Forum logs for 21 Jan 2019
| mircea_popescu: | meanwhile in unexpected lulz, LordMPofTMSR "How about you drop whatever it is you're doing and dedicate your life to serving me ?" PetiteGoddess21 21F Dom "Yes sir" LordMPofTMSR "Nah, meanwhile had a look at your profile. Not interested." | [10:38] |
| asciilifeform: | lol! | [10:39] |
| asciilifeform: | is this a 1st ? | [10:39] |
| mircea_popescu: | nah. | [10:39] |
| asciilifeform: | masochist:'beat me pleez!' sadist:'never!' | [10:39] |
| mircea_popescu: | more layers than that. domme "yes sir", omnimaster "meh" etc. | [10:39] |
| asciilifeform: | what was in the profile ? | [10:40] |
| asciilifeform: | ... had dogface ? | [10:41] |
| mircea_popescu: | anyway, i suppose that nah's unclear. plenty cases before where "domme" goes all soft for me plenty of cases before where "um... actually looking at your pics... nevermind". and some cases before where these two met, but never before in 12 words or less. | [10:41] |
| mircea_popescu: | so in that sense ... first. | [10:41] |
| mircea_popescu: | asciilifeform i dunno, dood. she's just weirdlooking. | [10:41] |
| mircea_popescu: | https://i.ibb.co/162btrS/derpychick.jpg | [10:43] |
| asciilifeform: | a++ prominent crate of vodka in photo | [10:44] |
| mircea_popescu: | i dunno that thing's anything anyone'd ever drink | [10:45] |
| mircea_popescu: | ustards writing "vodka" on some crap they made dun make it so. | [10:45] |
| mircea_popescu: | wtf is it, even ? | [10:45] |
| asciilifeform: | 'табуретовка' | [10:45] |
| asciilifeform: | btw is there a ro ver of that term? | [10:45] |
| asciilifeform: | 'extract of footstool' approx. i.e. 'this tastes as if it were made from old furniture' | [10:46] |
| mircea_popescu: | for samagon you mean ? "rachiu de pufoaica", literally "goretex brandy". | [10:46] |
| mircea_popescu: | supposedly made out of distilled chicken coop remains -- shit & feathers. | [10:47] |
| asciilifeform: | for rubbish samogon. but yes fits. | [10:47] |
| mircea_popescu: | oh, and, of course : "Latest activity PetiteGoddess21 posted a journal entry on her profile titled “ill sell whatever you want”: about 10 hours ago I'll sell whatever you want ) ( including videos, pics ,sexting, etc) if got all types of cloths for sale and request how you want them and how many days worn you want I'll also include a video of me playing in them , using them or anything else ... continue reading → " | [10:48] |
| mircea_popescu: | why the fuck do they spell it "cloths". | [10:48] |
| asciilifeform: | prolly cuz the rng picked that one letter to drop this time around | [10:48] |
| mircea_popescu: | nah. back in the day they used to spell "rogue" (the high fantasy playable character, right ?) as "rouge", notwithstanding they spoke no french or anything | [10:49] |
| asciilifeform: | innermost circle of quasiliteracy hell, i suspect, is when even mispelling not consistent | [10:49] |
| mircea_popescu: | it's just, there's some grooves in the moron brain, and they work a certain way. | [10:49] |
| mircea_popescu: | and of course there's "dominate" as a fucking noun. "she's a dominate". | [10:50] |
| asciilifeform: | funny how all that 19th c. sweat put into making engl look like a human lang, with standard typography etc, more or less evaporated in <20y span | [10:51] |
| mircea_popescu: | what irks me is that these are contrary "eases" -- if you say "well, cocksucker, can't palatalize anymore, there's no 'nt' in her world" then what do you say to "she prefers pronouncing ths to thes" | [10:51] |
| asciilifeform: | in e.g. pravd^H^H^Hwapo, 'times', etc, will find malapropisms on front pg, and outright line noise on nth pg | [10:53] |
| mircea_popescu: | asciilifeform aha. there's an interesting similarity at work here : the "nuclear family" nonsense spring, painfully and costly wound up by the imbecile universalist-chrsitian sect over a century, unwound in a few decades via http://trilema.com/forum-logs-for-19-jan-2019#2511542 process. this, of course, "nobody notices". | [10:53] |
