Forum logs for 17 Feb 2016

Sunday, 24 November, Year 11 d.Tr. | Author: Mircea Popescu

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deedbot-	[BitBet Bets Bets] 2.00000000 BTC on 'No' - Ben Carson will be Republicans' 2016 Presidential Nominee - http://bitbet.us/bet/1204/ben-carson-will-be-republicans-2016-presidential-nominee/#b13	[00:01]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 85350 @ 0.00056981 = 48.6333 BTC [+] {4}	[00:04]
mod6	;;bc,stats	[00:06]
gribble	Current Blocks: 398779 \| Current Difficulty: 1.4411644784734866E11 \| Next Difficulty At Block: 399167 \| Next Difficulty In: 388 blocks \| Next Difficulty In About: 2 days, 19 hours, 58 minutes, and 14 seconds \| Next Difficulty Estimate: None \| Estimated Percent Change: None	[00:06]
shinohai	Node Height: 317516 (79.6%)	[00:07]
mod6	how's that rollin along for ya?	[00:08]
shinohai	good so far, got stuck a bit earlier, restarted node unclogged.	[00:08]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 57165 @ 0.00057025 = 32.5983 BTC [+] {2}	[00:19]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 76150 @ 0.00055961 = 42.6143 BTC [-] {4}	[00:27]
mod6	http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/2016-February/000212.html	[00:29]
assbot	[BTC-dev] V [v99995] Beta 4 - Call For Testers! ... ( http://bit.ly/1Tnh3YL )	[00:29]
shinohai	^ will do first thing in the a.m.	[00:30]
mod6	np, gonna give an additional step here in a sec.	[00:31]
mod6	so what would be great here, is if you apply the patch, or use the v.pl attached to the email (check the sigs ofc), then start clean, do a fresh `./v.pl i http://thebitcoin.foundation`, and then press out the entire tree, `./v.pl p v v054 asciilifeform_maxint_locks_corrected.vpatch`, then `cd v054` and run that find command at the top of this pastehttp://dpaste.com/2SQ1VZ7.txt	[00:33]
mod6	You should end up with the exact same sha512 hashes as listed in the paste. Let me know, either way.	[00:34]
mod6	Thanks in advance everyone. Salud!	[00:34]
BingoBoingo	BingoBoingo: https://cryptome.org/2016/02/brown-0070.pdf << for possible reprocessing into loltronium ? << I'd need more context on the details motivating the dismissal	[00:42]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1WqytTC )	[00:42]
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phf	pocorgtfo http://btcbase.org/patches/experimental-genesis	[00:46]
phf	mod6 mircea_popescu asciilifeform ^	[00:47]
phf	source patched with http://paste.lisp.org/display/307448, run with a folder as argument and it'll prepend a header based on some conditions (rtfs) to all files	[00:47]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1Tnj3QK )	[00:47]
mircea_popescu	nb.	[00:48]
asciilifeform	neato!	[00:48]
mircea_popescu	in celebratory news, bottoms up! http://41.media.tumblr.com/67c3aa7312c56f9a487262b68d9c2086/tumblr_nifno7D83G1qlne6uo1_1280.jpg	[00:50]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1mGvqdL )	[00:50]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 141200 @ 0.00055952 = 79.0042 BTC [-] {3}	[00:52]
BingoBoingo	https://twitter.com/JebBush/status/699706718419345408	[00:52]
mod6	phf: cool	[00:54]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 67200 @ 0.0005591 = 37.5715 BTC [-] {2}	[00:59]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 18700 @ 0.00057062 = 10.6706 BTC [+] {3}	[01:04]
BingoBoingo	In other news when I was at the store today acquired 1lb carbon zinc battery for great justice	[01:06]
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BingoBoingo	Not sure if exactly one pound, but given it's heft that's what it feels like.	[01:07]
asciilifeform	BingoBoingo: where do these go ?	[01:09]
BingoBoingo	asciilifeform: for great justice	[01:09]
BingoBoingo	asciilifeform: Nah, 6v "floating lantern" to toss into trunk of car and hopefully forget for 3 years until it needs replacement	[01:10]
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asciilifeform	why not cranked lantern?	[01:10]
mircea_popescu	this fucking climate is beyond comprehension. IT GETS LOTS WARMER AFTER THE SUN SETS.	[01:11]
BingoBoingo	asciilifeform: Because if I need lantern light I'm probably going to need enough light to illuminate active worksite	[01:11]
mircea_popescu	how the fuck is 1 am 5 degrees above 1pm ?	[01:11]
BingoBoingo	mircea_popescu: Welcome to my world. Several days last week high of the day was immediately before sunrise.	[01:13]
mircea_popescu	is it some weird like "during day air moves off river, but at night direction change, hot air moves from plain towards river" or somesuch ?	[01:14]
BingoBoingo	asciilifeform: Precise monster zinc carbon went into is "everready dolphin" which walmart had on clearance, for same price as blue pogo which has moved still further down.	[01:14]
BingoBoingo	mircea_popescu: Here it's "so much plains air moves with impunity"	[01:15]
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deedbot-	[Qntra] Western Constitutional Hero Denied 8th Amendment Right To Make Bail - http://qntra.net/2016/02/western-constitutional-hero-denied-8th-amendment-right-to-make-bail/	[01:31]
BingoBoingo	^ Far more interesting that Barret Brown likely going stoolie	[01:34]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 122017 @ 0.00055917 = 68.2282 BTC [-] {5}	[01:39]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 36633 @ 0.00055439 = 20.309 BTC [-]	[01:40]
mircea_popescu	whossat again ?	[01:41]
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BingoBoingo	mircea_popescu: Barret Brown was "Anonymous" namefag journalist.	[01:47]
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punkman	still not sold on the dual genesis, but if the foundation moves forward with this model, I suggest the new genesis is the release/production/stable branch and the existing genesis the experimental one.	[01:58]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 45418 @ 0.00057106 = 25.9364 BTC [+] {3}	[02:05]
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mircea_popescu	davout http://dpaste.com/0D9T5ZR	[02:14]
assbot	dpaste: 0D9T5ZR ... ( http://bit.ly/20YuNiE )	[02:14]
mircea_popescu	punkman you think ?	[02:15]
punkman	mircea_popescu: makes more sense, lots of experimentals in existing genesis	[02:15]
mircea_popescu	not afaik. like what ?	[02:17]
punkman	shiva for one, my patches, polarbeard's patches	[02:18]
mircea_popescu	shiva is not in.	[02:18]
punkman	in what?	[02:19]
mircea_popescu	in the tree.	[02:19]
mircea_popescu	or wait, did alf rebase it ?	[02:19]
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mircea_popescu	i recall it had its own genesis.	[02:20]
punkman	the tinyscheme stands alone but there;s also 2-3 other patches related to it that touch trb	[02:20]
mircea_popescu	what do you mean by touch ?	[02:20]
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punkman	like this http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/attachments/20160128/asciilifeform_shiva_part_2_of_2.vpatch?sha1=abc9c21e3c86e7a540b20e49a6ebc86017758e48	[02:22]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1OfF7pT )	[02:22]
mircea_popescu	now how do i go from that to phf's nice tree thing ?	[02:23]
mircea_popescu	http://btcbase.org/patches/asciilifeform_shiva_part_2_of_2	[02:25]
assbot	asciilifeform_shiva_part_2_of_2 ... ( http://bit.ly/1OfFe4G )	[02:25]
mircea_popescu	yeah he rebased it didn't he. i c.	[02:25]
pete_dushenski	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=17-02-2016#1407796 << this might seem odd to you because you never (presumably) cared about the signal that an honours degree sent to potential employers. ie. the type who sort resumes by "has degree, doesn't. has honours, doesn't." which'd mostly be gov, so... it depends.	[02:25]
assbot	Logged on 17-02-2016 00:49:56; *: mircea_popescu recalls from his college days that most kids preferred taking exams with easy teachers over taking exams with good teachers.	[02:25]
mircea_popescu	punkman well, let's see what the others say. i faintly dislike the idea on morale grounds, but it's not the end of the world	[02:26]
mircea_popescu	pete_dushenski much larger fish than usual in a very tiny pond. what employers. crony capitalism ftw.	[02:26]
mircea_popescu	i dun think there exists even today the romanian speaker who a) is competent in the sense contemplated here and b) actually applies for a job, any job.	[02:27]
pete_dushenski	right, so bring on the best of the best of the nastiest of the crudest of the shrewdest teachers :)	[02:27]
mircea_popescu	there's not even space for head hunters, people just know.	[02:27]
BingoBoingo	mircea_popescu: What truly is a release other than a particular V tree?	[02:27]
mircea_popescu	BingoBoingo a signed path through it.	[02:28]
BingoBoingo	Sure	[02:28]
pete_dushenski	mircea_popescu: was there not status in working for 'foreign' firm ? did these not have interview/application processes ?	[02:29]
mircea_popescu	these jobs sucked, because foreign firm without exception tried to pay local salaries and demand foreign work.	[02:29]
mircea_popescu	much better deal to actually work in their home location.	[02:29]
mircea_popescu	some people did that.	[02:29]
punkman	a sidenote that came to mind looking at phf's lisp snippet: adding comments to everything for release patches (and alt-genesis) doesn't work so great if you have non-plaintext files. not a problem for trb as it is, but perhaps something to keep in mind.	[02:30]
mircea_popescu	but no, by and large there was no status there. for middling derps, yes. but not otherwise.	[02:30]
pete_dushenski	mircea_popescu: ok. so guy wants to improve his station by moving abroad to work for multinational. and he doesn't apply for this job by mailing a few pieces of paper with letters on them, but more importantly with ~numbers~ on them, lending clear incentive to find easy > great teacher in uni ?	[02:31]
mircea_popescu	the occasional exception being local lion backed by foreign capital, resulting in things like say protv. but very much exceptional, and only capable of existing in specific niches. also, temporary things.	[02:31]
mircea_popescu	pete_dushenski ro schooling isn't going to impress anyway.	[02:32]
mircea_popescu	though arguably it should, but that's another discussion.	[02:32]
pete_dushenski	quite.	[02:32]
mircea_popescu	for instance, i took rhetorics with the worlds best rhetorics teacher, no doubt about it. she gave me an 80%, which was by far my lowest mark that year, but then again a good 20% over the next best in the 800 strong year.	[02:33]
punkman	BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: What truly is a release other than a particular V tree? << a release is a vpatch that adds a comment to every single file. or at least that was the plan.	[02:33]
mircea_popescu	nevertheless... who the fuck exactly knows who elena dragos is.	[02:33]
pete_dushenski	now, the logs.	[02:33]
mircea_popescu	punkman the important point there is that mod6 signs it.	[02:34]
mircea_popescu	the girls especially loathed her.	[02:35]
pete_dushenski	because no special treatment ? no soft pandering to their fee-fees ?	[02:36]
mircea_popescu	eh who even knows.	[02:37]
mircea_popescu	prolly something like that.	[02:37]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 24505 @ 0.00056544 = 13.8561 BTC [-] {2}	[02:37]
phf	punkman: is comments in code still the plan? that seems to suffer from similar issues as experimental branch	[02:37]
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pete_dushenski	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=17-02-2016#1407940 << /me clicks excitedly! finds what appears to be toyota 'egg' van and two not particularly eager-looking sluts, which was a bit of a let down.	[02:44]
assbot	Logged on 17-02-2016 02:36:58; mircea_popescu: speaking of the king of jordan and his mercedes, http://40.media.tumblr.com/fb142efbdc04ec9115a00b342da8e762/tumblr_nir0r5aLaw1qlne6uo1_1280.jpg	[02:44]
pete_dushenski	but i guess there can't be ~that~ many pics of abdullah pounding white poon in the back of his open-air 600 landaulet	[02:45]
pete_dushenski	at least not on tumblr	[02:45]
mircea_popescu	lol	[02:52]
