | [12:58] |
| asciilifeform: | and originally i even had autozeroing for FZ, and zeroing on going-out-of-stackframe. | [12:58] |
| asciilifeform: | the latter required finalization and for FZ to be a struct rather than bare array ( finalization massively bloated the binary whereas structization massively bloated the src ) | [12:59] |
| asciilifeform: | so it's gone. | [12:59] |
| asciilifeform: | the genericunit allowed a given running instance of ffa to know the actual ffawidth desired and to have stricter checks on arguments | [12:59] |
| asciilifeform: | but it turns out that it is not possible to have a standalone static lib containing an uninstantiated generic, in adaworld | [13:00] |
| asciilifeform: | so generic -- gone. ( also shrinks the binary, a bit ) | [13:00] |
| asciilifeform: | diana_coman: you do have a point , though, an ffa that is an ideal mathematical description of every relevant bound, would look slightly different from the ffa i actually have, that has to actually run on idjit cmachine iron in something like real time. | [13:08] |
| asciilifeform: | and if i were a haskellist and writing with an eye toward ~machine~ proof, rather than fits-in-head, i probably would have written one. | [13:08] |
| asciilifeform: | but there are already plenty of haskellists writing nonsense. asciilifeform wanted an actually usable fits-in-head item. | [13:09] |
| asciilifeform: | ( 'ideal mathematically-sufficient' ffa would probably include solely egyptian multiplier, for example. ) | [13:10] |
| asciilifeform: | and solely knuthian divider for the modulus op. etc. | [13:10] |
| asciilifeform: | ( knuthian divider, if anyone forgets, is an exact inversion of egyptian multiplier. ) | [13:10] |
| asciilifeform: | ( btw nobody yet asked why ffa is now a standalone-built static lib, rather than as before , a set of sources to be simply dropped into other projects. answer is -- binary audit ) | [13:13] |
| mircea_popescu: | nothing keeps anyone from taking source either | [13:25] |
| asciilifeform: | anyone naturally can cut up into whatever pieces. the issue is how is it structured on asciilifeform's desk. | [13:26] |
| asciilifeform: | for certain purposes it makes a permanent difference. | [13:26] |
| * asciilifeform | bbl,meat | [13:27] |
| diana_coman: | http://btcbase.org/log/2017-12-02#1745589 <- makes sense | [14:47] |
| a111: | Logged on 2017-12-02 18:08 asciilifeform: diana_coman: you do have a point , though, an ffa that is an ideal mathematical description of every relevant bound, would look slightly different from the ffa i actually have, that has to actually run on idjit cmachine iron in something like real time. | [14:47] |
| mircea_popescu: | in other old news, http://trilema.com/2017/a-better-man-than-i/ aka la grande belezza is a fucking fabulous film. | [16:51] |
| mircea_popescu: | it might actually be the best film ever made. | [16:51] |
| asciilifeform: | in other eagle eyes, http://www.loper-os.org/?p=1913&cpage=1#comment-18380 | [16:58] |
| mircea_popescu: | aren't blogs cool ? seriously now. | [16:59] |
| mircea_popescu: | !~later tell apeloyee hey, do you want a job working for minigame ? | [17:00] |
| jhvh1: | mircea_popescu: The operation succeeded. | [17:00] |
| * asciilifeform | had nfi minigame had jobs etc | [17:01] |
| mircea_popescu: | why not ? | [17:02] |
| mircea_popescu: | i've been trying to hire a bunch of artists for what, 5 years now ? | [17:02] |
| mircea_popescu: | the one thing teh republic doesn't lack is jobs. | [17:03] |
| asciilifeform: | i suppose the word has >1 meaning | [17:03] |
| mircea_popescu: | like what ? | [17:04] |
| asciilifeform: | well we dun have so many, afaik, 'fix X, get Q btc' sort of job. | [17:05] |
| mircea_popescu: | we have tons. starting with "fix your tits, get 0.02 btc" and from there on. | [17:05] |
| asciilifeform: | other than the tits | [17:06] |
| asciilifeform: | do i know about any of this ? | [17:06] |
| mircea_popescu: | http://btcbase.org/log/2017-12-02#1745610 | [17:06] |
