Forum logs for 23 Sep 2015

Sunday, 24 November, Year 11 d.Tr. | Author: Mircea Popescu
mircea_popescu but the 'research' is not happening. << this is a point. [00:00]
mircea_popescu But even now those things are going from treatments for the rare and debilitating to treatments for the common and hammy << exactl;y, and these two go together. we're now at the point where "important" vaccines for purely imaginary conditions are being pushed out. srsly, some people get nonspecific pain from what may be a viral infection ? [00:01]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16300 @ 0.00076182 = 12.4177 BTC [-] [00:01]
BingoBoingo mircea_popescu: Ah, now most of the new "biologics" released in the US are for various forms of "autoimmune" arthritis but not really. [00:02]
BingoBoingo They work more on repetative load injuries. [00:02]
mircea_popescu one of the most lucrative and so often targetted by pharma spaces is where doctors go "dunno, let's try this. and that. and then see." [00:03]
mircea_popescu that's 100% of psycho, and most of nonspeciffic pain (which only exists because gps wanted a loophole to prescripe medocal social security to healthy men) and then "old age/shit habits" diseases. like some arthitis types (aka gout)./ [00:04]
deedbot- [BitBet Bets Bets] 23.00000000 BTC on 'Yes' - The ETH scam won't see 2016 - http://bitbet.us/bet/1199/the-eth-scam-wont-see-2016/#b25 [00:04]
mircea_popescu annnnnd it takes 1st place. [00:05]
BingoBoingo Dayum [00:05]
* Vexual is now known as butbut [00:06]
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BingoBoingo But seriously the big malingering complaint is now labeled "fibromyalgia" and there is actually a therapy that keeps these hams sated. Stong compounded mixes of tricyclic antidepressants and NSAIDS. [00:07]
* pursefirst is now known as waithuh [00:07]
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BingoBoingo Then the knees fail mechanically due to the load they bear. [00:07]
mircea_popescu that's just the world being unfair. [00:08]
BingoBoingo Gravity has been and always will be the ultimate shitlord [00:09]
mircea_popescu totally unselfware without a hint of irony [00:09]
mircea_popescu and ignorant. [00:09]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 36600 @ 0.00076265 = 27.913 BTC [+] {3} [00:09]
mircea_popescu interestingly enough, poloniex lost its 50% eth trading marketshare. now #3, #1 being something "gatecoin" [00:11]
BingoBoingo lol [00:11]
* Vexual is now known as zeroeth [00:11]
BingoBoingo Seems the Bitbet even slowed a bit after the bet. [00:11]
BingoBoingo Some folk must really want to fuck mircea_popescu [00:11]
* zeroeth is now known as Vexual [00:11]
mircea_popescu slowed ? [00:12]
BingoBoingo mircea_popescu: Yeah, haven't seen any deca BTC bets since the qntra [00:15]
BingoBoingo Oh, I guess that was oe [00:16]
BingoBoingo *one [00:16]
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* BingoBoingo in draft mode [00:16]
mircea_popescu originally it looked like the aim is to go for 5:1 [00:18]
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mircea_popescu kinda been degrading tho, curious if there's the required 1-200 btc left in the eth cheerleader camp to get it back on target. [00:19]
mircea_popescu lkol wait. 21 thing won't accept btc for its "product" ? [00:21]
mircea_popescu bwahahaha [00:21]
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mircea_popescu https://www.reddit.com/r/ethereum/comments/3lvsjd/prepare_yourselves_for_the_assault_on_ethereum_by/ [00:22]
assbot Prepare yourselves for the assault on Ethereum by certain hostile elements within bitcoin community. : ethereum ... ( http://bit.ly/1YBdAZ1 ) [00:22]
mircea_popescu "certain elements" are "attacking" the re-ripple thing by pointing out that it's stupid and pointless. TO THE BARRICADES!1 [00:23]
* assbot removes voice from psztorc [00:23]
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BingoBoingo Seriously [00:24]
BingoBoingo !up psztorc You know you dun got voice nao [00:24]
* assbot gives voice to psztorc [00:25]
* miteineichhorche is now known as eichhornchen [00:25]
psztorc Salutations [00:25]
BingoBoingo Welcome [00:25]
mircea_popescu https://medium.com/@timothyjcoulter/truffle-tricks-for-ethereum-development-dispelling-8-myths-first-impressions-880f66bf3320 << this is the lol of all fucking time. [00:26]
assbot Truffle Tricks for Ethereum Development: Dispelling 8 Myths & First Impressions — Medium ... ( http://bit.ly/1PqLPfD ) [00:26]
mircea_popescu recommended reading for asciilifeform just because i know he's a livresque masochist. [00:26]
BingoBoingo psztorc: Appologies for not replying to your email with wisdom, but my momma told me not to talk to strangers [00:26]
mircea_popescu hi psztorc . who're you ? [00:26]
psztorc I suppose I'm a "certain hostile element with bitcoin community". [00:26]
mircea_popescu o you are ? which one ? [00:26]
psztorc The second one in the Eth link you just posted [00:27]
* eichhornchen is now known as deezenuts [00:27]
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mircea_popescu ie Paul Sztorc ? [00:28]
mircea_popescu might be an idea to get your key reg'd with gribble. [00:28]
psztorc That's me. [00:28]
BingoBoingo mircea_popescu: He's got some sidechain betting thing, but more than that dun liek huffing ether [00:28]
mircea_popescu and by gribble i mean assbot. [00:28]
mircea_popescu "Truthcoin is my ambitious project to create a trustless P2P prediction-marketplace. This is possible because, unlike most marketplaces, the end product of a prediction market (PM) is information. " [00:29]
mircea_popescu oh another one of those. [00:29]
psztorc The last one. [00:29]
mircea_popescu you understand the fundamental problem with trying to create a "decentralized market" do you ? [00:29]
psztorc I hope so. [00:29]
mircea_popescu jesus reddit is retarded. omg not even wrong where to even start /me abandons the entire thread. [00:30]
mircea_popescu psztorc do tell ? [00:30]
psztorc The fundamental problem is tying the market to reality, without invoking a trusted 3rd party. [00:31]
mircea_popescu well no. the fundamental problem is that the function of a market is to centralize trade. decentralized market is like cool boiler. [00:32]
psztorc Can't a decentralized market centralize trade? [00:32]
psztorc One is a process, the other an outcome. [00:33]
mircea_popescu this argument is not even apparent if people were spherical cows in a vacuum. but as people are, it's impossible to obtain an outcome by opposite process. [00:33]
mircea_popescu dja know of any example from nature where something like that happens ? [00:34]
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mircea_popescu vex you gotta stop with the nick spam. [00:34]
psztorc Would you say that Bitcoin centralizes all transactions in one blockchain database? [00:34]
mircea_popescu depends where you're taking it. this could perhaps be said. [00:34]
psztorc When I say "decentralized", I mean it the same way Satoshi meant it: headless and immortal. The individual traders still all "meet" in one "place". [00:36]
mircea_popescu but bitcoin is in no sense a market. [00:36]
psztorc In the project I designed. [00:36]
mircea_popescu there is no meeting whatsoever involved. [00:36]
mircea_popescu this, incidentally, is why it actually is trustless. but also why it's irreversible. [00:36]
psztorc When I say meet, I mean same database. [00:37]
mircea_popescu but the "meet" in "market" has a different intension from "meet" as in "sql join". [00:37]
mircea_popescu in this sense, "the earth centralizes the imago-es of all astral bodies, as their light projection". nevertheless, the earth is not a black hole. [00:38]
BingoBoingo How a trusted third party could possibly be agreed upon though is among the most centralizing mechanisms possibru [00:38]
mircea_popescu to take a step out of the purest theory closer t oactual practice. [00:38]
psztorc You may be right about whatever you are talking about, but in Truthcoin the operations performed are almost exactly the same as existing Bitcoin transactions. [00:39]
mircea_popescu then why bother ? [00:40]
psztorc To enable people to use Bitcoin in markets, and bet on real world things. [00:40]
psztorc Why use BitBet? [00:40]
mircea_popescu but in the original terms. "in Truthcoin the operations performed are almost exactly the same as existing Bitcoin transactions". [00:40]
mircea_popescu well bitbet is plainly a central market for clearing risk. [00:41]
psztorc What "is" is a different question than what "is for". [00:41]
mircea_popescu ok. it's for clearing risk in a centrally-controlled environment. [00:42]
mircea_popescu (clearing, obviously, is a term of art, in finance. it's the process whereby definite items are recognized by others. very similar to the function of a torens title registrar, or the births book, or the military despatches.) [00:44]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20400 @ 0.00076274 = 15.5599 BTC [+] [00:45]
psztorc Are we still on "why bother"? [00:45]
mircea_popescu if you're satisfied with "why use bitbet" [00:46]
psztorc If you like to read, #1 of the lower 5 is about why I chose to create Truthcoin: http://www.truthcoin.info/papers/ [00:47]
assbot Papers | Truthcoin: Making Cheap Talk Expensive ... ( http://bit.ly/1PqP1YA ) [00:47]
* mircea_popescu goes in on the hope this won't be pdf. [00:48]
gernika Is it impossible to implement a public forum on a decentralized architecture, such as a dht? [00:49]
mircea_popescu heh. got a plaintext version psztorc ? [00:49]
* BingoBoingo too drunk for this [00:49]
psztorc Don't you ever miss all of the lovely pdf formatting? [00:49]
mircea_popescu gernika a) would you agree that the superset of this inquiry is the bbs and b) would you say it meets definitions of either "forum" or "decentralized" as you use them ? [00:50]
mircea_popescu psztorc haven't yet, no. [00:50]
BingoBoingo psztorc: No one really misses anything about pdf when they quit [00:50]
psztorc Well, I can pastebin it for you. [00:50]
mircea_popescu aite. [00:50]
psztorc http://pastebin.com/16sjgPXW [00:51]
assbot truthcoin-1 - Pastebin.com ... ( http://bit.ly/1PqPBp7 ) [00:51]
mircea_popescu "What if you had access to the combined intellectual powers of all mankind? It would be easier for you to make decisions." << you know, not only this does not follow, but the contrary is actually recorded as anecdotal observation by pretty much all sources. like say russell. [00:52]
gernika mircea_popescu: I can see a bbs as a public forum, yes. The decentralization is not as clear to me, at least not in the way I used them. I only ever dialed into one. [00:52]
gernika and it had all the porn I needed. [00:53]
mircea_popescu heh. [00:53]
mircea_popescu but you will notice you downloading porn and the functioning of a market are unrelated. [00:53]
mircea_popescu in any case, the question here isn't whether you could stuff the heart of an ox, the guts of a pig and the lungs of a horse inside the skin of a skinned goose. [00:54]
mircea_popescu the question is whether the animal so obtained will quack. [00:54]
* assbot removes voice from psztorc [00:55]
mircea_popescu !up psztorc [00:55]
-assbot- You voiced psztorc for 30 minutes. [00:55]
* assbot gives voice to psztorc [00:55]
gernika The problem I see is that there's no profit motive for the market owner, because there's no owner, so no one will drive the thing to work. Which I hope relates to your last point. [00:55]
mircea_popescu ""Whereas a stock market is a place to buy and sell shares of a corporation’s earnings, a Prediction Market (PM) is a place to buy and sell predictions. Valid predictions entitle their owner to $11"" << this, foir the record, is horrible writing. do not mix things so far apart the abstraction scale, it confuses idiots and it gives smart people the impression your abstractor really has very little breadth. [00:55]
mircea_popescu gernika it's a start, i'd say. [00:56]
psztorc That was actually a footnote. It was $1 in the pdf [00:56]
mircea_popescu why would it be a magic number and why would the number reference an undefined concept. [00:56]
mircea_popescu suppose i read this in 3030, at which point no fucking body knows what $ is, and we decide it stands for "trustcoin" [00:57]
psztorc I'm specifically choosing not to target the 3030 audience. [00:57]
mircea_popescu "The current market price of these tradable predictions can then be interpreted as the likelihood of the prediction coming true." << because, why ? [00:57]
BingoBoingo The paper honestly reads to me as BitBet ad copy [00:58]
psztorc Those statements are not original research...they're lifted from several mainstream scholars, econ textbooks, wikipedia "prediction markets" article. [00:58]
BingoBoingo Just with BitBet it is hard to lose to butthurt retards [00:59]
mircea_popescu lifted, no footnote ? [00:59]
mircea_popescu you're perhaps unfamiliar with the saying "traduttore, traditore". [00:59]
mircea_popescu careful what and whom you steal from, lest you get poisoned. [01:00]
psztorc Haha [01:00]
psztorc These are very basic concepts, not exactly plagiarism. [01:00]
mircea_popescu they are very basic INTELLECTUAL FASHIONS. [01:00]
mircea_popescu "When anyone can trade, no source of information is overlooked, and market forces balance [01:01]
mircea_popescu info-sources in a way that is consistently and unanimously acceptable." << like that. [01:01]
psztorc I assume you don't agree? [01:01]
mircea_popescu none of this stands to actual scrutiny, but hey, peopel got enamoured with whatever that irish thing was called, and it got to die a hero's death so we'll hear about it like we wouldn't have heard if it just died naturally. [01:01]
mircea_popescu i do not agree. [01:01]
mircea_popescu but leaving aside the entire "prediction market" thing, lemme try and find the actual coin discussion. [01:02]
psztorc What type of thing would change your mind? [01:02]
mircea_popescu " Television has a gift for simplifying and communicating ideas" << o lordy. [01:02]
mircea_popescu ok, indulge me. give me an example of an idea that was so communicated by television. [01:02]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 29811 @ 0.00076274 = 22.738 BTC [+] [01:03]
psztorc What follows that section are youtube videos to tv clips about prediction markets. [01:03]
mircea_popescu so... uh... [01:03]
mircea_popescu "i once got formed an idea while in front of the tv ergo tv has a gift" ? [01:03]
psztorc That sentence is not a claim that I make. [01:04]
mircea_popescu ah intrade there we go. [01:04]
psztorc It is in the pdf formatting that I am continuing my explanation of prediction markets in a different way. [01:04]
mircea_popescu "Bitcoin is P2P software. It was not ever designed for other people to store your money; it was designed for you to store your own money." << can you prove this ? [01:05]
mircea_popescu or at least shore it up past the nude declaratory thing ? [01:05]
psztorc You disagree with that? [01:05]
* BingoBoingo declares bread tripe, retires [01:05]
mircea_popescu yes. [01:05]
psztorc What exactly do you disagree with? [01:06]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 24400 @ 0.00076181 = 18.5882 BTC [-] {2} [01:06]
mircea_popescu o, you want the list ? mkay. [01:06]
mircea_popescu i disagree with the notion that whether bitcoin was designed for people to hold own money or opm follows from bitcoin being p2p ; that there is a way to differentiate between opm and yom. and other things [01:07]
psztorc You can't tell the difference between money you own and money that other people own? [01:07]
mircea_popescu there's nothing magical about money being "your own". the situation where you own house A, and live in house B which is identical but you rent ; and the situation where you own house A and live in house A is imaginary. [01:08]
mircea_popescu im sorry. the DIFFERENCE between the two situations is imaginary is what i mean. [01:08]
BingoBoingo Pro Idiotas! [01:09]
psztorc Replace "own" with "control" if you like. [01:09]
mircea_popescu and thje best example to verify this is, a situation where you and another guy sit in a bar for the space it takes to drink two drafts each. [01:09]
mircea_popescu whether each pays his own each time in silence, or you buy one round and he buys another round is nil. [01:09]
mircea_popescu this is why money is important, this annullment of a perceived difference. [01:10]
psztorc What I wrote has nothing to do with fungibility. [01:10]
mircea_popescu as the saying goes around here, you might not be interested in fungibility, but that doesn't prevent it from being interested in you. [01:10]
psztorc Again, I am interested in fungibility. [01:11]
psztorc But I didn't write about it in that paper. [01:11]
mircea_popescu "The Bitcoin businesses that oppose this intent by holding customer funds (for example the currency exchanges) lose those funds regularly." << except mpex never did. and bitbet never did. and so on. [01:11]
mircea_popescu together these make up a good 90% of bitcoin busiensses. [01:11]
mircea_popescu now, feel free to generalize on the remainder 10%, but it is not unlike saying "men are evil and should be locked up". [01:11]
mircea_popescu also an intellectual fashion in some circles. [01:11]
psztorc Really? [01:13]
mircea_popescu yes. [01:13]
mircea_popescu "Although businesses can prove their solvency, proof of future-solvency is impossible, and even solvent Bitcoin PM-businesses would be able to steal funds by trading on and then reporting incorrect prediction outcomes." << this is a feckless misstatement of the situation. a centralized business is predicated on the trustworthyness of its living owner. whose word is, to repurpose a JPM quote, "worth more than all the bo [01:14]
mircea_popescu nds in Christendom". [01:14]
mircea_popescu (do you happen to be familiar with the exchange i'm referencing there ?) [01:14]
psztorc I know that you own and operate MPEX [01:14]
mircea_popescu no i meant the jpm quote. [01:14]
