Forum logs for 30 Mar 2013

Saturday, 23 November, Year 11 d.Tr. | Author: Mircea Popescu

thestringpuller	;;ticker	[00:00]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [VTX] 1 @ 0.479 BTC [+]	[00:05]
thestringpuller	$oix	[00:06]
thestringpuller	!ticker ^oix	[00:06]
assbot	Hell, ain't we about more fucked than a whore at closin' time, huh?	[00:06]
thestringpuller	!ticker m ^oix	[00:06]
assbot	[MPEX:^OIX] 1D: 0 / 0 / 0 (0 shares, 0 BTC), 7D: 66.95953589 / 85.06143152 / 85.06556611 (111084 shares, 22,108.25 BTC), 30D: 0 / 0 / 0 (0 shares, 0 BTC)	[00:06]
mircea_popescu	MJR_III i don't really.	[00:07]
jborkl	https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=80312.1080	[00:07]
mircea_popescu	;;ticker	[00:07]
KRS1	lol@assbot	[00:07]
KRS1	is that his warning	[00:08]
benkay	/join #chef	[00:08]
thestringpuller	mircea_popescu: gribble is down	[00:10]
thestringpuller	;;gribble	[00:10]
gribble	yes I am gribble. why do you keep bothering me?	[00:10]
thestringpuller	;;asks	[00:10]
mircea_popescu	lolk	[00:10]
thestringpuller	mircea_popescu you are working some magic...	[00:10]
thestringpuller	sometimes I wonder who actually has more power, people like you, or the blokes at the bank...	[00:11]
MJR_III	;;calc 1+1	[00:11]
gribble	2	[00:11]
MJR_III	gribble is working...	[00:11]
mircea_popescu	i has no powar	[00:12]
MJR_III	bitfinex is down i think	[00:13]
smickles	ya know, i don't recall bitcoinica going down as often as ya'll say bitfinex goes down	[00:16]
smickles	'coinica really only went down once	[00:16]
MJR_III	its back up	[00:16]
MJR_III	i think it has to do with the cloudflare anti-dddos	[00:16]
*	saulimus has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)	[00:16]
*	saulimus (~someone@37-219-41-67.nat.bb.dnainternet.fi) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[00:17]
jurov	so i just came from meeting about btc alternatives	[00:19]
jurov	that changed into ppcoin sales pitch	[00:19]
MJR_III	jurov: alt chains?	[00:19]
jurov	yes	[00:19]
smickles	jurov: what's so good about ppcoin?	[00:19]
jurov	bitcoin is too power hungry, ppcoin is more ecological	[00:20]
smickles	orly	[00:20]
MJR_III	you've lost me there	[00:21]
jurov	plus we received stern warning that moeny is not morally nutral	[00:21]
MJR_III	if you find something that uses less power, more people will mine	[00:21]
jurov	*neutral	[00:21]
MJR_III	driving difficulty up further and using the same power	[00:21]
jurov	so if we become suddenly rich, we shoudl thin about the outcome of our actions	[00:21]
jurov	and ppcoin is not using difficulty	[00:22]
*	cads has quit (Quit: Leaving)	[00:22]
MJR_III	interesting	[00:22]
*	XRPTrader2 (~XRPTrader@netblock-208-127-246-121.dslextreme.com) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[00:22]
jurov	everyone who has enough coins*time can have a right to issue a block	[00:22]
jurov	but it's not in effect yet, its mining normally until some time passes	[00:22]
*	saulimus has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)	[00:23]
*	saulimus (~someone@37-219-41-67.nat.bb.dnainternet.fi) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[00:23]
*	XRPTrader2 has quit (Remote host closed the connection)	[00:23]
*	cads (~m@c-76-17-110-13.hsd1.ga.comcast.net) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[00:23]
jurov	for now i'm reserving my judgement, maybe buying some just in case	[00:24]
MJR_III	while i rate all other cryptocurrencies chances as around 1% might be worth it to hold a basket of all of them, just in case	[00:26]
smickles	no upper limit on ppcoin amounts either	[00:26]
*	blacktape (~nodebot@ec2-54-242-47-5.compute-1.amazonaws.com) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[00:27]
jurov	that was mentioned too that he considers inflation as consequence of 2nd thermodynamic law and thus it should be allowed	[00:28]
smickles	i feel like the proof-of-stake bit turns it into a game, get 51% of the coins and you win	[00:28]
jurov	no, someone with older coins than you can issue blocks instead	[00:28]
jurov	you have to wait with your 51% to get the right	[00:29]
jurov	after receiving them	[00:29]
smickles	but, wouldn't that mean they have to do nothing w/ their coins to maintain	[00:29]
Bugpowder	I would love to short ripple	[00:29]
jurov	yes, if you spend the coins, you lower your weight	[00:30]
jurov	this actually would be motivation to hoard, hence inflation is necessary	[00:30]
smickles	so, if someone gets anywhere near 50%, then people have to stop spending coins to protect it	[00:30]
kakobrekla	lol	[00:31]
MJR_III	while it may be an interesting and novel approach	[00:31]
MJR_III	as with all the others i doubt it will gain the momentum it needs	[00:32]
smickles	lol	[00:32]
jurov	if someone gets anywhere near 50% he has to wait to be able to pull 51% attack, meanwhile others mine blocks and lower his part	[00:32]
MJR_III	it would need to have a signifigant advantage	[00:32]
smickles	take many massive loans, get near 50%, the claim you can't pay because you have to protect the network!	[00:33]
jurov	you can pay	[00:33]
jurov	but you can't use them as a proof of stake tomine	[00:33]
MJR_III	bugpowder: what's stopping you?	[00:33]
jurov	cuz all ur coins are new and shiiny	[00:33]
MJR_III	in some ways this ruins the fungibility of the money though	[00:33]
MJR_III	all coins are not equal	[00:34]
jurov	and only older coins can be used as proof of stake to mine	[00:34]
*	DeaDTerra has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)	[00:34]
*	saulimus has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)	[00:34]
jurov	well, actually i heard about it today first time, that's how i understood it	[00:34]
*	saulimus (~someone@37-219-41-67.nat.bb.dnainternet.fi) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[00:34]
MJR_III	i just finished reading their white paper	[00:34]
Bugpowder	where can I short ripple?	[00:35]
MJR_III	bugpowder: just find someone willing to lend you some	[00:35]
jurov	and all btc coins aren't equal too, as anyone who tried to spend new satoshidice outputs can attest	[00:35]
MJR_III	jurov: because they haven't been verified yet?	[00:35]
*	XRPTrader2 (~XRPTrader@netblock-208-127-246-121.dslextreme.com) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[00:36]
Bugpowder	no cause they dusted	[00:36]
jurov	een after they were verified, satoshi client defaults to higer txfee	[00:36]
*	error4733 has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)	[00:36]
jurov	you have to wait	[00:36]
MJR_III	oh	[00:36]
jurov	aside from that dusted consideration	[00:36]
*	error4733 (~userirc@ip-83-134-214-20.dsl.scarlet.be) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[00:37]
Bugpowder	oh, here was that blog with the mining profit plots	[00:38]
Bugpowder	http://organofcorti.blogspot.com	[00:38]
jurov	anyway my peeve with them altcoins is they all use outdated satoshi codebase	[00:39]
jurov	both litecoin and ppcoin are based on 0.6	[00:39]
jurov	while bitcoind was quite much refactored in 0.7/0.8 versions	[00:40]
*	toffoo has quit ()	[00:40]
jurov	causing simple merging impossible	[00:40]
jurov	and boy, they are thrashy...	[00:40]
*	benkay has quit (Quit: benkay)	[00:41]
kakobrekla	thats the good part.	[00:43]
*	jurov waits for tibbycoin	[00:44]
kakobrekla	ya really	[00:44]
kakobrekla	yope.	[00:44]
kakobrekla	O_o	[00:44]
jurov	bitcoin is not ready to replace any amount of worldwide economy. we do need experiments/forks at this stage	[00:45]
jurov	but we also need someone to do it properly	[00:46]
*	Guest00001 (~userirc@ip-80-236-227-102.dsl.scarlet.be) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[00:46]
jurov	yea, these poor silkroad dealers you mentioned yest. let's remember them with moment of silence.	[00:47]
*	Guest00001 has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)	[00:48]
MJR_III	what happened to the sr dealers?	[00:48]
thestringpuller	that will change as price increases	[00:48]
jurov	tiberiusiv because it is too risky to keep big amounts on exchanges	[00:48]
*	error4733 has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)	[00:48]
*	error4733 (~userirc@ip-80-236-227-102.dsl.scarlet.be) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[00:48]
Bugpowder	You can move about 0.5MM pretty easily	[00:49]
jurov	and that's actually good, it slows the rally while we accrue some real competency (by tial and error, but hopefully still)	[00:50]
Bugpowder	huh?	[00:50]
Bugpowder	people buy that all the time	[00:50]
Bugpowder	0.5MM?	[00:50]
pgp	need credible exchange	[00:50]
jurov	like if there were millions going in and out, that wouldn't cause wild swings?	[00:50]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [SDICE] 1 @ 0.41999999 BTC [-]	[00:50]
*	diana_coman has quit (Quit: Leaving)	[00:51]
Bugpowder	single 1MM gox orders have been going off once a day for the past 2 weeks	[00:51]
Bugpowder	there is a 1.5MM bid at 76 right now	[00:51]
Bugpowder	the swings are from goxlag	[00:51]
jurov	nonsense. if all 10m bitcoins were on mtgox's ask side	[00:51]
Bugpowder	yes it is	[00:51]
MJR_III	true which is around 30 seconds now	[00:51]
Bugpowder	I saw it go up	[00:51]
MJR_III	;;goxlag	[00:52]
gribble	36.499108 seconds	[00:52]
jurov	then 1m USD would still move the price considerably	[00:52]
jurov	so? don't clamor for impossible them.	[00:52]
jurov	*then	[00:52]
Bugpowder	a 1M buy right now moves the price 5%	[00:52]
Bugpowder	if you hit it all at once	[00:53]
Bugpowder	instead of dribble	[00:53]
Bugpowder	I bet a 1MM bid moves any midcap stock at least as much	[00:53]
Bugpowder	no	[00:53]
jurov	tiberiusiv so how do you propose to get instantly into 1trillion mkt cap?	[00:54]
jurov	so you can have your beloved liquidity?	[00:54]
MJR_III	hahaha	[00:54]
*	Bugpowder has quit (Quit: Page closed)	[00:54]
jurov	it's necessary condition	[00:54]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9700 @ 0.00067039 = 6.5028 BTC [-]	[00:54]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 2718 @ 0.00066531 = 1.8083 BTC [-]	[00:54]
jurov	one of necessary conditions	[00:54]
pgp	bp - your right about comparing to trading in midcap stocks	[00:55]
pgp	the same can be said of companies that ipo	[00:56]
pgp	often they float <10% of there shares and often aren't that liquid	[00:56]
pgp	mt gox makes it a closed system to a certain extent	[00:57]
*	saulimus has quit (Quit: saulimus)	[00:58]
jurov	i'd argue that fiat is "overliquid" since it has inflated supply so you have too high expectations	[01:00]
jurov	bitcoin is scarce, not easy to just lend 10k block	[01:01]
jurov	from central bank	[01:01]
jurov	and use it to trade	[01:01]
assbot	[BTCTC] [B.YABMC] 1 @ 0.014 BTC [+]	[01:01]
jurov	but where you can take it from? someone will lend it to you	[01:01]
jurov	this isn't so easy with btc.. jus lend it on moment;s notice	[01:02]
jurov	tiberiusiv, all that "volume" and "liuquidity" on irl fin markets is thanks to leverage	[01:02]
jurov	agree or not?	[01:03]
jurov	and there were crashes every now and then	[01:03]
jurov	and panics	[01:03]
jurov	like we have now in btc	[01:04]
jurov	yes, and i do ask, where is the liquidity from?	[01:04]
jurov	from leverage, i say.	[01:04]
assbot	[BTCTC] [BASIC-MINING] 1 @ 0.37 BTC [+]	[01:04]
pgp	leverage and credit lines are the key to liquidity in modern financial markets	[01:04]
jurov	gold covered money was not either. $1m could really create panic at its time	[01:05]
*	error4733 has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)	[01:06]
jurov	this is fiat at the moment	[01:06]
MJR_III	ugh i can't trade like this	[01:07]
jurov	how so? they are printing and loaning it out in hopes some greater fool will come and eat all the debt	[01:07]
jurov	tiberiusiv don't change the topic	[01:07]
jurov	lalalalala	[01:08]
jurov	you obvoisly aren't trying to understand what i'm saying :/	[01:08]
jurov	what i told in last 50 lines?	[01:08]
jurov	obviously if you aren't even replying to my point	[01:09]
MJR_III	jurov: he is not interested in your points, he will always change topics once you have proven him wrong yet again...	[01:09]
jurov	^^^ this	[01:10]
MJR_III	i ignored him long ago...i wish everyone else would	[01:10]
MJR_III	i know how tempting it can be to show someone who is obviuosly wrong how and where they are wrong...but i couldn't get sucked into that trap any more	[01:10]
MJR_III	he is banking on you getting invested in trying to show him the intelligent way of looking at things	[01:10]
MJR_III	he'll devolve into ad hominem, and any other logical fallacy	[01:11]
jurov	i know. but it's useful for me to try and explain, too, even if he isn't listening	[01:11]
MJR_III	good point	[01:11]
MJR_III	i at least enjoyed reading your points	[01:11]
bgupta	Is there a relatively conventional futures market in btc?	[01:11]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [SDICE] 2 @ 0.41999999 = 0.84 BTC [-]	[01:11]
*	Thinker_ (~Thinker~@cpe-24-59-184-164.twcny.res.rr.com) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[01:14]
jurov	so? you want to pump and dump and can't?	[01:15]
jurov	and it can get you more if ye weren't inept and bought mpoe options with these 12k in meantime	[01:15]
jurov	they are most liquid instrument there is	[01:16]
smickles	;;bc,24hprc	[01:16]
gribble	88.81	[01:17]
jurov	dude they are just covered by tens of thousands of btc.	[01:17]
MJR_III	cue talking shit about mircea_popescu	[01:17]
MJR_III	i can't see what he wrote but i'm guessing gypsy something	[01:18]
jurov	yea btc is illiquid hence everything is shit lalalalala	[01:18]
smickles	mp is just a greasy wanabe pimp	[01:18]
MJR_III	ooh thats new	[01:18]
MJR_III	love that he can still surprise me	[01:18]
smickles	tiberiusiv: np :D	[01:18]
MJR_III	this is actually fun	[01:18]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [SDICE] 72 @ 0.41 = 29.52 BTC [-]	[01:18]
MJR_III	guessing his arguments from watching half the convo	[01:18]
MJR_III	how many people has he called poor? over/under 3	[01:19]
jurov	tiberiusiv nobody here agrees with you. so you must have indeed better understanding :)	[01:19]
taub	downpressure is stronger than ever	[01:19]
jurov	no i'm mere sockpuppet	[01:19]
*	B0g4r7 has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)	[01:20]
jurov	so we finally arrived at name calling :D	[01:21]
jurov	seems i did convince you as well	[01:21]
jurov	granted, i did convince them first :)	[01:22]
jurov	yes? what did he try to sell you?	[01:23]
jurov	and how do you know for example iDiffs i'm selling aren't overvalued trash?	[01:24]
jurov	and you have obsession with undoing someone, i see :)	[01:25]
jurov	oh seems talking to self mode activated	[01:26]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 21636 @ 0.00067234 = 14.5467 BTC [+]	[01:26]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5000 @ 0.00067326 = 3.3663 BTC [+]	[01:26]
jurov	sorry to disrupt your thought processes	[01:26]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15664 @ 0.00067327 = 10.5461 BTC [+]	[01:26]
smickles	what've you got against psycopaths?	[01:26]
*	TradeFortress (~TradeFort@c58-111-143-105.thorn2.nsw.optusnet.com.au) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[01:26]