| a111: | Logged on 2017-12-02 22:02 mircea_popescu: i've been trying to hire a bunch of artists for what, 5 years now ? | [17:06] |
| asciilifeform: | artist auditions are different item than the one in the q where 'fix x... get..' neh | [17:07] |
| mircea_popescu: | asciilifeform you personally for instance http://btcbase.org/log/2016-12-27#1591437 to quote from teh very boardroom of minigame earlier, "<mircea_popescu> noa. evident ca idealu' ar fi fost ca tata asta sa fi fost gata facuta din 2016, cum discutasem initial cu stan. da'... sufletu'." | [17:08] |
| a111: | Logged on 2016-12-27 22:14 mircea_popescu: course since the nsa consulting work for minigame is going to produce ada rsa, it might be an idea to have an ~ada~ tmsr crypto lib. | [17:08] |
| mircea_popescu: | ie, it'd have been nice to have this item done last year as per original discussions. but whatever. | [17:08] |
| mircea_popescu: | asciilifeform there's no difference. artists dun wanna work, ie ON TIME and TO SPEC and ON WHAT THEY'RE TOLD TO just like erryone else. | [17:09] |
| asciilifeform: | actually now that i think about it, mircea_popescu had a crypto bounty thing also | [17:10] |
| asciilifeform: | for symmetric ciphering | [17:11] |
| * asciilifeform | can't turn up the link for some reason | [17:11] |
| mircea_popescu: | the amount of jobs awaiting workers exceeds the amount of availavble workers by a factor never before seen in human history not even during the saudi reign 20 years ago. not even in china. nowhere. | [17:11] |
| mircea_popescu: | take for instance http://btcbase.org/log/2017-11-22#1742032 | [17:12] |
| a111: | Logged on 2017-11-22 11:41 RagnarDanneskjol: mircea_popescu I may have someone worth inviting to chan for interview in the coming days. Most of the folks I know over there are primarily oral translators, so having to look around a bit. Just got back yesterday - BJ is a real shithole but the people are adorable, lots of good duck. FYI - 'VPN AC' (Romanian) seems to be the only one working well/consistently behind the firewall (I've used many) and | [17:12] |
| mircea_popescu: | has it yet been A YEAR since the discussion of hiring a motherfcucking chinese office girl was tabled ? | [17:12] |
| * asciilifeform | finally did dig up the first mention of proto-ffa in l0gz : http://btcbase.org/log/2016-06-09#1479552 | [17:12] |
| a111: | Logged on 2016-06-09 22:06 asciilifeform: i discovered that mainstream finite field libs are as complicated as they are largely because they insist on growable - and, ergo, heap-allocated - nums. | [17:12] |
| mircea_popescu: | where the fuck is the office girl ? | [17:12] |
| mircea_popescu: | etcetera. | [17:13] |
| asciilifeform: | !~seen RagnarDanneskjol | [17:13] |
| jhvh1: | asciilifeform: RagnarDanneskjol was last seen in #trilema 1 week, 3 days, 10 hours, 32 minutes, and 21 seconds ago: <RagnarDanneskjol> Everbright Bank has, by far, the lowest entry barriers for business or tourist visitors opening new accounts. | [17:13] |
| mircea_popescu: | and yes, i'd much rather pour a coupla bitcents into the ground instead of paying "hiring experts" etcetera. by very far. | [17:13] |
| mircea_popescu: | at least when i pour it into the ground, i know what i'm doing with it as i do it. | [17:13] |
| mircea_popescu: | consider this schmucktard : http://btcbase.org/log/2017-10-11#1724165 | [17:14] |
| a111: | Logged on 2017-10-11 20:40 BHopkins: I had to look up the current price, and the answer is yes :) | [17:14] |
| asciilifeform: | what about him | [17:15] |
| mircea_popescu: | nobody in his line of work has EVER made a bitcoin's worth in one year no matter what they did. but does he have enough sense to go... hmmm... i'll treat this as an advance, and use it to finance my supposedly useful work coming back with deliveries worth at least 10x that, because thaty's how useful i am, and see what happens | [17:15] |
| mircea_popescu: | so... no. white man is lazy and stupid, in whatever order. the problem's not the lack of jobs. | [17:15] |