psztorc and of course I'm familiar with BitBet [01:15]
psztorc I'm familiar with some of JPM's history [01:15]
psztorc How do you square your 90% figure against MtGox's loss of 850,000 Bitcoins. [01:17]
mircea_popescu the proposition that mtgox was a bitcoin business is tenuous. [01:18]
psztorc My understanding was that MPEX's volume was much lower than that, let alone total stored. [01:18]
mircea_popescu you don't think walmart is a tide business for instance, do you ? [01:18]
psztorc No. [01:19]
mircea_popescu moreover, mtgox mostly "lost" money it never had. [01:19]
psztorc But I think that all Bitcoin exchanges are Bitcoin businesses. [01:19]
mircea_popescu on the basis of what ? [01:19]
psztorc It is a question of definition...I chose to define it that way. [01:20]
psztorc What definition do you use? [01:20]
mircea_popescu well, for starters, they priced bitcoin in dollars not dollars in bitcoin. [01:22]
psztorc And BitPay claims to process over 100,000 Bitcoin per month [01:22]
mircea_popescu these claims must be novel. ever since they forgot to mention how shockingly little they processed for "black friday" [01:22]
psztorc that's a lot more than MPEX's volume [01:22]
mircea_popescu but no, the various hanger ons trying to insinuate themselves in bitcoin do not by this desire actually become part of the thing. [01:22]
psztorc And your definition is? [01:23]
mircea_popescu anyway : consider that when mp said mtgox goes away, mtgox actually went away. [01:23]
mircea_popescu much to the disbelief of the entire collected "foundation" & assorted jesuses, captains of industry and whatnots. [01:23]
mircea_popescu the closest i ever came to stating a definition was in this 2012 article : http://trilema.com/2012/the-politics-of-bitcoin/ [01:24]
assbot The politics of Bitcoin on Trilema - A blog by Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1K07c9f ) [01:24]
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* assbot removes voice from psztorc [01:25]
mircea_popescu !up psztorc [01:26]
-assbot- You voiced psztorc for 30 minutes. [01:26]
* assbot gives voice to psztorc [01:26]
mircea_popescu anyway, the jpm thing is more important, so let's get back to that for a second. the matter was put to him, in a congressional hearing, "Is not commercial credit based primarily upon money or property?" [01:26]
psztorc I'm afraid I couldn't find the definition. [01:26]
mircea_popescu and the responses came rather informatively : [01:26]
mircea_popescu "No sir, the first thing is character." [01:26]
mircea_popescu "Before money or property?" [01:26]
mircea_popescu "Before money or anything else. Money cannot buy it...Because a man I do not trust could not get money from me on all the bonds in Christendom." [01:26]
mircea_popescu there is in fact no way to substitute for this. [01:26]
mircea_popescu the notion that "proving" "solvency" which is to say, having money may somehow buy character, and on it trust. [01:27]
mircea_popescu this is delusional. [01:27]
psztorc Of course, as I'm sure you know, "credit" comes from the latin "cred-" for "belief/faith" [01:27]
mircea_popescu the only thing "proofs" will do is make people optimize for the exam. that is all. [01:27]
mircea_popescu aha. [01:27]
psztorc And the sentence I wrote was to explain exactly why "proofs of solvency" are insufficient (which you have just restated) [01:28]
mircea_popescu alright. [01:28]
mircea_popescu "Although Bitcoin does not solve our PM problems, it demonstrates that a blockchain can provide scalable, censorship-resistant, and trustless solutions. Blockchain solutions also generate efficiency by cutting out middlemen and avoiding overhead costs (no brick-and-mortar, compliance, administration, etc.)." << this is miserable. what exactly is "solutions" supposed to mean ? and more importantly : the blockchain settl [01:30]
mircea_popescu ement device is BY FAR the most expensive, cumbersome and unwieldy mechanism for settlement ever devised. it was not even feasible to contemplate before computing and major bandwidth was available. [01:30]
mircea_popescu the entire "bitcoin is efficient" thing is very 2010s naivete. it is anything but. [01:31]
mircea_popescu it's ironclad, sure. but a tank has not very good fuel economy. [01:31]
psztorc For a given level of security, the payments are now cheaper. [01:31]
psztorc Also, I'm sure you've heard of the Lightning Network. [01:32]
mircea_popescu ok, sure, for a given level, as long as that level is very high, they are in fact cheaper. [01:32]
mircea_popescu this is not what usually is meant by eficiency. [01:32]
psztorc Well we have to compare apples to apples don't we? [01:32]
mircea_popescu best specify what apples we're comparing. [01:33]
mircea_popescu anyway. [01:33]
psztorc Hey, when you wanted to read Satoshi's pdf whitepaper, did you like ask a friend to print it out for you or something? [01:33]
mircea_popescu "My design was able to solve a few other PM-problems as well. Any user can create a market about anything, removing the dual-requirement that a PM-administrator must not only be trustworthy, but also share your prediction-interests. Market scoring rule technology ensures that trading volume is irrelevant, and traders will always be able make a trade updating the price to their estimation (even if they are the only trad [01:33]
mircea_popescu er)." << dja understand the concept of liquidity ? [01:33]
mircea_popescu because if i want to sink your chances, understand, all i need is to quote this and snicker. [01:33]
mircea_popescu suppose you're in a VC office trying to close a deal. and i drop by to take the guy out to golf. [01:33]
mircea_popescu and you're like, almost there, and all i do is recite that and laugh. you're out on your ass. [01:33]
mircea_popescu dja understand this ? [01:33]
psztorc No [01:33]
mircea_popescu ok. what is liquidity ? [01:34]
psztorc Loss of common knowledge of an asset's valuation. [01:34]
psztorc Gain/loss* [01:34]
mircea_popescu uhm. what ungodly sort of post structuralist lacanian approach to finance is this supposed to be! [01:35]
mircea_popescu fiat, delta knowledge on valuation. i doubtr you'll find anyone who even will entertain the approach, within finance. but moving on : [01:35]
mircea_popescu whence in the everloving fuck will you summon into existence counters for all the solo traders trading with no one ? [01:35]
psztorc That isn't post structuralism... PS is when the audience is supposedly more important than the author's text or intent. [01:36]
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psztorc This has nothing to do with that. [01:37]
mircea_popescu lol [01:37]
psztorc I could link to a pdf on market scoring rules [01:37]
psztorc or an Excel spreadsheet [01:37]
psztorc but I'm guessing..... [01:37]
mircea_popescu or you could keep it simple, and explain why your excel spreadsheet isn't hard at work finding boyfriends for all the very fat lonely feminists out there. [01:37]
mircea_popescu they too got a knowledge, why isn't it being met ? [01:38]
psztorc MSRs are a formula which relate [1] the current quantity of outstanding shares (of mutually-exclusive states) to [2] an account filled with money. [01:38]
mircea_popescu by whom ? [01:39]
psztorc The traders, although you can put some money in the middle (which you'll lose) to create... [01:39]
psztorc .. [01:39]
psztorc your favorite word [01:39]
psztorc liquidity. [01:39]
psztorc The derivative of [1] share quantity happens to be the prices. [01:40]
asciilifeform i'd like to ask psztorc for a monopole magnet [01:40]
psztorc People propose updates to the share quantity, and can locally calculate how the account [2] would have to change. [01:40]
asciilifeform to be made after he is done with the counter-less market of solo traders. [01:40]
asciilifeform i could really use a monopole. [01:40]
psztorc If they pay the right amount, the trade goes through, otherwise it does not. [01:40]
psztorc Again this isn't something I made up, a physicist designed it like 15 years ago and it is currently being used in a few places. With play money at SciCast. [01:42]
mircea_popescu i'm kinda puzzled why the problem is not directly obvious. [01:42]
mircea_popescu psztorc let's try a mental experiment shall we ? [01:42]
psztorc I love experiments. [01:43]
mircea_popescu i mean srsly nobody cares if you came up with it or clark gable did. that's not at issue. and in general "original research" is even a topic only among the wikitards. it's not a legitimate consideration. [01:43]
mircea_popescu but as to the experiment : suppose your coin exists. suppose it has a total issued volume of 1mn coins. suppose i own them all, because i'm an asshole and i buy them all. [01:44]
psztorc A given claim is more likely to be false if only one person has assessed it. [01:44]
mircea_popescu this is false. [01:44]
mircea_popescu now, suppose i make a bet that tomorrow will be a solar eclipse. [01:44]
mircea_popescu the odds on this are dismal. [01:44]
* pete_dushenski (~pete_dush@unaffiliated/pete-dushenski/x-8158685) has joined #bitcoin-assets [01:44]
mircea_popescu whence will the money come to liquidate my position ? [01:44]
mircea_popescu for instance : when i put 1 btc on the theory that ethereum dies by the end of the year, i got liquidated 5:1 within hours. [01:45]
psztorc From you, you'll win all of your own money back. [01:45]
mircea_popescu uh... i am not putting any money on No. [01:45]
mircea_popescu i bet all the coins on yes. [01:45]
* assbot gives voice to pete_dushenski [01:45]
psztorc If you really own all the coins, and you didn't put any in the middle, your first share of Yes will cost you 1. [01:45]
psztorc As will your 2nd and all the rest. [01:46]
mircea_popescu i really don't care what they cost. i am taking them all. [01:46]
mircea_popescu and i expect to see fair liquidity. say 10k to 1 against me. [01:46]
mircea_popescu where will ten billion coins spring for to liquidate my position ? [01:47]
psztorc You bought 1 mn coins. [01:47]
mircea_popescu aha. [01:47]
psztorc You traded 1 mn coins for 1 mn shares [01:47]
mircea_popescu aha. [01:47]
psztorc the answer was "Yes" [01:47]
mircea_popescu how the fuck would it be yes ? [01:48]
psztorc the 1 mn shares became worth 1 mn coins again. [01:48]
mircea_popescu there's not gonna be any sort of solar eclipse tomorrow. [01:48]
mircea_popescu the answer will be no. [01:48]
psztorc Well then you lose all of your coins... [01:48]
mircea_popescu to whom ? [01:48]
psztorc In that astonishingly unlikely scenario, no one. [01:48]
mircea_popescu did "no one" bet 10 bn coins on no ? [01:48]
psztorc They're just inaccessible. [01:48]
psztorc You're the only one who did anything. [01:49]
mircea_popescu so your liquidity has a problem in simply materializing from the, if you'll excuse the pun, the ether ? [01:49]
mircea_popescu understand, the scenario is in no sense astonishing or at all unlikely. the scenario repeats itself 100% of the time in your model, just, you're not usually well instrumented to notice this. [01:49]
mircea_popescu unlike in my example, where i scrubbed off all incidentals that may hide the matter. [01:50]
psztorc What exactly is your question? [01:50]
* asciilifeform observes that 'bugs' like this (if gaping hole in the chest of an idea can still be referred to as a 'bug'...) can live almost indefinitely long when there is a 'play money only' system such as ones mentioned earlier. simply because the 'unreasonable!11!!!11!!' folk with serious dough don't show up to clean their clocks. [01:51]
mircea_popescu this is not a question, it is a statement of fact. counterintuitively, perhaps (not sure why, but this only happens to some people), your addition of a coin to the problem has in fact worsened your efficiency, by introducing a significant friction factor. [01:52]
mircea_popescu all this in an attempt to solve poorly an already solved problem (solved by centralization). [01:52]
* rdymac has quit (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity) [01:53]
mircea_popescu ie, your attempt to get fatties laid already suffers from the "wide area low height" problem. putting a coin on top of this is just crushing it into oblivion, and going exactly tyhe opposite directionm of solving it. [01:53]
psztorc : ) [01:53]
psztorc And yet, you change the subject so frequently. [01:53]
psztorc Do you believe that MSRs have a liquidity problem? [01:54]
mircea_popescu ie mortgage servicing rights ? [01:54]
psztorc Haha [01:54]
psztorc Market scoring rules, which we were just discussing. [01:54]
psztorc Feel free to use your fast knowledge to evade more questions : ) [01:55]
mircea_popescu you know, the abbreviation happens to already have a meaning, in the space. [01:55]
mircea_popescu im not entirely sure what "market scoring rules" are. but by the excel reference i vaguely expect a bayesian atrocity. [01:55]
psztorc There are Bayesian versions [01:56]
mircea_popescu unsurprisingly. [01:56]
* assbot removes voice from psztorc [01:56]
mircea_popescu understand : rules are generally powerless. the soviets had rules about how capital should be allocated. [01:56]
mircea_popescu didn't help them, especially once they didn't have the capital. [01:56]
mircea_popescu !up psztorc [01:56]
-assbot- You voiced psztorc for 30 minutes. [01:56]
* assbot gives voice to psztorc [01:56]
psztorc Almost as predictable as your question dodging. [01:56]
mircea_popescu how about you get registered in assbot so i can give you a rating so i don't have to keep doing the upping. [01:57]
psztorc I thought I had, like a year ago. Does it expire or something? [01:57]
pete_dushenski http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=18-09-2015#1278736 << turns out that i was off the mark here. to wit : "Emissions system and fuel economy testing is conducted while a vehicle is placed on a dynamometer—think of it as a two big rollers or a treadmill—rather than driving on the road. The vehicle has only its driving wheels rolling (the front ones, in the case of VW vehicles). But the rear tires are station [01:57]
pete_dushenski ary. The vehicle could otherwise interpret the test procedure as a dangerous situation or malfunction, activating traction control or stability control. By enabling a test mode, the vehicle will be able to operate during the test process. Once the test is complete and the car is restarted, the car reverts to its normal function. And once the cars are in on-the-road mode, nitrogen oxide levels increased by 10 to [01:57]
pete_dushenski 40 times the federal standard, according to the EPA." [01:57]
assbot Logged on 18-09-2015 18:54:21; pete_dushenski: either a) when anything plugs into the obd-ii port, or b) the whole thing is a parallel construction to keep ze germans at bay against tbtf 'domestics' [01:57]
mircea_popescu well what do you want me to do. they don't, per se, have a liquidity problem, not being the sort of thing that may have a liquidityy problem. they simply have no relation to liquidity whatsoever. [01:57]
mircea_popescu !gettrust psztorc [01:57]
assbot psztorc is not registered in WoT. [01:57]
mircea_popescu it doesn't expire and it doesn't think you ever did. [01:57]
pete_dushenski ;;gettrust psztorc [01:58]
gribble WARNING: Currently not authenticated. Trust relationship from user pete_dushenski to user psztorc: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 0 via 0 connections. Graph: http://b-otc.com/stg?source=pete_dushenski&dest=psztorc | WoT data: http://b-otc.com/vrd?nick=psztorc | Rated since: never [01:58]
psztorc Well I tried to do it when I discovered your blog, which was like last autumn. [01:58]
mircea_popescu http://wiki.bitcoin-assets.com/first_steps_in_bitcoin-assets << see ethere it's a half minute's job. [01:59]
assbot first_steps_in_bitcoin-assets [bitcoin assets wiki] ... ( http://bit.ly/1J73Z7o ) [01:59]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 21800 @ 0.00076274 = 16.6277 BTC [+] [01:59]
asciilifeform pete_dushenski: if (steering_shaft_turned_since_start()){while(1){pollute();}} [01:59]
psztorc !register F162C410 [02:00]
assbot That does not seem to be a valid fingerprint. [02:00]
mircea_popescu full size. [02:00]
pete_dushenski asciilifeform: if (rear_wheels_stationary_while_front_wheels_in_motion()){while(1){pollute();}} [02:00]
psztorc !register 16C81597E76E86E6C01EF037AA4B3330F162C410 [02:01]
assbot Searching pgp.mit.edu for key with fingerprint: 16C81597E76E86E6C01EF037AA4B3330F162C410. This may take a few moments. [02:01]
assbot Key F162C410 / "Paul Sztorc (Truthcoin)
" successfully imported. 		[02:01]
assbot Registration successful. [02:01]
mircea_popescu !rate psztorc 1 Has no idea what post-structuralism is. Just like everyone else. [02:01]
assbot Request successful, get your OTP: http://w.b-a.link/otp/0c3e5e073ec4f06d [02:01]
mircea_popescu !v assbot:mircea_popescu.rate.psztorc.1:d864f2f84f1203a928a97576d8edb2bc1231e49eb6b35d20b368ed1070206df2 [02:01]
assbot Successfully added a rating of 1 for psztorc with note: Has no idea what post-structuralism is. Just like everyone else. [02:01]
pete_dushenski http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=03-05-2014#657618 << hehe. [02:02]
assbot Logged on 03-05-2014 17:28:03; bitcoinpete: https://github.com/psztorc/Truthcoin < [02:02]
* agorecki has quit (Quit: Leaving) [02:02]
asciilifeform 'Reputable: Truthcoin was designed by a Yale Statistician with degrees in the blockchain-relevant fields of econ, psychology, and mathematics, who has been passionate about prediction markets since long before Bitcoin was created. Truthcoin was reviewed (favorably) by Andrew Poelstra, sidechains-co-author and skeptical author of widely-circulated technical papers on cryptosystem stability. Gregory Maxwell has been aware of the [02:04]
asciilifeform project for months, Peter Todd is actively reviewing it. Unlike 100% of all Bitcoin 2.0 projects, there have (so far) been no standing complaints from these elite-skeptics. Roger Ver, who has famously invested-in and donated-to some of the most promising organizations and experiments in the Bitcoin space (from original Ripple, to BitPay, to Purse.io), and ignored many others, has endorsed this project financially.' [02:04]
