Forum logs for 23 Jan 2016

Sunday, 24 November, Year 11 d.Tr. | Author: Mircea Popescu
* funkenstein_ (~bowler@unaffiliated/funkenstein) has left #bitcoin-assets ("Leaving") [00:00]
asciilifeform ben_vulpes: apparently fella wanted to reimplement v in gnumake (as i once considered doing) but made some peculiar design decisions along the way [00:00]
asciilifeform (no, you don't ~have~ to split the patches into patchons, to do this) [00:01]
asciilifeform also it appears that his version requires you to manually munge it every time a new patch is added [00:01]
polarbeard I would have to implement a hash table in bash [00:01]
polarbeard meh [00:01]
polarbeard to keep track of multiple parents [00:01]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 80950 @ 0.00055893 = 45.2454 BTC [+] {3} [00:02]
asciilifeform which is how i ended up ~not~ doing it in gnumake [00:02]
polarbeard that's right, I shouldn't have released it this early anyway [00:02]
polarbeard just wanted to get some love [00:02]
asciilifeform but overall, dependency on ~more~ unix tools is a bad thing, and dependency on ~more complicated~ and less-likely-to-be-reimplemented-by-wot-folk-soon tools, likewise [00:03]
asciilifeform polarbeard: why not try your hand at, say, a tx debugger? sorely needed item [00:03]
polarbeard what do you want from a tx debugger [00:04]
polarbeard I wanted to instrumentalize trb a bit, btw [00:04]
polarbeard a tx debugger sort-of-fits in my plans [00:04]
polarbeard feed me :3 [00:05]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 48400 @ 0.00055818 = 27.0159 BTC [-] {3} [00:20]
mircea_popescu << who's brunel ?! [00:26]
assbot Logged on 23-01-2016 02:03:27; asciilifeform: brunel was in the up elevator [00:26]
mircea_popescu << i have nfi. i think it's a lot of "how does one get a gf". not being worthy, per se. not demanding $randomfemale submit, per se. not that far off, either. [00:27]
assbot Logged on 23-01-2016 01:58:10; ben_vulpes: clearly, there's no 'worthy' but 'demands'. [00:27]
mircea_popescu << but it does make a lot of difference. a rising tide lifts all boats, there was no admiral nelson of the mughal empire. certainly not at that date. [00:28]
assbot Logged on 23-01-2016 02:04:27; ben_vulpes: well that's novel and depressing [00:28]
* NewLiberty has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) [00:29]
mircea_popescu << it happened. [00:30]
assbot Logged on 23-01-2016 02:10:21; ben_vulpes: i can see it though [00:30]
mircea_popescu << you deeply misunderstand what "investor grade" means in this context. the point is that he is RARE. you understand this ? the fundamental property of capital control in any functioning society without exception possible is that it must be concentrated. [00:35]
assbot Logged on 23-01-2016 02:17:41; asciilifeform: and by no automagic means 'investor-grade' humanoid. [00:35]
mircea_popescu so, if that guy fucks up, as no doubt he will, his distress is merely amusing from a societal pov. and perhaps instructive., but mostly amusing. [00:35]
mircea_popescu and "you only have yourself to blame". [00:35]
mircea_popescu when plebs "own stock", the problem becomes unsolvable, because the ready answer is, "i can't blame myself, for i'm nothing - so i'll just blame the gods" [00:35]
mircea_popescu you can't blame the gods and live to see the morn. [00:35]
BingoBoingo for alf [00:37]
assbot ... ( ) [00:37]
mircea_popescu "and the moon changes ever as his mind!" [00:38]
assbot Logged on 23-01-2016 02:23:28; asciilifeform: ok so you ~were~ speaking of stock. [00:38]
mircea_popescu << there's no other way out of the idiocy of equality. [00:41]
assbot Logged on 23-01-2016 02:27:13; asciilifeform: mega-unsurprise [00:41]
mircea_popescu two step process : a) make everyone ACTUALLY carry the burden of being the lord he was seeing himself as and b) allow the scum to shirk away. [00:41]
mircea_popescu then they'll rant and rave about "dupa ce i-a cheltuit vor merita sa devina muncitori ! Nu mai au nici o scuza ca au devenit saraci!" [00:42]
mircea_popescu the people who don't care if they life or die either live or die. the people who do care - end up paying rent to the ones that live. [00:43]
mircea_popescu this is the cornerstone of any possible sociology. [00:44]
asciilifeform << isambard kingdom brunel. quite possibly greatest engineer of all time - built first modern bridges, world's largest ships of his century, for britain [00:44]
assbot Logged on 23-01-2016 03:24:11; mircea_popescu: << who's brunel ?! [00:44]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 236958 @ 0.00055614 = 131.7818 BTC [-] {6} [00:45]
danielpbarron ;;later tell mod6 i think your twatter bot died again [00:46]
gribble The operation succeeded. [00:46]
* NewLiberty (~NewLibert@2602:306:b8e0:8160:1d24:166b:c99f:bb49) has joined #bitcoin-assets [00:46]
danielpbarron i like to retweet those greaterthan 100 btc trades [00:46]
mircea_popescu oh oh [00:46]
asciilifeform << this'd be rather like a pirate proposing that piracy is the only possible structure. if it were, what would there be for him to plunder ? [00:48]
assbot Logged on 23-01-2016 03:41:20; mircea_popescu: this is the cornerstone of any possible sociology. [00:48]
asciilifeform su existed. [00:48]
asciilifeform for the privatizatory to carve up [00:48]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform prison term didn't dislodge. people came back to their own flats. [00:48]
mircea_popescu prison term FOR WHOLE FAMILY [00:48]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: not if 'sentenced to 100th km' [00:48]
mircea_popescu even those got rescinded. [00:48]
asciilifeform on occasion, yes [00:49]
mircea_popescu right. but generally fambly kept the place, for mere conviction. it had to be political-wrathful to dislodge. [00:49]
mircea_popescu anyway - the exact same sort of people sifted to the top in the su as do anywhere else all the time. which is why yeltsin didn't survive and putin did. [00:49]
asciilifeform history is not, fortunately or otherwise, an endless loop of the same thing [00:51]
mircea_popescu pfff. [00:51]
mircea_popescu history is precisely an endless loop of the same thing. also, it has to be. [00:51]
asciilifeform it is the job of the inventor to not permit the endless loop. [00:52]
asciilifeform otherwise, yes, 5000 yrs of egypt. [00:52]
mircea_popescu the inventor is in this matter very closely related to the fashion designer. [00:52]
mircea_popescu they work hard at lipsticking the pig. [00:52]
mircea_popescu fortunately or otherwise, few live the millenia required for most of it to wear off. [00:53]
asciilifeform wake me up from my grave when, e.g., the gunpowder fashion, dies down. [00:53]
mircea_popescu also you'll be very hard pressed to argue that 5000 years of egypt were less than 5000 years hence. [00:53]
mircea_popescu (if for instance your aim is "population", mind that they started on a very narrow base. hard to beat.) [00:54]
mod6 danielpbarron: thx for the heads up [00:54]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: the egypt point is in re: the fact that the 3000th yr was quite like the 4000th and entirely possibly indistinguishable even to pro archaeologist [00:55]
asciilifeform perhaps a better example would've been the 10,000 yrs of australian abo. [00:55]
mircea_popescu you flatter yourself if you imagine there's more difference here than there, to an archeologist so distant in the future. [00:55]
mircea_popescu their shit keeps better than your shit does. [00:55]
asciilifeform no doubt. [00:55]
asciilifeform and the fossilized skeletons of the jurassic keep better still. [00:56]
mircea_popescu besides, the discussion in civilisational terms is besides the point. i guarantee that there was an alf in upper egypt bemoaning the vagaries of fate in the following exact terms : [00:56]
mircea_popescu "Whether 'tis nobler in the mind, to suffer the slings and arrows of outrageous fortune, or to take up arms against a sea of troubles and by opposing, end them ?" [00:57]
* NewLiberty has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) [00:59]
asciilifeform quite possibly. [01:00]
asciilifeform but meanwhile somebody wiped arse with the papyrus. [01:00]
asciilifeform so we're stuck guessing. [01:00]
mircea_popescu so what did not repeat ? the shape of the woman's pants ? [01:00]
mircea_popescu who cares, it's the same ass. [01:01]
asciilifeform telegraphy ? [01:01]
mircea_popescu telegraphy is not a thing. [01:02]
trinque they used to have feet. so what? [01:02]
asciilifeform i know full well that mircea_popescu can arbitrarily redefine 'a thing' for there to be none. [01:02]
mircea_popescu do you miss the things that'll be discovered after you die, perhaps ? nobody cares. you happen to have seen telegraph. they saw the complex calculation of how to pi, and counted them very civilised for it. big whoop. [01:03]
trinque it's simply staring at the tool and thinking of it in isolation, rather than inside the human process in which it is used [01:03]
asciilifeform i can boot up fortran and set 1 to equal 2 also. [01:03]
* terminal has quit (Quit: Page closed) [01:03]
asciilifeform and i suppose 'human processes' didn't change a lick since pharaonic egypt. aha, right. [01:04]
mircea_popescu quite. [01:04]
mircea_popescu there's exactly nothing to change. what'd you change ? [01:04]
mircea_popescu you still value what you lost more than what you gain by that loss. you still need stimuli to grow geometrically for subjective sensation to progress arithmetically. [01:05]
* BananaLotus (~BananaLot@ has joined #bitcoin-assets [01:05]
asciilifeform and my arse still takes up space in 3 dimensions, big whoop [01:05]
mircea_popescu your eyes' cablature still crosses behind your nose. [01:05]
mircea_popescu quite. [01:05]
* guruvan (~guruvan@unaffiliated/guruvan) has joined #bitcoin-assets [01:05]
* trinque notes the former SU guy's fixation on novelty [01:06]
trinque HA! [01:06]
mircea_popescu lol [01:06]
* asciilifeform pictures mircea_popescu blasting off to mothership, tells chums 'this planet is a mega-snore, nothing ~ever~ changes there, let's get outtahere' [01:06]
mircea_popescu i don't mind. [01:06]
mircea_popescu i expect change like you expect nonsense. it comes out of young / silly people. [01:06]
asciilifeform and asteroids. [01:07]
mircea_popescu hardly. [01:07]
mircea_popescu you ever read that thing on the latin language ? [01:07]
asciilifeform 'the 80th latin' or what was it [01:08]
asciilifeform on trilema ? [01:08]
mircea_popescu yeah that. [01:08]
asciilifeform aha [01:08]
asciilifeform spiffy [01:08]
mircea_popescu so asteroid. what sort of novelty is that ? [01:08]
mircea_popescu the only news in the world is the history you didn't know and the measurements you took incorrectly. [01:09]
mircea_popescu not like photons went you know what ? this planck constant's boring, let's get a new one. [01:09]
asciilifeform i suppose if asteroid cleaned everybody's clock but the hydrothermal vent microbes, mircea_popescu would (from his dirigible!) still say, 'nothing novel, planet still crawling with whatevers, snore' [01:10]
mircea_popescu pretty much. [01:10]
asciilifeform i cannot say to this, but only take off my hat. [01:10]
asciilifeform *say anything [01:10]
mircea_popescu your earlier mistake was to suppose it's UP TO THEM. [01:10]
mircea_popescu it isn't up to them. some people dont' care. some do. they can't change this anymore than you can be a woman. [01:11]
asciilifeform wai wut? up to whom ? [01:11]
mircea_popescu now, it's true that miseducation can bring one up to think himself the other kind, whichg CAN be remedied. [01:11]
mircea_popescu but this is not unlike retarded mother bringing boy up in skirts. [01:11]
mircea_popescu eventually, if nothing was cut off, duck in the yard can no longer resist the call of ducks in the sky and takes off. [01:11]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform [01:12]
assbot Logged on 23-01-2016 03:40:38; mircea_popescu: the people who don't care if they life or die either live or die. the people who do care - end up paying rent to the ones that live. [01:12]
asciilifeform this is also how we get [01:13]
assbot Logged on 23-01-2016 01:09:02; mircea_popescu: << if anyone in afghanistan etc were not fully employed in countig rocks and fucking goats thus managing to find their way here, i'd definitely finance a project to fly a quad to a drone and use the old komet trick [01:13]
mircea_popescu how would you know this ? [01:13]
trinque mircea_popescu │ eventually, if nothing was cut off, duck in the yard can no longer resist the call of ducks in the sky and takes off. << I'm going to go ahead and carve this one into the inside of my skull. [01:14]
asciilifeform in approx same way and to same degree as i know that electron exists. [01:14]
asciilifeform (no, i did not see one with naked eye.) [01:14]
mircea_popescu so what did you see to make this equivalence stick ? [01:14]
mircea_popescu for instance, charge of electron can be measured even from white noise of antenna. [01:15]
asciilifeform aha [01:15]
mircea_popescu and from molar mass / speed of reaction [01:15]
asciilifeform and the sheer mega-virility of pashtun can be likewise measured in 1,001 ways. [01:15]
mircea_popescu and from a number of other things. [01:15]
mircea_popescu but that's not your thesis. [01:15]
asciilifeform thesis is that 'the spartan speaks with his sword', untempered, results in goatfuckistan. [01:16]
mircea_popescu but no. your thesis is that "can only result in" goatfuckistan. [01:16]
asciilifeform as amply confirmed experimentally as anything i'd care to think of. [01:16]
mircea_popescu and this has nothing to stand on. [01:16]
mircea_popescu such as actual sparta ? [01:16]
asciilifeform has same to stand on as 'communism results in misery' etc [01:16]
asciilifeform the totality of the record. [01:16]
mircea_popescu not so. [01:16]
* DreadKnight (~DreadKnig@unaffiliated/dreadknight) has joined #bitcoin-assets [01:17]
mircea_popescu there's another great difference, which may be easier to ford. socialism - sacrifice now for later paradise. this - is enjoyable. now. so much so i have not the least care if paradise or no paradise, or as the old man of the mountain said to allah, [01:18]
asciilifeform wake me up when the he-men create so much as a 'aa' battery. [01:18]
mircea_popescu "you can keep your virgins" [01:18]
mircea_popescu "i already ate". [01:18]
asciilifeform this being said, i wouldn't mind visiting limonov's (or mircea_popescu's for that matter) planet where folks practice bare-handed head-chopping from sunrise to noon, and measure neutron cross-sections, compose symphonies, after dinner [01:20]
asciilifeform followed by a good ol'fashioned chess-boxing match on weekend. [01:20]
asciilifeform i might get eaten as a snack on said planet, but it'd be almost worth it [01:21]
BingoBoingo !b 3 [01:21]
assbot Last 3 lines bashed and pending review. ( ) [01:21]
mircea_popescu teh stubborn is strong with this one :D [01:21]
asciilifeform unrelatedly, not long ago had a brain-melting mindfuck, browsed maths crud on 'amazon' rec list, and noticed b00k, 'wait a sec, where did i see the author' - turns out, in email box [01:23]
asciilifeform (at wurk) [01:23]
mircea_popescu this is common neh ? [01:23]
mircea_popescu publish or shittish. [01:23]
asciilifeform personal first [01:23]
mircea_popescu eh, period in my life, i'd go to a party and inexorably leave with a half sack of books. [01:24]
asciilifeform interestingly, never happened when i actually was involved in academic racket [01:24]
mircea_popescu possibly a contributing factor in my distaste with the damned things. [01:24]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 108150 @ 0.00055877 = 60.431 BTC [+] {3} [01:25]
asciilifeform my father had a world-class library, left it behind, today cannot stand the idea of amassing any such thing [01:25]
trinque why is the egyptian man's desire for food, a place to shit, and women to fuck different from mine? and if it isn't, whence this idea that my motivations are manifold (and advanced!), his few? [01:25]
* trinque brb [01:25]
asciilifeform i suspect that i will go the same [01:25]
asciilifeform the b00kz become associated with thing-that-anchors-you, i suspect [01:25]
mircea_popescu trinque well, an argument can be brought that yours are a lot more cleaved. like, you know, you can separately desire to lay with the woman as in cuddle, to lay with the woman as in fuck her brains out, to lay with the woman as to impregnate her and so on. whereas poor simple he, just lay with the woman. [01:26]
mircea_popescu now, whether a natural tongue or one surgically bifurcated is a change worth the mention... well... i suppose we must leave this up to the inventor. [01:26]
mircea_popescu lest the academic has to publish to justify his high station, an' the inventor must invent, hence so many new inventions all the time. [01:27]
asciilifeform i'd put the bifurcation as the whole of the man-monkey divide [01:27]
mircea_popescu you would. [01:27]
asciilifeform sure as hell, monkey has one fuck mode [01:27]
mircea_popescu this doesn't explain why young men are so undistinguishable from monkeys. [01:27]
asciilifeform not bifurcated far [01:27]
* NewLiberty (~NewLibert@2602:306:b8e0:8160:1d24:166b:c99f:bb49) has joined #bitcoin-assets [01:27]
mircea_popescu "not along - across!" [01:27]
asciilifeform l0lz! [01:27]
mircea_popescu anyway. the difference between man and monkey is that man realises it's not actually worth the hassle. [01:28]
mircea_popescu ie, contemplation, not invention. [01:28]
mircea_popescu or to put it in more familiar terms, you know why the german goes bald arouind the corona, and the romanian arfound the forehead ? [01:30]
asciilifeform speaking of 'indistinguishable from monkeys', i observed that approx 1 train car in 5 has a loud, rambling nutter in it [01:30]
asciilifeform or at least a black fella singing loudly along to his headphones, without a care [01:31]