| a111: | Logged on 2019-01-19 19:25 mircea_popescu: meanwhile in sad lulz, https://www.blacktowhite.net/threads/moving-away-from-cuckold-into-stag-vixen.146933/ ("Are people moving away? I'm noticing a shift in ads, profiles and websites that I browse. No one is really looking for a cuckold thing anymore. I got enthralled with the cuckold fantasy and I would love to meet a couple that was for it. But Cuckolds couples are hard to find. Couples, single females are easier but as | [10:53] |
| mircea_popescu: | but THEN, the EXACT SAME nonsense spring, painfully and costly wound up by previous generation of exactly-same imbeciles, "english human lang", unwinding EXACT SAME WAY | [10:53] |
| mircea_popescu: | first the "ease and inclusion" and then the "proper expression" etc. | [10:54] |
| asciilifeform: | it's esp frustrating to watch when you were beaten with sticks to learn the king's english for no particularly good reason | [10:54] |
| mircea_popescu: | ah. | [10:55] |
| mircea_popescu: | well, i guess i have the priviledge & advantage a) nobody dared beat me, sticks or otherwise coupled with b) was always better at english than anyone anyways. | [10:55] |
| * asciilifeform | as 5yo was already sweating, filling exercise boox | [10:55] |
| mircea_popescu: | did i recount that incident when we were visiting england in a group (of 20+ people, including 3 professional english teachers) and teh stewardesses asked me to explain things to the rest (of the unruly orcs), back in early 90s ? | [10:56] |
| asciilifeform: | dun recall | [10:56] |
| mircea_popescu: | one of those poor women had to be my english teacher for YEARS to come, in school. | [10:57] |
| mircea_popescu: | mme carolina orasan. she wasn't very good -- but she was studious and insistent, and i suppose perfectly fine for an orc. the others, even worse. | [10:57] |
| asciilifeform: | sounds like typical orc lang instructor | [10:58] |
| mircea_popescu: | aha. | [10:59] |
| asciilifeform: | it's what we had in grade school. but asciilifeform's folx decided that was rubbish, took him to old woman with buncha aquariums in her flat, who actually spoke the lang somehow | [10:59] |
| mircea_popescu: | it's amusing, if one takes a dispassionate look, how equally likely to hurt as to hinder are parental best intentions. | [10:59] |
| * asciilifeform | had nfi as 5yo, but his folx's plot to move , incl. destination, was already in motion then | [11:01] |
| mircea_popescu: | o wait -- did i say two negatives ? i meant "help as to hinder". | [11:01] |
| mircea_popescu: | please believe. | [11:01] |
| asciilifeform: | ( the funny bit, is that of course had to fucking relearn , nobody in gringolandia actually speaks the lang that asciilifeform was taught... ) | [11:02] |
| mircea_popescu: | i dunno why people fret so much about languages generally. | [11:02] |
| mircea_popescu: | they really are not hard, especially once one stops whiteknuckling quite so hard. | [11:03] |
| asciilifeform: | ( was moar like http://bimbo.club/2019/01/philosophical-transactions-for-the-months-of-july-august-and-september-1716-part-ii/ etc ) | [11:03] |
| mircea_popescu: | asciilifeform should prolly use it on the dating scene, young hussies respond quite well! | [11:03] |
| asciilifeform: | mircea_popescu: i entirely agree, as consequence of the 'abuse' asciilifeform never once 'fretted' about languages | [11:03] |
| mircea_popescu: | yeah, learn pinoy over blowjobs or w/e it is. how hard can it be, and how long can it stay that way. | [11:04] |
| mircea_popescu: | the language, i mean. | [11:04] |
| asciilifeform: | can even learn from a half-working shortwave set, if must. | [11:04] |
| mircea_popescu: | my english came to me from computers and cartoons. | [11:04] |
| asciilifeform: | worx a++ | [11:05] |
| mircea_popescu: | (back then romanians hadn't yet taken the step of imbecility and dubbed nothing.) | [11:05] |
