Forum logs for 10 Dec 2014
Sunday, 24 November, Year 11 d.Tr. | Author: Mircea Popescu
assbot | [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 10 @ 0.12800001 = 1.28 BTC [+] | [00:04] |
mircea_popescu | [00:09] | |
mircea_popescu | [00:10] | |
mircea_popescu | ;;rate EPiSKiNG- 1 New blood :p | [00:11] |
gribble | Rating entry successful. Your rating of 1 for user EPiSKiNG- has been recorded. | [00:11] |
decimation | there is plenty of 'hard work' going on in the us, just misdirected | [00:11] |
mircea_popescu | !up EPiSKiNG- | [00:11] |
-assbot- | You voiced EPiSKiNG- for 30 minutes. | [00:11] |
* | assbot gives voice to EPiSKiNG- | [00:11] |
mircea_popescu | there you go. | [00:11] |
decimation | !up badon | [00:11] |
* | assbot gives voice to badon | [00:11] |
mircea_popescu | decimation quite. | [00:12] |
thestringpuller | !t m s.qntr | [00:12] |
assbot | [MPEX:S.QNTR] 1D: 0 / 0 / 0 (0 shares, 0 BTC), 7D: / / ( shares, BTC), 30D: 0.00015 / 0.00015943 / 0.00016 (5300 shares, 0.85 BTC) | [00:12] |
mircea_popescu | [00:13] | |
decimation | Yeah I am going to have to work it out for myself it seems | [00:13] |
decimation | using the secp256k1 parameters | [00:13] |
mircea_popescu | tho i am very suspicious of ecdsa for what you'd call "political" reasons. | [00:15] |
mircea_popescu | as in, notscientific. | [00:15] |
decimation | yeah, I agree | [00:15] |
mircea_popescu | but there's also some scienfitic doubt. you really don't know a) how good a "random curve" is n the generla case ; b) you don't really know how to calculate the quality of a good curve. | [00:15] |
mircea_popescu | asciilifeform's fond of pointing out to the pi problem of "random numbers", ie, for all you know xth index of pi digits is random | [00:16] |
mircea_popescu | for FUCKING OBVIOUS reasons, such as... the involvement of pi! this is true for curves too. | [00:16] |
decimation | yeah this is why RSA seems more compelling | [00:16] |
decimation | people have been banging their heads against factoring large primes for a long time | [00:16] |
mircea_popescu | there's also that. | [00:17] |
mircea_popescu | in fact the reason why we favour rsa is quite long. | [00:17] |
mircea_popescu | list of reasons* | [00:17] |
decimation | I can see why satoshi avoided using the nist curves, but using ecc in general was probably a bad move | [00:17] |
decimation | it's true it greatly reduced the size of the blockchain, but at what cost? | [00:18] |
mircea_popescu | well, he hedged his bets. | [00:18] |
mircea_popescu | ecdsa alone isn't enough to breach it. | [00:18] |
mircea_popescu | it has to be said, again and again, lest anyone forgets : this was designed as a prototype. | [00:18] |
mircea_popescu | it's what it is. | [00:18] |
TomServo | ha! did orlov crib 'infinite hit points? | [00:18] |
mircea_popescu | he did ? | [00:19] |
TomServo | Consider this: knowledge is always limited and specific, but ignorance is infinite and completely general; knowledge is hard to convey, and travels no faster than the speed of light, but ignorance is instantaneous at all points in the known and unknown universe, including alternate universes and dimensions of whose existence we are entirely ignorant. In short, there is a limit to how much you can | [00:20] |
TomServo | know, but there is no limit at all to how much you don't know but think you do! | [00:20] |
asciilifeform | factoring large primes << l0l! i'll factor any large prime for you, free! limited time 0ff3r! | [00:20] |
mircea_popescu | eh i don't have a lien on that. | [00:20] |
TomServo | Just immediately reminded me of it is all. | [00:21] |
decimation | asciilifeform: sorry, I mean factoring large composites :) | [00:21] |
mircea_popescu | lol | [00:21] |
mircea_popescu | such a stickler is he :D | [00:21] |
asciilifeform | laugh, but bill gates referred to the great unsolved problem 'factoring large primes' in one of 'his' 'books', in dead tree print. | [00:22] |
mircea_popescu | TomServo it does link nicely. | [00:22] |
decimation | orlov is right that wages haven't increased, but prices have fallen | [00:24] |
decimation | at least, for food and computers | [00:25] |
asciilifeform | re: public key: incidentally, agitprop! http://www.theregister.co.uk/2014/12/03/gchq_boffins_quantumbusted_own_crypto_primitive | [00:25] |
assbot | GCHQ boffins quantum-busted its OWN crypto primitive • The Register ... ( http://bit.ly/1uipowx ) | [00:25] |
mircea_popescu | not for food, per se. | [00:25] |
decimation | yeah, for 'food' | [00:25] |
mircea_popescu | just, they found ways to repackage cheaper shit as food. | [00:25] |
asciilifeform | and 'computers' | [00:25] |
decimation | I was pricing a nice wild-caught salmon from alaska, goes for $20 per lb at the cheap rate | [00:25] |
mircea_popescu | my own personal opinion is you're taking that too far. srsly, current cpus are worth 80 2014 dollars | [00:25] |
mircea_popescu | if a z80 was worth 40 1980 dollars. | [00:26] |
asciilifeform | for numeric wrangling, sure, i'll take 2014. see last week's thread. | [00:26] |
asciilifeform | for overall quality of life - 1980. | [00:26] |
mircea_popescu | i thought you were kinda arguing both ends of a candle here :p | [00:26] |
asciilifeform | it's burning on both ends! | [00:27] |
mircea_popescu | so blow. | [00:27] |
decimation | the problem is that 2014 has 1980 built into is core, under layers of 'tardation | [00:27] |
mircea_popescu | but faster bus :D | [00:27] |
BingoBoingo | It's a fucking candle, piss it out. | [00:27] |
asciilifeform | 1980 built into its core << only the bad parts | [00:27] |
decimation | heh yeah | [00:27] |
mircea_popescu | you can't argue with that part. they got really good at printing them. | [00:28] |
decimation | no lisp machine in an x86 | [00:28] |
mircea_popescu | these specific things, like the quality of paints... | [00:28] |
mircea_popescu | asciilifeform dja recall soviet paints of the 80s ? | [00:28] |
mircea_popescu | that maroon ? | [00:28] |
asciilifeform | aha | [00:28] |
asciilifeform | there's a post office here where i live now, that seems to have been painted with the very same paints | [00:28] |
mircea_popescu | those shitty plastics of the era... not really very mouldable... | [00:29] |
* | Vexual (~x@unaffiliated/vexual) has joined #bitcoin-assets | [00:30] |
decimation | I know for certain that nazi-era IG farben was way ahead of the world in paint technology at the time | [00:31] |
mircea_popescu | [00:31] | |
mircea_popescu | they run it because they're not smart enough to even figure there's away out of the paper bag, as a principle. | [00:32] |
BingoBoingo | !up Vexual | [00:32] |
* | assbot gives voice to Vexual | [00:32] |
asciilifeform | http://imgur.com/79DTA7H << 'no parking' sign outside of that post office. (i don't presently have a photo of the inside.) | [00:34] |
assbot | imgur: the simple image sharer ... ( http://bit.ly/1uiruMX ) | [00:34] |
decimation | http://imgur.com/79DTA7H << "By 2020, current cost trends will lead to an average cost of between $15 billion and $20 billion for a leading-edge fab, according to the report. By 2016, the minimum capital expenditure budget needed to justify the building of a new fab will range from $8 billion to $10 billion for logic, $3.5 billion to $4.5 billion for DRAM and $6 billion to $7 billion for NAND flash, according to the report." | [00:35] |
assbot | imgur: the simple image sharer ... ( http://bit.ly/1uirH2T ) | [00:35] |
mircea_popescu | decimation "at the time" for 1940 tho. | [00:35] |
decimation | this strikes me as more limiting than physics | [00:35] |
mircea_popescu | i linked aus dem leben der marionetten here yest. | [00:36] |
mircea_popescu | if you're curious to get a feel for the actual flavour of everyday bvack then, it's a good primer. | [00:36] |
mircea_popescu | all those lightbulbs and whatnot. | [00:36] |
Vexual | now the koreans are making the best limo at the best price, just coz they can | [00:38] |
asciilifeform | i see no light bulbs in that article. are they inside the arses ? | [00:38] |
mircea_popescu | they're in teh film | [00:39] |
mircea_popescu | whoever did the decors put a shitton of intelligent work in | [00:39] |
assbot | [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 64100 @ 0.00050754 = 32.5333 BTC [-] | [00:40] |
assbot | [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 18100 @ 0.0005116 = 9.26 BTC [+] | [00:41] |
decimation | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tN-HIA4H1vA << even street urchins wore jackets in new york ca. 1900 | [00:41] |
assbot | New York City Street Scene Easter 1900 - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1wZqK6m ) | [00:41] |
* | assbot removes voice from EPiSKiNG- | [00:42] |
* | assbot removes voice from badon | [00:42] |
Vexual | t-shirts are a recent invention | [00:42] |
mircea_popescu | http://trilema.com/2012/das-schlangenei/ << also good. perhaps actually better. | [00:42] |
assbot | Das Schlangenei pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1wZqRPv ) | [00:42] |
mircea_popescu | you know, lightbulbs going out, visibly. because back then ? they did. | [00:42] |
Vexual | slowly? | [00:43] |
mircea_popescu | (also bergman) | [00:43] |
assbot | [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 70082 @ 0.00051256 = 35.9212 BTC [+] {2} | [00:44] |
* | PeterL (~peterl@unaffiliated/peterl) has joined #bitcoin-assets | [00:44] |