asciilifeform in a car otherwise full of dour folk making angry eyes [01:31]
asciilifeform so why the german goes bald ... ? [01:31]
mircea_popescu it's a visual joke. imagine me saying "hmm, i wonder how best to do this" whille scratching the top of my head [01:32]
asciilifeform ah! [01:32]
mircea_popescu and then "omfg what have i done" slapping forehead [01:32]
mircea_popescu contemplation. that's the divide. reflexivity. once the hardware started doing recursion, it split. [01:33]
mircea_popescu monkey-human divide cybernetically equivalent to non-recursive / recursive systems. [01:33]
asciilifeform aha, as pictured in hofstadter and minsky [01:33]
mircea_popescu mebbe ? i dun recall [01:33]
asciilifeform (the former wrote a whole mega-l0ltron re: same, 'i am a strange loop') [01:33]
asciilifeform and i suppose the egyptians must have known this [01:34]
asciilifeform or we'd have a... new idea [01:34]
mircea_popescu i'm sure we also have a new language! [01:35]
mircea_popescu such novel! [01:35]
mircea_popescu this conception of "novelty" is not so dissimilar to creationist's conception of darwinism. "he said my auntie's a dog!" [01:35]
asciilifeform i am picturing, one day measured value of plank's constant shifts, mircea_popescu goes back to sleep, says 'this shift was implicit all along, could not otherwise happen.' and will sleep until the very integers get up and walk around. [01:36]
asciilifeform this is not curable. [01:36]
mircea_popescu catch me doing that first, wouldja ? [01:36]
mircea_popescu so far the score's about a trillion to 0 the other way. [01:36]
asciilifeform aha, which is why lulzy [01:36]
mircea_popescu (actually the only sane model of physical cosmogony i know doth require shifting planck constant, if ever so shyly) [01:37]
BingoBoingo ;;bc,stats [01:53]
* linton_s_dawson has quit (Quit: Leaving.) [01:53]
gribble Current Blocks: 394567 | Current Difficulty: 1.1335429980147113E11 | Next Difficulty At Block: 395135 | Next Difficulty In: 568 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 3 days, 8 hours, 11 minutes, and 17 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: None | Estimated Percent Change: None [01:53]
mircea_popescu (the problem, in the simplest terms, is that for h to be constant energy and spacetime must stay coupled. as such, it's impossible to have an original singularity (aka the big bang) seeing how everything solves neatly for a radius of 0, yielding a pretty field of 0's and a pile of nondetermined constants. conversely : in planck terms, the age of the universe is about 10^61, its radius about 10^61 and its energy about 1 [01:55]
mircea_popescu 0^61, which is one hell of a coincidence that it should allign so right now! (same results can be expressed looking at the schwarzschild radius, too). ) [01:55]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform btw, re boxchess, ever showed you ? [02:07]
assbot S02.Ep19.Mat - YouTube ... ( ) [02:07]
* justanotheruser has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) [02:13]
* justanotheruser (~Justan@unaffiliated/justanotheruser) has joined #bitcoin-assets [02:16]
mircea_popescu << i've yet to meet an electron who thought himself the ceo of the atom in question. [02:18]
assbot Logged on 23-01-2016 02:43:37; asciilifeform: 'electron moves because allah willed so' [02:18]
mircea_popescu << even the simple step of "add flag to trb to dump mempool into file each time a block is found" would be helpful atm. [02:23]
assbot Logged on 23-01-2016 03:02:42; polarbeard: feed me :3 [02:23]
mircea_popescu (speaking of which - de-stupidification of the logging process would be a fucking blessing already. debug.log, srsly ? how about error.log mempool.log connect.log blocks.log for starters ?) [02:24]
polarbeard ^ agree, also hex logs [02:25]
mircea_popescu well, at least sanely tabulated. [02:25]
mircea_popescu in any case, then you could start it with -logs=emcb for all 4, or otherwise whatever combo thereof. [02:26]
mircea_popescu and for the love of christ implement either rolling or else a maxsize for files or something. [02:26]
polarbeard roger [02:26]
polarbeard no logrotate love? [02:26]
mircea_popescu or that. anything. [02:26]
mircea_popescu as it stands right now it's made by sheepherds. [02:27]
polarbeard it's a miracle it works [02:27]
mircea_popescu ah, and also - fucking timestamps on loglines omfg. [02:31]
mircea_popescu who did that! [02:31]
mircea_popescu "here's a logline. it's from fuck you o'clock. you're welcome." [02:31]
ben_vulpes fuck you o'clock lol [02:32]
ben_vulpes didn't phf do something with timestamps? [02:32]
polarbeard haha, 'just derive it from block height man' [02:32]
mircea_popescu it doesn't even dump that, which would be insane but at least it'd be insane. [02:33]
ben_vulpes polarbeard: good idea except that syncing reference implementations to the best of my knowledge don't know the current blockheight [02:33]
polarbeard /ironic off :) [02:34]
polarbeard I'd be happy with unix_time space hex_message sent_or_received_bit [02:35]
ben_vulpes the log history that you're missing is that blockheight is the only non usg-shared time. [02:35]
mircea_popescu ben_vulpes it could always curl for the latest. [02:35]
ben_vulpes yes let's compile libcurl into the reference implementation [02:36]
mircea_popescu after all... we have fucking json in there for reasons! [02:36]
ben_vulpes i'm sure polarbeard can get on that train [02:36]
ben_vulpes choo choo! [02:36]
polarbeard moar deps [02:36]
ben_vulpes #nodeps [02:36]
mircea_popescu lol aren't you a bucket fulla sunshine. [02:36]
ben_vulpes writing software fills a boy with hate. [02:36]
ben_vulpes mircea_popescu: what was the calculation you ran to determine the hashpower necessary to nail a block more or less every 24 hours? [02:37]
mircea_popescu #noderps #nodeps #nodes [02:37]
ben_vulpes #definitelynofuckinnode [02:38]
mircea_popescu that there's 6 blocks an hour and 24 hours in 24 hours ? [02:38]
ben_vulpes so one'd need ~ 1/144th of nethash? [02:38]
mircea_popescu well, yes, if one's tolerant with the variance [02:38]
ben_vulpes sure [02:39]
mircea_popescu as you divide, variance divides by less. [02:39]
ben_vulpes ;;nethash [02:39]
gribble 892506470.131 [02:39]
polarbeard blocks per day = (my_share_rate / difficulty ) x 86400 / block_time [02:39]
mircea_popescu still, it comes to about 2MW's worth, more or less. [02:40]
polarbeard my_share_rate = hash rate / 2^32 [02:40]
mircea_popescu polarbeard so basically myhash/nethash * 144. [02:41]
ben_vulpes someone missed dimensional analysis in school? [02:41]
polarbeard yep, but nethash is not exact I think? [02:41]
mircea_popescu neither is 144. [02:42]
* NewLiberty has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) [02:42]
ben_vulpes approximation is a nifty wunderwaffen. [02:42]
ben_vulpes mircea_popescu: schooled me rather hard on a good example around c3 [02:43]
mircea_popescu i could hear you chuckling from here. [02:43]
ben_vulpes nethash is a joke is what it is [02:43]
mircea_popescu amusingly, the proper measure for nethash actually is PW or somesuch. [02:44]
ben_vulpes petawatts? [02:44]
mircea_popescu by the time it gets to 50%+1 all these approximations will be a lot less approximative [02:44]
mircea_popescu 50 TW, something like that. [02:45]
mircea_popescu 50 PW* [02:45]
ben_vulpes that has a lot of assumptions on mining chip efficiency boss [02:46]
ben_vulpes non? [02:46]
mircea_popescu nope. stable situation is where nethash is half the power generation. [02:47]
mircea_popescu chips irrespective, be they z80s or whatever startrek [02:47]
ben_vulpes but now. [02:47]
ben_vulpes not then. [02:47]
mircea_popescu universally. [02:47]
mircea_popescu "Hypothetically, according to Robert Engelman (Worldwatch institute), in order to prevent collapse, human civilization would have to stop increasing emissions within a decade regardless of the economy or population (2009)." [02:48]
ben_vulpes when you say that it comes to 2MW's worth. [02:48]
mircea_popescu ahh this shit's always such lulzyu lull. [02:49]
mircea_popescu ben_vulpes ah yes, yes. [02:49]
mircea_popescu currently we're only burning something to the tune of 30GW [02:49]
mircea_popescu which is scandalous, but hey. [02:49]
thestringpuller mircea_popescu: 21co tried to make energy friendly chips, now they are trying to pawn them on users as "compooter" [02:50]
mircea_popescu ;;calc 3* 10^10 * 24 * 365 [02:50]
gribble Error: Something in there wasn't a valid number. [02:50]
mircea_popescu ;;calc 3* 10**10 * 24 * 365 [02:50]
gribble 262800000000000 [02:50]
mircea_popescu << the esteemed republic is #13, after italy and above most of the world. [02:51]
assbot List of countries by electricity consumption - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ... ( ) [02:51]
mircea_popescu it could light up almost 3000 chads. [02:51]
thestringpuller always imagined some d00d with access to nuclear power building a reactor on some island and using all the power for mining [02:52]
* Duffer1 ( has joined #bitcoin-assets [02:53]
ben_vulpes did anyone ever run the numbers on what it would naively cost to lease the hashpower required to mint a block a day? [02:55]
ben_vulpes ;;help nethash [02:56]
gribble (nethash takes no arguments) -- Shows the current estimate for total network hash rate, in Ghps. [02:56]
mircea_popescu maybe 1% of the cost of a block, a day ? [02:56]
mircea_popescu of the subsidy of a block* [02:56]
mircea_popescu very simple mechanism to ACTUALLY improve your insurance : make a pool which pays 25.25 btc for the first block it finds each day. [02:57]
mircea_popescu this is a very neat way to solve an otherwise very thorny economical problem, and it will figure prominently in the future. [02:57]
mircea_popescu miners will not only optimize txn to include in blocks per se, but also "whose pool to mine nao at" [02:57]
ben_vulpes so what's the lowdown on the various pool payout maths? [02:57]
mircea_popescu what do you mean ? [02:58]
ben_vulpes every time i look into pool payout schemes my eyes glaze over and my fraud alert systems kick in. [02:58]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 35017 @ 0.000556 = 19.4695 BTC [-] {2} [02:58]
mircea_popescu there's 3 or 4 principal ways to do it, 2 or 3 of which are very slight variation on the same theme. [02:58]
mircea_popescu it's a complex topic but no, they're not fraudulent. [02:58]
mircea_popescu arrived at through a lot of experimental as well as theoretical effort. [02:59]
ben_vulpes has anyone written this up anywhere? [02:59]
mircea_popescu well... miners. [02:59]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 81283 @ 0.00055562 = 45.1625 BTC [-] {3} [02:59]
mircea_popescu worth your time to research it for your own sharpening, it's all pretty clever. [02:59]
ben_vulpes myeah [02:59]
ben_vulpes perhaps i'll do that while i install os x on this laptop for the umpteenth time [02:59]
ben_vulpes fucking operating systems [03:00]
mircea_popescu should take about a week. [03:00]
mircea_popescu depends how hard you push the "but why!" pedal. [03:00]
mircea_popescu lotta history. [03:00]
ben_vulpes man imma have to learn chinese at this rate [03:02]
ben_vulpes ideograms, man. [03:02]
* dbclk_ has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) [03:02]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 35000 @ 0.00055963 = 19.5871 BTC [+] {2} [03:04]
ben_vulpes mircea_popescu: and i'm going to guess most of this history is on [03:09]
mats [03:20]
assbot Ukrainian Armor (The Rolling Stones - Gimme Shelter) - YouTube ... ( ) [03:20]
ben_vulpes mats: badass [03:25]
ben_vulpes tis the age of the cmos [03:25]
* samO_ (~samO@unaffiliated/samo) has joined #bitcoin-assets [03:28]
mats the autoloader is cool [03:29]
mats for some reason the abrams doesn't have it [03:29]
* samO (~samO@unaffiliated/samo) has joined #bitcoin-assets [03:30]
* samO__ has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) [03:30]
* samO_ has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) [03:32]
* joshbuddy (~josh@wikimedia/Joshbuddy) has joined #bitcoin-assets [03:35]
* MobGod (~Mob@unaffiliated/mobgod) has joined #bitcoin-assets [03:49]
* joshbuddy has quit (Quit: joshbuddy) [03:55]
* joshbuddy (~josh@wikimedia/Joshbuddy) has joined #bitcoin-assets [03:56]
* bagels7 has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) [04:02]
* joshbuddy has quit (Quit: joshbuddy) [04:02]
* bagels7 (~bagels7@unaffiliated/bagels7) has joined #bitcoin-assets [04:42]
* Alopex has quit (Remote host closed the connection) [05:17]
* Alopex ( has joined #bitcoin-assets [05:23]
* samO_ (~samO@unaffiliated/samo) has joined #bitcoin-assets [05:28]
* samO has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) [05:31]
* samO__ (~samO@unaffiliated/samo) has joined #bitcoin-assets [05:32]
* samO_ has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) [05:35]
punkman bon dia [05:42]
punkman [05:42]
assbot ... ( ) [05:42]
punkman ^ dirigible [05:43]
punkman especially the earlier history, yes. possibly a good place to start:;u=14118;sa=showPosts;start=6160 [05:55]
assbot Logged on 23-01-2016 06:06:51; ben_vulpes: mircea_popescu: and i'm going to guess most of this history is on [05:55]
assbot Latest posts of: organofcorti ... ( ) [05:55]
punkman ;;diffchange [05:56]
gribble Estimated percent change in difficulty this period | None % based on data since last change | 10.264 % based on data for last three days [05:56]
punkman [05:57]
assbot MegaBigPower :: Info ... ( ) [05:57]
punkman "pleased to announce our ASIC BuyBack Program" [05:58]
punkman "Buy Bitcoin Direct from MegaBigPower at a Discount on a Future Date. Auctions Occur Once Per Month." [05:59]
punkman "It has been quite a while since any new hardware became available, it is reasonable to assume that most small miners will have recouped the majority of what they initially outlaid for the hardware, and are now disinclined to continue ‘supporting the network’, whilst incurring unnecessary cost. So: MegaBigPowers ‘land-grab’, to acquire all this idle hashing power seems like a smart move. As, [06:01]
punkman once the next price run up begins, there will be a frantic scrabble to re-power all the mothballed rigs lying around." [06:01]
punkman from [06:02]
assbot Thoughts on the current state of Bitcoin mining | Blockchain Stuff ... ( ) [06:02]
punkman "Bitfury recently announced their 28nm, 0.2 J/Gh offering (with some impressive efficiencies claimed) but have declined to inform us when they will be available, either-ways they do not sell to the public anymore. They also alluded to a 16nm chip with efficiencies as low as 0.02 due out later this year." [06:03]
punkman "KNC are in a similar holding pattern, awaiting production of their 16nm ‘Solar’ chip, with astonishing claims of 0.07 J/Gh,  They no longer sell to the public either." [06:04]
kakobrekla they sold until it was garbage, now that further decreasement in process size are hardly possible, they hold [06:05]
punkman oooh just noticed "March 2015" [06:05]
kakobrekla basically folks have been used as sort of catalyst for the reaction of them getting 16nm or so and are now no longer needed [06:07]
punkman hmm [06:09]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 50750 @ 0.00055964 = 28.4017 BTC [+] [06:11]
ben_vulpes << perhaps i am up too late, but i cannot make heads nor tails of this [06:13]
assbot Logged on 23-01-2016 05:53:27; mircea_popescu: maybe 1% of the cost of a block, a day ? [06:13]
punkman ben_vulpes: 1% extra [06:17]
* julmac ( has joined #bitcoin-assets [06:17]
punkman "single-file public-domain/open source C libraries with minimal dependencies" [06:20]
assbot stb/ at master · nothings/stb · GitHub ... ( ) [06:20]
* julmae has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) [06:20]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 36700 @ 0.00055964 = 20.5388 BTC [+] [06:22]
* SuchWow has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) [06:26]
* TheAdversary has quit (Remote host closed the connection) [06:26]
ben_vulpes ah? [06:27]
* joshbuddy (~josh@wikimedia/Joshbuddy) has joined #bitcoin-assets [06:36]
BingoBoingo [06:42]
* Duffer1 has quit (Quit: later) [06:43]
* Xuthus (~x@unaffiliated/xuthus) has joined #bitcoin-assets [07:46]
* Linus_ ( has joined #bitcoin-assets [07:47]
* dbclk (~dbclk@ has joined #bitcoin-assets [07:50]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 53000 @ 0.00055964 = 29.6609 BTC [+] [07:57]
* punkman1 (~punkman@unaffiliated/punkman) has joined #bitcoin-assets [08:03]
* punkman has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) [08:06]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 51500 @ 0.00056057 = 28.8694 BTC [+] {3} [08:24]
* punkman (~punkman@unaffiliated/punkman) has joined #bitcoin-assets [08:31]
* punkman1 has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) [08:32]
* Naphex ( has joined #bitcoin-assets [08:58]
* Naphex has quit (Changing host) [08:59]
* Naphex (~naphex@unaffiliated/naphex) has joined #bitcoin-assets [08:59]
shinohai Height 394621 o/ [09:03]
* shinohai pops cork on muscadine wine even though it is 7 a.m. [09:03]
* julmae ( has joined #bitcoin-assets [09:38]
* Xuthus has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) [09:40]
* julmac has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) [09:41]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 30800 @ 0.00055961 = 17.236 BTC [-] [09:46]
* julmac ( has joined #bitcoin-assets [09:50]
* julmae has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) [09:53]
* julmac has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) [10:05]
* twixisowned ( has joined #bitcoin-assets [10:17]
* julmae ( has joined #bitcoin-assets [10:19]
* trixisowned has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) [10:21]
* joshbuddy has quit (Quit: joshbuddy) [10:28]
* drnet ( has joined #bitcoin-assets [10:29]
* assbot gives voice to Azelphur [10:34]
Azelphur ;;rate RagnarDanneskjol -10 3 months of unpaid salary, will remove rating if payment ever arrives. [10:34]