mircea_popescu why this habit of no names btw ? [02:05]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 47018 @ 0.00076274 = 35.8625 BTC [+] {2} [02:05]
psztorc I should edit that because PT did finish reviewing it. [02:05]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 2732 @ 0.00076287 = 2.0842 BTC [+] [02:06]
asciilifeform '...when you [1] watch journalists lie on television, [2] have to deal with obviously dishonest politicians rising through an obviously-dysfunctional "democratic" process, [3] get beaten down by office politics at work, or [4] participate in any serious argument with anyone. The fiber optic cable of the 90's gave the global community a "nervous system", called the internet, but despite advances in filesharing ("memory"), and s [02:06]
asciilifeform earch / auto-complete ("pre-processing"), we don't yet have a "central" nervous system to advise our decisions...' [02:06]
asciilifeform for fuck's sake. [02:06]
mircea_popescu http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2015-09-18/these-two-projects-are-racing-to-bring-election-gambling-back-for-2016 << the bloomberg piece is mildly amusing. [02:07]
assbot These Two Projects Are Racing to Bring Election Gambling Back for 2016 - Bloomberg Business ... ( http://bit.ly/1Felstd ) [02:07]
psztorc Yeah, I couldn't convince that guy that markets aren't gambling. [02:08]
mircea_popescu anyway. so what's the deal with the augur thing ? [02:08]
pete_dushenski psztorc: then what's gambling ? [02:08]
mircea_popescu of which i mostly know because some derps on reddit kept being butthurt at bitbet existing or somesuch. [02:08]
psztorc Stole from me and in the process of being poisoned. [02:08]
psztorc pete_dushenski: markets have prices which vary, producing useful info. gambling prices do not vary / static uselessness [02:09]
mircea_popescu "stole". you're an idea guy, correct ? how can you be stolen from ? [02:09]
mircea_popescu wait. wut ?! you ever watched a game of poker ? [02:09]
mircea_popescu of course the pot value varies. [02:09]
psztorc I don't consider poker gambling, personally. [02:10]
pete_dushenski mebbe psztorc is american and is used to 'betting lines' ? [02:10]
psztorc Too much skill. [02:10]
mircea_popescu ah. do you specifically mean the line betting scam ? [02:10]
psztorc https://github.com/truthcoin/truthcoin-cpp [02:10]
assbot truthcoin/truthcoin-cpp · GitHub ... ( http://bit.ly/1KzRUD0 ) [02:10]
mircea_popescu THAT's not betting. it's just like college ponzi, a scamatron. [02:11]
mircea_popescu "For millennia, there was suffering and misery. Can you imagine a world without music, or eyeglasses, or DayQuil?" << wut is dayquil ? [02:11]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: acetaminophen [02:11]
asciilifeform (curious choice) [02:12]
pete_dushenski psztorc: btw, even 'lines' change y'know. so... not static. so... time for a new definition ! [02:12]
mircea_popescu and yes, /me grew up in a world without glasses. or divorce. [02:12]
pete_dushenski or maple syrup [02:12]
* pete_dushenski has no point here. [02:12]
pete_dushenski http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=22-09-2015#1282406 << this, pointedly and as far as the eye can see, does NOT happen to be true. [02:14]
assbot Logged on 22-09-2015 13:57:38; mircea_popescu: (which happens to be true, architects know a lot about how buildings may be, and for this reason nothing about buildings that are) [02:14]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20750 @ 0.00076287 = 15.8296 BTC [+] [02:14]
pete_dushenski what, like architects only design new buildings ex nihilo on greenfield sites ? [02:14]
pete_dushenski in alberta, sure, this is often the case, but this is the overwhelming exception [02:15]
asciilifeform https://www.realitykeys.com << atrocity, linked from earlier atrocity. apparently there is no shortage of attempted schemes to build this perpetuum mobile, the 'decentralized fact verifier machine' [02:15]
assbot Reality Keys - Facts about the future, cryptographic proof when they come true ... ( http://bit.ly/1Fem6qq ) [02:15]
pete_dushenski architecture is as far more about existing buildings, topographies, and spaces as 'the new stuff' [02:16]
pete_dushenski *is far more [02:16]
pete_dushenski this is not only about renovations either [02:16]
pete_dushenski which is certainly a large chunk of the industry. [02:16]
pete_dushenski ultimately, architecture takes place in and around other architecture [02:17]
pete_dushenski it doesn't happen in a vacuum [02:17]
pete_dushenski 'modernisations', 'reskinning', and other forms of revamping that rely on the existing bones of a building are what keep cities alive and allow neighbourhoods to go through multiple phases of waxing and waning [02:20]
pete_dushenski without understanding the way buildings are, there's really no architecture. [02:21]
pete_dushenski sure, if you're fresh out of school, you know dick all, which is quite specifically why architects aren't 'licensed' until damn near a decade of practice [02:22]
pete_dushenski and even after that they're unlikely to lead a project [02:22]
psztorc Well, this has been fun but it is getting to be past my bedtime. [02:22]
psztorc I'll probably be back. [02:23]
psztorc Au revoir. [02:23]
pete_dushenski it's an old, hierarchical industry. architecture moves incredibly slowly. and quite rightly so as its products ~have~ to last decades, if not centuries. [02:23]
pete_dushenski psztorc: bon soir [02:23]
* psztorc (4575fa8d@gateway/web/freenode/ip.69.117.250.141) has left #bitcoin-assets [02:23]
pete_dushenski http://mashable.com/2015/09/17/nutella-personalised-jars-australia/#MysMdBAttSkS << hey cazalla, you a nutella fan ? [02:26]
assbot Nutella should not let Australians personalise their own jars ... ( http://bit.ly/1KzTqF5 ) [02:26]
pete_dushenski http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=22-09-2015#1283039 << isn't this what hondajet is/was/will be for ? [02:29]
assbot Logged on 22-09-2015 23:59:19; asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=22-09-2015#1282971 << omg1111111111 i can't afford 'boeing' !! where is my NEED-BASED AID !??!! [02:29]
pete_dushenski !s hondajet [02:29]
assbot 0 results for 'hondajet' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=hondajet [02:29]
cazalla pete_dushenski, nope but that is lulzy [02:32]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 93100 @ 0.00076311 = 71.0455 BTC [+] {5} [02:38]
cazalla totally to be expected as well, which is probably why they did it to begin with [02:43]
mircea_popescu pete_dushenski> and even after that they're unlikely to lead a project << maybe we'll allow your argument re civilised places. but in the us specifically, none of the stuff you discuss ever happens. [02:44]
pete_dushenski crazy. [02:45]
pete_dushenski who knew that canada was the cultural mecca of the americas ? [02:45]
pete_dushenski the apotheosis, if you will ;P [02:46]
mircea_popescu ;;later tell psztorc "BetsOfBitcoin Also old, yet closed Mysteriously. Funds stolen or missing. " << nothing mysterious about it. back in 2012 inaba was pushing the bfl scam, had a deal with the various "bet site operators" to allow bets on bfl delivery and then anull if it doesn't deliver. betsofbitcoin went for it, got called out for it, was dead after that. https://bitbet.us/bet/7/bfl-will-deliver-asic-devices-befor [02:48]
mircea_popescu e-march-1st/ << bitbet's version, which cost bfl close to 1k btc, and which resulted in http://trilema.com/2013/the-positive-market-effects-of-the-delivery-bet/ and which in turn resulted in a lot of clearing the air for legitimate operators in the space, and which is to some degree why asics even exist today as a private thing rather than coming a couple years later as a usg only thing. [02:48]
gribble The operation succeeded. [02:48]
assbot BitBet - BFL will deliver ASIC devices before March 1st :: 791.29 B (47%) on Yes, 898.53 B (53%) on No | closed 2 years 7 months ago ... ( http://bit.ly/1KzV49K ) [02:48]
assbot The positive market effects of the delivery bet. on Trilema - A blog by Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1KzV3mo ) [02:48]
mircea_popescu and the "MtGox-failure, a failure that itself resulted in the loss of 6% of the circulating Bitcoin money supply." verbiage is particularly ill advised. the bitcoin mtgox lost never circulated for the most part, in that they were imaginary. [02:49]
mircea_popescu similarly, all sorts of derps on "bitfinex" and assorted scum are currently booking imaginary bitcoins they "will get in the future". except they don't, but their losses aren't of bitcoin, they're losses of "bitcoin", [02:50]
pete_dushenski http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=23-09-2015#1283371 << irlol! [02:54]
assbot Logged on 23-09-2015 04:32:30; psztorc: Loss of common knowledge of an asset's valuation. [02:54]
mircea_popescu ironically that can actually stand. [02:54]
pete_dushenski as a definition of liquidity ?! [02:55]
mircea_popescu myeah. [02:55]
mircea_popescu http://www.truthcoin.info/blog/contracts-oracles-sidechains/ << the treatment of "how to increase fictitious '''optionality''' through factual restrictions" is particularly scandalous. [02:56]
assbot Oracles are the Real Smart Contracts | Truthcoin: Making Cheap Talk Expensive ... ( http://bit.ly/1KzVE7m ) [02:56]
mircea_popescu what if we don't fucking want to buy bullshit lucas crap at any price, and what if we would gladly pay for that crap to not even have the possibiklity to exist ? [02:56]
mircea_popescu what of all good films that never happened because that shit existed, and who pays for the damage britney spears did to music ? [02:56]
mircea_popescu fuck "total optionality" in the sense of, strip mall. [02:57]
mircea_popescu what if hollywood never existed altogether and i wouldn't have to explain to sane people from the future why the fuck exactly is it that every woman in every film has a permanently affixed bedspread righ above her tits for some reason ? [02:57]
mircea_popescu optionalitits my ass. [02:58]
* Tyklol is now known as Tykling [02:59]
pete_dushenski mircea_popescu: as to liquidity, hot damn if i don't see it now. only 6 hours into this yom kippur fast and i'm always too slow. [03:00]
mircea_popescu lol [03:00]
* pete_dushenski sends himself to a hungry slumber [03:00]
* pete_dushenski has quit (Remote host closed the connection) [03:01]
mircea_popescu anyway, the amusing thing if one actually reads the above linked thing is that the proponent of truthcoin objects that ethereum bets won't work because they're not bitbet. which is a correct point, but leaves him in the lurch. [03:03]
mircea_popescu "Ultimately, as Bitcoin takes over the internet, all non-Bitcoin projects (of any kind) will be treated with the ridicule afforded a US resident who tries to pay for his milk with Japanese yen. Eventually, interest in using a non-Bitcoin will fall to zero. Altcoins, even somehow-useful ones, don’t have a future." << and the proper link for this is, of course, http://trilema.com/2014/the-woes-of-altcoin-or-why-there-i [03:07]
mircea_popescu s-no-such-thing-as-cryptocurrencies/ [03:07]
assbot The woes of Altcoin, or why there is no such thing as "cryptocurrencies" on Trilema - A blog by Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1j8LgNl ) [03:07]
mircea_popescu more respek for actual experiments and their results. [03:07]
mircea_popescu "Getting the Good Authority In the old days, competition kept Authorities in line. For example, in The Merchant of Venice, Shylock is trying to get a contract enforced by an Authority:" << heh, look at that. [03:08]
mircea_popescu mkay, /me has had enough of this poorly sourcing of material. srsly, buncha quotes to tardipedia ? none to actual source material ? mmmkay. [03:09]
mircea_popescu https://twitter.com/virtuallylaw/status/645645873716850688 << check it out asciilifeform :D [03:11]
mircea_popescu mwahahaha. [03:11]
mircea_popescu in other news, yet another one of these : https://twitter.com/BitcoinBabeAU/status/646504292392771584 [03:17]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 48200 @ 0.00076332 = 36.792 BTC [+] {4} [03:24]
* Now talking on #bitcoin-assets [10:03]
* Topic for #bitcoin-assets is: http://bitcoin-assets.com || http://log.bitcoin-assets.com || http://bash.bitcoin-assets.com || http://blogs.bitcoin-assets.com [10:03]
* Topic for #bitcoin-assets set by kakobrekla!~kako@unaffiliated/kakobrekla at Wed Mar 5 16:58:12 2014 [10:03]
-assbot- Welcome to #bitcoin-assets. To get voice (ie, to be able to speak), send me "!up" in a private message to get an OTP. You must have a sufficient WoT rating. If you do not have a WoT account or sufficient rating, try politely asking one of the voiced people for a temporary voice. [10:03]
* assbot gives voice to mircea_popescu [10:04]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 32753 @ 0.00075915 = 24.8644 BTC [+] [10:09]
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mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=23-09-2015#1283587 << hm, is it me or the no side is kinda getting spent ? originally it was very chipper at 5:1, but running out of steam at 2.x :1 by now [10:19]
assbot Logged on 23-09-2015 06:54:44; deedbot-: [BitBet Bets Bets] 24.66420430 BTC on 'No' - The ETH scam won't see 2016 - http://bitbet.us/bet/1199/the-eth-scam-wont-see-2016/#b27 [10:19]
phf http://emarsden.chez.com/downloads/mandel.ps << mandelbrot in postscript, apropos code vs. serialised formats [10:35]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1ja37mQ ) [10:35]
shinohai http://boingboing.net/2015/09/22/yet-another-pre-installed-spyw.html [10:38]
assbot Yet another pre-installed spyware app discovered on Lenovo computers / Boing Boing ... ( http://bit.ly/1gNof0B ) [10:38]
mircea_popescu o hey shinohai, how goes the hunt ? [10:39]
shinohai Still the same, casting a lot but no bites :/ [10:47]
mircea_popescu you ever saw the stripper lulz btw ? [10:47]
shinohai stripper lulz? [10:47]
mircea_popescu one sec lemme dig it up [10:48]
shinohai kk [10:48]
mircea_popescu https://www.stripperweb.com/forum/archive/index.php/t-181800.html [10:49]
assbot Bitcoin Giveaway [Archive] - Stripper Web Exotic Dancer Community ... ( http://bit.ly/1ja5Xbw ) [10:49]
deedbot- [BitBet Bets Bets] 1.00000000 BTC on 'Yes' - BTC to top $700 before November - http://bitbet.us/bet/1179/btc-to-top-700-before-november/#b36 [10:50]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 129600 @ 0.00076497 = 99.1401 BTC [+] {7} [10:50]
shinohai "Who knew giving away stuff to strippers is going to turn into some sort of criminal case, seriously now." <<< Love hanbot [10:55]
punkman was just looking at poloniex. you could sell ~300k eth to hit 0.1 now (and you'd take home ~1100 btc) [10:56]
punkman err 0.0001 [10:56]
shinohai I've never seen strippers turn down *free fucking money* mircea_popescu [10:58]
mircea_popescu so now you have. [10:59]
shinohai 1 whole BTC yet, thats pretty generous [10:59]
mircea_popescu the fuckiung internet. it breeds stupid and lazy. [10:59]
mircea_popescu goes to funkenstein's attempt with that guy yest. [10:59]
mircea_popescu it would seem the "popular mechanics" interpretation of the internet in the common mind (which is what everyone no matter how brilliant in selected fields reverts to anwyay, in a process we call "the memory hole effect") is something like "the internet is an implementation of god - and a god that cares at that". [11:00]
deedbot- [BitBet Bets Bets] 10.94821216 BTC on 'No' - BTC to top $700 before November - http://bitbet.us/bet/1179/btc-to-top-700-before-november/#b37 [11:01]
shinohai Think what could have happened for a few of them with just a little research. Mighta found a way to invest said bitcoin into many times that by now :/ [11:02]
mircea_popescu yeah, into p2p lending. [11:02]
shinohai p2p lending kek [11:03]
shinohai I'd put it in coinbr, but I didn't know of this place in 2013 [11:03]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 29700 @ 0.00075353 = 22.3798 BTC [-] {3} [11:07]
shinohai I am seeing a correlation here though. You are practically giving away btc to artists that are doing it anyway, but most are too lazy to open a webchat and come to irc. [11:09]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu will love this one: http://arstechnica.com/business/2015/09/coffee-shop-owners-face-backlash-after-pick-up-artist-podcast-exposed [11:09]
assbot Coffee shop owners face backlash after “pick-up artist” podcast exposed | Ars Technica ... ( http://bit.ly/1Vao3Gk ) [11:09]
mircea_popescu lol [11:12]
asciilifeform http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=23-09-2015#1283583 << what am i looking at ? [11:13]
assbot Logged on 23-09-2015 06:09:33; mircea_popescu: https://twitter.com/virtuallylaw/status/645645873716850688 << check it out asciilifeform :D [11:13]
mircea_popescu peter murck wanna "kill the drama" [11:14]
shinohai I commented on that tweet kek [11:14]
asciilifeform this is a what, a gavin ? [11:14]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform one of the people killed in my recent drawing. [11:14]
asciilifeform ah [11:15]
mircea_popescu because you know, bitcoin is not backed by lulz and drama anymoar. it's backed by inept pencildicks in pretendsuits. [11:15]
asciilifeform i confess i must have slept through whatever this was. [11:15]
mircea_popescu anyway. it just amused me as a case of "bug shaped man confused that the future doesn't seem to belong to him." [11:15]
asciilifeform it is very easy to be confused when flying in own jet while opponents starve [11:16]
mircea_popescu yes, were that to be the case it would easy to be confused. [11:16]
mircea_popescu meanwhile, http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=23-09-2015#1283046 [11:17]