| asciilifeform: | mircea_popescu: we had such 'dubs' that one still could ( and normally would, if actually care to understand half a shit ) hear the orig track | [11:06] |
| mircea_popescu: | how's that work ? | [11:06] |
| asciilifeform: | poor sync, and mumble | [11:06] |
| mircea_popescu: | o brother. | [11:06] |
| mircea_popescu: | that must've been plenty frustrating, too. | [11:06] |
| asciilifeform: | btw apparently the 'translator wears clothespin on nose' item is mythical : turns out that good % of the tapes were simply dubbed by this 1 ex-boxer, with perma-broken nose | [11:07] |
| mircea_popescu: | hahaha | [11:07] |
| mircea_popescu: | well, in ro you got ro text overimposed on english speech. if one's brain works AT ALL... | [11:07] |
| asciilifeform: | y'know, same fella who turned 'diehard' into 'умри тяжело' | [11:08] |
| mircea_popescu: | lol. such an inept habit this. even today, you know, download some film, discover it has a ru spoken track, that's it. | [11:08] |
| mircea_popescu: | WHO THE FCUK could POSSIBLY!!!! in any conceivable universe!!!! want to hear some ukr cosmetologist INSTEAD of bette davis ? | [11:09] |
| asciilifeform: | there's oddballs continuing the 'fine tradition' out of , i suspect, sheer nostalgia. ( i do not know whether they use clothespin or get somebody to break nose tho... ) | [11:09] |
| mircea_popescu: | possibly the #1 extant item which puts russkis today in the situation of ye olde http://btcbase.org/log/2018-06-19#1826770 | [11:10] |
| a111: | Logged on 2018-06-19 16:04 mircea_popescu: and we can keep going, but you get the idea. russians had managed to make themselves as impopular as humanly possible with the ~only martial neighbour it had at the time. | [11:10] |
| mircea_popescu: | i literally know people who would genocide the country for this one sin. | [11:10] |
| mircea_popescu: | asciilifeform speaking of which item, you ever seen il scopone scientifico ? | [11:10] |
| asciilifeform: | nein | [11:10] |
| mircea_popescu: | bette davis' last role, together with a decent it crew (mangano, sordi). | [11:11] |
| mircea_popescu: | do me a favour and watch the it, not the ru dialogues lol. | [11:11] |
| mircea_popescu: | actually, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n-iegjCj-iI | [11:11] |
| * asciilifeform | pushes to queue | [11:13] |
| mircea_popescu: | in other euloraleaks, it seems self-evident that by the time we're done writing a kernel in ada, the os will be called auntoo, right. | [11:17] |
| mircea_popescu: | as per ye olde omnibus->autobus broken etymologyu tradition. | [11:18] |
| * asciilifeform | already has, of sorts, 'os in ada'. ( it only adds, subs, muls, modexps... but what moar could one want!111 ) | [11:22] |
| mircea_popescu: | the BAB instr. | [11:22] |
| asciilifeform: | hm? | [11:23] |
| asciilifeform: | ...returns babbage's dictum? | [11:23] |
| mircea_popescu: | BAB wrong_number wrong_number > right | [11:23] |
| asciilifeform: | aaha exactly so | [11:23] |
| mircea_popescu: | you asked what more, yes ? i told. | [11:24] |
| asciilifeform: | babbage lives in erry instruction. | [11:24] |
| asciilifeform: | babbage 'жил, жив, будет жить', a la lenin. | [11:25] |
| asciilifeform: | re eulora -- occurred to asciilifeform to wonder, does the thing actually demand the 3d card ? or could just as readily polygonize with cpu | [11:26] |
| mircea_popescu: | could, and does. | [11:28] |
| mircea_popescu: | it's not very intensive and pretty sure we talked about this befoar. | [11:28] |
| asciilifeform: | then could readily 'os' aha | [11:28] |
| mircea_popescu: | most machines today have a vidcard for the whole rounded corners bs anyways. | [11:29] |
| asciilifeform: | i also thought there was in the l0gz a place where somebody measured it with 'soft' 3d and it gave 60+hz. ( can't seem to dig up tho ) | [11:29] |
| mircea_popescu: | /fps > 59.76 displaying FPS. | [11:30] |
