Forum logs for 19 Jun 2015

Sunday, 24 November, Year 11 d.Tr. | Author: Mircea Popescu
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ag3nt_zer0 if I were to embark on a learning journey exploring the rudiments of programming, would there be good reason to not start with C? I always like to go to the root of something I am learning, which in my ignorant guesswork I like to think C is one of those root languages, but I have heard whisperings here and there that python is the way to go... any thoughts? [00:13]
decimation C is essentially the 'bedrock' of modern computers [00:13]
decimation unless you want to make your own computing machine I suggest learning bedrock [00:13]
ag3nt_zer0 haha ok [00:13]
mats on the subject of timezones [00:14]
mats am confuse about why London is GMT+1 [00:14]
mats o/ [00:14]
decimation daylight savings [00:14]
decimation just like here [00:14]
mats oh, that explains it. [00:14]
decimation to make things stupid they also go on daylight savings at different calendar days than we do [00:15]
decimation also GMT is kinda outdated, the new thing is french UTC [00:15]
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mats ic [00:19]
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funkenstein_ mayans laughing their asses off at us [00:20]
decimation ftp://hpiers.obspm.fr/iers/bul/buld/bulletind.124 < after the leap second, DUT1 will be +0.3s [00:21]
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funkenstein_ while we're on the subject of time, i've been working on building a clock [00:26]
funkenstein_ it grabs headers from several altcoins and estimates the current time [00:26]
decimation as I recall this was needed in the pogo [00:29]
funkenstein_ the DUT1 was needed? [00:29]
decimation no, but some rough clock setting [00:29]
decimation because nobody wanted to trust ntp [00:29]
BingoBoingo it grabs headers from several altcoins and estimates the current time << The proper way to build a clock is with brass, a lathe, and a steady hand [00:30]
funkenstein_ hehe, well, i guess this is a meta clock [00:34]
funkenstein_ all it does is collect what miners have said the time is [00:34]
BingoBoingo If you just want to count seconds on a C machine http://www.openntpd.org/ is pretty much the gold standard nao [00:35]
assbot OpenNTPD ... ( http://bit.ly/1H2lG6N ) [00:35]
decimation funkenstein_: it would be useful if you could determine time accuracy and variance [00:35]
decimation as well as how quickly you can acquire time [00:36]
BingoBoingo They had to fight TimeGavin who fought their efforts to clean code and kill retardation [00:36]
funkenstein_ each coin you add increases accuracy, [00:37]
funkenstein_ but the whole thing seems somewhat pointless [00:37]
BingoBoingo And yes, the shitgnomes fight improvement and cleanliness no matter how seemingly trivial a part of the stack janitors want to devomit [00:37]
BingoBoingo funkenstein_: And then ATC or Doge abandoment dicks your averaging effort over [00:38]
decimation funkenstein_: the point is that you can get time without trusting anything outside verified coins [00:38]
funkenstein_ decimation, exactly [00:39]
danielpbarron why include altcoins at all [00:39]
funkenstein_ danielpbarron, to get better than ~ 10 min. accuracy [00:40]
BingoBoingo "coins" have insufficient entropy to be useful as a precision measure of time at all. [00:40]
decimation don't need accuracy [00:40]
mats precision and accuracy are different things [00:41]
BingoBoingo If you want to measure epochs and years BTC blockheight is fine. If you want a race you want something calibrated against nuclear decay. [00:41]
BingoBoingo More random gives you more precise time. [00:41]
BingoBoingo Accurate time doesn't happen [00:41]
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funkenstein_ one could always look at the sky [00:42]
decimation mats: I'm aware, don't need precision either [00:42]
danielpbarron funkenstein_, you aren't limited to just the last block [00:42]
BingoBoingo funkenstein_: Timekeeping is a battle between astronomy and nuclear chemistry [00:43]
danielpbarron could be something like the difficulty adjustment only not limited to the last 2 weeks [00:43]
BingoBoingo danielpbarron: Block height is always going to to a rough measure of time due to entropy. Could make a great system for a calendar, poor for slicing up a day though [00:45]
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BingoBoingo This though is largely why OpenNTPD beats ISC NTPD http://web.archive.org/web/20050304032724/http://bradknowles.typepad.com/considered_harmful/2004/09/openntpd.html [00:46]
assbot Considered Harmful: OpenNTPd... ... ( http://bit.ly/1H2mJnt ) [00:46]
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* BingoBoingo notes that though both are prefixed with shit Shitgnomes and Shitlords are very different things. [00:48]
BingoBoingo And are naturally opposed. [00:48]
funkenstein_ this is liable to get confusing [00:50]
BingoBoingo Shitgnomes leave turd traps and prevent nice things. Shit lords bury gnomes in turds to highlight their wretch. Mike Hearnia is a cononical shitgnome. Theo Deraadt and alf are cononical shitlords [00:50]
BingoBoingo funkenstein_: Everything is heirarchy. [00:50]
BingoBoingo Shitgnomes try to ruin the things shit lords want to use [00:50]
BingoBoingo funkenstein_: Start constructing a memory palace. [00:51]
mats i don't understand how your link relates to why OpenNTPD is better than ISC NTPD [00:51]
mats you are on the edge of coherence tonight [00:52]
BingoBoingo mats: http://www.advogato.org/person/dtucker/diary/52.html << The answer sheet on the ntpd conflict [00:53]
assbot Advogato: Blog for dtucker ... ( http://bit.ly/1H2nnBr ) [00:53]
funkenstein_ when the two shitplates touch: shitquake [00:53]
BingoBoingo Indeed [00:54]
BingoBoingo Eventually such a shitquake will happen such that we start printing upclocked Z80 processors on a 7nm process [00:59]
mats this is too cult-y for me [00:59]
decimation mats: I'm similiarly lost [01:00]
decimation how many sheets to the wind are you? [01:00]
BingoBoingo About 4 sheets [01:01]
BingoBoingo I swear I had a solid case for OpenNTPD over ISC NTPD, but the opinions on timekeeping are kept in a treacherous antipode [01:05]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 52548 @ 0.00043508 = 22.8626 BTC [-] [01:07]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 23229 @ 0.00043787 = 10.1713 BTC [+] [01:18]
mats http://www.popularmechanics.com/technology/gadgets/a16087/beats-headphones-weighted [01:20]
assbot Four Tiny Pieces of Metal Keep Beats Headphones From Feeling Cheap ... ( http://bit.ly/1Cgd7Os ) [01:20]
mats http://www.businessinsider.com/paid-actors-at-donald-trump-announcement-2015-6 << already creating jobs [01:22]
assbot REPORT: Donald Trump paid actors for his 2016 announcement - Business Insider ... ( http://bit.ly/1CgdfNU ) [01:22]
BingoBoingo mats: Anything work for your carpal tunnel yet? I've got an angry wrist nerve I am trying to conquer [01:23]
mats nope [01:23]
decimation mats: the beats thing still pisses me off [01:23]
decimation a company like sennheiser makes actual headphones, with specifications and everything [01:24]
decimation some dumbfucks make shit plastic and get $3bil [01:24]
mats am seriously considering going under the knife in spite of the low chance it'll even work [01:24]
mats decimation: about to make even more after beats store goes live [01:25]
BingoBoingo I mashed up some naproxen with a bit of leaf from the lambs ear outside to use a a carrier. Positive effect for sure, but prolly would be better with some DMSO. [01:25]
mats http://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2015/jun/17/kitchen-gadgets-review-ikettle-boil-phone lol [01:26]
assbot Kitchen gadgets review: the iKettle – a world off its rocker | Life and style | The Guardian ... ( http://bit.ly/1flIH8H ) [01:26]
cazalla mats, doesn't every nominee have paid actors do that shit? [01:26]
mats BingoBoingo: have been popping ibuprofen like candy [01:26]
BingoBoingo cazalla: Most hide it better, a few can save some money on true believers. [01:26]
funkenstein_ decimation, look at any luxury good for the same racket [01:26]
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mats am around 2g over last two weeks [01:27]
BingoBoingo mats: Your poor stomach. What about trying that stuff topical? [01:27]
mats am also applying bengay liberally [01:27]
mats i have become my grandfather [01:28]
BingoBoingo Ouch. Bengay is basically topical super aspirin [01:28]
mats is that good [01:28]
mats i was under the impression that it reduces inflammation [01:29]
BingoBoingo It does. [01:29]
BingoBoingo The salicyclate is the active part of aspirin [01:29]
mats its not working [01:29]
BingoBoingo I mean you can try a comounding pharmacy for a more extreme replacement for the BenGay. Mixing a different NSAID with amitryptiline or nortryptiline to hit the nerve endings harder [01:32]
decimation funkenstein_: yeah I know, people here bitch about the lack of 'adult' products. glitzy candy beats serious in the market every time [01:32]
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BingoBoingo !up Chicago [01:32]
* assbot gives voice to Chicago [01:32]
mats decimation: nvm, apparently beats music has been up for some time [01:32]
funkenstein_ large price tag, heavy advertising [01:33]
funkenstein_ people buy the price tag, not the weights [01:33]
Chicago o/ Hello [01:33]
mats hi [01:33]
decimation mats: yeah I think it came out a few weeks ago [01:33]
mats http://techcrunch.com/2015/06/08/beat-it/ lol [01:34]
assbot Beats Music Tells Users To Switch To Apple Music | TechCrunch ... ( http://bit.ly/1CgelZW ) [01:34]
decimation mats: what is the cause of your pain? [01:35]
mats i believe its ulnar nerve entrapment [01:35]
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BingoBoingo I'm telling you old arthiritic folk love topical tricyclic antidepressants to kill nerve pain, but if truly trapped knife may be an eventuality [01:37]
mats I want to know if there's an issue with continuing this regimen of aspirin and ibuprofen [01:37]
decimation mats: sucks. [01:37]
decimation most folks I know who have knee or back surgery tend to have poor results [01:37]
BingoBoingo mats: Do you have an ulcer yet? [01:38]
mats BingoBoingo: can i ask for that without a script? [01:38]
Chicago mats, I had the left ulnar nerve released in 2010 and still do the meds. They're really not so helpful. [01:38]
Chicago (intramuscular release) [01:39]
BingoBoingo mats: You'd need a script, and you'd need a compounding pharmacy to fill the script. [01:39]
mats the meds are not helpful, or the release was not helpful? [01:39]
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Chicago mats, The release was done and may be needed again in the future. I still have the numbness in 4th and 5th digits of the left hand once in a while (but not as bad as the constant it was prior). The meds though, I think are more for my comfort and not a real treatment. They're not solving anything. [01:40]
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Chicago Prior to the release, I couldn't feel the keyboard underneath my fingers for 6 months. [01:41]
mats a fairly common outcome, i think [01:42]
mats maybe its time for us to learn typing with feet [01:43]
cazalla gee you guys must spend a lot of time jacking it to require surgery [01:43]
BingoBoingo If you find a doctor who can help you go with a heavier topical preparation you can also switch out from ibuprofen to something like diclofenac which is too antiinflammatory to take orally [01:44]
Chicago I adapted my workstation heavily. So the change has made a difference in comfort. Now, the desk is about 36" deep and I can rest my arm on it and the keyboard sits deep too. [01:44]
Chicago So there is room to have uniform pressure on the lower part of the arm. [01:44]
Chicago cazalla, wrong arm [01:45]
mats BingoBoingo: no ulcer yet [01:45]
cazalla Chicago, ah you don't use both arms? [01:45]
mats lo [01:45]
Chicago Just my mouth, both feet and my right fist. [01:45]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 22426 @ 0.00043022 = 9.6481 BTC [-] {2} [01:46]
