Forum logs for 25 Mar 2015

Sunday, 24 November, Year 11 d.Tr. | Author: Mircea Popescu

mircea_popescu	decimation quite.	[00:00]
mircea_popescu	so to conflate "modern idiotic usgtronics" with "capitalism" which in turn conflates with "everything minus stone age, feudalism, and the soviets" is...	[00:00]
mircea_popescu	well distilled imbecility, frankly.	[00:01]
mircea_popescu	"teach the faux controversy mayhap people forget shit doesn't have tyo be eaten"	[00:01]
asciilifeform	still no boot, with this >> http://dpaste.com/2Z0E50V.txt	[00:01]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1FDyajC )	[00:01]
asciilifeform	(kernel config)	[00:01]
mircea_popescu	danielpbarron there wouldn't normally be huge differences.	[00:02]
asciilifeform	building for arm922t which, as far as i can tell, marvell is compatible with.	[00:02]
asciilifeform	hangs on jump into kernel.	[00:03]
asciilifeform	just like the... 57? previous linux kernels i built for this thing.	[00:03]
asciilifeform	no signs of life.	[00:03]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12633 @ 0.00020725 = 2.6182 BTC [-]	[00:03]
*	The20YearIRCloud (uid38883@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-yragdbexwztwagyi) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[00:03]
mircea_popescu	so basically no os whatsoever builds on these things ?	[00:04]
asciilifeform	http://dpaste.com/2MSHFN2.txt << buildroot config for completeness	[00:04]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1FDz0Nj )	[00:04]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: not quite. netbsd builds	[00:05]
decimation	keynes threw england into the shitter just so he could 'win at the game of life'	[00:05]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: it is the -only- thing i was able to build from source and actually get a shell on	[00:05]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: hence why i spent so long on it	[00:05]
mircea_popescu	hm	[00:05]
nubbins`	kirkwood has 2x sata?	[00:06]
asciilifeform	http://buildroot.uclibc.org << anyone who wants to re-create my experiment, now can	[00:06]
assbot	Buildroot: making embedded Linux easy ... ( http://bit.ly/1FDziUy )	[00:06]
asciilifeform	use the two configs posted just now.	[00:06]
asciilifeform	one is buildroot's, the other is the kernel's	[00:06]
asciilifeform	nubbins`: 1	[00:06]
asciilifeform	or wait	[00:06]
asciilifeform	if you're thinking of speed - 2	[00:06]
asciilifeform	(1 connector, 2x speed)	[00:06]
asciilifeform	oh, and in case this wasn't clear,	[00:07]
asciilifeform	-none of these os-en build on the machine itself!!!-	[00:07]
asciilifeform	must use cross-compiler	[00:07]
nubbins`	"Two SATA 2.0 ports with integrated PHYs"	[00:07]
*	nubbins` shrugs	[00:07]
asciilifeform	nubbins`: one's a phantom limb, i think	[00:07]
nubbins`	a	[00:07]
asciilifeform	at any rate, precisely one plug.	[00:08]
nubbins`	"security engine"!	[00:08]
asciilifeform	we don't use it for anything	[00:08]
asciilifeform	does - would you believe - accelerated xor.	[00:09]
decimation	one sign that nobody is rich today is that nobody could possibly dream of floating the national debt of england	[00:09]
nubbins`	or a sign nobody's been that poor before	[00:11]
BingoBoingo	asciilifeform> nubbins`: one's a phantom limb, i think << Phantom limbs got me much less excited about the latest Sun hardware I'd been investigating when the problem of keeping a post 2016 blockchain would have been a big challenge. (IDE limited to sub 127 GB, USB 1.1, and Firewire ports unsupported in OS of choice which means gambling on PCI USB 2.0 card working for moar storage)	[00:11]
BingoBoingo	does - would you believe - accelerated xor. << megalol	[00:12]
*	gernika (~awt@unaffiliated/gernika) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[00:12]
BingoBoingo	In other news I discovered apparently firefighting trains exist	[00:13]
nubbins`	http://dev.gentoo.org/~armin76/arm/sheevaplug/install.xml	[00:16]
assbot	Gentoo Linux Documentation	[00:16]
nubbins`	might be something of interest there	[00:16]
asciilifeform	nubbins`: there most certainly was not.	[00:17]
asciilifeform	was first place i looked way back when.	[00:17]
BingoBoingo	sheevaplug seems to be different beast for reasons only Vishnu knows	[00:18]
asciilifeform	that isn't why	[00:19]
BingoBoingo	sorry, reasons only Vishnuplug knows	[00:19]
asciilifeform	just that there is no meaningful detail in there about config for 3.18	[00:19]
asciilifeform	(or anything else)	[00:20]
asciilifeform	anyone here have pogo with debian running?	[00:22]
asciilifeform	please extract the config & post	[00:23]
asciilifeform	zcat /proc/config.gz > config.txt	[00:23]
asciilifeform	note that this may or may not work depending on whether the kernel was built with this enabled	[00:23]
asciilifeform	if no one has debian, but someone has arch - please post that	[00:23]
asciilifeform	BingoBoingo, mod6, danielpbarron, mircea_popescu, ben_vulpes ???	[00:24]
asciilifeform	punkman ?	[00:24]
*	BingoBoingo yet to try .foundation build as spec'd, mostly has moar weird in his plan pipeline	[00:27]
nubbins`	gzip: /proc/config.gz: No such file or directory	[00:27]
nubbins`	haha wat.	[00:27]
asciilifeform	nubbins`: snipped to save space then	[00:27]
asciilifeform	but it means that there is no way to replicate the kernel build short of catching the perpetrator and slowly roasting him over a fire	[00:27]
nubbins`	http://dev.gentoo.org/~armin76/arm/sheevaplug/install/configsheeva fwiw	[00:28]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1FDERlN )	[00:28]
nubbins`	(probably 0)	[00:28]
asciilifeform	nubbins`: not 3.18 !	[00:28]
nubbins`	right, 2.6	[00:28]
nubbins`	don't mind me	[00:28]
*	decimation has quit ()	[00:30]
nubbins`	http://pastebin.com/X3GhWU7u	[00:32]
assbot	config-3.16.0-kirkwood-tld-3 - Pastebin.com ... ( http://bit.ly/1FDFZpD )	[00:32]
asciilifeform	nubbins`: from where ?	[00:32]
nubbins`	http://forum.doozan.com/read.php?2,12096	[00:32]
assbot	Linux Kernel 3.18 (FDT) and 3.16 (non-FDT) Kirkwood package and rootfs ... ( http://bit.ly/1FDG3Wh )	[00:32]
*	eric has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)	[00:33]
mod6	http://thebitcoin.foundation/ml/btc-dev/2015-March/000071.html	[00:33]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1FDGaRG )	[00:33]
nubbins`	this is the guy from http://blog.qnology.com/2014/07/hacking-pogoplug-v4-series-4-and-mobile.html	[00:33]
assbot	Qui's techNOLOGY Blog: Hacking the Pogoplug v4 (Series 4 and Mobile) with Linux (Debian or Arch)	[00:33]
nubbins`	which is what i followed to get my pogo up and running	[00:33]
nubbins`	but i think the guide i used was for 3.18	[00:33]
nubbins`	shrug	[00:33]
asciilifeform	nubbins`: ty, about to test it	[00:33]
nubbins`	np, lmk!	[00:34]
BingoBoingo	;;ls	[00:35]
gribble	What do you think I am, a shell?	[00:35]
*	eric (~ericp4@unaffiliated/ericp4) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[00:36]
asciilifeform	woah the sheer amount of turdage in that one	[00:37]
nubbins`	it's looooooooooong, hey?	[00:37]
asciilifeform	crapolade that is not possibly used for anything, ever.	[00:37]
asciilifeform	i mean, it's 10x the size	[00:37]
asciilifeform	every possible sound card, gpu,...	[00:37]
nubbins`	i thought i accidentally pasted twice when scrolling down to pastebin submit button!	[00:37]
asciilifeform	no	[00:38]
nubbins`	"for GoFlex Home/Net, Pogoplug E02/Mobile/V4, iConnect, Dockstar, Sheevaplug, NSA320, NSA325, Topkick, and all other Kirkwood plugs that are already in the mainline"	[00:38]
nubbins`	in other words, bring your own scissors :0	[00:38]
asciilifeform	and that is why ten thousand joysticks ?	[00:38]
nubbins`	ha	[00:39]
asciilifeform	still building	[00:39]
asciilifeform	and for who knows how long.	[00:39]
mircea_popescu	!up eric	[00:40]
-assbot-	You voiced eric for 30 minutes.	[00:40]
*	assbot gives voice to eric	[00:40]
BingoBoingo	!up eric	[00:41]
*	assbot gives voice to eric	[00:41]
nubbins`	shrug	[00:42]
nubbins`	!up eric	[00:42]
*	assbot gives voice to eric	[00:42]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17314 @ 0.00021445 = 3.713 BTC [+]	[00:42]
BingoBoingo	;;ticker	[00:42]
gribble	Bitfinex BTCUSD ticker \| Best bid: 247.58, Best ask: 247.72, Bid-ask spread: 0.14000, Last trade: 247.97, 24 hour volume: 65174.61242121, 24 hour low: 241.39, 24 hour high: 267.49, 24 hour vwap: None	[00:42]
asciilifeform	nubbins`: no signs of life	[00:43]
asciilifeform	nubbins`: from that kernel.	[00:43]
asciilifeform	(the extra mass in the config was actually from building every possible module. which went into the rootfs and had no impact on the kernel proper)	[00:43]
nubbins`	boo. didja try 3.18 or .16	[00:43]
asciilifeform	anyway it's just as dead as the last maxint kernels	[00:44]
nubbins`	ah	[00:44]
asciilifeform	nubbins`: 3.18	[00:44]
asciilifeform	which comes with buildroot	[00:44]
asciilifeform	using your config	[00:44]
*	funkenstein_ has quit (Quit: Leaving)	[00:47]
nubbins`	hm	[00:48]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 18300 @ 0.00021445 = 3.9244 BTC [+]	[00:53]
BingoBoingo	perhaps pogolinux is actually just OS/2 with gratuitous text substitution?	[00:54]
*	BingoBoingo also learned today all of his most exotic fire extinguisher ideas have largely been incorporated into class D fire extinguishers already except for the DU based supressant idea	[00:56]
asciilifeform	the famous kerosene fire extinguisher.	[00:57]
asciilifeform	(hey it extinguishes - eventually.)	[00:57]
BingoBoingo	And the carbon tetrachloride fire extinguishing grenade	[00:58]
BingoBoingo	JetA puts out fires pretty well though provided you are flicking a cigarette butt into a bucket of JetA most of the time	[00:59]
BingoBoingo	God dammit, coyotes are back already this year	[01:01]
nubbins`	he's got config files going back to 3.8.11 fwiw	[01:03]
nubbins`	all hyooj	[01:03]
nubbins`	http://pastebin.com/sCTDPpQ2	[01:07]
nubbins`	latest	[01:07]
assbot	config-3.18.5-kirkwood-tld-1 - Pastebin.com ... ( http://bit.ly/1C9m3H6 )	[01:07]
asciilifeform	nubbins`: he has a patch.	[01:08]
asciilifeform	that's the boojum, i think	[01:08]
nubbins`	http://pastebin.com/g0Ra5XTa	[01:08]
assbot	linux-3.18.5-kirkwood-tld-1.patch - Pastebin.com ... ( http://bit.ly/1C9mhOu )	[01:08]
asciilifeform	guess what, i built a kernel	[01:08]
asciilifeform	that boot	[01:08]
asciilifeform	s	[01:08]
asciilifeform	... and promptly panics	[01:09]
asciilifeform	(because no root fs)	[01:09]
asciilifeform	but hey, works	[01:09]
asciilifeform	using -vanilla buildroot-	[01:09]
nubbins`	oh cool	[01:09]
asciilifeform	make sheevaplug_defconfig	[01:09]
asciilifeform	make	[01:09]
nubbins`	see line 615 in above	[01:09]
asciilifeform	that's it	[01:09]
asciilifeform	didn't use any of the weirdo crap from above link	[01:10]
nubbins`	woo!	[01:10]
asciilifeform	tomorrow evening i'll 1) flash in the rootfs to get something like a working box	[01:11]
asciilifeform	2) mercilessly root out the idiot crud that gets rolled in by default	[01:11]
asciilifeform	(sound cards, etc)	[01:11]
nubbins`	amazing	[01:11]
assbot	AMAZING COMPANY!	[01:11]
nubbins`	THAT'S THE SPIRIT	[01:12]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: habemus kernelam	[01:12]
mircea_popescu	o hey!	[01:12]
mircea_popescu	who won ?	[01:12]
mircea_popescu	sheeva ?	[01:12]
asciilifeform	me.	[01:12]
mircea_popescu	lol	[01:12]
*	assbot removes voice from eric	[01:12]
mircea_popescu	so this is a sheevaplug brew of what, netbsd ?	[01:13]
asciilifeform	nono	[01:13]
asciilifeform	linux 3.18	[01:14]
nubbins`	so you didn't need anything from that patch file?	[01:15]
asciilifeform	apparently not	[01:15]
asciilifeform	the interesting parts were rolled in some time ago in mainline, apparently	[01:15]
asciilifeform	just as i suspected	[01:15]
asciilifeform	7089334f25a0e1d8b09db96da4d61fbdf7ea7aca258fdd20012f85be976c39e63f5bc29842b25f0dc18a8ccdc74ad1e7c4ed7af56faa39b3917f76e082077589 turdel.gz	[01:16]
*	pete_dushenski (~pete_dush@unaffiliated/pete-dushenski/x-8158685) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[01:16]
BingoBoingo	!up pete_dushenski	[01:16]
*	assbot gives voice to pete_dushenski	[01:16]
asciilifeform	http://www.loper-os.org/pub/turdel.gz	[01:16]
nubbins`	actually, looking at the pogoplug-related entries in that patch, it's all trivial stuff	[01:16]
nubbins`	front LEDs etc	[01:16]
asciilifeform	nubbins`: not entirely	[01:16]
asciilifeform	nubbins`: there are some memory-mapped i/o iirc	[01:17]
asciilifeform	anyway whoever wants can boot up turdel using my tftp instructions (or by actually flashing it in) and see that it did happen.	[01:17]
asciilifeform	(it croaks, having no meaningful rootfs, but that's for tomorrow)	[01:17]
nubbins`	oh, yeah, i see em	[01:17]
nubbins`	eject button too!	[01:17]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: netbsd i had running weeks and weeks ago. but it sucks for reasons already described in log	[01:19]
pete_dushenski	thx bb!	[01:19]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: today by popular demand i went on a little deathmarch and got a source-built traditional linux going on it.	[01:19]
mircea_popescu	cool.	[01:19]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16476 @ 0.00022407 = 3.6918 BTC [+] {2}	[01:20]
*	mircea_popescu looks for a virgin or 40	[01:20]
asciilifeform	this is amply enough to work from	[01:20]
asciilifeform	and can be trimmed into some approximation of good shape.	[01:20]
mircea_popescu	so then, this + 32bit bitcoind and we're done.	[01:20]
mircea_popescu	(in the sense of having a miserable memory leaking low cost node)	[01:21]
asciilifeform	aha	[01:21]
nubbins`	heh	[01:21]
nubbins`	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=25-03-2015#1069353	[01:21]
assbot	Logged on 25-03-2015 01:20:19; mod6: alright, new droplet created for x32 deb6 testing.	[01:21]
asciilifeform	the one ingredient that is still needed, that i have not attempted at all, is the formatter	[01:21]
mircea_popescu	linux doesn't come with one ?!	[01:21]
nubbins`	fdisk in crontab to be safe	[01:21]
asciilifeform	that is, which detects 1) have we a disk plugged in? 2) if so, has it a blockchain? 3) if plugged in, no blockchain - format disk	[01:21]
asciilifeform	4) start bitcoind (in reset death loop)	[01:22]
asciilifeform	it is also of great importance to blink the correct colour led!	[01:22]
mircea_popescu	aha	[01:22]
nubbins`	yah!	[01:22]
asciilifeform	or else how is operator to know what becomes of his node	[01:22]
asciilifeform	maybe disk is dead	[01:22]
asciilifeform	maybe net connection dead	[01:22]
nubbins`	have the eject button send us a message on irc or something	[01:22]
asciilifeform	nubbins`: pogo4 has no buttons	[01:22]
*	assbot gives voice to pete_dushenski	[01:23]
nubbins`	ah, i thought the purple logo'd one did	[01:23]
trinque	up to the operator to deploy updates later?	[01:25]
asciilifeform	what updates.	[01:25]
trinque	0.5.3.1 is perfect?	[01:26]
BingoBoingo	0.5.3.1 is perfect? << C doesn't do perfect	[01:26]
asciilifeform	if you must, signed updates	[01:26]
asciilifeform	but i wasn't even thinking of this.	[01:26]
asciilifeform	anyway since when do i have to decide this	[01:26]
asciilifeform	therealbitcoin chairmen, awaken	[01:27]
asciilifeform	ben_vulpes, mod6 ?	[01:27]
trinque	bet you could tell it about updates just like deedbot	[01:28]
nubbins`	asciilifeform: my pogo has an eject button :S	[01:28]
asciilifeform	nubbins`: does it actually press?	[01:28]
nubbins`	...	[01:28]
asciilifeform	also whoever it was who marvelled (l0l) at pogo being a 32bit arm - 64bit is lunacy on a box with 128m of ram and no swap	[01:29]
asciilifeform	it just makes pointers take up 2x the space	[01:29]
nubbins`	yes	[01:29]
asciilifeform	and bloats exe by ~2 factor	[01:29]
nubbins`	granted, it doesn't do anything atm	[01:30]
asciilifeform	the designer made an entirely rational choice	[01:30]
nubbins`	but it's at least a real button	[01:30]
asciilifeform	nubbins`: would you care to post a photo of the unit ?	[01:30]
asciilifeform	nubbins`: because it is quite clearly different from mine	[01:30]
ben_vulpes	hm?	[01:31]
*	ben_vulpes just cracked the craptop	[01:31]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: another ingredient, since you were making a list, is the seed list	[01:31]
nubbins`	http://mhassan.me/blog/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/pogoplug_v4_top_removed1.jpg	[01:31]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1C9p8He )	[01:31]
nubbins`	^ that's yours, not mine	[01:31]
nubbins`	next to eth	[01:32]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: recall how it has a gigantic seedlist consisting of mostly corpses, compiled in ?	[01:32]
asciilifeform	nubbins`: -that- button	[01:32]
nubbins`	:D	[01:32]
asciilifeform	i have it too	[01:32]
nubbins`	i had to double check	[01:32]
asciilifeform	thought yours might have had a button under the lamp	[01:32]
nubbins`	no. pressed it like 5x to make sure	[01:32]
nubbins`	i wish :/	[01:33]
nubbins`	instead you need a toothpick	[01:33]
asciilifeform	if ben_vulpes and mod6 decide that we must have an updater (signed, naturally) i suggest that the button be used to trigger it	[01:33]
asciilifeform	loading from attached storage of course	[01:33]
asciilifeform	(not the net)	[01:33]
asciilifeform	at the very minimum, development units ought to have it	[01:34]
ben_vulpes	for pogos?	[01:34]
asciilifeform	ben_vulpes: long thread re: pogo.	[01:34]
ben_vulpes	no shit.	[01:34]
nubbins`	if we end up jamming the os onto the nand, you could have it scan SD cards on insert for patches	[01:34]
*	Dannyl (bf07404e@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.191.7.64.78) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[01:35]
ben_vulpes	since when is the pogo my project?	[01:35]
asciilifeform	nubbins`: tomorrow rootfs in nand	[01:35]
*	nubbins` cheers	[01:35]
asciilifeform	the kernel i just posted, sees the nand.	[01:35]
asciilifeform	ben_vulpes: in as far as it may end up the first battlefield deployment of 0.5.3.x - aha.	[01:36]
nubbins`	danielpbarron's project if anyone's 8)	[01:36]
nubbins`	well. alf's if anyone's !	[01:36]
ben_vulpes	^	[01:36]
ben_vulpes	yeah, that.	[01:36]
asciilifeform	lol i cleaned a cm of dust off my pogo today.	[01:36]
BingoBoingo	!up Dannyl	[01:36]
*	assbot gives voice to Dannyl	[01:36]
nubbins`	far be it from me to assume ;D	[01:36]
ben_vulpes	a cm?!	[01:36]
*	GSpotAssassin___ (sid4086@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-jcecgpvnmujsmauc) has left #bitcoin-assets	[01:37]
ben_vulpes	dc air must be miserable	[01:37]
asciilifeform	nah just me	[01:37]
nubbins`	who's got pogos anyway	[01:37]
asciilifeform	i presently am sitting on no fewer than 12.	[01:37]
asciilifeform	and i think mod6 had a bunch	[01:37]
nubbins`	i'll have 3 at some point this week	[01:37]
ben_vulpes	that's a lot of dust...	[01:38]
nubbins`	dpb has at least one	[01:38]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu iirc had some	[01:38]
nubbins`	hundreds!	[01:38]
ben_vulpes	;)	[01:38]
asciilifeform	and possibly punkman	[01:38]
nubbins`	hmm yes	[01:38]
asciilifeform	i'm almost beginning to not-regret picking that machine	[01:39]
asciilifeform	having finally booted a reasonable linux	[01:39]
ben_vulpes	hah	[01:39]
nubbins`	i've got some nebulous plans to kit-ify these & sell em	[01:39]
ben_vulpes	you like things?	[01:39]
asciilifeform	ben_vulpes: didn't say 'like,' l0l	[01:39]
ben_vulpes	couldn't resist, boss	[01:39]
asciilifeform	nubbins` do you think you could do a print of some kind over the lid?	[01:39]
asciilifeform	or other parts of chassis	[01:40]
asciilifeform	i was considering lasering mine	[01:40]
nubbins`	some sort of vinyl sticker would be easiest/cheapest	[01:40]
asciilifeform	eh chinese	[01:40]
nubbins`	you wouldn't even need to apply the sticker yourself, people like doing that stuff	[01:40]
*	Dannyl (bf07404e@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.191.7.64.78) has left #bitcoin-assets	[01:40]
asciilifeform	stickers are so 10 yrs ago when we all had that gnu with horns on laptops	[01:40]
BingoBoingo	Does anyone have a python script for computing the odds of adult male of supplied height and weight versus (Y) pack of coyotes if armed with a tack hammer?	[01:40]
nubbins`	you'd want solvent inks to silkscreen on that, and yuck	[01:41]
asciilifeform	nubbins` laser then.	[01:41]
nubbins`	it's too bad the name is already stamped into the top	[01:41]
nubbins`	you could laser a byline or smth tho	[01:41]
asciilifeform	nothing a 40w laser can't fix	[01:41]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7399 @ 0.00021258 = 1.5729 BTC [-]	[01:42]
asciilifeform	now result might be a heap of slag where the logo was	[01:42]
nubbins`	anyone here have a lead on custom injection-molded plastics?	[01:42]
asciilifeform	but ought to try	[01:42]
nubbins`	8D	[01:42]
asciilifeform	nubbins`: if you think pcb is expensive, try injection-molded anything.	[01:42]
nubbins`	recall fake bomb detector story, the one thing the guy always brought when he ran was the tooling	[01:43]
asciilifeform	l0l aha	[01:43]
asciilifeform	ok, quick likbez on 'buildroot'	[01:44]
asciilifeform	ben_vulpes, mod6, mircea_popescu, others :	[01:44]
asciilifeform	'buildroot' is this mega-automaton for building cross-compiled os for routers and the like	[01:44]
asciilifeform	it builds, in this order 1) toolchain (using local gcc) for target cpu - gcc and binutils	[01:44]
asciilifeform	2) kernel	[01:44]
mod6	<+asciilifeform> and i think mod6 had a bunch << naw, don't even own one yet.	[01:45]
asciilifeform	3) userland (rootfs image for stuffing wherever, nand in our case)	[01:45]
asciilifeform	the thing is mega-configurable and very baroque	[01:45]
ben_vulpes	ben_vulpes mod6 mircea_popescu and other interested parties: http://pastebin.com/raw.php?i=uJQDaKcz << neat	[01:45]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1C9qF0b )	[01:45]
asciilifeform	my notion, as of a month plus ago, was to bake the entire orchestra into a buildroot	[01:45]
trinque	my pogo's promised to me by the 3rd	[01:46]
asciilifeform	that is, the same crosscompiler it builds, that builds kernel etc. will also build bitcoind and its deps	[01:46]
nubbins`	ben_vulpes block=191668 !	[01:46]
asciilifeform	the result ought to be a self-contained bag of shit that, when executed on any reasonable unix, eventually churns out a set of images suitable for flashing to a 'pogo'.	[01:46]
asciilifeform	and yes, this means we freeze gcc, ulibc, etc. in time.	[01:47]
ben_vulpes	mod6 i should stress that none of the hardening options are included in that makefile, and it really should not be used for anything other than reference << see, reference y'all	[01:47]
nubbins`	S-CBOS	[01:47]
nubbins`	i like it	[01:47]
ben_vulpes	it pins the protocol	[01:47]
asciilifeform	there we go	[01:47]
asciilifeform	ben_vulpes gets.	[01:47]
ben_vulpes	it's a subtle rapier, not a thing for use in anger.	[01:47]
ben_vulpes	leastaways no time soon.	[01:47]
asciilifeform	little secret re: 'in anger' - ada doesn't need an os...	[01:48]
asciilifeform	(got its own scheduler, aha)	[01:48]
ben_vulpes	k well write a bitcoind then shiva	[01:48]
asciilifeform	i intend to	[01:48]
asciilifeform	but this wasn't a secret, was it	[01:48]
asciilifeform	but it will be some time before anyone is faced with question of what to do with my ver.	[01:49]
ben_vulpes	don't ask me what everyone doesn't know	[01:49]
asciilifeform	i will admit that, with regards to the reference version (let's call it 'traditional') i am especially interested in a tandem-operable variant	[01:50]
ben_vulpes	tandem-operable?	[01:50]
asciilifeform	that is, one which (or, even better, its subcomponents) can be ran in lockstep with another nominally-equivalent program	[01:50]
asciilifeform	ben_vulpes: imagine you're mircea_popescu	[01:51]
ben_vulpes	i do this regularly, but in what scenario today?	[01:51]
asciilifeform	ben_vulpes: and one of the folks here (not guaranteed that it'll be me) writes a spiffy 'ab initio' bitcoind	[01:51]
trinque	right, you'll want to check them against each other before making the leap	[01:51]
trinque	if you ever actually leap	[01:52]
asciilifeform	trinque: because of the difficulty, and ultimately the very real practical limits of programmatic proof, tandem is likely our fate for many years.	[01:52]
asciilifeform	or at least the fate of truly serious folks with much to lose	[01:52]
