Forum logs for 13 Jul 2018

Monday, 16 March, Year 12 d.Tr. | Author:
ave1: trinque, http://btcbase.org/log/2018-07-12#1833848, working on it but this is going slowly (so not very soon) [05:11]
a111: Logged on 2018-07-12 15:14 trinque: ave1: how far away is bit-identical build in your gcc? [05:11]
ave1: btw the most recent version will only build static executables! so no support for shared anything. Does the musl / gentoo overlay depend on shared libs? (Python usually builds statically and depends for installable modules on it, etc.) [05:14]
mod6: mornin' [10:05]
BingoBoingo: Mornin [10:09]
mod6: How goes today? [10:15]
shinohai: gm mod6, BingoBoingo .... #trilema at large [10:20]
mod6: hey shinohai, how's it goin? [10:22]
asciilifeform: ohai shinohai ! [10:22]
asciilifeform: shinohai: wb [10:22]
asciilifeform: shinohai: i've been enjoying your www [10:22]
shinohai: ah ty asciilifeform ... been busy with irl stuffs but hope to resume shortly. [10:27]
shinohai: goes well mod6 and u? [10:27]
shinohai: im following the rockchip stuff and been meaning to put my logbot in there [10:28]
asciilifeform: shinohai: issued 1st cuntoo box to pizarro customer the other day ( see l0gz ) [10:28]
asciilifeform: shinohai: otherwise pretty busy, currently with ffa reignition [10:28]
shinohai: read that this morning with coffee, nice worx [10:29]
shinohai: i almost got one of trinques cuntoo's to build for mips64 to run on erl xD [10:30]
asciilifeform: shinohai: almost ? what was the obstacle ? [10:30]
mod6: <+shinohai> goes well mod6 and u? << oh not bad, busy asf. [10:32]
shinohai: my obstacle is that erl has trouble reading some usb drives, gotta get another sandisk [10:32]
asciilifeform: shinohai: iirc it has a very modest max current, you need a small/slow drive, like the vendor's original [10:33]
shinohai: but it is tucked in neat beside the pogoplug, still chugging along and rsyncing blocks [10:33]
shinohai: the vendor original is shite ... literally [10:33]
asciilifeform: it is, but worx for so long as you dun write to it, lol [10:33]
shinohai: well of course lel [10:34]
shinohai: but still a neat box all in all for things like fw on cheap [10:34]
asciilifeform: shinohai: mine's been running ye olde freebsd, for 3yrs nao, 24/7 [10:35]
shinohai: oh neat. i already got a 32G sandisk with bsd working, din want to overwrite since i had no spare [10:36]
shinohai: i more interested in rockchip now, because trb [10:36]
mod6: asciilifeform: oh, interesting, thought it was netbsd [10:49]
asciilifeform: shinohai: prolly the best result re trb on rockchip would be with 'adult' samsung sata ssd via usb3-sata snake ( you can buy short one, that fits in box ) [11:04]
asciilifeform: shinohai: it is possible to buy e.g. 512G usb stick, but it is poor bang for bux proposition, it will quickly burn [11:05]
shinohai: yeah, not abt to try it without ssd [11:05]
asciilifeform: shinohai: trying doesn't hurt. and iirc somebody actually got a mechanical-hdd node to stay synced more or less decently with aggression patch [11:13]
asciilifeform: ( currently failing to dig up in the l0gz going from memory ) [11:13]
asciilifeform: rk3328-roc-cc + usb3sata snake + 1tb mech hdd -- might potentially make a working ~100bux trb node. worth a shot, shinohai , if you have a free hand. [11:16]
BingoBoingo: https://www.elobservador.com.uy/los-inmuebles-son-cada-vez-mas-caros-las-familias-que-quieren-comprar-n1254558 << Of Entomological interest [11:19]
diana_coman: asciilifeform> shinohai: trying doesn't hurt. and iirc somebody actually got a mechanical-hdd node to stay synced more or less decently with aggression patch -> yes, I did [11:31]
shinohai: neato diana_coman, also salutations! [11:38]
diana_coman: hi shinohai [11:39]
shinohai: congrats on discovery of new object in eulora [11:47]
asciilifeform: oh hey [11:59]
asciilifeform: diana_coman: didja ever post block timer readings from that node ? [12:00]
asciilifeform: diana_coman: and has it stayed reliably in sync ? [12:01]
diana_coman: asciilifeform, no, I didn't and yes, it has stayed as far as I can tell (i.e. I check it daily to see if it's in sync and it has been in sync for several months now) if you have somewhere a step-by-step thing with what would be interesting to publish, I can go through it and do it but otherwise tbh I'm so swamped with other stuff that it's waaaay at the bottom of any queue [12:02]
asciilifeform: aite, this is not a desperately urgent q or anyffing of the kind [12:03]
diana_coman: shinohai, hey, thanks! [12:03]
diana_coman: asciilifeform, no, but it might even help at a later time it wouldn't be wasted time at any rate [12:03]
asciilifeform: http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/2017-February/000256.html << for reference the block timers. [12:04]
diana_coman: i.e. noob comes, wants to run node, can point him to minimal reporting guidelines sort of thing [12:04]
asciilifeform: i expect that soon n00b will be able to revv up a trb box simply by making use of trinque's builder and then 'emerge trb' or the like. [12:05]
diana_coman: reporting is still a different thing [12:06]
asciilifeform: ( i.e. the old 'rotor'-on-conventional-linux process will finally be obsoleted ) [12:06]