mircea_popescu | it just occured to me that b-a is actually the only place on the english web where german, russian,french, spanish etc are not merely spoken, | [00:44] |
mircea_popescu | but the respective cultures actually accessible and tied in. | [00:44] |
mircea_popescu | at least afaik the only place. | [00:44] |
asciilifeform | we have a german ? | [00:45] |
mircea_popescu | no but we like them :D | [00:46] |
mircea_popescu | anyway, i'm from transylvania, i could as 1/3 german. | [00:46] |
Vexual | mircea runs a mercedes | [00:46] |
mircea_popescu | jurov's from slovakia, that's like 1/2 german, and kako's somalia is an ex german colony. so like 1/6 | [00:46] |
mircea_popescu | ;;calc 1/3 + 1/2 + 1/6 | [00:46] |
gribble | 1.0 | [00:46] |
mircea_popescu | win. | [00:46] |
decimation | Ich spreche einbisschen Deutch | [00:46] |
decimation | my family is nearly all from germany, but they stopped teaching their kids the language around wwii (in the us) | [00:47] |
* | CheckDavid has quit (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity) | [00:47] |
mircea_popescu | decimation afaik about 40% of the us is actually from germany at some point | [00:48] |
decimation | yes, the majority of 'white people' in the us are german | [00:48] |
* | assbot gives voice to PeterL | [00:48] |
decimation | which is why the englishers had to squash that shit | [00:48] |
mircea_popescu | anyway, quick quiz : who is the first person to have spoken german in public in israel post ww2 ? | [00:48] |
Vexual | was he in physics? | [00:48] |
decimation | eh? weren't nearly all the 'returning jews' from german backgrounds? | [00:49] |
decimation | http://forward.com/articles/154277/jews-stream-back-to-germany/?p=all << "But under German law since May 1949, any Jew — or the descendants of such a Jew — who fled Nazi Germany has the right to become a naturalized German" | [00:53] |
assbot | Jews Stream Back to Germany – Forward.com ... ( http://bit.ly/1uivnlc ) | [00:53] |
* | assbot removes voice from Vexual | [01:02] |
decimation | academic/media/civil servant complex is the us is chattering about increasing the gas tax, since prices have nearly halved | [01:04] |
decimation | no talk about rebalancing spending to cover the shortfall | [01:04] |
mthreat | there's also people asking if the US fracking companies will be "bailed out" | [01:09] |
assbot | [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10250 @ 0.00050723 = 5.1991 BTC [-] | [01:10] |
decimation | mthreat: http://www.nasdaq.com/article/opecs-no-to-oil-production-cut-dents-crude-prices-3-energy-funds-to-dump-mutual-fund-commentary-cm419481 | [01:14] |
assbot | OPEC's No to Oil Production Cut Dents Crude Prices: 3 Energy Funds to Dump - Mutual Fund Commentary - NASDAQ.com ... ( http://bit.ly/1uiAf9P ) | [01:15] |
TomServo | http://www.mprnews.org/story/2014/12/09/daily-circuit-transportation-funding | [01:15] |
assbot | Transportation chief: $1 billion surplus can't fix road problems | Minnesota Public Radio News ... ( http://bit.ly/1uiAhi0 ) | [01:15] |
decimation | opec is dumping oil to kill the fracking producers in the us | [01:15] |
TomServo | Aye - 20-40% fewer well permits being reported, depending on production area. | [01:17] |
decimation | http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=22-11-2014#931330 | [01:18] |
assbot | Logged on 22-11-2014 04:04:57; mircea_popescu: you familiar with the "giant stool" approach to economics ? | [01:18] |
decimation | opec wants to grow into a giant to squash the midgets in oil | [01:18] |
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assbot | [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 39700 @ 0.00051437 = 20.4205 BTC [+] {3} | [01:20] |
PeterL | is opec not already a giant? | [01:21] |
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decimation | yes, and they can embiggen themselves to squash any troublesome midgets for a period of time | [01:22] |
* | agorecki has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) | [01:25] |
mats | i wonder how putin feels about it | [01:30] |
asciilifeform | http://ichef.bbci.co.uk/news/ws/660/amz/worldservice/live/assets/images/2014/12/06/141206063050_putin_poster_624x351_ap.jpg | [01:30] |
assbot | ... ( http://bit.ly/1uiDVIE ) | [01:30] |
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BingoBoingo | http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/speaking-of-science/wp/2014/12/09/the-richest-man-in-russia-bought-james-watsons-nobel-prize-just-so-he-could-return-it/ | [01:31] |
assbot | The richest man in Russia bought James Watson’s Nobel prize just so he could return it - The Washington Post ... ( http://bit.ly/1uiEja5 ) | [01:32] |
decimation | BingoBoingo: that's awesome | [01:33] |
asciilifeform | lol! | [01:34] |
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asciilifeform | picture if - the equalistas will step up their game now. i recall there already was talk of (soviet-style!) revocation of watson's degrees. | [01:41] |
decimation | asciilifeform: such a development would be welcome, as it would require a press release with names attached | [01:42] |
BingoBoingo | Ah, the greatest protest Watson could undertake would be to sell his nobel annually | [01:42] |
asciilifeform | and his (alleged) plan to buy back 'respectability' with money is uncharacteristically foolish | [01:42] |
mircea_popescu | [01:43] | |
[]bot | Bet placed: 2.00000001 BTC for No on "Gold to drop under $1000 before Feb 2015" http://bitbet.us/bet/1080/ Odds: 12(Y):88(N) by coin, 13(Y):87(N) by weight. Total bet: 8.43248982 BTC. Current weight: 89,167. | [01:43] |
asciilifeform | who bribes inquisitors ? | [01:43] |
BingoBoingo | [01:43] | |
asciilifeform | he did not know that it would be returned. | [01:44] |
asciilifeform | said, supposedly, that he will buy back into respectability with the money. | [01:44] |
BingoBoingo | Ah | [01:44] |
mircea_popescu | asciilifeform> and his (alleged) plan to buy back 'respectability' with money is uncharacteristically foolish << i didn't read any such plan in there. just, "i want money" "what for ?" "fuck you lol: | [01:45] |
asciilifeform | he did utter 'will use it to return to public life' | [01:45] |
BingoBoingo | But now Watson can surmise he will be saved by stotting behavior until the one time he isn't | [01:45] |
decimation | nah he said he would give it to a few institutions | [01:45] |
asciilifeform | and did, iirc, mention donations to various academitrons | [01:45] |
mircea_popescu | more like "this should do x" | [01:45] |
mircea_popescu | he didn't seem to want to personally do anything past telling the others what they should be doing | [01:45] |
asciilifeform | giving money to his tormentors looks like pure nuttery | [01:45] |
mircea_popescu | admittedly, the traditional behaviour of intellectual types. | [01:46] |
mircea_popescu | understand old man psychology : the whole world is made out of younger men | [01:46] |
mircea_popescu | and for this reason, his toermentors. | [01:46] |
decimation | http://www.the-scientist.com/?articles.view/articleNo/41594/title/Watson-Sells-Nobel-for--4-1M/ "Watson told The New York Times that he planned to donate most of the proceeds from the sale to academic institutions, including the University of Chicago, which he attended as an undergraduate; Indiana University, where he earned his PhD; Cambridge, where he and Crick worked; and Cold Spring Harbor Laboratory. “The sale is to support | [01:46] |
decimation | and empower scientific discovery,” he said." | [01:46] |
assbot | Watson Sells Nobel for $4.1M | The Scientist Magazine® ... ( http://bit.ly/1D7jrgj ) | [01:46] |
mircea_popescu | he will ~talk about~ giving them money. | [01:46] |
asciilifeform | but in actuality, mail it to 'isis' ? | [01:47] |
decimation | yeah he was unspecific about the amounts - "most" | [01:47] |
mircea_popescu | he was also going to buy some painting | [01:48] |
* | asciilifeform thinks he understands old man psychology very well | [01:48] |
mircea_popescu | dithering, basically. | [01:48] |
* | asciilifeform had birthday a few days ago | [01:48] |
mircea_popescu | cast a wide net of tormentors looking for a handout, watch em squirm basically. | [01:48] |
mircea_popescu | lol how old does that make you ? | [01:48] |
asciilifeform | 31 + epsilon | [01:48] |
decimation | all of those except maybe cold spring will waste it on stupid shit | [01:49] |
mircea_popescu | that's not so old. | [01:49] |
mircea_popescu | you could do a lot better! | [01:49] |
asciilifeform | lol | [01:49] |
mircea_popescu | next year... | [01:49] |
asciilifeform | ;;google you're older than you've ever been | [01:50] |
gribble | Older - They Might Be Giants (Best Version) - YouTube: |
[01:50] |
decimation | for instance, Indiana University has floated the idea of starting an engineering school http://www.idsnews.com/article/2014/11/committee-to-explore-engineering-program-at-iu-bloomington | [01:50] |
assbot | Indiana Daily Student: :: Committee to explore engineering program at IU-Bloomington | [01:50] |
decimation | "Of the 62 universities in the Association of American Universities, only four do not have programs in engineering, according to the plan. Of those four, two have joint programs in engineering with other institutions." | [01:52] |
decimation | but everyone else does it!! | [01:52] |
asciilifeform | on one hand, old man feels old, envies young impotently, etc. on the other - has impulse for 'last hurrah.' word is that e. teller dreamed of presiding over a nukefest until the day he died. | [01:53] |
