Forum logs for 12 Feb 2012

Saturday, 23 November, Year 11 d.Tr. | Author: Mircea Popescu

*	Now talking on #bitcoin-otc	[05:54]
*	Topic for #bitcoin-otc is: OTC marketplace for Bitcoin trading and exchange. \|\| http://bitcoin-otc.com/ \|\| Bot's control sequence is ';;'. \|\| Start with the ;;guide \|\| Before you trade, talk to people, and check user ratings. \|\| Beware the FRAUDSTERS. ;;fraud \|\| Trade Options: http://polimedia.us/btc \|\| Bitcoin VPS: http://www.bitvps.com \|\| Support bitcoin-otc! 1F1dPZxdxVVigpGdsafnZ3cFBdMGDADFDe	[05:54]
*	Topic for #bitcoin-otc set by nanotube at Mon Dec 19 23:38:55 2011	[05:54]
mircea_popescu	ahh, isn't it a lovely time to buy some options... :D	[05:54]
reeses	no but it does have 1tb of raid 10 ssd and 40tb of raid 1 das :)	[05:54]
rawrmage	la ti mo ti mo	[05:55]
imsaguy	I use the raid with battery backup in my IBMS, pretty awesomesauch	[05:55]
rg	http://www.ebay.com/itm/RACKABLE-1U-C1001-TY3-XEON-QUAD-CORE-L5520-2-x-2-26GHZ-48GB-2-x-73GB-10K-SAS-/130639765723?pt=COMP_EN_Servers&hash=item1e6abca0db	[05:55]
rg	that'd do	[05:55]
rg	just need to upgrade the disks	[05:55]
rg	and check on the cooling	[05:55]
MBS	reeses what speed do you get with raid 10 ssd	[05:55]
*	smickles\|idle is now known as smickles	[05:55]
reeses	not fast enough	[05:55]
MBS	although fuck hard drive prices, need some more media storage but not going to buy until prices are back under $30/tb	[05:55]
MBS	reeses, an estimate at least?	[05:56]
imsaguy	heh, seems like just yesterday when storage being $1/mb was a good deal	[05:56]
reeses	it’s my desktop, i haven't bothered	[05:56]
reeses	http://www.solarsystems.com/products/sun/servers/coolthreads/enterprise_t5140/	[05:56]
reeses	buy that instead	[05:56]
reeses	you’ll be happy	[05:57]
MBS	if intel can get TRIM working on RAID 0 like they promised, would love to get another 120gb force gt or 2	[05:57]
reeses	wonder if they have fusion io drivers yet for mac	[05:57]
MBS	although i am wonder if i should even bother for raid	[05:58]
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reeses	raid 0 makes me nervous	[05:58]
MBS	main game i want to build rig for (ARMA 3, which got fucking delayed to Q4 : ( ) i am planning to have a 24GB ramdisk for anyway, lol	[05:58]
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reeses	i only do 10 because i have four bays and i found 2x2.5 adapters that raid 0 the drives	[05:59]
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Graet	ssd makes me nervous, so i only keep os files there anything important is on mirroed drives :)	[05:59]
reeses	so i do raid 1 across two of those	[05:59]
MBS	wait the adapters that have built in raid? arent those limited to sata 2	[05:59]
MBS	my hotswap bay has a raid version, but i just have the normal one	[05:59]
MBS	was planning on going sandy brdige e for my gaming rig, but if i hear any thing about ivy bridge e by summer will probably just wait even longer to build rig :(	[06:00]
reeses	I've had more ssd failures than magnetic	[06:00]
reeses	especially ocz crap	[06:00]
MBS	for new desktop guess i will sorta consolidate drives, right now have a 640GB and a 1TB, 640 has user files and manually installed games and 1TB has steam games	[06:01]
reeses	i just crammed 3tb drives in a pc tower and used port multipliers	[06:02]
Someguy123	Graet SSD's are LESS secure than HDD's	[06:02]
MBS	not sure what i will go with, dont imagine would get a huge performance upgrade with raid 5, but at the same time wouldnt feel like spending a shit ton of money and case room on 4x2-3TB	[06:02]
Someguy123	their failure rate is stupidly high at the moment	[06:02]
phantomcircuit	Someguy123, depends entirely on the ssd model	[06:02]
MBS	thats what backups and warrenties are for	[06:02]
reeses	i back up like a madman	[06:02]
phantomcircuit	the ocz drives are ridiculous reliable	[06:02]
MBS	i actually dont back up anything at all right now, lol	[06:02]
MBS	well except my media server to crashplan	[06:03]
Someguy123	phantomcircuit bull, someone said they had to send back the same OCZ SSD to OCZ 7 times in a row	[06:03]
reeses	phantomcircuit: err, not in my experience	[06:03]
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reeses	they’re the worst	[06:03]
Someguy123	and it was DOA 3 times after the RMA's	[06:03]
reeses	bricked more than any other	[06:03]
Someguy123	where they apparantly fixed it, but it was broken before he even plugged it in	[06:03]
phantomcircuit	the consumer drives are rebranded	[06:03]
phantomcircuit	they've been selling the pcie ones for ages	[06:03]
reeses	ocz doesn't make anything	[06:04]
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reeses	they whitelabel it all	[06:04]
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MBS	if i would have been able to get more drives i would back up my desktop to my home server which would be backed up to crashplan, but right now i would rather have more downloaded stuff, lol	[06:05]
MBS	if i have to im even considering deleting all my steam games for server overflow	[06:05]
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rg	http://www.ebay.com/itm/HP-Proliant-DL585-G2-4x-AMD-2-6ghz-DC-128gb-2x-PSU-/290640473231?pt=COMP_EN_Servers&hash=item43ab85ac8f	[06:08]
rg	mmm	[06:08]
rg	come to rg	[06:08]
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MBS	rg, bleh that cpu	[06:10]
MBS	well cpus	[06:10]
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reeses	i love dl585s too	[06:11]
MBS	though might be able to strip ram out and resell it XD	[06:11]
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reeses	do you need less rack space or fewer servers?	[06:11]
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MBS	buying mtgoxusd/btc for amazon payments/serve/clover/venmo (varying limits on each). can buy things for you from newegg/amazon/etc for mtgoxusd/btc, and can resell you http://www.kimsufi.ie servers ($25/$65/$80 respectively converted to BTC)	[06:12]
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MILF2	rg, that'd be damned nice really	[06:13]
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MILF2	for some virtualization	[06:13]
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MILF2	run a stripped down copy of linux or so	[06:13]
MILF2	and a bunch of vm's running in ram	[06:13]
MILF2	that thing would just fly	[06:13]
MILF2	:D	[06:13]
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trigliu	kool	[06:16]
Graet	Someguy123 ? that would be why ssd makes me nervous, so i only keep os files there anything important is on mirrored platter drives :)	[06:17]
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MBS	MILF2, but what if someone needs to do something cpu intensive	[06:19]
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rg	hmm	[06:20]
rg	i found a sweet server	[06:20]
rg	but its got no rails	[06:21]
copumpkin	I only write cobol on cogs	[06:21]
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copumpkin	http://www.coboloncogs.org/	[06:21]
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rg	$90 for rails	[06:22]
rg	what a fucking scam	[06:22]
rg	i hate ebay	[06:22]
rg	they sell the servers for cheap then charge $200 for the rails	[06:22]
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rg	cause they know youll need them	[06:22]
MBS	you cant find the rails anywhere else?	[06:22]
rg	probably not	[06:23]
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rg	oo actually	[06:23]
rg	i found them much cheaper	[06:23]
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MBS	rg, not really server grade but you could always build a SB-E 3930K box	[06:23]
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rg	MBS, it has to go into a regular rack	[06:24]
azkabal	Would someone a bit experienced with #bitcoin-otc mind if I pm to ask a few questions? it's in regards to the order process of when I, the buyer, want to trade moneypak for bitcoins ...	[06:24]
smickles	ok, auto-reconnect doesn't work :(	[06:24]
rg	otherwise the DC would tell me to fuckoff	[06:24]
MBS	rg thats what empty cases are for	[06:24]
rg	azkabal: just read teh guide	[06:24]
rg	;;tell azkabal [guide]	[06:24]
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azkabal	Thanks rg - I already read it through a few times, and have setup everything required I believe - but there are still some aspects in which I am uncertain about.	[06:25]
smickles	ident azkabal	[06:25]
smickles	;;ident azkabal	[06:25]
MBS	http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE&N=100008044%20600029570&IsNodeId=1&name=Rackmount	[06:26]
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rg	like what	[06:26]
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*	gribble gives voice to Someguy123	[06:27]
MBS	http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131804	[06:28]
smickles	;;voiceme	[06:28]
*	gribble gives voice to smickles	[06:28]
MBS	then this but out of stock right now http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819116492	[06:28]
MBS	and then something like this http://eshop.macsales.com/item/Other+World+Computing/1333D3X8M64K/	[06:28]
azkabal	Well, I purchased a moneypak I would like to trade here for bitcoins - for starters I would like to know how I find out what a decent / fair trade would be... for example a $100 moneypak	[06:29]
MBS	or if that isnt enough there is always this http://eshop.macsales.com/item/Other%20World%20Computing/1333D3X9M128/	[06:30]
smickles	;;ticker	[06:30]
gribble	Best bid: 5.70001, Best ask: 5.70619, Bid-ask spread: 0.00618, Last trade: 5.70001, 24 hour volume: 93917, 24 hour low: 5.5001, 24 hour high: 6	[06:30]
MBS	lol rg, i am assumine a blatent price mistake like this wouldnt ship unfortunately, http://www.memorynmore.com/128gb-8x16gb-ddr3-1333mhz-ecc-pc10600-dimm/	[06:30]
smickles	azkabal: ^ fair rate	[06:30]
azkabal	Secondly, how do I verify a user is who he says he is according to the OTC web of trust	[06:30]
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smickles	;;ident azkabal	[06:31]
gribble	Nick 'azkabal', with hostmask 'azkabal!~azkabal@gateway/tor-sasl/amivit', is not identified.	[06:31]
smickles	^	[06:31]
smickles	and to contrast	[06:31]
smickles	;;ident smickles	[06:31]
gribble	Nick 'smickles', with hostmask 'smickles!~michael@cpe-071-070-169-083.nc.res.rr.com', is identified as user smickles, with GPG key id EA62D7CEB2450C3F, and key fingerprint 96ACCA7C3B09EC61B0A6D7F9EA62D7CEB2450C3F.	[06:31]
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reeses	just colo a bunch of iPods running linux http://nanocolo.com/	[06:31]
azkabal	Thanks a lot, excuse my newbieness - that's also why I wanted to pm so i wouldn't have to clutter up your chat when everyone here thinks this is stupidly basic stuff ^^	[06:32]
neonindian	I have $60 MoneyPak if anybody is selling bitcoins. PM Me. Thanks!!!	[06:32]
smickles	azkabal: it's not a problem :D	[06:32]
trigliu	kool	[06:33]
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azkabal	So, a fair rate would be around 5.7 - but isn't the person selling the BC interested in making sometrhing off of it? Is there not a percentage that is "usual" for a seller to take? Or could I expect $100*5.7 BC for a standard trade?	[06:34]
paulzag	;;getrating [ident neonindian]	[06:34]
gribble	Error: This user has not yet been rated. Currently not authenticated.	[06:34]
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smickles	azkabal: with MP you might be able to get 5.7	[06:35]
pigeons	copumpkin: did you see amiller's https://socrates1024.s3.amazonaws.com/notes_01_12_2012.html notes?	[06:35]
reeses	azkabal: the price is what you agree to. 5.7 is mtgox pricing, where the cash has less value because it takes longer to withdraw	[06:35]
smickles	azkabal: you should make an offer, and if people want more, they'll haggle with you	[06:35]
reeses	azkabal: whereas a moneypak can be used right away	[06:36]
copumpkin	pigeons: oh, nope	[06:36]
copumpkin	oh, those are the old ones	[06:36]
MBS	sometimes people are in a rush to sell and offer to sell for 5 for moneypaks	[06:36]
copumpkin	then I think so	[06:36]
pigeons	oh ok, i just saw it and thought it was something you'd be interested in you geeks	[06:36]
reeses	so $1 MP > $1 mtgox	[06:36]
azkabal	Ok, that is interesting :) thanks.. also, what prevents, even a very highly rated / trusted user to scam someone completely unknown such as me? Wouldn't it be easy for the given persons reputation to say i MYSELF were the cheater ?	[06:36]
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trigliu	good point azkabal	[06:37]
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reeses	that’s what #bitcoin-court or whatever is for	[06:37]
trigliu	lots of established IDs are scamming newbies	[06:37]
reeses	you can also ask someone to escrow	[06:37]
trigliu	and then blaming the newb	[06:37]
pigeons	trigliu: ???	[06:37]
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smickles	azkabal: if that happens, rate them as a -10	[06:37]
pigeons	trigliu: name one, or maybe I misinterpreted you	[06:38]
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trigliu	look at the forums. there are complaints all the time	[06:38]
smickles	azkabal: people will then ask you why you rated someone a -10 and you can explain	[06:38]
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amiller	copumpkin, pigeons, i have two slightly different attempts on my github https://github.com/amiller/CoinCoq/	[06:38]
reeses	other than the shill ratings from new accounts, i don’t know of an established trader scamming anyone	[06:38]
pigeons	trigliu: I think we are talking about #bitcoin-otc	[06:38]
trigliu	you have too much blind faith in a rating system if you think it prevents cams	[06:38]
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smickles	azkabal: also, it's pretty easy to prove that you were not sent btc	[06:38]
amiller	one is in haskell and it uses a monad transformer rather than just a monad, the other is an 'unfolded' version in Coq without monads but it has a lot more of the scripting language, and some proofs	[06:39]
amiller	i'm mostly hoping that Ken` finishes the paper he's working on and then comes and kicks ass at bitcoin in Coq.	[06:39]
pigeons	trigliu: No one said it prevents scams, but you said < trigliu> lots of established IDs are scamming newbies	[06:39]
reeses	oh no another one	[06:39]
pigeons	trigliu: which I know of no cases of	[06:39]
reeses	FUD	[06:39]
trigliu	look at the forums. there are complaints all the time	[06:39]
smickles	trigliu: about -otc?	[06:40]
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pigeons	trigliu: about #bitcoin-otc? Give us a link to one please	[06:40]
trigliu	yes otc users are involved	[06:40]
reeses	you’re confounding things trigliu	[06:40]
trigliu	not at all	[06:40]
smickles	trigliu: can we have some evidence?	[06:40]
reeses	rated otc users with legit ratings?	[06:40]
Cory	Scottlad and foodst4mp received legitimate ratings before scamming.	[06:40]
MBS	someone sell me bitcoins/mtgoxusd for amazon payments	[06:41]
pigeons	legit ratings over a longer period of time than say, a few days	[06:41]
MBS	i promise im not a scammer	[06:41]
MBS	you can trust me ;)	[06:41]
reeses	oh fucking scottlad	[06:41]
*	copumpkin scams MBS	[06:41]
trigliu	no true scotsman territory. they werent real otc users cory :)	[06:41]
MBS	;;getrating MBS	[06:41]
gribble	User MBS, created on Tue Apr 19 17:18:54 2011. Cumulative rating 48, from 27 total ratings. Received ratings: 27 positive, 0 negative. Sent ratings: 25 positive, 0 negative. Details: http://bitcoin-otc.com/viewratingdetail.php?nick=MBS Currently authenticated from hostmask MBS!~MBS@unaffiliated/mbs	[06:41]
reeses	his were puppet ratings though	[06:41]
rg	;;getrating rg	[06:41]
gribble	User rg, created on Sun Jun 5 10:39:49 2011. Cumulative rating 109, from 56 total ratings. Received ratings: 56 positive, 0 negative. Sent ratings: 52 positive, 2 negative. Details: http://bitcoin-otc.com/viewratingdetail.php?nick=rg Currently authenticated from hostmask rg!~james@admin.bitvps.com	[06:41]
Cory	trigliu: Heh. But what are the current scandals you're talking about?	[06:41]
rg	<< superior	[06:41]
rg	supp	[06:41]
*	btc_dev (~btc_dev@c-67-169-209-6.hsd1.or.comcast.net) has joined #bitcoin-otc	[06:41]
azkabal	But for a reputable trader, isn't the -10 something easily neglectable and still very much worth the $100 ... that's my concern... also what prevents anyone from just randomly throwing -10's on a reputable seller? Since my account is completely fresh, one could assume that I simply created it to give a low rating which the "scammer" could then appeal for and say I created the account simply...	[06:42]
smickles	trigliu: there is a diff b/t no true scottsman an established long term users	[06:42]
azkabal	...to give a neg rating :p	[06:42]
reeses	azkabal: word gets around fast	[06:42]
*	copumpkin sighs	[06:42]
MBS	ill buy your moneypak for amazon payments :p	[06:42]
trigliu	azkabal: its a valid concern. the people with a lot of blind faith in the otc ratings wont believe you	[06:42]
pigeons	azkabal: even if you are new at at first glance people think you must be making a false accusation, people will still want proof, and no, no way is that worth $100	[06:43]
reeses	azkabal: and you have bitcointalk for a more permanent/visible claim of shens	[06:43]
*	Raccoon- (bismuth@unaffiliated/raccoon) has joined #bitcoin-otc	[06:43]
*	ChanServ gives voice to Raccoon-	[06:43]
trigliu	i would start very small then only trade with people whose rating is comparable to yours or lower	[06:43]
*	whisk3y_ (~ergonaugh@cpe-184-58-30-27.woh.res.rr.com) has joined #bitcoin-otc	[06:43]
copumpkin	trigliu: can you give us a link or two?	[06:43]
*	Raccoon- is now known as Raccoon	[06:43]
reeses	i would start very small then only trade with people whose rating is comparable to yours or lower	[06:43]
reeses	wtf	[06:43]
smickles	;;getrating scottlad	[06:43]
gribble	User scottlad, created on Fri May 6 09:10:02 2011. Cumulative rating -66, from 16 total ratings. Received ratings: 5 positive, 11 negative. Sent ratings: 4 positive, 0 negative. Details: http://bitcoin-otc.com/viewratingdetail.php?nick=scottlad Currently not authenticated.	[06:43]
pigeons	one link will do for starters, and Shakaru doesn't exactly count as a scammer or "scamming newbs"	[06:43]
smickles	;;getrating foodst4mp	[06:43]
gribble	User FooDSt4mP, created on Fri Jun 3 04:16:33 2011. Cumulative rating -1, from 90 total ratings. Received ratings: 67 positive, 23 negative. Sent ratings: 68 positive, 9 negative. Details: http://bitcoin-otc.com/viewratingdetail.php?nick=FooDSt4mP Currently not authenticated.	[06:43]
trigliu	copumpkin: if you believe in otc, youll just believe the person with a high rating. its a circular argument	[06:44]
azkabal	That's annoying since my whole goal with bitcoin is not to be very involved but there is a certain thing I wish to purchase so i will most likely only be doing this one time moneypak > bitcoin trade :p	[06:44]
copumpkin	trigliu: I just meant about the numerous complaints you mention on the forum	[06:44]
pigeons	trigliu: we just want one of these specific complaints you mention	[06:44]
pigeons	because honestly we haven't seen what you're claiming	[06:44]
copumpkin	"find them yourself"	[06:44]
reeses	you’re making claims without evidence	[06:44]
pigeons	just one link will do	[06:44]
smickles	foodst4mp is an example of azkabal fears and trigliu point	[06:44]
pigeons	we named the people we could think of	[06:44]
trigliu	someone just gave you 2 examples. and now you want "just one"	[06:45]
*	EvilJStoker (jstoker@unaffiliated/jstoker) has joined #bitcoin-otc	[06:45]
reeses	or we’ll talk about dependent types	[06:45]
trigliu	you obviously have a high degree of blind faith in otc	[06:45]
pigeons	you said all the time, those are nearly a year old now	[06:45]
copumpkin	okay	[06:45]
amiller	dependent types == bring out the comfy chair!	[06:45]
*	copumpkin senses a pattern here	[06:45]
reeses	“blind faith”	[06:45]
pigeons	i have no faith in otc, i just want to see what you are talking about	[06:45]
reeses	amiller: :)	[06:45]
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MBS	i can buy anything online for bitcoins	[06:46]
MBS	gift cards, stuff via amazon prime, stuff from newegg, w/e	[06:46]
reeses	trigliu: what is your real agenda here? to scam him yourself?	[06:46]