| mircea_popescu: | i think it's actually capped at 60 in configs tho. | [11:30] |
| asciilifeform: | i dun think i even have any moar displays that do >60 | [11:30] |
| asciilifeform: | ( interesting 'step backwards' if you thinkaboutit.. ) | [11:30] |
| mircea_popescu: | well, much harder to do on the new shits than was on crt. | [11:31] |
| mircea_popescu: | back then, if it came to it, could give luser knob, make it 10khz | [11:31] |
| asciilifeform: | you can buy'em, supposedly, but they have castrated palette | [11:31] |
| asciilifeform: | (6bit channels iirc) | [11:31] |
| mircea_popescu: | other than terminals which are habitually filmed, i can't imagine what use for non-60hz refresh. | [11:32] |
| mircea_popescu: | and even then -- nothing under 2-3k or so worth the mention. | [11:32] |
| asciilifeform: | in the http://btcbase.org/log/2019-01-21#1888701 days, that crt was already the last 1 in the lab ( the headpiece was a lcd shutter, and demanded a 120hz display to output the left-right sequential frames. so had to crt. ) | [11:33] |
| a111: | Logged on 2019-01-21 00:27 asciilifeform: i had a 30k$ sgi 3d viewer thing, worked ok ( 1 part 50kg crt, other part went on yer head. ) point is that nao you can get ~same thing for 100. not that there's much in the way of people who are still doing any of this afaik. | [11:33] |
| asciilifeform: | funnily enuff, even the 60hz panels are 'step back' in that they have sloppy vsync, frames tear. | [11:35] |
| asciilifeform: | even 'eizo' et al. | [11:35] |
| mircea_popescu: | o yeah. you should see this "large screen", scrolls visibly on diagonal. | [11:35] |
| asciilifeform: | it's a plague. | [11:36] |
| asciilifeform: | iirc we even had a 2014 thread, whole thing where machine shits the frame to the lcd at N hz, is retarded, framebuffer oughta live in the display | [11:37] |
| asciilifeform: | ( which , if lcd, is ~regardless~ stuck latching the bits, even nao ) | [11:37] |
| mircea_popescu: | aha. | [11:38] |
| asciilifeform: | ( this is ~already~ a metre or whatever - sized sram ! ) | [11:38] |
| asciilifeform: | depressing subj, back when i had crt, never 1ce saw 'frame tear', not since cga days at any rate | [11:39] |
| asciilifeform: | today -- even emacs tears. | [11:39] |
| * asciilifeform | played 'quake' on 486 'dx2', at 11fps... but no tear!11 | [11:42] |
| * asciilifeform | brb,teatime | [11:42] |
| feedbot: | http://qntra.net/2019/01/unrest-today-israel-kills-4-syrian-soldiers-in-airstrike-after-syria-rejected-israeli-demand-not-to-shoot-down-missiles-during-earlier-airstrike/ << Qntra -- Unrest Today: Israel Kills 4 Syrian Soldiers In Airstrike After Syria Rejected Israeli Demand Not To Shoot Down Missiles During Earlier Airstrike | [11:48] |
| diana_coman: | http://btcbase.org/log/2019-01-21#1888880 -> this reminds me of "after first 10 languages or so, ALL the rest are really easy to learn" lol | [12:07] |
| a111: | Logged on 2019-01-21 16:03 mircea_popescu: they really are not hard, especially once one stops whiteknuckling quite so hard. | [12:07] |
| lobbes: | http://btcbase.org/log/2019-01-17#1888176 << to update: I've just now set up irssi on the box with no issues. ty again | [12:08] |
| a111: | Logged on 2019-01-17 22:19 lobbes: ty BingoBoingo. login successful. Will attempt irssi setup later and report back | [12:08] |
| mircea_popescu: | lol. YES! | [12:16] |
| Mocky: | trinque is there anything wrong with my deposit from a week ago sunday? It seems not to have gone thru | [12:19] |
| trinque: | Mocky: nope, just people have been pinging me when they have a deposit, since running them is a human step. | [12:23] |
| trinque: | I'll get to it shortly | [12:23] |
| Mocky: | ok thx | [12:23] |
| BingoBoingo: | lobbes: ty | [12:28] |
| asciilifeform: | in other lulz, 'numpy' ( 1 of the few useful libs for that lang, does various numericalmethods ) Officially turns tard, proclaims 'this is last ver to support python 2.7, from nao on 3' | [12:45] |
