Forum logs for 16 Oct 2018

Monday, 16 March, Year 12 d.Tr. | Author:
hanbot: BingoBoingo http://p.bvulpes.com/pastes/48Uzp/?raw=true [01:13]
ave1: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-10-15#1863087, look at the pasted code. Yes, you move it from a dynamic allocation on the heap to a "dynamic allocation" on the stack. With the major advantage that the stack is a well defined mechanism with predictable results where dynamic allocations are not. [05:19]
a111: Logged on 2018-10-15 19:13 bvt: ave1, can you expand on getting rid of string allocations? I see a way to get rid of it for Mode, but not for the Path argument. i can move its c-string from heap to stack, but that would be it. anyhow, i will revise this aspect. [05:19]
ave1: Using the stack makes code less error prone and a lot more readable, please read the FFA code http://www.loper-os.org/?cat=49. [05:22]
bvt: thanks, i see what you mean. the Interfaces.C.Strings.New_String() comments explicitly say that the heap allocation is necessary for the large strings, which is not the case for vpatch temporary file names. [07:18]
bvt: i have already reworked the code based on the following code from GNAT: http://p.bvulpes.com/pastes/xjjec/?raw=true (g-locfil.adb, lockfile implementation). i.e. System.Address of an aliased String as argument to C function. [07:18]
deedbot: http://ossasepia.com/2018/10/16/smg-comms-chapter-2-raw-types/ << Ossasepia - SMG Comms Chapter 2: Raw Types [07:20]
mircea_popescu: yknow it occurs to me, one could make a likely very popular film, call it "captive" or w/e, simply through filming the male seminal canal from teste to ligature point in one of those tube-tied doods. 4 minuites of voice-over at the beginning explaining what's what ("this is joe. joe is a sperm." bla bla) and then the rest of an hour and a half just... let people watch the random walk. [07:28]
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-10-16#1863187 << this'll take some rereading ima take it with me on trip. [07:38]
a111: Logged on 2018-10-16 11:20 deedbot: http://ossasepia.com/2018/10/16/smg-comms-chapter-2-raw-types/ << Ossasepia - SMG Comms Chapter 2: Raw Types [07:38]
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-10-15#1863111 << thinking about this in the interim, it is EVIDENTLY the case. "files" as in ~the fucking thing REFERENCED~ in the "file"system names aren't even first class abstractions! the drive's a BYTE device! there's no fucking files ANYWHERE except in the imagination. [07:44]
a111: Logged on 2018-10-15 19:24 mircea_popescu: s a file system AT ALL, and the "all things are files" is just a thin wraper on a turd sausage made out of "we have no data model beyond ram and our disk doesn't actually work". [07:44]
mircea_popescu: what passes for a "file system" currently is this attempt to force a byte-device (sometimes with some half-baked geographical allocation bolted on) through a half-baked database model. wtf is a "FAT" or a "journal" besides poorly implemented mysql/postgres dben ? [07:45]
mircea_popescu: in any case there's no such thing as a filename anywhere at all, it's not even 2nd class, it's a sort of indian. [07:46]
mircea_popescu: and obviously most of the reason the sql flavour is broken is because "oh, structure could never be aforeknown" and so "must have maximal hallucinatory freedoms". [07:47]
mircea_popescu: "then you want to put these '''maximal freedom''' elements in a tree ?" "it's not a tree, it's a '''directory structure'''." "wtf is that ?" "a half-baked tree." "you're really dedicated to this half-baked thing beyond all else, aren't you ?" [07:47]
mircea_popescu: what fucking filesystem. halfbakedsystem more like it. [07:48]
mircea_popescu: man-drive dialogue flows always like : "i want file X" "wtf is that ?" "tell me what i told you before file X is supposed to be" "bytes 4978459876 through 50987498098" "i want bytes 4978459876 through 50987498098 please" "here you go" "are these file X ?" "fuck you" "does file X even exist ?" "little bitch..." "grep -a -C 500 'known pattern' /dev/sda | tee /tmp/recover" [07:51]
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-10-16#1863191 << bonus: nobody actually sells a hdd that's 'byte device', they're addressable in 512byte blox ( and internally with 4096byte flash sectors ) and it actually makes a diff , not only in re speed but the life of the iron ( erry sector can be written ~2000 times ) [09:31]