assbot Logged on 23-09-2015 00:19:51; mircea_popescu: http://www.cnbc.com/2015/09/22/controversial-drug-ceo-was-accused-of-serious-harassment.html << so it begins. [11:17]
BingoBoingo ./bitcoin-qt [11:18]
asciilifeform eh, http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=23-09-2015#1283072 [11:18]
assbot Logged on 23-09-2015 01:36:58; asciilifeform: also usg giveth, usg taketh away. a 'pharma ceo' has so much as one cent purely by the good graces of hitler - who helpfully keeps penny-a-pill indian generics mostly out of u.s. market [11:18]
mircea_popescu "own jet" baby. you said. [11:18]
mircea_popescu it's not my fault i end up repeating myself. [11:18]
* asciilifeform possibly sees where mircea_popescu is going with this [11:19]
mircea_popescu i'm staying right here! [11:19]
asciilifeform point. [11:19]
asciilifeform from same rag, http://arstechnica.com/security/2015/09/serious-imgur-bug-exploited-to-execute-worm-like-attack-on-8chan-users [11:20]
assbot Serious Imgur bug exploited to execute worm-like attack on 8chan users | Ars Technica ... ( http://bit.ly/1VapKUa ) [11:20]
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mircea_popescu and this is not (one of the) tor deanonymization tricks. [11:21]
mircea_popescu ie, mandated hole in img hoster. [11:21]
asciilifeform possibly the oldest [11:21]
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shinohai Shalom pete_dushenski [11:24]
* assbot gives voice to pete_dushenski [11:25]
pete_dushenski guten morgen [11:25]
shinohai https://i.imgur.com/sRUZoaT.jpg <<< yellowfever.jpg [11:27]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1jafrnl ) [11:27]
pete_dushenski http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=23-09-2015#1283628 << huh [11:27]
assbot Logged on 23-09-2015 13:54:22; punkman: was just looking at poloniex. you could sell ~300k eth to hit 0.1 now (and you'd take home ~1100 btc) [11:27]
pete_dushenski ;;calc 300000/2000 [11:28]
gribble 150 [11:28]
mircea_popescu https://forums.gentoo.org/viewtopic-t-421391-start-0.html some top keks. [11:29]
assbot Gentoo Forums :: View topic - Enslave gnome-pty-helper ... ( http://bit.ly/1Var49q ) [11:29]
deedbot- [Trilema] The strange case of the six hundred dollars and other stories. - http://trilema.com/2015/the-strange-case-of-the-six-hundred-dollars-and-other-stories/ [11:29]
pete_dushenski so anyone crazy enough to have plunked down 150 btc on ethereum's pre-sale would take home ~1`100 btc + whatever chunk of the bitbet they so desired before closing it out [11:29]
asciilifeform 'turns out xfce4's terminal app depends on it. it's getting pretty tough to keep a gnome/kde free system. maybe i should give in to the evil' << l0l [11:30]
mircea_popescu kakobrekla ^ [11:30]
punkman pete_dushenski: seems like there's at least 30 "accounts" with more than 300k eth https://etherchain.org/accounts [11:30]
assbot Accounts - etherchain.org - The ethereum blockchain explorer ... ( http://bit.ly/1Var9tZ ) [11:30]
mircea_popescu punkman so i guess now we find out that "those were fictive" ^H^H^H^H^H^H ppls really believe in teh technologee. [11:30]
asciilifeform where the hell do they get this 'tough to keep a gnome/kde free system' [11:31]
pete_dushenski mircea_popescu: punkman fictive and/or ostriches [11:31]
mircea_popescu aha. [11:31]
pete_dushenski or better yet, 'civil gentlemen who don't do things like betting' [11:32]
pete_dushenski 'because gambling is uncouth and only done with vegas bookies using their scammy lines' [11:32]
asciilifeform jurov: well, if we count gtk, then - virtually everything [11:32]
mircea_popescu yeah, they're into this for the money, except they only want to make money by going long. shorts are bad mkay. [11:32]
asciilifeform if we don't - can't think of anything i have on my boxes that would [11:32]
pete_dushenski mircea_popescu: this'll sound strange, but shorts are 'pessimistic' and even 'cynical' in the eyes of the large-foreheaded [11:33]
jurov asciilifeform: i meant these cases where the libraries spawn processes on their own [11:34]
mircea_popescu right because there's a fundamental difference between equations that come out positive and equations that come out negative. [11:34]
mircea_popescu like 1/x -4 is entirely a different thing from 1/x +4. [11:35]
mircea_popescu this is what they teach in math school now. [11:35]
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shinohai Top minds of #bitcoin-assets: Is or is not Pope Francis a socialist? [11:41]
kakobrekla mircea_popescu yeah should prolly bump the initial bet to .1 instead [11:42]
mircea_popescu kakobrekla the problem i see is this : forcing bets removes their signalling capacity. if i increase the minimum i just remove meaning from money. [11:42]
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kakobrekla how is it more forcing than now? [11:43]
mircea_popescu now it's just 0.01, which means we suck the meaning out of a cent. if minimum becomes 0.1, we suck the meaning out of ten cents. which may be too much, [11:43]
mircea_popescu basically this might be one of those situations where regulation is a loser. [11:44]
mircea_popescu might be why the "2 btc minimum on sports bets" thing introduced last year nigh on killed sports. that may need to be taken off. [11:44]
mircea_popescu but basically... it never occured to me that in point of fact bitbet's minimum acts as a tax. and a lot of other things in here never occured to me. i'm still reeling over the whole pile. [11:45]
mircea_popescu anyway, im taking the local devs out for a breakfast hackathon. bbl. [11:49]
shinohai https://www.reddit.com/r/Buttcoin/comments/3m1j8r/accessories_for_the_21_buttboard_now_available/ <<< priceless [11:49]
assbot Accessories for the 21 BUTTBOARD now available. : Buttcoin ... ( http://bit.ly/1jakTq4 ) [11:49]
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punkman https://forum.bitcoin.com/bitcoin-discussion/i-m-charlie-shrem-bitcoin-pioneer-currently-in-federal-prison-ama-t239.html#p393 Ver asking Shrem for prison tips [11:54]
punkman http://news.netcraft.com/archives/2015/09/23/ebay-phishing-sites-hosted-by-ebay.html [11:56]
assbot eBay phishing sites hosted by… eBay | Netcraft ... ( http://bit.ly/1jamBHX ) [11:56]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 38050 @ 0.00076877 = 29.2517 BTC [+] {3} [12:04]
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jurov shinohai: https://secure.marketwatch.com/story/thank-god-the-pope-is-an-anticapitalism-socialist-2013-12-11 [12:26]
assbot Pope is an anticapitalism socialist — thank God - Paul B. Farrell - MarketWatch ... ( http://bit.ly/1QynkNz ) [12:26]
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shinohai Thanks jurov. Seems today he is with the democratic socialists. [12:31]
lobbes you also gotta love how he feels qualified to endorse the 'climate change' scam. smells like a usg appendage to me [12:36]
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funkenstein_ good morin' lords ladies and esteemed bots [12:42]
funkenstein_ pete_dushenski, what's goin' on with VW? [12:42]
funkenstein_ the notion that britney spears did damage to music might be compared to the idea that Garza did damage to bitcoin [12:43]
funkenstein_ while itunes listeners, CD collectors, and arena concert attendees are part of musical history like redditors with circle accounts are part of bitcoin history [12:44]
lobbes I'd argue that 'music' is just fine, but it is the 'popular music industry' that suffers today. But, the masses have come to expect (tm) as they say [12:46]
pete_dushenski funkenstein_: vw is under investigation for 'studying to the test' atm. i'm sure they'll be slapped with a big ol' fine by usg and then watch their sales fall by 10-20% [12:48]
lobbes yeah, didn't they alter their code to 'switch' when it detected testing or something similar? [12:49]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 73666 @ 0.00075727 = 55.7851 BTC [-] {3} [12:50]
pete_dushenski http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=23-09-2015#1283456 << thread [12:50]
assbot Logged on 23-09-2015 04:55:31; pete_dushenski: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=18-09-2015#1278736 << turns out that i was off the mark here. to wit : "Emissions system and fuel economy testing is conducted while a vehicle is placed on a dynamometer—think of it as a two big rollers or a treadmill—rather than driving on the road. The vehicle has only its driving wheels rolling (the front ones, in the case of VW vehicles). Bu [12:50]
lobbes aha [12:51]
ben_vulpes lobbes: usg tentacle is the catholic church's only future existence [12:51]
ben_vulpes ;;later tell asciilifeform that'd truly make it a little shop of horrors! [12:52]
gribble The operation succeeded. [12:52]
pete_dushenski lobbes: in essence, the usg's continued insistence that, in every regard and in every field, the map is the territory, is used to trip up both citizens and corporations wherever and wherever it might be convenient [12:53]
ben_vulpes funkenstein_: can't really hold the streetwalker responsible for the condition of the streets now can you? [12:53]
pete_dushenski basically, the usg is one giant boobytrap [12:53]
pete_dushenski and vw's hindleg is stuck in a trap from which is must now chew its way out [12:54]
pete_dushenski http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/2015/09/no-fixed-abode-rage-zipcar/ <-- excellent reference to --> http://thelastpsychiatrist.com/2010/01/im_building_a_rape_tunnel.html [12:56]
assbot Rage Against The Zipcar – No Fixed Abode ... ( http://bit.ly/1OuEoq9 ) [12:56]
assbot The Last Psychiatrist: I'm Building A Rape Tunnel ... ( http://bit.ly/1OuEoqj ) [12:56]
pete_dushenski can't say i'd come across this tlp article until now. [12:57]
pete_dushenski !s rape tunnel [12:57]
assbot 0 results for 'rape tunnel' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=rape+tunnel [12:57]
pete_dushenski "Why rape? Because as an artistic gesture, it's one of the most impactful I can think of... It dawned on me that if the work [we local artists] created had never existed, the world would be no different than if it had. None of it mattered to anyone outside of our small and insignificant circle of peers. I wanted something that would have more impact...I want to make it clear that I plan to make the experience as [12:57]
pete_dushenski unpleasant as I possibly can to anyone who dares to crawl through the tunnel. I will try to the best of my ability to make them regret their decision...I'll try my very best to sexually assault him or her. The tunnel is constructed in such a way that it gets smaller the closer you get to the project room. The bigger you are, the more difficult it is to comfortably crawl out. And trust me, I have a lot of secret [12:57]
pete_dushenski s up my sleeve to ensure that I can overpower anyone that comes through the tunnel." [12:57]
pete_dushenski ^too lulzy not to keep on record [12:58]
pete_dushenski 'artist' is/was one Richard Whitehurst [12:58]
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wywialm shinohai, depends on the definition of socialism [13:00]
wywialm :) [13:00]
wywialm i'm no expert on catholic teaching, but under charitable interpretation, Pope Francis is not outside catholic guidelines on care of the poor and principle of subsidiarity [13:01]
pete_dushenski wywialm shinohai et al., i refer you to http://trilema.com/2013/universalism-postwar-progressivism-as-a-christian-sect/ [13:05]
assbot "Universalism: postwar progressivism as a Christian sect" on Trilema - A blog by Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1OuF5zQ ) [13:05]
pete_dushenski pope poverty-spec isn't exactly breaking the mold here. [13:05]
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wywialm pete_dushenski, to be fair, i'm not sure how this relates to Pope Francis official teaching or private opinions [13:11]
wywialm could you please explain? [13:11]
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pete_dushenski wywialm: the idea being that xtians are the original socialists, if not the jews before them. [13:12]
wywialm as i stated earlier, this depends on the definition of socialism [13:13]
pete_dushenski so expecting francis or any other clergyman of 'the people' to expound the virtues of capitalism or sanity is like expecting a potato to grow legs and start running marathons [13:13]
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pete_dushenski socialism : the political viewpoint that holds as its highest virtue the coercive redistribution of resources [13:16]
wywialm then Pope Francis is not a socialist [13:16]
pete_dushenski oh ? [13:16]
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BingoBoingo !up ascii_field [13:18]
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wywialm the catholic teaching on the subject (afaik) is that there should be no redistribution, but that there are obligations to the poor that should be met in a non-centralistic manner [13:18]
wywialm also, the effect - the redistribution - is not the virtue, charity, i.e. voluntary act is [13:19]
wywialm and the virtue is the preservation of the moral order of society, of which private property is an essential part [13:20]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 23150 @ 0.0007597 = 17.5871 BTC [+] {3} [13:21]
wywialm what must be said, though, that in his private utterances, Pope Francis leaves much space for uncharitable interpretation [13:21]
pete_dushenski eg ? [13:22]
pete_dushenski the private utterances, that is [13:23]
wywialm e.g. his adhortation he issued just after election [13:24]
wywialm to my knowledge, it does not have a status of an official teaching [13:25]
pete_dushenski ;;google pope francis adhortation [13:25]
gribble Pope Francis - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: ; Will Pope Francis Clash With American Conservatives on His Trip to ...: ; For G.O.P., Pope Francis' Visit to Congress Comes With Tensions ...: (1 more message) [13:25]
wywialm evangelii gaudium, if i remember correctly [13:26]
pete_dushenski wywialm: you have a link to transcript or something ? [13:26]
wywialm let me look [13:26]
wywialm http://w2.vatican.va/content/francesco/en/apost_exhortations.index.html [13:27]
assbot Apostolic Exhortations | Francis ... ( http://bit.ly/1gNYJbw ) [13:27]
wywialm note that there is no latin text [13:27]
pete_dushenski ya, why not ? [13:27]
wywialm please ask the Pope [13:27]
wywialm the same goes with his recent encyclical [13:28]
pete_dushenski lol will do [13:28]
ascii_field l0l, that pope is in town today, neon signs warning of it on the 'beltway' [13:28]
pete_dushenski ;;later tell pope_francis are you too much of a 'man of the people' for latin now ? [13:29]
gribble The operation succeeded. [13:29]
ascii_field pete_dushenski: he's a vat.-II-compliant pope [13:30]
ascii_field iirc in usa somewhere there is a spare, schismatic pope who isn't [13:30]
pete_dushenski and web-II compliant tambien [13:30]
ascii_field dig him up. [13:30]
pete_dushenski i'll leave that bit of homework to others, wywialm perhaps [13:31]
ascii_field 'Whem I'm released, the only restriction I have is travelling for the first few months. Other than that, Im allowed to use the internet. Im debating wether to buy the blackphone when I get out or just root an android ' << win [13:32]
wywialm ascii_field, incidentally, the Vat-II does not mandate majority of His actions, beginning but not ending with the Mass and ecumenic policy [13:33]
pete_dushenski "56. While the earnings of a minority are growing exponentially, so too is the gap separating the majority from the prosperity enjoyed by those happy few. This imbalance is the result of ideologies which defend the absolute autonomy of the marketplace and financial speculation. Consequently, they reject the right of states, charged with vigilance for the common good, to exercise any form of control. A new tyrann [13:33]
pete_dushenski y is thus born, invisible and often virtual, which unilaterally and relentlessly imposes its own laws and rules. Debt and the accumulation of interest also make it difficult for countries to realize the potential of their own economies and keep citizens from enjoying their real purchasing power. To all this we can add widespread corruption and self-serving tax evasion, which have taken on worldwide dimensions. T [13:33]
pete_dushenski he thirst for power and possessions knows no limits. In this system, which tends to devour everything which stands in the way of increased profits, whatever is fragile, like the environment, is defenseless before the interests of a deified market, which become the only rule." << every socialist hashtag wrapped up in a single paragraph. no points for guessing who wrote. [13:33]
ascii_field wywialm: pope has ~actions~ !?! who else, queen of denmark ? emperor of jp ? [13:34]
wywialm well, the pope has vastly more power on His subjects than queen of denmark, if this is what you mean [13:36]
ascii_field https://www.bop.gov/locations/institutions/lew/LEW_aohandbook.pdf >> http://dpaste.com/0Q12M1P << jail manual. handy. [13:36]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1gO0Coo ) [13:36]
assbot dpaste: 0Q12M1P ... ( http://bit.ly/1gO0zJq ) [13:36]
ascii_field 'Confinement in any institution such as Lewisburg is never a pleasant experience. Every attempt is [13:37]
ascii_field made, however, to make thi [13:37]
ascii_field s institution one in which each man has the opportunity to “make the most” [13:37]
ascii_field of his time. It is important that each inmate follow the rules of the institution in order that all [13:37]
ascii_field may live in comparative harmony without fear or threats or intimidation.' [13:37]
ascii_field 'In January 2009, USP Lewisburg began a mission change converting to a Special Management Unit (SMU) facility. Therefore, the information in this handbook is for the general population inmates only (Cadre Unit).' << this is worth explaining. SMU is a series of 'special prisons' where folks are held incommunicado. instituted under bush II [13:38]