gribble Error: For identification purposes, you must be authenticated to use the rating system. [10:34]
Azelphur ;;rate RagnarDanneskjol -10 3 months of unpaid salary, will remove rating if payment ever arrives. [10:35]
gribble Rating entry successful. Your rating of -10 for user RagnarDanneskjol has been recorded. [10:35]
* Azelphur sighs [10:35]
Azelphur Was really unsure whether to place that one (badmouthing former employer and all) but figured he'll probably look here for someone to replace me, and other people might not be so financially secure as I am. [10:41]
* assbot gives voice to punkman [10:43]
punkman told me he needed some contract work 3 months ago, but didn't follow through [10:46]
punkman ;;seen RagnarDanneskjol [10:47]
gribble RagnarDanneskjol was last seen in #bitcoin-assets 44 weeks, 0 days, 2 hours, 50 minutes, and 19 seconds ago: trinque - i am occasionally using the nick for continued development on punks ver. if anyone here's partial to the name I can pass it over. Wow that xm42 [10:47]
Azelphur punkman, yea for me I did the work, he just keeps saying he will pay and continues to delay / make excuses [10:47]
Azelphur he said he; [10:48]
Azelphur whoops, he said he'd pay me an installment of £1000ish on Monday, then said it was a bank holiday and that he would send it out Tuesday, ignored me till yesterday where he claimed he had sent it out, but honestly he has said it's sent so many times and it didn't arrive I don't trust it any more [10:49]
punkman yeah that's not very good [10:50]
mircea_popescu << yea, actually, the one thing bitcointalk is a source for is miner stuff. they never got any other venue , well noit publicly anyway [10:51]
assbot Logged on 23-01-2016 06:06:51; ben_vulpes: mircea_popescu: and i'm going to guess most of this history is on [10:51]
Azelphur Indeed it's not, had no money over christmas. His misinformation has cost me money too [10:51]
mircea_popescu o.O [10:52]
mircea_popescu that didn't work out so well did it [10:52]
Azelphur apparently not, no [10:52]
Azelphur was great up until the whole not paying me thing [10:52]
punkman you were working with him for a while though, right? [10:53]
Azelphur punkman, yea, I started with him last October iirc [10:53]
Azelphur ie, October 2014 [10:53]
mircea_popescu kakobrekla << anything to this ? [10:54]
assbot BitBet (S.BBET) December 2015 Statement on Trilema - A blog by Mircea Popescu. ... ( ) [10:54]
punkman mircea_popescu: yeah I get a new cert on bitbet, issued 2016/01/21 [10:55]
mircea_popescu ah kk. [10:55]
mircea_popescu thing ended up in spam, possibly because of the link [10:55]
Azelphur but yea, officially looking for new work now. Hopefully it's a good move and I'll get paid a little more (and at all :P) [10:57]
* TheRealJohnGalt has quit (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity) [10:57]
mircea_popescu << ahaha no that's a balloon. dirigible is oval not buttshaped. [11:03]
assbot Logged on 23-01-2016 08:40:37; punkman: ^ dirigible [11:03]
mircea_popescu << he also had a blog which was pretty good. [11:03]
assbot Logged on 23-01-2016 08:52:39; assbot: Latest posts of: organofcorti ... ( ) [11:03]
mircea_popescu iirc the dude hated me for some reason. [11:03]
mircea_popescu << well, actually, they sold back when they had to take the poisoned dollars of the masses, a few bucks at a time. once they n olonger need that, they don't. who eats garbage if they can help it. [11:05]
assbot Logged on 23-01-2016 09:03:04; kakobrekla: they sold until it was garbage, now that further decreasement in process size are hardly possible, they hold [11:05]
mircea_popescu Azelphur notsure why you're not using the assbot wot anyway. [11:06]
Azelphur mircea_popescu, haven't been around much recently so haven't familiarised myself with it [11:06]
mircea_popescu ah [11:06]
mircea_popescu anyway, there was a bank holiday on monday. in the us. some black speechmaker dude [11:07]
asciilifeform << tell a bit about the concentrated thing [11:08]
assbot Logged on 23-01-2016 03:32:24; mircea_popescu: << you deeply misunderstand what "investor grade" means in this context. the point is that he is RARE. you understand this ? the fundamental property of capital control in any functioning society without exception possible is that it must be concentrated. [11:08]
Azelphur mircea_popescu, yea I know, dude is very good at excuses, as I say it has been 3 months, and even if he has sent a bank transfer it's still only for a small percentage of total owed [11:08]
asciilifeform is it the '1024 chickens' idea ? [11:09]
mircea_popescu nope. it's the "brain resides in skullbox not spread out throughout cells like mitochondria". [11:09]
asciilifeform same thing, no ? [11:09]
mircea_popescu i guess it can be viewed so, yeah. ok. [11:09]
asciilifeform i'm trying to grasp how it isn't an argument for gosplan tho [11:10]
mircea_popescu the problem here is that both ox and chickens are separate from the thing they pull. [11:10]
mircea_popescu ah, this IS an argument for gosplan. the only one. [11:10]
Azelphur if it was just missed payment by a few days I'd be cool with it, heck I was fine with it up until about 2 weeks late, stopped working when it was a month late, and public -10 has only happened after 3 months late [11:10]
mircea_popescu nevertheless, the argument against gosplan is that "fuck you". [11:10]
mircea_popescu while you personally may not be inclined, i am, and without me it dies. [11:10]
mircea_popescu Azelphur i c. [11:10]
Azelphur started to get really annoyed when I had the choice of taking money out of my cold wallet or taking a loan from my parents to make rent over christmas - not cool :/ [11:11]
asciilifeform so mircea_popescu doesn't have an argument against gosplan ?! other than not liking the colour & shape on purely aesthetic grounds? [11:11]
mircea_popescu the argument against gosplan is exactly the argument against "hi guise i am ceo". [11:12]
mircea_popescu "who the fuck are you ?" [11:12]
Azelphur I feel bad -10ing him though, I like to work things out with people and it just sucks that he's not meeting his obligations or even being reasonable really [11:12]
mircea_popescu which is why all the red square nuclear bomb displays and etc. obligate pompousness. [11:12]
asciilifeform lucky we are that 'hi guise im ceo' has no army and no navy. [11:12]
mircea_popescu it's a forced mistake. [11:12]
mircea_popescu quite. [11:12]
asciilifeform (except when he does, e.g., obamitler) [11:13]
mircea_popescu problem being, they don't actually help, just serve to alienate me further. [11:13]
asciilifeform only because the beast is immunocompromised [11:13]
mircea_popescu mno. [11:13]
mircea_popescu i am immune to it, it depends on me. this creates a certain situation of power in the field. [11:14]
asciilifeform depends how ? [11:14]
mircea_popescu anyway, in the expression of the castrated subhumans that nevertheless are intelligent enough to notice the problem, this is usually called the "knowledge problem", ie poor state can't acquire and process enough information to make a reasonable gosplan. [11:14]
mircea_popescu nevertheless, this is a flattering if incorrect representation. like saying "unfortunately whale did not have enough evolution mojo to grow wings". yeasure. [11:15]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform i have no idea how to formulate this better than to refer you to the (oft mentioned, by me) worms dispute. [11:15]
mircea_popescu king can not invest by staff. he doesn't have a staff to give. [11:16]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: modern usg is going for 'eastern despot' caesaropapism. [11:20]
mircea_popescu which is why they keep inventing academic honors for the emperor. they work admirably, don't they. [11:21]
asciilifeform hey it worked for the 5000yr egyptianreich! [11:21]
mircea_popescu not so. [11:21]
mircea_popescu your idea that "5000 yr egyptianreich" is not unlike a 1900s victorian idea that "5000 yr chinareich". wut ? [11:22]
mircea_popescu they had more dynasties than americans had sexual partners. [11:22]
asciilifeform point^ [11:22]
mircea_popescu ironically, the people who could be caesar ie emperor and pontifex max uniformly do not wish to be, so much so it's almost a heuristic. [11:24]
mircea_popescu and they do not wish to be not because they somehow give a shit about brutus and brutish jealousies. [11:24]
mircea_popescu but, at this juncture, augustus' memoirs are recomended re-read. might explain the vecchio rotinculo much closer than before. [11:25]
asciilifeform << ukrs are apparently really good at shooting into 1) air 2) earth 3) defenceless farm houses. who'dhaveknown. [11:27]
assbot Logged on 23-01-2016 06:17:35; mats: [11:27]
asciilifeform spiffy firewurx. [11:27]
asciilifeform and wake me up when they ~make~ a tank. [11:28]
mircea_popescu aww why the haet! [11:28]
mircea_popescu dja know that the AVERAGE ammo expenditure per enemy killed is in the 2mn range by now ? [11:28]
mircea_popescu people keep mocking hollywood marksmanship. mostly because they've never been in a warzone. [11:29]
asciilifeform well also because did not go to kindergarten, never learned concept of suppressive fire [11:29]
mircea_popescu seeing how it's about 2kj per bullet, we find that each enemy combatant takes ~1MWh in bullets only! [11:31]
mircea_popescu and that's on the modest 39mm. pretty much a thing of the past, everyone doing 51 now amirite. so 2x that. [11:31]
* asciilifeform was very very confused until realized that mircea_popescu is counting the ~length~ of the shell ! [11:33]
* drnet has quit (Quit: Leaving) [11:33]
mircea_popescu well yes. 39 is the old ak/sks russian thing. nato has a bigger one. [11:33]
asciilifeform today as in '70s the man-portable small arms fire the 'intermediate' things and the squad guns - the 1890s longer one. [11:34]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 101766 @ 0.00055833 = 56.819 BTC [-] {3} [11:35]
mircea_popescu well, depends. the large nato round is really like the hunting .308 [11:36]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: << sov-new (ak74), nato-new (m16), sov-old (ak47), nato-old-fullsize, sov-old-fullsize (mosin, and all ru squad guns, 1890s round) [11:37]
assbot Ammo Side By Side Photo by Akalvarez_2007 | Photobucket ... ( ) [11:37]
mircea_popescu aha [11:38]
asciilifeform notice the very archaic flanged shell and rimmed bottom on the last [11:38]
mircea_popescu yeah lol. [11:38]
mircea_popescu century old bullet! [11:39]
asciilifeform oldest rifle cartridge still in mass use. [11:39]
asciilifeform more than century. [11:39]
* asciilifeform played with a bag of empty shells of those, as a boy [11:40]
asciilifeform << i thought we had this ? [11:46]
assbot Logged on 23-01-2016 05:23:47; mircea_popescu: and for the love of christ implement either rolling or else a maxsize for files or something. [11:46]
asciilifeform << all i really want presently is to dump mempool. and to have some means of removing ANYTHING whatsoever from it. because if we had this, we COULD semispace-garbagecollect. [11:46]
assbot Logged on 23-01-2016 05:20:23; mircea_popescu: << even the simple step of "add flag to trb to dump mempool into file each time a block is found" would be helpful atm. [11:47]
asciilifeform (add what belongs in the pool to a new pool, then nuke what remains. also defrags...) [11:47]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform let the guy do something useful wouldja. step at a time. [11:47]
asciilifeform << ick [11:47]
assbot Logged on 23-01-2016 05:33:08; mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes it could always curl for the latest. [11:47]
mircea_popescu and drink humour vitamins! [11:48]
asciilifeform l0lzamins [11:48]
mircea_popescu very fucking hard making jokes about bitcoin codebase, seeing the state it's in. [11:48]
asciilifeform 'who has been in the army, does not laugh in the circus' (tm) (r) (su) [11:49]
mircea_popescu like fucking pagliacci over here, just turns to sad. [11:49]
mircea_popescu ahahaha quite. [11:49]
asciilifeform << this looks disturbingly like BingoBoingo's material [11:50]
assbot Logged on 23-01-2016 08:40:14; punkman: [11:50]
asciilifeform << this seems like a deviously clever notion until you recall that most of the asic miners were - quite likely deliberately - not built to last [11:50]
assbot Logged on 23-01-2016 08:59:13; punkman: "It has been quite a while since any new hardware became available, it is reasonable to assume that most small miners will have recouped the majority of what they initially outlaid for the hardware, and are now disinclined to continue ‘supporting the network’, whilst incurring unnecessary cost. So: MegaBigPowers ‘land-grab’, to acquire all this idle hashing power seems like a sm [11:50]
mircea_popescu << in other news, never trust a man with a garage. [11:51]
assbot ... ( ) [11:51]
asciilifeform (they never got the wear circuits to behave plausibly like a real-life bathtub curve, either. so the things would routinely ship with varying number of working hash cores, etc) [11:51]
mircea_popescu iirc the overall "delivered asic, all cores working" was in the <5% zone. [11:52]
asciilifeform aha. [11:52]
asciilifeform i've always wanted to do a bit of microscopy on those, see if there was a set of magicks for re-enabling the 'accidented' cores [11:52]
kakobrekla deliberately? imo overlyconfident. [11:53]
asciilifeform kakobrekla: the whole racket stood on a solid column of chump, and was designed around such [11:53]
mircea_popescu more or less. really, esp early on, it was just blindly flailing. [11:54]
kakobrekla they didnt have the time to make anything past "this will prolly work" [11:54]
mircea_popescu easy to reinterpret what memory salvaged of the midden of history, but if you were there and saw the missing 95% from that story... [11:54]
asciilifeform kakobrekla: if this were so, there would have been many asic co. sunk by a taped out dud [11:54]
asciilifeform afaik there were none. [11:54]
mircea_popescu and so there were. [11:54]
mircea_popescu ahahaha don't kid, you make my heart jump so. [11:55]
asciilifeform but i - obviously - wasn't there. [11:55]
asciilifeform nor wanted to be. [11:55]
mircea_popescu of the people who scammed their "investors, at least half, to two thirds, were scammed in turn, by their "providers". [11:55]
kakobrekla i did say probably, not possibly. [11:55]
asciilifeform yes but any public intel suggesting a taped-out total dud ? [11:55]
asciilifeform or just 'took the money & ran' [11:56]
mircea_popescu asicminer had a fully blown up run. so did bfl, twice iirc. [11:56]
mircea_popescu so did many others. [11:56]
mircea_popescu there were, up until early 2013 or so, more dead runs than live. [11:56]
asciilifeform i am specificially thinking of ~ic~ rather than ~board~ [11:56]
asciilifeform i remember very well the smoking ~boards~ [11:56]
mircea_popescu pre-packaged chips. [11:57]
kakobrekla afaik there were 'duds' i dont recall specifics from top of the head [11:57]
asciilifeform then yes. [11:57]
asciilifeform << this is a mega-l0l, worth reading! turns out, one day they decided to play 'obfuscated c contest' at ft meade [11:58]
assbot Logged on 23-01-2016 09:39:27; BingoBoingo: [11:58]
mircea_popescu actually a proper history of early mining would be a most respectable endeavour for a serious, diligent historian at this point. [11:58]
asciilifeform (srsly who the FUCK uses 'salsa' etc) [11:58]
mircea_popescu of course they're busy fucking around doing nothing much. but hey, gosplan! [11:58]
punkman I'd like to contribute more debug-related patches, could maybe split the gui-snip stuff from debug_sanity patch, and start over. [12:04]
punkman does asciilifeform like anything from djb? [12:05]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 68950 @ 0.00056063 = 38.6554 BTC [+] {2} [12:08]
* NewLiberty (~NewLibert@2602:306:b8e0:8160:1d24:166b:c99f:bb49) has joined #bitcoin-assets [12:12]
punkman interesting logging library, less than 1kloc, includes simple log rotation [12:14]
assbot GitHub - SergiusTheBest/plog: Portable and simple C++ logging library ... ( ) [12:14]
asciilifeform punkman: quite a few things [12:35]
* NewLiberty has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) [12:36]
mircea_popescu punkman start over, how you mean ? [12:37]
asciilifeform punkman: i'm a fan of the man's cryptoanalytic work. but the sv-popularity of his cipher primitives is concerning [12:37]
asciilifeform problem is that one doesn't get to 'make a name' in academe as 'cryptographer' by pushing rsa. [12:38]
asciilifeform just like you don't become a famous small arms designer by refining the kalash [12:38]
asciilifeform even if ~that would be the Right Thing~ [12:38]
* NewLiberty (~NewLibert@2602:306:b8e0:8160:1d24:166b:c99f:bb49) has joined #bitcoin-assets [12:39]
asciilifeform so he's stuck with the ecc gargle. [12:39]
asciilifeform and with devising block ciphers, which is very easy to 'do' [12:39]
asciilifeform !s from:mircea_popescu originality [12:40]
assbot 6 results for 'from:mircea_popescu originality' : [12:40]
asciilifeform ^see also [12:40]
mircea_popescu djb = bernstein ? [12:41]
asciilifeform right [12:41]
mircea_popescu guy's brilliant, hard to argue with that. but yes, seems he's being slowly ground to paste by "teh system" [12:42]
asciilifeform one way to look at it is that he isn't much more of a 'free man' than, e.g., i am [12:43]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform actually may want to write him a letter, iirc he was also all about fits in head but arrived there on slightly different path [12:43]
asciilifeform in that he has to work on certain flavours of shit icecream, in order to eat [12:43]
mircea_popescu didn't he end up basically rewriting sendmail because sendmail sucked ? [12:44]
asciilifeform aha [12:44]
punkman mircea_popescu: start over, meaning make a new debug_sanity patch with more improvements (and without the gui snipping parts bundled together) [12:44]
* DreadKnight has quit (Quit: #AncientBeast - Master Your Beasts ( )) [12:45]