MBS	pretty much just over mtgox spot	[06:46]
trigliu	after you got a couple examples, the predictable defense of otc went into "no true scotsman" territory.	[06:46]
MBS	or for some things equal to it	[06:46]
trigliu	its no use arguing with blind faith	[06:46]
reeses	(i loves me the ad hominem)	[06:46]
smickles	azkabal: there is little risk in buying from an established trusted user of -otc	[06:46]
Cory	trigliu: Do you know of the gettrust command? http://wiki.bitcoin-otc.com/index.php?title=OTC_Rating_System&oldid=354#Notes_about_gettrust	[06:47]
*	Shaded has quit (Quit: Shaded)	[06:47]
reeses	it’s no use arguing with a troll	[06:47]
azkabal	Hmm ok smickles, well... if you guys were like me, what would you do to ensure the least risk possible to convert the $100 moneypak into BC...Use an escrow?	[06:47]
pigeons	< trigliu> lots of established IDs are scamming newbies	[06:47]
trigliu	someone who doesn't share your blind faith is a troll	[06:47]
pigeons	one link	[06:47]
copumpkin	trigliu is the usual beacon of sanity in the hysteria of -otc	[06:47]
copumpkin	THREE CHEERS FOR TRIGLIU	[06:47]
trigliu	pigeons: 2 > 1	[06:47]
smickles	azkabal: i was like you once, the first trade was scary, but it went well	[06:47]
trigliu	he's still asking for "just one example!!"	[06:47]
reeses	fuck stop talking to him	[06:47]
copumpkin	trigliu: you said there were complaints of it all over the forum, and we haven't seen any	[06:48]
MBS	its only $100	[06:48]
azkabal	smickles: in comparison to other trades that users do - would my $100 be a larger amount?	[06:48]
trigliu	copumpkin: you just saw 2. and that's "not any". lmao	[06:48]
trigliu	see how blind faith makes you completely irrational?	[06:48]
copumpkin	trigliu: my point was the "on the forum" bit	[06:48]
reeses	it’s Saturday night and he’s trolling for fun, just put him on ignore so i don’t have to see half the discussion	[06:48]
trigliu	they were discussed "on the forum". ad nauseum	[06:48]
copumpkin	oh okay	[06:49]
*	copumpkin slaps Cory	[06:49]
copumpkin	Cory: you fucker	[06:49]
reeses	all he has to do is up-arrowing his “you have blind trust” straw man	[06:49]
smickles	azkabal: no, yours is not large	[06:49]
azkabal	For example, Keefe is at the top of the ratings, would the -10 be worth the $100 for him ?	[06:49]
trigliu	i was in otc when they were scamming	[06:49]
MBS	someone sell me $100 worth of bitcoins for amazon payments so i can sell them to this moneypak guy	[06:49]
smickles	azkabal: no	[06:49]
pigeons	azkabal: no	[06:49]
trigliu	its not new information to me at least	[06:49]
reeses	azkabal: keefe would have wayyyyy too mech to lose	[06:49]
smickles	azkabal: 100 is not worth it for even me	[06:49]
pigeons	one -10 would make everyone else look into what is going on	[06:49]
reeses	much	[06:50]
Cory	copumpkin: GammaG too!	[06:50]
MBS	azkabal, would you trust buying bitcoins from nanotube?	[06:50]
*	pingdrive has quit (Quit: Leaving)	[06:50]
azkabal	Ok, I'll have to take a semi-leap of faith then and take someone extremely reputable, should I add in a escrow on top of it to be even more safe or does that just add additional complications?	[06:50]
reeses	nanotube controls gribble controls the WoT ratings!	[06:50]
pigeons	azkabal: also, hang out and get to know people, until you get comfortable with trading with someone	[06:50]
MBS	additional complications usually	[06:50]
smickles	azkabal: #bitcoin-escrow	[06:50]
MBS	especially with moneypak	[06:50]
MBS	unless of course seller would prefer some other payment than moneypak	[06:51]
smickles	azkabal: ooh, ooh, what pigeons just said	[06:51]
MBS	in which case escrow could convert it	[06:51]
pigeons	azkabal: i would look for continuous trades over many months	[06:51]
reeses	moneypak is worth more, though, in trade	[06:51]
MBS	reeses, though alot of people have gotten moneypak blocked on paypal and etc	[06:51]
reeses	you should be able to do 5.5-5.6 right now	[06:51]
*	pirateat40 already doesn't like trigliu.	[06:52]
amiller	i like to think that the trust ratings aren't what you base your trust-decision on directly, they're just a conversation starter, the beginning of an investigation	[06:52]
MBS	i do like half of my trades not even authed into my gpg thing	[06:52]
reeses	MBS: that’s because they trip the money transmitter test	[06:52]
rg	forum != bitcoin-otc	[06:52]
trigliu	i wouldnt put any stock in trust ratings. i prefer hard to spoof evidence	[06:52]
MBS	reeses, yeah i know	[06:52]
rg	haha	[06:53]
rg	trig	[06:53]
rg	youre a doofus	[06:53]
rg	i have been trading here since 5/10	[06:53]
reeses	people can tell I'm me because i’ll put gay thoughts into your head and take your btc	[06:53]
rg	i go by the trust web and the rating system	[06:53]
trigliu	anecdote != data	[06:53]
rg	you know how many times ive been ripped off?	[06:53]
trigliu	thx for that autobigraphical excursion	[06:53]
rg	guess	[06:53]
smickles	lol reeses , i just fell victim to part of that	[06:53]
rg	guess how many times people were able to 'spoof evidence'	[06:53]
reeses	hahahaha	[06:54]
trigliu	in reality ripoffs are rare in any forum. theres a risk of getting caught for a low-value scam	[06:54]
reeses	send me btc now	[06:54]
rg	so you dont want to guess?	[06:54]
smickles	;)	[06:54]
trigliu	anecdote != data	[06:54]
pigeons	there is a difference between saying "don't trust ratings" and "established users are scamming newbies"	[06:54]
reeses	its not really a guess at this point rg	[06:54]
trigliu	ive never been scammed and i rarely use otc	[06:55]
rg	well	[06:55]
rg	its 0	[06:55]
Guest17867	i can't speak for everyone, but my feeling is $100 isn't much. anyone with an established rating here is going to try to scam someone of much more than $100 if they were to at all. on the other hand, someone with a ton of good ratings like myself might figure they could get away with a few negatives if they spin it right as if it were the other guy's fault. they'd still have an overall positive rating	[06:55]
rg	for nearly a year of trading following the trust web and rratings	[06:55]
smickles	trigliu: the data seems to be one established user scammed people	[06:55]
MBS	;;seen netxshare	[06:55]
gribble	netxshare was last seen in #bitcoin-otc 14 hours, 17 minutes, and 1 second ago: it's all I do	[06:55]
rg	id say thats a pretty effective system	[06:55]
reeses	how about “trolls are often trolling the channel”	[06:55]
Guest17867	oh, hehe, myself=Keefe...	[06:55]
rg	MBS: we was talking in #bitvps earliar	[06:55]
rg	i think hes around	[06:55]
MBS	he pm'ed me but im not sure exactly how long ago	[06:55]
*	Guest17867 is now known as Keefe	[06:56]
MBS	think it was just now, but cant be absolutely sure, lol	[06:56]
copumpkin	Guest17867: omg poser	[06:56]
*	Keefe has quit (Changing host)	[06:56]
*	Keefe (~keefe@unaffiliated/keefe) has joined #bitcoin-otc	[06:56]
*	ChanServ gives voice to Keefe	[06:56]
pigeons	and when someone unrelated gets scammed, people like rg and copumpkin take it personally and everyone tries help	[06:56]
reeses	you’d spend the time building a rep for maybe $10k if you’re a kid or if that is otherwise worth a lot to you	[06:56]
azkabal	is there any way for me to utilize gpg with the seller to make it easier for me to prove we had a deal?	[06:56]
rg	indeed i do take it personally	[06:56]
rg	even if its someone i dont like	[06:56]
copumpkin	pigeons: I'm useless though, didn't you see yesterday? :)	[06:56]
trigliu	reeses: if the high-rating person suddenly needs quick cash, then its easy to cash in that rating on people's gullibility	[06:56]
reeses	but then again, it’s tough to get that rating on your $1/week allowance	[06:56]
smickles	azkabal: yes	[06:56]
amiller	azkabal, definitely, you just sign the messages describing the transaction	[06:56]
pigeons	maybe someone will, it definately can happen, but that is very different from saying it does happen	[06:56]
rg	i've had moderate success	[06:56]
smickles	azkabal: double signed contracts	[06:57]
Keefe	fixed	[06:57]
MBS	reeses, parents credit cards :p	[06:57]
amiller	azkabal, the rating system keeps track of the fingerprints, so if both parties have signed messages agreeing about the deal, and the signatures match Gribble's fingerprints for them, that would convince anyone in this channel for sure.	[06:57]
MBS	so, who wants to sell me mtgoxusd for some amazon payments :p	[06:57]
reeses	copumpkin has a simple contract signing proposal	[06:57]
smickles	'fo 'sho	[06:57]
copumpkin	reeses: no no, I don't produce anything of value	[06:57]
amiller	hm, i'd like to look at that, copumpkin wup	[06:57]
amiller	lol	[06:57]
trigliu	first you need proof that the counterparty has the asset you want. they you need to arrange it so you have gradual transfer of assets in both directions. so if youre buying 100 MPs, transfer 1 at a time	[06:57]
copumpkin	I apparently have a reputation for derailing conversations and not doing anything useful	[06:58]
reeses	copumpkin: that’s why i said proposal	[06:58]
copumpkin	oh okay	[06:58]
MBS	why would someone buy 100 moneypaks	[06:58]
reeses	who said you were useless, other than me	[06:58]
azkabal	.... lol you guys are hilarious for a trading channel :D	[06:58]
azkabal	jees	[06:58]
pigeons	azkabal: we'll be here all week, be sure to tip your waitress, tonight's special is stuffed eggplant	[06:59]
Graet	trigliu doesnt trust -otc, he stated that, now he is just making up unrealist situations to further his arguments	[06:59]
smickles	azkabal: i often think it's like the coffee shop where the old guys sit around and chat while waiting for business	[06:59]
reeses	MBS: to avoid having to drive to a 7-11 at 2am?	[06:59]
MBS	in reality everyone in this channel is all part of a big conspiracy to scam noobs	[06:59]
trigliu	whats unrealistic about anything i said?	[06:59]
*	aTK-[e] (twenty@173-160-142-130-Washington.hfc.comcastbusiness.net) has joined #bitcoin-otc	[06:59]
copumpkin	reeses: trigliu did yesterday	[06:59]
Graet	100moneypaks? lol	[06:59]
pigeons	< trigliu> lots of established IDs are scamming newbies	[06:59]
copumpkin	I get the impression he likes picking fights with people :)	[06:59]
reeses	he’s been around more than just now?	[06:59]
MBS	i need 50000 in moneypaks	[06:59]
reeses	i hadn’t noticed him	[06:59]
copumpkin	oh yeah, it was great last night	[06:59]
pigeons	me either	[07:00]
Graet	MBS nah - all of bitcoin... this is just a microcosm	[07:00]
smickles	pigeons: that quote is golden	[07:00]
Graet	lol	[07:00]
copumpkin	he's apparently been observing me for quite a while, because he made many profound statements about my behavior around here	[07:00]
copumpkin	and about me as a person, too	[07:00]
trigliu	copumpkin: stop playing the victim. it's tiresome	[07:00]
reeses	is triggglglglaga an established id?	[07:00]
copumpkin	it was enlightening, to say the least	[07:00]
reeses	;;ident trigliu	[07:00]
gribble	Nick 'trigliu', with hostmask 'trigliu!~trigliu@client-208-124-84-252.consolidated.net', is not identified.	[07:00]
copumpkin	trigliu: oh no, I'm not playing the victim at all!	[07:00]
copumpkin	trigliu: I was genuinely impressed :)	[07:00]
reeses	;;getrating trigliu	[07:00]
gribble	Error: This user has not yet been rated. Currently not authenticated.	[07:00]
reeses	ah	[07:00]
Graet	....	[07:00]
smickles	;;getrating [ident trigliu]	[07:01]
trigliu	pigeons: you got 2 examples of scammers with good ratings. but you still believe the system is perfect	[07:01]
gribble	Error: This user has not yet been rated. Currently not authenticated.	[07:01]
reeses	scammer	[07:01]
trigliu	its easily subverted, as those examples prove	[07:01]
copumpkin	strawman alert	[07:01]
pigeons	trigliu: i don't think the rating system is perfect	[07:01]
*	cyphunk has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)	[07:01]
pigeons	i just want one example not from last june	[07:01]
trigliu	lol. no true scotsman	[07:01]
copumpkin	wtf	[07:01]
smickles	trigliu: i don't think pigeons said it was perfect	[07:01]
copumpkin	that doesn't even work here	[07:01]
*	dkjlaevhutbaqcen (4a4365b9@gateway/web/freenode/ip.74.67.101.185) has joined #bitcoin-otc	[07:01]
rawrmage	lol what	[07:01]
reeses	trying to reduce the confidence in “groupthink” so he can take advantage of sympathizers	[07:01]
trigliu	"those scammers werent real OTC users, because it was from last june!!" no true scotsman to the max	[07:02]
copumpkin	"no true OTC rating was made in june!!"	[07:02]
pigeons	trigliu: if you said otc system sucks i might even agree on points, but you said established id's are scamming newbs	[07:02]
smickles	and trigliu, of the 2 examples only one was an established user.	[07:02]
copumpkin	trigliu: he didn't say that, either	[07:02]
trigliu	keep adding qualifications to the definition of otc user... its hilarious	[07:02]
reeses	copumpkin: well, to be fair, you ARE a stalker freak	[07:02]
copumpkin	trigliu: he was asking for recent examples, not saying that yours aren't valid	[07:02]
MBS	free money	[07:02]
MBS	MTGOX-USD-94JG4-RA3NE-S4MYJ-790EC	[07:02]
Cory	copumpkin: Hey, he's just found the list of logical fallacies on Wikipedia and is trying to use them. Let the man learn!	[07:02]
MBS	MTGOX-USD-KRD8Y-RPV2J-ZXWGK-73C5C	[07:02]
MBS	MTGOX-USD-YAX8C-NLWY6-WABWS-09E5E	[07:02]
NASDAQEnema	what's thzt MBS	[07:03]
MBS	MTGOX-USD-UFHWS-TMRR7-8C3S9-117D1	[07:03]
MBS	mtgox codes	[07:03]
Graet	lol Cory	[07:03]
nanotube	MBS: i think someone's got a goxcode cashing bot.	[07:03]
MBS	certainly	[07:03]
nanotube	gotta obfuscate them to make it interesting :)	[07:03]
trigliu	copumpkin: why? my point is sufficiently demonstrated with those examples. let him do his own investigation if he wants more info	[07:03]
smickles	I got one!	[07:03]
pigeons	because at first i thought you might be serious, then i thought you might believe what you say, now i believe reeses, either that or you are reeses having fun	[07:03]
MBS	MTUSD-GOX-RL6CS-UD2YK-CD9V8-14778	[07:03]
amiller	i got two of them!	[07:03]
smickles	o/	[07:03]
reeses	weird, that’s my root password and the other is my gig passphrase	[07:03]
reeses	gpg	[07:04]
copumpkin	trigliu: because your statement was that it happens all the time, and it hasn't happened in 8 months, and you have two examples that you didn't even provide yourself, so we were wondering which ones you were going to provide, had Cory not done so for you	[07:04]
*	dkjlaevhutbaqcen has quit (Client Quit)	[07:04]
smickles	trigliu: why do you say it happens often?	[07:04]
MBS	last one hasnt been cashed yet	[07:04]
pigeons	the closest thing I can think of is shakaru	[07:04]
trigliu	it does	[07:04]
reeses	pigeons: you are a wise man to suspect a false flag from me	[07:04]
MBS	gotta reverse USD and GOX though	[07:04]
smickles	trigliu: what do you consider often?	[07:04]
pigeons	well it was the insults to copumpkin that made me suspect reeses, because who else would be cruel enough to insult such a sweet guy	[07:05]
trigliu	restricting examples to "only recent cases" is a hilarious no-true-scotsman diversion by a band of zealots who really want to believe that otc is reliable	[07:05]
reeses	nanotube: they were ROT-26	[07:05]
copumpkin	trigliu: you are kind of sad	[07:05]
smickles	trigliu: what do you consider often?	[07:05]
pigeons	"all the time" implies there are recent cases	[07:05]
amiller	i think it's pretty clear there's nothing to be gained from this argument, maybe taking it to another channel would be appropriate	[07:05]
trigliu	the blind faith on display is hilarious	[07:05]
reeses	pigeons: hmm…that is a tough one	[07:05]
smickles	trigliu: what do you consider often?	[07:05]
amiller	i made a reservation in #bitcoin-fight	[07:06]
trigliu	amiller: its not even an argument. the trolls already conceeded my point. now thy want more links and examples.	[07:06]
nanotube	reeses: haha	[07:06]
smickles	trigliu: what do you consider often?	[07:06]
trigliu	smickles: do you think nuclear accidents happen often or rarely?	[07:06]
smickles	or maybe:	[07:06]
reeses	pigeons: i can’t think of anyone. even vragnaroda would be nice to him and probably never insult him	[07:06]
smickles	trigliu: rarely	[07:06]
smickles	trigliu: what's the point of that question?	[07:07]
*	elektriks has quit (Quit: Leaving)	[07:07]
amiller	you could settle this the sporting way, with shots of roulette in #bitcoin-games	[07:07]
trigliu	how many nuclear accidents do you think happen per year?	[07:07]
smickles	trigliu: that's a non-sequiter (sp?)	[07:07]
Rabbit67890	buying humble bundle android at average price....	[07:08]
Rabbit67890	buying humble bundle android at average price….	[07:08]
Rabbit67890	;;eauth Rabbit67890	[07:08]
smickles	trigliu: i'm not sure, few enough that the disaster crazy media doesn't have many to push	[07:08]
rg	can we quiet this dude	[07:09]
trigliu	there are hundreds of nuclear plant violations a year in america alone. at around 10 classified as "serious" by the NRC	[07:09]
pigeons	i like how accident switched to violation	[07:09]
smickles	trigliu: still a non-sequitor fallacy	[07:09]
MrTiggr	/ignore trigliu rg	[07:09]
*	Greed has quit (Remote host closed the connection)	[07:09]
*	Greedier has quit (Remote host closed the connection)	[07:09]
azkabal	Ok I think I'm ready ^^ ...So is anyone reputable here up for the $100 bitcoin = 17.5 trade :)	[07:09]
Rabbit67890	lol	[07:10]
trigliu	pigeons: so violations are intentional? that would be a criminal offense	[07:10]
rg	that would be rude sharing the fruits of his quietness by myself	[07:10]
rg	id rather the whole channel be able to enjoy	[07:10]
MrTiggr	lol	[07:10]
azkabal	i mean... $100 moneypak	[07:10]
Rabbit67890	...	[07:10]
smickles	;;calc 100/[ticker --last]	[07:10]
gribble	17.4520678955	[07:10]
Rabbit67890	ok, anyone have a humble bundle android for average price?	[07:11]
trigliu	rg: stop being a drama queen	[07:11]
trigliu	heh	[07:11]
nanotube	smickles: trigliu: pigeons: can we please take this off otc?	[07:11]
smickles	aw damn, called out by nanotube	[07:11]
Rabbit67890	...	[07:12]
*	smickles is a bad boy	[07:12]
rg	;;getrating trigliu	[07:12]
gribble	Error: This user has not yet been rated. Currently not authenticated.	[07:12]
Rabbit67890	take it to #spam	[07:12]
rg	hes not even trading	[07:12]
rg	just boot him	[07:12]
azkabal	;;gpg auth flazmok	[07:12]
vragnaroda	lol	[07:12]
smickles	;;ident azkabal	[07:12]
gribble	Nick 'azkabal', with hostmask 'azkabal!~azkabal@gateway/tor-sasl/amivit', is not identified.	[07:12]
smickles	ooh, too quick i suppose	[07:12]
amiller	if you aren't putting money in the slot machine, you don't get any free drinks	[07:12]
*	kakobreklaa has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)	[07:12]
MBS	Rabbit67890, i can get one for you	[07:12]
*	copumpkin has something to prove	[07:12]
*	kakobreklaa (~T42@89-212-41-49.static.t-2.net) has joined #bitcoin-otc	[07:13]
trigliu	ive got a few otc accounts. im not trading right now, no	[07:13]
Rabbit67890	ok MBS	[07:13]
smickles	amiller: tell that to the casinos in missouri, you don't get free drinks regardless	[07:13]
Rabbit67890	how many BTC	[07:13]
rg	multiple accounts?	[07:13]
amiller	copumpkin, i hope that is your official tagline	[07:13]
rg	how sketchy	[07:13]
Rabbit67890	;;get rating MBS	[07:13]
gribble	Error: The command "get" is available in the Dunno, Herald, and Topic plugins. Please specify the plugin whose command you wish to call by using its name as a command before "get".	[07:13]
MBS	;;getrating MBS	[07:13]
gribble	User MBS, created on Tue Apr 19 17:18:54 2011. Cumulative rating 48, from 27 total ratings. Received ratings: 27 positive, 0 negative. Sent ratings: 25 positive, 0 negative. Details: http://bitcoin-otc.com/viewratingdetail.php?nick=MBS Currently authenticated from hostmask MBS!~MBS@unaffiliated/mbs	[07:13]
copumpkin	amiller: I'm considering it :)	[07:13]
copumpkin	nanotube: why did gribble start speaking in here again?	[07:13]
nanotube	copumpkin: only to authed users. because sometimes it's nice. :)	[07:13]
trigliu	rg: if you have multiple entities like a business, you shouldn't be using the same otc acct.	[07:13]
copumpkin	oh, okay	[07:13]
*	Staatsfeind (~markac@unaffiliated/vragnaroda) has joined #bitcoin-otc	[07:14]
*	ChanServ gives voice to Staatsfeind	[07:14]
rg	..	[07:14]
rg	why	[07:14]
lunks	If someone wants to buy BTC using Paypal, I'm selling.	[07:14]
rg	i sell btc for myself and for my company under 'rg'	[07:14]
