Forum logs for 16 Feb 2015

Sunday, 24 November, Year 11 d.Tr. | Author: Mircea Popescu

decimation	mircea_popescu: it's now common in modern us 'tract' homes that the build has no air vent in the kitchen	[00:03]
BingoBoingo	These are a people for whom hiring professional cleaners even annually is considered a luxury expense.	[00:03]
mircea_popescu	what.	[00:04]
mircea_popescu	so the 3rd is actually for guests ?!	[00:04]
mircea_popescu	holy shit why, because stray pubic hairs ?	[00:04]
decimation	the 'replacement' is a recirculating fan with a 'filter' that doesn't work at all	[00:04]
mircea_popescu	because no one may be a maid so nobody ever cleans a bahtroom so htey're filthy ? why ?	[00:04]
mircea_popescu	decimation but you can just open the window neh ?	[00:04]
decimation	sure, when it's -10C	[00:05]
*	mircea_popescu never liked kitchen air vents. they generally favour infestations.	[00:05]
decimation	the reason they lack them is apparently because the builders could be liable for the kitchen fires that happen when nobody cleans out the air vent pipe	[00:05]
mircea_popescu	uh.	[00:06]
BingoBoingo	holy shit why, because stray pubic hairs ? << That and lingering urine smells, because "Clean when I moved in" is good enough to not justify cleaning ever again for the more degenerate Pindos	[00:07]
BingoBoingo	decimation: I find it lulzy when I encounter stovetop vents that pump air into the freezer	[00:08]
decimation	BingoBoingo: eh?	[00:08]
ben_vulpes	my stovetop vent vents into the apartment.	[00:09]
BingoBoingo	decimation: a few places I've seen the kitchen stovetop vent fan pipes air in the the neighboring fridge's freezer compartment because... Who fucking knows anymore	[00:09]
ben_vulpes	and yet you savages still don't have cunt basins as a regular fixture, amirite ? << why's the shower so inadequate?	[00:10]
BingoBoingo	https://images.encyclopediadramatica.se/2/2d/L4nlogo.png	[00:10]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1At9bxY )	[00:10]
decimation	BingoBoingo: sounds like they were 'supposed' to install an outdoor vent, and ended up installing nothing	[00:10]
BingoBoingo	decimation: Nah when you open the freezer while using the stove at a friend's place you get a definite fog of steaming out of the freezer. The only justification I can thing of is the hope freezing smells sequesters them?	[00:12]
ben_vulpes	ben_vulpes: post your x86 auto.sh on the listserv ? << any reason to not run with -xeu?	[00:13]
decimation	the real estate chumpatron in the us is finely tuned to prevent any actual person from being involv[	[00:13]
decimation	ed with	[00:13]
decimation	supervising the design and construction	[00:13]
BingoBoingo	AH, here's the thing the inspired feminine linux https://gitorious.org/c-plus-equality/c-plus-equality/source/cefcfb4276889bd3833c539225a9cdfd3eb16d33:	[00:13]
assbot	./ in c-plus-equality/c-plus-equality (cefcfb4276889bd3833c539225a9cdfd3eb16d33) - Gitorious ... ( http://bit.ly/1zhp2d9 )	[00:13]
mircea_popescu	ben_vulpes << it's not, provided it specifically ISNT an usian shower	[00:14]
mircea_popescu	but instead the civilised model with 3 meter's worth of flexible chord.	[00:14]
decimation	those can be retrofit into us showers but are definitely 'out of fashion'	[00:15]
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[]bot	Bet placed: 2 BTC for No on "Gold to drop under $1000 before April 2015" http://bitbet.us/bet/1119/ Odds: 24(Y):76(N) by coin, 25(Y):75(N) by weight. Total bet: 5.0401 BTC. Current weight: 98,721.	[00:15]
BingoBoingo	those can be retrofit into us showers but are definitely 'out of fashion' << Plenty of them in Nursing homes and higher end hotels (i.e. the ones foreigners can afford)	[00:16]
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mircea_popescu	so how exactly is a woman supposed to wash standing while being rained upon ?	[00:20]
mircea_popescu	bleach her snatch ?	[00:20]
mircea_popescu	here's a hint : female genital washing mostly involved dilution not soap.	[00:21]
mircea_popescu	it's self-soaping, the vagina.	[00:21]
ben_vulpes	i've always been amused by the "bend over and get it wet" approach, but i'm a total noob.	[00:22]
mircea_popescu	if you think about it for a second, you realise what a fucking scandal this is.	[00:22]
mircea_popescu	"bend over and get it wet with stuff that washes off your arsehole"	[00:22]
decimation	I like the 'shower with a hose' because it makes it simple to rinse off the shower after cleaning	[00:23]
mircea_popescu	every usanistan obgyn that is not insane treats sporadic uti in healthy females the same way : "get a proper shower woman!"	[00:24]
mircea_popescu	the rest prescribe windex or w/e the fuck.	[00:24]
decimation	or they hand out antibiotics	[00:25]
mircea_popescu	decimation i suspect you lived (as in, with women) long enough to know exactly what antibiotics do to their bits ?	[00:26]
ben_vulpes	i am not accustomed to being responsible for female cleanliness!	[00:26]
danielpbarron	there's this commercial they keep airing about a product for women who have "swagger" which is apparently code for "fat smelly vag"	[00:26]
mircea_popescu	ben_vulpes this is more like management than execution.	[00:26]
decimation	mircea_popescu: they also ruin the gut fauna	[00:27]
asciilifeform	BingoBoingo: wai wat !?! where did you see a freezer with an air inlet hose, and can you swear that you were sober ?	[00:27]
mircea_popescu	yes, but you can't just throw some yogurt into your cunt.	[00:27]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform honestly i just skipped over all that, it's too insane.	[00:27]
asciilifeform	l0l	[00:27]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 61462 @ 0.00005056 = 3.1075 BTC [-] {16}	[00:28]
BingoBoingo	asciilifeform: Rental house in southern Illinois. When there I am frequently drunk but been there enough times to verify this sober while cleaning.	[00:28]
mircea_popescu	BingoBoingo so what happens at the joints ?	[00:28]
asciilifeform	BingoBoingo: who sells this? and can you describe that it looked like ?	[00:28]
asciilifeform	*what	[00:28]
mircea_popescu	3 inches of styrofoam?	[00:28]
decimation	throw some yogurt < yes you can actually: http://www.walgreens.com/store/c/rephresh-pro-b-probiotic-feminine-supplement-capsules/ID=prod6003401-product	[00:29]
assbot	RepHresh Pro-B Probiotic Feminine Supplement Capsules \| Walgreens ... ( http://bit.ly/1zhq5tp )	[00:29]
mircea_popescu	o.O	[00:29]
mircea_popescu	the land of the free, where stupidity creates a whole industry!	[00:29]
mircea_popescu	i guess it must be good for the economy.	[00:30]
BingoBoingo	asciilifeform: Silver hose come out of wall goes into freezer. Snake sent throug hose strikes over stove fan.	[00:30]
asciilifeform	some demented builder	[00:31]
*	asciilifeform unable to think of, much less find on net, any possible justification for this	[00:32]
decimation	that pretty much the dumbest thing I've ever heard	[00:32]
decimation	for one thing, venting into a closed box means that there's no venting	[00:32]
mircea_popescu	i still can't make sense of it.	[00:33]
mircea_popescu	no condensation around the hose ?	[00:33]
ben_vulpes	bb's trollin.	[00:33]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 63807 @ 0.00041437 = 26.4397 BTC [-]	[00:35]
BingoBoingo	;;ticker	[00:36]
gribble	Bitstamp BTCUSD ticker \| Best bid: 231.14, Best ask: 231.48, Bid-ask spread: 0.34000, Last trade: 231.48, 24 hour volume: 29169.04151104, 24 hour low: 227.75, 24 hour high: 267.92, 24 hour vwap: 246.426429178	[00:36]
asciilifeform	re: gnat: 4.6.4 builds but actually attempting to use yields 'gnatgcc: fatal error: -fuse-linker-plugin, but liblto_plugin.so not found'	[00:36]
asciilifeform	^ does anyone other than me care	[00:36]
asciilifeform	if not about gnat, the overall state of decay.	[00:37]
decimation	asciilifeform: what are you trying to compile that is written in ada?	[00:37]
asciilifeform	'hello world'	[00:37]
decimation	heh	[00:37]
BingoBoingo	about decay yes. WFT "fix" was important enough to kill this	[00:38]
asciilifeform	who wants to laugh, but there are precisely two programming languages in existence which are 1) standardized and 2) you can -actually write complete systems- using -the language described in the standard-	[00:38]
asciilifeform	two and only two.	[00:38]
mircea_popescu	ada and lisp ?	[00:38]
asciilifeform	common lisp	[00:39]
asciilifeform	and yes - ada.	[00:39]
decimation	asciilifeform: even usg has abandoned ada	[00:39]
decimation	but not because it failed to serve a purpose	[00:39]
asciilifeform	(pet peeve of mine - 'lisp' (or worse, the '60s-ism LISP) is a hopelessly nonspecific term that encompasses languages that differ from one another far more even than 'algol' differs from 'c')	[00:40]
asciilifeform	decimation: usg, interestingly, did not entirely abandon. but under pressure from microshit (primarily) relaxed the ancient laws	[00:40]
asciilifeform	avionics, power plant controls, the like - systems whose failure reliably produces piles of corpses and messy 'pr' - are still very heavy on ada.	[00:41]
BingoBoingo	Also sun when they were monied enough to bezzel up Java	[00:42]
decimation	presumably they do not use gcc	[00:42]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 49000 @ 0.0004195 = 20.5555 BTC [+]	[00:42]
asciilifeform	decimation: actually - they do	[00:42]
decimation	heh	[00:42]
asciilifeform	or rather, the ada component of gcc is based on the ancient usg-commissioned thing	[00:42]
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asciilifeform	an ancient usg	[00:43]
decimation	I doubt they use x86 for such purposes either	[00:43]
asciilifeform	thing is mainly architecture-agnostic, interestingly	[00:43]
asciilifeform	(no big surprise to folks accustomed to gcc)	[00:43]
BingoBoingo	^ most good things are architecture agnostic	[00:44]
asciilifeform	i advise folks to learn enough ada to understand why something quite like it is necessary.	[00:44]
asciilifeform	it is more or less the antithesis of the 'hip language'	[00:45]
asciilifeform	in being tremendously unpleasant to work in	[00:45]
decimation	the problem is that many of the promises of ada cannot be kept by the underlying hardware	[00:45]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [AMHASH1] 2450 @ 0.0007311 = 1.7912 BTC [-] {18}	[00:45]
asciilifeform	situation today is that most folks would not even notice a promise broken by hardware	[00:45]
asciilifeform	because it can be reliably blamed on softs.	[00:45]
asciilifeform	you more or less have to present a smoking cratered cpu to make others believe in 'it was the hardware'	[00:46]
decimation	yeah that's a good point	[00:47]
asciilifeform	there are interesting things to be learned from the ada approach, if you can pinch your nose and get past the 'ick factor'	[00:47]
*	assbot gives voice to TheNewDeal	[00:47]
asciilifeform	for instance, all error messages refer to a page in the rationale book	[00:47]
asciilifeform	(in traditional implementations)	[00:47]
asciilifeform	buffer overflows, pointer fandango, etc. - are impossible	[00:47]
asciilifeform	^ without requiring a bulky 'runtime'	[00:47]
TheNewDeal	;;Later tell TomServo sorry I missed you last evening. Went out for some drinks and left my irc on. Will be back thursday evening	[00:48]
gribble	The operation succeeded.	[00:48]
asciilifeform	just what the doctor ordered for proggys whose behaviour (and error modes) must follow rigorous spec, or user - dies.	[00:49]
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thestringpuller	a canadian appears	[00:51]
BingoBoingo	!up pete_dushenski	[00:52]
*	assbot gives voice to pete_dushenski	[00:52]
decimation	asciilifeform: yeah there's much to like in this approach	[00:52]
punkman	https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B971P9XCEAIKleT.jpg	[00:52]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1zhrDnk )	[00:52]
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mod6	asciilifeform: in your portotronic script, the line `make STATIC=1 -f makefile.unix bitcoind` ends up doing "-Wl,-Bstatic ... -Wl,-Bdynamic" when actually executed because of the bug in the makefile.	[00:55]
decimation	asciilifeform: there's also ARINC standard 653 if you want an RTOS along with your ada	[00:55]
asciilifeform	mod6: odd. because i ended up with proper static linking	[00:55]
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asciilifeform	mod6: did check the elf	[00:55]
mod6	is it appropriate to do `make LMODE="static" LMODE2="static" -f makefile.unix bitcoind` instead?	[00:55]
decimation	actually it would be interesting to know exactly what hardware is used in modern avionics	[00:55]
mod6	asciilifeform: no, i didn't im currently rebuilding.	[00:57]
mod6	sec...	[00:57]
mod6	asciilifeform: ben_vulpes might have the same problem with his, is there something he should be specifically looking for in the elf?	[00:58]
thestringpuller	jurov: PM me about how to go about renting aws instance.	[00:58]
asciilifeform	$ armv5tel-softfloat-linux-gnueabi-readelf --dynamic bitcoind-armv5-bastard	[00:59]
asciilifeform	Dynamic section at offset 0x3f3874 contains 32 entries:	[01:00]
asciilifeform	Tag Type Name/Value	[01:00]
asciilifeform	0x00000001 (NEEDED) Shared library: [libdl.so.2]	[01:00]
asciilifeform	0x00000001 (NEEDED) Shared library: [libpthread.so.0]	[01:00]
asciilifeform	0x00000001 (NEEDED) Shared library: [libstdc++.so.6]	[01:00]
asciilifeform	0x00000001 (NEEDED) Shared library: [libm.so.6]	[01:00]
asciilifeform	0x00000001 (NEEDED) Shared library: [libgcc_s.so.1]	[01:00]
asciilifeform	0x00000001 (NEEDED) Shared library: [libc.so.6]	[01:00]
asciilifeform	0x00000001 (NEEDED) Shared library: [ld-linux.so.3]	[01:00]
asciilifeform	[detail snipped]	[01:00]
asciilifeform	so everything but the std libs is statically linked in	[01:00]
mircea_popescu	http://trilema.com/2015/just-how-stupid-is-the-redditard-crowd/ << one of the lulziest things on trilema.	[01:00]
assbot	Just how stupid is the Redditard crowd ? pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1zhshkC )	[01:00]
punkman	asciilifeform: is "z" not used, noticed you removed it from portatronic	[01:00]
mod6	i thought we didn't want to use shared libs? only static libs *.a's	[01:00]
asciilifeform	punkman: zlib is only demanded by the retarded version of boost	[01:00]
asciilifeform	forget after which date	[01:01]
asciilifeform	it isn't used in bitcoin, no.	[01:01]
asciilifeform	mod6: i overlooked the std lib stuff, was satisfied with not seeing openssl, boost, bdb. but you are quite right, this is not a proper static elf	[01:01]