MJR_III	lol	[01:26]
MJR_III	have we arrived at this point already?	[01:27]
smickles	psycopaths are usually productive members of society	[01:27]
jurov	yea, especially sociopaths are among the most productive	[01:27]
MJR_III	they say a lot of ceo's are sociopaths	[01:27]
smickles	i dunno about that, seems kinda off-handed remarkish	[01:28]
*	B0g4r7 (natty@9.sub-75-243-157.myvzw.com) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[01:28]
MJR_III	yeah, its more of an urban legend i suppose	[01:29]
*	smickles founds the psycopathic rights movement	[01:29]
MJR_III	i can't trade at all right now, bitfinex is fucked	[01:30]
smickles	MJR_III: what do you want to trade?	[01:30]
MJR_III	not sure...maybe just short at 92	[01:30]
MJR_III	try to get out around 88	[01:30]
MJR_III	its mostly for fun on my bitfinex account, i usually just lend out the money, but interest rates have dropped, so i am actively trading the account to try and grow it a bit	[01:31]
smickles	wow, you picked a winner of a site do trade on	[01:31]
MJR_III	lol, only margin trading platform really	[01:31]
MJR_III	as far as i know	[01:31]
smickles	icbit works better than this place	[01:32]
MJR_III	i was wondering though, and maybe mircea_popescu has some experience, but what if you used some sort of system to break up the channel of info	[01:32]
MJR_III	like have orders on a certain port	[01:32]
MJR_III	data on a different one	[01:32]
MJR_III	and none of them are 80	[01:32]
MJR_III	or if you had a vpn session or something	[01:32]
smickles	what would be the point?	[01:32]
MJR_III	avoid ddos	[01:33]
smickles	i bet they could direct ddos at any port	[01:33]
MJR_III	i wonder if you could create a fix engine in a web browser	[01:33]
MJR_III	i'm sure they could smickles	[01:33]
MJR_III	hence you have to have a valid logon	[01:33]
MJR_III	and then your trading session goes across that	[01:33]
smickles	you'd still have to negotiate the logon	[01:33]
MJR_III	true	[01:34]
MJR_III	hmmm	[01:34]
MJR_III	i just had another idea...but not sure if it would work	[01:34]
MJR_III	you know how yubikey or any of those authenticators work?	[01:34]
MJR_III	what if you used that for port based connection	[01:34]
MJR_III	only registered customers could connect cuz they know what port to connect on	[01:35]
smickles	obfuscation is not protection	[01:35]
smickles	eventually, that port would be known	[01:35]
smickles	if not right away	[01:35]
jurov	i'd use ssl certificate	[01:35]
MJR_III	no, the port constantly changes	[01:36]
MJR_III	every 20 seconds	[01:36]
jurov	with some ddos protection that supports ssl	[01:36]
MJR_III	but since your auth is changing the same way as their client	[01:36]
MJR_III	you can always connect	[01:36]
jurov	the ddos coinbr saw would have no problem penetrating all 65535 ports	[01:37]
Troic	hmm what good is a different port if your upstream connection is saturated ?	[01:37]
MJR_III	good points	[01:37]
assbot	[BTCTC] [B.YABMC] 1 @ 0.007601 BTC [-]	[01:38]
mircea_popescu	MJR_III understand, ddos threat is not to cpu	[01:38]
mircea_popescu	it's to the routers.	[01:38]
MJR_III	yes	[01:38]
MJR_III	thats what you were telling me	[01:38]
jurov	using various IP addresses instead of port may work	[01:39]
jurov	but you still need to expose some stable anchor where users authenticate	[01:40]
MJR_III	i still think that you could use the yubikey method	[01:40]
jurov	and get the ip	[01:40]
mircea_popescu	but we also need someone to do it properly << i'm with him	[01:41]
jurov	hmmm... maybe create DNS entry .domain.com seems doable?	[01:41]
mircea_popescu	ppcoin sounds more like "what does this button do" than anything.	[01:41]
assbot	[BTCTC] [ASICMINER-PT] 2 @ 0.787948 = 1.5759 BTC [+]	[01:41]
mircea_popescu	often they float <10% of there shares and often aren't that liquid <<< /me grins	[01:42]
MJR_III	jurov yeah that is what i was thinking	[01:43]
Troic	nothing to stop the dosser getting the ip, well 30btc, unless each user has a differnt ip/isp	[01:43]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.DICE] 3 @ 0.0039999 = 0.012 BTC [+]	[01:43]
MJR_III	a token based system	[01:43]
MJR_III	how would he get the token?	[01:43]
jurov	yes you need a pool of ips	[01:43]
MJR_III	only registered users would get it	[01:43]
MJR_III	and yes, a pool of ips, but that shouldn't be that hard	[01:43]
jurov	yubikey creates a pseudorandom string and you know what the strign is going to be, no?	[01:44]
MJR_III	yes	[01:44]
jurov	as you issued the yubikey	[01:44]
Troic	pool of IPs on different AS, that is expensive, at least you can shut the account down :)	[01:44]
MJR_III	and it changes every 20 seconds according to a pattern that only you can tell]	[01:44]
jurov	bah, it can be just a bunch of spot instances or cheap vpses	[01:45]
MJR_III	i guess it would be similar to the one time password that gribble does	[01:45]
MJR_III	exactly, its just a simple authenticator which serves as a gatekeeper before you connect	[01:45]
Troic	'bunch of spot instances or cheap vpses' all on same router for dos to target	[01:45]
mircea_popescu	myeah.	[01:46]
MJR_III	can't you split them up?	[01:46]
Troic	expensive	[01:46]
jurov	Troic, on amazon you can have the instances on like 10 diff places	[01:46]
MJR_III	AWS instances in different zones?	[01:46]
mircea_popescu	MJR_III this is what was going on back during ddos	[01:46]
jurov	for almost the same price, yes	[01:46]
mircea_popescu	some ninny actually took the time to blow them up one at a time	[01:46]
Troic	10 customers	[01:46]
jurov	mircea_popescu cuz you didn't use amazon loadbalancer... granted, with 10TB traffic it would get a bit expensive :)	[01:48]
mircea_popescu	jurov they were cheap vps's etc	[01:48]
mircea_popescu	i thought htat's what we were disucssing	[01:48]
MJR_III	what is the cost of a ddos of that magnitude?	[01:48]
mircea_popescu	siiignificant.	[01:49]
jurov	yes we were talink about that, but after experimenting i realized hiding these cheap vpses behind loadbalancer is the way to go	[01:49]
jurov	*talking	[01:49]
mircea_popescu	i hear 1gbit for 30 seconds is like 5-10 bux for random noob.	[01:49]
MJR_III	10 terabytes? that has got to cost quite a bit	[01:49]
jurov	10TB is around 300bux iirc	[01:50]
jurov	for a lb	[01:50]
MJR_III	per how long?	[01:50]
jurov	total	[01:50]
jurov	accoumulated	[01:50]
*	coinners (~coinners@host86-128-124-184.range86-128.btcentralplus.com) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[01:50]
MJR_III	that is pretty cheap	[01:50]
mircea_popescu	10 tb = 1000 seconds of 10 gbit	[01:50]
jurov	thre's maybe hope they are onyl counting legit traffic that ges through	[01:51]
jurov	not syn flood	[01:51]
jurov	i should research it	[01:51]
mircea_popescu	possibly ya	[01:53]
mircea_popescu	but so was i.	[01:53]
mircea_popescu	synflood is like, 14 bytes per packet ?	[01:53]
jurov	$0.008 per GB of data processed by an Elastic Load Balancer, no further details	[01:53]
jurov	plus $0.025 per Elastic Load Balancer-hour (or partial hour)	[01:54]
MJR_III	not too bad	[01:54]
MJR_III	you could bring it up when the attack starts	[01:54]
MJR_III	and i think you would be blocking their expensive attack with a cheap shield	[01:55]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [VTX] 10 @ 0.48 = 4.8 BTC [+]	[01:59]
taub	what do you guys think? up/down?	[02:00]
taub	I'm still bearish short term, this retracement isn't over	[02:00]
MJR_III	think we are somewhat stablising	[02:01]
MJR_III	i think we bounce between 92 and 88	[02:02]
MJR_III	maybe if gox lag gets bad quick spikes in either direction	[02:02]
MJR_III	mircea_popescu: so what is cloudflare actually doing for bitfinex	[02:02]
MJR_III	i can't use their website	[02:03]
mircea_popescu	i dunno who was asking me about ddos protection services and i said they all have their issues	[02:03]
mircea_popescu	this'd be an example.	[02:03]
taub	bitfinex would work better if they would deploy on a more solid exchange	[02:03]
taub	like bitfloor	[02:03]
MJR_III	i agree	[02:03]
MJR_III	bitfloor has the best response time i think	[02:04]
taub	yea, its the least worst exchange i've seen	[02:04]
MJR_III	lol	[02:04]
MJR_III	wish there was a better order interface	[02:04]
MJR_III	but what can you do	[02:04]
taub	okay mpex is the pinnacle, but for btcusd	[02:04]
MJR_III	also margin and shorting would be nice	[02:04]
MJR_III	well of course	[02:04]
jurov	mircea_popescu: options did exercise but old names still stayed	[02:04]
jurov	or it's scheduled for later?	[02:05]
mircea_popescu	yeah.	[02:05]
MJR_III	also...roman told me that he could handle 2k orders per second	[02:05]
taub	:O	[02:06]
MJR_III	mircea_popescu: so if its the router...if it just drops all but a certain subset of traffic, can it still be overloaded?	[02:07]
*	XRPTrader2 has quit (Quit: XRPTrader2)	[02:07]
mircea_popescu	MJR_III yes.	[02:07]
*	Troic has quit (Quit: Leaving)	[02:08]
*	Diablo-D3 has quit (Quit: This computer has gone to sleep)	[02:10]
MJR_III	mircea_popescu: so there is unblockable ddos?	[02:11]
mircea_popescu	yes.	[02:11]
jurov	;;bc,24hprc	[02:12]
gribble	89.55	[02:12]
jurov	if they flooded with fully legit gpg-encypted requests for example	[02:12]
MJR_III	interesting	[02:12]
KRS1	i dont think there is such a thing MJR	[02:12]
MJR_III	KRS1: a purely hardware overload	[02:12]
KRS1	you can filter it through a proxy	[02:12]
KRS1	thats what my friend does for a living..he mitigates attacks	[02:13]
MJR_III	KRS1: if the proxy is overloaded	[02:13]
bgupta	http://www.foxnews.com/tech/2013/03/29/digital-currency-bitcoin-surpasses-20-national-currencies-in-value/	[02:13]
KRS1	i know a bit about it being in IT but i'm not an expert in that area	[02:13]
MJR_III	well, i think every piece of hardware will have a limit	[02:13]
MJR_III	and this is just theorizing	[02:13]
MJR_III	but if any piece is overloaded (it could restart, or have its buffers flooded) you break the site	[02:14]
KRS1	the proxy typically is equipped for the traffic and then its filtered and sent to the customer	[02:14]
MJR_III	no i understand	[02:14]
MJR_III	mircea was talking about terabytes of data	[02:14]
*	rdponticelli has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)	[02:15]
*	rdponticelli (~rdpontice@200-081-044-151.wireless.movistar.net.ar) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[02:16]
KRS1	the idea is that if you cant accept the traffic something needs to accept it for you that cant be overwhelmed	[02:17]
KRS1	even for terabytes of data	[02:17]
MJR_III	but my point is that as far as i know there is no device with unlimited capacity	[02:18]
KRS1	thats right	[02:18]
ThickAsThieves	how many hours til newstyle options might be released?	[02:18]
KRS1	you scale it	[02:18]
KRS1	with additional hardware	[02:18]
MJR_III	so if you had a 100gb router (they exist) it could still be brought down	[02:18]
KRS1	sure why not...any distributed effort can be bigger than its target.	[02:19]
MJR_III	true	[02:19]
MJR_III	of course you probbably donb't need to stop theoretical attacks just make it impractical	[02:20]
KRS1	hopefully you have something that can accept the traffic that can handle it	[02:20]
MJR_III	yes true	[02:20]
MJR_III	but for example, i am setting up an stunnel to bitfloor	[02:20]
MJR_III	so worst case if the site goes down, that should not bring down my stunnel	[02:20]
assbot	[BTCTC] [GSDPT] 14 @ 0.00385 = 0.0539 BTC [-]	[02:21]
assbot	[BTCTC] [GSDPT] 20 @ 0.00381 = 0.0762 BTC [-]	[02:21]
MJR_III	so for an institutional client, some sort of vpn on dedicated hardware is probably best	[02:21]
KRS1	encryption adds a lot of overhead	[02:21]
KRS1	i think i see what you are saying	[02:21]
KRS1	what would be the target though	[02:22]
KRS1	right	[02:22]
KRS1	hopefully multiples that can failover if need be	[02:22]
MJR_III	good point	[02:23]
KRS1	the cisco ASA can vpn too	[02:23]
MJR_III	yep	[02:23]
MJR_III	that is what we have lol	[02:23]
MJR_III	and 6509's 2 of them VSS'd	[02:23]
KRS1	nice	[02:23]
KRS1	dont forget about bandwidth when setting up stunnel, encryption adds overhead	[02:24]
KRS1	dns..etc.	[02:24]
MJR_III	its ture	[02:24]
MJR_III	true	[02:24]
MJR_III	hmmm, what is the best router out there?	[02:25]
MJR_III	i'm just curious	[02:25]
MJR_III	the asa is actually a firewall right	[02:26]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [HIM] 2 @ 1.895 = 3.79 BTC [+]	[02:26]
MJR_III	juniper makes some nice stuff	[02:28]
MJR_III	fuck when i finally got back on bitfinex i am greeted by the position i didn't know i had	[02:28]
kakobrekla	lol	[02:29]
*	tiberiusiv has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)	[02:29]
MJR_III	it actually is not that bad of a position though...short at 90.50	[02:29]
jurov	mircea used vwap 90.34 ??? quite a boost we got there :P	[02:32]
*	XRPTrader2 (~XRPTrader@adsl-76-235-155-118.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[02:33]
MJR_III	i exercised at 71, what a sucker i am	[02:34]
MJR_III	that was awesome, my local pizza place delivered me cigarettes	[02:37]
KRS1	yea asa is awesome	[02:38]
MJR_III	i wonder...how will ipv6 change the DDOS landscape	[02:39]
KRS1	router-depends on what you use it for	[02:39]
MJR_III	cisco 7000 series	[02:39]
MJR_III	:)	[02:39]
KRS1	ipv6 is just a transport mechanism not sure it would matter	[02:39]
MJR_III	you could have a MUCH greater address pool	[02:39]
*	Transisto has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)	[02:39]
KRS1	sorry i mean addressing method	[02:39]
MJR_III	and also you wouldn't have to worry about NATing	[02:39]
MJR_III	which can be a bottleneck	[02:39]
KRS1	yeah ipv6 would increase the # of ddos participants against the target if you could ever get there	[02:40]
MJR_III	good point	[02:40]
KRS1	router- depending on the application	[02:40]
KRS1	voip traffic, etc	[02:40]
thestringpuller	mircea_popescu: financials up yet?	[02:41]
MJR_III	tcpip = cisco i think	[02:41]
MJR_III	vs udp etc	[02:41]
MJR_III	i mean	[02:41]
jurov	lol certain lucky coinbr user made 4 btc out of one using calls (not tibby obviously)	[02:42]
MJR_III	wow what did he have?	[02:42]
MJR_III	41 calls is what i got	[02:42]
jurov	thestringpuller don't be impatient :)	[02:42]
*	shakeIt has quit (Remote host closed the connection)	[02:43]
KRS1	bbl	[02:43]
*	bVector (~bVector@unicorns.xxx) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[02:45]
mircea_popescu	http://polimedia.us/trilema/2013/mpoe-march-2013-statement/	[02:46]
mircea_popescu	ok tghere it is.	[02:46]
copumpkin	hmm, that's not ideal	[02:46]
*	Transisto (~TransistO@bas2-quebec03-1176409428.dsl.bell.ca) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[02:47]
*	Transisto has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)	[02:47]
jurov	so all the bonds that went below 100BTC will be paid out automatically or we need to ask?	[02:48]
assbot	[BTCTC] [S.MPOE-PT] 700 @ 0.000617 = 0.4319 BTC [-]	[02:48]
assbot	[BTCTC] [S.MPOE-PT] 120 @ 0.000616 = 0.0739 BTC [-]	[02:49]
mircea_popescu	jurov they get paid.	[02:49]
mircea_popescu	i forgot the red lines	[02:50]
