Forum logs for 15 Jul 2018

Monday, 16 March, Year 12 d.Tr. | Author:
ben_vulpes: http://trilema.com/forum-logs-for-13-jul-2018#2458963 << yes, sold a small amount of btc via WU through this channel [01:10]
a111: Logged on 2018-07-14 01:56 mircea_popescu: did pizarro ever build up a localbitcoins acct ? [01:10]
ben_vulpes: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-07-14#1834379 << clickbank is fiat-only, and as for the "btc affiliate programs" http://btcbase.org/log/2018-06-21#1828510 [01:13]
a111: Logged on 2018-07-14 01:56 mircea_popescu: did the clickbank account ever stand up ? etc etc, i dunno how executing on the lenghty list of items in the log these pasts month could put one behind. [01:13]
a111: Logged on 2018-06-21 23:47 mircea_popescu: leaving aside the quite obvious question of why would one even entertain a wanna-be bitcoin thing that's uppity enough to not be here in the first place. [01:13]
ben_vulpes: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-07-14#1834420 << he is positioned to do a far better job than i have/can, and i believe that he will [01:17]
a111: Logged on 2018-07-14 02:43 asciilifeform: imho BingoBoingo is ideal for the job. [01:17]
ben_vulpes: for instance (attn asciilifeform, mod6, BingoBoingo), while reviewing books with mod6 recently i realized that i calculated s.mg's lease cost from the machine purchased from s.nsa (which we got bare, no storage), and not from the cost of the machine stuffed full of disks. [01:20]
deedbot: http://pizarroisp.net/2018/07/15/june-statement/ << PizzaroISP - Pizarro June Statement [01:27]
ben_vulpes: BingoBoingo: the only marginally complicated thing about statements is tracking the customer equity line and invoicing for the month-to-month customers, i will hand over my notes and assist you should you take the gig [01:31]
mircea_popescu: diana_coman fucking hysterical, whole package dead because some 'my_print_stacktrace' function ? printing is the death of "open source". [02:19]
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-07-14#1834459 << answer is no bitcoin is a shining example of yahoo usage of threading. [02:50]
a111: Logged on 2018-07-14 13:25 brazilish: first question is: do initial sync benefits from moar cores? [02:50]
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-07-14#1834507 << jesus god yes. unix is not even usable w/o screen. [02:53]
a111: Logged on 2018-07-14 15:09 diana_coman: ftr screen also fails and I'd rather have it than not have it but it's not a eulora dep in itself [02:53]
mircea_popescu: this is bizarre enough, http://p.bvulpes.com/ still up, but if you try and paste anything it goes dead. [03:06]
* asciilifeform tried it just nao, seems to work [07:33]
asciilifeform: re 'screen' -- funnily enuff for many yrs asciilifeform did not use it aside from as rs232 terminal a la 'kermit' for the absolutely fucking vital item of 'leave my bg processes alone when i disconnect', used simply 'nohup', which comes with afaik errry unix since system5 [07:41]
spyked: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-07-14#1834346 <-- fwiw, I believe I'm also ill-equipped for this job. I'd only trust a spyked to get this right after he's delivered on at least a couple of self-directed projects, and even then... I need a wee bit more experience under my belt. on this note, /me finds http://trilema.com/2018/technology-and-governance/ to be a good reread. [08:41]
a111: Logged on 2018-07-14 00:13 lobbes: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-07-13#1834333 << I'll state for the record that I consider myself largely unqualified for the role (plus my hopper overfloweth atm) [08:41]
BingoBoingo: ben_vulpes: I am inclined to take the gig [09:29]
diana_coman: asciilifeform, re screen & nohup: metoo! but nowadays I do use screen a LOT [09:31]
diana_coman: BingoBoingo, go for it! [09:33]
BingoBoingo: brb, time to go for a walk [09:55]
BingoBoingo: But yes, I am on location. My name is on the fiat side paperwork. The incentives are lined up. Make Uruguay, Great Again! [09:55]
shinohai: gm #trilema http://btcbase.org/log/2018-07-13#1834119 <<< Ran a x86 node 3+ years with mechanical hdd, aggression patch did keep mine within ~10 blocks always. [10:22]
a111: Logged on 2018-07-13 15:31 diana_coman: asciilifeform> shinohai: trying doesn't hurt. and iirc somebody actually got a mechanical-hdd node to stay synced more or less decently with aggression patch -> yes, I did [10:22]
shinohai: When my rockchips arrive though, i guess i'll use one of my old rusty hdd's in one just for lulz, I have like 10 now. [10:23]
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: congrats [10:33]