trigliu	do you use your personal account for your business?	[07:14]
rg	this isnt a bank account	[07:14]
NASDAQEnema	;;getrating lunks	[07:14]
rg	its a trading channel	[07:14]
smickles	lunks: how much/ what price?	[07:14]
trigliu	and?	[07:14]
*	nok0 has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)	[07:14]
rg	so then yes	[07:14]
rg	i do	[07:14]
*	Staatsfeind has quit (Client Quit)	[07:14]
lunks	20 @ 6.5 USD NASDAQEnema smickles	[07:14]
rg	and i see no reason otherwise to do different	[07:15]
amiller	6.5 yeeeesh even for paypal, which i suppose it's nice of you to accept at all	[07:15]
lunks	I can sell smaller quantities as well	[07:15]
*	Staatsfeind (~markac@unaffiliated/vragnaroda) has joined #bitcoin-otc	[07:15]
*	ChanServ gives voice to Staatsfeind	[07:15]
trigliu	a person buying from a business might want to know that business's rating. not the rating for an individual	[07:15]
NASDAQEnema	15% markup dayaaam	[07:15]
rg	why	[07:16]
rg	why does it matter	[07:16]
rg	if you trade from one account your ratings will still be there	[07:16]
rg	if anything it makes you look less reputable for having less ratings	[07:16]
trigliu	yeah why do we need rating agencies? just publish the fico score of the ceo!	[07:16]
trigliu	im sure people buy government bonds based on obama's personal fico score	[07:16]
rg	you are sketchy as fuck	[07:16]
trigliu	cool story	[07:17]
lunks	amiller: that's how much paypal charges for me, no way around that :/	[07:17]
NASDAQEnema	lunks what you mean?	[07:17]
*	pingdrive (~pingdrive@gateway/tor-sasl/pingdrive) has joined #bitcoin-otc	[07:17]
lunks	Paypal for my country charges around 8%	[07:17]
copumpkin	wow	[07:18]
nanotube	well, it's true that for a larger organization it may be sensible to separate. for a one-man show it's largely irrelevant.	[07:18]
copumpkin	amiller: my proofs about modular arithmetic are failing miserably! :(	[07:18]
reeses	amiller: can you write a github coq syntax mode plz?	[07:19]
trigliu	a business with a bid history, can erase that history by having an established ID become their front	[07:19]
trigliu	bad rather	[07:19]
copumpkin	reeses: I've tried contacting github about adding coq or agda and they said they weren't interested until a bunch of people used it	[07:19]
reeses	greasemonkey time	[07:19]
copumpkin	having big mathematicians like voevodsky or mike shulman on github writing coq doesn't seem to count	[07:20]
reeses	they should obviously work in ruby	[07:20]
copumpkin	totally	[07:20]
copumpkin	univalent foundations in ruby	[07:20]
reeses	or maybe python if they’re naughty	[07:21]
copumpkin	lol	[07:21]
lunks	i think you can add support to coq if you do a pull request	[07:21]
copumpkin	lunks: there's also the issue of disambiguating by contents	[07:22]
copumpkin	since .v is also used for verilog	[07:22]
copumpkin	which has a rather different syntax :)	[07:22]
lunks	oh	[07:22]
copumpkin	.agda at least is fairly unique :P	[07:22]
copumpkin	but they still didn't want it	[07:22]
amiller	maybe if i send them an email asking for the support it will help	[07:22]
amiller	is there a petition	[07:22]
paulzag	anybody WTB BTC for some form of usd payment?	[07:23]
copumpkin	nope	[07:23]
amiller	i'm new at this whole outreach / participation / involvement business	[07:23]
*	baby_ghost has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)	[07:24]
MBS	buying BTC/mtgox usd for amazon payments/serve/clover	[07:24]
reeses	paulzag: what are you holding?	[07:25]
MBS	;;rate netxshare 2 Have traded mtgoxusd/amazon several times	[07:25]
gribble	Rating entry successful. Your rating for user netxshare has changed from 1 to 2.	[07:25]
MBS	so who was that guy that came in here like a week ago with the university xeon cluster?	[07:26]
amiller	copumpkin i was helping this kid learning to code the other day with a 'high low number guessing game', so i tried to show off by putting in coq but burned out pretty quickly	[07:26]
trigliu	4.7% of otc users have received a negative rating.	[07:26]
trigliu	that's a pretty high risk level	[07:26]
rg	how many of them are for active users	[07:26]
reeses	coq academy	[07:26]
rg	and how many of them are jokes	[07:26]
amiller	i love the part where you specify your functions very precisely, i still tend to hit a brick wall very quickly when it's time to prove something.	[07:26]
copumpkin	amiller: aw	[07:27]
rg	inactive users with negative ratings = dont matter	[07:27]
MBS	coq sucks	[07:27]
smickles	lol	[07:27]
copumpkin	MBS: AGDA 4 EVA	[07:27]
trigliu	theyre inactive because they created new accounts after getting neg'd	[07:27]
smickles	how do you pronounce "coq"	[07:27]
MBS	actually i dont know a think about either	[07:27]
rg	trigliu: uh huh	[07:27]
MBS	was just making a joke	[07:27]
amiller	smickles, like 'cock'	[07:27]
smickles	:)	[07:27]
paulzag	oops just reread my last statement	[07:27]
rg	did you come here for a purpose	[07:27]
rg	or just to be annoying	[07:27]
MBS	let me show you this coq i was playing with last night	[07:28]
trigliu	rg: are you annoyed?	[07:28]
rg	cause all you've done is nitpick and offered 0	[07:28]
amiller	as in 'this coq is way too hard'	[07:28]
reeses	SerajewelKS had a visualizer with graphviz, it would be nice to add recency decay as well	[07:28]
rg	no, i dont care about you	[07:28]
paulzag	I will sell BTC for USD (PP, MP, others)	[07:28]
MBS	all your coq are belong to us	[07:28]
amiller	http://serajewelks.bitcoin-otc.com/trustgraph.php?source=amiller&dest=copumpkin	[07:28]
reeses	or in gribble’s get trust as well	[07:28]
amiller	+1 for the graphviz	[07:28]
MBS	paulzag, amazon payments?	[07:28]
reeses	paaul	[07:28]
trigliu	rg: cool story bro. you seem to be talking about me incessantly. then fake-gnoring me. but its all because you dont care.	[07:29]
reeses	rep paulzag how much btc?	[07:29]
rg	fake ignoring?	[07:29]
trigliu	the fact that 4.7% of otc users have received a negative rating should be taken account by anyone doing trades.	[07:29]
paulzag	got 80 now - can get more	[07:29]
trigliu	now ive done lot of trades, and have never been scammed. so do your due diligence	[07:30]
NASDAQEnema	no	[07:30]
MBS	paul if you take amazon payments at mtgox price i can take alot :p	[07:30]
reeses	price for 80 w/ppusd?	[07:30]
rg	no wait	[07:30]
copumpkin	trigliu: what are your identities when you do trade?	[07:30]
rg	lets talk about this fake ignoring	[07:30]
NASDAQEnema	4.7% is not the metric	[07:30]
paulzag	sorry MBS haven't worked out what to do with Amazon - despite your excellent efforts on the iphone yesterday	[07:30]
rg	besides, everyone makes mistakes	[07:30]
MBS	oh wait yeah	[07:30]
*	minimoose has quit (Quit: minimoose)	[07:30]
MBS	keep forgetting you are aussie	[07:30]
NASDAQEnema	it should be trades	[07:30]
paulzag	:p MBS	[07:31]
paulzag	;;getrating [ident reeses]	[07:31]
gribble	User reeses, created on Mon May 2 21:23:05 2011. Cumulative rating 39, from 12 total ratings. Received ratings: 12 positive, 0 negative. Sent ratings: 15 positive, 2 negative. Details: http://bitcoin-otc.com/viewratingdetail.php?nick=reeses Currently authenticated from hostmask reeses!~reeses@li225-59.members.linode.com	[07:31]
trigliu	well the problem with positively-rated trades is you have no way to determine if it was an "arms-length transaction" (technical term)	[07:31]
*	bitcoins_ has quit (Read error: Network is unreachable)	[07:31]
*	bitcoinstreet (~textual@116.199.214.196) has joined #bitcoin-otc	[07:31]
trigliu	so you have to discount them	[07:31]
paulzag	;;gettrust reeses paulzag	[07:31]
gribble	Trust relationship from user reeses to user paulzag: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 2 via 1 connections. Graph: http://serajewelks.bitcoin-otc.com/trustgraph.php?source=reeses&dest=paulzag	[07:31]
smickles	discount all positive ratings?	[07:32]
smickles	so only go by negative ratings?	[07:32]
*	chsados (~chsados@c-71-229-206-230.hsd1.co.comcast.net) has joined #bitcoin-otc	[07:32]
smickles	that sounds stooo000o00o0oopid	[07:32]
copumpkin	lol	[07:33]
trigliu	not necessarily all ratings. but you need to apply a discount nonetheless. like i said, i dont go by ratings. i go by verifiable due diligence	[07:33]
rg	so i guess theres no comment on this fake ignoring	[07:34]
rg	and no guess for how many times ive been ripped off	[07:34]
trigliu	rg: stop it. no one cares	[07:34]
rg	i dare say it is you who is doing the fake ignoring	[07:34]
rg	no if youre gonna come in here and talk shit	[07:34]
reeses	rg imma gonna have to ignore you soon	[07:34]
rg	youre going to back up what you say	[07:34]
rg	reeses: go ahead	[07:34]
rg	i dont care	[07:34]
rg	i dont even know you	[07:34]
Rabbit67890	;;rate MBS 1 Gave me the android humble bundle for 1.15 BTC!	[07:35]
gribble	Rating entry successful. Your rating of 1 for user MBS has been recorded.	[07:35]
MBS	;;rate Rabbit67890 Sold a humble bundle	[07:36]
gribble	Error: 'Sold' is not a valid integer.	[07:36]
MBS	;;rate Rabbit67890 1 Sold a humble bundle	[07:36]
*	bill_stickers has quit (Quit: Lost terminal)	[07:36]
gribble	Rating entry successful. Your rating of 1 for user Rabbit67890 has been recorded.	[07:36]
MBS	since when is sold not an integer	[07:36]
NASDAQEnema	ok I have a retroshare gpg key	[07:36]
MBS	is '1 2 3 sold' not correct?	[07:36]
NASDAQEnema	how do I use that?	[07:36]
rg	;;rate Rabbit67890 Sold a humble bundle	[07:37]
rg	you didnt include a rating	[07:37]
MBS	;;gettrust MBS gribble	[07:37]
gribble	Trust relationship from user MBS to user gribble: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 1 via 1 connections. Graph: http://serajewelks.bitcoin-otc.com/trustgraph.php?source=MBS&dest=gribble	[07:37]
Rabbit67890	lol	[07:37]
paulzag	MBS you need to bang a gavel in between	[07:37]
rg	though it would be nice if it defaulted to 1	[07:37]
rg	when not specified	[07:37]
Rabbit67890	;;getrating Rabbit67890	[07:37]
gribble	User rabbit67890, created on Sun Jan 1 22:09:08 2012. Cumulative rating 2, from 2 total ratings. Received ratings: 2 positive, 0 negative. Sent ratings: 4 positive, 0 negative. Details: http://bitcoin-otc.com/viewratingdetail.php?nick=rabbit67890 Currently authenticated from hostmask Rabbit67890!~Rabbit678@55-3-178-69.static.gci.net	[07:37]
rawrmage	;;gettryst mbs gribble	[07:37]
amiller	gettryst lol	[07:37]
MBS	;;rate gribble 1 Mah best friend	[07:37]
gribble	Rating entry successful. Your rating of 1 for user gribble has been recorded.	[07:37]
rg	haha gribble actually is rate	[07:37]
rg	d	[07:37]
Rabbit67890	lol	[07:37]
rawrmage	;;eauth rawrmage	[07:37]
rg	hes not got a very good rating though, considering all the work he does for us	[07:38]
amiller	;;rate gribble 5 without gribble i wouldn't know WHO to trust	[07:38]
gribble	Rating entry successful. Your rating of 5 for user gribble has been recorded.	[07:38]
Rabbit67890	;;rate gribble 10 We trust him with all OTC activities, along with nanotube.	[07:38]
*	jamescarr has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)	[07:38]
MBS	;;getrating gribble	[07:38]
gribble	Rating entry successful. Your rating of 10 for user gribble has been recorded.	[07:38]
gribble	User gribble, created on Fri Nov 12 01:57:21 2010. Cumulative rating 103, from 30 total ratings. Received ratings: 26 positive, 4 negative. Sent ratings: 0 positive, 0 negative. Details: http://bitcoin-otc.com/viewratingdetail.php?nick=gribble Currently not authenticated.	[07:38]
spawn-	hey	[07:38]
amiller	i think 10 indicates that you ARE gribble	[07:38]
rg	slow night for sales	[07:38]
MBS	lol 5 bucks gribble entry is just some random dude that set name	[07:38]
rg	this is boring	[07:38]
*	gribble gives voice to rawrmage	[07:38]
MBS	im guessing you arent allowed to change names? cuz if so would be lolzy	[07:39]
rg	all ive had to do today is migrate two customers to a different cluster	[07:39]
rawrmage	;;gettrust rawrmage gribble	[07:39]
gribble	Trust relationship from user rawrmage to user gribble: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 1 via 4 connections. Graph: http://serajewelks.bitcoin-otc.com/trustgraph.php?source=rawrmage&dest=gribble	[07:39]
rg	MBS: you can	[07:39]
rg	i changed from rapeghost to rg	[07:39]
MBS	lol	[07:39]
rawrmage	;;gettrust rawrmage rg	[07:39]
gribble	Trust relationship from user rawrmage to user rg: Level 1: 3, Level 2: 13 via 9 connections. Graph: http://serajewelks.bitcoin-otc.com/trustgraph.php?source=rawrmage&dest=rg	[07:39]
rg	level 1 trust	[07:39]
MBS	then 5 bucks gribble in trust thing is just some random dude waiting to build up ratings	[07:39]
azkabal	I think I'm going to work out a deal with smickles with my $100 moneypak for bitcoins, is there perhaps someone here well established & trusted that would mind acting as an escrow? I tried asking in the escrow channel but there are not many people there unfortunately..	[07:39]
rg	doesnt get any better than that	[07:39]
rawrmage	;;rated rg	[07:39]
gribble	You rated user rg on Fri Dec 9 14:42:55 2011, giving him a rating of 3, and supplied these additional notes: traded multiple times, very trustworthy :).	[07:39]
rg	azkabal: smickles is rated and trusted	[07:39]
rg	you dont need an escrow	[07:39]
trigliu	is there a successor to clearcoin?	[07:39]
MBS	opaquecoin	[07:40]
amiller	i'll do escrow	[07:40]
MBS	ill do escrow for the escrow	[07:40]
smickles	rg, trigliu azkabal wants to escrow the MP	[07:40]
rg	yeah and im saying theres no reason to	[07:40]
rg	you've 19 successful trades	[07:40]
rawrmage	;;rate rg 5 traded multiple times, awesome!	[07:40]
gribble	Rating entry successful. Your rating for user rg has changed from 3 to 5.	[07:40]
copumpkin	trigliu: I don't think there's anything particularly established, but the protocol does sort of support a form of escrow natively now	[07:40]
trigliu	why was clearcoin shutdown anyway.. i mean it doesn't seem like it would require all that much time to maintain	[07:40]
trigliu	copumpkin: oh rly? how so	[07:41]
smickles	multi sig?	[07:41]
*	ForceMajeure_ (~quassel@pool-173-70-45-178.nwrknj.fios.verizon.net) has joined #bitcoin-otc	[07:41]
copumpkin	you can send coins to an address that will require n of k signatures to spend	[07:41]
trigliu	hmmm	[07:42]
smickles	anyway, amiller can you escrow MP?	[07:42]
copumpkin	you do need a mutually trusted third party, still	[07:42]
*	ForceMajeure_ has quit (Remote host closed the connection)	[07:42]
copumpkin	which is annoying	[07:42]
copumpkin	but there's no real way around that, as far as I know	[07:42]
*	Shaded (~Shaded@bangor180.chapman.edu) has joined #bitcoin-otc	[07:42]
trigliu	yes someone has to determine if the parties complied with the deal	[07:42]
*	Shaded has quit (Changing host)	[07:42]
*	Shaded (~Shaded@unaffiliated/shaded) has joined #bitcoin-otc	[07:42]
copumpkin	someone needs to be disinterested	[07:42]
Rabbit67890	lol	[07:42]
Rabbit67890	we need a new bitcoin escrow....	[07:42]
Rabbit67890	we need a new bitcoin escrow….	[07:42]
MBS	$300 NRA life membership, lol http://slickdeals.net/f/3937072-300-NRA-life-member-offer	[07:42]
Rabbit67890	built in the software	[07:42]
copumpkin	but the idea is that the coins are sent to an escrow address that must be signed by 2 of 3 signatures, where the three are the two parties and the escrow agent	[07:43]
*	chazam (swatch@c-121-188.static.worldcom.bz) has joined #bitcoin-otc	[07:43]
copumpkin	if there's no contention, the two parties can send the coins to the receipient	[07:43]
trigliu	yeah pretty cool copumpkin	[07:43]
amiller	smickles, i'd be happy to i need to check how i will validate the amount of the moneypak as i have not used it before	[07:43]
smickles	amiller: what do you think of redeeming the MP and ppusding it to me?	[07:43]
copumpkin	trigliu: it's pretty new though, so I think most miners ignore stuff like that, and I think the only client that supports it is the web client on blockchain.info	[07:43]
NASDAQEnema	can you buy moneypak online with debit card	[07:43]
trigliu	ahh i c	[07:44]
rg	Rabbit67890: i started coding one	[07:44]
copumpkin	but with any luck it'll be in the next round of client releases	[07:44]
rg	exclusively for -otc people	[07:44]
rg	but i didnt think it'd get used for trust issues	[07:44]
rg	while im very trusted here, i duno	[07:44]
amiller	sure smickles i would switch MP to paypal for you sure	[07:44]
rg	just seems like it'd be better if pirate or someone did it	[07:44]
paulzag	NASDAQEnema, let me know if you find out that you can buy BTC online with a debti card -I've heard cash only so far	[07:44]
*	hippos4lyfe (~hngryhngr@pool-71-191-150-126.washdc.fios.verizon.net) has joined #bitcoin-otc	[07:44]
trigliu	rg: cool.. i would use that escrow	[07:45]
*	Rabbit67890 has quit (Quit: Rabbit67890)	[07:45]
*	vapor has quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)	[07:45]
copumpkin	I've performed escrows for DBordello a few times, and once for imsaguy ages ago	[07:45]
copumpkin	I guess it was before imsaguy's ratings exploded	[07:45]
MBS	paulzag, so any more thought on iphone?	[07:45]
rg	haha really?	[07:46]
trigliu	shouldn't amiller escrpw the bitcoins, rather than the MP	[07:46]
copumpkin	yeah, I think it was my first dealing with imsaguy	[07:46]
paulzag	sorry mate but it's not worth the hassle just to buy it in BTC	[07:46]
*	vinhpk (~khacvinhp@123.16.31.70) has joined #bitcoin-otc	[07:46]
paulzag	Some things like iPhones, BTC isn't ready for	[07:46]
rg	just dont send first	[07:46]
rg	in my experience, people with moneypaks afraid to send to trusted users have been scammers	[07:46]
spawn-	hey paulzag	[07:47]
spawn-	check your pm	[07:47]
copumpkin	paulzag: well	[07:47]
spawn-	bro amiller check your pm plz	[07:47]
copumpkin	the feature I was mentioning a minute ago for escrow	[07:47]
trigliu	ok but then the buyer loses nothing cuz the btc is scrowed	[07:47]
copumpkin	can also be used for multi-factor auth for spending	[07:47]
*	Staatsfeind has quit (Quit: leaving)	[07:47]
azkabal	Ok i think i will end up doing the trade with smickles escrowing through amiller	[07:47]
rg	http://www.ebay.com/itm/Infiniband-DDR-20Gbps-MPI-Cluster-128-cores-512GB-RAM-/300662347074?pt=COMP_EN_Servers&hash=item4600df5542	[07:47]
rg	^^ new bitvps vm cluster	[07:48]
trigliu	nice	[07:48]
rg	id rather the faster infiniband	[07:48]
MBS	rg, nah just have that been the SAN for it and connect some storageless servers to it	[07:48]
rg	well	[07:49]
rg	thats the point of the infiniband	[07:49]
rg	20gbit = 2560MB/sec	[07:49]
rg	plenty of speed	[07:49]
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trigliu	walmart will sell you a prepaid debit card via paypal	[07:50]
MBS	really?	[07:50]
vragnaroda	No.	[07:50]
trigliu	yeah. i think they started doing that a couple monthe ago	[07:50]
MBS	also for anyone redeeming moneypak	[07:51]
MBS	http://www.serve.com , free $10 for joining, and $5 bonus for redeeming moneypaks	[07:51]
rg	who the hell is brocktice?	[07:51]
trigliu	http://www.walmart.com/ip/Visa-100-Gift-Card/16513386	[07:52]
trigliu	pretty good business. selling $100 for $105	[07:52]
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rg	thats the standard rate	[07:53]
rg	ive paid $5 for nearly all my prepaid cards	[07:53]
copumpkin	rg: lol, this comes up a lot	[07:53]
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rg	well for most visa, etc	[07:53]
rg	its $5	[07:53]
rg	its usually more cause the store charges more	[07:54]
rg	walmart probably bought so many they got them for $101	[07:54]
trigliu	prepaid cards make a ton off fees, but probably much more in breakage	[07:54]
trigliu	where the person who has $7 left on his card just loses it or doesn't end up using it	[07:55]
rg	http://www.ebay.com/itm/Sun-x4100-M2-Dual-AMD-Quad-Core-Opteron-2356-2-3Ghz-32GB-RAM-2x-73GB-Sever-RAILS-/130646397919?pt=COMP_EN_Servers&hash=item1e6b21d3df	[07:56]
rg	thats nice too but it'd require a drive upgrade	[07:56]
rg	disks are too damn expensive right now	[07:56]
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rawrmage	lol	[07:57]
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MBS	will sell those $100 visa gift cards for 19.5 BTC :p	[07:58]
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MBS	5.3 BTC for $25 version http://www.walmart.com/ip/Visa-25-Gift-Card/16513374	[07:59]
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trigliu	good deal	[08:00]
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rg	does hot-swap ram exist?	[08:10]
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BTCTrader	no	[08:12]