punkman	phf, seems so. my initial suggestion was releases as patch sequence files, but I don't think anyone liked this idea. My vtron does .seq files with "foo.vpatch sha512(foo.vpatch) " inside, which works for my blobby vtronized things.	[02:53]
pete_dushenski	http://www.reuters.com/article/us-australia-politics-tech-idUSKCN0VP2TJ << the x of y finally comes to bitcoin in 2016.	[03:04]
assbot	Flux Party seeks to be the bitcoin of Australian politics	[03:04]
pete_dushenski	"like the uber of toilet paper!"	[03:04]
pete_dushenski	"the facebook of buttsex!"	[03:04]
pete_dushenski	"the tesla of television!"	[03:05]
pete_dushenski	in related news, https://49.media.tumblr.com/aa87a865abcffd7bf9667a05c79bce78/tumblr_o2nlbskSfq1qg51mgo1_400.gif	[03:07]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1R7qp8Z )	[03:07]
pete_dushenski	and unrelated news that i wish were related https://49.media.tumblr.com/dfeb8d3d74d56b42e20a03c0b18adc87/tumblr_o0pri49FVK1v0wc8oo2_400.gif	[03:09]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1R7qqK7 )	[03:09]
punkman	"the Indiana Jones of exploring crotch", "the Shakespeare of enormous cock"	[03:13]
pete_dushenski	it's not polite to talk about how hung will s. was. it'd be like asking him how much he's paid.	[03:15]
BingoBoingo	http://epmonthly.com/article/hydroxocobalamin-turning-cyanide-into-vitamin-b12/	[03:19]
assbot	Hydroxocobalamin: Turning Cyanide into Vitamin B12 - Emergency Physicians Monthly ... ( http://bit.ly/1R7qRE6 )	[03:19]
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pete_dushenski	https://45.media.tumblr.com/5324017569c091d792f9dd15ae4451c0/tumblr_o2ioiyS3E31tyncywo1_500.gif << hurr durr	[03:27]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1KVHQtZ )	[03:27]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 41300 @ 0.00056946 = 23.5187 BTC [+] {2}	[03:32]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 35548 @ 0.00056946 = 20.2432 BTC [+]	[03:53]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 51822 @ 0.00057091 = 29.5857 BTC [+] {3}	[03:56]
punkman	http://www.tuxedocomputers.com/Linux-Hardware/Linux-Notebooks/10-14-Zoll/TUXEDO-InfinityBook-13-3-matt-Full-HD-IPS-Aluminiumgehaeuse-Intel-Core-i7-Energiespar-CPU-zwei-HDD/SSD-bis-16GB-RAM-bis-15h-Akku-Slim-Book.geek	[03:58]
assbot	TUXEDO InfinityBook - 13,3 Zoll matt Full-HD IPS + Aluminiumgehäuse + Intel Core i7 Energiespar-CPU + zwei HDD/SSD + bis 16GB RAM + bis 15h Akku + Slim-Book ... ( http://bit.ly/1SRJsI9 )	[03:58]
punkman	pity it doesn't have a better screen	[03:59]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 116326 @ 0.00057122 = 66.4477 BTC [+] {4}	[04:19]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16391 @ 0.0005676 = 9.3035 BTC [-] {2}	[04:37]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9209 @ 0.00056544 = 5.2071 BTC [-]	[04:38]
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phf	i added simple hash navigation to btcbase	[05:15]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 50435 @ 0.00057139 = 28.8181 BTC [+] {4}	[05:16]
phf	can click on a hash from patch display and get a list of producers and consumers, like http://btcbase.org/hash/BDC4FC472BE4A86FB91FA69368FAACE04414FDEEE5B8C82795E31D37E21581B973CAF7F3E9CCC27D487944A5782E3B59615180EAB87C8B3E81242901F3039E4D	[05:17]
assbot	patches for hash BDC4FC472BE4A86FB91FA69368FAACE04414FDEEE5B8C82795E31D37E21581B973CAF7F3E9CCC27D487944A5782E3B59615180EAB87C8B3E81242901F3039E4D ... ( http://bit.ly/1KVPTXv )	[05:17]
phf	multiple producers indicate a conflict, multiple consumers - a divergent press tree	[05:19]
phf	which makes me wonder about some of the patches and how to do conflict resolution, for example http://btcbase.org/hash/BDC4FC472BE4A86FB91FA69368FAACE04414FDEEE5B8C82795E31D37E21581B973CAF7F3E9CCC27D487944A5782E3B59615180EAB87C8B3E81242901F3039E4D all patch wallet.cpp towards a divergent state	[05:21]
assbot	patches for hash BDC4FC472BE4A86FB91FA69368FAACE04414FDEEE5B8C82795E31D37E21581B973CAF7F3E9CCC27D487944A5782E3B59615180EAB87C8B3E81242901F3039E4D ... ( http://bit.ly/1KVPTXv )	[05:21]
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phf	erm, that was supposed to be two different urls..	[05:22]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 55355 @ 0.00056544 = 31.2999 BTC [-] {2}	[05:29]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 34645 @ 0.00056211 = 19.4743 BTC [-] {2}	[05:30]
punkman	phf: how to do conflict resolution << just let the user pick one of the conflicting branches	[05:32]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 38500 @ 0.00057144 = 22.0004 BTC [+]	[05:40]
punkman	http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/feb/16/medical-marijuana-dispensaries-california-tax-cash-only	[06:03]
assbot	Cash-only marijuana dispensaries flood California tax office with paper \| US news \| The Guardian ... ( http://bit.ly/1KpaMub )	[06:03]
punkman	https://claims.mtgox.com/assets/index.html	[06:06]
assbot	MTGOX 破産債権届出システム／MTGOX bankruptcy claims filing system ... ( http://bit.ly/1onXZ0Q )	[06:06]
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punkman	"The trustee has approved part of the filed claims. At this time those who have filed "BTC-only claim" will know whether it is approved. Other approvals are still on hold.."	[06:08]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 65200 @ 0.00055847 = 36.4122 BTC [-] {4}	[06:22]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 36879 @ 0.00055711 = 20.5457 BTC [-] {2}	[06:36]
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davout	ohai	[06:46]
davout	looks like log.b-a.com is missing some bits from yesterday	[06:47]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 69474 @ 0.0005562 = 38.6414 BTC [-]	[06:47]
davout	hrm, maybe it's just me missing some bits in my head	[06:50]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 62650 @ 0.00055532 = 34.7908 BTC [-] {3}	[07:05]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 21600 @ 0.00055421 = 11.9709 BTC [-] {2}	[07:09]
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punkman	https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CbXbuGzUsAESSVf.jpg:large	[07:11]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1U7j6kt )	[07:11]
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davout	deedbot-: http://dpaste.com/0MQ96JH.txt	[07:24]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1U7jzTP )	[07:24]
deedbot-	[fr.anco.is] X.EUR February 17th 2016 statement - http://fr.anco.is/2016/x-eur-february-17th-2016-statement/	[07:24]
deedbot-	accepted: 1	[07:24]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16816 @ 0.0005562 = 9.3531 BTC [+]	[07:44]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3284 @ 0.00056459 = 1.8541 BTC [+]	[07:56]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 24873 @ 0.00055419 = 13.7844 BTC [-]	[08:21]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 36800 @ 0.00056528 = 20.8023 BTC [+] {3}	[08:39]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 69300 @ 0.00055981 = 38.7948 BTC [-]	[09:26]
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*	Now talking on #bitcoin-assets	[11:13]
*	Topic for #bitcoin-assets is: http://bitcoin-assets.com \|\| http://log.bitcoin-assets.com \|\| http://bash.bitcoin-assets.com \|\| http://blogs.bitcoin-assets.com	[11:13]
*	Topic for #bitcoin-assets set by kakobrekla!~kako@unaffiliated/kakobrekla at Wed Mar 5 16:58:12 2014	[11:13]
-assbot-	Welcome to #bitcoin-assets. To get voice (ie, to be able to speak), send me "!up" in a private message to get an OTP. You must have a sufficient WoT rating. If you do not have a WoT account or sufficient rating, try politely asking one of the voiced people for a temporary voice.	[11:13]
ACTION	AME ANICK AMSG ADDBUTTON ALLCHAN ALLCHANL ALLSERV AWAY	[11:13]
jurov	davout actually transferwise should work for you fine, too. except that iirc you require funding from own accounts and twise sends sepa transfers from estonia instead	[11:13]
*	assbot gives voice to mircea_popescu	[11:14]
davout	jurov: re usians, our new fiat financial partner tells us we accept customers from pretty much all countries now	[11:16]
mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=17-02-2016#1408105 << epic.	[11:16]
jurov	did they tell you how much usians pay to wire funds to you?	[11:16]
assbot	Logged on 17-02-2016 08:15:17; phf: multiple producers indicate a conflict, multiple consumers - a divergent press tree	[11:16]
davout	s/we accept/we can accept/	[11:16]
mircea_popescu	jurov i don't think by now any usian is without eu banking.	[11:16]
mircea_popescu	there's simply no banking to be had in the us.	[11:17]
davout	jurov: no idea	[11:17]
mircea_popescu	(no i don't mean redditards, i mean people with jobs, jerry! and secretatries.)	[11:17]
jurov	i am not speaking of usians with own dirigibles here	[11:17]
mircea_popescu	davout bout $100	[11:17]
jurov	^	[11:17]
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davout	i'd guess more around 20~30 €, i'll ask around	[11:18]
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mircea_popescu	and the monetary cost is nothing, us banks are incredibly parochially retarded, will pretend like they can send wires, but then don't.	[11:19]
mircea_popescu	it's a huge hassle for us people do do business.	[11:19]
mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=17-02-2016#1408121 << which ?!	[11:20]
assbot	Logged on 17-02-2016 09:43:18; davout: looks like log.b-a.com is missing some bits from yesterday	[11:20]
davout	twas just my client being derpy	[11:20]
mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=17-02-2016#1408126 << you know that's almost exactly what i mean by "built like a boy"	[11:20]
assbot	Logged on 17-02-2016 10:07:57; punkman: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CbXbuGzUsAESSVf.jpg:large	[11:20]
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davout	not too often that i can say "a boy i'd fuck"	[11:21]
mircea_popescu	me either!	[11:21]
mircea_popescu	but apparently with age this comes also.	[11:21]
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jurov	TIL	[11:22]
davout	so apparently fees on non-sepa wires are 'complicated' and may or may not depend on the the original fee setting request (OUR, SHA, BEN if memory serves), and on possible currency conversion fees on either end	[11:22]
mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=17-02-2016#1408153 << you know, i don't salt my food. i merely add chlorine and sprinkle some sodium on top.	[11:23]
assbot	Logged on 17-02-2016 13:35:48; PeterL: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=16-02-2016#1407557 << What is this lithium ion cell business? Real men just throw a hunk of lithium into their water with tea leaves.	[11:23]
mircea_popescu	davout aha.	[11:23]
mircea_popescu	i'm telling you , advise us partners to either a) get an eu entity incorporated and use that or b) be less poor, as applicable.	[11:23]
mircea_popescu	the upfront cost of attempting to do business as a us subject far exceeds any possibility of gain no matter how fantasmagorically distant.	[11:24]
mircea_popescu	it's basically a soviet country, just like the russians were. unlike the other soviet union, however, it doesn't fucking know this, goes to bed every night collectively imagining that "start-ups" as implemented there are actual business ; and "stars" as implemented there are examples of successful people. it's really quite amusing.	[11:26]
davout	either way i'll ask the question a bit more formally, and ask about outgoing non-sepa wires too could be useful since i don't plan on ever becoming a victim of my own success	[11:27]
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mircea_popescu	i dunno how you feel about arab girls, but a trip to bahrein is in order.	[11:29]
mircea_popescu	and in other banking news, here's an illustration of empowered, liberated us feminist getting herself a new credit card - http://40.media.tumblr.com/726408e24ac80c2ae491becd304a82e0/tumblr_nia2tnRBnB1qlne6uo1_1280.jpg	[11:30]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1PQxtEB )	[11:30]
jurov	davout try formulating the question for lulz "us clients complained about fees, what do you recommend to them"	[11:30]