*	Diablo-D3 (~diablo@pool-70-16-109-241.port.east.myfairpoint.net) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[02:50]
*	Transisto (~TransistO@bas2-quebec03-1176409428.dsl.bell.ca) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[02:50]
jurov	mircea_popescu: and why so high vwap got used? did it really fell from 90.34 to 89.55 in 10 minutes?	[02:55]
*	deadweasel has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)	[02:59]
mircea_popescu	actually i see it 91.05 atm ?	[03:00]
jurov	;;bc,24hprc	[03:01]
gribble	89.53	[03:01]
jurov	where?	[03:01]
*	Smoovious has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)	[03:02]
jurov	http://www.bitcoincharts.com/markets/currencies/ lists 89.53 too	[03:02]
mircea_popescu	hm	[03:02]
*	Smoovious (~imp586@75-12-89-18.lightspeed.wyngmi.sbcglobal.net) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[03:02]
taub	i dont like this price action one bit	[03:03]
mircea_popescu	there's a lot of volume right at the edge of the rolling window	[03:05]
*	gribble has quit (Quit: brb ....)	[03:05]
MJR_III	wow mircea_popescu, that did make me nauseous	[03:07]
thestringpuller	mircea_popescu: where is dat post	[03:07]
thestringpuller	lolol	[03:07]
mircea_popescu	myeah	[03:07]
*	Anduck has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)	[03:11]
*	DBordello has quit (Quit: ZNC - http://znc.in)	[03:11]
*	DBordello (~DBordello@unaffiliated/dbordello) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[03:11]
*	gribble (~gribble@unaffiliated/nanotube/bot/gribble) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[03:15]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [SDICE] 1 @ 0.4 BTC [-]	[03:15]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [SDICE] 1 @ 0.4199 BTC [+]	[03:16]
jurov	https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=131270.msg1702603#msg1702603	[03:21]
jurov	converted even bad news into sales pitch...	[03:21]
*	deadweasel (~gr1ffon@cpe-74-75-235-219.maine.res.rr.com) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[03:21]
jborkl	we all knew the bot was going to beat like rodney king	[03:23]
MJR_III	but why did bugpowder think that would affect dividends	[03:23]
jborkl	just a one month deal	[03:23]
jborkl	sorry mp.rough month	[03:23]
jurov	mpex.co now looks so easily comprehensive, all options gone	[03:25]
MJR_III	nice	[03:31]
MJR_III	bitfinex sucks, they don't actually send orders out, but whatever engine they have doesn't send them out quickly enough, which partially gox's fault	[03:32]
MJR_III	it traded down to 87 without me getting filled	[03:32]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [SDICE] 10 @ 0.4 = 4 BTC [-]	[03:32]
*	oizotov (~irssi@gateway/tor-sasl/oizotov) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[03:33]
jurov	20 to 200 with step 3 planned? we'll have 244 new options then...	[03:34]
MJR_III	wouldn't it be 90 puts and 90 calls for each month?	[03:35]
jurov	no, 61 puts and 61 calls	[03:36]
jurov	if i'm to believe this oocalc thing	[03:36]
MJR_III	180/3	[03:36]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [SDICE] 50 @ 0.4 = 20 BTC [-]	[03:36]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [SDICE] 30 @ 0.4 = 12 BTC [-]	[03:36]
MJR_III	i thought	[03:37]
jurov	180/3=60 lol	[03:37]
MJR_III	lol, thats why i should use gribble	[03:37]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [SDICE] 40 @ 0.4 = 16 BTC [-]	[03:38]
jurov	C750 to be upgraded to C77, yum	[03:39]
MJR_III	looking forward to sdice financials this month	[03:39]
MJR_III	jurov: isn't that downgraded?	[03:41]
smickles	lol	[03:41]
MJR_III	unless you were short i suppose	[03:42]
jurov	you're right :)	[03:42]
MJR_III	but if i was long that call i would have rather gone to 74	[03:42]
*	XRPTrader2 has quit (Quit: XRPTrader2)	[03:45]
smickles	oh, lol, that went well	[03:49]
*	Chaang-Noi has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)	[03:49]
*	smickles debugs	[03:49]
*	Diablo-D3 hands smickles the raid	[03:49]
smickles	BUY\|O.USD.C920T\|7\|11344696 <<< does that look wrong to anyone :D	[03:49]
Diablo-D3	no because I have no clue wtf it says	[03:50]
jurov	that looks VERY bullish	[03:50]
jurov	Diablo-D3: smickles wants option to buy 7 BTC at $920 each :)	[03:50]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [SDICE] 1 @ 0.4 BTC [-]	[03:50]
*	mrdavis (~mrdavis@d118-75-117-26.try.wideopenwest.com) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[03:51]
jurov	at measly 1.134 per option	[03:51]
smickles	;;calc 920/(1-.1134)	[03:51]
gribble	1037.67200541	[03:51]
smickles	nice b/e point	[03:51]
Diablo-D3	jurov: I like the cut of his jib	[03:51]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [SDICE] 2 @ 0.4 = 0.8 BTC [-]	[03:52]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [SDICE] 2 @ 0.4 = 0.8 BTC [-]	[03:52]
topace_	!ticker h sdice	[03:53]
assbot	[HAVELOCK:SDICE] 1D: 0.35000000 / 0.41321889 / 0.46500000 (457 shares, 188.84103088 BTC), 7D: 0.35000000 / 0.45346676 / 0.53000000 (1701 shares, 771.34695284 BTC), 30D: 0.35000000 / 0.5143263 / 0.68950000 (6033 shares, 3102.93054732 BTC)	[03:53]
*	XRPTrader2 (~XRPTrader@netblock-208-127-246-121.dslextreme.com) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[03:54]
thestringpuller	lololq	[03:54]
TradeFortress	bfl asics doesn't hash lol	[03:55]
Diablo-D3	but I bought a bowl and everything :<	[03:56]
MJR_III	TradeFortress: really?	[03:57]
TradeFortress	MJR_III: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4C4bgho5JSI	[03:57]
MJR_III	would it be fun to have an open cry pit for bitcoins?	[03:59]
MJR_III	i think it would be	[03:59]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3600 @ 0.00067327 = 2.4238 BTC [+]	[04:01]
MJR_III	i mostly want to do it for the cool jackets...	[04:01]
smickles	ok, what's wrong with BUY\|O.USD.C89T\|7\|12279228 ?	[04:04]
arij	what the	[04:05]
mircea_popescu	smickles 089	[04:05]
smickles	mircea_popescu: why does it show on mpex.co as C89T?	[04:05]
mircea_popescu	so : the mpsic change is complete. if you had N's that were realocated they should show up.	[04:05]
mircea_popescu	bot is quoting.	[04:06]
mircea_popescu	the entire thing is trading under supervision and stuff may be rolled back if there's issues.	[04:06]
smickles	oh, it just changed	[04:06]
mircea_popescu	go ahead and test.	[04:06]
jurov	and multiply	[04:06]
taub	thats a lot of options :D	[04:07]
mircea_popescu	:p	[04:09]
MJR_III	what do you think mircea_popescu, trading jackets and open cry pit?	[04:10]
MJR_III	plus the hand signals look cool	[04:10]
mircea_popescu	can't hurt.	[04:10]
MJR_III	its so anachronistic	[04:11]
*	toffoo (~tof@201.53.123.46) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[04:12]
assbot	[BTCTC] [ASICMINER-PT] 5 @ 0.78791 = 3.9396 BTC [-]	[04:12]
assbot	[BTCTC] [ASICMINER-PT] 3 @ 0.787948 = 2.3638 BTC [+]	[04:12]
assbot	[BTCTC] [ASICMINER-PT] 1 @ 0.78795 BTC [+]	[04:12]
assbot	[BTCTC] [ASICMINER-PT] 1 @ 0.788 BTC [+]	[04:12]
assbot	[BTCTC] [ASICMINER-PT] 10 @ 0.78895 = 7.8895 BTC [+]	[04:12]
thestringpuller	mircea_popescu: that was the saddest financial report ever	[04:13]
taub	oh sick bids @ mtgox	[04:13]
mircea_popescu	myeah	[04:14]
thestringpuller	;;asks 94	[04:14]
gribble	There are currently 8425.506 bitcoins offered at or under 94.0 USD, worth 779353.416378 USD in total. \| Data vintage: 72.7984 seconds	[04:14]
*	Chaang-Noi (~j@180.183.191.210) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[04:20]
thestringpuller	;;seen smickles	[04:21]
gribble	smickles was last seen in #bitcoin-assets 14 minutes and 57 seconds ago: oh, it just changed	[04:21]
Chaang-Noi	;;bids 85	[04:22]
mircea_popescu	it traded down to 87 without me getting filled << usually the sign of bucket shoppery.	[04:22]
gribble	There are currently 16363.067 bitcoins demanded at or over 85.0 USD, worth 1467808.69682 USD in total. \| Data vintage: 0.0052 seconds	[04:22]
Chaang-Noi	damn that is a wall...	[04:23]
Chaang-Noi	;;bids 75	[04:23]
gribble	There are currently 46099.881 bitcoins demanded at or over 75.0 USD, worth 3796776.10301 USD in total. \| Data vintage: 26.1647 seconds	[04:23]
mircea_popescu	C750 to be upgraded to C77, yum << you mean 74 ?	[04:23]
Chaang-Noi	10k coins at 92	[04:23]
*	midnightmagic has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)	[04:23]
jurov	yes i stand corrected	[04:23]
*	midnightmagic (~midnightm@unaffiliated/midnightmagic) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[04:24]
mircea_popescu	i'll be damned... everything seems in order ?	[04:24]
MJR_III	here comes another spike	[04:25]
MJR_III	that is a huge ass wall at 92	[04:25]
Chaang-Noi	yes sir	[04:25]
Chaang-Noi	10k	[04:25]
mircea_popescu	bot is quoting correctly and everything. cool beans.	[04:26]
MJR_III	this movie is pretty fun to watch	[04:26]
MJR_III	The Pit	[04:26]
Chaang-Noi	10k and growin, like 13k now... bull trap maybe? get people to place bids at 92, then crash market? :)	[04:26]
MJR_III	i think so	[04:26]
MJR_III	i'm short at 92	[04:27]
mircea_popescu	i might have lost 15k rthis month, but on the upside who the duck else has monthly report and whole mpsic changeover in 2 hours ?	[04:27]
mircea_popescu	fucking worth a million and a half i tell you	[04:27]
MJR_III	mircea_popescu yes, nice transition	[04:27]
MJR_III	this is the most interesting thing about trading, is that for every trade there is someone else on the other side	[04:30]
MJR_III	and i think economics forgets that at times	[04:30]
MJR_III	and people who trade with each other a lot, its like your win can be their loss	[04:30]
Chaang-Noi	lift off and wall at 17k lol	[04:31]
MJR_III	yeah looks like we are headed to 94 for sure	[04:31]
taub	shh Chaang-Noi	[04:31]
Chaang-Noi	lol, like im going to scare the bulls :)	[04:32]
Chaang-Noi	we might get 100 before april after all	[04:33]
*	coinners has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)	[04:33]
Chaang-Noi	;;asks 100	[04:33]
gribble	There are currently 23844.076 bitcoins offered at or under 100.0 USD, worth 2309880.5722 USD in total. \| Data vintage: 63.0708 seconds	[04:33]
Chaang-Noi	hmmm	[04:33]
Chaang-Noi	asic miner, too many rich holders eh? well lets wait for the 260 ghs :)	[04:36]
*	pigeons (~pigeons@249.69-48-199.rdns.scalabledns.com) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[04:38]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 2282 @ 0.00066531 = 1.5182 BTC [-]	[04:40]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6068 @ 0.00066529 = 4.037 BTC [-]	[04:40]
assbot	[MPEX] [O.USD.C098T] 230 @ 0.22099114 = 50.828 BTC	[04:40]
mircea_popescu	!ticker m ^oix	[04:41]
assbot	[MPEX:^OIX] 1D: 0 / 0 / 0 (0 shares, 0 BTC), 7D: 66.95953589 / 85.06143152 / 85.06556611 (111084 shares, 22,108.25 BTC), 30D: 0 / 0 / 0 (0 shares, 0 BTC)	[04:41]
MJR_III	hi pigeons	[04:41]
MJR_III	hmmm	[04:42]
jurov	MJR_III: coinbr should be done too	[04:42]
MJR_III	104 calls look nice	[04:42]
assbot	[MPEX] [O.USD.P050T] 8 @ 0.0157744 = 0.1262 BTC	[04:42]
MJR_III	jurov: have we gotten divs yet?	[04:44]
jurov	s.mpoe hasn't paid yet	[04:44]
MJR_III	;;bc,24hprc	[04:44]
gribble	89.91	[04:45]
mircea_popescu	https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=131270.msg1558393#msg1558393	[04:46]
mircea_popescu	o wow look at all the detective work	[04:46]
jurov	oh yes, i must tell to deprived they weren't in order	[04:47]
MJR_III	jurov, nice avatar	[04:48]
MJR_III	i take it you are a recipient of the double cherry truck award?	[04:48]
jurov	yea, i have drawn it and awarded mpex. got 5btc in return :)	[04:49]
MJR_III	very nice	[04:49]
jurov	the contest: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=122881.0	[04:50]
jurov	in memory of Patrick Harnett	[04:50]
*	TradeFortress has quit (Quit: Leaving)	[04:50]
*	thestrin1puller (~leflor@99-39-97-12.lightspeed.tukrga.sbcglobal.net) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[04:50]
*	XRPTrader2_ (~XRPTrader@netblock-208-127-246-121.dslextreme.com) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[04:50]
mircea_popescu	lol yea	[04:51]
mircea_popescu	jurov : if you have any artist friends you can always troll them	[04:51]
mircea_popescu	by pointing out that they don't ger 500 bux for a vignette	[04:51]
assbot	[BTCTC] [B.YABMC] 1 @ 0.01449 BTC [+]	[04:52]
MJR_III	lets see that wall disappear	[04:52]
assbot	[BTCTC] [B.YABMC] 1 @ 0.0145 BTC [+]	[04:52]
assbot	[BTCTC] [B.YABMC] 1 @ 0.016 BTC [+]	[04:53]
assbot	[BTCTC] [B.YABMC] 1 @ 0.017 BTC [+]	[04:53]
assbot	[BTCTC] [B.YABMC] 1 @ 0.019 BTC [+]	[04:53]
jurov	yea. that was actually second time i won some such contest	[04:53]
assbot	[BTCTC] [B.YABMC] 11 @ 0.01966 = 0.2163 BTC [+]	[04:54]
*	SomeoneWeird_ (~SomeoneWe@ec2-122-248-235-44.ap-southeast-1.compute.amazonaws.com) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[04:54]
MJR_III	so, did you transfer rights to the double cherry truck award to mpex, or do you retain the rights to award said trophy	[04:54]
*	SomeoneWeird_ has quit (Changing host)	[04:55]
*	SomeoneWeird_ (~SomeoneWe@unaffiliated/someoneweird) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[04:55]
*	XRPTrader2 has quit (.net .split)	[04:55]
*	DBordello has quit (.net .split)	[04:55]
*	topace has quit (.net .split)	[04:55]
*	SomeoneWeird has quit (.net .split)	[04:55]
*	cheebydi has quit (.net .split)	[04:55]
*	thestringpuller has quit (.net .split)	[04:55]
*	topace_ has quit (.net .split)	[04:55]
*	JimmyHo2 has quit (.net .split)	[04:55]
*	EPiSKiNG- has quit (.net .split)	[04:55]
*	XRPTrader2_ is now known as XRPTrader2	[04:55]
*	SomeoneWeird_ is now known as SomeoneWeird	[04:55]
mircea_popescu	i retain all rights!	[04:56]
mircea_popescu	and priviledges	[04:56]
jurov	MJR_III: i guess once btc will rise enough, i can find lawyer to pick the case pro bono	[04:56]
MJR_III	ah	[04:56]
jurov	:D	[04:56]
jurov	ooh and also received payout, that was quick: http://bitbet.us/bet/3/mpbor-over-10-in-q1/?ref=1EteoRKNYbNhhmFfsKnUSWRF3JUpKCcMnc	[04:56]
MJR_III	i think that award will be worth a lot in the future...i would like to be a recipient of the double cherry truck award, but i think that the moody's triple a rating will be slightly smoky dragon	[04:57]
*	cheebydi (~cheebydi@178.209.51.82) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[04:57]
mircea_popescu	haha	[04:58]
mircea_popescu	i'm gonna have to come up with criteria to award these now	[04:58]
MJR_III	yep	[04:58]
jurov	and i'll be awarding ravaging mermaid	[04:59]
MJR_III	NICE	[04:59]
*	cads has quit (Quit: Leaving)	[04:59]
MJR_III	i do like the mermaid	[04:59]
MJR_III	fuck, what to watch next	[04:59]
*	EPiSKiNG- (~EPiSKiNG@67.222.146.161) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[04:59]
*	DBordello (~DBordello@unaffiliated/dbordello) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[04:59]
*	JimmyHo2 (~JimmyHo2@d24-150-134-160.home.cgocable.net) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[05:00]
jurov	kakobrekla: you should make banners with rotating bets and put them on reddit, some bet fall quickly into obscurity	[05:00]
*	EPiSKiNG- has quit (Changing host)	[05:00]
*	EPiSKiNG- (~EPiSKiNG@unaffiliated/episking) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[05:00]