phf http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_7sRArBiqnC4/SU7ROynutjI/AAAAAAAAAP8/sKqNE7ZyxHI/s1600/PBF244-Preach_Skate.jpg << 'man of the people' [13:41]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1gO1wBp ) [13:42]
shinohai Ah great find pete_dushenski [13:43]
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pete_dushenski despite paul's opinion to the contrary, there's always a trilema reference somewhere [13:46]
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pete_dushenski wywialm: in any event, that's a 'world's tallest midget' competition. the pope is still just a politician representing way too many people and interests to be effective [13:50]
wywialm again, only to my knowledge, he does not represent any 'people', however considered [13:50]
shinohai I brought up the subject due to the statement he made that "I am not a socialist" yet in my limited knowledge of the subject, he has a lot of socialist ideas. [13:52]
wywialm and this sentence, shinohai, is probably very close to truth [13:53]
shinohai trilema, is there any knowledge it doesn't contain [13:53]
shinohai This bs >>> checkpoints.cpp:59:1: fatal error: opening dependency file obj/nogui/checkpoints.d: No such file or directory [13:54]
wywialm pete_dushenski, he may try to speak as the voice of the 'people', but it is clear to me that it is way outside of his mandate as a pope [13:56]
pete_dushenski wywialm: ok. i'll bite. what's the pope ~actual~ mandate ? [13:57]
shinohai To distract people from child-diddling with his flashy outfits ? [13:58]
wywialm the most precise definition of this is the vaticanum I constitution "pastor aeternus", and this is to guard the tradition of the Church [14:00]
phf shinohai: you're probably missing src/obj/nogui folder? [14:01]
deedbot- [Qntra] FDA Regulatory Overreach Allows Price Gouging - http://qntra.net/2015/09/fda-regulatory-overreach-allows-price-gouging/ [14:01]
shinohai I'll try manually adding it. I'm in the habit of deleting object files when a build fails [14:02]
shinohai (-__) #facepalm that was it ... [14:05]
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phf i think there was a conversation at some point how diff/patch doesn't create empty directories and you have to resort to .keepme hacks, it was suggested that the correct solution is to patch makefile.unix instead, but i don't think that was done [14:07]
pete_dushenski BingoBoingo: "Because in spite of prices being involve," << missing a letter here [14:07]
BingoBoingo thx pete_dushenski fxd [14:08]
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danielpbarron http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=23-09-2015#1283763 << Jesus said to help your neighbor; not to force your neighbor to help some other guy neither of you has ever heard of [14:33]
assbot Logged on 23-09-2015 16:13:59; pete_dushenski: socialism : the political viewpoint that holds as its highest virtue the coercive redistribution of resources [14:33]
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pete_dushenski jesus is an entity very much distinct from the church [14:34]
pete_dushenski this is obvious [14:35]
pete_dushenski that the pope follows jesus' teachings to the letter would be like obama following jefferson's [14:35]
danielpbarron if you mean the "catholic" church, then I couldn't agree more: http://www.atruechurch.info/catholicism.html [14:38]
assbot A True Church - Roman Catholicism Leads to Hell ... ( http://bit.ly/1iwRLZJ ) [14:38]
pete_dushenski in this case, yes, i do [14:41]
pete_dushenski as it's our subject matter [14:42]
wywialm pete_dushenski, there is no letter in Jesus's teaching to be followed [14:48]
wywialm that does not however mean that his power is arbitrary [14:48]
pete_dushenski http://www.transportenvironment.org/publications/vw%E2%80%99s-cheating-just-tip-iceberg << moar on emissions testing with a focus on e.u. oversight. [14:52]
assbot VW’s cheating is just the tip of the iceberg | Transport & Environment ... ( http://bit.ly/1V9zNhB ) [14:52]
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pete_dushenski http://www.wnd.com/2015/09/the-left-has-its-pope/ << wywialm danielpbarron [15:07]
assbot The left has its pope ... ( http://bit.ly/1V9APKi ) [15:07]
pete_dushenski "It is not poverty, but prosperity, that needs explaining. Poverty is automatic, but prosperity requires many things – none of which is equally distributed around the world or even within a given society." [15:07]
pete_dushenski !up thestringpuller [15:14]
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danielpbarron > Paine rejected the teachings of "any church that I know of," including "the Roman church." << me too (with the exception of that one, which I found almost by accident through a mutual interest in the Ron Paul presidential campaign) [15:17]
pete_dushenski o what was 'that one' ? [15:18]
pete_dushenski thestringpuller: so what's your way to limit wealth ? [15:19]
danielpbarron the one to which I linked earlier [15:19]
lobbes atruechurch.info << this one? [15:19]
danielpbarron ya [15:19]
danielpbarron I met the author of that site, and a couple of his daughters, one of his sons, and his sister and her son, oh and his mother [15:19]
danielpbarron all at PaulFest 2012 in florida [15:19]
thestringpuller pete_dushenski: kill all the rich people when they get past threshold [15:21]
thestringpuller i.e. rape and pillage! [15:22]
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danielpbarron and on the topic of socialism vs capitalism and the Bible, see also: http://www.atruechurch.info/slavery.html >> Believers in the first century owned slaves (Ephesians 6:9; Colossians 4:1; 1 Timothy 6:2), and they were not instructed to let them go; but rather, to treat them with justice [15:22]
assbot A True Church - Slavery ... ( http://bit.ly/1V9BLi0 ) [15:22]
thestringpuller But /wind 1 [15:23]
pete_dushenski thestringpuller: this'd be too hard to measure and even harder to enforce. honestly, a sterile male clone army is simpler. [15:23]
thestringpuller pete_dushenski: "As such, I would find it absolutely essential, in order to take this question to its logical conclusion, to murder everyone in my constituency extant and to replace them with an army of sterile maleviii clones (perhaps with the help of Monsanto because I hear they’re pretty good at this sort of thing), whom will be raised by robot nannies, so as to control for the differences between parenting qualities and s [15:23]
wywialm pete_dushenski, you don't have to convince me that pope allows himself statements that sound dangerously leftist [15:24]
pete_dushenski wywialm: is this another case of 'do what he means not what he says' ? [15:25]
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thestringpuller Add some soma and other drugs in the mix and you have robotic people who don't care about wealth but "maintaining" the machine that spawned them. Honestly in this context a differentiation of male clones would benefit society in the same way the Irkin empire in Invader Zim came to power. [15:25]
pete_dushenski wywialm: because that opens the door to an untold number of personal fantasies, as has been previously discussed in the logs [15:25]
wywialm is this another case of 'do what he means not what he says' << just the opposite [15:26]
thestringpuller At that rate instead of limiting wealth, why not make the leader of society the person who happens to be the tallest, (if that is everyone is bred to be the same height but due to anomolies one or two individiuals are much taller than the rest) [15:26]
pete_dushenski thestringpuller: because the leader is the breeder, not the slave clone ? [15:27]
wywialm do what he says as interpreted as charitably as possible and in the light of the whole catholic teaching [15:27]
pete_dushenski wywialm: go on. [15:28]
wywialm what pope means is not more interesting than your average intellectual [15:28]
thestringpuller pete_dushenski: actually no. in this context the leader is bred of "the machine". [15:28]
thestringpuller lets say we have a breeding machine that breeds all humans. [15:29]
wywialm what he says, in particular what he says officially and marks as his official teaching, is way more important [15:29]
thestringpuller a few come out as taller, and are hence deemed leaders. [15:29]
thestringpuller Eventually they die and more are spawned in the machine. [15:29]
wywialm however, this pope doesn't seem to be bothered by such things as 'official text' [15:29]
thestringpuller In this scenario I would say all men are a slave to the machine. Without the machine the species ends. [15:30]
pete_dushenski wywialm: mkay then the issue at hand is from whence we derive this 'charitable interpretation' if not from his 'meaning' rather than his 'words' [15:31]
pete_dushenski either pope's words are his words and stand as they are, or else they have an alternative and alterior 'meaning' and can be 'charitably interpreted' [15:31]
wywialm well, catholicism has not begun in 2013 and not in 1965 as well and there is plenty of context to be applied [15:32]
pete_dushenski thestringpuller: and the machine came about naturally ? just like that ? [15:32]
pete_dushenski wywialm: that's not my argument. on that we agree. but you still need to back up http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=23-09-2015#1283872 [15:33]
assbot Logged on 23-09-2015 18:24:29; wywialm: is this another case of 'do what he means not what he says' << just the opposite [15:33]
wywialm yes, that is what i'm trying to defend [15:33]
pete_dushenski you seem to be doing a very circular and specious job of it :P [15:34]
thestringpuller Well lets say the machine was created by protohumans (pre-machine humans), and then as a result became slaves to the machine [15:34]
thestringpuller future generations became slaves* [15:34]
thestringpuller the protohumans eventually die off and what is left is a human race dedicated to maintaining the machine, in the sense of the zerg protecting the hivemind. Here the machine is the leader not a man. [15:35]
wywialm i'm not particularly interested in Jorge Bergoglio's opinion and what he means, i'm rather scared that this is far away from i'd like to hear [15:35]
pete_dushenski thestringpuller: can the machine have lazers ? for shooting non-tall slaves ? but then one tall one survives the blast and becomes the leader of the resistance ? [15:35]
pete_dushenski wywialm: is jorge too socialistic for your taste ? or ... [15:36]
wywialm but i'm interested in what is the Pope's teaching on the subject of helping the poor is [15:36]
thestringpuller Random L0L: I'm Charlie Shrem, Bitcoin Pioneer currently in Federal Prison. << I'm tempted to ask, "Is your butthole still tight?" [15:37]
thestringpuller ^ Shrem's AMA btw [15:37]
wywialm if this sounds ambigous to me - and it does - i'd check what is the context of what the pope says, and this is e.g. his predecessors [15:38]
wywialm yes, jorge bergoglio *sounds* way too 'leftist' for me [15:39]
danielpbarron thestringpuller, who would want to have sex with him? http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=19-09-2015#1279241 [15:40]
assbot Logged on 19-09-2015 03:02:00; mircea_popescu: nobody's getting "anally dilated" in prison dude. wake up and smell the coffee, erections are rare. [15:40]
thestringpuller Look at that smiley baby face! We've all seen shawshank redemption. [15:40]
thestringpuller Come on a lifer with no conjugal visits gets desperate. [15:41]
pete_dushenski wywialm: yes, jorge bergoglio *sounds* way too 'leftist' for me << and yet, http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=23-09-2015#1283764 [15:41]
assbot Logged on 23-09-2015 16:14:26; wywialm: then Pope Francis is not a socialist [15:41]
pete_dushenski are we splitting hairs over leftism v. socialism ? [15:42]
thestringpuller ^- pete_dushenski is there a difference at this point? [15:42]
thestringpuller wind 4 [15:42]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 42092 @ 0.00075996 = 31.9882 BTC [+] {3} [15:42]
pete_dushenski thestringpuller: to wywialm there may be, tis what i'm interested to find out [15:43]
thestringpuller pete_dushenski: i've always wondered, by definition, does socialism prevent natural selection? [15:43]
thestringpuller By forcing society to be "equal" doesn't that benefit the stupid more than the fit? [15:44]
phf doesn't cathoic church has a deedbot of some sort? i'm more familiar with orthodox system, but presumably they come out every once in a while to updates for canon and the catechism, "we found the previous belief that 10 angels can fit on a head of a needle invalid, and on the account of recent scientific developments in nanotechnology, we are now convinced that the correct number is in fact 17" sort of thing [15:45]
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pete_dushenski thestringpuller: see, 'socialism', while we tend to use it in this manner here, doesn't ~have~ to refer to the societal level. it can also refer to, say, the family level, wherein it works quite well and, yes, prevents natural selection, which'd be the point. [15:46]
pete_dushenski !up thestringpuller [15:46]
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phf in which case whatever pope says is basically his personal believes as a famous public figure [15:46]
wywialm pete_dushenski, i hope not. i said that Bergoglio sounds leftist, because that is in my opinion broader than (at least economically understood) socialism [15:46]
wywialm but i think there is difference between saying that about Bergoglio as Bergoglio, and as Pope Francis [15:47]
pete_dushenski phf: catholic church definitely revised its opinions from time to time. see galileo. [15:47]
thestringpuller pete_dushenski: when you say from a family level (which is more decentralized in context to global societies socialism), do you mean immediate family? Dad Mom Borther Sister? Or do you mean a larger lineage: grandpa, grandma, aunt uncle cousins? [15:48]
pete_dushenski wywialm: nope. that just doesn't wash. this is the EXACT same shtick as 'opinions of ceo of megacorp are not the opinions of megacorp' [15:48]
pete_dushenski yes. they are. [15:48]
pete_dushenski wtf else is a leader for. [15:48]
wywialm pete_dushenski, i'm a little bit familiar with the galileo case, and i wouldn't put it as an example of revision of doctrine [15:48]
thestringpuller and even here wouldn't socialism in the family unit prevent natural selection only temporarily? [15:49]
pete_dushenski this rationalist dualist approach to division of the same mind holds no water. [15:49]
pete_dushenski thestringpuller: families are very personal things, up for each to decide where to draw the lines of 'close enough to care about' [15:50]
wywialm i do not believe that pope has opinions, simply put. what pope says is what pope says *officially* and not to the journalists at the airport [15:50]
pete_dushenski mnope. [15:50]
pete_dushenski there's no official v. unofficial distinction to be drawn. none whatsoever. [15:51]
wywialm i wanted to point that the level of officiality (at least by catholic criteria) is ambiguous even with most publicised texts, such as his adhortation or encyclicals [15:51]
wywialm we have to disagree on that point [15:51]
thestringpuller pete_dushenski: yes but the affect of "preventing" natural selection from occurring in the family unit is only temporary. even d00d protected in parents basement until his 40's may never have kids. (or perhaps the barrier to having kids is so low the termporary shield against selection of any sort gives unfit offspring the opportunity to spawn with other unfit offspring i.e. idiocracy) [15:51]
thestringpuller pete_dushenski: imo in both these cases, it's detrimental to the species since the weak are perserved for no other reason than "because I can and I love my son/daughter". [15:52]
wywialm there is difference between what i say loosely, what i say clearsigned and what i sign and put on the deedbot [15:53]
thestringpuller ^^- Whatever you say at this point is logged... [15:54]
pete_dushenski wywialm: the only difference there is verifiability [15:54]
thestringpuller ^^^ and that [15:54]
pete_dushenski which doesn't apply to the pope's case here. [15:54]
wywialm no, as the pope does not sign with only his personal key [15:54]
pete_dushenski there's no 'maybe he didn't say that' when it's verifiably on the record. [15:55]
pete_dushenski wywialm: pope has multiple keys ?! [15:55]
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wywialm well, catholic church teaches that he received some from his predecessors :) [15:56]
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pete_dushenski thestringpuller: your 'imo' as to the merits and value of intrafamilial socialism doesn't stand up against the biological and historical record. [15:56]
wywialm also, he is bound by what has been signed by them [15:57]
pete_dushenski it's much too expensive an action to be a spandrel [15:57]
wywialm i think this is a good metaphor [15:57]
pete_dushenski s/spandrel/vestigial << hungry brain hard at work ! [15:58]
thestringpuller pete_dushenski: but this isn't caveman times when women would fuck you based on how awesome of a hunter you are. [15:58]
pete_dushenski thestringpuller: hunter fucks women, not the other way around. [15:58]
thestringpuller pete_dushenski: my mistake; but intrafamilial socialism was beneficial in allowing the species to use "strength in nubmers" against say the wooly mammoth and sabertooth tiger. [15:59]
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thestringpuller In this instance I'd think weakest hunter is used as cannon fodder. [16:00]
thestringpuller In modern times it seems to enable stupidity rather than squelch it. [16:00]
pete_dushenski wywialm: well, catholic church teaches that he received some from his predecessors :) << doesn't add up with >> also, he is bound by what has been signed by them [16:02]
