Forum logs for 21 Feb 2016

Sunday, 24 November, Year 11 d.Tr. | Author: Mircea Popescu
shinohai seems to be running fine here [00:00]
mod6 ok cool [00:08]
* anondran (~anondran@unaffiliated/anondran) has joined #bitcoin-assets [00:11]
BingoBoingo Slowed Dissent https://archive.is/6cuOR [00:17]
assbot The Bitcoin Roundtable Consensus Proposal — Too Little, Too Late — Medium ... ( http://bit.ly/1mPxnVx ) [00:17]
phf ok so http://btcbase.org/upload now works. takes seal and vpatch and saves it to uploads patchset http://btcbase.org/patches?patchset=uploads. uploads patchset inherits from experimental, which in turn inherits from stable. those who'd like to upload a patch are welcome to give it a try and let me know if it doesn't work. [00:20]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1L1rIqB ) [00:20]
BingoBoingo oh also, in getinfo I get this >> "errors" : "WARNING: Displayed transactions may not be correct! You may need to upgrade, or other nodes may need to upgrade." << The hard shutdown may have left your blockchain copy corrupted at the end. Gotta get a UPS. [00:21]
BingoBoingo danielpbarron: This problem happened with quantrill this week. Was unresponsive so I ordered a reboot, after reboot... holy fucksticks the disappoint. [00:22]
BingoBoingo powercycling a bitcoin node is something of a gamble [00:23]
BingoBoingo I dunno what insanity possessed me to order that reboot, when the same problem is why I got batteries and UPSs for local machines [00:24]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 60630 @ 0.00056719 = 34.3887 BTC [+] {3} [00:26]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10620 @ 0.00057275 = 6.0826 BTC [+] [00:30]
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ben_vulpes phf: btcbase keeps getting niftier [00:39]
ben_vulpes but when i click the dropdown some js takes over and doesn't let me select anything [00:39]
ben_vulpes oh interesting [00:39]
ben_vulpes does not work when tabbing to the dropdown and hitting the spacebar [00:39]
phf bah, that's what i get for sprinkling some jquery on that bitch [00:40]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 40400 @ 0.00056358 = 22.7686 BTC [-] {2} [00:40]
phf (i killed the js) [00:41]
ben_vulpes much better [00:42]
ben_vulpes can has submit onSelect ? [00:42]
ben_vulpes or would that be horrendously dumb [00:42]
mod6 also, re: regrind, this is for sure: when doing this task, it forces you to read and understand the patch that needs regrinding. nothing wrong with this as far as I can tell. [00:43]
phf ben_vulpes: i'm not quite sure what to attach and where [00:46]
phf $('#patchset-select select').on('select', function() { alert('foo') }) doesn't do what i think it should [00:46]
phf oh, there's "change" [00:47]
ben_vulpes ah yeah change [00:48]
ben_vulpes ah jesus fuck javascript [00:48]
phf i already have jquery there because i wanted to add jumping from hunk to hunk on patch page by j/k [00:49]
phf (it works now by the way) [00:49]
phf err, both jumping from hunk to hunk and the on change [00:49]
ben_vulpes nifty phf [00:50]
ben_vulpes how are you shipping to this thing? hacking directly on the running lisp image? [00:50]
phf rsync/asdf/screen [00:51]
phf very boring :) [00:51]
ben_vulpes i appreciate boring [00:51]
ben_vulpes so does that mean no parenscript? :P [00:53]
* assbot gives voice to gernika [00:54]
phf alexandria cffi flexi-streams net-telent-date trivial-features usocket araneida cl-irc gpg-error rfc2388 trivial-gray-streams v babel defservice gpgme split-sequence uiop [00:55]
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ben_vulpes just snarking phf [00:57]
gernika mod6 I'm stuck on the pgp issue ben_vulpes encountered. http://dpaste.com/2X6BDH8 [00:57]
assbot dpaste: 2X6BDH8 ... ( http://bit.ly/1TsLi0y ) [00:57]
phf :) [00:57]
gernika I have manually imported that pubkey, to no avail. [00:57]
ben_vulpes gernika does your script go so far as to exit at that point?! [00:57]
mod6 *sigh* [00:58]
gernika ben_vulpes: yes [00:58]
ben_vulpes mine sailed through merrily [00:58]
ben_vulpes "what verification error?!: [00:58]
mod6 the thing that bothers me, is this: all that is different about the build script itself is the version of V. [00:58]
phf so i tried installing parenscript it pulls in all kinds of retarded. i don't even. anaphora, named-readtables. [00:58]
mod6 so why didnt we have this trouble a few weeks ago? [00:58]
ben_vulpes mod6: are you even certain there was a 'we' running this a few weeks ago? [00:59]
ben_vulpes and not just a 'you' and a very sleep deprived and useless me? [00:59]
mod6 ummm. yes? [00:59]
mod6 we all went through this with V99996 [00:59]
mod6 back around the 28th. [01:00]
mod6 gernika: do you have this fine somewhere in your build env? buildroot-2015.05.tar.gz.sign ? [01:00]
mod6 s/fine/file [01:00]
gernika mod6 I have that fine file in rotor :) [01:01]
ben_vulpes (girl hands me child, i place child on floor, "you know precisely what i do when you hand him to me, you could just save us the fifteen seconds and put him on the floor yourself") [01:01]
mod6 gernika: what happens if you're in the rotor dir and you do `gpg --verify buildroot-2015.05.tar.gz.sign` ? [01:03]
gernika mod6: the exact same message as in the dpaste. [01:04]
gernika ok interesting [01:05]
mod6 what does this say `gpg --fingerprint 0xAB07D806D2CE741FB886EE50B025BA8B59C36319` ? [01:05]
gernika same for previous version of the file [01:05]
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ben_vulpes mod6: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-08-2015#1246638 << this has been a known issue since august 2015 [01:06]
assbot Logged on 21-08-2015 02:24:26; danielpbarron: gpg: WARNING: not a detached signature; file 'buildroot-2015.05.tar.gz' was NOT verified! [01:06]
ben_vulpes waitwait hang on [01:06]
mod6 ben_vulpes: can you identify why this is an issue? [01:06]
BingoBoingo In other news Jeb quit. [01:08]
mod6 gernika: <+mod6> what does this say `gpg --fingerprint 0xAB07D806D2CE741FB886EE50B025BA8B59C36319` ? [01:08]
phf i proposed a solution to that problem. have a set of gpg commands that work with .wot. so something like vgpg verify file, will 1) tmp=mktemp -d gpgxxxx 2) gpg --homedir $tmp --import wot/*.asc 3) gpg --homedir $tmp --verify 4) rm -rf $tmp, so that no foundation operations ever work with ~/.gnupg and always work with ~/.wot [01:09]
ben_vulpes mod6: because gpg says the signature isn't actually verified! [01:10]
ben_vulpes unless it's lying and it is verifying the signature anyways [01:10]
mod6 it does for me [01:10]
gernika mod6: http://dpaste.com/3XAZ46P [01:10]
assbot dpaste: 3XAZ46P ... ( http://bit.ly/1TsMa5e ) [01:10]
mod6 http://dpaste.com/1J5910T.txt [01:11]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1TsMaCa ) [01:11]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 24450 @ 0.0005633 = 13.7727 BTC [-] [01:11]
ben_vulpes phf: you'll note that's more or less exactly what my v does [01:11]
mod6 well, im fuckin stumped. this is crazy [01:11]
BingoBoingo Nevar forget https://archive.is/dKz2d [01:12]
assbot Sad Jeb Bush Is Just Sitting Up At Night, Waiting To Chat About Football With You ... ( http://bit.ly/1TsMroS ) [01:12]
phf ben_vulpes: that's what all v's do, but we also have this auxiliary operations before the press that require calling gpg --verify [01:12]
phf *these [01:12]
mod6 i disagree, totally, that V should contain any functionallity to validate anything outside of the V tree, contained in the patches dir. [01:13]
ben_vulpes yeah the v-wrapping build scripts don't isolate themselves from the user keyring. [01:13]
ben_vulpes mod6: nobody's saying that buildroot should be v-verified, but that not isolating buildscripts from the user gpg keyring is...not great. [01:14]
mod6 ok perhaps [01:15]
ben_vulpes if asciilifeform hadn't already declared himself to not touch anything that brought anything down from the net he'd be complaining about all of the above as well [01:15]
phf mod6: that's not what i'm proposing [01:15]
mod6 but this problem isn't realted to that. [01:15]
ben_vulpes sure, no. [01:15]
mod6 for some reason, this guys friggin thing apparently wont verify, except for me. i seem to be the only one who has a gpg & his key that'll verify this damn thing [01:15]
ben_vulpes gernika: gpg version? [01:16]
gernika ben_vulpes: 1.4.19 [01:17]
ben_vulpes mod6: mine *does* verify the signature, but not in the build-bitcoin-v999o*.sh context [01:18]
ben_vulpes v9999** [01:18]
mod6 well fuck. [01:18]
mod6 gpg (GnuPG) 2.0.26 << both of my goddamn gentoo's have this installed. [01:19]
ben_vulpes oh yeah [01:19]
mod6 what a goatfucking pile of shit [01:19]
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ben_vulpes mod6: =app-crypt/gnupg-1.4.19 [01:19]
ben_vulpes emerge --ask =app-crypt/gnupg-1.4.19 [01:20]
gernika mod6 - seems the build-bitcoind-V99995.sh script exits for me when attempting to download boost: http://dpaste.com/3GCPPX2 [01:20]
assbot dpaste: 3GCPPX2 ... ( http://bit.ly/1TsN95v ) [01:20]
mod6 well, i dunno what to say i guess. [01:21]
mod6 you don't have to build with the script, just pull all the pieces and build by hand then. [01:21]
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mod6 im off [01:21]
ben_vulpes go take a vacation dood [01:21]
ben_vulpes it's not like gavin's going to steal a march on you or anything [01:21]
BingoBoingo Actually it's hard to tell. [01:22]
BingoBoingo That's the problem with hamplanets of the sort Gavin is growing into. It is impossible to predict the things they will steal. [01:22]
* ben_vulpes waits for the punchline [01:23]
BingoBoingo What punchline, all truefax. If you leave a planet in a room with icing, cornchips, and cookies there is a fair probability the hamplanet will eat the veggie burgers first out of curiosity. [01:24]
ben_vulpes heh [01:25]
ben_vulpes "so you leave a hamplanet in a room with frosting, cornchips, guacamole, and cookies. which do they eat first?" [01:25]
BingoBoingo the eggrolls [01:25]
BingoBoingo Even if you didn't know they were there. [01:26]
ben_vulpes "trick question: first they magic veggieburgers into existence to pretend like they ate something wholesome before desert." [01:26]
mod6 <+ben_vulpes> go take a vacation dood << this is not a solution. [01:26]
gernika Some local color, since I'm voiced: I attended a bitcoin meetup in Oakland and encountered a team of "researchers" from Georgia Tech exploring using bitcoin to help the unbanked in Ethiopia. I asked, and no, none of them had been there. [01:26]
BingoBoingo lol [01:26]
mod6 what i need, is help. every day. until this is resolved. [01:26]
ben_vulpes gernika: megalol [01:26]
mod6 if someone knows what the problem is here, please submit. if testing is need, lets do it. all those things. telling me to take a break, or calm down, or take a vacation is not a solution. [01:27]
ben_vulpes i thought the vacation was already scheduled, hence the manic deadline pressure [01:27]
mod6 brah. [01:28]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 21900 @ 0.0005704 = 12.4918 BTC [+] {2} [01:29]
ben_vulpes ... [01:29]
ben_vulpes yes? [01:29]
phf mod6: that signature is busted, just vidy output of curl -s http://buildroot.uclibc.org/downloads/buildroot-2015.05.tar.gz.sign [01:31]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1JlKXnn ) [01:31]
mod6 vidy? [01:32]
phf see [01:32]
phf well, not busted, but not actually a signature for the tar.gz file [01:34]
mod6 ok [01:34]
mod6 http://dpaste.com/0A6CT6W.txt [01:34]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1TsO1ag ) [01:34]
phf mod6: ~look~ at the inside of the signature [01:34]
asciilifeform http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-02-2016#1411795 << thats what package mask is for!! [01:34]
assbot Logged on 21-02-2016 04:15:54; mod6: gpg (GnuPG) 2.0.26 << both of my goddamn gentoo's have this installed. [01:34]
phf it's not a detached signature. it's a standalone signed message that makes claims about shasums [01:35]
mod6 dare i even ask what a package mask is? [01:35]
mod6 phf: yeah, i see that, ok must be fixed [01:35]
asciilifeform basic gentooism, it's a list of nevers [01:35]
assbot [MPEX] [S.QNTR] 8513 @ 0.00023316 = 1.9849 BTC [-] [01:36]
asciilifeform things that won't be pulled in no matter what. [01:36]
asciilifeform re: thread: ftr i still use my original rotor builder. [01:37]
asciilifeform and intend to continue. [01:37]
asciilifeform it - works... [01:38]