jurov	especially some i'd like to bet moar	[05:00]
*	topace_ (~kvirc@CPEc0c1c03be745-CM00407b85cf6f.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[05:03]
*	topace (~kvirc@ottawa-hs-69-20-234-37.s-ip.magma.ca) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[05:03]
*	topace is now known as Guest34627	[05:03]
Chaang-Noi	large drama on bitcoin talk = large bets	[05:04]
Chaang-Noi	a company to profit off of bitcoin drama, best idea evar	[05:04]
jurov	Chaang-Noi: have you seen the one "bitcointalk treasurer to be scammer tagged"?	[05:05]
Chaang-Noi	yeah	[05:05]
Chaang-Noi	i expect Og to be the scammer of the group	[05:05]
Chaang-Noi	i forget the otehrs	[05:06]
*	cads (~m@c-76-17-110-13.hsd1.ga.comcast.net) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[05:06]
Chaang-Noi	also dont forget theymos is the guy who hands out tags:)	[05:06]
mircea_popescu	wait. og as in, the ognasty club guy ?	[05:09]
Chaang-Noi	yeah, i dont trust him	[05:11]
pigeons	m-i-c	[05:12]
pigeons	k-e-y	[05:12]
mircea_popescu	o this can't possibly end well.	[05:12]
mircea_popescu	where's that bet again ?	[05:12]
*	cads has quit (Quit: Leaving)	[05:12]
ThickAsThieves	mp, do mpex PR lackeys get an @mpex.co email addy?	[05:15]
Chaang-Noi	lol	[05:15]
ThickAsThieves	could use email addy's as referral system	[05:15]
mircea_popescu	um	[05:16]
mircea_popescu	i'd hope they have their own email ><	[05:16]
mircea_popescu	o also, someone be kind enough to put march report on reddit ?	[05:16]
mircea_popescu	curious what the derpcrowd does	[05:16]
Chaang-Noi	theymos still has you banned?	[05:17]
mircea_popescu	um	[05:18]
mircea_popescu	i have no idea tbh	[05:18]
*	mrdavis (~mrdavis@d118-75-117-26.try.wideopenwest.com) has left #bitcoin-assets	[05:21]
MJR_III	who put up that wall and to what end?	[05:21]
Chaang-Noi	want has btc or want has btc price move up?	[05:27]
ThickAsThieves	;;ticker	[05:27]
gribble	BTCUSD ticker \| Best bid: 92.52001, Best ask: 92.74995, Bid-ask spread: 0.22994, Last trade: 92.74995, 24 hour volume: 73187.25009339, 24 hour low: 85.50000, 24 hour high: 94.00000, 24 hour vwap: 90.09023	[05:27]
*	BitOTTer552 (36f3c1681f@rider.us) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[05:28]
Chaang-Noi	two 1000 btc sell orders fell into it	[05:28]
Chaang-Noi	its a real wall	[05:28]
*	mod6 (02dbb346f8@rider.us) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[05:30]
MJR_III	hmmm	[05:31]
MJR_III	interesting	[05:31]
MJR_III	well, we are digging in	[05:31]
assbot	[BTCTC] [S.MPOE-PT] 47 @ 0.000607 = 0.0285 BTC [-]	[05:32]
*	BitOTTer552 has quit (Remote host closed the connection)	[05:34]
*	BitOTTer582 (4c82a23536@rider.us) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[05:35]
*	Chaang-Noi has quit (Quit: Leaving)	[05:36]
assbot	[BTCTC] [ASICMINER-PT] 3 @ 0.797793 = 2.3934 BTC [+]	[05:37]
MJR_III	;;calc 91.77*1.2	[05:39]
gribble	110.124	[05:39]
ThickAsThieves	;;bids 0	[05:40]
gribble	There are currently 34671020 bitcoins demanded at or over 0.0 USD, worth 10482734.1184 USD in total. \| Data vintage: 0.0176 seconds	[05:40]
ThickAsThieves	waitll bug sees that	[05:41]
assbot	[BTCTC] [ASICMINER-PT] 9 @ 0.797794 = 7.1801 BTC [+]	[05:42]
ThickAsThieves	;;asks 99.91	[05:42]
gribble	There are currently 18564.837 bitcoins offered at or under 99.91 USD, worth 1797672.6472 USD in total. \| Data vintage: 0.0022 seconds	[05:42]
ThickAsThieves	;;bids 85	[05:43]
gribble	There are currently 20005.793 bitcoins demanded at or over 85.0 USD, worth 1792948.69182 USD in total. \| Data vintage: 25.0206 seconds	[05:43]
*	Now talking on #bitcoin-assets	[12:23]
*	Topic for #bitcoin-assets is: http://bitcoin-assets.com/	[12:23]
*	Topic for #bitcoin-assets set by kakobrekla!~kako@unaffiliated/kakobrekla at Wed Mar 13 14:15:50 2013	[12:23]
assbot	[BTCTC] [BASIC-MINING] 1 @ 0.3451 BTC [-]	[12:23]
assbot	[BTCTC] [ASICMINER-PT] 1 @ 0.8 BTC [+]	[12:24]
*	nanotube (~nanotube@unaffiliated/nanotube) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[12:27]
*	fydel has quit ()	[12:30]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [SDICE] 1 @ 0.38000001 BTC [-]	[12:33]
*	DeaDTerra (~DeaDTerra@226.169.216.81.static.apv.siw.siwnet.net) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[12:33]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [HIM] 1 @ 1.88 BTC [-]	[12:34]
*	gribble (~gribble@unaffiliated/nanotube/bot/gribble) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[12:34]
ThickAsThieves	;;bc,stats	[12:34]
gribble	Current Blocks: 228740 \| Current Difficulty: 6695826.282596251 \| Next Difficulty At Block: 229823 \| Next Difficulty In: 1083 blocks \| Next Difficulty In About: 6 days, 2 hours, 50 minutes, and 50 seconds \| Next Difficulty Estimate: 7311735.07761 \| Estimated Percent Change: 9.1984	[12:34]
assbot	[BTCTC] [ASICMINER-PT] 4 @ 0.8 = 3.2 BTC [+]	[12:42]
*	Smoovious has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)	[12:48]
*	Smoovious (~imp586@75-12-89-18.lightspeed.wyngmi.sbcglobal.net) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[12:48]
assbot	[BTCTC] [ASICMINER-PT] 1 @ 0.79 BTC [-]	[12:53]
assbot	[BTCTC] [ASICMINER-PT] 1 @ 0.78 BTC [-]	[12:53]
assbot	[BTCTC] [ASICMINER-PT] 1 @ 0.771 BTC [-]	[12:54]
assbot	[BTCTC] [ASICMINER-PT] 5 @ 0.77 = 3.85 BTC [-]	[12:55]
deadweasel	;;ticker	[12:56]
gribble	BTCUSD ticker \| Best bid: 91.30001, Best ask: 91.98999, Bid-ask spread: 0.68998, Last trade: 91.30000, 24 hour volume: 68373.91210877, 24 hour low: 85.50000, 24 hour high: 94.98000, 24 hour vwap: 90.17684	[12:56]
*	Populus has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)	[12:59]
*	leotablet (~yaaic@110-174-7-79.tpgi.com.au) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[13:03]
*	farfi has quit (Remote host closed the connection)	[13:04]
*	farfi (~farfi@87.68.213.78.adsl.012.net.il) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[13:04]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 2200 @ 0.00066394 = 1.4607 BTC [-]	[13:05]
*	asciilifeform has quit (Remote host closed the connection)	[13:09]
*	saulimus has quit (Quit: saulimus)	[13:10]
*	cads has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)	[13:11]
*	PsychoticBoy has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)	[13:15]
*	PsychoticBoy (~Psychotic@tsn85-159-236-214.dyn.nltelcom.net) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[13:15]
*	PsychoticBoy has quit (Changing host)	[13:15]
*	PsychoticBoy (~Psychotic@pdpc/supporter/active/psychoticboy) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[13:15]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7868 @ 0.00066409 = 5.2251 BTC [+]	[13:18]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 1347 @ 0.00067673 = 0.9116 BTC [+]	[13:18]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 36 @ 0.00067674 = 0.0244 BTC [+]	[13:18]
*	Olive6767 has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)	[13:20]
*	Olive6767 (~Olive@rob67-1-82-231-68-62.fbx.proxad.net) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[13:21]
*	Smoovious has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)	[13:21]
*	Uglux (~uglux@port-92-204-86-100.dynamic.qsc.de) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[13:26]
*	topace_ has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)	[13:30]
*	topace_ (~kvirc@CPEc0c1c03be745-CM00407b85cf6f.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[13:31]
*	BitHub (~BitHub@unaffiliated/bithub) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[13:42]
*	terryww has quit (Read error: Operation timed out)	[13:44]
assbot	[BTCTC] [BASIC-MINING] 3 @ 0.37 = 1.11 BTC [+]	[13:44]
assbot	[BTCTC] [COGNITIVE] 7 @ 0.1565 = 1.0955 BTC [+]	[13:47]
*	daybyter (~andreas@88-134-88-253-dynip.superkabel.de) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[13:51]
*	DBordello has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)	[13:55]
*	damientrog has quit (Quit: damientrog)	[13:57]
*	DBordello (~DBordello@unaffiliated/dbordello) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[13:59]
assbot	[BTCTC] [ASICMINER-PT] 2 @ 0.8 = 1.6 BTC [+]	[13:59]
*	awkorama has quit (Quit: Leaving.)	[14:10]
assbot	[BTCTC] [BASIC-MINING] 2 @ 0.37 = 0.74 BTC [+]	[14:10]
*	awkorama (~awk@195.12.158.2) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[14:11]
*	tiberiusiv (~tiberiusi@gateway/tor-sasl/tiberiusiv) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[14:11]
assbot	[BTCTC] [S.BBET-PT] 10 @ 0.00158 = 0.0158 BTC [+]	[14:13]
*	asa1024 has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)	[14:14]
*	saulimus (~someone@37-136-171-62.nat.bb.dnainternet.fi) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[14:16]
*	Smoovious (~imp586@75-12-89-18.lightspeed.wyngmi.sbcglobal.net) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[14:17]
*	Uglux has quit (Quit: Leaving)	[14:17]
*	asa1024 (~asa@unaffiliated/asa1024) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[14:22]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 18664 @ 0.00067674 = 12.6307 BTC [+]	[14:24]
*	Troic (~troic@cpc18-pool13-2-0-cust39.15-1.cable.virginmedia.com) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[14:29]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [VTX] 1 @ 0.485 BTC [+]	[14:34]
mircea_popescu	so it turns out strongcoin was indeed fucked.	[14:34]
assbot	[BTCTC] [GSDPT] 20 @ 0.00399 = 0.0798 BTC [-]	[14:36]
kakobrekla	13:37.17 ( idioterna ) bitstamp guy	[14:38]
kakobrekla	13:37.18 ( idioterna ) http://us3.na.apcdn.com/full/98938.gif	[14:38]
mircea_popescu	lol	[14:41]
assbot	[BTCTC] [PAJKA.BOND] 1 @ 0.1059 BTC [+]	[14:43]
*	Troic has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)	[14:46]
*	terryww (~terryww@gw.spanskiborci.si) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[14:47]
assbot	[MPEX] [O.USD.C092T] 600 @ 0.24766633 = 148.5998 BTC	[14:50]
*	Troic (~troic@cpc18-pool13-2-0-cust39.15-1.cable.virginmedia.com) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[14:52]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 936 @ 0.00067685 = 0.6335 BTC [+]	[14:53]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 1214 @ 0.00066805 = 0.811 BTC [-]	[14:53]
*	diana_coman (~diana_com@2.24.215.80) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[15:00]
*	fdas (c2964112@gateway/web/freenode/ip.194.150.65.18) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[15:03]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5901 @ 0.00067952 = 4.0098 BTC [+]	[15:13]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 299 @ 0.00067955 = 0.2032 BTC [+]	[15:13]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7586 @ 0.00066805 = 5.0678 BTC [-]	[15:18]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 912 @ 0.00066394 = 0.6055 BTC [-]	[15:18]
assbot	[BTCTC] [ASICMINER-PT] 1 @ 0.81 BTC [+]	[15:23]
assbot	[BTCTC] [ASICMINER-PT] 2 @ 0.8 = 1.6 BTC [-]	[15:23]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [VTX] 1 @ 0.485 BTC [+]	[15:24]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 25400 @ 0.00067955 = 17.2606 BTC [+]	[15:25]
*	hnz (~bla@dslb-178-001-192-104.pools.arcor-ip.net) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[15:28]
assbot	[BTCTC] [ASICMINER-PT] 22 @ 0.8 = 17.6 BTC [-]	[15:31]
*	fdas has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)	[15:31]
assbot	[BTCTC] [BASIC-MINING] 1 @ 0.37 BTC [+]	[15:32]
*	saulimus has quit (Quit: saulimus)	[15:32]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] [PAID] 196.89044015 BTC to 500`000`000 shares, 39 satoshi per share	[15:33]
assbot	[BTCTC] [BASIC-MINING] 2 @ 0.37 = 0.74 BTC [+]	[15:38]
*	greenglue (~textual@modemcable078.221-179-173.mc.videotron.ca) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[15:43]
greenglue	Hello!	[15:43]
greenglue	is there any sort of stock market for BTC? other than MPEx which costs 30BTC to join	[15:44]
*	tiberiusiv has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)	[15:45]
ThickAsThieves	there a several	[15:47]
ThickAsThieves	sec	[15:47]
greenglue	such as...	[15:47]
greenglue	ok thanks!	[15:47]
ThickAsThieves	www.bitfunder.com	[15:48]
ThickAsThieves	www.btct.co	[15:48]
ThickAsThieves	www.litecoinglobal.com	[15:48]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5000 @ 0.00067953 = 3.3977 BTC [-]	[15:48]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 37 @ 0.00067955 = 0.0251 BTC [+]	[15:48]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 2863 @ 0.00067955 = 1.9456 BTC [+]	[15:48]
greenglue	do you use either one?	[15:48]
ThickAsThieves	https://coinbr.com/ref?c=Q9gPSuUvYS	[15:48]
ThickAsThieves	i use all of them	[15:48]
ThickAsThieves	coinbr us actually a window into mpex	[15:48]
ThickAsThieves	with lower more spread out fees	[15:48]
assbot	[BTCTC] [B.YABMC] 1 @ 0.007701 BTC [-]	[15:49]
greenglue	really? sounds interesting	[15:50]
greenglue	so coiner is the best?	[15:50]
*	fdas (c2964189@gateway/web/freenode/ip.194.150.65.137) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[15:51]
ThickAsThieves	there is no best	[15:52]
ThickAsThieves	but coinbr is the most affordable way to do mpex	[15:52]
ThickAsThieves	unless you are a big player	[15:52]
greenglue	so the others have fees as well?	[15:52]
ThickAsThieves	no hard fees	[15:52]
ThickAsThieves	only transactional fees	[15:52]
ThickAsThieves	which all exchanges have	[15:53]
greenglue	yea	[15:53]
*	jan (~jan@p5DC113CE.dip.t-dialin.net) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[15:55]
*	jan is now known as Guest51713	[15:55]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 2050 @ 0.00067955 = 1.3931 BTC [+]	[15:55]
*	BitHub has quit ()	[16:02]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [VTX] 1 @ 0.4999 BTC [+]	[16:03]
*	greenglue has quit (Quit: Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com)	[16:06]
*	fydel (~fydel@p579920F3.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[16:06]
ThickAsThieves	wtb 5000+ SDICE pm if you have fair price (below current market asks)	[16:09]
*	daybyter has quit (Quit: Konversation terminated!)	[16:09]
*	Guest51713 has quit (Quit: Colloquy for iPhone - http://colloquy.mobi)	[16:10]
*	awkorama has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)	[16:16]
assbot	[BTCTC] [ASICMINER-PT] 1 @ 0.8 BTC [-]	[16:18]
*	awkorama (~awk@195.12.158.2) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[16:19]
assbot	[BTCTC] [GSDPT] 1 @ 0.0041 BTC [+]	[16:19]
assbot	[BTCTC] [GSDPT] 399 @ 0.0041 = 1.6359 BTC [+]	[16:20]
pgp	question: MPEX support a socket based implementation for requesting trades from a certain seq number forward. Why isn't there something like that for quotes?	[16:20]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [SDICE] 1 @ 0.41499999 BTC [+]	[16:23]
*	tiberiusiv (~tiberiusi@gateway/tor-sasl/tiberiusiv) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[16:25]
mircea_popescu	ThickAsThieves why not just put a bid ?	[16:37]
*	asciilifeform (~asciilife@pool-108-48-89-59.washdc.fios.verizon.net) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[16:41]
assbot	[BTCTC] [GSDPT] 25 @ 0.00409 = 0.1023 BTC [-]	[16:43]
*	fdas has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)	[16:55]