| asciilifeform: | http://www.numpy.org/neps/nep-0014-dropping-python2.7-proposal.html << from horse's mouth. | [12:45] |
| mircea_popescu: | sooo... while the right-honourable ingredients involved sit for a moment in a bowl to make friends with each other, allow me to describe for posterity what is right and properly known as "the despration breakfast". | [12:50] |
| mircea_popescu: | in a bowl you flake smoked trout, with chunked : onion (red, raw), pickled gherkins (salt pickles, not vinegar "pickles"), artichoke add capers, fresh (or salt-pickled) tarragon leaf. the base cheese is something sweet (schweizer works fine in this instant example), the signatuer cheese is something sharp (here, a very fine camambert, but ideally, casu marzu, well ripe). | [12:53] |
| mircea_popescu: | to be served on a bed of lettuce on the side : smoked sprats and eggs overed easy with cayenne pepper. | [12:53] |
| mircea_popescu: | and for desert -- breakfast doesnt take desert ?! who says ! -- cashew chocolate paste and (separately!) cozonac filling, served on scottish-style shortbread cookies. | [12:57] |
| asciilifeform: | sounds heavy | [12:57] |
| mircea_popescu: | gotta get that cholesterol up somehow. | [13:05] |
| mircea_popescu: | plus, of course, a chardonnay, a zinfadel, something, preferably vienese style (crushed ice, mineral water, wine in equal parts) | [13:29] |
| mircea_popescu: | and thus restaurated, we can then continue our readings of the morn! to wit : "You didn't talk like that before," said Dulcie plaintively. "II thought perhaps you'd be glad to see me. You were once. Andandwhen you went away last you asked me totokiss you, and I did, and I wish I hadn't. And you gave me a ginger[Pg 72] lozenge with your name written on it in lead pencil, and I gave you a cough-lozenge with mine | [13:30] |
| mircea_popescu: | and you said it was to show that you were my sweetheart and I was yours. But I suppose you've eaten the one I gave you?" | [13:30] |
| mircea_popescu: | lead pens ftw, how sweeter the love! | [13:30] |
| asciilifeform: | mircea_popescu: is somebody 'stress testing' trilema box ? thing seems to give 1+sec pg load time, for coupla days nao | [17:37] |
| asciilifeform: | http://btcbase.org/log/2019-01-21#1888953 << imho all the roman langs count as 1!111 (ditto germans slavs etc) | [17:40] |
| a111: | Logged on 2019-01-21 17:07 diana_coman: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-01-21#1888880 -> this reminds me of "after first 10 languages or so, ALL the rest are really easy to learn" lol | [17:40] |
| BingoBoingo: | My experience and experiments among the unthinking yet literate is that in spoken language situations the behavior channel carries more information than the "language" channel. | [20:19] |
| BingoBoingo: | The intra language sound shifts can be a bitch. | [20:27] |
| mircea_popescu: | asciilifeform as per http://btcbase.org/log/2019-01-20#1888551 | [21:04] |
| a111: | Logged on 2019-01-20 17:20 mircea_popescu: apparently 200 reqs ~per 100ms~ (that's how long it takes to complete one) is not enough to bring it down. | [21:04] |
| mircea_popescu: | sudo ldconfig -v | grep libode | [21:14] |
| mircea_popescu: | libode.so.1 -> libode.so.1.1.1 | [21:14] |
| mircea_popescu: | a damn., wrong chan. | [21:14] |
| trinque: | Mocky et al, ping | [21:38] |
| asciilifeform: | incidentally, imho it's rather perverse that the popularly expected behaviour in 'moar server reqs / sec. than can be serviced' is 'fall down' rather than 'triage + busy signal' | [21:42] |
| asciilifeform: | why the fuck should it ever fall down. | [21:42] |
| asciilifeform: | if the cycles aint there to serve a page or whatever op, then simply shouldnt ACK, that's it | [21:44] |
| asciilifeform: | the folx who shat out apache & co., i suspect were at least as aggressively retarded as koch. | [21:45] |
| mircea_popescu: | because it's written by free and open source people ? | [21:47] |