trinque	asciilifeform: will also be useful to out any fuckery of the phoundation client later down the chain	[01:52]
asciilifeform	(i for one will happily jump with the parachute i packed for self. but my carcass isn't worth especially much)	[01:53]
ben_vulpes	i don't understand what's so special about 'tandem operable'	[01:53]
asciilifeform	ben_vulpes: good question:	[01:53]
nubbins`	there's no POSIX standard for bitcoin	[01:54]
nubbins`	8)	[01:54]
ben_vulpes	asciilifeform: you built a chute?	[01:54]
asciilifeform	ben_vulpes: the implication is that various internals are accessible, and flow can be stopped	[01:54]
asciilifeform	ben_vulpes: not literally	[01:54]
asciilifeform	ben_vulpes: referring to a tradition in certain armies where men are expected to wrap own parachute	[01:54]
asciilifeform	and sign it	[01:54]
asciilifeform	before it is used	[01:54]
asciilifeform	'i packed this. --mr grunt'	[01:54]
ben_vulpes	right.	[01:54]
ben_vulpes	gotcha.	[01:55]
asciilifeform	then, if they find a pancake, there is no question of 'whodunit'	[01:55]
*	felipelalli has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)	[01:55]
ben_vulpes	you can't postpone everything until everything else just like you can't have everything louder than everything else. << i think i found where this started	[01:56]
asciilifeform	(fwiw, my father informs me that this custom was unknown in his unit, and only expert was trusted with wrapping chutes)	[01:56]
nubbins`	whoever survived the first time they tried the signatures was deemed an expert and dispersed throughout the other units	[01:56]
ben_vulpes	hyuuu	[01:57]
asciilifeform	the photo mats randomly posted today is, incidentally, a picturesque metaphor for what we're doing.	[01:59]
asciilifeform	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=24-03-2015#1068467	[01:59]
assbot	Logged on 24-03-2015 19:20:12; mats: http://i.imgur.com/09FTJTl.jpg pictured: one partially disassembled hellfire missile	[01:59]
ben_vulpes	ben_vulpes mod6 what do you two figure is a realistic timeline for "bitcoind version that doesn't allocate memory without checks and so doesn't crash in THAT particular way" ? << this actually raises the all-important question of priority list	[01:59]
ben_vulpes	ah hey check it out!	[02:01]
ben_vulpes	i get to strike #1 off the foundation todo list!	[02:01]
ben_vulpes	Goals:	[02:02]
ben_vulpes	1. Cut a build	[02:02]
nubbins`	woop	[02:02]
ben_vulpes	asciilifeform: guess what #2 is	[02:02]
nubbins`	jam it on a pogo!	[02:02]
ben_vulpes	hey	[02:02]
ben_vulpes	you	[02:02]
*	nubbins` zips lips, raises hand	[02:03]
ben_vulpes	nubbins`?	[02:03]
nubbins`	spoke outta turn!	[02:03]
ben_vulpes	i'm calling on you lol	[02:03]
ben_vulpes	and no, it's not pogo	[02:04]
*	asciilifeform hasn't a clue	[02:06]
nubbins`	REGRESSION TESTING!	[02:06]
ben_vulpes	bastard block fix.	[02:06]
nubbins`	YEAH!	[02:06]
ben_vulpes	nubbins` pre-release regression testing is pretty dumb-dumb right now	[02:07]
ben_vulpes	build	[02:07]
nubbins`	ha	[02:07]
ben_vulpes	sync with mainnet	[02:07]
ben_vulpes	send	[02:07]
ben_vulpes	well, send to	[02:07]
asciilifeform	eh i know it isn't 'sexy' but don't forget the seed list.	[02:07]
ben_vulpes	then send from	[02:07]
asciilifeform	the one that's in there now is unusable.	[02:07]
ben_vulpes	asciilifeform: right hang on let me diddle this text for a second	[02:07]
nubbins`	we'll need more seeds	[02:07]
asciilifeform	and did the dns seed snip ever get merged ?	[02:07]
ben_vulpes	no.	[02:07]
ben_vulpes	maybe?	[02:07]
asciilifeform	aha so it's pointing straight at phoundation's dns	[02:08]
*	ben_vulpes checks turdolator	[02:08]
asciilifeform	they can send the whole lot of us to dev/null	[02:08]
nubbins`	i don't think so	[02:08]
nubbins`	almost certainly not, no	[02:08]
ben_vulpes	anyone who runs without -connect is asking for it in the arse.	[02:09]
mircea_popescu	http://log1.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=25-03-2015#1069706 << of course.	[02:10]
assbot	Logged on 25-03-2015 04:21:10; trinque: up to the operator to deploy updates later?	[02:10]
ben_vulpes	kark its breeks lol	[02:11]
ben_vulpes	what does that even mean asciilifeform?	[02:12]
mircea_popescu	http://log1.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=25-03-2015#1069747	[02:12]
assbot	Logged on 25-03-2015 04:29:57; asciilifeform: at the very minimum, development units ought to have it	[02:12]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: actually he can't	[02:12]
mircea_popescu	that's my point.	[02:12]
mircea_popescu	serviceable 19 dollar units ? gtfo.	[02:13]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: if 'humane' can open shell when that programmable button near the jack is pressed	[02:13]
mircea_popescu	once they make a 4gb unit for ~25 we'll think about it ?	[02:14]
ben_vulpes	http://dpaste.com/3F70MCT.txt << current contents of foundation hopes and dreams and todos list, attn asciilifeform, mircea_popescu, mod6, nubbins`, decimation, trinque et al	[02:14]
asciilifeform	personally what i'd do is look for and verify foundation gpg sig on tarball on sd card when button pressed	[02:14]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1CX4Dkx )	[02:14]
asciilifeform	and no other behaviour	[02:14]
mircea_popescu	http://log1.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=25-03-2015#1069773 << some crates, yes.	[02:14]
assbot	Logged on 25-03-2015 04:33:41; asciilifeform: mircea_popescu iirc had some	[02:14]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform and now you gotta add gpg and debug it and srsly...	[02:14]
mircea_popescu	forget it, you want to upgrade get a new unit.	[02:15]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: gpg fits handily on the nand	[02:15]
ben_vulpes	heh i like that.	[02:15]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: if these were still made and we could parachute them around the world - that'd be one thing	[02:15]
asciilifeform	but they aren't	[02:15]
asciilifeform	and we haven't so many.	[02:15]
mircea_popescu	so then we buy more.	[02:15]
asciilifeform	and getting physical objects from one place to another is still pretty hard.	[02:15]
mircea_popescu	no dude. you're trying to raise the engineering bill by 1000s of dollah to save pennies.	[02:16]
nubbins`	http://www.essexb2b.com/auction/auction/view/id/3195/	[02:16]
mircea_popescu	then you complain that no time and stuff. srsly.	[02:16]
assbot	1 Pallet of PogoPlug Personal Cloud, New Condition, 100 Units, Retail $2,100, LaVergne, TN, PLT186057 \| Closes: Oct 16, 2014 12:00:00 PM PDT \| Essex B2B Liquidations ... ( http://bit.ly/1CX4PQN )	[02:16]
nubbins`	$4ea!	[02:16]
nubbins`	shame	[02:16]
mircea_popescu	nubbins` can you store a pellet ?	[02:16]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: rolling in gpg1 is 1000s ?	[02:16]
nubbins`	mircea_popescu not as easily as a box of tees 8)	[02:16]
asciilifeform	wrong pogo!!!	[02:17]
mircea_popescu	ah yeah not the right kind	[02:17]
asciilifeform	or wait	[02:17]
mircea_popescu	it's the no disk one innit ?	[02:17]
asciilifeform	-may be- the right	[02:17]
nubbins`	looks like blue logo	[02:17]
nubbins`	no sata	[02:17]
asciilifeform	with previous type of box	[02:17]
asciilifeform	i see purple logo	[02:17]
asciilifeform	but blue box	[02:17]
asciilifeform	go figure	[02:17]
nubbins`	not sealed	[02:18]
nubbins`	heh	[02:18]
mircea_popescu	http://log1.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=25-03-2015#1069787 << handcarve it instead.	[02:18]
nubbins`	anyway auction was last oct	[02:18]
assbot	Logged on 25-03-2015 04:35:44; asciilifeform: i was considering lasering mine	[02:18]
asciilifeform	pictures on boxes suggest no sata	[02:18]
asciilifeform	(my boxes have an arrow pointing to the lid, 'removable and has sata')	[02:19]
mircea_popescu	http://log1.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=25-03-2015#1069800 << shenzen	[02:19]
assbot	Logged on 25-03-2015 04:37:57; nubbins`: anyone here have a lead on custom injection-molded plastics?	[02:19]
asciilifeform	these - no	[02:19]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: if you have a favourite classical tarball of gpg, please consider sign and post it (with disclaimer similar to your collectible 0.5.3 tarball on listserv)	[02:21]
mircea_popescu	it's not even just that. gotta make sure it correctly takes and verifies the sigs now. etc etc.	[02:21]
asciilifeform	1liner	[02:22]
mircea_popescu	ok, im redefinining my addictives list	[02:22]
asciilifeform	we already all hang from that particular parachute!	[02:22]
mircea_popescu	it's not just opioidis and nubbins`, it's also overengineering	[02:22]
asciilifeform	if it is used in the exact form we are accustomed to - i see no issue with it	[02:23]
nubbins`	you can't get enough of me 8)	[02:23]
mircea_popescu	http://log1.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=25-03-2015#1069841 << ahaha	[02:23]
assbot	Logged on 25-03-2015 04:46:57; ben_vulpes: i do this regularly, but in what scenario today?	[02:23]
nubbins`	if you wanted to do the acrylic slab + posts thing like the bitseed or w/e node	[02:24]
nubbins`	you could put whatever lid on the pogo you wanted	[02:24]
nubbins`	ditch the case altogether	[02:24]
nubbins`	dat dust tho	[02:24]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: ...overengineering << 'Русские долго запрягают, но быстро едут.' << bismarck!	[02:24]
nubbins`	dat added cost	[02:24]
nubbins`	etc	[02:24]
asciilifeform	nubbins`: case holds the heatsink	[02:24]
asciilifeform	through mechanical pressure only	[02:25]
asciilifeform	go and try to run without.	[02:25]
ben_vulpes	;;later tell brendafdez yo you know anyone renting bikes at not retarded tourist prices?	[02:28]
gribble	The operation succeeded.	[02:28]
nubbins`	a	[02:29]
asciilifeform	incidentally, today's log is long enough that some of you may have missed my 'highlights of underhanded crypto contest' summaries.	[02:29]
asciilifeform	do not miss.	[02:29]
nubbins`	slab+post case could hold the heat sink too	[02:29]
asciilifeform	won't regret reading.	[02:29]
nubbins`	until you dropped it on a corner anyway	[02:29]
asciilifeform	nubbins`: it'd be almost less ugly to pour it in cement.	[02:30]
nubbins`	no kidding	[02:30]
asciilifeform	(anyone considering -actually- pouring electronics into cement - remember that it dries exothermically! need cooling)	[02:31]
nubbins`	colored logo could be easily removed	[02:31]
*	asciilifeform to bed	[02:31]
asciilifeform	if anyone does the honour of testing the 'turdel' - please post.	[02:31]
*	ben_vulpes weeps for log	[02:35]
nubbins`	alf will sleep the sleep of the just	[02:36]
ben_vulpes	http://danielpbarron.com/pogo/howto.txt << wowee, danielpbarron	[02:36]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1GSndrC )	[02:36]
*	yhwh_ has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)	[02:39]
ben_vulpes	seems that's 64 bit only now o.O << ahaha in between this line and my logreading mod6 posted a patch	[02:40]
ben_vulpes	hooray you fiend you	[02:40]
mircea_popescu	ayup	[02:40]
mircea_popescu	was keeping my fingers crossed for it being just you know, two lines and a whistle.	[02:41]
ben_vulpes	we're assholes, yet here we are trying << "a for effort"	[02:43]
BingoBoingo	(fwiw, my father informs me that this custom was unknown in his unit, and only expert was trusted with wrapping chutes) << Many ground pounders in the extended family, slosest one to using chute at all broke ankle on helachoppa repel	[02:45]
BingoBoingo	;;bc,stats	[02:56]
gribble	Current Blocks: 349129 \| Current Difficulty: 4.671754964470642E10 \| Next Difficulty At Block: 350783 \| Next Difficulty In: 1654 blocks \| Next Difficulty In About: 1 week, 2 days, 20 hours, 17 minutes, and 8 seconds \| Next Difficulty Estimate: 52321389587.7 \| Estimated Percent Change: 11.99515	[02:56]
*	FabianB (~fabian@f053216100.adsl.alicedsl.de) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[02:56]
*	FabianB is now known as Guest50302	[02:56]
ben_vulpes	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=25-03-2015#1069289 << no man, the solid is the drone.	[02:57]
assbot	Logged on 25-03-2015 00:37:43; assbot: Logged on 23-03-2015 06:08:33; ben_vulpes: I just thought of a brilliant anti-'area denial' (to usg term) weapon system. imagine a small turboprop uav ... that can drop its wings and turn into kerosene rocket << why bother with expensive turbomachinery? just use solid propellants...	[02:57]
ben_vulpes	it's just disposable.	[02:57]
ben_vulpes	and you can take fifty of them with you in a backpack...anywhere.	[02:57]
*	Guest53384 has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)	[03:00]
BingoBoingo	https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/307kye/an_entire_us_school_district_is_having_its_whole/cppze19	[03:00]
assbot	ButterNubber comments on An entire US school district is having its whole network held hostage for a 500 bitcoin ransom. The FBI and Homeland Security are getting involved. ... ( http://bit.ly/1GifYv8 )	[03:00]
mircea_popescu	alternatively, they coul;d just ditch shit-o-soft...	[03:03]
BingoBoingo	Or Coindesk/buzz could stop inflating the typical numbers ransomeware demands	[03:05]
ben_vulpes	just had a "don't blame the hackers" conversation.	[03:05]
ben_vulpes	"two decades of malicious microsoft sales. you have to expect the attacks, and the schools are simply the widest-open targets."	[03:05]
BingoBoingo	ben_vulpes: Schools used to tend towards Mac fo a reason and that was Nvir vs all those damn DOS & Windows virii	[03:07]
ben_vulpes	okay i'm logged	[03:07]
ben_vulpes	no, nodes don't get updated.	[03:07]
ben_vulpes	asciilifeform, mod6: keep it up	[03:08]
ben_vulpes	me, i have beds to burrow into	[03:10]
BingoBoingo	SO, brainstorm, could anything real be within 4x as fast as fundnations headers only?	[03:10]
mircea_popescu	wut ?	[03:14]
BingoBoingo	mircea_popescu: I have no backing for that brainturd. Just inundating el braino with tequila given seekrit mission otd.	[03:15]
*	The20YearIRCloud has quit (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)	[03:18]
mircea_popescu	:p	[03:20]
BingoBoingo	lol	[03:22]
*	NewLiberty has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)	[03:25]
mircea_popescu	http://log1.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=24-03-2015#1067789 << well, i'd expect no less from schneier.	[03:27]
assbot	Logged on 24-03-2015 14:41:46; mats: ive personally confirmed with schneier - in person - and have second-hand confirmations by others who have interacted with recipients of leaks	[03:27]
*	smidge (~smiddel@HSI-KBW-091-089-192-244.hsi2.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[03:28]
mircea_popescu	http://log1.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=24-03-2015#1067830 << the "tor stinks" evidence is in the public record.	[03:29]
assbot	Logged on 24-03-2015 14:51:20; mats: look, i'm putting my skepticism on the record. if there was evidence, it'd look like 'Tor Stinks' or the slides from Der Spiegel's work on the Belgacom pwnage. i'm not saying that Dual_EC_DRBG doesn't have obvious flaws or that anyone should continue using it, but my skepticism regarding it being an intentional backdoor remains	[03:29]
mircea_popescu	but importantly, your skepticism, while amply affirmed, is not supported by anything else. so you're skeptical of x theory, as an aesthetic matter. good for you. what's that do ?	[03:30]
mircea_popescu	http://log1.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=24-03-2015#1067841 << and more importantly : improductive to try. the guy who we hang if we consider it malice doesn't belong to us anyway. if he were in the wot maybe the point would be remotely worht considering	[03:31]
assbot	Logged on 24-03-2015 14:54:16; fluffypony: I think it's very hard to tell the difference between mistake and malice.	[03:31]
mircea_popescu	but for the fate of a random usg muppet ? dude, burn him down, his name won't even be remembered.	[03:32]
mircea_popescu	who cares ?	[03:32]
mircea_popescu	http://log1.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=24-03-2015#1067856 << all the excitedness about it recently re bitcoin does make it look suspicious.	[03:33]
assbot	Logged on 24-03-2015 14:55:51; fluffypony: DJB believes secp256k1 is broken	[03:34]
BingoBoingo	More suspicious than niggers.o as a library function?	[03:34]
mircea_popescu	on the other hand, Daniel J. Bernstein is merely going by ec2, which is based on cm field discriminants / laders and indistinguishability	[03:36]
mircea_popescu	none of these seem, at least superficially, to be directly relevant to the usecase.	[03:36]
mircea_popescu	particularly the ladder... so it's not a montgommery curve. so what.	[03:37]
BingoBoingo	DJB also has inherent paranoia to the point http://www.crazymeds.us/CrazyTalk/index.php/forum/23-risperdal-risperidone-invega-paliperidone/ to the point of lactation may be a substitute for grains of salt	[03:37]
assbot	Risperdal (risperidone) & Invega (paliperidone) - Crazy Talk: The Crazymeds Forum ... ( http://bit.ly/1BkTKD4 )	[03:37]
nubbins`	ugh: http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/30562s/bitnodes_will_be_releasing_plug_play_bitcoin_node/ ... we removed bitnodes as a dnsseed in bitcoin core because they kept engaging in sketchy behavior, and IMO dishonest. (e.g. we'd ask them to stop connecting at super high frequency to monitor every node in the network, and they said they would.. and a month later they instead had a perpetual	[03:38]
assbot	Bitnodes will be releasing plug & play Bitcoin node hardware mid-2015! : Bitcoin ... ( http://bit.ly/1BkTWT0 )	[03:39]
mircea_popescu	the cm field issue is probably the most concerning, and if there's a baked in backdoor (something like, say, nsa is able to directly see through maybe 10% of all keys ever generated ?) that's where it'd be, that 3= -1 * 3≈ -2^1.6 property it shares with weak curves like bn(2,254) etc.	[03:39]
nubbins`	<+ben_vulpes> http://dpaste.com/3F70MCT.txt << current contents of foundation hopes and dreams and todos list << it vanished, dpaste sux	[03:41]
assbot	Not Found ... ( http://bit.ly/1BkUnMR )	[03:41]
mircea_popescu	well alternatively a) deedbot b) set the damned timer.	[03:42]
mircea_popescu	http://log1.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=24-03-2015#1067870 << heh, alf is more poetic than me.	[03:42]
assbot	Logged on 24-03-2015 15:01:59; asciilifeform: yes, some crypto designers make mistake, they are good people, sure, whatever. i will borrow from slavoj žižek and say then 'we put them to a good wall, shoot them with a good bullet from a good gun, and bury them in with a good shove in the good earth' - since sure, they are good people.	[03:42]
mircea_popescu	http://log1.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=24-03-2015#1067898 << fleas do not come from dirt.	[03:43]
assbot	Logged on 24-03-2015 15:05:28; asciilifeform: that from -tolerasty- comes poettering & crew.	[03:43]
midnightmagic	BingoBoingo: sorry.. what? lactation and salt paranoia?	[03:44]
mircea_popescu	http://log1.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=24-03-2015#1067925 << a request not unlike "so you found drugs in his car ? but where's the notebook ? no notebook, no conviction!"	[03:45]
assbot	Logged on 24-03-2015 15:13:34; mats: show me the motherfucking evidence! you mean to tell me these bureaucrats decided not to commit anything to paper this go-around?	[03:45]
Adlai	re: montgomery ladder, you can implement constant-time secp256k1, but it's a pita	[03:45]
mircea_popescu	Adlai it is.	[03:45]
BingoBoingo	midnightmagic: Oh, I was jsut supposing risperidone as an alternative to grains of salt	[03:45]
mircea_popescu	not sure it's particularly a point of interest for bitcoin for that matter.	[03:45]
Adlai	(this seems to be djb's real reason behind discounting curves without a convenient constant-time algorithm)	[03:45]
mircea_popescu	only on THAT one score.	[03:46]
mircea_popescu	256k1 fails VERY hard on what are more relevant criteria.	[03:46]
trinque	nubbins` \| <+ben_vulpes> http://dpaste.com/3F70MCT.txt << current contents of foundation hopes and dreams and todos list << it vanished, dpaste sux << had the tab http://dpaste.com/2MAHAB9.txt	[03:46]
assbot	Not Found ... ( http://bit.ly/1GizasF )	[03:46]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1GizaJ8 )	[03:46]
mircea_popescu	FIRST B-A LEAK!11	[03:47]
trinque	boom	[03:47]
BingoBoingo	Someone pkg_add for qntra and claim words/shares	[03:47]
nubbins`	aww yeah	[03:48]
mircea_popescu	http://log1.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=24-03-2015#1067965 << another one	[03:49]
assbot	Logged on 24-03-2015 15:35:34; nubbins`: this place has done more to fundamentally change my thought processes than six years at university	[03:49]
mircea_popescu	buncha cultists.	[03:49]
nubbins`	i know, and all they gave me was a b.sc.	[03:50]
*	BingoBoingo has an M.I.Forget.All.The.Letters	[03:50]
ben_vulpes	http://dpaste.com/3F70MCT.txt << myup, fat-fingered the expiration	[03:54]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1BkWWhZ )	[03:54]
*	NewLiberty (~NewLibert@2602:304:cff8:1580:e45c:bc66:94e5:2307) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[03:54]
mircea_popescu	http://log1.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=24-03-2015#1068035 << no, it's a claim made here.	[03:55]
assbot	Logged on 24-03-2015 16:22:37; mats: the claim i'm most concerned about is that the weakness was engineered by NSA, and that, by having approved it, NIST was complicit, thus casting doubt on all other NIST standards	[03:55]
*	JoshG_ has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)	[03:55]
mircea_popescu	nist specifically is hostis humani generis due to that and similar mishaps.	[03:55]
BingoBoingo	Everything about NIST that isn't pure time sucks	[03:56]
BingoBoingo	Even then Rubidium standards are cheap. Run Ntpd as Stratum 1.	[03:56]
mircea_popescu	http://log1.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=24-03-2015#1068045 << no "figuring out" is contemplated or desired. that division is desired, so that the loafers can dangle.	[03:57]
assbot	Logged on 24-03-2015 16:27:38; mats: leaving us with no real basis for actually figuring out the situation.	[03:57]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 290 @ 0.00347999 = 1.0092 BTC [+] {2}	[03:57]
mircea_popescu	the point of a functioning intellect isn't to make one one with the universe. the point of a functioning intellect is to make it impossible for the universe to make itself one with one.	[03:57]
mircea_popescu	as in, i don't think so i can go wallow in the mud. i think so the mud can't come wallowing on me.	[03:58]
BingoBoingo	as in, i don't think so i can go wallow in the mud. i think so the mud can't come wallowing on me. << I wasted years 19 to 27 with the contrapositive here pls don't make the mistake	[03:59]
nubbins`	sleep	[04:00]
*	nubbins` has quit (Quit: Quit)	[04:01]
*	brendafdez (~brendafde@unaffiliated/brendafdez) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[04:02]
mircea_popescu	lol check out pete_dushenski writing lots	[04:03]
BingoBoingo	!up brendafdez	[04:03]
*	assbot gives voice to brendafdez	[04:03]
BingoBoingo	mircea_popescu: I'm pround of pete	[04:03]
mircea_popescu	http://log1.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=24-03-2015#1068066 << a possible explanation is that jamaica has been turned by its reputation for "place for middle aged white women to come have a brown baby" into a very specific sort of strip joint.	[04:04]
assbot	Logged on 24-03-2015 16:47:19; pete_dushenski: on one end is disinterest, a la paris or w/e, on the other end is entitlement	[04:04]
mircea_popescu	you wouldn't complain that the strippers don't wait on tables properly, would you ? as a woman ?	[04:04]
pete_dushenski	BingoBoingo: well ty	[04:05]
BingoBoingo	you wouldn't complain that the strippers don't wait on tables properly, would you ? as a woman ? << Serious labor problem here in the Middle West. Strippers aren't table servers	[04:05]
pete_dushenski	mircea_popescu: suppose not.	[04:05]
mircea_popescu	http://log1.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=24-03-2015#1068081 << this is a discogent antiargument because people here don't generally dig ditches for a living. obviously someone who leverages doesn't revert to data entry as a job.	[04:05]