davout	lulzier if it's just "can you give me an exhaustive list of your currently active fees?"	[11:32]
jurov	heh that won't really work (our fees are $x, add to that $random on the murican side)	[11:35]
davout	i'd be very happy with such an answer, i could simply display "Fees on our end are $x, see with your bank for fees on your side"	[11:36]
davout	kinda how bitcoin works	[11:36]
mircea_popescu	not what consumers have come to expect.	[11:36]
davout	bitcoin deposits are free + bring-your-own network fee	[11:37]
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mircea_popescu	now this is true.	[11:37]
davout	"not what consumers have come to expect." <<< child pays for parent may one day be a thing	[11:38]
PeterL	isn't that why you have children, so they can support you when you are old?	[11:39]
mircea_popescu	depends where. in kandahar, maybe.	[11:39]
mircea_popescu	you can't seriously contemplate this applies in the us ?	[11:39]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17300 @ 0.00056595 = 9.7909 BTC [-]	[11:40]
PeterL	what, you expect government to be able to support your retirement?	[11:40]
PeterL	one has to prepare for the future somehow	[11:40]
mircea_popescu	yes. by moving out of the us.	[11:40]
mircea_popescu	what else ?!	[11:40]
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PeterL	I have decided to stay here, so I will just have to deal with that decision	[11:42]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 50645 @ 0.00056827 = 28.78 BTC [+] {3}	[11:42]
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mircea_popescu	consider this simple point : so i materialize out of the ethers and offer well trained young slave to us kid, for $sum. how can he pay ? he can't. he has no money, the usual way he pays for things (begs daddy-government's agent, called "bank" for absolutely no reason much like fast-food is unrelated to food, being a species of engine oil) does not work for this purpose. what's left ? we just discussed how he can not do	[11:42]
mircea_popescu	any business or in any way EARN any money.	[11:42]
mircea_popescu	now replace "i materialize out of the ethers and offer well trained young slave" with "any discretionary expense" and you've got a pretty accurate picture.	[11:43]
mircea_popescu	even if he WANTED to, your kid will not be able to support you ; chiefly because he can not have nor can he acquire any money or property.	[11:43]
mircea_popescu	and yes, this was EXACTLY the situation throughout the 2nd half of the 20th century in russia & friends.	[11:44]
PeterL	and it is different in other parts of the world?	[11:44]
mircea_popescu	this is an open question. specify some parts ?	[11:44]
PeterL	do you know any part which are different?	[11:45]
mircea_popescu	this is a complicated question. if your kid is smart, such that all he needs to make money is for bitcoin to exist, then most of the world fits the bill, because all he really needs is weak local government.	[11:45]
PeterL	I could go back to my ancestral homeland, but I hear England sucks more than US now	[11:45]
mircea_popescu	if your kid is not smart, but merely autistic, then some hope may exist - but probably in china	[11:46]
mircea_popescu	(for the record, most autistic children misrepresent themselves as smart, and actual smart children as some sort of chtonic horror/chtulhu)	[11:46]
mircea_popescu	yeah, england's not really on the map, unless you wish to join the arab footsoldiers and rape fat ugly chicks for the next decade.	[11:46]
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shinohai	https://i.imgur.com/PBnAnZw.png	[11:52]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/20Z8Tfc )	[11:52]
mircea_popescu	shinohai moslty manufactured by the us "embargo on russia". which so totally hurt putin o noes.	[12:00]
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mircea_popescu	yet the canadians aren't swarming across the border to fucking burn down the dangerous rogue state next door.	[12:00]
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shinohai	lol	[12:02]
mircea_popescu	no but don't you think it's kind-of funny nobody goes "hey, bahamas-the-laureate said embargo will totally hurt russia - it decimated our allies instead. maybe bahamas is just fucking stupid ?"	[12:03]
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PeterL	Who is going to be the first country that openly spurns the US?	[12:04]
mircea_popescu	so far, positive action produced pretty much the least competent us president to date, a few notches below even jefferson davies (and actually very similar in style, too!) who just happens to be a black man.	[12:04]
mircea_popescu	im sure it's ever so glorious being black and having these idiots for "supporters". with such help you really don't need any enemies.	[12:04]
mircea_popescu	PeterL you mean other than pretty much every one there ? from argentina to saudi arabia, take your pick ?	[12:04]
mircea_popescu	and even the retarded canadians... "us posturing precipitated a trade war that just ENDED canada as an industrial nation. wat do ?"	[12:06]
mircea_popescu	"obviously, pretend like nobody could have predicted" "a totally, solid plan mate!"	[12:06]
PeterL	The rest of the world starts ignoring the US, the US pretends they still control everything	[12:08]
mircea_popescu	retarded euros on the other hand... "us posturing precipitated an immigration influx that we reallty can't support. wat do ?" "i dunno, but try to not notice that the us-provided security costs a degree or two of magnitude more than the worst possible case would be without them around"	[12:08]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 44434 @ 0.00056053 = 24.9066 BTC [-]	[12:09]
mircea_popescu	obviously, europe enjoys getting fucked, after so many years of not getting any. but still... money is money. sending washington the bill for the 10mn arabs ?	[12:09]
mircea_popescu	last i heard germany only wanted 5k a head, so it should come out to maybe 50bn or so, not the end of the world	[12:10]
mircea_popescu	(plus wire fees, of course. OUR.)	[12:10]
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davout	lol	[12:15]
mircea_popescu	davout laugh all you want, but you know zee germans are counting those bn against their eu contributions yes ?	[12:16]
mircea_popescu	french farmers that depend on eu money, which is to say french farmers, may not be so amused.	[12:17]
davout	would make sense	[12:17]
mircea_popescu	and to think that if only they had the fucking common sense to allow turkey in (like mp said, back in the day, but hey, why listen to mp when you got politicians et all) would have not only prevented this, but made the whole effort productive instread of merely defensive.	[12:19]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 28100 @ 0.00056875 = 15.9819 BTC [+]	[12:19]
mircea_popescu	PeterL> The rest of the world starts ignoring the US, the US pretends they still control everything << incidentally, the soviets had a very similar delusion going, see komintern etc. it worked about as much as the us thing does, which is to say not at all unless you're either very enamoured with the delusion or otherwise see a ready way to profit from castigating it.	[12:21]
mircea_popescu	most of what the komintern practically did was allow a ready way for people outside of russia to get rid of their inconvenient opponents.	[12:21]
PeterL	I guess my question is: will other countries actively attack the US?	[12:23]
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mircea_popescu	it's a wonder to see it at work, too : consider the case of ross ulbricht. amply retarded kid, did pretty much every stupid thing in the book. yet because he was indicted by the us-komintern, he still has A LOT molre support than would be warranted on the face of things.	[12:23]
mircea_popescu	PeterL attacks are driven by value. if/when someone finds a way to explot it, it will be. so far, it's made relatively safe by its sheer uselessness. which measns that like africa, it will HAVE TO stay dumb to survive.	[12:24]
mircea_popescu	which is what i expect to see.	[12:24]
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mircea_popescu	note that the few people who actually do atm derive value from it, the mexican narcos, do not bother to replace the federal government, just route around it.	[12:25]
mircea_popescu	because it is in fact cheaper to do this than undertake the expense to administer it.	[12:25]
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mircea_popescu	(and no, the notion that the usg has any say in this is preposterous - if the mexican narcos decided to take over, they would take over, and no us president would even deign to EVEN NOTICE that "hey, at some point in the recent past the border was on the river".)	[12:26]
mircea_popescu	but, fortunately for it, the us has nothing to offer. it'd be an active safari grounds for live slaves, if the women weren't generally ugly and universally fat. it is being raided to shit by indian/chinese people for whatever shreds of prestige it may have left, tho from what i hear us diplomas are becoming 2nd rate in beijing these days.	[12:29]
mircea_popescu	what else that anyone could conceivably want is found in the 50 states ?	[12:30]
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PeterL	lots of farm land, mineral resources, space in which to operate factories	[12:31]
mircea_popescu	and yes, i am aware that you're thinking you're decent people, and your friends idem, and you'll toil and labour and this can't all be to waste. the thing you're not aware of is that i have friends like that in say togo. ever heard of togo ? and had friends like that in lebanon years ago, and so on.	[12:31]
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mircea_popescu	PeterL hey, sounds exactly like argentina! tough market.	[12:32]
PeterL	seems to me there is lots of resources here that other people may want to control?	[12:32]
mircea_popescu	maybe.	[12:33]
PeterL	pounds of lard (roughly $USPOP * 300)	[12:33]
mircea_popescu	tough market, you see.	[12:33]
mircea_popescu	who the fuck buys lard.	[12:33]
PeterL	well, the other stuff. lard was joke	[12:34]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 35300 @ 0.0005693 = 20.0963 BTC [+] {2}	[12:42]
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jurov	!t m s.qntr	[12:44]
assbot	[MPEX:S.QNTR] 1D: 0.000476 / 0.0004795 / 0.0004796 (38450 shares, 18.44 BTC), 7D: 0.00039598 / 0.00042659 / 0.0004796 (171352 shares, 73.10 BTC), 30D: 0.00024 / 0.00041828 / 0.0004796 (180994 shares, 75.71 BTC)	[12:44]
jurov	O.o	[12:44]
mircea_popescu	wowza.	[12:47]
mircea_popescu	!up Reydevkiwi	[12:48]
*	assbot gives voice to phf	[12:48]
-assbot-	You voiced Reydevkiwi for 30 minutes.	[12:48]
*	assbot gives voice to Reydevkiwi	[12:48]
phf	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=17-02-2016#1408149 << http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=17-02-2016#1407950	[12:49]
assbot	Logged on 17-02-2016 13:21:37; asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=17-02-2016#1408036 << this is the old, broken version, why is it here ?	[12:49]
assbot	Logged on 17-02-2016 02:44:08; phf: (my press is still broken though, because i want to have all the patches that were ever produced in there, even the conflicting ones, and simply throwing them into a pile seems to not work. i'll figure it out sometime this week)	[12:49]
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asciilifeform	phf: i see the rationale, but you keeping these on www right alongside the working versions, is quite certain to confuse folks.	[12:53]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu, for instance, appears to have mistook it for the current ver	[12:53]
mircea_popescu	i had, because i expected the thing to work in terms of straight url substitution.	[12:53]
mircea_popescu	ie, if patch on ml is X, patch on base is X	[12:53]
asciilifeform	v doesn't do substitutions.	[12:54]
asciilifeform	hand-cranked gardens like mod6's - might	[12:54]
mircea_popescu	myeah	[12:54]
mircea_popescu	i've been thinking about this ever since then	[12:54]