gmaxwell	Yes.	[08:12]
rg	hrm	[08:12]
rg	i wish i could remmeber the nick of that dude here	[08:12]
rg	who was saying he bought the 1u hardware from the datacenter	[08:12]
rg	i cant remember his nick	[08:12]
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gmaxwell	(http://lhms.sourceforge.net/)	[08:12]
Myhatstoosmall	Hello :D	[08:12]
rg	does anyone keep logs of the channel?	[08:12]
BTCTrader	why do you want 1u's?	[08:13]
rg	from the past week?	[08:13]
rg	BTCTrader: cheaper to colo	[08:13]
Cory	Hi Myhatstoosmall. :)	[08:13]
BTCTrader	well yeah but for what?	[08:13]
Myhatstoosmall	Whats goin on	[08:13]
whutruduin	have btc for sale for moneypak if anyone is looking	[08:13]
rg	BTCTrader: i run a VPS companty	[08:13]
rg	looking to can the three servers i rent now	[08:13]
rg	for one massive	[08:13]
BTCTrader	too bad i am not in that business anymore :)	[08:14]
Myhatstoosmall	Ill sell a few btc for PP or MP :D	[08:14]
rg	it is too bad	[08:14]
rg	the thing is , at our other provider we got 4x450GB SAS 15k disks	[08:14]
rg	with a battery backed RAID cache	[08:14]
rg	and its basically fixed all our bottleneck issues	[08:15]
lunks	;;rate Bigpiggy01Mining 3 Did some pho work for him, very trustable and friendly. Highly recommended.	[08:15]
rg	so instead of paying $500 for the three servers, i wanna buy a server for $1-$2k	[08:15]
gribble	Rating entry successful. Your rating of 3 for user Bigpiggy01Mining has been recorded.	[08:15]
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paulzag	spawn-, answer your PM	[08:15]
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spawn-	yups	[08:16]
spawn-	already	[08:16]
azkabal	So, I am doing my first trade (very nervous lol) of $100 moneypak to 16.9 bitcoins with smickles, and amiller as escrow... Does this double contract look OK? http://pastebin.com/raw.php?i=C2XU0Ygv Should I be good to go?	[08:17]
phantomcircuit	rg, oh god battery backed raid	[08:17]
BTCTrader	better off using escrow azkabal	[08:17]
paulzag	anybody used to watch Recess?	[08:18]
Cory	Looks good azkabal. Make sure both of you sign it. :)	[08:18]
nanotube	azkabal: seems reasonable. now get it signed for that extra zing. :)	[08:18]
amiller	yup, public review, and i'll sign it last	[08:18]
paulzag	nice azkabal - that's a belt & braces approach	[08:18]
MILF2	azkabal, yea, and it seems like amiller is appearently a good escrow from his rating	[08:18]
MILF2	:P	[08:18]
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azkabal	Yay glad to get receive approval from everyone haha	[08:19]
BTCTrader	foods4mp is my escrow	[08:19]
MILF2	dammit, i wanna get in on the escrow action though my feedback may be a little too low :P	[08:19]
trigliu	indeed	[08:19]
rg	BTCTrader: do you have any hardware contacts still	[08:19]
trigliu	well an escrow site would be nice	[08:19]
amiller	clearcoin used to work great	[08:19]
rg	i also take it you found my bitjack21 offer insuffucient?	[08:19]
amiller	pioneered the 0.5% fee	[08:19]
MILF2	i'd do escrow for like 0.2%	[08:20]
trigliu	yeah amiller.. does the protoocl support the "dead-mans" escrow that satoshi/clearcoin had	[08:20]
rg	since i recieved no reply	[08:20]
trigliu	where the cash goes to charity or is burned	[08:20]
BTCTrader	i'm buying some from ironsystems.com now	[08:20]
reeses	rg: disk controller cache flapping is the root of much evil.	[08:21]
BTCTrader	just depends what you're local too really to save on shipping really	[08:21]
amiller	you're right, that's osmething missing	[08:21]
amiller	while we're collab-developing this protocol	[08:21]
amiller	what happens if i receive the $100 moneypak, but smickles disappears	[08:21]
reeses	ahh, clearcoin	[08:21]
MILF2	isn't the owner of clearcoin still around?	[08:21]
MILF2	i know the site's dead	[08:21]
trigliu	yeah.. gavin	[08:21]
rg	reeses: why	[08:21]
amiller	in clearcoin, you would typically set a time limit where after 1 month or 6 months you get your btc back	[08:21]
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paulzag	SH!T SH!T SH!T gotta backup my gpg key stuff, etc. I don't think ;;guide helps with that. Anybody got a howto for ubuntu?	[08:21]
trigliu	i believe satoshi was the first to decribe it	[08:22]
MILF2	someone should just ask him for source of clearcoin	[08:22]
trigliu	https://bitcointalk.org/?topic=750	[08:22]
MILF2	and/or how it works	[08:22]
BTCTrader	paulzag, why the fib at the door?	[08:22]
BTCTrader	fbi	[08:22]
smickles	amiller: i don't intend to disappear ;)	[08:22]
azkabal	So I just got smickles to sign it, http://pastebin.com/RTamt2Ae, what exactly do I do to verify it and resign it with gnupg :P	[08:22]
spawn-	give me some btc paul hehe for remainding you hehe	[08:22]
reeses	rg: because it will nuke your throughput when you have too many oops from multiple clients	[08:22]
*	gribble gives voice to spawn-	[08:22]
reeses	iops dammit	[08:22]
rg	the whole point of cache is that it doesnt do that	[08:22]
nanotube	paulzag: gpg keys are in ~/.gnupg	[08:22]
rg	i will get a 1GB cache	[08:22]
rg	battery bcked	[08:22]
nanotube	paulzag: there is a 'secring.gpg' and a 'pubring.gpg' in there. but really, just back up the whole .gnupg dir.	[08:23]
reeses	except when the cache is too small for the requests	[08:23]
spawn-	;;rate nanotube 2 thank you for assisting me :)	[08:23]
gribble	Rating entry successful. Your rating of 2 for user nanotube has been recorded.	[08:23]
rg	reeses as opposed to when there is No cache	[08:23]
rg	and the iowait goes up to 50%	[08:23]
MILF2	but yea, if the owner of clearcoin is still around	[08:23]
reeses	no cache just sucks	[08:23]
rg	besides its not for disk reads so much	[08:23]
MILF2	has anyone approached him	[08:23]
rg	its to prevent disk thrashing	[08:23]
MILF2	and asked him	[08:23]
MILF2	about someone else basically reenabling it	[08:24]
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MILF2	and maintaiing it?	[08:24]
rg	vps 1 writes 20 bytes at the same time as vps 2, drive has to jump from one place to another	[08:24]
reeses	4gb on a san head when yoou add 6 esx boxes to the environment is bad news	[08:24]
rg	while 20 other vps's do the same thing	[08:24]
rg	where as if there were cache	[08:24]
rg	itd be fine	[08:24]
rg	well im not doing a SAN	[08:24]
spawn-	;;rate cory 2 fast smooth transactions	[08:24]
gribble	Rating entry successful. Your rating of 2 for user cory has been recorded.	[08:24]
rg	it will ideally be 4x450GB SAS	[08:24]
spawn-	:)	[08:24]
Cory	<3	[08:25]
reeses	because the san asshats will say everything is fine because they see ok cpu and disk utilization	[08:25]
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MILF2	Cory, i keep forgetting	[08:25]
MILF2	where in WI are you again?	[08:25]
amiller	this is definitely worth a blog post, learn to do escrow the hard way with command line gpg	[08:25]
rg	amiller you got burned?	[08:26]
Cory	Wausau, MILF2.	[08:26]
nanotube	azkabal: first, make sure you have smick's gpg key in your ring (gpg --recv-keys if needed). then, run gpg --verify, and paste the contract.	[08:26]
amiller	oh no not burned just, it's the fun way to do it	[08:26]
reeses	lol	[08:26]
MBS	buying mtgoxusd/btc for amazon payments/serve/clover/venmo (varying limits on each). can buy things for you from newegg/amazon/etc for mtgoxusd/btc, and can resell you http://www.kimsufi.ie servers ($25/$65/$80 respectively converted to BTC)	[08:26]
nanotube	amiller: yea if you make it, i'll link it on otc :)	[08:26]
MBS	azkabal, you are really going with too much hassle for this trade, lol	[08:26]
azkabal	nanotube: I imported his PGP public key from the ;;ident command, and it said they was not valid when i tried to verify http://pastebin.com/RTamt2Ae, what does this mean>	[08:26]
MILF2	heh..that's a bit of a hike	[08:26]
BTCTrader	i accept amazon for btc	[08:27]
MILF2	even from where i may be moving to	[08:27]
reeses	amiller: in 30 years, if you start today, you can have a gui app in agda to handle the simple case	[08:27]
MBS	BTCTrader, amazon payments at mtgox rate?	[08:27]
BTCTrader	i ask for a marginal fee like .1 for my time	[08:27]
BTCTrader	and depends on amount	[08:27]
MBS	wait you are selling btc right?	[08:28]
nanotube	azkabal: well, let me try a verification here and see if it works	[08:28]
amiller	i verified it on my end	[08:28]
BTCTrader	if the price is right :D	[08:28]
amiller	i'd recommend wget with the 'raw' link	[08:28]
nanotube	amiller: ah ok then i guess i won't bother :)	[08:28]
reeses	no curl?	[08:29]
BTCTrader	i sold to one customer earlier today	[08:29]
MBS	BTCTrader, prefer mtgoxusd but willing to do btc at mtgox price, how much of either would you be willing to sale for amazon payments	[08:29]
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MILF2	Cory, lol...you're kinda up in the middle of the woods up there, eh? granted i know Wausau itself is somewhat large, but next nearest	[08:29]
*	gribble gives voice to splatster	[08:29]
splatster	Hey there people!	[08:30]
MILF2	"large" cities are what...rhinelander and eau clare?	[08:30]
MILF2	XD	[08:30]
nanotube	ok, well, verifies on my end too. :)	[08:31]
Cory	Yeah, we're about as good as it gets. :P	[08:31]
MILF2	heh	[08:32]
MILF2	i'm taking a job in kiel.....small little place near plymoth	[08:33]
Cory	That Kara Neumann case got some national attention, where Kara's parents treated her diabetes with prayer rather than medication and Kara died because of it.	[08:33]
Cory	She attended the same elementary school I did.	[08:33]
MILF2	and i'm near milwaukee.	[08:33]
MILF2	oh really?	[08:33]
MILF2	O_o	[08:33]
reeses	did they pray to st pancras?	[08:33]
MILF2	that's cool.....i currently live like 2 miles away from where jeffry dahmer grew up.	[08:33]
MBS	she died because she was a sinner	[08:33]
MBS	obviously	[08:34]
reeses	well fuck, no wonder	[08:34]
MILF2	i swear to god, this state drives people just batshit nuts.	[08:34]
reeses	I’m alive, ergo I am an innocent	[08:34]
rg	hehe	[08:34]
rg	anyone want to see what GammaG looksl ike	[08:34]
MILF2	must be the cold weather X_X	[08:34]
rg	http://media.steampowered.com/steamcommunity/public/images/avatars/ea/eadb4961f0d79cda6e1880947bb524dd97bdd27e_full.jpg	[08:34]
Cory	It's the weather.	[08:34]
reeses	I consulted in MSP for two years	[08:35]
Cory	GammaG really is a girl?	[08:35]
reeses	you got weird people in that part of the world	[08:35]
rg	yep	[08:35]
reeses	lots of one-eyed or lazy-eyed people	[08:36]
reeses	it’s disturbing	[08:36]
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trigliu	the btc escrow site doesn't actually have to handle or receive any money. let the buyer sign 2 transactions, one burning the coins, the other sending it to the seller. the escrow publishes only one depending on the outcome of the transaction	[08:44]
trigliu	that way the escrow avoids accepting any funds	[08:44]
phantomcircuit	trigliu, nobody wants that to be their options	[08:45]
phantomcircuit	burning the funds vs forwarding to the seller	[08:45]
vragnaroda	phantomcircuit: Oh, you think he's rational. How cute.	[08:45]
trigliu	why not? thats what satoshi proposed	[08:45]
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trigliu	lol the founder of bitcoin devised this escrow. yet vragnaroda thinks its irrational	[08:45]
phantomcircuit	yes this isn't a religion	[08:46]
vragnaroda	Newton was an alchemist.	[08:46]
trigliu	well this is a dead-end, but why do you think satoshi's scheme is irrational?	[08:46]
nanotube	phantomcircuit: well, clearcoin did essentially that. only instead of burning, sent to eff and whatnot.	[08:46]
trigliu	ill try to disabuse you of your misunderstanding, whatever it may be	[08:47]
nanotube	from the pov of the buyer, it was the same, send to seller, or send "somewhere else and never see again"	[08:47]
trigliu	nanotube: yeah the problem with sending to a "charity" is that the charity may be a fake. at one point, a group associated with mybitcoin was one of the listed non-profits.	[08:47]
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nanotube	was it really? on clearcoin?	[08:47]
trigliu	yeah. the hayek society of canada or something	[08:48]
trigliu	it was created by a dude involved in the whole mybitcoin thing	[08:48]
nanotube	ah heh i see interesting	[08:48]
trigliu	but legally an automated escrow might want to avoid handling any funds	[08:48]
nanotube	indeed, i like that idea, publishing two tx, but not actually have the escrow guy own the coins at any point.	[08:49]
nanotube	er, s/publishing/sending to escrow/	[08:49]
trigliu	the 'scrow would probably have to hand you a key to a wallet with prepaid funds after it completes the transaction	[08:49]
trigliu	to avoid the whole double spend thing	[08:49]
MILF2	of course, there's always the oppertunity of the system/escrow person screwing peoples over	[08:50]
MILF2	even if it's automated	[08:50]
trigliu	yeah MILF2.. but statisticall you hope you are not the user that gets screwed, assuming they have a trackrecord of verifiable reliability	[08:50]
rg	thats why someone trusted has to do it	[08:50]
MILF2	there's the chance that it could fuck up (faulty scripting, etc)	[08:50]
paulzag	why are people surprised GammaG is a girl? cause she scammed? Junkies are girls too. equal opportunity disease	[08:50]
rg	paulzag , that has nothing to do with it	[08:50]
rg	we didnt believe it was a girl cause it was sketchy	[08:51]
trigliu	if the escrow doesn't handle funds, they have nothing to gain from screwing up the transaction	[08:51]
rg	generally a good tactic to scam people is pretend youre a girl	[08:51]
rg	especially on IRC	[08:51]
MILF2	not many girls manage to make there way in here too, i'd imagine.	[08:51]
rg	cause 90% of IRC are virgins	[08:51]
amiller	it's worse than just 'statistically', because the escrow might actually target you	[08:51]
paulzag	I love how this channel uses the word "sketchy"	[08:51]
Graet	lol rg	[08:51]
trigliu	true amiller. that goes for any investment	[08:51]
amiller	with blinded signatures and by communicating over tor, the escrow would be unable to discriminate in that way, and so you'd be left with just the statistical unlikelihood	[08:51]
paulzag	oh true rg I'd forgotten	[08:51]
trigliu	yeah good point	[08:51]
MBS	XD	[08:51]
MBS	https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=61498.0	[08:51]
MILF2	amiller, yea, but scripts can always be buggy..	[08:52]
MBS	I'm offering 1 BTC per PLEX. (must be in continues High Sec)	[08:52]
MBS	and I'll sell 1 PLEX for 2 BTC.	[08:52]
MBS	:\|	[08:52]
trigliu	uacceptable risk	[08:52]
MILF2	that being said, it'd probably be a good idea to "beta test" with very small amounts	[08:52]
trigliu	^acceptable	[08:52]
MILF2	i.e. is the coin faucet still around?	[08:52]
phantomcircuit	MBS, the fuck is a PLEX	[08:52]
nanotube	MILF2: yes the faucet is still around	[08:52]
MBS	gives you a month of EVE online	[08:52]
MBS	ask derpderp, lol	[08:52]
MILF2	just some 0.00001 coin transactions	[08:53]
MILF2	or something	[08:53]
MILF2	from there	[08:53]
MBS	hes working on some eve bots or something, lol	[08:53]
MILF2	to use as test cases	[08:53]
phantomcircuit	MBS, he is?	[08:53]
phantomcircuit	inb4failure	[08:53]
MILF2	make sure it runs fine on those, then get volunteers to run agaiinst real coinage of similar sizes	[08:53]
MILF2	then eventually go "completely" live.	[08:54]
MILF2	test the shit out of it before it gets any real use...heh	[08:54]
trigliu	a) deposit to an address provided by the escrow b) sign 2 new transactions (one to be used if the deal is unsuccessful, the other if successful) c) tell the escrow to publish one of the transactions d) if the transaction is invalid (NSF) the escrow takes the deposit sent in step a, otherwise the escrow returns it to you	[08:56]
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trigliu	in most cases the escrow will end up returning your deposit, instead of sending it to the seller	[08:56]
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amiller	a) isn't necessary	[08:57]
nanotube	what's the deposit? the escrow fee?	[08:57]
trigliu	nanotube: it's equal to the escrow amount	[08:57]
trigliu	the only benefit is that the escrow isn't physically sending funds to the seller (to avoid being involved in money laundering or whatever)	[08:58]
MBS	buying mtgoxusd/btc for amazon payments/serve/clover/venmo (varying limits on each). can buy things for you from newegg/amazon/etc for mtgoxusd/btc, and can resell you http://www.kimsufi.ie servers ($25/$65/$80 respectively converted to BTC)	[08:58]
reeses	;;rate paulzag 2 Paul sold me 80BTC for a tiny premium for PPUSD. Very careful side-channel validation through linkedin.	[08:58]
gribble	Rating entry successful. Your rating of 2 for user paulzag has been recorded.	[08:58]
MBS	reeses, you should get you soem kimsufis now	[08:59]
MILF2	hey, not that i care too much, but how often can one smack up the bitcoin faucet?	[08:59]
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MILF2	because 0.005 coins doesn't really add up very fast anyways :P	[09:00]
trigliu	the protocol could support the satoshi-escrow natively. that would require some way to specify a burn-or-send-to-address operation	[09:00]
MILF2	boolean	[09:00]
trigliu	where burn means the money dissapears.. or a charity i guess	[09:00]
MILF2	based on if the transaction is seen	[09:00]
*	chsados (~chsados@c-71-229-206-230.hsd1.co.comcast.net) has joined #bitcoin-otc	[09:00]
MILF2	in like block explorer	[09:00]
MILF2	after x amount of time.	[09:00]
MILF2	if it is, send it on out	[09:01]
reeses	what is a kimsuti?	[09:01]
MILF2	if not, "burn" it	[09:01]
MILF2	or send it to charity	[09:01]
MILF2	...better yet, instead of charity	[09:01]
MILF2	send it to bitfaucet or something :D	[09:01]
trigliu	send to the next miner	[09:01]
MILF2	keep the community up and kicking	[09:01]
reeses	paulzag: what does ‘sketchy’ mean in strayan?	[09:02]
nanotube	trigliu: i don't get the point of a) then. aren't the two signed transactions already for the escrow amount?	[09:02]
MBS	MILF2, https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Bonus_Programs	[09:02]
Bigpiggy01Mining	reeses kimsuti = online version of the kamasutra where users can edit or add positions	[09:02]
MBS	kimsufi	[09:02]
MBS	http://kimsufi.ie	[09:02]
MBS	cheap french servers :p	[09:02]
trigliu	nanotube: yeah, but what happens if the buyer spends his wallet to $0. then the signed transactions are invalid	[09:02]
reeses	wait, there’s more than “the stranger”?	[09:02]
MBS	better than cheap french whores	[09:03]
MILF2	MBS...nice	[09:03]
reeses	dunno about that one	[09:03]
paulzag	reeses, means mostly the same "dodgey" but more often "incomplete"	[09:03]
*	_chsados_ has quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)	[09:03]
MILF2	i like the idea of throwing it at the faucet though	[09:03]
trigliu	theres some lag time between when the seller gets assurance the funds exist to when the deal is concluded	[09:03]
nanotube	trigliu: ah i see good point	[09:03]
trigliu	shipping time or whatever	[09:03]
MILF2	just because it eventually ends up going directly back into the community	[09:03]
reeses	makes sense	[09:03]
MILF2	get a couple of scamming people	[09:03]
paulzag	i.e. "details of the alien crash site are sketchy"	[09:03]
MILF2	and you got potentially a few hundred coins back in the faucet.	[09:03]
reeses	sketch → sketchy almost never gets use in the us among the ≤40 year-old crowd	[09:04]
paulzag	yeah - I got the impression it was a youth slang use	[09:05]
MILF2	but i like that idea instead of "burning" it	[09:05]
MILF2	where you never see it again	[09:05]
MILF2	nor does anyone else	[09:05]
MILF2	for that matter	[09:05]
MILF2	charity isn't a bad thought either though....	[09:05]
reeses	who is charity? women are scammers!	[09:06]
trigliu	yeah. its just tricky. you have charities people disagree with	[09:06]
MILF2	yea	[09:06]
MILF2	or you could take	[09:06]
MILF2	the amount of the transaction	[09:06]
trigliu	im all for charities.. both sides woul dhave to agree on it i guess	[09:06]
paulzag	the escrow should name it's charity. They get to	[09:06]
MILF2	keep a small amount for whoever is running the site for maintanance	[09:06]
*	chsados has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)	[09:06]
MILF2	then take EVERYTHING else	[09:06]
paulzag	that's the cost of doing biz	[09:06]
MILF2	and disperse it	[09:06]
MILF2	between say the last couple hundred site users	[09:07]