asciilifeform | to 'go out with a bang.' | [01:53] |
decimation | if watson wanted to 'go out with a bang' he would find the right young men to found an institute that explicitly is an enemy of his idio-cratic critics | [01:54] |
BingoBoingo | Or he'd do the Jurassic park, breed theme park monsters thing | [01:56] |
asciilifeform | about equally doable. | [01:56] |
asciilifeform | and for approximately same reasons. | [01:56] |
BingoBoingo | Actual dinosaurs impossible. Theme park monsters with vague resemblance to dinosaurs could probably be done in a decade or two if anyone cared to go monsanto on chickens | [01:59] |
assbot | [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 25400 @ 0.00050889 = 12.9258 BTC [-] | [02:02] |
decimation | yeah as Mr. Yarvin enjoys pointing out, the past is dead, cannot live again | [02:02] |
assbot | [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 59200 @ 0.00052146 = 30.8704 BTC [+] {4} | [02:03] |
* | kermit has quit (Quit: Leaving.) | [02:06] |
BingoBoingo | That's actually the line the Jurassic park sequels take when dinosaur feathers happened to become the consensus-ish thing IRL | [02:06] |
PeterL | http://xkcd.com/1211/ | [02:12] |
assbot | xkcd: Birds and Dinosaurs ... ( http://bit.ly/1uiMbZh ) | [02:12] |
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assbot | [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7300 @ 0.00052508 = 3.8331 BTC [+] | [02:23] |
asciilifeform | incidentally, german phrase of the day: | [02:29] |
asciilifeform | verscharfte vernehmung. | [02:29] |
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BingoBoingo | http://wapc.mlb.com/cutfour/2014/12/08/103552062/adam-wainwright-apologizes-to-fantasy-baseball-players-for-missing-final-start | [02:41] |
assbot | Adam Wainwright apologizes to fantasy baseball players for missing final start | MLB.com ... ( http://bit.ly/1uiRR5l ) | [02:41] |
assbot | [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 21450 @ 0.00052529 = 11.2675 BTC [+] {2} | [02:47] |
assbot | [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 127 @ 0.00857331 = 1.0888 BTC [+] {2} | [02:48] |
assbot | [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 33000 @ 0.00052727 = 17.3999 BTC [+] {2} | [02:48] |
assbot | [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15200 @ 0.00050889 = 7.7351 BTC [-] | [03:05] |
* | smidge (smidge@HSI-KBW-109-193-227-212.hsi7.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de) has joined #bitcoin-assets | [03:09] |
assbot | [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 2500 @ 0.00052754 = 1.3189 BTC [+] | [03:14] |
ben_vulpes | okay 700 log lines. go! | [03:22] |
ben_vulpes | [03:24] | |
assbot | I hope he comes here to tell us how "gpg is not user friendly and too hard." /jyap http://t.co/w1PgofiYzc /hashtag/bitcoin?src=hash-assets /ElectrumWallet | [03:24] |
assbot | [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 55900 @ 0.00052756 = 29.4906 BTC [+] {2} | [03:25] |
ben_vulpes | BingoBoingo: ad nauseum << lol! | [03:26] |
ben_vulpes | [03:27] | |
ben_vulpes | ;;ident mats | [03:28] |
gribble | Nick 'mats', with hostmask 'mats!sid23029@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-jxahmfiunuuiztjr', is identified as user 'mats', with GPG key id B9527964891A5566, key fingerprint B37F49DC35FD838B1F8783CC59C93F63549036BD, and bitcoin address None | [03:28] |
ben_vulpes | ;;gettrust assbot mats | [03:28] |
gribble | Currently authenticated from hostmask mats!sid23029@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-jxahmfiunuuiztjr. Trust relationship from user assbot to user mats: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 3 via 3 connections. Graph: http://b-otc.com/stg?source=assbot&dest=mats | WoT data: http://b-otc.com/vrd?nick=mats | Rated since: Thu Jun 19 20:47:48 2014 | [03:28] |
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ben_vulpes | ah i think i recall now. | [03:29] |
mircea_popescu | used to be mats_something | [03:34] |
ben_vulpes | mats_cd03 | [03:34] |
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ben_vulpes | [03:38] | |
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ben_vulpes | decimation: "street urchins" << https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vzT8EqhuYxA moar tenements, i say! | [03:47] |
assbot | Tenement Life 1860-1910 - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1sbDm9v ) | [03:47] |
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* | Now talking on #bitcoin-assets | [14:01] |
* | Topic for #bitcoin-assets is: http://bitcoin-assets.com || http://log.bitcoin-assets.com || http://bash.bitcoin-assets.com || http://blogs.bitcoin-assets.com | [14:01] |
* | Topic for #bitcoin-assets set by kakobrekla!~kako@unaffiliated/kakobrekla at Wed Mar 5 16:58:12 2014 | [14:01] |
-assbot- | Welcome to #bitcoin-assets. To get voice (ie, to be able to speak), first identify with gribble and then send "!up" to assbot in a private message. If you do not have a WoT account, try politely asking one of the voiced people for a temporary pass. | [14:01] |
* | assbot gives voice to mircea_popescu | [14:02] |
assbot | [HAVELOCK] [AMHASH3] 1041 @ 0.0012 = 1.2492 BTC | [14:04] |
assbot | [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6650 @ 0.00058371 = 3.8817 BTC [-] | [14:05] |
[]bot | Bet placed: 1 BTC for No on "Bitcoin to win vs S&P 500" http://bitbet.us/bet/989/ Odds: 31(Y):69(N) by coin, 50(Y):50(N) by weight. Total bet: 2.32410779 BTC. Current weight: 16,370. | [14:06] |
assbot | [HAVELOCK] [AMHASH3] 1750 @ 0.0012 = 2.1 BTC | [14:07] |
mircea_popescu | punkman no notary still ? | [14:10] |
assbot | [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11177 @ 0.00058371 = 6.5241 BTC [-] | [14:13] |
assbot | [HAVELOCK] [AMHASH3] 1300 @ 0.0012 = 1.56 BTC | [14:14] |
mircea_popescu | Namworld send me teh fb data if it's done (seems to be ?) | [14:16] |
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assbot | [HAVELOCK] [AMHASH3] 4957 @ 0.0012 = 5.9484 BTC | [14:23] |
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assbot | [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10671 @ 0.0006401 = 6.8305 BTC [+] {2} | [14:48] |
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assbot | [HAVELOCK] [AMHASH3] 3766 @ 0.0012 = 4.5192 BTC | [14:52] |
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* | assbot gives voice to Namworld | [14:55] |
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Namworld | I just checked, it's about 3/4th of the way through. | [14:56] |
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assbot | [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6908 @ 0.00066468 = 4.5916 BTC [+] | [15:06] |
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assbot | [HAVELOCK] [AMHASH3] 2000 @ 0.0012 = 2.4 BTC | [15:11] |
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assbot | [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 29000 @ 0.00061962 = 17.969 BTC [-] | [15:14] |
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assbot | [HAVELOCK] [AMHASH3] 1009 @ 0.0012 = 1.2108 BTC {3} | [15:27] |
assbot | [HAVELOCK] [AMHASH1] 1000 @ 0.00121935 = 1.2194 BTC [+] | [15:27] |
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assbot | [HAVELOCK] [AMHASH3] 8118 @ 0.0012 = 9.7416 BTC {2} | [15:55] |
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mircea_popescu | Namworld ah kk ty | [15:56] |
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assbot | [HAVELOCK] [AMHASH1] 4210 @ 0.00121935 = 5.1335 BTC [-] | [16:04] |
assbot | [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 40000 @ 0.00064862 = 25.9448 BTC [+] | [16:09] |
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* | assbot gives voice to dignork | [16:12] |
assbot | [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 19173 @ 0.00061945 = 11.8767 BTC [-] {2} | [16:12] |
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nubbins` | http://imgur.com/alOGguf | [16:19] |
assbot | imgur: the simple image sharer ... ( http://bit.ly/1x3431c ) | [16:19] |
assbot | Russian circus attaches 'dead' hamsters to balloons and DROPS them as 'gifts' | Daily Mail Online ... ( http://bit.ly/1x34gS3 ) | [16:20] |
nubbins` | lel | [16:21] |
nubbins` | russian "circus" throws dead rats in jars at children | [16:21] |
assbot | [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 66871 @ 0.00057701 = 38.5852 BTC [-] {4} | [16:22] |
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assbot | [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 20 @ 0.14075 = 2.815 BTC [-] {2} | [16:32] |
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assbot | [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 26727 @ 0.00062562 = 16.7209 BTC [+] {2} | [16:39] |
assbot | [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16642 @ 0.00068095 = 11.3324 BTC [+] {2} | [16:40] |
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assbot | [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17308 @ 0.00069042 = 11.9498 BTC [+] | [16:41] |
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assbot | [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 10957 @ 0.0002 = 2.1914 BTC [-] {21} | [16:53] |
assbot | [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 7877 @ 0.00018133 = 1.4283 BTC [-] {38} | [16:59] |
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thestringpuller | $depth mpoe | [17:18] |