asciilifeform	see if you can produce one.	[01:02]
mod6	ok. no problem. just trying to get it down to a spec	[01:02]
mod6	workin on it :)	[01:02]
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decimation	asciilifeform: http://www.embedded.com/electronics-blogs/break-points/4025675/RTOS-dissatisfaction < "Safety-critical applications may need a certifiable OS. That's not one meant for an asylum, but one that can, for tolerable costs, be shown to conform to a standard like DO-178B. The costs are staggering; the certification process for one app I know of generated half a page of documentation per line of code."	[01:04]
assbot	RTOS dissatisfaction \| Embedded ... ( http://bit.ly/1zhswMP )	[01:04]
asciilifeform	fortunately we are not interested in usg certificates.	[01:04]
decimation	have you played with http://micrium.com/rtos/ucosiii/overview/	[01:04]
assbot	µC/OS-III Overview \| Micrium ... ( http://bit.ly/1zhsBjy )	[01:04]
asciilifeform	but 'half a page of docs per line' is about what ought to be expected of 'therealbitcoin' when mature.	[01:04]
asciilifeform	decimation: yes. and i can't say that i am interested in any future direction of 'c os' on 'c machines'	[01:05]
asciilifeform	incl. it.	[01:05]
decimation	heh yeah	[01:05]
decimation	yeah, 'half a page of docs per line' is pretty much the same as your 'what does this line do?' test	[01:06]
asciilifeform	not quite	[01:06]
BingoBoingo	have you played with http://micrium.com/rtos/ucosiii/overview/ << Wild guess here, but would bet at the right odds, FreeBSD userland on Minix like microkernel	[01:06]
assbot	µC/OS-III Overview \| Micrium ... ( http://bit.ly/1zhsBjy )	[01:06]
asciilifeform	the test is, in my imagination, an exam given in real time, in the flesh	[01:06]
asciilifeform	that is, reactive and unpredictable.	[01:07]
mircea_popescu	^	[01:07]
asciilifeform	like soviet exams	[01:07]
mircea_popescu	someone's been reading on punishments.	[01:07]
decimation	asciilifeform: yes, of course, but the student must learn from something	[01:07]
asciilifeform	now that it came up, mircea_popescu did have a 'punishments' article that used something like that formula	[01:07]
ben_vulpes	"disproportionate" is in there too.	[01:07]
asciilifeform	iirc it was 'disproportionate, unpredictable,'	[01:07]
asciilifeform	and something else	[01:08]
mircea_popescu	ah, unrelated ?	[01:08]
mircea_popescu	well, sanity neverthleess.	[01:08]
asciilifeform	but yes related	[01:08]
asciilifeform	an exam is something like a punishment (for what? for having not yet demonstrated mastery, of course)	[01:08]
asciilifeform	not the same, but related, as a ladder is to a staircase	[01:09]
mircea_popescu	http://www.thedrinkingrecord.com/2014/06/08/inconvenience/#rf4-858	[01:09]
assbot	Inconvenience \| Bingo Blog ... ( http://bit.ly/1zhsUuI )	[01:09]
mircea_popescu	apparently it only exists in romanian anyways	[01:09]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform impredictable, disproportionate and visible.	[01:09]
asciilifeform	aha!	[01:10]
asciilifeform	yes.	[01:10]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform which incidentally is the missing point in the supreme court discussion of punishment quoted as it happens earlier	[01:10]
mircea_popescu	they fail to consider that punishing the mentally retarded is a signal FOR EVERYONE	[01:11]
mircea_popescu	including the non-mentally retarded.	[01:11]
mircea_popescu	it's quite ridoinculous what sort of compartimentalised nonsense they sprout. you'd flunk senior hs essays for this	[01:11]
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decimation	for this reason the us should bring back hangings and should televise them live	[01:11]
*	asciilifeform highly recomments the historic tour 'seeing justice done' by p. friedland. one of the very few good works on the subject	[01:11]
mircea_popescu	decimation i dunno if i descreibed it or not, but i think so : the prison zoo.	[01:12]
asciilifeform	of the hows and whys of public executions in europe from 800 or so ad to present	[01:12]
asciilifeform	!s zoolag	[01:12]
assbot	10 results for 'zoolag' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=zoolag	[01:12]
mircea_popescu	torture people behind the glass, force highschoolers to visit yearly.	[01:12]
asciilifeform	yeah this was described	[01:12]
asciilifeform	beautiful idea.	[01:12]
decimation	I would prefer 'torture' to be 'hard labor, gulag style'	[01:13]
decimation	but that's difficult to capture through a window	[01:13]
ben_vulpes	https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/blob/v0.5.3/src/bitcoinrpc.cpp#L210 ... https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/blob/v0.7.2/src/rpcblockchain.cpp#L12	[01:13]
assbot	bitcoin/bitcoinrpc.cpp at v0.5.3 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub ... ( http://bit.ly/1zhtdWf )	[01:13]
assbot	bitcoin/rpcblockchain.cpp at v0.7.2 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub ... ( http://bit.ly/1zhtdWm )	[01:13]
BingoBoingo	I would prefer 'torture' to be 'hard labor, gulag style' << Quality punitive torture can leave souveniers	[01:13]
decimation	for thieves, embezzlers, etc it gives a good yardstick	[01:14]
decimation	'pay back yer debt in coal'	[01:14]
mircea_popescu	sure. dig a yard of trench per dollar embezzled.	[01:14]
mircea_popescu	it's healthy, too. most usians could immensely benefit from more exercise, especially if nude under the nude sky.	[01:14]
ben_vulpes	wai wut? i thought bezzling was a good thing.	[01:15]
mircea_popescu	ben_vulpes so is digging.	[01:15]
decimation	heh. only if you are in on it	[01:15]
ben_vulpes	end of times and all that fun stuff.	[01:15]
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punkman	I was making a case for "sentence all members of parliament to 30 years hard labor" yesterday at dinner, "but what of the innocent ones"	[01:16]
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TheNewDeal	20?	[01:17]
ben_vulpes	ABSOLUTELY UNRELATED	[01:19]
ben_vulpes	https://scroguard.com/	[01:19]
assbot	Scroguard \| Less Worry. More Fun. ... ( http://bit.ly/1zhtCrM )	[01:19]
cazalla	mircea_popescu: yes, but you can't just throw some yogurt into your cunt. <<< but you can throw some yogurt out of it! http://www.inquisitr.com/1839518/phd-student-creates-yoghurt-using-her-vagina/	[01:20]
assbot	PhD Student Creates Yogurt Using Her Vagina ... ( http://bit.ly/1zhtEjv )	[01:20]
punkman	ben_vulpes: I don't get it	[01:20]
asciilifeform	!s menstrual cookies	[01:20]
assbot	0 results for 'menstrual cookies' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=menstrual+cookies	[01:20]
asciilifeform	https://forums.gentoo.org/viewtopic-p-7633136.html?sid=1e44c177a5b76671206084811186d30e << on earlier thread	[01:21]
assbot	Gentoo Forums :: View topic - The state of Ada on Gentoo ... ( http://bit.ly/1zhtGIb )	[01:21]
decimation	the 'forced exercise' idea reminds me of a passage in the 'rise and fall of the third reich': "The young in the Third Reich were growing up to have strong and healthy bodies, faith in the future of their country and in themselves and a sense of fellowship and camaraderie that shattered all class and economic and social barriers. I thought of that later, in the May days of 1940, when along the road between Aachen and Brussels one saw	[01:22]
decimation	the contrast between the German soldiers, bronzed and clean-cut from a youth spent in the sunshine on an adequate diet, and the first British war prisoners, with their hollow chests, round shoulders, pasty complexions and bad teeth – tragic examples of the youth that England had neglected so irresponsibly in the years between the wars."	[01:22]
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BingoBoingo	!up julmac	[01:33]
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*	TheNewDeal (~TheNewDea@unaffiliated/thenewdeal) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[01:35]
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mircea_popescu	cazalla eww	[01:37]
mircea_popescu	punkman lol the innocent ones. splendid.	[01:38]
mircea_popescu	in other news : http://40.media.tumblr.com/a19733372c89135be1c4ce0aad534e2d/tumblr_n8w6mezL3y1tx1yzzo1_500.png	[01:39]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1zhuUDg )	[01:39]
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ben_vulpes	punkman: me neither.	[01:46]
BingoBoingo	The original gmail http://web.archive.org/web/20001017105222/http://gmail.garfield.com/	[01:49]
assbot	Set Your E-mail Free ... ( http://bit.ly/1AtnPp5 )	[01:49]
mircea_popescu	dude where the fuck do anglos pull their data from. 0.4% BAC = LD50 ?!	[01:51]
asciilifeform	wai wat ?!	[01:51]
mircea_popescu	in the Romania i grew up, being drunk BEGAN at .3	[01:51]
mircea_popescu	you need like... i dunno, 5% or so to fucking die of it.	[01:51]
asciilifeform	is that value for man even	[01:51]
asciilifeform	or field mouse	[01:51]
mircea_popescu	i tyhink it may be for feminist.	[01:52]
mircea_popescu	for the sake of argument, 0.4% means 32 ml of alcohol in the 8 liters of blood ? srsly ?	[01:52]
mircea_popescu	so when i drink a liter of 52% moonshine over a night my liver takes out 50ml/hour while carefully keeping total blood alcohol under 30 least i die ?	[01:53]
BingoBoingo	Not even breakfast	[01:53]
mircea_popescu	http://thelastpsychiatrist.com/2007/02/just_how_many_drinks_a_day_is.html << reference.	[01:54]
assbot	The Last Psychiatrist: Just How Many Drinks A Day Is Bad? ... ( http://bit.ly/1AtouGU )	[01:54]
mircea_popescu	But legal driving limit is usually .08%. And 50% of the time, .4% is death, so there's that.	[01:54]
mircea_popescu	i wish to know these 100 people out of whom 50 died of .4% bac.	[01:55]
*	assbot gives voice to TheNewDeal	[01:55]
TheNewDeal	offhand, does anyone remember the name of usagi's gold company?	[01:55]
danielpbarron	heh i was just reading about that; it's at the start of the public logs	[01:55]
asciilifeform	considering -who- typically dies of EtOH overdose, consider comorbidities.	[01:55]
mircea_popescu	TheNewDeal sadly, no. lessee	[01:56]
danielpbarron	and it was silver, not gold; unless he had another thing i'm not aware of	[01:56]
decimation	asciilifeform: the 'RTEMS' os https://devel.rtems.org/wiki/TBR/UserManual/RTEMSAda < supports ada, is open source, but is written in C	[01:56]
mircea_popescu	TheNewDeal he did silver. tu.silver	[01:56]
decimation	it's based on some ancient usg code	[01:56]
TheNewDeal	ahhh	[01:57]
asciilifeform	decimation: written in c, isn't a unix - hence uninteresting	[01:57]
TheNewDeal	there's a company in the us called "amagi metals" and for some reason I thought that rang a bell	[01:57]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform that's a point	[01:57]
asciilifeform	to me.	[01:57]
decimation	apparently there are varying levels of posix support in actual flight systems	[01:57]
mircea_popescu	TheNewDeal they have been trying to trade for bitcoin with moderate success.	[01:57]
TheNewDeal	you're aware of amagi?	[01:58]
mircea_popescu	yes.	[01:58]
decimation	asciilifeform: I suppose that if one really wants an os written in ada that 'fits in head' - one should write it himself	[02:00]
decimation	after all, a program that manages to boot the target and run an infinite loop is a basic os	[02:00]
asciilifeform	decimation: not even asking for an os	[02:01]
decimation	yeah I know you weren't, but I thought it was an interesting question	[02:01]
asciilifeform	decimation: just for gnat to build, from source, on my particular, unremarkable gentoo box	[02:01]
asciilifeform	the way printed on the box	[02:01]
mircea_popescu	http://31.media.tumblr.com/970b9af35bd767902b45116e3b5ab04a/tumblr_n7k8g6t70m1rl2fgko1_500.gif a metaphor for education.	[02:03]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1AtqbUH )	[02:03]
mircea_popescu	"a pleasurable activity which needs outside incentives"	[02:03]
cazalla	gee someone mentions alcohol and now im salivating	[02:24]
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thestringpuller	http://www.mtv.com/news/2069307/old-man-bald-haircut-bad-kids-children/ << i don't know why I think this is so funny.	[02:31]
thestringpuller	dat face	[02:32]
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cazalla	thestringpuller, lol	[02:33]
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TheNewDeal	;;bids 216.9	[02:36]
gribble	Bitstamp \| There are currently 3005.8877 bitcoins demanded at or over 216.9 USD, worth 671376.912891 USD in total. \| Data vintage: 0.1582 seconds	[02:36]
TheNewDeal	!down TheNewDeal	[02:36]
*	assbot has kicked TheNewDeal from #bitcoin-assets (Bye.)	[02:36]
asciilifeform	https://gcc.gnu.org/ml/gcc-patches/2012-03/msg01073.html	[02:42]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1zYjfwS )	[02:42]
asciilifeform	^ we found the shitgnome.	[02:42]
asciilifeform	it was drepper.	[02:43]
asciilifeform	and yes, it perma-breaks the gcc 4.1 that is built as part of the gnat bootstrap.	[02:48]
ben_vulpes	is drepper the shitgnome or did drepper find the thing?	[02:49]
asciilifeform	shitgnome	[02:50]
ben_vulpes	disregard i eat cocks	[02:50]
ben_vulpes	who is drepper anyways?	[02:50]
asciilifeform	glibc	[02:50]
asciilifeform	(and yes, as far as i can tell, the recent glibc pant-shitting was -also- drepper)	[02:51]
mircea_popescu	hm... it occurs to me... wouldn't it be a good idea if all progressives were required to register themselves with the state ?	[02:53]
ben_vulpes	stake?	[02:53]
asciilifeform	stake.	[02:53]
mircea_popescu	so, for instance, they are not allowed to take up residence in single occupant dwellings / family houses etc ?	[02:53]
asciilifeform	the wide kind.	[02:53]
mircea_popescu	but only dormrooms with shared bathrooms etc ?	[02:53]
mircea_popescu	also, kept away from children and so on.	[02:53]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: we mostly have this already	[02:53]
mircea_popescu	ah, good then.	[02:53]
asciilifeform	the present-day crop of college kidz will never live in anything other than a kommunalka	[02:54]
mircea_popescu	it's called social studies graduate programs, isn't it ?	[02:54]
asciilifeform	can't afford children, etc	[02:54]
mircea_popescu	Ladies and gentlemen, seldom can it have been a greater pleasure and privilege than it is for me now to announce that the next observation gave me the great pleasure and privilege of observing that it is my great pleasure and privilege to live in the best possible world of all the worlds that are possible already.	[02:55]
*	asciilifeform falls down, stack overflowing	[02:55]
mircea_popescu	definitely.	[02:55]