| mircea_popescu: | the problem's the 3rd world whore's attitude, as described in that friday piece. | [17:15] |
| mircea_popescu: | but otherwise -- everything's sough. you got tits ? make money. you can code ? make money. you can draw ? make money. you "got relations" / can pr/whatever the fuck you got ? MAKE MONEY! | [17:16] |
| mircea_popescu: | "oh but mp... really... i can't do anything, not usefully, not well, not within pre-glacial timeframes, not... not..." | [17:17] |
| mircea_popescu: | riight, | [17:17] |
| asciilifeform: | glacial at least beats nuffin.. | [17:18] |
| mircea_popescu: | http://trilema.com/2015/these-fools-have-been-handed-a-technology-so-clever-so-disruptive-and-revolutionary-that-the-rulers-of-the-world-would-have-to-fully-unmask-themselves-as-ruthless-tyrants-in-order-to-suppress-it/#comment-123721 << this stupid bitch, can be arsed to spam trilema by hand, can NOT be arsed to read anything. everyone, including the very last hopeless african in the throes of death by innanition imagines th | [17:18] |
| mircea_popescu: | emselves a process designer. | [17:18] |
| asciilifeform: | asciilifeform so far only glacial . | [17:18] |
| mircea_popescu: | ima, dontcha know, follow the funnel they constructed, like everyone's got an apple concept store. | [17:18] |
| mircea_popescu: | what, and write them emails ? | [17:18] |
| mircea_popescu: | why. who the fuck are they, and who the fuck am i, and who adapts to whom ? | [17:18] |
| mircea_popescu: | recall that schmuck with the french isp, which upon examination turned out to be 0% isp and 100% a vehicle for the inept vanities and worldviews of a few idle and overcomfortable schmucks ? | [17:19] |
| asciilifeform: | the cocks thing ? | [17:19] |
| mircea_popescu: | it's all that, all the way down. | [17:19] |
| mircea_popescu: | asciilifeform no, recently, some grenoble thing. | [17:19] |
| asciilifeform: | the one davout dug up ? | [17:19] |
| mircea_popescu: | or for that matter just as recently, some german dork. | [17:19] |
| mircea_popescu: | the dude with fucking options and self-determinations as to who he wants to work with. | [17:20] |
| mircea_popescu: | all of it, however wrapped, however excused, it's the same thing : we here in white man world are incapable of doing anything useful and don't wish to see why this'd make any difference. | [17:20] |
| asciilifeform: | possibly people shit their pants when they find that an entire field has to be burned and rebuilt | [17:22] |
| mircea_popescu: | so why should that sort of people eat ? | [17:22] |
| asciilifeform: | can't think of why. | [17:23] |
| mircea_popescu: | if you're rich enough to make your own decisions, good, make shit on your own time and in your own way, that's ACTUALLY VALUABLE, get paid via ownership share. | [17:24] |
| mircea_popescu: | if you're too poor to ownership share, need to be paid in cash, that means no options and no decisions and off to work whore. | [17:24] |
| mircea_popescu: | either way, low output means low value and dubious humanity. that's capitalism. | [17:25] |
| mircea_popescu: | and capitalism ain't going anywhere. | [17:25] |
| * asciilifeform | points out, ftr, that he is only able to sometimes make-in-own-time by whoring out in saeculum. | [17:28] |
| asciilifeform: | like several other folx here. | [17:28] |
| mircea_popescu: | hey. erryone's living his own life. | [17:28] |
| mircea_popescu: | but you can't argue both ends. it can't be "oh, there's no jobs" and ALSO "i'm not doing the jobs". unemployment office kicks you out, and so does everyone else, for good reason. | [17:28] |
| mircea_popescu: | now, obviously in the particular case of "make crypto bit for eulora" the problem evidently is that such an item is more complex than what worker usually workers. this is true, but also it was your idea, blocking also that out. | [17:30] |
| asciilifeform: | fwiw asciilifeform will submit ffa.rsa to be judged in mircea_popescu's symm cipher contest, supposing the latter is still running | [17:30] |