asciilifeform: diana_coman: reporting block r/w times currently requires pressing with the little patch that takes the times. ( it is not part of 'flagship' trb ) [12:07]
diana_coman: right I didn't press that patch [12:08]
asciilifeform: notably , the patch started life as a general-purpose profiling of a whole buncha things in trb, but i ended up cutting out all but block timing, given as that was where something like 99% of ~active~ (i.e. as opposed to waiting for rain to fall, this was pre- aggression) cycles are spent [12:09]
asciilifeform: at any rate, the block processing delay was a kind of red herring, turned out that 'wait for rain to fall' was in fact the culprit in all ( known to asciilifeform ) cases of 'trb node won't stay in sync' [12:10]
asciilifeform: the longest block-processing delays i ever measured were 4-5 minutes, still well below the 10min magic mark [12:12]
asciilifeform: ( on mech hdd ) [12:12]
diana_coman: the by-now-usual "it's stupider than you'd think" [12:13]
asciilifeform: actually stike that, there were a few 10-15 min data points [12:13]
asciilifeform: but rare. [12:13]
asciilifeform: *strike [12:14]
asciilifeform: ( point being, it may very well be feasible to run a reliable infrastructural trb noad on mech hdd. certainly worth test. ) [12:15]
diana_coman: I suspect it is tbh but yes, we need some data on this [12:15]
asciilifeform: i suggested it specifically to shinohai because he's apparently still experimenting with trb and afaik isn't tied up with anyffing else. [12:16]
asciilifeform: conceivably, even 256MB-pogo-cum-mech-hdd-cum-swap-partition-cum-aggression might work. [12:18]
asciilifeform: ( admittedly a stretch ) [12:19]
asciilifeform: shinohai: consider taking a short at porting cuntoo to pogo, oughta be relatively simple [12:20]
asciilifeform: *shot [12:20]
* asciilifeform bbl,meat [12:20]
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-07-13#1834133 << probably just get sane logging in there, then can have noob paste from the respective logfile. [13:48]
a111: Logged on 2018-07-13 16:06 diana_coman: reporting is still a different thing [13:48]
mircea_popescu: iirc ben_vulpes was working on something like that prior to pizarro adventure. [13:48]
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: he actually baked a patch, about same time as my aggression item, http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/2017-December/000282.html [13:51]
asciilifeform: afaik it doesn't auto-timestamp tho, iirc ben_vulpes , trinque , and possibly others, use linux system log to 'cheat' and get timestamps from trb [13:53]
mircea_popescu: ~sane logging~ [13:53]
asciilifeform: aha. ( imho a Trooly sane log oughta even have separate log, for : block # / time received / time verified & written to db / from where received ) [13:55]
asciilifeform: the mempool crapola oughta be separate log ( even while we do not yet have mircea_popescu's mempooltron-blocktron cut ) [13:56]
mircea_popescu: yeah, should drop a pile of textfiles in /log [13:56]
asciilifeform: btw , while on subj, how are mircea_popescu's 'aggression' nodez doing ? i.e. stay in sync ? [13:57]
asciilifeform: mine - yes, iirc mod6's also, and diana_coman's [13:57]
mircea_popescu: i've not been having syncing problems [13:59]
mircea_popescu: (not even on classical prb) [13:59]
asciilifeform: i recall at least 1 episode specifically with mircea_popescu's node, was stuck for, what , 6 wks [14:00]
asciilifeform: but that was a while ago [14:00]
mircea_popescu: indeed. [14:00]
mircea_popescu: also when i got aggressive with iptable configs. [14:00]
asciilifeform: ( i vaguely suspect there exists even a 'herd immunity' of sorts, where aggressive trb helps other peers, of whatever config, stay in shape ) [14:01]
mircea_popescu: probably. [14:01]
asciilifeform: re iptables, asciilifeform's old 'ban all aws' trick worked wonders for asciilifeform . [14:01]
asciilifeform: ( a surprising % of the moar outrageous prb & quasi-forkolade derps, are stingy, parked on aws ) [14:02]
mircea_popescu: amusingly enough, the shit's so advanced in the soup, all bans help. even http://trilema.com/2018/how-to-remove-usgalphabet-usually-called-google-by-the-jews-pantsuit-from-your-web-experience/#comment-126128 [14:03]
asciilifeform: lol! they also have shitnodes?! [14:04]
mircea_popescu: they're involved in about half the efforts to make the net a shittier, slower, stinkier, buggier place. [14:04]
asciilifeform: naturally. but thus far ~all google activity asciilifeform's observed is centered on port80 [14:05]
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: What about google's email spamming? [14:05]
asciilifeform: ( formerly i banned it from phuctor, but after the db optimizations i let it live, shows up occasionally & crawls the broken keys, it dun create any particular problem to date ) [14:06]
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: moar specifically ? [14:07]
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: The deal where email was a thing and then google made Gmail and ate it [14:09]
asciilifeform: aa BingoBoingo , i dun expect to see a resurrection of email tho. [14:09]
asciilifeform: it was eaten and digested and shat long ago. [14:09]
asciilifeform: gmail was a usg victory aol et al could only dream of, if you're stuck sending email today you're more or less stuck doing it from shitmail, or watch it silently vanish somewhere on the way. [14:11]