asciilifeform	http://pastebin.com/VkgE27Pd << undoes the shitgnomism, but wtf should i have to rebuild glibc and -everything- to use a perfectly ordinary proggy ?	[02:58]
assbot	siginfo_t_fix.patch - Pastebin.com ... ( http://bit.ly/1zYkzzC )	[02:58]
mircea_popescu	shut up and rebuild.	[02:58]
asciilifeform	no telling, also, what -else- will die	[02:59]
*	ben_vulpes goes to bed, asciilifeform goes to rebuild the universe.	[02:59]
ben_vulpes	what a time to be alive.	[02:59]
asciilifeform	ain't happening. 'make world' on this box would take longer than the hardware's mtbf.	[03:00]
mircea_popescu	lol in unrelated news, somebody just cussed me the fuck out because i am a wetback piece of shit left leaning commie.	[03:01]
asciilifeform	l0l!	[03:01]
mod6	haha wat	[03:01]
mircea_popescu	this entirely predicated on the very simple 'lives in argentina -> was born there -> planet of hats'	[03:01]
asciilifeform	i thought it was more ordinarily 'lives in argentina -> heil hitler' ?	[03:02]
mircea_popescu	so did i. but hey, at least i'm not a gypsy nigger.	[03:02]
asciilifeform	srsly, until very recently the common derp's sole item of 'knowledge' re: ar was that the fuhrer lives (yes) there	[03:03]
mircea_popescu	i would also guess this person owns more weapons than remaining fingers (firecracker accidents), and they have more telescopes than barrel notches.	[03:03]
asciilifeform	lol wut	[03:04]
mircea_popescu	be specific!	[03:04]
*	asciilifeform mindfucked, is searching for error msg, and #b-a log is #4 hit	[03:06]
asciilifeform	log of me crapping it in here	[03:07]
asciilifeform	a few hrs ago.	[03:07]
punkman	might be personalization	[03:07]
asciilifeform	punkman: does not appear to be...	[03:07]
punkman	let me try	[03:07]
asciilifeform	punkman: 'gnat "error: field 'info' has incomplete type" '	[03:08]
punkman	well google loves the log apparently	[03:09]
mircea_popescu	a few hrs ago. << yes. we dominate google mostly because we say interesting things.	[03:09]
mircea_popescu	the machine can tell by now.	[03:09]
punkman	I've been seeing it more often for various search strings, but I assumed it was personalization	[03:09]
*	asciilifeform already learned the cause of the error, but is looking to see who else was affected	[03:09]
asciilifeform	the shitgnome destroyed the ability to use an entire language	[03:09]
mircea_popescu	to a large degree it's the silent progress that has been happening in thefield of machine processing of human text for the past... 20 years ?	[03:09]
mircea_popescu	google is a major contributor. you can do wonderful things by sorting, word densities, etc etc.	[03:10]
*	coingenuity has quit (Read error: No route to host)	[03:10]
asciilifeform	google has extremely questionable motives and - at this point - competence	[03:10]
mircea_popescu	you know all those "how to spam google ? ORIGINAL CONTENT!!1" advicey bits ? they're actually quite on point.	[03:11]
mircea_popescu	original of course doesn't mean what the marginal retard "trying to make it online" imagines.	[03:11]
asciilifeform	for all we know, they favour #b-a log on account of the sheer frequency with which sp4mz0rz and sc4mz0rz are mentioned here.	[03:11]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform all motives are questionable. that's kinda what a motive is : "he's not doing it for me, he's doing it for himself"	[03:11]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform nah, in one sentence it'd be "for the sheer frequency with which rare associations that match types they only see in quality text are seen here"	[03:12]
mircea_popescu	believe it or not, google can actually recognise useful new papers from shitty new papers better than "peer review" committees can.	[03:12]
punkman	https://majestic.com/reports/site-explorer?q=log.bitcoin-assets.com&oq=log.bitcoin-assets.com&IndexDataSource=F	[03:13]
assbot	Site Explorer Results - Summary - Majestic ... ( http://bit.ly/1zYlPTp )	[03:13]
punkman	65k links from external sources	[03:13]
asciilifeform	punkman: betcha that's a random number	[03:14]
asciilifeform	the thing has a thoroughly spamatronic feel to it	[03:15]
punkman	no they crawl	[03:15]
mircea_popescu	they do crawl.	[03:15]
punkman	good addition for robots.txt block	[03:15]
mircea_popescu	i never bothered.	[03:15]
mircea_popescu	let them crawl lol.	[03:15]
mircea_popescu	ahrefs.com is a similar thing, also crawls.	[03:18]
punkman	there's at least a dozen of those mega-crawlers	[03:18]
mircea_popescu	yeah. big business, giving idiots in cubicals something to do with their time that looks more srs bzns than facebook	[03:19]
punkman	purpose being "find out where that other guy spams links, so you can do it too"	[03:19]
*	assbot gives voice to joecool	[03:19]
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asciilifeform	so the 'google finds unique strings' thing, sure - can we conclude that i'm the only one alive trying to build 'gnat' on 'gentoo' ?	[03:21]
asciilifeform	this is sad.	[03:22]
asciilifeform	where did the others go? ate their nagants from frustration ?	[03:22]
joecool	google moved away from unique strings over the past few years... moved to signals, will match synonyms and areas to a query	[03:22]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform in a sane manner for sane reasons ? yes.	[03:23]
mircea_popescu	others : http://trilema.com/2014/the-perfect-pitch/	[03:23]
assbot	The perfect pitch pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1Ad2RHA )	[03:23]
asciilifeform	where are the fossilized traces of folks doing it in insane matter, for lunatic reasons?	[03:23]
mircea_popescu	the fly eyes on the meat aren't a joke.	[03:23]
asciilifeform	i'd care to read'em. but nowhere	[03:23]
mircea_popescu	^	[03:24]
asciilifeform	just to underscore the sheer level of the braindamage i've uncovered - the thing won't build on any box with past 2+ yrs of glibc.	[03:25]
asciilifeform	3+	[03:25]
asciilifeform	mean to tell me that i'm the only one to 1) notice 2) say something on the net	[03:26]
asciilifeform	?	[03:26]
mircea_popescu	yes.	[03:26]
mircea_popescu	i don't think you actually understand how the world works.	[03:27]
asciilifeform	evidently not	[03:27]
mircea_popescu	ok. let's put it in perspective. at some point i ended up peripherally involved in the "Art" scene by virtue of fucking in it.	[03:27]
mircea_popescu	out of every 1k kids spending at least 1mn man-hours/year discussing a) creativity, generally and b) various projects	[03:28]
mircea_popescu	a total of less than 100 hours ever got put into any actually existent item that could be burned for instance.	[03:28]
asciilifeform	what happens to the rest of the time ?	[03:29]
mircea_popescu	just because it's easier (and cheaper) to type into box than throw paint at canvas does not mean more anything ever gets made.	[03:29]
asciilifeform	at some point you end up wondering what they're doing instead	[03:29]
mircea_popescu	happens ?	[03:29]
mircea_popescu	what is the pentium 1 doing "instead" ?	[03:30]
asciilifeform	heating the room.	[03:30]
mircea_popescu	instead of what lol. that's the clock rate.	[03:30]
asciilifeform	i mean, it is approximately correct to say that it is discharging heat in the time between ticks	[03:30]
asciilifeform	as the necessary 'instead'	[03:30]
mircea_popescu	well im sure they all maintained metabolic balance throughout.	[03:31]
mircea_popescu	one particular schmuck formulated plans for at least 24 months, at the rate of one a week, to TALK TO this particular whore.	[03:31]
mircea_popescu	he failed, at the end of the reporting period, to have met the bare minimum level of achievement of finding out that the girl was actually working.	[03:32]
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asciilifeform	what would have been the purpose of such an exercise ?	[03:32]
mircea_popescu	dude i dunno, if i spend my time planning how to murder obama and fail to find out he died three years prior as a side product	[03:33]
mircea_popescu	i'd be fucking worried.	[03:33]
asciilifeform	http://i260.photobucket.com/albums/ii18/drmabuse06/TimeTravelHitler.jpg	[03:34]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1zYnDvT )	[03:34]
mircea_popescu	imagine you were going to war in afghanistan and discovered the centcom thought afghanistan is actually in zanzibar ?	[03:34]
asciilifeform	^ obligatory	[03:34]
mircea_popescu	if that happens im fucking defecting, because srsly. finding just one cockroach in the kitchen is one thing, but here we have found a cockroach inside the cockroach and no sign of any kitchens.	[03:35]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 24800 @ 0.00041847 = 10.3781 BTC [-]	[03:37]
asciilifeform	why would someone sit and formulate a 'plan' to talk to a whore ?	[03:38]
asciilifeform	that was the question	[03:38]
mircea_popescu	he DID NOT KNOW THIS	[03:39]
asciilifeform	aha	[03:39]
mircea_popescu	and he failed to find out.	[03:39]
mircea_popescu	which should be informative. i've never spent two years planning on how to fix a window without discovering it really is a door, at some point during all that.	[03:39]
*	asciilifeform suddenly grasps what the story was probably about	[03:39]
mircea_popescu	aha.	[03:39]
mircea_popescu	the process is wholly self-referential. it is in no sense different from the goings on in any insane asylum. you are essentially asking "ok, the sanitariums of the world hold a supply of at least 5000 napoleons. why is there no glorious history being produced ?"	[03:40]
mircea_popescu	i dunno. guess ?	[03:40]
asciilifeform	'insufficient number and quality of bicorns issued to the napoleons'	[03:41]
asciilifeform	moar phunding needed.	[03:41]
mircea_popescu	clearly.	[03:41]
mircea_popescu	and in fact more funding is issued by the long suffering parents, either directly (as is the case in romania) or through collective buying (the state ->taxes->etc in the us).	[03:42]
mircea_popescu	but this can not result in any substantial change, because more effort applied to faulty premise.	[03:42]
assbot	[HAVELOCK] [AM1] 34 @ 0.09331825 = 3.1728 BTC [-] {3}	[03:45]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 18128 @ 0.00041437 = 7.5117 BTC [-]	[03:45]
mircea_popescu	consider the ever popular https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9f06QZCVUHg	[03:45]
assbot	Bryan Adams - Summer of 69 - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1Ad4HIB )	[03:45]
mircea_popescu	now imagine that, through technological advance, there is actually no real job for any of the kids to do. so jimmy does not quit. and consequently jodi has nobody to marry. so she does not. so twenty years later, they are still in that garage, still with that guitar.	[03:46]
mircea_popescu	fingers still bleed.	[03:46]
mircea_popescu	has more music been produced ?	[03:46]
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mircea_popescu	a lot of neuropathy to "explain" and justify it all, sure. but google can sort through all that pretty fast, especially because it being psychogenic rather than rational it is dreadfully boring and entirely predictable.	[03:47]
mircea_popescu	read one police report of crime x, you've read half of them. read ten, you've (practically) read them all. clinical psychology is only interesting to the patently insane, as a practice. otherwise all the notes say endlessly the same five or six things. there just aren't that many things to say.	[03:49]
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mircea_popescu	"and then the engine blew a cylinder". gee.	[03:49]
mircea_popescu	and i'm putting this on my blog.	[03:51]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 21100 @ 0.00040743 = 8.5968 BTC [-]	[04:00]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13471 @ 0.00040058 = 5.3962 BTC [-] {2}	[04:06]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 81179 @ 0.00038973 = 31.6379 BTC [-] {2}	[04:07]
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mircea_popescu	;;later tell joecool http://trilema.com/2015/youve-made-the-bed-enjoy-dying-in-it/ << you've made trilema!	[04:12]
gribble	The operation succeeded.	[04:12]
assbot	You've made the bed. Enjoy dying in it. pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/19mO58w )	[04:12]
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mircea_popescu	http://thelastpsychiatrist.com/2007/03/a_primer_on_pedophilia.html << for the reason, the guy has omfg no idea what he's talking about.	[04:33]
assbot	The Last Psychiatrist: A Primer on Pedophilia ... ( http://bit.ly/1Ad8FB3 )	[04:33]
mircea_popescu	this is the most moldbug-like tlp article so far.	[04:33]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 31950 @ 0.00041131 = 13.1414 BTC [+]	[04:38]
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BingoBoingo	http://www.returnofkings.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/02/child-walk.jpg	[05:19]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1DXromT )	[05:19]
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fluffypony	http://phys.org/news/2015-02-hackers-billion-banks.html	[05:23]
assbot	Hackers steal up to $1 billion from banks, security co. says (Update) ... ( http://bit.ly/1DXrOK7 )	[05:23]
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*	assbot gives voice to RagnarDanneskjol	[05:33]
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mircea_popescu	qntra pls!	[05:52]
*	Now talking on #bitcoin-assets	[13:54]
*	Topic for #bitcoin-assets is: http://bitcoin-assets.com \|\| http://log.bitcoin-assets.com \|\| http://bash.bitcoin-assets.com \|\| http://blogs.bitcoin-assets.com	[13:54]
*	Topic for #bitcoin-assets set by kakobrekla!~kako@unaffiliated/kakobrekla at Wed Mar 5 16:58:12 2014	[13:54]
-assbot-	Welcome to #bitcoin-assets. To get voice (ie, to be able to speak), send me "!up" in a private message to get an OTP. You must have a sufficient WoT rating. If you do not have a WoT account or sufficient rating, try politely asking one of the voiced people for a temporary voice.	[13:54]
*	Adlai likes mckenna's "If the words 'life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness' don't include the right to experiment with your own consciousness, then the Declaration of Independence isn't worth the hemp it was written on."	[13:54]
*	assbot gives voice to mircea_popescu	[13:55]
mircea_popescu	Adlai http://trilema.com/2015/this-is-why-medicine-is-not-a-liberal-profession-but-a-servile-career/ << funnily related, fresh off the presses.	[13:55]
assbot	This is why medicine is not a liberal profession, but a servile career pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1AJnAVm )	[13:55]
