Forum logs for 03 Jan 2019

Monday, 16 March, Year 12 d.Tr. | Author:
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform i don't get it, what about it ? [01:54]
diana_coman: mod6, http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/2019-January/000321.html gives me http://p.bvulpes.com/pastes/aaNkK/?raw=true [02:19]
feedbot: http://bimbo.club/2019/01/part-i-if-im-lucky/ << Bimbo.Club -- Part I - if im lucky [04:55]
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-01-03#1884045 << heathen www, hosted on garbage hoster, but turned out to be packed full of useful retro-comp tidbits, is all. [09:58]
a111: Logged on 2019-01-03 06:54 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform i don't get it, what about it ? [09:58]
asciilifeform: diana_coman: looks like ml not yet moved to pizarro, it's still hosted wherever it was that jurov had it [09:59]
asciilifeform: ( lulazon iirc ) [09:59]
diana_coman: I was under the impression it moved [10:04]
asciilifeform: loox like only the trb www moved, ml was on separate box, still needs moving. [10:23]
BingoBoingo: !Xview 1027 [10:53]
auctionbot: Buy order # 1027: 2k wired Filthy Fiats Opening: 540mn ecu Leading Bid: None Ending: 2019-01-04 10:08:07.710708 UTC (30 hours 11 mins) [10:53]
diana_coman: asciilifeform, you broke all your links on your www to FFA code on btcbase when you changed the name of vpatches because of keccak vs sha: e.g. btcbase.org/patches/ffa_ch7_turbo_egyptians/tree/ffa/ffacalc/cmdline.ads#L42 in Ch8 404s now because no ".kv" [11:33]
asciilifeform: diana_coman: hm , i thought phf had the older ones still in there [11:34]
asciilifeform: diana_coman: i'ma have to fix by hand. [11:35]
diana_coman: well, it's meant as replacement not as alternative so I don't see why would one keep the sha patches onth replacement in place aka no name change doesn't break anything either [11:36]
asciilifeform: diana_coman: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-09-26#1854819 [11:38]
a111: Logged on 2018-09-26 22:00 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: prolly like most folx who actually work on proggies, asciilifeform has '9000' vtrees on various disk, on various boxen, that are in classical format, and many not even intended for publication, the ones that see daylight naturally will become newtype [11:38]
asciilifeform: but i'ma have to fix the links. [11:39]
asciilifeform: ( will replace'em all to ch11-and-up-style links to gnathtml-generated snapshots. ) [11:39]
asciilifeform: ty for the eggog report, diana_coman [11:40]
diana_coman: np and yes, I know how/why .kv [11:42]
asciilifeform: btw, to round off yesterday's http://btcbase.org/log/2019-01-03#1884041 , culprit is https://www.spinics.net/lists/linux-scsi/msg08419.html ( 12 yrs! and still not fixed, apparently. ) [11:48]
a111: Logged on 2019-01-03 02:19 asciilifeform: aalso i spoke too soon, it stops mid through boot, dun see cd drive. [11:48]
asciilifeform: box is dead in the water on apparently all linux kernels since ~2006ish, and seems like nobody gives a fuck. [11:49]
asciilifeform: diana_coman: i fixed the links by hand, there were only a handful. [11:56]
diana_coman: asciilifeform, phf updated with my sigs for FFA ch7 and ch8: http://ossasepia.com/reference-code-shelf/#selection-627.0-665.43 [11:56]
asciilifeform: plz lemme know if it turns out that missed one. [11:56]
asciilifeform: congrats diana_coman ! [11:56]
diana_coman: ch8 was esp easy :P [11:57]
asciilifeform: diana_coman: any interesting finds/nitpicks ? [11:57]
diana_coman: apeloyee beat me to the cut nothing else so far [11:57]
asciilifeform: aite [11:57]
asciilifeform: ty for putting in the sweat, diana_coman [11:57]
asciilifeform: currently yer the champ in ffaology. [11:58]
diana_coman: actually rather curious why doesn't apeloyee sign what he reads [11:58]
asciilifeform: this, i do not know [11:58]
asciilifeform: given as the fella didn't end up sticking to republic, i dun expect we'll ever find out. [11:59]
asciilifeform: btw diana_coman -- your earlier nitpicks made it in to 14b. [12:00]
diana_coman: cool one day I'll make it to ch14b too, lol [12:01]
asciilifeform: no need to hurry. [12:01]
asciilifeform: ftr i very much appreciate all nitpicks, even purely stylistic ones, an explicit objective of ffa is to be not only bug-free but entirely clean of sharp edges, to the extent possible on the available irons. [12:02]
diana_coman: the trouble is that "sharp edges" are quite often operator-shaped as it were [12:03]
diana_coman: ftr I had to refresh a bit on Knuth Vol 2 at some point but I don't see that as a minus at all [12:03]