mircea_popescu this with a view to better semantics, or with a view to reinstate gui ? [12:45]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: my original thumbs-down for his patch was on account of bundling multiple-unlikes [12:46]
mircea_popescu it does carry water. [12:46]
asciilifeform the vestigial wx crapolade needs to go [12:46]
asciilifeform but ~in own patch~ [12:46]
asciilifeform this makes it considerably easier to evaluate every path [12:46]
asciilifeform *patch [12:46]
mircea_popescu yeah. [12:46]
punkman both gui-snip and debug-sanity are gonna touch a lot of files though, and I would prefer to do this once [12:46]
asciilifeform 'does this do X and ONLY X' [12:46]
asciilifeform punkman: this is very much the wrong idea [12:47]
asciilifeform we aren't trying to minimize patch-line-counts AS SUCH [12:47]
mircea_popescu punkman certainly a worthy attempt, even if mod6 prolly won't be able to put it in current release. [12:47]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform well yes, but not what he said. [12:47]
mircea_popescu what i took it to mean was that if he's gonna load his head with shit, would rather do two things than one and reload [12:48]
asciilifeform ok to make the two patches in one sitting [12:48]
asciilifeform but they gotta be separate. [12:48]
mircea_popescu that small logger thing actually looks pretty good [12:48]
mircea_popescu to my documentedly noobish eye. [12:48]
punkman can do the gui-snip thing first, work is already done [12:49]
mircea_popescu incidentally, why the fuck does bitcoin have json support ? do we actually want this ? [12:49]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: it is still there because that is how the rpc thing works [12:49]
mircea_popescu yes but fuck that, we have a protocol that then imports json ? [12:49]
punkman need to have a format for api output anyway right? [12:49]
asciilifeform i very dearly wanted to rip it out, but then all the robotics folks are presently 'come to expect' will have to be scrapped. [12:50]
mircea_popescu this strikes me as the same fundamental insanity of "we'll replace bdb with leveldb in the sense that WE KEEP BOTH!!1". [12:50]
asciilifeform if you recall, i wanted to replace it with unix signals. [12:50]
mircea_popescu i do but i don't recall why i wasn't so hot about that. [12:50]
asciilifeform or at the worst, a simple telnet-type protocol [12:50]
asciilifeform because it sux [12:50]
asciilifeform but unix doesn't give us a rpc-thing that doesn't suck [12:50]
mircea_popescu yes because it sucks lol. if you're happy with that much. [12:50]
punkman standard format would be nicer than new invention [12:51]
mircea_popescu punkman only if "standard format" doesn't expand at pre-compile time into "here's a debalanced tree of 547657698 "standards"" [12:51]
asciilifeform punkman: when the standard does not fit-in-head and yields 200kB of heathen code - it can go die [12:51]
mircea_popescu it is ipso definitio not a standard. [12:51]
mircea_popescu just a glorified mess. [12:51]
punkman there are some tiny json libraries [12:51]
mircea_popescu the implementation is not the standard. [12:51]
asciilifeform punkman: any written by wot men? [12:51]
punkman no [12:52]
mircea_popescu even before wot issue considered : there's two branches to corectness. [12:52]
mircea_popescu one is code, the other standard. it helps me nothing that you've made one small if this makes the other huge. [12:52]
* frankenmint ( has joined #bitcoin-assets [12:52]
asciilifeform sorta what i meant in earlier thread, [12:52]
assbot Logged on 21-01-2016 22:16:42; asciilifeform: << yes! and you can almost ~define~ 'sane system' this way. with the caveat that it can't be a non-orthogonal fudge like a program consisting of one line 'start_bitcoind()' nor anything in that spirit. ORTHOGONAL operators. [12:52]
mircea_popescu i guess so. [12:53]
asciilifeform ~genuine~ reduction in complexity specifically excludes shenanigans where it is 'swept under the rug' and hidden somewhere else [12:53]
punkman well, something for the foundation to decide, whether json is to be kept or replaced with something else [12:56]
asciilifeform it is intrinsically retarded [12:57]
asciilifeform and the logical replacement is sexpr. [12:57]
asciilifeform which is 'standard' that fits in ONE MOTHERFUCKING PARAGRAPH [12:57]
asciilifeform and correctly implementable by a stray dog [12:58]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 88000 @ 0.00056176 = 49.4349 BTC [+] {5} [12:58]
punkman so if I talk to to bitcoind with python I get sexpr in ascii or otherwise? [12:58]
asciilifeform in ascii. [12:58]
asciilifeform json is really sexpr but was dropped as a baby [12:59]
asciilifeform all sv garbage is of this general flavour, incidentally [13:00]
punkman could have both and break compatibility later [13:00]
asciilifeform i.e. something built by the hands of ACTUAL people, that WORKED, but taken by jolt-cola-drinking jwz types and 'hacked!111 1333773d' into... what we have [13:01]
asciilifeform anyway i did not touch the json thing for the same reason i did not touch the whitespace formatting [13:02]
asciilifeform ... because it does not solve any of the dire problems of the era [13:02]
asciilifeform 'deck chairs on titanic' [13:03]
punkman what is there to do on titanic other than abandon ship? [13:04]
asciilifeform the correct model is that there are no other ships. [13:05]
asciilifeform and the ocean is made of boiling oil. [13:05]
asciilifeform << ftr i do not like this one bit. WHY ADD 1000 LINES OF ???? [13:06]
assbot Logged on 23-01-2016 15:11:54; punkman: interesting logging library, less than 1kloc, includes simple log rotation [13:06]
asciilifeform this is how we got prb. [13:06]
asciilifeform 'let's add this useful!11111 pheature' [13:06]
punkman and if prb had sane logging we wouldn't be having this discussion [13:08]
asciilifeform mno. [13:09]
* NewLiberty has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) [13:10]
asciilifeform it is bad enough that trb has 500 man-year of study baked into it. let's now add a 501st ? [13:10]
asciilifeform fuck that. [13:10]
asciilifeform ergo replacing, e.g., openssl, with a 1000 line thing THAT CAN BE UNDERSTOOD, is a worthy thing [13:11]
asciilifeform adding an ~additional~ turd to the ball of shit, is not. [13:12]
asciilifeform removing boost would be a worthy thing. BUT NOT if it multiplies the line count 2x, OR if it entails forcing gcc5 build [13:12]
asciilifeform (as discussed in the c++11 thread) [13:13]
asciilifeform ~likewise~ any change that increases substantially the number of lines written by non-wot folks, is ipso facto a loss. [13:14]
asciilifeform i thought all of this was elementarily obvious. [13:14]
asciilifeform with that in mind, YES, the logs need timestamps, or better still, an adjustable format, verbosity levels, etc. [13:15]
asciilifeform BUT NOT by adding some derp's 'log library' [13:15]
asciilifeform 'let's add the library' is, in mircea_popescu's well-chosen wordz, 'the hole through which the night slides in' [13:16]
punkman I didn't even dare suggest adding it of course! [13:17]
* xiaomorph is now known as yangwao [13:19]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 135000 @ 0.00056336 = 76.0536 BTC [+] [13:23]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 47450 @ 0.00056336 = 26.7314 BTC [+] [13:31]
* B0g4r7_ has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) [13:39]
* adlai (~adlai@unaffiliated/adlai) has joined #bitcoin-assets [13:57]
* assbot gives voice to adlai [13:59]
adlai << seems like everybody who doesn't lurk in #crypto-crackpots missed the joke [13:59]
assbot Logged on 22-01-2016 16:17:47; PeterL: << Later I realized why I missed the isomer joke: L is isomer of D, R is isomer of S, not quite interchangeable [13:59]
* SuchWow (~SuchWow@unaffiliated/suchwow) has joined #bitcoin-assets [14:11]
* TheAdversary (~adversary@unaffiliated/hasimir/bot/theadversary) has joined #bitcoin-assets [14:11]
mircea_popescu << i think this is so. [14:48]
assbot Logged on 23-01-2016 15:55:03; asciilifeform: and the logical replacement is sexpr. [14:48]
mircea_popescu heh im bashing that baby stuff. alf huffed the right paint this morning :D [14:49]
asciilifeform achtung, panzers! does ( belong to one of ye lot ? [14:50]
mircea_popescu << not so. the first step of work is cleaning out the workspace. it is the work of truly inept management to impede on this "because it does not directly contribute to productivity" [14:52]
assbot Logged on 23-01-2016 16:00:29; asciilifeform: 'deck chairs on titanic' [14:52]
* terminal ( has joined #bitcoin-assets [14:52]
mircea_popescu re BingoBoingo 's << check out the ugly head of puritanism rearing its head yet again. "if i don't enjoy anything in the world i will surely be spared doom!!1". nothing's quite as resilient as idiocy. [14:54]
assbot Ruston's Guide to Spotting and Avoiding Fatfishing | fatpeoplehate ... ( ) [14:54]
mircea_popescu << in italian accent "Did you ever think about what you're going to do on the toilet? (yelling) What are you going to do on the toilet!" [14:56]
assbot Logged on 23-01-2016 16:09:28; asciilifeform: adding an ~additional~ turd to the ball of shit, is not. [14:56]
asciilifeform l0l! is this a ref to something? [14:57]
mircea_popescu << with interpretation. [14:57]
assbot Seinfeld - Edward Scissorhands BEST SCENE EVER - YouTube ... ( ) [14:57]
mircea_popescu anyway. it's one thing to add "a library". it's another to "import this 1k lines that i read myself". [14:58]
asciilifeform if gonna add 1k lines, make it... tinyscheme-89 [15:00]
asciilifeform implement tx debugger, sane logger instrumentation, and 101 other things, IN IT [15:00]
mircea_popescu now tinyscheme may be a good import [15:00]
asciilifeform so perhaps i can now admit to having this quietly on my hdd. [15:01]
mircea_popescu but conceptually, in my head at least, more of a "bitcoind migrates into bitcoinos" thing [15:01]
asciilifeform aha. slowly cut off chunks & replace with it. [15:01]
asciilifeform until the whole thing, one fine day, starts just fine in a mildly massaged sbcl [15:01]
asciilifeform and nobody even notices the cpp is gone. [15:01]
mircea_popescu anyway, as a general point : even if you did compute a fastest route, and even if in fact you are correct (which is fundamentally an undecidable problem), there is still no reason to panic if phenomena goes a slightly more circuitous path. there are at least two good reasons, both political. one's education (ie, benefit of the ingroup), the other ... well let's just say the other's for the benefit of the outgroup. [15:02]
polarbeard s/jsonrpc/ipc socket/g [15:03]
thestringpuller asciilifeform: sbcl? [15:03]
mircea_popescu holy shit why does that substitution need recursion. [15:03]
asciilifeform thestringpuller: [15:03]
assbot ... ( ) [15:04]
asciilifeform thestringpuller: my personal favourite readily-available lisp runtime [15:04]
polarbeard and plug-in whatever you like [15:04]
thestringpuller i barely "know" C, how am I ever gonna learn LISP?!?!? [15:06]
thestringpuller LISP is like the masters saw. [15:06]
asciilifeform thestringpuller: will have to spend a weekend, possibly risk opening a book [15:06]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 123300 @ 0.00056234 = 69.3365 BTC [-] [15:08]
thestringpuller "When you handle the master carpenter's tools, chances are that you'll cut your hand." [15:09]
thestringpuller I want to be competent/sane before attempting to pick up master carpenter's tools. [15:09]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: unrelatedly, i now envision your toilet-of-the-future as looking rather like a cray-II. [15:12]
mircea_popescu lol! [15:12]
mircea_popescu for the record, no girl liked the idea. [15:12]
asciilifeform cray 1 rather [15:12]
asciilifeform oh? why not [15:12]
mircea_popescu "would this be a punishment toilet ? for like the dungeon ?" "do you think the jacuzzi is a punishment pool ?" "ewww!" [15:13]
mircea_popescu now doesn't want to go into jacuzzi. [15:13]
asciilifeform l0l! [15:14]
asciilifeform << for reference [15:14]
assbot ... ( ) [15:14]
mircea_popescu anyway, my idea was originalyl that it's a collaborative tool par excellence. girls better support each other's back, lest they fall in. [15:14]
mircea_popescu but i suspect this heavy... butted aesop is a little too hamfisted for the actual butts in question. [15:15]
asciilifeform oh huh [15:15]
asciilifeform with no backs, interesting. [15:15]
asciilifeform i really pictured more of a cray. [15:15]
asciilifeform (vs gigantic ivan iv - style cauldron) [15:15]
mircea_popescu << in other news, the new york apartment of the future. [15:16]
assbot ... ( ) [15:16]
thestringpuller << this one? [15:16]
asciilifeform thestringpuller: yes. see also earlier link. [15:16]
mircea_popescu dude speaking of "provability" bs. FSB are "provably secure" because it can be proven they're at least as hard as regular syndrome decoding. which is np complete. while we don't actually know if THAT is in fact resolvable in polynomial time or not, nevertheless... PROVEDLY SECURE!!11 [15:18]
mircea_popescu idiots. [15:18]
mircea_popescu "this bag is as heavy as that car. we don't know whether that car is just a cardboard cutout or what, but hey, provedly heavy bag! !1" [15:19]
asciilifeform don't expect ~sane~ crypto out of the leprosorium [15:19]
asciilifeform this is elementary. [15:19]
asciilifeform see also the ecc claptrap [15:19]
asciilifeform (as secure as 8x the bits of rsa!1111111) [15:19]
mircea_popescu and incidentally, as a bright mathematical mind pointed out once, "at some point the effort invested in stating rsa is 'widely researched' exceeds the effort ever expended into researching it" [15:20]
asciilifeform ^ [15:20]
mircea_popescu it's one thing when five people who spend most of their time doing things gather in bohr's outhouse and agree "x is prolly hard". [15:20]
mircea_popescu it's another... eh, anyway. what am i doing. [15:20]
asciilifeform funnily enough, we did a walkover of the shmoo talks, incl. the crackpot algebraiceraser crypto thing, at the slave galley [15:21]
asciilifeform and even there folks chortled when i asked 'notice no mention of complexity class proof or even assumption' [15:21]
mircea_popescu the one thing i wonder, asciilifeform , is why do we always talk in strawmen. [15:23]
asciilifeform hm? [15:23]
mircea_popescu remember new guy, got overwhelmed a few days back. [15:23]
asciilifeform which? [15:23]
mircea_popescu [15:24]
assbot Logged on 22-01-2016 16:43:36; AdrianG: why do you guys only speak in strawmen? [15:24]
thestringpuller if they rip out OpenSSL for libsecp256k1 won't this cause undeterministic behavior in signature checking? Or does the "comooniteee" just want to not check signatures anymore? [15:24]
asciilifeform i was not able to decipher this [15:24]
ben_vulpes << hehuahuahaehua [15:25]
assbot Logged on 23-01-2016 13:32:55; Azelphur: ;;rate RagnarDanneskjol -10 3 months of unpaid salary, will remove rating if payment ever arrives. [15:25]
ben_vulpes i mean poor Azelphur [15:25]
mircea_popescu i just read it as "the difference between one's understanding and the course requirement, call it D, is the maximal aperture past which useful metaphors (with an utility marked as U) and inept strawmen (with a deviance marked as -U) can still be distinguished" [15:26]
mircea_popescu ie, if U > D, U and U' are undiscernible. [15:26]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu had a spiffy article, 'variety speak' a while back. [15:27]
asciilifeform n00bz should not only read the logz but be grateful they don't have to learn 5,000 kanji first. [15:27]
mircea_popescu of course the correct method to learn greek consists of reading the source material and the angry german commentary in alternation. [15:28]
ben_vulpes mircea_popescu may have his reasons for being so friendly and welcoming but bearing a deep suspicion of new faces in #b-a has saved me untold heartbreak (and no doubt riches, if i were to listen to robert viragh's ilk) [15:29]
adlai << for starters, stop capitalizing it... LISP is from the same era as ALGOL and nobody uses either one today [15:29]
assbot Logged on 23-01-2016 18:03:25; thestringpuller: i barely "know" C, how am I ever gonna learn LISP?!?!? [15:29]
asciilifeform ben_vulpes: where do you suppose they put spent ninjashotguns ? [15:29]
asciilifeform or do they rebarrel'em somewhere. [15:29]
mircea_popescu in marriages. [15:29]
mircea_popescu this is the traditional pathway of the derp. spends youth being inept, adolescence being revolutionary, gets metabolized by sub-slut grade female into "family unit" [15:30]
asciilifeform adlai: eh, if everyone knew this, how would we readily distinguish n00bz in conversation.. [15:30]
ben_vulpes asciilifeform: aren't there a million open source for 'em to get cycled through? each no doubt in need of deproblematizing some codebase of genderered nouns? [15:30]
asciilifeform ben_vulpes: possibly. but iirc that one was quite ready for the glue factory [15:31]
ben_vulpes with just a touch of retraining he could be right at home in a bike advocacy group [15:31]
mircea_popescu lol [15:31]
* NewLiberty (~NewLibert@2602:306:b8e0:8160:a163:494c:c3db:84c0) has joined #bitcoin-assets [15:31]
adlai asciilifeform: because they'll mix up set, setf, get, getf, and never quite understand the long form expansion definitions [15:32]
ben_vulpes but airbnb started out with traffic calming! [15:32]
asciilifeform ben_vulpes: the kind that puts caltrops in front of trucks on a highway ? [15:32]
mircea_popescu interestingly enough, senor vulpes understands quite exactly what i don't like about the subculture. [15:32]
ben_vulpes i mean traffic calming is good for children! [15:32]
ben_vulpes you should put a wifi in that kid. [15:32]
thestringpuller adlai: I'm already lost. I'm super n00b when it comes to master's tools. [15:32]
ben_vulpes thestringpuller: oh ffs sit down with clojure for a week if you're so scared [15:33]