paulzag	and the charity should probably be EFF	[09:07]
MILF2	(granted that'd take a LOT of code to do...)	[09:07]
trigliu	yeah clearcoin had a bunch of worthy charities	[09:07]
MILF2	but it'd give a potential incentive for people to use the service	[09:07]
MILF2	as opposed to just straight up dealing with people	[09:07]
paulzag	If the scow service states where the funds go, neither party gets a say - they're bona fides would be in question	[09:08]
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MBS	also if anyone needs gift cards/prepaid visa/mastercard/amex for BTC i can get those too	[09:08]
paulzag	I got too much PPUSD right now... MBS	[09:09]
MBS	lol	[09:09]
MILF2	MBS...i know those cost to activate	[09:09]
MILF2	how much of a charge per card on those?	[09:09]
trigliu	yeah charity is cool.. i guess one of the reasons the admin was wary was some charities want to tknow the identity of the donator.. or filing taxes	[09:09]
MBS	well would order online from walmart, would vary on which one :p	[09:09]
MBS	$5-8 over value	[09:09]
MILF2	heh	[09:09]
trigliu	if the escrow can be removed from handling the money directly thats good	[09:09]
MBS	so pretty cheap	[09:10]
MBS	free shipping or you can pick up at local walmart	[09:10]
BTCTrader	i buy mine with cash	[09:10]
BTCTrader	http://bitcashretail.com/visa.php	[09:10]
MILF2	i still like the idea of filtering it back into the community	[09:10]
MILF2	that way no one can bitch about which charity is good or bad	[09:10]
MILF2	lol	[09:10]
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trigliu	if the protocol supported some kind of time limit for a transaction to be redeemed, that would be all you need	[09:11]
MILF2	protocol itself doesn't	[09:11]
MILF2	but blockexplorer has an api, no?	[09:11]
trigliu	yeah	[09:11]
MILF2	just run it against blockexplorer	[09:11]
smickles	;;rate [ident azkabal] 1 good tx with signed contract and escrow	[09:12]
gribble	Rating entry successful. Your rating of 1 for user flazmok has been recorded.	[09:12]
MILF2	first check if you can find block explorer (i.e. that the site itself isn't down)	[09:12]
MILF2	if it does, continue with the transaction	[09:12]
azkabal	;;rate smickles 1 my $100 Moneypak for bitcoins, went perfect.. my first time EVER and he was really nice & patient helping out :)	[09:12]
gribble	Rating entry successful. Your rating of 1 for user smickles has been recorded.	[09:12]
MILF2	if not...don't do shit with it	[09:12]
MILF2	then generate the potential result set	[09:12]
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MILF2	then it checks block explorer for said transaction	[09:12]
MILF2	when it finds it, it sends	[09:13]
MBS	how about an escrow bot splits payment to bitcoin-otc users depending on activeness :p	[09:13]
MILF2	after whatever number of time, if the transaction isn't found, donate it/send it off to wherever the hell	[09:13]
smickles	;;rate amiller 2 a fine escrow	[09:13]
gribble	Rating entry successful. Your rating for user amiller has changed from 1 to 2.	[09:13]
azkabal	;;rate amiller 1 a+ escrow :)	[09:14]
gribble	Rating entry successful. Your rating of 1 for user amiller has been recorded.	[09:14]
trigliu	so if you have a multi-sig transaction, what happens if it doesn't get signed? the money is lost?	[09:14]
MILF2	hrm...you'd have to look for the correct number of sigs	[09:14]
MILF2	if not, it gets sent back to sender?	[09:14]
MILF2	dammit, i wish i had better knowledge on some of this stuff...	[09:15]
nanotube	if it doesn't get signed, it just sits there, equivalent to getting 'lost'	[09:15]
MILF2	i'm only just starting out with my "real" programming stuff	[09:15]
nanotube	until such a time that you can get the requisite number of signers to agree to sign it.	[09:15]
MILF2	if it doesn't get signed at all, send it back to wherever the fuck it came from	[09:16]
MILF2	lol	[09:16]
trigliu	ok.. well then.. there you go. satoshi-escrow. require 2 signatures, then only sign it the second time if you're satisfied with the transaction	[09:16]
trigliu	if youre dissatisfied, you lost the money	[09:16]
trigliu	but the scammer doesn't profit	[09:16]
nanotube	yes, that's the classic multi-sig escrow. 2 of 3 tx, with the 3 parties being buyer, seller, escrow.	[09:16]
trigliu	yeah i mean, no escrow needed... you just sign it if you're happy, and if not, the funds are burned	[09:17]
nanotube	indee	[09:17]
nanotube	d	[09:17]
MILF2	i still don't like the idea of truely burning the funds	[09:17]
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trigliu	the complicated scheme i mentioned before is unnecessary with multisig	[09:17]
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nanotube	MILF2: it makes the rest of the bitcoins more valuable. how bad can it be? :)	[09:17]
MILF2	nanotube, but it makes the funds lost. permanently	[09:18]
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nanotube	trigliu: indeed. one of the uses of multisig that people have been 'anticipating' is the in-chain escrow.	[09:18]
nanotube	MILF2: yes it does... and that makes it a little sad. but unless it's /your/ coins getting lost, it doesn't seem so bad :)	[09:18]
MILF2	heh	[09:19]
trigliu	actually theres a small profit incentive to be had by burning the funds deliberately	[09:19]
MILF2	lol	[09:19]
nanotube	well, yes, someone who may own a lot of coins, may go around and troll transactions by being a fake-seller and failing to deliver	[09:19]
nanotube	resulting in a lot of burned coins, and thereby hoping to increase the value of his stash	[09:20]
azkabal	Now that I received money in my wallet, does that mean I have to create a new offline backup of the wallet.dat file, or is that only for when I send money out ?	[09:20]
trigliu	the buyer profits because he gets the asset and his share of total bitcoins in circulation is greater than it wouldve been if he sent the money to the seller	[09:20]
nanotube	azkabal: it is always a good idea to have backups.	[09:20]
MILF2	yea, so maybe going the route of giving them away	[09:20]
nanotube	;;bc,wiki securing your wallet	[09:20]
MILF2	to somewhere	[09:20]
MILF2	is a better idea.	[09:20]
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nanotube	azkabal: https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Securing_your_wallet	[09:20]
MILF2	because then there's no real loss of coins, but rather they just get pushed off elsewhere	[09:20]
vragnaroda	If it only made a difference when you sent bitcoins out, I'd rather that difference not be backed up. ;)	[09:20]
trigliu	the profit is miniscule if its small amounts.. but its still there. you would rather have 25 out of 75 bitcoins in existence, rather than 25 out of 100 bitcoins in existence!	[09:20]
MILF2	and no profit to be made from screwing someone else over.	[09:20]
trigliu	burning the coins, makes your remaining coins more valuable (slightly)	[09:21]
NASDAQEnema	do shipping companies provide a way to see a picked up shipping label online	[09:21]
trigliu	for a 100btc trade tho, the benefit is infinitessimal..	[09:21]
MILF2	not even for 1 100btc trade	[09:22]
MILF2	but like 5	[09:22]
MILF2	or 6	[09:22]
MILF2	that's enough to put waves in mtgox even.	[09:22]
trigliu	nanotube: maybe the funds should be recycled back into the blockchain? simply add it to the unpaid bounties	[09:23]
trigliu	to avoid the troll scenario	[09:23]
NASDAQEnema	the burn goes to the burn insurance pot problem solved	[09:23]
nanotube	trigliu: heh great idea, unfortunately it is not possible with current bitcoin system.	[09:23]
trigliu	well stlil the troller gets away with it for a few hundred years	[09:23]
nanotube	the only thing that can go into a future block bounty is pre-set bounty, and fees from transactions included in the block.	[09:23]
trigliu	yeah currently	[09:24]
vragnaroda	lol, eliminate this one avenue for griefing by creating another	[09:24]
trigliu	hopefully the seller/troll would have more to profit by actually selling the asset, rather than increasing his share of circulating bitcoins	[09:24]
MILF2	require a user login to be set up with gpg	[09:24]
nanotube	good pt vragnaroda , this does incentivize miners to grief escrow transactions.	[09:25]
MILF2	and if you have a transaction go bad on your end	[09:25]
MILF2	flag your account	[09:25]
MILF2	granted that's not completely foolproof	[09:25]
NASDAQEnema	vragnaroda: we haven't mastered the art of creating intentional entropy	[09:25]
MILF2	and people could set up multiple accounts	[09:25]
MILF2	but it'd make it a lot more of a pain in the ass for someone to screw people over	[09:25]
MBS	could have a bot send a certain amount to the previous winning block for each new block	[09:25]
MILF2	like for example	[09:26]
MILF2	how often do people screw others over	[09:26]
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MILF2	here	[09:26]
MILF2	when actually gpg'ed in	[09:26]
MBS	though anyway	[09:26]
trigliu	well the only solution is for the seller to escrow in an amount of btc equal to whatever share of btc he'd gain by reducing circulation	[09:26]
trigliu	and the buyer signs both	[09:26]
NASDAQEnema	i got one	[09:26]
rg	http://www.ebay.com/itm/INTEL-SR1560SFHS-1U-SERVER-2x-3GHZ-QUAD-CORE-CPU-WITH-32GB-MEM-3x-300GB-15K-SAS-/380407526094?pt=COMP_EN_Servers&hash=item58920e32ce	[09:26]
rg	now thats nice	[09:27]
MBS	i doubt anyone using USD would use an escrow if all the escrow did was "if the seller doesnt send their stuff, we will burn your money"	[09:27]
MILF2	it tends to happen, but not so much when people are gpg'ed in.	[09:27]
rg	too bad its not $400 cheaper	[09:27]
smickles	nanotube: you'd love the number of sigs on this http://pastebin.com/raw.php?i=YWEtXDWf	[09:27]
MILF2	MBS, i think we've decided that plain out and burning it	[09:27]
MILF2	is a bad idea.	[09:27]
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MBS	well i mean no one would use an escrow if they wouldnt get their money back if they got scammed, lol	[09:28]
trigliu	make the seller put up 10% of the amount himself in a tx that must be signed by the buyer. so the seller loses more than he could gain by shrinking bitcoin	[09:28]
trigliu	mbs: yeah for larger amounts, burn is less appealing	[09:28]
MBS	would be better to have an actual escrow company setup, contacts and etc	[09:28]
nanotube	smickles: lol awesome	[09:28]
MBS	where if you tried to chargeback, escrow company would have proof that you agreed to it	[09:28]
trigliu	but for small amts, its ideal	[09:28]
MILF2	yea...maybe say for transactions under.....5 coins (of course this amount could be changed)	[09:29]
MILF2	but for now, say 5 coins	[09:29]
MILF2	funds get burned	[09:29]
NASDAQEnema	try this: both seller and buyer send half the amount to a pot if the item is received then the amount goes to the seller - if the item is not received the amount goes to the buyer	[09:29]
MBS	so you have to have coins to buy coins?	[09:30]
rg	my idea was this: user a trades with user b, user b logs into escrow site, sends btc, gets a link to show the other trader how much has been desposited, when, # of confirms, and the user who sent them	[09:30]
MILF2	heh	[09:30]
MILF2	i was gonna say	[09:30]
rg	user a sends money	[09:30]
MILF2	that doesn't work	[09:30]
MILF2	:D	[09:30]
rg	user b releases bitcoins	[09:30]
rg	but the catch is	[09:30]
rg	once you upload bitcoins, you cant withdraw them	[09:30]
rg	that way no one can upload funds, rip off	[09:30]
rg	then request them back	[09:30]
rg	and after a week theyre automatically sent to the person you filled in	[09:31]
rg	when you started the escrow	[09:31]
rg	pretty fool proof?	[09:31]
MILF2	where would the funds be stored though	[09:31]
rg	in a wallet?	[09:32]
rg	where are all funds stored	[09:32]
MILF2	ya see, that's the problem though	[09:32]
rg	its not if its a TRUSTED MEMBER OF OTC	[09:32]
MILF2	because then the escrow is dealing directly with the money	[09:32]
rg	for the 10000th time	[09:32]
MILF2	well not even that so much	[09:32]
MILF2	but it could cause potential problems with other things	[09:33]
rg	lay it out for me	[09:33]
MILF2	like taxes if you live in certain countries	[09:33]
MILF2	etc	[09:33]
rg	... taxes?	[09:33]
rg	what the fuck	[09:33]
smickles	rg, there is no true scottsman er,, trusted member of otc	[09:33]
MILF2	because you've got all that money flying across you	[09:33]
MILF2	lol	[09:33]
smickles	weren't you here earlier?	[09:33]
MBS	thats not how taxes work	[09:33]
MILF2	and yea, no matter what	[09:33]
rg	its an escrow site for -otc people only	[09:33]
rg	it will link up with WoT	[09:33]
MILF2	there's always the potential of corruption	[09:33]
rg	dude, look at people like pirate	[09:33]
*	fimp (~fimp@4309ds2-vby.0.fullrate.dk) has joined #bitcoin-otc	[09:34]
rg	they manage (not an exact number cause i dont know) upwards of like $100k btc	[09:34]
rg	a day	[09:34]
rg	so scamming 20 btc of joe nobody isnt going to entice them to steal	[09:34]
extor	WoT?	[09:34]
smickles	web of trust	[09:34]
rg	extor: web of trust	[09:34]
extor	ahh	[09:34]
MILF2	there's always the greed factor though	[09:34]
extor	I think he meant how will you explain 200k worth of USD moving across when the taxman calleth	[09:34]
Greed	And the MILF2 factor	[09:35]
MILF2	about the only way you take that out	[09:35]
Greed	The MILFs run the show here	[09:35]
MILF2	is by automating it	[09:35]
rg	extor	[09:35]
Greed	No question about it	[09:35]
*	LibrtiORDeth (~IceChat77@66.62.141.1) has joined #bitcoin-otc	[09:35]
rg	not everyone cashes out into money	[09:35]
rg	some of us , like me , only cash out when we have t	[09:35]
rg	o	[09:35]
extor	well you have to become licensed as a money exchanger at those levels	[09:35]
extor	banking regulations and all	[09:35]
rg	not if its bitcoins	[09:35]
MILF2	yea.....not everyone DOES	[09:35]
MILF2	but if it takes off enough	[09:36]
*	fimp has quit (Client Quit)	[09:36]
MILF2	200k flying across you	[09:36]
MILF2	is pretty fucking hard to explain	[09:36]
rg	but 200k would never fly across me	[09:36]
extor	it's not just bitcoins, it's bictoins and USD that flow to banks	[09:36]
rg	the escrow would be BTC only	[09:36]
rg	no 'real' money	[09:36]
rg	so no taxes, no nothing	[09:36]
MILF2	so..people what	[09:36]
extor	200k a month in ACH transactions? Sorry...that will trip a few wires	[09:36]
MILF2	swap bitcoin for bitcoin?	[09:36]
MILF2	lol	[09:36]
rg	omg	[09:36]
rg	you guys are retards	[09:36]
rg	seriously	[09:37]
NASDAQEnema	no dollars	[09:37]
smickles	rg: i understand	[09:37]
rg	smickles: i think the majority of the channel understood	[09:37]
trigliu	trolls burning bitcoins isn't a problem if the seller of the goods also escrows some btc	[09:37]
extor	so the otr users send ACH to the other party?	[09:37]
NASDAQEnema	bitcoins don't have a dollar value	[09:37]
trigliu	10% seems reasonable	[09:37]
NASDAQEnema	there is no ACH	[09:37]
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rg	im going to start coding this escrow	[09:37]
MILF2	NASDAQEnema, tell that to mtgox	[09:37]
rg	when its done	[09:37]
extor	SO like gift cards and all	[09:37]
rg	i will hand it over to nanotube	[09:37]
rg	and he can run it if he chooses	[09:37]
rg	that way, if you cant trust nanotube, you shouldnt be in here	[09:38]
trigliu	rg: dont you want the profit?	[09:38]
rg	what profit?	[09:38]
rg	its a free service of -otc	[09:38]
rg	to protect otc users	[09:38]
rg	look, im poor, like, real poor	[09:38]
trigliu	the escrow charges a fee to maintain itself	[09:38]
MILF2	like i suggested	[09:38]
rg	ive had chances to steal thousands upon thousands of btc	[09:38]
rg	and i didnt	[09:38]
MILF2	if a transaction goes splat	[09:38]
amiller	i don't see the value in bitcoin to bitcoin escrow	[09:38]
rg	because i love bitcoin	[09:38]
rg	and i love this channel	[09:38]
amiller	it's interaction with another payment mode that's important	[09:38]
MILF2	have the service itself take a small fee	[09:38]
amiller	even clearcoin interacted wiht paypal for you	[09:38]
MILF2	for maintainance	[09:38]
smickles	;;hug rg	[09:38]
*	gribble hugs rg	[09:38]
CCoolty	;;tell rg [tell hi]	[09:38]
rg	hai!	[09:39]
rg	[gribble(~gribble@unaffiliated/nanotube/bot/gribble)] CCoolty wants me to tell	[09:39]
rg	you: (tell ) -- Tells the whatever is.	[09:39]
rg	Use nested commands to your benefit here.	[09:39]
trigliu	its just more legal hassles for the escrow.. handling currency has all sorts of issues	[09:39]
CCoolty	lol	[09:39]
rg	;;tell ccoolty [tell ccoolty tell ccoolty hi]	[09:39]
gribble	Error: This command cannot be nested.	[09:39]
NASDAQEnema	btc != currency	[09:39]
trigliu	but yes, it would be more convenient if the escrow could handle money	[09:39]
NASDAQEnema	it are tokens	[09:39]
trigliu	NASDAQEnema, it is, but i was talking about usd from paypal et al	[09:39]
NASDAQEnema	no it are not	[09:40]
trigliu	btc is a fiat currency	[09:40]
NASDAQEnema	tokens	[09:40]
NASDAQEnema	lol	[09:40]
rg	btw	[09:40]
rg	anyone watching 'The River'?	[09:40]
CCoolty	;;tell rg [ticker]	[09:40]
nanotube	amiller: i don't think clearcoin did anything with paypal, or any form of usd.	[09:41]
trigliu	multisig escrow is the solution for small amts.. buyer sends a tx that requires his sig, seller deposits 5% to himself in a tx buyer must sign.. then buyer decides at the end if the amounts should be paid	[09:42]
smickles	;;buy 1 btc @ 5.92 ppusd up to 16.89189 total	[09:42]
gribble	Order id 6762 created.	[09:42]
*	spawn- VPS/VPN/IRCBOUNCER for BTC anyone ?	[09:42]
smickles	;;remove 6762	[09:42]
gribble	Order 6762 removed.	[09:42]
smickles	<.<	[09:42]
smickles	>,>	[09:42]
trigliu	and yeah if you want the chance of recovering rather than burning the money, add a neutral third party	[09:43]
trigliu	which is impossible because bitcoin is such a small community	[09:44]
trigliu	but its better than nothing	[09:44]
MILF2	neutral 3rd party?	[09:45]
MILF2	rofl	[09:45]
trigliu	until miners support all the multisig stuff, youd probably need a site to facilitate.. but it wouldn't necessarily have to accept any funds in the first case (burn)	[09:45]
MILF2	and wouldn't this have the potential forthe BUYER to screw stuff up too?	[09:45]
MILF2	and screw the seller out of the money?	[09:46]
trigliu	MILF2: if the buyer loses his wallet? yeah it could happen..	[09:46]
MILF2	(not that they'd really have any incentive to do so, short of being a jackass)	[09:46]
MILF2	well no, i'm just saying	[09:46]
MILF2	the buyer could set up the transaction	[09:47]
MILF2	it could go completely smoothly	[09:47]
smickles	;;buy 17.95332 btc @ 5.57 ppusd (price per btc)	[09:47]
MILF2	and at the end of a multisig escrow	[09:47]
gribble	Order id 6763 created.	[09:47]
MILF2	the buyer could say fuck you to the seller	[09:47]
MILF2	and shoot them in the foot.	[09:47]
trigliu	MILF2: yeah it can happen. this scheme definitely favors the buyer	[09:47]
MILF2	burn the funds, as the case would be	[09:47]
trigliu	the buyer could extort the seller: give me another 10 btc or i'll burn the funds, etc	[09:48]
*	plutonic has quit (Quit: plutonic)	[09:48]
MILF2	that being said, i'd LIKE to think that wouldn't happen	[09:48]
MILF2	then again, i know how this shit works	[09:48]
MILF2	and it probably will	[09:48]
trigliu	for small amounts, there would be little to profit from doing that..	[09:49]
MILF2	true...	[09:49]
amiller	hm yeah you're right i'm totally wrong about clearcoin, it was btc only	[09:49]
trigliu	the buyer and the escrow agent could both extort the seller. cash on delivery works better of course	[09:50]
MILF2	lol	[09:50]
MILF2	damn dilemmas	[09:50]
MILF2	lol	[09:50]
trigliu	they could claim the goods were never received or they were broken... impossible for the community to verify the claim	[09:50]
MILF2	so you run on good faith?	[09:51]
MILF2	and maybe a user rating system of sorts?	[09:51]
trigliu	i would do the burn escrow for small amounts, anything larger would need lots more due diligence	[09:51]
smickles	gribble api?	[09:51]
MILF2	(though like i said earlier, that could be worked around too)	[09:51]
MILF2	even for small transactions (upper limit on like 4 or 5 coins) this would be a good idea i think	[09:52]
smickles	there's probably no perfect answer, just keep piling shit on 'till it's considered art	[09:52]
MILF2	there's no real perfect answer for anything to speak of.	[09:53]
*	Bemmu (u841@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-uyjaxwrlplizjxss) has joined #bitcoin-otc	[09:53]
smickles	MILF2: that's why i brought art into the mix	[09:53]