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-07-15#1834721 << for comparison -- what was it like prior to 'aggression' ? [10:35]
a111: Logged on 2018-07-15 14:22 shinohai: gm #trilema http://btcbase.org/log/2018-07-13#1834119 <<< Ran a x86 node 3+ years with mechanical hdd, aggression patch did keep mine within ~10 blocks always. [10:35]
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-07-15#1834717 << there's really not a substitute for 'screen' if you're leaving ~interactive~ cmd line processes in background (e.g. shells) , aha [10:36]
a111: Logged on 2018-07-15 13:31 diana_coman: asciilifeform, re screen & nohup: metoo! but nowadays I do use screen a LOT [10:36]
shinohai: Pretty much same as I always reported, usually stayed several "days" behind, this did not improve until I purchased samsung ssd about a year ago. [10:36]
* shinohai has always used tmux, but did use screen for some time. [10:37]
asciilifeform: incidentally, a miniature raid (i.e. harness 4 cheapo hdd to 1 usb3 cable) would be a very useful thing. which afaik unfortunately does not exist. [10:38]
shinohai: A friend of mine has one of those mediasonic mini raid boxes, i cant remember how many drives it holds. [10:40]
asciilifeform: shinohai: afaik these all use 'software' raid [10:40]
shinohai: bummer [10:41]
asciilifeform: stupidly expensive, too, for what they do. [10:41]
shinohai: Thankfully, pogo turned out to be great NAT device, I run a mech hdd in the dumb-as-bricks vertical hdd slot, and a samsung t3 portable ssd from the top usb connector. [10:44]
shinohai: SO have entire trb chain backed up in case of failure ( also www, etc) [10:44]
asciilifeform: shinohai: didja bake own nat thing for it, or used the vendor's shitware ? [10:44]
asciilifeform: shinohai: speaking of www, yours seems to be down just nao ? [10:45]
shinohai: nah, i made own setup after the arch linux install, just do a gentoo chroot once in to sort of unify my setup [10:45]
shinohai: yeah www is down for netbsd upgrade [10:46]
asciilifeform: aa [10:46]
shinohai: pogo also makes a handy local binhost, for those who don't wish to build the same 500 packages when trying new stuff on gentoo. [10:47]
asciilifeform: nat is very much a 2edged sword, just 2 or 3 nat boxen with heavy use will saturate typical GB lan switch [10:47]
asciilifeform: nas, rather [10:47]
shinohai: yeah s/NAT/NAS above [10:48]
asciilifeform: shinohai: i've found that trb state can't be effectively backed up without stopping the node ( otherwise indices turn to barf . ) how do you do yours ? periodic stops ? [10:55]
asciilifeform: and whole concept of 'backing up trb' strikes me as wrongheaded -- the most effective backup is simply a 2nd node. [10:56]
asciilifeform: a new node plugged directly in ( i.e. over lan ) to a working trb node, with 'aggression' should sync in week or 2. [10:57]
asciilifeform: ( if we had the 'configurable checkpoints thing' discussed 2y ago, this would sync in 3 days or so ) [10:58]
asciilifeform: i.e. at ~max speed permitted by the disk writes. [10:59]
asciilifeform: you can approximate the effect with dumpblock/eatblock. [11:00]
shinohai: asciilifeform my system is by no means perfect .... but yeah periodic stops, I only scheduled rsync for twice weekly to pogo, to minimize downtime. Never results in more than half-hour downtime. [11:01]
shinohai: Which is far better than starting from zero when hdd crashed that time and I lost whole thing xD [11:02]
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform check this out : i got a bundle which compiles to 64 bits except one lib, which compiles to 32 bit and then i get " wrong ELF class: ELFCLASS32 Program exited with code 0177". the configure for it manages to ignore both enable-lib64 --disable-lib32 and CFLAGS=-m64 CXXFLAGS=-m64 LDFLAGS=-m64 sets of flags. you ever heard of such ?! [11:38]
trinque: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-07-14#1834507 << read and enjoyed your porting process for mysql. this will be how things go. many items already have patched ebuilds in the musl-overlay, which your system is using atop traditional portage. some wont, and will need to be fixed. [11:39]
a111: Logged on 2018-07-14 15:09 diana_coman: ftr screen also fails and I'd rather have it than not have it but it's not a eulora dep in itself [11:39]
mircea_popescu: i can't tell you just how fucking thrilled we are it was actually approachable in this level. [11:40]
mircea_popescu: usualyl when you end up going into codepile to ablate idiocy you discover the broken glass [11:40]
trinque: indeed, glad to see she got right through [11:40]