a111: Logged on 2018-10-16 11:44 mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-10-15#1863111 << thinking about this in the interim, it is EVIDENTLY the case. "files" as in ~the fucking thing REFERENCED~ in the "file"system names aren't even first class abstractions! the drive's a BYTE device! there's no fucking files ANYWHERE except in the imagination. [09:31]
asciilifeform: !Q later tell diana_coman http://ossasepia.com/2018/10/16/smg-comms-chapter-2-raw-types/comment-page-1/#comment-4339 [09:39]
lobbesbot: asciilifeform: The operation succeeded. [09:39]
asciilifeform: diana_coman: if my nitpick isn't clear, i can post an example later today. [09:40]
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-10-16#1863198 << yes fs is a 1960-style db, i thought this was obvious [09:44]
a111: Logged on 2018-10-16 11:51 mircea_popescu: man-drive dialogue flows always like : "i want file X" "wtf is that ?" "tell me what i told you before file X is supposed to be" "bytes 4978459876 through 50987498098" "i want bytes 4978459876 through 50987498098 please" "here you go" "are these file X ?" "fuck you" "does file X even exist ?" "little bitch..." "grep -a -C 500 'known pattern' /dev/sda | tee /tmp/recover" [09:44]
asciilifeform: a http://btcbase.org/log/2018-10-15#1863136 - machine needs no predefine fs, you can use whatever data structures you like and they'll still be there when the power is cycled, per http://www.loper-os.org/?p=231 formula. [09:45]
a111: Logged on 2018-10-15 19:34 asciilifeform: for instance 1 possible answer is 'no files, errything is an s-expression, and names live in gns' [09:45]
asciilifeform: the fs as we know it is a classic example of 'plugging funnel at wrong end'. [09:48]
diana_coman: asciilifeform, good point answered [09:54]
lobbesbot: diana_coman: Sent 14 minutes ago: <asciilifeform> http://ossasepia.com/2018/10/16/smg-comms-chapter-2-raw-types/comment-page-1/#comment-4339 [09:54]
asciilifeform: when disk was refrigerator-sized, its write speed was 100kB/sec, and ram cost 1 toyota per 128kB, in 1980, it made sense to ask operator to manually move data structures to/from disk/ram. imho today it does not. run in ram, persist it to flash when power cuts out , running from supercap. [09:54]
asciilifeform: ohai diana_coman [09:54]
diana_coman: it might really be that my ada-fu is not up to the task yet [09:54]
asciilifeform: diana_coman: dun worry, it will make sense very quickly when you bake the record [09:55]
diana_coman: I expect /hope so meanwhile it's very good to have that observation there, thank you! [09:55]
asciilifeform: diana_coman: didja ever look at my 'nqb' example ? it has buncha records , that get serialized/deserialized correctly [09:55]
asciilifeform: ( some components -- 'manually', as shitoshi used wildly variable sizes some -- cleanly ) [09:55]
diana_coman: I did and I will re-visit it [09:55]
diana_coman: at any rate when I get to the records I might come and whine loudly if I get stuck [09:56]
asciilifeform: diana_coman: you won't need to do any of the streams horror that i did there, because those of your subfields that are arrays, have strictly bounded sizes [09:56]
diana_coman: thing is: there are lots of this "int8 number of keys" followed by "n*int8 key ids" and this in turn is just part of the wider thing [09:57]
asciilifeform: diana_coman: if you get stuck i'ma show you how to make it go, cleanly, i have a working example of nearly the same thing you're doing ( gossip prototype thing ) that simply hasn't been cleaned for publication of yet [09:57]
asciilifeform: same proggy i took the udp lib from [09:58]
BingoBoingo: hanbot: ty [09:58]
diana_coman: noted, thank you [09:58]
asciilifeform: np [09:58]
asciilifeform: of all the various items asciilifeform has used over the yrs, ada ( and not even 'modern', but even back in ada-83 ) has the absolute sanest support for strict record layout that actually worx as described [10:00]
asciilifeform: kinda like cl's 'binary-types' thing, but as part of the language, rather than add-on hackolade [10:00]
asciilifeform: it was one of the items i saw back in '16 and thought 'hmm' [10:01]
diana_coman: and added for clarification re converters since it struck me that it might be unclear there what's all about: http://ossasepia.com/2018/10/16/smg-comms-chapter-2-raw-types/comment-page-1/#comment-4341 [10:03]
asciilifeform: diana_coman: this is correct, i think you grasped it [10:03]