asciilifeform http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-02-2016#1411785 << i won't use thing that insists n downloads. and i ~definitely~ won't use a thing that wants to rebuild gcc or boost etc each time. [01:40]
assbot Logged on 21-02-2016 04:11:48; ben_vulpes: if asciilifeform hadn't already declared himself to not touch anything that brought anything down from the net he'd be complaining about all of the above as well [01:40]
asciilifeform my build script is two dozen lines, and bugless. [01:42]
asciilifeform i have nfi why it needed 'progress'... [01:43]
asciilifeform http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-02-2016#1411817 << l0l! [01:45]
assbot Logged on 21-02-2016 04:22:56; gernika: Some local color, since I'm voiced: I attended a bitcoin meetup in Oakland and encountered a team of "researchers" from Georgia Tech exploring using bitcoin to help the unbanked in Ethiopia. I asked, and no, none of them had been there. [01:45]
* asciilifeform never has, and never will, go near anything 'bitcoin-themed' meatspace in heathendom. [01:46]
gernika asciilifeform: you might be interested to know that the scheme involved some sort of Coke Machine with a water filtration system. [01:46]
* BingoBoingo still remembers the one time he saw a person wearing a bitcoin t-shirt in a bar [01:47]
asciilifeform cough up keyz or die of thirst? [01:47]
asciilifeform worx [01:47]
gernika l0l the ethiopian coke machine [01:47]
asciilifeform also am i the only one to whom 'unbanked' evokes a way of connecting memory ? [01:48]
asciilifeform and little else [01:49]
asciilifeform (vs banked naturally) [01:49]
BingoBoingo lol [01:50]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4450 @ 0.0005633 = 2.5067 BTC [-] [02:07]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 26707 @ 0.00056327 = 15.0433 BTC [-] {2} [02:16]
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mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-02-2016#1411789 << pretty sure it verified for me also. [02:43]
assbot Logged on 21-02-2016 04:12:28; mod6: for some reason, this guys friggin thing apparently wont verify, except for me. i seem to be the only one who has a gpg & his key that'll verify this damn thing [02:43]
mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-02-2016#1411821 << no looky, it's not meant in that sense at all. just letting you know that we love you! [02:44]
assbot Logged on 21-02-2016 04:24:10; mod6: if someone knows what the problem is here, please submit. if testing is need, lets do it. all those things. telling me to take a break, or calm down, or take a vacation is not a solution. [02:44]
mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-02-2016#1411859 << nope exactly what i think also. and i'm closer to the financial field than fucking hardware. [02:47]
assbot Logged on 21-02-2016 04:45:43; asciilifeform: also am i the only one to whom 'unbanked' evokes a way of connecting memory ? [02:47]
mircea_popescu us-style retail banking is an abominable pile of nonsense the likes of which nightmares are made of. [02:47]
mircea_popescu but in other news, chores! http://40.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m8h21v0J8e1rcdktuo1_1280.jpg [02:47]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/20MQMnm ) [02:47]
danielpbarron ;;later tell BingoBoingo http://danielpbarron.com/qntra-mint.asc.txt [02:49]
gribble The operation succeeded. [02:49]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/20MQVXZ ) [02:49]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10798 @ 0.00056646 = 6.1166 BTC [+] [03:04]
punkman asciilifeform: afaik we don't presently have a vtron that is capable of digesting everything incl. the old crud. << my vtron digests conflicting patches [03:04]
punkman asciilifeform: (you will have to rename the dir manually, because DIFF IS RETARDED) << I'll do a punkdiff release this week [03:05]
mircea_popescu https://pbs.twimg.com/profile_images/698748328511696896/tHcNra2H_400x400.png << that's a pretty cool album cover lol. [03:05]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/20MSjd3 ) [03:05]
BingoBoingo danielpbarron: ty, great find [03:08]
phf my v can beat up your v [03:08]
deedbot- [Qntra] Linux Mint Server Compromised, Spread Malware - http://qntra.net/2016/02/linux-mint-server-compromised-spread-malware/ [03:08]
mircea_popescu nuts [03:11]
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BingoBoingo nuts, gotta protect them if you've got em' [03:17]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 53552 @ 0.00056431 = 30.2199 BTC [-] {2} [03:19]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 23716 @ 0.0005623 = 13.3355 BTC [-] [03:20]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 29800 @ 0.00056151 = 16.733 BTC [-] [03:23]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16750 @ 0.00056206 = 9.4145 BTC [+] [03:42]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 60000 @ 0.00056151 = 33.6906 BTC [-] [03:55]
deedbot- [BitBet Bets Bets] 5.00000000 BTC on 'No' - Bernie Sanders will be Democrats' 2016 Presidential Nominee - http://bitbet.us/bet/1242/bernie-sanders-will-be-democrats-2016-presidential-nominee/#b22 [04:08]
deedbot- [BitBet Bets Bets] 2.00000000 BTC on 'No' - Ted Cruz will be the Republicans' 2016 Presidential Nominee - http://bitbet.us/bet/1246/ted-cruz-will-be-the-republicans-2016-presidential/#b14 [04:08]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 27860 @ 0.00056078 = 15.6233 BTC [-] {4} [04:13]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15202 @ 0.00055919 = 8.5008 BTC [-] [04:30]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 57598 @ 0.00055865 = 32.1771 BTC [-] {2} [04:33]
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punkman https://www.drupal.org/project/misery [04:48]
assbot Misery | Drupal.org ... ( http://bit.ly/1mPPUki ) [04:48]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 54088 @ 0.00055861 = 30.2141 BTC [-] [05:05]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 21700 @ 0.0005599 = 12.1498 BTC [+] {2} [05:33]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 38950 @ 0.0005586 = 21.7575 BTC [-] [05:36]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 56600 @ 0.00055813 = 31.5902 BTC [-] {3} [05:43]
ben_vulpes yo where da trinque at [05:58]
ben_vulpes ;;later tell trinque yo hey yo hey [05:58]
gribble The operation succeeded. [05:58]
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deedbot- [BitBet Bets Bets] 2.03600000 BTC on 'No' - AlphaGo will defeat Lee Sedol overall in March 2016 match - http://bitbet.us/bet/1249/alphago-will-defeat-lee-sedol-overall-in-march/#b72 [06:01]
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mats heatin up [06:08]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20200 @ 0.0005601 = 11.314 BTC [+] [06:18]
ben_vulpes no mention of handicap [06:19]
ben_vulpes that bet is going to surprise some people [06:19]
ben_vulpes alphago can "win" with handicap of 12 stones and that bet goes green [06:20]
ben_vulpes unless mp^H^Hmods decide 'overall' has some magical meaning [06:20]
* assbot gives voice to adlai [06:34]
adlai so "some people" made an ass out of them and himself [06:34]
adlai ;;later tell BingoBoingo http://dpaste.com/34BA0H6.txt [06:45]
gribble The operation succeeded. [06:45]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1WAf171 ) [06:45]
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adlai ;;later tell BingoBoingo /me accidentally a word http://dpaste.com/3WX0P03.txt [06:55]
gribble The operation succeeded. [06:55]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1WAfS7R ) [06:55]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16300 @ 0.00055935 = 9.1174 BTC [-] {2} [07:01]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 67200 @ 0.00056242 = 37.7946 BTC [+] {2} [07:08]
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mats i don't see why there would be a handicap now [07:19]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 97621 @ 0.00056802 = 55.4507 BTC [+] {3} [07:20]
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mircea_popescu ben_vulpes> that bet is going to surprise some people << "overall" covers it imo [10:06]
mircea_popescu what's so magical about it ? [10:06]
mircea_popescu but in other news, http://40.media.tumblr.com/f6b4810f7b7499277a3b9424f2aeac37/tumblr_mveinsoBEr1qlne6uo1_1280.jpg [10:08]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1Qs0Ooc ) [10:08]
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asciilifeform http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-02-2016#1411879 << imho this will have to be a thing that is solved in one Final Solution shot, with turing-complete diff. we can NOT have 1,001 incompatible hacked gnudiff variants floating around in attempted use, it is chaos and death by ants. [12:42]
assbot Logged on 21-02-2016 06:02:08; punkman: asciilifeform: (you will have to rename the dir manually, because DIFF IS RETARDED) << I'll do a punkdiff release this week [12:42]
asciilifeform it is why i settled on straight gnudiff instead of trying 'clever' things [12:43]
mircea_popescu turing complete diff ?! [12:45]
mircea_popescu what's the diff if loop ? [12:45]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: this is a continuation of a thread almost as old as 'v' - consider the tinyscheme-genesis patch, shiva, and the 'pedigree bridge' [12:46]
asciilifeform we have this atrocity because gnudiff is incapable of renaming a directory without MORONICALLY --- -ing EVERY FUCKING LINE of every file and +++ -ing it in again [12:46]
asciilifeform likewise file deletions [12:46]
mircea_popescu no argument there., [12:46]
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asciilifeform and more generally, unix 'patch' output was not really designed for human eyes [12:47]
asciilifeform nor was the thing in any sense designed at all, really. [12:47]
asciilifeform just grew, like fungus. [12:47]
asciilifeform like most open sores crud. [12:47]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: if this was not clear, there is not presently any such thing as turing-complete diff/patch [12:49]
asciilifeform but it is one of the things that must come to exist, for sanity. [12:49]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform> nor was the thing in any sense designed at all, really. << quite very much this. [12:49]
mircea_popescu i just don't see the gap between "cleanly covers corner cases" and "is turing complete" bridged. [12:50]
asciilifeform because 'cover corner cases' through 'enumerated' is braindamage. [12:50]
mircea_popescu you can't put a kernel in every single thing including the diff utility! [12:50]
asciilifeform no kernel, just a little scheme interpreter. [12:51]
mircea_popescu ah that's what you had in mind. [12:51]
asciilifeform could've guessed, aha ? [12:51]
mircea_popescu listen, if you say "diff should parse scheme" instead of "diff should be turing complete" people'd follow a lot easier. [12:51]
mircea_popescu i for instance judged that since you DON'T say the obvious, you specifically do not mean the obvious. [12:52]
mircea_popescu why'd i guess like when talking to 16yos on saturday night ? [12:52]
asciilifeform well it technically doesn't have to be scheme. draft ver of 'p' for instance is more forth-like. [12:52]
mircea_popescu anyway, i can see it. [12:52]
asciilifeform 'v' as we have it now, or at least as it appeared in my initial publication, was a very hasty and premature, wartime wunderwaffen thing [12:53]
asciilifeform it was really only half-gestated. [12:53]
asciilifeform the adult version as i envision it is much more like what is described above. [12:54]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 188096 @ 0.00056155 = 105.6253 BTC [+] {3} [12:59]
mircea_popescu "The simplest way to generate a patch is to use ‘diff -Naur’ (see Tips for Patch Producers), but you might be able to reduce the size of the patch by renaming or removing some files before making the patch. If the older version of the package contains any files that the newer version does not, or if any files have been renamed between the two versions, make a list of rm and mv commands for the user to execute in th [13:00]
mircea_popescu e old version directory before applying the patch. Then run those commands yourself in the scratch directory." [13:00]
mircea_popescu speak of "not designed at all". [13:00]