asciilifeform: almost always sharp edge is invisible to the orig author, who 'knows where not to run fingers' [12:03]
asciilifeform: hence the importance of other thinking folx giving the thing a thorough walk. [12:04]
asciilifeform: diana_coman: where at all possible, i tried to use ~simpler~ algo than what was given by knuth. e.g. karatsuba without moving pivots. [12:04]
diana_coman: if nitpick at all, the one thing that consistently nags at me (though for which I can't make up my mind as to actual solution) is the implicit reliance on indices to be in fact starting from 1 when copying stuff e.g. http://btcbase.org/patches/ffa_ch7_turbo_egyptians.kv#L187 [12:06]
diana_coman: asciilifeform, yes, it was rather basic stuff but the fact is that I read Knuth ~10 years ago so refresh was long due [12:07]
diana_coman: re nitpick: in my code I tend to keep to XS'First..XS'First+X'Length but it does make it ugly & long [12:08]
asciilifeform: diana_coman: where this appears, it is a concession to 1) speed 2) brevity of code . where the indexing of the array is known, because it is a local buffer, it is referred to explicitly invocations X'First, X'Last, etc cost measurable cpu, it turned out. but where indexing is not known ( e.g. if operand may be part of a karatsuba ) , there it is unavoidably X'First etc. [12:08]
asciilifeform: as i've said previously, ffa post-ch6 is largely an 'uglification' to buy usable performance on pc. [12:09]
diana_coman: heh, talked in parallel there I know and that's why I did not mention it at all at first it was just because you asked for as much nitpick as possible, so now it's at least said [12:09]
asciilifeform: i took the approach where i built the thing maximally-compactly, and then proceeded in direction of 'now let's make it go in less than geological time'. [12:09]
asciilifeform: diana_coman: in fact i did ask and happy to have it. [12:10]
asciilifeform: imho the de-facto convention i proposed is reasonable tho -- if the array is a local creation, and its indexing is known, then to refer to it explicitly is permissible. otherwise, not. [12:11]
asciilifeform: if diana_coman et al find instance where i deviated from said convention ( and not fixed in current spearhead ) -- i would like to know about it. [12:11]
asciilifeform: btw no doubt must remain whatsoever re this point in the mind of anyone contemplating switching off the range checks in their build (this buys ~2x 'phree' speedup) [12:12]
asciilifeform: diana_coman: when you read ch10, you will find that i had to rewrite some of the basic arithm logic, so as to remove dependence on indexing. [12:14]
asciilifeform: when i started with adaism, i initially found the preservation of indexing in array-slices annoying. but then saw the wisdom, it whips programmer into having a much firmer grasp of wtf he is doing. [12:15]
asciilifeform: ( it also buys the ability to know where in array you are, without 'pointerisms' ) [12:17]
feedbot: http://qntra.net/2019/01/usg-today-two-years-of-divided-congress-begins-partial-shutdown-continues-while-trump-remains-unfulfilled/ << Qntra -- USG Today: Two Years Of Divided Congress Begins, Partial Shutdown Continues While Trump Remains Unfulfilled [12:22]
feedbot: http://qntra.net/2019/01/france-macron-arrests-particularly-loud-yellow-jacket-protestor-demands-french-people-in-france-submit-to-foreign-world-order/ << Qntra -- France: Macron Arrests Particularly Loud Yellow Jacket Protestor, Demands French People In France Submit To Foreign World Order [12:50]
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-01-03#1884066 << aand to properly round off the thread, that box nao runs openbsd ( which worx 100% ) , for nao. [13:33]
a111: Logged on 2019-01-03 16:48 asciilifeform: btw, to round off yesterday's http://btcbase.org/log/2019-01-03#1884041 , culprit is https://www.spinics.net/lists/linux-scsi/msg08419.html ( 12 yrs! and still not fixed, apparently. ) [13:33]
asciilifeform: that thing has stupendously loud hdd, incidentally -- i can hear it from three rooms. [13:33]
mircea_popescu: jesus that was the era of loud hdds [13:34]
asciilifeform: 1 of those 15,000rpm scsi items. ( 'alpha' is moar or less the 'money no object' box from late '90s-early-2000s, tended to have the most outlandish periphs [13:34]
asciilifeform: the spindle sounds like dental drill, the head motor -- like door buzzer. [13:35]
asciilifeform: and guten tag mircea_popescu ! [13:35]
mircea_popescu: :) [13:36]
* asciilifeform trimmed iron stash down to 2 'alphas', 1 runs barbaric 'tru64' (for that bolix emulator), 1 nao set up for 'ffa on arch that aint x64 or arm' tests laters [13:36]