asciilifeform: ( in ~both~ directions ) [14:11]
asciilifeform: i have a classical email box, complete with 'squirrelmail' etc, and pretty much only one i was able to have reliable 2way traffic with, was mircea_popescu -- back when he had a similar box [14:12]
mircea_popescu: heh [14:12]
mircea_popescu: anyway, tbh i can't find a use for email. if it's not a trilema-article-and-link nor a p.bvulpes-and-link then why isn't it in #trilema. [14:14]
asciilifeform: the 1 remaining use case is reaching out to heathens who can't be pinged through anything else, but i haven't had any result worth half a shit with that in aeons , so that leaves just about nuffin [14:15]
asciilifeform: i'm inclined to agree with mircea_popescu's item re the salvation of the drowning. [14:16]
mircea_popescu: i find fetlife sluts are about 10kx more interesting than hikikomori bois a la whatever set we've been contemplating, from curtis yarvin to rms. [14:16]
mircea_popescu: and all the menagerie in between. [14:16]
asciilifeform: well for starters they answer the fuckingmail, neh. [14:16]
mircea_popescu: in droves. and for other starters, they got tits, and i got pliers, and if they're annoying i twist nipples. [14:17]
asciilifeform: even http://btcbase.org/log/2018-07-12#1833889 , is moar fun than talking to /dev/null . [14:17]
a111: Logged on 2018-07-12 15:48 mircea_popescu: aand in today's dose of manilla humour, http://p.bvulpes.com/pastes/bEMvL/?raw=true [14:17]
mircea_popescu: i r agree! [14:18]
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: tbh i'm surprised that email lived as long as it did. it was exactly 'dodo bird', 0 defenses against predation at all. [14:23]
mircea_popescu: strongly relies on implicit wot enforced by "not give tards net access" [14:24]
BingoBoingo: Pretty much [14:24]
mircea_popescu: much stronglier than, say, bbs. [14:24]
asciilifeform: aha, but somehow managed to outlive the tard flood by almost decade. [14:24]
mircea_popescu: the fact that people pretended "it still works" for longer is imo one of the best points of illustration of anglotards retardation. [14:24]
mircea_popescu: they have serious privacy issues, in the specific sense that the hole in the church roof bothers them a heck of a lot more than the hole in their outhouse [14:25]
mircea_popescu: notwithstanding a) nobody cares about church and b) getting drizzled on while shitting is the #1 distinction between nation of africa and nation of human. [14:25]
asciilifeform: word 'privacy' in application to email, was always a stretch [14:26]
mircea_popescu: i just mean, because they're being groped in the privacy of their own bedroom, rather than in the publicity of the subway, they tolerate it much better. [14:27]
mircea_popescu: and in the same way, pretend email is still a thing in 2010, while given up on pretense bbs is still a thing in 1995. [14:28]
asciilifeform: funnily enuff, most usa zeks couldn't bbs today even if wanted to, the faux voicetel-over-fiber thing they have won't carry modem [14:29]
asciilifeform: ( nor will cellpnoje ) [14:29]
mod6: <+asciilifeform> mine - yes, iirc mod6's also, and diana_coman's << aha, mine have been good, when the hardware has been sane. so, if I can find the time still this month, I want to add that vpatch to the main vtree @ thebitcoin.foundation [14:29]
mod6: (and update the howto guide with that info) [14:29]
asciilifeform: tho asciilifeform was actually able to make 300 baud go , over '2g' [14:29]
mircea_popescu: of course. [14:29]
asciilifeform: ( at one time asciilifeform bought a number of cellmodems, of various makes , bag of 'sims', and did experiment ) [14:30]
asciilifeform: '2g' , notably, is being phased out in usa, in many places ( and on most of the carriers) nao impossible to make a connection at all with these [14:32]
asciilifeform: ( '3g' and newer , mostly not available in inexpensive chinese modems, because they are made for civilized world, where different bands and protocol are in use ) [14:33]
mircea_popescu: i'm not specifically defending bbs or anything. just making the point, comparably useless/dysfunctional approaches, one lived much longer. [14:33]
asciilifeform: bbs -- in so far as it represented 'can talk without necessarily going through nsa backbone in london' -- was a greater loss than email. [14:34]
mircea_popescu: im not aware that ever was a think. trunked is trunked. [14:34]
asciilifeform: it was, if you were calling local, you would go through 1 hop, local pbx. [14:35]
mircea_popescu: in 1975. [14:35]
asciilifeform: ( still largely 1970s iron , over here ) [14:35]
mircea_popescu: today, it'd still go through nsa eavesdropping station in london. [14:35]
asciilifeform: if you have the 'latest and greatest' faux-voice-over-fiber -- then invariably. [14:35]
asciilifeform: sorta why they tightened the noose on old-school copper telecom. [14:36]
asciilifeform: ( it did not play well with 'put EVERYTHING through london' derpitude ) [14:36]
mircea_popescu: right. [14:36]
mircea_popescu: soviets had a helluva time tapping them, and all ye olde school "use phone booth" worked wunderbar. [14:36]
asciilifeform: ( copper telco exchanges are still , last i knew, stuck on nixon-era 'police tap box' , writes to... tape ) [14:37]