asciilifeform aha recall this from early trb days ? [13:01]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 49500 @ 0.00057 = 28.215 BTC [+] [13:01]
asciilifeform specifically 'chicken' [13:01]
asciilifeform what a fuckingmisery [13:01]
asciilifeform (chicken was what i nowadays call a 'pedigree bridge') [13:01]
mircea_popescu aha. [13:02]
mircea_popescu in truth the situation here is that we don't even know much of the stuff we need until we need it, [13:02]
asciilifeform which is why turingcompletefinalsolution. [13:02]
mircea_popescu nor do we know the banal names of banal things until after we've made them, because unlike posterity, we don't have the advantage OF FUCKING SANE ANTECESSORS. [13:02]
mircea_popescu we're born of snails and other oratanii [13:03]
asciilifeform nobody said terraforming planets would be easy... [13:03]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform complete solutions are rarely best solutions tho. too heavy. [13:03]
mircea_popescu complete tank solution includes oil well. [13:03]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: this is a misconception, in this case. weigh my tinyscheme vs gnudiff! [13:03]
asciilifeform any metric you like - lines, complexity, hours to read [13:04]
asciilifeform complete solution made from ~orthogonal pieces~ is the magic sword which weighs as a feather. [13:04]
* mircea_popescu is not arguing against tinischeme [13:04]
asciilifeform it is also how you get 'no motherfucking updates ever, weld into concrete' while still getting exactly what is needed at every juncture. [13:05]
shinohai https://i.imgur.com/1ZafV6N.jpg [13:05]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1SKdCwE ) [13:05]
* asciilifeform wonders about the hypertrophied labia 90%+ of porn chix seem to have [13:06]
mircea_popescu that's hyper ? [13:07]
asciilifeform i suppose if mircea_popescu tells me that it is standard, i will believe. [13:07]
mircea_popescu you can't even see it ? [13:08]
mircea_popescu you mean the outer labia ? [13:08]
asciilifeform aha [13:08]
asciilifeform labia majora [13:08]
mircea_popescu that's mostly just fat/position tho. [13:08]
asciilifeform hm. [13:08]
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mircea_popescu there's been this weirdo trend of (mostly anglo) girls getting worried about their labia minora being "wrong", mostly on account of thgere being a LOT of natural variation on that score, and anglo chicks being all weird and insecure and sexually inexperienced. plus of course the crazed marketing society, that feeds into all of the above. [13:10]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 40436 @ 0.00056906 = 23.0105 BTC [-] [13:21]
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* assbot gives voice to polarbeard [13:24]
polarbeard so I've been playing a bit with shiva, I'm developing a simple hook mechanism, here's a preview https://gist.github.com/polarbeard/f5c5b02a2ce7c1a69c77 [13:24]
assbot shiva_hooks.patch · GitHub ... ( http://bit.ly/20NQyMF ) [13:24]
polarbeard thoughts? [13:25]
asciilifeform polarbeard: why all the crud ? [13:26]
asciilifeform why reverse_in_place, mk_list, marshall, etc. in cpp ? [13:26]
polarbeard re: my patches, I'm trying to keep an up to date version of them on my github trb repo, wouldn't mind submitting to the ml if somebody asks [13:26]
polarbeard utility functions? [13:26]
asciilifeform these should be in scheme. [13:26]
asciilifeform everything that can be in scheme, MUST BE. [13:26]
polarbeard marshall should be in scheme? [13:26]
asciilifeform explain to me why it is even necessary. [13:27]
polarbeard CNode marshalling [13:27]
asciilifeform WHY [13:27]
polarbeard because I'm marshalling per value type, not per hook type [13:28]
asciilifeform shiva.cpp as i originally wrote it, includes all of the trb headers. you can form scheme data structures handily without engaging in weird cppisms, just by iterating over, e.g., the node list, and forming scheme list while you do it. [13:28]
polarbeard that's what I do [13:29]
asciilifeform and what is this ? >> https://gist.github.com/polarbeard/f5c5b02a2ce7c1a69c77#file-shiva_hooks-patch-L142 [13:29]
assbot shiva_hooks.patch · GitHub ... ( http://bit.ly/20NR2ma ) [13:29]
polarbeard I'm just encapsulating the functionality [13:29]
asciilifeform this is not an explanation. [13:29]
polarbeard that was a bug fix [13:29]
asciilifeform do you know what an explanation is ? [13:29]
asciilifeform WHAT BUG [13:29]
asciilifeform if you found an ACTUAL bug, that should be OWN PATCH. [13:30]
polarbeard this is not a vpatch, don't you see that? [13:30]
asciilifeform i do [13:30]
asciilifeform but it is also not an anything else. [13:30]
asciilifeform it is an example of everything i stand against. [13:31]
polarbeard so, what you're going to do with ts then? [13:31]
asciilifeform i did give example. [13:31]
asciilifeform for one thing, i won't be implementing list reversal in cpp ! [13:31]
asciilifeform for another, bug fixes are their own patches, one per bug, that must contain nothing else. [13:31]
polarbeard I won't be adding unnecessary code to init.scm [13:32]
asciilifeform on the contrary, that is the ideal place for all new code pertaining to shiva. [13:32]
asciilifeform anything that is not going there, must answer why. [13:32]
polarbeard I'll split the bug fixes into their own vpatches when the time comes [13:32]
asciilifeform please do. [13:32]
asciilifeform these i will happily read, and sign. [13:32]
polarbeard atm I just wanted to dump what I'm working for, to get constructive feedback [13:32]
asciilifeform but doings in cpp what can be done inside tinyscheme, i will not. [13:33]
asciilifeform and i hope this is good feedback. [13:33]
asciilifeform see, the big thing here, [13:34]
asciilifeform is that by 'marshalling' the pointers, you are introducing trb's leakages into tinyscheme. [13:34]
asciilifeform (not to mention, bloating the code, but this is secondary) [13:34]
asciilifeform the point of shiva is PRECISELY the opposite [13:34]
asciilifeform 1) to have the cpp content of trb asymptotically go to ZERO with time [13:35]
asciilifeform 2) to THERMONUKE the idiot leaks. [13:35]
polarbeard never, I'm not translating trb to scheme [13:35]
polarbeard that's pointless and a waste of time [13:35]
asciilifeform nobody asked you to. but try also refrain from translating shiva to cpp, and spreading the leak metastases into it ? [13:35]
polarbeard so you embedded scheme for that reason? [13:36]
asciilifeform for the time being, with the more modest goal of abolishing the rpc module. [13:36]
asciilifeform but yes, in the long run it is intended as a prosthesis to take over where the brain damage of the original is incurable. [13:36]
asciilifeform (for n00bs or readers who have not been keeping up, 'shiva' is a highly experimental affair and not to be considered part of mainline trb!) [13:37]
asciilifeform and also in case polarbeard missed last night's thread, [13:38]
asciilifeform the magic of 'v' is that polarbeard does NOT have to agree with me!111 [13:38]
asciilifeform he is free, and encouraged to, produce his own schismatic shiva, and sign it, and who knows, folks may come to prefer it to mine. [13:38]
polarbeard I agree with you on that [13:38]
* assbot gives voice to pete_dushenski [13:39]
polarbeard yes, I'm not surprised that you have a different point of view, and I'm even pleased I think [13:39]
asciilifeform from my naked eye reading, your thing will run until the first gc cycle. [13:40]
asciilifeform but i can't promise this, and can't be bothered to test, for reasons already described. [13:40]
polarbeard it actually stores the callbacks [13:40]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10937 @ 0.000569 = 6.2232 BTC [-] [13:40]
polarbeard it works well, but still simple hooks because only a single callback may be registered per hook, not sure yet if there will be need for callback management [13:42]
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jurov http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-02-2016#1411948 << have you looked into 'ed' diffs? but yes, they can't rename directory either. [13:49]
assbot Logged on 21-02-2016 15:39:46; asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-02-2016#1411879 << imho this will have to be a thing that is solved in one Final Solution shot, with turing-complete diff. we can NOT have 1,001 incompatible hacked gnudiff variants floating around in attempted use, it is chaos and death by ants. [13:49]
asciilifeform jurov: i've looked into everything. [13:51]
phf dat patch, can take them to water, can't make them drink [13:51]
asciilifeform and i'm not very interested in 'can do all but X' widgets. [13:52]
asciilifeform i demand X, even values of X i don't yet know about. [13:52]
asciilifeform hence turingcompletevtron. [13:52]
asciilifeform and srsly, 'ed' ?! not meant for human reading any more than 'patch'. [13:52]
asciilifeform it is almost exemplary of the opposite of what we need here. [13:53]
* BingoBoingo is now known as oglafbot [13:54]
oglafbot http://oglaf.com/merrymen/ [13:54]
assbot Merry Men ... ( http://bit.ly/20NTIjC ) [13:54]
* oglafbot is now known as BingoBoingo [13:54]
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jurov asciilifeform: either it's 'can do all but X' or turing complete and thus with potentially unbounded runtime [13:56]
asciilifeform jurov: the magic trick is that there is no such thing as unbounded runtime on my box. [13:56]
asciilifeform there is exceed-bound-and-i-negrate [13:56]
asciilifeform we have finessed the halting problem !1111 [13:57]
jurov also, you imply basically to expose all filesystem primitives to scheme, are they comprehensively and soundly defined? [13:58]
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jurov i smell you'll eventually end with different presses in diff machines due to different filesystem semantics [13:58]
jurov who're you negrating now? [13:58]
asciilifeform any future folks who might think they are being clever with, e.g., nonterminating vtron program. [13:59]
asciilifeform jurov: what do you have with different filesystem semantics ? vax ? [13:59]
asciilifeform msdos ? [13:59]
pete_dushenski http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-02-2016#1412011 <-heh-> http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-02-2016#1412086 [14:00]
assbot Logged on 21-02-2016 16:07:32; mircea_popescu: there's been this weirdo trend of (mostly anglo) girls getting worried about their labia minora being "wrong", mostly on account of thgere being a LOT of natural variation on that score, and anglo chicks being all weird and insecure and sexually inexperienced. plus of course the crazed marketing society, that feeds into all of the above. [14:00]
assbot Logged on 21-02-2016 16:51:03; oglafbot: http://oglaf.com/merrymen/ [14:00]
jurov while you slept, "modern" filesystem implementors deemed to fit to reorder operations to improve performance [14:00]
asciilifeform glorious! [14:00]
asciilifeform show me example ? [14:00]
asciilifeform 'i deleted this first before reading, faster!1111' [14:01]
asciilifeform srsly, we are there already ?? [14:01]
phf i recall riastradh making an srfi proposal for a minimum subset of filesystem operations. could just implement it for tinyscheme [14:01]
phf http://mumble.net/~campbell/proposals/filesys.text [14:01]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1SZUPh4 ) [14:01]
asciilifeform phf: this was on my list of things to include, but i wanted to 'take it slow.' [14:02]
asciilifeform i did not include the tcp module for ts either [14:03]
asciilifeform though i have it [14:03]
jurov https://github.com/google/leveldb/issues/195 [14:03]
assbot Possible bug: fsync() required after calling rename() · Issue #195 · google/leveldb · GitHub ... ( http://bit.ly/1SZUZ8a ) [14:03]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16450 @ 0.00055661 = 9.1562 BTC [-] [14:03]
asciilifeform gotta love these 'optimizations' [14:04]
asciilifeform see also the gcc5 threads [14:04]
jurov lol looky now i'm the one to predict crapocalypse [14:04]
asciilifeform anyway this particular crapocalypse is avoidable, at least on our planet. BAN any heathen fs. [14:04]
asciilifeform instruct new users that they must operate on a sane fs. [14:05]
phf ext2 [14:05]
asciilifeform and much as i loathe the idea, we will probably have to nail down our own linux distro. [14:05]
jurov which fs is sane? which mount options? [14:06]