phf	mircea_popescu: there's another patch there that's named differently that does same thing	[12:54]
mircea_popescu	yeah.	[12:55]
asciilifeform	the only thing v does without cranking is to accurately represent longest-chain-signed-by-these-here-folks	[12:55]
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asciilifeform	this is not only deliberate but is implicit in the very idea.	[12:56]
*	assbot gives voice to mthreat	[12:57]
asciilifeform	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=17-02-2016#1408239 << ru getting up off its knees and spitting out the 1990s cock it swallowed during eltsin, would have happened anyway. simply happened to land on obamitler's desk	[12:59]
assbot	Logged on 17-02-2016 14:59:11; mircea_popescu: no but don't you think it's kind-of funny nobody goes "hey, bahamas-the-laureate said embargo will totally hurt russia - it decimated our allies instead. maybe bahamas is just fucking stupid ?"	[12:59]
mircea_popescu	http://archive.is/NXOlk << check out that qntra!	[12:59]
assbot	S.QNTR last 37450@0.00047960 ... ( http://bit.ly/1PQHz8r )	[12:59]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 80911 @ 0.00055927 = 45.2511 BTC [-] {2}	[12:59]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform russia is a minor player.	[12:59]
mircea_popescu	better aligned than the us, tis true, but still a minor player.	[12:59]
asciilifeform	the brzezinski are not concerned with it because it is an economic giant (such as, e.g., cn)	[12:59]
Reydevkiwi	http://www.apple.com/customer-letter/	[13:00]
asciilifeform	but because the most terrifying thing, to the rotten west, is a viable alternate civ.	[13:00]
assbot	Customer Letter - Apple ... ( http://bit.ly/1PQHKk9 )	[13:00]
asciilifeform	^ l0l crapple playing 'good cop'	[13:00]
mircea_popescu	i'm vaguely unsure if it can be called a civ or not.	[13:00]
asciilifeform	saw this in the fishwrap this morning and ignored.	[13:00]
mircea_popescu	care to argue it for me ?	[13:00]
Reydevkiwi	just saw a doc on all the backdoors in apple phone os, then this	[13:01]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: let's try an easier case, e.g., japan	[13:02]
asciilifeform	civ ?	[13:02]
phf	(so to wrap up previous thread, patches will remain, until clicking any patch in that graph produces a press, ideally clicking on one of the patches from mod6 release should produce press identical to mod6's press even in the presence of conflicting patches. i'll solve this problem sometime this week)	[13:02]
mircea_popescu	yes.	[13:02]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: then ru likewise. and with similar caveats.	[13:03]
mircea_popescu	sounds good phf. ftr i dun think there was anything wrong with your thing per se. broke an assumption i made that i still don't well understanbd, so... it counts as a positive.	[13:03]
adlai	adnn aegis ahmedbodi Aleph0 Alopex Anduck Apocalyptic artifexd asciilifeform assbot Azelphur	[13:03]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 22189 @ 0.0005564 = 12.346 BTC [-]	[13:03]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform teh point is made.	[13:03]
mircea_popescu	now, your earlier point notwithstanding, bahamas is still an ineptitude record-setting president, on the level of j. davis. tis not ~by~ the adversity he encounters that you know a man, but IN.	[13:05]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 50550 @ 0.00057065 = 28.8464 BTC [+] {3}	[13:05]
asciilifeform	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=17-02-2016#1408258 << on the other hand, the only reason usa has any spending money at all is the international copyrasty treaty system. if it falls apart, game over. instantly.	[13:05]
assbot	Logged on 17-02-2016 15:17:11; mircea_popescu: PeterL> The rest of the world starts ignoring the US, the US pretends they still control everything << incidentally, the soviets had a very similar delusion going, see komintern etc. it worked about as much as the us thing does, which is to say not at all unless you're either very enamoured with the delusion or otherwise see a ready way to profit from castigating it.	[13:05]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform i would propose this is not so, nobody actually PAYS the us for ip. merely subsidiaries repatriate capital under that guise.	[13:06]
asciilifeform	cn is paying for motherfucking arm cpu license.	[13:06]
mircea_popescu	no, it's the tendency of people to abuse the usd as a temporary replacement for btc, until btc was devised.	[13:06]
mircea_popescu	that's what's propping the whole charade, and well...	[13:06]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform international trade is particularly complex and famously confusing.	[13:06]
asciilifeform	copyrasty is pretty simple to understand. all of the money flows into usa. tribute.	[13:07]
mircea_popescu	let me give you an example : when i was 16, i was paying rent for a place i practically never used, to a married mother of two. who took it in all the holes like a champ, twice a week.	[13:07]
mircea_popescu	for me, it was way the fuck cheaper than to pay the woman for her work. for her, it was an excellent alibi.	[13:07]
mircea_popescu	who's paying who and for what ?	[13:07]
mircea_popescu	tribute ? rly ?	[13:07]
asciilifeform	the answer, as far as i can see, is that usg has the politburo in both cases by the balls, they all have swiss accounts 'which could have problems' if they don't play ball.	[13:09]
mircea_popescu	you should study histopathology more.	[13:09]
asciilifeform	hm?	[13:09]
mircea_popescu	actually i have nfi why it's not required study for syustems people.	[13:09]
asciilifeform	actually my first paying job involved gnarly particulars of immune response	[13:10]
asciilifeform	lulzily.	[13:10]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform it's just... you have no ready model for this particular thing, in your head. it's showing. tissue decays and reacts to its decay in particular manners, which are pointedly not arbitrary.	[13:10]
asciilifeform	but how's this play in	[13:10]
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asciilifeform	actually i have a very clear model of how orcs relate to humans	[13:11]
mircea_popescu	and there's sure as heck no "life power" behind it all, which amusingly is your go-to answer whenever complexity overwhelms.	[13:11]
asciilifeform	~now~ i'm lost	[13:12]
asciilifeform	wtfwut?	[13:12]
mircea_popescu	" is that usg has the politburo in both cases by the balls, they all have swiss accounts 'which could have problems' if they don't play ball." << if we were discussing a tissue sample, this would directly map to "god's life force prevails"	[13:12]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu is telling me that orc chieftains no longer send their children as hostages to the humans ?	[13:14]
mircea_popescu	let me quote for your benefit, a second.	[13:14]
asciilifeform	no longer plan their whole lives with an eye towards retiring in palo alto ?	[13:14]
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mircea_popescu	http://en.yibada.com/articles/95731/20151217/british-court-clears-saudi-millionaire-who-claims-he-tripped-fell-on-teen-accusing-him-of-rape.htm	[13:14]
assbot	British Court Clears Saudi Millionaire Who Claims He Tripped & Fell On Teen Accusing Him Of Rape : News : Yibada ... ( http://bit.ly/1PQJycM )	[13:14]
mircea_popescu	does this sound like much of a hostage to you ?	[13:15]
asciilifeform	saudis had the west, within certain limits, by the balls since '70s	[13:15]
mircea_popescu	your theory doesn't stand.	[13:15]
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*	assbot gives voice to deedbot-	[13:15]
mircea_popescu	and nobody i ever met retires to palo alto. have you EVEN SEEN the place ?	[13:16]
asciilifeform	how not ?	[13:16]
phf	(in other apple is dead not so news, i logged into a developer account in hopes of grabbing xcode dmg's direct instead of going through apple store, and oh boy. what used to be a rather spartan list of downloads, docs, resources has turned into "Click your iPhone app into Apple Store! Anyone can do it!" complete with giant banners of hip womens holding iphones. where's the docs? where's all the shit? literally the only thing you can do	[13:16]
phf	is renew your $99/yr dev license)	[13:16]
mircea_popescu	it's nothing but rats hoping to make it.	[13:16]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: rats orbiting $100M houses of the lottery winners aha	[13:16]
mircea_popescu	phf why the everloving fuck would you pay a license to develop.	[13:16]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform 1990s lottery winners.	[13:17]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: crapple follows the nintendo model, your thing won't even be considered by the censors unless you hold an account	[13:17]
mircea_popescu	back when there was still hope.	[13:17]
mircea_popescu	by the who ?	[13:17]
asciilifeform	the censors.	[13:17]
asciilifeform	who, you know - sign the binary	[13:17]
mircea_popescu	i dun follow ?	[13:17]
mircea_popescu	what ?	[13:17]
mircea_popescu	oh oh this is about putting stuff in the apple store thing is it.	[13:17]
mircea_popescu	yeah i c.	[13:17]
asciilifeform	on ipnohe, the loader only loads signed bins. and the crapplestore only hosts same. i thought this was well known.	[13:18]
asciilifeform	aha.	[13:18]
mircea_popescu	i'm only very marginally following it.	[13:18]
PeterL	trying to get stuff into walled garden, has to go past gate guards	[13:18]
asciilifeform	when i say 'nintendo' this is what it means.	[13:18]
mircea_popescu	why the fuck would you develop for anything but rooted appleware unless apple was paying your salary+benefits is unclear to me.	[13:18]
asciilifeform	the model was pioneered by game console makers.	[13:18]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: lottery	[13:18]
asciilifeform	as per your 'hollywood waitress' article.	[13:18]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform yeah it finally nudged my coin so to speak.	[13:18]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform i get that part, but i meant you as in phf not you as in look what i found on reddit, even has tits.	[13:19]
jurov	mircea_popescu thinks that extracting coins from the wot is easy?	[13:19]
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asciilifeform	iirc ben_vulpes programs for ipnohe.	[13:19]
asciilifeform	all day, every day.	[13:19]
PeterL	if you expect to get rich off $1 sales, you need the garden market, not the few individuals outside it	[13:19]
mircea_popescu	jurov /me thinks that you don't have to pay anything to try.	[13:19]
mircea_popescu	PeterL in other news, eulora sold more game time and made more revenue per game time than pretty much everything in that walled garden. but then again...	[13:20]
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jurov	heh eulora.. depends for whom.	[13:21]
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mircea_popescu	is this factual btw ? are there more people with unrooted apple-things than rooted ?	[13:23]
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mircea_popescu	because it occurs to me - if you really care about alf-considerations re kbd rf, use an ipad.	[13:23]
mats	heh... overheard in palo alto bar shortly after new years: 'so i'm trying to choose between Harvard Law, Stanford Law, and Palantir... what do you think i should do? ;)'	[13:23]
asciilifeform	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=17-02-2016#1408268 << same thing as in su - anything from intact copper pipes, to the five specialists who still know how to make neutron tubes for fissile initiators	[13:23]
assbot	Logged on 17-02-2016 15:26:10; mircea_popescu: what else that anyone could conceivably want is found in the 50 states ?	[13:23]
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PeterL	I assume so, most iphnoe owners are lazy, right?	[13:23]
jurov	hahahahaha of course majority leaves it unrooted	[13:23]
mircea_popescu	really ?	[13:23]
mircea_popescu	why the fuck ?!	[13:23]
mats	palo alto sucks, can confirm	[13:23]
jurov	even i could not be arsed to mess with moms ipad	[13:23]
jurov	web works, email works, so why root	[13:24]