trigliu	a pizza shop can give you one pepperoni slice at a time in exchange for $x, until the full amount is paid. unfortunately not all physical assets are infinitely divisible	[09:53]
MILF2	i'm just throwing out ideas and thoughts	[09:53]
MILF2	heh	[09:53]
NASDAQEnema	i've got it	[09:53]
smickles	:o	[09:54]
*	Vaerros has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)	[09:54]
MILF2	maybe automate the feedback	[09:54]
NASDAQEnema	seller buyer and escrow put in 1/3 each	[09:54]
MILF2	until a user hits x number of feedback	[09:54]
MILF2	they can't do large transactions.	[09:55]
smickles	like otc feeback?	[09:55]
MILF2	something like that, yeah.	[09:55]
NASDAQEnema	if seller frauds the buyer gets the seller's third	[09:55]
smickles	that's a hard x to define :(	[09:55]
MILF2	true enough	[09:55]
MILF2	and of course, there's always workarounds on that too.	[09:56]
MILF2	i'd just throw this idea out there	[09:56]
extor	It's rare to see prices equal between btce and mtgox...that time is now. I wonder why?	[09:56]
smickles	i think defining a x give the scammers a goal to work towards	[09:56]
MILF2	minimum of 10 positive transactions	[09:56]
MILF2	with at least 5 different users	[09:56]
trigliu	extor: maybe the abitragers are running on both exchanges	[09:56]
rg	rg bored	[09:56]
rg	maybe ill work on teh websitez	[09:57]
smickles	rg: what happened to working on that escrow ?	[09:57]
rg	people will just be gay about it	[09:57]
MILF2	or like different classes of transactions or something	[09:57]
trigliu	how many otc ratings are given per day?	[09:57]
smickles	'nuthin wrong with gay ;)	[09:57]
rg	im not going to work on something just to have a bunch of people who dont know shit about shit	[09:57]
extor	how would the arbitragers be linking the russian system with the us one? I thought that was the only cause of the rift	[09:58]
rg	talk shit	[09:58]
rg	smickles	[09:58]
rg	its 2012	[09:58]
MILF2	rg, i think it's still just idea gathering time	[09:58]
rg	gay doesnt mean gay	[09:58]
rg	fag doesnt mean fag	[09:58]
MILF2	trying to find out what possible loopholes there are	[09:58]
MILF2	and if there's any good workarounds for them	[09:58]
MILF2	:P	[09:58]
smickles	rg: it's 2012, the pejorative gay is still bad	[09:59]
smickles	(not that you can't use it)	[09:59]
MILF2	alright...pushing 2am here..time to sleep...gotta be up in a few hours	[09:59]
MILF2	:/	[09:59]
rg	milf2	[09:59]
rg	ive put a lot of thought into my project	[09:59]
rg	its pretty foolproof	[09:59]
rg	theres no way to scam a user once the preliminary info is put in	[09:59]
MILF2	well then work on it :D	[09:59]
rg	and even if they do decide to scam	[09:59]
rg	you have to put the second users btc addy in there	[10:00]
rg	and it gets sent to them within a week	[10:00]
rg	and when the first user looks at the page verifying the funds	[10:00]
rg	it shows them what the other user put in	[10:00]
rg	s if they put in a different btc addy	[10:00]
rg	they be scammin you	[10:00]
smickles	oh moi	[10:01]
smickles	it's past 3am here :o	[10:01]
trigliu	lets say there are an average of 20 otc transactions a day for an avg ticket value of 10 btc.. an escrow site taking 1% would make around 730 btc a year if it did all orders... however i think an escrow would actually increase the volume, so it might be more	[10:02]
rg	my escrow would be free	[10:02]
rg	people can just donate to nanotube	[10:02]
trigliu	you sohuld be paid for your time	[10:02]
splatster	God I love freelancing.	[10:02]
*	lunks has quit (Remote host closed the connection)	[10:02]
MBS	splatster, got any more bitcoins now?	[10:03]
splatster	MBS: Meh, not really into the whole idea of a Mac Mini anymore	[10:03]
MBS	lol	[10:03]
splatster	Gonna get myself a new 15inch macbook pro	[10:03]
MBS	you should trade me your bitcoins for mtgox price amazon payments then	[10:03]
splatster	this one is three years old and has been through some tough times to say the least	[10:03]
*	Shaded (~Shaded@unaffiliated/shaded) has joined #bitcoin-otc	[10:04]
splatster	Meh again, freelancing pays USD usually	[10:04]
splatster	not sure these guys have heard of bitcoin	[10:04]
trigliu	sir goxalot	[10:04]
splatster	haven't asked	[10:04]
amiller	MtCoq	[10:04]
trigliu	MtHol	[10:05]
smickles	rg has the right idea, the benefit to the community would repay him enough	[10:05]
splatster	amiller: No need for sexual innuendoes in -otc.	[10:05]
rg	and thats what makes me hard	[10:05]
MBS	splatster, this one?	[10:06]
MBS	http://www.amazon.com/Apple-MacBook-MB985LL-15-4-Inch-Laptop/dp/B002C7458M/ref=sr_1_9?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1329033940&sr=1-9	[10:06]
splatster	MBS: I'm getting a custom one with high res display and some other upgraded specs	[10:06]
*	SomeoneWeird (~SomeoneWe@unaffiliated/someoneweird) has left #bitcoin-otc ("Leaving")	[10:06]
rg	http://www.ebay.com/itm/Apple-XServe-Dual-2-3GHz-PowerPC-G5-8GB-Ram-360GB-HDD-Leopard-10-5-/140701892280?pt=COMP_EN_Servers&hash=item20c27c7eb8	[10:06]
MBS	oh	[10:06]
rg	that would make such a sweet linux box	[10:06]
rg	So sweet	[10:06]
MBS	no it wouldnt	[10:07]
splatster	rg: The Xserves got discontinued by apple because of how load they were	[10:07]
MBS	how load	[10:07]
amiller	i just realized i'm IP banned from 4chan for 'CP' i assume because of running a tor relay	[10:07]
trigliu	rg, are there any el-cheapo datacenters in greater metro area. they might be able do a cabinet for much less than the city	[10:07]
*	plato has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)	[10:08]
smickles	what shitty isp do you have amiller ?	[10:08]
MBS	amiller, duh	[10:08]
trigliu	i thought 4chan promoted that stuff	[10:08]
trigliu	hmm	[10:08]
*	plato (~plato@98.143.152.29) has joined #bitcoin-otc	[10:09]
*	plato has quit (Changing host)	[10:09]
*	plato (~plato@unaffiliated/therealplato) has joined #bitcoin-otc	[10:09]
splatster	I am so annoyed when people don't capitalize	[10:09]
splatster	'I'	[10:09]
extor	there's a 0.0002% chance that tor relay helped someone organise a slutwalk for Riyadh. It was all worth it.	[10:09]
gmaxwell	amiller: relay not exit?	[10:09]
splatster	i is not I	[10:09]
gmaxwell	amiller: if you've never run an exit you need to flame the shit out of 4chan for incompetence in their tor blocking.	[10:09]
amiller	no it is an eit	[10:09]
amiller	exit	[10:09]
gmaxwell	Ah okay.	[10:09]
gmaxwell	yea, thats part of the cost of running an exit. FWIW, the eff advises agaisnt running exits at home.	[10:10]
MBS	inb4 FBI	[10:10]
amiller	i've run it for over a year but only occasionally have to enter a captcha in google	[10:10]
MBS	so are you gathering passwords from it?	[10:10]
amiller	i am at home but a renter...	[10:10]
gmaxwell	This is because should some idiot law enforcement folks not realize its an exit you might get all your computers swollowed up before they ask the obvious questions.	[10:10]
splatster	amiller: Capitalize your damn 'I's!	[10:10]
gmaxwell	Whereas if it's not in a home the law enforcement types will think twice before raiding and realize that it's an exit.	[10:11]
MBS	i dONT sEe Wha7 ur PROBLEM is splatster	[10:11]
trigliu	why would they care? they could stlil prosecute a tor exit and argue against a common carrier defense	[10:11]
splatster	;;leet What the fuck?!	[10:11]
gribble	Wh@ +h3 fuck?!	[10:11]
MBS	;;leet [getrating MBS]	[10:12]
gribble	U53r M8z, cr38d 0n 7u3 4pr 19 17:18:54 2011. Cumu1@!v3 r@!ng 49, fr0m 28 +0+41 r@!ngz. R3c3!v3d r@!ngz: 28 p05!+!v3, 0 n3g@!v3. S3n+ r@!ngz: 27 p05!+!v3, 0 n3g@!v3. D3+4!1z: h++p://b!+c0!n-0+c.c0m/v!3wr@!ngd3+4!1.php?n!ck=M8z Curr3n+1y 4u+h3n+!c8d fr0m h05+m45k M8z!~M8z@un4ff!1!8d/mbz	[10:12]
*	Silberfuchs (~Travel@p57B2B484.dip.t-dialin.net) has joined #bitcoin-otc	[10:12]
splatster	;;leet [getrating splatster]	[10:12]
gribble	U53r 5p1@5+3r, cr38d 0n Fr! J4n 13 22:39:48 2012. Cumu1@!v3 r@!ng 13, fr0m 10 +0+41 r@!ngz. R3c3!v3d r@!ngz: 10 p05!+!v3, 0 n3g@!v3. S3n+ r@!ngz: 12 p05!+!v3, 0 n3g@!v3. D3+4!1z: h++p://b!+c0!n-0+c.c0m/v!3wr@!ngd3+4!1.php?n!ck=5p1@5+3r Curr3n+1y 4u+h3n+!c8d fr0m h05+m45k 5p1@5+3r!~5p1@5+3r@un4ff!1!8d/5p1@5+3r	[10:12]
spawn-	;;leet [getrating spawn-]	[10:12]
gribble	U53r 5p4wn-, cr38d 0n z@ F3b 4 19:27:00 2012. Cumu1@!v3 r@!ng 25, fr0m 14 +0+41 r@!ngz. R3c3!v3d r@!ngz: 14 p05!+!v3, 0 n3g@!v3. S3n+ r@!ngz: 10 p05!+!v3, 0 n3g@!v3. D3+4!1z: h++p://b!+c0!n-0+c.c0m/v!3wr@!ngd3+4!1.php?n!ck=5p4wn- Curr3n+1y 4u+h3n+!c8d fr0m h05+m45k 5p4wn-!~h3115p4wn@193.200.91.132	[10:12]
spawn-	awesome! :)	[10:13]
MBS	;;binary [getrating MBS]	[10:13]
gribble	0101010101110011011001010111001000100000010011010100001001010011001011000010000001100011011100100110010101100001011101000110010101100100001000000110111101101110001000000101010001110101011001010010000001000001011100000111001000100000001100010011100100100000001100010011011100111010001100010011100000111010001101010011010000100000001100100011000000110001001100010010111000100000010000110111010101101 (6 more messages)	[10:13]
trigliu	https://blog.torproject.org/running-exit-node	[10:13]
*	wood (wood@umm.google-it.info) has joined #bitcoin-otc	[10:13]
smickles	;;supa1337 is better :P	[10:13]
gribble	;z \|>3++3\|2 :P	[10:13]
trigliu	but all that said.. i would probably prefer to run the node outside of my home country	[10:13]
trigliu	amiller: have you ever gotten any dmca complaints?	[10:14]
MBS	;;supa1337 [1337 [getrating MBS]]	[10:14]
trigliu	if you're rate limiting, probaly not	[10:14]
gribble	Error: "1337" is not a valid command.	[10:14]
MBS	;;supa1337 [leet [getrating MBS]]	[10:14]
gribble	\|_\|53\|2 //8z, <\|238<\| 0\|\| 7\|_\|3 4p\|2 19 17:18:54 2011. C\|_\|//\|_\|1@!/3 \|2@!\|\|g 49, f\|20// 28 +0+41 \|2@!\|\|gz. \|23<3!/3<\| \|2@!\|\|gz: 28 p05!+!/3, 0 \|\|3g@!/3. $3\|\|+ \|2@!\|\|gz: 27 p05!+!/3, 0 \|\|3g@!/3. \|)3+4!1z: \|-\|++p://\|>!+<0!\|\|-0+<.<0////!3//\|2@!\|\|g<\|3+4!1.p\|-\|p?\|\|!<\|<=//8z C\|_\|\|2\|23\|\|+1y 4\|_\|+\|-\|3\|\|+!<8<\| f\|20// \|-\|05+//45\|< (1 more message)	[10:14]
amiller	enough gribble spam	[10:14]
splatster	;;hash Does this work?	[10:14]
gribble	Error: "hash" is not a valid command.	[10:14]
rg	smickles	[10:14]
rg	what do you mean low use	[10:14]
splatster	;;sha256 Does this work?	[10:15]
gribble	Error: "sha256" is not a valid command.	[10:15]
splatster	:(	[10:15]
trigliu	;;supa1337 [clock]	[10:15]
splatster	;;binary Now I'm sad...	[10:15]
gribble	Error: You don't have the #bitcoin-otc,filter capability. If you think that you should have this capability, be sure that you are identified before trying again. The 'whoami' command can tell you if you're identified.	[10:15]
phantomcircuit	splatster, gribbles miner	[10:15]
phantomcircuit	lol	[10:15]
*	gribble gives voice to splatster	[10:15]
splatster	;;binary Now I'm sad...	[10:15]
gribble	Error: You don't have the #bitcoin-otc,filter capability. If you think that you should have this capability, be sure that you are identified before trying again. The 'whoami' command can tell you if you're identified.	[10:15]
splatster	:((((((((	[10:15]
trigliu	;;{getrating} mbs	[10:16]
splatster	trigliu: ;;getrating MBS	[10:16]
trigliu	ahh	[10:16]
smickles	rg: when did i say low use?	[10:17]
MBS	someone buy something from me	[10:17]
*	bitcoinTrader (~Adium@92.96.121.21) has joined #bitcoin-otc	[10:17]
smickles	also "I'm coming out of my dick nipples" <-- that is why 4chan is awesome	[10:17]
MBS	lol googled slutwalk	[10:18]
splatster	MBS: I'll buy a Macbook Pro that costs $2,400 for 75 BTC	[10:18]
MBS	nothx	[10:18]
smickles	;;lucky slutwalk	[10:18]
gribble	http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SlutWalk	[10:18]
MBS	most of the chicks in the pictures, "do not want to rape"	[10:18]
rg	08:07 rg: The Xserves got discontinued by apple because of how	[10:19]
rg	load they were	[10:19]
rg	i said smickles	[10:19]
rg	but clearly i meant splatster	[10:19]
rg	and i gave out several hints	[10:19]
rg	so.. its your fault for not getting them	[10:19]
rg	mmm... yes.... thats right	[10:19]
splatster	DISSED!	[10:19]
*	smickles missed the hints	[10:20]
splatster	*and dismissed	[10:20]
splatster	;;leet Well, I'm off to bed.	[10:20]
gribble	Error: You don't have the #bitcoin-otc,filter capability. If you think that you should have this capability, be sure that you are identified before trying again. The 'whoami' command can tell you if you're identified.	[10:20]
splatster	WTF!	[10:20]
smickles	lol	[10:20]
rg	So sweet	[10:20]
rg	see	[10:20]
MBS	http://www.zombietime.com/deconstructing_slutwalk/IMG_1033b.jpg	[10:20]
MBS	no	[10:20]
MBS	im pretty sure you are a cart	[10:21]
splatster	Who took away my filter capability?	[10:21]
splatster	damnit	[10:21]
rg	there's no xserves with the spec i need	[10:21]
splatster	W311, 1'm 0ff +0 b3d.	[10:21]
rg	;;leet later bro stack	[10:21]
phantomcircuit	MBS, that is a very confused cart	[10:21]
rg	l4t3r br0st4fF	[10:22]
smickles	splatster:	[10:22]
splatster	S33 j00 411 +0m0rr0w! D0n'+ b10w 411 y0ur c45h 0n w33d 4nd b10w.	[10:22]
trigliu	trolloscopy	[10:22]
splatster	smickles: WHAT? I need my sleep!	[10:22]
smickles	join #gpumax and play roulette with me realy quick	[10:22]
splatster	Uhg	[10:23]
splatster	okkkk	[10:23]
MBS	another confused cart: http://www.zombietime.com/deconstructing_slutwalk/IMG_0971.jpg	[10:23]
smickles	lol	[10:23]
paulzag	;;seen coinpal	[10:24]
gribble	I have not seen coinpal.	[10:24]
trigliu	sluttable	[10:25]
splatster	;;roulette	[10:26]
phantomcircuit	MBS, lold	[10:26]
splatster	Ok, -now- I'm going to bed	[10:27]
splatster	But seriously, don't blow your bitcoins on drugs.	[10:27]
splatster	See ya tomorrow	[10:27]
*	splatster has quit (Quit: Sunshine, sunshine, it's fine.)	[10:28]
MBS	http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FM5S-1XEdys&feature=player_embedded	[10:28]
MBS	totally gunna stop alot of rapes with that	[10:29]
MBS	lol at top youtube comment	[10:29]
MBS	Yeah, I think I'll stick with a gun.	[10:29]
paulzag	Anybody selling BTC for PPUSD?	[10:29]
OneFixt	MBS: hmm, that CAN mess someone up	[10:30]
OneFixt	you should claw the eyes while you're at it	[10:30]
MBS	not the way they are doing it	[10:30]
phantomcircuit	MBS, i like the lady in red second from right	[10:30]
phantomcircuit	clearly a tranny	[10:30]
smickles	http://pastebin.com/raw.php?i=3cjK4tR8	[10:30]
OneFixt	MBS: yeah, not quite that way... and not smiling	[10:30]
MBS	if you want to stop someone by getting their eyes, you dont do that fucking bird beak thing, you gotta do all you can to just rip their eyes out	[10:30]
phantomcircuit	teaching women half assed martial arts techniques is an excellent way to get them killed	[10:30]
MBS	really a thumb jab would be better	[10:31]
phantomcircuit	i was trying to explain this to someone recently and they just didn't get it	[10:31]
MBS	because the stupid bird beak thing would just spread pressure against eye instead of concentrating it	[10:31]
OneFixt	MBS: like this http://www.targetfocustraining.com/uploaded_images/Tim-Larkin-56-2-798809.jpg	[10:31]
rg	someone needs to file a fucking support ticket	[10:31]
rg	or something	[10:31]
MBS	and worse if you slightly missed with birdbeak thing, it wouldnt do shit	[10:31]
rg	i need something to do	[10:31]
MBS	while if you slightly miss with thumb, it can still turn and go into their eye socket	[10:32]
phantomcircuit	worse all of these strategies will just end up with getting your asskicked	[10:32]
phantomcircuit	ALL OF THEM	[10:32]
rg	phantomcircuit: order a vm	[10:32]
rg	then break it	[10:32]
MBS	SlutWalk organizers want to "publicly shame" rapists. Really? That's all?	[10:32]
MBS	I want to execute rapists.	[10:32]
phantomcircuit	rg, nothx	[10:33]
MBS	lol	[10:33]
MBS	worse all of these strategies will just end up with getting your ass raped	[10:33]
MBS	literally	[10:33]
smickles	MBS: you have a crooked sense of justice	[10:33]
trigliu	most humans are the descendant of a woman was raped	[10:33]
phantomcircuit	rg, you noticed that swap performance with qemu-kvm is fucking attrocious?	[10:33]
MBS	smickles, just posting from this page, lol	[10:33]
trigliu	its an awful crime	[10:33]
rg	phantomcircuit, what caching option are you using on your swap partition	[10:34]
MBS	phantomcircuit, you mean vm swap or host swap?	[10:34]
*	dvide_ has quit ()	[10:34]
phantomcircuit	i've said too much	[10:34]
trigliu	rg, isnt it 3:30 am where you are	[10:34]
MBS	screw vms	[10:34]
MBS	buy a cheap dedicated server from me	[10:34]
MBS	lol, finally got an order yesterday XD	[10:35]
phantomcircuit	lol was it my referral?	[10:35]
*	Now talking on #bitcoin-otc	[18:48]
*	Topic for #bitcoin-otc is: OTC marketplace for Bitcoin trading and exchange. \|\| http://bitcoin-otc.com/ \|\| Bot's control sequence is ';;'. \|\| Start with the ;;guide \|\| Before you trade, talk to people, and check user ratings. \|\| Beware the FRAUDSTERS. ;;fraud \|\| Trade Options: http://polimedia.us/btc \|\| Bitcoin VPS: http://www.bitvps.com \|\| Support bitcoin-otc! 1F1dPZxdxVVigpGdsafnZ3cFBdMGDADFDe	[18:48]
*	Topic for #bitcoin-otc set by nanotube at Mon Dec 19 23:38:55 2011	[18:48]
mircea_popescu	i wonder why wis.dm kicked the bucket.	[18:49]
mircea_popescu	it was fun five years ago or so.	[18:49]
*	BTC765 (6d818a80@gateway/web/freenode/ip.109.129.138.128) has joined #bitcoin-otc	[18:49]
BTC765	HI, IS ANYONE INTERESTED BY BUYING 40K SL FOR 30BTC?	[18:49]
BTC765	PLZ I RLY NEED THOSE 30BTC ASAP, I SEND THE 40K SL RIGHT NOW!	[18:51]
pirateat40	STOP YELLING!	[18:51]
BTC765	nobody ?	[18:52]
mcorlett	BTC765: It's been 3 minutes...	[18:52]
mcorlett	;;getrating BTC765	[18:53]
BTC765	usually how much time it takes, sry but i'm new here	[18:53]
BTC765	mcorlett are you interested?	[18:54]
*	xlcus (~xlcus@62.3.254.150) has joined #bitcoin-otc	[18:54]
mcorlett	Time before an interested party reads your post + time spent making the deal = amount of time spent waiting for a happy BTC765.	[18:55]
AcidicChip	BTC765, please read the guide, and get authed, no one will trade with you until you are authed, and most won't trade until you have atleast 1 good rating.	[18:55]
mcorlett	I'm not into Second Life, no. I'm busy enough with my own.	[18:56]
AcidicChip	BTC765 Once you read the guide and are authed, hit me up and I might be willing to do a smaller exchange to establish some trust and get your ratings started	[18:57]
AcidicChip	BTC765, start by typing: ;;guide	[18:57]
BTC765	can you send me the guide plz ? :) I'll do it right now	[18:57]
BTC765	ok	[18:58]
BTC765	;;guide	[18:58]
silvercoin	http://wiki.bitcoin-otc.com/wiki/Using_bitcoin-otc	[18:58]
AcidicChip	AFK a bit while yer doing that, need to get some caffeine running through my veins	[18:58]
mcorlett	nanotube: Do you know how many users actually follow through with registration after typing ;;guide?	[18:58]
mcorlett	It'd be an interesting statistic.	[18:58]
silvercoin	http://wiki.bitcoin-otc.com/wiki/GPG_authentication	[18:58]
nanotube	mcorlett: haha no idea, but i suppose the data can be collected from chanlogs and auth logs...	[19:00]
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nanotube	anyone know if sll are chargebackable?	[19:01]
BTC765	no chargeback with all, for sure :)	[19:01]
BTC765	sll	[19:02]
mcorlett	nanotube: Pretty sure they aren't. It's one of the credit card entry points via WirWox or whatever they're called.	[19:02]
mcorlett	To whom it may concern: I'm offering a bounty of 0.955 BTC for the following information: How many users actually follow through with registration after typing ;;guide.	[19:02]
silvercoin	not sure if serious	[19:02]
nanotube	mcorlett: by 'follow through' you mean successfully create an account, or does merely starting a register/eregister request count? :)	[19:02]
*	vuce (~vuce@89.142.243.131) has joined #bitcoin-otc	[19:03]
BTC765	nanotube: if you're interested, hit me up :)	[19:03]
mcorlett	nanotube: An account. Bonus points for how many actually get their first rating.	[19:03]
nanotube	BTC765: nah i don't do sl, sorry. but i've seen a few people around doing sll, so maybe. see if anything is on the order book?	[19:03]
silvercoin	;;guide	[19:04]
gribble	Guide to using #bitcoin-otc: http://wiki.bitcoin-otc.com/wiki/Using_bitcoin-otc	[19:04]
BTC765	nanotube: first I'm trying to understand how to set a gig :p	[19:04]
BTC765	gpg	[19:04]
*	MORA\| has quit ()	[19:04]
silvercoin	GPG --->http://www.gpg4win.org/	[19:04]
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BTC765	silvercoin: i'm a mac user :)	[19:05]