pete_dushenski pope either owns the keys of his predecessors, and therefore everything they've every signed, or he doesn't and then he can pick and choose what to sign with his own key [16:02]
wywialm he cannot contradict what they chose to sign with these keys, can he? [16:03]
pete_dushenski either way, he is bound by what he says on record. not what he 'means' in the context of whatever arbitrary third parties may deem to be relevant teachings of his predecessors [16:03]
wywialm but what he says is not obvious [16:04]
pete_dushenski so you say. [16:04]
pete_dushenski while you ALSO say "'do what he means not what he says' << just the opposite" [16:05]
asciilifeform !up ascii_field [16:05]
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ascii_field holy fuck is this thread a snore. [16:05]
pete_dushenski lol [16:05]
wywialm :) [16:05]
thestringpuller ascii_field: my piano teacher wants to talk to you. [16:05]
thestringpuller he is like you but instead of computers he does piano. [16:05]
ascii_field wawat [16:06]
mod6 piano reverser [16:06]
thestringpuller Showed him a bunch of bash.bitcoin-assets.com quotes and he was like "is this guy russian?" [16:06]
ascii_field what could've led him to that suspicion. [16:06]
wywialm pete_dushenski, i already tried to clarify what i meant on 'what he says' [16:06]
thestringpuller mod6: seriously he is a music reverse engineer. He can listen to a song and write down the chords on a single listen. [16:07]
thestringpuller d00d is fucking magical like good ol alf here [16:07]
pete_dushenski wywialm: yes, 'signed statements only', which still doesn't wash in mine eyes, but seems to be a matter of perspective. [16:08]
pete_dushenski i guess you're free to do business with people who have this duality is you so please :) [16:09]
wywialm if you meet, say, Warren Buffett, and he tells you 'sure, I'll give you some money', do you expect the cash to come from his personal funds or from BRK accounts? I'd expect from any officer to distinguish between his private actions and actions of his office [16:14]
wywialm and with pope, the actions are primarily teaching, so i strive to keep this difference there [16:15]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 42400 @ 0.00075012 = 31.8051 BTC [-] {5} [16:16]
wywialm in particular, when i do not approve of his certain actions, i assume them to be his private and not official, unless proven otherwise [16:16]
mircea_popescu holy log... [16:17]
wywialm hi, mircea_popescu :) [16:17]
mircea_popescu the notion that britney spears did damage to music might be compared to the idea that Garza did damage to bitcoin << still, i'd pay a little for it not being possible for britney to exist. and garza idem. [16:18]
ascii_field ^ deal! where do i pay [16:19]
mircea_popescu if we can have an arrangement where these peasants are opressed into the dirt by boot to the face, i'm willing to forego ipads in exchange. [16:19]
ascii_field this'd be lovely. [16:19]
mircea_popescu because fuck this sort of rotten pseudo-creativity. [16:19]
pete_dushenski ascii_field: poor people can't pay [16:19]
ascii_field sure they can [16:20]
mircea_popescu how goes wywialm [16:20]
ascii_field pay last penny, sell shirt [16:20]
wywialm quite slowly, but fine, thanks, and you? [16:21]
mircea_popescu arguing with people in a layered cake. [16:21]
mircea_popescu https://bitbet.us/bet/1179/btc-to-top-700-before-november/ << gotta love how this thing insta-rebalances so the no side makes a shaving above 101%, ie, what bitbet takes. [16:22]
assbot BitBet - BTC to top $700 before November :: 5.03 B (4%) on Yes, 118.82 B (96%) on No | closing in 2 weeks 2 days | weight: 38`035 (100`000 to 22`000) ... ( http://bit.ly/1FuQ1uw ) [16:22]
mircea_popescu srsly, the odds bitcoin breaks out next month are worse than 10:1 ? [16:22]
ascii_field breaks out ? [16:23]
mircea_popescu ie goes over 700 [16:24]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 25409 @ 0.00075129 = 19.0895 BTC [+] [16:26]
mircea_popescu o hey, check out the ballas insights. [16:30]
mircea_popescu "Fear assumes limitless possibilities: the thing you fear has infinite power, infinite resources, infinite resolve, unknown identity. Hate comes when you know them. Cyril Connolly did not say, "if it bleeds, we can kill it." But he should have." [16:30]
mircea_popescu banal shit, but : there's two kinds of men. there's those who assume the usg is anon all powerful ; and those who've killed usg agents after being bored to tears by their inept begging. [16:30]
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shinohai !up ascii_field [16:36]
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ascii_field https://code.google.com/p/google-security-research/issues/detail?id=460 [16:37]
assbot Issue 460 - [16:37]
mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=23-09-2015#1283785 << because he's an uncultivated hack. [16:38]
assbot Logged on 23-09-2015 16:25:48; wywialm: please ask the Pope [16:38]
ascii_field 'The fix for this issue seemed to be modifying the file verification process to only allow a signed file which also has in its version information the original filename of vpndownloader.exe. This, along with the name change makes it clear you only want to execute the VPN Downloader application. However the code doesn’t limit the location of the executable file, so one exploitation vector is DLL planting. The downloade [16:39]
ascii_field r loads a lot of DLLs from the executable directory first, so by copying the vpndownloader.exe file from Program Files to a temporary directory and dropping an appropriately named DLL you can get code execution as SYSTEM.' [16:39]
ascii_field Run Moar Winblowz! [16:39]
mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=23-09-2015#1283826 << im kinda impressed with wywialm s rather well rounded understanding of catholic issues. [16:42]
assbot Logged on 23-09-2015 16:58:16; wywialm: the most precise definition of this is the vaticanum I constitution "pastor aeternus", and this is to guard the tradition of the Church [16:42]
mircea_popescu anyway. the pope has one job and one tool. his job is to provide non-breaking answers to any questions that can't otherwise be resolved or set aside. his tool is infallibility, which is to say that if he speaks ex cathedra he can't be wrong. [16:43]
mircea_popescu this is almost exactly what the master of a harem is, for that matter. [16:43]
wywialm re: infallibility, indeed, though i'm not sure if this is his only tool [16:44]
mircea_popescu name another ? [16:44]
ascii_field when's the last time he pulled that trigger ? [16:44]
mircea_popescu anyway, i very much doubt there's that many people who are the intellectual equals of the task. the catholics decided that this must be so, but setting that doctrine aside, i find it dubious in practice. [16:44]
mircea_popescu ascii_field that's the problem, the task is made significantly harder by previous idiots who didn't understand they were pulling the trigger. [16:45]
mircea_popescu think of catholicism as much harder programming with immutability baked in. [16:45]
ascii_field was gonna say. [16:45]
ascii_field in engineering this used to be known as 'design space shrinkage' [16:45]
mircea_popescu it's a wonder it hasn't yet fallen over. [16:45]
mircea_popescu quite that, yes. [16:45]
ascii_field as described by, e.g., rob pike [16:46]
ascii_field in his 'systems research is dead' talk [16:46]
wywialm he has more ordiary tools at his disposal, the infallibility is the ultimate. He may excommunicate, promulgate canon law, issue church penalties, issue magisterial statements, accept & decline ordinance of bishops [16:46]
mircea_popescu the ordinary tools are predicated on the tool. much like i will go "do i need to pick up the stick ?" [16:46]
shinohai http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=23-09-2015#1284014 <<< ikr? I asked a simple question, wywialm expounds on it in great detail. [16:46]
assbot Logged on 23-09-2015 19:40:11; mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=23-09-2015#1283826 << im kinda impressed with wywialm s rather well rounded understanding of catholic issues. [16:46]
mircea_popescu this only works because the stick. [16:46]
wywialm ok, in this we agree [16:47]
mircea_popescu aha. [16:47]
wywialm let me only make the provision that the application of ordinary tools, while depending on the power you refer to, is not infallible (just to clarify, in case it's not obvious) [16:50]
mircea_popescu certainly. [16:51]
mircea_popescu anyway, "voice of the people" pope is a gross misunderstanding of the entire thing already. [16:51]
mircea_popescu to francis' defense, he does a lot more of the pretense of that than actuality of it, [16:51]
mircea_popescu but still. [16:51]
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pete_dushenski bbiab [16:53]
wywialm to francis' defense, he does a lot more of the pretense of that than actuality of it << that is another good point [17:00]
mircea_popescu anyway, if people be curious in latino-derpage, https://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opción_preferencial_por_los_pobres [17:00]
assbot Opción preferencial por los pobres - Wikipedia, la enciclopedia libre [17:00]
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ascii_field mircea_popescu: i thought it was a kgb front [17:01]
mircea_popescu more or less. [17:02]
mircea_popescu anyway, the heretical, unwelcome, incorrect, impudent, poisonous, insolent, frivolous, vulgar, coarse, brazen proposition that the poor are not lesser humans but more, in contrary of nature, obvious fact and the manifest will of any conceivable divinity. [17:03]
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mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=23-09-2015#1283966 << both of them, actually. [17:11]
assbot Logged on 23-09-2015 19:03:27; ascii_field: holy fuck is this thread a snore. [17:11]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 28264 @ 0.00075198 = 21.254 BTC [+] [17:16]
mircea_popescu "Mustaches and beards are permitted so long as they are kept clean and neat." [17:16]
mircea_popescu ahahaha wtf happened at lewisburg. [17:16]
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wywialm i'll be going, thanks pete_dushenski for a nice (even if boring to the audience) discussion [17:28]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 38450 @ 0.00075113 = 28.8809 BTC [-] {3} [17:30]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 46100 @ 0.00074873 = 34.5165 BTC [-] {2} [17:41]
shinohai https://twitter.com/rogerkver/status/646730673454059520?s=09 [17:45]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 58100 @ 0.00074822 = 43.4716 BTC [-] [17:53]
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* BingoBoingo starting to wonder if pogo could ever run bitcoind and a form of p2pool at the same time [18:05]
shinohai Interesting thought BingoBoingo [18:08]
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BingoBoingo shinohai: Would likely require a deturded p2pool with a gossip sort of "pool with people I don't think are shitheads" Wot mechanism [18:10]
asciilifeform !up ascii_field [18:11]
* assbot gives voice to ascii_field [18:11]
ascii_field BingoBoingo: we don't have anything remotely close to a pogo-capable bitcoind. [18:12]
ascii_field BingoBoingo: see recent, http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=20-09-2015#1280144 [18:12]
assbot Logged on 20-09-2015 04:11:51; asciilifeform: rewinding to, [18:12]
BingoBoingo ascii_field: of course that is an obstacle. [18:12]
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shinohai I have faith in you ascii_field [18:26]
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ascii_field somebody else is gonna have to do it. [18:27]
ascii_field i - elementarily - lack the time. [18:27]
BingoBoingo pogo may end up better suited to simpler #b-a services that emerge than serving bitcoin proper [18:29]
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ascii_field BingoBoingo: gotta understand why i even opened the issue to begin with. the dependence of therealbitcoin on pc hardware is an extreme danger. [18:31]
BingoBoingo it is [18:31]
BingoBoingo dependence of gossipd (whenever it emerges) may face geater danger [18:32]
ascii_field BingoBoingo: gossipd is a computationally very lightweight thing, and also does not suffer from network effect [18:33]
ascii_field i.e. if three people have it, it is just as useful as if 33 did [18:33]
BingoBoingo ascii_field: But the "network effect" in the sense of putting up more relay nodes with various people's trust preferences reduces DDoS risks [18:34]
ascii_field BingoBoingo: correctly-implemented gossipd is intrinsically ddosproof. [18:34]
ascii_field even one a single node taken separately. [18:34]
BingoBoingo ascii_field: But is the wire DDoS proof [18:35]
ascii_field depends which [18:35]
ascii_field but who said you had to have just one wire. [18:35]
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BingoBoingo Ah [18:39]
BingoBoingo http://ftp.openbsd.org/pub/OpenBSD/LibreSSL/libressl-2.3.0-relnotes.txt << LibreSSL removes SHA-0 which is apparently still in OpenSSL [18:40]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1V9Sfq9 ) [18:40]
BingoBoingo In other news, trolling the news with basic gardening http://www.kake.com/home/headlines/Winfield-gardener-finds-strange-fruit-on-the-vine-328743471.html?device=phone&c=y [18:41]
assbot Winfield gardener finds strange fruit on the vine ... ( http://bit.ly/1V9Sj9p ) [18:41]
* assbot removes voice from ascii_field [18:42]
BingoBoingo Just in case it gets pulled https://archive.is/vx2c1 [18:42]
assbot Winfield gardener finds strange fruit on the vine ... ( http://bit.ly/1V9Skds ) [18:42]
BingoBoingo !up ascii_field [18:42]
* assbot gives voice to ascii_field [18:42]
BingoBoingo The answer to the problem is not "tomato-watermelon hybrid" [18:43]
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BingoBoingo !up K1NGREX [18:46]
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BingoBoingo K1NGREX: That is an awfully declarative IRC nick [18:46]
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lobbes redundant, too [18:49]
shinohai Doesn't "Rex" mean king in Latin anyway ? [18:49]
BingoBoingo Dammit they edited the story before archiving to introduce part of the eggplant truth [18:49]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 74080 @ 0.00074786 = 55.4015 BTC [-] {2} [19:01]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 26150 @ 0.00074622 = 19.5137 BTC [-] {2} [19:07]
mircea_popescu https://twitter.com/SatoshiShinohai/status/646787239616188416 awwwlolz [19:10]
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shinohai Somehow, I just don't think he's gonna respond to me on that. [19:11]
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mircea_popescu must suck to be reduced to trying to support yourself through whoring out your name, which you gotta keep telling yourself is somehow valuable. which it isn't, but desperate scammers don't have other options and who knows, really stupid noobs may not know any better. [19:18]
shinohai I can't find *any* contribution he really makes to the space besides increasing popcorn share prices. [19:20]
shinohai I almost responded to his baby Jesus analogy, but didn't want to offend danielpbarron [19:20]
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mircea_popescu this is actually a valid question to ask the muppets. "name a venture roger ver was associated with to any degree that didn't fail". [19:23]
mircea_popescu and no, "bitcoin" is not an acceptable answer. what's next, "hey, he was an inmate at pleasant valley and it didn't fail either" ? [19:23]
mircea_popescu he's definitely more closely associated with the cdcr than with btc. [19:24]
shinohai xD [19:24]
shinohai https://twitter.com/rogerkver/status/646746115321237505?s=09 [19:24]
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shinohai Has Ver ever made an appearance here? [19:28]
mircea_popescu i dun recall. [19:29]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4283 @ 0.00074621 = 3.196 BTC [-] {2} [19:30]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 50117 @ 0.00074559 = 37.3667 BTC [-] [19:31]
shinohai https://i.imgur.com/5bhh4j1.jpg <<< make me a sandwich [19:32]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1KCaASE ) [19:32]
pete_dushenski Yogi Berra, a Hall of Fame catcher for the New York Yankees whose mangled syntax made him one of the sports world's most beloved and frequently quoted figures, has died at the age of 90." [19:35]
pete_dushenski in memory, some quotes : [19:35]
pete_dushenski “When you come to a fork in the road, take it.” [19:35]
pete_dushenski "Nobody goes there anymore, it's too crowded." [19:35]
pete_dushenski “A nickel ain’t worth a dime anymore.” [19:35]
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pete_dushenski “Baseball is 90 percent mental. The other half is physical.” [19:36]
trinque that 3rd one is excellent [19:36]
gernika http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=23-09-2015#1284117 << seems to me to be an argument against block size inflation. [19:38]
assbot Logged on 23-09-2015 22:33:35; pete_dushenski: "Nobody goes there anymore, it's too crowded." [19:38]
mircea_popescu nice. [19:41]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 29319 @ 0.00075212 = 22.0514 BTC [+] [19:41]
mircea_popescu teh sandwich i mean. [19:41]
BingoBoingo I was about to say earlier that one of the people on my shortlist of Satoshi candidates died today. [19:42]
pete_dushenski http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=23-09-2015#1284054 << pleasure was mine. [19:47]
assbot Logged on 23-09-2015 20:26:20; wywialm: i'll be going, thanks pete_dushenski for a nice (even if boring to the audience) discussion [19:47]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 30650 @ 0.0007439 = 22.8005 BTC [-] {3} [19:49]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 24163 @ 0.00074329 = 17.9601 BTC [-] [19:54]