mircea_popescu: anyway, fwiw : mysql existing as gnat/cuntoo item (combined with its deployment in mp-wp, eulora etc) pretty much guarantees by now that tmsr db will be mysql derivative. [11:41]
mircea_popescu: if anyone has serious issues with this better get a portage candidate up asap so it can be imported when cuntoo comes, because otherwise it's as dead as the woodchipped people. [11:42]
mircea_popescu: postgres or w/e. [11:42]
trinque: musl will "break" where it refused to implement glibc feature-creep outside the posix libc standard. it's a stricter implementation. [11:45]
trinque: some of this work won't have to be done completely ab initio there are musltronic distros out there that can at least act as source material for research, alpine and void linux for example. [11:46]
diana_coman: trinque, cheers! glad it wasn't worse there really (will see for the rest :D ) [11:47]
mircea_popescu: trinque im not saying it's impossible, by any means but it'll have to be either done or not done, there's no "i'm not waht i do i'm what i dream". like a wedding, "anyone wanting postgres/whatever speak now or stfu fe&e" [11:48]
trinque: 100% agree, and appreciate the underscoring of it. no "hobbyist approach" will work. [11:49]
trinque: to take a specific example, my mention of musl distros isn't an excuse for anyone to blindly pilfer patches and then sign because "built!!" [11:50]
mircea_popescu: great way to get whacked. [11:51]
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-07-15#1834748 << trb node is one of the few items that ~can't~ be backed up in the usual sense. because what you get if you just blindly copy is a shitup not a backup. [11:59]
a111: Logged on 2018-07-15 14:56 asciilifeform: and whole concept of 'backing up trb' strikes me as wrongheaded -- the most effective backup is simply a 2nd node. [11:59]
mircea_popescu: bitcoin is not "blockchain technologies" shitheadery, it's precisely ~adnotated data~, lisp style. there's no meaning to it outside of context. [11:59]
mircea_popescu: and apropos of nothing/everything : " Magic: 7f 45 4c 46 02 01 01 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 " << this fucking annoys me. [12:01]
deedbot: http://trinque.org/2018/07/15/deedbot-wallet-on-chain-operations-resumed/ << trinque - Deedbot wallet on-chain operations resumed [12:05]
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-07-15#1834755 << pretty interesting -- what proggy was this ? [12:10]
a111: Logged on 2018-07-15 15:38 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform check this out : i got a bundle which compiles to 64 bits except one lib, which compiles to 32 bit and then i get " wrong ELF class: ELFCLASS32 Program exited with code 0177". the configure for it manages to ignore both enable-lib64 --disable-lib32 and CFLAGS=-m64 CXXFLAGS=-m64 LDFLAGS=-m64 sets of flags. you ever heard of such ?! [12:10]
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-07-15#1834762 << when i get own cuntoo test machine up, will test postgres also ( phuctor is currently baked on postgres, though in principle it would also work on mysql etc., simply never yet tried ) [12:11]
a111: Logged on 2018-07-15 15:42 mircea_popescu: if anyone has serious issues with this better get a portage candidate up asap so it can be imported when cuntoo comes, because otherwise it's as dead as the woodchipped people. [12:11]
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-07-15#1834771 << from ~cold~ node it backs up as well as anything else . point was that i can't think of any good reason to do it that way, nodes ( correctly-built, i.e. with aggression ) are self-replicating reasonably quickly [12:13]
a111: Logged on 2018-07-15 15:59 mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-07-15#1834748 << trb node is one of the few items that ~can't~ be backed up in the usual sense. because what you get if you just blindly copy is a shitup not a backup. [12:13]
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-07-15#1834764 << oh hm trinque already tried postgres ? it barfed ? where ? [12:14]
a111: Logged on 2018-07-15 15:45 trinque: musl will "break" where it refused to implement glibc feature-creep outside the posix libc standard. it's a stricter implementation. [12:14]
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-07-15#1834774 << where was this ? [12:14]
a111: Logged on 2018-07-15 16:01 mircea_popescu: and apropos of nothing/everything : " Magic: 7f 45 4c 46 02 01 01 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 " << this fucking annoys me. [12:14]
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform standard readelf output [12:14]