*	Uglux (~Uglux@port-92-204-86-100.dynamic.qsc.de) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[17:00]
taub	hm, maybe there wont be a big second downmove from here	[17:01]
ThickAsThieves	i have bids up, was just fishing to see if there were any sellers inside the spread that dont have asks up	[17:04]
*	Bugpowder (~Bugpowder@pool-71-171-106-2.clppva.fios.verizon.net) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[17:04]
ThickAsThieves	it's all in bugpowder's pocket probly	[17:04]
Bugpowder	Jesus	[17:05]
Bugpowder	The market making not	[17:05]
Bugpowder	Not	[17:05]
Bugpowder	Bot	[17:05]
Bugpowder	Yes	[17:05]
Bugpowder	Historically it averages 12% return on notional exposure a month	[17:06]
Bugpowder	But the variance is... High.	[17:06]
*	Uglux has quit (Remote host closed the connection)	[17:06]
ThickAsThieves	ihave to imagine the bot algo has been tightened, or?	[17:07]
Bugpowder	It does do explicit hedging	[17:07]
Bugpowder	Mostly mircera	[17:07]
Bugpowder	It's all in the financial statement	[17:08]
Bugpowder	Read it	[17:08]
assbot	[BTCTC] [ASICMINER-PT] 2 @ 0.8 = 1.6 BTC [-]	[17:09]
ThickAsThieves	STOP	[17:09]
*	fydel has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)	[17:09]
ThickAsThieves	fucking idiot	[17:09]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [SDICE] 1 @ 0.39999999 BTC [-]	[17:10]
OneMiner	+b PsychoticBoy	[17:10]
TomServo	^	[17:10]
ThickAsThieves	^	[17:10]
Bugpowder	This was always possible, very clearly so	[17:10]
ThickAsThieves	you dont have the right to spam	[17:10]
ThickAsThieves	just ask your questions cleanly	[17:11]
ThickAsThieves	and wait for answers	[17:11]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [SDICE] 1 @ 0.4 BTC [+]	[17:11]
Bugpowder	Based on August results	[17:11]
assbot	[BTCTC] [PAJKA.BOND] 7 @ 0.106 = 0.742 BTC [+]	[17:11]
OneMiner	There's no doubt that this is self aggrandizing trolling. If what you are saying is the truth or not you're trying to make yourself the center of attention. Knock it off.	[17:11]
Bugpowder	Actual losses of principal were 19k of which mircrea provided 75% of	[17:11]
OneMiner	Ya, just wanted to pass into. Like everything you've said about it and how your opinion matters so much. Don't flood.	[17:12]
Bugpowder	That is not true	[17:12]
Bugpowder	Look at past statements	[17:12]
ThickAsThieves	my only question is, has the bot algo been adjusted to mitigate this exposure in the future	[17:13]
Bugpowder	Mpex is a sideshow	[17:13]
ThickAsThieves	or is this just how it is	[17:13]
Bugpowder	Mpoe is the real profit engine	[17:13]
ThickAsThieves	Pycho, you only lost a few hundred bux	[17:14]
ThickAsThieves	cheap lesson	[17:14]
Bugpowder	Well considering the max bond exposure is always less than the total capital, indefinitely.	[17:15]
Bugpowder	Although the bot liquidity might go bye bye	[17:15]
ThickAsThieves	i lost some too	[17:16]
ThickAsThieves	i blame me	[17:16]
*	Uglux (~Uglux@port-92-204-86-100.dynamic.qsc.de) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[17:16]
Bugpowder	I wish I had all the gains.	[17:16]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [SDICE] 4 @ 0.4 = 1.6 BTC [+]	[17:17]
ThickAsThieves	but if MP lost that much covering the bonds, I'd like to hear if changes have been made to mitigate	[17:17]
Bugpowder	Yeah, extremely well	[17:17]
ThickAsThieves	Bug who are you talking to, i must have them on ignore	[17:17]
Bugpowder	Lol	[17:17]
Bugpowder	Anyway, if you dont understand the risks of being a bond holder, you should probably go back to the gloves kiddy pool	[17:18]
Bugpowder	Glbse	[17:18]
assbot	[BTCTC] [GSDPT] 9 @ 0.00409 = 0.0368 BTC [-]	[17:19]
ThickAsThieves	unignoring tiberius :(	[17:19]
ThickAsThieves	ola	[17:20]
Bugpowder	Anyway, have a wonderful weekend.	[17:20]
Bugpowder	Because he didn't understand the real risks	[17:22]
ThickAsThieves	MPs losses are a small portion of his assets, but I have to assume he will asjust exposure of the bot after this, no?	[17:22]
Bugpowder	Mpoe bonds never seemed like a good value prop To me.	[17:23]
ThickAsThieves	what does sdice have to do with this	[17:23]
Bugpowder	Sdice has made	[17:23]
Bugpowder	70k	[17:23]
ThickAsThieves	so	[17:23]
ThickAsThieves	i thought you were chiding MP, not Erik	[17:23]
ThickAsThieves	right, so rather than litter this chan with bitching, I'm just asking what I think is a sensible question,	[17:24]
ThickAsThieves	will he protect the bot better	[17:24]
mircea_popescu	my only question is, has the bot algo been adjusted to mitigate this exposure in the future << no.	[17:25]
mircea_popescu	bot hasn't been altered fundamentally since 2011	[17:25]
ThickAsThieves	thank you	[17:25]
Bugpowder	I'm sure u could tweak the ago	[17:25]
ThickAsThieves	MP, so you'll continue to take on the majority liability of the bot?	[17:26]
Bugpowder	Ago	[17:26]
Bugpowder	Algo	[17:26]
mircea_popescu	Bugpowder the issue is that people make assumption based on the algo as is	[17:26]
mircea_popescu	any tweak is fundamentally market intervention	[17:26]
mircea_popescu	the correct fix is for bond ppl to set appropriatge interests	[17:26]
mircea_popescu	not for me to dick around in the fabric of the universe.	[17:26]
ThickAsThieves	but the sustainability of your setup is in danger if price continues to move violently	[17:26]
mircea_popescu	ThickAsThieves i've always backstopped the bot, since day one.	[17:26]
mircea_popescu	if not enough bonds sell i'm covering.	[17:26]
ZedsterX	lol	[17:27]
ThickAsThieves	i'm about to put you two back on ignore fml	[17:27]
ThickAsThieves	Psycho, tib, grow up plz	[17:28]
mircea_popescu	Bugpowder anyway, the variance would be fucking high. +400% a month fml.	[17:28]
*	Uglux (~Uglux@port-92-204-86-100.dynamic.qsc.de) has left #bitcoin-assets ("Leaving")	[17:28]
Bugpowder	Yah	[17:28]
OneMiner	Why is the whole internet a troll magnet? Be respectful, please.	[17:28]
mircea_popescu	http://www.youtube.com/embed/LJP1DphOWPs << this guy...	[17:28]
Bugpowder	And for me, if I don't see what I consider to be mispriced options, I'm not going to buy them	[17:29]
OneMiner	Just don't be rude about it. There's no reason to be a jerk.	[17:29]
ThickAsThieves	no, THIS guy http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bTwQXpGtTyE	[17:29]
*	Uglux (~Uglux@port-92-204-86-100.dynamic.qsc.de) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[17:29]
*	Uglux has quit (Client Quit)	[17:29]
Bugpowder	Where is the fraud here?	[17:29]
OneMiner	Cool, say it once and be done.	[17:29]
Bugpowder	Not seeing it. I'm seeing clear contracts traded and honored	[17:30]
ZedsterX	can't we all just be freinds	[17:30]
*	Uglux (~Uglux@port-92-204-86-100.dynamic.qsc.de) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[17:30]
ThickAsThieves	i dont see any fraud either	[17:30]
Bugpowder	What about covered exposure are you pretending you don't understand?	[17:31]
*	Uglux has quit (Client Quit)	[17:31]
OneMiner	I personally don't know and don't hold any of this asset. But I'm being prevented from listening to any intelligent talk about the issue by trolling.Wether you think you are justified or not.	[17:31]
Bugpowder	You are clearly	[17:31]
assbot	[MPEX] [O.USD.C092T] 575 @ 0.24943748 = 143.4266 BTC [+]	[17:31]
Bugpowder	Heheh	[17:31]
Bugpowder	More options!!!	[17:31]
Bugpowder	Moar	[17:31]
mircea_popescu	fucking hell am i going to be paying .6 btc worth 200 each on these ?	[17:32]
*	greenglue (~textual@modemcable078.221-179-173.mc.videotron.ca) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[17:32]
mircea_popescu	i tell you, running the options book is the worst fucking racket there is. when you get no trade you're depressed, when you do get trade you're worried.	[17:32]
OneMiner	Oh lord. +b tiberiusiv He's just repeating himself over and over.	[17:33]
OneMiner	It's a slow flood.	[17:33]
mircea_popescu	OneMiner prolly ignore works better than banning people.	[17:33]
OneMiner	sigh	[17:33]
OneMiner	Ignore is confusing. Can't tell who is talking to who.	[17:34]
mircea_popescu	this is true.	[17:34]
ThickAsThieves	ignore doesnt work when people keep feeding the troll	[17:34]
mircea_popescu	it DOES make unignored people look like muppets when they're in effect talking to themselves lol	[17:34]
ThickAsThieves	tib has been polluting this channel all week	[17:34]
Bugpowder	Ciuciu is back! I thought he was gone after robbing everyone	[17:34]
ThickAsThieves	and was already banned once	[17:35]
mircea_popescu	Bugpowder girl said he was there to warn everyone about her shirt	[17:35]
ThickAsThieves	quit with the gypsy shit	[17:36]
thestrin1puller	!ticker m S.MPOE	[17:37]
assbot	[MPEX:S.MPOE] 1D: 0.00066393 / 0.00067378 / 0.00068314 (591559 shares, 398.58 BTC), 7D: 0.0006 / 0.00066121 / 0.00071369 (2268750 shares, 1,500.12 BTC), 30D: 0.0006 / 0.00073136 / 0.00078628 (17700228 shares, 12,945.38 BTC)	[17:37]
thestrin1puller	oh nice	[17:37]
mircea_popescu	wait it went up ?	[17:37]
Bugpowder	Up Pre report	[17:37]
thestrin1puller	yea	[17:37]
assbot	[MPEX] [O.USD.C089T] 120 @ 0.26539875 = 31.8479 BTC	[17:38]
Bugpowder	Not much action since?	[17:38]
mircea_popescu	kinda incredible	[17:38]
*	greenglue (~textual@modemcable078.221-179-173.mc.videotron.ca) has left #bitcoin-assets ("Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com")	[17:38]
thestrin1puller	there is a 29k loss for bondholders, maybe bondholders aren't mpoe holders	[17:38]
mircea_popescu	then again... i guess i can see it. shareholders don't care, not their skin. made a 39 per which is not really much lower than usual	[17:38]
mircea_popescu	thestrin1puller they are lol. i hold most of mpoe and held most of the bond book >.<	[17:39]
thestrin1puller	mircea_popescu: what's the plan to bring MPOE bot to MPOE bot 2.0	[17:39]
ThickAsThieves	how are bonds purchased, other than thrue the coinbr bitfunder assets?	[17:39]
ThickAsThieves	through*	[17:40]
mircea_popescu	ThickAsThieves you send no less than 100 btc to 1JPvucRfu3ZzEvfBUQTJwsxMrZjeTqD6zR ending in 888 (so like 100.00000888) after you've emailed me stating your beneficiary addy and desired %	[17:40]
mircea_popescu	thestrin1puller what'd 2.0 be like ?	[17:40]
thestrin1puller	dunno, seems the bot has trouble with times of extreme volatility	[17:40]
thestrin1puller	except for Feb	[17:41]
mircea_popescu	listen, there's no way to make a bot so you always win.	[17:41]
mircea_popescu	sometimes you'll take a beating.	[17:41]
ThickAsThieves	sensible, but it seems odd to be THAT exposed in the algo	[17:41]
mircea_popescu	but this is what it does. mpoe bot is in the market of buying exposure.	[17:42]
mircea_popescu	so other people can sell their exposure and increase their safety.	[17:42]
mircea_popescu	for this service it charges.	[17:42]
ThickAsThieves	or pays	[17:42]
ThickAsThieves	:)	[17:42]
mircea_popescu	it's sort of like insurance, if you will. you pay a little every month	[17:42]
mircea_popescu	when a hurricane hits the insurer pays through the teeth.	[17:42]
thestrin1puller	how do bondholers then hedge their risk?	[17:42]
thestrin1puller	bondholders*	[17:42]
ThickAsThieves	buying options	[17:42]
mircea_popescu	thestrin1puller well they don't really. the idea is they're taking on risk for a high %	[17:42]
mircea_popescu	mpoe-bonds are pretty much the highest reward / highest risk actgion in btc.	[17:43]
mircea_popescu	by a wide margin, with a lot of depth etc.	[17:43]
ThickAsThieves	the history of gained % seems a bit disproportionate to the risk	[17:43]
mircea_popescu	if that's true then bondholders have been mispricing their %	[17:44]
ThickAsThieves	you are learget bondholder	[17:44]
ThickAsThieves	largest*	[17:44]
thestrin1puller	as a last resort though	[17:44]
ThickAsThieves	right?	[17:44]
ThickAsThieves	i see	[17:44]
mircea_popescu	well ya on this month. i rarely participate in the actual market.	[17:44]
mircea_popescu	as in, i don't set a %, i just take whatever the max was	[17:44]
asciilifeform	question: wtf do gypsies have to do with all of this?	[17:45]
thestrin1puller	...	[17:45]
ThickAsThieves	thats not a question	[17:45]
ThickAsThieves	its a troll	[17:45]
DeaDTerra	WTS GSDPT shares and BTCQuick shares :)	[17:46]
thestrin1puller	mircea_popescu: why not create a war chest? For times like thse.	[17:46]
thestrin1puller	these*	[17:46]
mircea_popescu	what's a warchest ?	[17:46]
ThickAsThieves	a reserve	[17:47]
thestrin1puller	is it unnecessary or what...?	[17:47]
mircea_popescu	well, imo it would just muddy the waters.	[17:48]
thestrin1puller	http://www.foxnews.com/tech/2013/03/29/digital-currency-bitcoin-surpasses-20-national-currencies-in-value/ - lol fox news	[17:48]
mircea_popescu	atm mpoe is a 0 capital venture, which is a good thing.	[17:48]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9014 @ 0.00067281 = 6.0647 BTC [-]	[17:48]
thestrin1puller	I've used the same model for some of my real life ventures, it's a very good model in that you view capital as "equipment"	[17:48]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [VTX] 10 @ 0.48 = 4.8 BTC [-]	[17:49]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [VTX] 6 @ 0.4994 = 2.9964 BTC [+]	[17:49]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [VTX] 12 @ 0.4995 = 5.994 BTC [+]	[17:49]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [VTX] 72 @ 0.4999 = 35.9928 BTC [+]	[17:49]
thestrin1puller	however it's the riskiness involved in "borrowing" the capital (can it be paid back /w interest)	[17:49]
Scrat	the trolling potential of this channel is quite high. how could I miss this	[17:50]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [SDICE] 1 @ 0.41499998 BTC [+]	[17:51]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [SDICE] 1 @ 0.41499999 BTC [+]	[17:53]
thestrin1puller	trolls with no money have no purpose :P	[17:53]
thestrin1puller	!ticker h HIM	[17:53]
assbot	[HAVELOCK:HIM] 1D: 1.88000000 / 1.89 / 1.89500000 (3 shares, 5.67000000 BTC), 7D: 1.41000000 / 1.72614891 / 2.00000000 (182 shares, 314.15910103 BTC), 30D: 1.40000000 / 1.82208764 / 17.25000000 (716 shares, 1304.61475269 BTC)	[17:53]
taub	I guess I can now go to my grave having contributed ~15k BTC of my own to the stabilisation of BTC <- was that big push you yesterday? :>	[17:56]
mircea_popescu	Mpex is a sideshow <<< if it weren't for mpex there'd have been no divs this month at all.	[17:57]
Bugpowder	In terms of the main profit engine	[17:57]
Bugpowder	Mpoe has provided most of the returns and volatility	[17:58]
Bugpowder	Mpex is a steady stream	[17:58]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [HIM] 5 @ 1.93 = 9.65 BTC [+]	[17:59]
*	benkay (~benkay@c-71-193-200-93.hsd1.or.comcast.net) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[17:59]
mircea_popescu	yeah	[17:59]
mircea_popescu	just like a successful marriage.	[18:00]
mircea_popescu	mpex makes sure there's warm server soup on the table.	[18:00]
benkay	isn't that what the help is for?	[18:00]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [KCIM] 1 @ 1.198 BTC [+]	[18:01]