shinohai https://i.imgur.com/9WTCxWE.jpg [19:57]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1KCeCdz ) [19:57]
shinohai https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1181693.msg12505384#msg12505384 <<< someone mentions bitcoin-assets lawgs [20:03]
assbot Bitcoin XT Post Mortem - Group Discussion ... ( http://bit.ly/1MJP0RK ) [20:03]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 58800 @ 0.00074272 = 43.6719 BTC [-] {4} [20:06]
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danielpbarron http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=23-09-2015#1284102 << please don't hold back on my account; it's not possible to offend me over some side comment. And regarding The Bible, I've heard it all. [20:22]
assbot Logged on 23-09-2015 22:18:50; shinohai: I almost responded to his baby Jesus analogy, but didn't want to offend danielpbarron [20:22]
shinohai I figured one snappy tweet was enough for him today anyway. First one was pretty good. [20:23]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12300 @ 0.00074238 = 9.1313 BTC [-] [20:24]
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phf is there reason why openssl docs snip by Marcel Hernandez is not part of canon? [20:34]
phf oh i see what it is , nm [20:39]
phf shinohai: you probably have rm_gitignore.patch applied, which removes .gitignore files from src/obj/nogui and nukes the folders along the way? [20:45]
shinohai Nah I am experimenting with an arm build and deleted the folder myself, forgot to add them back like a genius. [20:50]
phf ah word [20:50]
BingoBoingo Weird, I was smoking out front and saw a camaro with the license plate "For USD" or maybe "For USO" [20:52]
shinohai Feebs are checking up on ya BingoBoingo [20:55]
BingoBoingo shinohai: I just kinda assume that nowadays. Apparently one of the local 5-0 lives in the duplex across from this house, but the only sign I get that he lives there is he stops there on breaks and says he lives there [20:57]
BingoBoingo Not the weirdest thing though. The weirdest thing was seeing a train full of open top coal cars going through town from WEST to EAST [20:57]
shinohai I feel safe knowing our government has it's eye on you, you're so dangerous and all. [20:58]
phf creating jobs [20:59]
shinohai Wasting money for no obvious reason. [21:00]
phf !shasum wot [21:01]
assbot sha256sum wot_users.sql.gz : 19156ac26b3007ee5d78dd7e882c2ba7228f0cef61a2bb2579e08a5e81836c9d [21:01]
assbot sha256sum wot_ratings.sql.gz : f76d906ae56e1c2582e66ef3427e0fcd7a5319d69fcfcbec0a7bcf1e02db5de0 [21:01]
assbot sha256sum trustlist.txt : 97b2a0630c22d02ae4c604a0caa031b72d6db600fdf788ffd78ca939f3d1d348 [21:01]
BingoBoingo Seriously though why would a train carrying coal move through the area around St Louis from WEST to East? [21:01]
phf ^- above values don't seem to be correct. i'm getting f76d906ae56e1c2582e66ef3427e0fcd7a5319d69fcfcbec0a7bcf1e02db5de0 wot_users.sql.gz and e431011e2a09122a8695a9a5d326d760f5da1e0fe40da112670d2bf694440488 wot_ratings.sql.gz [21:04]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 34385 @ 0.00074358 = 25.568 BTC [+] [21:07]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 25350 @ 0.00074196 = 18.8087 BTC [-] {3} [21:10]
phf that was copy paste fail, but i'm still getting wrong shasums, http://paste.lisp.org/display/155678 [21:11]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1KAF7iK ) [21:11]
shinohai 488c71753df901d9e6b9ac8278cb6206f5ef05eebb9a8e760a8041b26d56bc2a wot_users.sql.gz [21:13]
shinohai so yeah, diff [21:14]
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mod6 <+phf> shinohai: you probably have rm_gitignore.patch applied, which removes .gitignore files from src/obj/nogui and nukes the folders along the way? << i said to disregard this patch. reason is, it wipes out output dirs required by the bitcoin makefile. [21:27]
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mod6 oh, thought that said "should have" [21:29]
shinohai Nah it was me derping and forgetting to mkdir obj after I deleted the other :/ [21:30]
mod6 anyway, yeah, just be aware that it breaks things with the Makefile. http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/2015-July/000127.html [21:30]
assbot [BTC-dev] Remove .gitignore files from Reference Implementation ... ( http://bit.ly/1KAGbDe ) [21:30]
mod6 ah, yeah, ok good deal. [21:31]
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shinohai How's that V coming mod6 [21:35]
mod6 nice, actually. [21:35]
mod6 working on some cleanup. toposort seems to be doing what it should be, press is testing well so far (manual tests), currently writing the help info etc. [21:36]
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mod6 i perhaps wanna touch on some colorization of the graphviz graph nodes depending on the signatory, we'll see. [21:37]
asciilifeform mod6: neato! [21:37]
mod6 I also am considering adding a "pull" or "sync" method. something to check your local vpatches against whats available at the foundation. [21:38]
mod6 we'll see. [21:38]
mod6 asciilifeform: yeah, it's coming along! [21:38]
mod6 oh, and I was gonna add a bunch of cucumber tests to exercise the V code to ensure correctness. haven't even started that part yet. [21:38]
mod6 but shouldn't be too bad. [21:38]
* shinohai will test cukes as necessary .... [21:39]
mod6 i mean cucumber with perl is better than with java or ruby. might be nice with python, but again, that's not exactly my thing yet. [21:40]
mod6 so maybe someday, we'll have the gherkin with a python backend. [21:40]
mod6 walking my way through alf's toposort taught me a few things though. [21:41]
shinohai Fuck java [21:42]
mod6 including that there is no actual way to have an else case for a for loop in perl. lol. [21:42]
mod6 so i had to kinda make my own magic there. was simple with an added flag + check. [21:42]
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BingoBoingo !up chatquack [21:43]
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shinohai I'm willing to bet you need 13 libraries just to echo "hello world" in java. [21:43]
mod6 well, arguably there are a variety of classes involved there. but you can make that happen with just the standard development kit, no special imports of packages are required. [21:44]
mod6 but yeah, java sucks. [21:44]
BingoBoingo Java not only sucks, it is owned by evil [21:47]
mod6 no arguments there [21:48]
trinque unblinking, eyebrow-less evil [21:48]
mircea_popescu gas chamber kek [21:52]
asciilifeform gasenwagen! [21:52]
BingoBoingo gasenwagen! << Tis the People's Wagen nao [21:53]
mod6 The National Razor had a better ring to it. [21:53]
asciilifeform faaaaaaaahrvergnügen ! [21:53]
* mircea_popescu is tempted to start whorehouse, call it people's house./ [21:55]
asciilifeform prolly already sop in north kr [21:56]
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BingoBoingo Subminor 21 co lol https://archive.is/gnPW3 [22:00]
assbot pizzaface18 comments on ELI5 21Inc. (part 2): Why do we panic when mining pools hit 51%, but support 21Inc.'s inevitable 51% IoT-based pool? (Since it's "Not about the mining", it's about microtransactions mined for free by 21Inc51%Pool^TM?) ... ( http://bit.ly/1LxD97X ) [22:01]
cazalla http://www.abc.net.au/news/2015-09-24/make-it-unaustralian-to-disrespect-women-turnbull-100-million-dv/6800330 <<< "All violence against women begins with disrespecting women," Mr Turnbull told reporters at the launch in Melbourne. [22:01]
assbot PM calls for it to become 'un-Australian' to disrespect women: $100 million commitment on domestic violence - ABC News (Australian Broadcasting Corporation) ... ( http://bit.ly/1LxD83U ) [22:01]
mircea_popescu i haven't read bitcointalk in like years, but hey, i tend to read stuff people link here. and in that thread, iCEBREAKER dude is fucking breaking 'em. [22:02]
mircea_popescu "Sure, go ahead and "challenge gatekeepers" with your TOR blacklists and awesome ~0% of network mining power. [22:02]
mircea_popescu To the proposal of "XT?" the community overwhelmingly responded "NACK" (cite: xtnodes.com). So regardless of your fact-free preference-tailored extreme minority opinion, the debate is over, and was won on inherency take-outs + presumption (not to mention solvency and the a priori 'FUCK HEARN AND THE CORE DEV HE RODE IN ON' deontological imperative). [22:02]
mircea_popescu "Shackles of the BIP?" [22:02]
mircea_popescu Oh right, the 1MB cap is exactly like slavery days. Got it. That's not offensive at all. And neither are your first world armchair claims of resistance against censorship. You and your exorbitantly privileged critique of theymos' moderation wouldn't last a day in China, where real censorship exists. [22:02]
mircea_popescu Could you possibly be anymore self-righteous and self-regarding, while simultaneously self-pitying? [22:02]
mircea_popescu For very good reasons, XT got #REKT, and all the pretentious undergraduate Marxist pomo jargon in the universe won't help it be anything but a colossal failure." [22:02]
mircea_popescu is the guy even here ? [22:02]
shinohai I've never seen him, but I found it pretty nifty he mentioned #b-a [22:04]
mircea_popescu if anyone still got an account somehow, see if he maybe wants to write for qntra ? i could read more of that [22:04]
mircea_popescu but i doubt i'll be doing more tardstalk. [22:04]
asciilifeform link? [22:04]
mircea_popescu shinohai> https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1181693.msg12505384#msg12505384 <<< someone mentions bitcoin-assets lawgs [22:05]
assbot Bitcoin XT Post Mortem - Group Discussion ... ( http://bit.ly/1MJP0RK ) [22:05]
asciilifeform ty [22:05]
BingoBoingo is the guy even here ? << My vague recollection is back in the day he wasn't an MPOE-PR fan. Usagi critic sure but though MPOE was just a differnet evil. Then again I am drunk early and memory flawed. [22:05]
mircea_popescu i dun recall him ever running a "business" [22:05]
BingoBoingo Neither do I [22:06]
mircea_popescu well other than that who the fuck cares. [22:06]
BingoBoingo I think him or someone with a similar name tried to sell a big bar-o-silver for LTC [22:06]
mircea_popescu "bar of silver" and big somehow don't go together. what's silver, like a pizza an ounce ? [22:07]
mircea_popescu how big was this bar, like obama standing ? [22:07]
BingoBoingo I've seen the nick brg444 before though. Fuck you brg444 get in assWoT already. Also don't think I didn't see you shilling for 21's Po-Po plug. [22:07]
BingoBoingo mircea_popescu: Prolly 10 oz or so. Less than a steak but more than the average dick. [22:08]
mircea_popescu eh, rubber duckling's more than the average dick. [22:08]
BingoBoingo Are you sure, with China ascendant and all... [22:08]
asciilifeform unrelatedly, ada is melting my brain. [22:08]
mircea_popescu lol. btw, anyone remember the rubber duckling incident ? [22:09]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform is that in a good way ? like, licking it on a cone ? [22:10]
asciilifeform mno [22:10]
asciilifeform in the bad way. [22:10]
asciilifeform like reactor. [22:10]
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* assbot gives voice to mike_c [22:11]
shinohai I wish mpoe-pr was still there, btctalk was worth reading then. [22:11]
shinohai She can certainly chew 'em up and spit 'em back out. [22:12]
* asciilifeform wishes there existed some other typesafe, statically typed language usable on a microcontroller [22:12]
* assbot removes voice from chatquack [22:13]
BingoBoingo I wish mpoe-pr was still there, btctalk was worth reading then. << I think most people here value her health too much. When she left the Fillipenis wasn't so bad. Now it is pretty much all aids [22:14]
BingoBoingo General question, did http://qntra.net/2015/09/fda-regulatory-overreach-allows-price-gouging/ seem to accurately capture the hypocrisy? [22:15]
assbot FDA Regulatory Overreach Allows Price Gouging | Qntra ... ( http://bit.ly/1LxEX0H ) [22:15]
cazalla do americans actually pay such prices or is it simply a case where end user pays $8.80 (as we do here) and the goverment/tax payer is fucked for the rest of it? [22:18]
mircea_popescu it's wordy and weak. [22:18]
asciilifeform cazalla: you get ZIP from usg unless you are part of the blessedly indigent class [22:18]
mircea_popescu granted it's a very difficult task because the issue is medicine (which is wordy by default) and the proposed jump somewhat distant. [22:18]
BingoBoingo Ah [22:19]
cazalla so what benefit is there in raising the price if no end user can actually buy it? [22:19]
asciilifeform cazalla: this normally requires - at the minimum - multiple years of tax receipts proving indigence [22:19]
BingoBoingo cazalla: Well consider before the price spike in question med was going for $13.50 per pill in the US and about $0.035 elsewhere [22:20]
asciilifeform cazalla: 'buy' is a flexible concept in usa. if you have 'health insurance', it gets milked out to its theoretical maximum, and then you pay (if you have lines of credit, will max'em out naturally) [22:20]
BingoBoingo cazalla: Obola care usually pays now [22:20]
mircea_popescu cazalla insurance has no option but to pay. [22:20]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: this is demonstrably and abundantly false [22:20]
mircea_popescu understand the evil of a 3 party system. the user has no say. the doctor decides if it's needed or not, doesn't care about the cost. [22:20]
mircea_popescu insurance can not overrule doctor. [22:20]
asciilifeform often enough, 'insurer' (misnomer, these are not insurance co. in the traditional sense) will find a way to avoid paying [22:21]
mircea_popescu as a result, they'll be billed for a few millions, and react to it, gouging insurance prices by a few billion in a half decade. [22:21]
BingoBoingo cazalla insurance has no option but to pay. << WIth the added danger that until Obola care came to all sorts of present evil could be vetoed by actual businesses [22:21]
asciilifeform or at the very least leave the diseased chump with $maxint bill [22:21]
mircea_popescu the societal cost of that cocky 20yo handpuppet is comparable to what obama costs. [22:21]
BingoBoingo often enough, 'insurer' (misnomer, these are not insurance co. in the traditional sense) will find a way to avoid paying << This many times "insurer" is or was payment handler for actual business's healthcare claims [22:22]
asciilifeform often this process takes the form of 'we will pay, but for amputation rather than treatment' [22:22]
mircea_popescu and this is the main problem here : for ~20 years, the president was a sort of priviledged class, allowed to burn pieces off the country. [22:22]
mircea_popescu but apparently the situation is degrading and every entry level project manager can do this now. [22:22]
mircea_popescu or, to quote an anonymous derp, "are we comfortable with regulation introduced by a guy named bob ?" [22:22]
BingoBoingo Recent corporate medicine where available has been move employees to medicaid so state feels the pain instead. [22:23]
mircea_popescu which the feds love, let the state be bled dry. [22:23]
BingoBoingo By "states" often happy to pay deficit [22:23]
asciilifeform BingoBoingo: understand, no one is eligible for 'medicaid' until whatever earthly goods he had, are properly and documentedly vultured away [22:23]
asciilifeform e.g., if you had title to a house, it is to be sold [22:23]
asciilifeform all of the 'turkey-buying dollars' are to be vacuumed up. [22:24]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform we're talking employees here. [22:24]
mircea_popescu what goods. [22:24]
BingoBoingo asciilifeform: Nah. Only for the retired. Incompletely employed eligible by default nao. [22:24]
asciilifeform BingoBoingo: ever hear of 'medical bankruptcy' ? [22:24]
mircea_popescu the last "normal american" that had any value left in him was ambushed on a highway cca 2003. [22:24]
BingoBoingo No income retiree with assets must first bleed much before medicaid. [22:24]
asciilifeform it is entirely sop in usa. [22:24]
BingoBoingo asciilifeform: Sure. I've done the chapter 7 thing myself about 5 years ago. [22:25]
mircea_popescu let's play the "guess the size of today's apache log for trilema". [22:26]
asciilifeform 300 MB [22:26]
BingoBoingo The obamacare new medicaid rules keep wealth tests for the retired and prevent incomes above X from medicaid, but low earners of nearly any net wealth get new medicaid [22:26]
BingoBoingo 173.47 MB [22:26]
mircea_popescu more. [22:26]
shinohai 500 mb [22:27]
mircea_popescu mmmm [22:27]
mircea_popescu ore. [22:27]
BingoBoingo 1.357 GB [22:27]
mircea_popescu still more. [22:27]
mircea_popescu it is 2.9 gb for the love of fuck. [22:27]
BingoBoingo 9.867 GB [22:27]
asciilifeform BingoBoingo: understand that 'low earner' per usg is somebody with WHOLE YEAR OF TAX RECEIPT proving such. [22:27]
BingoBoingo asciilifeform: Once again varies by state [22:27]
asciilifeform as in, if i get sacked i get to starve long before could ever show up as 'low earner' [22:27]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform it's not for you. [22:27]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: no shit! [22:28]
mircea_popescu but otherwise, you don't have to actually file. [22:28]
asciilifeform no file, no handouts [22:28]
mircea_popescu if you've not filed tax returns for past coupla years, you're still eligible [22:28]
mircea_popescu aha. [22:28]
asciilifeform we were speaking of usg payola such as 'medicaid' [22:28]
mircea_popescu yes. [22:28]
mircea_popescu they get you for insurance fraud on top of whatever if you file later and it turns out you had moneys. [22:28]
asciilifeform it is strictly, strictly for registered members of the lumpen castes. [22:28]
asciilifeform also (elaborated for n00bs) usg's definition of 'has money' is ~strictly~ about income. [22:31]
asciilifeform whatever it is you blew it on, e.g., rent, is considered, in effect, discretionary [22:31]
BingoBoingo asciilifeform: medicaid is for everyone. It just isn't for you... yet [22:34]