Adlai	this footnote density is really outta hand	[13:56]
*	pete_dushenski has quit (Remote host closed the connection)	[13:56]
mircea_popescu	not even the worst offender, that one.	[13:57]
nubbins`	dat lack of credits	[13:58]
nubbins`	i'll read it next week 8)	[13:58]
mircea_popescu	lol send me a copper bitcent, i'llset you up	[13:58]
ben_vulpes	"Why, he will be castigated by the authority, cast out by the other doctors, and no longer be able to call himself a doctor." << rarely happens in the ussa, but this place is a hellhole.	[14:00]
nubbins`	"Have you ever traveled, beyond all mere metaphors, to the Mountain of Shame and stayed for a thousand years? I do not recommend it."	[14:01]
nubbins`	mp addy plox	[14:02]
mircea_popescu	ben_vulpes speaking of that : http://thelastpsychiatrist.com/2007/01/not_competent_to_make_medical.html#comment-26	[14:02]
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assbot	The Last Psychiatrist: Not Competent To Make Medical Decisions? ... ( http://bit.ly/1AJpvcB )	[14:02]
nubbins`	actually i guess i can do this myself right on the page	[14:02]
mircea_popescu	exactly.	[14:02]
mircea_popescu	!up Codmadnesspro	[14:02]
-assbot-	You voiced Codmadnesspro for 30 minutes.	[14:02]
*	assbot gives voice to Codmadnesspro	[14:02]
nubbins`	BUT WHO WILL HOLD MY HAND	[14:02]
mircea_popescu	urc0k ?	[14:02]
Adlai	the cock wagging the hand?	[14:03]
mircea_popescu	why not!	[14:03]
nubbins`	why did this man feel that taking 400mcg of LSD, alone, in a rowboat, in the middle of a lake, in nepal, was a good idea?	[14:04]
nubbins`	ah, youth	[14:04]
mircea_popescu	;;later tell imsaguy http://trilema.com/2011/fetele-bitcoin-ului-episodul-ii/ << hey remember 2011 ?! random commenter dug it up.	[14:04]
gribble	The operation succeeded.	[14:04]
assbot	Fetele bitcoin-ului, episodul II pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1AJq0TV )	[14:04]
mircea_popescu	ben_vulpes but in any case, it probably happens even rarely-er to slavegirls.	[14:06]
nubbins`	hey, it ended with a quote from "the varieties of religious experience"	[14:06]
*	nubbins` highly recommends Sagan's "the varieties of scientific experience"	[14:06]
Adlai	and omitted james's favorite variety.	[14:06]
nubbins`	same lecture series, ~90 years later	[14:07]
Adlai	https://www.erowid.org/chemicals/nitrous/nitrous_article1.shtml	[14:07]
assbot	Erowid Nitrous Vault : The Subjective Effects of Nitrous Oxide, by William James ... ( http://bit.ly/1AJqRnt )	[14:07]
nubbins`	Adlai i can recall trying to explain to someone what it's like being put to sleep by "gas" when in the hospital	[14:07]
nubbins`	after hemming and hawing for a bit, i said "it's like doing whippets until you pass out"	[14:08]
nubbins`	paused to think	[14:08]
Adlai	s/like //	[14:08]
nubbins`	"actually, take the word 'like' out of there"	[14:08]
Adlai	yeah :D	[14:08]
nubbins`	:D	[14:08]
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mircea_popescu	i thought they use simple N2 in those cans, not NO	[14:09]
Adlai	N₂O	[14:09]
mircea_popescu	is it ? but why ?	[14:09]
mircea_popescu	n2 much cheaper, inert.	[14:09]
Adlai	it's kinda illogical for n2 to get you high	[14:10]
Adlai	or rather, the n2 high is the most common one, by faaaaar	[14:10]
Adlai	the default high, if you will.	[14:10]
mircea_popescu	it's kinda illogical to tell me you actually think billions of gallos of heavy duty intoxicant are being sold otc all over the world.	[14:10]
nubbins`	o.O	[14:11]
*	Adlai cited no numbers	[14:11]
nubbins`	...they are.	[14:11]
Adlai	also nitrous isn't that cheap	[14:11]
nubbins`	like a buck a hit!	[14:11]
Adlai	if lsd fun is $2/hr, nitrous is more like $200	[14:11]
nubbins`	^	[14:11]
mircea_popescu	so how much does a can of whipping cream cost ?	[14:11]
mircea_popescu	$79 + tax ?	[14:11]
nubbins`	couple bucks	[14:11]
mircea_popescu	buncha dopeheads.	[14:12]
nubbins`	skip the cream, buy the canisters.	[14:12]
mircea_popescu	and you still think the can's pressurized with n2o ?	[14:12]
Adlai	skip the cannisters, buy the tank	[14:12]
*	nubbins` facepalms	[14:12]
nubbins`	of course it is.	[14:12]
mircea_popescu	because just n2 not good enough ?	[14:12]
danielpbarron	there was a guy with a nitrous tank at porcfest with a group of zombies crowded around it	[14:12]
nubbins`	mircea_popescu it's precisely n2o.	[14:12]
nubbins`	https://www.google.ca/search?q=whipped+cream+canisters&tbm=isch	[14:13]
assbot	whipped cream canisters - Google Search ... ( http://bit.ly/1AJsa5Z )	[14:13]
Adlai	how on earth (the planet with an atmosphere full of nitrogen) would nitrogen gas get you anything other than sober / oxygen deprived	[14:13]
davout	mircea_popescu: you get high from n2 starting at ~4 bar partial pressure iirc	[14:13]
mircea_popescu	so someone sells you $200 an hour stuff at coupla bux a can ?	[14:13]
danielpbarron	the trip lasts about a minute	[14:13]
nubbins`	^	[14:13]
mircea_popescu	Adlai most dopeheads can't distinguish asphyxia from a high.	[14:13]
nubbins`	the trip lasts almost precisely as long as you can hold your breath.	[14:13]
mircea_popescu	^	[14:13]
PeterL	Adlai: oxygen deprivation can feel like getting high?	[14:13]
nubbins`	mircea_popescu FWIW asphyxia is a completely different buzz.	[14:13]
nubbins`	also FWIW as long as your air has, what, 15-20% oxygen, you're fine	[14:14]
Adlai	i'm sorry, but if you can't distinguish o2 deprivation from n2o intoxication, then you've never intoxicated on n2o.	[14:14]
mircea_popescu	get a mass spectrometer, can at it, see if it's n2o or n2 or co2 (more commonly now)	[14:14]
Adlai	they are different	[14:14]
nubbins`	o.O	[14:14]
nubbins`	<--has been high on medical-grade n2o	[14:14]
nubbins`	<--has also tried whippets	[14:14]
danielpbarron	how is it surprising you can get high with whipped cream? you can also make your own ether fairly easily	[14:14]
nubbins`	<--has also held breath til unconsciousness (!)	[14:14]
Adlai	now THAT is impressive willpower	[14:15]
nubbins`	Adlai every day is a winding road	[14:15]
danielpbarron	as a teenager i impressed some friends with that little trick: buy some starter fluid, mix with water in garbage bag, wait for it to settle, drain out the impurities	[14:15]
nubbins`	mircea_popescu while co2 canisters are popular, they're a different size and generally used for paintball/bb guns	[14:15]
mircea_popescu	nubbins` im more talking the industrial side of things here.	[14:15]
mircea_popescu	suppose you have a canning operation.	[14:16]
nubbins`	ok, let's take Air Liquide for an example	[14:16]
nubbins`	;;google air liquide	[14:16]
gribble	Home > American Air Liquide: ; Careers > American Air Liquide: ; Search Jobs and Apply > American Air Liquide:	[14:16]
mircea_popescu	do you buy the expensive and license-requiring n2o, or the cheap atmospheric gas ?	[14:16]
nubbins`	well, it depends. what do i want to use it for?	[14:16]
mircea_popescu	making two buck a can whipping cream	[14:16]
Adlai	fwiw, there's "automotive-grade" and "food-grade" nitrous. the latter is (supposedly) regulated to contain nitrous and not whatever else is cheaper.	[14:16]
mircea_popescu	right.	[14:17]
nubbins`	yeah, "NOS" is n2o.	[14:17]
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Adlai	and yes, if you buy a tank of nitrous oxide, and you don't check what grade it is, you will get sulfur dioxide (or worse) impurities	[14:17]
mircea_popescu	is there also a medical anesthetic ?	[14:17]
mircea_popescu	also regulated, amoing other things, to not be dispensed otc / to unlicensed physicians ?	[14:17]
Adlai	+nubbins` \| <--has been high on medical-grade n2o	[14:17]
nubbins`	most dentist's offices have n2o on tap.	[14:18]
nubbins`	every hospital does.	[14:18]
mircea_popescu	most household bathrooms however do not.	[14:18]
Adlai	;;google cause i'm a dentist	[14:18]
gribble	Little Shop of Horrors I'm a Dentist - YouTube: ; Little Shop of Horrors - Dentist Song - YouTube: ; Little Shop Of Horrors - Dentist! Lyrics \| MetroLyrics:	[14:18]
nubbins`	unless they buy n2o cartridges from the restaurant supply store.	[14:18]
mircea_popescu	for that matter, all hospitals also have morphine on tap.	[14:18]
Adlai	some even have desomorphine!	[14:18]
mircea_popescu	kinda why druggies try to steal from hospitals rather than police stations or courthouses.	[14:18]
Adlai	er, diamorphine	[14:18]
Adlai	i doubt any have deso :P	[14:18]
nubbins`	mircea_popescu plain n2 is probably not fat soluble.	[14:18]
nubbins`	(guessing)	[14:19]
Adlai	... why not?	[14:19]
Adlai	plain n2 is probably anything-soluble	[14:19]
Adlai	(guessing)	[14:19]
mircea_popescu	to get a pressurized container you don't need fat solubility, nor is 2 buck a can whipping creram anything but styrofoam.	[14:19]
mircea_popescu	for that matter, co2 is not bread soluble either, works just fine to leaven bread.	[14:19]
nubbins`	well the fat solubility is what whips the cream.	[14:19]
mircea_popescu	you're nuts.	[14:19]
nubbins`	you're nuts.	[14:19]
nubbins`	add heavy cream to a canister.	[14:19]
nubbins`	add n2o.	[14:19]
mircea_popescu	and shake ?	[14:19]
nubbins`	no.	[14:20]
PeterL	it needs to be non-soluble to make the bubbles	[14:20]
nubbins`	if the container is pressurized, the n2o will dissolve into the cream.	[14:20]
mircea_popescu	sometimes i wish to visit the industrial plants artists would make to support their independent nation	[14:20]
nubbins`	now you have liquid cream filled with n2o.	[14:20]
nubbins`	when this is released into the atmosphere	[14:20]
mircea_popescu	PeterL shut up, he can distinguish highs and also has vision spectrometry built in.	[14:20]
nubbins`	the n2o releases itself from the cream	[14:20]
nubbins`	foaming ("whipping") it in the process	[14:20]
PeterL	I just don't understand how the world works?	[14:20]
nubbins`	srsly, howstuffworks.	[14:20]
mircea_popescu	well, not his.	[14:20]
mircea_popescu	nubbins` and this would not work the same with any other gas.	[14:21]
*	Adlai wonders whether anybody bothered to read william james's gassy babblings. tl;dr: "There are no differences but differences of degree between different degrees of difference and no difference."	[14:21]
nubbins`	mircea_popescu i'd imagine it would	[14:21]
mircea_popescu	so then who thefuck would use anything but either co2 or n2, ie, atmospheric gases.	[14:21]
nubbins`	"it produces whipped cream four times the volume of the liquid, whereas whipping air into cream only produces twice the volume. If air were used as a propellant, oxygen would accelerate rancidification of the butterfat; nitrous oxide inhibits such degradation. Carbon dioxide cannot be used for whipped cream because it is acidic in water, which would curdle the cream and give it a seltzer-like "sparkling" sensation."	[14:21]
mircea_popescu	notice 02 wasn't there. it's obvious why not : fucking expensive. because reactive.	[14:22]
Adlai	related: you want to sell roses in gas stations. q: why would you add a useless hole to your vase? a: because you don't actually want to sell roses, you're selling crack pipes.	[14:22]
nubbins`	of course o2 isn't there	[14:22]
mircea_popescu	right. and ok, co2 is acidic. that leaves n2.	[14:22]
Adlai	but n2 won't bring additional revenue from kiddies looking for kicks	[14:23]
nubbins`	i'm no chemist, but maybe if we asked someone qualified, they'd be able to give an actual answer	[14:23]
mircea_popescu	(kinda why co2 is used in "beverages" - acidity there's a plus)	[14:23]
mircea_popescu	nubbins` like who, PeterL ?	[14:23]
PeterL	I'm thinking about it	[14:23]
mircea_popescu	PeterL do you have a mass spectrometer anywhere ?	[14:23]
nubbins`	i'm not sure why you think there's an industry-wide conspiracy and that all whipped cream canisters are intentionally mislabelled?	[14:23]
nubbins`	that's retarded	[14:23]
PeterL	not since I got laid off a couple weeks ago	[14:23]
nubbins`	like, actually.	[14:23]
mircea_popescu	nubbins` it gets you to buy it, dunnit ?	[14:23]
Adlai	we could also ask google: http://www.justsayn2o.com/nitrous.dairy.html	[14:23]
assbot	Why Is Nitrous Oxide Used In Whipped Cream ... ( http://bit.ly/1AJuRo2 )	[14:23]
PeterL	and I think gas chromatogram is what you are looking for?	[14:24]
mircea_popescu	not a single fmcg item is properly labeled if the dispute is "get nubsy to think it's better than it is"	[14:24]
*	nubbins` sighs	[14:24]
mircea_popescu	PeterL yeah. i r physicist not chemist. and a theoretical one at that >D	[14:24]
nubbins`	so the premium fuel i'm putting into my car is actually regular grade?	[14:24]
mircea_popescu	nubbins` can we now move on to the wrestling dispute ?	[14:24]
nubbins`	sounds like you've got this conspiracy cracked wide open	[14:24]
Adlai	it's actually just nitrogen	[14:24]
Adlai	your car moves by magic	[14:24]
mircea_popescu	no, but it doesn;'t "protect the engine"	[14:24]
nubbins`	right.	[14:25]
mircea_popescu	tho they claim it.	[14:25]
mircea_popescu	and have, for > 50 years.	[14:25]
mircea_popescu	'new formulation, protects the engine!11"	[14:25]
nubbins`	so our options are: (1) n2o is actually n2o and there's a reason why n2 won't cut it. or (2) all n2o is n2, without exception, and every single person who knows this secret isn't telling.	[14:25]
*	nubbins` nods slowly	[14:25]
Adlai	http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/free.png	[14:25]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1AJvgqt )	[14:25]
nubbins`	(2) does sound like the more reasonable one	[14:26]
nubbins`	(1) is suspicious	[14:26]
mircea_popescu	nubbins` our options are, 1) two buck a can items are made with the cheapest possible thing and 2) two buck a can items are made with expensive medicine, because there's a conspiracy to keep kids entertained while they can't legally as much as buy a drink.	[14:26]
Adlai	3) mircea_popescu is trolling nubbins`	[14:27]
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nubbins`	no kidding	[14:27]
mircea_popescu	that goes without saying bitch! :D	[14:27]
nubbins`	anyway	[14:27]
Adlai	yeah but nubbins` seems set on convincing you, rather than trolling along...	[14:27]
mircea_popescu	he's half and half.	[14:27]
nubbins`	Adlai it's one of my failings	[14:27]
mircea_popescu	he was more like 80/20 when he was younger, but he learns.	[14:27]
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PeterL	my guess is that N2o is used because, like propane, it becomes liquid at reasonable pressures	[14:29]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4755 @ 0.00041067 = 1.9527 BTC [-]	[14:30]
Adlai	now let's talk about how danielpbarron passed off diethyl ether as moonshine	[14:30]
nubbins`	fun fact, cooking sprays generally use propane/butane	[14:30]