| asciilifeform: | ( at the risk of pedantry : they used ~heapism~ . consequently, found it impossible to answer the q 'does machine have the cycles to do this-here request?' in o(1) ! ) | [21:47] |
| mircea_popescu: | anyway, it's not unsalvageable. very robust machines can be built on apache. | [21:48] |
| asciilifeform: | mircea_popescu: the microshit people, innocent of opensores, did same, it's a c macula | [21:48] |
| mircea_popescu: | ~same people, really. | [21:49] |
| mircea_popescu: | it's not like microshit hired a different set of eggheads than populated slashdot. | [21:49] |
| mircea_popescu: | ~same romanian dorks on both "aisles" | [21:49] |
| asciilifeform: | mircea_popescu: thing is roughly like trb - can throw iron at it until it eats the desired reqs/sec without shitting self. but, just as in trb, it's a barbaric/empirical ritual, quite impossible to say 'on napkin' how much cpu will yield what # of what kB pg served /sec w.out falling | [21:51] |
| asciilifeform: | and ( again like trb ) it dies disgracefully at the boundary of capacity, | [21:51] |
| asciilifeform: | cuz has nfi what capacity is. | [21:52] |
| Mocky: | !!pay-invoice BingoBoingo 1 | [21:52] |
| deedbot: | Get your OTP: http://p.bvulpes.com/pastes/vK1Mp/?raw=true | [21:52] |
| Mocky: | !!v D80D0E6CF388A6BFEF9DE3BB9B283433119DE1BD1B3D8AA59A341A4ABB2CB678 | [21:52] |
| deedbot: | Mocky paid BingoBoingo invoice 1 | [21:52] |
| mircea_popescu: | this is not factual, actually. | [21:54] |
| mircea_popescu: | as exemplified by the point in case. | [21:54] |
| asciilifeform: | hm? | [21:54] |
| mircea_popescu: | well, trilema's not dead, is it. | [21:55] |
| asciilifeform: | not dead, but couldja say just how many cycles/s and bytes of ram will give what # of loads/s ? | [21:55] |
| mircea_popescu: | atm eg doing ~220 connections / .1s sorta thing. the problem's the would-be attackers output capacity, not some kind of limit on trilema side. it'll serve as much as dood can send through. | [21:56] |
| asciilifeform: | if architecture of bldgs worked the way apache is worked, all structures would be pyramid | [21:56] |
| mircea_popescu: | asciilifeform cycles/s or ram bytes about as meaningful in this discussion, might as well ask "how much free memory". no such thing, really. | [21:57] |
| asciilifeform: | mircea_popescu: a sane server oughta work at ~line~ rate | [21:57] |
| mircea_popescu: | which is what it does ? | [21:57] |
| asciilifeform: | i'll believe, will assume mircea_popescu actually tested with a lan-connected box requesting loads at gb/s or whichever. but to make this guarantee with apache and other heapistic softs, needs massive margin of iron | [21:59] |
| mircea_popescu: | the cycles go 70-80% user / 10-15% system / etc whether there's 5 or 500 people asking for a page, it just doesn't figure into some sort of cycle economy | [21:59] |
| asciilifeform: | !#s what i think it crashes | [21:59] |
| a111: | 16 results for "what i think it crashes", http://btcbase.org/log-search?q=what%20i%20think%20it%20crashes | [21:59] |
| mircea_popescu: | asciilifeform the issue on http is generally packets rather than bytes. | [21:59] |
| asciilifeform: | ^ see also | [21:59] |
| asciilifeform: | mircea_popescu: sessions, if you want pedantic, but sure | [22:00] |
| mircea_popescu: | and yes, a properly configured webserver serves at line speed, in the sense that the way to ddos is by overwhelming ~the router~ not the webserver. | [22:00] |
| mircea_popescu: | but this is not some kind of xanadu. item exists. | [22:00] |
| asciilifeform: | aha, simply eats 10x ( or even moar ) current than really oughta. | [22:00] |
| asciilifeform: | ( and suffers ugly meltdown if you ~do~ saturate it eventually ) | [22:01] |
| mircea_popescu: | anyway. the reason you were seeing at some point slightly longer pageloads is precisely that, it'll serve you when it gets to you. and if you decide (if ~you~ decide) that whenever's too late and timeout, more power to you, feel free to retry. | [22:02] |