mircea_popescu: next we're going to dig up a 1990 era soviet stolen sub to run it on their handcranks also. [13:37]
mircea_popescu: in other news, i look at the time, and it's 13:37. [13:37]
asciilifeform: they're nifty boxes, in some ways (e.g. http://btcbase.org/log/2018-12-01#1877067 , and the mobo slides in and out without tools ) [13:37]
a111: Logged on 2018-12-01 01:22 asciilifeform quite fond of alpha, the architecture book was ~thin~ [13:37]
asciilifeform: lol [13:38]
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i won't know whether the 'constanttimeism litmus' actuallyworx, until i dredge up an iron where it outputs negative [13:39]
mircea_popescu: not much of a priority. [13:39]
asciilifeform: not burning, no. [13:40]
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-01-03#1884048 << oh i see. i just saw a "omfg my traffux" dork "blogger" typical piece, the numbers seemed low for a month of amateur bloggership so had to take a 2nd look, turned out they're FOR THE YEAR, what can yo9u do. [13:41]
a111: Logged on 2019-01-03 14:58 asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-01-03#1884045 << heathen www, hosted on garbage hoster, but turned out to be packed full of useful retro-comp tidbits, is all. [13:41]
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i can count on fingers of 1 hand how many times i dig up on 'lone man net' sumthing useful, in a yr [13:42]
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-01-03#1884059 << yes, but he gotta invent problems for himself. which he does at an amazing rate, ~comparable to his capacity for solving problems. after all, stability is self-enforcing. [13:42]
a111: Logged on 2019-01-03 16:36 diana_coman: well, it's meant as replacement not as alternative so I don't see why would one keep the sha patches onth replacement in place aka no name change doesn't break anything either [13:42]
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform i believe, but maybe deep link to the something useful. [13:43]
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-01-03#1884068 << i don't expect any of the ten thousand fly eyes has a dec, ever had a dec, or can come up with any actual use for a dec. or for that matter care to know whether their code doesn't work at all. different paradigm!!! [13:45]
a111: Logged on 2019-01-03 16:49 asciilifeform: box is dead in the water on apparently all linux kernels since ~2006ish, and seems like nobody gives a fuck. [13:45]
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: well ~that~ d00d has dec. and even dec vax, and ports various soft to'em. [13:45]
mircea_popescu: not bad. [13:46]
asciilifeform: largely archaeological interest ( tho he also has some 'modern-day' items, bypasses for winblowz 'seekoority', etc . overall surprisingly high snr. ) [13:46]
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-01-03#1884081 << any reason you believe this ? (i have nfi, there's some obligation to participate in the sense of weighing in on decisions for the lordship, but afaikl dude never was/wanted to be, and for the citizenry at large there's no such thing is there ?) [13:46]
a111: Logged on 2019-01-03 16:59 asciilifeform: given as the fella didn't end up sticking to republic, i dun expect we'll ever find out. [13:46]
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: fwiw i do not know whether he tuned out entirely, or lurks, or which. [13:47]
asciilifeform: only that he hasn't been seen since... [13:47]
asciilifeform: !#seen apeloyee [13:47]
a111: 2018-01-17 <apeloyee> !#s whisperers [13:47]
mircea_popescu: keks nice final note. [13:47]
mircea_popescu: anyway, many people took yearish hiatuses, mats recently emerged after a slumber for eg. [13:48]
asciilifeform: i admit that i'd be delighted to see apeloyee return he was '9000 level' useful d00d. [13:48]
asciilifeform: wb Mocky [13:50]
Mocky: thx asciilifeform [13:50]
lobbesbot: Mocky: Sent 19 hours and 34 minutes ago: <mircea_popescu> further issue with bot for your list : if it dings two skills, it only trains one. really it should have a check ~before~ crafting whether it can do any skill upgrading somehiow. [13:50]
mircea_popescu: !!up stratum [13:50]
deedbot: stratum voiced for 30 minutes. [13:50]
mircea_popescu: anyone knows who this is then ? [13:51]
* asciilifeform does not [13:51]
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-01-03#1884083 << bwahahaha. [13:51]
a111: Logged on 2019-01-03 17:01 diana_coman: cool one day I'll make it to ch14b too, lol [13:51]
Mocky: oh hey, never thought about multiple skill dings, I'll note [13:52]
mircea_popescu: as she points out, http://logs.minigame.biz/2019-01-03.log.html#t14:53:01 [13:53]