| mircea_popescu: | so... you wanna work self-managedly, and are rich enough to afford it, great! not rich enough to afford it... stfu. pick one and only one. | [17:30] |
| diana_coman: | http://btcbase.org/log/2017-12-02#1745663 <- how was that, "perfectly insignificant and incapable individuals, whose existence is only rendered possible through the high organization of civilized crowds..." | [17:31] |
| a111: | Logged on 2017-12-02 22:20 mircea_popescu: all of it, however wrapped, however excused, it's the same thing : we here in white man world are incapable of doing anything useful and don't wish to see why this'd make any difference. | [17:31] |
| mircea_popescu: | diana_coman except here's the biter : the "civilized crowds" only ever survives (briefly) as an extraction engine. | [17:31] |
| mircea_popescu: | BECAUSE india credited london, THEREFORE the ~pretense~, idle and basless, of british empire. | [17:31] |
| mircea_popescu: | BECAUSE http://trilema.com/2014/la-florida-and-other-places/#selection-103.0-103.28 THEREFORE "us empire" | [17:32] |
| diana_coman: | hm, by same token life only ever survives (briefly) as an extraction engine, what of it | [17:32] |
| mircea_popescu: | (anyone remember the derpage early 2000s in the same venues that these days discuss "toxic facts" and "russian hackers" ?) | [17:33] |
| mircea_popescu: | diana_coman that the republic is the only economically stable thing -- the extraction of the smart. | [17:33] |
| mircea_popescu: | everything else... just trying to. lasts while it lasts. | [17:33] |
| mircea_popescu: | there's no fundamental reason for nicaraguan working abroad to save in dollars there was no fundamental reason for indian to think his kid must go to school in london. smoke and mirrors, and those are terrible basis for one's life | [17:34] |
| asciilifeform: | i thought it was dollars because 'best horse in glue factory' | [17:34] |
| mircea_popescu: | in the specific sense that by the time "you figure it out" they're gone. today, everyone wants to go to college. today it's too late to go to college. everyone wants a 401k ? guess what... too late to. and so on. | [17:35] |
| mircea_popescu: | asciilifeform nothing about the usd makes it best. no, it's dollars for the same reason "eat at mcdonalds" -- worst horse in glue factory. | [17:35] |
| asciilifeform: | at one time was some sort of optimum between 'inflates slowly' and 'gettable', neh | [17:36] |
| mircea_popescu: | by the time the plebs figure out "where the party is", the party just moved. | [17:36] |
| mircea_popescu: | this is how earth has worked for 5k+ years, no exceptions known. | [17:36] |
| mircea_popescu: | the one you're looking at, whatever it may be, won't turn out to be the exception, either. | [17:36] |
| asciilifeform: | lol how else. who wants a party full of everyone. | [17:36] |
| mircea_popescu: | quite. | [17:36] |
| mircea_popescu: | so this "civilized crowds" thing is ~suicide. | [17:37] |
| mircea_popescu: | yes, were you living in the time of your parents, the strategy you came up with would have worked. you're not. | [17:37] |
| mircea_popescu: | were the ww2 generals fighting ww1, they'd have ALL been great military minds | [17:37] |
| mircea_popescu: | but... they weren't. | [17:37] |
| diana_coman: | well, the *what* it extracts is of course much more telling of what the thing is to start with as for the reasons there... reason was as far as I understand it "they are better than us because they defeated us", can't say it's obviously "smoke and mirror" | [17:37] |
| asciilifeform: | i'll admit that i'm not quite sure what the opposing argument, that mircea_popescu is bulldozing, exactly was | [17:37] |
| asciilifeform: | ( it's a quality bulldozing. but of what exactly. ) | [17:38] |
| mircea_popescu: | asciilifeform natural indolence and psychological comfort seeking, i guess. unspoken because defensive. | [17:38] |