empyex | thestringpuller: Want a bash? http://bash.bitcoin-assets.com/?quote=26 Or use a valid MPSIC! | [17:18] |
thestringpuller | $depth s.mpoe | [17:18] |
empyex | thestringpuller: [S.MPOE] Bids: 11123 @ 0.00064896 1500 @ 0.00056345 23817 @ 0.00056344 31631 @ 0.00055679 | [17:18] |
empyex | thestringpuller: [S.MPOE] Asks: 46700 @ 0.00065278 64200 @ 0.00066432 28551 @ 0.00068328 52200 @ 0.00068937 | [17:18] |
assbot | [HAVELOCK] [AMHASH3] 930 @ 0.0012 = 1.116 BTC | [17:20] |
thestringpuller | notary is down for extended maintenance I thought. | [17:25] |
assbot | [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10473 @ 0.00064896 = 6.7966 BTC [-] | [17:26] |
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assbot | [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 35827 @ 0.00065246 = 23.3757 BTC [+] {2} | [17:32] |
assbot | [HAVELOCK] [AMHASH1] 2420 @ 0.00121799 = 2.9475 BTC [+] {2} | [17:42] |
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assbot | [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 7754 @ 0.00014999 = 1.163 BTC [-] {3} | [17:50] |
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mircea_popescu | iirc was last weekend. anyway. | [18:02] |
thestringpuller | punkman: you got some 'splainin to do! | [18:02] |
thestringpuller | jkjk | [18:02] |
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assbot | [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12200 @ 0.00063602 = 7.7594 BTC [-] | [18:06] |
mircea_popescu | 63s now huh ? | [18:14] |
thestringpuller | it's because you announced the mircea_popescu stimulus package | [18:14] |
mircea_popescu | oidid ? | [18:14] |
thestringpuller | Haha. I was just imagining you as Bitcoin's Obama. It was funnier in my head because of the implied irony. | [18:16] |
thestringpuller | But whatever. | [18:16] |
mircea_popescu | i thought this was ghoing to be a sex joke. | [18:16] |
thestringpuller | that probably would have been a better avenue | [18:16] |
thestringpuller | i get booed off the stage when I do stand up :( | [18:16] |
mircea_popescu | "the mp stimulus package", http://trilema.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/pula_mea2s.jpg | [18:16] |
assbot | ... ( http://bit.ly/1IBYJFF ) | [18:16] |
thestringpuller | shemlessly opened in the middle of a training session at work | [18:17] |
mircea_popescu | that'll train ya. | [18:19] |
thestringpuller | I wish my teacher was a porn star teaching the class naked. | [18:20] |
mircea_popescu | whjat class is it anyway | [18:20] |
thestringpuller | mandatory training for onboarding on this company | [18:20] |
thestringpuller | it's like Google's Bootcamp, but for this company (VMWare) | [18:20] |
mircea_popescu | aha | [18:21] |
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mircea_popescu | cazalla who was John Powell in bitcoin-terms ? | [18:29] |
mircea_popescu | punkman: 10 GBP for truck mail? that's highway robbery <<< no, it's... AIRWAY ROBBERY | [18:30] |
mircea_popescu | har har har | [18:30] |
assbot | Art Student Hand-Illuminates, Binds a Copy of Tolkien's Silmarillion | MAKE ... ( http://bit.ly/1IC1ZAR ) | [18:31] |
mircea_popescu | punkman: yeah and maybe indian/chinese guy watered field with sewage << actually good for it. | [18:31] |
mircea_popescu | whoa nubbins` now you have to hire that guy | [18:31] |
mircea_popescu | or marry him. | [18:31] |
mircea_popescu | http://blog.bettercrypto.com/?p=1004 << this by the way is an excellent write-up. anyone know the guy / invite him over ? | [18:34] |
assbot | Controversy Around Bitcoin Elliptic Curve | Financial Cryptography, Bitcoin, Crypto Currencies ... ( http://bit.ly/1IC2A5J ) | [18:34] |
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mircea_popescu | "unanimous allergic reactions when serious security questions are raised by uninvited academics" | [18:36] |
mircea_popescu | heh. | [18:36] |
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kakobrekla | was there a new ssh vuln found past 24hrs? | [18:38] |
mircea_popescu | "ERROR: JavaScript and Cookies are required in order to post a comment. | [18:39] |
mircea_popescu | Please be sure JavaScript and Cookies are enabled in your browser." | [18:39] |
mircea_popescu | derpistan. | [18:39] |
cazalla | mircea_popescu, dunno yet, no court docs online, not entered in offender search yet either | [18:40] |
asciilifeform | ecdsa curves, 'nothing up my sleeve' constants << think back to the legend with the 'randomly wired' neural net. if secp256k1 (or, another example, aes s-boxes) have sufficiently broad classes of 'weak key' - then all you need to do is find a simple, e.g., sqrt(2), whatever, 'sleeve constant' that impresses the fools. | [18:40] |
* | assbot gives voice to nubbins` | [18:42] |
nubbins` | jurov "he hand-illuminated the text which had been printed on his home Canon inkjet printer. He worked with a binder to assemble the resulting book." | [18:42] |
mircea_popescu | so the guy that wrote that otherwise interesting post : 1) aslo wrote http://blog.bettercrypto.com/?p=640 , a complete misrepresentation of the tim swhatever incident ; 2) runs a blog where you need cookies/js to leave him a comment pointing out that no, he's not extempt from the common requirements of "know what you're talking about before you posture" ; 3) has a contact page where i could donate btc to him (or ltc he | [18:42] |
mircea_popescu | h), but which does not include his email, or his pgp key. | [18:42] |
assbot | Bitcoin Security and Cryptography: Reasons to Worry | Financial Cryptography, Bitcoin, Crypto Currencies ... ( http://bit.ly/1umah5a ) | [18:42] |
mircea_popescu | how the fuck do these people expect to survive, seriously ? | [18:42] |
nubbins` | dude uses a canon ;/ | [18:42] |
mircea_popescu | i get it, he's a "google scholar" and he has patents. whopee. | [18:42] |
nubbins` | and didn't even bind it himself! | [18:42] |
nubbins` | what kind of art preschool did he attend?! | [18:42] |
mircea_popescu | asciilifeform atm im trying to discern whether the recent "secp256k1" talk is simply the defeated nsa trying to find a better reason to fork bitcoin, or these derps actualy have something. | [18:43] |
mircea_popescu | but they're so fucking derpy they're not helping me, as itemized above. | [18:43] |
asciilifeform | 'one cannot safely just ignore the advice of the cryptographic community about the elliptic curves. Not taking these questions seriously is bad, potentially a gross professional misconduct, and one could in theory even go to prison for that on the basis of some existing laws, for example safeguards rule in the US Gramm-Leach-Bliley Act...' << obey or gasenwagen! | [18:43] |
mircea_popescu | heh. | [18:43] |
cazalla | mircea_popescu, there is http://i.imgur.com/55MwjMX.png too | [18:43] |
assbot | ... ( http://bit.ly/1umaxkR ) | [18:43] |
cazalla | wonder why they didn't mention drugs in the news article | [18:44] |
mircea_popescu | srsly, he keeps linking to reddit thinking/pretending to think he's engaging bitcoin thereby. | [18:44] |
mircea_popescu | so much nuttery. | [18:44] |
BingoBoingo | mircea_popescu: I'm wrestling with my PACER login to find some filings in the Powel case | [18:45] |
mircea_popescu | cool. | [18:46] |
mircea_popescu | asciilifeform still, i can see the argument that "7" is not safe just for being you know, the number of holes on your body. | [18:47] |
mircea_popescu | i wonder, if i say Dr. Nicolas T. Courtois will this then be the first hit on his name tomorrow or something ? | [18:49] |
mircea_popescu | anyway, birdy whispers in my ear guy's from group that came up with the original xls aes attack. definitely more standing than tim swanson or w/e. | [18:51] |
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asciilifeform | 'there is like 30 papers each year published in cryptographic literature in which cryptosystems fail exactly because they use small integers...' << ahahaha. what a brazen and deliberate confusion. bringing up rsa coppersmith attack in thread on unrelated cryptosystem. | [18:52] |
mircea_popescu | but the principle remains. "small integers" are not in fact either small or integers but for our perspective. | [18:53] |
mircea_popescu | they're just numbers, like any other numbers, exactly so. | [18:53] |
mircea_popescu | !up rdymac | [18:55] |
-assbot- | You voiced rdymac for 30 minutes. | [18:55] |
* | assbot gives voice to rdymac | [18:55] |
mircea_popescu | asciilifeform (incidentally, coppersmith didn't think much of the xsl thing) | [18:56] |
BingoBoingo | Finally got the login sorted out, vague indictment was vague | [18:57] |
mircea_popescu | BingoBoingo they can put people away without even saying what for huh. | [18:58] |
BingoBoingo | Well, Indictment lists the charges as money transmission stuff, and "possession of marijuana with intention to distribute" | [18:59] |
BingoBoingo | Going to read more | [18:59] |
mircea_popescu | heh | [18:59] |
mircea_popescu | so the guy had a bag big enough is it ? | [18:59] |
mircea_popescu | iirc that's what intent is predicated on | [19:00] |
asciilifeform | questionable attacks on aes, etc << there are stables of ops grunts paid to sow disinfo - false research leads, general-purpose 'fud' for the academic community, promotion of sensational mystery meats ('badbios' !), etc. | [19:00] |
asciilifeform | a bag big enough >> : | [19:01] |
asciilifeform | !s toilet tank | [19:01] |
assbot | 7 results for 'toilet tank' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=toilet+tank | [19:01] |