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asciilifeform jurov: i've been using reiserfs for ~decade. [14:06]
asciilifeform with 0 issues. [14:06]
asciilifeform the fact that reiser was jailed cemented it as permanently high-quality, no one wants to touch it, no 'progressors' progressate at it, no gnomes, no popularizers!111, etc. [14:07]
asciilifeform appears that it was bug-free as it was. [14:08]
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asciilifeform sooo [14:12]
asciilifeform gotta do a few things to the mains wiring, i (and zoolag) will be down for 30 min. to an hour. [14:13]
asciilifeform starting now. [14:13]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6400 @ 0.00055655 = 3.5619 BTC [-] {2} [14:24]
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phf added patch highlight to btcbase (got tired of trying to visually locate patches in the graph) [15:10]
phf for example http://btcbase.org/patches?patchset=stable&search=showmyip [15:10]
assbot trb ... ( http://bit.ly/1ow0Y7q ) [15:10]
phf or my favorite http://btcbase.org/patches?patchset=stable&search=asciilifeform [15:11]
assbot trb ... ( http://bit.ly/1ow16nt ) [15:11]
deedbot- [BitBet Bets Bets] 1.00000000 BTC on 'No' - AlphaGo will defeat Lee Sedol overall in March 2016 match - http://bitbet.us/bet/1249/alphago-will-defeat-lee-sedol-overall-in-march/#b74 [15:12]
* justanotheruser (~Justan@unaffiliated/justanotheruser) has joined #bitcoin-assets [15:12]
BingoBoingo ;;ticker --market all [15:19]
gribble Bitstamp BTCUSD last: 432.66, vol: 13065.58845587 | BTC-E BTCUSD last: 432.623, vol: 11650.44569 | Bitfinex BTCUSD last: 436.5, vol: 54646.13980057 | CampBX BTCUSD last: 440.0, vol: 0.60533968 | BTCChina BTCUSD last: 442.360947, vol: 67064.74420000 | Kraken BTCUSD last: 432.1104, vol: 898.75107699 | Bitcoin-Central BTCUSD last: 425.870649, vol: 71.32973054 | Volume-weighted last (1 more message) [15:19]
BingoBoingo ;;more [15:19]
gribble average: 438.487963423 [15:19]
BingoBoingo ;;bc,stats [15:23]
gribble Current Blocks: 399479 | Current Difficulty: 1.6349165490895926E11 | Next Difficulty At Block: 401183 | Next Difficulty In: 1704 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 1 week, 6 days, 12 hours, 34 minutes, and 17 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: None | Estimated Percent Change: None [15:23]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 45150 @ 0.00055747 = 25.1698 BTC [+] [15:30]
* asciilifeform (~asciilife@unaffiliated/asciilifeform) has joined #bitcoin-assets [15:37]
* PaulCapestany has quit (Quit: .) [15:39]
* PaulCapestany (~PaulCapes@204.28.124.82) has joined #bitcoin-assets [15:41]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 97155 @ 0.00056091 = 54.4952 BTC [+] {2} [15:42]
mod6 so with that build script, i'm thinking just take out the curl & --verify of that stupid .sign file. [15:43]
mod6 still will check the hash of the buildroot artifact. [15:47]
mod6 gonna try that out locally here. [15:47]
mod6 i guess, the other good news to that is you wont need to import that rando's guy's key into your keyring. still would need mine, alf & trinque's tho. [15:47]
* assbot gives voice to asciilifeform [15:47]
danielpbarron oh mod6, with a fresh .bitcoin/ directory, your new thing seems to work fine [15:54]
* assbot gives voice to kakobrekla [15:58]
* kakobrekla is back [15:59]
kakobrekla logs tell me no one missed me, great :) [15:59]
pete_dushenski don't believe everything you don't read [16:01]
ben_vulpes bitbet is broken kakobrekla [16:01]
ben_vulpes also assbot [16:02]
ben_vulpes and irc [16:02]
jurov and assbot's stuff is swollen [16:02]
ben_vulpes you keep irc working right? [16:02]
kakobrekla looks like i returned prematurely [16:03]
ben_vulpes wait come back [16:03]
ben_vulpes mircea_popescu's javascript also doesn't work in every browser [16:04]
ben_vulpes mod6: perhaps hard code the hashes from korsgaard's signature and verify those? [16:05]
phf ben_vulpes: they are like md5 and sha1 [16:06]
mod6 ^ [16:06]
* kakobrekla had a blast snowboarding the prime slopes of Dolomites region of Alps [16:07]
mod6 i think this was actually discussed quite some time ago. i dont remember what the sentiment was exactly. but i think it was like "meh" [16:07]
mod6 danielpbarron: ok thanks for the update [16:07]
mod6 anyway, i guess i don't mind, i can add a part where we check the SHA1 & MD5 of the buildroot artifact and then continue to verify that .sign file. [16:09]
phf kakobrekla: i went camping in the Appalachian last weekend, -20c w/ winds, but it was awesome. i did just enough trash talking about russian blood to come down with a flu by thursday... [16:09]
kakobrekla l0lz [16:09]
kakobrekla meanwhile i was the only person in sauna yesterday evening [16:09]
phf as soon as i can move again, i'm going to make it to russian&turkish baths in nyc. they don't really do saunas on the east coast, but that baths place is awesome [16:11]
ben_vulpes mod6: while there's no harm in checking the .sign, i don't know what it buys us [16:12]
ben_vulpes also that signature is disturbingly short [16:12]
kakobrekla really no saunas? whats the deal with that? [16:12]
mod6 ben_vulpes: yeah, i dunno what the deal is with it, seems to not work exactly as expected. [16:12]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10150 @ 0.00056778 = 5.763 BTC [+] {2} [16:13]
* Guest50412 is now known as schmidty [16:14]
phf i hnfi. these people do "spas", but the sauna part is typically a joke [16:14]
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* schmidty (~schmidty@unaffiliated/schmidty) has joined #bitcoin-assets [16:14]
mod6 im gonna look again at what happens with 1.4.19 & that sign file. [16:15]
phf there's literally 4 places in the entire virgnia-connecticut stretch. maybe there's something up in Massachusetts. there's "east european" places ran by russians but with a lot of turks, etc. and then there's korean baths. but koreans frown on cold plunges, so they would usually have a tepid shower/pool [16:16]
kakobrekla im fine with shower only as long as you can set the temp to whatever you want [16:17]
mod6 ok, so right, with 1.4.19 it has that WARNING at the end: http://dpaste.com/1BZA8NQ.txt [16:17]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1UgmUQg ) [16:17]
phf yeah, korean places are not bad, but i know only of one that caters specifically to koreans (i.e. good heat), a lot of them are western oriented so massage and facials and such [16:18]
phf this place is great http://www.russianturkishbaths.com if you're ever in nyc [16:19]
assbot 010813rtbh ... ( http://bit.ly/1Ugn6PB ) [16:19]
deedbot- [BitBet Bets Bets] 1.00000000 BTC on 'No' - Donald Trump gets Republican Nomination - http://bitbet.us/bet/1206/donald-trump-gets-republican-nomination/#b104 [16:20]
ben_vulpes ha wow did the shitgnomes snip that mod6 ? [16:20]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 64900 @ 0.0005694 = 36.9541 BTC [+] {2} [16:21]
mod6 hrm? [16:22]
mod6 ah, no idea. [16:22]
mod6 so ... https://buildroot.org/downloads/ [16:23]
assbot Index of /downloads ... ( http://bit.ly/1ow8JKK ) [16:23]
mod6 in here there seem to be .sign files for the .tar.gz's, but they seem to have .gpg's for the tar.bz2's [16:23]
mod6 im gonna take a look at that instead. [16:23]
mod6 ooh... not for our version :( [16:24]
mod6 guess that only started with the version /after/ our version 2015.05 [16:24]
mod6 lol ofc [16:24]
mod6 oh nm, looks like those are only there for an RC version? [16:25]
mod6 ok. ya [16:25]
ben_vulpes apparently [16:25]
mod6 heh, these guys built this huge thing, but their sign files only have SHA1 & MD5, even the most recent 2016.02 [16:26]
mod6 wth [16:27]
mod6 why even bother? [16:27]
mod6 im starting to think that our SHA512 sum of this artifact is better than whatever they've got. [16:28]
* assbot gives voice to shinohai [16:31]
* asciilifeform ears stand up! [16:34]
phf illustration: ^- http://www.somepets.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/manul4.jpg [16:35]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1UgoEZZ ) [16:35]
ben_vulpes mod6: yeah. [16:36]
* ben_vulpes imagines stan's face shooped onto the manul [16:36]
asciilifeform exactly this, aha. [16:37]
asciilifeform mod6: tell me which tarballs, i will dig out my originals and sum [16:38]
asciilifeform in other nyooz, from the depths, http://www.newsbtc.com/2016/02/21/xapo-announces-plans-to-upgrade-to-bitcoin-classic [16:39]
assbot Xapo Announces Plans to Upgrade to Bitcoin Classic ... ( http://bit.ly/1ow9SSp ) [16:39]
mod6 asciilifeform:this is the one that we're pulling [16:44]
mod6 http://buildroot.uclibc.org/downloads/buildroot-2015.05.tar.gz [16:44]
mod6 we expect this sha512: [16:44]
mod6 c42fdd39cb2bc46804a86a7d7b2605bd3cd9ddcb365c4e5a1fb147eb02b234fc31a70c8140be2f4d27cd371c84e0c6701f8cb47697dd1c18dd0e0cce784aa07a [16:44]
danielpbarron https://twitter.com/Joseph_Young_ << literally philippino [16:45]
assbot Joseph (@Joseph_Young_) | Twitter ... ( http://bit.ly/1owaasp ) [16:45]
asciilifeform c42fdd39cb2bc46804a86a7d7b2605bd3cd9ddcb365c4e5a1fb147eb02b234fc31a70c8140be2f4d27cd371c84e0c6701f8cb47697dd1c18dd0e0cce784aa07a [16:46]
asciilifeform downloaded may 31 2015. [16:47]
asciilifeform i have, i think, also earlier buildroots [16:47]
asciilifeform if anyone wants. [16:47]
asciilifeform and their tars. [16:47]
asciilifeform and their cached crapolade. [16:48]
mod6 ok great [16:48]
mod6 yeah, here's what i've got in total: http://dpaste.com/35XDBSS.txt [16:48]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1owaqYA ) [16:48]
mod6 the md5 & sha1 match the sign file [16:49]
* pete_dushenski has quit (Remote host closed the connection) [16:49]
ben_vulpes c42fdd39cb2bc46804a86a7d7b2605bd3cd9ddcb365c4e5a1fb147eb02b234fc31a70c8140be2f4d27cd371c84e0c6701f8cb47697dd1c18dd0e0cce784aa07a [16:49]
* shesek has quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) [16:50]
mod6 what we really aught to do is write to that guy, get him to join the wot with a 4096 bit RSA key, and have him resign all of the bundles. [16:51]
mod6 or at least, just the one we're using. [16:52]
ben_vulpes "the army we have" [16:52]
mod6 want me to do it? [16:53]
mod6 i can do that. [16:53]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 41550 @ 0.00056304 = 23.3943 BTC [-] {2} [16:54]
danielpbarron which guy? [16:54]
mod6 "Peter Korsgaard " [16:54]
ben_vulpes it's just another thing in the way of wrapping this up, mod6 . [16:55]
ben_vulpes asciilifeform produced legacy hashes, they match the ones i have on disk and the ones you have right? [16:55]
mod6 sure sure. [16:56]
mod6 just thinking that hey, cant hurt anything to enlighten the guy that these hashes that he's signing, even up to this current month are obsolete. [16:56]
asciilifeform obsolete?! [16:56]
asciilifeform what even is this [16:56]
mod6 SHA1 & MD5 are broken are they not? [16:57]
asciilifeform ah this yes [16:57]
asciilifeform do we have a confirmed collision here ?! [16:57]
asciilifeform i.e. different sha512 but same sha1/md5 ? [16:57]
mod6 anyway, an open line of comms to these folks could help us -- especially going forward as we basically might need to "roll our own" so that it doesn't pull the deps via rsync. [16:58]
mod6 asciilifeform: not as far as i've seen. [16:58]
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ben_vulpes my sha1 and md5 match those in k's .sign [16:59]
mod6 so as far as the build-bitcoind-V99995.sh is concerned. let's just check that hash and call it a day then. [17:02]
mod6 i've updated the script here: http://www.mod6.net/btcf/build-bitcoind-V99995.sh [17:03]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1mOPSt7 ) [17:03]
asciilifeform phf: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-02-2016#1412134 << this is very spiffy [17:04]
assbot Logged on 21-02-2016 18:08:18; phf: or my favorite http://btcbase.org/patches?patchset=stable&search=asciilifeform [17:04]
mod6 take a look, i've removed 3 lines: 1. in the comment section where it lists PK's key fingerprint at the top 2. the curl that pulls the sign file for buildroot-2015.05.tar.gz.sign 3. the gpg command that verifies buildroot-2015.05.tar.gz.sign [17:04]
jurov with my `cwd` problem yest, looks like i have ran into http://www.perlmonks.org/?node_id=304587 :( [17:05]
* asciilifeform looks [17:05]
assbot why does ignoring sigCHLD corrupt return value from system()? ... ( http://bit.ly/1UgrlLc ) [17:05]
jurov why do i keep getting such obscure stuff... [17:05]