asciilifeform	mats: sucks for plebe. but have you tried having $1B there ?	[13:24]
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PeterL	my grandparents lived in Palo Alto for a while, that is where my dad went to high school (back in the 60's)	[13:24]
mircea_popescu	i shall now be quiet while alf, who has never set foot in california, proceeds to explain to people who live there how the place is.	[13:24]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: 'rooting' ipnohe is complicated. not in the sense of 'how to do it', it is braindamagedly easy. BUT you have to run a multi-MB closed turd. which installs ???????.	[13:24]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform explain this have to ?	[13:25]
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asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: unless you want to discover your own pwnhole	[13:25]
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mircea_popescu	iirc the whole thing was os.	[13:25]
asciilifeform	which tends to take a while.	[13:25]
deedbot-	[Qntra] US Marshalls Join Student Debt Collection Racket - http://qntra.net/2016/02/us-marshalls-join-student-debt-collection-racket/	[13:25]
jurov	and there's qntra. phf, say, if you write the why and how of V, you'll surely recoup the $99 several times.	[13:25]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: gotta find exploit in the firmware (typically, the bootloader, if you want the 'rooting' to persist across power cycles)	[13:25]
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mircea_popescu	asciilifeform i admittedly have no clue, but i'd have expected the golden route is to simply replace the blessed chip of blessings with normal item.	[13:26]
jurov	hahahahaha if the damned things could be even sanely opened	[13:27]
PeterL	and you think average joe is going to replace a chip on his expensive phone?	[13:27]
mircea_popescu	jurov it's traditionally hoiw rthis insanity is defeated, dunno	[13:27]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: there is not a 'normal item'	[13:27]
asciilifeform	there is a massive multi-GB bolus of shit	[13:27]
mircea_popescu	PeterL a) phone is free with carrier bill is it not ? huge incentive - get out of 3k in payments ; b) usually specialist shops do it.	[13:28]
asciilifeform	with metastasis throughout	[13:28]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: we are NOT speaking of 'unlocking'	[13:28]
asciilifeform	entirely separate matter	[13:28]
mircea_popescu	well, fwiw i find the conversation very instructive.	[13:28]
asciilifeform	(apple only sells unlocked phones, for some time now)	[13:28]
mircea_popescu	aha	[13:28]
jurov	hahahahaha apple specialists are trained to either replace device or exchange for coupons to newe shinier one	[13:28]
mircea_popescu	jurov not apple-specialist. independent-specialist.	[13:29]
mircea_popescu	speaking of nintendo, i recall a thriving mod chip industree just about the time the bulgarians were taking over cd pressing.	[13:29]
phf	there was a project for os replacements back in 3g days, back when you could still conceivably load your own blob as an os, and expect it to do ~something~	[13:29]
jurov	have you caught the recent update problems? get non-original part, get bricked on next update	[13:29]
mircea_popescu	jurov seems like a great incentive to take the crap out altogether.	[13:29]
asciilifeform	we were speaking of 'jailbreak'	[13:29]
mircea_popescu	what is this "update"	[13:29]
asciilifeform	entirely separate process	[13:29]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: what do you mean 'take the crap out'	[13:30]
jurov	^	[13:30]
mircea_popescu	make it be the lousy pentium-2 it was born to be ?	[13:30]
jurov	even capbles have proprietary chips	[13:30]
jurov	*cables	[13:30]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: obtain and open an 'ipnohe'	[13:30]
asciilifeform	more instructive than 1,001 lines from me explaining.	[13:30]
jurov	^	[13:30]
asciilifeform	you will find a SINGLE ic, and a good chunk of the crapolade is in mask rom.	[13:31]
mircea_popescu	i guess ima have to.	[13:31]
trinque	at least in android's case there's something of a linux down there you can get to without back-alley surgery	[13:31]
asciilifeform	https://www.ifixit.com/Teardown/iPhone+6+Teardown/29213 << or this	[13:31]
assbot	iPhone 6 Teardown - iFixit ... ( http://bit.ly/1Ql5LFr )	[13:31]
mircea_popescu	next time babe goes into the bath with her phone in hand, ima look into the damned thing i guess.	[13:31]
asciilifeform	https://d3nevzfk7ii3be.cloudfront.net/igi/F5NPpFSfDkF5NfPW.huge << the fat one	[13:31]
*	mircea_popescu clicks	[13:31]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1Ql5MsZ )	[13:31]
mircea_popescu	is iphone 6 the current ?	[13:32]
asciilifeform	(there is also a nand flash on there, some power supply crud, and the baseband)	[13:32]
asciilifeform	aha.	[13:32]
asciilifeform	the teardown www has chip ids, links.	[13:32]
mircea_popescu	this thing looks basically like laptop ++	[13:33]
asciilifeform	also note that they are all bga	[13:33]
asciilifeform	i.e. not removable without ir oven and not remountable without xray.	[13:33]
mircea_popescu	aha.	[13:33]
asciilifeform	uneconomic to actually do anything at all with these.	[13:33]
mircea_popescu	they'd have to be tho. space.	[13:34]
asciilifeform	aha.	[13:34]
asciilifeform	also starting with, iirc, ipnohe 5, the cpu is custom crapple asic (licensed arm) and has the various 'seek00rity' crud in mask rom.	[13:35]
*	assbot gives voice to BingoBoingo	[13:35]
BingoBoingo	;;later tell hdbuck You got published again!	[13:35]
gribble	The operation succeeded.	[13:35]
asciilifeform	to 'jailbreak', you normally have to discover one of the handful of bugs planted for usg use.	[13:35]
asciilifeform	these are precious and hoarded.	[13:35]
mircea_popescu	"pentalobe"	[13:35]
mircea_popescu	wtf is wrong with people already.	[13:36]
BingoBoingo	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=17-02-2016#1408301 << cool	[13:36]
assbot	Logged on 17-02-2016 15:55:21; mircea_popescu: http://archive.is/NXOlk << check out that qntra!	[13:36]
phf	also ftr i've never had a paid license. even without it developer.apple.com used to have all kinds of goodies. source code for all their opensource parts, legacy software, old version of xcode, various specialist tools for debugging, etc.	[13:36]
BingoBoingo	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=17-02-2016#1408314 << Newton, the actual apple pocketable or heretic iThing	[13:37]
assbot	Logged on 17-02-2016 15:57:31; Reydevkiwi: just saw a doc on all the backdoors in apple phone os, then this	[13:37]
PeterL	according to Forbes, roughtly 2% of ios are jailbroken (data vintage Feb 2013)	[13:37]
asciilifeform	BingoBoingo: 'newton' has been dead and buried since the re-enthronement of steve jobs	[13:37]
asciilifeform	surely you knew this.	[13:37]
BingoBoingo	asciilifeform: Who was Jobs to curate my Apple/Crapple filter?	[13:38]
mircea_popescu	"Apple A8 APL1011 SoC + SK Hynix RAM as denoted by the markings H9CKNNN8KTMRWR-NTH (we presume it is 1 GB LPDDR3 RAM, the same as in the iPhone 6 Plus) ; Qualcomm MDM9625M LTE Modem ; Skyworks 77802-23 Low Band LTE PAD ; Avago A8020 High Band PAD ; Avago A8010 Ultra High Band PA + FBARs ; Skyworks 77803-20 Mid Band LTE PAD ; InvenSense MP67B 6-axis Gyroscope and Accelerometer Combo"	[13:38]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 43600 @ 0.00056711 = 24.726 BTC [-] {2}	[13:39]
mircea_popescu	and a coupla dozen more. wut a soup.	[13:39]
jurov	not yer old pentium fo sho	[13:39]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: they quit making carrier-specific version, so yes, it has ~every~ modem.	[13:40]
mircea_popescu	funny how space is not a consideration there lol.	[13:40]
asciilifeform	it ~is~ a consideration, in each new release they merge a few of the ic into one.	[13:40]
asciilifeform	the mainboard used to actually occupy the footprint of the phone	[13:40]
asciilifeform	now it is this matchbox thing	[13:41]
mircea_popescu	ic.	[13:41]
asciilifeform	i expect that at some point it will be fused with the lcd glass	[13:41]
asciilifeform	and the chips - be purchased die-only	[13:41]
asciilifeform	(you can get ~most~ ic in die-only package)	[13:41]
mircea_popescu	packaging even as bga is spurious in the constraints	[13:41]
asciilifeform	aha, only done because economics-of-scale, as in, samsung sells not only to crapple	[13:42]
asciilifeform	but when whole thing becomes 1 asic - no need for bga.	[13:42]
mircea_popescu	yea. hence "normal" chip.	[13:42]
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asciilifeform	but the only 'normal chip' in there is the nand. and possibly the gyro.	[13:42]
asciilifeform	everything else is custom at least in the metallization layer sense	[13:42]
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mircea_popescu	so in other words, the results of this discussion are - that apple isn't there yet, but it'd love to pretend like it is, and lazy general usian population / anti-entrepreneurial spirited usian elite will concede the point ot them.	[13:43]
asciilifeform	where there	[13:43]
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mircea_popescu	asciilifeform if "samsung sells not only to crapple", thus therefore the normal chip can be had.	[13:43]
asciilifeform	and do what, exactly ?	[13:43]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform there. "you can't get in".	[13:43]
asciilifeform	thing is, you ~can~ break it, this is done by 1,000,001 folks.	[13:44]
asciilifeform	by running one of the heavily obfuscated auto-jailbreakatrons.	[13:44]
mircea_popescu	that is unrelated to our discussion, why do you keep reintroducing it "?	[13:44]
mircea_popescu	"saudi woman can drive a car - by driving a model car in the garage!!1"	[13:44]
asciilifeform	am i mistaken re: what the discussion even was ?	[13:44]
mircea_popescu	wut ?	[13:44]
asciilifeform	say i replace apple's cpu with samsung's hypothetical pin-compatible one. now what ?	[13:45]
asciilifeform	i run openbsd ?	[13:45]
mircea_popescu	to me it was "take apple out of the apple product".	[13:45]
mircea_popescu	well no, i'd expect you to run musl-os	[13:45]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu understands that nobody buys the motherfucking phone for the hardware, right ?	[13:45]
asciilifeform	on touch screen ? who wants to write the gui ? mircea_popescu ?	[13:45]
mircea_popescu	i don't care about apple products altogether.	[13:46]
asciilifeform	the 'open sores' world wasn't even able to cough up a mouse gui that didn't trigger anaphylactic shock in half the users	[13:46]
asciilifeform	much less touchatron.	[13:46]
mircea_popescu	" lazy general usian population / anti-entrepreneurial spirited usian elite will concede the point ot them."	[13:46]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: my point was that if you wanted to make own touchatronic os, it would be considerably cheaper to use a handset from another vendor.	[13:47]
asciilifeform	using crapple's would be masochism, plain and simple	[13:47]
mircea_popescu	this does not bode well for apple's market value, if true.	[13:47]
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asciilifeform	the market value, such as it is, is 100% from the software.	[13:47]
mircea_popescu	not the apple store ?!	[13:47]
asciilifeform	'app store'	[13:48]
asciilifeform	and os.	[13:48]
mircea_popescu	lmao.	[13:48]
mircea_popescu	til apple worth ~= slashdot.	[13:48]
mircea_popescu	have you EVEN SEEN the appstore ?	[13:48]
asciilifeform	and believe or not, folks ~like~ the censorship. in the sense that there are no public infectors, in the usual sense, for crapple ipnohe.	[13:48]
mircea_popescu	i thought theres one a week.	[13:49]
asciilifeform	and yes, this is achieved at the cost of apps not having any access to the file system, etc.	[13:49]
asciilifeform	nope.	[13:49]
asciilifeform	not one. ever. (nsa aside)	[13:49]
asciilifeform	malicious app can only try to trick the user into revealing secret. it cannot, e.g., access the file system (you are not permitted fopen() ... )	[13:49]