lobbesbot: Logged on 2019-01-03 14:53:01: <diana_coman> 18 pops, lmao [13:53]
mircea_popescu: Mocky but the important part is "resilient design" so to speak : it should keep polling after doing what it thought it did. same exact thing as with the "put stuff in inv" : put all you find of the type you're putting, if you miss some on one cycle, catch up on next. sorta thing. [13:54]
mircea_popescu: there's a good principle in there we're digging out. [13:54]
asciilifeform: briefly upstack to the archaeologies : switched on the http://btcbase.org/log/2019-01-02#1883853 device, and it worx a++++, simulates cdroms even (arbitrary # of'em) , and hdds, etc [13:55]
a111: Logged on 2019-01-02 15:31 asciilifeform: mats: i haven't built anyffing useful from ice40 with own hands yet. but, interestingly, when bought a 'scsi2sd' device for replacing disk in bolix box, found that author in fact used ice40 for the job [13:55]
asciilifeform: and has usb hose for mounting same from pc end. [13:56]
mircea_popescu: specifically : the oldest illustration of "robotics" in the charlie chaplin deeply misguided http://btcbase.org/log/2015-03-06#1043874 approach (and yes, i am very unimpressed by charlie chaplin as the "intellectual great" pantsuit make him out to be, specifically because this sort of deliberate stupidity to cater to pantsuit nonsense dun count as wisdom) is an amelia bedelia-esque "person sent to broom will broom the room, r [13:56]
a111: Logged on 2015-03-06 02:28 asciilifeform: 'On two occasions I have been asked, 'Pray, Mr. Babbage, if you put into the machine wrong figures, will the right answers come out?' I am not able rightly to apprehend the kind of confusion of ideas that could provoke such a question.' [13:56]
mircea_popescu: obot sent to broom will broom individual items" sorta bs. [13:56]
asciilifeform: ( imho must-have gadget for old-irons people , really ) [13:56]
mircea_popescu: there's no serious reason to write our poor people in the way THEIR poor people would like our poor people to work [for the transparent reason that thusly, our poor people won't outcompete and drown out their poor people]. [13:57]
mircea_popescu: (and yes, republican bot is ==== imperial "we the people", no question about it.) [13:58]
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: from the 'steam engine is 'the workerz' 'but minus the drinkin' and unionizin''' pov ? [13:59]
stratum: i am a real person [13:59]
mircea_popescu: from the gimme a second ima clean up this bimboconvo. [13:59]
asciilifeform: oh hey talks [13:59]
mircea_popescu: stratum and who might you be then ? [13:59]
stratum: i am a real person who has seen the wonderful dpb spread the gospel and came here to watch [14:00]
danielpbarron: he is from efnet, l0de fan [14:00]
asciilifeform: stratum: y'know there is a log, http://btcbase.org/log/ [14:00]
danielpbarron: also a fan of https and skeptic of rsa [14:00]
asciilifeform: 'promising' already.. [14:01]
mircea_popescu: cool. [14:01]
asciilifeform: stratum: let's hear about this ? [14:01]
stratum: I do not recall any skeptical talk about rsa, though, I do think https can be valuable in attempting to mitigating some issues one may encounter, this is true. [14:03]
Mocky: yes, a more resilient design is much needed for the bot. it also needs to get out from under the thumb of the ps event/thread model so that adding capabilities doesn't require crimes-against-humanity levels of extra code in order to approach resilience [14:03]
Mocky: unfortunately my cpp skills are not there yet [14:04]
asciilifeform: stratum: valuable for what ? [14:05]
stratum: In some cases, which do not involve a determined attacker or state actor, https can prevent man in the middle attacks, the capture of full browsing sessions, and, while unfortunately involving untrusted third party mega corporations tied to the security state, one can be slightly more assured you're talking to the actual website you intend to. [14:08]
asciilifeform: stratum: given that the most active criminal is the nato reich itself, what exactly is the worth of pkiistic 'sekoority' where they have master key ? [14:10]
stratum: It depends on ones threat model. [14:11]
stratum: I think most IRC people would be more concerned with some random internet jackoff fucking with them than GCHQ. [14:11]
asciilifeform: actual crypto worx just same against randojackoff and hitler. [14:12]
stratum: Certainly, but one still has to survive among the internet places as they exist.. We cannot all be RMS and have a helper print out websites for us because we're paranoid. [14:13]