assbot | [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 28100 @ 0.00064487 = 18.1208 BTC [+] {2} | [19:02] |
BingoBoingo | So many sealed documents. Apparently last employed April 2008 making $10k/month | [19:02] |
BingoBoingo | 2006 Hyundai Sonata | [19:02] |
mircea_popescu | asciilifeform sure. which is why it's so difficult to discern. | [19:03] |
mircea_popescu | obviously, honest man would be in wot rather than sitting at the fringe arguing about how him being in the thief seats is wholly immaterial, he's just there for the view, comfort and etc. | [19:04] |
asciilifeform | mircea_popescu: sometimes, the buggers 'go into tilt' and make it laughably easy. that piece reads as if it had been written by mr. spamgun himself. | [19:04] |
BingoBoingo | The fuckers, part of his pre-trial release conditions was a prohibition on alcohol, 21st amendment yo! | [19:04] |
mircea_popescu | i still dunno why we'd believe 7 is a good exponent | [19:05] |
mircea_popescu | rather than whatever any other one. | [19:05] |
mircea_popescu | obviously, this is no reason to change anything, but as an intellectual pursuit. | [19:05] |
mircea_popescu | BingoBoingo basically they're just begging for attention at this point. | [19:05] |
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asciilifeform | mircea_popescu: lol, i didn't pick the 7! but i dare to guess that it was chosen out of spite. | [19:06] |
mircea_popescu | i didn't pick it either, and i am thankful for not having had to. | [19:06] |
mircea_popescu | i certainly am not about to go over the man's picks and "improve em". | [19:06] |
mircea_popescu | but even an ant may wonder. | [19:06] |
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BingoBoingo | Here's the defendan't blog http://sharethezing.blogspot.com/ | [19:10] |
assbot | Share The Zing ... ( http://bit.ly/1umeE0m ) | [19:10] |
cazalla | is this related to ddos guy or just random http://dpaste.com/0DZR5J9 ? | [19:10] |
assbot | dpaste: 0DZR5J9 ... ( http://bit.ly/1umeGoT ) | [19:10] |
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BingoBoingo | One of the presentencing documents is a prinout of the fucking wikipedia page on Bitcoin | [19:11] |
mircea_popescu | cazalla sems random spam | [19:12] |
mircea_popescu | BingoBoingo which court is this ? | [19:12] |
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BingoBoingo | mircea_popescu: US Central District of Illinois | [19:13] |
mircea_popescu | idiots. | [19:13] |
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BingoBoingo | The entire witness list consists of one item "Group of Photos" | [19:14] |
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BingoBoingo | And some illegible name with them Luke something or other | [19:15] |
assbot | [HAVELOCK] [AMHASH1] 1300 @ 0.001205 = 1.5665 BTC [-] {5} | [19:16] |
BingoBoingo | And... he plead guilty | [19:16] |
mircea_popescu | on advice from his court-provided or else court-owned scamlawyer | [19:17] |
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mircea_popescu | the crowd of vultures pretending to represent people's interests in the us courts while strictly representing the court's interest in people's lives is one of the most underrated problems of that country. | [19:18] |
mircea_popescu | it's like nigeria, except in nigeria you can't find dentists. in the us you can't find lawyers. | [19:18] |
BingoBoingo | I'm guessing court appointed, but no way to tell. The only interesting filing was his handwritten filing pre sentencing. | [19:18] |
BingoBoingo | Also the "Statement of Reasons" last filing is also unavailable | [19:20] |
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* | assbot removes voice from rdymac | [19:25] |
undata | that top qntra article is sad. | [19:27] |
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undata | I was working on my own crypto-only exchange for a bit, then thought better of it since I don't have piles of money for lawyers | [19:28] |
BingoBoingo | Not much in the documents other than how evil it is to plea guilty because it lets prosecutors become lazy | [19:28] |
undata | looks like I made the right choice | [19:28] |
undata | side note: bitswap.io is for sale :p | [19:28] |
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mircea_popescu | the more interesting tyhing is that BingoBoingo is practically becoming a field-trained paralegal. | [19:31] |
BingoBoingo | Well, I'm already a university trained librarian. The rest is just getting a vague idea of what the law shit means | [19:31] |
mircea_popescu | i guess so. | [19:32] |
assbot | [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3850 @ 0.00064929 = 2.4998 BTC [+] | [19:33] |
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BingoBoingo | Well, the university training wasn't much other than social justice derping as a minority. | [19:36] |
BingoBoingo | *surviving | [19:36] |
BingoBoingo | Because when they are in the majority the social justic derps oppress, just less competently | [19:38] |
BingoBoingo | Which is to everyone's detriment. | [19:38] |
assbot | [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16476 @ 0.0006518 = 10.7391 BTC [+] | [19:40] |
* | BingoBoingo may have called out fellow students for hating on the Football team, by suggested they we hating the way those young men expressed their gender... | [19:43] |
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* | ChanServ gives voice to []bot | [19:45] |
* | assbot gives voice to mats | [19:45] |
* | BingoBoingo also might have suggested the derps were racist for hating the football team because it is one of the most prominent means by which young african americans can achieve upwards social mobility | [19:45] |
mats | yeah, and joining the military. | [19:46] |
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BingoBoingo | Yeah there's that too. | [19:46] |
mats | your chances of killing yourself are roughly half! | [19:46] |
assbot | [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12900 @ 0.00065278 = 8.4209 BTC [+] | [19:47] |
BingoBoingo | I know football presents a greater chance of disability for much more imaginary future money | [19:47] |
adlai | do we finally see potus for what it is, just another role on a stage? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=95KTrtzOY-g | [19:47] |
assbot | The Colbert Report - President Obama Delivers The Decree - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1GlbEbb ) | [19:47] |
mats | yeah, what is it, like two in three NFL players end up broke after leaving the league? | [19:47] |
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mats | o wow. even higher. http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/sports/story/2012-04-22/Pro-athletes-and-financial-trouble/54465664/1 | [19:48] |
assbot | Pro athletes and financial trouble – USATODAY.com ... ( http://bit.ly/1Glc0OR ) | [19:48] |
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mats | > Sports Illustrated estimated in 2009 that 78 percent of NFL players are bankrupt or facing serious financial stress within two years of ending their playing careers and that 60percent of NBA players are broke within five years of retiring from the game. | [19:49] |
assbot | [HAVELOCK] [AMHASH3] 1667 @ 0.0012 = 2.0004 BTC | [19:50] |
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BingoBoingo | Yeah, they get that access to so much money so fast | [19:52] |
undata | probably not a profession that selects for intelligence to begin with, and it runs a high risk of frontal lobe injury | [19:53] |
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ben_vulpes | and who said slavery and gladiation was dead!? | [19:53] |
BingoBoingo | undata: Well, pretty much any impact related brain injury is possible. Because helmets make people Invincible! Who cares about physics. | [19:54] |
undata | BingoBoingo: heh, they even use that animation of the two helmets colliding | [19:55] |
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BingoBoingo | Even though the players aren't allowed to do that anymore because it is "Targeting" and justifies suspending the SEC sacks leader mid game so Alabama won't have to suffer the possibility of a close game. | [19:56] |
mats | the NFL should just get rid of helmets. | [19:56] |
BingoBoingo | Prolly, or go back to the doofy leather things | [19:57] |
undata | I need a word for this. It's such a common Americanism. | [19:57] |
undata | football *certainly isn't* about watching idiots injure each other | [19:57] |
undata | like child beauty pagents *certainly aren't* weird quasi-child-porn | [19:58] |
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undata | ah Orwell already treated it as "war is peace" | [19:58] |
undata | BingoBoingo: mats: or just accept that what we're doing is watching people fuck each other up | [19:59] |
undata | at least the UFC has very little pretense about that | [19:59] |
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mats | meh. i don't watch sports on television. | [20:00] |
BingoBoingo | The UFC sucks because the matchups aren't competative. | [20:00] |
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mats | things i do watch: Homeland, The Newsroom, New Girl, Sons of Anarchy, Psycho Pass | [20:02] |
mats | if you enjoyed Ghost in the Shell, you'll probably like Psycho Pass. | [20:02] |
mats | i lost the battle in giving up TV. i haven't picked up anything new though, so thats a win, i guess | [20:03] |