asciilifeform: aa [12:14]
mircea_popescu: anyway, it turns out the lib built ~is~ 64 bit, contrary to my assumption that error messages are useful. [12:15]
mircea_popescu: so strike all that. [12:15]
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: btw were you building with trinque's gcc or with ave1 's ? [12:17]
mircea_popescu: vintage 4.x [12:18]
asciilifeform: well they're both 'vintage 4.x' [12:18]
mircea_popescu: right, but this is mine. [12:18]
asciilifeform: aa [12:18]
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-07-15#1834764 << trinque do you have a list of items you observed to be broken under musl ? or is this still in the works [12:22]
a111: Logged on 2018-07-15 15:45 trinque: musl will "break" where it refused to implement glibc feature-creep outside the posix libc standard. it's a stricter implementation. [12:22]
asciilifeform: the 2 major ones i specifically recall in logs were 'screen' and emacs [12:23]
mircea_popescu: though it's arguable emacs works in any sense. [12:24]
asciilifeform: [insert oblig emacs thread here] [12:25]
mircea_popescu: anyway, i expect neither gtk nor kde work, and i expect contrary to postgresetc discussion above, nobody likes any of 'em even vaguely enough to import. [12:25]
mircea_popescu: but should probably try X at some point i guess. [12:26]
asciilifeform: i can't picture anybody shedding a tear for gtk/kde/etc [12:26]
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform just as long as i can still use cuntoo to show cunts their cunts too! [12:26]
asciilifeform: plain x oughta suffice, for this. [12:26]
mircea_popescu: if it works. which... [12:27]
mircea_popescu: video drivers etc. [12:27]
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: kernel mods dun use userland libc, so this should in principle not be affected by muslism [12:27]
mircea_popescu: i guess we'll find out soon enough. [12:28]
asciilifeform: will be interesting to put cuntoo on box with vga card and see if, for instance, any www browser can be made to run. [12:29]
mircea_popescu: re http://btcbase.org/log/2018-07-12#1833740 the above http://btcbase.org/log/2018-07-15#1834793 is 4.4.3 [12:29]
a111: Logged on 2018-07-12 11:18 asciilifeform: trinque's gcc, btw, is exactly as was printed on the crate, x86_64-gentoo-linux-musl 4.9.4 [12:29]
a111: Logged on 2018-07-15 16:18 mircea_popescu: right, but this is mine. [12:29]
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform and by "any" you mean which ? [12:30]
mircea_popescu: i've conducted a review of extant browsers outside of opera ~none work worth a shit and in the lulziest of manners, eg, firefox 45 crashes about 4.5 times more frequently than firefox 10. and so on. [12:30]
asciilifeform: i meant 'any'. afaik the only remaining graphical www thing that builds even on asciilifeform's ban-flagged gentoo ( not even speaking of musl ) is old firefox. [12:30]
asciilifeform: i dun know much about ye olde closedsores opera -- if it was built statically, it oughta run on cuntoo [12:31]
asciilifeform: if not -- then guaranteed bomb [12:31]
mircea_popescu: kinda my point. [12:31]
asciilifeform: ( i assumed mircea_popescu was speaking of ye olde norwegian ministry of telecom or wherever 1MB closed x86 opera, rather than the 'modern' abortion ) [12:32]
asciilifeform: commercial/closed binariolade 'for linux' will not run on cuntoo unless it was built statically, but prolly erryone realizes this. [12:33]
mircea_popescu: afaik they were, even as far as the 10.x series but this i've never put to the cuntoo test. [12:36]
mircea_popescu: here included by reference, the "acid3 test" lulz etc. who even remembers 2007 anymoar. [12:37]
* asciilifeform fires up box with opera 12.16 -- confirmed static [12:37]
asciilifeform: so yes you could run it. tho on x86/amd64 strictly, naturally, afaik there was never a build for arm etc [12:38]
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform iirc that's the last one where it can even be claimed to be a thing, afterwards moved to being skin on chrome. [12:39]
asciilifeform: aha, sorta why i had it lying around [12:39]
asciilifeform: afaik it was the very last. [12:39]
mircea_popescu: imo that's the correct cut here : not "oh, is it the 1995 safari-clone by nowegians" but "oh, is it the thing before or after google gutted it" [12:39]
asciilifeform: google et al not only gutted it, but arranged for the orig src to be buried in cement, for the obv reason. [12:41]
mircea_popescu: also imported by reference, all the "oh, we're moving to webkit, it's so great and good and btw folks, totally A TECHNICAL DECISION OK!!!" then google drops webkit moves on to their in-house shitpile, oprea "dev" team is like... o yeah totally! [12:41]