assbot	Logged on 24-03-2015 16:50:29; nubbins`: how much of your own time do you waste on maybes?	[04:05]
brendafdez	I was just approved to join the linux for women mailing list. In the welcome email I'm both reminded that 'what happens on list stays on list' (no archives or sharing) and they also say literally "You must know your password to change your options (including changing the password, itself) or to unsubscribe. It is: XGx4#KmI#HeF%P7C^ Normally, Mailman will remind you of your linuxchix.org mailing list passwords once every month, alt	[04:06]
brendafdez	hough you can disable this if you prefer. This reminder will also include instructions on how to unsubscribe or change your account options. There is also a button on your options page that will email your current password to you."	[04:06]
brendafdez	I like it when they tell me right away that their security is crap. So I don't have to wonder. Here, hashed what?	[04:07]
pete_dushenski	sweet, sweet leverage	[04:07]
mircea_popescu	http://www.cuckoldvideoclips.com/myslutwife2/ sauce.	[04:07]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1BkZ9u0 )	[04:07]
pete_dushenski	speaking of which, turns out that bitcoin atms can actually make a buck!	[04:07]
pete_dushenski	;;seen adamobrien	[04:08]
gribble	I have not seen adamobrien.	[04:08]
pete_dushenski	or what was it...	[04:08]
pete_dushenski	;;seen adam_obrien	[04:09]
gribble	adam_obrien was last seen in #bitcoin-assets 4 weeks, 3 days, 3 hours, 48 minutes, and 11 seconds ago: I have to run here, if any of you need Bitcoin give me a ping adam@btcsolutions.ca	[04:09]
pete_dushenski	^we had coffee today and apparently one of his lamassus did CAD$25k in transactions last month. at 8% commission	[04:10]
*	hktud0 has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)	[04:10]
mircea_popescu	http://log1.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=24-03-2015#1068136 << every idiot's approach works well enough for him. shit, mr lazer handycraftsman's approach workes well enough for him	[04:11]
assbot	Logged on 24-03-2015 17:04:54; nubbins`: anyway tl;dr their approach works well enough for them	[04:11]
mircea_popescu	and for the forum retards at that.	[04:11]
pete_dushenski	he has a couple other too, none do quite that well but i was reasonably impressed that he hadn't lost his shirt	[04:11]
pete_dushenski	probably helps that cavirtex is tubed.	[04:12]
mircea_popescu	http://log1.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=24-03-2015#1068157 << clearly shot down by the italian separatists under berlusconi	[04:13]
assbot	Logged on 24-03-2015 17:14:37; pete_dushenski: this is assuming it wasn't hacked, shot down, etc.	[04:13]
*	hktud0 (ncidsk@unaffiliated/fluffybunny) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[04:13]
pete_dushenski	'clearly' because ... ?	[04:13]
mircea_popescu	you don't understand how the world works.	[04:14]
mircea_popescu	italy is massing army at the french border	[04:14]
mircea_popescu	herpity-derp	[04:14]
mircea_popescu	those imperialistic dreams of the papal states were apparently never extinguished!	[04:15]
pete_dushenski	lol aok	[04:15]
pete_dushenski	well i for one would like to see what the argentinian in the big house could muster as far as a military goes	[04:16]
mircea_popescu	http://static1.squarespace.com/static/54bb4cfce4b045585ada36f7/t/5510d89ce4b0fda1fcf4a144/1427167390317/ << o look, overweight, impotent, irrelvant and fundamentally cowardly white middleaged men clining to the unwarranted pretense of relevance.	[04:17]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1xxAFS9 )	[04:17]
mircea_popescu	srsly guise, you do all that ?	[04:17]
mircea_popescu	i bet your mom cares.	[04:17]
pete_dushenski	he's in far better condition to charge into battle than the hitler youth opa	[04:17]
pete_dushenski	ha, just read that too	[04:17]
mircea_popescu	battle i dunno about, but off tune melee for a few hours - sure.	[04:17]
pete_dushenski	symbolically sufficient	[04:18]
mircea_popescu	ascii_field:	[04:19]
mircea_popescu	'According to reporting, "1.6 percent of developers earn more than the other 98.4 percent combined. And the bottom 47 percent of engineers earn less than $100 per month." << o chjecxk it out asciilifeform! as jurov sayz, clearly this isn't working o.O	[04:19]
mircea_popescu	note that out of that 1.6%, about 1.5% is state-sponsored crapolade a la zynga. leaving the other 0.1% with an accidental 55k this year, which is barely enough to you know, pay rent.	[04:20]
mircea_popescu	and next year...	[04:20]
brendafdez	such inequality	[04:20]
mircea_popescu	well you don't win the lottery each year.	[04:20]
pete_dushenski	^the 'gold rush'	[04:20]
pete_dushenski	sorta like mining btc on your laptop	[04:20]
mircea_popescu	http://log1.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=24-03-2015#1068229 << see! it bothers you when usians do it. somehow, orlov-tolerant.	[04:21]
assbot	Logged on 24-03-2015 18:03:12; ascii_field: or do words have no meaning to him	[04:21]
mircea_popescu	nationalist!	[04:21]
pete_dushenski	nationalist workerbee. best defense against meta problem!	[04:22]
*	BingoBoingo is tone deaf	[04:22]
*	BingoBoingo did not know I was tone deaf until admited to US college as music specialist	[04:23]
pete_dushenski	you'll just have to trust me that i'm a decent singer then.	[04:23]
*	BingoBoingo is great at karaoke though	[04:23]
mircea_popescu	BingoBoingo most people that i've seen karaoke fit this boring midwestern 30something so-so woman type.	[04:24]
mircea_popescu	to the point in my head it connotes that, like bingo connotes old jewish women	[04:24]
BingoBoingo	BingoBoingo most people that i've seen karaoke fit this boring midwestern 30something so-so woman type. << But that's easy mode to getting your dick wet. It works	[04:25]
pete_dushenski	cheek-pinching connotes stereotypical old jewish women for me	[04:26]
pete_dushenski	real ones: schmetten torte	[04:27]
BingoBoingo	I dunno that I've ever met an old jewish woman	[04:27]
mircea_popescu	http://log1.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=24-03-2015#1068268 << i spent prolly 3-500 bucks on my foray in ipad gaming	[04:28]
assbot	Logged on 24-03-2015 18:15:00; funkenstein_: i refuse to admit that any creature would pay for an app	[04:28]
pete_dushenski	BingoBoingo: some are sneaky. you may have met one and not known it.	[04:29]
BingoBoingo	pete_dushenski: I've met plenty of young jews and gotten along fine. The mythic old jews are something else	[04:30]
pete_dushenski	https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1l3wco9zVao << 'you can barely see her horns'	[04:31]
mircea_popescu	http://log1.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=24-03-2015#1068306 << ayup	[04:31]
assbot	borat at jews house - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1xxCcHU )	[04:31]
assbot	Logged on 24-03-2015 18:21:31; trinque: best thing about gossipd is probably going to be writing software around it	[04:31]
pete_dushenski	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=25-03-2015#1070096 << so is this where you, like, finally !rate me or something ?	[04:32]
assbot	Logged on 25-03-2015 06:59:23; BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: I'm pround of pete	[04:32]
mircea_popescu	!rated pete_dushenski	[04:32]
assbot	You rated user pete_dushenski on 08-Jul-2014, with a rating of 2, and supplied these additional notes: Pimp..	[04:32]
BingoBoingo	pete_dushenski: I thought I rated you earlier. If not leave a not. I'm too pickled atm to access important keys. Insufficiently skilled at the knife.	[04:33]
brendafdez	Scared that drugs would work?	[04:34]
mircea_popescu	http://log1.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=24-03-2015#1068333 << there's exactly one field where payware is the only weay to go, and that's games.	[04:34]
assbot	Logged on 24-03-2015 18:24:31; ascii_field: nubbins`: payware costing money is by far the least significant problem with it, in my experience	[04:34]
*	assbot removes voice from brendafdez	[04:34]
*	assbot gives voice to brendafdez	[04:35]
pete_dushenski	;;later tell BingoBoingo please to be less pickled :D	[04:35]
gribble	The operation succeeded.	[04:35]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6200 @ 0.00021785 = 1.3507 BTC [-]	[04:35]
mircea_popescu	lol there's little more amusing than seeing people try various fringe ideologies on b-a.	[04:36]
BingoBoingo	pete_dushenski: That would involve untrusted 3rd parties	[04:36]
mircea_popescu	dudes you should totally not eat meat and use free software!	[04:36]
pete_dushenski	or not eat software and use free meat.	[04:37]
BingoBoingo	brendafdez: Certain classes of drugs have a history of being very effectual on me, but most drugs dropped in drink I have a strongly trained cross tolerance to.	[04:37]
mircea_popescu	i do use free meat!	[04:38]
mircea_popescu	uh i mean... i freely use meat.	[04:38]
pete_dushenski	BingoBoingo: well, i'll bug you another time i guess. i just tend to strike when the iron is hot, even if the iron is also blackout wasted.	[04:38]
Adlai	;;ticker --market all	[04:39]
gribble	Bitstamp BTCUSD last: 237.14, vol: 21462.80141475 \| BTC-E BTCUSD last: 235.98, vol: 15570.03822 \| Bitfinex BTCUSD last: 236.01, vol: 76464.99214271 \| CampBX BTCUSD last: 244.0, vol: 54.30174294 \| BTCChina BTCUSD last: 233.579688, vol: 199715.62230000 \| Kraken BTCUSD last: 240.0, vol: 37.55828405 \| Bitcoin-Central BTCUSD last: 242.7126, vol: 148.46250756 \| Volume-weighted last average: (1 more message)	[04:39]
BingoBoingo	pete_dushenski: But when the backbody is emitting in the IR spectrum>	[04:39]
BingoBoingo	?	[04:39]
pete_dushenski	hopefully the front isn't ?	[04:40]
BingoBoingo	lol	[04:42]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6500 @ 0.00021785 = 1.416 BTC [-]	[04:43]
*	badon_ (~badon@pdpc/supporter/active/badon) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[04:44]
*	badon has quit (Disconnected by services)	[04:44]
*	badon_ is now known as badon	[04:45]
BingoBoingo	!up badon	[04:46]
*	assbot gives voice to badon	[04:46]
pete_dushenski	"Jordan has signed a $10bn deal with Russia to build the kingdom's first nuclear power plant, with two 1,000-megawatt reactors in the country's north." << someone is actually building nuclear reactors these days.	[04:49]
BingoBoingo	"Jordan has signed a $10bn deal with Russia to build the kingdom's first nuclear power plant, with two 1,000-megawatt reactors in the country's north." << someone is actually building nuclear reactors these days. << /me remembers when King Hussein was the "Good Guy" (TM)	[04:50]
mircea_popescu	http://log1.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=24-03-2015#1068531 << this made exactly no sense.	[04:50]
assbot	Logged on 24-03-2015 20:01:21; thestringpuller: ascii_field: snore for now, but if they start selling, they lower barrier to fork.	[04:50]
pete_dushenski	i should say, 'someone is importing reactor designs'	[04:50]
mircea_popescu	you don't seriously imagine the rasbperry pi 150 dollar node a) can achieve critical mass or b) can support gavincoin ?	[04:51]
mircea_popescu	a is a non starter because their demo is reddit demo = poor people. it has to be free or no dice.	[04:51]
mircea_popescu	b is a non starter because srsly, do the maffs.	[04:51]
mircea_popescu	all that thing's doing is a more expensive, less useful, bitcoin node.	[04:51]
pete_dushenski	i'm guessing that china, russia, india reactors are in-house worx	[04:52]
pete_dushenski	BingoBoingo: not so long ago eh.	[04:52]
BingoBoingo	I support thestringpuller's idea that it could be dangerous because how much can it cost USG to rack 3 tons of banana pi's	[04:53]
pete_dushenski	except gov't doesn't do economical things like that	[04:56]
pete_dushenski	it's nature is to do uneconomical things.	[04:56]
pete_dushenski	its*	[04:57]
*	BingoBoingo wonders if anyone else here remembers when the Library marketed LOCKSS solution was based on OBSD	[04:58]
mircea_popescu	BingoBoingo dangerous doing what.	[05:02]
BingoBoingo	When did I say dangerous in this convo tonight?	[05:04]
mircea_popescu	I support thestringpuller's idea that it could be dangerous <	[05:04]
BingoBoingo	I was just asking if people remember a distributed memory safe system beign abandoned.	[05:04]
mircea_popescu	and holy shit this logging up took forever.	[05:04]
mircea_popescu	BingoBoingo mebbe i misread.	[05:05]
BingoBoingo	I support thestringpuller's idea that it could be dangerous < << Ah, I'm just thinking he might have a better measure of the enemy's pulse.	[05:05]
mircea_popescu	better than whom, and why would that be ?	[05:05]
mircea_popescu	dude look at that graph, mpoe fell of a cliff in slow motion.	[05:05]
mircea_popescu	and it follows the bitcoin curve to boot!	[05:06]
mircea_popescu	someone been playing teh big bad wolf ? i hope i haven't disappointed by not being impressed ?	[05:06]
BingoBoingo	''vishnuplug	[05:06]
BingoBoingo	^FU	[05:06]
*	BingoBoingo feels liek ButtBetting Soon	[05:08]
pete_dushenski	alright gang, off to dream about the next papal wars.	[05:12]
pete_dushenski	g'night	[05:12]
*	pete_dushenski has quit (Remote host closed the connection)	[05:12]
mircea_popescu	it totally was a puk missile!	[05:16]
*	assbot removes voice from badon	[05:16]
mircea_popescu	cazalla im not so sure about "differnent site". in any case same quantcast codes, so...	[05:17]
BingoBoingo	cazalla im not so sure about "differnent site". in any case same quantcast codes, so... << SHHHHHH.... same atm	[05:18]
mircea_popescu	so they should be.	[05:18]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 18950 @ 0.00021896 = 4.1493 BTC [+] {2}	[05:18]
*	Now talking on #bitcoin-assets	[06:30]
*	Topic for #bitcoin-assets is: http://bitcoin-assets.com \|\| http://log.bitcoin-assets.com \|\| http://bash.bitcoin-assets.com \|\| http://blogs.bitcoin-assets.com	[06:30]
*	Topic for #bitcoin-assets set by kakobrekla!~kako@unaffiliated/kakobrekla at Wed Mar 5 16:58:12 2014	[06:30]
-assbot-	Welcome to #bitcoin-assets. To get voice (ie, to be able to speak), send me "!up" in a private message to get an OTP. You must have a sufficient WoT rating. If you do not have a WoT account or sufficient rating, try politely asking one of the voiced people for a temporary voice.	[06:30]
cazalla	wru scoopbot	[06:31]
*	assbot gives voice to mircea_popescu	[06:31]
davout	jurov: kek	[06:33]
mircea_popescu	o check it out, a davout	[06:33]
davout	yeah, touch me i'm french	[06:33]
mircea_popescu	can i kiss you you're french ?	[06:33]
davout	no tongue plox	[06:34]
mircea_popescu	no, tongue is british.	[06:34]
davout	fish & chips is british, all the rest was invented by the french	[06:35]
mircea_popescu	haha, dilbert does butts now ?!	[06:35]
cazalla	i hear brendafdez has got a baby in es.qntra.net	[06:36]
cazalla	hop to it, your shares await brendafdez	[06:36]
davout	me gusta	[06:36]
brendafdez	I always take a long time before I do anything, so as to be sure that I won't fail to disappoint everyone involved.	[06:37]
brendafdez	Ah	[06:37]
mircea_popescu	brendafdez better get out of the defensive shell of stupid and work your butt off, i think.	[06:37]
cazalla	i'm catching up on logs so i'm sure i'll get to that discussion soon	[06:38]
mircea_popescu	wasn't in there i dun think ?	[06:39]
cazalla	mircea_popescu, oh? i thought she was quoting herself from an earlier conversation or something	[06:39]
*	BingoBoingo a liter in deeper than when I last touched the skunkswork project	[06:40]
mircea_popescu	prolly private.	[06:40]
BingoBoingo	What isn't?	[06:40]
mircea_popescu	cazalla i was thinking btw, on the general principle of translations. what do you think of a model where translations, be they en to es, or es to en or cn to en or whatever they may be count for half the shares ?	[06:41]
BingoBoingo	It isn't like I plan to battle syphillis anytime soon again	[06:41]
mircea_popescu	also, articles written by drunk people only counted for 13.37% of normal wordage?	[06:41]
BingoBoingo	cazalla i was thinking btw, on the general principle of translations. what do you think of a model where translations, be they en to es, or es to en or cn to en or whatever they may be count for half the shares ? << +10%vote unless that is horribly uneconomical	[06:42]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 29500 @ 0.00022406 = 6.6098 BTC [+] {3}	[06:42]
BingoBoingo	also, articles written by drunk people only counted for 13.37% of normal wordage? << Also totes fair	[06:42]
mircea_popescu	BingoBoingo what's +10%vote mean ?	[06:42]
davout	mircea_popescu: half the shares of the original article? or half the shares of the translated piece? i'd say the former makes more sense	[06:42]
mircea_popescu	hm.	[06:43]
mircea_popescu	shit. languages are so fucking difficult.	[06:43]
BingoBoingo	BingoBoingo what's +10%vote mean ? << You and cazalla are 20% a piece I throw my 10% behind translations, because we aren't fucking Cointelegrah with seperate US and UK press releases	[06:43]
mircea_popescu	the first time today i sat here and couldn't figure out a problem was when i tried to parse davout's proposal. brain just can't cope.	[06:44]
cazalla	BingoBoingo, they have indian and greek too now!	[06:44]
mircea_popescu	BingoBoingo so you're thinking translation more like 2/3 ?	[06:44]
mircea_popescu	davout how do you figure which makes more sense ?	[06:45]
BingoBoingo	I thin translation is between 1/2 to 2/3rds. A full 1 if from strange to Eng	[06:45]
cazalla	i really don't see the issue with matching it 1:1 on the basis translation is useful, es not as much as cn but still	[06:45]
davout	mircea_popescu: some languages are much shorter than others, dutch is much denser than french for example	[06:45]
mircea_popescu	BingoBoingo the thing is, if you give them parity you'll end up with you know, hungarian translation of 500 qntra articles diluting you to shit.	[06:45]
cazalla	but then seeing i can only speaka da english , i am prolly not qualified to "opine" on such matters lol	[06:46]
mircea_popescu	cazalla so then let them be 1:1 but only allow basically es, en, cn and mebbe portuguese ?	[06:46]
BingoBoingo	BingoBoingo the thing is, if you give them parity you'll end up with you know, hungarian translation of 500 qntra articles diluting you to shit << Editors discretion. Fucking hungarian sucks, not a lang	[06:46]
mircea_popescu	it's as much a language as finish is!	[06:46]
BingoBoingo	Finish not a lang either, it is a goal	[06:46]
mircea_popescu	and before you dismiss that, you should see what fucking tits & ass lean tall blonde stuff they produce!	[06:46]
cazalla	why would we want anything other than spanish and chinesey?	[06:46]
mircea_popescu	cazalla so basically, extended cultural imperialism ?	[06:47]
mircea_popescu	i dunno, i could go withj that.	[06:47]
BingoBoingo	mircea_popescu: I hurd they were on US feminist diabeetus diet	[06:47]
cazalla	maybe arabic	[06:47]
cazalla	but other than that, those are top 3 next to english i assume	[06:47]
mircea_popescu	but prolly portuguese > spanish, on account of... well... brazil is like > south america.	[06:47]
cazalla	oh russian.. here we go, give an inch..	[06:47]
mircea_popescu	right ?	[06:47]
mircea_popescu	russian, japanese right ? then all the arabs will get pissy because why do we pick the one or the other ?	[06:48]
BingoBoingo	I could see placing spanish well before portugese because fuck brazil if they aren't waxing	[06:48]
mircea_popescu	but i don't think we can go "all bitcoin happens in english fuck you"	[06:48]
BingoBoingo	Not at all	[06:48]
Adlai	put it to shareholder votes. want more incentive for translations in your language? gotta pay to have a say, like in 'real' politics	[06:48]
mircea_popescu	BingoBoingo brazil is waxing yo. and btw, general point : girls get their tit implants age 16 down here.	[06:48]
BingoBoingo	I think we focus on trade languages of En ES and Fu	[06:49]
mircea_popescu	it's like a bat mitzvah gift.	[06:49]
brendafdez	tit implants :)	[06:49]
mircea_popescu	Adlai how are the shareholders paying exactly ?	[06:49]
Adlai	those who want more compensation for translators to some language, must buy shares in order to have their voices heard/regarded by the editors	[06:50]
mircea_popescu	yeah, that's totally how that'll work.	[06:50]
brendafdez	brendafdez better get out of the defensive shell of stupid and work your butt off, i think. << oops ;)	[06:50]
Adlai	(or they earn their shares the usual way)	[06:50]
cazalla	I could see placing spanish well before portugese because fuck brazil if they aren't waxing <<< so muff is ok ya know	[06:51]
BingoBoingo	mircea_popescu: I am totally fine with the En language space surrendering except as a pidgin used in trade. If you let a single slant language into the acceptable trading space though. I sense trouble. Don't know of, but anticipate	[06:51]
cazalla	some even	[06:51]
BingoBoingo	Muff is greap	[06:51]
BingoBoingo	Muff gives my beard something to socialize with	[06:52]
mircea_popescu	cazalla he just doesn't want hair in the asshole is all.	[06:52]
cazalla	but they poop from there, so i don't care, not going near butthole either way	[06:52]
mircea_popescu	some women wash.	[06:52]
BingoBoingo	You affraid of the poop muff?	[06:52]
mircea_popescu	fun fact : most large felines don't know how to shit as infants, so the mother licks their asshole to stimulate bowel movements.	[06:53]
mircea_popescu	think your life sucks ? at least you're not mom jaguar.	[06:53]
cazalla	i can just see you as the romanian vers of it's only smellz	[06:53]
mircea_popescu	(this, incidentally, works in constipated human infants too.)	[06:53]
BingoBoingo	Same kinda happens for primates, you ever seen reddit and momma chimp	[06:53]
brendafdez	black kiss, just what the doctor ordered	[06:54]
mircea_popescu	ordured, but anyway.	[06:54]
BingoBoingo	I just think it is too early to surrender to the chicoms. Even though I could prolly bang out a qntra.chicom in 45 minutes if I wasn't so pickled atm.	[06:56]
mircea_popescu	http://log1.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=25-03-2015#1070253 << /me thinks back, realises that... you know what ? i've never actually failed an exam in my life.	[06:56]
assbot	Logged on 25-03-2015 09:13:35; brendafdez: what i know is that i failed every single exam in my life which had word algebra somewhere	[06:56]
*	BingoBoingo still takes the LSAT on commision for select bidders	[06:57]
*	BingoBoingo is sure most people's best chance at passing the bar is hiring me to ident as them through law school	[06:58]
mircea_popescu	lol	[06:59]
BingoBoingo	I've actually made this offer before.	[06:59]
*	BingoBoingo has never scored lower than 176/180 on the LSAT. I am the full package law school Fast Forward button.	[07:00]
mircea_popescu	so you could get me a law degree just in time for lawsky being extradited to serenissima jurisdiction so i can da myself personally ?	[07:01]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8543 @ 0.00021886 = 1.8697 BTC [-]	[07:01]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10400 @ 0.00021643 = 2.2509 BTC [-]	[07:02]
BingoBoingo	mircea_popescu: Pretty much, so long as you offer me an identify that does not have a history of long term use of lamotrinine of chloro-amphetamines	[07:03]
mircea_popescu	you should prolly make that offer in chinese.	[07:03]
BingoBoingo	I prolly should. Not enough people take it up in English.	[07:04]
cazalla	BingoBoingo, ya know, big business down under in writing papers for uni students, big drama other week regarding it http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/mymaster-essay-cheating-scandal-more-than-70-university-students-face-suspension-20150318-1425oe.html	[07:04]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5100 @ 0.00021505 = 1.0968 BTC [-]	[07:04]
*	brendafdez (~brendafde@unaffiliated/brendafdez) has left #bitcoin-assets ("back to the defensive shell of stupid")	[07:04]
assbot	MyMaster essay cheating scandal: More than 70 university students face suspension ... ( http://bit.ly/1BlyVr2 )	[07:04]
BingoBoingo	cazalla: You never write for students, you BE the students	[07:05]
cazalla	sounds like a lot of effort	[07:05]
cazalla	how well can a student pay you for pretending to be them?	[07:05]
BingoBoingo	enough	[07:06]
BingoBoingo	Do they, no	[07:06]
cazalla	and good luck getting rolling down drunk and turning up in person, at least you can do online tests and write for them at home while drunk	[07:07]