asciilifeform: these are slowly getting the axe, 1 after another, most of the ( very solidly built, 2metre-thick walls etc ) exchange houses in usa, today largely empty [14:38]
asciilifeform: they put a 4u cisco thing in the basement somewhere and it replaces whole thing [14:38]
mircea_popescu: the zek herd has no fucking idea how to defend anything. kinda why they're not worth taking seriously. [14:38]
mircea_popescu: "oh, give me reasons to" "bitch... you'll just do it and like it, stfu." [14:38]
asciilifeform: jwz!! [14:39]
mircea_popescu: they're exactly ready, if tomorrow i start hanging "activists" the population will just clap along. just like the last time around. [14:39]
asciilifeform: afaik the 'fu, we'll make own internet, with hookers and blackjack, even if we gotta throw cables from window to window' thing had a brief life in usa, in '80s, then silently evaporated [14:43]
asciilifeform: today all that remains of it , is http://btcbase.org/log/2018-06-15#1825757 [14:43]
a111: Logged on 2018-06-15 16:47 asciilifeform surveyed what remains of shortwave , it's mostly empty, and what remains is largely these derps, 'texas can you hear me' 'this is utah, we can hear you' etc etc [14:43]
mircea_popescu: it had a long life in romania. still happens today. [14:43]
asciilifeform: aha. 'fidonet' reportedly still exists in ru. [14:43]
deedbot: http://qntra.net/2018/07/several-iphones-attacked-with-sideloaded-malware-apps/ << Qntra - Several iPhones Attacked With Sideloaded Malware Apps [14:44]
mod6: I'm happy to announce that The Bitcoin Foundation's 2nd TRB node is fully sync'd and will be added to the list of Advertised Republican Nodeds. [14:45]
mod6: Nodes, too. [14:45]
asciilifeform: congrats mod6 [14:45]
mod6: cheers! [14:47]
asciilifeform: funnily related story, back when asciilifeform was a uni student, cellpnojeism was beginning to spread among plebelands, and asciilifeform noticed that folx were paying telco fiddycents/minute to talk over 1-2km ! so asciilifeform went, like naive idjit, to engineering profs, with 'p2p telephony' proposal thing, reaction was the exact sort of through-the-teeth laughter of today's bernstein re phuctor . [14:52]
asciilifeform: 'It Would Be Wrong'(tm)(r) [14:52]
mircea_popescu: asswipes. [14:53]
asciilifeform: this was asciilifeform's 'intro course' to inca/star topology/etc. [14:53]
asciilifeform: nowadays they've 'progressed', happily pay not merely per minute but monthly ~lease~ on ipnoje, to talk across a street (via packets, via london, etc) [15:03]
asciilifeform: at uni we had a p2p lan warez thing, that somebody cobbled together. lulzily , however, ~searching~ relied on a central point of failure, at any given time 1 or 2 particular boxes, and they would live for 2-3 months until some rat ratted'em, then cycle repeated. [15:08]
asciilifeform: ( payloads were mostly pr0n , plus buncha 700MB-traditional film rips ) [15:10]
mircea_popescu: nowadays there's lateral peer discovery and things [15:11]
asciilifeform: right. but nowadays there's also bonsaikitten-students. [15:12]
mircea_popescu: just saying, the "p2p protocol" as a broad construct seems pretty well fleshed out. [15:12]
asciilifeform: aha. item however was an ultra-lowtech ad hoc thing, low-effort. [15:12]
BingoBoingo: At uni there was a little java program called "mytunes" which turned iTunes LAN shared music (a feature only used because of the pirate thing's popularity) into a sort of anon ftp [15:12]
asciilifeform: the much later, public 'p2p sharing nets' succumbed to wotlessness ( i.e. seeded with infinite fakes and crapola ) [15:13]
asciilifeform: they solved peer discovery, searching, etc. but not sybilism. [15:14]
BingoBoingo: Well this thing failed because at somepoint everyone ended up with all the same music. [15:14]
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: that ain't a tech failure, that's a meat failure. [15:14]
BingoBoingo: There was a parallel meat/tech failure Junior year which ended it. Wifi routers were just starting to become a thing and people kept plugging the WAN cable into the wrong ports. This happened repeatedly in casacades of failure because "Internet doesn't work, port must be bad" [15:18]
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform this is a good point, huh. eventually "private tracker" w/e was supposed to sorta-bandaid this [15:21]
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: sorta where state-of-the-art got stuck, to present day. [15:21]
mircea_popescu: yeah. [15:22]
mircea_popescu: and they're fucking terrible at user acquisition, too. [15:22]
BingoBoingo: !!up xdeller [16:08]
deedbot: xdeller voiced for 30 minutes. [16:08]
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: the 'private tracker' is really a step backwards, to the central-failure uni lan days. they live for a spell, then get killed/coopted/etc [16:42]
asciilifeform: ( cuz they're, elementarily, not really 'private', they're ~allcomers typically ) [16:43]
asciilifeform: there is not a techno-pill against the requirement of wot, just as there is not a system of magnets and pulleys that gets you a working perpetuum mobile. [16:44]
asciilifeform: ( in either case, naturally there will be found folx who keep right on trying and trying.. ) [16:45]