mircea_popescu: this cock, it tastes so very technical! [12:41]
mircea_popescu: doesn't it amstan , you dirty little whore daughter of a stupid mother. [12:41]
asciilifeform: in other heathen wtf's, https://archive.is/Ovauh >> 'Covert radio communications: a viable tactic for international terrorists?' [12:50]
asciilifeform: ( d00d, apparently, 'professional' doctrine/ops handbooks/etc spewer for usg ) [12:55]
asciilifeform: 'Hank Prunckun is associate professor of intelligence analysis at the Australian Graduate School of Policing and Security, Charles Sturt University, Sydney' blah etc. [12:55]
asciilifeform: OfficiallyEndorsed by hitler!11 ( https://archive.is/wrqK2 ) [12:56]
mircea_popescu: good thing they got trilema to crib [13:08]
asciilifeform: vintage, '14 lulgem, cribbing '13 trilema. [13:12]
deedbot: http://trilema.com/2018/lamb-aspic/ << Trilema - Lamb aspic [13:56]
mircea_popescu: meanwhile in the amusement files, MistressCrow20 20F Mistress 29m "How about YOU drop everything and kiss the ground in front of my feet? Im not kidding at all." LordMPofTMSR "No, because you're female." [14:02]
mircea_popescu: in carlin's own words, "that tends to hold them for about half an hour." [14:02]
mircea_popescu: oh, and to piss off trinque ave1 asciilifeform whoever else : quote last line of ldd --version on those vintage gccs ? :D [14:03]
BingoBoingo: <trinque> some of this work won't have to be done completely ab initio there are musltronic distros out there that can at least act as source material for research, alpine and void linux for example. <<As far as I can tell Alpine is a musl build of gentoo, comparatively clean. Void on the other hand is more like a tampon. Bloody inside and out [14:49]
mod6: Pizarro's bitcoins have been sent to my deedbot account in the amount of: 6.21445021 BTC [15:11]
mod6: !!pay jurov 0.46713262 [15:13]
deedbot: Get your OTP: http://p.bvulpes.com/pastes/mQfFE/?raw=true [15:13]
mod6: !!v 43D6BFBE080DEEA6D24BCF04F12AFCEF9521797DC62C0B3749E97370D586A36C [15:17]
deedbot: mod6 paid jurov 0.46713262 [15:17]
mod6: !!ledger [15:18]
deedbot: http://p.bvulpes.com/pastes/nZCBq/?raw=true [15:18]
mod6: Remaining Pizarro Balance: 5.83211428 BTC [15:22]
mod6: ignore this ^ some of my previous balance was added into that. [15:25]
mod6: !Qcalc 6.21445021 - 0.46713262 [15:25]
lobbesbot: mod6: 5.74731759 [15:25]
mod6: This is the current Pizarro BTC balance ^. [15:26]
mod6: In other news, BingoBoingo has accepted the position as Pizarro Manager, and officially will take over in this role after the August Statement is published in the first few days of September. Congrats to BingoBoingo! [15:28]
mircea_popescu: check out this beauty : dpkg -S /usr/lib/libGL.so.1 > dpkg: /usr/lib/libGL.so.1 not found. meanwhile $ ldd /usr/bin/glxinfo | grep "libGL" > libGL.so.1 => /usr/lib/mesa/libGL.so.1 (0x00007f129e644000) [15:32]
mircea_popescu: it... maybe exists. [15:33]
BingoBoingo: Well, what would the GNU is gnu/lumix be without gnostic dilemmas? [15:34]
deedbot: http://qntra.net/2018/07/french-police-deploy-tear-gas-to-contain-riots-after-african-world-cup-victory/ << Qntra - French Police Deploy Tear Gas To Contain Riots After African World Cup Victory [20:09]
mircea_popescu: ahaha [20:13]
BingoBoingo: Cooking steaks for the Peruana to celebrate the end of nationality as a thing [20:29]
mircea_popescu: sizzle dad shizzle! [20:30]
BingoBoingo: And the Uruguayos at the hostel were all in favor of unifying with Croatia before 2022 [20:30]
mircea_popescu: lol [20:30]
BingoBoingo: Both cuntries are within 1,000,000 warm bodies of each other [20:32]
BingoBoingo: Both have lots of cows [20:32]
mircea_popescu: better tit in republica oriental. [20:34]
mircea_popescu: tehn again, better tall in lesser serbia [20:34]
BingoBoingo: Unlike the attempt at a maritime adventure, this effort has time on its side [20:34]
BingoBoingo: And for the logs the steaks in question are 402 grams of entrecot, cost of 130 pesos [20:38]
trinque: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-07-15#1834795 << nah, no list yet. I've yet to successfully build a lisp, but alpine has sbcl, so I don't wager it's impossible. [21:21]
a111: Logged on 2018-07-15 16:22 asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-07-15#1834764 << trinque do you have a list of items you observed to be broken under musl ? or is this still in the works [21:21]
deedbot: http://blog.esthlos.com/log-reading-week-2/ << esthlos - Log Reading, Week 2 [22:18]
Category: Logs
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