mod6 c2ed1ccbb6769ada764b6d31e7a06873860c422109c4f8506cbda04402243c0534c9555f44f4c47071ebc3d6e3ece720b84de2940a2639381ef77652b34c3030 [17:05]
mod6 sha512 for build-bitcoind-V99995.sh is now ^^ [17:05]
mod6 jurov: do you mean `pwd' ? [17:06]
jurov yes pwd [17:06]
jurov basically, perl's fork() stopped working [17:06]
mod6 what version of *nix & what version of perl [17:06]
jurov much joy [17:06]
asciilifeform jurov: whatddyamean 'stop working' ?! [17:07]
asciilifeform as in, cosmic ray ? [17:07]
asciilifeform or did you... update the box. [17:07]
jurov gentoo, perl 5.20.2 [17:07]
jurov i updated glibc with the patch [17:07]
asciilifeform aaaaah [17:07]
jurov for getname [17:07]
asciilifeform which patch ? [17:07]
mod6 pwd is used iirc in v.pl, but only in the contex of it being a shell out - your environment should execute this and return the result to a scalar. [17:07]
jurov gethostbyname [17:07]
asciilifeform well yes [17:07]
asciilifeform but ~which patch~ [17:07]
mod6 fork() shoudn't even be a consideration here... im confused. [17:08]
phf yeesh, when shiva fails to read init.scm it kills the whole bitcoind there and then [17:08]
asciilifeform phf: kills how ? [17:09]
jurov mod6 `pwd` call subprocess [17:09]
jurov hence, fork [17:09]
phf Shiva: new session, connected from 127.0.0.1:49563 [17:09]
phf libc++abi.dylib: terminating with uncaught exception of type std::runtime_error: Shiva: failed to read init file! [17:09]
phf run: line 4: 67621 Abort trap: 6 [17:09]
mod6 perl doesn't care about what subprocesses a unix command may or may not use tho. [17:09]
asciilifeform phf: and this is the correct behaviour (IF SHIVA IS ENABLED), just needs to happen cleanly and humanely. does it ? [17:09]
asciilifeform ah this is CORRECT phf. [17:09]
jurov asciilifeform: how do i list patches that went into glibc-2.22-r2 ? [17:09]
mod6 it'd be like doing the same thing in a bash script: PWD=`pwd`; echo $PWD; [17:10]
phf oh i agree, it should kill, just not without prejudice [17:10]
phf (i.e. no reason to corrupt db in the process) [17:10]
asciilifeform jurov: look in the portage cache, possibly. but you might have to diff with previous. [17:10]
mod6 jurov: fwiw, i do a huge % of testing on a gentoo env with perl 5.20... [17:11]
asciilifeform phf: possibly it ought to die before the db is opened. [17:11]
mod6 v5.20.2 for x86_64-linux [17:11]
phf well, init.scm is read on each connection, since there's no persistence [17:11]
jurov mod6 well, on another box i updates glibc to same version and perl works fine [17:11]
jurov *updated [17:12]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 39300 @ 0.0005655 = 22.2242 BTC [+] [17:12]
mod6 weird [17:12]
mod6 so again, this is because somehow V thinks that your pwd is in / ? [17:17]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 41214 @ 0.00056467 = 23.2723 BTC [-] {2} [17:17]
mod6 are you in / when executing V, by doing something like `/path/to/where/V/is/actually/located/v.pl` [17:19]
mod6 because then your pwd would be / [17:19]
mod6 and it'll look for .wot in / [17:19]
punkman http://archive.is/DZy45 [17:19]
assbot Should enQ Get To Sell Spots In IRS Phone Queue? - Forbes ... ( http://bit.ly/1UgsJ0j ) [17:19]
jurov mod6 noooo, pwd is external program. it failed to run it and returned nothing [17:21]
jurov and nothing + '/.wot' is... [17:21]
mod6 ok, so pwd just fails as is. [17:21]
mod6 what does `which pwd` tell you? [17:22]
jurov but don't mind, this is my private mess [17:22]
jurov even system('ls') fails [17:22]
mod6 im simply curious here, never seen a pwd fail before. [17:22]
mod6 oooh. [17:22]
mod6 yeah, probably need to re-chroot or whatever it is with gentoo [17:23]
mod6 asciilifeform or trinque have any thoughts for the man? [17:24]
mod6 in other news jurov, im about to re-send the emails from yesterday [17:24]
jurov yay just recompiled perl without thread support, that did the trick [17:25]
jurov mod6 go on [17:25]
mod6 wait, now it works?!?! [17:25]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 44345 @ 0.00057003 = 25.278 BTC [+] {2} [17:25]
ben_vulpes lol thread support did it huh? [17:25]
jurov yes, both my perl and turdatron [17:25]
mod6 lemme see if i get this. perl with thread support broke your entire gentoo? [17:26]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12655 @ 0.0005712 = 7.2285 BTC [+] [17:26]
asciilifeform i have nfi [17:26]
jurov not entire. just occassional problems with perl scripts like v.pl and autotools [17:26]
mod6 but i thought you said that `ls` and `pwd` didn't work, like in your shell. that shouldn't have anything to do with perl. [17:27]
mod6 my mind is blown. these are C binaries. [17:27]
jurov THEY DID WORK [17:28]
jurov but perl failed to execue them! [17:28]
* da2ce7 has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) [17:28]
jurov most perl scripts meddle with $SIG so they worked fine [17:28]
mod6 but, say, normal use; you log in, you get a shell, you type `ls` and that would just work as expected right? [17:29]
jurov yes, everything worked. except perl -e "print system('ls') or die $!" returned just -1 [17:29]
mod6 ahhhh [17:29]
mod6 ok. [17:29]
mod6 then that makes a bit more sense. [17:29]
mod6 maybe i should rewrite V in C [17:30]
jurov as i said, don't mind. it's my problem, i should not avoid dubious USE flags [17:31]
mod6 well, someday maybe. still a dog with fleas. [17:31]
jurov *i should avoid [17:31]
shinohai btw mod6 I have reproduced it again just fine this morning Deb 8 and Ubuntu 14.04 [17:31]
mod6 ah, ok good deal shinohai. I updated the script so that it doens't even pull that .sign file. we'll just rely on the sha512 that I hvae, alf has, and ben has. [17:32]
mod6 the link is above if anyone wants to give it a try. [17:32]
shinohai works for me [17:32]
asciilifeform phf: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-02-2016#1412300 << as stated in the comments, i regard this as a serious loose end that must be tied before anyone can even contemplate using a shivatronic trb in the battlefield [17:33]
assbot Logged on 21-02-2016 20:08:29; phf: well, init.scm is read on each connection, since there's no persistence [17:33]
mod6 shinohai: ok cool! im running mine right now [17:34]
mod6 im making a `typescript' of the output as well. will post later when its complete. [17:34]
shinohai Me too did u get my pm with the address to node stats? [17:34]
mod6 ah, ya, haven't looked yet tho. [17:34]
* mod6 looks [17:34]
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* Cory has quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) [17:35]
mod6 cool! [17:35]
mod6 9 connections, there soemthing i don't see everyday. [17:35]
mod6 thanks for your help all. much appreciated. [17:36]
shinohai Sometimes gets as many as 12 [17:36]
mod6 wow. cool. [17:36]
mod6 so once we're happy with this build-script, etc. we cna update that wiki, then we're back in sync. then I can take some time to get the makefiles stuff all organized. [17:37]
mod6 no super rush there. [17:37]
mod6 just only was in a hurry to get back into sync. [17:37]
mod6 jurov: glad you got it resolved tho. let us know how it goes for you. [17:38]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 144950 @ 0.00057256 = 82.9926 BTC [+] {4} [17:38]
jurov it did compile the bitcoind, the problem was intermittent [17:38]
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mod6 ok now to resend those emails... [17:39]
mod6 wish me luck lol [17:39]
ben_vulpes > 9 connections << coracle currently serving 13 strangers [17:40]
ben_vulpes and in other nyooz of the weird and strange saga of ben_vulpes endeavoring to set up a reference implementation on his heathen macintosh, buildroot fails to compile in linux virtual machines of all sorts of flavors [17:41]
* ben_vulpes gives up again [17:41]
asciilifeform ben_vulpes: post moar detail ? [17:41]
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asciilifeform ben_vulpes: fwiw it builds on 'centos', ubiquitous [17:41]
phf i have it running in a frowned upon state. cmake, llvm, clang [17:42]
mod6 huh, yeah wouldn't have expected that [17:42]
ben_vulpes here's the last line, asciilifeform: x86_64-therealbitcoin-linux-musl-gcc: internal compiler error: Segmentation fault (program cc1) [17:42]
mod6 and this is a gentoo VM? or ubuntu? [17:42]
asciilifeform phf: this is not useless, you can do the thing with the call graph even [17:42]
ben_vulpes phf: share your weird! [17:42]
asciilifeform phf: i have long wanted to get this working, so i can haz call graph [17:42]
asciilifeform which gcc refuses to disgorge [17:43]
ben_vulpes mod6: under gentoo the vm simply gives up on life [17:43]
ben_vulpes mod6: under ubuntu 14.04 running make in buildroot exits as above [17:43]
asciilifeform ben_vulpes: lemme guess: gcc 5 [17:43]
ben_vulpes heh [17:43]
asciilifeform KILL IT WITH FIRE [17:43]
asciilifeform and try again. [17:43]
ben_vulpes i didn't even check. [17:43]
mod6 yeah, maybe alf has it [17:43]
asciilifeform 4.9 is already broken for some cases [17:43]
ben_vulpes gcc (Gentoo 4.6.3 p1.13, pie-0.5.2) 4.6.3 [17:44]
phf ben_vulpes: i'm building it from inside Clion, so i'm not sure how easy it is to do cmake otherwise, i can share the diff though [17:44]
asciilifeform ben_vulpes: hm, ought to work [17:44]
* ben_vulpes shrugs [17:44]
asciilifeform but wtf is 'pie' [17:44]
mod6 jurov: lol, those emails envetually went through!!!?! [17:44]
ben_vulpes is this perversion even worth running down? [17:44]
mod6 glad i checked or they would have been in there 2x. [17:45]
ben_vulpes i figured this for more of a "half bottle of wine in a girl's butt" report. entertainment, not science. [17:45]
asciilifeform ben_vulpes: any such perversion is ~always~ worth running to ground [17:45]
asciilifeform it is how we discovered the libnss thing [17:45]
asciilifeform and other evils [17:45]
mod6 yaaa, i recall this [17:45]
jurov mod6: what mail provides do you use? trying to resend email for 3 days is standard [17:45]
asciilifeform pretty much everything we have, we have because someone ran the motherfucking gnomes to ground, each time. [17:46]
asciilifeform ben_vulpes's turn. [17:46]
mod6 jurov: evil mail [17:46]
ben_vulpes to be frank, i have no idea how this gentoo image was even built in the first place. [17:46]
asciilifeform waiwut [17:46]
asciilifeform i thought you built it ? [17:46]
asciilifeform or where, found on the street ? [17:46]
ben_vulpes no, 'twas some abortion pulled in via 'atlas', 'hashicorp' [17:47]
asciilifeform what even is that [17:47]
mod6 ;;later tell pete_dushenski here's that change log you wanted: http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/2016-February/000213.html [17:47]
gribble The operation succeeded. [17:47]
phf ben_vulpes: you brought this upon yourself :D [17:47]
assbot [BTC-dev] mod6's V [in perl] version 99995 K ... ( http://bit.ly/1Ugvezz ) [17:47]
ben_vulpes 'easy development environments for derpvelopers on macintosh!' [17:47]
ben_vulpes phf: it's a hobby [17:47]
asciilifeform this is where i repeat mircea_popescu's admonition not to eat from dumpsters. [17:47]
ben_vulpes but the phood is phr33! [17:48]
asciilifeform quite. [17:48]
mod6 haha. also gives you the shits. [17:48]
ben_vulpes as demonstrated! [17:48]
mod6 hahahahahaha [17:48]
mod6 ugh. man. computers right? [17:49]
* felipelalli has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) [17:51]
jurov butbutbut riced dumpsters! [17:54]
asciilifeform unrelatedly, http://www.applelogic.org/files/6502SCHEMATIC.pdf [17:55]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1QTtHKq ) [17:55]
asciilifeform ^ apparently the whole thing. 1 page. [17:55]
phf man, writing scheme is like trying to build an eiffel tower out of toothpicks [17:55]
asciilifeform phf: only the first time. it then turns into a steel beam you can use to build proper towers. [17:55]
phf once i bootstrap entire cl you mean? (define-macro (destructuring-bind ... [17:56]
asciilifeform aha. [17:56]
asciilifeform incidentally, tried slib ? [17:56]
phf no [17:56]
phf will look [17:56]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 47900 @ 0.00056373 = 27.0027 BTC [-] {2} [17:58]
* TheRealJohnGalt_ has quit (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity) [18:00]
deedbot- [BitBet Bets Bets] 1.00000000 BTC on 'No' - Marco Rubio will be Republicans' 2016 Presidential Nominee - http://bitbet.us/bet/1205/marco-rubio-will-be-republicans-2016-presidential-nominee/#b17 [18:01]
mircea_popescu i shall now proceed to read the scrollback! [18:03]