asciilifeform: the notion pushed by reich where 'it is cheaper to only work against jackass' is fallacious, your cpu can bear the load. [14:13]
asciilifeform: stratum: why wouldja need 'helper to print web sites' ? [14:14]
asciilifeform: what's wrong with having multiple boxes for diff uses. [14:14]
stratum: If one can afford the money, time, and hassle, nothing. [14:15]
Mocky: also re bot, I do see the underlying problem that is revealed when someone says "oh hey, never thought of..." [14:15]
asciilifeform: stratum: so enlighten me, what's the logic -- you can't afford to plug in 2 boxes , but want to tell self stories at bedtime re 'secure anyway' ? [14:16]
stratum: Most people don't even have one "box" -- More and more browsing from their phones as their sole computing device, billions of them. I think there is a disconnect in what we're discussing: which is why I mention RMS and his helpers. [14:17]
asciilifeform: stratum: y'know, the money argument dun hold water -- a new 'ipnoje' actually costs moar than ~several~ entirely usable pc [14:18]
asciilifeform: ( not even counting its ~subscription~ ) [14:19]
stratum: I doubt any locksmith, who knows how easily they can be defeated, is arguing against locks for the average person, grandmas, and such. It seems like the argument against https from the likes of dpb is an argument of this type, in my opinion. [14:19]
Mocky: more like the tsa luggage locks [14:20]
asciilifeform: except where yer lock aint a lock at all, but instead is rather more similar to the plastic amulets 'boko haram' hands out to soldiers 'to stop bullets' [14:20]
asciilifeform: !!up stratum [14:21]
deedbot: stratum voiced for 30 minutes. [14:21]
asciilifeform: stratum: one doesn't even need to sit on hitler's throne to bypass sslism typical idjit os comes with root certs from such shitholes as e.g. greece and latvia [14:22]
asciilifeform: all you need is to buy/borrow/steal 1 ( and not even this, protocol itself is swiss cheese and regularly broken by amateurs without any need to steal privkeys from some derpistan ) [14:22]
stratum: Right now, for the billions, I think it is probably better than nothing, just like easily popped household locks. [14:24]
stratum: If individuals want to communicate using heavily encrypted sneakernet to avoid NSA goons, that is certainly okay by me. But I don't see that happening for the billions any time soon. [14:24]
Mocky: are you an advocate on behalf of the billions? [14:25]
asciilifeform: stratum: tech 'for the billions' remains a questionable proposition even in re 100 y.o. techs. 'the billions' still have trouble with not dropping running toaster in bathtub. [14:25]
asciilifeform: the appropriate tech 'for the billions' is prolly the ox-plow ( and with proviso that they turn into a moar manageable 'millions' ) [14:26]
asciilifeform: danielpbarron: i wonder if the fella knows just what's behind the door he's walked into. [14:27]
Mocky: unrelatedly, it's strange time distortion to be a newb and compress the reading of back #trilema & #ba logs into 8 months and then see http://btcbase.org/log/2019-01-03#1884140 and realize the fella (and plenty others fresh in the mind) hasn't even spoken here for a year [14:31]
a111: Logged on 2019-01-03 18:47 a111: 2018-01-17 <apeloyee> !#s whisperers [14:31]
danielpbarron: i did not tell him to join, and i have given up on reaching that crowd [14:32]
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform http://trilema.com/2019/what-is-meant-by-ai/ 'ere you go. [14:46]
asciilifeform: oh hey [14:47]
mircea_popescu: stratum we are only interested in destroying the capacity of posturing of the "state actor" known asw the usg. [14:50]
mircea_popescu: random schmuckette futzing with her phone "losing" her nudes is of no consequence, she is a party favour anyway, whether she knows this or not. [14:50]
mircea_popescu: and "most irc people" is an undefined symbol. there's the lordship and absolutely nothing else. there's no "irc people". [14:51]
mircea_popescu: poor danielpbarron, i'm starting to understand his problem : specifically because http://btcbase.org/log/2018-12-18#1881534 ie much lower intellectual bar, it is actually WAY THE FUCK EASIER to sell his church than the republic, to the sort of random interneteer. memory vs thought, hands down easier to memorize than structure the world. [14:54]
a111: Logged on 2018-12-18 19:57 mircea_popescu: why is it that this church is notable in spite of not having a feedbot ? [14:54]
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-01-03#1884196 << the point isn't the "monetary" cost, they have 0 money anyway. the point is the intellectual cost -- they're monkeys, they barely got enough brainpower to cluck at the shiny, what computer, what computers. [14:56]