mcorlett	GPG ---> apt-get install gnupg	[19:05]
*	gribble gives voice to DeLorean719	[19:06]
mcorlett	BTC765: http://www.gpgtools.org/	[19:06]
BTC765	thanks	[19:06]
nanotube	mcorlett: put an order on the book with your bounty heh. or might you by any chance be interested in doing the data trawling yourself and are just looking for data?	[19:07]
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mcorlett	nanotube: I can do that. Can I withdraw it later, should the price skyrocket?	[19:08]
mcorlett	...and you'll have to rephrase the latter part, I didn't understand.	[19:08]
nanotube	all orders are conditional upon people actually directly negotiating the conditions of trade. they're not binding.	[19:09]
nanotube	latter part is - if you are interested in doing the work for yourself, i can give you chanlogs etc.	[19:09]
mcorlett	Oh, I can give it a try. Send 'em over, if it's not too much trouble.	[19:10]
nanotube	in a bit, going afk.	[19:11]
vragnaroda	mcorlett: With your bounty, what are the terms? It seems a bounty is not a good way to do that because it incentivizes a first answer, not an accurate answer.	[19:18]
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vragnaroda	mcorlett: Also, on that note, 7%. :p	[19:19]
lordcyfer	;;rate [ident MORA] 1 Perfect transaction	[19:20]
*	BTC035 (6d818a80@gateway/web/freenode/ip.109.129.138.128) has joined #bitcoin-otc	[19:20]
lordcyfer	;;rate [ident MORA\|] 1 a nice transaction	[19:21]
BTC035	Hre I'm back, I really don't have the time to subscribe, set up a gig etc... so here's a fire sale: I sell 38750 SL [$125] for ONLY 20 BTC [$95]	[19:21]
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BTC035	I can send the SL right now, but I need a reputable buyer	[19:21]
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BTC035	and as SL can't be chargeback, there is no way I can scam you...	[19:22]
AcidicChip	BTC035, it honestly only takes a minute, maybe 15 if you don't know what yer doing and are following the tutorials. No one will make such a large trade without auth or ratings, plain and simple. You've been here since last night, I'm sure you can spare another 15 minutes.	[19:23]
AcidicChip	I'm willing to help you out and get you started, but you have to take the first steps	[19:23]
BTC035	ok let's say I take the time to do it, what doest it change as I still need to make transactions to gain feedback	[19:24]
BTC035	I'm coming here only for ONE sell, because I need those btc asap	[19:25]
BTC035	and because VIRWOX sucks	[19:25]
AcidicChip	Once authed, I'll make a smaller trade with you, establish trust between you and I, plus I'll give you a positive rating (provided all goes well).	[19:25]
AcidicChip	I'm sure there will come another time when you need to exchange again, consider it an investment of time.	[19:26]
BTC035	Humm and can we do this in 15 min???	[19:26]
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BTC035	I mean as soon as I'm authed	[19:26]
mircea_popescu	re : To whom it may concern: I'm offering a bounty of 0.955 BTC for the following information: How many users actually follow through with registration after typing ;;guide. I'd bet on 10%.	[19:26]
AcidicChip	You're the one that's not authed. Get it going	[19:26]
BTC035	ok well I'm gonna do it, I'll be back in 15 min	[19:27]
mircea_popescu	should i put my bet in the book ? :D	[19:27]
AcidicChip	15 mins was rough guestimate of time. It only took me 10 minutes, and I didn't know much of what I was doing.	[19:28]
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Someguy123	http://blockchain.info/tx-index/15500646/2832ec7725832cb6a18d1b6153687cf43054d535f47874254b11077c8c9883ae	[19:30]
Someguy123	well this should clear up the issues with Metabank ^^	[19:30]
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vragnaroda	mircea_popescu: What's your bet?	[19:30]
mircea_popescu	say 1 btc ?	[19:30]
*	gribble gives voice to DeLorean719	[19:30]
vragnaroda	1 BTC on what, though?	[19:30]
mircea_popescu	o hey nice new blockexplorer site you got there someguy123	[19:31]
mircea_popescu	that the number of ppl making an acct after going ;;guide is about 10%	[19:31]
vragnaroda	lol, I said 7%.	[19:31]
AcidicChip	The question was, how many people follow the registration after typing ;;guide? I'd bet 2 BTC that the answer is less than 1%...	[19:31]
mircea_popescu	want odds ?	[19:32]
AcidicChip	I type ;;guide all the time, not for registration, but for other references	[19:32]
mircea_popescu	ya but we're talking unique ips acidic	[19:32]
AcidicChip	So, I'm sure I'd win the bet	[19:32]
AcidicChip	Gotcha	[19:32]
vragnaroda	But also, he didn't specify terms for accepting it so it's a bullshit offer anyway.	[19:32]
AcidicChip	Was hoping for a loophole. :P	[19:32]
mircea_popescu	:p	[19:32]
vragnaroda	AcidicChip: It wasn't how many times someone types ;;guide but how many people do.	[19:33]
mircea_popescu	well we'd need to negociate it, proposition bets aren't really that standardised vragnaroda. yiu say 7 i say 10, if its inside what do we do ?	[19:33]
vragnaroda	mircea_popescu: I'm not really betting on it. I just said 7 because his bounty as stated incentivizes first answers not correct answers.	[19:34]
vragnaroda	lol	[19:34]
mcorlett	mcorlett: With your bounty, what are the terms?	[19:34]
mircea_popescu	lol k	[19:35]
mcorlett	If you've done the data collection, you're obviously going to post it.	[19:35]
vragnaroda	lolwut	[19:35]
mircea_popescu	doesn't sound like much more than 1btc's worth of awking and greping tbh.	[19:36]
mircea_popescu	provided you have the logs.	[19:36]
BTC035	;;guide	[19:36]
vragnaroda	mircea_popescu: I don't have gribble's PM logs with other people.	[19:37]
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mircea_popescu	i imagine nano does tho right ? or does g even keep logs ?	[19:38]
vragnaroda	I'm pretty sure nano does.	[19:38]
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vragnaroda	I know I did ;;guide in PM before I registered.	[19:38]
mcorlett	I can switch things up if you'd like - you guys guess the percentage, nanotube supplies me with the logs, the closest wins the bounty? I don't think any one person has logs all the way back to day 1.	[19:39]
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Phoebus	I would if I was here, used to hang out in -dev :P	[19:40]
vragnaroda	lol, who else even knows all the channels gribble's in?	[19:42]
mircea_popescu	i imagine chan op must have all logs since chan starting	[19:42]
mircea_popescu	if they didn't get deleted	[19:42]
vragnaroda	Not all of the ops stay connected 24/7.	[19:42]
mircea_popescu	true...	[19:42]
mircea_popescu	anyway, all that said, i think mcorlett's q is worth answering.	[19:43]
vragnaroda	Yeah, but he should have asked it better. :p	[19:43]
mircea_popescu	purist.	[19:44]
mcorlett	Oh shut up, you.	[19:44]
mircea_popescu	lolz	[19:44]
mcorlett	Here I am, waving money in your face, and you criticize me.	[19:45]
mircea_popescu	pfff. btc is not money	[19:45]
mircea_popescu	it's some virtual imaginary thing	[19:45]
mircea_popescu	darn kids today...	[19:45]
mcorlett	If one can buy drugs with it, it's money.	[19:45]
vragnaroda	Next thing you know, mircea_popescu will be saying jenkem's not a real drug.	[19:45]
vragnaroda	mcorlett: I'll sell you some jenkem for BTC. 2.5 BTC/L. ;p	[19:46]
copumpkin	vragnaroda: what vintage?	[19:46]
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vragnaroda	lol	[19:47]
mircea_popescu	lmao	[19:47]
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mircea_popescu	popular street drugs among Zambian street children, exactly what you'd expect copumpkin to know vintages of.	[19:48]
copumpkin	oh, I'm a connoisseur of many things	[19:48]
mircea_popescu	dja know the joke with the friar who knew wines well ?	[19:48]
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copumpkin	nope	[19:49]
mircea_popescu	was this friar in like belgium. he knew all the french and german wines	[19:49]
mircea_popescu	to the degree that one sip he could tell you the grape, the vineyard	[19:49]
mcorlett	I don't like where this is going	[19:49]
mircea_popescu	even the vintage year, or who put it in barels	[19:49]
vragnaroda	I know Encyclopedia Dramatica is more informative than TOW but I don't think jenkem can really be said to be popular among Zambian street children.	[19:49]
mircea_popescu	so one day, to mock him, some kids filled a flask with a young maiden's piss	[19:49]
mircea_popescu	the friar took a healthy sip and went	[19:49]
mircea_popescu	15, a virgin and not from our parish.	[19:50]
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mircea_popescu	vragnaroda : allow me to appeal for 15 mn btcs : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jenkem	[19:50]
mircea_popescu	sorry, i mistyped. was "a heartfelt appeal".	[19:51]
mcorlett	mircea_popescu: ★☆☆☆☆	[19:51]
mircea_popescu	awww! PURIST!	[19:51]
vragnaroda	was reported to be	[19:51]
copumpkin	http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_of_the_Coprophages	[19:51]
copumpkin	mircea_popescu: hah	[19:51]
mircea_popescu	does he nail that bug expert chick btw ?	[19:52]
mircea_popescu	i don't really recall	[19:52]
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mircea_popescu	gribble you sucker, keep going for all the new people.	[19:54]
mircea_popescu	then they leave you hanging in the cold.	[19:54]
mcorlett	gribble: Open the pod bay doors.	[19:55]
*	lebek (~peter@31.220.209.43) has joined #bitcoin-otc	[19:57]
lebek	;;guide	[19:57]
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Someguy123	vragnaroda: [17:59:13] User Someguy123, created on Thu Dec 22 20:59:23 2011. Cumulative rating 5, from 4 total ratings.	[19:59]
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Someguy123	a positive rating after 2 months :D	[19:59]
lebek	;;ident	[20:01]
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vragnaroda	Yay!	[20:03]
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*	smickles\|idle is now known as smickles	[20:03]
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imsaguy	;;rated Someguy123	[20:05]
mircea_popescu	imsaguy, the omnirater.	[20:06]
*	gribble gives voice to imsaguy	[20:06]
imsaguy	;;rated Someguy123	[20:06]
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imsaguy	ooh, the behavior was changed again	[20:06]
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smickles	ident imsaguy	[20:06]
smickles	;;ident imsaguy	[20:06]
gribble	Nick 'imsaguy', with hostmask 'imsaguy!~nick@unaffiliated/imsaguy', is identified as user imsaguy, with GPG key id 7D7EA76776E6CE48, and key fingerprint A1398F4C58AC3D387F012AFA7D7EA76776E6CE48.	[20:06]
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BorGor	;;guide	[20:07]
imsaguy	only certain things work in channel	[20:07]
imsaguy	;;guide	[20:07]
gribble	Guide to using #bitcoin-otc: http://wiki.bitcoin-otc.com/wiki/Using_bitcoin-otc	[20:07]
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lebek	;;gpg eregister lebek 0B22C5AE5449FD90	[20:10]
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lebek	;;gpg everify freenode:#bitcoin-otc:432ef7209e4eaac97153a41fd48cb162e98a3b56badba5683afdbf88	[20:12]
gribble	Registration successful. You are now authenticated for user lebek with key 0B22C5AE5449FD90	[20:12]
bitcoinTrader	;;getrating bitcoinTrader	[20:13]
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lebek	;;ident imsaguy	[20:14]
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lebek	;;ident imsagod	[20:14]
gribble	Nick 'imsagod', with hostmask 'imsagod!~nick@unaffiliated/imsaguy', is identified as user imsaguy, with GPG key id 7D7EA76776E6CE48, and key fingerprint A1398F4C58AC3D387F012AFA7D7EA76776E6CE48.	[20:15]
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smickles	wts up to 6 btc call, strike 5.8, premium 0.25 usd, expiry 11:59 UTC 14 feb 2012, settlement within t+24 hrs. American style, pm to exercise. premium is time sensitive. I can also write a custom option.	[20:15]
lebek	;;book MTGGBP	[20:16]
smickles	or actually,	[20:16]
lebek	;;help buy	[20:17]
gribble	(buy [--long] [at\|@] []) -- Logs a buy order for units of , at a price of per unit, in units of . Use the optional field to put in any special notes. may include an arithmetical expression, and {mtgox(ask\|bid\|last)} to index price to mtgox ask, bid, or last price. May also include (1 more message)	[20:17]
smickles	wts up to 6 btc call, strike 5.6, premium 0.45 usd, expiry 11:59 UTC 14 feb 2012, settlement within t+24 hrs. American style, pm to exercise. premium is time sensitive. I can also write a custom option.	[20:17]
TruthTaco	willing to pay a bitcoin for help with an accounting quiz!	[20:17]
smickles	TruthTaco: what level of accounting?	[20:17]
smickles	and what sort	[20:17]
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TruthTaco	Just a community college accounting 1 class. I can upload the quiz so you can see the questions if you want... but I really need to make sure I get 95% of them right	[20:19]
smickles	TruthTaco: i might be able to help	[20:19]
smickles	can i see the quiz?	[20:19]
TruthTaco	yea one sec	[20:20]
lebek	;;buy 2 btc at 3.7 GBP bank transfer	[20:20]
gribble	Order id 6765 created.	[20:20]
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Mqrius	Can someone suggest good resources for a small business that is considering accepting bitcoin? In this case, it's King Arthur's Gold, a 2d CTF minecraft game that's looking for new payment options	[20:21]
BorGor	Verify the latest encrypt-authentication request by providing your decrypted one-time password. If verified, you'll be authenticated for the duration of the bot's or your IRC session on channel (whichever is shorter).	[20:21]
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BorGor	WHAT DOEST IT MEAN???	[20:21]
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smickles	Mqrius: https://bit-pay.com/ should be easy	[20:22]
mircea_popescu	so i just crunched some numbers	[20:23]
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mircea_popescu	and it comes out that bitcoin is roughly the same size as Romanian advertising (tv + print)	[20:23]
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mircea_popescu	and about 2.5 times the romanian online (publishing + ecommerce)	[20:23]
smickles	BorGor: it means you need to decrypt the message from gribble and send it back to it	[20:23]
BorGor	ok thank you	[20:23]
silvercoin	lol	[20:24]
mircea_popescu	mqrius : you mean sometyhing like http://blockchain.info/ ?	[20:24]
silvercoin	I think bitcoin trading would really take off if there was a more friendly userface that is just as secure.	[20:24]
mircea_popescu	you're right on that silvercoin.	[20:24]
Mqrius	mircea_popescu: Naw, it's a company just considering accepting it in general	[20:24]
mircea_popescu	but i mean they need a wallet or what ?	[20:25]
Mqrius	they need general info	[20:25]
Mqrius	on accepting, cashing out, etc	[20:25]
AcidicChip	;;guide	[20:25]
gribble	Guide to using #bitcoin-otc: http://wiki.bitcoin-otc.com/wiki/Using_bitcoin-otc	[20:25]
smickles	Mqrius: do they want a catered solution (like bitpay) or a custom solution (like what rg made for himself)	[20:26]
mircea_popescu	ya prolly what gribble said	[20:26]
Mqrius	Imma suggest both.	[20:27]
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smickles	bitpay is probably the easiest solution,	[20:28]
smickles	a custom solution would require a decent coder	[20:28]
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smickles	but it's not too tough	[20:29]
Mqrius	smickles: Are there any decent examples or anything I can link to?	[20:29]
smickles	it's something like a program that generates payment address and watches them for the correct deposit, then route to gox and cashout	[20:30]
lunks	Hey, I'm selling 20 BTC @ 6.5 USD at Paypal. Let me know if you're interested.	[20:30]
Mqrius	smickles: Yeah, that's roughly what I just told him	[20:30]
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mircea_popescu	all you need is curl	[20:31]
mircea_popescu	tanana	[20:31]
mircea_popescu	all you need is curl	[20:31]
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BTCTrader	6.5usdpp, funny!	[20:32]
lunks	BTCTrader: that's pretty much what paypal charges for me	[20:33]
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Zilllly	;;guide	[20:34]
Zilllly	;;	[20:34]
Zilllly	wtf	[20:35]
silvercoin	;;guide	[20:36]
gribble	Guide to using #bitcoin-otc: http://wiki.bitcoin-otc.com/wiki/Using_bitcoin-otc	[20:36]
silvercoin	he likes me better	[20:36]
silvercoin	youo ever get those stats on the ;;guide	[20:37]
smickles	Mqrius: i mean even the cashout part has an api	[20:37]
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silvercoin	it's true i have traded with lunks, because of where he lives pay pal charges him more	[20:47]
lunks	thanks silvercoin	[20:47]
silvercoin	If I were you lunks I'd find a new method, that 8% is rediculous.	[20:47]
lunks	I'm not planning to be a regular BTC seller, this is more of an emergency	[20:48]
lunks	I had some funds in BTC and I suddenly needed to retrieve them	[20:49]
lunks	Here in Brazil it's a pain to get BTC :P	[20:49]
silvercoin	Yea, I heard banks over there are money hoards.	[20:49]
silvercoin	Or at least charge a lot for things and have weird laws.	[20:50]
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napkin_	I am new to this bitcoin-deal, and I am trying to find a way to purchase 20 BTCs, any help ?	[21:03]
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Raccoon	napkin_: best bet is to set up a Dwolla account. It's like PayPal but not as restrictive about its use.	[21:04]
BTCTrader	i sell btc for amazon gift cards	[21:04]
BTCTrader	dont use paypal	[21:04]
Raccoon	then set up an MTGOX accont	[21:04]
BTCTrader	dwolla only works if he is US	[21:04]
napkin_	yeah that's what I figure, I set one up and it's on the verify stage	[21:04]
napkin_	so I suppose I just have to wait	[21:04]
Raccoon	he's in the US	[21:04]
smickles	napkin_: can you buy a moneypak?	[21:05]
napkin_	so then I go from dwolla > mtgox > my wallet?	[21:05]
napkin_	yes i can	[21:05]
Raccoon	Dwolla. Create an account -> Add bank checking info -> Wait 2-3 days for ACH transfer of two small deposits -> Verify bank checking info (said deposit amounts) -> Initiate Transfer $USD from checking to MtGox -> Wait 2-3 days for ACH transfer. No Movement on Weekends. Overall expected time from start to finish, 7 to 8 days. Start now.	[21:05]
smickles	then people will sell to you here	[21:05]
napkin_	i've seen I can do that, 5 dollar fee which isn't so bad	[21:05]
napkin_	wouldn't you first transfer to dwolla then from dwolla to mtgox?	[21:06]
Raccoon	dwolla offers direct target to mtgox. behind the scenes you are correc	[21:06]
BTCTrader	Why did Whitney Houston snort Splenda?	[21:06]
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napkin_	would anyone want to sell me btcs for moneypak?	[21:06]
Raccoon	also you need to set up with gribble	[21:07]
Raccoon	a GPG authentication	[21:07]
smickles	Raccoon: he doesn't /need/ to	[21:07]
Raccoon	he should.	[21:07]
napkin_	gribble is feedback?	[21:08]
Raccoon	yes.	[21:08]
midnightmagic	He definitely should. :)	[21:08]
smickles	yes, napkin_ you'll get more takers if you register with gribble	[21:08]
napkin_	also, could someone explain to me pgp key?	[21:08]
Raccoon	sadly, until someone writes a really clear step-by-step guide, the process will take you about 20-30 minutes to get oriented	[21:08]
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napkin_	yeah I've noticed it's a bit confusing, but I find it really interesting figuring this all out	[21:08]
napkin_	all the exchange from here to there to there to here to there to get BTCs etc	[21:09]
Raccoon	helpful tools are GPG and WGET, both for windows or linux	[21:09]
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smickles	however, there are plenty of people who will sell btc for moneypak with a photo of the receipt if you send first	[21:09]
napkin_	yeah i can do that	[21:09]
napkin_	is it same exchange rate as mtgox?	[21:09]
napkin_	or lowest or whatever?	[21:09]
smickles	but, i do encourage you to register with gribble	[21:09]
napkin_	will	[21:09]
Raccoon	that's up to negotiation	[21:09]
napkin_	what's typical ?	[21:09]
Raccoon	consider that it takes about 7 to 10 days to get cash from moneypak back into btc	[21:10]