mircea_popescu	taub how you mean ?	[18:01]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [SDICE] 2 @ 0.41499998 = 0.83 BTC [-]	[18:04]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [SDICE] 4 @ 0.41499998 = 1.66 BTC [-]	[18:05]
*	Bugpowder has quit (Remote host closed the connection)	[18:05]
*	Diablo-D3 (~diablo@pool-70-16-109-241.port.east.myfairpoint.net) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[18:06]
*	Bugpowder (~Bugpowder@pool-71-171-106-2.clppva.fios.verizon.net) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[18:07]
assbot	[BTCTC] [BASIC-MINING] 24 @ 0.37 = 8.88 BTC [+]	[18:10]
taub	yesterday on mygox there suddenly was 15k on the bid	[18:10]
assbot	[BTCTC] [ASICMINER-PT] 1 @ 0.7701 BTC [-]	[18:10]
assbot	[BTCTC] [ASICMINER-PT] 2 @ 0.7701 = 1.5402 BTC [-]	[18:10]
assbot	[BTCTC] [ASICMINER-PT] 2 @ 0.77 = 1.54 BTC [-]	[18:10]
assbot	[BTCTC] [ASICMINER-PT] 1 @ 0.7653 BTC [-]	[18:10]
assbot	[BTCTC] [ASICMINER-PT] 6 @ 0.7605 = 4.563 BTC [-]	[18:10]
assbot	[BTCTC] [ASICMINER-PT] 8 @ 0.7603 = 6.0824 BTC [-]	[18:10]
mircea_popescu	nah, that was about the options coverage.	[18:10]
assbot	[BTCTC] [ASICMINER-PT] 10 @ 0.7602 = 7.602 BTC [-]	[18:11]
assbot	[BTCTC] [ASICMINER-PT] 2 @ 0.75 = 1.5 BTC [-]	[18:11]
assbot	[BTCTC] [ASICMINER-PT] 6 @ 0.75 = 4.5 BTC [-]	[18:11]
assbot	[BTCTC] [ASICMINER-PT] 4 @ 0.75 = 3 BTC [-]	[18:11]
assbot	[BTCTC] [ASICMINER-PT] 38 @ 0.74 = 28.12 BTC [-]	[18:11]
assbot	[BTCTC] [BASIC-MINING] 5 @ 0.38 = 1.9 BTC [+]	[18:11]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [KCIM] 1 @ 1.1999 BTC [+]	[18:12]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [SDICE] 1 @ 0.41499998 BTC [-]	[18:13]
assbot	[BTCTC] [GSDPT] 48 @ 0.00409 = 0.1963 BTC [-]	[18:14]
taub	but mpex either needs more horrible traders	[18:14]
taub	or you could start hedging your options	[18:14]
taub	to bring down that big variance...	[18:14]
taub	you're basically operating a bucket shop	[18:14]
taub	but not enough suckers	[18:14]
taub	who lose on their options	[18:15]
mircea_popescu	i don't follow your logic.	[18:16]
mircea_popescu	how is it a bucket shop ?	[18:16]
taub	because you take the other side of each trade, if traders only win against you then you lose money	[18:17]
mircea_popescu	that;'s not what a bucket shop is.	[18:17]
taub	in forex i thought it was, a broker taht assumes most of their customers are gonna lose money	[18:17]
mircea_popescu	but anyway : mpoe can't hedge. what it does is it allows others to hedge against it.	[18:17]
mircea_popescu	let me find you the relevant article.	[18:17]
mircea_popescu	http://mpex.co/faq.html#27 and next 2	[18:18]
benkay	would you elaborate on what a bucket shop is and why MPEx is not that?	[18:19]
taub	the exchange i solid	[18:19]
taub	the option bot is the worrysome part	[18:19]
taub	*is solid	[18:19]
benkay	i also do not understand the option bot's behavior.	[18:20]
taub	mircea_popescu: if the underlying volume and depth cant support your options you shouldnt be offering them like that maybe ;)	[18:20]
jurov	lol all the hate. inbetween, coinbr got possibly most deposits in one day in few hrs i was afk	[18:20]
benkay	or its role. mircea_popescu, would you elaborate on the bot's role?	[18:20]
jurov	this month	[18:20]
mircea_popescu	ok let's see.	[18:20]
*	cads (~m@c-76-17-110-13.hsd1.ga.comcast.net) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[18:20]
jurov	they will be processed shortly	[18:20]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [VTX] 20 @ 0.4999 = 9.998 BTC [+]	[18:21]
mircea_popescu	a bucket shop is a currently illegal, historically popular venue to take side bets on stocks.	[18:21]
jurov	as well as mpoe dividend	[18:21]
mircea_popescu	the operator would offer very high margin and trade with low net worth parties who couldn't participate in the real marketsd.	[18:21]
mircea_popescu	mpex does offer stocks, but that's not under discussion here. as for the derivative trade, ie options, these are a different market from the underlying.	[18:22]
taub	most forex brokers still operate like that	[18:22]
mircea_popescu	so does that clarify the difference ?	[18:22]
benkay	yes, that makes sense. and the bot?	[18:23]
mircea_popescu	okay. the bot itself is a primary seller of safety in btc.	[18:23]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10143 @ 0.00067879 = 6.885 BTC [+]	[18:23]
benkay	I don't understand the phrase "seller of safety in btc".	[18:23]
mircea_popescu	this is what it does. if i go buy safety somewhere else then i'm no longer PROVIDING it	[18:23]
mircea_popescu	i'm just flipping it.	[18:24]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [SDICE] 1 @ 0.41499999 BTC [+]	[18:24]
mircea_popescu	benkay take the insurance example, because it is really very apt.	[18:24]
mircea_popescu	if there's a flood plain and farmers work that plain,	[18:24]
mircea_popescu	it would be beneficial for them to buy flood insurance.	[18:24]
mircea_popescu	the only way to actually underwrite this is to have a lot of money, sign insurance policies with the farmers.	[18:24]
taub	i dont think thats how real option issuer work tho	[18:24]
mircea_popescu	when floods hit you pay.	[18:24]
taub	you got the cpital	[18:24]
taub	why not hedge	[18:24]
mircea_popescu	the alternative would be to simply re-buy insurance somewhere else. but this isn't underwriting, this is simply trading.	[18:25]
mircea_popescu	i'm not trading volatility, i'm actually providing the hedge endpoint.	[18:25]
mircea_popescu	or if you prefer the example of the internet : second, third and higher tier providers BUY bandwidth.	[18:25]
mircea_popescu	but the 1st level providers don't buy it, cause there's nobody to buy it from	[18:25]
mircea_popescu	they just swap it.	[18:25]
mircea_popescu	or in other words "create" it.	[18:26]
mircea_popescu	taub cause there's nobody to hedge against.	[18:26]
mircea_popescu	the moment i go in the market to hedge i'm basically releasing all the risk out there. this isn't waht mpoe does. mpoe just soaks up the risk.	[18:27]
thestrin1puller	doesn't i say that in your faq?	[18:27]
thestrin1puller	http://mpex.co/faq.html#27 http://mpex.co/faq.html#28	[18:27]
benkay	thanks mp, i understand the mechanism a little better now. what I still don't understand is what the MPOE bot is up to.	[18:27]
thestrin1puller	"You can't pull yourself up by your breeches and for the very same reason you can't have everybody in the market hedge. Someone needs to provide the support everyone else relies on to hedge. I'm that someone." - MP	[18:27]
benkay	we are engaging in a discussion of this topic, yes	[18:28]
mircea_popescu	benkay up to as in how you mean ?	[18:28]
benkay	no as in like wtf is it actually doing	[18:28]
mircea_popescu	it makes bids and asks for the options.	[18:28]
benkay	how does it decide where to place its bids?	[18:29]
mircea_popescu	that's proprietary. it has an algo.	[18:29]
benkay	so it behaves as just another trader?	[18:29]
mircea_popescu	pretty much yea	[18:29]
benkay	providing liquidity to the market?	[18:30]
thestrin1puller	why isn't the bot quoting right now?	[18:30]
mircea_popescu	thestrin1puller isnt it ?	[18:30]
mircea_popescu	benkay yep	[18:30]
thestrin1puller	nvm it's back up	[18:31]
thestrin1puller	site was lying to me	[18:31]
thestrin1puller	!ticker m ^OIX	[18:31]
assbot	[MPEX:^OIX] 1D: 0 / 0 / 0 (0 shares, 0 BTC), 7D: 55.14018691 / 85.06423935 / 85.06556611 (111010 shares, 22,104.19 BTC), 30D: 0 / 0 / 0 (0 shares, 0 BTC)	[18:31]
mircea_popescu	oix is fucked because of the mpsic change	[18:31]
thestrin1puller	oh	[18:32]
mircea_popescu	it will make sense again in about a week.	[18:32]
taub	they are binary options yea? dont think i quite understand their pricing from 0 to 1	[18:32]
thestrin1puller	all the way up to 200 I see :)	[18:32]
mircea_popescu	taub not binary. american style btc settled.	[18:32]
mircea_popescu	thestrin1puller ya, there's a notice.	[18:32]
benkay	what exchange-proprietary information does the bot get access to?	[18:33]
mircea_popescu	none.	[18:33]
benkay	obviously you have to say that.	[18:33]
mircea_popescu	all it sees is the btc/usd history	[18:33]
mircea_popescu	which is public	[18:34]
thestrin1puller	am I the only one who feels bad for this month's bond holders?	[18:34]
bitesak	thanks mp for the service you provide;	[18:34]
jurov	mircea_popescu: exercises are not public	[18:34]
mircea_popescu	bitesak i'd normally say my pleasure... but this month was a little rough.	[18:34]
mircea_popescu	jurov the bot doesn't see exercises tho	[18:35]
mircea_popescu	thestrin1puller no, i feel bad for them too.	[18:35]
thestrin1puller	I guess we can't always have months like Jan	[18:35]
bitesak	do you adjust the algo going forward to take into consideration what causes big losses?	[18:35]
mircea_popescu	nope.	[18:35]
*	Bugpowder has quit (Remote host closed the connection)	[18:36]
jurov	no replies on btctalk so far... but we'll see when ppl come to bitfunder to receive only 0.081 pre share	[18:36]
mircea_popescu	jurov scam	[18:36]
thestrin1puller	what was the % loss for the PT jurov ?	[18:36]
thestrin1puller	40?	[18:37]
jurov	wat?	[18:37]
mircea_popescu	like 25% i'd expect	[18:37]
jurov	it's 1:1 to MPOE	[18:37]
mircea_popescu	23	[18:37]
jurov	yes	[18:37]
thestrin1puller	"All complaints of bondholder loss should be directed to Bugpowder who now holds your money"	[18:37]
mircea_popescu	ahahaha	[18:37]
thestrin1puller	:D	[18:37]
jurov	heh, i made some myself, tooo	[18:37]
mircea_popescu	do you even know that ? lol	[18:38]
mircea_popescu	maybe he's just talkin'.	[18:38]
mircea_popescu	poor guy lol. one day he's claiming market success like what... 99% of all internet ppl in financial rooms	[18:38]
mircea_popescu	the next they ANGRY MOB WITH PITCHFORKS	[18:38]
thestrin1puller	Maybe he'll start a company to benefit bitcoin (yay optimism LOL)	[18:39]
jurov	he;'ll benefit tesla motors	[18:40]
thestrin1puller	tiberiusiv: option writers make the most money when there is no volatility in the underlying security	[18:40]
thestrin1puller	so overtime MPOE will be profitable to bondholers	[18:41]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [SDICE] 3 @ 0.41499998 = 1.245 BTC [-]	[18:41]
thestrin1puller	!ticker m S.DICE	[18:41]
assbot	[MPEX:S.DICE] 1D: 0.00337335 / 0.00368422 / 0.0039999 (14099 shares, 51.94 BTC), 7D: 0.0031 / 0.00338624 / 0.0045 (675573 shares, 2,287.66 BTC), 30D: 0.00300001 / 0.00449093 / 0.00637777 (1675373 shares, 7,524.00 BTC)	[18:41]
jurov	thestrin1puller: he knows everything, no need to explain anything to him. and ofc, thars NO LIQUIDITY	[18:41]
jurov	NO POK	[18:41]
mircea_popescu	at all ?!	[18:42]
thestrin1puller	Not sure if tiberiusiv is serious, or just trolling.	[18:42]
thestrin1puller	Up until this month MPOE bonds were profitable long term (all profits + all losses > 0)	[18:42]
jurov	tiberiusiv: ofc, if mp goes out of money he stops sellin options. happened before already	[18:43]
thestrin1puller	I know they are, this month they are, just like an insurance company loses money during a natural disaster...	[18:43]
jurov	tiberiusiv: those who profited by buying calls see the credibility soar :)	[18:44]
thestrin1puller	insurance companies also have reserves they invest to hedge that risk...	[18:44]
thestrin1puller	that's not up to mircea_popescu it's up to his bondholders	[18:45]
thestrin1puller	i feel like you aren't listening	[18:45]
thestrin1puller	insurance companies make losses all the time...	[18:45]
*	daybyter (~andreas@88-134-89-235-dynip.superkabel.de) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[18:45]
benkay	that's an expansive claim.	[18:46]
thestrin1puller	this is where he lists of AIG among others	[18:46]
thestrin1puller	BOOYA	[18:46]
thestrin1puller	I'm so predictive	[18:46]
thestrin1puller	no he's not	[18:46]
thestrin1puller	you keep saying that like it's fact	[18:46]
thestrin1puller	this is one exception!	[18:47]
thestrin1puller	1 month != all months	[18:47]
benkay	what sheet, tiberiusiv?	[18:47]
thestrin1puller	That made me LOL	[18:47]
jurov	tiberiusiv: there's mircea's private activities like MPHF	[18:48]
bitesak	mphf?	[18:48]
jurov	= shorting GLBSEsque assets	[18:48]
thestrin1puller	tiberiusiv: why are you making claims with out evidence	[18:48]
thestrin1puller	mircea_popescu: are ALL your financials public knowledge? lets clear this up	[18:49]
mircea_popescu	thestrin1puller no. i paid twennyfive dollars for a girls pair of stockings out of pocket yesterday.	[18:49]
mircea_popescu	what do you mean "all your financials" ?!	[18:50]
KRS1	lol	[18:50]
benkay	one could ask	[18:50]
benkay	hey mircea	[18:50]
benkay	how many months of 15k losses can MPEx/Mircea Popescu sustain?	[18:51]
thestrin1puller	mircea_popescu: it seems tiberiusiv knows your financials because they are all public	[18:51]
mircea_popescu	um	[18:51]
jurov	thestrin1puller i told ya, he knows everything	[18:51]
mircea_popescu	do you mean polimedia srl ?	[18:51]
benkay	i suppose. does polimedia srl's corporate structure provide for funding MPEx?	[18:51]
mircea_popescu	nope.	[18:52]
mircea_popescu	it's a romanian-based llc (srl in romanian) that i own ~99% of	[18:52]
benkay	then, how many months of 15kbtc losses can the exchange sustain?	[18:52]
mircea_popescu	at least a year.	[18:52]
thestrin1puller	mircea_popescu you make a bunch of people rich this month, and people still complain...	[18:53]
mircea_popescu	thestrin1puller ya well, the thing is this : mpoe and mpex are VERY complex, well thought out intricately designed gems.	[18:53]
mircea_popescu	"people" have been busily ignoring it for the past year or two	[18:53]
mircea_popescu	meanwhile it's been taking over.	[18:53]
mircea_popescu	now "people" are confronted with the rude awakening of reality. kinda bound to be a little thrashing about.	[18:53]
thestrin1puller	;;bc,24hprc	[18:54]
gribble	Error: "bc,24hprc" is not a valid command.	[18:54]
assbot	[BTCTC] [ASICMINER-PT] 4 @ 0.792 = 3.168 BTC [+]	[18:54]
thestrin1puller	;;ticker	[18:54]
gribble	BTCUSD ticker \| Best bid: 90.49001, Best ask: 90.50000, Bid-ask spread: 0.00999, Last trade: 90.50000, 24 hour volume: 51005.98011536, 24 hour low: 85.50000, 24 hour high: 94.98000, 24 hour vwap: 90.64316	[18:54]
bitesak	Roumania is taking Europe over__	[18:54]
benkay	ooh. what's the difference between MPOE and MPEx?	[18:54]
jurov	MPOE is the options trades, MPEx is the exchange	[18:54]
thestrin1puller	Hmm. mircea_popescu could one externally hedge risks of being a bondholder with other investments no?	[18:54]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [KCIM] 7 @ 1.198 = 8.386 BTC [-]	[18:55]
jurov	thestrin1puller hedge them by buying options :D	[18:55]
mircea_popescu	thestrin1puller like how ?	[18:55]
mircea_popescu	bitesak lol considering the state of finances everywhere in europe vs romania... that's not quite so far off.	[18:56]
thestrin1puller	mircea_popescu: for instance I put x BTC in Bonds during a bad month, but some other investment say, S.DICE growth, effectively neutralizes my bond losses	[18:56]
mircea_popescu	yeah, but these aren't related	[18:56]
thestrin1puller	i know but I'm saying diversification is one solution no?	[18:56]