ben_vulpes php and c are actually bigger pains in the ass and less useable than any lisp [15:33]
adlai thestringpuller: if you really want to learn CL, get used to feeling lost because it takes a couple years / decades to reach all the keys on this piano [15:33]
asciilifeform eh no it doesn't, wtf [15:33]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 85400 @ 0.00056314 = 48.0922 BTC [+] {2} [15:33]
thestringpuller maybe not for alfie who came out the womb with a commodore64 or some shiznit [15:34]
adlai well, longer than wrapping your head around all of C or $blub [15:34]
ben_vulpes mircea_popescu: for my own benefit what do i understand about bike advocacy? [15:34]
asciilifeform 978 motherfucking keywords in ansi std. [15:34]
adlai thestringpuller: how about i just hand you and you never feel lost again [15:34]
assbot - a redirect service for Common Lisp documentation ... ( ) [15:34]
mircea_popescu with just a touch of retraining he could be right at home in a bike advocacy group < [15:34]
ben_vulpes oh the endless blithering of nonsense? [15:35]
mircea_popescu a certain sort, a certain type. [15:35]
asciilifeform incidentally it blew my mind when ben_vulpes told us that some of his workers commute on bike [15:35]
asciilifeform i can only picture a sordid 1890s shanghai [15:35]
asciilifeform or vietnam [15:35]
mircea_popescu << for my own education, why the fuck does a .h file in a 2 file project need to say #ifndef TWEETNACL_H #define TWEETNACL_H endif ? [15:35]
asciilifeform (do any of them commute by riksha ?) [15:35]
assbot ... ( ) [15:35]
adlai asciilifeform: my point is that it takes years of working in CL to have multiple opportunities to use each of those symbols to solve original problems [15:36]
ben_vulpes the notion of a functional town only mildly corrupted by cars must be as foreign to you as an atomic dirigible. [15:36]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: many folks use editors that automatically insert the doubleifdef-preventer thing [15:36]
asciilifeform ben_vulpes: aaaactually my home town had very few cars [15:36]
mircea_popescu xml-c++ [15:36]
asciilifeform but nobody but children on bicycle [15:36]
asciilifeform most folks rode trams, trolleys, a few buses. [15:36]
ben_vulpes ah well those are absent and generally reserved for the poverty stricken or physically disabled [15:37]
asciilifeform aha like here [15:37]
ben_vulpes and the cultural hatred of cars runs very deep. [15:37]
adlai asciilifeform: so amsterdam must literally be the circles of hell for you :P [15:37]
asciilifeform trains in d.c. are interesting in that they carry folks from hobo to gs-15 [15:37]
ben_vulpes it'll be rather easy to turn that into a bloodthirsty hunt for californians alter. [15:37]
ben_vulpes later* [15:37]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 53804 @ 0.00056336 = 30.311 BTC [+] [15:37]
thestringpuller why is everyone hating on cyclist? you alfie of all people stuck in the horrid traffic of DC on a daily basis. [15:37]
thestringpuller in peak traffic takes just as long to travel to work on bike as by car [15:38]
asciilifeform thestringpuller: i've nothing against it per se but it is firmly linked in my head with the third world [15:38]
mircea_popescu because he's poor, young and in the way. [15:38]
ben_vulpes he can't imagine a situation in which people are not condemned to his own version of hell. [15:38]
asciilifeform ^^^ [15:38]
thestringpuller i'd rather just not sit in traffic and get more fat, that is one step above purgatory. [15:38]
adlai thestringpuller: (althoug i am not an exception to ) [15:38]
assbot Logged on 15-01-2016 06:47:07; adlai: buy a bike, you'll learn more about trading and addiction from not getting run over than you will from losing money on plebian status symbols [15:38]
assbot Logged on 23-01-2016 18:34:01; asciilifeform: but nobody but children on bicycle [15:39]
asciilifeform as a driver, i always despised the self-righteous pedaller who was convinced that he 'saved mother earth' [15:39]
ben_vulpes no, just his spine. [15:39]
asciilifeform does pedal man know how much fuel is wasted by the mile-long column stuck behind him ? [15:39]
ben_vulpes this is a hallmark of a miserable place to live. [15:39]
mircea_popescu i never lived anywhere that wouldn't have just splattered the derp. [15:39]
mircea_popescu nor do i see why i would. [15:39]
ben_vulpes sane places seperate the traffic. [15:39]
asciilifeform if bicyclist is permitted on a public street, so should horse ! [15:39]
polarbeard so now driving cars is altruism [15:39]
asciilifeform i would happily commute on horse. [15:39]
thestringpuller asciilifeform: this mile long column exist regardless of cyclist in my neck of the woods [15:39]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 40100 @ 0.00056336 = 22.5907 BTC [+] [15:39]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform you ever brushed a horse ? [15:39]
ben_vulpes and as a matter of fact horses /are/ allowed on the road. [15:40]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: not once. [15:40]
ben_vulpes and fwiw i'd rather ride a horse too. [15:40]
asciilifeform ben_vulpes: depends on locale [15:40]
adlai recently tlv municipality outlawed horse-driven antique furniture carts ("alte zachen"), yet another law nobody cares about [15:40]
asciilifeform horse is not permitted here except when used by police [15:40]
thestringpuller ben_vulpes: there is a d00d who sold his car for horse at livestock auction where my gf lives. [15:40]
mircea_popescu yeah well. horse maintenance is a lotta work. the whole horseback thing is a honest signal of a hierarchical society. [15:40]
asciilifeform auto is not so much less work [15:40]
ben_vulpes mircea_popescu: met the horse people by the river yet? [15:40]
thestringpuller thing is actually pretty fast, but upkeep seems a bit high, and of course the thing eventually dies [15:41]
mircea_popescu ben_vulpes the polo thing you mean ? [15:41]
ben_vulpes nono [15:41]
ben_vulpes the people who live by the river plate [15:41]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform somewhat less work, and importantly machineable. [15:41]
ben_vulpes and who raise their children on horses. [15:41]
mircea_popescu i dun think so. [15:41]
ben_vulpes very nice people. [15:41]
ben_vulpes put together a lovely parillada. [15:41]
ben_vulpes have approximately zero pesos to rub together. [15:41]
mircea_popescu any hot gypo chicks ? [15:42]
ben_vulpes met them through a south african who coached the greek olympic polo? dressage? teams before greece stopped paying for niceties like that. [15:43]
ben_vulpes i'm sure you can find cooze wherever [15:43]
mircea_popescu ;;ud cooze [15:43]
gribble | A cooze is a superficial, shallow, provincial, and generally ignorant girl, who is so intellectually and socially repulsive, that their only r... [15:43]
mircea_popescu check it out, that's a new one. [15:43]
ben_vulpes also wrong. [15:43]
ben_vulpes shorthand in my world for cunt. [15:44]
mircea_popescu what's all this "Society" so and so talk anyway. [15:44]
asciilifeform ben_vulpes: i thought it was traditionally 'cunt with the rifling worn off' [15:44]
ben_vulpes well it's urban dictionary, they're obsessed with their betters [15:44]
mircea_popescu ben_vulpes this wouldn't be a result of tarantino-cultism would it ? [15:45]
ben_vulpes asciilifeform: can be. context dependent. above usage is just assumption that mircea_popescu can magic gurlz out of the air in bsas gutter, river plate shores, nile and probably inside the pyramids even [15:45]
mircea_popescu one of his worse monologues. [15:45]
ben_vulpes which'd that be? [15:45]
mircea_popescu "Ok, let me tell ya what "Like a Virgin"'s about." [15:45]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform except cunt's not made out of soap, to wear off. it strengthens through usage. [15:46]
asciilifeform work-hardens ? [15:46]
asciilifeform like aluminum ? [15:46]
mircea_popescu pretty much. [15:46]
asciilifeform l0l [15:46]
ben_vulpes i swear we've done this thread [15:46]
mircea_popescu i think we might also do it again! [15:47]
asciilifeform until hard. [15:47]
ben_vulpes tonight, tonight... [15:47]
mircea_popescu imaqine all the people... [15:47]
mircea_popescu living in harmoneeee [15:47]
ben_vulpes hey y'all might appreciate my latest gentoo quest oopsie [15:48]
ben_vulpes i got the whole orchestra wired up, stage3 installed, everything mounted, uefi boot boss vanquished [15:49]
ben_vulpes and let the fucking laptop run out of batteries 2 seconds after running `emerge dhcpcd` [15:49]
ben_vulpes and this /retarded/ home router does not want to accept static IP declarations. [15:50]
mircea_popescu wait what ? [15:50]
asciilifeform ben_vulpes: a hundy buys you a pf-capable box with 3 GB eth jacks [15:50]
mircea_popescu what router is that. [15:51]
ben_vulpes actiontec pk5001a [15:52]
asciilifeform ew [15:52]
ben_vulpes asciilifeform: would be horrified at the state of my internal network [15:52]
ben_vulpes probably everone [15:52]
mircea_popescu so throw it out, today. [15:53]
ben_vulpes look here i only recently decided to move the toilet out of the kitchen okay [15:53]
mircea_popescu ahahahaha what. [15:53]
ben_vulpes you neckbeards with a decade of setting up your own personal infrastructure have completely forgotten what it's like to be a clueless noob [15:53]
asciilifeform phun phakt, my father's childhood was in a flat where the toilet ~literally~ was in the kitchen, behind a curtain. [15:53]
mircea_popescu "i one day stumbled on this irc channel, and it changed my life. #totallynotacult." [15:54]
* ben_vulpes lets mircea_popescu say it [15:54]
mircea_popescu speaking of insane idiocies. one apt i'm leasing i nthe fabulous ba has the following INSANE arrangement : two bedrooms, united by a 3x3 hallway, off one side of which is a 3x4 bathroom, and off the corner of which is... ANOTHER, tiny, 1x2 bathroom. [15:55]
mircea_popescu because making a proper, 6x4 bathroom to unite two bedrooms is EVIL [15:55]
ben_vulpes on the flip side i have a far better understanding of how linux machines boot now. so, not a particularly horrendous waste of time. [15:55]
mircea_popescu and must have little hallway. [15:55]
mircea_popescu idiots. [15:55]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: it was prolly intended for 2+ humanoids who don't fuck [15:55]
mircea_popescu if i end up buying it i'm so tearing down that shit... [15:56]
asciilifeform we have gigantic towers of these very same things here, and more being built as we speak [15:56]
asciilifeform !s communal [15:56]
assbot 19 results for 'communal' : [15:56]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform the notion of sharing space and not fucking is almost as ridiculous as the notion of female wearing clothes before 30. [15:56]
mircea_popescu i get it, if you're visiting the 3 floor, 100k sqft country house of the marquis de Q you might not be fucking EVERYONE there. [15:57]
mircea_popescu but apartments ? gimme a break. [15:57]
ben_vulpes [15:57]
assbot Micro apartments as small as 150 square feet NW Portland | ... ( ) [15:57]
asciilifeform l0l tokyo [15:57]
ben_vulpes and [15:58]
ben_vulpes [15:58]
assbot Tiny space, big price: Micro-apartments in Portland ... ( ) [15:58]
ben_vulpes eh it's not going to last [15:58]
ben_vulpes epic inventory hitting the market q4 2016 q2 2017 [15:58]
mircea_popescu uh. 150 sq ft ? [15:58]
asciilifeform inventory of what? [15:58]
mircea_popescu so basically living in a bathroom [15:58]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: jail [15:59]
ben_vulpes asciilifeform: mas apartmentos y condos [15:59]
asciilifeform except in jail they feed you and you (in most of usa) don't have to work [15:59]
asciilifeform so this is worse. [15:59]
asciilifeform ben_vulpes: that price floor is made of unobtainium and is going nowhere [15:59]
mircea_popescu ben_vulpes everything inconvenient lasts in socialism. [15:59]
asciilifeform because if it caves in, the whole thing caves [15:59]
ben_vulpes asciilifeform: portland goes through a boom-bust property cycle at about twice the frequency of the national market [16:00]
asciilifeform << linked from same rag. по просьбам трудящихся !111111 (tm) (r) [16:00]
assbot 'We the People' petition White House to arrest Bundy ... ( ) [16:00]
mircea_popescu lmao. [16:01]
ben_vulpes pretty routine to see 20% property value declines top to bottom [16:01]
asciilifeform ben_vulpes: so at what point in this supposed cycle can i walk in and buy a livable HOUSE for 20k? [16:01]
asciilifeform rounding error. [16:01]
ben_vulpes 2% is a rounding error, not 20. [16:01]
mircea_popescu ben_vulpes you have any idea what housing cost in the 80s ? [16:01]
ben_vulpes oh hilariously less [16:01]
mircea_popescu so yeah. 20% is a rounding error. [16:02]
ben_vulpes i'm not trying to argue against the property bezzle! [16:02]
asciilifeform ben_vulpes: the fluctuations come nowhere near making an actual palpable difference to anybody, ever. [16:02]
asciilifeform (it isn't as if they were of any serious amplitude, or even fluctuated in any particular phase to salaries, interest rates, or other relevant number) [16:03]
ben_vulpes my parents bought their current residence in...94? for 230k, are now batting away offers for 900+. i relent on the rounding error. [16:03]
mircea_popescu buy in 1981 for 35k, sell in 1994 for 230k, buy in 1994 for 230k sell in 2006 for 1.2mn [16:05]
mircea_popescu inflation over 25 years is a neat 3500% [16:05]
mircea_popescu 15% a year or thereabouts. [16:05]
asciilifeform 'how the world works!111' (tm) [16:05]
mircea_popescu so you took out a year and six weeks, once. rounding error. [16:05]
ben_vulpes okay okay! [16:06]
asciilifeform from billboard on other side of my commute: 'new townhomes in low 600s !' [16:07]
asciilifeform ^ in godforsaken piece of shit street [16:07]
thestringpuller asciilifeform: is crack still going on in DC? or do the white people still live on the otherside of the ptomic [16:08]
* hanbot (~hanbot@unaffiliated/hanbot) has joined #bitcoin-assets [16:08]
* assbot gives voice to hanbot [16:08]
asciilifeform thestringpuller: there are upscale white folk in dc now [16:08]
* terminal has quit (Remote host closed the connection) [16:09]
mircea_popescu and meanwhile, when i visited the us people generally tipped 10% and derps were derping about how it's really not enough and should be more like 15%. incidentally looked on reddit the other day, "Everyone agrees" it should be over 20%. [16:11]
mircea_popescu soon enough it'll just be "double the bill". [16:11]
mats nice [16:12]
thestringpuller mircea_popescu: you sound like that d00d in pulp fiction who doesn't believe in tipping. [16:13]
thestringpuller Buscemi was it? [16:13]
* terminal ( has joined #bitcoin-assets [16:13]
mircea_popescu spare me, i don't believe in hiring your shitty workers on my dime. i'll take a slavegirl with, and she can wait on me. your inept "staff" can go hang, how abvout that ? [16:14]
mircea_popescu run a fucking business rather than a morroccan tourist trap and have some fucking self respect. [16:14]
thestringpuller p. much right? [16:15]
mircea_popescu p much. [16:15]
thestringpuller waiters are generally shitty at their job too, cause "I'll be an actress one day!" [16:15]
thestringpuller In US tho, they spit in your food when you insult them with low tips. [16:16]
ben_vulpes "no, honey, we're not going out. you cook better, plate better, and do it all in the nude. i am not paying for designer lights, too much salt, and shitty hipster wait staff drinking habits. plus you'll want to tip 20% for completely miserable service and i just got my shoes off." [16:17]
mircea_popescu p much. [16:19]
thestringpuller That's why in house chef's have become more popular than eating out. [16:19]
* terminal has quit (Remote host closed the connection) [16:19]
thestringpuller or at least in whites-ville suburbia where I live [16:20]
mircea_popescu i imagine a larger driver is that a) "restaurants" saw the "opportunity" to turn into caterers and "prepare" pre-prepared meals and b) nobody trusts their fucking acquisition process. [16:21]
mircea_popescu "you wanna cook for me, pick ingredients from over here" is the main driver, i expect. [16:22]
thestringpuller For me I just have my own menu and tell chef "fix X here is money to go buy groceries. Don't get the cheap stuff." [16:23]
thestringpuller I should learn to cook. But I'm an extremely fickle eater. [16:23]
mircea_popescu for the same deal you could just get a poor gf. [16:23]
mircea_popescu i suppose ~half the marriages in the world today happen about like that. [16:24]
thestringpuller She doesn't cook as well as my buddy who went to culinary school. [16:24]
mircea_popescu well, get a competent immigrant. ukr chicks cook well. [16:24]
thestringpuller aha. I really should just learn to _actually_ cook. But I don't even know what foods I like. [16:25]
mircea_popescu travel & find out. [16:25]
thestringpuller when I'm no longer a USian slave I do plan to find out ;) [16:25]
mircea_popescu in other news, [16:26]
assbot ... ( ) [16:26]
thestringpuller Eventually there'll be enough good porn links in the logs to have a !bait command [16:27]
* Xuthus (~x@unaffiliated/xuthus) has joined #bitcoin-assets [16:32]
ben_vulpes from:mircea_popescu [16:33]
ben_vulpes ain't hard [16:33]
ben_vulpes in other apple nyooz, 'el capitan' ships with a new program 'photos' [16:49]
ben_vulpes that starts up, shits 40gb of files to disk immediately while importing the classic 'iphoto' library, and has now been spinning on the import for 2 straight days now. [16:49]
ben_vulpes fuck these people. [16:49]
* Naphex has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) [16:52]
* NewLiberty has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) [16:59]
ben_vulpes ah it was punkman with the logs [16:59]
fluffypony with the candlestick? [17:02]
deedbot- [cascadian hacker] The measure of a state is its ability to deny benefits to outsiders - [17:03]
ben_vulpes fluffypony: in the server room [17:06]