mircea_popescu	cazalla he probably only does it for the free rape	[07:08]
mircea_popescu	"phteven with a ph did it!"	[07:08]
BingoBoingo	cazalla: Have I ever told you about my GRE story?	[07:08]
cazalla	BingoBoingo, i don't even know what GRE is so, no	[07:08]
mircea_popescu	let some dude show up for you in exams today, be cited for 198 gang rapes next tuesday	[07:09]
cazalla	but if it's you turning up blind drunk and acing a test, i'd believe it	[07:09]
cazalla	lolol	[07:09]
mircea_popescu	america!	[07:09]
mircea_popescu	also, beneficial identity theft!	[07:09]
BingoBoingo	but if it's you turning up blind drunk and acing a test, i'd believe it << Since 1998 when the injun store stopped carding me	[07:09]
cazalla	BingoBoingo, ya know i use to get carded when i was 16, but i was smart enough to know the guy working at the bottle shop probably couldn't subtract my age from the current year, so he would glance at my provisional drivers licence and ring up my drinks no probs	[07:10]
cazalla	my dob i means to say	[07:11]
mircea_popescu	this "carding" thing...	[07:12]
*	BingoBoingo has alway done the deception thing	[07:12]
cazalla	means something else where you're from eh mircea_popescu	[07:12]
*	mircea_popescu had a drink at his junior high prom. which was held in a bar. because romanians didn't actually give a shit.	[07:12]
mircea_popescu	the other kids didn't, because kids.	[07:13]
BingoBoingo	* mircea_popescu had a drink at his junior high prom. which was held in a bar. because romanians didn't actually give a shit. << Wait Wut, you only had one drink at prom? Junior year I was trying to keep pace with Anya.	[07:13]
cazalla	BingoBoingo, ease up, he's a light drinker	[07:14]
mircea_popescu	that's kinda the thing, if it's not a big deal it just... isn't a big deal.	[07:14]
mircea_popescu	cazalla heh notrly. my high mark is putting away something over a liter of 50% moonshine and then walking out.	[07:14]
mircea_popescu	i suspek that makes me a heavy drinker, at least at the time.	[07:14]
BingoBoingo	Drink is totally not a big deal. In the same way standardized tests in the US are not a big deal. The cost to pass maximally is trivial.	[07:14]
mircea_popescu	but in truth i dun really drink like i used to.	[07:15]
cazalla	i suspek gypies sell non-alcoholic wine to young romanian men as american's sell oregano to the teens :P	[07:15]
mircea_popescu	i never saw non-alcoholic wine in yurp.	[07:16]
mircea_popescu	real thing too abundant.	[07:16]
cazalla	yeah my opa use to make it, locked him in the cellar once, such a hiding for that one	[07:17]
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cazalla	the funny thing is, i could've left him in there but i was so frightened that i opened it so that he could beat me	[07:17]
cazalla	prob had war flash backs or something, he went fkn bananas	[07:18]
mircea_popescu	romania (at least the nw, where i'm from) is all about this particular plum distilate.	[07:18]
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mircea_popescu	most respectable older men run their own stills, and they usually leak and are in basements	[07:19]
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mircea_popescu	so when it's firing time... buncha very drunk dudes that swear they didn't drink a drop	[07:19]
cazalla	banned here, unless for extracting essential oils	[07:19]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 29700 @ 0.00021789 = 6.4713 BTC [+] {3}	[07:19]
mircea_popescu	romania (at least back in the day) was this place where nothing could be banned.	[07:20]
cazalla	and whenever some dudes die from the methanol they produced, they make a big deal of it in the media to warn of the dangers of diy at home	[07:20]
mircea_popescu	the very notion that the govt would tell you what to do or not do... lol.	[07:20]
mircea_popescu	there's no methanol in this process.	[07:20]
mircea_popescu	actually, distilling fermented fruit can not yield methanol. it's ancient and perfectly safe at that.	[07:21]
BingoBoingo	Clean known moonsine stills here	[07:21]
BingoBoingo	From corn though	[07:21]
cazalla	mircea_popescu, must be making something else then, i have nfi, just hear in the media now and again	[07:21]
mircea_popescu	i think you gotta boil wood before you get crap like that.	[07:21]
cazalla	"Initial reports about the four men's methanol poisoning suggest it occurred when they tried to concoct grappa, a grape-based brandy."	[07:22]
mircea_popescu	pff.	[07:23]
cazalla	prob for the best i don't bottle my own, i'd be in perpetual state of drunkedness	[07:23]
mircea_popescu	they probably tried to "concoct grappa" out of office chairs or something.	[07:23]
mircea_popescu	seeing how one hundred thousand people made their own for decade upon decade without ill effect.	[07:24]
cazalla	well, if one is going to eat plastic food, may as well drink plastic too	[07:24]
mircea_popescu	anywya, if memory serves there's a good 10-20 degrees differential between ethanol and methanol boiling points.	[07:25]
cazalla	anyway, zzz for me	[07:26]
mircea_popescu	even if you start with a 50-50 mixture, keep the still open at ~75 degrees for half an hour, then you can just let it burn and collect the result.	[07:26]
mircea_popescu	nn c man	[07:26]
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mircea_popescu	sounds about right.	[07:34]
jurov	actually, distilling fermented fruit can not yield methanol << wait what???	[07:34]
BingoBoingo	My parents unlocked the scotch at 12	[07:34]
mircea_popescu	to which part ?	[07:34]
BingoBoingo	actually, distilling fermented fruit can not yield methanol << wait what??? << It totally can	[07:35]
jurov	i have held in my hand plum methanol, wtf if mircea up to	[07:35]
jurov	*is	[07:35]
BingoBoingo	jurov: He has an idealistic image of the old country	[07:35]
mircea_popescu	no dude, it's just fucking rare.	[07:36]
mircea_popescu	in the single digit ppm.	[07:36]
BingoBoingo	I've drank 98+ proof corn whiskey aged right with minimal fusile alcohols. Everyone wants their tradition to be the saint	[07:37]
jurov	http://homedistiller.org/intro/methanol/methanol apparently it depends	[07:38]
assbot	Home Distillation of Alcohol (Homemade Alcohol to Drink) ... ( http://bit.ly/1EFwqRE )	[07:38]
jurov	"for example apple juice can have 0.2-0.3% methanol, or if derived from pulp by enzymatic degradation, the levels can be 2 to 3 times higher."	[07:39]
mircea_popescu	jurov there's two things : one, what you use and how you ferment it. two, how you distil.	[07:39]
mircea_popescu	but historically, methanol is "wood alcohol". ie, if you try to distil roadkill and old boots, you get a lot of it.	[07:39]
jurov	yes but that's very different from "can not yield"	[07:39]
mircea_popescu	otherwise, properly fermented plums specifically are so and so.	[07:39]
mircea_popescu	well i was talking of the traditional process as used, not of whatever random strange one may try.	[07:39]
mircea_popescu	you know these things get highly traditional / fixated.	[07:40]
mircea_popescu	but in any case : methanol has significant lower boiling point. which, again, means that even if you start with an equal part mixture, if you distil correctly you take it all out.	[07:40]
jurov	yes	[07:41]
mircea_popescu	well so that.	[07:42]
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*	BingoBoingo is awfuly sure unregulated corn distillation products self has consumed in the past conatained far below te mandated fusile alcohols of the nao	[07:46]
BingoBoingo	If only fissible alcohols were a thing	[07:47]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15150 @ 0.00021505 = 3.258 BTC [-]	[07:50]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20192 @ 0.00021756 = 4.393 BTC [+] {2}	[08:10]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4711 @ 0.00022073 = 1.0399 BTC [+]	[08:37]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5863 @ 0.00022484 = 1.3182 BTC [+]	[08:53]
mircea_popescu	According to the 2002/2003 census, 143,167 farms had plum trees bearing fruit covering a total area of 554 km². According to the same census, about 75% of the crop ends up as țuică.	[08:59]
mircea_popescu	ha	[08:59]
mircea_popescu	romania, 3rd plum producer, after china and serbia	[08:59]
mircea_popescu	(mostly, damsons)	[09:00]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 25700 @ 0.00022792 = 5.8575 BTC [+] {2}	[09:02]
chetty	According to the 2002/2003 census, 143,167 farms had plum trees bearing fruit covering a total area of 554 km². According to the same census, about 75% of the crop ends up as țuică.//only 75%?	[09:06]
mircea_popescu	i think some plums grow feet and run away	[09:06]
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danielpbarron	height=296995 vs height=216536	[09:15]
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Adlai	so 'eris' is... a database? an application server? does GenDoug support Hybrid-Flex™ blockchains?	[09:33]
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danielpbarron	Adlai, it's a block chain with mining restricted by a centrally controlled key	[09:39]
danielpbarron	that is, blocks are only accepted as valid if they meet the difficulty requirement and are blessed with the magic key	[09:40]
danielpbarron	and that's supposed to eliminate the need for there being a currency	[09:40]
danielpbarron	to which I ask, why even use a block chain? it's like cloud storage with unneccessary drawbacks	[09:42]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17400 @ 0.00022821 = 3.9709 BTC [+]	[09:47]
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Adlai	decentralization theater :P	[09:52]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10104 @ 0.00022497 = 2.2731 BTC [-] {2}	[10:08]
jurov	guess they hope to sell mining equipment with the key baked in	[10:26]
jurov	and thus dip both ends	[10:26]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 18150 @ 0.00022214 = 4.0318 BTC [-]	[10:34]
danielpbarron	!up kyuupichan	[10:35]
*	assbot gives voice to kyuupichan	[10:35]
kyuupichan	danielpbarron: What do your messages saying "Height H1 vs H2" mean exactly?	[10:36]
danielpbarron	i'm running two pogos, one with a solid state drive, the other with a 5400 rpm drive	[10:37]
danielpbarron	i knew solid state would be faster; just seeing how much faster, and if 5400 rpm drive is a reasonable option	[10:38]
danielpbarron	22G vs 6.2G	[10:43]
danielpbarron	out of about 40G	[10:43]
danielpbarron	i think it would take about a year for a 5400 rpm drive pogo to sync with the network	[10:44]
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danielpbarron	;;later tell mod6 having some troubles here http://danielpbarron.com/auto-static-v0_0_5-x86_32.txt	[11:09]
gribble	The operation succeeded.	[11:09]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1BLYVuR )	[11:09]
*	mod6 looks	[11:10]
danielpbarron	i haven't caught up on the logs yet, maybe these issues were covered already	[11:10]
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mod6	So can you explain what you're builing, what version of auto.sh, what OS, did you change anything? what arch?	[11:12]
*	assbot gives voice to nubbins`	[11:12]
mod6	*building	[11:12]
mod6	Did you read this email? http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/2015-March/000071.html << this /should/ work on an x86 arch	[11:12]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1BLZ7do )	[11:12]
mod6	if you tried to build that version of auto.sh on an ARM arch, then i can see why you had issues.	[11:13]
danielpbarron	yes that's what i used	[11:13]
danielpbarron	i tried it first as is	[11:13]
mod6	what os/arch?	[11:13]
danielpbarron	gentoo x86	[11:14]
mod6	hmm	[11:14]
nubbins`	you installed libssl-dev?	[11:14]
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nubbins`	danielpbarron ^	[11:15]
danielpbarron	i don't think so	[11:17]
nubbins`	well that's your problem	[11:17]
nubbins`	emerge dat shit	[11:17]
danielpbarron	emerge: there are no ebuilds to satisfy "libssl-dev".	[11:17]
danielpbarron	i didn't need it last time	[11:17]
nubbins`	headers.h:20:28: fatal error: openssl/buffer.h: No such file or directory	[11:17]
nubbins`	hm	[11:18]
danielpbarron	my pogos are currently running a bitcoind that i compiled myself	[11:18]
nubbins`	does emerge tab-complete?	[11:18]
nubbins`	libssl	[11:18]
danielpbarron	emerge: Maybe you meant any of these: virtual/libudev, dev-libs/libsolv, dev-libs/libsigsegv?	[11:18]
nubbins`	neh	[11:18]
nubbins`	is buffer.h anywhere on your system>?	[11:18]
nubbins`	might be an include path issue	[11:19]
danielpbarron	i thought this is supposed to download a specific version of ssl and use a local copy	[11:19]
danielpbarron	why should i need to install things on my system?	[11:19]
nubbins`	pastebin your ./auto.sh	[11:20]
nubbins`	and your bitcoin/src/makefile.unix	[11:20]
nubbins`	heck, skip pastebin and danielpbarron.com them	[11:20]
nubbins`	openssl is the first dep that should get downloaded and compiled, so if it's halting there it's probably a path issue	[11:22]
mod6	i've never used gentoo before, but if this still a problem/not-resolved by the end of the day, I'll try to setup a new droplet and test the auto.sh changes there.	[11:22]
nubbins`	danielpbarron here's a snippet from the last chunk of text you shared	[11:23]
nubbins`	-I/home/dpb/pogo/bitcoind/static.5th/ourlibs/include -I/home/dpb/pogo/bitcoind/static.5th/ourlibs/include -I/home/dpb/pogo/bitcoind/static.5th/ourlibs/include	[11:23]
nubbins`	that's trying to include the same dir three times	[11:23]
nubbins`	which might indicate that it's failing to parse something after /include	[11:23]
danielpbarron	that attempt was using the arm toolchain	[11:24]
nubbins`	i had to modify makefile for osx because all the path stuff wasn't resolving, your gentoo might have similar prob	[11:24]
nubbins`	actually all three of your attempts show the same thing	[11:24]
nubbins`	(might be totally not the issue but worth examining)	[11:25]
thestringpuller	;;ticker	[11:27]
gribble	Bitfinex BTCUSD ticker \| Best bid: 246.34, Best ask: 246.48, Bid-ask spread: 0.14000, Last trade: 246.46, 24 hour volume: 71535.64113155, 24 hour low: 235.7, 24 hour high: 252.94, 24 hour vwap: None	[11:27]
danielpbarron	refresh http://danielpbarron.com/auto-static-v0_0_5-x86_32.txt	[11:30]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1BLYVuR )	[11:30]
*	PeterL (~peterl@unaffiliated/peterl) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[11:30]
*	assbot gives voice to PeterL	[11:31]
*	shesek (~shesek@77.127.158.156) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[11:32]
*	felipelalli (~Thunderbi@unaffiliated/felipelalli) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[11:33]
PeterL	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-03-2015#1061881 << my brother is ~6 ft tall, but usually slouches so he looks about 5'7	[11:34]
assbot	Logged on 21-03-2015 04:52:20; mircea_popescu: but to belabour the point : one of the principal reasons "measuring iq" as it were height is so ridiculous, is because nobody has yet had an off day for height.	[11:34]
nubbins`	danielpbarron sweet, how about makefile.unix from 5th	[11:35]
PeterL	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=21-03-2015#1061802 << I would say most of food is pretty well described by chemistry already	[11:35]
assbot	Logged on 21-03-2015 04:30:25; mircea_popescu: at any rate : expecting human behaviour to be addressed by genetics is a little like expecting food to be discussed by chemistry.	[11:35]
PeterL	and yes, there are chemists who specialize in food chemistry	[11:36]
nubbins`	there were behaviourists who specialized in genetics 8)	[11:37]
PeterL	but are there geneticists that specialize in behaviour?	[11:38]
nubbins`	prolly not since ww2	[11:39]
*	felipelalli has quit (Quit: felipelalli)	[11:40]
*	felipelalli (~Thunderbi@unaffiliated/felipelalli) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[11:41]
Adlai	there's a gene for smoking all the way down to the filter	[11:44]
Adlai	which is derpspeak for statistical correlation between certain genotypes, and that phenotype	[11:44]
nubbins`	8)	[11:47]
danielpbarron	nubbins`, http://danielpbarron.com/makefile.unix.txt	[11:56]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1BM1Mnq )	[11:56]
mircea_popescu	to which I ask, why even use a block chain? it's like cloud storage with unneccessary drawbacks << this pretty much	[11:56]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14275 @ 0.00022539 = 3.2174 BTC [+] {2}	[11:56]
mircea_popescu	guess they hope to sell mining equipment with the key baked in << wouldn't this necessarily leak it ?	[11:57]
jurov	no rake is forever	[11:58]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 27350 @ 0.00022567 = 6.1721 BTC [+]	[11:59]
nubbins`	danielpbarron: add these two lines to your auto.sh, right below "export LDFLAGS=" at the bottom	[11:59]
nubbins`	echo $OURLIBS	[11:59]
mircea_popescu	I would say most of food is pretty well described by chemistry already << you have no idea.	[11:59]
nubbins`	echo $OPENSSL_LIB_PATH	[11:59]
nubbins`	then run ./auto.sh again	[11:59]
PeterL	you think there is some mysterious undescribed part of food?	[12:00]
nubbins`	actually maybe preface with: echo "looky loo"	[12:00]
mircea_popescu	pretty much the only thing chemistry describes about food is that it has no hope in hell of describing it, and here's some alternatives that 90% of people can't distinguish	[12:00]
nubbins`	or other marker	[12:00]
*	nubbins` points out that "artificial flavor" and "natural flavor" can be chemically the same molecule, but must be labelled according to origin	[12:01]
mircea_popescu	PeterL didn't we have the discussion with the complexity of aminoacids ?	[12:01]
mircea_popescu	nubbins` this "chemically the same molecule" ... i can distinguish peppers and capsein.	[12:01]
mircea_popescu	now go make me a pickled cucumber.	[12:01]
nubbins`	i can distinguish marijuana and pure thc 8)	[12:01]
PeterL	what about them? chemists can say what they are, but might not be able to recreate them in the lab	[12:01]
mircea_popescu	PeterL they can't usefully say what they are, even.	[12:02]
mircea_popescu	human taste is sensitive to ppb in some lines. smell easily to ppm.	[12:02]
nubbins`	protip: the smell of nice marijuana is precisely the smell of thc	[12:02]
mircea_popescu	nubbins` sure, soime cases are more advantageous than others. now go distinguish a glass of wine from another glass of wine, chemically.	[12:03]
mircea_popescu	your competent oenologist can usually spot the year and most of the time the vineyard. not the region mind. the vineyard.	[12:03]
nubbins`	too many compounds bru!	[12:03]
mircea_popescu	oic.	[12:03]
mircea_popescu	i thought it was described.	[12:03]
PeterL	sure, you can identify the differing concentrations of various chemicals	[12:03]
nubbins`	oh, no doubt	[12:03]
nubbins`	everyone's seen a sommelier identify the vineyard by taste	[12:03]
mircea_popescu	PeterL no, you can't actually, because a glass is not enough sample.	[12:03]
nubbins`	only way to earn your level 3	[12:03]
nubbins`	now take a glass of house red and a glass of $5000/bottle red and ask the guy to do a blind taste test.	[12:04]
*	nubbins` has admittedly never drunk wine costlier than $500/bottle but can verify that all the superfluous descriptors on the label are actually present	[12:04]
jurov	http://m.perthnow.com.au/news/western-australia/assault-charge-woman-squirts-breast-milk-at-cop-refused-bail/story-fnhocxo3-1227278350251	[12:04]
nubbins`	"it DOES taste like oiled leather and rustic tobacco"	[12:04]
assbot	\| Perth Now ... ( http://bit.ly/1BM2j98 )	[12:05]
mircea_popescu	if you had a cistern to run through, and a few years and an infinity of budgets, you maybe could get something sorta usable some of the time. which is about wheree it is.	[12:05]
jurov	jus' squirt it	[12:05]
mircea_popescu	jurov you know that sounds so very gypsy...	[12:05]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17000 @ 0.00022567 = 3.8364 BTC [+]	[12:05]
*	The20YearIRCloud (uid38883@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-wljvujjuppvkohkf) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[12:06]
mircea_popescu	at any rate : most actual foodstuffs, such as pickles, cheeses, cured and aged meats etc aren't even flora-enumerated, in the sense that we don't even really know what all grows on them	[12:06]
mircea_popescu	it's "broadly this" and "mostly that" all the way.	[12:07]
PeterL	aren't pickles just cucumbers soaked in vinegar?	[12:07]
mircea_popescu	no, they are not.	[12:07]
mircea_popescu	pickes are cucumbers fermented in a saline solution in the dark and cool.	[12:08]
mircea_popescu	the vinegar thing is an industrial product and at best cattle feed.	[12:08]
nubbins`	brining and fermenting is an art	[12:09]
*	nubbins` has been dabbling	[12:09]
mircea_popescu	not that i'm contesting the importance and corectness of whatever, maillard, what have you. but nobody who looked at the matter seriously is claiming the problem to be even described	[12:10]
mircea_popescu	let alone solved.	[12:10]
nubbins`	this kimchi i'm working through could strip paint	[12:10]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8725 @ 0.00022038 = 1.9228 BTC [-] {2}	[12:10]
nubbins`	but yeah, mp has it. you can take a stab at the /types/ of organisms or compounds therein	[12:10]
*	smidge has quit (Quit: sorry, but you've mistaken me for someone who gives a fuck...)	[12:10]
nubbins`	but that's about as close as it gets	[12:10]
nubbins`	like, i know my kimchi has lactobacillus strains	[12:10]
nubbins`	which ones? shrug	[12:10]
mircea_popescu	moreover, the variety of bacteria is actually staggering.	[12:11]
nubbins`	ostensibly different ones than are in my sourdough.	[12:11]
PeterL	but chemists have a general knowledge of what goes into good food, unlike geneticists who have very little idea what goes into intelligence	[12:11]
mircea_popescu	PeterL but geneticists have am uch better idea of what goes into phenotypes.	[12:11]
mircea_popescu	uhhh... guanine	[12:11]
mircea_popescu	and... ahem.... ti something	[12:11]
mircea_popescu	there, they're ahead already.	[12:11]
nubbins`	heh	[12:11]
mircea_popescu	guanine and ti something, almost 1/3 of the job	[12:11]
nubbins`	incidentally, coffee is up there with wine as far as variety of chemical compunds goes	[12:12]
nubbins`	coffee plantation was the first time i ever saw (and smelled) a smell sample kit	[12:12]
mircea_popescu	so it is. and the yak milk thing the mongols drink	[12:12]
mircea_popescu	and on it goes.	[12:12]
nubbins`	10/10 would like to own one	[12:12]
*	nubbins` prefers wet-processed coffees, which means -- you guessed it -- fermentation	[12:13]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10550 @ 0.00021505 = 2.2688 BTC [-]	[12:13]
nubbins`	sometimes i feel like i've changed my gut flora enough that it's modified my brain chemistry to strongly desire stinky, fermented things	[12:14]
nubbins`	other side of the coin is that i've stopped indulging in mcdonald's and plastic food for long enough that the natural desire to eat /living food/ has come back	[12:14]
nubbins`	take yr pick	[12:14]
danielpbarron	nubbins`, refresh http://danielpbarron.com/auto-static-v0_0_5-x86_32.txt	[12:17]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1BLYVuR )	[12:17]
danielpbarron	i thought it might have been because i was still using my own script to patch 0.5.3, but the pre-patched 0.5.3.1 i tried also failed (that was the omitted 6th attempt	[12:19]
*	jurov imagined a dystopic flick featuring people with GMO gut flora living off all kinds of waste	[12:20]
jurov	i suspect such uncanny adaptations will be necessary for space, too	[12:21]
PeterL	I have entertained the idea of trying to implant gut flora from herbivores to allow us to live off grass, could be fun, no?	[12:21]
jurov	what fun? chewing all day?	[12:22]
PeterL	I've also wondered what would happen if we implanted chloroplasts in our skin, just live off sunlight?	[12:23]
nubbins`	danielpbarron so $OURLIBS resolves to /home/dpb/pogo/bitcoind/static.7th/ourlibs	[12:23]
nubbins`	$OPENSSL_LIB_PATH resolves to /home/dpb/pogo/bitcoind/static.7th/ourlibs/lib	[12:23]
nubbins`	^ not sure that's drilled down deep enough	[12:23]
nubbins`	no, wait, that's fine	[12:23]
