Forum logs for 12 May 2016

Monday, 16 March, Year 12 d.Tr. | Author:
mircea_popescu: $up indoor_jellyfish [01:03]
deedbot: indoor_jellyfish voiced for 30 minutes. [01:03]
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform nope. [01:04]
indoor_jellyfish: Does anyone know of a document that explains the linux boot process in detail? I've lisp code that builds /a/ ResuceCD ( but not /the/ ResuceCD needed for Masamune. [01:08]
indoor_jellyfish: ie, it the current process doesn't package together the existing libraries / binaries /sources on disk into the bootable USB, and instead uses my re-write of "Roll your own ResueCD" ( [01:10]
indoor_jellyfish: which uses and unpacked archive of binaries from the author of that blog post [01:10]
indoor_jellyfish: I don't really understand how the C linker or the rest of the linux "toolkit" works (eg, chroot) and a detailed explanation of how I would arrange a set of files + binaries, bundle them and generate a minimal bootable USB would go a long way. [01:11]
* indoor_jellyfish is gabriel_laddel [01:11]
indoor_jellyfish: without such a document, the masamune replication will get done, but it'll take a while.. [01:12]
BingoBoingo: [01:13]
punkman: later tell gabriel_laddel [04:36]
gribble: The operation succeeded. [04:36]
jurov: punkman these look like kernel innards, gabriel was asking more about userspace [07:05]
jurov: funny that I can't remember any concrete source how I learned that stuff. it somehow accreted [07:06]
jurov: later tell gabriel_laddel you'll definitely need this: [07:08]
gribble: The operation succeeded. [07:08]
punkman: jurov, dunno looks like it covers the whole thing [09:07]
mircea_popescu: jurov> funny that I can't remember any concrete source how I learned that stuff. it somehow accreted <<< thinking about it i dun think a proper source exists, outside of carder forums or w/e equiv. [09:09]
mircea_popescu: maybe good move for gabriel_laddel to actually post that thing on his blog once he makes it. [09:10]
mircea_popescu: o hey, paymium now joins bitstamp on the list of wanna-be bitcoin exchanges that email spam. [09:13]
asciilifeform: << aaaaaaassctually [09:41]
a111: Logged on 2016-05-12 13:09 mircea_popescu: jurov> funny that I can't remember any concrete source how I learned that stuff. it somehow accreted <<< thinking about it i dun think a proper source exists, outside of carder forums or w/e equiv. [09:41]
asciilifeform: it is in the logz! [09:41]
asciilifeform: my pogotron had it all... [09:41]
asciilifeform: srsly [09:42]
mircea_popescu: oh right you are huh. [09:50]
shinohai: I managed to make my own gentoo livecd a few weeks ago ... I used the roll-your-own initramfs thing like jurov posted earlier [09:53]
phf: asciilifeform: [10:04]
asciilifeform: << whole set?!!?? [10:05]
a111: Logged on 2016-05-12 14:04 phf: asciilifeform: [10:05]
phf: yes [10:05]
asciilifeform: where? [10:06]
asciilifeform: djvu or it neverhappened (tm) (r) [10:07]
phf: there's really too much documents for my lowly eos 5d, but i'm going for teh ic schematics and such. it's mostly like "here's how you machine part 560345 front left hinge" [10:09]
asciilifeform: how many schmidts you had to kill to get these! [10:09]
mircea_popescu: check him out ? [10:15]
mircea_popescu: phf care to qntra ? :) [10:17]
phf: no, this needs further slow movement. i'm still hoping to get the whole set on another trip [10:19]
phf: like there are cable assemblies, that are handy for repairs or new construction, that i just don't have time to capture [10:20]
mircea_popescu: what's the constraint ? [10:20]
phf: he still has open maintenance contracts [10:28]
phf: while the bulk is software, a dwindling part of it is repairs and console upkeep [10:30]
phf: the intended purpose is to help lispm owners maintain systems on their own since the number of available parts is basically two stables in a barn and those are going to the usual suspects [10:35]
phf: and since asciilifeform is a lispm owner i don't see particularly reason why s.nsa shouldn't have access to it [10:37]
asciilifeform: << there is one possible boojum that i know of: [10:41]
a111: Logged on 2016-05-12 14:19 phf: no, this needs further slow movement. i'm still hoping to get the whole set on another trip [10:41]
asciilifeform: most of the 'good stuff' was GAL listings [10:41]
asciilifeform: rather than schematics [10:41]
asciilifeform: as smbx was among the first outfits to use synthesized logic [10:41]
asciilifeform: i'll be quite surprised if these are to be found in the papers david s releases to machine owners [10:42]
asciilifeform: and they are what is needed to replicate the thing on fpga. [10:42]
asciilifeform: (either that or the 'snap4' emulator source code) [10:42]
phf: that's true, but those are not lost either [10:44]
mircea_popescu: this is pretty cool. [10:46]
mircea_popescu: $rated phf [10:46]
deedbot: mircea_popescu rated phf 3 at 3668926147 << Teh desire has been expressed and heard! [10:46]
phf: the main constraint is those same open maintenance contracts, but ultimately guy wants all that stuff preserved [10:46]
mircea_popescu: $rate phf 4 Keeper of the logs and of Symbolics history. [10:47]