Chicago mats, I know I've taken the Norco bottle and thrown it _far_ away from me in the past. [01:46]
Chicago Sometimes its just too much medicine and I'd like to crap once in a while. [01:46]
mats http://time.com/3926593/charleston-killer-flags/ [01:47]
assbot Charleston: The Meaning of the Suspected Killer's Flags on Facebook ... ( http://bit.ly/1flJTc6 ) [01:47]
Chicago mats, Does the alleged shooter look autistic to you? [01:48]
cazalla i'd bet this guy was a /pol/ack [01:48]
Chicago (with the small jaw and all) [01:48]
mats no the only remarkable thing about this guy is the bowl cut [01:50]
mats id probably go on a shooting spree too [01:51]
mats this guy was a victim of bullying for sure [01:51]
mats no doubt by some nigs [01:52]
cazalla nah, he just wanted to beat brevik's high score and failed miserably [01:52]
BingoBoingo !up Vexual [01:52]
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decimation what about that azn guy who shot up virginia state [01:56]
decimation somehow the media didn't talk much about him [01:56]
cazalla he was all over it decimation [01:57]
cazalla that one came close but still.. no brevik [01:58]
decimation well, as yarvin pointed out, brevik struck at the king and failed to kill him [02:00]
mats Is that supposed to be a reference to the wire [02:01]
cazalla mats, you best not miss eh? [02:01]
decimation nah it's machiavelli [02:01]
mats im uncultured [02:02]
mats night [02:02]
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cazalla anyway here is the dumb and dumber guy's archived facebook https://archive.is/LM2Tt [02:12]
assbot Dylann Roof ... ( http://bit.ly/1flLvTj ) [02:12]
cazalla lol when all his friends are black [02:13]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15000 @ 0.00044518 = 6.6777 BTC [+] [02:46]
BingoBoingo technically [02:46]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 18300 @ 0.00042886 = 7.8481 BTC [-] {5} [03:45]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 30950 @ 0.00045121 = 13.9649 BTC [+] {4} [03:53]
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* Now talking on #bitcoin-assets [15:28]
* Topic for #bitcoin-assets is: http://bitcoin-assets.com || http://log.bitcoin-assets.com || http://bash.bitcoin-assets.com || http://blogs.bitcoin-assets.com [15:28]
* Topic for #bitcoin-assets set by kakobrekla!~kako@unaffiliated/kakobrekla at Wed Mar 5 16:58:12 2014 [15:28]
-assbot- Welcome to #bitcoin-assets. To get voice (ie, to be able to speak), send me "!up" in a private message to get an OTP. You must have a sufficient WoT rating. If you do not have a WoT account or sufficient rating, try politely asking one of the voiced people for a temporary voice. [15:28]
* assbot gives voice to mircea_popescu [15:28]
mircea_popescu menahem what's being a hit mean ? [15:29]
mircea_popescu http://trilema.com/wp-content/themes/trilema/images/ [15:29]
assbot Index of /wp-content/themes/trilema/images ... ( http://bit.ly/1ev8sTW ) [15:29]
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menahem mircea_popescu - you're a smash, very popular. :D [15:31]
mircea_popescu but how do you know this ? [15:31]
* assbot gives voice to trinque [15:32]
mircea_popescu what's the metric ? something. [15:32]
trinque https://www.vox.com/2015/6/18/8803721/charleston-terrorism-racism << quick on the draw, aren't they? [15:32]
assbot Why calling the Charleston shooting terrorism is important to so many people - Vox ... ( http://bit.ly/1GnvSR0 ) [15:32]
menahem oh i posted a screenshot, lemme find it [15:32]
trinque and look, backed up by tweets! [15:32]
mats uniques, the currency of the internets [15:32]
mircea_popescu kakobrekla o hey cool beans eh. [15:32]
mircea_popescu im uniquely smashing! [15:33]
menahem first day of going live: http://screencast.com/t/5Y30zCpvFu [15:33]
assbot 2015-06-19_0007 - Saucal's library [15:33]
mircea_popescu menahem so is that "130 people checked it out 0 bought" ? [15:34]
menahem ecommerce tracking wasn't added until last night [15:34]
menahem we had 1 sale of the MP tee :D [15:34]
mircea_popescu haha cool. [15:35]
menahem i monetized you. :) [15:35]
mircea_popescu do i get royalities ? [15:35]
menahem haha, free banner ads. [15:35]
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menahem https://koinswag.com/shop/bitcoin-t-shirt/mpex-bitcoin-t-shirt/ [15:36]
assbot MPEx Bitcoin T-Shirt - KOIN ... ( http://bit.ly/1GnwvK8 ) [15:36]
mircea_popescu lol ok [15:36]
mircea_popescu if it ever makes you rich, donate to teh bitcoin foundation [15:38]
mircea_popescu http://thebitcoin.foundation/treasurer_contract.html [15:38]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1GnwTs8 ) [15:38]
menahem that I will do. [15:40]
menahem i'll def take some responsibility to fund that in the future. [15:40]
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mircea_popescu cool. [15:43]
asciilifeform !up ascii_field [15:55]
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* ascii_field tried last night to backport 'dumpprivkey' and 'importprivkey' from phoundation-0.7 and found that relevant data structures are entirely different [15:56]
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ascii_field i.e. thoroughly gavinized [15:57]
mircea_popescu yes, this is why 0.7 was right off when we discussed the branch [15:59]
ascii_field also how the fuck did anyone use bitcoin for serious battlefield operation prior to dump-/importprivkey ? [15:59]
mod6 yah. for now w, i'm told this works as a temp fix: https://github.com/jackjack-jj/pywallet [15:59]
assbot jackjack-jj/pywallet · GitHub ... ( http://bit.ly/1GnzXEE ) [15:59]
ascii_field iirc there was an external kludge that walked db ? [15:59]
mircea_popescu nobody serious to my knowledge has used this software as-is. [15:59]
mircea_popescu kind-of why the blind insistence / pretense put forth by the power rangers is so amusing to me [16:00]
mircea_popescu seriously, anyone gives a shit abvout what you release ? as anything other than toilet reading material ? when did that happen ? [16:00]
mircea_popescu they keep pretending like oh, the miners bla bla. nobody, ever, actually used the shit raw. because you can't, because obvious reasons. [16:00]
mod6 ascii_field tried last night to backport 'dumpprivkey' and 'importprivkey' from phoundation-0.7 and found that relevant data structures are entirely different << yeah, i found the same thing back 5-6 months ago when trying to do the same thing. glad there seems to be a workaround, i'm told. [16:02]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 25300 @ 0.00044933 = 11.368 BTC [+] {2} [16:03]
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mod6 anyway, I haven't had a chance yet to try out the pywallet.py thing myself; ascii_field lettuce know if it works for ya plz. [16:08]
mod6 shinohai said it worked for him. [16:08]
shinohai @ mod6 worked for me [16:08]
mod6 ^ :] [16:08]
shinohai >.> [16:08]
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shinohai That is just a hacky thing to me though. Definitely not a full scale solution. [16:09]
mircea_popescu !up hazirafel_ [16:10]
-assbot- You voiced hazirafel_ for 30 minutes. [16:10]
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mod6 in the case of pywallet.py, it looks like you just have to --dumpwallet, instead of being able to feed it a pub address and getting out a privkey right? [16:10]
mircea_popescu sooner or later everyone ends up with a full bitcoin data manipulator built in their favourite language, python or not. [16:10]
hazirafel_ thanks. [16:10]
mod6 mircea_popescu: yah [16:10]
mircea_popescu it'd be nice if the reference client provided this, however, what with thew "accounts" bullshit and etc in there, i doubt it'll be this decade. [16:10]
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* funkenstein_ considers bitaddress.org + coinb.in on offline box the reference wallet [16:12]
mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=18-06-2015#1167863 << this would be a technically correct argument :D [16:16]
assbot Logged on 18-06-2015 19:53:19; nubbins`: unfortunately mp just left so he is unable to inform us that the hallucinogenic effects of drugs don't exist and we're deluding ourselves into pretending to be hallucinating [16:16]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 19344 @ 0.00044836 = 8.6731 BTC [-] [16:17]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9300 @ 0.00042727 = 3.9736 BTC [-] [16:18]
shinohai Then once I figure out how to produce these hallucinogenic effects at will in my mind, I shall sell the secrets on Agora and dry it all up. [16:20]
mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=18-06-2015#1167881 << so did the gal visiting last night... [16:20]
assbot Logged on 18-06-2015 19:57:49; mats: all i did was walk around naked [16:20]
mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=18-06-2015#1167889 << and suddenly another utility of crate of benjies becomes apparent. [16:23]
assbot Logged on 18-06-2015 20:05:17; ascii_field: trinque: always wanted to try this, but never came close to accessing the dope [16:23]
trinque heh [16:23]
hazirafel_ don't know if this is a good place to ask, but here ... i'm code literate in java , and i really want to learn to know my way around fiddling with blockchains and bitcoin, i would love advice on places to start and where to get help and information. i guess i need to learn C first but i'm looking for more advice. thanks! [16:25]
mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=18-06-2015#1167905 << and did he immediately sack the comissioner of police ? [16:25]
assbot Logged on 18-06-2015 20:07:16; ascii_field: they machine-gunned his dogs [16:25]
mircea_popescu and only agreed to hire a replacewment once the replacement swore he is firing every single lieutenant in the department ? [16:25]
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mircea_popescu !up ascii_field [16:27]
-assbot- You voiced ascii_field for 30 minutes. [16:27]
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mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=18-06-2015#1167978 << and strangely enough, this ISNT'T the top of social media. [16:29]
assbot Logged on 18-06-2015 20:26:10; nubbins`: https://drugs-forum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2026 [16:29]
mircea_popescu instead, they're preoccupied with the liberty problems of trans-idiots. [16:29]
mats magic mushrooms make me want to poop myself during the entire experience [16:30]
hazirafel_ i forgot i read that being nice on the internet makes people think you're stupid. any fucking help bit-assholes? [16:31]
mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=18-06-2015#1168010 << this is drastically not how it works. an equivalent of this approach would be "was with a girl dressed in a skirt, had blow job". [16:31]
assbot Logged on 18-06-2015 20:34:36; ascii_field: nubbins`: can then say 'i took 5ug and discovered proof of goldbach's conjecture' or 'i took 500 and learned that thirty-three is purple' [16:31]
mircea_popescu sooooo ? [16:31]
mircea_popescu hazirafel_ what do you need help with ? [16:31]
mircea_popescu an' who're you anyway ? [16:31]
mircea_popescu oh the java c thing. [16:33]
mircea_popescu hazirafel_ listen, there is no practical way to understand anything relevant re bitcoin without actually reading the code. and the code is c++. you will have to do this as a first step. [16:34]
hazirafel_ ok cool. i've been reading the developers guid [16:34]
hazirafel_ e [16:34]
mircea_popescu the alternative, if you are a business person, is to have a programmer "read it to you", but this is expensive and rare a tradecraft, so. expect to spend the next year laying groundowkr, mostly in terms oif reading the codebase and wondering at the wonders of c++ [16:34]
mircea_popescu the problem with reading the developer guide is the same problem with reading mark twain, the cliff notes. [16:35]
mircea_popescu a) not in any sense funny and b) very dangerous, ion that it offers you the illusion of having understood (through recognition mostly) but no actual understanding. which is how people end up writing insecure applications [16:35]