asciilifeform: 'maybe haven't found the right magnets yet!' [16:46]
asciilifeform: anecdote : some time in 2004 or so, asciilifeform described , to a frustrated-with-lan-warez gurl, how proper p2p net might work, 'picture if each user only connects to folx he knows personally, and queries can hop if there's transitive trust', ~gossipd, etc , reaction : [horrified] 'omfg, like terrorist cells?! how couldyou!' [17:09]
asciilifeform: incaphilia, turns out, afflicts not only elderly greybeard profs. [17:11]
* BingoBoingo reheating incan fried rice with some morcilla dulce. [17:12]
asciilifeform: lol [17:12]
asciilifeform: how's the butane fridge treating ya, BingoBoingo ? do i need to include a flammable hydrocarbon sensor in next crate ? [17:13]
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: It is so quiet [17:15]
BingoBoingo: And cold [17:15]
asciilifeform: maybe, for double lulz, it's an adiabatic (heater-driven) fridge... [17:15]
BingoBoingo: The isobutane appears to be a vastly superior refrigerant compared to R134a [17:15]
asciilifeform: eh they're all 'quiet and cold' when new. [17:16]
asciilifeform: !#s fram [17:17]
a111: 12 results for "fram", http://btcbase.org/log-search?q=fram [17:17]
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-11-08#1733947 << subj. [17:17]
a111: Logged on 2017-11-08 02:05 asciilifeform: in related lulz, http://oldschgarage.blogspot.com/2014/11/old-fram-fridge-project.html << same fram ! i had no idea that it was an adiabatic cycle thing [17:17]
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Back in old country there weren't even quiet and cold on the sales floor [17:17]
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: there used to be this thing, mostly in orcistans ( 1950s su, ro, elsewhere ) where starvation-cheap fridge, no compressor, but driven by heat ( typically ammonia as working fluid ) , could even run off kitchen gas [17:18]
asciilifeform: err, adsorption, not adiabatic ( the latter's a different bag of crackpottery ) [17:20]
BingoBoingo: They remain a rural crackpot thing in USistan as well along with R-22 to propane conversions [17:20]
asciilifeform: 'envirowhinerism trinity : expensive, shoddy, deadly' (tm)(r)(uncle al) [17:22]
diana_coman: asciilifeform, HA, a fram exactly like that was actually IN USE at the countryside 10 years ago for all I know it might even still work if anybody plugs it in [17:24]
asciilifeform: diana_coman: i saw one at museum, in timis [17:25]
asciilifeform: ( wasn't plugged in, but prolly worked, supposing the coolant is still in. 0 moving parts. ) [17:25]
diana_coman: I suppose my great grandparents' house could work fine as a museum [17:25]
asciilifeform: fwiw su fridges ( with compressors ) largely still work, and are prized items, healthy 2ndhand market believe or not exists [17:25]
asciilifeform: we had a 1950s 'zil' that still worked in '92 when we left. [17:26]
diana_coman: heh, that's grandparents', yes next generation basically [17:26]
asciilifeform: https://krsk.au.ru/10190430/ << subj. ( visually superficially like that 'fram', but 'modern', i.e. with compressor ) [17:28]
diana_coman: the sad part being that really, it's not *just* tech stuff that used to work for ages, it's ~everything [17:31]
asciilifeform: aha ! [17:31]
asciilifeform: su vacuum cleaners, also prized today [17:31]
asciilifeform: 100% steel, ~eternal motor, etc. [17:31]
diana_coman: eh, I have some *clothes* that are older than me and look better than new stuff, what can I say [17:32]
asciilifeform: i have this, also. [17:32]
asciilifeform: overcoat from 1970s, etc [17:32]
asciilifeform: lost atlantean tech... [17:32]
asciilifeform: ( http://btcbase.org/log/2018-07-05#1832119 << recent thread on subj ) [17:33]
a111: Logged on 2018-07-05 22:14 asciilifeform: and on subj, not long ago asciilifeform repaired, for relative, ancestral clock, what looked like cheap alarm clock but is actually an enlarged sov copy of ~swiss~ movement , made to 'cosmonaut' specs, believe [17:33]
diana_coman: not that much I can make such clothes just like I can still make bread by hand but the time needed to make them.... [17:34]
mod6: mircea_popescu, diana_coman : Ben and I have been pouring over the numbers (as i'm getting an education here), and the prorated cost for the rest of July for UY3 will be: 0.03542985 BTC [17:34]
asciilifeform: diana_coman: in principle you can make just about anyffing by hand. in practice... [17:35]
* asciilifeform eats bread made by-hand also. [17:36]
diana_coman: in practice one single person has only 2 hands, that's the thing [17:36]
asciilifeform: aaaha. [17:36]
mod6: I'd like to remind everyone here that Pizarro still desperately needs a manager, please inquire within if you're interested. [17:37]
diana_coman: mod6, BingoBoingo aren't you though in the best position to work this out? [17:38]
mod6: Hmm? [17:39]
mod6: No, this isn't really for me. And more-over I have too much to do already. [17:39]
diana_coman: mod6, honestly, how do you see this sorted ? [17:39]
mod6: hire someone? [17:40]
asciilifeform: diana_coman: we have a pretty serious shortage of skilled hands. [17:40]
diana_coman: mod6, ok, but this doesn't strike me like a position that you can interview for exactly just like that, you print the ad in the newspaper and interview applicants or something [17:41]