| mircea_popescu: | diana_coman point isn't that it extracts, point is that it doesn't, not really. that's what i'm saying, that the whole "whose existence is only rendered possible through the high organization of civilized crowds" is really VERY vulnerable, because the high organization doesn't ACTUALLY cause or control the extraction. | [17:39] |
| mircea_popescu: | it's 100% "making the sun raise" by gesturing wildly at 5:15 am | [17:39] |
| mircea_popescu: | rise* | [17:39] |
| mircea_popescu: | which is why the british empire COULDNT prevent its own demise. nor the current one. nor any other "highly organized civilised crowd". | [17:39] |
| mircea_popescu: | the lido gets sanded. this is not up to venice to prevent. end of story. trying to live off civilization is exactly like trying to live off fishing, or off playing double-or-nothing at the casino. | [17:40] |
| mircea_popescu: | bitter poverty is the only certain result. | [17:40] |
| mircea_popescu: | (really, nobody ever wonders how come the fishermen are always the poorest demographic ? the sea is so very rich!) | [17:41] |
| diana_coman: | there was no counter-argument there those were scum the point was simply that this sort of scum is alive for longer than it would be if not for the warm/comfy "crowd" | [17:41] |
| mircea_popescu: | that's for sure. | [17:41] |
| diana_coman: | and moreover, that was said in 1898, not as if it's new or anything | [17:43] |
| mircea_popescu: | myeah. | [17:44] |
| diana_coman: | re not really extracts - I guess it's fair to say it's not "extracts" but rather "charms out of" and that certainly makes some sense although it's totally unclear how it went from conquering actively to charming passively | [17:45] |
| asciilifeform: | so why fisherman poor? maybe sea not so rich ? | [17:45] |
| mircea_popescu: | diana_coman it never went. see... take say the early greek wars. those dudes did essentially a society game : the men stripped and cockwrestled on a field on a sunday. the "defeat" of the defeated was a two phase game. phase 1, where their line broke. phase 2, most important, where THEIR WOMEN spread out for THE OTHER GUYS. because fuck you loser. exactly how college football worked when it worked, you mean means you get the | [17:47] |
| mircea_popescu: | other team's cheerleader bus, au naturel. exactly what teh airmen meant by "tailhookers all weather attack" fliers dumped on area colleges. | [17:47] |
| mircea_popescu: | it always was charming. | [17:47] |
| mircea_popescu: | that's the problem with "modern war", that its charming quality of yore became quite grotesque. | [17:47] |
| mircea_popescu: | yet the function remained, half the kids born in berlin 1946 were russian. | [17:48] |
| mircea_popescu: | asciilifeform the sea is rich but the fisherman's stuck playing a loser game. | [17:48] |
| mircea_popescu: | the problkem is this : your fishing today is in no way improved by your fishing yesterday. | [17:48] |
| mircea_popescu: | because i wrote all those trilema articles, when i sit down to write an article today, i copme up with http://btcbase.org/log/2017-12-01#1744980 | [17:48] |
| a111: | Logged on 2017-12-01 18:33 asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-12-01#1744952 << mega-piece btw | [17:48] |
| mircea_popescu: | every gram of sweat off my brow, every keystroke magnified thousandfold by the passive value of accumulated history. | [17:49] |
| mircea_popescu: | very easy to write trilema when you've been writing trilema fucking hard to be a fisherman when you've been a fisherman. hence http://trilema.com/2012/la-terra-trema/ | [17:49] |
| mircea_popescu: | the discussion re poker, EXACTLY same thing. once the buildup went away... no further point to playing. | [17:51] |
| mircea_popescu: | ( http://btcbase.org/log/2017-08-06#1694597 ) | [17:51] |
| a111: | Logged on 2017-08-06 16:51 mircea_popescu: (this point, in either "intern can progress" or "sit in forum and access meaning" presentation, is the fundamental mechanism of both "rounders" and that "poolhall junkies" cheapo rehack of it : that the dude playing can decide the girl's future, a degree of magnitude above her own capacity. take that away -- it's not worth doing. and you sure as fuck ain't meeting the head of ny law firm socially, and play $X with him so he g | [17:51] |