a111: Logged on 2019-01-03 19:18 asciilifeform: stratum: y'know, the money argument dun hold water -- a new 'ipnoje' actually costs moar than ~several~ entirely usable pc [14:56]
mircea_popescu: Mocky we're in the same time distortion field. i recall people dead for centuries as if we just interrupted a coffee conversation days ago i forgot idiots i met yesterday as if milennia had passed. [14:58]
mircea_popescu: time exists in the mind. [14:58]
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-01-03#1884103 << i think the logs reflect my thinking similarily at first but kinda dropped it also. [15:00]
a111: Logged on 2019-01-03 17:15 asciilifeform: when i started with adaism, i initially found the preservation of indexing in array-slices annoying. but then saw the wisdom, it whips programmer into having a much firmer grasp of wtf he is doing. [15:00]
feedbot: http://trilema.com/2019/what-is-meant-by-ai/ << Trilema -- What is meant by AI ? [15:03]
jurov: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-01-03#1884050 << asciilifeform next time please spend few precious seconds to actually check A and MX records. No, it's not on lulazon anymore. [16:28]
a111: Logged on 2019-01-03 14:59 asciilifeform: diana_coman: looks like ml not yet moved to pizarro, it's still hosted wherever it was that jurov had it [16:28]
asciilifeform: jurov: then mystery deepens . can you offer an explanation for http://btcbase.org/log/2019-01-03#1884046 ? [17:01]
a111: Logged on 2019-01-03 07:19 diana_coman: mod6, http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/2019-January/000321.html gives me http://p.bvulpes.com/pastes/aaNkK/?raw=true [17:01]
asciilifeform: why the everliving fuck would anyone ever see 'Generated by cloudfront (CloudFront)' from that thing ?? [17:03]
feedbot: http://bimbo.club/2019/01/philosophical-transactions-for-the-months-of-november-and-december-1715-part-iii/ << Bimbo.Club -- Philosophical Transactions. For the months of November and December, 1715 - Part III. [17:07]
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-01-03#1884225 << ada is surrounded by a kind of roman 'sudes' fort , consisting of 'why the fuck does it make me do this', kills 99+% of maggots on the spot. at least that's my hypothesis re why the thing remains usable ~40 yrs after first made, unlike e.g. unix [17:53]
a111: Logged on 2019-01-03 20:00 mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-01-03#1884103 << i think the logs reflect my thinking similarily at first but kinda dropped it also. [17:53]
mircea_popescu: possibru. [17:54]
asciilifeform: ( e.g. http://btcbase.org/log/2017-05-26#1662671 , and other examples i documented in 2016-7 l0gz ) [17:54]
a111: Logged on 2017-05-26 18:10 asciilifeform: for instance, the almost ubiquitous c-ism, of creating a pointer (ada 'access') variable on a procedure's local (stack) and passing it to something -- anything -- is illegal [17:54]
asciilifeform: Mocky collected the whole, iirc, set, i'ma link ftr to http://mocky.org/Log-Reference-Why-Ada/ . [17:56]
mircea_popescu: memory management in c is one of the weirdest things. this is not directly obvious first off, but if you stop to think about what you're saying ~actually means~ it's a guaranteed starseeing moment. [17:57]
asciilifeform: c programmers who 'stop to think about what it means' tend to go insane and gouge out own eyes etc. so not much experience of this in the field. [17:58]
asciilifeform: incidentally i'll add that most published heathen ada proggies use c-style heapism, it isn't banned by the lang per se. [17:59]
mircea_popescu: i suppose the first step in the wonderful world of language is the kid's "what incantations do" rather than "what does this mean". takes a considerable time exposed to "she is your genie, ask what you will, she'll produce it" sorta situation for the former to mutate into the latter, "what the fuck am i asking these genies to do here!" [18:00]
asciilifeform: ( in fact, if anyffing -- encouraged, the type safety makes it less immediately lethal than otherwise would be ) [18:00]
* asciilifeform brb,teatime [18:00]
feedbot: http://trilema.com/2019/qntra-sqntr-december-2018-statement/ << Trilema -- Qntra (S.QNTR) December 2018 Statement [18:03]
jurov: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-01-03#1884230 << perhaps someone is avoiding DNS and has stale static IP entry in hosts.txt ? [18:21]
a111: Logged on 2019-01-03 22:01 asciilifeform: jurov: then mystery deepens . can you offer an explanation for http://btcbase.org/log/2019-01-03#1884046 ? [18:21]