hazirafel_ who am i? :my name is sarah, i live in the 'holy land' , i did some programming courses in collage but bitcoin actually motivates me to learn the nuts and bolts, was looking around the net, saw a recommendation of this cha [16:35]
mircea_popescu (this is true generally, not just here) [16:35]
mircea_popescu !gettrust hazirafel_ [16:36]
assbot hazirafel_ is not registered in WoT. [16:36]
mircea_popescu !h [16:36]
assbot http://wiki.bitcoin-assets.com/irc_bots/assbot [16:36]
mircea_popescu also, start there. [16:36]
hazirafel_ mircea you [16:37]
hazirafel_ mircea you're talking about the developers guide? [16:37]
mircea_popescu aha ? [16:37]
hazirafel_ yeah i need to register. ok so you're saying learn c++ and read the source code? [16:38]
mircea_popescu yes. [16:38]
mircea_popescu one can drive the other. [16:38]
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hazirafel_ any recommendations for learning c++? how much time do you think is needed for basics? are questions welcome on this chat? [16:39]
mircea_popescu also meet Adlai. he's also from the jdif. [16:39]
hazirafel_ i see [16:39]
mircea_popescu questions are welcome, a reasonably intelligent & cultured person (which means 1% of ivy league) should be able to complete this in a year. [16:40]
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mircea_popescu !up hazirafel_ [16:41]
-assbot- You voiced hazirafel_ for 30 minutes. [16:41]
* assbot gives voice to hazirafel_ [16:41]
jurov for c++ there's alway the K&R canon [16:41]
hazirafel_ ehh... complete learning C++ or bitcoin literate ? Ivy League doesn't mean shit necessarily, from the people i've met [16:41]
mircea_popescu well yeah, but i don't know you, and so i have nfi what reference points to use, and so... [16:42]
jurov otherwise, learning programming is mostly individual affair [16:42]
jurov you can expect some false starts before you find material suitable to you [16:42]
mircea_popescu and, "sufficient proficiency in both c++ and bitcoin so as to be able to follow all the discussion here, and only say something stupid 50% of the time and less, and understand why it's stupid once explained 90% of the time or more" [16:42]
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mircea_popescu which is my idea of "basics" [16:43]
mircea_popescu ymmv [16:43]
mod6 the logs (see /topic ) have a wealth of knowledge too. the last 6-12 months are worth a read. [16:44]
hazirafel_ what is mostly discusses here? [16:44]
mircea_popescu porn, actually. [16:44]
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mircea_popescu but yes, k&r is prolly how one should start cpp [16:45]
hazirafel_ thank you [16:45]
trinque davout: saw your feedback re: going through deeds by author. sounds great; I'll try to find time for that [16:47]
ascii_field http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=19-06-2015#1168746 << k&r concerns exclusively c.. [16:47]
assbot Logged on 19-06-2015 19:41:25; mircea_popescu: but yes, k&r is prolly how one should start cpp [16:47]
ascii_field cpp is introduced in stroustrup but this in turn breathes not a word re: 'boost' etc [16:48]
mircea_popescu ascii_field her starting point was java. [16:49]
mircea_popescu which i suspect is actually the result of just how broken school is these days. [16:51]
mircea_popescu hazirafel_ how old are you ? [16:51]
hazirafel_ 26 [16:52]
ascii_field http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=15-04-2014#626237 [16:52]
assbot Logged on 15-04-2014 18:34:43; asciilifeform: 'we refuse to produce any more C programmers who are a danger to themselves and others.' -- my old dean [16:52]
mircea_popescu aha ok. [16:52]
ascii_field http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=19-06-2015#1168692 << only of utility to folks with nonzero 'street wot.' [16:53]
assbot Logged on 19-06-2015 19:19:46; mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=18-06-2015#1167889 << and suddenly another utility of crate of benjies becomes apparent. [16:53]
mircea_popescu nobody was born with it alfie. [16:53]
mircea_popescu it was built, by people, through the process of taking risks. [16:53]
ascii_field no but it typically happens in childhood. [16:53]
mircea_popescu not so. [16:53]
ascii_field the relevant brain circuits, i mean [16:53]
mircea_popescu didn't you grow up like sane people, in a sovblok urban development with 1k kids your age / acre and no tv to speak of ? [16:54]
ascii_field mircea_popescu: yes but was then moved to usa where was nearly total hermit since age ~9 [16:54]
mircea_popescu 9 is old enough. [16:54]
shinohai The blockchain is sacred. Don't fuck with it ala Gavin [16:54]
mircea_popescu let the unfortunate nato schmucks grown on facebook complain of "brain circuitry" [16:54]
ascii_field http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=19-06-2015#1168698 << iirc it was state police [16:55]
assbot Logged on 19-06-2015 19:21:48; mircea_popescu: and only agreed to hire a replacewment once the replacement swore he is firing every single lieutenant in the department ? [16:55]
mircea_popescu ascii_field does not matter who it was. [16:55]
mircea_popescu "your job is to defend, me first of all. you failed. go try your hand at garbage moving." [16:55]
ascii_field ^ matters in the sense that mayor of city of college park cannot fire md state police [16:55]
mircea_popescu he fires the people he has, [16:55]
mircea_popescu not the offenders. [16:55]
ascii_field fires them for failing to kill the state police? l0l! [16:56]
mircea_popescu if the line is breached, the officers decimate THEIR infantry, not the enemy's [16:56]
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mircea_popescu even tho it was THE ENEMY that ~actually~ did it. [16:56]
mircea_popescu "what were you doing during ???" [16:56]
mircea_popescu ascii_field caring is for idiots. [16:56]
ascii_field when the muppets open up on one another, i promise to wake up mircea_popescu. though it might have to be over spark-gap radio [16:56]
mircea_popescu it's just what you do. [16:57]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 27226 @ 0.00042727 = 11.6329 BTC [-] [16:57]
mircea_popescu "where were you ? bang." [16:57]
ascii_field where was the thread where mircea_popescu observed, 'if they weren't dumb shits we would not even be having this line of thought' ? [16:57]
ascii_field applies. [16:57]
mircea_popescu myeah. [16:57]
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mircea_popescu !up ascii_field [16:58]
-assbot- You voiced ascii_field for 30 minutes. [16:58]
* assbot gives voice to ascii_field [16:58]
ascii_field http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=19-06-2015#1168695 << why not understand something simple first? like 'pkzip' [16:58]
assbot Logged on 19-06-2015 19:21:25; hazirafel_: don't know if this is a good place to ask, but here ... i'm code literate in java , and i really want to learn to know my way around fiddling with blockchains and bitcoin, i would love advice on places to start and where to get help and information. i guess i need to learn C first but i'm looking for more advice. thanks! [16:58]
ascii_field for some reason i can't help but recall the kidz of 1990s who always began with 'where do i learn to write a game like 'doom' ?' [16:59]
mircea_popescu because something large is always moire interesting. [16:59]
hazirafel_ what can i say [16:59]
mircea_popescu most kids get into programming because they want to make a mmorpg. [16:59]
hazirafel_ that's a great motivation [16:59]
mircea_popescu which, and i say from bitter experience, is just as large a task as making an os, and so... the largest class there is. [16:59]
ascii_field but when you tell them 'write a 1980s-style MUD first' they balk [17:00]
mircea_popescu they should. [17:00]
mircea_popescu and you'll notice i never tell 'em that. it's a stupid thing to say. [17:00]
mircea_popescu "how do i get the girl i love ?" "get some sluts first" [17:00]
ascii_field why? [17:00]
mircea_popescu what is he, me ? [17:00]
mod6 haha [17:00]
ascii_field http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=12-09-2014#827603 << obligatory thread [17:01]
assbot Logged on 12-09-2014 15:39:53; asciilifeform: every time i see the bed of nails i think of the soviet caricature [17:01]
mircea_popescu so there you go. [17:02]
hazirafel_ you have a point, if i had the inclination into codeing needing to be block-chain literate i would of be swimming in it by my age... maybe [17:02]
hazirafel_ *needed [17:02]
ascii_field but in this case i do not think it is unreasonable to ask kid to learn wtf programming even means, prior to writing 'doom' [17:04]
trinque ascii_field: LOL @ "start small" [17:04]
hazirafel_ in which i mean, liking programming enough. [17:04]
mircea_popescu hazirafel_ it's really a lot like racing. to be into racing more than someone cheering in the stands / swimsuit model crowding the finish line, you gotta take an engine apart. grease and all. [17:04]
mircea_popescu just what it is. [17:04]
ascii_field ^ [17:04]
ascii_field !s camel has two humps [17:04]
assbot 7 results for 'camel has two humps' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=camel+has+two+humps [17:04]
hazirafel_ well yeah [17:04]
ascii_field ^ many would-be 'doom' authors discover that they can't actually stomach the very notion of a machine which behaves precisely as instructed and not 'as intentioned' [17:05]
mircea_popescu the advantage is that c++ grease doesn't irritate the skin. the disadvantage is that well... this thing has i would estimate about 10 to 100x more moving parts than a car, [17:05]
mircea_popescu and the relationships a good two layers deeper/more complex. [17:05]
ascii_field (this may be the ultimate psychological group divide) [17:05]
mircea_popescu ascii_field that's nothing but the infancy/adulthood divide. it's not a personal descriptor [17:06]
mircea_popescu other than "this adult exhibits intellectual neoteny". [17:06]
ascii_field mircea_popescu: recall the little quiz, where the kidz who made consistent errors usually passed the next 4 years, while of the shooters in the dark - none did [17:06]
ascii_field (all of these with no prior experience programming) [17:06]
mircea_popescu even so. [17:07]
mircea_popescu in other news, "the proportion of female faces that are more feminine than the most feminine male faces is much greater than the proportion of male faces that are more masculine than the most masculine female faces." [17:08]
mircea_popescu apparently recent research actually settles this point [17:08]
shinohai https://i.imgur.com/0gGQIg5.jpg [17:08]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1fmChGb ) [17:08]
hazirafel_ i did this course where i wrote in java for 30 hours a week, i have no problem doing it, no pain, didn't love it, it was mildley fun . my problem was organization, i expect it's much worse in C , but i could see it as a motivation for thinking in a more organized way. [17:10]
hazirafel_ mireca i didn't get your comment about the kidz and the errors [17:10]
mircea_popescu my who now ? [17:11]
* assbot removes voice from hazirafel_ [17:11]
mircea_popescu !up hazirafel_ [17:11]
-assbot- You voiced hazirafel_ for 30 minutes. [17:11]
* assbot gives voice to hazirafel_ [17:11]
hazirafel_ "mircea_popescu: recall the little quiz, where the kidz who made consistent errors usually passed the next 4 years, while of the shooters in the dark - none did [23:02] <+ascii_field> (all of these with no prior experience programming)" [17:11]
mircea_popescu he said it, and directed it at me, which is why my name is in there. [17:12]
ascii_field hazirafel_: this is related to a very old article, entitled 'the camel has two humps' [17:12]
shinohai Well those kids learned what *doesn't* work [17:12]
trinque wiki.t-o-f.info/uploads/EDM4600/The camel has two humps.pdf [17:12]
ascii_field which argued convincingly that a certain essential skill for learning to program cannot actually be taught [17:12]
mod6 hazirafel_: along with the logs: trilema.com if you don't already [17:12]
trinque obviously paste the whole thing; escape codes didn't make it in [17:12]