asciilifeform: diana_coman: it really has to be a l1 person, and so far no takers. [17:41]
diana_coman: asciilifeform, well, who exactly do you think would fit the bill anyway? [17:41]
asciilifeform: phf, trinque , danielpbarron ^ [17:41]
asciilifeform: http://trilema.com/2018/the-rivers-of-blood-article-or-the-lordship-list-fifth-year << for ref [17:42]
asciilifeform: hanbot, davout ^ also [17:43]
asciilifeform: iirc jurov already declined, as did mircea_popescu [17:43]
asciilifeform: ( i omitted diana_coman because presumably hands full, but whoknows... diana_coman ? ) [17:44]
asciilifeform: ... lobbes ? [17:45]
diana_coman: asciilifeform, well, I'm full time at s.mg as it is [17:45]
asciilifeform: aite [17:45]
diana_coman: ave1 is l1 too [17:45]
asciilifeform: oh yes [17:45]
asciilifeform: ... spyked ? [17:45]
mod6: mircea_popescu, diana_coman : Give me a thumbs up if you believe the box is ready for you to do your testing, and I'll invoice mircea_popescu. [17:49]
mod6: (at the end of the month, invoices will be sent) [17:50]
asciilifeform: diana_coman: also then signal BingoBoingo to remove the kvm cables, the kvm box is in no real sense secure , having it plugged in for extended time is a small but definite liability [17:51]
* asciilifeform brb [18:04]
* BingoBoingo is standing by for the signal [18:08]
BingoBoingo: And I have discovered something to do with these beaches before the bikinis return: http://www.uruguaypesca.com.uy/2009/11/la-burriqueta-o-borriqueta-es-conoceda.html [19:42]
mod6: nice [20:03]
lobbes: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-07-13#1834333 << I'll state for the record that I consider myself largely unqualified for the role (plus my hopper overfloweth atm) [20:13]
a111: Logged on 2018-07-13 21:45 asciilifeform: ... lobbes ? [20:13]
lobbes: to my (admittedly, untrained) eye, it does seem like BingoBoingo is the ideal fit for the role not only is he literally closest to the venture, but he also has sales experience iirc. Maybe what is needed is just a trusted "assistant manager", i.e. someone to handle the minutiae on a day-to-day basis under the direction of a chief strategist. [20:14]
lobbes: seems like that's what mod6 and BB are missing: "bandwidth to do X" [20:14]
lobbes: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-05-22#1816438 << in other news, you were not kidding! my trb (hdd + aggression) has moved a mere 20K blocks in one month [20:16]
a111: Logged on 2018-05-22 00:06 ben_vulpes: stand by to slow down [20:16]
lobbes: seemed to hit the wall right around height 350000 [20:20]
asciilifeform: lobbes: your node sounds like a good candidate for the timer patch (i.e. determine, why not syncs, is it block db delay, or it somehow gets nuffin from peers, or which.) [20:23]
asciilifeform: mid 300s is iirc where the packed-to-the-gunwales 'stress test'(tm)(r) blox begin. [20:24]
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu had good point, in that if sane logging (i.e. with msec timestamps for everything) were standard, question could be answered immediately. [20:27]
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-07-13#1834276 << it was always ai construct. [21:20]
a111: Logged on 2018-07-13 21:11 asciilifeform: incaphilia, turns out, afflicts not only elderly greybeard profs. [21:20]
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-07-13#1834299 << i had one at home growing up, too. [21:23]
a111: Logged on 2018-07-13 21:26 asciilifeform: we had a 1950s 'zil' that still worked in '92 when we left. [21:23]
mircea_popescu: o look, it's even in the logs! http://btcbase.org/log/2015-02-08#1012491 [21:23]
a111: Logged on 2015-02-08 05:44 mircea_popescu: http://media.englishrussia.com/new_images//zilmuseum-50.jpg << exactly the one in middle [21:23]
mircea_popescu: turns up top of the search if you try and find "zil fridge" [21:23]
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-07-13#1834316 << hence by extension of http://trilema.com/2010/doua-fete-argumentul-economic/ , the harem as an economic necessity. the marginal cost to make bread for 12 as opposed to 3 is sub 50% the marginal benefit from having local taylor to make you a dress while you make bread... [21:26]
a111: Logged on 2018-07-13 21:36 diana_coman: in practice one single person has only 2 hands, that's the thing [21:26]
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-07-13#1834322 << this is a fine question. what's the envisaged happy ending here ? [21:27]
a111: Logged on 2018-07-13 21:39 diana_coman: mod6, honestly, how do you see this sorted ? [21:27]
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-07-13#1834332 << she's technical rather than management track, also. much like you, and presumably a lot of other people in l1. which is a fundamental weakness we've been copacetically not really trying to address. [21:28]
a111: Logged on 2018-07-13 21:44 asciilifeform: ( i omitted diana_coman because presumably hands full, but whoknows... diana_coman ? ) [21:28]
mircea_popescu: (large part of the problem being, of course, that management folk are very disused to any sort or kind of actual work matter-of-coursedly display bizarre remunerative expectations on one hand and middling skills at busyworking/clockwaiting doubling an appetite for actual work verging on nil.) [21:31]