asciilifeform: jurov: this is entirely possible. lessee what diana_coman says when wakes up. [18:23]
asciilifeform: ( iirc diana_coman was the only 1 afflicted ) [18:24]
jurov: diana_coman: really, let's seriously troubleshoot this. if you aren't using hosts file, can you please paste the output of: dig therealbitcoin.org and: dig MX therealbitcoin.org [18:24]
BingoBoingo: dig shows the MX pointed at the foundation's Pizarro box from here [18:33]
asciilifeform: same here [18:33]
mod6: Yeah, I get the pizarro ip for both A and MX records. Just in case, I have posted the clearsigned report to my website for viewing: http://mod6.net/2018/December/31/btcf_address_201812.txt [19:46]
asciilifeform: unrelatedly : hey mircea_popescu , didja have a torrent tracker ? i seem to recall in the log ( tho cannot find. ) or was it an in-house thingie strictly. [20:12]
asciilifeform: i ask because i have a 9GB disk image from that bolix 'macivory' ( recorded using the 'alpha' from earlier thrd ) but am reluctant to simply put on dulap, soaking up bw for errybody [20:13]
asciilifeform: ( it's ~8GB gzipped ) [20:14]
asciilifeform: it aint that much good without the iron, but i would like the thing publicly gettable, given as i also baked a 'scsi2sd' config that eats the thing [20:15]
asciilifeform: ( solid state gadget that replaces the ancient whining hdd in the thing ) [20:16]
asciilifeform: lol holySHIT is gzip inefficient for disk snapshots. '7zip' gets it down to 256MB ! [20:25]
asciilifeform: possibly dun need torrents after all. ( it is nao smaller than those jpegs from last wk. ) [20:27]
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform wasn't a tracker, just a large box with the entire collection of trilema reviewed films. on for a year or so, but turned it off recently. [20:28]
asciilifeform: aa [20:28]
mircea_popescu: when realised that i do not like the "community" enough to pump 1k/mo into it or anything. [20:28]
asciilifeform: aite. [20:28]
asciilifeform: this is a fundamental problem with throwing up warez for 'public'. how to justify to self, the bird feeder. [20:29]
asciilifeform: it costs real moneyz to throw up GBs. [20:29]
mircea_popescu: http://trilema.com/2013/some-basic-discussion-of-charity/ what else. [20:31]
asciilifeform: aha [20:31]
mircea_popescu: nothing wrong with "here's a list of things you can have ~by request~ in my castle" [20:31]
asciilifeform: this also. tho it is headachy to arrange in practice. [20:32]
mircea_popescu: so asker must be this tall to ride. [20:32]
asciilifeform: i mean on serving end. [20:32]
mircea_popescu: when joe blow did enough for you that it overwhelms the headache, he can has. [20:33]
asciilifeform: i have a half-written bot that takes a deedbot-style gpg wot decrypt and puts out a single-use emulated ftp login thing. but it is not alive, because gnarly in practice ( if single-shot, resumes dunwork and no crypto, and prolly this is solvable but i dun have currently the time budget for massaging it ) [20:34]
asciilifeform: a reasonably-mechanized process for distributing warez to one's l1/l2 might be useful, but i haven't yet devised one that dun break in annoying ways in the field. [20:35]
mircea_popescu: the correct way is reverse : take ~ftp login~, dump it in there. [20:36]
asciilifeform: i.e. receiver puts up ftp ? [20:36]
mircea_popescu: yup. [20:36]
asciilifeform: i suppose that'd work ( tho still no crypto ) [20:36]
mircea_popescu: of course crypto. [20:36]
asciilifeform: with what ? [20:36]
mircea_popescu: with his key. [20:37]
asciilifeform: as in, per file ? [20:37]
mircea_popescu: per tarball, w/e. [20:37]
asciilifeform: i guess would work. [20:37]
asciilifeform: pretty heavy on the serving end, tho, needs scratch buffer of $file-length per each req. [20:37]
asciilifeform: ( of much moar, in fact, than $file-length, cuz gpg is retarded ) [20:38]
mircea_popescu: you got collection-of-shit 1 throught 99. joe wants shit-item-5-6-7. joe sends !Z http://p.bvulpes.com/pastes/12345/?raw=true wherein is found "shit-item-5 shit-item-6 shit-item-7 pubkey" [20:38]
mircea_popescu: you "shit-item-5 shit-item-6 shit-item-7" > tar > gpg -aer pubkey > joe.ftp.server [20:38]
asciilifeform: right, it'd work in principle. but costly on transmitter end. [20:39]
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform like this you can do it on an as-available basis. [20:39]
asciilifeform: naturally as-available, how else. [20:39]
mircea_popescu: WAY the fuck cheaper than alternative. [20:39]
asciilifeform: but it won't be very available. [20:39]
mircea_popescu: because www server will attempt to feed any clients at any time [20:39]
asciilifeform: 7 folx want to load, each needs a, what, 4GB+ buffer (if turd is 1GB) [20:40]