mircea_popescu ascii_field incidentally, i suspect the dataset there has a major flaw. to model it : two classes of brothel patrons. class A comes to reception, asks "do the girls here to X ?" ; class B comes to reception, asks "what can girls here do for me ?" [17:13]
mircea_popescu which of the two do you propose are more likely to spend money ? [17:13]
fluffypony http://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2012/06/how-to-blow-6-billion-on-a-tech-project/ [17:13]
assbot How to blow $6 billion on a tech project | Ars Technica ... ( http://bit.ly/1GnJNGK ) [17:13]
ascii_field mircea_popescu: the latter ? [17:14]
mircea_popescu necessarily. the latter propose to select from the set given, the former have a preformed set they compare to. [17:14]
ascii_field 'what can they do? -- wash cars. -- ok, my car is dusty, let's wash' [17:14]
mircea_popescu now, which would you say is likely to contain the largest proportion of intelligent people ? [17:14]
ascii_field fluffypony: winblows ce! in that photo. look carefully [17:15]
mircea_popescu fluffypony haha. nothing of the stealth plane yet huh. [17:15]
fluffypony I know, lol [17:15]
ascii_field 'When JTRS started, software-defined radio (SDR) was still in its infancy. The project's SCA architecture allowed software to manipulate field-programmable gate arrays (FPGAs) in the radio hardware to reconfigure how its electronics functioned, exposing those FPGAs as CORBA objects. But when development began, hardware implementations of CORBA for FPGAs didn’t really exist in any standard form.' << giga-l0l! [17:16]
mircea_popescu ascii_field to round up what i mean, class A are perhaps "the shooters in the dark". which means, they have an idea what they want, and programming [as taught] fails to satisfy [which is the fault of the teachers]. [17:17]
ascii_field as if fpga has ~ever~ (at least since '92 or so) been 'exposed' as anything but the blackest of black boxes [17:17]
mircea_popescu this is then mis-represented as "there's something wrong wit hthe patrons" [17:17]
ascii_field mircea_popescu: iirc the author of 'camels' did investigate what the 'shooters in dark' had in common - and in all cases, it was an inability to comprehend that the machine is entirely blind to human intent, and to build meaningful mental models of purely mechanistic systems as a class [17:18]
mircea_popescu but my proposition is that perhaps he found this because it's what he wanted to find. [17:18]
mircea_popescu maybe all the patrons in class A happen to be white [17:18]
mircea_popescu and incompetent pinoy brothel owner decides "gringos are assholes" [17:19]
ascii_field possible [17:19]
ascii_field http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2015/06/google-to-remove-revenge-porn-search-results << moar lulz [17:19]
mircea_popescu not "our brothel really fucking sucks, who ever heard of this" [17:19]
assbot Google to remove revenge porn search results | Ars Technica ... ( http://bit.ly/1GnKtf6 ) [17:19]
hazirafel_ dose extensive experience with Asperger people count? [17:20]
mircea_popescu count in what ? [17:21]
mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=18-06-2015#1168033 << wait, you think anyone drinks specified purity caffeine in their coffee ?! [17:21]
assbot Logged on 18-06-2015 20:38:16; ascii_field: would you tolerate this with coffee? booze ? [17:21]
ascii_field mircea_popescu: i specified 'coffee does not vary by order of magnitude' [17:22]
ascii_field (for one thing, if it did, you would typically be dead after a few pulls of the roulette trigger) [17:22]
hazirafel_ comprehending machines, i guess i'm kidding [17:22]
trinque hazirafel_: those types tend to do what they're told; wouldn't call it understanding [17:22]
mircea_popescu wasn't it the case caffeine tolerance actually builds to degrees of magnitude ? [17:23]
trinque *comprehending [17:23]
ascii_field mircea_popescu: different animal vs. 'roll dice to decide how many zeros appear in front of the milligram figure' [17:23]
mircea_popescu i guess. [17:23]
* mircea_popescu has really nfi what's out there re lsd purity [17:23]
ascii_field ditto for something like, e.g., an ordinary cig [17:24]
mircea_popescu well ok, getting 2 grams of nicotine would put you out [17:24]
ascii_field if it could just as easily contain 1g as 1mg of nicotine, it would be a suicide device [17:24]
mircea_popescu pretty much [17:24]
trinque this is why you should have friends more reckless than you are [17:25]
trinque when it doesn't kill them, great [17:25]
mircea_popescu or children [17:25]
trinque heh! [17:25]
mircea_popescu lol [17:25]
mircea_popescu but yes, this is WHY children are reckless. [17:25]
ascii_field http://www.reddit.com/r/WTF/comments/3ae3wn/guy_was_ordered_to_give_his_ex_half_of_the_stuff/? << in other nyooz [17:25]
mircea_popescu historically, what they've been used for. [17:25]
assbot Guy was ordered to give his ex half of the stuff after divorce. Well, he did. : WTF ... ( http://bit.ly/1GnLfsu ) [17:25]
ascii_field as a boy, i saw a '80s sov. film where a couple split up their possessions with gigantic laser [17:28]
mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=18-06-2015#1168051 << he has a point tho. you are aboput as likely to get 10 doses in one as you are to get 55 cups of latte for ordering 5. [17:28]
assbot Logged on 18-06-2015 20:42:01; *: ascii_field wonders why nubbins` is publicly begging lizard hitler to order his mail opened and tested [17:28]
ascii_field and ended with objects like these [17:28]
mircea_popescu meanwhile, people who sell very weak stuff prolly lose their custom [17:28]
mircea_popescu so, it may vary but it won't vary as drastically as you propose. prolly more in line with coffee/caffeine. [17:28]
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mircea_popescu !up ascii_field [17:28]
-assbot- You voiced ascii_field for 30 minutes. [17:28]
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ascii_field http://i.ebayimg.com/t/Halber-Motorradhelm-/00/s/MTAyNFg3Njg=/z/~oIAAOSwl8NVbcHr/$_57.JPG << win [17:29]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1GnLT9s ) [17:29]
ascii_field http://i.ebayimg.com/t/Halbes-Apple-MacBook-Pro-/00/s/OTAwWDEyMDA=/z/I4gAAOSwsLtVevMs/$_57.JPG << ultra-portable laptop for ben_vulpes ? [17:30]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1GnLXG5 ) [17:30]
mod6 haha [17:30]
trinque http://www.ebay.de/itm/Halber-Opel-Corsa-/201368555436?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_77&hash=item2ee2804fac [17:32]
assbot Halber Opel Corsa | eBay ... ( http://bit.ly/1fmDVHP ) [17:32]
trinque oh that's good [17:32]
trinque marriage, not even once... [17:32]
ascii_field mircea_popescu: http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2015/06/are-prosecutors-using-a-gag-order-to-search-for-reason-com-commenters << take a guess who isn't mentioned [17:33]
assbot Are prosecutors using a gag order to search for Reason.com commenters? | Ars Technica ... ( http://bit.ly/1fmE4v0 ) [17:33]
mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=18-06-2015#1168104 << all this c0khaet!1 [17:33]
assbot Logged on 18-06-2015 21:31:46; cazalla: ah i think she's attractive, just has that mousy look.. no cocks either! maybe mp could learn a thing or two from you :P [17:33]
mircea_popescu ascii_field obama. [17:33]
shinohai @ trinque "marriage, not even once" <<< My motto [17:38]
mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=18-06-2015#1168137 << yes. a large number of people do, who all seem to be lookingfor the same thing. "someone with experience with gpgtools for mac" [17:39]
assbot Logged on 18-06-2015 22:12:43; ag3nt_zer0: does anyone have experience with gpgtools for mac? [17:39]
mircea_popescu i suspect what they mean is, "someone with experience with crapple software that doesn't suck" [17:39]
mircea_popescu may be a bridge too far, too thin, too short and too fallen in the water too long ago. [17:39]
ascii_field mircea_popescu: and by 'for mac' they almost always mean 'using mac gui' [17:39]
ascii_field (normal shell-only gpg builds fine on mac) [17:40]
mircea_popescu aha [17:40]
* assbot removes voice from hazirafel_ [17:41]
mircea_popescu and now, ima go play some eulora. bbl! [17:42]
thestringpuller I suspekt the second you put priv keys on a mac they go straight ot the secret iCloud. [17:42]
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shinohai @ thestringpuller i had a pm from a guy using a mac last night using gpg on a mac (gui) I couldn't help because I know dick about macs. [17:49]
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trinque shinohai: that macgpg thing seems like a wad of unnecessary crap [17:51]
trinque er no, "gpgtools" is the one I had in mind [17:52]
shinohai gpgtools was what he was using. I was drinking pernod and told him to fuck off and use linux basically [17:53]
shinohai I feel bad now [17:53]
trinque no, that's precisely the right response [17:53]
trinque I'll happily lead a noob through using the proper tools, but wont bother with someone who refuses to use the proper tools [17:53]
shinohai I tried to help him but I m hoplessly out of my element with other OS's no matter how hard I try [17:56]
mod6 <+trinque> no, that's precisely the right response << i wonder if its easier to just tell mac people to fire up a vm of linux/bsd and just use gpg inside of that? [17:58]
mod6 but overall, i agree. [17:58]
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mod6 !up ascii_field [17:59]
* assbot gives voice to ascii_field [17:59]
trinque mod6: maybe; I'd like to see a standard piece of hardware recommended at some point [17:59]
shinohai I have a shitty laptop that came with Win8, I wouldn't trade it for a Mac even if you added a few btc to the mix [18:00]
trinque I might buy one of the pcengines machines ascii_field pointed out soon [18:00]
shinohai I must add I put Debian Jessie on that laptop in place of 8 [18:00]
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ascii_field trinque: keep in mind, those have no vga [18:08]
ascii_field nor does attaching one through the m-pcie slots appear to work [18:08]
ascii_field http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=19-06-2015#1168936 << i cannot in good conscience recommend any presently-manufactured general-purpose pc box [18:09]
assbot Logged on 19-06-2015 20:55:44; trinque: mod6: maybe; I'd like to see a standard piece of hardware recommended at some point [18:09]
trinque ascii_field: yeah I chose "pointed out" to keep from saying that's your recommended box [18:09]
ascii_field it is good for approximately same kind of uses as pogo [18:10]
ascii_field (but costs 5x more) [18:10]
trinque yeah, I'm thinking this would be a bitcoind dev/build box [18:10]
ascii_field trinque: so long as you're ok with operating over '80s-style terminal [18:10]
trinque ssh's fine by me [18:11]
trinque and was thinking of snagging decimation's terminal [18:11]
ascii_field trinque: are you also ok with building own bios ? [18:11]
ascii_field (iirc the one it ships with doesn't work) [18:11]
trinque I could probably manage [18:12]
trinque ah ok [18:12]
trinque what's the tooling to write to that run? [18:12]
ascii_field gcc [18:12]
ascii_field 'coreboot' (formerly aka 'linuxbios') [18:12]
trinque I mean flashing the guy [18:12]
ascii_field spi [18:12]
trinque k [18:12]
ascii_field needless to say it's built around amd g-series chip. so when amd kisses good-bye, that's all for this box [18:13]
ascii_field in terms of estimating longevity [18:13]
ascii_field on account of amd's poor health, i see x86 as being very soon dead to me entirely [18:14]
trinque of late I collect two things; old computers/parts and PDFs [18:16]
trinque while they can be got, heh [18:16]
ascii_field pdf ? [18:16]
trinque tends to be the format for papers posted here [18:16]
ascii_field most 'old computer' catagory is worthless. [18:17]
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shinohai There is no such thing as an obsolete computer in my mind, unless it is hopelessly fragmented by usg [18:18]
shinohai I just need to find a way to think around it. [18:18]
ascii_field the only thing more useless than a modern opaque turd is a 1990s opaque turd that no one is ~even working on~ reverse-engineering today [18:19]