mircea_popescu god help the man that takes a nap during republican times. [18:03]
mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-02-2016#1412040 << lol that escalated quickly. [18:03]
assbot Logged on 21-02-2016 16:27:59; asciilifeform: it is an example of everything i stand against. [18:03]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: read his thing, mega-recommended. [18:04]
asciilifeform will see why. [18:04]
mircea_popescu o no. i'm not going to arbiter on code matters. [18:04]
mircea_popescu consensus process, bitches. [18:04]
asciilifeform don't need to. but see the thing in question, imho it is more or less the perfect example of what not to do. [18:05]
mircea_popescu lol k. [18:05]
mircea_popescu heh. [18:06]
mircea_popescu so the guy is more familiar with cpp, naturally wants to isolate the weird he's taking in and take it in at controlled rate. [18:07]
mircea_popescu won't be accepted in trb by any means, but i dun see anything wrong wiht the process. [18:07]
mircea_popescu gotta figure it out somehow. [18:07]
asciilifeform well it pull in the direction precisely opposite to shiva. [18:07]
asciilifeform *pulls [18:07]
asciilifeform while being nominally a shiva patch. [18:07]
asciilifeform and i am all for the fella figuring things out, so long as he understands this, and the ~why~. [18:08]
mircea_popescu eh it doesn't pull anything. think about it : it is a modest, quiet hope, specifically that shiva/b-a/trb is actually heavy enough that it may pull him. [18:08]
mircea_popescu there's nothing wrong with treating your baby as a chunk of bedrock, you know. [18:08]
ben_vulpes what even was the point of the schemehooks? [18:08]
mircea_popescu tied some ropes to it and pulling on them, technically yes "this pulls the earth the wrong way". practically, tis alpinism. [18:08]
asciilifeform ben_vulpes: multifold point. most realistically, and in the short term, to abolish the json rpc crapolade. [18:09]
asciilifeform ben_vulpes: more generally, and later, as an internal debugger. [18:09]
asciilifeform ben_vulpes: much more generally, and much later - as potential replacement for entire chunks of the rotten flesh. [18:09]
ben_vulpes these are the original hooks? i misread [18:11]
asciilifeform there are no useful hooks yet. [18:11]
asciilifeform there is a demo, which was supplied with the original patch, that gets block count, and another knob that quits. [18:11]
phf asciilifeform: he's asking about SchemeHook from polarbeard's patch [18:12]
asciilifeform ah [18:12]
mircea_popescu myeah. [18:12]
asciilifeform these, i think, are meant to be debug hooks [18:12]
asciilifeform but ask him, not me. [18:12]
mircea_popescu and in the world's most amusing porn news, "pregnant male doctor grabs boob" http://41.media.tumblr.com/cbf106747cae91ec1e7fa6bbad5fcbe9/tumblr_mlvjrxMRnl1qlne6uo1_1280.jpg [18:16]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1QTvMpJ ) [18:16]
asciilifeform l0l this one's for BingoBoingo [18:16]
mircea_popescu imo the "skelet" thing on the wall totally makes it. [18:16]
asciilifeform aha. [18:17]
mircea_popescu modern if unintentional art. [18:17]
jurov at least he has he stethoscope on [18:18]
mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-02-2016#1412083 << total fucking misnomers alf won't let go of with his lyf! [18:18]
assbot Logged on 21-02-2016 16:49:27; asciilifeform: hence turingcompletevtron. [18:18]
asciilifeform hm? [18:18]
mircea_popescu what [i believe] you have in mind when ytou say "tc" in thsi context is pointedly not what most anyone reading it would expect it to mean. [18:19]
asciilifeform it means what everybody's kindergarten textbook had it mean!11 [18:19]
mircea_popescu but a very... haskellite, even, theoretical notion. [18:19]
asciilifeform how? [18:19]
asciilifeform all i ask for is that vtron be able to specify arbitrary transformations, e.g., 'replace every letter a with b', rather than the +++/--- imbecility. [18:20]
mircea_popescu in that it's "turing complete in a purely theoretical sense and with none of the practical overhead a practical implementation would imply except in those cases where it is clearly and truly needed". [18:20]
jurov ^yes i was hinting at this too [18:21]
asciilifeform i suppose, like every other time before, i am doomed to demonstrate ~by example~... [18:21]
mircea_popescu in this sense cunt is turing complete, it can express all proteins. [18:21]
mircea_popescu good luck getting the fps to do so, however. [18:22]
phf i think the idea is to have a slightly more constrained awk. patchmachine takes string, manipulates it, returns new string [18:23]
mircea_popescu phf my mental model is essentially "awk without regexp" [18:23]
asciilifeform phf: specifically not awk and nothing like awk. [18:23]
jurov no the ide was patchmachine takes *filesystem* and ditto [18:23]
asciilifeform enough with the arbitrary nonorthogonal craplangs. [18:23]
jurov *idea [18:23]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform what other than regexp do you hate in awk ? and being gnucpp, of course. [18:23]
asciilifeform plenty. [18:24]
asciilifeform e.g., not homoiconic [18:24]
phf jurov: or that [18:24]
asciilifeform no lambda. [18:24]
asciilifeform no proper arrays even. [18:24]
jurov lol first me tormenting alf with ed, now they awk [18:24]
mircea_popescu ok, you know, say that! "i want a homoiconic thing with lambda", rather than "tc" [18:24]
asciilifeform hey vdiff is in awk. [18:24]
mircea_popescu which is what the first pass of this convo actually exactly was, iirc. [18:24]
mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-02-2016#1411970 [18:25]
assbot Logged on 21-02-2016 15:48:49; mircea_popescu: listen, if you say "diff should parse scheme" instead of "diff should be turing complete" people'd follow a lot easier. [18:25]
asciilifeform anyway if i already knew what this needs to look like, i'd have already written it. [18:25]
mircea_popescu obviously. [18:25]
asciilifeform it needs to come out of the 'resistance of the medium' from the sort of thing we find ourselves doing with regularity. [18:25]
mircea_popescu which is why one'd expect a lot more alma matering of stuff like polarbeard's. [18:25]
mircea_popescu he's bound to run into a shitton of resistance of the medium in short order with that thing. [18:26]
asciilifeform if only it were so simple. do you notice what most programming types do when they run into a forest ? [18:26]
asciilifeform they build bulldozer, drive right through the oaks. [18:26]
mircea_popescu aha. [18:26]
jurov maybe we'll end up with vtron that actually allow to implement source code parser inside vpatches so that it computes checksums for every function [18:26]
asciilifeform as described by naggum, http://www.xach.com/naggum/articles/3144404199547949@naggum.no.html [18:26]
assbot source access vs dynamism - Naggum cll archive ... ( http://bit.ly/217BSgV ) [18:27]
mircea_popescu maybe we could name it php! [18:27]
jurov and the graph will be made from these checksums [18:27]
jurov so that descendants will list code snippets the actually depend on [18:27]
jurov instead of whole files [18:27]
asciilifeform jurov: forget about usefully parsing cpp. [18:27]
asciilifeform it is quite likely undecidable. [18:28]
asciilifeform (make of this what you will) [18:28]
jurov someone inewitably will try it anyway. and i wish to see your face upon seeing vpatch with embedded cpptron [18:29]
asciilifeform i am quite certain that every possible thing will be tried. [18:29]
phf vpatch generating mandelbrots [18:29]
asciilifeform betcha somebody's very busy stuffing the winblowz crud back in, for instance. [18:29]
asciilifeform and somewhere, probably not too far from each of us, [18:29]
asciilifeform a pig is eating its own shit. [18:30]
asciilifeform what of it. [18:30]
mircea_popescu jurov> someone inewitably will try it anyway. and i wish to see your face upon seeing vpatch with embedded cpptron <<< abhahaha win [18:30]
jurov actually, that's logical conclusion of what you want. instead of "teh stupid +++ --- stuff" make c++ parser, apply a transform and generate code [18:31]
asciilifeform jurov: do you know why not ? [18:31]
asciilifeform because it is HEAVY [18:31]
asciilifeform remember 'fits in head' ? [18:31]
jurov arbitrary text transformations like you dream of do not fit in head [18:32]
asciilifeform sure they do. [18:32]
asciilifeform tinyscheme fits in head. [18:32]
asciilifeform and it can do it. [18:32]
asciilifeform and it isn't even as slim as it could be. [18:32]
jurov then it couild also parse c++ [18:32]
jurov it's arbitrary text transformation, too [18:32]
asciilifeform jurov: you are welcome to try parsing cpp, it would be a pretty useful proggy incidentally [18:32]
asciilifeform but the last time i asked for one, no one found any other than 'clang'. [18:33]
asciilifeform the language is gargantuan, just enough parser to ~compile~ is likely to take you a decade to write. [18:33]
asciilifeform and no one will read. [18:33]
mircea_popescu incredibly enough, afl's objections actually carry. [18:34]
mircea_popescu "arbitrary text transformations" but only between these two sets we carefully curated. [18:34]
mircea_popescu exactly like how human sciences work. [18:34]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform now stop calling it "tc" and confusing people. concept needs a new name. [18:34]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: lacking a rigorously narrower complexity class, i am stuck with tc [18:35]
asciilifeform but if you have one, let's. [18:35]
mircea_popescu this is like saying "i want a whaleoctopusdeerkitten" because you dunno how to say girlfriend [18:35]
asciilifeform nah more like 'i need a bipedal mammal' [18:35]
mircea_popescu backpedal more like it amirite [18:36]
mircea_popescu snort snort nudge nudge [18:36]
ben_vulpes i read 'tc' in the sense of 'can express arbitrary actions', in the vein of the old joke about programming in $shitlang: "hey, it's turing complete, we can make it do whatever we need" [18:36]
ben_vulpes brainfuck etc [18:37]
mircea_popescu if a name is not produced we'll just call it alf-tc [18:37]
asciilifeform ben_vulpes: you are thinking of 'turing tarpit' [18:37]
asciilifeform '... where everything is possible but nothing of interest is easy' [18:37]
mircea_popescu quite. [18:37]
* Jacmet (~peko@stolen.plutonium.dk) has joined #bitcoin-assets [18:37]
mircea_popescu !up Jacmet [18:37]
-assbot- You voiced Jacmet for 30 minutes. [18:37]
* assbot gives voice to Jacmet [18:37]
mircea_popescu check it out, stolen plutoniumz. [18:37]
asciilifeform best h0stn4m3 [18:38]
ben_vulpes asciilifeform: yup. [18:38]
mircea_popescu is it supposed to say "stolen plutonium dick" ? possibly only better thing. [18:38]
Jacmet mircea_popescu: ;) [18:39]
mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-02-2016#1412091 << this is not even wrong ftr. [18:39]
assbot Logged on 21-02-2016 16:54:08; asciilifeform: we have finessed the halting problem !1111 [18:39]
mircea_popescu Jacmet who're you and what are you doing here ? [18:39]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: how's that [18:39]
mircea_popescu nono. i don't mean THAT "not even wrong" [18:39]
asciilifeform ah l0l [18:39]
mircea_popescu i mean to convey my surprise and giddy excitement as to how it's not wrong. [18:40]
asciilifeform 'if all you have is Unix, certain problems are so staggeringly tall that it takes an extra special genius to see what the _real_ problem is because all the people who are trying to climb it make it look as if doing something else is stupid.' << naggum delivers. [18:40]
mircea_popescu but lacking a better complexity class... [18:40]
asciilifeform ahahaha [18:40]
Jacmet mircea_popescu: got a mail that you guys were doing something with Buildroot and if I could join? [18:40]
mircea_popescu o hey! [18:40]
mircea_popescu we are : it's become the replacement harness for bitcoin. [18:40]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 43850 @ 0.00057355 = 25.1502 BTC [+] [18:40]
ben_vulpes whoa hey [18:40]
mircea_popescu and buildroot with musl prevented us from bathing in the same humiliation EVERYONE else ended up in with the recent gethostbyaddr thing [18:40]
Jacmet mircea_popescu: ahh, interesting [18:40]
ben_vulpes Jacmet: are you K? [18:41]
mircea_popescu so listen, register your gpg key with assbot. [18:41]
Jacmet mircea_popescu: and buildroot is working out of you or do you have some kind of problems? [18:41]