fluffypony heh [17:06]
ben_vulpes huh shoulda fixed the date on that wotpost while i was at it [17:06]
ben_vulpes O WELL [17:06]
asciilifeform << i did not notice this [17:08]
assbot Logged on 23-01-2016 19:47:00; ben_vulpes: that starts up, shits 40gb of files to disk immediately while importing the classic 'iphoto' library, and has now been spinning on the import for 2 straight days now. [17:08]
asciilifeform perhaps because i did not use the old sack'o'garbage ? [17:08]
asciilifeform nor the new ? [17:08]
ben_vulpes asciilifeform: i imagine you don't use iphoto [17:08]
asciilifeform wtf does it even do [17:08]
ben_vulpes open, see [17:08]
asciilifeform take photos with the cruddy webcam in the machine ? [17:09]
* ben_vulpes shakes head slowly [17:09]
ben_vulpes that'd be photo booth [17:09]
ben_vulpes oh ho ho [17:09]
ben_vulpes i discovered my photo booth archives from freshman year [17:09]
ben_vulpes oh the tits [17:09]
asciilifeform so tell me what makes this app necessary [17:10]
ben_vulpes gimp is not a thing on macos? [17:10]
ben_vulpes necessary is a stretch [17:11]
ben_vulpes iphoto i'm sure will eventually fall to quest of removing toilets from places they should not be [17:11]
ben_vulpes handy categorizer-of-photos-by-exif is probably the best justification for my continued use of it [17:11]
* ben_vulpes takes a lot of photos [17:12]
ben_vulpes has since...02? [17:12]
ben_vulpes would pull down the negative books from that era but they're in the family fire-proof safe [17:12]
ben_vulpes yes, i store the negatives, wtf with this printed photo nonsense. [17:13]
* wywialm (~mateusz@unaffiliated/wywialm) has joined #bitcoin-assets [17:13]
ben_vulpes on the flip side i do *not* store raw digital photos. [17:14]
ben_vulpes absurd waste of bits. photography is lossy, deal. [17:14]
* adlai has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) [17:14]
ben_vulpes << recurring thread at $shop: encourage people to customize for personal ergonomics and efficiency or attempt to cultivate a standard environment for ease of collaboration on each other's devices? [17:15]
assbot Logged on 23-01-2016 17:49:32; mircea_popescu: << not so. the first step of work is cleaning out the workspace. it is the work of truly inept management to impede on this "because it does not directly contribute to productivity" [17:15]
ben_vulpes probably unresolved because we're coolies working oars with illusions of being graham's "six smart hackers in a room" [17:16]
ben_vulpes << you are actually far more likely to lose a hand on the table saw your friend keeps in the garage that he doesn't know how to teach you to use than planing something flat on the master's shaper. [17:18]
assbot Logged on 23-01-2016 18:06:52; thestringpuller: "When you handle the master carpenter's tools, chances are that you'll cut your hand." [17:18]
ben_vulpes mostly because the shaper is a 5hp terror of cutter-face that'll make you think seven times before even beginning to cut, whereas your friend's table saw doesn't have the sawstop that your *other* idiot friend bought. [17:18]
ben_vulpes << obligatory slo-mo sawstop [17:19]
assbot Finger into Sawstop at slow motion - YouTube ... ( ) [17:19]
* raedah has quit (Quit: Leaving) [17:26]
* NewLiberty (~NewLibert@2602:306:b8e0:8160:a163:494c:c3db:84c0) has joined #bitcoin-assets [17:32]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 69200 @ 0.00055893 = 38.678 BTC [-] {3} [17:33]
punkman "SawStop has provoked opposition from the Power Tool Institute (PTI), which represents Black & Decker, Hilti, Hitachi Koki, Makita, Metabo, Bosch, Techtronic Industries and WMH Tool Group." [17:34]
punkman "In April 2008 they told Congress that SawStop's braking system is: dangerous because it requires the user to come in contact with the blade before activating; unproven, particularly in terms of durability; prone to false trips caused by commonly available wet and green wood; potentially vulnerable to latent damage that cannot be inspected and may cause a hazard; costly to the user because once [17:36]
punkman activated, saw blade and cartridge must be replaced; and significantly more expensive, ranging from a minimum of 25 percent and ranging upwards depending on saw type" [17:36]
punkman lulzy [17:36]
punkman "The PTI objects to the licensing necessary due to the "more than 50 patents" related to SawStop's braking system; such costs "would destroy the market for the cheapest, most popular saws, adding $100 or more to the price of consumer models that typically sell for less than $200." In response, their members developed "new plastic guards to shield table saw users from the dangers of a spinning [17:37]
punkman blade". PTI says "its member companies have received no reports of injuries on [the 750,000] table saws with the new guard design."" [17:37]
ben_vulpes punkman: they're fighting him because he kicked their ass on the licensing front [17:38]
ben_vulpes and the plastic guard is a joke, comes off at the first opportunity. [17:38]
punkman I bet it is [17:38]
punkman but can you really trust a carpenter with all 10 fingers? [17:38]
* terminal ( has joined #bitcoin-assets [17:40]
shinohai I think I saw this. Said guard does destroy the blade in the process. [17:42]
mats i learned today that the 82nd recently retrofitted their M4s to full auto [17:42]
ben_vulpes shinohai: i'd rather lose a blade than a finger. [17:44]
ben_vulpes in any event i'm long out of that line of work, and for good reason. [17:45]
asciilifeform !s sawstop [17:45]
assbot 0 results for 'sawstop' : [17:45]
asciilifeform hm [17:45]
asciilifeform short story, the shits tried to make their PATENTED thing MANDATORY [17:46]
asciilifeform and when the whole industry, predictably, tried to push back, 'oh noez they WANT your fingers chopped!1111' [17:46]
* terminal has quit (Remote host closed the connection) [17:46]
asciilifeform mats: was there ever a real rationale for the 3-round burst thing at all ? [17:47]
ben_vulpes mandatory? oh do cite plz [17:47]
mats asciilifeform: suppressive fire [17:47]
BingoBoingo << longer, but narrower [17:48]
assbot Logged on 23-01-2016 14:31:04; mircea_popescu: well yes. 39 is the old ak/sks russian thing. nato has a bigger one. [17:48]
mats what a massive waste of money for a) retrofit b) encouraging people to rambo [17:48]
asciilifeform mats: suppressive fire would be an argument for ordinary full auto, nein ? [17:48]
ben_vulpes ibd [17:48]
ben_vulpes that's hilarious [17:48]
ben_vulpes hey totally valid business strategy under gosplan--get yer shit mandated for use [17:49]
punkman ah now it makes more sense [17:50]
mats asciilifeform: well, yeah. burst is pretty good in close quarters [17:50]
mats the round itself is pretty light and you can control the grouping with practice [17:50]
asciilifeform ben_vulpes: << randomly picked summary [17:50]
assbot More SawStop BS | Toolmonger ... ( ) [17:50]
ben_vulpes meanwhile found it [17:50]
asciilifeform mats: i was asking about the 3-round limit [17:50]
* jixei (~jixei___@2607:fb90:427:1e9e:f31a:8995:d73b:22b6) has joined #bitcoin-assets [17:51]
asciilifeform i found it a puzzling thing, esp. given as nato world uses professional soldiers rather than orcish conscripts, the latter presumably cannot be trained to let go of the trigger [17:51]
punkman what's with the pharma spam in that article [17:52]
asciilifeform punkman: never seen a blog gone to seed before ? [17:52]
mats most people i've run into have been trained to exclusively use semi auto [17:55]
* Cory has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) [17:55]
asciilifeform how do you lay suppressive fire with semi ? ww1 volley style ? [17:55]
mats and some high speed units that have MOUT missions will teach burst in cqb [17:55]
mats and traditionally folks are taught that suppressive fire is for the SAW gunner [17:57]
BingoBoingo lol, yeah this idiocy exists everywhere [17:58]
assbot Logged on 23-01-2016 17:52:11; mircea_popescu: re BingoBoingo 's << check out the ugly head of puritanism rearing its head yet again. "if i don't enjoy anything in the world i will surely be spared doom!!1". nothing's quite as resilient as idiocy. [17:58]
* joshbuddy (~josh@wikimedia/Joshbuddy) has joined #bitcoin-assets [18:00]
* Cory (~C@unaffiliated/cory) has joined #bitcoin-assets [18:03]
BingoBoingo << I have no recollection of what it was that flipped that paranoia switches when he was PM'ing me drunk, sober reading the logs unrevealing, but I am now very glad that breaker flipped. [18:04]
assbot Logged on 23-01-2016 18:26:38; ben_vulpes: mircea_popescu may have his reasons for being so friendly and welcoming but bearing a deep suspicion of new faces in #b-a has saved me untold heartbreak (and no doubt riches, if i were to listen to robert viragh's ilk) [18:04]
* justanotheruser has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) [18:04]
asciilifeform BingoBoingo: reading the log i posted as his rating was not enough ? [18:04]
BingoBoingo asciilifeform: Not Robert V, The ragnar dude [18:05]
asciilifeform ah [18:05]
BingoBoingo The one who came with various promises of toil so can eat while hodl [18:05]
BingoBoingo At least it is one less ammends to make when step 9 comes around [18:06]
danielpbarron << that's exactly what I had imagined [18:07]
assbot Logged on 23-01-2016 18:12:25; mircea_popescu: anyway, my idea was originalyl that it's a collaborative tool par excellence. girls better support each other's back, lest they fall in. [18:07]
* adlie (~adlie@unaffiliated/adlai) has joined #bitcoin-assets [18:09]
* justanotheruser (~Justan@unaffiliated/justanotheruser) has joined #bitcoin-assets [18:09]
punkman [18:09]
assbot Firearms gang's glamorous assistant who posed in provocative selfie with AK-47 jailed for 10 years - Mirror Online ... ( ) [18:09]
* Xuthus has quit (Quit: Xuthus) [18:10]
* justanotheruser has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) [18:14]
ben_vulpes dafuq is a deactivated weapon [18:15]
BingoBoingo << Here horse is most privileged. Permitted on sidewalk, bike lanes, and road proper. Only limit on their popularity is pooper scooper laws. [18:16]
assbot Logged on 23-01-2016 18:37:54; asciilifeform: horse is not permitted here except when used by police [18:16]
* justanotheruser (~Justan@unaffiliated/justanotheruser) has joined #bitcoin-assets [18:20]
* wywialm has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) [18:25]
* NewLiberty has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) [18:29]
BingoBoingo ben_vulpes: "deactivated" typically means barrel filled with lead and various parts molested to place it substantially far from being a weapon capable of operation. Reactivating mean replacing parts. [18:31]
asciilifeform ben_vulpes: museum weapon [18:32]
* TheRealJohnGalt (uid29986@gateway/web/ has joined #bitcoin-assets [18:33]
* TheRealJohnGalt has quit (Changing host) [18:33]
* TheRealJohnGalt (uid29986@unaffiliated/therealjohngalt) has joined #bitcoin-assets [18:33]
* TheRealJohnGalt has quit (Changing host) [18:33]
* TheRealJohnGalt (uid29986@gateway/web/ has joined #bitcoin-assets [18:33]
BingoBoingo Also that. [18:33]
BingoBoingo For a while many of the fine mail order retailers of 'Murica actually marketed many of these museum weapons in their pages. Most have moved on from that though. [18:35]
* joshbuddy has quit (Quit: joshbuddy) [18:42]
BingoBoingo [18:42]
assbot JL: Neanderthal Idiots in Harm City ... ( ) [18:42]
BingoBoingo [18:44]
assbot Articles: Sympathy for the Devil... But None for White Victims of Violence ... ( ) [18:45]
* joshbuddy (~josh@wikimedia/Joshbuddy) has joined #bitcoin-assets [18:45]
BingoBoingo "When one boy snarled she should go back to India, she told him that under his argument he should go back to Africa. That cost her a disciplinary inquiry for 'racism'. She was also hauled in for suspected 'racism' when she used the technical term "negate" in her class -- and a black girl took it as an epithet and brought her hell-raising mother to school to confront her in the principal's office. " [18:46]
* soypirate has quit (Remote host closed the connection) [18:49]
BingoBoingo ;;ticker --market all [18:56]
gribble Bitstamp BTCUSD last: 390.36, vol: 7889.73415043 | BTC-E BTCUSD last: 393.0, vol: 5116.00628 | Bitfinex BTCUSD last: 389.79, vol: 25994.71324663 | CampBX BTCUSD last: 352.0, vol: 8.10773217 | BTCChina BTCUSD last: 392.84704, vol: 78857.98570000 | Kraken BTCUSD last: 390.8, vol: 372.47406101 | Bitcoin-Central BTCUSD last: 399.40716801, vol: 19.80240217 | Volume-weighted last average: (1 more message) [18:56]
BingoBoingo ;;more [18:57]
gribble 392.007608699 [18:57]
BingoBoingo ;;bc,stats [18:57]
gribble Current Blocks: 394695 | Current Difficulty: 1.1335429980147113E11 | Next Difficulty At Block: 395135 | Next Difficulty In: 440 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 2 days, 12 hours, 41 minutes, and 22 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: None | Estimated Percent Change: None [18:57]
ben_vulpes << citation [18:59]
assbot Logged on 08-01-2016 00:12:37; asciilifeform: and even not considering this absurdity, you would have same problem as vasectomy patient (the sperm gets reabsorbed and your immune system begins to generate antibodies against it. with bonus measurable extra risk of alzheimer's) [18:59]
ben_vulpes ? [18:59]
* Cory has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) [19:01]
* asciilifeform entirely snowed in, finally [19:03]
asciilifeform ben_vulpes: you will have to unearth the thing yourself [19:03]
mats stuck at work, asciilifeform ? [19:03]
asciilifeform mats: nah [19:03]
* Cory (~C@unaffiliated/cory) has joined #bitcoin-assets [19:04]
mats fortunate [19:04]
ben_vulpes huh [19:05]
thestringpuller ben_vulpes: see PM [19:05]
ben_vulpes for someone reason vasalgel is being pushed as an alternative to risug [19:05]
BingoBoingo,f_auto,fl_progressive,q_80,w_800/klka9zgkgsp0qhksprw8.jpg << US cops now doing the stupid "gansta grip" [19:05]
assbot ... ( ) [19:06]
ben_vulpes ty thestringpuller [19:06]
mats i feel bad for the pizza guy that has to drive here in 45 mins [19:06]
BingoBoingo [19:07]
assbot Oberlin's president refuses to negotiate with student list of demands ... ( ) [19:07]
BingoBoingo "The 14-page list of demands at Oberlin was detailed and contained many controversial items. Among other things, it demanded the immediate firing of some Oberlin employees, the immediate tenuring of some faculty members, specific curricular changes, a review and possible revision of the grading system (to be overseen by students), the creation of "safe spaces" for black students in at least three buildings on campus, the creation [19:08]
BingoBoingo of a program to enroll recently released prisoners from a nearby prison as undergraduates, divestment from Israel, and a requirement that black student leaders be paid $8.20 an hour for their organizing efforts." [19:08]
mircea_popescu <<< blockchain crapologies ? [19:09]
assbot Logged on 23-01-2016 19:47:00; ben_vulpes: that starts up, shits 40gb of files to disk immediately while importing the classic 'iphoto' library, and has now been spinning on the import for 2 straight days now. [19:09]
mircea_popescu BingoBoingo lol whence the spunk ? blackdemandsmatter! [19:11]
mircea_popescu oh wait, Marvin Krislov. almost russian! [19:11]
BingoBoingo Nah, Oberlin jack off [19:11]
BingoBoingo It's Oberlin though so they've been enabling this shit for decades [19:11]
mircea_popescu << the irony. [19:12]
assbot The Next Twenty-five Years ... ( ) [19:12]
asciilifeform one wonders, why not 'the next twenty-five thousand years' [19:13]
mircea_popescu because "progress". [19:14]
asciilifeform ogress. [19:14]
* frankenmint ( has left #bitcoin-assets [19:14]
mircea_popescu well yeah. any sort of longer stretch is either inacceptably unprogressive or outright ridiculous. [19:14]
mircea_popescu consider : "so we'll have 3500% inflation over the next 25 years." "wait, that coems to ONLY 15% a year ? TOO SMALL!!1" [19:15]
mircea_popescu sure baby. now do 150% a year for 25`000 years. [19:15]
ben_vulpes oho i'm going to have a blast with those demands later [19:15]
* asciilifeform just finished transplanting the switch under 'printscreen' to under spacebar [19:15]
asciilifeform so nice to have industrial soldering iron at last, heats up in maybe 5sec [19:16]
mircea_popescu "wait, that coems to ONLY 15% a year ? TOO SMALL!!1" <<< meant to be "only 150%", cuz nigga can't exponentiate, divides instead. [19:16]
mircea_popescu ben_vulpes so you starting your own "drunken mousy middle chalss chick at college" tumblr ? [19:17]
* jixei has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) [19:17]
ben_vulpes waiwut? [19:18]
BingoBoingo Further ButtFurry lulz, Want to boost block size, but... [19:18]
mircea_popescu i dunno, jus going through logs. [19:18]
assbot Cryptolution comments on "Consensus Round Table" meeting in Miami going on now ... ( ) [19:18]
BingoBoingo "This meeting has reached a maximum of 50 participants. Please try again later." [19:18]
ben_vulpes in reference to? [19:18]
mircea_popescu [19:18]
assbot Logged on 23-01-2016 20:06:49; ben_vulpes: i discovered my photo booth archives from freshman year [19:18]
assbot Logged on 23-01-2016 19:31:10; ben_vulpes: from:mircea_popescu [19:18]
ben_vulpes nah, just giving the botmakers lurking a tip on how to automate the baitprocurement [19:20]
mircea_popescu <<< i wouldn't buy a thing with "SawStop (tm)" and i certainly don't want to HAVE to. [19:24]
assbot Logged on 23-01-2016 20:35:44; ben_vulpes: punkman: they're fighting him because he kicked their ass on the licensing front [19:24]
asciilifeform ^ [19:24]
asciilifeform it is worse than that mercedes that brakes by itself. [19:24]
mircea_popescu quite. no rule everyone must run a saw. [19:25]
mircea_popescu << and this to me just reads "we gave up on learning any aim". [19:25]
assbot Logged on 23-01-2016 20:39:46; mats: i learned today that the 82nd recently retrofitted their M4s to full auto [19:25]