jurov	hardly chloroplasts. more likely figure out symbiosis with some sort of algae.. and i suspect it would not cover even significant part of metabolism	[12:25]
jurov	mostly worthwhile to synthesize vitamins and the like	[12:26]
nubbins`	danielpbarron your 7th halts at a different step, hey?	[12:26]
nubbins`	db_cxx.h vs buffer.h	[12:26]
*	PeterL has quit (Quit: PeterL)	[12:26]
mircea_popescu	jurov not a bad premise.	[12:28]
mircea_popescu	eh, you'd need to implant four stomachs too, peterl.	[12:28]
mircea_popescu	I've also wondered what would happen if we implanted chloroplasts in our skin, just live off sunlight? << toxic epidermal necrolysis much more likely./	[12:29]
*	OneNomos has quit (Remote host closed the connection)	[12:29]
nubbins`	hmm	[12:32]
nubbins`	danielpbarron	[12:32]
nubbins`	http://danielpbarron.com/auto-static-v0_0_5-x86_32.txt	[12:32]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1COYw0j )	[12:32]
nubbins`	bottom chunk: see 2nd line in paste	[12:33]
nubbins`	...failed updating 163 targets...	[12:33]
nubbins`	i think your problem might start a bit earlier?	[12:33]
chetty	I've also wondered what would happen if we implanted chloroplasts in our skin, just live off sunlight? << toxic epidermal necrolysis much more likely./// and poor vampires	[12:33]
nubbins`	danielpbarron compare to first paste, failed updating 1 target	[12:35]
mod6	danielpbarron: headers.h:26:20: fatal error: db_cxx.h: No such file or directory << did bdb get built ok?	[12:44]
mod6	you may want to do like one at a time: Comment out 77-95 (for BDB) & 97-119 (for Boost) and just see if you get a clean build from OpenSSL. Then if so, comment out 58-75 (openssl) and uncomment 77-95 for BDB and just run that... etc etc.	[12:46]
mod6	make sense?	[12:46]
jurov	fatal error: db_cxx.h: No such file << that's known issue on gentoo, you have to add -I	[12:46]
mod6	oh	[12:46]
danielpbarron	yeah, i think i remember doing that the last time i went through all this	[12:46]
danielpbarron	err.. what mod6 said, not what jurov said	[12:46]
mircea_popescu	vegetampires	[12:47]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 24900 @ 0.00021536 = 5.3625 BTC [+]	[12:47]
asciilifeform	chloroplasts << surface/volume ratio. fails, even if worked.	[12:48]
mircea_popescu	gmornin alf	[12:48]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9875 @ 0.00021873 = 2.16 BTC [+] {2}	[12:48]
*	asciilifeform caught up with logs, off to meatspace for a spell	[12:48]
mircea_popescu	i'm so fucking excited about this eulora release...	[12:49]
jurov	okay, but be sure to implement faster deposits :>	[12:54]
nubbins`	mircea_popescu hey who knows, maybe there'll be an osx build some time this summer	[12:56]
mircea_popescu	nubbins` cool, that way you can play too :D	[12:56]
nubbins`	instead of just mousing around the login screen with no kbd input :D	[12:56]
mircea_popescu	:D	[12:57]
mircea_popescu	https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=umeS2PWcRU0 << this guy.	[12:58]
assbot	Manole Stroici - Și pe tine or să te doară... - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1CP3nOP )	[12:58]
mircea_popescu	moldavian count. famous pop singer of the 20s. after which, took up clay pigeon shooting, and became world champion 4ever.	[12:59]
danielpbarron	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=25-03-2015#1069675 << ---[ end Kernel panic - not syncing: VFS: Unable to mount root fs on unknown-block(0,0)	[13:01]
assbot	Logged on 25-03-2015 04:13:16; asciilifeform: (it croaks, having no meaningful rootfs, but that's for tomorrow)	[13:01]
danielpbarron	on a related note, i'd like more specific info on how to make my own u-boot	[13:01]
danielpbarron	i'm not sure what asciilifeform recommends for this	[13:02]
danielpbarron	my adulterated pogo behaves strangly, sometimes it uses stock u-boot and sometimes it uses some thing i flashed to it, and i'm not sure why it changes	[13:02]
nubbins`	let me find you a link	[13:03]
nubbins`	http://blog.qnology.com/2014/07/hacking-pogoplug-v4-series-4-and-mobile.html	[13:03]
assbot	Qui's techNOLOGY Blog: Hacking the Pogoplug v4 (Series 4 and Mobile) with Linux (Debian or Arch)	[13:03]
nubbins`	that covers flashing nand with u-boot	[13:03]
nubbins`	not quite roll-your-own, but...	[13:04]
danielpbarron	yeah no, i mean how to make my own u-boot	[13:04]
danielpbarron	that's the one i'm probably using already	[13:04]
nubbins`	http://forum.doozan.com/read.php?3,12381	[13:05]
assbot	2014.07 U-Boot for FDT and Non-FDT Kernel - GoFlexNet, GoFlexHome, PogoE02, Dockstar, iConnect, NetgearStora, PogoV4/Mobile, Sheevaplug, NSA325, NSA320 ... ( http://bit.ly/1CP4myD )	[13:05]
nubbins`	see "references" section	[13:05]
danielpbarron	...failed updating 1 target... << this happens when i use the prepatched 0.5.3.1, the looky loo outputs correct paths	[13:05]
nubbins`	in http://forum.doozan.com/read.php?3,14697	[13:05]
assbot	Kirkwood U-boot - Getting all supported Kirkwoods on-board ... ( http://bit.ly/1CP4nT7 )	[13:05]
nubbins`	danielpbarron at the risk of being silly, does db_cxx.h exist in /home/dpb/pogo/bitcoind/static.7th/ourlibs/include	[13:06]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6000 @ 0.00022567 = 1.354 BTC [+]	[13:06]
danielpbarron	no	[13:08]
nubbins`	okay, so that's why that step can't find it :D	[13:08]
danielpbarron	i see boost and openssl	[13:08]
nubbins`	working backwards, next step is to modify auto.sh	[13:08]
danielpbarron	i guess that means db isn't finishing	[13:09]
nubbins`	comment out everything in auto.sh but the chunk where it builds bdb	[13:09]
nubbins`	then run it, see what errors it throws	[13:09]
danielpbarron	oh weird, it does exist in there when i try with the prepatched 0.5.3.1	[13:10]
*	CheckDavid has quit (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)	[13:10]
danielpbarron	http://danielpbarron.com/auto-static-v0_0_5-x86_32.txt << refresh	[13:11]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1CP5hit )	[13:11]
danielpbarron	this is output when i use the 0.5.3.1 release and the patched for 32 auto.sh	[13:11]
nubbins`	still failed 1 target above	[13:13]
nubbins`	try this: http://pastebin.com/raw.php?i=Ph1KJm0W	[13:13]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1CP5uSK )	[13:13]
danielpbarron	ok wow	[13:13]
nubbins`	save that as autobdb.sh	[13:13]
nubbins`	chmod 0755 autobdb.sh	[13:13]
nubbins`	./autobdb.sh	[13:13]
danielpbarron	i think my laptop has a 64 bit cpu	[13:13]
nubbins`	how much ram?	[13:13]
danielpbarron	3 gigs + 2 gigs swap	[13:14]
nubbins`	haha actually sorry, the pastebin i linked above has 1 error	[13:14]
nubbins`	s/osx/unix/ in line 6	[13:15]
danielpbarron	so i'm the dummy that didn't realize he had a 64 bit cpu and put 32 bit OS on it	[13:15]
nubbins`	try that and paste the result	[13:15]
nubbins`	fwiw if you've got 3gb ram i guess it doesn't really matter	[13:15]
mircea_popescu	danielpbarron don't worry, you also put 64 bit on the 32 bit arm.	[13:17]
nubbins`	heh	[13:18]
mircea_popescu	(also, 32 bit os should work on 64 bit hardware, compatibility mode)	[13:18]
nubbins`	i have no arms, and i must flail	[13:18]
mircea_popescu	!b 5	[13:18]
assbot	Last 5 lines bashed and pending review. ( http://dpaste.com/1ZQY1ZC.txt )	[13:18]
mircea_popescu	!b 8	[13:19]
assbot	Last 8 lines bashed and pending review. ( http://dpaste.com/2ACFJRA.txt )	[13:19]
mircea_popescu	whatevs.	[13:19]
danielpbarron	dpb@iscah ~/bitcoin/bitcoin-v0_5_3_1 $ ./autobdb.sh	[13:19]
danielpbarron	Found 'db-4.8.30', skipping...	[13:19]
nubbins`	o.O	[13:19]
ben_vulpes	you'll see that if you run ./auto.sh more than once, non?	[13:20]
nubbins`	comment out if/else/fi	[13:20]
danielpbarron	this is a different one than the one that didn't have the db_cxx.h	[13:20]
danielpbarron	oh, should i run it from scratch?	[13:20]
danielpbarron	(which is what i have been doing up until this point)	[13:20]
nubbins`	naw	[13:20]
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nubbins`	it does make clean	[13:21]
nubbins`	<+danielpbarron> this is a different one than the one that didn't have the db_cxx.h <<< ah	[13:21]
nubbins`	maybe you should start from scratch just so we can stay focused	[13:21]
nubbins`	it'll be a bit of a pain, but if you can comment out your auto.sh so that it only builds one component	[13:22]
thestringpuller	danielpbarron: i've done the same thing tho. i only had access to 32bit windows for my gaming rig, and i have to wipe the entire thing to install a 64bit version.	[13:22]
nubbins`	then comment out that one, uncomment the next, etc	[13:22]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11552 @ 0.00022637 = 2.615 BTC [+] {2}	[13:22]
nubbins`	it'll be easier to spot which builds fail	[13:22]
danielpbarron	it seems to find all three of openss, boosts, and db	[13:23]
danielpbarron	or um, yeah lemme do from scratch	[13:23]
nubbins`	yeah, find is one thing, build properly is another	[13:23]
thestringpuller	so we are building axes and swords today? :D	[13:23]
ben_vulpes	maces and bludgeons	[13:24]
nubbins`	just wetting the stones	[13:25]
ben_vulpes	heh yeah	[13:25]
ben_vulpes	swinging sticks at each other in the muddy courtyard	[13:25]
*	OneNomos (~OneNomos@pool-71-163-237-248.washdc.east.verizon.net) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[13:25]
nubbins`	hey, the best swordsmaster who ever lived was bested by a farmer with a quarterstaff	[13:26]
nubbins`	^ rabbit hole if anyone's into reading dead trees	[13:27]
mircea_popescu	ca multi lorzi de vita veche din indepartatul nord...	[13:27]
mircea_popescu	lordul john e-ntr-o ureche...	[13:27]
nubbins`	there's no beef in the north	[13:28]
nubbins`	just polar bear	[13:29]
mircea_popescu	vit,a aka lineage, kin	[13:29]
danielpbarron	on the openssl part, it ends with this: Makefile:640: recipe for target 'install_docs' failed	[13:29]
mircea_popescu	https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ge0WaPvECPw << there, sung.	[13:30]
assbot	Pasarea Colibri - Lordul John - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1BqRAAT )	[13:30]
nubbins`	while docs generally aren't crucial, i wonder if that stops some later process from happening	[13:30]
danielpbarron	oh also, should i be using the patched for 32 auto.sh if my cpu is 64 but my OS is 32 ?	[13:31]
nubbins`	match the os	[13:31]
mircea_popescu	actually... maybe try 16 bit something ?	[13:31]
mircea_popescu	protected mode ?	[13:31]
nubbins`	if you try running a 64bit program on a 32bit os, you're gonna be sad	[13:31]
mircea_popescu	they don't run	[13:32]
nubbins`	^ :D	[13:32]
mircea_popescu	inb4 danielpbarron accidentally builds ai	[13:32]
danielpbarron	in my "ourlibs" directory, it looks like there are only doc files	[13:32]
nubbins`	"y u no valid memory address"	[13:32]
danielpbarron	so i think it isn't finishing	[13:32]
nubbins`	ourlibs is where things get put as they're compiled	[13:33]
nubbins`	if you're only doing the first step, ourlibs won't be fully populated	[13:33]
nubbins`	does ourlibs/include exist?	[13:34]
danielpbarron	no	[13:35]
danielpbarron	only ourlibs/ssl/man	[13:35]
danielpbarron	looks like db built fine	[13:37]
nubbins`	here's the Makefile from openssl	[13:37]
nubbins`	install: all install_docs install_sw	[13:37]
nubbins`	you could remove install_docs from that line if you wanted	[13:38]
nubbins`	might be easier than figuring out why the docs won't install	[13:38]
nubbins`	failure of install_docs might preclude attempt at install_sw	[13:42]
nubbins`	(who in the fuck installs the docs /first/?)	[13:42]
nubbins`	bbl	[13:42]
mircea_popescu	nubbins` installs the dix first!	[14:00]
*	Xuthus has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)	[14:01]
mircea_popescu	fun fact : zog Ist was king of...	[14:02]
mircea_popescu	albania.	[14:02]
*	assbot gives voice to punkman	[14:17]
punkman	http://blog.samaltman.com/bubble-talk "This bet is open to the first VC who would like to take it . The loser donates $100,000 to a charity of the winner’s choice." meh	[14:17]
assbot	Bubble talk - Sam Altman	[14:17]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20650 @ 0.0002306 = 4.7619 BTC [+] {3}	[14:22]
*	Xuthus (~x@unaffiliated/xuthus) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[14:33]
*	ascii_field (~ascii_fie@66-162-3-25.static.twtelecom.net) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[14:37]
asciilifeform	!up ascii_field	[14:39]
*	assbot gives voice to ascii_field	[14:39]
ascii_field	danielpbarron: i'd like more specific info on how to make my own u-boot << i have a u-boot built from official source. the buildroot thing -also- builds a u-boot, as a matter of course, but i have not yet tested that one	[14:40]
ascii_field	ben_vulpes: no, nodes don't get updated << so, let's go into this in detail. they ship with all the seed ips they will ever have? for the record i proclaim this to be retarded. -keys- are the constants of our world, not ip addrs	[14:42]
ascii_field	i utterly understand the desire to 'tivoize' these things so they don't get turned into phoundation nodes by lamers. but this can be done without idiot waste.	[14:43]
ascii_field	once the twentybux boxes run out (and i expect that it will happen sooner rather than later) prepare to pay six times more for each node.	[14:43]
ascii_field	right now some bezzlatronic idiot is paying the difference	[14:44]
ascii_field	(the vendor is selling a loss-leader, hoping to attract chumps to its 5/mo. 'cloud' crapolade)	[14:44]
nubbins`	i think a lot of it is genuinely overstock too	[14:45]
ascii_field	likewise physical delivery is expensive. (witness kakobrekla's attempt to buy so much as one pogo and still have it 'feel disposable')	[14:45]
ascii_field	nubbins`: this also.	[14:45]
nubbins`	physical delivery, for me, bottoms out at ~$10usd	[14:45]
nubbins`	whether i buy 3 or 50	[14:45]
ascii_field	so, what, we're expecting operators to throw out perfectly good boxes to add a fucking seed node!?!	[14:46]
ascii_field	turning an ip address into a critical constant in a field-deployed machine paints a big fat target on that ip for usg	[14:46]
ascii_field	one of the few things usg is reliably good at is making a particular ip unusable	[14:46]
ascii_field	or emplacing own turd there	[14:47]
nubbins`	my ip address will be fine to use as a seed node, but it /may occasionally change/	[14:47]
ascii_field	nubbins`: there you go	[14:47]
ascii_field	hardcoded seeds - idiocy	[14:47]
nubbins`	and is thus useless for inclusion in a baked-in	[14:47]
ascii_field	there is no other side to this	[14:47]
nubbins`	now, i can gpg-sign my ip address and publish it somewhere when it changes	[14:47]
nubbins`	in fact, i can almost certainly have this process be automatic	[14:47]
ascii_field	nubbins`: this means gpg on the nodes	[14:48]
ascii_field	and updatatron	[14:48]
ascii_field	and mircea_popescu will say 'bah, unreliable, you're driving up engineering cost 1000 times'	[14:48]
nubbins`	gpg and curl, at the very least	[14:48]
ascii_field	i suggested this, yes	[14:48]
ascii_field	well, not curl	[14:48]
nubbins`	where's the seed list now, in a fucking .c file or something?	[14:48]
nubbins`	w/e it may be	[14:48]
ascii_field	can't rely on anything on the net staying put	[14:48]
ascii_field	SIGNED update would have to be on attached storage	[14:49]
ascii_field	plug in a card, if passes sig - used	[14:49]
*	assbot gives voice to mthreat	[14:49]
nubbins`	updated seed list on sd card?	[14:49]
mthreat	back in sudamerica	[14:49]
nubbins`	the list'll be stale by the time someone gets a box	[14:49]
mthreat	after the land of chipotle	[14:49]
ascii_field	nubbins`: updated whatever	[14:49]
ascii_field	seeds, bitcoind image, hell, whole rom	[14:50]
ascii_field	but -signed-	[14:50]
nubbins`	nod	[14:50]
ascii_field	and button must be held.	[14:50]
ascii_field	no automagic-anything.	[14:50]
nubbins`	there's gotta be a sane way to do this over the wire	[14:50]
ascii_field	user must consciously insist on update	[14:50]
ascii_field	nubbins`: silent wire updates are ipso facto insane	[14:51]
nubbins`	altho otw explicitly means you're not examining anything	[14:51]
nubbins`	"aha" 8)	[14:51]
ascii_field	user is free to examine the (signed) update on his own time	[14:51]
ascii_field	before firing it	[14:51]
ascii_field	(or not)	[14:51]
nubbins`	so this is all agreed, anything that can be modified should be signed	[14:52]
ascii_field	not proposing anything idiotic, e.g., it being ciphered in some way	[14:52]
nubbins`	this brings us back to the seeds	[14:52]
ascii_field	nubbins`: i am trying to knock some sense into the folks taking the 'no updates, throw'em out every time' folks	[14:52]
ascii_field	(who don't appear to be logged in at present, but, still)	[14:52]
nubbins`	hm	[14:53]
ascii_field	e.g., http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=25-03-2015#1069917	[14:54]
assbot	Logged on 25-03-2015 05:08:35; mircea_popescu: serviceable 19 dollar units ? gtfo.	[14:54]
*	gabridome_ has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)	[14:54]
ascii_field	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=25-03-2015#1069927	[14:54]
assbot	Logged on 25-03-2015 05:10:32; mircea_popescu: forget it, you want to upgrade get a new unit.	[14:54]
nubbins`	this is all fine and well	[14:55]
nubbins`	until you hardcode a thousand seed ips	[14:55]
nubbins`	and a week later they're all dead in the water	[14:55]
ascii_field	aha.	[14:55]
ascii_field	this is where the enemy excels	[14:55]
nubbins`	and there's you with half a blockchain	[14:55]
ascii_field	except they won't be dead, they'll be hosting phoundation syblics	[14:56]
ascii_field	*sybils	[14:56]
nubbins`	ha, there you go	[14:56]
ascii_field	and i disagree with mircea_popescu's hypothesis that 'enemy is stupid'. he is not stupid. he is being slow, so as to show off his sprezzatura.	[14:57]
nubbins`	this is getting dangerously closer to bringing the whole seed thing back to first principles, you know	[14:57]
ascii_field	give or take a few months, enemy starts to bark up the vaguely-correct tree.	[14:57]
nubbins`	hm	[14:58]
ascii_field	nubbins`: ultimately the first principle is that pubkeys are the only valid locators for anything purporting to be human	[14:58]
ben_vulpes	i'm reading, asciilifeform	[14:58]
ascii_field	ben_vulpes: aha, there you are.	[14:59]
ben_vulpes	you'll note, not arguing.	[14:59]
ascii_field	good, ben_vulpes is thinking	[14:59]
ascii_field	ben_vulpes: don't hurry, think.	[14:59]
ben_vulpes	it seems you object to 2 things	[14:59]
ben_vulpes	i may be wrong and stupid, but i'm willing to be corrected and learn	[15:00]
ben_vulpes	1) hardcoding of seeds by enemy	[15:00]
ben_vulpes	2) using enemy's keys	[15:00]
ascii_field	ben_vulpes: wai wat?!!	[15:00]
ascii_field	i was objecting to hardcoding of seeds -by us-	[15:00]
ben_vulpes	aha	[15:00]
nubbins`	what sort of handshake happens when you find a live ip in the seed list	[15:01]
ascii_field	warning that if we bake machines with unchangeable ip constants, this paints a fat blinking target on them	[15:01]
ascii_field	for usg	[15:01]
ascii_field	the only valid constant is keys.	[15:01]
nubbins`	you can't locate someone with a key	[15:02]
ben_vulpes	so if i might be forgiven for conflating things, should not any subset of the wot graph be able to use their own keys?	[15:02]
ascii_field	ben_vulpes: use their own keys for what ?	[15:02]
ben_vulpes	signing updates to seed list.	[15:02]
ascii_field	this is where you gotta make the call re: how much centralization you want.	[15:03]
ben_vulpes	if we're to entertain updating, operators must be able to update without foundation keys.	[15:03]
ascii_field	and where mircea_popescu wakes up and says 'now the machine is 1000x more complex, needs to know what wot is'	[15:03]
ben_vulpes	alternatively, with arbitrary keys.	[15:03]
ascii_field	meaning no key at all ?	[15:04]
nubbins`	suppose you get a box and then start suspecting we've been turned.	[15:04]
ben_vulpes	perhaps must be supplied with keys on initial flash	[15:04]
ascii_field	to tivo or not to tivo, that is the question	[15:04]
nubbins`	now you're stuck with a box with OUR keys being the arbiter	[15:04]
ascii_field	why would someone buy a box from therealbitcoin when he suspects we've been turned ?	[15:04]
nubbins`	s/when/before/	[15:04]
ascii_field	i'm fine with him having to buy a new box -then-	[15:05]
ben_vulpes	i thought boxes were user-flashed!	[15:05]
nubbins`	aha!	[15:05]
nubbins`	:D	[15:05]
nubbins`	let him buy a banana cream pi or w/e	[15:05]
ascii_field	ben_vulpes: user-flashed possibly, from vendor state, but not into a configuration that is reflashable in the same idiot (remote exploit) way	[15:05]
nubbins`	fuck it, get it to scan a random /16 for .foundation nodes on first boot	[15:07]
nubbins`	sure, it'll take a couple days humming before it starts getting blocks	[15:07]
nubbins`	BUT W/E	[15:07]
nubbins`	;p	[15:07]
ben_vulpes	lol y not	[15:08]
ascii_field	scan a random /16 for .foundation nodes << wai wat	[15:08]
ascii_field	how do you propose to distinguish friend/foe ?	[15:08]
ben_vulpes	there is no friend/foe	[15:08]
ascii_field	we have no mechanism for this	[15:08]
ben_vulpes	there are just nodes on the network	[15:08]
ascii_field	ben_vulpes: he use the phrase '.foundation nodes'	[15:08]
ascii_field	implies that these can be told apart from others	[15:09]
ascii_field	by machine	[15:09]
ben_vulpes	and it'll remain that way until the block download thing is fixed to a) track node quality and b) spot-check blocks provided by high quality peers	[15:09]
nubbins`	you can't have visible to users but invisible to usg	[15:09]
*	assbot removes voice from ascii_field	[15:09]
nubbins`	just can't	[15:09]
nubbins`	!up ascii_field	[15:09]
*	assbot gives voice to ascii_field	[15:09]
asciilifeform	!up ascii_field	[15:09]
*	assbot gives voice to ascii_field	[15:09]
nubbins`	anyway, consider the statement suitably modified	[15:10]
ascii_field	ultimately the only proper box is one where the only magical constant is an rsa key, and same key is also prominently burned into the chassis	[15:10]
nubbins`	i'm sure we all have at least a reasonably narrow range of IPs that'll be assigned to our nodes, even if they're dynamic	[15:10]
ascii_field	nubbins`: i don't	[15:10]
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nubbins`	o!	[15:10]
ascii_field	this is a very bad assumption	[15:11]
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ascii_field	my isp is a mega-conglomerate which owns and uses multiple slash-eights	[15:11]
ben_vulpes	and shouldn't this discussion be looking at ipv6 as well?	[15:11]
nubbins`	lel, total country bumpkins here re: ip blocks obv 8)	[15:12]
ascii_field	ben_vulpes: i recommend strongly against ipv6 in this machine	[15:12]
ascii_field	multiple known bugs revolving around mostly untested ipv6 crud	[15:12]
*	ben_vulpes is a total country bumpkin re: anything combudder	[15:12]
ascii_field	i recall at least one that concerns marvell in particular	[15:12]
ascii_field	i don't even have ipv6 enabled on my lan, much less outgoing.	[15:12]
ascii_field	even if nothing else, complicates reading packet dumps	[15:13]
ascii_field	which any reasonable person does regularly	[15:13]
ascii_field	to see what lives in his home	[15:13]
ascii_field	at the risk of pissing off many, i will still say, screw ipv6	[15:13]
nubbins`	hm	[15:15]
nubbins`	just thinking out loud here	[15:15]
ascii_field	i ban ipv6 in my home.	[15:15]
nubbins`	hardcode DNS servers and fill the seed list w/ hostnames instead of ips	[15:16]
ascii_field	100% usg	[15:17]
ascii_field	usg has real time iron control over all of dns.	[15:17]
ascii_field	to a first approximation.	[15:17]
ascii_field	this is right back to phoundation's idiocies.	[15:17]
nubbins`	well i'm not running a namecoin node	[15:17]
ascii_field	nubbins`: don't need to (and same problems apply to it)	[15:17]
ascii_field	the only way to cut usg-controlled apparatus entirely out of the loop is to have the node get all volatiles (e.g., ip addrs) from files, on inserable media, -signed- by burned-in and prominently-advertised key.	[15:18]
nubbins`	how many ips (or live ips, if you prefer) in current seed list?	[15:19]
nubbins`	i think this is on the ml somewhere..	[15:19]
ascii_field	yeah i posted it.	[15:19]
ascii_field	http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/2015-February/000043.html	[15:19]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1Cb2bDD )	[15:19]
ascii_field	http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/2015-February/000044.html	[15:20]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1Cb2bU9 )	[15:20]