mircea_popescu: nah. it's a 20% overhead or so. [20:40]
asciilifeform: classical gpg (base64) is a 400% neh [20:40]
mircea_popescu: neh. [20:40]
asciilifeform: ( assuming incompressible payload ) [20:40]
asciilifeform: given as most warez is already compressed [20:41]
mircea_popescu: you don't even have to ascii armor, if that bothers you. [20:41]
asciilifeform: this is prolly the most practical scheme suggested, to date, for this. but still feels heavy. [20:42]
mircea_popescu: what can i tell you. [20:44]
asciilifeform: also suffers from practical gnarl -- say the session gets thrown. how many times is the bot to retry upload. [20:45]
mircea_popescu: until done. [20:45]
mircea_popescu: ftp has resume, and besides, you got hashes. [20:45]
asciilifeform: tru [20:45]
mircea_popescu: and if it's such a problem, slice it. [20:45]
asciilifeform: soon enuff we're back to alt.binaries lol [20:46]
mircea_popescu: (if anyone wonders why all those r00 r01 etc slices back in the day) [20:46]
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform correct design is correct design. [20:46]
asciilifeform: oh hey remember the luby-style usenet archiver thing [20:46]
asciilifeform: i fughet what it was called [20:46]
asciilifeform: where you only needed e.g. 30 of 36 .rxx etc to magick the whole thing back into shape [20:47]
mircea_popescu: i dunno anyone actually bothered. [20:47]
asciilifeform: some defo bothered [20:47]
asciilifeform: iirc it was a plain reed-solomon tho, not newfangled luby [20:47]
asciilifeform: http://www.slyck.com/Newsgroups_Guide_PAR_PAR2_Files << found it. [20:56]
asciilifeform: 'PAR'. [20:56]
asciilifeform: apparently there were even multiple versions of the thing, i had nfi. [20:57]
asciilifeform: in the last days of the good old days, it was actually pretty common, in asciilifeform's recollection. [20:57]
asciilifeform: 'golden age' of usenet may have ended in '93, before i even got hands on it, but 'silver age' imho ended ~decade later. ( when usenet more or less disappeared entirely ) [20:58]
mircea_popescu: you and naggum might've been the only ones left by then [21:12]
asciilifeform: he outlived me there by considerable time. [21:13]
* asciilifeform was largely in lurk mode in those days, did not often presume to have what's worth saying. [21:14]
asciilifeform: there was, however, warez. asciilifeform got most of his msdos-goldenage stuff from alt.binaries.* [21:15]
asciilifeform: to round off the http://btcbase.org/log/2019-01-04#1884258 thrd : item confirmed to work. booted up box with it , it's a mixed blessing ( ~zero seek times, but slightly ~slower~ linear transfer than the mechanical disk. but, theoretically lasts '4evah', given as card can be easily backed up ) [21:16]
a111: Logged on 2019-01-04 01:15 asciilifeform: it aint that much good without the iron, but i would like the thing publicly gettable, given as i also baked a 'scsi2sd' config that eats the thing [21:16]
asciilifeform: i'ma post complete recipe laters. [21:17]
asciilifeform: at the very least, it's quiet, and pulls 1watt instead of 40, reducing strain on the ancient electrolytic caps.. [21:19]
asciilifeform: phf i expect these will work in your 'xl' also. [21:19]
asciilifeform: ( you can actually set arbitrary block size, so the weirdo 1280byte blox will work ) [21:20]
asciilifeform: the crapple ftr uses ordinary 512byte blks. [21:21]
asciilifeform: when i first went to look for the thing, found that there's a whole underworld of vintage crapple people ( and 'amiga' etc ) , most of'em moved to using these things. [21:22]
asciilifeform: ( interestingly also found that nowadays certain vintage crapples command 4fig prices. why -- cannot say. ) [21:23]
asciilifeform: there's folx running 'aix' even, that old favourite of BingoBoingo . [21:24]
* asciilifeform bbl, meat [21:24]
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: TBF a lot of weird looks good when the alternatives are Windows, Lunix, and ManzanaBSD [21:28]
feedbot: http://qntra.net/2019/01/longtime-national-security-journalist-quits-nbc-over-networks-pro-war-editorial-position/ << Qntra -- Longtime "National Security" Journalist Quits NBC Over Network's Pro-War Editorial Position [21:30]
feedbot: http://bimbo.club/2019/01/my-new-g/ << Bimbo.Club -- My new G [21:59]
trinque: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-01-02#1883981 << I'll give it some attention this weekend. [23:27]
a111: Logged on 2019-01-02 20:15 diana_coman: trinque, how's it going with getting the Cuntoo .vpatch in fixed shape? [23:27]
Category: Logs
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