mircea_popescu	http://www.abc.es/tecnologia/informatica-software/20150921/abci-apple-malware-appstore-201509211937.html	[13:49]
mircea_popescu	must be because in spanish then.	[13:49]
assbot	Apple confirma la existencia de «malware» en la Apple Store ... ( http://bit.ly/1WrJ9S9 )	[13:50]
asciilifeform	very loose notion of 'malware'	[13:50]
asciilifeform	for instance, one can write a proggy that tracks your location and uploads.	[13:50]
asciilifeform	or shows a trojanatronic 'gmail' login screen and waits for idiot to enter pw. etc	[13:50]
mircea_popescu	but not one that rowhammers the fuck out of it ?	[13:50]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: not publicly.	[13:50]
mircea_popescu	pff.	[13:51]
asciilifeform	understand, this is largely a testament to the sheer nintendoism of the os	[13:51]
mircea_popescu	encapsulation is a dream. you know that. what exactly activates your memory hole to think that apple "done it" ? usg perfume ? what is it ?	[13:51]
asciilifeform	rather than any civilized concept of security	[13:51]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: the fact that jailbreaking is a thing reveals that apple has not 'done it'	[13:52]
mircea_popescu	i never heard of retardation being an effectual preemptor of infection.	[13:52]
asciilifeform	just that the 0days are few and carefully hoarded by aficionados.	[13:52]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform yet you try and sit as if it had ?	[13:52]
mircea_popescu	purely aesthetic choice, this.	[13:52]
asciilifeform	when they leak out, are typically patched in a few days	[13:52]
asciilifeform	and then any jailbreak aficionado who has the misfortune to powercycle his box, is fucked	[13:53]
mircea_popescu	why don't you say "clearly nobody gives a shit about apple or its products - so few vulnerabilities they can almost chase them all down"	[13:53]
mircea_popescu	you DID say the exact this re qntra and ddos yest.	[13:53]
mircea_popescu	why the specific choice ?	[13:53]
asciilifeform	i admit that my crappleology is a few yrs out of date.	[13:54]
asciilifeform	perhaps something changed substantially in recent history.	[13:54]
mircea_popescu	could just as well be presented the other way around, you know ? if you're going to assign good/bad arbitrarily, might as well allign the needle backwards.	[13:54]
asciilifeform	will have to find out, what. when i can be arsed.	[13:54]
mircea_popescu	no, this has absolutely nothing to do with any finding out. it is not a matter of fact.	[13:54]
asciilifeform	hm?	[13:55]
mircea_popescu	when republican instrument succeeded in keeping enemies at bay, you credited lack of interest on the part of the enemies.	[13:55]
mircea_popescu	when imperial instrument succeeded in keeping enemies at bay, you credited the exquisite intrinsic superiority of imperial instrument.	[13:55]
mircea_popescu	you COULD, for the same money, put these in backwards.	[13:55]
mircea_popescu	it is a purely aesthetic choice. you realise this ?	[13:55]
asciilifeform	not precisely. re: qntra, i specifically think that the 'they don't exist, don't look there, nothing to see' field generator is operating so well, that they no longer see any need to draw attention with ddos.	[13:55]
mircea_popescu	going into detail does not change the above.	[13:56]
asciilifeform	well, i can identify who gives a fuck re: pwning crapple users - 1,000,001 orc carder monkeys, for instance	[13:56]
asciilifeform	there is actual monetization there.	[13:56]
asciilifeform	now orc monkeys are not the sharpest tools in the shed, true - have you ~seen~ a trojan of recent vintage? 19/20 are in vb	[13:57]
asciilifeform	and multi-MB. etc	[13:57]
mircea_popescu	so ?	[13:58]
mircea_popescu	i suppose the one neutral construction here would be that the larger the item under discussion, the more likely you are to credit ability and the less likely to credit happenstance, on the expectation that size and competency correlate.	[13:59]
mircea_popescu	still.. a useful judgement of "size" in this particular sense is very hard to come by.	[13:59]
mircea_popescu	for instance, my own sizeometer judges apple as relatively small.	[13:59]
asciilifeform	in the same sense as north kr is small.	[14:00]
asciilifeform	for the folks inside - it is very large indeed.	[14:00]
asciilifeform	whole world.	[14:00]
asciilifeform	(to them!)	[14:00]
mircea_popescu	world made of worlds made of worlds!	[14:00]
mircea_popescu	it's turworlds all the way down.	[14:00]
asciilifeform	https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wide_is_My_Motherland << oblig	[14:01]
assbot	Wide is My Motherland - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ... ( http://bit.ly/1oJZpmU )	[14:01]
*	asciilifeform had no idea engl. pediwik existed for this	[14:01]
mircea_popescu	note in any case that while the logic is correct, " on the expectation that size and competency correlate", it is NOT the case that what is meant by size is what'd intuitively appear.	[14:01]
mircea_popescu	this is an important point	[14:01]
asciilifeform	i realized that i actually have nfi what mircea_popescu's size metric is here	[14:02]
mircea_popescu	much to my chagrin, neither do i. it is at best an experience-bound heuristic atm.	[14:02]
mircea_popescu	shall have to think on this.	[14:03]
asciilifeform	but yes, to perelman ~all of computing~ is 'tiny'	[14:03]
asciilifeform	because he doesn't own a computer.	[14:03]
asciilifeform	nor wants to.	[14:03]
mircea_popescu	not at all what's contemplated here.	[14:03]
asciilifeform	this is a hilarious reversal of the old classic thread between asciilifeform and mircea_popescu re: 'programming == webdev'	[14:04]
mircea_popescu	something intuitively comprehensible as more akin the german-pioneered "tank shadow" item. whereby a unit was represented as a blob function of both its strength/battle readiness and it's mobility.	[14:04]
mircea_popescu	so a small elite unit was capable of projecting a long shadow whereas a churned to death rifle unit from a siege emplacement was a mere dot.	[14:04]
asciilifeform	^ the notion is well-known to city architects, as the concept of car space	[14:04]
mircea_popescu	right	[14:04]
asciilifeform	(car occupies far more than the size of the parking spot)	[14:04]
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mircea_popescu	sorta like "size in the mind of the strategist". clean, elite units loom large. complex, large elucubrations are barely noted.	[14:05]
asciilifeform	hence why i always said to mircea_popescu, 'webdev is insignificant worm and webdevers are not programmers'	[14:06]
mircea_popescu	i shall be off to eat a lot of cake and meditate.	[14:06]
asciilifeform	enjoy mircea_popescu !	[14:06]
asciilifeform	i'ma off to drink motor oil coffee, eat shit, and crank out useless crud for money	[14:06]
BingoBoingo	;;ticker --market all	[14:13]
gribble	Bitstamp BTCUSD last: 418.94, vol: 10174.76136276 \| BTC-E BTCUSD last: 419.195, vol: 10046.97394 \| Bitfinex BTCUSD last: 417.61, vol: 24588.7767113 \| CampBX BTCUSD last: 412.0, vol: 2.09408999 \| BTCChina BTCUSD last: 427.567497, vol: 45284.49820000 \| Kraken BTCUSD last: 416.61983, vol: 1147.12907435 \| Bitcoin-Central BTCUSD last: 422.19486, vol: 76.19484017 \| Volume-weighted last (1 more message)	[14:13]
BingoBoingo	;;more	[14:13]
gribble	average: 422.861605721	[14:13]
*	aegis is now known as aeg1s	[14:13]
deedbot-	[BitBet Bets Bets] 1.00056657 BTC on 'Yes' - Bitcoin to top $600 before Jul 2016 - http://bitbet.us/bet/1232/bitcoin-to-top-600-before-jul-2016/#b32	[14:13]
*	aeg1s is now known as aegis	[14:13]
*	aegis is now known as aeg1s	[14:14]
*	aeg1s is now known as aegis	[14:15]
BingoBoingo	https://archive.is/iaSEu << lulz an anti-qntra writes glowing review of another anti-qntra	[14:21]
assbot	What's Next For CoinDesk? - CCN: Financial Bitcoin & Cryptocurrency News ... ( http://bit.ly/1oK2O4U )	[14:21]
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BingoBoingo	hanbot: That's actually a serious problem. Being excited about things for their "product" -ness and not that part where they are useful as things.	[14:34]
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phf	The satisfaction that no longer comes from using the commodities produced in abundance is now sought through recognition of their value as commodities. Consumers are filled with religious fervor for the sovereign freedom of commodities whose use has become an end in itself. Waves of enthusiasm for particular products are propagated by all the communications media. [...] Reified people proudly display the proofs of their intimacy with	[14:37]
phf	the commodity. Like the old religious fetishism, with its convulsionary raptures and miraculous cures, the fetishism of commodities generates its own moments of fervent arousal. All this is useful for only one purpose: producing habitual submission.	[14:38]
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phf	debord wrote this in 67, he then wrote an update in the 80s, "everything has gotten even worse then i expected", promptly shooting himself	[14:41]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 160300 @ 0.0005717 = 91.6435 BTC [+] {6}	[14:45]
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BingoBoingo	"Re: recent node drop, someone is using up connection slots with fake SPV nodes; node count sites may be reporting nodes as down incorrectly." https://twitter.com/petertoddbtc/status/699919824416284672	[14:54]
asciilifeform	let ten thousand sybils bloom.	[14:57]
asciilifeform	and the heathens who never heard of malleus can talk to them to their heart's delight.	[14:58]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 42600 @ 0.00056978 = 24.2726 BTC [-] {2}	[15:01]
BingoBoingo	asciilifeform: In this case SPV is being used to describe garden variety pseudonode	[15:02]
BingoBoingo	Not Hearnia blasphemy	[15:02]
BingoBoingo	Dumb repeater SPV, not blind follower SPV	[15:03]
BingoBoingo	AWS banhammer is far more relevant in this case	[15:04]
BingoBoingo	asciilifeform: Since July "SPV" in power ranger and other usage has gone from describing a specific class of idiocy to describing a more general class of turds.	[15:07]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 299687 @ 0.00057281 = 171.6637 BTC [+] {8}	[15:08]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 53500 @ 0.00056765 = 30.3693 BTC [-]	[15:13]
BingoBoingo	Oh, no this was tradition bitcoinj SPV turd https://www.reddit.com/r/btc/comments/467oat/sudden_appearance_of_bitcoinj_nodes/	[15:17]
assbot	Sudden appearance of /bitcoinj nodes? : btc ... ( http://bit.ly/1oKcWe8 )	[15:17]
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asciilifeform	l0l, hearn's magnum opus	[15:25]
mircea_popescu	bingoBoingo> "Re: recent node drop, someone is using up connection slots with fake SPV nodes; node count sites may be << o look at that, derpland discovers blackholing.	[15:26]
BingoBoingo	Bunch of lite "wallets" all running in AWS	[15:26]
mircea_popescu	debord wrote this in 67 << aha.	[15:27]
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asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: how was the caek ?	[15:28]
mircea_popescu	the caek produced the conclusion that there is nothing useful here - the heuristic value of a concept of "size" in evaluating the matter wholly comes from the evaluation that had been already pre-baked in the "size".	[15:29]
*	asciilifeform suspected!	[15:29]
asciilifeform	BingoBoingo: one way or another, folks will learn to respect the 'give nothing to stranger for showing up' theorem.	[15:32]
BingoBoingo	eventually	[15:32]
asciilifeform	whether in application to servers, or hordes of migrants, or wherever else.	[15:32]
mircea_popescu	i have no problem giving food and water to wandering females.	[15:33]
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asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: but not female rats.	[15:34]
asciilifeform	as for travellers, when the known world was a cold and empty place, and wolves outnumbered wanderers 9000 to 1, etc. - it was a different thing.	[15:35]
BingoBoingo	Or the female to mayo transgenders	[15:35]
asciilifeform	whereas today all vermin own teleporters and will appear directly at your front door, if you feed one.	[15:35]