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undata | mats: the newsroom is a good show | [20:05] |
mats | the last episode was terrible. they should've avoided all commentary about feminazis in the media | [20:05] |
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assbot | [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 31056 @ 0.00065286 = 20.2752 BTC [+] | [20:06] |
mats | they do alright, generally, but chicks i talk to about it aren't happy with how women are portrayed in the show | [20:06] |
mats | their characters are shallow, and apparently don't pass the Bechdel test. | [20:06] |
mats | ;;google Bechdel test | [20:06] |
gribble | Bechdel test - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: |
[20:06] |
undata | yeah I can see that | [20:06] |
undata | the various romance subplots are insufferable | [20:07] |
mats | the more you know! | [20:07] |
assbot | [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 18232 @ 0.00065286 = 11.9029 BTC [+] | [20:11] |
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ben_vulpes | what i really want is to listen to strong female characters talking about...what to strong female characters talk about? | [20:26] |
mats | whatever the dudes talk about, i suppose. | [20:28] |
mats | http://aje.me/1x2Vun8 looks like they're not even going to bother with taking kurdistan first | [20:29] |
assbot | Iraq's Balad braced for battle with ISIL - Middle East - Al Jazeera English | [20:29] |
assbot | [HAVELOCK] [AMHASH3] 100000 @ 0.0012 = 120 BTC | [20:29] |
assbot | [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9450 @ 0.00065286 = 6.1695 BTC [+] | [20:31] |
mats | http://news.usni.org/2014/12/10/u-s-navy-allowed-use-persian-gulf-laser-defense | [20:32] |
assbot | U.S. Navy Allowed to Use Persian Gulf Laser for Defense - USNI News ... ( http://bit.ly/1x3N3Ib ) | [20:33] |
mats | what a useless and expensive weapon | [20:34] |
mircea_popescu | jesus the fruits in this country, i can't get over it. | [20:36] |
mircea_popescu | i have never in my life had cherries this good | [20:36] |
mircea_popescu | an' romaians are big on cherries. | [20:36] |
mircea_popescu | mats http://trilema.com/2014/the-romanian-language-for-other-people/#comment-110532 wd :) | [20:39] |
assbot | The Romanian language for other people. pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1x3NFNX ) | [20:39] |
mircea_popescu | http://www.thesmokinggun.com/buster/New-Jersey-breast-pump-thief-786543 << the lingering q is how the fuck are lactation aids worth 1k | [20:40] |
assbot | New Jersey Cops On The Hunt For Notorious Garden State Breast Pump Thief | The Smoking Gun ... ( http://bit.ly/1x3NORA ) | [20:40] |
assbot | [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 21200 @ 0.00067913 = 14.3976 BTC [+] {2} | [20:41] |
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assbot | [HAVELOCK] [AMHASH3] 2500 @ 0.0012 = 3 BTC | [21:08] |
assbot | [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 63538 @ 0.00064732 = 41.1294 BTC [-] {4} | [21:10] |
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assbot | [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8971 @ 0.00064765 = 5.8101 BTC [+] | [21:19] |
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assbot | [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 40300 @ 0.00065713 = 26.4823 BTC [+] {2} | [21:27] |
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assbot | [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14651 @ 0.00068303 = 10.0071 BTC [+] {2} | [21:34] |
assbot | [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6649 @ 0.00068937 = 4.5836 BTC [+] | [21:35] |
assbot | [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13091 @ 0.00064765 = 8.4784 BTC [-] | [21:50] |
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mats | mircea_popescu: cool. i appreciate your patience, still working on picking up latin and romanian. and maintaining the other languages bouncing around in my head. | [22:08] |
mats | ;;ident | [22:10] |
gribble | Nick 'mats', with hostmask 'mats!sid23029@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-qffzshlqkntuoouh', is identified as user 'mats', with GPG key id B9527964891A5566, key fingerprint B37F49DC35FD838B1F8783CC59C93F63549036BD, and bitcoin address None | [22:10] |
mats | mircea_popescu: 17HvePmDqPnKjZ79FrB1yicZPqyxTN4BnR | [22:11] |
* | asciilifeform is ever more convinced that systemd, with its default setting of vomiting syslog to every ptty console (!), constantly, is really an elaborate trolling gag project | [22:11] |
kakobrekla | now your bitcoin address will get ddosed : | [22:11] |
mats | :( | [22:12] |
mats | asciilifeform: seen the latest on 'Ubuntu Core'? piles on piles of shit. | [22:13] |
asciilifeform | why and how would i even see this. | [22:13] |
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ben_vulpes | http://www.ubuntu.com/cloud/tools/snappy << relevant | [22:14] |
assbot | Announcing Snappy Ubuntu | Cloud | Ubuntu ... ( http://bit.ly/167TuhY ) | [22:14] |
undata | on azure! | [22:14] |
undata | I would laugh my ass off for days if MS ever bought Canonical | [22:14] |
asciilifeform | only remembered 'systemd' now because happened to switch on a machine in my collection, a 'google chromebook a15', based on single-chip 'arm.' afaik, no clean (traditional init) linux distro has ever been published for said machine. | [22:14] |
asciilifeform | the real insult is that the manufacturer's stock os is: a bastardized gentoo. | [22:15] |
asciilifeform | but go and try to set up a normal gentoo, in such a way that all of the necessary peripherals (gpu, power controller) actually work. | [22:15] |
asciilifeform | afaik, no one has achieved this. | [22:15] |
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undata | asciilifeform: tried doing a localyesconfig on the Chrome OS? | [22:17] |
asciilifeform | i'm not interested in using 'chrome os.' | [22:17] |
asciilifeform | for anything. | [22:17] |
undata | asciilifeform: nah, that would give you a kernel config for gentoo proper | [22:17] |
asciilifeform | except it wouldn't | [22:17] |
asciilifeform | there are closed blobs in there. | [22:17] |
undata | oh, terrible! | [22:17] |
asciilifeform | bought that thing >1 yr ago, because could not resist an attempt at a laptop that is entirely solid state, can be carried in one hand, and runs 12+hrs on a charge | [22:18] |
asciilifeform | part of eternal quest for 'write in bed' machine | [22:18] |
undata | my most recent purchase was a lenovo x1 carbon | [22:18] |
asciilifeform | and non-x86 modern portable having keyboard is such a rarity that could not be passed up | [22:18] |
undata | the thinkpad brand is dead | [22:18] |
asciilifeform | the non-thinkpad brands are even deader. | [22:19] |
undata | I'm pretty sure this one has a hardware issue; / remounts read-only sporadically | [22:19] |
asciilifeform | but this tale was not about a 'proper' laptop, but attempt to glue together a portable-with-keyboard that isn't x86 and therefore can actually achieve some serious runtime on battery | [22:20] |
undata | yet there are no bad blocks to be found | [22:20] |
asciilifeform | undata: loose mount (as in physical connector) ? | [22:20] |
undata | asciilifeform: perhaps, though restarting it without jiggling anything always works | [22:21] |
* | asciilifeform full of wrath re: google profiting off all of the work that folks put into linux, to create the abortion spoken of earlier; a deliberate hardware troll. | [22:22] |
undata | that's their move; buy things that can be bought, snatch the free stuff | [22:23] |
asciilifeform | i can easily understand now why theo de raadt zapped support for loadable kernel modules in openbsd | [22:24] |
undata | shovel out shiny thing covered in ads and spyware | [22:24] |
asciilifeform | the only way to prevent this kind of situation - a pure scorched earth approach | [22:24] |
assbot | [HAVELOCK] [AMHASH3] 2025 @ 0.0012 = 2.43 BTC | [22:24] |
asciilifeform | not that someone could not, hypothetically, link a blob into an openbsd kernel and try to persuade folks to use it. but the result would probably be: laughter. | [22:25] |
asciilifeform | somehow the loadability seems to be psychologically necessary for blob acceptance. | [22:26] |
assbot | [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10500 @ 0.00065049 = 6.8301 BTC [+] | [22:27] |
decimation | asciilifeform: or fork openbsd | [22:29] |
assbot | [HAVELOCK] [AMHASH3] 5250 @ 0.0012 = 6.3 BTC | [22:29] |
decimation | but in the case it wouldn't openbsd anymore | [22:29] |
decimation | and one couldn't bake a meatloaf with particles of linux and call it 'linux' | [22:30] |
asciilifeform | decimation: hell knows how many entirely-closed industrial turds contain a bsd | [22:30] |
asciilifeform | the chromebook thing is just like the situation i spoke of last week: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=04-12-2014#944963 | [22:31] |
assbot | Logged on 04-12-2014 04:32:47; asciilifeform: http://imgur.com/a/llwZ2 | [22:31] |
asciilifeform | a gizmo, ships with a linux variant | [22:31] |
asciilifeform | but only runs because contains turds | [22:31] |
decimation | I've been tagged with supporting a 'palo alto' vpn turd box. I'm pretty sure it's bsd | [22:31] |
asciilifeform | if you try to construct own linux (or bsd, whichever) on the machine - nothing but torment | [22:31] |