Jacmet s/of/for/ [18:42]
ben_vulpes Jacmet: buildroot is working rather niftily. [18:42]
mircea_popescu so far it's working splendidly afaik. [18:42]
mircea_popescu !s buildroot [18:42]
assbot 251 results for 'buildroot' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=buildroot [18:42]
asciilifeform been working splendidly for nearly a year. [18:42]
Jacmet mircea_popescu: great [18:42]
* Xuthus has quit (Quit: Xuthus) [18:43]
mircea_popescu so get in teh wot, you have a lot of love here. [18:44]
Jacmet and yes, the current gpg key used for buildroot signing is getting quite old [18:44]
mircea_popescu aha. [18:44]
mircea_popescu that would be the one problem - the thing is a very valuable security asset, should be better protected. [18:45]
mircea_popescu make a 4kb key and use it rather than the strange md5 lists or what's that. [18:45]
asciilifeform Jacmet: as you probably know, buildroot is a coveted boobytrap target for 1,001 miscreants of various stripes. [18:46]
Jacmet mircea_popescu: true. I'll get the new key cross signed by the other devs at our next dev days and start using it [18:46]
asciilifeform Jacmet: and some folks have downloaded tarballs that don't pass checksum. [18:46]
Jacmet asciilifeform: really? We never had reports on the ml or on irc [18:47]
asciilifeform consider this a report. [18:47]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform where was the line/dpaste ? dja recall ? [18:47]
asciilifeform digging for it now [18:47]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5413 @ 0.00057355 = 3.1046 BTC [+] [18:47]
asciilifeform but most recently, today [18:48]
Jacmet asciilifeform: what was the difference between the bad/good tarball? Real rogue code or just interrupted download? [18:48]
mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-02-2016#1412151 << aww don't feel bad! [18:49]
assbot Logged on 21-02-2016 18:56:36; kakobrekla: logs tell me no one missed me, great :) [18:49]
asciilifeform Jacmet: i unfortunately do not have it presently. [18:49]
mircea_popescu Jacmet what is it, #buildroot ? [18:50]
Jacmet asciilifeform: ok, I would be *VERY* interested in comparing them [18:50]
Jacmet mircea_popescu: yes [18:50]
asciilifeform as would i. [18:50]
mircea_popescu and in unrelated news, do you take bitcoin donations Jacmet ? [18:51]
Jacmet mircea_popescu: I guess we could, but it has never come up so far [18:51]
asciilifeform Jacmet: the background: i originally picked up buildroot to do an arm system build for an obscure box. and then discovered that it is also the only practical means of compiling with musl instead of glibc, for any system [18:51]
asciilifeform and here we are. [18:51]
mircea_popescu so get that sane key made, reg it and sign an address, i'll send you a coin. [18:51]
Jacmet mircea_popescu: we're currently setting up a non profit organization around buildroot [18:52]
mircea_popescu that's a horrible idea if the wya such things work out in practice is any guide. [18:52]
Jacmet asciilifeform: ok [18:52]
mircea_popescu pick a strong leader in the form of a person, build your thing atop pgp sigs and forget the nonsense fiat. [18:52]
Jacmet mircea_popescu: we already have that (me ;) [18:53]
mircea_popescu so don't make the mistake. [18:53]
mircea_popescu it fucked up everyone to date. [18:53]
ben_vulpes !s linus [18:54]
assbot 148 results for 'linus' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=linus [18:54]
mircea_popescu x.org just recently lost their only asset because of inept "non profit" shenanigans. [18:54]
ben_vulpes !s de raadt [18:54]
assbot 35 results for 'de raadt' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=de+raadt [18:54]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 23928 @ 0.00056222 = 13.4528 BTC [-] [18:56]
mod6 Jacmet: thanks for stopping in. [18:57]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: can't seem to find it in the logz [18:58]
Jacmet mod6: you're welcome [18:58]
asciilifeform Jacmet: i dare say that linux is only meaningfully alive today in the form of buildroot. [18:59]
ben_vulpes Jacmet: another thing worth pointing out are that sha1 and md5 are obsolete [18:59]
Jacmet ben_vulpes: yes, the key is from 2009 or so, where those were the defaults [19:00]
ben_vulpes whats the connection between key and file hash algos? [19:01]
asciilifeform Jacmet: if you open a nonprofit org, esp. in usa, you will be surrounding yourself with, and eventually giving control over various aspects of the project, to people who do not work in good faith. [19:02]
asciilifeform as happened with, famously, openbsd. [19:02]
asciilifeform http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=16-02-2016#1407023 << thread. [19:03]
assbot Logged on 16-02-2016 16:36:23; asciilifeform: now the other thing about openbsd is the incident with theo and that microshit flunkie [19:03]
mod6 <+mircea_popescu> make a 4kb key and use it rather than the strange md5 lists or what's that. << RSA too. [19:03]
asciilifeform http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=02-12-2015#1335360 << more [19:04]
assbot Logged on 02-12-2015 04:13:47; BingoBoingo: "On a personal "hate ramen noodles and tuna" level, I agree. But my good-for-project-good-for-the-world side says the OpenBSD Foundation is more effective at growing the contribution pie and in particular funding the hackathons where great work happens." - Theo De Raadt [19:04]
asciilifeform !s bob beck [19:04]
assbot 27 results for 'bob beck' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=bob+beck [19:04]
* assbot removes voice from Jacmet [19:08]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 37241 @ 0.00056222 = 20.9376 BTC [-] [19:08]
asciilifeform !up Jacmet [19:08]
* assbot gives voice to Jacmet [19:08]
asciilifeform ;;later tell phf http://btcbase.org/patches?patchset=release << broken ? [19:15]
gribble The operation succeeded. [19:15]
assbot 404 Not Found ... ( http://bit.ly/24l9iYC ) [19:15]
phf huh, indeed [19:16]
phf asciilifeform: ah, sorry i did a rename [19:19]
phf while early in the game, stable, experimental, uploads and deprecated [19:19]
* TheRealJohnGalt_ (uid29986@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-ltvttgtrxcjltock) has joined #bitcoin-assets [19:20]
phf you want http://btcbase.org/patches?patchset=stable [19:20]
assbot trb ... ( http://bit.ly/24l9VkL ) [19:20]
phf actually i don't know how to call them.. [19:20]
mircea_popescu Jacmet give a looksee at how buildroot is currently used [19:20]
mircea_popescu mod6 got a link to the current sh ? [19:20]
mod6 yeah. [19:20]
* mod6 finds [19:20]
mod6 http://www.mod6.net/btcf/build-bitcoind-V99995.sh [19:21]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1mOPSt7 ) [19:21]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 23200 @ 0.00056651 = 13.143 BTC [+] [19:22]
Jacmet mod6: thanks. Any specific reason you guys are still on 2015.05? [19:23]
asciilifeform Jacmet: know of any specific reason why we oughta use a newer one ? [19:24]
Jacmet mod6: and why the manual download of openssl/db/boost instead of just letting Buildroot do it? [19:24]
mod6 np. well, we've been working for quite a while now to get all of this tooling setup the way we need it. we haven't had a reason to move forward with the version. [19:24]
Jacmet asciilifeform: newer and shinier ;) [19:24]
asciilifeform Jacmet: we permenently froze specific versions. [19:25]
asciilifeform of all dependencies. [19:25]
asciilifeform the 'why' of this is best illustrated by the heartbleed incident. [19:25]
mircea_popescu Jacmet tmsr doth not believe in upgrades. on the contrary, the versions here count towards 0. [19:25]
Jacmet asciilifeform: E.G. updated openssl, there's been some security fixes since 1.0.1g [19:26]
mod6 <+Jacmet> mod6: and why the manual download of openssl/db/boost instead of just letting Buildroot do it? << actually, one thing I think we're considering is doing a modification to buildroot so that we don't pull its deps over the wan via rsync. is there a way, currently, to just place all of its deps somewhere so it won't rsync? [19:26]
asciilifeform Jacmet: we don't use tls for anything, nor ever intend to. [19:26]
Jacmet mod6: yes, the download infrastructure in buildroot will only download if the tarball isn't already available in the dl dir, or you can point it to a local mirror [19:27]
phf Jacmet: bitcoind uses openssl for low level crypto operations, not actual client facing stuff [19:27]
Jacmet asciilifeform: ok [19:27]
mod6 Jacmet: oh fantastic, glad i asked. [19:27]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 42350 @ 0.0005679 = 24.0506 BTC [+] {3} [19:27]
mod6 i was sweating that we were going to have to 'roll our own'. [19:28]
mod6 :] [19:28]
mircea_popescu moreover, it's marked for replacement. just, iffy thing to replace, the crypto lib. [19:29]
mod6 Ok Gentlemen, I've gotta run for a few here. Jacmet: Thanks again for stopping in. When you're ready with your new key, stop on back and we'll help you get setup in the WoT. Cheers! [19:38]
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* assbot removes voice from Jacmet [19:38]
mod6 !up Jacmet [19:38]
* assbot gives voice to Jacmet [19:38]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 28528 @ 0.00056222 = 16.039 BTC [-] [19:41]
polarbeard mircea_popescu: so no love for da hooks? :) actually I'm not confortable at all using cpp... [19:41]
mircea_popescu what do you normally use ? [19:42]
polarbeard my daily work involves the rightfully hated javascript [19:43]
mircea_popescu oic. [19:43]
mircea_popescu pretty alien this whole landscape huh ? [19:43]
polarbeard but I usually prefer expressive non-bullshit languages [19:44]
polarbeard cpp is full of it [19:44]
mircea_popescu i would suspect as far as alf is concerned, javascript is cpp. [19:44]
BingoBoingo javascipt is worse, cpp on top of cpp [19:45]
mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-02-2016#1412184 << speaking of which, ever tried tourianski's establishment ? [19:46]
assbot Logged on 21-02-2016 19:16:07; phf: this place is great http://www.russianturkishbaths.com if you're ever in nyc [19:46]
phf no, what's that? [19:47]
mircea_popescu mmm danielpbarron's gf was iirc a canadian bath gal. [19:48]
mircea_popescu lemme see, should be in logs. [19:48]
mircea_popescu well not directly apparent. nevermind i guess [19:50]
phf oh, is that some other bathhouse in nyc? [19:50]
mircea_popescu might have been vancouver or something. [19:50]
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phf aah, i'll ask him when he's around, but that's west coast. they have great saunas there [19:52]
mircea_popescu i'm sorry, just a vague memory at this point. [19:53]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 152914 @ 0.00057355 = 87.7038 BTC [+] {2} [19:54]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15386 @ 0.00057356 = 8.8248 BTC [+] [19:55]
phf fwiw cascade range has a bunch of fantastic hot spring places. there's one next to Seattle, one next to portland, i mean of the the ones i've been too. but there's also numerous holes of course [19:56]
asciilifeform http://www.visual6502.org/images/6502/index.html << moar for old thread re: same. [19:57]
phf in fact i'm going to breitenbush two weeks from now, in the ben_vulpes area [19:57]
assbot 6502 Images ... ( http://bit.ly/1L47Tza ) [19:57]
* mircea_popescu is not terribly fond of hot springs, for some reason they attract old folks. [19:57]
mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-02-2016#1412261 << that's pretty weird. [20:00]
assbot Logged on 21-02-2016 20:02:18; jurov: why do i keep getting such obscure stuff... [20:00]
phf i used to do the whole 30 minute run through winter forest for a cold plunge in прорубь thing growing up, so i like hotsprings in winter. you get a pretty reasonable crowd around this time too, no idea how it is in summer [20:01]
mircea_popescu sounds like perhaps an actual buffer hole or something. [20:01]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 22114 @ 0.00057356 = 12.6837 BTC [+] [20:01]
* assbot removes voice from Jacmet [20:09]
mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-02-2016#1412317 << wtf. [20:09]
assbot Logged on 21-02-2016 20:19:18; jurov: even system('ls') fails [20:09]
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BingoBoingo Fiat system https://archive.is/Pw5Yr [20:13]