nubbins`	if you're quick, you can spray some into your mouth and breathe fire	[14:30]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 53645 @ 0.00042221 = 22.6495 BTC [+]	[14:31]
nubbins`	if you're slow, you get a terrible, terrible taste in your mouth without any neat flames	[14:31]
nubbins`	and cooking spray spit all over your house.	[14:31]
nubbins`	at least, that's what i hear.	[14:31]
mircea_popescu	PeterL what's n2 ?	[14:31]
PeterL	n2? nitrogen?	[14:31]
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PeterL	it's a gas	[14:32]
danielpbarron	Adlai, wah? no i didn't	[14:32]
Adlai	:P	[14:32]
danielpbarron	we didn't drink the stuff; we huffed it through a rag	[14:32]
Adlai	did it make you helpless and depraved?	[14:33]
danielpbarron	NO! totally overrated!	[14:33]
mircea_popescu	yes nitrogen. what temp i mean	[14:33]
mircea_popescu	to have a comparison	[14:33]
nubbins`	mircea_popescu, Adlai: in fact, you need 2x the amount of pressure to keep n2 liquid.	[14:33]
nubbins`	so... suck it. ;/	[14:33]
mircea_popescu	yeah, because totally, pressure is unavailable industrially. nobody ever used 2x the pressure to save on 90% the c ost.	[14:34]
*	Adlai sucks in n2, and lets it out	[14:34]
PeterL	not temp, pressure is what is important here, I am looking it up, just give me a sec...	[14:34]
mircea_popescu	at least not prior to 1720	[14:34]
Adlai	danielpbarron: i guess it's lost popularity for good reason	[14:34]
nubbins`	totally, it's the same cost to make a vessel resistant to twice the pressure. 8)	[14:34]
nubbins`	those fools!	[14:34]
nubbins`	nevermind that you're literally rupturing the canisters with a fuckin spike	[14:35]
mircea_popescu	shut up and let the chemist investigate	[14:35]
mircea_popescu	fucking lobbist!!11 THIS IS SCIENCE	[14:35]
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PeterL	critical point for nitrogen is only 125 K, critical point for n2o is about 35 K	[14:36]
nubbins`	oh hi, the rest of freenode	[14:36]
mircea_popescu	PeterL that does anything you figure ?	[14:36]
Adlai	trivia: n2o and n2 were both isolated in the same year, by different chemists. i hope they had a shitfest over who had really isolated nitrogen before realizing they were distinct compounds :D	[14:36]
ben_vulpes	welcome back nubbins`	[14:36]
ben_vulpes	i missed ya	[14:36]
nubbins`	i think this is the second time mp tried to tell me my subective experience was incorrect	[14:36]
mircea_popescu	Adlai they totally did actually, if i recall my biographies correctly.	[14:36]
nubbins`	also the second time i took the bait ;(	[14:36]
nubbins`	feelsbad.png	[14:36]
PeterL	yeah, that means at room temperature you can have liquid n2o, but not liquid n2	[14:36]
mircea_popescu	nubbins` clearly this would be because... your subjective experience... is ...	[14:37]
nubbins`	an affront to your ego	[14:37]
nubbins`	XD	[14:37]
mircea_popescu	PeterL 125 is not quite room temp. more like 273.15	[14:37]
PeterL	right	[14:37]
mircea_popescu	you can have solid fucking hydrogen at room temp if you push it hard enough	[14:37]
PeterL	room temperature is much higher than n2's critical point, but below the critical point of n2o	[14:38]
mircea_popescu	125 and 35 K are both under 0 C ?	[14:38]
nubbins`	hm	[14:38]
PeterL	oops, I meant 35 C for n2o	[14:38]
nubbins`	all the whipped cream is probably using elemental hydrogen as a propellant, then.	[14:38]
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nubbins`	it's cheaper, obvs	[14:38]
mircea_popescu	yeah, good idea, mix K and C that'll result in clarity :D	[14:38]
mircea_popescu	nubbins` nah it'll hydrolize teh vegetal fats	[14:39]
nubbins`	who cares?	[14:39]
Adlai	no, it'll result in a bunch of wildly angry cokeheads	[14:39]
nubbins`	it's just kids	[14:39]
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PeterL	h2 would probly need a catalyst to do anything to your fat	[14:39]
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danielpbarron	maybe there's something to what MP is saying; I can get pretty high from holding my breath while standing up suddenly	[14:39]
mircea_popescu	who ythe fuck knows what's in there tho	[14:39]
nubbins`	i know N2H used to be common for this purpose.	[14:39]
*	mircea_popescu loathes canned cream.	[14:39]
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nubbins`	danielpbarron FWIW this is completely different from n2o buzz 8)	[14:40]
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mircea_popescu	danielpbarron you don't say. try it while ejaculating suddenly sometime.	[14:40]
nubbins`	scroll up, i've passed out from both and can compare	[14:40]
danielpbarron	lol	[14:40]
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nubbins`	bbl things	[14:41]
nubbins`	oh also if any of you are into birds	[14:41]
nubbins`	we have a new batch of books done up	[14:41]
mircea_popescu	birds as in women ?	[14:41]
nubbins`	http://patrick-canning-ppkq.squarespace.com/birdsofnewfoundland/birds-of-newfoundland	[14:41]
assbot	Birds Of Newfoundland — PATRICK THOMAS CANNING ... ( http://bit.ly/1AJz9vG )	[14:41]
nubbins`	birds as in, of a feather	[14:41]
nubbins`	what is this, london in 1960? :D	[14:41]
nubbins`	crikey mate	[14:42]
nubbins`	this bird's gone all uh	[14:42]
mircea_popescu	o hey	[14:42]
*	nubbins` grasps	[14:42]
nubbins`	women's lib-y	[14:42]
nubbins`	or something	[14:42]
Adlai	wodehousian?	[14:42]
nubbins`	there ya go	[14:42]
Adlai	pronounced "wood house in", of course	[14:43]
nubbins`	also MFW i realized the "machismo" of north america in film, tv, commercials, etc etc was a response to second-wave feminism	[14:43]
nubbins`	in the 70s	[14:43]
nubbins`	anyway bbl	[14:43]
nubbins`	neckbeards gonna neckbeard	[14:43]
mircea_popescu	i don't really think "2nd wave" feminism was ever important enough to engender noticeable reaction.	[14:44]
mircea_popescu	obviously current fem derps would very much like to think so, mostly because it involves people they like to promote.	[14:45]
PeterL	so to finalize where I was going, since n2o goes through the gas/liquid transition you can squish much more into the can at a reasonable pressure than n2, and so you get fluffier cream when it comes out of the can. n2 whipped cream would not be fluffy.	[14:45]
Adlai	and it gets you high. who doesn't like products with dual market appeal!	[14:46]
mircea_popescu	i can see it.	[14:46]
mircea_popescu	i guess this drama's dried up, need to move on to something else to keep the btc price up.	[14:47]
PeterL	has nothing to do with solubilizing in the cream	[14:47]
mircea_popescu	how about "I am blocking you due to your association with a argentinian ass bag named MirceaPopescu who has stolen the personal information of many people on fet life and posted it to a web site."	[14:47]
mircea_popescu	my dream is that at some future point two groups of people will beat each other up to cries of "the asshole's a romanian gypsy!" "no he's an argentinian commie!"	[14:48]
Adlai	actually it's a lot worse, he's part of BITCOIN	[14:48]
mircea_popescu	HE FORKED BITCOIN INTO STAYING THE SAME!	[14:48]
PeterL	so mircea_popescu, when are you going to start pushing up the bitcoin price so you can win the berkshire bet?	[14:48]
mircea_popescu	that soudns too much like work.	[14:49]
Adlai	after he's done betting enough that he also wins the billion dollar bet bet	[14:49]
PeterL	have your slaves do it for you?	[14:49]
mircea_popescu	if my work self wins the bet, then that's not really the real me winning	[14:49]
mircea_popescu	i want to win by itself!	[14:49]
Adlai	it's not Work if it pays out in Virtual Currency	[14:50]
mircea_popescu	that's a theory...	[14:51]
PeterL	the only work worth doing is the kind that pays out in bitcoin	[14:51]
ben_vulpes	have we done exercise strategies yet?	[14:52]
ben_vulpes	or macronutrient ratios?	[14:52]
ben_vulpes	lots of lulz and drama to be had there.	[14:53]
mircea_popescu	speaking of macronutrients, http://38.media.tumblr.com/02a5dae6f2717b6f017869b0f09290cf/tumblr_n7gk41YjaL1snq5aro1_400.gif	[14:53]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1AJBV47 )	[14:53]
ben_vulpes	heh great	[14:53]
ben_vulpes	lady v loved cunt-in-a-box btw	[14:53]
mircea_popescu	haha cool.	[14:53]
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PeterL	!up xuthus	[15:03]
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xuthus	o/	[15:04]
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mircea_popescu	mike_c http://thetarpit.org/posts/y01/031-bitcoin-as-infrastructure-iv.html#fn1 << check it out, you had at least one fad!	[15:18]
mircea_popescu	fan*	[15:18]
assbot	The Tar Pit - Bitcoin as infrastructure [iv] ... ( http://bit.ly/1AJHIGY )	[15:18]
mike_c	oh, wow. that's cool :)	[15:19]
mike_c	i take back everything i ever said about footnotes.	[15:19]
mircea_popescu	hahaha	[15:20]
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mircea_popescu	http://41.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_mecsighbsW1ql6862o1_1280.jpg << you can now buy medieval torture devices.	[15:22]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1AJIAeu )	[15:22]
mircea_popescu	much better quality than ximenez ever had.	[15:22]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 44150 @ 0.00042221 = 18.6406 BTC [+]	[15:23]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17151 @ 0.00040839 = 7.0043 BTC [-]	[15:30]
xuthus	mircea you are sick...	[15:31]
mircea_popescu	right now ?	[15:33]
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mircea_popescu	lol	[15:34]
mircea_popescu	!up xuthus	[15:34]
-assbot-	You voiced xuthus for 30 minutes.	[15:34]
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xuthus	yep right now with your toy images	[15:35]
mircea_popescu	i didn'ty make it!	[15:35]
mircea_popescu	i merely report. to inform and entertain! im thye fucking gray lady over here.	[15:36]
xuthus	then you are forgiven	[15:37]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 37450 @ 0.00042221 = 15.8118 BTC [+]	[15:43]
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asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: can only speak for my case, but yes, the culinary shops sell NO2. where i live - in small cylinders approx. the size of a shotgun shell. i know full well which gas it is, because my sole use of it is in a miniature cutting torch.	[16:00]
mircea_popescu	aha!	[16:01]
mircea_popescu	so war on drugs that are powders ? gases are ok ?	[16:01]
mircea_popescu	unrelated lulz : http://thelastpsychiatrist.com/2007/04/inflammable_means_flammable_wh.html#comment-39883	[16:01]
assbot	The Last Psychiatrist: "Inflammable Means Flammable? What A Country!" ... ( http://bit.ly/1CBlB1K )	[16:01]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: laughers can get all the laughing gas they could wish for, yes. i often see these bottles - emptied - lying on the kerb, fallen out of upturned student house dumpsters.	[16:02]
mircea_popescu	whoops... in which we find tlp has 75% fewer comments than trilema over twice the period ? this sucks.	[16:02]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform if i lived there i'd prep my girls with a literful of it in the rectum before going to a student party in one opf those cramped apts like they do.	[16:03]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: for all i know, this is precisely how it is used.	[16:04]
mircea_popescu	kinda discretely fart while standing, right in the face of seated ppl.	[16:04]
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asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: and n2o not no2	[16:08]
mircea_popescu	right, no2 can't even exist.	[16:09]
mircea_popescu	also useful, http://38.media.tumblr.com/00984e56d18f885fdaa213761577a56f/tumblr_mlvpd4F8jh1rvhqkto1_250.gif	[16:11]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1vQ1gsQ )	[16:11]
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ben_vulpes	so war on drugs that are powders ? gases are ok ? << don't forget plants	[16:17]
thestringpuller	ben_vulpes: likes plants	[16:18]
thestringpuller	i kno i do	[16:18]
ben_vulpes	slander!	[16:19]
thestringpuller	:( i thought we were bff ben_vulpes	[16:19]
thestringpuller	I was gonna visit you up in the great NW when I was out in SF in March since its a train ride away.	[16:19]
thestringpuller	I guess no beers.	[16:19]
ben_vulpes	still can if you want to	[16:20]
ben_vulpes	just...slander	[16:20]
thestringpuller	so you don't like plants? I knew you were a 100% carnivore.	[16:23]
thestringpuller	forks! not knives!	[16:23]
asciilifeform	'medieval' pear << a gear puller is almost precisely a pear. visit a bicyclist's shop.	[16:23]
mircea_popescu	;;google Frederick Davidson, 36, grad student in engineering at San Diego State, shoots three professors at his dissertation defense.	[16:23]
gribble	San Diego State University shooting - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: ; Frederick Davidson \| Murderpedia, the encyclopedia of murderers: ; 3 on San Diego State Faculty Fatally Shot - Los Angeles Times:	[16:23]
mircea_popescu	talk about a fckin defense.	[16:24]
mircea_popescu	;;google Dec. 6, 1989: Gamil Gharbi, 25, engineering student at the University of Montreal, kills 13 women and wounds others (he released the men.)	[16:24]
gribble	The Last Psychiatrist: University Shootings: I'm Sure It's All Just A ...:	[16:24]
mircea_popescu	nubbins` also 2nd wave reaction ?	[16:24]
thestringpuller	mircea_popescu: this reminds me of d00d who attacked guy with a katana at Tech. << http://nique.net/news/2010/02/11/officials-release-sword-attack-details/	[16:25]
mircea_popescu	dude so backward can't even get semis ?!	[16:26]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: close quarters, unskilled hands, unarmed target - blade has something to recommend itself over pistol	[16:29]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6500 @ 0.00040839 = 2.6545 BTC [-]	[16:32]
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mircea_popescu	the katana is strictly useful to the skilled hands.	[16:45]
mircea_popescu	the ak-47... less strictly so.	[16:45]
mircea_popescu	it was made for russians after all :D	[16:45]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: strictly... to the skilled hands << against bare flesh ?	[16:46]
mircea_popescu	yes.	[16:46]
mircea_popescu	(for instace : it's trivial to get a blade stuck. say in the rib cage.	[16:46]
mircea_popescu	also trivial to break it, say in the lumbar spine.	[16:46]
mircea_popescu	etc etc. one who's never butchered - say game - doth not readily feel the difficulty of the problem)	[16:47]