| mircea_popescu: | and that is what it fucking means, that opportunity loss is unevaluable. had i not written http://trilema.com/2010/daca-tot-ce-poti-face-in-viata-asta/ in 2010, i couldn't have well written http://trilema.com/2016/and-now-the-story-has-an-ending/ in 2016 and without that in turn the quoted piece. you can't summon these up on the spot when you need them, literally cant, just like wolf can't physically sharpen his teeth in th | [17:59] |
| mircea_popescu: | e split-second right before fight, there's not enough brain in any skull that ever passed the woman's middle to manage such ample feats. some try, but why should i take amphetamine today to compensate for having been lazy a decade ago ? | [17:59] |
| mircea_popescu: | and for that matter, why did i write the original ? i had nfi when i did what the future'd be like. SURELY it was no possible perception of value. but this is merely an indication of just how fucking valuable the whole thing is, if it builds meaning upon itself in a manner that defies imagination. | [17:59] |
| mircea_popescu: | actually, re-reading the comments i know why i wrote it. because i didn't like the implication that "so what if liberalizing drugs leads to truck drivers being forced to meth by economic pressure, fuck them, they're truck drivers". the idea being that you never know who the truck driver is. | [18:03] |
| BingoBoingo: | <mircea_popescu> very easy to write trilema when you've been writing trilema fucking hard to be a fisherman when you've been a fisherman. hence http://trilema.com/2012/la-terra-trema/ << Mega film, need to rewatch | [18:49] |
| mircea_popescu: | ever seen il scopone scientifico ? | [18:50] |
| BingoBoingo: | Not yet that I remember | [18:50] |
| mircea_popescu: | bette davis is this old woman playing cards with ghetto italians (sordi and i think mangano ?) | [18:50] |
| mircea_popescu: | yeah, it was her. perfect chick for the role, basically subsistence prostitute in ww2 italy. then ended up in cinecitta. | [18:51] |
| BingoBoingo: | <mircea_popescu> other team's cheerleader bus, au naturel. exactly what teh airmen meant by "tailhookers all weather attack" fliers dumped on area colleges. << An appeal of hanging out with the old drunks in recovery is that their time drinking often seems a sort of cultural cosmoline. | [18:51] |
| mircea_popescu: | howssat ? | [18:52] |
| mircea_popescu: | in other lulz, imdb on lollobrigida : "She was the daughter of a furniture manufacturer, and grew up in the pictorial mountain village." | [18:53] |
| BingoBoingo: | Well, appears when the booze is preventing new memory formation you get a lot of "WTF? Why no butt patting the entertainment at work anymore" | [18:54] |
| mircea_popescu: | a | [18:54] |
| BingoBoingo: | And "Where my country gone" laments | [18:55] |
| BingoBoingo: | Also, Trump insufficiency syndrome | [18:56] |
| BingoBoingo: | http://trilema.com/2014/la-florida-and-other-places/#footnote_1_54763 << Ah, this is such a reminder of the datacenter search. Particularly in Peru and SE Asia | [19:06] |
| BingoBoingo: | !~ticker --market all | [20:27] |
| jhvh1: | BingoBoingo: Bitstamp BTCUSD last: 10891.59, vol: 8946.79513240 | Bitfinex BTCUSD last: 10858.0, vol: 49925.80321512 | Kraken BTCUSD last: 10846.0, vol: 2584.39676055 | Volume-weighted last average: 10862.3853444 | [20:27] |
| BingoBoingo: | Anyone want to put a bet against one bitcent for "Bitcoin passes 12500 (per '!~ticker --market all' VWLA) while I am enroute from StL to Montevideo | [20:29] |
| mircea_popescu: | BingoBoingo aite. | [21:09] |
| asciilifeform: | meanwhile, http://www.loper-os.org/?p=1913&cpage=1#comment-18384 | [21:49] |
| mod6: | yeah, thx for msg'ing back indeed, his pastes are gone!? | [21:57] |
| mircea_popescu: | asciilifeform better error message is "please use p.bvulpes, your pastes vanished" | [21:58] |
Category: Logs