assbot Jared Carrabis on Twitter: "Welp. Here it is. Via the @BostonGlobe, the picture that everyone's going to be talking about tomorrow. https://t.co/FbWPrm8DfH" ... ( http://bit.ly/1L49wg0 ) [20:13]
mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-02-2016#1412433 << this is where i point and laugh at you and mumble sometrhing about alf's admonition not to eat out of schemes [20:29]
assbot Logged on 21-02-2016 20:52:04; phf: man, writing scheme is like trying to build an eiffel tower out of toothpicks [20:29]
BingoBoingo ;;ticker --market all [20:31]
gribble Bitstamp BTCUSD last: 437.7, vol: 11075.47017945 | BTC-E BTCUSD last: 434.15, vol: 9701.36175 | Bitfinex BTCUSD last: 440.53, vol: 43990.17093531 | CampBX BTCUSD last: 440.0, vol: 0.60533968 | BTCChina BTCUSD last: 448.2492, vol: 65369.96210000 | Kraken BTCUSD last: 432.3158, vol: 870.71229551 | Bitcoin-Central BTCUSD last: 436.63648, vol: 71.6372979 | Volume-weighted last average: (1 more message) [20:31]
BingoBoingo ;;more [20:31]
gribble 443.61158638 [20:31]
ben_vulpes phf: popular place with the ru folk in the area [20:32]
ben_vulpes heck of a journey tho [20:32]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7900 @ 0.00057396 = 4.5343 BTC [+] [20:44]
gernika phf: Had a terrible vegetarian thanksgiving dinner at Breitenbush. I did see a naked woman there though, as a teenager. [20:51]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 39300 @ 0.00057396 = 22.5566 BTC [+] [21:00]
mircea_popescu what'd you say to her ? [21:02]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 95836 @ 0.00057389 = 54.9993 BTC [-] {2} [21:08]
BingoBoingo https://i.sli.mg/8gpczk.png [21:09]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1QaxI0S ) [21:09]
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mircea_popescu asciilifeform for the record this " the reason that source access is needed is the same as the cause of the problem: the inability to modify system behavior non-intrusively. if one could modify OPEN on any given system to acquire new behavior _without_ compiling a new OPEN or, even if you did, without re-linking the entire system (thus the need for dynamic linking and similar solutions, too), source code access would [21:21]
mircea_popescu be entirely immaterial." is rank idiocy. [21:21]
mircea_popescu he is correct in that foss is mostly a problem unto itself, making the previous situation worse rather than better. [21:21]
asciilifeform it is only possible to understand what naggum said if one is familiar with clos. [21:22]
mircea_popescu nevertheless, the "solution" he contemplates is of the level of "because inept us-style corporatism displays all the sechelae you'd expect if you got a bunch of farmers to say how cars should look, let's everyone run in traffic!" [21:22]
mircea_popescu i do not WISH to run an "open" which may acquire unspecified powers in the future if the caller rubs its belly just right. [21:23]
mircea_popescu the principal specification of any machine, not JUST computers, not just software stacks, not just lines of code, is to specify what it can never do. [21:23]
asciilifeform naggum also suffered from a kind of garden of eden innocence in re: that he never once showed any sign of understanding sabotage [21:24]
mircea_popescu right ? [21:24]
asciilifeform aha. [21:24]
asciilifeform then again he did pay for src licenses [21:25]
asciilifeform and read. [21:25]
mircea_popescu what he's talking about it is fractal they shall be delivered thing [21:25]
asciilifeform how so? [21:26]
mircea_popescu how so. how the fuck are you EVER going to sign off on any code when it is not possible to say what function call will never do ? [21:26]
asciilifeform this 'never do' exists only if you burn into rom and then pour concrete around it. [21:28]
mircea_popescu currently our substance is drawn specifically from the fact that for the past 2-3 decades, these twerps approached the problem of functionality ("the software doesn't do enough") with nary a clue about the problem of feedback ("the software does too much") [21:28]
asciilifeform otherwise you might cat /dev/random > /dev/mem [21:28]
asciilifeform and get a different do... [21:29]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform the sufficient and necessary concrete is readily available and of an abstract kind. i needn't any actual calcium carbonate to say various things about various bits of code. [21:29]
asciilifeform but you do. [21:29]
mircea_popescu i just mark it as broken. [21:29]
mircea_popescu as for instance with openssl above. [21:29]
asciilifeform the promises made by a c machine are false promises. [21:29]
asciilifeform and certainly not protocol. [21:29]
mircea_popescu this is a separate problem. [21:29]
mircea_popescu that the concept is poorly implemented is a separable and in fact separate problem from that the concept is broken [21:30]
asciilifeform these are not actually separate, causally [21:31]
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mircea_popescu we had a few threads about this. i suppose it's still an open q. [21:32]
asciilifeform c machine is an exquisite study in what 'broken concept' actually means in practice. [21:32]
asciilifeform it is a braindamaged model of computation that breeds fractal braindamage throughout. [21:32]
mircea_popescu that may well be so. "with dirty hands no clean pages will be written". [21:33]
asciilifeform not even hands, just an arse sliding around, inscribing in fecal ink. [21:33]
gernika mircea_popescu: I don't recall saying anything. Probably because I was pretending: "no big deal." or something. [21:35]
mircea_popescu teenagers, tsk tsk. [21:35]
mircea_popescu "(4) you could communicate your desire for a system-wide improvement to someone who could put it in the official sources and you could add your changes conditionally." << see specifically how he manges the very pointed difference discussed in http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=20-02-2016#1411186 [21:38]
assbot Logged on 20-02-2016 22:20:40; mircea_popescu: moe finds bitcoin in 2056, long after the republic prevailed, through his gf at the time. he steals her script, copies her .wot directory and now has a node! [21:38]
mircea_popescu i kinda wonder if naggum had lived to see b-a, whethger it'd have been passionate love or some sort of weird hate thing. [21:38]
asciilifeform naggum was an old-worlder. in the very specific sense of taleb et al [21:43]
asciilifeform for him, quality proggy is something created at a company, by experts, for money. [21:43]
mircea_popescu not necessarily wrong. [21:44]
asciilifeform aha. [21:44]
mircea_popescu not really related to the discussion here, either. [21:44]
mircea_popescu he doesn't believe, eg, math, is "something created at mit" [21:44]
mircea_popescu even if he may or may not believe any particular building is the result of some people who did some calculations in private for money. [21:44]
asciilifeform well not as such. but he very much saw it as something ~not~ created by teenagers in mother's basement [21:44]
asciilifeform which is largely true. [21:44]
mircea_popescu largely yes. [21:45]
mircea_popescu except if everyone had plutonium induced braindamage from the fashion of eating plutonium pills [21:45]
mircea_popescu then it would be. [21:45]
asciilifeform quite. [21:45]
mircea_popescu and lest you think such a thing is "impossible" : ustards ate off lead plates for many years, and even blamed tomatoes for hallucinated poisonousness. [21:45]
asciilifeform hell, romans. [21:46]
mircea_popescu all this because they really wanted to be as cool as the euros and didn't comprehend that faking it till you make it just gives you saturnism [21:46]
mircea_popescu nah, romans used it for plumbing. [21:46]
mircea_popescu and wrote down that you're not supposed to flint, michigan. [21:46]
asciilifeform iirc also goblets ? [21:46]
asciilifeform for the taste [21:46]
mircea_popescu iirc that wasn't ever more than say tit implants [21:47]
* asciilifeform can see it [21:47]
deedbot- [BitBet Bets Bets] 2.94000000 BTC on 'Yes' - AlphaGo will defeat Lee Sedol overall in March 2016 match - http://bitbet.us/bet/1249/alphago-will-defeat-lee-sedol-overall-in-march/#b76 [21:48]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13562 @ 0.00056708 = 7.6907 BTC [-] [22:00]
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phf pocorgtfo http://glyf.org/tmp/shiva-swank.png [22:38]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1QsL1W9 ) [22:38]
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asciilifeform phf: very neat, and exactly what i wanted! [22:43]
asciilifeform share? [22:43]
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phf of course [22:48]
phf right now it's a bit jury rigged though. most intrusive is the addition of "keywords" to scheme.c, i.e. :foo evaluates to :foo [22:49]
asciilifeform for some reason i thought that this was already there, selectably [22:51]
asciilifeform hm. [22:51]
mircea_popescu oya [22:51]
phf they have some package hack foo::bar (and not foo:bar), which mostly just breaks things [22:52]
asciilifeform ah. [22:53]
asciilifeform thing needs readermacros [22:53]
phf yes. [22:54]
asciilifeform then you : could simply equal ' [22:54]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 37563 @ 0.00057387 = 21.5563 BTC [+] {2} [23:03]
asciilifeform in other lulz, looked for discussion of the alphago bet, and found ... [23:07]
asciilifeform https://www.facebook.com/yudkowsky/posts/10153941386639228 [23:07]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1QsMICR ) [23:07]
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deedbot- [BitBet Bets Bets] 1.00000000 BTC on 'Yes' - AlphaGo will defeat Lee Sedol overall in March 2016 match - http://bitbet.us/bet/1249/alphago-will-defeat-lee-sedol-overall-in-march/#b77 [23:12]
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mircea_popescu i'm not gonna click on fb. [23:12]
asciilifeform 'I have one bet on at 2:3 against AlphaGo winning against Sedol in March - they get my $667 if AlphaGo wins, I get their $1000 if AlphaGo loses. Does anyone else like those odds? (They originally offered me $1000 to $1500 and I've decided that I regret not taking the full amount.) EDIT: Have reached current betting capacity on Sedol at $1500 to $2250, others may still be taking bets.' << the whole thing. [23:13]
asciilifeform dated feb 8. [23:13]
mircea_popescu mmmkay... [23:14]
mircea_popescu https://bitbet.us/bet/1249/alphago-will-defeat-lee-sedol-overall-in-march/ [23:14]
assbot BitBet - AlphaGo will defeat Lee Sedol overall in March 2016 match :: 30.73 B (53%) on Yes, 27.63 B (47%) on No | closing in 2 weeks 1 day| weight: 61`697 (100`000 to 1) ... ( http://bit.ly/1QsN9gt ) [23:14]
mircea_popescu ;;calc ( 30.73 + 27.63) * 443.61158638 [23:15]
gribble 25889.1721811 [23:15]
mircea_popescu amusingly bitbet is the largest pool on that topic on the whole internets, nobody seems to be aware of the situation. [23:15]
asciilifeform ;;google alphago bet [23:15]
gribble BitBet - AlphaGo will defeat Lee Sedol overall in March 2016 match ...: ; Computer Go player 'AlphaGo' defeats pro in even game for first time ...: ; In a Huge Breakthrough, Google's AI Beats a Top Player at the ...: [23:15]
mircea_popescu actually strike that, they are very aware. [23:15]
mircea_popescu even ended up in some slashdotty-like thing w/e it was [23:16]
mircea_popescu wired something [23:16]
asciilifeform they got this 'studiously ignore' thing going on, tho [23:16]
mircea_popescu hey, history is written by a dude Ira and his studious. [23:16]
deedbot- [BitBet Bets Bets] 2.28600000 BTC on 'No' - AlphaGo will defeat Lee Sedol overall in March 2016 match - http://bitbet.us/bet/1249/alphago-will-defeat-lee-sedol-overall-in-march/#b78 [23:17]
mircea_popescu aok o.O [23:18]
deedbot- [Trilema] Eulora auction, February the 28th - http://trilema.com/2016/eulora-auction-february-the-28th/ [23:29]
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phf tinyscheme can't read strings longer then #define STRBUFFSIZE 256, hmm [23:37]
mircea_popescu ffs. [23:37]
mircea_popescu how does this make sense ? [23:38]
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asciilifeform the buffer has to be a certain length... [23:45]
mircea_popescu and this is my problem because c ? [23:45]
asciilifeform yes. [23:46]
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trinque yo hey yo hey << looks like my bouncer took a crap while I was out for the weekend. sup! [23:58]
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