mircea_popescu	but anyway, humans aren't "bare flesh" in the sense of, overgrown squid. it's really quite well designed a mechanical apparatus. not least designed to... withstand swords.	[16:47]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: perhaps the ancient art of 'sword test' will be revived one day.	[16:48]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: lol, anybody with a kitchen knows that 'meat' isn't strictly flesh, yes	[16:48]
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mircea_popescu	asciilifeform yes except one pound of prime rib is a) one pound rather than one hundred - and quantity has a quality all of its own - for instance it won't likely spit blood in your eyes ; b) already intensively prepared. for instance ? skin removed.	[16:51]
mircea_popescu	a large part of the problem is similar to why you can't shoot fish worth a crap. skin, muscle, fatand bone have widely variant refractive indexes.	[16:51]
PeterL	mircea_popescu:right, no2 can't even exist. << does exist http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nitrogen_dioxide "reddish-brown toxic gas has a characteristic sharp, biting odor and is a prominent air pollutant."	[16:54]
assbot	Nitrogen dioxide - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ... ( http://bit.ly/1AeZErd )	[16:54]
mircea_popescu	jesus my chemistry's totally forgotten.	[16:55]
PeterL	don't worry, you have me to correct you :)	[16:56]
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mircea_popescu	http://36.media.tumblr.com/41c9f07f7468fc09605f0698ad415ca6/tumblr_mos7vz0RqF1rlxsb8o1_1280.jpg have a pretty blonde with impossible tits as your just reward.	[16:56]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1Af00xU )	[16:56]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: there is a very entertaining comic book (yes) titled 'samurai executioner', about the life and times of a (loosely historic) fella who famously specialized in testing swords on whole bodies (alive and dead).	[16:56]
PeterL	would be funny if some derp snorted NO2 instead of N2O	[16:56]
mircea_popescu	they'd choke	[16:57]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: i learned of it from ilkka kokkarinen. despite the format, worth the evening or two to read.	[16:57]
PeterL	right, not funny for them, funny for us watching	[16:57]
mircea_popescu	asciilifeform unrelatedly, can you imagine that fetlife rebelled, and banned my... acount. but not the ip. i'm still in shock over the fact.	[16:58]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: lulziez	[16:58]
mircea_popescu	sometimes i wonder if the internet itself shouldn't have a bus factor.	[16:58]
mircea_popescu	ie, osama killed off the us simply by flying a bomb disguised as a plane into the us financial nerve center disguised asa building.	[16:58]
mircea_popescu	is the next nut going to end the internet by killing 5k anon people that were 99.x% of all the people who understood how it works ?	[16:59]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: i suspect that 'grandfather time' has already clobbered most of'em	[16:59]
mircea_popescu	well, yes. because in 1970 there were like 100k.	[16:59]
mircea_popescu	down to 5k. like the bitcoin nodes.	[17:00]
mircea_popescu	"all is fine, don't worry, throw LOCs by the thousand million, because it's like a truck, it can hold anything	[17:00]
mircea_popescu	and it's worth doing it for your idiotic "national interests" of trying to hide useful bugs in the morass"	[17:00]
mircea_popescu	in short : once sociopathology is identified, it's god damned everywhere.	[17:01]
PeterL	and it makes work for derpy coders	[17:01]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: speaking of which, gnat built and functions on another box (presently i lack the time to investigate why, but will eventually say)	[17:01]
mircea_popescu	PeterL who all rely on an ununderstood externality.	[17:01]
mircea_popescu	PeterL for some reason i had thought N is trivalent and somehow this made n2o possible but no2 impossible	[17:02]
mircea_popescu	i guess esther n link	[17:02]
mircea_popescu	or how do you call the double link again ?	[17:02]
PeterL	double bond?	[17:02]
mircea_popescu	yes.	[17:02]
mircea_popescu	like acetylene, what's that ?	[17:03]
PeterL	well, there are plenty of compounds that don't have perfect octets for all the atoms	[17:03]
mircea_popescu	ok but generally two hydrocarbons united by a double link at some point are called something no ?	[17:03]
PeterL	ethylene	[17:04]
mircea_popescu	alkyne	[17:04]
PeterL	alkene	[17:04]
mircea_popescu	ok	[17:04]
PeterL	alkyne has triple bond	[17:04]
mircea_popescu	erryday i's learn things i used to know.	[17:04]
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thestringpuller	mircea_popescu: this is how I feel when I listen to your stories MP.	[17:12]
thestringpuller	This channel reminds me of someone holding court.	[17:13]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 23773 @ 0.00042221 = 10.0372 BTC [+]	[17:14]
PeterL	thestringpuller: expound on the court idea?	[17:16]
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thestringpuller	So I guess I visualize the IRC channel as a bunch of people huddled in some large beautiful room. A new person enters and one of the lords is like "you have permission to speak, what have you?" Which reminds me of congregations of days of old.	[17:20]
PeterL	zxs,;2ow[4f6latyrews/qsjde;iuop['f[p	[17:27]
PeterL	ack! 3yo atacking keyboard	[17:27]
mircea_popescu	hello precocious 3yo. signatures already ?	[17:28]
Adlai	Which reminds me of congregations of days of old. << except our doormen are robots	[17:28]
thestringpuller	lol. I can't wait til a large crypto company is left to a precocious 3yo.	[17:29]
PeterL	and there is not one king at the throne, it is more like a council, or the greek forum	[17:29]
thestringpuller	"I want toys. Lets build toys."	[17:29]
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thestringpuller	PeterL: it's more feudal IMO than those examples, but same gist of things.	[17:31]
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mircea_popescu	the lulz thickens http://trilema.com/2015/sooo-fetlife-is-butthurt/	[17:49]
assbot	Sooo... FetLife is butthurt. pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1FjCxA1 )	[17:49]
ben_vulpes	i just tried to share a folder from one mac to another	[17:53]
ben_vulpes	functionality that's worked for what, a decade?	[17:53]
ben_vulpes	fucking nothing.	[17:53]
ben_vulpes	i can see the guy's laptop, can't even open the "dropbox".	[17:53]
ben_vulpes	he can't even see mine from his machine.	[17:53]
ben_vulpes	good job apple.	[17:53]
mircea_popescu	apple just works neh ?	[17:53]
ben_vulpes	way to break functionality that's just worked.	[17:53]
PeterL	does he have sharing enabled on his machine?	[17:53]
ben_vulpes	PeterL: i'm pretty savvy with the os x shit.	[17:54]
ben_vulpes	sharing is on.	[17:54]
ben_vulpes	on mine as well.	[17:54]
ben_vulpes	the amusing thing is how their "airdrop" shit doesn't work either.	[17:54]
ben_vulpes	.1 btc sez it's because i refuse to upgrade to 10.10	[17:54]
mircea_popescu	im not taking that.	[17:54]
PeterL	I am still on 10.5, I don't know anything about the new versions	[17:55]
ben_vulpes	PeterL: kudos to you	[17:57]
ben_vulpes	i dismiss the upgrade notification each and ev-er-y day.	[17:57]
PeterL	not like I did it on purpose, now I can't get any new software	[17:57]
thestringpuller	airdrop is iffy	[17:58]
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thestringpuller	ben_vulpes: Yosemite is the best upgrade evah tho	[18:03]
thestringpuller	that Hand-Off	[18:03]
thestringpuller	and SMS in iMessage for iPhone users	[18:04]
scoopbot	New post on Trilema by Mircea Popescu: http://trilema.com/2015/sooo-fetlife-is-butthurt/	[18:09]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 44118 @ 0.00041815 = 18.4479 BTC [-] {2}	[18:09]
mircea_popescu	o scoopy's back ?	[18:10]
asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: fetlife article << mega-lol!	[18:14]
mircea_popescu	ya srsly.	[18:16]
mircea_popescu	someone drop it on hn, maybe the folk are bored and looking for a rehash of 2005's internet politics ?	[18:16]
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ben_vulpes	reusable code means code you can copy and paste elsewhere in your codebase	[18:37]
mircea_popescu	shoul;dn't that really be a function/object/we ?	[18:54]
mircea_popescu	"Taking Iraq and President Bush as starting points, and examining the defense mechanisms we use to cope with both, yields the unsurprising conclusion that we are a society of narcissists.	[18:56]
mircea_popescu	While this discovery is familiar to readers of my blog, what might be a surprise is what this heralds for our society politically and economically. It isn't socialism, or even communism, as I had feared. It's feudalism. It's not 2007. It's 1066."	[18:56]
mircea_popescu	http://thelastpsychiatrist.com/2007/05/the_wrong_lessons_of_iraq.html << guy knew about 5 years before me.	[18:56]
assbot	The Last Psychiatrist: The Wrong Lessons Of Iraq ... ( http://bit.ly/1FjTOsI )	[18:56]
thestringpuller	ben_vulpes: wish I had bashed that.	[18:57]
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*	assbot gives voice to Adlai	[19:02]
mircea_popescu	http://www.fairfaxunderground.com/forum/file.php?40,file=30897,filename=dre_burning_man.jpg << lol ?	[19:03]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1FjVzX9 )	[19:03]
thestringpuller	holy shit if that's real that's fucking hilarious	[19:05]
thestringpuller	"Wish I was up in that ass."	[19:06]
thestringpuller	I'm totally signing emails to my girl that way for now on.	[19:06]
nubbins`	heh	[19:07]
mircea_popescu	from what i gather dr dre invented the modern, commercial burning man	[19:07]
mircea_popescu	ianae, maybe im being trolled.	[19:08]
nubbins`	just maybe	[19:10]
nubbins`	oh, my pogoplug arrived today!	[19:11]
nubbins`	so tiny	[19:11]
mircea_popescu	thjey're small aren't they	[19:11]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 45448 @ 0.00040944 = 18.6082 BTC [-] {2}	[19:15]
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pete_dushenski	shkoop: http://www.contravex.com/2015/02/16/shame-them-beat-them-parent-them/	[19:18]
assbot	Shame them, beat them, parent them. \| Contravex: A blog by Pete Dushenski ... ( http://bit.ly/1yNRhiv )	[19:18]
pete_dushenski	"Nobody’s really talking about it, but I suspect this is a wider trend: blogs aren’t dying, but they are significantly declining. 2015 might be a rough year."	[19:19]
pete_dushenski	uhuh right	[19:20]
pete_dushenski	i'm sure that using someone else's platform is "just as good"	[19:21]
pete_dushenski	and that shallow splashes in the kiddy pool are going to replace the ocean.	[19:21]
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assbot	[HAVELOCK] [AMHASH1] 3155 @ 0.00075 = 2.3663 BTC [+]	[19:25]
mircea_popescu	o ya, im sure lol.	[19:31]
mircea_popescu	course it's fairly obvious who would be claiming that, and why.	[19:32]
ben_vulpes	shoul;dn't that really be a function/object/we ? << being a bit sarcastic here boss	[19:32]
mircea_popescu	gotta prop up that whatsap pool	[19:32]
mircea_popescu	ben_vulpes oh kk	[19:32]
pete_dushenski	lol yup	[19:32]
ben_vulpes	found thirty lines copied 3 times each	[19:32]
ben_vulpes	variable names changed	[19:32]
ben_vulpes	comment blocks left unchanged	[19:33]
ben_vulpes	oh the life of a webdev monkey	[19:33]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 50950 @ 0.000421 = 21.45 BTC [+] {2}	[19:36]
pete_dushenski	"The U.S. National Security Agency has figured out how to hide spying software deep within hard drives made by Western Digital, Seagate, Toshiba and other top manufacturers, giving the agency the means to eavesdrop on the majority of the world's computers"	[19:36]
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mircea_popescu	lols	[19:40]
pete_dushenski	"It is not clear how the NSA may have obtained the hard drives' source code. Western Digital spokesman Steve Shattuck said the company "has not provided its source code to government agencies." The other hard drive makers would not say if they had shared their source code with the NSA. "	[19:40]
mircea_popescu	derp.	[19:40]
pete_dushenski	ya another wound for the nsa	[19:41]
pete_dushenski	and anyone doing business with the americans	[19:41]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 23500 @ 0.00042221 = 9.9219 BTC [+]	[19:42]
danielpbarron	a hard drive has source code?	[19:42]
mircea_popescu	well they run something on the embedded chips.	[19:42]
pete_dushenski	the firmware for it does	[19:42]
Adlai	my hard drives have tons of source code!	[19:44]
Adlai	is it that hard to imagine that nsa doesn't need the manufacturers' text source to backdoor their drives!?	[19:45]
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Adlai	and even if they did, it's probably faster for them to steal it than ask nicely (not that the latter wouldn't work... it just takes time and paperwork)	[19:46]
mircea_popescu	how does the diddled source end up on the hdds ?	[19:47]
pete_dushenski	The group used a variety of means to spread other spying programs, such as by compromising jihadist websites, infecting USB sticks and CDs, and developing a self-spreading computer worm called Fanny, Kasperky said.	[19:49]
pete_dushenski	Fanny was like Stuxnet in that it exploited two of the same undisclosed software flaws, known as "zero days," which strongly suggested collaboration by the authors,	[19:49]
Adlai	i'm not this kind of 'hacker', but i gather that if you have root access to the computer, you can send arbitrary bits down the bus connected to the hdd	[19:49]
pete_dushenski	from the article: http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/02/16/us-usa-cyberspying-idUSKBN0LK1QV20150216	[19:49]
assbot	Russian researchers expose breakthrough U.S. spying program	[19:49]
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mircea_popescu	Adlai yes, but that does not necessarily replace the firmware.	[19:50]
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mircea_popescu	if it did... think about it.	[19:50]
Adlai	http://spritesmods.com/?art=hddhack&page=3	[19:50]
assbot	Sprites mods - Hard disk hacking - Hooking up JTAG ... ( http://bit.ly/1DzqV9Y )	[19:50]
PeterL	thestringpuller: I figured out why your blog was killing scoopbot: there is no author field included	[19:50]
mircea_popescu	yes but you gotta hook the jtags...	[19:51]
punkman	the hdd manufacturers publish firmware updaters	[19:52]
mircea_popescu	that work off the data bus ?	[19:52]
punkman	pretty sure	[19:52]