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mircea_popescu	heh.	[15:35]
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asciilifeform	one of the reasons i wrote 'g' (which remains unreleasable, ty mircea_popescu for the block cipher lulz, aha) is that the public node is not a sustainable thing.	[15:36]
asciilifeform	really not so long for this world.	[15:36]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 96700 @ 0.00057322 = 55.4304 BTC [+] {2}	[15:36]
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mircea_popescu	in other news, my mint is blooming.	[15:42]
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BingoBoingo	Cool. My daffodils survived last week's snows with leaves intact. Mininal brown on the tips.	[15:44]
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mircea_popescu	win.	[15:45]
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BingoBoingo	Hyacinths are more uncertain, but still lots of green. Tulip status unknown, likely many were consumed by squirrels.	[15:46]
ben_vulpes	ohai	[15:46]
BingoBoingo	hai thur	[15:46]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10400 @ 0.00057332 = 5.9625 BTC [+]	[15:47]
*	ben_vulpes looking forward to new and exciting bouncer failure modes	[15:47]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 73400 @ 0.00057336 = 42.0846 BTC [+] {3}	[15:55]
deedbot-	[Qntra] Auschwitz Releases Political Language Software - http://qntra.net/2016/02/auschwitz-releases-political-language-software/	[15:57]
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asciilifeform	ahahaha the poles	[15:58]
asciilifeform	the folks who burned all the jews they could long before germany so much as asked	[15:59]
asciilifeform	(the baltics were even more prolific champs)	[15:59]
BingoBoingo	But POLITICS!!!	[16:00]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 41100 @ 0.00056752 = 23.3251 BTC [-] {2}	[16:14]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 46200 @ 0.00057342 = 26.492 BTC [+]	[16:17]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16007 @ 0.00057342 = 9.1787 BTC [+]	[16:25]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 36293 @ 0.00057402 = 20.8329 BTC [+] {2}	[16:26]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 36100 @ 0.00056623 = 20.4409 BTC [-] {2}	[16:40]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 39435 @ 0.00056996 = 22.4764 BTC [+]	[16:55]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 37365 @ 0.00057403 = 21.4486 BTC [+]	[16:56]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 256082 @ 0.00056446 = 144.548 BTC [-] {5}	[17:13]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15743 @ 0.00056808 = 8.9433 BTC [+]	[17:23]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 24658 @ 0.00056223 = 13.8635 BTC [-]	[17:29]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 123239 @ 0.00056685 = 69.858 BTC [+] {4}	[17:30]
asciilifeform	;;later tell mircea_popescu http://milandr.ru << can source any of this? or vapour, like elbrus ?	[17:53]
gribble	The operation succeeded.	[17:53]
assbot	Home − Milandr ... ( http://bit.ly/1QJB9rr )	[17:53]
asciilifeform	http://zeptobars.com/en/read/1645RT2U-milandr-radhard-antifuse-rom << die shot.	[17:53]
assbot	1645RT2U - Milandr radhard antifuse ROM : weekend die-shot : ZeptoBars ... ( http://bit.ly/1QJBb2G )	[17:53]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6792 @ 0.00057403 = 3.8988 BTC [+]	[17:55]
asciilifeform	http://adamsblog.aperturelabs.com/2013/01/fun-with-masked-roms.html << related.	[17:57]
assbot	Obviously a Major Malfunction...: Fun with Masked ROMs - Atmel MARC4 ... ( http://bit.ly/1QJBHgX )	[17:57]
asciilifeform	^ much pr0n	[17:57]
asciilifeform	^ proggy that reads mask rom ~optically~	[17:57]
jurov	only 250k chips needed to store blockchain	[17:57]
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asciilifeform	jurov: these likes are from my recent attempt to locate a modern supplier of antifuse rom of reasonable density	[17:59]
asciilifeform	*these links	[17:59]
jurov	yep, spiffy pics	[17:59]
trinque	for cardano ROM?	[17:59]
asciilifeform	trinque: nope	[17:59]
asciilifeform	for blockchain.	[17:59]
asciilifeform	recent discovery is that nand flash slowly self-erases from ~reading~	[18:00]
asciilifeform	which opens up a rowhammer-like attack vector.	[18:00]
asciilifeform	(i can't recall if this was public, but IT IS NOW!111)	[18:00]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform seems even more vapor.	[18:00]
trinque	that's fun; meanwhile platters are practically unusable for it	[18:00]
mircea_popescu	if that were possible	[18:00]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: quite possible, try it	[18:01]
asciilifeform	needs crafted seek pattern.	[18:01]
mircea_popescu	no i meant - if something being more vapor than elbrus were possible	[18:01]
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asciilifeform	ah!	[18:01]
mircea_popescu	also - there's a reason ssd in raid.	[18:02]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: raid doesn't help.	[18:02]
asciilifeform	in this case.	[18:02]
asciilifeform	(it could, conveivably, be made to)	[18:02]
mircea_popescu	which kind of raid doesn't help ?	[18:03]
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asciilifeform	any of the off-the-shelf ones, as far as i can tell	[18:03]
asciilifeform	or rather, raid5 will prevent the machine from coughing up corrupted blocks, but enemy can still drive you into penury by inducing wear	[18:04]
asciilifeform	blocks really oughta live on storage that doesn't measurably wear. luckily this was invented in the '70s, and is called antifuse rom.	[18:05]
asciilifeform	but as far as i can tell, it is no longer manufactured in any serious quantity.	[18:05]
mircea_popescu	aha. well... blocks from 0 to n-1 at any rate.	[18:05]
asciilifeform	all blocks.	[18:05]
asciilifeform	remember, antifuse isn't mask rom	[18:05]
asciilifeform	doesn't need to be pre-baked at tapeout	[18:05]
mircea_popescu	yeah but you don't want to keep changing things either	[18:05]
asciilifeform	last thing i will say for now on subj is - expect many more 'rowhammer'-like effects as desperate wunderwaffen attempts to resuscitate 'moore's law' explore new depths of fuhrerbunker desperation.	[18:07]
asciilifeform	http://joshuawise.com/projects/ndfslave << for anyone who wondered how 'wear leveling' worked.	[18:08]
assbot	Reverse Engineering a NAND Flash Device Management Algorithm \| Joshua Wise's domain ... ( http://bit.ly/1QJDjHI )	[18:08]
mircea_popescu	heh.	[18:09]
asciilifeform	oh one other thing, blocks really ought to live on a storage device where connecting tx outputs is a constant-time operation.	[18:10]
asciilifeform	this is buildable.	[18:10]
asciilifeform	(left as an exercise for the reader, how.)	[18:10]
mircea_popescu	next you're gonna want ring buffers or who knows what heresy	[18:10]
asciilifeform	hey i specialize in uselessly predicting crapocalypses years before they happen.	[18:11]
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asciilifeform	(the folks who laughed when i said 'no curl on trb build box' - still laughing ?)	[18:11]
asciilifeform	!s parachute	[18:12]
assbot	120 results for 'parachute' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=parachute	[18:12]
mircea_popescu	you can take curl from my cold dead hands or how was it	[18:12]
asciilifeform	i thought that was perl	[18:12]
mircea_popescu	no, it was symbolic notation.	[18:13]
asciilifeform	ah l0l	[18:13]
mircea_popescu	same diff-erence.	[18:13]
*	asciilifeform falls down.	[18:13]
mircea_popescu	:D	[18:13]
*	asciilifeform made the mistake of looking at yesterday's reddit thread. barfalicious.	[18:14]
asciilifeform	apparently peanut gallery holds mircea_popescu responsible (somehow) for... gox	[18:14]
asciilifeform	and 1,001 like marvels.	[18:15]
mircea_popescu	lmao.	[18:15]
mircea_popescu	it's not any sort of gallery. organised disinfo effort trying to take "mp said mtgox must die, bitcoin communitwerps opposed it, got beaten to shit over it" into its reverse.	[18:15]
asciilifeform	not sure what came after that, it was when i quit reading	[18:15]
mircea_popescu	this is plainly how you know who was behind upkeeping the scam,	[18:15]
mircea_popescu	and how badly the butt hurt once i fucked them raw.	[18:15]
asciilifeform	btw gox is one possible candidate for 'did they ever fire the glass cannon' ?	[18:16]
asciilifeform	the glibc one or otherwise	[18:16]
mircea_popescu	but, as any rapist knows, the best thing for that trade is a ready supply of victims who will deny the deed. "i was never raped!11"	[18:16]
asciilifeform	there was a spiffy mircea_popescu article where he discusses how victim with no recourse internally re-wires itself	[18:17]
mircea_popescu	aha.	[18:17]
asciilifeform	afaik all literate folk know about, e.g., the auschwitz inmates who collected scraps of german uniforms, etc.	[18:17]
asciilifeform	the other lul from the thread was the people (?) vigorously denying that a unix box could run without ever invoking dns	[18:19]
asciilifeform	(perhaps only funny to me?)	[18:19]
trinque	how do you know who you are if nobody tells you?	[18:20]
asciilifeform	waiwut	[18:21]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform re ip.	[18:21]
mircea_popescu	it's a deeply telling thing. THEY don't know what the fuck they are by themselves. why would a box.	[18:21]
trinque	^	[18:21]
mircea_popescu	surely computers can't be better than hoomans ?	[18:22]
mircea_popescu	can't even beat hoomans at go!	[18:22]
mircea_popescu	GOOOOO TEAM!	[18:22]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 74532 @ 0.00057427 = 42.8015 BTC [+] {3}	[18:22]
*	dbclk has quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)	[18:23]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3368 @ 0.00057438 = 1.9345 BTC [+]	[18:23]
asciilifeform	i think that a more elementary thing is at work - these folks literally can't imagine a box other than 'ubuntu', rathead, etc. with 'autoupdater' and the like	[18:23]
mircea_popescu	box gotta read the lolpics each morning.	[18:24]
asciilifeform	consider, for instance, the anon who 'who'll be laughing when peter todd changes hosting providers'	[18:24]
mircea_popescu	the who ?	[18:24]
asciilifeform	actually thought, or pretended to, that we hardcoded the idiot sipa seed thing	[18:24]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: some monkey in the reddit thread	[18:25]
mircea_popescu	sipa!=peter todd ?	[18:25]
mircea_popescu	sipa is the wuille derp	[18:25]
asciilifeform	yes (though this was not even the main lul)	[18:25]
mircea_popescu	iirc bluematt had some sort of stupid thing to help the network lie about how connected it is	[18:25]
mircea_popescu	you mean that ?	[18:25]
mircea_popescu	(he's neither of these two)	[18:25]
asciilifeform	nfi	[18:26]
mircea_popescu	iirc he also turned it off when he realised it's actually bad for bitcoin.	[18:26]
asciilifeform	but point was, i bet monkey cannot actually conceive of the 'no hardcoded seed thing'	[18:26]
mircea_popescu	like everything else -dev does, but that realisation hasn't mostly struck yet.	[18:26]
asciilifeform	because this is a technology that only makes sense in wot planet	[18:26]
mircea_popescu	well sure. we're agreeing with you there.	[18:26]
mircea_popescu	(we = me and trinque )	[18:26]
*	asciilifeform strongly suspects that the very notion of ~identity~ is Ur-terrifying to monkey man	[18:27]
mircea_popescu	quite the point.	[18:28]
mircea_popescu	humans are built upon identity. mooman's delusions of humanity are built on the perceived or constructed impossibility of identity.	[18:28]
mircea_popescu	which is why all the derpage around anonimity, as if it were a thing.	[18:28]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 37000 @ 0.00057474 = 21.2654 BTC [+] {2}	[18:39]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 63261 @ 0.00057171 = 36.1669 BTC [-]	[18:52]
*	HostFat (~HostFat@2-235-224-2.ip230.fastwebnet.it) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[18:55]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 27450 @ 0.0005699 = 15.6438 BTC [-]	[19:02]