ascii_field e.g., various old intel chipsets [18:19]
ascii_field i bought a spiffy-looking fanless 486 box some weeks ago, for playing gamez [18:19]
trinque ascii_field: no value in collecting say "pre-9/11" hardware? [18:20]
ascii_field turned out, it lacks a bios battery [18:20]
ascii_field as in, literally no place to emplace it [18:20]
trinque asking genuinely, perhaps there's not [18:20]
ascii_field trinque: depends very much on whether you can distinguish genuinely valuable things from the kind of garbage i was describing just now [18:20]
ascii_field to finish the story, i dug for data sheets for the 'ali' chipset found therein, in hopes of affixing something like a 'cmos battery' - and found, unsurprisingly, nothing [18:21]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 34401 @ 0.00042685 = 14.6841 BTC [-] {2} [18:21]
ascii_field i would like 486 but not if i have to set up the disk thing every time it turns on. [18:21]
shinohai @ ascii_field what are your thoughts on this? https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1598272670/chip-the-worlds-first-9-computer [18:22]
assbot CHIP - The World's First Nine Dollar Computer by Next Thing Co. — Kickstarter ... ( http://bit.ly/1ITUu7W ) [18:22]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6649 @ 0.00041705 = 2.773 BTC [-] [18:22]
ascii_field shinohai: idiocy [18:22]
shinohai I'd rather build something on my own when I haz knowledge [18:23]
ascii_field shinohai: chip is available now, on other boards. yet another 'arm', nothing remarkable about it [18:23]
* ascii_field fucking hates 'arm' [18:23]
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shinohai I can do the same thing with any discarded android, with enuf time [18:24]
ascii_field thing is a turd, from the black-box cpu (all 'arm' are builds of opaque licensed blob from uk) to the 'systemd' shit ecosystem that will run on top [18:25]
shinohai I <3 Debian but the bloated systemd kills me [18:26]
trinque shinohai: try mod6's gentoo build maybe [18:26]
trinque has most of the bullshit removed via USE [18:26]
shinohai @ trinque I am a dumb fuck that knows nothing about gentoo. I wish I could so I could slap Luke Jr in da face. [18:27]
trinque the guide is directly aimed at noobs [18:27]
shinohai ping mod6 [18:28]
* assbot removes voice from ascii_field [18:30]
shinohai !up ascii_field [18:30]
* assbot gives voice to ascii_field [18:30]
trinque !s mod6 http: [18:30]
assbot : http://s.b-a.link/?q=mod6+http%3A [18:30]
trinque !s mod6 http [18:31]
assbot 398 results for 'mod6 http' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=mod6+http [18:31]
trinque shinohai: top result [18:31]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11800 @ 0.00042897 = 5.0618 BTC [+] [18:37]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 37682 @ 0.00042897 = 16.1644 BTC [+] [18:42]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17949 @ 0.00044186 = 7.9309 BTC [+] {2} [18:55]
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mod6 !up ascii_field [19:12]
* assbot gives voice to ascii_field [19:12]
mod6 trinque: need a link? [19:12]
ascii_field back to the 'plz recommend standard hardware that isn't retarded' thing - i can't help but rub in the point here, that we are playing 'junkyard wars' [19:12]
trinque mod6: pulled it from teh logz for shinohai [19:12]
mod6 ok np. just checkin [19:13]
ascii_field there ~is not a good answer~ to this question [19:13]
ascii_field in the words of orlov, 'try asking a different question, to which there may be an answer' [19:13]
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decimation ascii_field: re: JTRS < lolfest of usg spending on academitardation [19:17]
ascii_field decimation: afaik 100% of usg code that actually ~works~ is 1995 and prior [19:18]
trinque ascii_field: my aim is to have something upon which to build buttcoind repeatably [19:18]
decimation it's almost dead predictable every time a new tech cycle comes around: usg spends $bil on 'new tech that will save lots of money', fails any gains, actual people working in the field are displaced by carpetbaggers [19:18]
trinque after which who knows, I might dare dabble in C++ for the second time in my career [19:18]
trinque I've avoided the shit like the plague otherwise [19:19]
trinque I have no delusions about having a generally useful computer this decade [19:19]
decimation ascii_field: yes, radios that are designed to work as radios rather than platonic ideals of radios do tend to work well [19:19]
decimation plus, once you are paying $bil to corba and java developers, they are not gonna listen to some rf engineer who knows about radios [19:20]
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mircea_popescu turned out, it lacks a bios battery << oh i recall those shitty boards. [19:24]
ascii_field mircea_popescu: this thing started life as a winblows-ce (yes) graphical terminal [19:24]
decimation ascii_field, others: related> [19:24]
decimation http://www.spacewar.com/reports/US_nuclear_bombers_lack_satellite_terminals_for_emergencies_999.html [19:24]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1QHctFE ) [19:25]
mircea_popescu there was a huge cost to, basically, gavinize computers around that time. it's how "mmx" processors came about, and "streamlined" mobos with no batteries etc. [19:25]
mircea_popescu it went nowhere, ftr. [19:25]
mircea_popescu as all these idiocies ever do. [19:25]
mircea_popescu (the "cheap laptop" thing being a recent example) [19:25]
decimation mmx is a streaming extension to x86 for processing floating point [19:25]
ascii_field except then it becomes ubiquitous [19:26]
ascii_field piecemeal [19:26]
decimation it's been 'upgraded' 3 more times [19:26]
mircea_popescu decimation no no, there was a shitty series of 486 processors [19:26]
ascii_field mircea_popescu is thinking of 486dx [19:26]
ascii_field (sx rather) [19:27]
mircea_popescu oh right right [19:27]
decimation yeah the sx was without the floating point unit I think [19:27]
mircea_popescu i got the letters wrong [19:27]
ascii_field where they snipped the fpu [19:27]
mircea_popescu ya [19:27]
decimation yeah that's fucktarded [19:27]
decimation note the divorce between marketing and technologists [19:27]
mircea_popescu aye. [19:27]
mircea_popescu this was purely a marketing concoction [19:28]
mircea_popescu "because technocomputerology is not masses accessible sufficiently!111" [19:28]
mircea_popescu ended up... losing money. [19:28]
mircea_popescu How Stars Like Cara Delevingne, Kristen Stewart, & Miley Cyrus Are Leading the Gender Fluid Movement for Millennials << who the fuck are these "stars" ? [19:29]
ascii_field a usual gambit is to try to 'luxurify the ordinary' by getting folks used to a crippled item, then re-introducing the missing bits [19:29]
mircea_popescu more importantly, how do we know it's not "buncha anon hags are driving the star-fluid movement, wherein everyone thinks they're a star" [19:29]
decimation ^ [19:29]
decimation for instance this dre fellow thinks he knows how to engineer headphones [19:29]
mircea_popescu srsly, cara delevingne ? [19:29]
mircea_popescu what is this, avril lavigne v2.0 ? [19:30]
mircea_popescu is this actually a person even ? [19:30]
decimation add a few ounces of metal to the cheapass plastic; charge $200 [19:30]
decimation apple buys you for $3 bil [19:30]
mircea_popescu which you can't spend. [19:30]
trinque speaks volumes on apple's present state [19:30]
decimation you can spend some of it, maybe [19:30]
decimation at any rate the irs definitely taxes your shit on it, even if unspendable [19:31]
mircea_popescu omfg! i totally called it. ITS THE SAME LIFTED PHOTOS GUYSE! [19:31]
mircea_popescu http://www.google.com/search?q=Cara+Delevingne&complete=0&tbm=isch&sa=X vs http://www.google.com/search?q=Avril+Lavigne&complete=0&tbm=isch&sa=X vs [19:32]
assbot Cara Delevingne - Recherche Google ... ( http://bit.ly/1QHdbCO ) [19:32]
assbot Avril Lavigne - Recherche Google ... ( http://bit.ly/1QHdbCU ) [19:32]
decimation I thought it was well known that anything to do with 'popular music' is essentially nothing more than a marketing chumpatron [19:32]
mircea_popescu apparently [19:32]
trinque they take a skinny white chick and feed her into the machine every other year [19:32]
mircea_popescu different ones ? [19:33]
trinque clone army maybe [19:33]
decimation sometimes it helps if she has singing talent, but it's not that important [19:33]
decimation http://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2015/06/10/obama-cracks-down-on-airplane-emissions-buys-massive-new-air-force-one/ < Taxpayers currently spend $206,337 for every flight hour aboard Air Force One. [19:34]
mircea_popescu so i guess they decided they could make more money by keeping fewer clone tanks [19:34]
trinque decimation: they don't even make 'em do that r&b yodel anymore [19:34]
assbot Obama Cracks Down on Airplane Emissions, Buys Massive New Air Force One - Breitbart ... ( http://bit.ly/1QHdptC ) [19:34]
mircea_popescu and call it "gender fluid" ? [19:34]
trinque just autotune the shit and put some buzzing synth in there [19:34]
decimation greenspun: "(compare to about $25,000 per flight hour to charter (source)). If American Airlines spent this much during the 7-hour flight from London to Boston it would cost $1.44 million for the trip in operating cost (i.e., not including the capital cost of the aircraft) or about $3500 per passenger (i.e., a round-trip coach ticket couldn?t be sold for less than about $7000 plus taxes and fees)." [19:34]
mircea_popescu and they sell for... about that ? [19:35]
mircea_popescu sooo... ? his point being that airlines are robbing us blind ? [19:35]
decimation no his point is that obama's airplane is [19:36]
decimation actual round trip ticket to london is like $1k [19:36]
mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=18-06-2015#1168172 << isn't casual racism an oxymoron, like temporary death or sunday religiosity ? [19:36]
assbot Logged on 18-06-2015 22:36:07; mats: casual racism is the norm here [19:36]
decimation so somehow air force one costs 7x regular airliner [19:36]
mircea_popescu decimation first class or chimp class ? [19:36]
decimation I assume chimp class [19:37]
mircea_popescu you don't actually want the president to travel with the immigrands ? [19:37]
decimation other presidents do [19:37]
mircea_popescu but for this reason. [19:37]
decimation I think the uk prime minister flys on british airways [19:37]
mircea_popescu but the uk is a sort of egypt. [19:38]
mircea_popescu "used to be a great empire" [19:38]
* decimation was unaware that svelte transport on grand air-sedan (powered by pure slave money) was needed for greatness [19:38]
trinque hell, sounds kinda fun though [19:39]
mircea_popescu svelte means thin [19:39]
ascii_field i've been reading an autobiography of hans baur, best known as hitler's pilot. he spoke of various folks he had flown, and described how king of bulgaria flew part of a trip with him, then caught an ordinary train [19:39]
ascii_field real mindfuck to modern eyes [19:39]
mircea_popescu i think modern eyes still understand bulgaria's a shithole. [19:39]
decimation ascii_field: the best part of that 20 juli movie with tom cruise were the scenes with hitler's planes [19:39]
trinque sounds like folksy pandering [19:40]
decimation apparently it was an actual Ju-52 that still flies https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Junkers_Ju_52#/media/File:Ju-Air_Junkers_Ju-52_in_flight_over_Austria.jpg [19:40]
assbot Junkers Ju 52 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ... ( http://bit.ly/1QHdYn8 ) [19:40]
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mircea_popescu what was that rocket plane they had, he something [19:40]
trinque among the waste in usg, air force one is way in the long tail [19:41]
ascii_field fuhrer did not fly in rocket plane. [19:41]
trinque and look what happened to him [19:41]
trinque dead! [19:41]
mircea_popescu trinque im still in shock someone proposed 7k a seat as outrageous. i must be buying in all the wrong places. [19:41]
decimation actually $7k per seat is about right for business/first class [19:41]