mircea_popescu oddly related to the saw thing. [19:25]
* ben_vulpes admittedly has difficulty pulling head out of workplace safety mindset [19:26]
mircea_popescu <<< yes. [19:26]
assbot Logged on 23-01-2016 20:44:26; asciilifeform: mats: was there ever a real rationale for the 3-round burst thing at all ? [19:26]
asciilifeform actually it suggests usg confidence that it will ~never~ suffer shortages of ammo [19:26]
asciilifeform even localized [19:26]
mircea_popescu ben_vulpes workplace safety != this just like domestic faithfulness != chastity belts. [19:26]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform can't fucking aim that bs. [19:27]
ben_vulpes mircea_popescu: wut? [19:27]
mats its a change that does make rifle teams more flexible [19:28]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: full auto is for suppressive fire, just needs to go in the general direction of the enemy, nein ? [19:28]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform but ONLY full auto means you can't do most of the things you actually want to do. [19:28]
mircea_popescu you want suppressive fire get a fucking platform. [19:28]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: m16 was never 'only' [19:28]
mircea_popescu what the fuck are you going to do with a pos hot rifle that only fires full auto in the remains of a town ? [19:28]
mats although the effect is psychological and may not work against a trained enemy [19:28]
mircea_popescu shoot yourself and be done with the misery, i guess. [19:28]
asciilifeform it was traditionally select b/w single and auto [19:29]
mircea_popescu from what i understood it went full auto ? [19:29]
mircea_popescu or do i misunderstand ? [19:29]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: they removed the 3-round burst thing that was put in instead of auto in the '90s [19:29]
mircea_popescu mats and "trained" in this context merely means experienced. [19:29]
asciilifeform it had a clockwork gadget that fired 3s [19:29]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform like every civilised everyone everwhere. aim the first. [19:29]
mircea_popescu by the time the 3rd went off, your barrel is so far up high it no longer matters. [19:30]
mircea_popescu save on the heat. [19:30]
asciilifeform bbbut what if spinnin' round & round, 'fooor piglet' [19:30]
asciilifeform !s for piglet [19:30]
assbot 5 results for 'for piglet' : [19:30]
* Keefe_ is now known as Keefe [19:32]
ben_vulpes << surprisingly close read of the logs by...whom now? [19:33]
assbot Logged on 21-01-2016 15:24:17; thestringpuller: LOL >> "Don't forget Mr Popescu, who loves to harp on about how Bitcoin is not for the unwashed masses, just two weeks ago had a hugely embarrassing fiasco where he revealed he hadn't the faintest idea how Bitcoin transactions work. [19:33]
mats i personally like burst [19:33]
mats but the complexity it adds, usually isn't worth it [19:33]
ben_vulpes what, but the complexity of stack randomization /is/?! [19:34]
mats i don't make the rules, man [19:34]
assbot [MPEX] [S.NSA] 120000 @ 0.000087 = 10.44 BTC [-] [19:35]
asciilifeform l0l l00ks like jurov found a buyer [19:36]
ben_vulpes 87? [19:37]
ben_vulpes wow [19:37]
ben_vulpes am i missing an order of magnitude here? [19:37]
ben_vulpes holy shit snsa listed in 2013 [19:38]
assbot [MPEX] [S.NSA] 260000 @ 0.000085 = 22.1 BTC [-] [19:38]
asciilifeform ben_vulpes: iirc you were there [19:39]
ben_vulpes at the bell even [19:39]
jurov actually, 85 :( [19:40]
asciilifeform if i had an account, i'd buy it off him ! [19:40]
mats i bought those [19:40]
* justanotheruser has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) [19:41]
jurov may they serve you well [19:41]
mats did you take a loss selling those [19:42]
* justanotheruser (~Justan@unaffiliated/justanotheruser) has joined #bitcoin-assets [19:42]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 226316 @ 0.0005557 = 125.7638 BTC [-] {5} [19:45]
jurov mats, guess what was the ipo price? [19:46]
mats 9980? [19:48]
jurov close, but nope. [19:49]
jurov 2013-10-17 08:16 Buy xxxxx@0.0001 [19:49]
mircea_popescu bbbut what if spinnin' round & round, 'fooor piglet' << i imagine you're exactly on the mark. cartoon army, designing weapons for cartoon usage. [19:50]
mats ic [19:50]
mircea_popescu holy shit snsa listed in 2013 <<< well yes, was gonna be xmas remember! [19:50]
jurov if i had an account, i'd buy it off him ! << iirc the person that holds your coins, does have an account? just ash zer to place teh order. [19:52]
jurov *ask [19:52]
asciilifeform jurov: i think this would violate his monastic oath or at least give him indigestion [19:53]
jurov imo you gave him some indigestions already [19:53]
jurov s/gave/caused/ [19:54]
BingoBoingo Indigestions are an imprecise thing that over time increases risks of things like Barret's oesophagus [19:55]
BingoBoingo Hard to tell exactly when too many indigestions happen [19:55]
* DreadKnight (~DreadKnig@unaffiliated/dreadknight) has joined #bitcoin-assets [20:06]
mircea_popescu who are you two talking about ? [20:07]
mircea_popescu "NervousNorbert [score hidden] 4 hours ago Consensus on increasing the maximum participant limit was not reached." << ahahaha top keks. [20:08]
* NewLiberty ( has joined #bitcoin-assets [20:08]
* NewLiberty has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) [20:11]
* NewLiberty ( has joined #bitcoin-assets [20:12]
mircea_popescu "The gang's downfall came when Aaron Shane Murphy and Uzair Patel, both 29, were stopped by police in a taxi in Newham in June 2015." [20:14]
mircea_popescu orly, check that out, airstrip one got taxi stopping policies nao ? [20:14]
mircea_popescu "I recently moved to the Pacific Northwest from Baltimore. What partly impelled the move was being beaten up by a black guy who I had grappled with and held down after he was chasing his girlfriend with a baseball bat. His GF and another woman went nuts, beating me as he and I grappled on the ground with me holding the bat with both arms. To shut them up, I stupidly rolled the bat away and let him get up. He promptly d [20:19]
mircea_popescu ecked me, kicked the hell out of my head (concussion and bleeding). I was very lucky. " [20:19]
mircea_popescu awww. [20:19]
* DreadKnight has quit (Quit: #AncientBeast - Master Your Beasts ( )) [20:24]
mircea_popescu "These yuppie “blockbuster” musicians, who think they can save those who hate them and put their women and children in danger to assuage their own misplaced feminist guilt and world-saving bitch complex, should be staked out, skinned, have their eyelids pinned back, and left for the crows." [20:28]
mircea_popescu or, alternatively, they could be just left to do what they do, which is both cheaper and conceptually cleaner. [20:29]
mircea_popescu in somewhat related news, [20:30]
assbot ... ( ) [20:30]
mircea_popescu me: 'the measure of a state's sovereignty and quality of life therein is the degree to which it can deny benefits to outsiders' << certainly works to "why is B,TMSR~ superior to USG and necessarily a replacement thereof". [20:35]
* Linus_ has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) [20:35]
mircea_popescu ben_vulpes nevertheless, bear in mind that there is a catastrophic difference between "derp needing" and "dude trying to contribute". [20:36]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 66432 @ 0.00056091 = 37.2624 BTC [+] {3} [20:43]
hanbot me: 'the measure of a state's sovereignty and quality of life therein is the degree to which it can deny benefits to outsiders' << certainly works to "why is B,TMSR~ superior to USG and necessarily a replacement thereof". << to borrow a recent parallel from copypaste, couldn't the same be said of best korea? [20:45]
mircea_popescu sure. on the scale of sovereignity north korea is doing pretty well, too bad they're stupid. [20:45]
mircea_popescu ie, much easier to "deny benefits to outsiders" when nobody wants the benefits you offer. [20:46]
hanbot admittedly i was looking moar at the "quality of life" bit [20:46]
hanbot mhm [20:46]
mircea_popescu well, "my son, we're bums but you'll inherit all of it" sorta degree. no loss in quality of life there. [20:47]
phf so only thing i did with timestamps in logs is add milliseconds to the log printer (to add necessary precisions to graphs). i'm pretty sure i discovered that blockchain height served as well in my case (produced similar shapes with none of the "laptop went to sleep" noise), but i was looking specifically at the number of block send/recv retries [20:48]
mircea_popescu is this in a patch ? [20:48]
phf milliseconds are [20:49]
hanbot i wonder how often that's more tolerable than eg cazalla's worse-off-than-grandpa plight. [20:49]
* justanotheruser has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) [20:49]
phf but the patch got lost, between punkman taking over logging improvements and the v-ification [20:49]
* samO__ has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) [20:50]
mircea_popescu hanbot should be universal. if i find any thing worse than in the time of the predecessors i'm bringing out the machine guns and fire throwers as a matter of principle. and i want the skies bathed in the screams of the innocent and the blood of gutted babes, also as a matter of principle. [20:50]
mircea_popescu phf what sorry state of sin is this! [20:50]
* justanotheruser (~Justan@unaffiliated/justanotheruser) has joined #bitcoin-assets [20:51]
* samO__ (~samO@unaffiliated/samo) has joined #bitcoin-assets [20:52]
phf i can bring it forward, it wasn't included in the v release, nor did anybody ask about it, so i assumed it's not needed [21:01]
phf fwiw openbsd didn't make it through v-ification either, it was designed to work cross platform, but i believe there were makefile modifications since, that didn't include it. i don't actively run openbsd, so can't integration test the result [21:05]
danielpbarron >> me: the universe does not guarantee a solution to things that humans perceive as problems. << personification of 'universe' to replace God [21:07]
BingoBoingo lol that third paragraph of disclaimers [21:09]
BingoBoingo [21:09]
assbot Lesson learned from the Classic coup attempt or why Core needs to prepare a GPU only PoW — Medium ... ( ) [21:09]
* bagels7 has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) [21:17]
* bagels7 ( has joined #bitcoin-assets [21:20]
* punkman1 (~punkman@unaffiliated/punkman) has joined #bitcoin-assets [21:21]
* punkman has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) [21:21]
ben_vulpes mircea_popescu: dude, yes. transient, no. [21:30]
ben_vulpes mod6: i do believe that i understand now. [21:31]
ben_vulpes 'tis a very surgical strike, if i'm reading correctly. only if the flag is set and the sig does not bear the correct order is order enforced. [21:32]
ben_vulpes i'd have probably done something ham-handed and just set the order for the given flag, which would be a bigger change to life-fire use than i think would be warranted. [21:32]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5600 @ 0.00055547 = 3.1106 BTC [-] [21:34]
ben_vulpes danielpbarron: i swear that i'm referencing something mircea_popescu said with that line, but i'll be damned if i can find the original. [21:35]
* adlie has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) [21:40]
mod6 phf: your patch(s) did work for me on openbsd. i think, once we have all of trinque's makefiles ready to go with the new (forthcoming) version of V, you and I should work together to get a new vpatch of your openbsd changes submitted. [21:43]
mod6 The hang up here is that, it basically can't be mirrored in the same place as the rest of the patches; simply because when one sync's up against a mirror your changes will break the rest of the tree. [21:43]
mod6 so either, we need a separate repository for openbsd patches (not a bad idea), or we should just put the new openbsd vpatch in the mailing list for those who need it -- let them just add it to their V 'patches' directoriy by hand [21:44]
mod6 *directory [21:44]
mod6 make sense? [21:44]
mod6 <+ben_vulpes> mod6: i do believe that i understand now. << cool! [21:45]
ben_vulpes fwiw i completely failed to get the openbsd patch to work. [21:45]
ben_vulpes but i probably hosed something on that machine way before ever making it to building tri. [21:45]
mod6 yeah, i think i need to walk you through the exact steps. i did get it to build, and fully sync a chain even. was very happy about that. [21:45]
shinohai mod6: i am fully synced nau ^^ [21:46]
mod6 having an alternate to linux is important to me. and i was able to build a static binary, but obviously this doesn't work with the rotor (linux only buildroot). i did build it with the stator. [21:47]
mod6 anyway, getting a buildable openbsd is a priority of mine. there are just bigger things in front of that for the moment. [21:48]
mod6 <+shinohai> mod6: i am fully synced nau ^^ << ^6 [21:48]
mod6 does that bring us to 8 nodes now [21:48]
mod6 ? [21:48]
* samO (~samO@unaffiliated/samo) has joined #bitcoin-assets [21:48]
* samO__ has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) [21:49]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20300 @ 0.00055547 = 11.276 BTC [-] [21:49]
shinohai and ~ 90% complete to pogo backup of blockchain [21:50]
mod6 you're just using it as a storage bin for the time being? [21:50]
shinohai yeah for now. [21:52]
shinohai i just have it cat the latest blkxxx.dat over once every 12 hours. [21:53]
mod6 ah aight [21:53]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 89850 @ 0.000562 = 50.4957 BTC [+] {2} [21:55]
* drnet ( has joined #bitcoin-assets [22:00]
BingoBoingo [22:03]
assbot ... ( ) [22:03]
BingoBoingo [22:05]
assbot ... ( ) [22:05]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 24400 @ 0.00056201 = 13.713 BTC [+] [22:09]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 43890 @ 0.00056201 = 24.6666 BTC [+] [22:15]
deedbot- [cascadian hacker] Money, Trust, and the Wild Wild Web (A socioeconomic history of that SSL, or that green lock symbol in your browser) - [22:29]
ben_vulpes a no fuck that lol [22:31]
* bagels7 has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) [22:31]
* adlie (~adlie@ has joined #bitcoin-assets [22:34]
* adlie has quit (Signing in (adlie)) [22:34]
* adlie (~adlie@unaffiliated/adlai) has joined #bitcoin-assets [22:34]
shinohai wash BingoBoingo 's fat pics from your eyes: [22:34]
assbot ... ( ) [22:34]
* adlai (~adlai@unaffiliated/adlai) has joined #bitcoin-assets [22:35]
ben_vulpes oh those are hardly even worth mentioning [22:36]
* raedah (~raedah@ has joined #bitcoin-assets [22:36]
* bagels7 ( has joined #bitcoin-assets [22:36]
BingoBoingo Seriously been a while since I posted a really bad one [22:36]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 136800 @ 0.00055615 = 76.0813 BTC [-] {3} [22:36]
BingoBoingo !up bagels7 [22:37]
* assbot gives voice to bagels7 [22:37]
BingoBoingo !Up raedah [22:37]
ben_vulpes man i fucking hate my webshit. [22:37]
* assbot gives voice to raedah [22:37]
deedbot- [cascadian hacker] Money, Trust, and the Wild Wild Web (A socioeconomic history of SSL, or that green lock symbol in your browser) - [22:37]
BingoBoingo << Did Ragnar move on? [22:37]
assbot Be a part of the thriving underground economy with a darknet job! : SeaJobs ... ( ) [22:37]
* drnet has quit (Quit: Leaving) [22:42]
* assbot gives voice to adlai [22:43]
adlai ;;nethash [22:44]
gribble 946829249.036 [22:44]
adlai cmon chinese chicken! [22:44]
adlai ;;google youtube rhcp chinese chicken [22:45]
gribble Chinese - YouTube: ; Chinese Chicken Song - YouTube: ; How to cook Chicken and Mango Stri-fry recipe - YouTube: [22:45]
* adlai fails, twice in a row. too fuck to drunk? !down [22:46]
adlai ;;later tell mike_c candle charts outta sync, comment moderation constipation? [22:47]
gribble The operation succeeded. [22:47]
adlai anybody know the guy? the site is *almost* functional in absentia, but not quite enough [22:48]
ben_vulpes "We DEMAND the inclusion of teachers and educators with auditory and relative business skills pertaining to contemporary Black musical styles." << relative business skills? what are those [22:51]
ben_vulpes also looks like the storied Oberlin conservatory is about to turn into Rap Kollege [22:52]
adlai fwiw friend who teaches classics at a usg 'prep school' attests to having had a student excused from any and all performance standards due to APD (which stands for 'auditory processing disorder') [22:53]
adlai tis the new AD[h]D [22:54]
ben_vulpes "We DEMAND an online database that outlines the deadlines, dates, and forms critical for the successful academic journey of Black students" because we can't be arsed to figure it out ourselves, read syllabi when they're handed out or at all, and because of course knowing to do all of the above is something we were not prepared for in life and this must be rectified at the expense of everyone else attending the school. [22:54]
ben_vulpes lol required events [22:54]
ben_vulpes who goes to required freshmen events? [22:54]
ben_vulpes woo hoo hoo fifteen [22:55]
adlai fifteen whats? [22:56]
ben_vulpes "We DEMAND a change in the fundamental ways that we asses knowledge at this institution, starting with a student evaluation of the effectiveness of the grading system. We will have oversight over the results of that evaluation. If the results state that the grading system is not reflective of this institution's student body, we DEMAND an immediate change of that grading system." [22:56]
ben_vulpes grades are racist! [22:56]
BingoBoingo deedbot-: [22:57]
assbot ... ( ) [22:57]
deedbot- accepted: 1 [22:57]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8608 @ 0.0005603 = 4.8231 BTC [+] {2} [23:03]
ben_vulpes "We DEMAND the renaming of these specific academic buildings" [23:04]