diana_coman: that was my whole point of the separation between layer 0 and layer 1 there: at 0 everything is just an array of octets, nothing more [10:05]
diana_coman: anyway, when I get to the data structures, I'll see re serializing [10:05]
asciilifeform: diana_coman: aha you dun actually need to shovel raw octets anywhere other than the udp transceiver [10:05]
diana_coman: yes [10:06]
asciilifeform: back when i wrote in c, i also serialized/deserialized 'just once', when casting packet to the correct struct, but to precisely nail down the latter required gcc-specific pragmas, as c per se does not give this ability. but in ada the required knobs are standard. [10:07]
deedbot: http://bimbo.club/?p=54 << Bimbo.Club - TMSR Log Summary - 10/13/2018 [10:26]
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-10-16#1863220 << and this is such a fucking boon... [10:36]
a111: Logged on 2018-10-16 13:56 asciilifeform: diana_coman: you won't need to do any of the streams horror that i did there, because those of your subfields that are arrays, have strictly bounded sizes [10:36]
diana_coman: it is! [10:39]
mircea_popescu: anyway, those int8, nint [10:41]
mircea_popescu: things are kinda deliberately made to dovetail with ada, so i hope they do and if they don't we fix. [10:42]
diana_coman: kk I'll keep up this approach of published-even-if-stumbling small steps so on one hand there is something concrete to shoot down if needed and on the other hand we can correct any trouble early on, hopefully [10:44]
mircea_popescu: sounds like the perfect plan [10:51]
mircea_popescu: anyway, /me shall be back ~thurs, though might say hi on the road. but will certainly read teh logs! [10:59]
asciilifeform: ohai mircea_popescu [11:16]
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: enjoy the road [11:16]
BingoBoingo: Have fun [11:47]
BingoBoingo: In other local news, neighbors miss the recently destroyed, poorly stocked, drug fort https://www.elobservador.com.uy/nota/vecinos-extranan-la-seguridad-del-muro-narco-de-su-barrio-20181015192742 [12:43]
diana_coman: !!v 494D05ED14F37EF04279E1E2734703FD2D424F0A05FBB0529D5BB3B31F24D3B2 [14:25]
deedbot: diana_coman updated rating of phf from 2 to 4 << writes at http://barksinthewind.com/ [14:25]
diana_coman: !!v 7E1E4F2FE34E14D134AE36766BDB9B03A33E70E732EA895F3C85B5069050A5CC [14:26]
deedbot: diana_coman unrated EDLionX. [14:26]
diana_coman: !!v B028A6C69F57E59F9FF2C8A8D42E832AFBFCBA384BED37DCB6954AD2D85BC645 [14:28]
deedbot: diana_coman updated rating of hanbot from 2 to 5 << writes at http://thewhet.net/ met irl. [14:28]
diana_coman: !!v 7664D19896607450301C7F57F742BFEE0AD8A86C65BF93C176F82E1E781CC990 [14:30]
deedbot: diana_coman updated rating of mircea_popescu from 5 to 7 << writes at trilema.com at the centre of it all, like it or not met irl. [14:30]
diana_coman: !!v 954D1597F8088BE1679F8B983F91C936D5A90A12AE6AE7BC73634FEE5F6123E1 [14:31]
deedbot: diana_coman updated rating of mod6 from 3 to 4 << writes at http://mod6.net/ [14:31]
diana_coman: !!v 51D9B2F000C98F62F624B2FEB04FE44F223ABA6477CC368D8B2632D33E584814 [14:32]
deedbot: diana_coman unrated wyrdmantis. [14:32]
diana_coman: !!v 912DB9A1C6D979744DD512AAE2608ABA764A2ED6B936F990B49653D3AD463853 [14:36]
deedbot: diana_coman updated rating of lobbes from 2 to 3 << writes at http://blog.lobbesblog.com/ [14:36]
diana_coman: !!v C5547478E1128CE2F64C3EEF99881B95E3F4ED3651A76126651A2F47B4BEBB08 [14:37]
deedbot: diana_coman unrated andreicon. [14:37]
diana_coman: !!v DF1EDA520FF757011AF51DD8636BE05BB40407A53814815502998D715A045126 [14:38]
deedbot: diana_coman updated rating of esthlos from 1 to 2 << writes at http://blog.esthlos.com/ [14:38]
diana_coman: !!v 28D6D307695429A291B597547A035ADA8EEE530E657A5B079B438406AA2CD4CD [14:42]
deedbot: diana_coman updated rating of BingoBoingo from 3 to 4 << writes at bingology.net and qntra.net moved to Uruguay and started Pizarro ISP. [14:42]
diana_coman: !!v 665D5265D7E55647EE0DD68AE67ADC43A270B1C3016F8EA1403181173E27CF37 [14:44]
deedbot: diana_coman updated rating of trinque from 3 to 4 << writes at trinque.org deedbot and cuntoo he makes me want again to visit Texas. [14:44]
diana_coman: !!v 9DE75EF527902CC5D6B9AB61342C527E98BB7F3B5EE33C19E455290EC06A9E6B [14:46]
deedbot: diana_coman rated bvt 1 << introduced himself with well formed question on my blog [14:46]
diana_coman: !!v E5C2C32C4E2E92AC4415BA9BFBAA4715EACC29ED58A7D18699451B08905714BE [14:53]