ascii_field mircea_popescu: add another zero and you can lounge in the entire plane [19:41]
trinque I'm not a rich guy or head of state, but seems either merits better shuffling around than what I use [19:41]
mircea_popescu maybe double, but certainly not the 10 to 100x the article would need it to be [19:42]
mircea_popescu maybe someone blew up their math somewhere ? [19:42]
ascii_field add yet another 0 and... buy the machine [19:42]
mircea_popescu ascii_field what machine you're gonna buy for 700k again ? [19:42]
* assbot removes voice from ascii_field [19:42]
decimation well, you also gotta realize that when air force one is flying, there is usually a fleet of other aircraft for car, plane, etc [19:42]
trinque !up ascii_field [19:42]
* assbot gives voice to ascii_field [19:42]
mircea_popescu you intend to fly the guy in an old antonov birotor ? [19:42]
mircea_popescu decimation then it's a not very well written/researched article ? [19:43]
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decimation Greenspun was just making the side point that the aircraft is relatively expensive to operate compared to others in its class [19:43]
mircea_popescu but it came out the other way around. [19:43]
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decimation it might be confusing, but he points out that a 747 costs about $25k per hour for everything [19:46]
decimation so it's about 10x [19:46]
decimation who knows how that cost is calculated, because an arbitrary number of usg throne-keepers could be bundled [19:47]
mircea_popescu so is the idea something like "it costs 10x more to move this one guy than to move these 450 other guys" ? [19:47]
mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=18-06-2015#1168198 << ahahaha. wut teh fuck [19:48]
assbot Logged on 18-06-2015 22:59:55; cazalla: for a moment i was like.. why would jurov not give qntra the scoop? http://www.coindesk.com/latin-america-coinbr-acquires-coinverse/ [19:48]
mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=19-06-2015#1168270 << the clean coins trading thing was a major enabler of the original ponzi (pirate's) [19:51]
assbot Logged on 19-06-2015 00:49:01; asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=18-06-2015#1168261 << hypothetical twist: whole thing is a front by chinese miners, anxious to sell certifiably 'clean' coin to gullible schmucks at a premium [19:51]
mircea_popescu because at that time, had he not also run a "buy new coinbases from miners at 110% "business" on the side, people would have noticed they're being paid with their own coins. [19:51]
ascii_field how ? [19:51]
ascii_field ah [19:51]
ascii_field ergo 'taint' exists. [19:52]
ascii_field at least for some special cases [19:52]
mircea_popescu yes, for the special case where you're running a ponzi equal to the monetary mass. [19:52]
ascii_field and it is not hard to establish that a heavy share of miners operates at a loss [19:52]
ascii_field so there ought to be a reason for it [19:52]
mircea_popescu most oil refineries also operate at a loss. [19:53]
mircea_popescu generally, most infrastructure in all times and places operates at a loss, which is why commodification is not particularly welcomed by business people, which is how you get apple. [19:53]
mircea_popescu and bad software, and everyone wanting to make their own web app and so on [19:53]
ascii_field !s pay for the sun [19:54]
assbot 4 results for 'pay for the sun' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=pay+for+the+sun [19:54]
cazalla https://voat.co/v/announcements/comments/146757 [19:55]
assbot Our provider, hosteurope.de shut down our servers due to "political incorrectness" | announcements ... ( http://bit.ly/1QHfaXT ) [19:55]
mircea_popescu heh/ [19:55]
mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=19-06-2015#1168292 << for flavour, "piu piu" is the chirp sound of birds in romanian. [19:56]
assbot Logged on 19-06-2015 02:03:34; asciilifeform: 'The PiuPiu oversharing site allows users to create PiuPiu accounts and post 140-character messages. The federal government wants PiuPiu to surveil user activity on the site, by archiving any posts that match certain patterns outlined in a national security letter. Subject to the nondisclosure constraints of the letter, PiuPiu may not inform anyone of the surveillance request.' [19:56]
mircea_popescu and what a chicklet does is "piuie", ie, "makes the piu sound" [19:57]
ascii_field mircea_popescu: speaking of, notice that 2014 medalist is (nominally) chick [19:57]
mircea_popescu aha. [19:57]
mircea_popescu mg cto is also, factually, chick. [19:57]
mircea_popescu lack of women in tech is not a problem of women or of tech, but merely of a bunch of dorks going around looking for women in tech in the garbage. well duh, why'd they be in the garbage ? [19:58]
mircea_popescu teenage boys go in the garbage. [19:58]
mircea_popescu (this is actually an anciend graham post, i subscribe entirely) [19:59]
mircea_popescu !s Cichlid [19:59]
assbot 2 results for 'Cichlid' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=Cichlid [19:59]
ascii_field 'A lot more men than women choose to do seemingly irrational things such as become petty criminals, fly homebuilt helicopters, play video games, and keep tropical fish as pets (98 percent of the attendees at the American Cichlid Association convention that I last attended were male). Should we be surprised that it is mostly men who spend 10 years banging their heads against an equation-filled blackboard in hopes of [19:59]
ascii_field landing a $35,000/year post-doc job?' [19:59]
mircea_popescu aye. 2nd result. [20:00]
ascii_field greenspun btw [20:00]
ascii_field not graham [20:00]
ben_vulpes re: accounts thread and data structures, this imho is why the change addr behavior mneeds a zappin [20:00]
mircea_popescu oh right. my bad. [20:00]
ascii_field ben_vulpes: i could shoot the change-addr thing in the head in ten minutes, but mircea_popescu wants to keep it for some reason [20:01]
mircea_popescu "some reason" => "let's keep changes to a needed minimum" [20:01]
ben_vulpes is the incurred complexity needed? [20:02]
ascii_field personally i see the random-change-addr thing to be as screamingly retarded as memory leak [20:03]
ascii_field i'd like to see someone present a coherent argument for the negative here [20:03]
ben_vulpes i suppose you'd have us leave testnet in as well [20:03]
mircea_popescu the argument was presented last we discussed this. "you can do the things you want to do once you've done the things that must be done and the result works" [20:04]
mircea_popescu no dessert as of so far. [20:04]
mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=19-06-2015#1168374 << quite exactly. fine example of the bezzle moral hazard. [20:05]
assbot Logged on 19-06-2015 04:19:54; decimation: mats: the beats thing still pisses me off [20:05]
ascii_field this - sure [20:06]
ascii_field but is there an argument actually in favour of the mechanism ? [20:06]
ben_vulpes moreover, what all is in this list of 'must be done'? [20:07]
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mircea_popescu anyway, i agree they're stupid. originally it was "they must go out because they break backups". turned out they don't. now it's "they should go out because they're stupid", which is valid, but also an aesthetic judgement. we're not at aesthetics yet. but eventually, whole wallet scheme needs to be made by someone who's not retarded in the fucking head. [20:07]
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ben_vulpes wai wut how do they not break backups. [20:08]
mircea_popescu !s a process [20:08]
assbot 559 results for 'a process' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=a+process [20:08]
ben_vulpes oh because a wallet is really a collection of the inputs that a key or set of keys can sign on and so a 'wallet' in the satoshi client parlance is actually not back=up-able if in use? [20:09]
mircea_popescu no. [20:09]
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mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=19-06-2015#1168397 << because idiots "should have money too", then there's an infinity of them, before you know it they drive the market. "inequality" is actually a stupid word to describe a functional society, where shit is not being promoted by shitheads. [20:11]
assbot Logged on 19-06-2015 04:28:39; decimation: funkenstein_: yeah I know, people here bitch about the lack of 'adult' products. glitzy candy beats serious in the market every time [20:11]
mircea_popescu the only way for the hundred million idiots to not impose their britney spears over anything and everything else is for the hundred million to not have as much as a single cent disposable income. [20:12]
kakobrekla http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=19-06-2015#1168375 < actually sennheiser is meh. here i have a 20$ headphones that beat the shit out of 200 and 350$ sennheisers. [20:12]
assbot Logged on 19-06-2015 04:20:12; decimation: a company like sennheiser makes actual headphones, with specifications and everything [20:12]
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* assbot removes voice from ascii_field [20:13]
mod6 !up ascii_field [20:13]
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ascii_field afaik 'good headphone' does not exist [20:14]
ascii_field any more than 'good laptop' [20:14]
kakobrekla correct. [20:14]
ascii_field i put on a 30k set of electrostatic phones in a linguistics lab. air piles to ears instead of wires. still meh. [20:14]
ascii_field *air pipes [20:14]
kakobrekla senn orpheus ? [20:14]
mircea_popescu btw, did we discuss the dude that drove an armored vehicle into some texas something or the other ? [20:14]
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trinque http://www.breitbart.com/texas/2015/06/13/dallas-police-shooting-zombie-apocalypse-assault-vehicle-and-troop-transport/ << looks to be the one [20:16]
assbot DALLAS POLICE SHOOTING: ‘Zombie Apocalypse Assault Vehicle and Troop Transport’ ... ( http://bit.ly/1Sx98Gy ) [20:16]
trinque oh texas, how I love you [20:16]
mircea_popescu lol [20:16]
mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=19-06-2015#1168484 << lol pretty good. [20:18]
assbot Logged on 19-06-2015 08:06:30; copypaste: they flipped their shit when i told them in the US that if their boyfriends took the pictures that means the boyfriends own the pictures and only they can write DMCAs [20:18]
ascii_field kakobrekla: nah, it was long ago [20:18]
kakobrekla anyway if anyone is out for headies, 20$ 'superlux 681' will blow away senn hd650 like nothing. [20:19]
mircea_popescu somehow "if you made a business you don't own that business", yet "if you have a pair of tits it's your pair of tits" [20:19]
mircea_popescu well nao! [20:19]
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kakobrekla they are a chinas copy of some akg model [20:19]
kakobrekla taht got lucky with the end result. [20:19]
mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=19-06-2015#1168522 << i've had bear. [20:21]
assbot Logged on 19-06-2015 08:22:09; cazalla: you've had bear? [20:21]
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mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=19-06-2015#1168563 << i absolutely despise tofu. [20:23]
assbot Logged on 19-06-2015 08:51:42; mats: tofu is kind of an analogue for real chinese cuisine [20:23]
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mircea_popescu in truth i don't care much about most chinese cuisine either, but not because it'd be bland. because they can't cook. some stuff is actually excellent, but plenty of stuff is "hey, let's throw everything in the kitchen in the same pot. vinegar, oil, sugar, what the hell." [20:25]
cazalla agreed, but i didn't want to offend him so i did not mention this heh [20:25]
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mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=19-06-2015#1168568 << i can always tell, because of the tell-tale "metallic" aftertaste a half hour to an hour later, coming from all the exhausted overfired neurons. [20:26]
scoopbot_revived Bryan Micon To Return To Las Vegas To Face Charge http://qntra.net/2015/06/bryan-micon-to-return-to-las-vegas-to-face-charge/ [20:26]