mircea_popescu	that's pretty dumb eh.	[19:52]
Adlai	sorry, this one: http://spritesmods.com/?art=hddhack&page=6 "The Western Digital firmware upgrade tools proves this is possible: it's basically a tool you run under DOS to put new firmware to both the flash and the service area aka the reserved sectors of the hard disk."	[19:53]
assbot	Sprites mods - Hard disk hacking - Software flashing ... ( http://bit.ly/1Dzrb8W )	[19:53]
punkman	http://knowledge.seagate.com/articles/en_US/FAQ/207931en	[19:53]
assbot	Firmware Updates for Seagate Products ... ( http://bit.ly/1Dzrgt6 )	[19:53]
punkman	"Until recently, firmware updates for typical desktop and laptop computers were difficult and somewhat risky. This situation, in part, was based on a lack of friendly firmware download tools and operating system limitations. This situation has improved and Seagate now offers firmware updates as a routine matter for the general support of your Seagate drive."	[19:53]
mircea_popescu	i can not begin to conceive how this is an improvement.	[19:54]
pete_dushenski	PeterL: same with my articles then ? author needed ?	[19:54]
Adlai	improvement... because the ceo gets fewer phone calls from usg	[19:55]
PeterL	no pete_dushenski, I still don't know why yours are failing	[19:55]
pete_dushenski	lolk	[19:55]
Adlai	they can backdoor the drive without the ceo having to patch usg through to the cto	[19:55]
pete_dushenski	let this go down in history as a great mystery	[19:55]
Adlai	it's because PeterL doesn't beat scoopbot in public, instead berating the authors	[19:56]
pete_dushenski	like why suleiman didn't try to conquer vienna again	[19:56]
pete_dushenski	Adlai: ha!	[19:56]
pete_dushenski	give scoopbot an old man haircut	[19:56]
pete_dushenski	teach that indignant fuck who's boss	[19:56]
Adlai	spraying water on a puppy's face works wonders, has anybody tried that with brats?	[19:58]
PeterL	I sprayed my cat a couple times to keep her from walking on the dining room table, never tried it with my kids	[19:59]
Adlai	you managed to train a cat!?	[19:59]
Adlai	they must not make them like they used to	[20:00]
mircea_popescu	it's generally better to talk to children	[20:00]
PeterL	well, "train" as in she does not do that one thing which I liked least	[20:00]
Adlai	where is mircea_popescu and what have you done with him!?	[20:00]
mircea_popescu	lol	[20:00]
PeterL	who here has the most kids?	[20:00]
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mircea_popescu	you and mike_c have each one afaik, that being teh record.	[20:01]
pete_dushenski	cazalla has a pair iirc	[20:01]
PeterL	I only have 3 so far	[20:01]
mircea_popescu	cazalla only 1 no ?	[20:01]
pete_dushenski	you're probably right	[20:01]
pete_dushenski	3 takes the cake then	[20:02]
mircea_popescu	only 3 ? dude, you kidding, you're the guy the biological survival of the english speaking world relies on if you have 3. what only/	[20:02]
cazalla	i only have the 1	[20:02]
PeterL	well, only as in I might have more later, and two of my siblings have more than me	[20:02]
cazalla	first and last	[20:02]
mircea_popescu	is it fun ?	[20:02]
pete_dushenski	cazalla: lol colour me shocked	[20:02]
cazalla	it can be lots of fun	[20:03]
PeterL	making kids is fun	[20:03]
Adlai	there should be #bitcoin-asslings with hand-held log readings and condescension seminars	[20:03]
mike_c	i have 1.5	[20:03]
cazalla	pete_dushenski, how do you feel about actually letting the little shits in the playground run amok so that you can gauge how much of a pussy your own kids are if they don't stand up to him?	[20:03]
PeterL	how do you have half a kid?	[20:04]
mike_c	bun in the oven	[20:04]
mircea_popescu	PeterL is this due to some sort of religious belief or just personal preference ?	[20:04]
PeterL	religious belief? more of a cultural thing	[20:05]
pete_dushenski	cazalla: not sure that would determine my kids' pussiness one way or another	[20:05]
pete_dushenski	it may be energetically cheaper to ignore the tard	[20:05]
cazalla	pete_dushenski, well he is either going to turn around and smack the other kid upside the head or allow another kid to hen peck him	[20:05]
PeterL	but yes, a few families at church bigger than mine	[20:06]
pete_dushenski	cazalla: or move to the other side of the playground	[20:06]
pete_dushenski	or ask to go home	[20:06]
cazalla	pete_dushenski, or smash the kid and have him move instead	[20:06]
pete_dushenski	sure	[20:06]
cazalla	i am inclined to let kids sort out their own drama anyway, turns out they usually end up friends by the next day anyway	[20:07]
pete_dushenski	i'm not advocating for helicoptering	[20:07]
mircea_popescu	cazalla that's kinda how it goes yes.	[20:09]
pete_dushenski	cazalla: i could see that	[20:11]
pete_dushenski	as many relationships start	[20:11]
pete_dushenski	guy teases girl, they end up dating, etc	[20:11]
cazalla	well, that's more teenagers	[20:11]
Adlai	anybody read perez's "Technological Revolutions and Financial Capital" ?	[20:11]
cazalla	as i see it, the problems begin when parents/teachers get involved and start teaching the kids it is better to seek out an adult to deal with the bully than hit back and sort it out yourself	[20:11]
Adlai	oh we're discussing Ender's Dilemma now	[20:11]
mike_c	physically fighting bullies has a short lifespan. when you get to high school they get a lot stronger.	[20:11]
cazalla	mike_c, that's what friends are for, real friends, the ones with balls, the ones who will grab his arms from behind while you sock him a couple times	[20:11]
cazalla	what do i know though, only went to naughty boys school for 6 months :P	[20:11]
mike_c	hehe. it's a strategy i suppose.	[20:11]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 61594 @ 0.00042542 = 26.2033 BTC [+] {3}	[20:19]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 71750 @ 0.00043228 = 31.0161 BTC [+] {2}	[20:20]
PeterL	!up copumpkin	[20:22]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 31700 @ 0.00043646 = 13.8358 BTC [+] {2}	[20:23]
cazalla	researching an article and you know what would be good? a wiki of bitcoin companies, who was involved, when they launched/closed etc etc, edited and maintained by a select few	[20:24]
mike_c	somebody was doing that..	[20:25]
mike_c	BingoBoingo: that was you!	[20:25]
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mircea_popescu	lol	[20:31]
mircea_popescu	it would be good. if you have the time/energy, cazalla, it would work well as a companion to qntra.	[20:31]
mircea_popescu	sort-of like that arrington thing worker, we its name was	[20:32]
mike_c	crunchbase	[20:32]
cazalla	crunchbase?	[20:32]
mircea_popescu	right that.	[20:32]
mircea_popescu	yup	[20:32]
mircea_popescu	huge workload tho.	[20:32]
thestringpuller	scoopbot /wind 12	[20:32]
mike_c	smaller if it's crowdsourced	[20:32]
mike_c	a million eyes makes everything easy!	[20:33]
scoopbot	New post on Pull Your Own Strings: http://thestringpuller.tumblr.com/post/111222539949	[20:33]
mike_c	but seriously, if there were an L2 editable repository (like the b-a wiki), I'm sure multiple people would contribute	[20:33]
PeterL	aha, it worked!	[20:33]
thestringpuller	:D	[20:33]
BingoBoingo	mike_c: Pretty sure I threw in the towel because sources that needed consulted were threatening brain damage	[20:34]
lobbes	So getting ZNC configured to use SSL ended up being a great 'introduction project' for learning some of the basics of linux. I would recommend to all the other n00bs out there	[20:35]
cazalla	i actually like the idea, i might brainstorm some ideas and see what i come up with, start by cherring picking the easier topcis such as exchanges	[20:36]
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thestringpuller	pete_dushenski: Child soldiers make the best kids.	[20:38]
pete_dushenski	i'll take your word for it ;)	[20:39]
pete_dushenski	jokes aside, soldiers are obedient and dedicated	[20:39]
pete_dushenski	they appreciate authority and understand hierarchy	[20:40]
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pete_dushenski	so i suppose child soldiers would make decent kids	[20:41]
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mircea_popescu	lobbes wd.	[20:52]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 39466 @ 0.00043797 = 17.2849 BTC [+] {2}	[21:14]
cazalla	anyone able to recommend wiki software?	[21:16]
mircea_popescu	kakobrekla is using something on b-a wiki	[21:18]
mike_c	why not just use the b-a wiki? It already has limited editors.	[21:19]
mike_c	unless it's meant as seo fodder for qntra i guess.	[21:20]
scoopbot	New post on Qntra.net by cazalla: http://qntra.net/2015/02/netagio-to-close-bitcoin-exchange-in-favour-of-fiat/	[21:21]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 70900 @ 0.00043797 = 31.0521 BTC [+]	[21:21]
cazalla	mike_c, that is specific to #b-a moreso than Bitcoin in general isn't it? and anyway, if i pursue this by myself in the short-mid term, it'll reflect on me instead of b-a website	[21:21]
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mike_c	it is specific to bitcoin assets, yes :) History of bitcoin companies seems appropriate. But I think it mostly depends on how much help you want.	[21:29]
mike_c	If you want a bunch of people to contribute, the wiki is there. If you basically want to do it yourself, then sure, put it wherever.	[21:29]
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mike_c	It certainly would tie in with qntra.	[21:30]
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mircea_popescu	http://33.media.tumblr.com/904ca035334c9b3ddba2959a6f7bbef7/tumblr_n7xwm8eVU11sgur0go1_400.gif	[21:33]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1DzMcAh )	[21:33]
mircea_popescu	it could work as a wiki or as a category on qntra i ugess.	[21:33]
thestringpuller	lol furries.	[21:34]
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BingoBoingo	Adlai: is it that hard to imagine that nsa doesn't need the manufacturers' text source to backdoor their drives!? << PC9000	[22:01]
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*	Adlai is too busy doing the victory dance to look this up... he now has two scalpls running in the same lisp image and they're not stepping on eachother's toes	[22:03]
Adlai	last time i tried this, with a financier watching over my shoulder, his bot trod on mine, and after much wailing and gnashing of teeth, both irrevocably crashed... that was nearly 5 months ago. now it's working flawlessly :D	[22:06]
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assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 55889 @ 0.00044511 = 24.8768 BTC [+] {2}	[22:17]
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decimation	that netagio closing is amusing. I wonder what the real story behind it is	[22:23]
decimation	" Market share of Bitcoin trading globally continues to mirror Bitcoin adoption stages, with China leading the way with 67%, the US capturing 27% of all Bitcoin trading, the EU following with 2.5% and the UK with a stagnating 0.25%, mostly as a result of a lack of regulatory guidelines and UK banks withdrawing banking support from British Bitcoin businesses."	[22:23]
mircea_popescu	lmao!	[22:24]
decimation	if those numbers are correct, I wonder why europe is so low?	[22:24]
mircea_popescu	mostly the result of shitty regulation environment and uk people being idiots.	[22:24]
mircea_popescu	decimation europeans are by and large exactly like usians, ie, monolinguistic.	[22:25]
mircea_popescu	with the added disadvantage that they speak obscure languages	[22:25]
decimation	the goldmoney people (who invested in netagio) seem to know what they are doing	[22:25]
decimation	'monolinguistic' in the sense that their opinion was fixed by harvard ca. 1945?	[22:25]
mircea_popescu	tbh, that 67/27/2.5/0.25 thing pretty much exactly matches the map of real gdp	[22:25]
mircea_popescu	no, in the sense that they simply do not know what happens if it wasn't written in hungarian	[22:26]
decimation	I thought that most germans and french spoke english at least	[22:26]
mircea_popescu	or w/e. danish	[22:26]
mircea_popescu	well, most americans speak french	[22:26]
decimation	heh, 'speak'	[22:27]
mircea_popescu	at least if you mean "most of the people makin > 250k and living in a big city"	[22:27]
decimation	but this very parochialism is why bitcoin ought to be attractive	[22:27]
decimation	'maybe people outside hungary will use this new trade coin'	[22:27]
decimation	well, at any rate I give the netagio people credit - they unwound in an orderly way when the business wasn't working out	[22:29]
mircea_popescu	http://www.infobae.com/2015/02/16/1627076-puerto-madero-como-es-el-lugar-donde-encontraron-un-cadaver-incinerado	[22:34]
assbot	Puerto Madero: cómo es el lugar donde encontraron un cadáver incinerado \| La muerte de Nisman - Infobae ... ( http://bit.ly/1FUN7La )	[22:34]
mircea_popescu	that's a new one	[22:34]
decimation	the plaza of the women?	[22:37]
mircea_popescu	yeh	[22:38]
mircea_popescu	i actually walked by there, in the middle of teh night maybe a month or two ago ?	[22:38]
mircea_popescu	but with naked rather than flaming woman in tow.	[22:38]
asciilifeform	hdd firmware << 1) snore. revealed definitively in doc. ~month ago, http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=18-01-2015#981436 2) proven as concept in 'linux on hdd head controller' ~2 yrs ago 3) experimented with privately by numerous folks, incl. yours truly, for a few years before 4) mostly a snore, even the best hdd diddle falls down in a raid5 system	[22:45]
assbot	Logged on 18-01-2015 04:50:24; asciilifeform: http://www.spiegel.de/media/media-35661.pdf << the document concerning specific doctored firmware	[22:45]
mircea_popescu	i still don't see the wisdom of allowing diddling of firmware via data bus.	[22:49]
asciilifeform	whizzdom	[22:50]
mircea_popescu	yeah well...	[22:50]
asciilifeform	and now that the multivendor diddlomatic is out, winblows users will get what they so persistently beg for	[22:50]
asciilifeform	(by remaining winblows users, that is)	[22:50]
asciilifeform	it'll be in every ring0 turd on the planet before the year's out, possibly.	[22:51]
asciilifeform	(and yes, virtually all extant hdds are trivially reflashable.)	[22:52]
asciilifeform	of the handful of vendors whose drives i have studied personally, not one used a signature scheme of any kind, for example	[22:54]
asciilifeform	anyone who has ring0 on the box and can send raw ata cmds. can flash.	[22:54]
BingoBoingo	Reflashing firmware is one of those things that should require a goat sacrifice. Fort Mead would smell better.	[22:54]