mircea_popescu	to hedge you would need things which for good reason move in opposing directions.	[18:56]
mircea_popescu	diversification certainly is a solution, yes.	[18:56]
jurov	thestrin1puller: BTC growth itself effectively neutralized your bond losses, don't forget	[18:56]
mircea_popescu	if you have 105 btc and put 100 btc into mpoe bonds expect a wild ride.	[18:57]
mircea_popescu	jurov that is a point, in fiat terms the bondholders made money :D	[18:57]
mircea_popescu	actually... this is interesting. from a purely fiat perspective mpoe bonds may be one of the best btc-investments you can make.	[18:57]
thestrin1puller	unless you have an august month	[18:58]
bitesak	I have been saying that for sometime in Switzerland :)	[18:58]
thestrin1puller	That was just...	[18:58]
thestrin1puller	August was terrible	[18:58]
mircea_popescu	yeah.	[18:59]
jurov	tiberiusiv, you forget there's someone who actually sees your portfolio and call you on your BS	[19:00]
jurov	and sdice?	[19:01]
mircea_popescu	thestrin1puller thinking more about your question : it would seem to me there is some relation here:	[19:02]
*	benkay has quit (Quit: benkay)	[19:02]
mircea_popescu	MPOE bonds make money on calm fx market, lose money on volatility.	[19:02]
mircea_popescu	places like mtgox make money on volatility	[19:03]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.DICE] 1750 @ 0.0039999 = 6.9998 BTC [+]	[19:03]
mircea_popescu	so maybe the best play is a weighted binary portofolio, bonds and mtgox shares	[19:03]
mircea_popescu	it's moot practically as they're not listed, but since we're discussing theory.	[19:03]
jurov	and options	[19:03]
mircea_popescu	jurov yeah, you could be trading options too	[19:03]
taub	mtgox makes money on volume, not volatility	[19:03]
mircea_popescu	taub those'd be related tho	[19:04]
taub	they dont have to	[19:04]
mircea_popescu	also true	[19:04]
jurov	tiberiusiv, i actually did it once when everyone was like "half reward is coming, brace ur"	[19:04]
jurov	i did a split, sold both puts and calls	[19:05]
*	fdas (c2964189@gateway/web/freenode/ip.194.150.65.137) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[19:05]
jurov	and indeed nothing happened then	[19:05]
mircea_popescu	lol	[19:05]
jurov	but won't dare to repeat it	[19:05]
ThickAsThieves	mp, obv you should be hedging using litecoin	[19:05]
ThickAsThieves	:)	[19:05]
taub	who was pirate	[19:05]
mircea_popescu	i guess btc is still very much a contrarian market. whatever the public consensus is, it's prolly wrong.	[19:05]
mircea_popescu	taub http://polimedia.us/trilema/2012/the-bitcoin-drama-timeline/	[19:05]
mircea_popescu	good start point for the history of btc financials.	[19:06]
mircea_popescu	(not implying pirate was such a thing)	[19:06]
mircea_popescu	hey, who here was from slovenia ?	[19:07]
jurov	that kakobrekla fella	[19:07]
mircea_popescu	kakobrekla what's it like there ? i can't make sense of all the bs i'm reading.	[19:07]
kakobrekla	about what	[19:08]
jurov	about impending doom	[19:08]
kakobrekla	fyi italy is in yurop and you worry bout slovenia?	[19:08]
jurov	slovenia to sunk into adriatic, austrians want some coastline :D	[19:08]
mircea_popescu	is maribor going under ?	[19:09]
kakobrekla	i dont think so	[19:09]
thestrin1puller	S.DICE should be skyrocketing	[19:10]
thestrin1puller	!ticker m S.DICE	[19:10]
assbot	[MPEX:S.DICE] 1D: 0.00337335 / 0.00371908 / 0.0039999 (15849 shares, 58.94 BTC), 7D: 0.0031 / 0.00338783 / 0.0045 (677323 shares, 2,294.66 BTC), 30D: 0.00300001 / 0.00449042 / 0.00637777 (1677123 shares, 7,531.00 BTC)	[19:10]
kakobrekla	why again?	[19:10]
thestrin1puller	Based on the rise in PT prices	[19:10]
thestrin1puller	the original source is still a few % lower than PT price	[19:10]
ThickAsThieves	temporal	[19:10]
*	brianethier_ (171d7e66@gateway/web/freenode/ip.23.29.126.102) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[19:13]
brianethier_	With a lot of headecks, we managed to put together another site from wich you can buy Amazon Gift Cards with Bitcoins. You no longer need an account, it’s much simpler to use now. We received a lot of complaints that user accounts are not necessary so we removed them. We are still a bit rugged, but donations are open so you can donate (if you want to) so we can improve the site. The new site is at: http://amazonbitco	[19:13]
thestrin1puller	mircea_popescu: it seems you win again ;) I would say, all and all for a month that is a beating, you have come out relatively unscathed...	[19:13]
*	assbot sets ban on !@gateway/web/freenode/ip.23.29.126.102	[19:14]
*	assbot has kicked brianethier_ from #bitcoin-assets (Bye.)	[19:14]
ThickAsThieves	fail spam	[19:14]
mircea_popescu	lol wtf is with people.	[19:14]
mircea_popescu	why can't he participate in the chan like normal human beings.	[19:14]
jurov	what are headecks?	[19:15]
jurov	something like tinfoil hats, just for stupidity?	[19:15]
ThickAsThieves	landing pads for space cadets	[19:16]
*	toffoo (~tof@201.53.123.46) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[19:16]
*	Luceo has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)	[19:17]
ThickAsThieves	https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=101902.msg1705462#msg1705462	[19:17]
ThickAsThieves	hints of hints of news	[19:17]
jurov	his previous post is also interesting	[19:18]
jurov	not US resident anymore	[19:19]
*	terryww has quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)	[19:19]
ThickAsThieves	yep	[19:19]
ThickAsThieves	although i think that has been a rumour for a bit	[19:19]
KRS1	and it will be even harder now	[19:23]
KRS1	with BTC deflation	[19:23]
KRS1	I thought BTC wont go through deflation period until almost mined up	[19:23]
KRS1	maybe i dont understand the context..but..	[19:23]
KRS1	from what I understand about economics, like inflation deflation is not necessarily good	[19:24]
mircea_popescu	http://polimedia.us/trilema/2013/options-and-leverage-a-case-study/	[19:25]
mircea_popescu	just calculated the implicit leverage for march.	[19:25]
mircea_popescu	5.02x	[19:25]
KRS1	so this is a good case of deflation	[19:25]
KRS1	ok	[19:26]
ThickAsThieves	alternative idea for channel bannings: offer ignore bounties, pay .001 to anyone that ignored the desired person, if you are caught responding to that troll you pay .1 penalty, profits go to assbot dev	[19:26]
mircea_popescu	KRS1 bitcoin inflation is about 8% pa atm	[19:26]
ThickAsThieves	sorta like a swear jar?	[19:26]
KRS1	How do you get that figure mircea popescu	[19:26]
KRS1	thats low as far as im understanding it and not bad either	[19:27]
mircea_popescu	KRS1 25 btc x 6 blocks x 24 hours in a day	[19:27]
mircea_popescu	compare to the total btc in circulation	[19:27]
KRS1	ic	[19:27]
mircea_popescu	annualize somehow	[19:27]
*	copumpkin has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)	[19:27]
KRS1	these are all good indicators i think	[19:27]
mircea_popescu	(the exact way is left as an exercise to the user, seeing how depending on how you do it you get diff results)	[19:27]
*	copumpkin (~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[19:28]
KRS1	ok thank you guys-	[19:29]
jurov	CoinBr.MPBPT-O paid out, 0.07679501 BTC per share (nominal value 0.1 BTC)	[19:36]
*	da2ce7 (~da2ce7@opentransactions/dev/da2ce7) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[19:43]
*	farfi has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)	[19:44]
assbot	[BTCTC] [ASICMINER-PT] 2 @ 0.795 = 1.59 BTC [+]	[19:45]
assbot	[BTCTC] [ASICMINER-PT] 4 @ 0.7999 = 3.1996 BTC [+]	[19:45]
*	da2ce7_d has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)	[19:46]
*	farfi (~farfi@87.68.213.78.adsl.012.net.il) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[19:49]
bitesak	;;ticker	[19:49]
gribble	BTCUSD ticker \| Best bid: 90.80001, Best ask: 90.98999, Bid-ask spread: 0.18998, Last trade: 90.98999, 24 hour volume: 49893.62640319, 24 hour low: 85.50000, 24 hour high: 94.98000, 24 hour vwap: 90.70184	[19:49]
Diablo-D3	still not 100	[19:51]
toffoo	prolly not going to be over easter holiday weekend	[19:52]
toffoo	gotta wait for the snail banks to open again to get more fresh buying funds into the market	[19:53]
mircea_popescu	that's a point	[19:53]
ThickAsThieves	surpised it's not moving down really	[19:55]
ThickAsThieves	;;bids 85	[19:55]
gribble	There are currently 16264.821 bitcoins demanded at or over 85.0 USD, worth 1422076.42737 USD in total. \| Data vintage: 0.0064 seconds	[19:55]
toffoo	looks like maybe litecoin is the one that's rockin to new highs these days	[19:55]
ThickAsThieves	;;bids 88	[19:55]
gribble	There are currently 6698.9219 bitcoins demanded at or over 88.0 USD, worth 596157.374234 USD in total. \| Data vintage: 5.3952 seconds	[19:55]
ThickAsThieves	;;asks 96	[19:55]
gribble	There are currently 11822.091 bitcoins offered at or under 96.0 USD, worth 1113104.50621 USD in total. \| Data vintage: 21.2181 seconds	[19:55]
ThickAsThieves	;;asks 93	[19:55]
gribble	There are currently 3311.6116 bitcoins offered at or under 93.0 USD, worth 306592.030934 USD in total. \| Data vintage: 33.4255 seconds	[19:55]
ThickAsThieves	heh	[19:55]
toffoo	maybe litecoin will cross $1 before bitcoin crosses $100	[19:56]
ThickAsThieves	maybe	[19:56]
*	pib1943 (~pib1943@your.friendly.media.team.coder.ark-cr.info) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[19:58]
mircea_popescu	i fail to grok how litecoin can be worth 1	[20:02]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 971 @ 0.00067327 = 0.6537 BTC [-]	[20:03]
toffoo	well it's worth $0.81 right now ...	[20:03]
toffoo	i'd managed to ignore it all all other *coins until now,	[20:03]
toffoo	but this month it has gotten my attention	[20:04]
*	DeaDTerra has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)	[20:04]
ThickAsThieves	all in all I'd have been better off not dabbling in LTC at all, other than that it introduced me to Deprived, who's pretty interesting	[20:06]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [HIM] 1 @ 1.94999999 BTC [+]	[20:06]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [HIM] 2 @ 1.97999999 = 3.96 BTC [+]	[20:06]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [HIM] 1 @ 1.98 BTC [+]	[20:06]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [HIM] 1 @ 1.99999999 BTC [+]	[20:06]
*	DeaDTerra (~DeaDTerra@226.169.216.81.static.apv.siw.siwnet.net) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[20:06]
thestrin1puller	OH SNAP HIM	[20:06]
thestrin1puller	I KNEW IT	[20:06]
kakobrekla	ThickAsThieves why would you be better off	[20:06]
thestrin1puller	MWAHAHAHAHA	[20:06]
*	DeaDTerra is now known as Guest22312	[20:06]
*	Guest22312 is now known as DeaDTerra1	[20:07]
mircea_popescu	i bought some on like the 5th	[20:07]
mircea_popescu	but then sold it off. apparently i sold too soon	[20:07]
mircea_popescu	but srsly wtf.	[20:07]
kakobrekla	yeah i played the game too	[20:07]
kakobrekla	made 100% in 3 days or so and never looked back	[20:07]
mircea_popescu	yeah. something of the sort.	[20:07]
mircea_popescu	but i certainly didn't get out at the top. wtf lol	[20:08]
toffoo	well, my investment thesis is something like the following:	[20:08]
kakobrekla	i was riding 0.07 to 0.15	[20:08]
*	DeaDTerra1 has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)	[20:08]
toffoo	i've always followed pretty closely the effect of difficulty on bitcoin prices,	[20:08]
*	tiberiusiv has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)	[20:08]
toffoo	and now with ASICs moving that to the moon,	[20:08]
taub	hah	[20:09]
toffoo	the feeling is that a lot of the GPU mining farms will drop out and start mining litecoin,	[20:09]
mircea_popescu	toffoo so ?	[20:09]
toffoo	which will cause it's difficulty to start rising,	[20:09]
kakobrekla	it still is useless	[20:09]
toffoo	which it has,	[20:09]
toffoo	and therefore market prices are following	[20:09]
kakobrekla	well you can invest in eskimo bobs ART and thats about it	[20:09]
mircea_popescu	hum	[20:09]
mircea_popescu	kakobrekla o totally forgot. how's the clay business i wonder	[20:10]
kakobrekla	hes gonna be klin millioanare	[20:10]
toffoo	try to find a chart of litecoin difficulty the past few weeks	[20:10]
mircea_popescu	you mean klim ?	[20:10]
ThickAsThieves	basically, i started to learn the price manipulation patterns in BTC-e for LTC,	[20:10]
ThickAsThieves	and joined them	[20:10]
ThickAsThieves	did fine	[20:10]
ThickAsThieves	then BTC blew up a bajillion % higher	[20:11]
ThickAsThieves	and i was holding the bag	[20:11]
mircea_popescu	aww	[20:11]
*	Guest22312 (~DeaDTerra@226.169.216.81.static.apv.siw.siwnet.net) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[20:11]
mircea_popescu	i'd kinda short ltc at 1 dollar each	[20:11]
ThickAsThieves	about a 12btc haircut for me that day	[20:11]
kakobrekla	i ment kiln	[20:11]
kakobrekla	for pottery?	[20:12]
kakobrekla	nvm	[20:12]
mircea_popescu	lolk	[20:12]
ThickAsThieves	but i covered a bit by sniping underpriced assets at ltcglobal	[20:12]
*	saulimus (~someone@37-219-43-8.nat.bb.dnainternet.fi) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[20:12]
ThickAsThieves	i even got props from Deprived for a couple of my moves :)	[20:12]
mircea_popescu	haha cool	[20:12]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.DICE] 430 @ 0.003512 = 1.5102 BTC [-]	[20:13]
*	Guest22312 is now known as DeaDTerra1	[20:13]
mircea_popescu	you know in retrospect... that s.dice ipo price was judicious	[20:13]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3000 @ 0.00066871 = 2.0061 BTC [-]	[20:13]
*	DeaDTerra1 has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)	[20:14]
assbot	[BTCTC] [S.DICE-PT] 36 @ 0.005455 = 0.1964 BTC [+]	[20:15]
mircea_popescu	wait what ?!	[20:16]
mircea_popescu	!ticker btctc s.dice-pt	[20:16]
assbot	[BTCT:S.DICE-PT] 1D: 0.00459 / 0.00521 / 0.005455 (81 shares, 0.4 BTC), 7D: 0.00366 / 0.00452 / 0.0055 (4499 shares, 20.3 BTC), 30D: 0.00361 / 0.00525 / 0.00643 (30048 shares, 157.8 BTC)	[20:16]
*	Guest22312 (~DeaDTerra@226.169.216.81.static.apv.siw.siwnet.net) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[20:17]
*	Guest22312 is now known as DeaDTerra1	[20:17]
mircea_popescu	there's a 70% gap ?!	[20:17]
jurov	but whole order book is 13btc bids, 18btc asks... not worth bugging deadterra about	[20:19]
ThickAsThieves	thats Nam's	[20:19]
ThickAsThieves	not DT's	[20:19]
ThickAsThieves	oh	[20:19]
ThickAsThieves	nvm	[20:19]
ThickAsThieves	you meant to arb	[20:20]
ThickAsThieves	no	[20:20]
jurov	haha i see now... and GSDPT is copletely elsewhere	[20:20]
mircea_popescu	70% of 13 btc is like 100 bux lol	[20:20]
jurov	the same exchange, yet one would need to engage two ops to arbitrage	[20:20]
mircea_popescu	1000	[20:20]
jurov	why they just can't list one pt together	[20:21]
ThickAsThieves	i like multiple	[20:21]
jurov	why?	[20:21]
jurov	for lulz?	[20:21]
mircea_popescu	somebody should plot the various pt price vs mpex one day	[20:21]
mircea_popescu	it'd make one hell of a grap	[20:21]
ThickAsThieves	well in the case of Nam's	[20:21]
ThickAsThieves	it's not successful enough	[20:21]
ThickAsThieves	to provide a lot of arb	[20:21]