assbot Logged on 19-06-2015 08:59:21; mats: msg presents differently in various things [20:26]
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mircea_popescu cazalla that said, a chinese guy had a decent restaurant a mile from my place in ro (actually, conference went there). guy made some incredible baked eggplant [20:27]
mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=19-06-2015#1168587 << people asking these types of questions have not done their reading. [20:28]
assbot Logged on 19-06-2015 10:54:47; wyrdmantis: I was asked if there is a "defense" plan to "isolate" the Bitcoin XT nodes or something similar. I thought this is a non-issue for you guys... [20:28]
mircea_popescu this shit redditards pull where they go about blathering for three months and then pretend like nothing happened and questions can be asked as if just discovered may work on reddit, but it'll give all of them a busted lip irl. [20:29]
mats im inclined to say you've rarely had legit chinese cuisine, and if you did and still feel that way... you have an unrefined palette [20:29]
mircea_popescu the entire "consensus" bullshit collapsed because i said back in january exactly what the plan is. [20:29]
mircea_popescu mats how could i evaluate this ? [20:29]
mats chinese folks have had thousands of years of recorded history to develop recipes [20:29]
mircea_popescu for instance - i never ate chinese food in places not owned and operated by chinese people. [20:30]
mats can't, food is a personal matter. you don't like what you don't like. cultural context notwithstanding [20:30]
mircea_popescu mats and cats have had millions of years to develop fishing implements. [20:30]
mircea_popescu not necessarily a cogent argument. [20:30]
mats alright, man [20:30]
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mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=19-06-2015#1168597 << im not so sure the replace by fee thing is intelligent. [20:34]
assbot Logged on 19-06-2015 17:17:56; BingoBoingo: tldr: Pool implements a replace by fee patch, derps herp because it means People can double spend before the transaction is committed to a block! [20:34]
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mircea_popescu mats while food is obviously a personal matter, whether one has legit or not legit X food should be verifiable experimentally neh ? [20:42]
mats sure. on the other hand, you are a white man, and server or chef might choose to whitewash the meal to appeal to some sense of your palette [20:45]
mats but that's unlikely. [20:46]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 22901 @ 0.00045837 = 10.4971 BTC [+] [20:46]
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cazalla that also doesn't really fit with yum cha and the one i ate at was full of chinese so you'd think it was the good one [20:47]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 21350 @ 0.00045139 = 9.6372 BTC [-] [20:47]
mats anyway not really a productive discussion, i don't enjoy thai food but i recognize it takes skill [20:48]
mircea_popescu well i never ate anything in china, that's for sure. [20:48]
mircea_popescu i have no doubt it's food, ie, a product of human industry. [20:48]
cazalla mats, i love thai food.. i have a kaffir lime just for this alone [20:48]
mircea_popescu ironically, my first exposure to azn cooking was in a thai restaurant [20:48]
mircea_popescu i had... the sushi :D [20:49]
mats ...why [20:49]
mircea_popescu because im weird. [20:49]
mircea_popescu i dunno, just, what i orderer [20:49]
mircea_popescu ordered* [20:49]
mircea_popescu (this was on the boston wharf, so a seafood choice perhaps more easy to understand) [20:50]
mats hmm [20:51]
mats i think ill have a lobster roll this weekend [20:52]
mircea_popescu lobster roles. [20:55]
trinque I identify as lobster; this is offensive. [20:56]
cazalla you'll be needing yourself a lobster girl then trinque [20:57]
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mircea_popescu best pray ~i~ don't identify you as lobster/ [21:06]
Adlai i'm code literate in java << they've really been lowering the bar eh [21:07]
Adlai used to be you needed to write a macro to get your shilly wings [21:07]
mircea_popescu honestly i never saw someoine who could code call themselves "code literate in x". sounds more like something i'd say. [21:08]
Adlai fwiw that nick means "dark pig" [21:09]
scoopbot_revived Changing the BitBet resolution process. http://trilema.com/2015/changing-the-bitbet-resolution-process/ [21:18]
asciilifeform wtf does 'code literate' mean [21:23]
asciilifeform for instance, i've met folks who 'i know c' but cannot tell me how 'duff's device' works [21:24]
asciilifeform ( http://www.lysator.liu.se/c/duffs-device.html << for n00bz) [21:24]
assbot Tom Duff on Duff's Device ... ( http://bit.ly/1RhZZPQ ) [21:24]
asciilifeform http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=19-06-2015#1169198 << umpteenth 'usg vs. clinically retarded schmuck' match. wake me up when the 'usg vs. smart folks' match is being played. [21:29]
assbot Logged on 19-06-2015 23:12:39; trinque: http://www.breitbart.com/texas/2015/06/13/dallas-police-shooting-zombie-apocalypse-assault-vehicle-and-troop-transport/ << looks to be the one [21:29]
mircea_popescu "A second poster tried the test, but botched the implementation, proving only that with diligence it is possible to make anything run slowly." [21:31]
mircea_popescu win [21:31]
asciilifeform duff's device is ~3 wks older than i am. [21:32]
mircea_popescu bang emailpaths too [21:33]
asciilifeform http://everything2.com/title/Duff%2527s+device << see also. [21:33]
mircea_popescu ah lordy. [21:33]
assbot Duff's device - Everything2.com ... ( http://bit.ly/1Ri0Ujk ) [21:33]
mircea_popescu From research!ucbvax!dagobah!td Sun Nov 13 07:35:46 1983 [21:34]
mircea_popescu Received: by ucbvax.ARPA (4.16/4.13) id AA18997; Sun, 13 Nov 83 07:35:46 pst [21:34]
mircea_popescu Received: by dagobah.LFL (4.6/4.6b) id AA01034; Thu, 10 Nov 83 17:57:56 PST [21:34]
mircea_popescu three fuckenb days. [21:34]
asciilifeform hey, usenet. [21:34]
asciilifeform 3, or 33, just the same. [21:35]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 38050 @ 0.00041736 = 15.8805 BTC [-] {2} [21:36]
mircea_popescu "It amazes me that after 10 years of writing C there are still little corners that I haven't explored fully. " [21:38]
mircea_popescu top kek [21:38]
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asciilifeform 'corners of c' are not unlike 'corners of chess' [21:38]
mircea_popescu what do you mean "how it works" anyway ? cheaper to compare than to iterate. [21:39]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: many n00bs begin with 'wtf how does this even compile' [21:40]
mircea_popescu why shouldn't it compile ? [21:40]
* asciilifeform was not one of them, cannot answer [21:41]
asciilifeform http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=19-06-2015#1169180 << my objection is not 'breaks backups', but 'breaks brainwallets' [21:41]
assbot Logged on 19-06-2015 23:04:20; ben_vulpes: wai wut how do they not break backups. [21:41]
decimation http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=19-06-2015#1169188 < yeah sennheiser has gone down in quality over the past few years too, they have to try to milk the idiot-herd too I guess [21:41]
assbot Logged on 19-06-2015 23:08:30; kakobrekla: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=19-06-2015#1168375 < actually sennheiser is meh. here i have a 20$ headphones that beat the shit out of 200 and 350$ sennheisers. [21:41]
asciilifeform (see recent 'brainwallet' thread) [21:42]
mircea_popescu is it because they imagien that the "do" only exists in case 0 [21:42]
mircea_popescu and otherwise there's a "dangling while" ? [21:42]
mircea_popescu this isn't how the compilers [used to] work [21:42]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: aha [21:43]
asciilifeform 'wires cross that must not cross' or the like. [21:43]
mircea_popescu actually i appreciate now why you mentioned it [21:43]
asciilifeform breaks some folks' mental model of c [21:43]
mircea_popescu this is a subtle but perhaps excellent test for distinguishing the categories you proposed [21:43]
asciilifeform there we go [21:43]
* asciilifeform appreciates mircea_popescu's quickness on the uptake [21:43]
mircea_popescu "they who imagine the computer is god" from "they who imagine the computer is this tramp they picked up hitchhiking and will fcuk her a little before cutting her up to pieces" [21:44]
asciilifeform ^ this and precisely this [21:44]
mircea_popescu incidentally, the original babbage wonderment is perhaps the first clash of the two [21:44]
mircea_popescu "why should the machine put out the right numbers regardless ?!?! BECAUSE IT IS THE MACHINE" [21:44]
asciilifeform the ultimate stage of this development is to realize that the tramp was already dead, cut up by a long series of maniacs previously, and one's job is to in fact stitch its parts together into a frankensteinian creature of one's own conception [21:45]
mircea_popescu before fucking her a while before cutting her up again [21:45]
asciilifeform naturally. [21:45]
asciilifeform how else. [21:45]
asciilifeform of course, folks who regularly deal with the output of c compiler cannot be surprised by duff's device [21:46]
mircea_popescu actually, any half good lawyer wouldnt be surprised either. [21:47]
mircea_popescu this is exactly how law works too. [21:47]
asciilifeform the 'mystery moment' only exists for those who began their study with c or similar [21:47]
decimation the confusing thing to me is the closure in the middle of the switch [21:47]
asciilifeform 'language lawyer' is a term of art for a reason. [21:47]
mircea_popescu but it is a powerful indictment of the "colored bits" concept. because lo! the compiler doth NOT CARE whence this executionable bitcoin went. merely what it says [21:47]
mircea_popescu if the while has where to return, it is happy. [21:47]
asciilifeform aha. [21:48]
asciilifeform sorta like the machine doesn't care if such-and-such is getting jumped to because a d00d munged the return address through buffer overflow, etc [21:48]
asciilifeform !s cold equations [21:48]
assbot 16 results for 'cold equations' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=cold+equations [21:48]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 54950 @ 0.00041553 = 22.8334 BTC [-] {4} [21:48]
decimation I guess if it compiles and produces machine code, machine will execute [21:48]
asciilifeform ^ the basic story of the whole 'camel hump' thing, long before pc [21:48]
mircea_popescu decimation the only way that wouldn't compile is if you specifically put custom code in tyh4e compiler to complain about it [21:49]
mircea_popescu and i bet you for any bayesian filter you can come up with someone can find a circumventer [21:49]
decimation yeah, no compiler/static checker can possibly consider all cases [21:51]
decimation any more than enumerate all possible chess 'corners' [21:51]
decimation https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shannon_number < shannon and others estimated number of chess positions to be around 2^155 [21:53]
assbot Shannon number - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ... ( http://bit.ly/1TClmPN ) [21:53]
mircea_popescu that said, it's prolly a safe bet that contemporary compilers do in fact complain [21:53]
mircea_popescu i dunno. [21:53]
mircea_popescu (about trivial cases, obviously) [21:53]
mircea_popescu anyway : the do doesn't exist when it appears in the code, but when the returning while is looking for it. much like the tits on the girl don't belong to the girl. [21:54]
decimation gcc swallows it without complaint [21:55]
mircea_popescu was thinking more like visualc / msvc / whatever [21:55]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform "Police disabled the vehicle with a .50 caliber rifle shot to the engine block." [21:59]
decimation "I cannot quote chapter and verse, but Larry Rosler, who was chairman of the language subcommittee (I think), has assured me that X3J11 considered it carefully and decided that it was legal." [22:00]