asciilifeform	if there exists, somewhere, a maker of drives which demand signatures - usg is the first to get a copy of the key, to no one's great surprise	[22:55]
asciilifeform	BingoBoingo: what is the reason why it should not be a mask rom ?	[22:55]
asciilifeform	i can see no legit reason to ship a drive with buggy firmware.	[22:55]
asciilifeform	it is done, like the 'anal child' in mircea_popescu's essay, 'because they can get away with it'	[22:56]
asciilifeform	(not news) usg really loves rc5 and rc6 as non-attributable stream ciphers	[22:57]
BingoBoingo	asciilifeform: No particular reason. Makes Data recovery stuff easier with PC9000. Also creates a market for that kind of data recovery when firmware makes drive shit the bed.	[22:57]
asciilifeform	if these produce statistical anomalies (distinguishable from white noise) as rc4 is known to, this'd be a good avenue to search for 'mouse droppings' in the wild.	[22:58]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 34400 @ 0.00044645 = 15.3579 BTC [+] {2}	[23:01]
decimation	re: diddling firmware via data bus << in band signaling strikes again	[23:02]
asciilifeform	updatable via the bus for the same reason as everything else: so lusers can update from winblows	[23:03]
asciilifeform	without even having to contemplate opening the chassis, in which, as is known, daemons live	[23:03]
decimation	of course, the drive manufacturers couldn't put a switch or toggle on the front of the computer	[23:05]
asciilifeform	It Would Be Wrong (TM)	[23:05]
decimation	in a similar way that allowing the user to enter their own cryptography via a separate front panel would be wrong	[23:06]
asciilifeform	^ specifically prohibited in the export control statute	[23:06]
asciilifeform	by name.,	[23:06]
decimation	gee I wonder why	[23:06]
asciilifeform	'It is not clear how the NSA may have obtained the hard drives' source code.' << wtf	[23:07]
asciilifeform	who needs the source?	[23:07]
*	asciilifeform didn't	[23:07]
BingoBoingo	So Free world chip foundries are what, 5 to 20 years out?	[23:07]
decimation	asciilifeform: it's impossible to analyze the rom contents of a simple microcontroller	[23:07]
asciilifeform	granted, some of the drives had weird variations on the usual themes (say, dual mips cores with oodles of proprietary coprocessor regs)	[23:07]
asciilifeform	but nothing especially 'martian'	[23:08]
decimation	hell I bet some of them have a flash chip sitting there	[23:08]
asciilifeform	BingoBoingo: unless you know something i don't, they're $maxint years out	[23:08]
asciilifeform	BingoBoingo: not even the theoretical basis for contemplating such a thing, presently exists.	[23:08]
asciilifeform	decimation: most of'em.	[23:08]
BingoBoingo	asciilifeform: it's impossible to analyze the rom contents of a simple microcontroller << Once again PC9000. Russian product that basically lets anyone who can understand the interface su all over the hdd firmware.	[23:09]
asciilifeform	BingoBoingo: no need for weird winblows crapware	[23:09]
decimation	yeah I was being sarcastic	[23:09]
asciilifeform	BingoBoingo: connect a ttl-to-serial voltage converter to the convenient debug pins, and have at it	[23:09]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 87744 @ 0.0004482 = 39.3269 BTC [+] {2}	[23:09]
asciilifeform	earlier today someone reposted the famous (~2yr.) link of demo where linux is installed on the head controller	[23:10]
decimation	there are many ways to map machine code to assembly to pseudo-c	[23:10]
asciilifeform	decimation: generally no one does this. folks read the asm straight	[23:10]
decimation	'fits in head'	[23:10]
asciilifeform	http://ep.yimg.com/ay/yhst-14437584971410/91401152-7.gif	[23:10]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1vQZ98c )	[23:10]
asciilifeform	^ convenient illustration	[23:10]
asciilifeform	pulled it straight out of arse	[23:10]
asciilifeform	http://g04.s.alicdn.com/kf/HTB1aHXaGXXXXXbnXVXXq6xXFXXXr/201052183/HTB1aHXaGXXXXXbnXVXXq6xXFXXXr.jpg	[23:11]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1vQZd7T )	[23:11]
asciilifeform	and $maxint more	[23:11]
asciilifeform	read with what?	[23:12]
asciilifeform	with one of these:	[23:12]
asciilifeform	http://i.ebayimg.com/00/s/MTI4OVgxNjAw/z/lDUAAOxyRhBSs3Px/$_35.JPG	[23:12]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1vQZjwl )	[23:12]
asciilifeform	^ useful household tool, everyone should own	[23:12]
decimation	I would like to get a collection of 'chip clips'	[23:12]
asciilifeform	used as such - https://farm9.static.flickr.com/8483/8250761184_8a3331953d.jpg	[23:13]
BingoBoingo	BingoBoingo: connect a ttl-to-serial voltage converter to the convenient debug pins, and have at it << PC9000 largely valued because drive plugs in to IDE or SATA ports in this ISA/(hopefully there's a PCI version by now) card. Boot to card. Diddle at leisure with curses interface. Most operations automated already.	[23:13]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1vQZnfr )	[23:13]
*	Transisto has quit ()	[23:13]
decimation	asciilifeform: what do you think the best method would be to semi-permanently attach a lead to an smt chip pin? I tend to ruin the pad by soldering	[23:15]
decimation	I wonder if there's like a little mini-clamp that you can affix to a pin	[23:15]
asciilifeform	logic analyzers come with 'crocodiles' for single pins but no real use for high-pitched smt	[23:18]
asciilifeform	and no real use for high frequencies	[23:18]
BingoBoingo	So OpenBSD 0.7.2 qt build 17 hours without an OOM kill (returned to 512MB process limit a while back) Presently a June 15th, 2013. Seems the space for bastards to be introduced has shrank enough to make bastards moar manageable.	[23:18]
asciilifeform	gotta solder them or use a properly fitted clip like in the photo	[23:18]
asciilifeform	the soic-8 one pictures costs around $10.	[23:19]
decimation	yeah that's what I figured	[23:19]
ben_vulpes	Adlai: what's the goal of running multiple bots in the same lisp image?	[23:20]
ben_vulpes	what does it buy one?	[23:20]
Adlai	share code & data	[23:20]
ben_vulpes	ah ha	[23:20]
Adlai	remember, my "server" is a thinkpad ca 2002, so every cons counts	[23:21]
*	NewLiberty (~NewLibert@99-48-178-219.lightspeed.irvnca.sbcglobal.net) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[23:22]
ben_vulpes	i'd no idea, actually.	[23:22]
ben_vulpes	re: bastards, has anyone experimented with the number of blocks requested?	[23:24]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 90850 @ 0.00043356 = 39.3889 BTC [-]	[23:24]
ben_vulpes	'tis another knob to turn. if instead of rewriting the bastard storage mechanism, one could leverage the network protocol to reduce the number of bastards per wad sent over the wire, it might alleviate some pain.	[23:25]
asciilifeform	ben_vulpes: regardless of what else, the unbounded data structure has to go	[23:25]
*	BingoBoingo sad Tadpole laptops still sell for effectively $maxint	[23:26]
asciilifeform	ben_vulpes: it's a 'not whether death, but when' sorta thing	[23:26]
BingoBoingo	http://www.ebay.com/itm/Tadpole-RDI-General-Dynamics-UltraBookIIi-UltraSPARC-Solaris-UNIX-Laptop-/161106196715?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2582ad78eb	[23:26]
assbot	Tadpole RDI General Dynamics Ultrabookiii UltraSPARC Solaris Unix Laptop \| eBay ... ( http://bit.ly/1vR0ETZ )	[23:26]
asciilifeform	15k!	[23:26]
asciilifeform	a bit much even for most museums.	[23:26]
asciilifeform	you can get any lisp machine ever made, for example, with a crate of parts to last you a lifetime, for half of this	[23:27]
BingoBoingo	Seriously	[23:27]
asciilifeform	mega-lol in the 'faq' on that listing ^	[23:27]
asciilifeform	'QUESTION: Are you insane? Are you stupid? No one would ever pay this much for a laptop! You should sell it to me for $10 because it is so old and worthless. / ANSWER: Contrary to your opinion, I sell several of these machines per week. These machines are used for many reasons including: / Government & Military projects ...'	[23:28]
BingoBoingo	Even Beastmode looks like it comes to under $500 with shipping http://www.ebay.com/itm/SUN-Ultra-80-Server-Quad-450MHz-4GB-Memory-73GB-HD-/380342615233?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item588e2fbcc1	[23:29]
assbot	Sun Ultra 80 Server Quad 450MHz 4GB Memory 73GB HD \| eBay ... ( http://bit.ly/1vR0X0P )	[23:29]
asciilifeform	BingoBoingo: my uni threw out pallets of these	[23:29]
BingoBoingo	asciilifeform: One Uni I attended at last visit earlier this year still has lab full of its wimpier contemporary	[23:30]
*	asciilifeform doesn't see the appeal of closed source unixen, no matter how he tries	[23:30]
asciilifeform	regardless of on what chip, etc.	[23:30]
BingoBoingo	That lab "engineering building Floor one at SIU Carbondale, forget which wing" still solaris lab. I like the hardware though for "lives forever" and other unixen run fine	[23:32]
BingoBoingo	WHat lab is full of http://www.ebay.com/itm/Sun-Ultra-60-Workstation-2x-450MHz-2GB-RAM-73GB-HD-/380274164694?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item588a1b43d6 << Not same price as Ultra 80 which is twice the processors of this one	[23:33]
assbot	Sun Ultra 60 Workstation 2X 450MHz 2GB RAM 73GB HD \| eBay ... ( http://bit.ly/1zjKGgK )	[23:33]
asciilifeform	BingoBoingo: the best way to get something like this is to be there when folks are throwing them out by the tonne	[23:36]
asciilifeform	e.g., when i did	[23:36]
BingoBoingo	I'm waiting for them to hit the dumpster	[23:36]
BingoBoingo	Don't know if they ever will	[23:37]
BingoBoingo	Connects on campus have yet to send the flag and since on every visit lab still intact I assume they aren't slacking	[23:38]
*	asciilifeform fucking hates slowaris	[23:40]
asciilifeform	the boxes were ok.	[23:40]
asciilifeform	the folks running ancient closed-source unixen today do so 'not from a good life'	[23:41]
asciilifeform	but because forced to on account of working for usg or having to use some likewise closed turdware (usually also because, ultimately, usg)	[23:42]
asciilifeform	or, i suppose, archaeologists	[23:42]
BingoBoingo	Thankfully other Unixen work on the boxes	[23:42]
asciilifeform	^ vms, for instance, is an interesting os - conceptually, and i have it one one of my 'alpha'	[23:42]
asciilifeform	http://i.4cdn.org/g/1424118682210.png << l0lz	[23:43]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1vR2AvI )	[23:43]
asciilifeform	http://i.4cdn.org/g/1424118770173.png << m0ar	[23:43]
assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1vR2C6E )	[23:44]
*	Vexual (~v@unaffiliated/vexual) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[23:45]
BingoBoingo	Quest for "real-ish computer" which can handled contemporary amounts of RAM and HDD space is arduous search	[23:45]
BingoBoingo	!up Vexual	[23:45]
*	assbot gives voice to Vexual	[23:45]
*	Dr-G2 (~Dr-G@gtng-d9bf7143.pool.mediaways.net) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[23:45]
asciilifeform	BingoBoingo: realize, if you get off modern turdware (incl. graphical www), you almost certainly don't need so much as 1GB for anything	[23:46]
asciilifeform	unless you're into physics sims	[23:46]
BingoBoingo	asciilifeform: Blockchain parsing	[23:46]
asciilifeform	the entire ussr never had, quite likely, 1g of ram between it	[23:46]
asciilifeform	BingoBoingo: what do you need to do with the blockchain that can't be done 1G at a time ?	[23:47]
asciilifeform	(just picked this number more or less arbitrarily)	[23:47]
BingoBoingo	More RAM makes Electrum server more feasile. Not to run the server for the wallet mind you, but because of the queryable database of blockchain data.	[23:48]
*	Dr-G has quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)	[23:48]
decimation	"asciilifeform doesn't see the appeal of closed source unixen" << I see the appeal of actual people maintaining a unix, closed or open	[23:48]
Adlai	somehow git gets by without an in-memory index, i wonder how!	[23:49]
asciilifeform	slowaris is maintained somewhere ?	[23:49]
asciilifeform	or hpux ?	[23:49]
decimation	not anymore, but in its day it sorta was	[23:49]
BingoBoingo	Open Indiana et al	[23:49]
Adlai	( `ls .git/objects` reveals how)	[23:49]
decimation	although the rumor I heard back then was that most of the 'smart guys' working on solaris were spending their working days trying to unravel the gordian knot of kernel locks	[23:50]
asciilifeform	while everyone knows the caveats of the 'million fly eyes', the concept of closed source os is really dead forever - as far as thinking folks are concerned	[23:50]
decimation	asciilifeform: also, the 'spiritual heir' of solaris is maintained by those 'joyent' people	[23:50]
asciilifeform	lol yes	[23:50]
BingoBoingo	Shame the solaris 10 with the SMF turd introduced was the only "open" one and likely inspired so many systemdevaintisms	[23:50]
asciilifeform	decimation: corpses don't get to decide what to be eaten by, ants, vultures, cannibals	[23:51]
assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 54942 @ 0.00043273 = 23.7751 BTC [-] {3}	[23:51]
decimation	asciilifeform: the concept of a closed design chip is dead forever too	[23:52]
decimation	doesn't stop it from being undead	[23:52]
BingoBoingo	although the rumor I heard back then was that most of the 'smart guys' working on solaris were spending their working days trying to unravel the gordian knot of kernel locks << But as an Oracle turd they can now break whatever they want in the name of handling one database faster.	[23:53]
asciilifeform	until ic can be fabbed in a kitchen - it's alive	[23:53]
decimation	can fab a board full of 74xx logic :)	[23:53]
Vexual	Im not melting silcon in mine.	[23:56]
*	sergiohlb (~Sergio@189.61.252.71) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[23:56]
*	sergiohlb has quit (Changing host)	[23:56]
*	sergiohlb (~Sergio@unaffiliated/sergiohlb) has joined #bitcoin-assets	[23:56]
Vexual	Aluminum was bad enough	[23:56]
BingoBoingo	asciilifeform: So killed Dbus this weekend on my OpenBSD install. Only thing asking for DBUS when invoked is Emacs, works fine without DBUS though.	[23:56]
decimation	I'm surprised dbus comes with openbsd at all	[23:57]
BingoBoingo	decimation: Mtier and Gnome	[23:57]
decimation	ah so it's in a 'port'	[23:58]
BingoBoingo	Mtier = Golden toilet company that sells exportable installs of desktop systems for oil rigs et al makes Gnome a centerpiece of their OpenBSD desktop solution.	[23:59]
BingoBoingo	Mtier makes many of the OpenBSD port	[23:59]
BingoBoingo	s	[23:59]
BingoBoingo	so when they make ports, dbus	[23:59]

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