lobbes: asciilifeform: oya, I've squirreled away that link to the timer patch you dropped earlier in the logs. I'm thinking I'll apply it to my node once I get auctionbot2.0 through the conveyor, after which I can publish more concrete data. [21:36]
mircea_popescu: meanwhile in "sales/leads generating machines", http://trilema.com/contact-pgp/#comment-126230 [21:50]
mircea_popescu: because the moron utterly has to http://trilema.com/2017/the-practical-costs-of-hallucinated-freedom/ can't simply come fucking here, register a key, do something useful as ordered. no, none of that, business school produces more special cuntlets than miss america competitions, he gotta sing his own fucking tune. because this is actually possible, every dick, tan and harry can come up with marching tunes. [21:52]
mircea_popescu: i'm about as impressed of this autistic waste as of pete_dushenski's latest lists of important bitcoin posts he thinks he's made, and whatever other monkey-emperors of "all they survey". [21:53]
BingoBoingo: lobbes et al: I'll keep taking stuff on my plate, but the reason Pizarro isn't BBISP is... A need for more direction. [21:53]
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo in practical terms, you got a place to sleep and an internet connection. what specifically is keeping you from building up sales funnels ? [21:54]
mircea_popescu: trinque's provided a turnkey accounting solution, you do a !!ledger once a month, reconcile it with ops list and there you go, accounting's done. [21:55]
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: Nothing, updates from the funnel mines should be starting [21:55]
mircea_popescu: did pizarro ever build up a localbitcoins acct ? [21:56]
mircea_popescu: did the clickbank account ever stand up ? etc etc, i dunno how executing on the lenghty list of items in the log these pasts month could put one behind. [21:56]
BingoBoingo: I have one a localbitcoins account, started flirting with the alt-alt, and do have this lengthy list of items to push on [22:01]
mircea_popescu: alrighty. [22:01]
trinque: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-07-13#1834328 << mod6 also ran this by me. most of my opposition stems from having a lengthy list of wallet features yet to build, which have been delayed by (quite necessary) gentoo confiscation. [22:04]
a111: Logged on 2018-07-13 21:41 asciilifeform: phf, trinque , danielpbarron ^ [22:04]
BingoBoingo: I am comfortable taking tech direction from alf. If mod6 wants to take the purse from ben_vulpes, that's a board. [22:05]
trinque: beyond that, what's not clear is whether management means directing, or doing a lot of hands-on work on machines. it's likely I have little time for the former, but have absolutely no time for the latter. [22:05]
trinque: the fact that wallet features benefit greatly from a live and healthy pizarro is also not lost on me, which is why I jumped to be (afaik) live customer #1 [22:08]
mircea_popescu: trinque i don't think you have any business getting involved, fwiw. you're doing great in your line, keep doing that. [22:09]
trinque: yep, delicately saying as much. activist customer is about as far as I'm able to sign in blood atm. [22:10]
BingoBoingo: Well, pizarro has the dedicated boxes that require invoicing and the occasional standup. The rockchips that require invoicing and the occasional standup. Then there's the shared hosting server which is beefy as hell and runs a very lean gentoo. [22:10]
mod6: <+mircea_popescu> http://btcbase.org/log/2018-07-13#1834322 << this is a fine question. what's the envisaged happy ending here ? << As I was saying, was hoping to hire someone. [22:17]
a111: Logged on 2018-07-13 21:39 diana_coman: mod6, honestly, how do you see this sorted ? [22:17]
mod6: I understand if this doesn't happen right away, but eventually, position will need to be filled. The offer stands, even if it stands for some time. [22:19]
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: standing up boxen, to the degree that it can be done telerobotically, is asciilifeform's . [22:19]
asciilifeform: ( as with the most recent one ) [22:20]
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: And that has been a welcome change [22:20]
BingoBoingo: <mod6> I understand if this doesn't happen right away, but eventually, position will need to be filled. The offer stands, even if it stands for some time. << One way to handle this is... Take over what ben_vulpes on an interim basis and hand off tasks you don't have time for. [22:21]
mircea_popescu: mod6 yes hire someone, i get it, but really that's not how hiring works. hire someone that what ? [22:30]
mod6: Yeah, I need to write up a job description. [22:31]
mircea_popescu: a new one ?! [22:31]
mod6: And BingoBoingo, yeah, that's the plan. I'll do the best I can at this, but the more I learn about what was all involved day-to-day with ben_vulpes, the more I'm worried that I'm ill-equiped to do this work. [22:32]
mod6: mircea_popescu: hmm? [22:32]
mod6: To your question "hire someone that what ?" : That manages the day-to-day task for BingoBoingo, does accouting tasks (reporting, invoicing, payments), can possibly lend a hand with sysadmin tasks. That sort of thing. [22:34]