deedbot: Get your OTP: [10:47]
mircea_popescu: $v 5B32D3412CCCD6B40CAE1CC564C953BE033C546D99BD1E35C62E449B93BCA1E2 [10:47]
deedbot: mircea_popescu updated rating of phf from 3 to 4 << Keeper of the logs and of Symbolics history. [10:47]
asciilifeform: phf: last thing dks said to me was that the rights to the whole shebang were bought at auction by prof j mallery of mit/nsa. [10:53]
asciilifeform: or rather, he admitted that they were sold, but did not say to whom, i discovered through other informants [10:53]
phf: i know that mallery owns the entire software side, no idea where the vlsi falls, but afaiu that's the reason why nobody's doing anything with the assets [11:02]
phf: but after shuffling "assembly" and "harness" papers for two days i know for a fact that some dedicated japanese man will be able to lovingly carve an smbx replica as his chosen otaku hobby [11:08]
asciilifeform: l0l [11:25]
asciilifeform: phf: the vlsi falls squarely in the software side afaik [11:26]
asciilifeform: it existed almost entirely as src text [11:26]
asciilifeform: ditto the synthesis system [11:26]
asciilifeform: (smbx had this, apparently, before ~anybody else, though today it is sop) [11:27]
asciilifeform: a smbx box actually contained not 1 but ~3~ computers [11:28]
asciilifeform: the lispm itself, the 'fep' (which did disk/tape/etc. i/o, and was its own m68k machine) plus another m68k in the console [11:28]
asciilifeform: it might be possible to recreate the last 2 from the schematics. [11:29]
asciilifeform: fwiw. [11:29]
phf: there are some funny comments about t.i. people on the margins [11:29]
asciilifeform: the largest competitor, aha [11:29]
asciilifeform: (ti sold what was mostly a straight miniature clone of the original mit lispm) [11:29]
asciilifeform: i will note that there are no unusual cables (other than the long triax console cable) in my lispm [11:35]
asciilifeform: the internals are mostly on the backplane. [11:35]
asciilifeform: (disk is on a st-506 cable but the pinout is public and you can buy the cable on, e.g., ebay) [11:37]
asciilifeform: dc power supply (a monster, iron box in the machine) was made by 3rd party and has labeled screw terminals [11:38]
asciilifeform: the last true smbx box, xl1200, actually had standard scsi in it. [11:39]
asciilifeform: (and the 'macivory' product that sat in a 68k mac, was simply a card with the smbx cpu in it... no cables at all) [11:40]
asciilifeform: at one point i considered buying one, but was not able to swing the access to the needed microscopy [11:40]
asciilifeform: $up luke-jr [11:40]
deedbot: luke-jr voiced for 30 minutes. [11:40]
asciilifeform: what brings you here luke-jr ? [11:41]
luke-jr: so we're discussing whether we can get consensus for a hardfork with the community here [11:41]
luke-jr: is there any possibility of that, or is it just impossible? [11:42]
asciilifeform: luke-jr: what's in your hardfork ? [11:42]
luke-jr: asciilifeform: not sure yet ideally, only things that everyone thinks are acceptable (including people here) [11:42]
asciilifeform: well nobody can answer this mega-question until the concretes are given, neh ? [11:43]
luke-jr: (unreasonable people demand we support 2 MB old transactions) [11:43]
asciilifeform: normally folks going hard-forking have some specific idea of why... [11:44]
luke-jr: asciilifeform: to show the industry that a hardfork and consensus is a possible thing [11:45]
mircea_popescu: luke-jr do your reading. [11:47]
mircea_popescu: also, please don't refer to tmsr as "a community". it is not "a community", it is your liege. [11:47]
* shinohai makes popcorn [11:49]
luke-jr: asciilifeform: things I'd like to see in it would be merged mining, additional inputs to the generation transaction, and maybe fix block withholding [11:50]
mircea_popescu: $down luke-jr [11:50]
mircea_popescu: as the romanian expression goes, prostu' parca nu-i destul daca nu e si fudul. [11:51]
trinque: << serious wtf I'll look into it [12:15]
a111: Logged on 2016-05-11 21:38 mircea_popescu: world of tanks lol. trinque wtf the api can't be that broken ?! [12:15]
trinque: << wrote my bot with the intention of making creating new commands very easy [12:16]
a111: Logged on 2016-05-12 01:39 mod6: trinque: any thoughts here? should we just collaborate on this? phf? [12:16]
trinque: could be that you expose some api - or SQL - my direction, or otherwise that I somehow sync (rsync?) tickets from you [12:18]
trinque: << yeah, "commandbot" is WoTsauce [12:18]
a111: Logged on 2016-05-12 01:49 mircea_popescu: quite possibly, see what trinque says. running two bots does not necessarily mean one must write two bots. [12:18]
trinque: << shinohai, nice dude! [12:21]
shinohai: Trying to get all that stuff mioved over to a site we control. I'm actually liking clwiki now, thanks for providing it! [12:25]
trinque: sweet [12:26]
shinohai: The bot section will need a whole new writeup though, since everything was merged into deedbot so gotta get a list of all those features compiled. [12:27]
trinque: $help [12:37]
deedbot: [12:37]