ascii_field	http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/2015-February/000046.html	[15:20]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1AoqAY2 )	[15:20]
ascii_field	^ that was all i think	[15:20]
nubbins`	six?	[15:20]
mod6	you rang?	[15:21]
nubbins`	heh.	[15:21]
jurov	if seedlist is to be signed, then it can download it automatically, no?	[15:21]
nubbins`	so according to this, six live seeds would ostensibly be enough to bootstrap with	[15:21]
ascii_field	until they're shot	[15:21]
nubbins`	right.	[15:22]
nubbins`	then those six are useless	[15:22]
ascii_field	the only reason they are alive (and are they? i checked a good while ago) is that no one cared.	[15:22]
nubbins`	in the meantime, we've been using a different six since we sent out the first X units	[15:22]
nubbins`	cat-and-mouse	[15:22]
nubbins`	brb	[15:22]
ascii_field	there will be considerably less cat'n'mouse if enemy -knows- that there can be no effect from chewing on the mice	[15:23]
ascii_field	and the only way this could be so is if there are no magic hardcoded ips.	[15:23]
ascii_field	you can't ddos an rsa key	[15:23]
ascii_field	or have it administratively forced to rout to ft meade	[15:24]
ascii_field	*route	[15:24]
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*	ben_vulpes thinks more	[15:30]
*	kushed is now known as Kushed	[15:33]
jurov	!mpif	[15:36]
assbot	BtcAlpha.com F.MPIF Tracker estimated NAV per share: 0.00021375 B (Total: 467.44 B). Delta: 0.31 B. Last trade for F.MPIF on MPEX was at 0.000207 BTC [+]	[15:36]
jurov	!t m f.mpif	[15:36]
assbot	[MPEX:F.MPIF] 1D: 0 / 0 / 0 (0 shares, 0 BTC), 7D: / / ( shares, BTC), 30D: 0.000207 / 0.000207 / 0.000207 (1000 shares, 0.21 BTC)	[15:36]
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asciilifeform	!up ascii_field	[15:42]
*	assbot gives voice to ascii_field	[15:42]
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nubbins`	ascii_field so what's the path from rsa key -> seed node	[15:52]
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ascii_field	nubbins`: i proposed a very simple one	[15:52]
nubbins`	maybe i'm being obtuse :S	[15:52]
ascii_field	nubbins`: node ships with no seeds. even without bitcoind binary. user inserts a storage unit on which he has placed a therealbitcoin-signed tarball. this gets eaten up.	[15:53]
ascii_field	repeat as necessary.	[15:53]
ascii_field	(and user presses button, yes)	[15:53]
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nubbins`	a a a.	[15:53]
nubbins`	i gotcha	[15:54]
ben_vulpes	seeds included in tarball?	[15:54]
nubbins`	heh.	[15:54]
ascii_field	ben_vulpes: aha	[15:56]
nubbins`	any seed list made public by any means is a target	[15:57]
nubbins`	us cloaked ones forget about ddos lurkers in here	[15:57]
ascii_field	nubbins`: yes. but -how attractive- a target, will depend on how much damage can be done to our cause by shooting at it	[15:57]
ascii_field	hence the sheer lunacy of unchangeable ips anywhere	[15:57]
nubbins`	at this rate you're gonna have to get in the wot before someone tells you a seed ip	[15:58]
*	nubbins` blinks twice	[15:58]
ascii_field	nubbins`: bitcoin doesn't run on secret ips	[15:59]
ascii_field	that's a road to lameness	[15:59]
ascii_field	but there is a reasonably sane solution that doesn't involve secrecy	[15:59]
ascii_field	but simply 'we can move these at zero cost to us and ours if we want to, so don't bother shooting at them'	[15:59]
*	nubbins` gestures appropriately	[16:02]
nubbins`	foundation could publish a list of trusted seeds each month w/ state of the union	[16:03]
nubbins`	i don't know	[16:03]
ascii_field	why not.	[16:03]
nubbins`	also woot, 2x raspi & 2x pogo just showed up	[16:03]
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nubbins`	seed list is in a source file?	[16:03]
nubbins`	or txt	[16:04]
ascii_field	txt	[16:04]
nubbins`	beaut	[16:04]
nubbins`	monthly seed list updates	[16:04]
nubbins`	separate tarball	[16:04]
nubbins`	unit comes w/ instructions for use, that includes grabbing both the bitcoind tarball and a seed list tarball of choice	[16:04]
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ascii_field	try to see, i don't suggest hosting therealbitcoin mega-seeds on dynamic ip consumer boxes	[16:05]
ascii_field	but on solid pipes somewhere, ideally	[16:05]
ascii_field	the movability is like nukes, shouldn't ever have to be -used- - with any regularity	[16:05]
nubbins`	nod	[16:05]
ascii_field	it must be there to remind the enemy of his helplessness	[16:05]
*	[KS] has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)	[16:06]
nubbins`	so the switch from phoundation seeds to foundation seeds must happen after said pipes are tapped	[16:07]
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ascii_field	phoundation - usg	[16:09]
ascii_field	foundation - therealbitcoin	[16:09]
nubbins`	nod	[16:10]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5115 @ 0.00023349 = 1.1943 BTC [+]	[16:10]
nubbins`	i try to use .foundation when they're not both in the same sentence 8)	[16:11]
*	assbot removes voice from ascii_field	[16:12]
asciilifeform	!up ascii_field	[16:12]
*	assbot gives voice to ascii_field	[16:12]
nubbins`	http://imgur.com/aIuCFrx	[16:12]
assbot	Imgur ... ( http://bit.ly/1BMu0OZ )	[16:12]
nubbins`	gonna try the SD-for-block-storage route on one of these	[16:13]
ascii_field	these are sata-less variant ?	[16:13]
nubbins`	nod	[16:13]
ascii_field	aha	[16:13]
nubbins`	still haven't found a reasonable purple-logo unit source for canada	[16:13]
nubbins`	although i suppose i'm sort of being an asshole by saying $28usd isn't reasonable	[16:13]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14850 @ 0.00023234 = 3.4502 BTC [-]	[16:29]
danielpbarron	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=25-03-2015#1069704 << it does have an "eject" button on the back next to the USB3 ports	[16:32]
assbot	Logged on 25-03-2015 04:18:28; asciilifeform: nubbins`: pogo4 has no buttons	[16:32]
nubbins`	yeah we determined that after	[16:32]
nubbins`	both had to check units iirc	[16:32]
ascii_field	danielpbarron: at first i though that the rear button was a cpu reset line	[16:32]
ascii_field	*thought	[16:32]
*	assbot removes voice from ascii_field	[16:43]
asciilifeform	!up ascii_field	[16:43]
*	assbot gives voice to ascii_field	[16:43]
mircea_popescu	this one's for nubbins` http://i.imgur.com/QblQ8cO.gifv	[16:58]
assbot	Old dog tricking puppy, so cute. ... ( http://bit.ly/1budlut )	[16:58]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6700 @ 0.000232 = 1.5544 BTC [-] {2}	[16:58]
mircea_popescu	http://log1.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=25-03-2015#1070789 << check it out, altman is poor.	[17:00]
assbot	Logged on 25-03-2015 17:13:12; punkman: http://blog.samaltman.com/bubble-talk "This bet is open to the first VC who would like to take it . The loser donates $100,000 to a charity of the winner’s choice." meh	[17:00]
mircea_popescu	what's with the charity bs and what's with the sub million bs. is this the new jersey memorial golf circuit ?	[17:01]
mircea_popescu	(for poor people reading : "donating to a charity" = tax deduction = you didn't actually spend anything. because say my company has made 1mn revenue this year, and my tax accountant is bs so i have to pay like 120k in tax. if i donate 100k to a charity and pay 30k ish im all done. so therefore - whether i lose this bet or not decides whether i write a check to x or to y, not whether i write the check at all.	[17:03]
mircea_popescu	"donation to charity" is what rich people do to make poor people think something happened.)	[17:03]
mircea_popescu	and dealing in sub-million units is really like proposing to settle differences by wager of battle, "except let's use styrofoam weapons". totally dude, rad.	[17:04]
ascii_field	for extra mega-b0nus, the 'charity' is run by phriendz/childrenz/catamites of the 'donor'	[17:04]
mircea_popescu	in his case, for sure.	[17:05]
mircea_popescu	considering how the entire subculture is composed of nothing but "transhumanists"	[17:05]
mircea_popescu	where the fuck is that kid.	[17:05]
mircea_popescu	such a great picture he had	[17:05]
ascii_field	cishumanists	[17:05]
thestringpuller	ascii_field made a south parkian joke!	[17:06]
ascii_field	wai wat	[17:06]
thestringpuller	ascii_field: so russian d00d works on implmentations team. he was in the break room and we go up to him to ask him random question about rapper or something, and he's like "I don't have time for this shit. Are you paying me to answer this question?"	[17:06]
*	ascii_field would likely demand pay to answer such a question	[17:07]
mircea_popescu	omfg where is turkenest head	[17:07]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 300 @ 0.00349371 = 1.0481 BTC [-]	[17:09]
danielpbarron	http://i0.wp.com/hplusmagazine.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/Screen-Shot-2015-03-12-at-10.58.28-AM.png?fit=300%2C300	[17:09]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1bufy9p )	[17:09]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14750 @ 0.00022722 = 3.3515 BTC [-] {2}	[17:10]
nubbins`	heh	[17:11]
mircea_popescu	jerm la haine! found him!	[17:11]
mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=20-03-2015#1059325	[17:11]
assbot	Logged on 20-03-2015 04:12:53; mircea_popescu: "Jerm La Haine: I’ve been doing music production and graphic design for just under twenty years now."	[17:11]
nubbins`	20 years o.O	[17:12]
nubbins`	what makes me think this guy is 25	[17:12]
mircea_popescu	http://i0.wp.com/hplusmagazine.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/Screen-Shot-2015-03-12-at-10.58.28-AM.png?resize=302%2C439 << jerm! la haine!	[17:12]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1bug5rO )	[17:12]
mircea_popescu	ah tyvm danielpbarron lol	[17:13]
*	danielpbarron is following him on twitter	[17:13]
mircea_popescu	i was digging	[17:13]
mircea_popescu	since then or b4 ?	[17:13]
danielpbarron	i should have labeled it	[17:13]
danielpbarron	since then	[17:13]
mircea_popescu	lol shock trooper	[17:13]
*	assbot removes voice from ascii_field	[17:13]
danielpbarron	he claimed to not know who whoever someone here compared him to	[17:13]
danielpbarron	jaronlanier	[17:14]
mircea_popescu	and to round up the "sam altman is poor" thing : yes, he actually is.	[17:14]
mircea_popescu	leah goodman poor, which is to say he gets a few 100s of discretionary tspending a week and gets to - at the lord's pleasure - inhabit a decent mancave. for now.	[17:15]
mircea_popescu	but that's it.	[17:15]
nubbins`	i forgot about her	[17:15]
nubbins`	(tm)	[17:15]
mircea_popescu	and it his isn't poverty, i guess i'm just privileged.	[17:15]
*	OneNomos (~OneNomos@pool-71-163-237-248.washdc.east.verizon.net) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[17:15]
mircea_popescu	nubbins` the ugly but aging sex in the city aspirationalist that "found satoshi's identity". then ascii_field thought she was rich then she wasn't.	[17:16]
mircea_popescu	if you b-a her name it's all in there because she's one of those (unfamous, anon irrelevant people that appear suddenly and on one topic. as opposed to say lenin.)	[17:16]
asciilifeform	!up ascii_field	[17:16]
*	assbot gives voice to ascii_field	[17:16]
*	ascii_field has a possibly different imagination of 'rich' than mircea_popescu	[17:16]
mircea_popescu	you know, stupid people sleep ad libitum by the definition of those terms.	[17:17]
ascii_field	mircea_popescu: do they? or does the dependapotomus and its six screaming offspring wake'em	[17:17]
ascii_field	or the roommatez	[17:17]
ascii_field	or the roaches and bedbugs	[17:17]
nubbins`	i generally wake the roommates, not the other way around 8)	[17:17]
mircea_popescu	anyway im gonna be briefly afk	[17:19]
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*	OneNomos (~OneNomos@pool-71-163-237-248.washdc.east.verizon.net) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[17:21]
fluffypony	Romania: Internet vs. Roads - http://i.imgur.com/XHw8GLw.jpg	[17:21]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1BMCtl9 )	[17:21]
punkman	http://theuserisdrunk.com/	[17:23]
assbot	The User is Drunk ... ( http://bit.ly/1BMCFRp )	[17:23]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5800 @ 0.00023317 = 1.3524 BTC [+]	[17:23]
punkman	" Is this your only job? No. I have a full time job changing the world."	[17:24]
punkman	http://jpleary.tumblr.com/post/113925136153/keywords-for-the-age-of-austerity-16-flexibility	[17:25]
assbot	Keywords for the Age of Austerity 16: Flexibility ... ( http://bit.ly/1BMCJRf )	[17:25]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16931 @ 0.00022409 = 3.7941 BTC [-]	[17:25]
*	hegemoOn (~plonky@shell.netmonk.org) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[17:26]
trinque	punkman: hah I just quoted that part myself	[17:28]
trinque	what a toolbag	[17:28]
trinque	punkman: this is his "changing the world" https://www.ideapod.com/	[17:29]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1BMDcTD )	[17:29]
trinque	looks like uh... twitter social thing, part 2352580238	[17:29]
punkman	https://www.ideapod.com/idea/55129ac7aed1543322f7ea2f	[17:30]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1BMDlGt )	[17:30]
trinque	"I've always felt as if my brain was always wired for a short circuit or at least in a way that wasn't too appealing for anyone else but me.	[17:31]
trinque	Ideapod has given me courage to share my insights with its delightful community and made me realise that the problem wasn't my personal content, but my personal context. "	[17:31]
trinque	ahahahah	[17:31]
ascii_field	waiwat	[17:31]
trinque	yep given the right spotlight, any hag becomes irresistable	[17:31]
trinque	that's what I just learned	[17:32]
trinque	get enough of those together and "progress concentrate" starts to form, which can be bottled and sold at Whole Foods	[17:32]
ascii_field	menstruade (TM)	[17:33]
nubbins`	batorade (tm)	[17:33]
trinque	bahaha, either works	[17:34]
trinque	o look a poem https://www.ideapod.com/idea/54c70f5477656217dcfc0400	[17:34]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1BME62c )	[17:34]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9946 @ 0.00023349 = 2.3223 BTC [+]	[17:36]
*	Xuthus has quit (Quit: Xuthus)	[17:44]
*	assbot removes voice from ascii_field	[17:47]
asciilifeform	!up ascii_field	[17:47]
*	assbot gives voice to ascii_field	[17:47]
nubbins`	http://imgur.com/gC3AHbA	[17:51]
assbot	My copy machine was programmed not to completely copy money - Imgur ... ( http://bit.ly/1BMFsu2 )	[17:51]
ascii_field	'my targeting computer was programmed not to fire at usg'	[17:52]
ascii_field	anybody recall the gps-boobytrapped cnc mills thread	[17:53]
ascii_field	?	[17:53]
ascii_field	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=09-01-2014#439853	[17:55]
assbot	Logged on 09-01-2014 02:38:52; asciilifeform: http://www.practicalmachinist.com/vb/dmg-mori-gildemeister-maho-cnc/mori-ellison-gyroscope-unlocking-273841/	[17:55]
ascii_field	'We as a company own all of the machines. There is no outstanding balance and we've already had the tech come out to unlock them. Due to some business changes, we want to move the machines around the shop floor to reconfigure our machining cell however as we've done more research, we've found that there is a small board in the electrical panel of the machine that houses a gyroscope so that if the machine is moved/tilted,	[17:56]
ascii_field	it will lock out the machine.'	[17:56]
ascii_field	^ vintage thread. but reposted for the record	[17:56]
ascii_field	this is what usg-mandated code looks like.	[17:56]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 75438 @ 0.000236 = 17.8034 BTC [+] {6}	[18:02]
nubbins`	i recall that	[18:04]
*	punkman1 (~punkman@unaffiliated/punkman) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[18:08]
*	punkman has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)	[18:11]
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*	assbot removes voice from ascii_field	[18:17]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15826 @ 0.00025392 = 4.0185 BTC [+]	[18:19]
thestringpuller	!up ascii_field	[18:21]
*	assbot gives voice to ascii_field	[18:21]
nubbins`	!s turdel	[18:24]
assbot	2 results for 'turdel' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=turdel	[18:24]
jurov	Romania: Internet vs. Roads << slovakia the same	[18:24]
mircea_popescu	fluffypony yup. pretty much exactly.	[18:26]
mircea_popescu	The User is Drunk ... << why not go all the way and admit it. "the user is stupid, therefore worthless. so am i. please pay me money because worthless idiots are people too. HUMAN RIGHTS ARE IRREVERSIBLE!!11"	[18:28]
mircea_popescu	https://plasso.co/richard.littauer@gmail.com << genius. let's use emails as urls.	[18:29]
assbot	Pay: Richard Littauer ... ( http://bit.ly/18Y6Puq )	[18:29]
mircea_popescu	trinque oddly that thing doesn't load any content for me. either im not drunk enough or you broke it.	[18:30]
mircea_popescu	nubbins`> batorade (tm) << secreted by the batshit insane ?	[18:30]
nubbins`	it still rhymes with gatorade!	[18:31]
trinque	mircea_popescu: you're not missing anything	[18:31]
mircea_popescu	anyway, the "Copy machine money" : this is a sad necessity. if it weren't present, muppets WOULD "try it", and discover "it works", and srsly financial collapse. for real.	[18:31]
trinque	the great canon pixma revolution of 2018	[18:32]
ascii_field	mircea_popescu: they did try, and result could only fool a muppet	[18:32]
mircea_popescu	which is 90% of people engaged in commerce.	[18:32]
ascii_field	and it takes some actual work to bleach a 1usd note to get anything like plausible paper for benjie	[18:32]
mircea_popescu	check it out, bitcointalk scams fooled tons of "early adopters", "world changers" etc.	[18:33]
ascii_field	different game. 'they wanted to believe'	[18:33]
mircea_popescu	ascii_field im talking money cut out of a fucking notebook.	[18:33]
mircea_popescu	so do these ?	[18:33]
mircea_popescu	exactly same game.	[18:33]
mircea_popescu	where's that video.	[18:33]
mircea_popescu	;;google christina applegate buys a car with kellog's cornflakes cutoutsd.	[18:35]
gribble	No matches found.	[18:35]
ascii_field	(phun phact for non-u.s. folks: all u.s. dollar notes have exactly the same physical dimensions.)	[18:35]
mircea_popescu	yeah, well, google... that just means you're useless.	[18:35]
*	smidge has quit (Quit: sorry, but you've mistaken me for someone who gives a fuck...)	[18:41]
mircea_popescu	ascii_field i don't get it. who would "buy" such a thing ?	[18:43]
mircea_popescu	we're not talking 100 bucks for a piece of plastic here.	[18:43]
ascii_field	wai wat	[18:43]
ascii_field	buy what	[18:43]
mircea_popescu	'We as a company own all of the machines. There is no outstanding balance and we've already had the tech come out to unlock them."	[18:43]
ascii_field	aha, as in 'who would buy a boeing' ?	[18:44]
mircea_popescu	"a company, not a person - or in other words nobody"	[18:44]
mircea_popescu	gotta love the systematic nature of stupid.	[18:44]
ascii_field	i thought mircea_popescu was asking why a firm would purchase rather than lease the machines	[18:44]
mircea_popescu	they paid them, it's not a lease anymore.	[18:45]
ascii_field	aha	[18:45]
*	ascii_field thought that mircea_popescu was asking why the machines are offered for purchase rather than, as often happens with such equipment, for lease	[18:45]
trinque	should've sued instead of just thanking the tech for restoring access to their property	[18:45]
ascii_field	trinque: you 'agree' when you buy	[18:46]
ascii_field	to the crapolade	[18:46]
mircea_popescu	trinque im thinking the same, this is something readily resolved in court.	[18:46]
mircea_popescu	ascii_field you agree never to move it ?	[18:46]
mircea_popescu	why ?	[18:46]
ascii_field	you agree to pay $$$$$ to move	[18:46]
ascii_field	because usg inspectors	[18:46]
*	mircea_popescu is unfamiliar with the field.	[18:47]
mircea_popescu	what's being inspected specifically ?	[18:47]
ascii_field	location	[18:47]
mircea_popescu	http://log1.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=25-03-2015#1070794 << the SEEDS. nodes constantly discover their own peers. starting from a seed list.	[18:47]
assbot	Logged on 25-03-2015 17:37:53; ascii_field: ben_vulpes: no, nodes don't get updated << so, let's go into this in detail. they ship with all the seed ips they will ever have? for the record i proclaim this to be retarded. -keys- are the constants of our world, not ip addrs	[18:47]
trinque	how hard would it be to break the accelerometer?	[18:47]
mircea_popescu	trinque it probably stops working.	[18:47]
nubbins`	gzip: turdel.gz: not in gzip format	[18:47]
mircea_popescu	ascii_field what about it ?	[18:47]
ascii_field	nubbins`: it sure as fuck is a gzip	[18:47]
ascii_field	wget it	[18:47]
ascii_field	don't use browser	[18:48]
ascii_field	(they often unzip)	[18:48]
nubbins`	o.	[18:48]
trinque	mircea_popescu: someone should have a business doing aftermarket mods on these	[18:48]
nubbins`	totally what i did. sec.	[18:48]
nubbins`	(and til!)	[18:48]
ascii_field	mircea_popescu: what about it << it being in a usg-blessed region	[18:48]
mircea_popescu	http://log1.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=25-03-2015#1070795 << there's no such thing desired or even possible. understand : the scam foundation is stupid because it is actually stupid, not because me or you or god said it should be deemed as stupid.	[18:48]
assbot	Logged on 25-03-2015 17:39:09; ascii_field: i utterly understand the desire to 'tivoize' these things so they don't get turned into phoundation nodes by lamers. but this can be done without idiot waste.	[18:48]
mircea_popescu	actual hardware is useless for their purposes	[18:48]
mircea_popescu	they need imaginary hardware to support their imaginary "technologies"	[18:48]
ascii_field	^ my puny brain does not get the meaning of this	[18:48]
ascii_field	imaginary hardware ?	[18:49]
mircea_popescu	yes.	[18:49]
ascii_field	as in vapourware ?	[18:49]
mircea_popescu	usgavin's been on a kick about this imaginary hardware that will run his 200 trillion jiggabit nodes.	[18:49]
mircea_popescu	because you know, "it quadruples every two weeks"	[18:49]
mircea_popescu	what's the pogo gonna do ?	[18:49]
ascii_field	neh from my perch it looks like they're gearing up for an elementary meat war of conventional nodes	[18:49]
mircea_popescu	that's what they think they're doing.	[18:50]
mircea_popescu	understand : they can stand on their fucking head. "vote" ? what fucking vote ?	[18:50]
mircea_popescu	heck, i'll vote WITH them on the voting stage of things	[18:50]
mircea_popescu	still rape them once the switch happens.	[18:50]
mircea_popescu	this is not a discussion of anything but the hard laws.	[18:50]
mircea_popescu	or w/e hanbot called it	[18:50]
*	gernika has quit (Quit: WeeChat 0.4.2)	[18:50]
trinque	hm	[18:51]
mircea_popescu	so : yeah, usg&friends thinks it's engaging me on its own terms.	[18:51]
mircea_popescu	and it has been doing this, for years now.	[18:51]
trinque	is it just a matter of preserving the existing chain?	[18:51]
trinque	not "winning" in the sense of a fork?	[18:51]
mircea_popescu	it does not work. might as well grab the moon with a tweezer	[18:51]
trinque	because they become incompatible, then go off to eventually die?	[18:51]
nubbins`	ascii_field oh wait this is just a blob, isn't it?	[18:51]
mircea_popescu	"i wonder why that doesn't work, the allignm,ent was perfect!"	[18:51]
*	hegemoOn (~plonky@shell.netmonk.org) has left #bitcoin-assets	[18:51]
ascii_field	nubbins`: it's just a demo kernel for pogo	[18:51]
mircea_popescu	trinque it autowins the fork.	[18:51]
nubbins`	nod	[18:51]
ascii_field	nubbins`: armv5 binary. nothing earth-shaking	[18:52]
*	assbot removes voice from ascii_field	[18:52]
mircea_popescu	!up ascii_field	[18:52]
-assbot-	You voiced ascii_field for 30 minutes.	[18:52]
*	assbot gives voice to ascii_field	[18:52]
nubbins`	brainfarted and thought you mentioned smth about a uboot being in there	[18:52]
ascii_field	nubbins`: -also- built u-boot	[18:52]
ascii_field	but not posted	[18:52]
nubbins`	aha! :D	[18:52]
ascii_field	and in case anyone needs to be reminded, please don't use downloaded binaries for anything serious	[18:53]
nubbins`	i was about to flash the nand when i recalled a nebulous something about this	[18:53]