ben_vulpes "We DEMAND that a mandatory professional development program be developed for faculty across departments in the College & Conservatory that will help facilitate their udnerstanding of the ways in which racial capitalism, settler colonialism, and other forms of violent oppression inform and shape instructional methods for the disciplinary content of their courses. We further DEMAND that the content of this information be integrated in [23:05]
ben_vulpes their coursework." [23:05]
ben_vulpes "We DEMAND a 6% annual increase in grant offers vs. loan offers for Black Students" [23:06]
polarbeard << It turns out shitty rotation is there: [23:06]
assbot Logged on 22-01-2016 16:56:17; PeterL: does trb debug.log grow infinitely? [23:06]
assbot Satoshi ... ( ) [23:06]
ben_vulpes !s compression [23:07]
assbot 42 results for 'compression' : [23:07]
asciilifeform ben_vulpes: you laugh, but THAT was how we got xyz-studies in the '70s usa [23:07]
ben_vulpes i'm not laughing i'm horrified [23:07]
ben_vulpes i thought there'd be about another 5 years before things got this nutso [23:07]
BingoBoingo And seriously Oberlin historically has been a trailblazer in surrendering to such demands [23:08]
* assbot removes voice from bagels7 [23:08]
* assbot removes voice from raedah [23:08]
ben_vulpes tenure for an artist in residence, nice [23:09]
ben_vulpes "We DEMAND that Black student leaders be provided a[n] $8.20/hr stipend for their continuous organizing efforts around the well[-]being of Black people on Oberlin's campus, city and beyond" << man that is some low-dough shit [23:11]
ben_vulpes why not 15? 20? [23:11]
asciilifeform 2B! [23:11]
asciilifeform or why not demand bottomless bank account ? [23:11]
ben_vulpes that /is/ the demand. [23:11]
* funkenstein_ (~bowler@unaffiliated/funkenstein) has joined #bitcoin-assets [23:11]
asciilifeform i remember reading as a kid, about some south american dictator who gave his phriendz such a thing, and being horrified [23:12]
ben_vulpes "We DEMAND that each worker, temporary or permanent working for the College Dining Hall Services be given a meal every work shift" [23:12]
asciilifeform worker? work? [23:12]
* assbot gives voice to funkenstein_ [23:12]
asciilifeform what kind of crackpot revolutionaries are these [23:12]
asciilifeform who still speak of.. work [23:12]
ben_vulpes "We DEMAND that the workload given to employees be reflective of their abilities...should not be given a workload that they cannot handle." [23:12]
ben_vulpes "all employees be given healthcarea and insurance" [23:13]
ben_vulpes DEMAND immediate firing of: ... Gerri Johnson...for their rude behavior towards Black Students [23:13]
ben_vulpes "We DEMAND that Oberlin College stop functioning as a gentrifying institution" [23:14]
ben_vulpes "the immediate implementation of a free bussing system" [23:14]
ben_vulpes ah jeez [23:15]
ben_vulpes okay, phew. [23:15]
* bagelss7 ( has joined #bitcoin-assets [23:15]
* bagels7 has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) [23:15]
ben_vulpes too goddamn funny. [23:16]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 79900 @ 0.00056034 = 44.7712 BTC [+] {2} [23:18]
mircea_popescu in the same news, [23:21]
assbot ... ( ) [23:21]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 50200 @ 0.00055513 = 27.8675 BTC [-] {3} [23:21]
polarbeard fatsideboob [23:22]
funkenstein_ ben_vulpes thanks for lulz of the day :) [23:24]
mircea_popescu you mean the girl is fat ? [23:24]
polarbeard no, only her side boob [23:24]
mircea_popescu << wait, explain this to me ? [23:25]
assbot Logged on 24-01-2016 00:41:21; mod6: The hang up here is that, it basically can't be mirrored in the same place as the rest of the patches; simply because when one sync's up against a mirror your changes will break the rest of the tree. [23:25]
mircea_popescu we can't be the first people doing a multi-platform release. [23:26]
asciilifeform but we ~might~ be the first people who won't tolerate pestilential #ifdefs OR duplicate trees for it [23:27]
BingoBoingo ^ [23:27]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform so what do we do ? [23:28]
mircea_popescu ;;nethash [23:28]
gribble 949473454.023 [23:28]
asciilifeform openbsd won't run linux elf, like netbsd ? [23:28]
asciilifeform BingoBoingo ? [23:28]
BingoBoingo asciilifeform: Only i386 will. [23:29]
mod6 <+mircea_popescu> << wait, explain this to me ? << the idea is that our makefiles, or whatever build scripts will utilize V to build inside of the rotor (a linux thing) - the source must be compatable with that. phf's openbsd scripts are not compatible with this. [23:29]
assbot Logged on 24-01-2016 00:41:21; mod6: The hang up here is that, it basically can't be mirrored in the same place as the rest of the patches; simply because when one sync's up against a mirror your changes will break the rest of the tree. [23:29]
asciilifeform everything i've so far experienced with openbsd suggests that [23:29]
asciilifeform it is retarded [23:29]
mircea_popescu << rap "industree" is dead in the water so all the wanna-be succeeders at "the game" want federal dollars to prop up their delusion. [23:29]
assbot Logged on 24-01-2016 01:49:23; ben_vulpes: "We DEMAND the inclusion of teachers and educators with auditory and relative business skills pertaining to contemporary Black musical styles." << relative business skills? what are those [23:29]
asciilifeform and that it is only quasi-works for a few very specific use cases [23:29]
asciilifeform perhaps it was once a thing, i cannot say [23:29]
mod6 however, if he and I work together, we could possibly get some patches in place that would check to see what the local environment is and if __BSD__, then apply, otherwise, do not. [23:29]
* pete_dushenski (~pete_dush@unaffiliated/pete-dushenski/x-8158685) has joined #bitcoin-assets [23:30]
asciilifeform pretty much every single 'openbsdism' i've so far run into screams braindamage [23:30]
mircea_popescu mod6 so basically we can't use our convenient makefiles to build the pressed source ; openbsd people gotta finagle their own build chain to get the same source to compile and link ? [23:30]
asciilifeform (~different~ braindamage than in linux, and this is appealing to some people) [23:30]
mod6 yes. [23:30]
mircea_popescu well yeah, seems this will have to be separately maintained. [23:30]
asciilifeform just like the nintendo port. [23:31]
mircea_popescu i suspect it'd be a horrid mistake to try and merge the notion of a press and the notion of a makefile. [23:31]
* assbot gives voice to pete_dushenski [23:31]
mod6 and further, the changes that we wanted to make with V (where we mechanically check to see the patch was applied correctly by checking the hashes) also will not work on bsd unless a bunch more alterations are made, but this is a side issue. [23:31]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: correct, they are entirely different processes with just enough superficially in common to lead n00bz to conceptual perdition [23:31]
pete_dushenski << nyooz at 11 [23:31]
assbot The Sad State of Web Development — Medium ... ( ) [23:31]
mircea_popescu mod6 how can that possibly happen ?! [23:31]
mod6 this is because BSD's sha/md commands spit out the digests in different way than on linux. [23:32]
mircea_popescu oh ffs. [23:32]
ben_vulpes yeah, i ran into this. [23:33]
ben_vulpes needs -q flags. [23:33]
mircea_popescu so basically, this should prolly be on the wiki or what. [23:33]
mod6 linux: [23:34]
mod6 # sha256sum blah.txt [23:34]
mod6 827aa4d3ea7c8b7177abe0e2d1d87f45857755df32956fbc54e7a1c10981e6b4 blah.txt [23:34]
mod6 bsd [23:34]
mod6 sha256 blah.txt [23:34]
mod6 SHA256 (blah.txt) = 827aa4d3ea7c8b7177abe0e2d1d87f45857755df32956fbc54e7a1c10981e6b4 [23:34]
BingoBoingo (~different~ braindamage than in linux, and this is appealing to some people) << This is pretty much its appeal to me. I have modest needs as far as necessary hardware and necessary software go. [23:34]
mod6 so a minor annoyance there. but alas. [23:34]
* adlai notes that the three laws are phrased as guidelines for builders, rather than code for execution [23:35]
BingoBoingo Also Openbsd base system is complete enough to make internet on mars [23:35]
adlai ... wrong chanl (or maybe not?) [23:35]
mod6 <+mircea_popescu> mod6 so basically we can't use our convenient makefiles to build the pressed source ; openbsd people gotta finagle their own build chain to get the same source to compile and link ? << and further more, they'll never have the same build process like we want. [23:35]
mod6 because they can not use buildroot... at least, I don't *think* they can, easily at lesat. they could turn on Linux Binary Comapt mode and perhaps some other kernel tweeks. would need to be looked a.t. [23:36]
mircea_popescu mod6 thinking about this, the problem slowly becomes that not only does bitcoin gravitate towards bitcoinos, but it puts some serious problems to any attempt at wide support. [23:36]
mod6 for sure. our best bet, is bitcoinos. [23:37]
pete_dushenski <-- same 'amanda hess' chica as --> [23:37]
assbot VR porn is here. Does virtual sex really feel real? ... ( ) [23:37]
assbot You need an Ambien to sleep because you bought the trappings of power instead of the real thing. | Contravex: A blog by Pete Dushenski ... ( ) [23:37]
* NewLiberty has quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) [23:37]
pete_dushenski in related news, is a dead link [23:37]
mircea_popescu the problem with that is that well... nobody'd want to bash in bitcoinos. so we'll end up with a very strange catamaran of a stack. [23:37]
assbot 404 Not Found ... ( ) [23:37]
mircea_popescu pete_dushenski do you mind ? [23:37]
adlai pete_dushenski: more helpful to say where you encountered the deadlink :) [23:37]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: i am actually dealing with precisely this as we speak [23:38]
danielpbarron pete_dushenski, follow assbot's bitly link [23:38]
asciilifeform dusted off draft of something i had a while back, because mircea_popescu mentioned it and proclaimed that it isn't wholly retarded [23:38]
mircea_popescu which was this ? [23:38]
asciilifeform tinyscheme welded onto trb [23:38]
asciilifeform draft name on my disk was.. shiva [23:39]
mircea_popescu ah, right. [23:39]
mircea_popescu anyway, for the first time so far it occurs to me we might be setting ourselves up for failure here. because of this support / os issue. [23:39]
asciilifeform it will be a ~shell~ [23:39]
asciilifeform in trb. [23:39]
pete_dushenski my apologies for the linkspam interruption [23:39]
asciilifeform only switched on, with command line flag, if you are really ready to meet allah; [23:40]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform logically : a) you won't want to ssh into the node and do your bash there (providing it even has ssh). this means you'll be stuck using something else on top of bitcoin-os. [23:40]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: this is elementarily not so [23:40]
mircea_popescu obviously, as a general thing, people MIGHT consider running a bitcoin node on any box they run. [23:40]
mircea_popescu but if bitcoin can not be run there... well... [23:40]
asciilifeform the bare metal variant will expose shiva shell through one of the serial ports [23:40]
asciilifeform which can be attached to whatever you like, e.g., a unix box running sshd [23:41]
asciilifeform sort of what folks do with routers and factory robots today [23:41]
mircea_popescu hm [23:41]
mircea_popescu so then the model here is to have fundamentally speaking a pogo/arm-ish level bitcoind/os, that doesn't really natively build on anything without a laundry list of finicking ? [23:41]
asciilifeform builds ~on~ whatever the fuck you like [23:42]
asciilifeform rotor does this already [23:42]
mircea_popescu i mean software-on not hardware-on [23:42]
asciilifeform software-on. [23:42]
asciilifeform rotor will build on nintendo. [23:42]
mircea_popescu then what is the bsd problem ? [23:42]
asciilifeform building ~for~ [23:42]
mircea_popescu huh ? [23:42]
asciilifeform iirc nobody succeeded in building ~for~ it ? [23:42]
mircea_popescu so you bring up your *bsd box, run rotor on it, does it build or doesn't it. [23:43]
asciilifeform or hm, looks like userland caltrops prevent even v from running there [23:43]
mircea_popescu right. so no, rotor doesn't "do this already". [23:43]
asciilifeform aha [23:43]
asciilifeform to which i say that it is braindamaged to expect the thing to build on arbitrary crud os [23:43]
asciilifeform what, i also do a winblows toolchain now ? [23:44]
asciilifeform vms? [23:44]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform so if someone has a box that they're using, they can't run a bitcoin node there unless they run it under bitcoinos ? [23:44]
asciilifeform build the linux variant ? [23:44]
asciilifeform understand, if someone ~wants~ to maintain a nintendo port, let'em [23:44]
mircea_popescu "bitcoinos" is a symbol here. may mean linux, whatever the fuck it means. [23:45]
asciilifeform but 'runs for everybody on every kind of dead animal in a box' is a dead end goal [23:45]
mircea_popescu and so what, we're officially targetting "anything that's unix post bsd pre systemd" ? [23:45]
asciilifeform i dare say that expecting a vaguely linuxlike ~build environment~ is not unreasonable [23:45]
mircea_popescu and so then bsd support, like windows or crapple support, would be a bolt-on ? [23:46]
asciilifeform if somebody wants to maintain a parallel universe 'v' et al where the bsd flags make it go, i will take off my hat to them. [23:46]
asciilifeform aha. [23:46]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform well apparently phf was half-trying but no hats. [23:46]
mircea_popescu phf you seriously considering maintaining a bsd rotor thing ? [23:47]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 61500 @ 0.00056137 = 34.5243 BTC [+] {3} [23:48]
mircea_popescu BingoBoingo srsly why are you putting your uni library in the deedbot. [23:49]
BingoBoingo mircea_popescu: So that I don't have to link fiat uni web sites. [23:49]
mircea_popescu hm. [23:49]
BingoBoingo If reddit is to be denied links so ought they. [23:49]
BingoBoingo In case the documents get "Oberlin'd" [23:50]
* adlai notes that a) works for backup b) deedbot provides verification alone c) the blockchain works for paranoid-max backup, if you pay your way [23:50]
mircea_popescu BingoBoingo yeah the part where your otherwise reasonable idea breaks down is where deedbot is not really a webservice [23:51]
mircea_popescu even if currently available on web endpoint as well. [23:51]
BingoBoingo Well, librarybot is still 18-36 months out. [23:53]
mircea_popescu anyway. i suppose this entire compatibility general issue will need more thinking about. [23:54]
* adlai is currently working on blockchain-databot or whatever's a better name [23:54]
mod6 yeah, very much so. a good conversation to have though, as our future roadmap depends on some early-on food for thought. [23:54]
adlai SaaS (spam, spam, blockchain, spam) [23:54]
mircea_popescu mod6 to my mind it's almost as if we bit a recursion girder over here. "v presses source". "ok how do i build it ?" "uh... i guess you need a v-make genesis and follow that for your os." "ok... how do i do that ?" "well... get v-make-make and..." [23:56]
mod6 i guess my thought is, if we wanna make bitcoinos - we will end up forking either SVR4 or BSD, and then getting married. [23:56]
adlai the general goals being - get the data in there, as cheaply as possible, without same standards as and some reasonable method to random-access without having to reconstruct the entire turd [23:56]
assbot Loper OS » Practical Blockchain Telegraphy. ... ( ) [23:56]
adlai s/out// blah [23:56]
mod6 so we may think of a different way of doing something like this, maybe it's not a full OS of sorts, maybe its a embedded deal. [23:56]
asciilifeform adlai: why not also suggest placing it on mars ? [23:56]
asciilifeform cheaper. [23:57]
mircea_popescu mod6 here's the problem with "Bitcoinos" : you will want it adapted for bitcoin needs, which necessarily means it won't be your tool of choice for doing almost anything else, which necessarily means maintaining it will be a pain in the ass. [23:57]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: trying to wiggle out from under this is misguided imho. [23:57]
asciilifeform it is a logical necessity. [23:57]
mircea_popescu im not making any calls here, just running the horse around the field. [23:57]
adlai asciilifeform: because large amounts of data are worth paying small amounts of btc to immortalize, today; and small amounts of data will always be worth paying large amounts of btc to immortalize - even tomorrow. [23:57]
asciilifeform just like missile guidance needs a particular kind of os [23:57]
asciilifeform that you won't play tetris on [23:57]
asciilifeform or even compile itself on. [23:57]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 86600 @ 0.000562 = 48.6692 BTC [+] {2} [23:58]
* adlai also got an upfront btc donation to do this so ~shrug~ [23:58]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform but this faces you with the unpleasant choice of whether to not play tetris or not run bitcoin on your homebox. [23:58]
asciilifeform i already have this choice with many other things [23:58]
mircea_popescu see, that';s thje bitch here : missile guidance has to be on missile and there only. there's no benefit from it running on jane's computor. [23:59]
asciilifeform e.g., i have a set of boxes for running winblowz virii on. [23:59]
asciilifeform that are not fit for any other purpose [23:59]
mircea_popescu nevertheless. [23:59]
asciilifeform and many folks keep similar winblowz box for games, etc [23:59]
adlai mircea_popescu: ever heard of 4th gen ATMs? (not the kind that gets skimmed) [23:59]
mircea_popescu there's no space in the future for windows. [23:59]
mircea_popescu so i'm not terribly interested in that line of thought. [23:59]
Category: Logs
Comments feed : RSS 2.0. Leave your own comment below, or send a trackback.
Add your cents! »
    If this is your first comment, it will wait to be approved. This usually takes a few hours. Subsequent comments are not delayed.