decimation | asciilifeform: only google knows the right bits to flip I guess | [22:32] |
asciilifeform | it will either refuse to run at all, or worse - run intermittently because there nominally exist open drivers for the necessary peripherals, but the manufacturer did not used them | [22:32] |
asciilifeform | *use | [22:32] |
assbot | [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 20 @ 0.1401008 = 2.802 BTC [-] {2} | [22:32] |
decimation | they probably hired some taiwanese code monkeys to write drivers with the nda'ed full docs | [22:33] |
asciilifeform | and then you go and buy 25 different gizmos to see if even one does not meet this pattern | [22:33] |
asciilifeform | and end up with a crate of scrap | [22:33] |
asciilifeform | because 100%. | [22:33] |
assbot | [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 22 @ 0.140001 = 3.08 BTC [-] | [22:34] |
decimation | it pisses me off that one cannot buy a 100% nda free x86 system | [22:35] |
decimation | yes, I know about the 'novena' | [22:35] |
asciilifeform | what processor - can ? | [22:35] |
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asciilifeform | can i see the mask for 'arm' core - the actual production mask - without nda? | [22:36] |
asciilifeform | or, for that matter, with ? | [22:36] |
decimation | I just want the spec and docs (with talmud of errata) | [22:36] |
asciilifeform | 'novena laptop' is a hardware troll | [22:36] |
decimation | some intel peripheral chips are documented | [22:36] |
decimation | well, I would give novena a hell of alot more credit if they actually shipped | [22:37] |
asciilifeform | that is, something so laughably and irredeemably inadequate for its nominal purpose that its very existence is a troll. | [22:37] |
decimation | it appears to me they have been 'prototyping' for about a year | [22:37] |
decimation | and they are still 'fundraising' as far as I can tell | [22:37] |
decimation | with a reasonable and open bus, it would be simple to plug in an fpga card if one wanted to use | [22:38] |
decimation | PCI is neither reasonable nor open | [22:38] |
asciilifeform | where is the open fpga? | [22:38] |
decimation | no it uses xilinix | [22:38] |
asciilifeform | pci is a paragon of transparency compared with any extant fpga | [22:38] |
decimation | I guess 'no nda' just means drivers specs | [22:38] |
decimation | yeah | [22:38] |
asciilifeform | and how about the micro in the ssd ? | [22:38] |
asciilifeform | whither the specs | [22:39] |
decimation | hehe asciilifeform pokes | [22:39] |
asciilifeform | will poke until it bursts. and it doesn't take much. | [22:39] |
asciilifeform | hardware trolls - to scrapyard. authors - to biodiesel. | [22:39] |
assbot | [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 20 @ 0.140001 = 2.8 BTC [-] | [22:39] |
decimation | one wonders about the touchscreen drivers too | [22:40] |
decimation | what about the keyboard uC firmware? | [22:40] |
decimation | and so forth | [22:40] |
asciilifeform | the most enraging thing is the idiots who think there has been -any- progress made on this front. | [22:41] |
asciilifeform | because this is a situation where anything short of 100% is equivalent to 0%. | [22:41] |
decimation | basically to even *start* to do anything will require someone like that russian billionare giving a shit | [22:41] |
asciilifeform | would have to give enough of a shit to fund, but not enough to attempt to direct. this will happen shortly after pigs fly. | [22:42] |
decimation | yeah. if herr watson wishes to poke at modernity that would be a good start | [22:42] |
decimation | but his few $mil is too piddly to accomplish anything | [22:43] |
asciilifeform | incidentally, there once lived upon the good earth a group of people who carried on development of entirely open computer hardware, prying open closed turds whenever they felt necessary without even breaking a sweat | [22:47] |
asciilifeform | and daring anyone to try to stop them | [22:47] |
asciilifeform | it was called the ussr. | [22:47] |
* | yhwh__ has quit (Remote host closed the connection) | [22:48] |
mats | well, when the rocket leaves the pad, id be happy to join you in this prying | [22:48] |
* | asciilifeform favours the 'year zero' approach, but this is not news | [22:48] |
asciilifeform | a forcibly blown open 'xilinx' soft/hard stack would be a good start though. | [22:49] |
asciilifeform | as i may have once explained, the chicoms have not done this and should not be expected to ever do it, because fpga is profoundly useless in a mass consumer product. | [22:50] |
asciilifeform | fundamentally. | [22:50] |
decimation | asciilifeform: "US Gramm-Leach-Bliley Act...' << obey or gasenwagen!" << USG generally has no problem giving commands to 'technical people' in its Vader Voice | [22:50] |
asciilifeform | decimation: that line was a 'the mask fell off' moment in that article. | [22:50] |
asciilifeform | decimation: after it, there could be no mistake as to the nature and motivations of the author. | [22:50] |
decimation | not only is open fpga useless for consumer market, it openly antagonizes it | [22:50] |
asciilifeform | it is simply wasteful for any extant mass application - does a dildo need general-purpose switching matrix logic ? | [22:51] |
assbot | [HAVELOCK] [AMHASH3] 3000 @ 0.0012 = 3.6 BTC | [22:52] |
asciilifeform | don't wait for the chinese to copy fpga. they have no reason whatsoever to. | [22:52] |
asciilifeform | for prototyping (the only thing they are presently used for) they are happy to buy the american chips and use their closed turdchains. | [22:52] |
decimation | yeah, it really is only useful for 'actual people' who want to research interesting digital applications | [22:52] |
asciilifeform | just as china (along with the rest of the planet) happily runs winblows. | [22:52] |
decimation | this is not a large market | [22:53] |
asciilifeform | it's a market of, what... 10 people. | [22:53] |
decimation | is this dominance of xilinix, ms, etc really a case of the 'giant' sitting on the stool? | [22:53] |
asciilifeform | i will not only die of old age but probably manage to fossilize before anyone ever thinks of serving this market. | [22:54] |
decimation | it seems to me that if there were any midgets, they are long gone | [22:54] |
asciilifeform | decimation: the midgets were exterminated, possibly before birth, by patents | [22:54] |
decimation | yeah and copyright in the case of ms | [22:54] |
asciilifeform | decimation: notice that all known fpga manufacturers (xilinx, altera, lattice, a few others) have the same business model | [22:55] |
decimation | it's a neat trick to time-warp into the future and murder your competitors in the womb | [22:55] |
asciilifeform | licensing of circuit modules | [22:55] |
asciilifeform | this is because it is quite impossible, as i understand, to really make serious money selling the chips | [22:55] |
asciilifeform | they virtually never end up in consumer products except as a result of extreme haste (rushing a prototype to market) | [22:55] |
decimation | yeah I've heard it referred to as the "ip cores" market | [22:55] |
asciilifeform | (where!? see, e.g, the 'rio pmp' early mp3 player.) | [22:56] |
asciilifeform | !s xilinx | [22:56] |
assbot | 42 results for 'xilinx' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=xilinx | [22:56] |
asciilifeform | discussed here on several separate occasions. | [22:56] |
decimation | apparently the the prices they charge for these "ip cores" are highly negotiable depending on your account with them | [22:56] |
asciilifeform | and their ability to carry out this 'air merchant' trick is entirely tied to a maximally-closed chip architecture. | [22:57] |
asciilifeform | otherwise it would be a simple matter to learn how the mystery meat module works and remplement. | [22:57] |
asciilifeform | *reimplement | [22:57] |
decimation | yeah whenever I hear "ip cores" I immediately think of all the legal bullshit that they are pimping to support their 'business' | [22:57] |
decimation | maybe some snowden working for xilinix will release the dox one day | [22:58] |
asciilifeform | doesn't do much good | [22:58] |
decimation | they would probably just discontinue that line | [22:58] |
asciilifeform | i did tell the tale, of how on one occasion someone succeeded in mostly reversing a particular chip | [22:58] |
asciilifeform | it is now entirely unobtainable. | [22:58] |
asciilifeform | almost as much as the first (and last, and only) xilinx part that had open docs from the vendor | [22:59] |
asciilifeform | it is never enough to reverse engineer a particular item. | [22:59] |
asciilifeform | the results must go into soviet-style production by the megatonne. | [22:59] |
asciilifeform | at least, for a silicon chip, that cannot be made in a cellar | [22:59] |
decimation | that's something the russian billionare could help with | [23:00] |
asciilifeform | but why | [23:00] |
decimation | unfortunately there is not much 'spare' capacity | [23:00] |
asciilifeform | there will -never- be spare capacity for a counter-economic project. | [23:00] |
decimation | the only credible buyers I can imagine are non-us defense | [23:00] |
asciilifeform | the same folks happily running winblows and ms-office ? | [23:01] |
asciilifeform | hahaha | [23:01] |
decimation | yeah I know | [23:01] |
asciilifeform | martian defense. | [23:01] |
asciilifeform | that's who'll buy. | [23:01] |