trinque: shinohai: deedbot's can link to that, as I'll have that autogenerated from its sauce [12:37]
shinohai: ah ok will do [12:40]
PeterL: hi all [12:41]
PeterL: so, I bought a house, I figured it is a good time to lock up a loan at 3.5% interest for 30 years [12:42]
PeterL: rates can't go much lower than they are [12:43]
shinohai: trinque: how do i insert a line break? <br> doesn't work it seems. [13:23]
shinohai: and now I am getting 502 error as well :/ [13:34]
trinque: yeah I did that [13:35]
trinque: it's back [13:35]
shinohai: Good, I didn't break it [13:35]
trinque: wait one sec [13:35]
trinque: :p [13:35]
trinque: damned thing doesn't shit errors out anywhere [13:40]
trinque: so I'll be digging for a minute [13:40]
shinohai: kk no worries [13:42]
asciilifeform: from the bureau of vintage lulz: [13:51]
asciilifeform: 'For instance, Diffie quizzed an MIT colleague named Dan Edwards, who would join the NSA after graduating. "He was extremely unhelpful," Diffie later reported, "failing to reveal things which were certainly not classified and which I later saw in the bibliography of his thesis." And when a colleague at Mitre went to work at IDA, Diffie asked him if he could share anything about his work. After a tan [13:55]
asciilifeform: talizing pause: no.' [13:55]
mircea_popescu: PeterL even if they do, if you can't use capital more productively than 5% a year it's time to go back to school. [14:22]
mircea_popescu: (yes - that's the point of sending kids to school. to get them from where their average capital productivity is < 0% to where they get at least even with average. which should be within reach for an iq 100 fellow which is the only meaningful definition of iq available in the first place.) [14:23]
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform goes right back to the whole "gestapo couldn't keep abreast of all the phonecalls from the "innocent public" they kept receiving". just like policeman rarely works there as a job, and generally works there as a hedge against his own inferiority complexes, derps working for nsa work there mostly for to be working there. [14:24]
PeterL: so are you saying you wouldn't lend money at less than 5% because you have better things to do with it? [14:25]
mircea_popescu: PeterL something like that. i wouldn't lend money in general, i'm not old and out of touch enough for that. [14:25]
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform to look at it from a different perspective : attaching the attribute "classified" to a specified item has a number of effects on the world, some of which can have associated values that are computable. one such example is : that it triggers interest from the enemy, however defined. this is clearly a -. another one such example is : that it makes the workforce feel more important. since compensation always has to [14:27]
mircea_popescu: = "opportunity cost" + "self-actualisation value", and since the sort of idiots that actually take jobs with the nsa have very simple "self actualisation" functions, which often evaluate to "be in a place where things are called 'classified'", then this necessarily is a +. [14:27]
mircea_popescu: it stands then to reason to say that classification is more of a hr/personnel retention tool than a opsec instrument. [14:28]
mircea_popescu: experience seems amusingly enough to confirm this theory. [14:28]
asciilifeform: toilet cleaning schedule is classified [14:30]
asciilifeform: but so is manhattan project. [14:30]
mircea_popescu: and it ended up with the russians. [14:31]
asciilifeform: so it did. [14:31]
mircea_popescu: so that didn't help or even hindered. [14:32]
asciilifeform: usa of the period was a culturally impoverished zimbabwe [14:32]
asciilifeform: was stuck using foreign specialists. [14:32]
mircea_popescu: meanwhile, it DID make the job of recruiters that much easier. [14:32]
mircea_popescu: i am not so convinced the past 60 years made the us any less of a culturally impoverished zimbabwe. it's still not a nation, nor much of a country. it doesn't even make much of a hotel, used to be a sort of cote d'azur, now more like jamaica. [14:33]
mircea_popescu: "the place where middleaged couples with strange ideas about what'd put the spark back in the bedroom go for massage-vacations" [14:33]
asciilifeform: my point was, they use aryans now. [14:43]
asciilifeform: wake me up when princeton leaks even 1 page. [14:44]
trinque: << [14:46]
a111: Logged on 2016-05-12 17:23 shinohai: trinque: how do i insert a line break? <br> doesn't work it seems. [14:46]
asciilifeform: [16:43]
shinohai: ^ kek [16:46]
mircea_popescu: is this good for bitcoin ? [16:58]
BingoBoingo: lol [17:07]
deedbot: [Trilema] The Megawatt standard - [17:14]
BingoBoingo: Meaningful rebellion in one's twilight years [17:21]
mircea_popescu: awww. [20:56]
mod6: <+asciilifeform> << lol these should go up everywhere [21:30]
trinque: all the abstinence kids look like their genes are quite happy with calling their current derp the end of the road. [22:02]
mircea_popescu: word. [22:03]
deedbot: [» Contravex: A blog by Pete Dushenski] Outsourcing fever. - [23:24]
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