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mircea_popescu you know what happened. some lt in that preceinct had a .5 DE in his special closet. [22:00]
mircea_popescu i dun wanna hear any more bitching about that gun [22:00]
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decimation https://web.archive.org/web/20070106181008/http://blogcritics.org/archives/2006/08/02/152847.php < nearly 50 years ago, before swat teams, police just asked local folks come with their guns and help [22:02]
assbot Charles Whitman and Futureshock 40 Years Later @ Blogcritics.org ... ( http://bit.ly/1TCmkvg ) [22:02]
mircea_popescu well, a posse [22:03]
decimation "What struck me as most fascinating were the accounts from several sources of how the police dealt with the lack of covering fire that a SWAT team would provide today. They just went to citizens in the area and asked them to bring their rifles and shoot at the tower, and they all went to their pickups, got their deer rifles and did what they could to help." [22:03]
decimation "Their covering fire kept Whitman down and limited him to shooting through a drain opening, pretty much stopping the killing and giving officers the opportunity to get into the building. The officers also deputized one of the citizens to go with them into the tower to give them a bit more firepower, although he didn't end up facing Whitman. [22:03]
decimation they probably didnt' use a .50 DE, they probably had a proper anti-material rifle [22:05]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 54850 @ 0.0004272 = 23.4319 BTC [+] {2} [22:06]
* mircea_popescu doesn't think so. [22:07]
mircea_popescu iirc amr .5 is a russian idea. [22:08]
mircea_popescu nato fires 99mm [22:08]
decimation I doubt a .50 action express has enough power to penetrate armor [22:08]
trinque asciilifeform | http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=19-06-2015#1169198 << umpteenth 'usg vs. clinically retarded schmuck' match. wake me up when the 'usg vs. smart folks' match is being played. << weather's getting hotter all the time [22:09]
assbot Logged on 19-06-2015 23:12:39; trinque: http://www.breitbart.com/texas/2015/06/13/dallas-police-shooting-zombie-apocalypse-assault-vehicle-and-troop-transport/ << looks to be the one [22:09]
decimation mircea_popescu: yeah but the desert eagle round is only 33 mm long [22:10]
decimation has about 10x less energy [22:10]
decimation http://controversialtimes.com/news/dallas-gunman-killed-by-single-shot-from-snipers-50-caliber-rifle/ < was .50 bmg rifle [22:12]
assbot Dallas Gunman Killed by Single Shot from Sniper’s .50 Caliber Rifle ... ( http://bit.ly/1TCnyXm ) [22:12]
trinque joe stack et al, glory to them all [22:12]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 27450 @ 0.00041203 = 11.3102 BTC [-] {2} [22:13]
asciilifeform http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=20-06-2015#1169341 << no!! 'barrett.' standard issue in usa to police since a few yrs ago [22:14]
assbot Logged on 20-06-2015 00:56:22; mircea_popescu: you know what happened. some lt in that preceinct had a .5 DE in his special closet. [22:14]
asciilifeform precisely for occasions like this [22:14]
asciilifeform if anyone recalls, a while ago i posted photos from my town's police expo. they had just such a rifle, and introduced it as 'for cars' [22:14]
decimation yes and the armor piercing .50 bmg rounds are common. [22:15]
decimation I have a friend who has one, they are fairly common among shooting enthusiasts [22:15]
asciilifeform a little costly [22:15]
asciilifeform but available [22:15]
decimation yeah [22:15]
decimation he told me the cheapest way to get ammo is to buy usg surplus [22:16]
asciilifeform https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.50_BMG#/media/File:Rifle_cartridge_comparison.jpg << far left of photo [22:16]
assbot .50 BMG - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ... ( http://bit.ly/1IplYzm ) [22:16]
decimation apparently after the round is shipped too many times, the powder becomes too fine and burns off too quickly [22:16]
decimation usg sells shell as surplus, can reload yourself [22:16]
asciilifeform https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.50_Action_Express#/media/File:50_AE_and_32_ACP.jpg << left side - the cartridge mircea_popescu may have been thinking of [22:17]
assbot .50 Action Express - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ... ( http://bit.ly/1Ipm61Q ) [22:17]
asciilifeform iirc it was pitched for 'big game' [22:17]
decimation the .50 ae? [22:17]
asciilifeform aha [22:17]
decimation it's not really strong enough for that either [22:18]
decimation maybe at really close range [22:18]
asciilifeform there are a few ludicrously heavy pistols that fire .50ae. for some reason mircea_popescu seems to like'em. [22:19]
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decimation maybe he spent his youth playing counterstrike [22:19]
asciilifeform http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=20-06-2015#1169352 << 99mm would be a cannon shell - if it existed [22:21]
assbot Logged on 20-06-2015 01:04:38; mircea_popescu: nato fires 99mm [22:21]
asciilifeform (perhaps mircea_popescu was thinking of famous nazi '88' ?) [22:21]
decimation I assume he meant .50x99mm [22:21]
asciilifeform ah [22:21]
asciilifeform ru version has same, iirc, bullet, but 108mm shell [22:22]
asciilifeform (why? ask'em not me) [22:22]
decimation asciilifeform: apparently the marine snipers use .308 with only 1000 yards range http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/why-the-marines-have-failed-to-adopt-a-new-sniper-rifle-in-the-past-14-years/2015/06/13/cb924d96-0eaf-11e5-a0dc-2b6f404ff5cf_story.html [22:24]
assbot Why the Marines have failed to adopt a new sniper rifle in the past 14 years - The Washington Post ... ( http://bit.ly/1IpmuO7 ) [22:24]
decimation taliban/isil with .50 cal dshk can outrange them [22:24]
asciilifeform in nato armies, 'sniper' is often used interchangeably with 'designated marksman' which are rather different jobs [22:25]
decimation yeah it isn't clear if this article is about actual snipers or designated marksmen [22:26]
asciilifeform at any rate, u.s. police love these things. for shooting through cars, boats, walls [22:27]
decimation yeah, in this case it obviously came in handy [22:29]
decimation but this will be the one corner case that will justify $mil in usg 'requirements' [22:30]
asciilifeform iirc most of them were handed out to police by pentagon, for 'free' (gulfwar2 surplus) [22:30]
decimation yeah probably [22:30]
asciilifeform for enthusiasts - 5-8k usd. [22:31]
asciilifeform who wants - go, buy. [22:31]
decimation if you fill out reams of usg paperwork and file for license you can also have .50 machine gun [22:31]
asciilifeform (usa. no idea what equiv. is elsewhere.) [22:31]
decimation but be ready to spend $$$ for ammo [22:31]
asciilifeform at ~5 usd / round, one has to really like the music. [22:31]
decimation heh yeah [22:31]
asciilifeform http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=20-06-2015#1169336 << which is why http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=20-06-2015#1169312 [22:37]
assbot Logged on 20-06-2015 00:50:54; mircea_popescu: anyway : the do doesn't exist when it appears in the code, but when the returning while is looking for it. much like the tits on the girl don't belong to the girl. [22:37]
assbot Logged on 20-06-2015 00:42:54; asciilifeform: of course, folks who regularly deal with the output of c compiler cannot be surprised by duff's device [22:37]
asciilifeform 'duff's device' represents 'leaking abstraction' concept. [22:37]
asciilifeform (it rubs the reader's face in the fact that all c control structures translate into jumps, which are quite the same as the much-maligned 'goto') [22:38]
asciilifeform compiler won't let you cross stack frames, though [22:39]
asciilifeform (for this, you need setjmp()...) [22:39]
asciilifeform phun phakt: 'scheme' programming language has its 'call-with-current-continuation', perhaps the oddest and 'most generic' control structure known, which takes the current place in execution and turns it into an assignable (yes) closure (i.e. callable function!) -- typically it is implemented using setjmp(). [22:41]
asciilifeform http://www.madore.org/~david/computers/callcc.html << see also. [22:41]
assbot A page about call/cc ... ( http://bit.ly/1IpnEZK ) [22:41]
asciilifeform call/cc reliably melts n00bs' brains when first encountered. [22:42]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 29521 @ 0.00041292 = 12.1898 BTC [-] [22:43]
* menahem (~menahem@unaffiliated/menahem) has joined #bitcoin-assets [22:50]
mircea_popescu decimation aha right you were. [22:50]
decimation asciilifeform: might as well set program counter directly [22:56]
* joshbuddy has quit (Quit: joshbuddy) [22:57]
* Lycerion_ (~Lycerion@unaffiliated/lycerion) has joined #bitcoin-assets [22:59]
* Lycerion has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) [23:03]
* menahem has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) [23:05]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 44598 @ 0.00041157 = 18.3552 BTC [-] {3} [23:06]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6400 @ 0.00040329 = 2.5811 BTC [-] [23:12]
* Pierre_Rochard (~Pierre@unaffiliated/pierre-rochard/x-3593157) has joined #bitcoin-assets [23:17]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17600 @ 0.00040024 = 7.0442 BTC [-] [23:22]
* hanbot (~hanbot@unaffiliated/hanbot) has joined #bitcoin-assets [23:24]
* assbot gives voice to hanbot [23:25]
decimation http://www.irishexaminer.com/world/airplane-stowaway-plunges-to-his-death-338044.html [23:25]
assbot Airplane stowaway plunges to his death | Irish Examiner ... ( http://bit.ly/1GxuUVw ) [23:25]
* CheckDavid has quit (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity) [23:26]
* Pierre_Rochard has quit (Quit: Pierre_Rochard) [23:26]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 30200 @ 0.00040013 = 12.0839 BTC [-] {2} [23:41]
* indiancandy1 (~indiancan@cpc15-finc13-2-0-cust106.4-2.cable.virginm.net) has joined #bitcoin-assets [23:45]
decimation !up indiancandy1 [23:46]
* assbot gives voice to indiancandy1 [23:46]
indiancandy1 hey bitches [23:50]
mircea_popescu haha. [23:51]
mircea_popescu you on xotika yet ? [23:51]
indiancandy1 were [23:51]
mircea_popescu https://xotika.tv/ [23:51]
assbot XOtika.TV: Bitcoin adult live streaming community. ... ( http://bit.ly/1J9j8V5 ) [23:51]
indiancandy1 mp did u run a porn business [23:51]
mircea_popescu sort-of. [23:51]
indiancandy1 few years ago [23:52]
indiancandy1 ? [23:52]
mircea_popescu yeah. [23:52]
mircea_popescu https://bitbet.us/bet/1155/freeseas-inc-nasdaq-free-will-trade-at-least-0-10/#c4849 < lmao [23:52]
assbot BitBet - FreeSeas INC, NASDAQ:FREE, will trade at least 0.10 USD per share before 1st July 2015. :: 3.24 B (44%) on Yes, 4.19 B (56%) on No | closed 1 day 21 hours ago ... ( http://bit.ly/1J9jf2R ) [23:52]
indiancandy1 what [23:53]
indiancandy1 what did u do [23:53]
indiancandy1 sell porn on a irc [23:53]
indiancandy1 is xotika ur thing [23:54]
indiancandy1 hello [23:55]
decimation wtf why are people betting on random greek shipping companies? [23:55]
mircea_popescu decimation i have nfi. [23:55]
mircea_popescu indiancandy1 nah it's naphex' [23:55]
indiancandy1 im greek [23:56]
indiancandy1 :P [23:56]
indiancandy1 well half [23:56]
decimation lol FREE has -336% net profit 2014 [23:56]
indiancandy1 is he onine [23:56]
indiancandy1 naphex message me [23:56]
indiancandy1 mircea [23:58]
indiancandy1 tell me about ur porn production [23:59]
mircea_popescu indiancandy1 not much to tell, back before you were born porn used ot make money. [23:59]
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  1. 1
    Let's talk about power. on Trilema - A blog by Mircea Popescu. (via Pingback)
    Tuesday, 31 March 2020

    [...] now. There's just "different" spigots off the same cage trough. [↩]Hey, anyone still remember Obama ? [↩]Truth. At the time Romania had the draft (for plebs, that is) ; and the proceedings did [...]

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