*	rdponticelli (~quassel@ns1.puan.com.ar) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[19:05]
*	rdponticelli (~quassel@ns1.puan.com.ar) has left #bitcoin-assets	[19:06]
*	Reydev has quit (Quit: Nettalk6 - www.ntalk.de)	[19:08]
mircea_popescu	;;google 1FundZy7m7b8begbh9haCguKJcAdFopRJ9	[19:10]
gribble	Bitcoin address 1FundZy7m7b8begbh9haCguKJcAdFopRJ9 ...: ; Introducing A New Bitcoin Foundation \| Qntra: ; The Treasurer's Contract - The Bitcoin Foundation:	[19:10]
mircea_popescu	check it out - blockchain.info lost google spot.	[19:10]
mircea_popescu	trinque there's something very weird going on with deedbot.org ? can you help me locate http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=15-01-2016#1371189 for instance ?	[19:16]
assbot	Logged on 15-01-2016 15:27:59; mircea_popescu: deedbot- http://dpaste.com/1JCZHZY.txt	[19:16]
*	aegis has quit (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)	[19:16]
trinque	mircea_popescu: know what that might've been? dpaste garbage collected it	[19:18]
trinque	I'll see if I can find what block happened near there	[19:18]
mircea_popescu	trinque it was the dividends for mpoe and bbet	[19:22]
mircea_popescu	which - i can't find any trace of any such thing on deedbot. which is ridoinculous wtf.	[19:22]
mircea_popescu	should be each month after 15th. for months nao.	[19:23]
trinque	mircea_popescu: http://deedbot.org/bundle-393434.txt	[19:23]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1PGAGZp )	[19:23]
mircea_popescu	aha!	[19:23]
mircea_popescu	am i blind ?	[19:23]
trinque	eh, not like it's easy to search through	[19:23]
trinque	but the db has the info which will make its way to the surface at some point	[19:24]
mircea_popescu	you know i just searched the page source for deedbot.org, deedbot.org/bundle-393434.txt not in there	[19:24]
mircea_popescu	a href="/bundle-393434.txt ah found	[19:24]
mircea_popescu	393434 18YWgn8UHh5V4N9RvXR5bnCQtxiQRmewaV 2A4A728F75668B50162D4F13EE2BDEF602DD2D91 1	[19:25]
mircea_popescu	393434 18YWgn8UHh5V4N9RvXR5bnCQtxiQRmewaV 2A4A728F75668B50162D4F13EE2BDEF602DD2D91 2	[19:25]
mircea_popescu	why the fuck would it be listed under that ooooooohhh	[19:25]
mircea_popescu	sorry. all my fault.	[19:25]
trinque	no problemo	[19:25]
trinque	I'm happy to be human search while there isn't one	[19:25]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 61887 @ 0.00057188 = 35.3919 BTC [+] {3}	[19:27]
*	HostFat has quit (Quit: Leaving)	[19:33]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 43549 @ 0.00056013 = 24.3931 BTC [-] {2}	[19:43]
*	DreadKnight has quit (Quit: #AncientBeast - Master Your Beasts ( www.AncientBeast.com ))	[19:52]
jurov	http://money.cnn.com/2016/02/17/technology/windows-10-pentagon/ "Secretary of Defense Ash Carter has ordered all 4 million of the Pentagon's PCs to be upgraded to Windows 10 within the next 12 months."	[19:53]
assbot	Pentagon orders Windows 10 to be installed on all 4 million of its PCs - Feb. 17, 2016 ... ( http://bit.ly/1PRsqnm )	[19:53]
jurov	on order from ft.meade?	[19:53]
mircea_popescu	da fuck are they doing with 4mn solitare statuions.	[19:54]
jurov	"I see this as a best proof point for Microsoft showing that Windows 10 is certainly more secure than its predecessor and stable enough to be rolled out to millions of people," said Pat Moorhead, analyst at Moor Insights & Strategy.	[19:54]
jurov	you need hands-on win10 experience to truly savor such claim	[19:57]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: same thing they were doing earlier with 10 million older solitaire stations !	[19:57]
asciilifeform	remember, this is how microshit eats.	[19:57]
mircea_popescu	quite.	[19:57]
asciilifeform	(have you ever heard of a ~person~ paying for winblowz?!)	[19:58]
mircea_popescu	"best proof point windows maintains the favour of nazi hq"	[19:58]
asciilifeform	incidentally, i drove past it today, as every day, flags at half mast all week (herr scalia ?)	[19:58]
mircea_popescu	wait ... is pat moorhead married to a fellow named moorhead, who is the head of moor something or the other ?	[19:58]
asciilifeform	and speaking of, why has ussa not adopted the wonderful custom of playing 'swan lake' when politburo man dies ?	[19:59]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform maybe for herr scalia's pillow.	[19:59]
asciilifeform	mmmhmmmnnmm.	[19:59]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15708 @ 0.00056845 = 8.9292 BTC [+]	[20:05]
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*	assbot gives voice to ben_vulpes	[21:25]
ben_vulpes	latest useless office equipment acquisition: BLACK POST IT NOTES	[21:27]
adlai	http://cs633228.vk.me/v633228834/f7c8/d38GXV90-H4.jpg	[21:29]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1TnZ18G )	[21:29]
adlai	oops! http://i1.kwejk.pl/k/obrazki/2015/10/a4ef7346bd1227e6be8153554fcd9c8e.png	[21:29]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1TnZ3gS )	[21:29]
ben_vulpes	ancient trope adlai	[21:29]
ben_vulpes	nice to see you again tho	[21:29]
*	adlai blames the image similarity neural networks for reading his mind wrt the language (since half the channel probably didn't notice anything wrong with the first one)	[21:30]
ben_vulpes	want to scrawl on black post its in black ink with me?	[21:30]
adlai	!google paint it black	[21:30]
ben_vulpes	today i cover staff desks in black post it notes with pentagrams drawn on them	[21:30]
*	adlai adds this to the list of "music i know thanks to violent video games"	[21:30]
adlai	is it black which soaks all other inks, or do you have some sorta gouach that can paint over it?	[21:31]
danielpbarron	i imagine it's to go with those metalic colored sharpie markers	[21:32]
ben_vulpes	the ink black is somewhat more light absorbent than the paper black	[21:32]
adlai	draw pentagrams in the middle of stack, return to office supply warehouse, rinse, repeat	[21:33]
*	BingoBoingo has quit (Quit: Leaving)	[21:34]
ben_vulpes	danielpbarron: http://i.imgur.com/Mz2GqWY.jpg	[21:34]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1TnZc46 )	[21:34]
ben_vulpes	bye bye bb	[21:34]
adlai	woah ben_vulpes since when does the IFF have its own cloakmasks?	[21:40]
phf	we paint the roses red, we paint the roses red	[21:40]
ben_vulpes	sometime when you weren't around	[21:44]
ben_vulpes	DUH	[21:44]
adlai	damn	[21:45]
mircea_popescu	when did s/jdif/iff/ ?	[21:45]
ben_vulpes	mircea_popescu: you just don't understand how the world works	[21:46]
mircea_popescu	i jewst don't understand ?	[21:47]
adlai	ben_vulpes: don't worry someday the kid might grow up	[21:48]
*	BingoBoingo (~BingoBoin@unaffiliated/bingoboingo) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[21:51]
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ben_vulpes	BEHOLD I AM CHIEF CULTURE OFFICER	[21:54]
ben_vulpes	I COVER DESKS IN POST IT NOTES	[21:55]
adlai	mircea_popescu: suggested marginal revenue stream for qntra - affiliate links in articles referencing bitbets	[22:01]
adlai	(authors should not get to pick the links... or maybe you disagree?)	[22:01]
adlai	ie authors would earn through shareholder revenue (or increased share price)	[22:02]
*	assbot gives voice to BingoBoingo	[22:06]
*	sinetek has quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)	[22:06]
adlai	ben_vulpes: btw thank you for gladness. and i'm sorry that i tried unsolicited to sell you btc via pm.	[22:07]
*	p15x has quit (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)	[22:10]
mircea_popescu	i have nfi. BingoBoingo ? ye think ?	[22:11]
BingoBoingo	I gotta catch up on logs	[22:12]
*	adlai notes that ben_vulpes was wise to refuse, given timing & retrospect	[22:12]
*	adlai has to as well, but actually has to ~work~ beforehand, believe it or not	[22:12]
asciilifeform	l0l work	[22:24]
adlai	fite me	[22:25]
adlai	https://online-go.com/play	[22:25]
assbot	The best place to play go online! ... ( http://bit.ly/1UDzzf1 )	[22:25]
asciilifeform	adlai: i normally play on igs	[22:25]
adlai	everybody needs a server they wouldn't be caught dead on	[22:26]
*	adlai has not picked one yet	[22:26]
asciilifeform	that's what kiseido is for	[22:26]
adlai	but at least i lose to better people on this one	[22:26]
BingoBoingo	K, the bitbet affliate link thing probably has a place, but likely as part of a larger monetization effort when that time comes. I'm uncertain on this matter at this moment.	[22:27]
adlai	V	[22:27]
mircea_popescu	yeah, tbd.	[22:27]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10600 @ 0.00057026 = 6.0448 BTC [+]	[22:29]
*	diana_coman has quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)	[22:29]
*	joshbuddy (~josh@wikimedia/Joshbuddy) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[22:32]
adlai	https://botbot.me/freenode/bitcoin-wizards/2016-02-18/?msg=60345485&page=1	[22:41]
assbot	IRC Logs for #bitcoin-wizards \| BotBot.me [o__o] ... ( http://bit.ly/1LukPcr )	[22:41]
BingoBoingo	adlai: A position paper is liek the vocabulary suggests, a paper that "advances" a particular political position	[22:44]
adlai	tl;dr: the only place where 'Blockchain' is camelpitalized is in the title	[22:45]
adlai	paper is about Bitcoin, and dozens of hypothetical bitcoins (lowercase)	[22:46]
adlai	capitalizes Bitcoin (and upon its popularity) everywhere.	[22:46]
adlai	so i'd actually say it's a move in the right direction, regardless of the authors's's position	[22:48]
adlai	but definitely tl;dr,able at a whopping 7,243 shares	[22:48]
*	adlai (~adlai@unaffiliated/adlai) has left #bitcoin-assets ("Not all who wander are lost")	[22:49]
*	adlai (~adlai@unaffiliated/adlai) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[22:49]
*	p15 (~p15@87.91.145.64.client.static.strong-tk2.bringover.net) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[22:49]
*	trixisowned has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)	[23:14]
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*	trixisowned has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)	[23:21]
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*	shesek has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)	[23:28]
*	DreadKnight (~DreadKnig@unaffiliated/dreadknight) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[23:35]
mod6	;;bc,stats	[23:46]
gribble	Current Blocks: 398936 \| Current Difficulty: 1.4411644784734866E11 \| Next Difficulty At Block: 399167 \| Next Difficulty In: 231 blocks \| Next Difficulty In About: 1 day, 10 hours, 52 minutes, and 4 seconds \| Next Difficulty Estimate: None \| Estimated Percent Change: None	[23:46]
mircea_popescu	;;nethash	[23:47]
gribble	1068305335.67	[23:47]
*	shesek (~shesek@bzq-84-110-36-98.cablep.bezeqint.net) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[23:48]
mircea_popescu	in other news, http://40.media.tumblr.com/9f624bed34b9584ee03c017017fd4ec0/tumblr_ndpdngIjcZ1qlne6uo1_1280.jpg	[23:48]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1PRPoL3 )	[23:48]
asciilifeform	l0l!	[23:50]
mod6	haha	[23:50]
mircea_popescu	hehe	[23:52]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.BBET] [PAID] 4.60383615 BTC to 5`000`000 shares, 92 satoshi per share	[23:54]
mircea_popescu	deedbot- http://dpaste.com/1ZKQZWV.txt	[23:54]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1PRPZfK )	[23:54]
deedbot-	accepted: 1	[23:54]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] [PAID] 46.60687115 BTC to 500`000`000 shares, 9 satoshi per share	[23:56]
mircea_popescu	deedbot- http://dpaste.com/31SYN3T.txt	[23:56]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1PRQaHV )	[23:56]
deedbot-	accepted: 1	[23:56]
*	assbot gives voice to adlai	[23:57]
adlai	!t m s.bbet	[23:57]
assbot	[MPEX:S.BBET] 1D: 0.000105 / 0.000105 / 0.000105 (500 shares, 0.05 BTC), 7D: 0.000105 / 0.000105 / 0.000105 (500 shares, 0.05 BTC), 30D: 0.00007821 / 0.00009027 / 0.00013 (4600 shares, 0.42 BTC)	[23:57]
adlai	!t m s.mpoe	[23:57]
assbot	[MPEX:S.MPOE] 1D: 0.00055323 / 0.00056592 / 0.0005748 (3968178 shares, 2,245.68 BTC), 7D: 0.00054156 / 0.00056108 / 0.0005748 (35084807 shares, 19,685.59 BTC), 30D: 0.00051942 / 0.00056002 / 0.00060199 (97993405 shares, 54,878.76 BTC)	[23:57]

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