smickles	typical is within 10% of mtgox last	[21:10]
Raccoon	so some people might ask for what they predict btc is potentially worth 10 days from now	[21:10]
smickles	although, usually, it's pretty close to mtgox last	[21:10]
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smickles	it is the weekend tho, fewer sellers are in the chat	[21:11]
napkin_	i just started looking into bitcoins today/yesterday, so it's still a bit fresh to me. Do the exchange rates fluctuate a lot? and is it always going up, -- or does it depend on the market like other economics?	[21:11]
Raccoon	both	[21:12]
Ken`	fluctuates quite a lot	[21:12]
smickles	quite a lot	[21:12]
BTCTrader	more down then up	[21:12]
Raccoon	sometimes it sits at the same value for weeks or months, other times it goes through a lot of commotion	[21:12]
smickles	BTCTrader: that depends on your vantage point	[21:12]
Raccoon	especially when bitcoin is mentioned on TV	[21:12]
BTCTrader	my vantage point is last july	[21:12]
napkin_	so when it gets more popular btcs are worth more, I take it	[21:13]
Raccoon	from last year, it's worth about 5X as much	[21:13]
Raccoon	but it's also worth about 1/6th of it's max value	[21:13]
Raccoon	so it's pretty much in the middle	[21:14]
napkin_	really strange	[21:14]
napkin_	such a cool concept though	[21:14]
napkin_	it's amazing that it actually works out	[21:14]
Raccoon	bitcoins are just shiney rocks	[21:14]
Raccoon	they have whatever value you place on them	[21:14]
BorGor	Selling 38775 lindens [140USD] for 20 BTC	[21:14]
BTCTrader	looks like a test to 5.5 now	[21:16]
Raccoon	i've even heard bitcoin explained as a "rating of credit". in that, people with a lot of it can be seen as having a "high credit score" they can exchange for a "lower credit score" if you give them money.	[21:16]
smickles	that's an odd one	[21:17]
Raccoon	that's essentially how any credit system works, right?	[21:17]
BTCTrader	jarred uses the "public ledger book" analogy	[21:18]
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napkin_	so it's basically a universal currency, in addition	[21:18]
napkin_	i'm sure it fluctuates depending on the general economy as well, in all markets	[21:18]
Raccoon	currency can be a dangerous word, since it implies coinage	[21:18]
napkin_	yeah	[21:18]
BTCTrader	universal and open source	[21:18]
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BTCTrader	you can buy bitcoin coins	[21:19]
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lebek	in what sense is bitcoin universal?	[21:20]
smickles	cuz i can send btc to Andromeda	[21:20]
smickles	;)	[21:20]
Raccoon	in the sense that it's not actually part of a national economy	[21:20]
BTCTrader	because it is not delimited by national boundaries	[21:20]
Raccoon	it's autonomous	[21:20]
lebek	universal would suggest you can use it anywhere	[21:21]
BTCTrader	time to sell :D	[21:21]
lebek	it doesn't have geographic/political boundaries but still has boundaries	[21:21]
Mqrius	smickles: Distance would cause blockchain splits ;)	[21:21]
celeste	Hi i have a $50 dollar CVS pharmacy email gift card i will send first i want 4 bitcoins for it thank you	[21:21]
Raccoon	4?	[21:22]
celeste	yes 4	[21:22]
Raccoon	you're offering $12.5 per btc?	[21:22]
smickles	Mqrius: i've read discussion that intra-solarsystem would work tho	[21:22]
Mqrius	smickles: That thread was a bit weird though, if we're talking about the same one :P	[21:22]
lebek	12.5 CVS dollars	[21:22]
BTCTrader	are cvs cards reversible?	[21:22]
celeste	how much is it worth?	[21:23]
celeste	no	[21:23]
smickles	Mqrius: anyway, it was in jest ;)	[21:23]
BTCTrader	i could send the you btc	[21:23]
Raccoon	celeste: type /msg gribble ;;buy 4 BTC at 12.5 USD "as a $50 CVS Pharmacy gift card."	[21:23]
Mqrius	smickles: Yeah :P	[21:23]
celeste	ok BTCTrader	[21:24]
celeste	pm me	[21:24]
lunks	I'm still selling 20 BTC @ 6.5 USD using Paypal, need some personal info if you're new. Let me know if you're interested!	[21:34]
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stamit	gentlemen, we need shotguns. the bears are charging	[21:43]
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pirateat40	They wont get far... we got the place surrounded.	[21:43]
stamit	i don't care if it's an endangered species. shoot!	[21:44]
pirateat40	Shoot it, Shoot it...	[21:44]
pirateat40	http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gCe-1LYj_4o	[21:44]
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*	stamit jokes fund: 1iJs2MAuhCVJJ2H1zuTtwNB7gMy8msQ4L	[21:45]
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AcidicChip	;;rate BorGor 1 Great transaction, easy to work with. Will do more business. Thanks!	[21:50]
gribble	Rating entry successful. Your rating of 1 for user BorGor has been recorded.	[21:50]
celeste	BTCTrader is a good man and a very good trader thanks once again	[21:52]
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BTCTrader	thx :D	[21:53]
celeste	np	[21:53]
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smickles	.title	[21:55]
markac	smickles: Toyota Tacoma Loch Ness Monster Ad - YouTube	[21:55]
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napkin_	is there a link that can help me install gribble?	[22:09]
BorGor	;;guide	[22:09]
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napkin_	i'm running xchat	[22:09]
napkin_	[on windows]	[22:09]
TruthTaco	;;guide	[22:09]
BorGor	how can i open a conversation with someone ? :)	[22:10]
dirkdizzler	type	[22:10]
dirkdizzler	forms words from letters and sentences from words	[22:10]
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dirkdizzler	mix in punctuation	[22:10]
napkin_	lol, guide didn't pop anything up ?	[22:10]
napkin_	;;guide	[22:12]
napkin_	aha!	[22:12]
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EasyAt	Can I see messages if gribble already delivered them to me?	[22:15]
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smickles	;;voiceme	[22:17]
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smickles	nwo	[22:17]
smickles	er, now	[22:17]
smickles	EasyAt: do you mean ";;later tell" messages?	[22:18]
vinhpk	hello	[22:18]
vinhpk	;;later tell	[22:18]
smickles	howdy	[22:18]
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EasyAt	Uhm I dunno. I came in onetime and gribble had a couple messages waiting... but i completly forget the content	[22:20]
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BorGor_	;;getrating AcidicChip	[22:23]
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BorGor_	;;getrating BorGor	[22:24]
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celeste	Hi i have a $150 dollar CVS pharmacy email gift card i will send first i have just traded a $50 one with BTCTrader with no problems thank you.	[22:37]
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bulanula	everify	[22:38]
bulanula	;;gpg eauth	[22:38]
napkin_	where do I get my one time everify password? it didn't go in my clipboard like video says	[22:39]
celeste	wot was your password to kleopata	[22:39]
celeste	that is your ontime password	[22:40]
napkin_	says not correct, hm	[22:40]
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napkin_	the decrypted one-time pw?	[22:41]
celeste	think	[22:41]
celeste	yes	[22:41]
celeste	when you set up kleopatra	[22:41]
celeste	they ask you for a one time password	[22:42]
napkin_	yeah, i tried that.. maybe i should start over	[22:42]
celeste	i dosent go to windows clip board	[22:43]
celeste	it goes to kleopatra clip board	[22:43]
celeste	so kleo has to be open	[22:43]
celeste	in taskbar	[22:43]
napkin_	yeah, i did the decrypt put in pgp key then typed in my one-time pw that i used when i setup kleo	[22:44]
napkin_	unless i just typed it incorrectly, which i swear i didn't	[22:44]
celeste	cop and paste	[22:44]
celeste	copy	[22:44]
celeste	Hi i have a $150 dollar CVS pharmacy email gift card i will send first i have just traded a $50 one with BTCTrader with no problems thank you.	[22:46]
napkin_	still no dice hmm, can I reset my one-time decrypted passphrase?	[22:47]
celeste	dont think so	[22:47]
celeste	do you get a link?	[22:48]
celeste	yes	[22:48]
napkin_	i got the very long pgp link	[22:48]
celeste	does it open	[22:48]
napkin_	the link opens yes	[22:48]
celeste	to a tab	[22:49]
celeste	in a tab	[22:49]
napkin_	yes	[22:49]
celeste	copy message al of it	[22:50]
celeste	all	[22:50]
celeste	every bit	[22:50]
napkin_	yup start to finish	[22:50]
lunks	I'm still selling 20 BTC @ 6.5 USD using Paypal, need some personal info if you're new. Let me know if you're interested!	[22:51]
celeste	do you have kleo runnig	[22:51]
napkin_	yes	[22:51]
celeste	in the taskbar on right hand side of computer	[22:52]
celeste	kleo	[22:52]
celeste	yes	[22:52]
napkin_	then i go to decrypt, put in my password, says it completes, no signatures found, then i try to paste/put in my pw and says it's incorrect	[22:53]
celeste	click decrypt and verify	[22:53]
celeste	yes	[22:53]
*	pingdrive has quit (Quit: Leaving)	[22:53]
napkin_	i was supposed to change to pgp.mit.edu yes?	[22:54]
celeste	you have got message no signatures found	[22:55]
celeste	yes	[22:55]
napkin_	correct	[22:55]
celeste	now go back to gribble	[22:56]
celeste	yes	[22:56]
mcorlett	Any Swedes in here? Speak up!	[22:56]
napkin_	it doesn't seem to be pasting anything, it looks like i'm trying to get a decrypted key of the link it sent me	[22:57]
napkin_	but it doesn't paste	[22:57]
napkin_	i wonder if it's cuz i am typing on dvorak, but right click > paste should work	[22:57]
celeste	you are very close	[22:58]
Mqrius	down 9k	[22:58]
celeste	it seems to me you have password wrong	[22:58]
celeste	you will get it	[23:01]
celeste	Hi i have a $150 dollar CVS pharmacy email gift card i will send first i have just traded a $50 one with BTCTrader with no problems thank you.	[23:01]
*	malkauns (~neil@c-24-130-197-14.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) has joined #bitcoin-otc	[23:02]
*	MrTiggr has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)	[23:02]
BTCTrader	buy it before i do again, please	[23:02]
celeste	lol	[23:02]
*	whutruduin has quit (Quit: Leaving)	[23:02]
napkin_	aight i got past that part, i think it was a dvorak/qwerty password shit	[23:03]
celeste	you got ?	[23:04]
celeste	it	[23:04]
celeste	yes	[23:04]
*	Dark_Apostrophe has quit (Remote host closed the connection)	[23:04]
celeste	i will help you	[23:04]
celeste	dont worry	[23:04]
celeste	we will sort it out	[23:04]
celeste	that video is not that clear on instructions	[23:05]
napkin_	i think i got it	[23:07]
napkin_	how do i look someone up?	[23:07]
celeste	does your one time pass work	[23:08]
celeste	;;getrating napkin	[23:09]
napkin_	You are now authenticated for user napkin	[23:09]
celeste	;;getrating	[23:09]
napkin_	;;getrating celeste	[23:09]
celeste	napkin ya	[23:09]
celeste	well done	[23:09]
celeste	;; last	[23:10]
*	M4v3R (~M4v3R@unaffiliated/m4v3r) has joined #bitcoin-otc	[23:10]
*	nmat has quit (Quit: Page closed)	[23:10]
*	nmat (529a0d92@gateway/web/freenode/ip.82.154.13.146) has joined #bitcoin-otc	[23:10]
celeste	;;getrating napkin	[23:11]
*	dwon has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)	[23:11]
celeste	napkin This user has not yet been rated. Currently authenticated from hostmask napkin_!~Admin@c-98-240-186-81.hsd1.mn.comcast.net	[23:11]
celeste	good job	[23:11]
napkin_	tyty wasn't too bad	[23:11]
Tril	;;getrating [ident napkin_]	[23:12]
*	GlooBoy (48948d9a@gateway/web/freenode/ip.72.148.141.154) has joined #bitcoin-otc	[23:13]
M4v3R	Heh, I knew it we'll see 5.4 again	[23:13]
napkin_	so when do i get a page of feedback? after i do a sale?	[23:13]
celeste	Hi i have a $150 dollar CVS pharmacy email gift card i will send first i have just traded a $50 one with BTCTrader with no problems thank you.	[23:13]
celeste	yes	[23:13]
celeste	you cant rate someone untill you are rated	[23:13]
celeste	so buy or sell btc	[23:14]
celeste	and you will get rated	[23:14]
celeste	are you buying or selling?	[23:14]
napkin_	i am trying to purchase btcs	[23:14]
*	johndoenotme has quit (Quit: Page closed)	[23:14]
celeste	payment method?	[23:15]
napkin_	not sure am flexible	[23:15]
napkin_	was thinking moneydot	[23:15]
napkin_	or paypal but i hate the fees	[23:15]
celeste	money pack is best	[23:15]
celeste	moneydot	[23:15]
napkin_	i'm just sorta waiting on dwolla to link w/ bank, thought i might as well try this	[23:16]
*	BTCTrader should of sold at 10	[23:16]
celeste	how many coins	[23:16]
napkin_	20	[23:16]
*	dwon (~dwon@75-119-251-37.dsl.teksavvy.com) has joined #bitcoin-otc	[23:16]
celeste	with paypal?	[23:16]
BTCTrader	friends dont let friends use paypal	[23:16]
napkin_	i mean i have the option	[23:16]
smickles	yeah, napkin_ if you continue to try throughout the day or put the offer in the book, you should be able to find a seller fairly soon	[23:17]
celeste	yes	[23:17]
celeste	but paypal is bad	[23:17]
smickles	napkin_: weren't you buying with moneypak?	[23:17]
napkin_	i can	[23:17]
*	smickles reads log	[23:17]
GlooBoy	;;guide	[23:17]
napkin_	this IRC is way helpful; i swear i would've said fuck it if I didn't have some encouragement	[23:17]
smickles	MP is usually best for -otc "newbies"	[23:17]
celeste	napkin press my name	[23:18]
napkin_	MP is really convenient	[23:18]
celeste	pm me	[23:18]
smickles	;;getrating [ident celeste]	[23:18]
BorGor_	;;help rate	[23:18]
smickles	napkin_: beware, celeste isn't authed ... (no offense intended celeste )	[23:19]
celeste	np	[23:20]
napkin_	celeste seems to know a bit about this though	[23:20]
napkin_	but yeah you never know	[23:20]
celeste	just traded with btc trader	[23:20]
BTCTrader	btctrader > legit > foodst4amp	[23:21]
smickles	foodst4amp is like a bad word	[23:21]
BTCTrader	:D	[23:21]
napkin_	;;voiceme	[23:22]
BTCTrader	yes but a highly memorable one, i had his video tour of his house at one point	[23:22]
BTCTrader	it was full of lolz	[23:22]
smickles	napkin_: you need to be authed with gribble before ;;voiceme will work	[23:23]
napkin_	i guess i need to be here a day or some shit too	[23:23]
AcidicChip	;;voiceme	[23:23]
*	gribble gives voice to AcidicChip	[23:23]
napkin_	i am authed	[23:23]
napkin_	i believe	[23:24]
AcidicChip	Woot, I'm cool now.	[23:24]
smickles	;;ident napkin_	[23:24]
gribble	Nick 'napkin_', with hostmask 'napkin_!~Admin@c-98-240-186-81.hsd1.mn.comcast.net', is identified as user napkin, with GPG key id 67FB58AF3DE3BF93, and key fingerprint 29308393FF76C74F67CEADE167FB58AF3DE3BF93.	[23:24]
smickles	oh wow, i guess there is a minimum time	[23:24]
napkin_	i'm just hella quick	[23:24]
napkin_	:P	[23:24]
smickles	AcidicChip: welcome to the club ;)	[23:25]
AcidicChip	Thanks. :D	[23:25]
*	AcidicChip sets mode: +m #bitcoin-otc	[23:25]
AcidicChip	:P	[23:25]
pirateat40	hmmm	[23:26]
napkin_	so basically gribble proves that userid = same person who has feedback	[23:26]
*	pirateat40 pirateat40 kicks AcidicChip from #bitcoin-otc: Just Cause	[23:26]
smickles	hmmm is better than grr	[23:26]
*	xHire has quit (Remote host closed the connection)	[23:26]
pirateat40	damn, messed it up	[23:26]
AcidicChip	f@!1	[23:26]
*	smickles read that as "fart"	[23:27]
*	BTCTrader has quit (Quit: BTCTrader)	[23:27]
*	mcorlett has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)	[23:27]
*	M4v3R has quit (Quit: Bitmarket.eu - you place to exchange Bitcoin)	[23:29]
smickles	damn, the chip i'm eating formed into a 'scissor' and tried to cut my tongue out :o	[23:30]
*	BorGor_ has quit (Quit: Page closed)	[23:30]
*	silvercoin (47442431@gateway/web/freenode/ip.71.68.36.49) has joined #bitcoin-otc	[23:31]
*	xHire (~xhire@kos.paskuli.cz) has joined #bitcoin-otc	[23:31]
*	BTCTrader (~aaa@unaffiliated/btctrader) has joined #bitcoin-otc	[23:32]
*	olp (~onelinepr@riwsclient-136-244.riws.ualberta.ca) has left #bitcoin-otc	[23:32]
napkin_	btctrader can i pm you quick?	[23:33]
BTCTrader	yes	[23:33]
silvercoin	;; eauth silvercoin	[23:34]
AcidicChip	silvercoin, would your name happen to imply that you would be willing to trade BTC for USD Silver Currency?	[23:35]
AcidicChip	I have a few empty slots in my collection I would mind filling up via BTC.	[23:35]
*	Justasic has quit (Excess Flood)	[23:36]
silvercoin	Sorry Acid, tid just a nick.	[23:36]
silvercoin	tis'*	[23:36]
AcidicChip	Gotcha. Anyone else might be trading USD silver currency for BTC?	[23:37]
*	trisdan (59f6d94a@gateway/web/freenode/ip.89.246.217.74) has joined #bitcoin-otc	[23:37]
AcidicChip	Or how about silver in general?	[23:37]
*	AcidicChip clasps his hand firmly around the tail of his large trout "ANYONE?!"	[23:37]
MORA\|	I have solder paste with silver in it :)	[23:38]
AcidicChip	Extract the silver and comprize 1 troy ounce, and we'll talk	[23:38]
*	Justasic (~Justasic@unaffiliated/justasic) has joined #bitcoin-otc	[23:38]
*	olp (~onelinepr@riwsclient-136-244.riws.ualberta.ca) has joined #bitcoin-otc	[23:39]
AcidicChip	Willing to buy 1 troy oz of silver for 5 BTC	[23:40]
silvercoin	Are you looking to get silver or get rid of BTC?	[23:40]
AcidicChip	I'm willing to do which ever has the higher markup at the time. :D	[23:40]
*	ovidiusoft2 has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)	[23:41]
AcidicChip	I often thought about making a bank that would issue tangible items for your bitcoins, and visa-versa... Kind of opposite of what the government does now, lol	[23:41]
AcidicChip	goverment/banks	[23:41]
AcidicChip	each tangible "bitcoin" would have a serial number associated to it's entry in the wallet... Prolly not worth my time, doubt anyone would actually use it	[23:42]
AcidicChip	Would be nice to hand someone something tangible if out inthe streets and be able to redeem it for bitcoins	[23:42]
*	dwon has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)	[23:43]
AcidicChip	I guess issueing the tangible item in and out of BTC would become a mess though	[23:44]
*	AcidicChip tucks that idea away	[23:44]
smickles	AcidicChip: see Casascius	[23:44]
silvercoin	It'd still requie a high level of trust.	[23:44]
silvercoin	itted	[23:45]
smickles	;;bc,wiki casascius	[23:45]
gribble	https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Casascius_physical_bitcoins \| Jan 2, 2012 ... Casascius physical bitcoins, also called Casascius coins, are physical metal coins created by Bitcoin user Casascius (Mike Caldwell, Sandy, ...	[23:45]
*	hngryhngryhippo (~hngryhngr@pool-71-191-150-126.washdc.fios.verizon.net) has joined #bitcoin-otc	[23:45]
silvercoin	Unless you had a third party insurer but that just means fees.	[23:45]
silvercoin	brb	[23:45]
*	silvercoin has quit (Quit: Page closed)	[23:45]
smickles	;;bc,wiki bitbills	[23:46]
gribble	https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Bitbills \| Nov 27, 2011 ... A Bitbill is a plastic card that holds the cryptographic key that will allow the face value amount of the card to be spent. The key is on a QR code ...	[23:46]
smickles	;;bc,wiki printcoin	[23:46]
*	bulanula has quit (Quit: Page closed)	[23:46]
*	dwon (~dwon@2607:f2c0:a000:c0:217:31ff:fe53:f7c7) has joined #bitcoin-otc	[23:47]
gribble	https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/PrintCoins \| Nov 27, 2011 ... PrintCoins are purchased as paper-stock and are later loaded with value. PrintCoins were announced on November 27, 2011.	[23:47]
*	MORA\| has quit ()	[23:48]
*	nelisky (~nelisky@unaffiliated/nelisky-/x-0749711) has joined #bitcoin-otc	[23:48]
BTCTrader	4.19. damn	[23:51]
celeste	Last price:$5.53845	[23:52]
*	Cablesaurus has quit (Quit: Some folks are wise, and some otherwise.)	[23:52]
BTCTrader	opps, was looking in euro	[23:53]
celeste	lol	[23:53]
*	Sil has quit (Quit: Verlassend)	[23:53]
celeste	it is holding it own around 5.5 and 6	[23:53]
kakobrekla	maybe you would be interested in #bitcoin-otc-eu BTCTrader	[23:53]
celeste	strong coin	[23:53]
*	splatster has quit (Quit: Linkinus - http://linkinus.com)	[23:54]
*	UNOE227 (~mmc@unaffiliated/unoe227) has joined #bitcoin-otc	[23:57]
*	hngryhngryhippo has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)	[23:57]
celeste	BTCTrader bitcoins will just get bigger and bigger but they have made only so many so they will 100% go up and up think about it	[23:58]
*	nmat has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)	[23:58]
*	angusbates100 (56001573@gateway/web/freenode/ip.86.0.21.115) has joined #bitcoin-otc	[23:59]

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