ThickAsThieves	but in the end there has alway been variance between each PT	[20:22]
ThickAsThieves	enough to arb	[20:22]
ThickAsThieves	i'm sold out of Nam's though	[20:22]
ThickAsThieves	because it got a premium	[20:22]
ThickAsThieves	from low uptake	[20:22]
ThickAsThieves	now not enough people in it	[20:22]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 2239 @ 0.00066871 = 1.4972 BTC [-]	[20:23]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4122 @ 0.00066869 = 2.7563 BTC [-]	[20:23]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 239 @ 0.00066868 = 0.1598 BTC [-]	[20:23]
*	terryww (~terryww@84-255-240-24.static.t-2.net) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[20:24]
*	farfi has quit ()	[20:32]
fdas	toffoo, I have reasoned the same about LTC	[20:34]
*	tiberiusiv (~tiberiusi@gateway/tor-sasl/tiberiusiv) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[20:34]
thestrin1puller	http://bitcoinity.org/assets/fail.jpg YES!	[20:36]
*	Troic has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)	[20:41]
jurov	have you looked to past performance? not every month is his exposure needed.	[20:42]
jurov	and if btc goes up twice again next month, some 20% loss wouldn't be so tragic	[20:44]
jurov	well. so there will be no options. that is the point.	[20:44]
jurov	happened already, no prob	[20:44]
ThickAsThieves	;;bids 0	[20:44]
gribble	There are currently 34833411 bitcoins demanded at or over 0.0 USD, worth 10285047.2026 USD in total. \| Data vintage: 55.2628 seconds	[20:44]
*	benkay (4a55ff4a@gateway/web/freenode/ip.74.85.255.74) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[20:51]
thestrin1puller	That's more bitcoins than exist...	[20:51]
thestrin1puller	LOL	[20:51]
thestrin1puller	tiberiusiv: is an irate bondholder!	[20:51]
thestrin1puller	pleaes direct all complaints to Bugpowder	[20:51]
thestrin1puller	and you are?	[20:52]
thestrin1puller	SO MR. tiberiusiv you know everything?	[20:52]
thestrin1puller	you know what the Oracle says about men who say they know everything	[20:52]
thestrin1puller	HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA	[20:53]
thestrin1puller	they are	[20:53]
thestrin1puller	You don't read enough.	[20:53]
*	PsychoticBoy has quit (Quit: Ik ga weg)	[20:53]
*	PsychoticBoy (~Psychotic@tsn85-159-236-214.dyn.nltelcom.net) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[20:53]
*	PsychoticBoy has quit (Changing host)	[20:53]
*	PsychoticBoy (~Psychotic@pdpc/supporter/active/psychoticboy) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[20:53]
benkay	what would your preferred implementation be, tiberiusiv?	[21:01]
ThickAsThieves	tib, by selling bonds he's already letting people underwrite the options	[21:04]
ThickAsThieves	he's considers it an investment	[21:04]
ThickAsThieves	he	[21:04]
ThickAsThieves	you dont think that him losing XXXXX btc is a test of his risk management?	[21:06]
ThickAsThieves	he's not betting	[21:06]
ThickAsThieves	maybe he's trying to create a market	[21:06]
ThickAsThieves	of a new order of magnitude in size	[21:06]
ThickAsThieves	he spends 15k today, maybe makes 150k next year	[21:07]
ThickAsThieves	i'm done, you can beat on him all you want	[21:08]
ThickAsThieves	he has plenty	[21:09]
ThickAsThieves	to risk this investment	[21:09]
*	damientrog (~dtrog@109.130.49.223) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[21:12]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17450 @ 0.00066868 = 11.6685 BTC [-]	[21:13]
ThickAsThieves	sry tib, gotta turn you off for a while	[21:14]
jurov	lol that's just some assertions, not truth	[21:17]
assbot	[BTCTC] [GSDPT] 1 @ 0.00323 BTC [-]	[21:23]
assbot	[BTCTC] [GSDPT] 282 @ 0.00323 = 0.9109 BTC [-]	[21:23]
*	riX2000 (~riX2000@unaffiliated/rix2000) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[21:25]
jurov	obv if you come to btc in a "i know shit" fashion you'll get burned	[21:28]
jurov	i started trying options only after few months observations, went off well enough so far	[21:29]
jurov	no, you're not payng attention, i do. with iDiffs.	[21:30]
jurov	adn i do write mpoe options occassionally, too	[21:31]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5000 @ 0.00067326 = 3.3663 BTC [+]	[21:31]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11529 @ 0.00067327 = 7.7621 BTC [+]	[21:31]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 543 @ 0.00067469 = 0.3664 BTC [+]	[21:31]
Diablo-D3	wtf is ThickAsThieves even talking about	[21:31]
jurov	Diablo-D3: perhaps you ignore tibby?	[21:33]
Diablo-D3	I do	[21:33]
Diablo-D3	the guy is a nutjob	[21:33]
jurov	so, thick was chatting with him	[21:33]
*	diana_coman has quit (Quit: Leaving)	[21:34]
jurov	sauce?	[21:35]
*	benkay has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)	[21:36]
kakobrekla	yeah	[21:37]
kakobrekla	the sad part is he made more than 95% too	[21:37]
jurov	just coinbr-managed holdings are way more than whatever you're insinuating here.	[21:37]
jurov	and i have no illusion that even all users combined it's one of smaller players here	[21:37]
jurov	*all coinbr users together i mean	[21:38]
ThickAsThieves	sry diablo, i got sucked into th vortex, tib is back on ignore now	[21:39]
Diablo-D3	what is he doing anyhow?	[21:40]
jurov	sorry tibby, my insanity threshold is clearly lower than average, but you just crossed it	[21:40]
jurov	mircea has lost in 1month probably more bitcoins then 95% of this channel hold combined.	[21:40]
Diablo-D3	mircea doesnt have more than 1000 BTC so clearly false	[21:40]
kakobrekla	lol	[21:40]
ThickAsThieves	he lost it all on ltc	[21:40]
jurov	ignored.	[21:40]
ThickAsThieves	yuss	[21:41]
kakobrekla	right.	[21:41]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3450 @ 0.00066869 = 2.307 BTC [-]	[21:42]
*	hnz_ (~bla@dslb-178-001-192-104.pools.arcor-ip.net) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[21:42]
thestrin1puller	tiberiusiv: keep talking you're making the stock shortable	[21:42]
kakobrekla	tiberiusiv just make sure you are on the other side of the stick and more welth to you no'	[21:43]
kakobrekla	i dunno why you complain	[21:43]
*	bitessak (b2c1ee1b@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.193.238.27) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[21:43]
kakobrekla	stop troling already	[21:43]
kakobrekla	for srs	[21:43]
kakobrekla	its good for nothing	[21:43]
*	sgornick (~steve@unaffiliated/sgornick) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[21:44]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 1574 @ 0.00066869 = 1.0525 BTC [-]	[21:47]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14726 @ 0.00066868 = 9.847 BTC [-]	[21:47]
*	hnz_ has quit ()	[21:47]
*	bitessak has quit (Quit: Page closed)	[21:48]
*	Anduck (~Anduck@unaffiliated/anduck) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[21:54]
assbot	[MPEX] [O.USD.C200T] 200 @ 0.05079251 = 10.1585 BTC	[22:05]
jurov	http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/1bbgtr/this_is_how_serious_business_is_done_27k_loss/	[22:07]
jurov	^^ let's see what will happen	[22:08]
mircea_popescu	ima add 1mn btc buttons to mpex.	[22:08]
mircea_popescu	lol jurov where did you find that "fu" pic of mine	[22:09]
jurov	lmao reddit found it itself	[22:09]
mircea_popescu	it's like... "smug. let me show you how it's done"	[22:10]
*	awkorama has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)	[22:11]
arij	is there a guide for options trading	[22:12]
arij	seems so confusing :/	[22:12]
jurov	https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=67302.0	[22:13]
mircea_popescu	arij http://polimedia.us/trilema/2013/options-and-leverage-a-case-study/	[22:13]
arij	thank you	[22:13]
mircea_popescu	click on the first link nm	[22:13]
mircea_popescu	jurov is too fast	[22:13]
arij	heh	[22:13]
mircea_popescu	heh i wonder where draco isd	[22:13]
mircea_popescu	;;seen draco49	[22:13]
gribble	I have not seen draco49.	[22:13]
jurov	but the linked page from that thread is missing... since it's referenced much, maybe MPOE-PR can update it	[22:14]
thestrin1puller	mircea still owes me trilema credits :(	[22:14]
jurov	using MKOPT/SPLIT instead of email	[22:14]
mircea_popescu	thestrin1puller how so ?	[22:15]
mircea_popescu	jurov ya thaty's a point.	[22:15]
mircea_popescu	old old thread.	[22:15]
thestrin1puller	my ip changed a long time ago	[22:15]
thestrin1puller	well not too long ago	[22:15]
thestrin1puller	And now the paywall hates me	[22:15]
mircea_popescu	aww!	[22:15]
mircea_popescu	so get pw based credits	[22:16]
assbot	[BTCTC] [GSDPT] 1 @ 0.00408 BTC [+]	[22:16]
thestrin1puller	i know I should have	[22:16]
thestrin1puller	waaaah	[22:16]
thestrin1puller	waaah	[22:16]
thestrin1puller	I'm sad	[22:16]
thestrin1puller	lol	[22:16]
thestrin1puller	it's cool mircea_popescu	[22:16]
thestrin1puller	i respect you enough to warrant a loss ;)	[22:16]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [HIM] 2 @ 1.95 = 3.9 BTC [-]	[22:17]
assbot	[BTCTC] [GSDPT] 1948 @ 0.00409 = 7.9673 BTC [+]	[22:17]
*	Bugpowder (47ab6a02@gateway/web/freenode/ip.71.171.106.2) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[22:18]
thestrin1puller	Havelock is slowly becoming the berkshire hathaway of btc investments...	[22:18]
thestrin1puller	mircea_popescu: you should creating a mining bond	[22:18]
thestrin1puller	(this is where we all laugh)	[22:18]
jurov	was going to reply "there was one already"	[22:19]
thestrin1puller	jurov: that giga etf that went to shit?	[22:21]
thestrin1puller	tiberiusiv: Havelock is a savings medium different space than the others	[22:21]
jurov	yes, and there was a 1GH or so future.. going quickly down to 1 satoshi	[22:21]
*	saulimus has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)	[22:21]
*	saulimus (~someone@37-219-43-8.nat.bb.dnainternet.fi) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[22:22]
thestrin1puller	Man I want to invest in HIM	[22:22]
mircea_popescu	thestrin1puller but i never mined	[22:22]
thestrin1puller	:)	[22:23]
thestrin1puller	^- that is how I know mircea_popescu is legit	[22:23]
thestrin1puller	you mean yesterday	[22:23]
thestrin1puller	also tiberiusiv you know what the oracle says	[22:23]
thestrin1puller	shouldn't you know?	[22:24]
thestrin1puller	tiberiusiv: what's the next movement going to be	[22:24]
thestrin1puller	tiberiusiv: what's the meaning of life?	[22:24]
thestrin1puller	tiberiusiv: how do I make more coin back?	[22:24]
Bugpowder	;;bids 0	[22:25]
gribble	There are currently 34845084 bitcoins demanded at or over 0.0 USD, worth 10289649.6484 USD in total. \| Data vintage: 115.2992 seconds	[22:25]
*	Bugpowder has quit (Quit: Page closed)	[22:25]
thestrin1puller	LOL	[22:25]
thestrin1puller	Bugpowder is avoiding the angry mobs	[22:25]
*	copumpkin has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)	[22:26]
assbot	[MPEX] [O.USD.C116T] 1 @ 0.1536719 BTC	[22:26]
*	copumpkin (~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[22:27]
assbot	[MPEX] [O.USD.C116T] 19 @ 0.1536719 = 2.9198 BTC	[22:30]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [VTX] 7 @ 0.4999 = 3.4993 BTC [+]	[22:31]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [VTX] 5 @ 0.5 = 2.5 BTC [+]	[22:31]
*	arij (arij@unaffiliated/arij) has left #bitcoin-assets ("Leaving")	[22:32]
*	arij (arij@unaffiliated/arij) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[22:37]
*	Troic (~troic@cpc18-pool13-2-0-cust39.15-1.cable.virginmedia.com) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[22:38]
*	riX2000 has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)	[22:38]
taub	I don't think anyone is mad at him?	[22:40]
KRS1	cant always win jeez	[22:45]
KRS1	if u put out you need to expect to lose too	[22:45]
KRS1	can anyone provide advice? I am hearing more about mtgox every day and even though i dont have a lot in there, i'd like to protect what i do have..i dont use redeemable codes..do I have to pull out of gox and go with another?	[22:47]
KRS1	i think all the news is around the codes but im not using em	[22:48]
KRS1	and they're moving to the canada deal forgot the name..coin something	[22:48]
KRS1	prob because of the US regulation now? idk maybe im talking out my ass	[22:48]
*	arij has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)	[22:54]
KRS1	anyone?	[22:54]
*	arij (arij@unaffiliated/arij) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[22:56]
jurov	KRS1 you you use it a wallet, definitely pull out by any means	[22:56]
jurov	*if you use it as wallet	[22:57]
jurov	and even if you daytrade, i'd recommend preemptively pulling before the coinlab deal goes into effect	[22:57]
kakobrekla	ok guise	[22:58]
kakobrekla	we now have Sentiment charts	[22:58]
kakobrekla	http://bitbet.us/bet/307/bfl-will-deliver-asic-devices-before-july-1st/	[22:58]
pizzaman1337	oh, nice	[22:58]
kakobrekla	:)	[22:58]
mircea_popescu	KRS1 prolly best to look for gox alternatives	[23:05]
mircea_popescu	pretty cool graphs	[23:06]
*	arij has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)	[23:14]
*	arij (arij@unaffiliated/arij) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[23:16]
*	saulimus has quit (Quit: saulimus)	[23:29]
*	awkorama (~awk@195.12.158.2) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[23:33]
*	fishfish (~fishfish2@cpc10-mort5-2-0-cust225.19-2.cable.virginmedia.com) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[23:33]
mircea_popescu	jurov http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/1bbgtr/this_is_how_serious_business_is_done_27k_loss/c95ddt2	[23:34]
mircea_popescu	it just dawned on him	[23:34]
*	Troic has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)	[23:37]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 1300 @ 0.00067465 = 0.877 BTC [+]	[23:37]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5000 @ 0.00067466 = 3.3733 BTC [+]	[23:37]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8700 @ 0.00067469 = 5.8698 BTC [+]	[23:37]
assbot	[BTCTC] [ASICMINER-PT] 2 @ 0.78 = 1.56 BTC [-]	[23:43]
jurov	so, slovak PM is to show on a trial started by ex-PM	[23:48]
jurov	except that police nor anybody else know his address	[23:48]
jurov	lmao	[23:49]
jurov	bulletproof legal immunity	[23:52]
*	Troic (~troic@cpc18-pool13-2-0-cust39.15-1.cable.virginmedia.com) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[23:53]
*	Troic_ (~troic@cpc18-pool13-2-0-cust39.15-1.cable.virginmedia.com) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[23:54]
*	troic__ (~troic@cpc18-pool13-2-0-cust39.15-1.cable.virginmedia.com) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[23:55]
mircea_popescu	address nullrooted	[23:56]
*	Troic has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)	[23:59]
jurov	oh and also his office is not accepting such mail	[23:59]

« Forum logs for 29 Mar 2013

Forum logs for 31 Mar 2013 »

Category: Logs

Comments feed : RSS 2.0. Leave your own comment below, or send a trackback.

Add your cents! »

If this is your first comment, it will wait to be approved. This usually takes a few hours. Subsequent comments are not delayed.

Forum logs for 30 Mar 2013

Recent Comments

Recent Articles

Pages

Say NO! to platforms