decimation | as long as usg sits on the stool it will remain that way | [23:02] |
asciilifeform | i'm not convinced this is a usg-dependent phenomenon | [23:02] |
decimation | no, the real driver is the expense of a chip fab | [23:02] |
asciilifeform | as in, usg can and will perish, but the widgets spoken of here will not magically appear. | [23:02] |
asciilifeform | there would have to be some rational mechanism to bring them into being. | [23:02] |
decimation | cheap chip fabrication would do it | [23:03] |
decimation | but that's almost science fiction | [23:03] |
asciilifeform | if you had cheap chip fab, there would not even be much reason to build fpga ! | [23:03] |
decimation | I mean if we could 'kickstart' such a design for a few $K | [23:03] |
asciilifeform | other than for exotic circuits that reprogram selves, etc | [23:03] |
asciilifeform | even then | [23:04] |
decimation | actually the design work is way more than the fabrication | [23:04] |
asciilifeform | nope. | [23:04] |
asciilifeform | not if you're the designer | [23:04] |
decimation | well, costs lifetime then | [23:04] |
asciilifeform | costs no more than we're paying now to talk. | [23:04] |
decimation | including the warez for design toolchain? | [23:05] |
asciilifeform | ideally, a from-scratch rational reimplementation (that ignores patents on best-known algos, yes) | [23:06] |
assbot | [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 10 @ 0.140001 = 1.4 BTC [-] | [23:06] |
asciilifeform | technically if you were to write a logic synthesis tool today, from scratch, it would still be 'warez' | [23:06] |
* | midnightmagic has quit (Quit: quit) | [23:07] |
asciilifeform | i generally tag all of the parties responsible for this state of affairs as agents of usg, whether they would think of themselves as such or not. | [23:07] |
* | kdomanski has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) | [23:08] |
decimation | certainly most of their sales are to usg's layer 2 | [23:08] |
decimation | there aren't many fpgas in consumer chips in general | [23:09] |
decimation | consumer boards I should say | [23:09] |
asciilifeform | wasn't speaking of fpga specifically | [23:09] |
asciilifeform | but anyone involved in the patent of algorithms apparatus | [23:09] |
asciilifeform | in whatever capacity. | [23:10] |
assbot | [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 40 @ 0.13995025 = 5.598 BTC [-] {3} | [23:10] |
* | midnightmagic (~midnightm@unaffiliated/midnightmagic) has joined #bitcoin-assets | [23:10] |
decimation | ironically the us got its start pirating machine designs from england | [23:10] |
* | kdomanski (~kdomanski@kolimator.pl) has joined #bitcoin-assets | [23:11] |
asciilifeform | this is well-known. | [23:11] |
decimation | that and talented machinists would leave to 'seed' enterprises in europe & elsewhere | [23:11] |
asciilifeform | the secret boojum of chip business is that anything whose production is inherently centralized to that degree, is almost divinely ordained to suck. | [23:13] |
asciilifeform | if rifles could only be produced in 12 places on the planet, most fighting would still be conducted with spears and axes. | [23:14] |
decimation | heh http://www.ibiblio.org/hyperwar/USN/ref/MG/I/MG-2.html#16 << related | [23:14] |
assbot | HyperWar: The Machine Gun (Vol. I/Part II) ... ( http://bit.ly/1wixV6N ) | [23:14] |
asciilifeform | !s you and the atomic bomb | [23:15] |
assbot | 10 results for 'you and the atomic bomb' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=you+and+the+atomic+bomb | [23:15] |
asciilifeform | ^ more related | [23:15] |
* | kdomanski has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) | [23:15] |
undata | asciilifeform: how much money would you need to produce said computer and a suitable OS? | [23:16] |
asciilifeform | suitable for whom ? | [23:16] |
* | jborkl (~jborkl@unaffiliated/jborkl) has joined #bitcoin-assets | [23:17] |
undata | a guy wanting to write some code and keep a secret or two | [23:17] |
asciilifeform | very vague, this. | [23:17] |
* | undata hands asciilifeform his busted laptop | [23:17] |
undata | something that replaces this piece of trash | [23:17] |
asciilifeform | back to chip thread, for a spell - we're roughly in the situation of ancient china, which had printing but not movable type | [23:18] |
asciilifeform | the closest thing anyone has conceived off to movable type re: chip design is the fpga concept. | [23:18] |
asciilifeform | which is actually more analogous to a teletype (slow, ponderous, you would not want to print a book's print run on it) | [23:18] |
asciilifeform | but indispensable for certain work. | [23:19] |
* | jborkl has quit (Client Quit) | [23:19] |
decimation | and it isn't 'movable type' in the sense that someone with a brain can arrange the internals to serve his needs | [23:19] |
asciilifeform | the way i understand it, a 100% open fpga, produced in a thousand factories of mutually-antagonistic owners, is the one and only way to 'open computer.' | [23:20] |
asciilifeform | unless some fundamental discovery enabling cellar chip fab were to be made | [23:20] |
decimation | or 'chip printing' | [23:20] |
decimation | both of which are fantastic science fiction today | [23:20] |
asciilifeform | ^ grantsmanship, usg desinfo. | [23:20] |
asciilifeform | nothing remotely resembling a 'chip printer' is conceivable with presently-known physics | [23:21] |
decimation | yeah it is easier to conceive of trained bacteria who arrange parts appropriately | [23:21] |
decimation | 'bio-assembly' or whatever | [23:22] |
asciilifeform | bacterium is almost as much too large as you and i. | [23:22] |
asciilifeform | for this work. | [23:22] |
asciilifeform | even if he had hands. | [23:22] |
asciilifeform | once you clear away the usg grantsmanship, what mr. mold called 'scientocracy', you realize that actual science mostly 100% stopped around 1960. | [23:23] |
decimation | yeah one would need trained molecules | [23:23] |
asciilifeform | at least in the english world. | [23:23] |
decimation | yes, usg 'sat' on this stool too | [23:23] |
assbot | [HAVELOCK] [AMHASH3] 875 @ 0.0012 = 1.05 BTC | [23:25] |
asciilifeform | usg annihilated science to an extent no one ever, i suspect, thought of as possible. | [23:25] |
asciilifeform | in contrast, e.g., trofim lysenko's victims were at least intellectually-equipped to understand what was happening to them. | [23:26] |
mircea_popescu | mats but there please. | [23:26] |
decimation | asciilifeform: reading about lysenko immediately conjures the 'stierlitz files' where all the nazis had a high-school education | [23:28] |
decimation | usg also stole the "having stolen science" | [23:28] |
asciilifeform | the ones with actual education, went off to derp in aryan physics or annenerbe etc. | [23:29] |
asciilifeform | big, fat difference. | [23:29] |
decimation | or fled | [23:29] |
asciilifeform | note, there was a where to flee. | [23:29] |
decimation | heh true this | [23:29] |
asciilifeform | where do you flee from the planet-devourer -if you want to do science- ? | [23:30] |
asciilifeform | no destination. | [23:30] |
decimation | king neptune? | [23:30] |
asciilifeform | lol | [23:30] |
* | Lee- has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) | [23:33] |
decimation | mircea_popescu: I like your romanian poet/french revolution quote. It could almost be used as a motto for the west today | [23:34] |
mircea_popescu | hehe. | [23:35] |
mircea_popescu | the irony of modernity is that there's no shortage of answers. in fact, they're written generally a century ago. just... nobody [knows how to] reads. | [23:36] |
assbot | [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 40552 @ 0.0006453 = 26.1682 BTC [-] {5} | [23:37] |
* | asciilifeform should like the answer to 'how do i grow single-crystal si in jungle conditions, how do i lay down dopant with ion beam sans high vacuum' etc. | [23:38] |
* | asciilifeform wants to know in what roman text these answers lie. | [23:38] |
* | asciilifeform can read. | [23:38] |
assbot | [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 24600 @ 0.00067574 = 16.6232 BTC [+] {2} | [23:38] |
mircea_popescu | ah but! we're talking of different things. | [23:39] |
mircea_popescu | he was discussing politics and society. | [23:39] |
asciilifeform | aha lol | [23:39] |
asciilifeform | the human zoo's been around for quite some time, yes. | [23:39] |
asciilifeform | well-documented. | [23:39] |
mircea_popescu | quiote | [23:40] |
assbot | [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8929 @ 0.00063894 = 5.7051 BTC [-] | [23:50] |
* | Lycerion is now known as Holdor | [23:51] |
decimation | asciilifeform: I wouldn't mind a 500 micrometer fab if it were possible at home | [23:56] |
asciilifeform | i wouldn't mind a car that runs on farts, if it were possible at home. | [23:57] |
decimation | hehe | [23:58] |
undata | I'm still interested to hear an estimate on the R&D cost of an 'actual' computer | [23:58] |
asciilifeform | undata: i can't even begin to say, because the expense involved is literally astronomical. | [23:58] |
asciilifeform | as in, you would have to re-create entire industries from scratch | [23:59] |
asciilifeform | as if after a global thermonuking. | [23:59] |
asciilifeform | and you would not stand to make any of it back. it would have to be a purely narcissistic pyramid built for the self-aggrandizement of some king. | [23:59] |
Category: Logs