mircea_popescu	ascii_field dja get my meaning here ?	[18:53]
ascii_field	mircea_popescu: if i understand, the meaning is that there is no phoundation node ?	[18:53]
ascii_field	this still doesn't give us a license to be retarded when making these	[18:53]
mircea_popescu	there can not be a power ranger node that can run on a pogo.	[18:53]
mircea_popescu	think about it. 20mb blocks ? srsly ?	[18:53]
mircea_popescu	no, itdoesn't give us a license to be retarded.	[18:54]
thestringpuller	20mb is only the limit!	[18:54]
ascii_field	actually, i can see them trying to convert'em to 0.10 or what it was	[18:54]
thestringpuller	the blocks will be much smaller	[18:54]
ascii_field	just to maintain relevance for selves	[18:54]
thestringpuller	until then!	[18:54]
ascii_field	and keep us off the stage	[18:54]
mircea_popescu	but if you imagine there's any room in the spec of this thing for the end user to fiddle with it you're ourgiht nuts.	[18:54]
mircea_popescu	fire and forget.	[18:54]
mircea_popescu	only way.	[18:54]
*	thestringpuller says other pseudo arguments	[18:54]
ascii_field	hardcoded seeds are retarded	[18:54]
ascii_field	i stand by this	[18:54]
trinque	mircea_popescu: yeah thought in the shower today that giving an easy way to dump other code into the thing later was a terrible idea	[18:54]
trinque	all the thing has to do is hold the line	[18:54]
ascii_field	they -will- be ddosed and sinkholed to usg machines.	[18:54]
ascii_field	guaranteed.	[18:54]
mircea_popescu	trinque it.costs.20.bux.to.get.one.	[18:55]
trinque	yeap	[18:55]
mircea_popescu	wtf people. srsly. if anyone WANTS TO run a pogo they can	[18:55]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14500 @ 0.00025269 = 3.664 BTC [-]	[18:55]
mircea_popescu	they can run fucking madonna videos on it	[18:55]
mircea_popescu	k ?	[18:55]
ascii_field	mircea_popescu: 20bux + a man with a suitcase to bring it to you, if you're in ar	[18:55]
mircea_popescu	we are solving third world problems now ?	[18:55]
ascii_field	and that's while the 20bux machines last.	[18:55]
mircea_popescu	fuck the third world with a spiked club. if it wasn't made by retards it wouldn't be third.	[18:55]
ascii_field	mircea_popescu: if we're so non-thirdworld, where's my ic fab ?	[18:56]
mircea_popescu	these are different problems omg.	[18:56]
mircea_popescu	the mexican billionaire w/e his name is has his own ic fab made out of driewd cunt juice./	[18:56]
ascii_field	fact is, 101st or 202nd pogo, whichever, will cost $maxint.	[18:56]
mircea_popescu	so ?	[18:56]
ascii_field	so we're thirdworld. or we wouldn't be playing junkyard wars.	[18:56]
ascii_field	or do i misunderstand the term	[18:57]
thestringpuller	how is this anything like junk yard wars?	[18:57]
ascii_field	thestringpuller: we're repurposing obsolete hardware	[18:57]
ascii_field	rather than fabbing single-chip node	[18:57]
ascii_field	from ore	[18:57]
trinque	an AK is a great gun	[18:57]
ascii_field	!s izhevsk	[18:57]
assbot	4 results for 'izhevsk' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=izhevsk	[18:57]
ascii_field	^ mandatory	[18:58]
mircea_popescu	i think you misunderstand the term.	[18:58]
ascii_field	hm?	[18:58]
mircea_popescu	but anyway : forget argentina, and forget the anecdotal peculiarities of my odd choices in things.	[18:58]
thestringpuller	ascii_field: this seems more like battlebots than junkyard wars. (Junkyard wars reminds me more of ed edd and eddie which was pretty much all junkyard hacking"	[18:59]
mircea_popescu	this is a consumer product, it works like a consumer product. once it stops working it gets thrown out.	[18:59]
mircea_popescu	it is not an item to be loved, dreamed about, repaired, tuned etc.	[18:59]
ascii_field	mircea_popescu: i get this. but we're dealing with a fundamental case of amplification attack.	[18:59]
mircea_popescu	specifically ?	[18:59]
ascii_field	enemy can cost us K by spending J, where J is close to nil and K is positive	[19:00]
mircea_popescu	sp.eci.fi.cally!!111	[19:00]
ascii_field	they ddos the magic ips - or worse, silently redirect to own boxes	[19:00]
ascii_field	and we have to parachute new units ?	[19:00]
mircea_popescu	yes.	[19:00]
ascii_field	i say this is retarded	[19:00]
mircea_popescu	for the cost of this project, i wish to see large scale ip diddling	[19:00]
mircea_popescu	i totally wish to see it.	[19:00]
mircea_popescu	heck, ima make a blog post about it.	[19:00]
ascii_field	just for mircea_popescu's pleasure they will do straight sinkhole	[19:01]
ascii_field	instead of diddlage	[19:01]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5400 @ 0.00025269 = 1.3645 BTC [-]	[19:01]
mircea_popescu	and this won't be all over the internets, either.	[19:01]
mircea_popescu	dja see how the fucking attacked ips are actually more valuable than the damned pogos ?	[19:01]
ascii_field	at any rate, -we won't know- that it's pointing to usg boxes emulating our nodes	[19:01]
mircea_popescu	right.	[19:01]
ascii_field	there is no mechanism for distinguishing a correctly operating node from one that will be until day X	[19:02]
mircea_popescu	overengineering is like cocaine.	[19:02]
ascii_field	the fucking attacked ips are actually more valuable than the damned pogos << they are not valuable because we can never prove they exist	[19:02]
ascii_field	even to our own satisfaction	[19:02]
mircea_popescu	...	[19:02]
ascii_field	i'll spell it out:	[19:03]
mircea_popescu	because they only exist halfway, like competent usg and able nsa ?	[19:03]
ascii_field	1) we deploy boxes with magic ips	[19:03]
ascii_field	2) usg redirects them to exact copies of our own boxes sitting in ft meade	[19:03]
ascii_field	3) ages pass and we notice nothing. they switch theirs off when ours go off, etc. direct mitm	[19:03]
mircea_popescu	orly.	[19:03]
mircea_popescu	no measurable latency of this	[19:03]
ascii_field	4) on day X they turn on the mitm diddlamatic and do... something	[19:03]
ascii_field	5) ???	[19:03]
ascii_field	6) profit	[19:03]
mircea_popescu	what fucking profit lol.	[19:04]
ascii_field	ask'em not me	[19:04]
mircea_popescu	ft meade gets to look like a kiddy pool i took a piss in	[19:04]
mircea_popescu	total profit.	[19:04]
nubbins`	so deploy them with magic ips and "check here monthly for updated seed list, the walls have eyes, sam is in the trees, etc"	[19:04]
mircea_popescu	wron side of the scoreboard, but sure, profit.	[19:04]
mircea_popescu	nubbins` that's a concentration of the problem.	[19:04]
mircea_popescu	now you have a "here"	[19:04]
nubbins`	the original seed list is a "here"	[19:04]
ascii_field	precisely why i didn't say 'network update'	[19:04]
mircea_popescu	right but you're adding a narrower version.	[19:05]
nubbins`	(and there, and there, and there...)	[19:05]
ascii_field	i said 'will eat update signed by key'	[19:05]
ascii_field	the key in mircea_popescu's ring, or wherever	[19:05]
mircea_popescu	ascii_field if you're so absolutely convinced, how about seedlist is a config file sits with blockchain on disk ?	[19:05]
trinque	ascii_field: that's what I proposed	[19:05]
ascii_field	aha	[19:05]
ascii_field	that was what i asked for	[19:05]
trinque	an address sending transactions which indicate hashes of updates	[19:05]
trinque	of the seedlist, whatever	[19:05]
trinque	and yeah, then somebody is a point of failure	[19:05]
mircea_popescu	ascii_field seemed to me you're asking for an entirely something erlse, but anyway	[19:06]
mircea_popescu	iirc you were asking for a complex update gpg signature thing. not for a simple "move x text file from /sda to /sdb"	[19:06]
nubbins`	<+mircea_popescu> right but you're adding a narrower version. << so "check the usual places monthly", w/e	[19:07]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16171 @ 0.00024929 = 4.0313 BTC [-] {2}	[19:08]
mircea_popescu	nubbins` if it's not narrower just make it the seed list. bam back to square one.	[19:08]
mircea_popescu	you're trying to jump a fence by crawling on your back.	[19:08]
*	nubbins` shakes head	[19:08]
trinque	what if the seed list was encoded directly as transactions?	[19:09]
nubbins`	monthly state of bitcoin address, "check out these sweet seed ips"	[19:09]
trinque	trusted after some large number of confirmations	[19:09]
trinque	nubbins`: yeha.	[19:09]
nubbins`	"feel free to update the seed list that came w/ your device"	[19:09]
nubbins`	"it's been signed by us and our pubkeys shipped with your device"	[19:09]
trinque	I'm not even saying that	[19:09]
mircea_popescu	motherfucker.	[19:09]
nubbins`	THEN you only need to worry about the NSA intercepting the shipments.	[19:09]
trinque	encode IPs into outputs or something	[19:10]
mircea_popescu	build a cnc mill in every pogo, be done with it.	[19:10]
mircea_popescu	they could make dildos while brushing gf's teeth.	[19:10]
nubbins`	<+trinque> what if the seed list was encoded directly as transactions? <<< how you gonna get those transactions?	[19:11]
mircea_popescu	by infinite power.	[19:11]
*	mircea_popescu passes out "you suck at system design" dounce hats liberally.	[19:11]
trinque	eh ok	[19:12]
*	nubbins` sighs	[19:12]
trinque	obviously the thing has to connect to something first	[19:12]
trinque	if you wanted it to connect to other somethings later, either the natural way or some means of signaling	[19:12]
nubbins`	i'm suggesting shipping them with a hardcoded seed list just like you are	[19:12]
trinque	if you can't trust a txn that's very old, uh	[19:12]
trinque	bitcoin doesn't work	[19:12]
mircea_popescu	nubbins` do you mind ? i'm being mean over here.	[19:12]
nubbins`	i'm just also saying that /new seeds can be published in the future by the .foundation, if they want to/	[19:12]
*	nubbins` tips table over	[19:13]
mircea_popescu	was that a laser tip or an artisanal tip ?	[19:13]
nubbins`	mushroom tip	[19:13]
mircea_popescu	jus' the tip!	[19:13]
nubbins`	's all that fits	[19:13]
mircea_popescu	(im kinda nonplussed that nobody even seems to realise seed list is only interesting on boot and these aren't intended to ever reboot, really.)	[19:14]
trinque	comcast will eventually go out	[19:15]
mircea_popescu	boot. not network outage.	[19:15]
mircea_popescu	how often does your 1.8 watt thing drain the ups ?	[19:15]
trinque	if they're consumer turds no ups	[19:15]
nubbins`	once every whoops i unplugged it	[19:15]
trinque	"fucking around behind the TV"	[19:15]
mircea_popescu	nubbins` onoes, you ruined 20 bux worht of old gear (plus shipping and handling!)	[19:15]
mircea_popescu	buy two plug them in diff bedrooms.	[19:16]
mircea_popescu	this is hopw the problem is solved in this space : buy more units.	[19:16]
mircea_popescu	i guess nobody ever played zerg hm ?	[19:17]
mircea_popescu	"dude that zergling's broken" "mmkay" "aren't you going to repair it ?" "wut ?! click click click click click"	[19:17]
nubbins`	nobody's gonna pay ten cents for something that breaks if you turn it off	[19:17]
mircea_popescu	it breaks if you turn it off && fort meade floats in the air above your house.	[19:18]
nubbins`	ha.	[19:18]
mircea_popescu	also known as, not a single seed ip remains.	[19:18]
trinque	anyhow I think any remote control of any kind is bad, mkay	[19:18]
trinque	but if they need some kind of signaling, signaling by blockchain is probably the safest	[19:19]
trinque	not "we trust this pastebin" or w/e	[19:19]
trinque	even gpg signed	[19:19]
mircea_popescu	in general. not when you're signalling how to get the blockchain.	[19:19]
*	trinque goes to find the length of the longest-ever fork	[19:20]
trinque	rather, fork which was abandoned	[19:20]
mircea_popescu	in any case, the "this thing breaks if it runs out of power at any point after the enemy (or more likely plain old rust) has destroyedall seed ips" proposition is better value than	[19:20]
mircea_popescu	"this thing breaks iof there's a bug found in gpg. or if we didn't implement signature checking correctly. or or or or"	[19:20]
nubbins`	trinque for all you know i forked the blockchain 2 years ago and am still shuffling my forked coins	[19:20]
mircea_popescu	trinque not an answerable q.	[19:20]
mircea_popescu	(and before anyone goes "how could we implement signature checking incorrectly", this was discussed mere days ago. === "no errors found" or what was it)	[19:21]
trinque	nubbins`: you can declare you've spent my coin? and others will be able to verify this?	[19:22]
*	assbot removes voice from ascii_field	[19:22]
mircea_popescu	!up ascii_field	[19:22]
-assbot-	You voiced ascii_field for 30 minutes.	[19:22]
*	assbot gives voice to ascii_field	[19:22]
mircea_popescu	trinque they can be empty blocks, still a fork.	[19:22]
nubbins`	trinque that's not what you were looking for 8)	[19:23]
nubbins`	mircea_popescu so are you proposing that all pogos ever sent out will contain 0.5.3.1 or w/e current release is when the first one goes out?	[19:23]
mircea_popescu	nope.	[19:23]
nubbins`	then it's sort of a self-solving problem	[19:23]
mircea_popescu	i propose whoever makes one puts w/e the fuck they want in there and that's that for the damned unit in question	[19:23]
mircea_popescu	and if you want to change, derp. change the production flux.	[19:23]
mircea_popescu	you know, like industry works since fortever. not like ford mondeo got recalled because hey, they got ford fluence out, so they'll conver them	[19:24]
nubbins`	obviously if the foundation is still producing new releases, it's going to be maintaining a seed list for that release, rather than just continuing to let the dead nodes build up	[19:24]
mircea_popescu	ok.	[19:24]
nubbins`	so if anyone particularly feels like they don't want their out of date unit to be so	[19:24]
nubbins`	they're 100% welcome to grab the latest foundation release, because obv it'll still work	[19:25]
nubbins`	it's just off-label usage as far as we're concerned.	[19:25]
nubbins`	ascii_field ^^ ?	[19:26]
danielpbarron	i know "time isn't really money" but however long it takes to upgrade one of these things is probably enough time to earn more than 20 USD working at McDonalds	[19:26]
mircea_popescu	danielpbarron the (actually sound) argument is that they won't be 20 forever, we're eating up a bubble of externalised cost.	[19:26]
jurov	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=25-03-2015#1071312 why, yes, this has been done: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Countries_blocking_access_to_The_Pirate_Bay	[19:26]
assbot	Logged on 25-03-2015 21:56:26; mircea_popescu: i totally wish to see it.	[19:26]
assbot	Countries blocking access to The Pirate Bay - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ... ( http://bit.ly/1Nhf4PC )	[19:26]
trinque	heh!	[19:27]
mircea_popescu	jurov i am not seeing it can not be done.	[19:27]
mircea_popescu	i am seeing i wish to see it done, for us.	[19:27]
mircea_popescu	s/seeing/saying/	[19:27]
jurov	lolk	[19:27]
jurov	i see, it actually helped thepirateby immensely	[19:29]
*	Pierre_Rochard (~Pierre@unaffiliated/pierre-rochard/x-3593157) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[19:29]
mircea_popescu	they ARE making political parties and getting various lawmaker seats because of it.	[19:29]
*	assbot gives voice to Pierre_Rochard	[19:29]
jurov	and alf will finally get his dreamed out gasenwagen too	[19:29]
mircea_popescu	well he wanted to meet o'brien.	[19:30]
ascii_field	was in meeting	[19:33]
ascii_field	bak	[19:33]
danielpbarron	https://youtu.be/f-6UwDP23s4?t=1m46s	[19:34]
assbot	Seinfeld - George Hates the Jews - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1NhfXaR )	[19:34]
*	brendafdez (~brendafde@unaffiliated/brendafdez) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[19:34]
trinque	beat the thing one more time... publishing say a magnet link from a known address to an address or addresses representing a bittorrent magnet link seems a fine way to be able to trust shuffling bits out to nodes if that were wanted	[19:34]
ascii_field	aarrgh	[19:34]
mircea_popescu	lawl.	[19:35]
trinque	pub/priv-key encrypt either works or doesn't, sha256 either works or doesn't	[19:35]
ascii_field	trinque: mircea_popescu was alluding to protocol finesse	[19:35]
ascii_field	rather than cryptobreak	[19:35]
ascii_field	as in, e.g., the 'der' idiocy	[19:35]
mircea_popescu	it's just more hard work to read the shit. which is work. which we don't fucking hasve the time for.	[19:35]
mircea_popescu	let's do only the things that are useful.	[19:35]
*	assbot gives voice to brendafdez	[19:36]
trinque	mircea_popescu: 100% granted, that is a fine reason not to do it	[19:36]
mircea_popescu	i'm in no case saying that w/e, any one in b-a couldn't correctly implement what alf is proposing./	[19:36]
mircea_popescu	i am however saying that no one here can implement it in zero time.	[19:36]
*	ascii_field can probably implement it in less time than building linux 3.18 took	[19:37]
mircea_popescu	wouldja stop ?! omai gawd.	[19:37]
*	ascii_field wishes to ask mircea_popescu for a favourite tarball of gpg, signed	[19:37]
mircea_popescu	dude keeps exposing himself to these cardano by xmas type of things. why all the self hate yo!	[19:37]
ascii_field	http://xkcd.com/1425 << obligatory	[19:38]
assbot	xkcd: Tasks ... ( http://bit.ly/1CZveh0 )	[19:38]
brendafdez	;;later tell BingoBoingo it doesn't like me. says too many redirects. links says same. http://i.imgur.com/P5BZM7y.png	[19:38]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1CZvgFv )	[19:38]
gribble	The operation succeeded.	[19:38]
mircea_popescu	just forget it, srsly. seed list can live on hdd with blockchain if the notion of hardcoded magic ip numbers makes you retch	[19:38]
mircea_popescu	that's a completely sufficient solution here, lettuce move on.	[19:38]
*	felipelalli has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)	[19:39]
*	ascii_field will build rootfs tonight	[19:39]
ascii_field	for pogo/linux	[19:40]
ascii_field	if anyone has notions of what cmdline utils ought to be included - please say.	[19:40]
ascii_field	brb, car.	[19:40]
*	ascii_field has quit (Remote host closed the connection)	[19:40]
danielpbarron	tail	[19:40]
danielpbarron	ps	[19:40]
danielpbarron	top	[19:40]
trinque	danielpbarron: that's all in busybox iirc	[19:41]
danielpbarron	grep	[19:41]
trinque	maybe not top, dunno	[19:41]
trinque	neh top is	[19:41]
trinque	danielpbarron: http://www.busybox.net/downloads/BusyBox.html	[19:41]
assbot	BusyBox - The Swiss Army Knife of Embedded Linux ... ( http://bit.ly/1NhgLfO )	[19:41]
danielpbarron	top might not be needed; i'm just listing the things I use on a regular basis on pogo	[19:42]
danielpbarron	i use top to watch for when bitcoind is done throwing a tantrum	[19:42]
danielpbarron	oh, sshd	[19:43]
trinque	if they're fire and forget anything that needs an open port is an attack vector	[19:43]
danielpbarron	in that case, none of what i just listed is needed	[19:44]
*	mogreen has quit (Quit: http://quassel-irc.org - Chat comfortably. Anywhere.)	[19:45]
trinque	the disposable RTS unit thing rings true	[19:45]
trinque	the guy who buys this either can service, can buy a new one, or fuck off.. there's no support staff	[19:46]
danielpbarron	if the thing ascii is making will not sshd, anyone who wishes to help test will need to "adulterate" their pogo	[19:46]
*	trinque has simply read too much loper os, the blockchain telegraphy one in particular	[19:46]
jurov	did you solve the clock, does it need time sync at all?	[19:50]
trinque	bwah hah ha	[19:51]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8950 @ 0.00023389 = 2.0933 BTC [-]	[19:55]
trinque	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=27-01-2015#993360	[19:57]
assbot	Logged on 27-01-2015 01:58:25; asciilifeform: ^ above code will have to be changed to actually set the machine clock ?	[19:57]
trinque	^ relevant perhaps, found via googling, heh! not via logs.b-a search	[19:58]
*	CheckDavid (uid14990@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-tlbljdtrvjmidhbd) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[19:59]
*	mixdio has quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)	[20:01]
trinque	!up CheckDavid	[20:01]
*	assbot gives voice to CheckDavid	[20:01]
*	hanbot has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)	[20:04]
*	mixdio (~quassel@quassel.woboq.com) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[20:04]
trinque	!up mixdio	[20:06]
*	assbot gives voice to mixdio	[20:06]
nubbins`	<+danielpbarron> if the thing ascii is making will not sshd, anyone who wishes to help test will need to "adulterate" their pogo <<< plz to sshd!	[20:06]
trinque	if you give a mouse an sshd he's going to want his pubkey added	[20:07]
danielpbarron	it sounds like a very hard thing to do if you've never soldered before, but think of it as a good excuse to learn a new skill	[20:07]
danielpbarron	and it's not /so/ hard	[20:07]
nubbins`	i'm not soldering anything into more than one unit	[20:07]
danielpbarron	you only need one	[20:07]
nubbins`	wait, test, heh	[20:08]
trinque	my VPS has something attacking it at the moment, lol	[20:08]
mircea_popescu	brendafdez try now.	[20:08]
trinque	really wants to ssh in	[20:08]
nubbins`	anyway for the sake of popping it in there, keep sshd	[20:09]
brendafdez	mircea_popescu it works now. Anyway the IP I'm on now is one of a public AP, it shouldnt be whitelisted. I'll later give you my home IP, and BingoBoingo has my VPS IP already. I didn't know you were filtering.	[20:10]
BingoBoingo	The insanity would really be not filtering	[20:10]
*	brendafdez has quit (Remote host closed the connection)	[20:11]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 18380 @ 0.00024063 = 4.4228 BTC [+] {2}	[20:14]
mod6	<+danielpbarron> top << instead of this heavy weight bs, vmstat	[20:15]
*	mod6 has never liked top much	[20:16]
trinque	seems irrelevant, if you're in, you can already install stuff	[20:17]
mircea_popescu	did you solve the clock, does it need time sync at all? << REAL CLOCKS KEEP THEIR OWN TIME!	[20:20]
danielpbarron	trinque> really wants to ssh in << me too	[20:20]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 21200 @ 0.0002424 = 5.1389 BTC [+] {2}	[20:20]
trinque	danielpbarron: nah I was talking about a bot attacking my VPS	[20:21]
danielpbarron	yeah me too	[20:21]
trinque	oh lol	[20:21]
trinque	hah I stopped getting hit when I mentioned it here	[20:25]
mod6	does anyone know where I might be able to get a gentoo vm?	[20:25]
mircea_popescu	http://log1.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=25-03-2015#1070848 << lawl	[20:25]
assbot	Logged on 25-03-2015 17:48:05; ascii_field: (who don't appear to be logged in at present, but, still)	[20:25]
mod6	digitalocean has ubuntu/freebsd/fedora/debian/coreos/centos	[20:26]
trinque	mod6: I've got gentoo up on ec2	[20:26]
mircea_popescu	http://log1.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=25-03-2015#1070912 << this bit of nubbsy wisdom is perhaps the pivot for understanding what's to understand in this pogo debate.	[20:28]
assbot	Logged on 25-03-2015 18:04:25; ben_vulpes: there is no friend/foe	[20:28]
mircea_popescu	there literally is no enemy. there can't be. bitcoin is agnostic in this sense.	[20:28]
mircea_popescu	the only option agents have is whether to exist or not exist.	[20:28]
mod6	trinque: ah, ok. thanks. i think i'll try to set up a local one first. my env is x86_64, but maybe vbox will let me run a x86_32 environment	[20:28]
mircea_popescu	there's no lever to toggle from enemy to friend or w/e.	[20:28]
trinque	mod6: https://rich0gentoo.wordpress.com/2012/09/24/gentoo-ec2-tutorial-bootstrapping/ << might be helpful	[20:29]
assbot	Gentoo EC2 Tutorial / Bootstrapping \| Rich0's Gentoo Blog ... ( http://bit.ly/1N9Xcbb )	[20:29]
mod6	thanks	[20:29]
mircea_popescu	http://log1.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=25-03-2015#1070918 << spot-check ?! why spot check. you check.	[20:29]
assbot	Logged on 25-03-2015 18:04:58; ben_vulpes: and it'll remain that way until the block download thing is fixed to a) track node quality and b) spot-check blocks provided by high quality peers	[20:29]
mircea_popescu	http://log1.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=25-03-2015#1070932 << quite. ip6 doesn't exist for this purpose yet.	[20:30]
assbot	Logged on 25-03-2015 18:07:41; ascii_field: ben_vulpes: i recommend strongly against ipv6 in this machine	[20:30]
mod6	is there a preferred version of gentoo that I should test on?	[20:30]