| asciilifeform: | this is correct behaviour. | [22:02] |
| asciilifeform: | it really shouldnt require a n-fold overprovisioned machine tho. | [22:02] |
| mircea_popescu: | and otherwise, the server actually spits out in excess of 2k pageloads / s, as a matter of actuarial evidence. | [22:02] |
| * asciilifeform | believes | [22:03] |
| mircea_popescu: | i dunno what specifically overprovisioning would mean here. | [22:03] |
| mircea_popescu: | i mean, pick a thoroughput you wish, build the box, that's what you get. | [22:03] |
| BingoBoingo: | The weakest link on the Internet are... the links | [22:03] |
| mircea_popescu: | i guess one could say "my blog will never have 100s of simultaneous readers, so mp's machine is 10x overprovisioned". which is fine, but also entirely arbitrary. | [22:04] |
| mircea_popescu: | one could also say "there's not THAT MANY PEOPLE, and if there are they can sure as fuck wait". which, also fine. | [22:04] |
| mircea_popescu: | moreover, considering it takes 10 minutes or more to ~read~ an article and whatever, a second or less to actually load it, even being able to serve 1 request/s is fucking ample, each day you will have put out 600 day-reader worth of material. | [22:06] |
| asciilifeform: | mircea_popescu: my objection is to the prng element in apache and other heapistic proggies, where actual resource consumption is a function not only of req rate, but how much footprint of each one happened to be , fragging the heap | [22:06] |
| asciilifeform: | this is well studied in trb, but applies elsewhere | [22:06] |
| mircea_popescu: | i don't think there even exists a publication currently that manages 500 reader-days. period and full stop, the fucking bible doesn't get that. | [22:06] |
| mircea_popescu: | asciilifeform it's not nearly as serious a problem in apache as you seem to think. | [22:06] |
| asciilifeform: | it doesn't stop being retarded simply cuz mircea_popescu and for that matter asciilifeform give the thing 256GB of ram to run it and never see the barf | [22:08] |
| asciilifeform: | *run in | [22:08] |
| BingoBoingo: | After spending substantial time as a skeptic apache beats the "smarter" alternatives (lighttpd, nginx, cherokee, etc)to apache | [22:10] |
| asciilifeform: | sorta like, building bridge of solid rock all the way from road to sea floor is great, if you have infinite rock, but is titanic waste, if yer at all interested in max bang for yer cement bux | [22:10] |
| asciilifeform: | BingoBoingo: they're all exactly same from this pov | [22:10] |
| BingoBoingo: | asciilifeform: No, the "smart" alternatives that implement "clever" die sooner | [22:11] |
| asciilifeform: | BingoBoingo: apache afaik is hands down best horse in that glue factory. | [22:11] |
| BingoBoingo: | We don't use horses in this glue factory. Too expensive. | [22:12] |
| BingoBoingo: | Depending on what you need apache can be titebond II or titebond III, If everything else is on point you can beat it to hold your toothpicks. | [22:15] |
| BingoBoingo: | Nginx is a sort of polyurethane "gorilla glue", very african. The details can be glossed over in a way that makes it appear very cool until pressure reveals a bunch of gaps have been filled up with exactly foam rubber. | [22:19] |
| asciilifeform: | BingoBoingo: last i recall it was =~ apache, but with buncha features cut out ( phpism, load balanceism, etc ) | [22:20] |
| BingoBoingo: | Poking suggests otherwise. It's a reverse proxy. It can be deployed as a webserver and people deploy it as that, but it was designed around a different job. | [22:21] |
| asciilifeform: | BingoBoingo: the pt i was trying to make is possibly too subtle to readily make sense until i write a proggy around it, to illustrate. which sadly aint happening in near term. | [22:23] |
| asciilifeform: | assertion is, the cost of a processing job oughta 1) be calculable in advance of performing said job 2) depend only on ~said job~, rather than what else the machine happened to have done recently or may be doing concurrently with remaining cycles | [22:24] |