deedbot: diana_coman rated deedbot 10 << Bot: voice, deeds, wallet http://deedbot.org/help.html [14:53]
diana_coman: that should be all, apologies for the long list of !!v [15:00]
* BingoBoingo back from paying the rent, pretty sure they eyes managed to get a bit of sunburn in spite of sunglasses [15:04]
diana_coman: o.O how do eyes get sunburn BingoBoingo ? [15:06]
diana_coman: BingoBoingo, also, "comminsion" in the most recent qntra title? [15:07]
asciilifeform: cornea burn ? [15:07]
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo has all-natural eyes, no glass [15:08]
asciilifeform: ( possibly the 1 win from wearing glasses, is the uv filter coat... ) [15:08]
BingoBoingo: Well, in this southern hell afternoon walks may lead to a bit of a headache. It increases in intensity and seens to be centered around the eyes. [15:08]
asciilifeform: mno then not this, no headache from cornea burn, just 1 hell of an itch and quicker cataract [15:09]
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: I did wear the UV filters today [15:09]
asciilifeform: then what ails you is old-fashioned heat stroke, drink water [15:09]
BingoBoingo: That could be it [15:10]
BingoBoingo: diana_coman: ty, fxd [15:16]
diana_coman: BingoBoingo, second asciilifeform there: it does sound like heat stroke really cover your head [15:18]
BingoBoingo: Natural headcover still intact [15:18]
diana_coman: I can say the same, but honestly, it was never enough protection against the sun (and fwiw I have thick hair anyway) [15:19]
diana_coman: anyways, each with their own head [15:21]
asciilifeform: when i was in BingoBoingostan, found myself on numerous occasions wishing for cork helmet. [15:21]
asciilifeform: but interestingly 0 sunburn, in asciilifeform's experience sunburn seems to exist only in usa.. [15:21]
diana_coman: ahahah well, I did get sunburn on my shoulders in Costa Rica but mainly because of being in the water most of time while at the beach [15:22]
* BingoBoingo has met a number of not entirely white Brazillians who managed to pick up profound beach sunburn [15:25]
deedbot: http://pizarroisp.net/2018/10/16/pizarro-september-2018-provisional-statement/ << PizarroISP - Pizarro September 2018 Provisional Statement [15:29]
diana_coman: I can easily picture that really at any rate, I got otherwise at least 2 shades darker after the few days by the ocean and even now (so...2 months later) I'm still darker than my natural shade [15:29]
BingoBoingo: My arms and legs manage to tan to darker shades with sun exposure, but my face pretty much constantly stays in a state of more or less accute sunburn regardless of the quantity and frequency of "bloqueador de sol" applied [15:31]
Mocky: BingoBoingo, usually by the end of winter I look like a coffee with too much cream, but slightly too much summer sun and I turn into kunta kinte for 6 months [16:36]
BingoBoingo: Mocky: That sounds rather healthy. My face and ears have taken to the color red as a seemingly permanent part of their color palette [17:21]
BingoBoingo: Mocky: How is Qatar feeling? Does it feel normal yet? [17:51]
BingoBoingo: ATTN: Over the next few weeks I will be making some fairly big changes to the Pizarro website (theme chopping, pictures, etc) If the pizarro site is broken and stays broken please let me know. [18:02]
deedbot: http://qntra.net/2018/10/9-proud-boys-charged-by-nypd-after-being-ambushed-by-antifa-npc-mob/ << Qntra - 9 "Proud Boys" Charged By NYPD After Being Ambushed By Antifa NPC Mob [18:23]
asciilifeform: * deedbot has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) << trinque ? [20:24]
trinque: huh, was rebooted without consent! raaaep!! [20:26]
trinque: ty asciilifeform [20:26]
asciilifeform: np [20:26]
trinque: going to intentionally reboot and make sure I fixed what didn't resurrect last time [20:29]
trinque: great [20:31]
mircea_popescu: fucking rain. [21:55]
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-10-16#1863300 << i think he now also counts as african-american. [21:59]
a111: Logged on 2018-10-16 20:36 Mocky: BingoBoingo, usually by the end of winter I look like a coffee with too much cream, but slightly too much summer sun and I turn into kunta kinte for 6 months [21:59]
asciilifeform: rain ? was mircea_popescu flyin' in a gilder or wat [22:01]
asciilifeform: *glider [22:02]
mircea_popescu: eh some bs tropical storm, rains perpetually till friday. [22:08]
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