trinque	wow. seriously, entries in auth.log every couple seconds until just now	[20:31]
trinque	IPs from all over china	[20:31]
*	trinque chuckles	[20:31]
*	assbot removes voice from CheckDavid	[20:31]
mod6	danielpbarron: what version of gentoo are you using?	[20:32]
danielpbarron	3.17.8-gentoo-r1	[20:35]
mod6	thanks :]	[20:35]
danielpbarron	trinque, same here	[20:36]
danielpbarron	wtf	[20:36]
*	assbot removes voice from mixdio	[20:36]
mod6	im confused here...	[20:36]
mircea_popescu	pastebin ips ?	[20:37]
trinque	danielpbarron: get ye some fail2ban	[20:37]
trinque	mircea_popescu: yeah I will	[20:37]
trinque	and sign	[20:37]
nubbins`	sorry guise, misconfig on my chinese node botnet	[20:37]
mircea_popescu	well both of you, and compare.	[20:37]
mod6	is it called "stage3"? is this an appropriate iso? http://distfiles.gentoo.org/releases/x86/autobuilds/current-stage3-i686/install-x86-minimal-20150324.iso	[20:37]
danielpbarron	http://danielpbarron.com/sshd-fail.txt	[20:40]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1N9Z9EB )	[20:40]
trinque	danielpbarron: oh yeah, I've got those IPs	[20:41]
trinque	pasting in a sec	[20:41]
*	mircea_popescu idly looks	[20:41]
danielpbarron	someone is also doing the same to another ip address i have	[20:42]
danielpbarron	Blocking 103.41.124.173:4 for >630secs: 40 danger in 4 attacks over 8 seconds	[20:43]
nubbins`	height=200150!	[20:44]
jurov	mod6 stage3 yes	[20:45]
mircea_popescu	http://dpaste.com/18KNR7V << this is how a day of trilema looks like. average, 1-200 derps try.	[20:46]
assbot	dpaste: 18KNR7V ... ( http://bit.ly/1Na0dbo )	[20:46]
jurov	just move the sshd to alternative port (best if it isn't in nmap shortlist)	[20:46]
mod6	thanks jurov	[20:47]
danielpbarron	https://twitter.com/danielpbarron/status/580856115312738304	[20:48]
assbot	Moderator asks audience, "Who here thinks there will be a hard fork missile crisis?" /petertoddbtc raises his hand.	[20:48]
asciilifeform	l0l wat	[20:50]
asciilifeform	trinque: blockchain telegraphy << bootstrap flyer. you don't have a blockchain when the thing powers up	[20:52]
asciilifeform	sshd << i will include 'dropbear' (cut-down sshd used in routers) for the dev build. i don't expect to see it in the battlefield build.	[20:53]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: there literally is no enemy... << this is a tough nut to crack, could use explanation	[20:54]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform recall the ancient discussion re "what if nsa held a bunch of btc" ?	[20:54]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: the only option agents have is whether to exist or not exist << their purpose is to un-exist us.	[20:54]
*	marteen has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)	[20:54]
mircea_popescu	danielpbarron where was this ?	[20:54]
asciilifeform	spot-check ?! why spot check. you check << see latest thread re: tandem	[20:55]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform but there isn't a box in the windoze to input that purpose.	[20:55]
mircea_popescu	that's the big deal here.	[20:55]
asciilifeform	danielpbarron: sshd-fail.txt << a balanced diet of 1) nonstandard port for the demon 2) 'fail2ban' or equivalent 3) just not giving a fuck - works for me	[20:56]
trinque	asciilifeform: the notable part is that attack stopped for both of us when I mentioned it	[20:56]
mircea_popescu	i think you may have a genetic explanation of intelligence there.	[20:57]
asciilifeform	wawat	[20:57]
BingoBoingo	http://qntra.net/2015/03/shavers-enters-not-guilty-plea/	[20:57]
assbot	Shavers Enters Not Guilty Plea \| Qntra.net ... ( http://bit.ly/1Na2CD6 )	[20:57]
mircea_popescu	(me last year, waiting for cab with dude in timisoara. cab kinda late. me : "check it out, i'ma light a cigarette and by the magical magic of smoking, it'll show up immediately.	[20:58]
mircea_popescu	mp lights cigarette, cab turns in immediately, mp is revered as god by the kid in question.)	[20:58]
trinque	danielpbarron: where does it end in your log?	[20:58]
*	asciilifeform routinely refers to umbrella as 'rain eliminator'	[20:58]
asciilifeform	(just as much as the cig is a cab-summoner!)	[20:58]
BingoBoingo	(me last year, waiting for cab with dude in timisoara. cab kinda late. me : "check it out, i'ma light a cigarette and by the magical magic of smoking, it'll show up immediately. << Most well known phenomenon associated with tobacco use	[20:59]
mircea_popescu	correlation of pseudorandom variables is a wonderfuil thing	[20:59]
*	jfdjdjdjdjrejeii (~androirc@c-73-218-118-55.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[21:00]
mircea_popescu	!up jfdjdjdjdjrejeii	[21:01]
-assbot-	You voiced jfdjdjdjdjrejeii for 30 minutes.	[21:01]
*	assbot gives voice to jfdjdjdjdjrejeii	[21:01]
jfdjdjdjdjrejeii	Yo	[21:01]
mircea_popescu	aha.	[21:01]
trinque	notably the thing never tries any username obviously associated with public info about me	[21:01]
mircea_popescu	thanks god for autotab.	[21:01]
trinque	just strange	[21:01]
jfdjdjdjdjrejeii	Aha what	[21:01]
asciilifeform	meowmix ?	[21:02]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9200 @ 0.00023937 = 2.2022 BTC [-] {2}	[21:02]
trinque	probably chinese bots just crawling the internet for hostnames to poke	[21:02]
jfdjdjdjdjrejeii	Meowmix is a cat food	[21:02]
asciilifeform	it is also a bozo who connects from jfdjdjdjdjrejeii's slash24	[21:03]
*	marteen (~martin@190.113.141.247) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[21:04]
mircea_popescu	Mar 09 20:39:38 * HFSPLUS (~Hannspree@c-73-218-118-55.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) has joined #bitcoin-assets Mar 16 18:12:52 * Hannspree23 (~Hannspree@c-73-218-118-55.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) has joined #bitcoin-assets Mar 21 00:25:18 * ponyslaystation (~androirc@c-73-218-118-55.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) has joined #bitcoin-assets Mar 21 00:28:21 * ponyslaystation (~androirc@c-73-218-118-55.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) has joined #bitcoin-ass	[21:05]
mircea_popescu	ets Mar 21 19:48:59 * KatelynT (~KatelynT4@c-73-218-118-55.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) has joined #bitcoin-assets Mar 22 16:33:52 * fhiejeurjjurru (~androirc@c-73-218-118-55.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) has joined #bitcoin-assets Mar 25 21:00:53 * jfdjdjdjdjrejeii (~androirc@c-73-218-118-55.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[21:05]
mircea_popescu	for completeness.	[21:05]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform i dun recall, who was that dude ?	[21:06]
jfdjdjdjdjrejeii	Bsrack obama?	[21:07]
trinque	danielpbarron: http://dpaste.com/3EVB8XP	[21:09]
assbot	dpaste: 3EVB8XP: fuckbag IPs ... ( http://bit.ly/1Na4A6k )	[21:09]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: who was that dude << no idea, my best hypothesis is that he isn't alive at all but a script	[21:09]
nubbins`	jfdjdjdjdjrejeii did you?	[21:09]
jfdjdjdjdjrejeii	Yeah im a troll whatever	[21:10]
mircea_popescu	http://41.media.tumblr.com/4be4d9998c39d363099cc70e5b73b674/tumblr_nlrycyiKM21sgp77yo1_1280.jpg << the ows movement that didn't make it into gawker.	[21:10]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1Na4NGA )	[21:10]
jfdjdjdjdjrejeii	Who has an xbox one?	[21:11]
jfdjdjdjdjrejeii	I kick there ass in cod	[21:11]
trinque	!down jfdjdjdjdjrejeii	[21:11]
*	assbot removes voice from jfdjdjdjdjrejeii	[21:11]
trinque	log shows a connect attempt every 1-2sec until Mar 25 16:33:40 PST	[21:13]
mod6	somehow i dl'd a live cd? o.O	[21:14]
nubbins`	nb	[21:15]
trinque	also PSA, ec2's firewall thing now does outbound rules too	[21:16]
mod6	can anyone direct me to a installable gentoo iso for x86_32	[21:18]
mod6	this is annoying. sorry.	[21:18]
mod6	(non-live cd)	[21:19]
trinque	that's how you install it	[21:19]
trinque	boot the livecd then follow the handbook	[21:19]
mod6	it is?	[21:19]
trinque	yeah	[21:19]
mod6	D:	[21:19]
trinque	it's not that bad	[21:19]
trinque	great way to become acquainted with the internals too	[21:20]
mod6	we shuold just support slackware from floppy disks	[21:20]
trinque	boot cd -> partition drive -> untar stage3 -> build kernel -> set up grub	[21:20]
trinque	with some handwaving along the way	[21:21]
mod6	dear lord	[21:21]
*	felipelalli (~Thunderbi@unaffiliated/felipelalli) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[21:21]
mod6	if i use aws do i get to bypass this bullshit?	[21:21]
trinque	mod6: these guys have their own gentoo AMIs if you trust 'em http://www.dowdandassociates.com/products/gentoo-in-the-cloud/	[21:22]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1Na76JM )	[21:22]
trinque	otherwise those bootstrap instructions are in order	[21:22]
*	jfdjdjdjdjrejeii has quit (Quit: AndroIRC - Android IRC Client ( http://www.androirc.com ))	[21:22]
jurov	mod6 what's the problem with handbook?	[21:23]
mod6	i wanna just work on bitcoin, not learn the in's and out's of gentoo :P	[21:23]
mod6	sigh	[21:23]
mod6	guess i'll give it a whirl. wth.	[21:23]
trinque	>linux	[21:23]
trinque	>i just wanna	[21:24]
trinque	lol	[21:24]
mod6	stab	[21:24]
trinque	:D	[21:24]
nubbins`	http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/cbcasks-debate-is-politics-broken-1.3008834	[21:24]
assbot	#CBCAsks debate: Is politics broken? - Politics - CBC News ... ( http://bit.ly/1Na7tUJ )	[21:24]
nubbins`	heh	[21:24]
mike_c	mod6: helpful? http://www.dowdandassociates.com/products/pygoscelis-papua/	[21:24]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1GoGhQd )	[21:24]
trinque	mike_c: yeh that's the one I linked	[21:24]
jurov	"Starting in January 2015, we will ... cease building the 32-bit images"	[21:25]
mike_c	yeah, but there are still some on there	[21:25]
mike_c	from last november	[21:25]
trinque	https://www.niftiestsoftware.com/2011/09/24/converting-a-virtualbox-vm-to-an-ec2-ami/ << also possible	[21:26]
assbot	Converting a VirtualBox VM to an EC2 AMI \| Niftiest Software ... ( http://bit.ly/1GoGK53 )	[21:26]
*	felipelalli has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)	[21:26]
jurov	mod6 alternatively you can hire someone to configure the system nudge wink	[21:26]
mircea_popescu	argentina is so musically fucking weird omg...	[21:30]
mircea_popescu	they all sing the same song. they all sing the SAME SONG	[21:30]
nubbins`	http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/30ay6u/almost_10_more_full_nodes_since_this_morning/	[21:30]
mircea_popescu	the same song. they sing it. same. song.	[21:30]
assbot	Almost 10% more full nodes since this morning connected to the network. Over 400 more in US. Is there some sort of competition I don't know of ? : Bitcoin ... ( http://bit.ly/1GoHWoX )	[21:30]
nubbins`	heh!	[21:30]
mircea_popescu	yeah, the competition is called "mp said the nodes are the weakest point of bitcoin, bitcoin ppls are fixing it"	[21:31]
asciilifeform	what song ?	[21:32]
*	felipelalli (~Thunderbi@unaffiliated/felipelalli) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[21:33]
mike_c	mircea_popescu: maybe not. could be a much dumber reason. "It's all one node just with 600 addresses. This is what happens when you fucking pay people to sybil attack the network."	[21:33]
mircea_popescu	https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1IOGFENyGJM <<	[21:34]
assbot	"BRASIL DECIME QUE SE SIENTE" CON LETRA HD - "Hit" de los Hinchas Argentinos en Brasil - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1Na9xMA )	[21:34]
mircea_popescu	they change the words. but the song fprever the same. no matter what happens. this is the song.	[21:34]
mircea_popescu	and amusingly they think it's some pop rock of the 70s.	[21:34]
mircea_popescu	mike_c the notion of "counting nodes" is bizarre in the first place.	[21:36]
mircea_popescu	why not count "water taps" while at it.	[21:36]
nubbins`	heh	[21:37]
*	gernika (~awt@unaffiliated/gernika) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[21:37]
mircea_popescu	ie, most infrastructure nodes i know of work on SOME SORT ofload balancing or othewr, necessarily thus exposing variable ips to the world etc.	[21:37]
nubbins`	anyway, only counting 0.8.x and above, that's like giving a population count of every country in the world, but excluding everyone under 5 feet tall.	[21:38]
nubbins`	and also only measuring the head of each household	[21:38]
*	OneNomos has quit (Remote host closed the connection)	[21:39]
mircea_popescu	in other news, http://41.media.tumblr.com/9c8248cf59d3897128ba0917e70e831a/tumblr_njxlug21jx1r3tor7o1_1280.jpg	[21:39]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1GoKxiP )	[21:39]
nubbins`	i didn't know you were a foodie	[21:39]
mike_c	do they give any justification for the version requirement?	[21:40]
mircea_popescu	who they ?	[21:40]
mike_c	this retarded australian	[21:41]
mike_c	and/or the phoundation.	[21:41]
mircea_popescu	dawg... you wanna see comedy look through the foudnation voting thing. what justification ?	[21:42]
nubbins`	'cause there was totally a hard fork duod.	[21:42]
nubbins`	earlier than 0.8 won't work	[21:42]
mircea_popescu	it's a wonder they find the fridge 5 times a week	[21:42]
nubbins`	duod	[21:42]
nubbins`	because changing a config setting in a peripheral piece of software is a fork	[21:43]
nubbins`	(duod)	[21:43]
nubbins`	http://np.reddit.com/r/todayilearned/comments/307ihi/til_that_when_a_cockroach_touches_a_human_it_runs/cpq3jky?context=3	[21:43]
assbot	goosegoosegoosegoose comments on TIL that when a cockroach touches a human it runs to safety to clean itself ... ( http://bit.ly/1GoLqIc )	[21:43]
mike_c	ah, the great accident was around that version.	[21:43]
nubbins`	"My husband pushes me over to the sink and shoves my head under the faucet, trying to flush it out, but every millimeter of space in my ear is full of horrific cockroach. For some reason, he pulls my pajama top off. I still ask him why, but he doesn't know. Either he didn't want my shirt to get wet, or titties."	[21:43]
mod6	ok so what version of stage3 are people using from the mirror? 12.1, 12.0, 11.2... ?	[21:43]
mircea_popescu	nubbins` hey, changing the world right ? like that chick changing they into whey or w/e	[21:43]
mod6	jurov: lol, this is supposed be a "quick" setup and test. didn't think it'd be a three hour tour.	[21:44]
mike_c	so use the ami..	[21:44]
mod6	or have to hire a captain	[21:44]
mike_c	you'll be up in 5 mins.	[21:44]
mod6	yah ok. fts	[21:45]
*	assbot gives voice to marteen	[21:45]
nubbins`	hi marteen	[21:45]
marteen	hi nubbins` :)	[21:45]
nubbins`	qu'est-ce que c'est?	[21:45]
asciilifeform	nubbins`: i guess some folks don't own vacuum pumps ?	[21:46]
mike_c	mircea_popescu: life's too short to read the foundation forum. i flipped the bozo bit on them, no more research required :)	[21:46]
nubbins`	asciilifeform vacuum + ear?!	[21:46]
nubbins`	granted, her eardrum ended up getting shredded anyway.	[21:46]
asciilifeform	nubbins`: not whole ear!	[21:46]
asciilifeform	nubbins`: thin nozzle	[21:46]
nubbins`	ah	[21:46]
nubbins`	just roach ass	[21:46]
nubbins`	i'm sure they had at least a turkey baster	[21:46]
nubbins`	but, y'know. panic.	[21:47]
mircea_popescu	nubbins` that reddit is the most retarded shit i ever read.	[21:47]
nubbins`	mircea_popescu she'll have a series of novels out this year	[21:47]
*	mircea_popescu got bit by viper, chick in group sucked it out the next moment, me was fine.	[21:47]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform exactly.	[21:48]
nubbins`	i've never been bitten by anything more exotic than fire ants	[21:48]
jurov	dunno if you can get any chich to suck out the bug	[21:48]
mircea_popescu	their mouths don't work.	[21:48]
jurov	*chick	[21:48]
mircea_popescu	jurov so the problem suddenly isn't the bug	[21:48]
asciilifeform	^^^^	[21:48]
mircea_popescu	"i'll lick out his asshole but fuck take that bug away from me"	[21:48]
asciilifeform	the problem, if we continue with this valuable train of thought, - is almost never the bug, per se.	[21:49]
asciilifeform	it is always the available suction.	[21:49]
*	trinque got ass-bit by a brown recluse once, didn't bitch as much as the story	[21:49]
trinque	complete with dying flesh	[21:49]
mircea_popescu	notice that the idiots in question cost an emergency call, an er visit plus an emt visit later	[21:49]
mircea_popescu	plus drugs. hours out of the lives of a dozen + people, all supposedly skilled.	[21:49]
mircea_popescu	this is about as sustainable as a tower of liquid piss in the shape of roosevelt's wheelchair.	[21:50]
nubbins`	once, while on vacation, my mom got bitten on the face a couple times by some sort of spider	[21:50]
nubbins`	got all stiff etc	[21:50]
nubbins`	had to go to an AMERICAN HOSPITAL	[21:50]
mircea_popescu	nubbins`> i've never been bitten by anything more exotic than fire ants << for one thing fire ants are more exotic than vipers in carpathians. for the other, i would bet a lot more painful. poor snake's drastically overhyped	[21:51]
mircea_popescu	(so is scorpion, for that matter. most don't kill or anything)	[21:51]
nubbins`	it def didn't tickle	[21:51]
nubbins`	(on jungle walk. woman in front of me says "aah! ants!" then proceeds to try brushing them off WHERE SHE STOOD)	[21:52]
mircea_popescu	europe is particularly mild on this shit. you get stung by the tiny polen wasps that live ther,e it's like... mk.	[21:52]
trinque	they drained quite a bit of death out of my asscheek and thigh	[21:52]
mircea_popescu	get stung by nutso us wasp o may gawd...	[21:52]
trinque	I was drugged to hell, laughing about it	[21:52]
asciilifeform	what's in a wasp, anyway? formic acid ?	[21:52]
BingoBoingo	lol https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=524101.msg5932326#msg5932326	[21:53]
assbot	Kick-off Discussion: Existing Forum Temperature Check + Criticism ... ( http://bit.ly/1GoOfsH )	[21:53]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 24260 @ 0.00024259 = 5.8852 BTC [+]	[21:53]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform depends on the wasp, but not very well known really.	[21:53]
mircea_popescu	"apitoxin" is you know, one of those vinegars peterl analysed.	[21:54]
nubbins`	peptides+enzymes followed by norepinephrine followed by hyaluronidase and MCDP	[21:54]
mircea_popescu	some sort of quinone iirc.	[21:54]
asciilifeform	speaking of vinegars,	[21:55]
asciilifeform	the wine thing	[21:55]
nubbins`	that is to say, enzymes and more enzymes	[21:55]
asciilifeform	i think the 'wine experts' who don't get nailed by the food colouring experiment live in the same place as meta-nsa	[21:55]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform you know this is something that you could pleasantly research ?	[21:55]
asciilifeform	(which is to say, the land of the i-can't-rule-it-out marvels)	[21:55]
mircea_popescu	there's no way they don't have that shit in dc, with all the dumb money floating about. take the girl out for a wine tasting show once	[21:56]
nubbins`	^	[21:56]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: this was famously and publicly done not long ago, but i've misplaced the link	[21:56]
nubbins`	wine tasting shows are hilarious	[21:56]
asciilifeform	that was actually why i remembered.	[21:56]
nubbins`	sommelier friend of mine has worked a few	[21:56]
mircea_popescu	i'm not going to go as far as to say "date a french somellier chick that can actually tell you what you ate after you squirt her palate"	[21:56]
asciilifeform	thing is, i'm not sure if we have 'the genuine article' sort of expert around here	[21:57]
asciilifeform	not sure if the test was ever attempted in a 'serious' wine country	[21:57]
mircea_popescu	so wiat, is your thesis that this doesn't exist ? or what ?	[21:58]
nubbins`	asciilifeform the genuine articles are few and far between	[21:58]
asciilifeform	my thesis is that i've not a clue.	[21:58]
asciilifeform	l0l	[21:58]
mircea_popescu	ah lol. so then my suggestion best avenue.	[21:58]
asciilifeform	'It's all one node just with 600 addresses.' << ahahahaha.	[21:59]
*	asciilifeform picks self up from floor	[21:59]
nubbins`	asciilifeform there's 140 "master sommeliers" in usa	[21:59]
*	agorecki_ is now known as agorecki	[21:59]
nubbins`	so maybe 25-50 legit	[22:00]
nubbins`	but... that aside,	[22:00]
nubbins`	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=25-03-2015#1070578	[22:00]
assbot	Logged on 25-03-2015 15:00:24; *: nubbins` has admittedly never drunk wine costlier than $500/bottle but can verify that all the superfluous descriptors on the label are actually present	[22:00]
asciilifeform	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-06-2014#712152	[22:00]
assbot	Logged on 10-06-2014 19:46:16; asciilifeform: the sad part is, 'cyranose' (1990s product based on an oddball solid state gas column) actually worked.	[22:00]
asciilifeform	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-06-2014#712153	[22:00]
assbot	Logged on 10-06-2014 19:46:26; asciilifeform: locked up in patent purgatory to this day, afaik	[22:00]
nubbins`	oooo	[22:01]
asciilifeform	iirc works on wine	[22:01]
nubbins`	that's cool	[22:01]
BingoBoingo	get stung by nutso us wasp o may gawd... << There's a burrowing and colonizing Vespid species endemic here. When they nest in the yard it is time for the serious chemicals. Eradicating a nest will scar that part of the yard for years.	[22:01]
asciilifeform	to the point of outputting how many days in cask of what wood	[22:01]
nubbins`	great for finding food pairs!	[22:01]
nubbins`	twodogland is generally free of nasty vermin	[22:02]
asciilifeform	i still suspect that 'cyranose' was disappeared not only because useful in homeland severity (tm)	[22:02]
nubbins`	no snakes, raccoons, skunks, venomous spiders...	[22:02]
asciilifeform	but because it readily exposes fraudulent 'food'	[22:02]
nubbins`	lel	[22:02]
asciilifeform	if programmed appropriately	[22:02]
nubbins`	scan a GMO apple	[22:02]
mircea_popescu	haha	[22:02]
asciilifeform	and could be manufactured for a few usd	[22:02]
mircea_popescu	so next nsa product ?	[22:02]
asciilifeform	(solid-state carboniferous sensor)	[22:02]
nubbins`	"this isn't olive oil!"	[22:02]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: right after we can make even a z80 yes	[22:02]
mircea_popescu	ahak	[22:03]
*	asciilifeform refers 'gmo' enthusiasts to old thread	[22:03]
asciilifeform	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=12-09-2014#827711	[22:04]
assbot	Logged on 12-09-2014 19:19:30; asciilifeform: except - they aren't banning monsanto garbage. they're banning 'gmo.'	[22:04]
nubbins`	who maintains thebitcoin.foundation website?	[22:04]
*	PeterL (~peterl@unaffiliated/peterl) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[22:04]
asciilifeform	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=12-09-2014#827645	[22:04]
assbot	Logged on 12-09-2014 16:40:01; asciilifeform: once you utter 'pro-' or 'anti-gmo' you're swallowed the stupid pill.	[22:04]
asciilifeform	nubbins`: iirc it was jurov	[22:04]
nubbins`	jurov if this is correct, plz to small change?	[22:05]
*	assbot gives voice to PeterL	[22:05]
nubbins`	<<< size should be either not present, or -1	[22:05]
nubbins`	dat huge text	[22:05]
mod6	i do	[22:08]
mod6	is that better?	[22:09]
mod6	(removed the size attribute)	[22:09]
mod6	ok gentoo up and running...	[22:19]
mod6	building openssl first to ensure good build.	[22:20]
nubbins`	mod6 perf thanks	[22:23]
nubbins`	now the banner fits on my screen :D	[22:23]
ben_vulpes	persnickety sob	[22:24]
ben_vulpes	<3	[22:24]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 25808 @ 0.00022673 = 5.8514 BTC [-]	[22:25]
*	TheNewDeal (~TheNewDea@unaffiliated/thenewdeal) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[22:25]
*	assbot gives voice to TheNewDeal	[22:29]
TheNewDeal	;;bc,stats	[22:29]
gribble	Current Blocks: 349256 \| Current Difficulty: 4.671754964470642E10 \| Next Difficulty At Block: 350783 \| Next Difficulty In: 1527 blocks \| Next Difficulty In About: 1 week, 2 days, 15 hours, 56 minutes, and 57 seconds \| Next Difficulty Estimate: 52024434137.3 \| Estimated Percent Change: 11.35951	[22:29]
nubbins`	ben_vulpes didn't ya hear, nobody cares unless it looks good? 8)	[22:33]
nubbins`	at least i suggest fixes ;D	[22:34]
TheNewDeal	;;nethash	[22:35]
gribble	379131327.415	[22:35]
TheNewDeal	sweet hash	[22:35]
ben_vulpes	y'r a dear	[22:38]

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