| BingoBoingo: | asciilifeform: I suspect I know where your point is going, but at this time we don't yet need a violin. We're still trying to sit in chairs without finding out ass navigating debris on its way to the ground. | [22:25] |
| asciilifeform: | that way you can have something like civilized engineering calculation, rather than ' i dun know if i'll buy 3 kg of potato or 4, so let me bring a 50 tonne flatbed truck' | [22:26] |
| BingoBoingo: | <asciilifeform> assertion is, the cost of a processing job oughta 1) be calculable in advance of performing said job 2) depend only on ~said job~, rather than what else the machine happened to have done recently or may be doing concurrently with remaining cycles << This is a violin. We gotta get a lumber yard stocking something other than Spruce/pine/fir or we hit the sill plate problem. | [22:27] |
| asciilifeform: | http://trilema.com/2013/ho-vinto-la-lotteria-di-capodanno/ << oblig mircea_popescu illustration re truck | [22:28] |
| * BingoBoingo | stuck in wood metaphors | [22:28] |
| asciilifeform: | BingoBoingo: subj aint a short-term urgent itch by any means. moar re general principle | [22:29] |
| BingoBoingo: | Well, eventually we might get maple, walnut, and ferrocement | [22:29] |
| asciilifeform: | briefly upstack to http://btcbase.org/log/2019-01-22#1889021 << possibly i'm thick, but it ~also~ never made sense to me why a ~router~ would fall down, either. seems like if yer pipe is e.g. 100mb/s , and incoming enemy crapola at 1000mb/s, then you simply oughta get (from pov of arbitrary test peer) 90% packet loss. rather than a smoking crater where router was. | [23:07] |
| a111: | Logged on 2019-01-22 03:00 mircea_popescu: and yes, a properly configured webserver serves at line speed, in the sense that the way to ddos is by overwhelming ~the router~ not the webserver. | [23:07] |
| asciilifeform: | granted i know that they ~do~ fall down, but to me this suggests that they're made of wadded toilet paper, rather than it being an inescapable physical fact | [23:09] |
| asciilifeform: | ( and also happen to know why : they 'give to allcomers' in the sense of allocating memory for state of tcp connection. therefore it stands to reason that if one built router that doesn't tcp at all -- it will not fall. ) | [23:11] |
| asciilifeform: | fwiw simply rejecting tcp won't do the trick, you also gotta not allocate state for udp ( all extant routers, afaik, do.. but e.g. s.mg protocol and similar, will operate entirely correctly without this, as i understand it ) | [23:14] |
| asciilifeform: | i.e. could build router that simply... routes. rather than trying to be 'smart' and keep stateful connections. | [23:16] |
| * asciilifeform | bbl,meat | [23:16] |
| feedbot: | http://bingology.net/2019/01/22/the-internet-of-poverty-or-why-residential-internet-is-cheap/ << Bingology - BingoBoingo's Blog -- The Internet Of Poverty Or Why Residential Internet Is Cheap | [23:35] |
| BingoBoingo: | ^ Rela-TIT | [23:36] |
| asciilifeform: | BingoBoingo: entirely makes sense. | [23:56] |
| BingoBoingo: | asciilifeform: Substantial poking was involved | [23:56] |
| BingoBoingo: | No in-WoT blood was drawn in the research | [23:57] |
| asciilifeform: | BingoBoingo: interestingly, the cache-of-lolcats thing actually seems to have freed up substantial bw for actual net traffic. to the point that my 100bux actually buys symmetric 100mb/s here, on erry day of the year except when some idjit backhoes the fiber | [23:57] |
| asciilifeform: | ( symmetric to/from uy, jp, etc, rather than to lolcat local cache, i dun subscribe to the latter ) | [23:58] |
| BingoBoingo: | You just don't know that you subscribe to the lolcat cache. | [23:59] |
| asciilifeform: | how's that work ? | [23:59] |
| asciilifeform: | it's a subscription 'aol' neh | [23:59] |
Category: Logs