mircea_popescu: i dunno what the impediment is here. looky here : 1. you want to write a ~new~ job description, now. the job isn't new, so where's the old job description ? if you didn't have one then, why would you have one now, and if you didn't think you need one then, why would you need one now, and if it didn't occur to you to write it then why are you qualified to write it now ? [22:34]
mod6: So, a job description would be helpful. [22:34]
mod6: lol. [22:35]
mod6: I have no idea. I'm just trying to swim upstream here, Sir. [22:35]
mircea_popescu: 2. http://btcbase.org/log/2018-07-02#1831375 STILL didn't get a direct answer, two weeks later. this "withdraw into busywork" reaction to uncomfortable realities may work (it doesn't work, but subjectively may seem to work) in lines typically well fit to the autistic. but as things stand here it's at least mildly insulting to BingoBoingo, that he's the dood on the ground and you're somehow looking right throguh him. [22:36]
a111: Logged on 2018-07-02 18:37 mircea_popescu: well... so what are you gonna do, promote in house i suppose ? [22:36]
mod6: No no. [22:36]
mircea_popescu: ima ask again the thing i asked you lot when you came up with the batshit insane options arrangement : do you think he's not a real person because he's actually DOING things, real things, scary real things such as fucking venezuelans, and real people are only the meditative kind ? [22:36]
mircea_popescu: because there's problems here, and you're not helping yourself with the approach. [22:36]
mod6: I sent out personalized letters to two Lords asking if they wanted to fill the role. I didn't sit back and kick it. [22:37]
mod6: And to the point of BingoBoingo, he has said before that he wants direction from a manager. As he said earlier tonight. [22:37]
mircea_popescu: the difference between these two is lost on me, seeing how the lords are at least sufficiently acquainted with the situation and sufficiently possessed of their own wits to volunteer if they feel it. [22:37]
mircea_popescu: yes, well, and i want kim kardashian to blow up my ass. we get what we get. [22:37]
BingoBoingo: mod6: A fairly hands off (i.e not day to day situation) report to the board situation is fine [22:38]
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo and you! don't get into that situation where halp, has not what to eat and nothing's moving, you hear ? survival skills, yes! [22:39]
BingoBoingo: Since leaving the noise of the hostel that possible reality has been easier to hear. [22:41]
mod6: <+a111> Logged on 2018-07-02 18:37 mircea_popescu: well... so what are you gonna do, promote in house i suppose ? << you know, when we talked about this a week ago... it never even considered BingoBoingo , not because i think he's not a person or any such nonsense. But because when we started this ventue, he said that he needed strict guidence. [22:43]
asciilifeform: imho BingoBoingo is ideal for the job. [22:43]
mod6: But I missed what you were asking, you were asking if I was going to promote BingoBoingo. I totally didn't even get that until just now. [22:44]
mircea_popescu: ikr. [22:44]
asciilifeform: d00d survived the seven hells, fleas, brazilians. [22:44]
BingoBoingo: Well, the strict guidance thing was before ben_vulpes gave it a shot [22:44]
mod6: And I agree that the man could be good at it. But I tend to believe a man when he says "hey, I need instructions, day to day". [22:44]
mircea_popescu: the more you believe that, the more the day-to-day instructions books grow... [22:45]
BingoBoingo: Week to week should suffice [22:45]
mod6: Hey, nothing against BingoBoingo. At all. He has been through a battle, this is true. [22:45]
trinque: after surving all that, man just needs a mirror and to look once in a while [22:45]
trinque: "oh, should shave/eat/get dick sucked for wildcatting like a boss" [22:45]
trinque: actually fuck the shave, wildcatters grow beards [22:45]
BingoBoingo: <trinque> actually fuck the shave, wildcatters grow beards << This is true [22:46]
BingoBoingo: Shaving leads to razor bumps [22:46]
mod6: Well... [22:46]
mircea_popescu: i got beard... [22:46]
trinque: trinque, beard also. the metaphor went sideways on me! [22:47]
mod6: BingoBoingo: I'm gonna let you think about it for a few days if you need. Think about if you really want to take on major parts of this role. I think you ~can~ do it. But, I don't want you to feel overwhelemed or pushed into it either. [22:47]
BingoBoingo: Last time I tried the shaving it was maybe a week and a half before I had straight out of Africa shaving bumps [22:47]
mircea_popescu: mod6 seriously, pushing people into things, scary things especially, is what the job is. fuck him, let him swim already. what is this, the girlscouts ?! [22:48]
mod6: i need the man to stay content with his situation, he's the boots on the ground. [22:49]
BingoBoingo: I'm not buddhist. Contentment is impossible [22:49]
mod6: Alright. [22:51]
BingoBoingo: But we have just about burned through half of July since ben_vulpes' announcement [22:51]
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  1. sexually worthless males) + (reproductive value women [↩]
Category: Logs
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