asciilifeform BingoBoingo: by the time it is 'for me', it will consist of a complimentary cyanide [22:34]
BingoBoingo Prolly, but Michelle Obola will likely be president if there still is one [22:35]
mircea_popescu even with the very steam-punk techno-nazis cyanide was not for everyone. [22:35]
asciilifeform only for attendees of wagner concert ! [22:35]
mircea_popescu aha. [22:36]
mircea_popescu what's wrong with strychnine [22:36]
asciilifeform costly. [22:36]
mircea_popescu cheaper than cyanide. [22:36]
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BingoBoingo what's wrong with strychnine << Occasionally results in angry hulk rather than cadaver [22:37]
mircea_popescu makes for great cinema! [22:38]
BingoBoingo Not really, Hulk movies are the super hero movies that don't make money [22:38]
asciilifeform folks outside of usadom rarely know just how much the handouts, 'safety nets', and other socialisms ~strictly~ exclude the non-lumpens. [22:38]
mircea_popescu well, people of the nordic system sorta-expect nordic system. [22:39]
asciilifeform recall tlp's piece re: how a history of normal employment is more or less a kiss of death in consideration for 'disability' pension [22:39]
mircea_popescu i would expect that probably changed. [22:40]
mircea_popescu no other explanation for all the third gender survival observed in the fields. [22:41]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: they are proper lumpens [22:41]
asciilifeform i.e. people who have never shown any symptoms of earning one's keep [22:41]
asciilifeform of having any inclination to. [22:41]
mircea_popescu this is not so. you're not born obese. [22:42]
mircea_popescu gotta work for it. [22:42]
asciilifeform obese or whatever other p.t. barnum deformity alone doesn't cut it. [22:42]
BingoBoingo i would expect that probably changed. << Only really changed in healthcare and only in a way that ascii must eat shoes for a year to be lumpen [22:42]
asciilifeform add several years for 'processing' [22:43]
mircea_popescu so how do the fatties survive ? [22:43]
BingoBoingo so how do the fatties survive ? << Two years of leaching off family and then "blackface" [22:44]
asciilifeform partly on handouts from blood relations, parasitism of sex partners (yes) [22:44]
mircea_popescu i dunno... [22:44]
asciilifeform very occasionally (at least for white usians) - meagre payola from state ('food stamps', etc) [22:44]
mircea_popescu dude... a girl that weighs what 5 weigh costs what 10 cost. [22:45]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: costs how ? [22:45]
asciilifeform recall that in usa, the most calorific 'food' (i cannot bring myself to call it food) is hands-down the cheapest. [22:46]
BingoBoingo dude... a girl that weighs what 5 weigh costs what 10 cost. << Ah, if girl can pregnancy. [22:46]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 26404 @ 0.00074358 = 19.6335 BTC [+] [22:46]
asciilifeform to the point that living on the dole virtually guarantees candidacy for that freakshow forum BingoBoingo reads [22:46]
* mircea_popescu introduces by reference the mortuary services piece. [22:46]
BingoBoingo to the point that living on the dole virtually guarantees candidacy for that freakshow forum BingoBoingo reads << This 600-800 calories to the dollar is not an unrealistic target in USia [22:47]
mircea_popescu o.O [22:50]
asciilifeform there is a good reason why the traditional stereotype in usa is that 'poor' goes with 'fat' [22:50]
BingoBoingo ^ [22:50]
asciilifeform and vice-versa [22:50]
asciilifeform they are almost inextricably linked. [22:50]
mircea_popescu pretty good, i think i barely get 5% of that. [22:50]
mircea_popescu srsly, a complete meal out of $3 ? no wonder inflation figures are down. [22:51]
asciilifeform if they could get people to run on diesel, they would. [22:51]
mircea_popescu better than thr 60s. [22:51]
asciilifeform 'complete meal' is not the best description here. [22:51]
asciilifeform it staves off caloric starvation, but just about everyone who makes a habit of these 'meals' suffers from one or more kinds of malnutrition. [22:52]
BingoBoingo it staves off caloric starvation, but just about everyone who makes a habit of these 'meals' suffers from one or more kinds of malnutrition. << Yhis [22:52]
punkman how much pork does $3 buy? [22:53]
BingoBoingo In a McDonalds burger most calories come from the bun and its added sugar [22:53]
BingoBoingo how much pork does $3 buy? << Little [22:53]
mircea_popescu i very much doubt there's any meat in mcdonalds&co. [22:54]
asciilifeform most of the calories these folks take in come from corn fructose. [22:54]
mircea_popescu looks to me a suspiciously like spraypainted soy [22:54]
asciilifeform which is added to literally everything where this is physically possible. [22:54]
* mircea_popescu goes off to verify this strange. [22:54]
BingoBoingo i very much doubt there's any meat in mcdonalds&co. << WHen I was there the actual "beef patty" seemed to be all beef though small. Just what part of beef... [22:54]
mircea_popescu The Demise of the High Fructose Corn Syrup Futures Contract: A Case Study [22:55]
mircea_popescu omfg it's gone ? [22:55]
mircea_popescu how the fuck do you price this shit now ? [22:55]
asciilifeform by crown fiat. [22:55]
BingoBoingo Now "Taco Bell" has a new flagship item selling for ~1 dollar/400 calories mostly textured soy protein, corn flour, and other corn [22:56]
mircea_popescu anywhay, let's say it's ~30 per lb. [22:56]
mircea_popescu if memory serves [22:56]
asciilifeform the other thing folks outside of usaschwitz sometimes do not know, is that the cost of the materials of the 'food' is only half the story. [22:56]
asciilifeform there is also the fact of the 'fast' in 'fast food' [22:56]
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asciilifeform i.e. the victi^H^H^H^Hchum^H^H^customers are typically folks to whom ~preparing a meal~ is a foreign concept [22:57]
BingoBoingo how the fuck do you price this shit now ? << same way sub saharan africans can buy anti-malarials that before gouging cost $13.50 a pop in USia [22:57]
asciilifeform many do not even have access to something normal person would recognize as a kitchen. [22:57]
mircea_popescu at the usual 4 calories/gram, [22:57]
mircea_popescu ;;calc 4 * 450 / 30 [22:58]
gribble 60 [22:58]
mircea_popescu seems it's 60 callories to the dollar eh ? what 600. [22:58]
asciilifeform a $1 bag of chips can easily go over 1000. [22:59]
punkman 4 calories per gram of corn syrup? [22:59]
BingoBoingo ;;google daredevil burrito nutrition facts [22:59]
gribble Taco Bell® | Nutrition Menu - Nutritionix: ; Taco Bell® | Dare Devil Loaded Griller - Fiery Ghost Pepper: ; Taco Bell® | Dare Devil Loaded Griller - Mild Chipotle: [22:59]
asciilifeform ('chips' - or 'crisps' to other side of the ocean - are something like equal parts potato to synthetic rubbish.) [22:59]
mircea_popescu punkman generally glucides are 4, lipides 7. [23:00]
punkman hmm indeed, seemed low in my head [23:01]
mircea_popescu im sure there's differences (iirc hfcs is about half fructose half weird), but they are not that significant [23:01]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform there;s something amiss here. [23:02]
BingoBoingo https://www.tacobell.com/nutrition/information << 430 calorie item on the $1 menue an this is about medium energy density pauper food [23:02]
assbot Menu Calories and Nutrition Information | Taco Bell ... ( http://bit.ly/1WjSFYb ) [23:02]
cazalla but epic meal time is so cool! [23:03]
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asciilifeform mircea_popescu: usians also drink liquid hfcs like water. [23:04]
asciilifeform in the form of various 'soda' [23:04]
phf just went to groceries, spent about $200 for ~maybe~ two weeks worth of food (chicken for just a couple of days and fruits for 3 days since it'll go bad), cashier kept asking questions "wow that's a lot of food! how many people? is this for a month? etc." [23:04]
asciilifeform recall the car full of rubbish ? [23:04]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform but even in bulk that's 60 calories to the dollar. [23:04]
mircea_popescu phf cashier was trying to suck cock for sammiches. [23:04]
* asciilifeform pays similar [23:04]
phf mircea_popescu: that was my impression too [23:04]
BingoBoingo HFCS wouldn't even be a big issue if it wasn't for the fact that fructuse doesn't respond to insulin [23:04]
mircea_popescu "when do you get off" is teh right answer. [23:05]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu has prolly never seen an american cashier up close [23:05]
* mircea_popescu has asked usian cashiers out. [23:05]
mircea_popescu who the fuck do you fuck, artists ? [23:05]
BingoBoingo asciilifeform but even in bulk that's 60 calories to the dollar. << Math is either off or FCS is now the expensive component of trash food [23:05]
cazalla phf, was she hot? [23:05]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: organic chemists [23:06]
cazalla because sounds like a good opportunity to invite her over for a proper meal [23:06]
phf cazalla: no [23:06]
mircea_popescu aww. [23:06]
BingoBoingo http://www.spondoolies-tech.com/products/sp50 << perhaps solid companion to ship out with ever pogo [23:06]
assbot SP50 – Spondoolies-Tech ... ( http://bit.ly/1WjTa4A ) [23:06]
asciilifeform BingoBoingo: outside of a few odd exceptions which you and i will never meet, mining is of interest strictly to borderline imbeciles [23:07]
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cazalla BingoBoingo, is that new? [23:08]
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asciilifeform BingoBoingo: it is every bit the archetypical example of a sucker's game. [23:08]
mircea_popescu Power Supply 10 x 1600 W Form Factor 11 U rack [23:08]
BingoBoingo asciilifeform: I spent a dollar for lunch yesterday at taco bell, I may be such an imbicel [23:08]
BingoBoingo cazalla: Seems so [23:08]
phf it's a coop with whole foods prices, they have a truly weird selection of cashiers, working there for a discount. i'd say trader joes has prettiest cashiers here, but that's a far away truck just to talk to some hipster girls. might as well go to a bar [23:08]
mircea_popescu asciilifeform hey, you wanted irl chips with tolerances ? +-10%! [23:09]
phf *track [23:09]
BingoBoingo Power Supply 10 x 1600 W Form Factor 11 U rack << reasonably even out power savings from pogo [23:09]
mike_c mining is a good way to learn though [23:09]
mike_c get your hands dirty a bit [23:09]
asciilifeform a (former) colleague of mine bought something quite like this, at the time i had access to a cabinet with 'free' mains current, let him plug it in. it blew out the breakers. [23:09]
mircea_popescu i also don't share asciilifeform's lowview of mining. [23:09]
mircea_popescu there is such a thing as strategic mining. [23:09]
BingoBoingo mike_c: Also with saner p2pool could provide decent safety net [23:09]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: i did say 'exceptions' [23:09]
mircea_popescu ;;gentime 110000000 [23:10]
gribble The average time to generate a block at 110000000.0 Mhps, given difficulty of 59335351233.9, is 3 weeks, 5 days, 19 hours, 33 minutes, and 13 seconds [23:10]
asciilifeform some folks just want clean-burning coin without transacting in usd with anyone. [23:10]
asciilifeform and don't much care what it fixed-costs. [23:10]
mircea_popescu the case for owning one : you can in general expect your own tx to confirm in a month, n omatter what. [23:10]
asciilifeform mircea_popescu: only if you regularly add units to keep up with diff [23:11]
mike_c BingoBoingo: i don't know about safety net, we couldn't even protect altcoin [23:11]
BingoBoingo mircea_popescu: only if you regularly add units to keep up with diff << Then get four. You'll get at least 1 conf a month for a year [23:12]
asciilifeform thing is, 'strategic' mining in the sense of 'protect' pretty much guaranteed to fail - because 'customs inspector's theorem' applies [23:12]
* Guest41371 has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) [23:12]
asciilifeform you have to 'get lucky every day', he - 'only has to get lucky once' [23:12]
BingoBoingo thing is, 'strategic' mining in the sense of 'protect' pretty much guaranteed to fail - because 'customs inspector's theorem' applies << Host in Sinaloa datacenter [23:12]
asciilifeform enemy only needs to supply a temporary burst to kill you. [23:12]
asciilifeform it is not enough to 'have miner', you need to control a sizable ~fraction of planetary hash~ [23:13]
BingoBoingo BingoBoingo: i don't know about safety net, we couldn't even protect altcoin << Altcoin had to die for our sins of believing in a monetized testnet for a few months [23:13]
asciilifeform to count as 'strategic' [23:13]
mike_c hehe [23:13]
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assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 35050 @ 0.00074649 = 26.1645 BTC [+] {5} [23:18]
BingoBoingo qntra gets all the socialed medials https://archive.is/X01BB [23:18]
assbot Conspiracy ... ( http://bit.ly/1WjUvID ) [23:18]
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punkman http://lolmythesis.com/post/129657314480/watching-disney-movies-is-less-fun-when-you-pay [23:23]
assbot lol my thesis: Watching Disney movies is less fun when you pay... ... ( http://bit.ly/1WjV6tP ) [23:23]
mircea_popescu wasn;t this the argument against prostitution since forever ? [23:25]
mircea_popescu somehow the same derps don't figure paying detracts from the quality of medical practice. [23:25]
mircea_popescu "i wouldn't dare take a free abortion, but who knwos what evil paid fuck-professionals may do!!" [23:25]
mircea_popescu best cognitive dissonance ever. [23:26]
BingoBoingo FUCKING FAT ASS IMGUR https://voat.co/v/fatpeoplehate/comments/536627 [23:30]
assbot Checking your bits ... ( http://bit.ly/1WjVKHH ) [23:30]
punkman "looks like the ad network I was using isn't going to pay me for the last 2 months of ads I placed on my site. Which kind of sucks." [23:31]
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BingoBoingo !up tvmcsoqenc [23:35]
* assbot gives voice to tvmcsoqenc [23:35]
danielpbarron http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=24-09-2015#1284406 << yeh some of the girls at the stores I frequent are pretty cute [23:39]
assbot Logged on 24-09-2015 02:03:33; *: mircea_popescu has asked usian cashiers out. [23:39]
BingoBoingo https://i.imgur.com/S0vKRDP.jpg << Lumpen cuisine [23:41]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1WjWNaF ) [23:41]
punkman "My gf don't know this but everytime we fuck I put $1 in a jar & thats how much imma spend on her for her bday. So far she gettin a mcchicken" [23:42]
BingoBoingo lkol [23:42]
punkman "mayo soup" ehrmagerd [23:43]
assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12315 @ 0.00074175 = 9.1347 BTC [-] [23:43]
phf eerily reminiscent of prison "spread" [23:45]
phf ;;google prison spread [23:47]
gribble How to Cook Prison Spread - YouTube: ; 10 Revolting Foods That People Have Made in Prison - io9: ; Jail House Recipes: [23:47]
punkman http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=24-09-2015#1284231 << I had similar feelings but I assumed this was because I lacked experience in low-level language [23:48]
assbot Logged on 24-09-2015 01:06:52; asciilifeform: unrelatedly, ada is melting my brain. [23:48]
punkman https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CCfHn7UWAAAuG4j.jpg:large [23:51]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1WjXEIo ) [23:51]
punkman "anyone old enough to remember the PopUp wars knows this ad crap won't stop until it breaks the web, and gets blocked by browsers." << except you can still get popups, because fuck browsers [23:53]
BingoBoingo http://thesouthern.com/news/local/dozens-support-confederate-flag-at-school-meeting/article_4d05f31b-5052-5a68-bf58-de4fa98a889b.html [23:54]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1WjY01T ) [23:54]
* tripleslash has quit (Remote host closed the connection) [23:54]
BingoBoingo punkman: Then change your browser [23:54]
BingoBoingo And still moar from the white trash beat http://thesouthern.com/news/local/pinckneyville-police-arrest-member-of-country-music-street-group/article_462eabff-2789-5649-8cb5-6efaf1b96631.html [23:55]
BingoBoingo Also Obolacation http://thesouthern.com/news/local/siu/siu-president-says-school-reshaping-no-new-programs/article_e06dd0ad-13f5-57eb-be22-40ba585e7945.html [23:57]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1WjYm8w ) [23:57]
* brg444 (415ce2ab@gateway/web/freenode/ip.65.92.226.171) has joined #bitcoin-assets [23:57]
punkman https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CPng7LnU8AE6rZt.jpg:large [23:57]
assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1WjYp4n ) [23:57]
BingoBoingo "Dunn did highlight positive news, including a growing and diverse student enrollment." [23:57]
BingoBoingo !up brg444 [23:57]
* assbot gives voice to brg444 [23:57]
BingoBoingo http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2892378/ [23:58]
assbot Skin Integrity in Critically Ill Obese Patients ... ( http://bit.ly/1WjYsgo ) [23:58]
brg444 !register 4A0363951AFA090B6C221787E2F23DB84A63EC22 [23:58]
assbot Searching pgp.mit.edu for key with fingerprint: 4A0363951AFA090B6C221787E2F23DB84A63EC22. This may take a few moments. [23:58]
assbot No valid OpenPGP data found on pgp.mit.edu. [23:58]
BingoBoingo "Incontinence of bowel and bladder in obese patients is a common cause of perineal dermatitis which can increase tissue friability and place patients at higher risk for skin breakdown." [23:58]
BingoBoingo brg444 Where does your public key sleep? [23:59]
brg444 looks to be alive there? http://pool.sks-keyservers.net:11371/pks/lookup?op=vindex&search=0x4A0363951AFA090B6C221787E2F23DB84A63EC22 [23:59]
assbot Search results for '0x4a0363951afa090b6c221787e2f23db84a63ec22' ... ( http://bit.ly/1J3eAed ) [23:59]
Category: Logs
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