Of mendacity, mold, bugs and other things.

BingoBoingo Best preambulatory clause:

WHEREAS F.DERP issues synthetic equivalents of worthless fiat businesses fraudulently purporting involvement in Bitcoin and exposure to the Bitcoin economy with the irresponsible support of the US propaganda machine as well as the allegedly private investment arm of the US Fed, in order to allow unfettered price discovery for the underlyings in the actual Bitcoin stock market ;

mircea popescu That reminds me BingoBoingo : I was gonna say I don't like curtis yarvin / mencius moldbug for the following very specific reason - he sounds exactly like a propaganda job for smart people. That is to say, he admits some "outrageous" points, which gives him some credence in the eyes of the more naive intelligent folk, youngsters mostly. He then turns around and uses this capital to consolidate the very monster he pretends to position himself against. Stuff like Unqualified Reservations: The BDH-OV conflict is a very plain example in this spirit.

This should be reason enough for anyone to avoid taking up cudgels on behalf of either.

Orly ? The whole thing works, intentionally or not, as a fine work of Mr. O'Brien. Only a fucking imbecile would imagine that THAT is the book of the insurgency.ⁱ The insurgency is not derping with stupid books, the insurgency is the mob, amassing power at the bottom of the market fluxes in the utopian world. This because back at reality ranch, the only way to win the game is to constantly attack all the way to the king. There's no prizes for having lost the game but "successfully sieged a rook" - which is the spirit behind that clauseⁱⁱ, and generally speaking the spirit behind everything that'll ever work.

dignork He is consistent, Moldbag is proposing a model of "better" government, when current one crashes, for whatever reason.
mircea popescu He is consistent in the sense that he doesn't want the current one to crash. Once that's on the table, the difference between Yarvin and Dutta is purely cosmetic.

dignork More that he doesn't see how it can be crashed, so he stays passive.
mircea popescu I do not believe so. If this were the true case he wouldn't have been out there trying to make a bitcoin-killer-app six weeks after it became obvious to him bitcoin is the killer app.ⁱⁱⁱ He'd have been here, long ago.

dignork He claims that democracy is self-stabilizing mud, and hence almost uncrashable.
mircea popescu I am aware. This is not a disinterested claim.

dignork In any case, through his writings I was searching for a better model, but he forgot to provide one, so it was fun to read, but nothing more.
mircea popescu Reading can't hurt anyway.

BingoBoingo I am astounded by that post, the structure and foundation of his argument, and his conclusions. Applying Subcontinental templates onto US society with the readiness a programmer might call some javascript data structures to be used in python.
mircea popescu What I most took exception with was the inane proposition that the mob (w/.e he calls it, D something) had "no cultural institutions". Fuck off, the only reason you can even have a decent meal in New York is the fucking mob. As far as that lasts, if it even survived past the Brahmin Bloomberg. But that aside, the relative success of b-a as compared to every other dickless-shithead^iv run channel on Freenode and beyond speaks directly to the superior cultural achievements and ability of the structured society.^v

BingoBoingo Or that H and D are specifically "Blue" as though he has never been to this "Middle America".
mircea popescu So to come round circle, I guess he could be just incredibly fucking stupid, as dignork proposes. Perhaps. Be that as it may, he's a reasonably useful tool^vi, and in a utilitarian world his idiocy does not define him as his utility does.

BingoBoingo Maybe he works as a "convenient highlighter". I've never really liked his argumentative style as he tries to put forth the grand societal argment relying on mush that seem reminiscent of Urbit "jets".
dignork I never said he is stupid, but the proposed model is not thought through.
mircea popescu De facto, in the "malicious or idiotic" dilemma you were proposing the latter. Or at least it's what I read.

BingoBoingo One can not build a banana republic by stacking deck chairs on the Titanic. The water's too deep.
dignork That's an extrapolation, but a good one.
mircea popescu I don't consider idiocy to be any more all-encompassing than genius. One can be a Chemistry genius and die of accidental exposure. One can similarly be a complete idiot in say politics and yet an accomplished farmer. (And yes I'm thinking of Jefferson).

dignork Malicious vs. idiotic problem is an intersting one: when I see somebody smarter than myself, by say +3 points, I can assume that he didn't find a solution because it required +4. Alternative: I assume that he is +6, because that's how smart he supposed to be to fool me... default would be +3.
mircea popescu This however is not supported by what we're discussing. When you see someone who displays the mental gymnastics required to comprehend the FFT^vii and then fails to resolve a problem which requires merely differential calculus... What then ?

dignork It also can be a mental barrier, for example if he tries to maintain humanism, while rejecting democracy.
mircea popescu Functionally, this is idiocy (denying the fruits of reason lest they interfere with the desires of emotion).

dignork For most, self preservation is above reasoning.
mircea popescu No argument. Most don't get to serve as cultural reference points. For this reason.

BingoBoingo Amazing how the Yarvins don't separate their reasoned arguments from their emotional rants.
mircea popescu Do I ?

BingoBoingo You write in a way that the elements of the emotional rants and reasoned arguments have clear seperations discernable to readers.
mircea popescu I wonder if this is in any way my merit. I always thought the distinction is the job of the readership.

BingoBoingo May be because you didn't grow up on Ingles.
mircea popescu Or maybe it's because I killed Andreas AntonoWhatevs.^viii

(after the shortest of pauses)

mircea popescu No but I'm seriously offended. The entire fucking pile of a century worth of Chomskis and whatnot "brahmins" has produced exactly 0 cultural output. It's not that the US doesn't have a great brahmin novel. It has NOTHING, and this schmuck has the unmitigated audacity to belittle other shit from atop of all that nonachievement ?! It contributed to the culture of the world less than fucking Chad.^ix At least the Chadians dance and shit. Stupid ass US "brahmins" can't even take their clothes off.^x
BingoBoingo I blame Husserl and Derrida.

mircea popescu Neither were USians.
BingoBoingo The USian Brahmin emulate the French, for some god awful reason.

mircea popescu What French lol. I fucked French. They're emulating a 1844 postcard sent from Paris, Wisconsin and drawn by some out of work industrial sketcher dude.
BingoBoingo More their imagined sense of the French. The USian brahamin could have done great if they would have let James starve when the dumpsters ran out of food and instead elevated Peirce.

mircea popescu Even leaving that scandal aside, consider their treatment of Buffett. Guy comprehends more economy than the entire profession of academic economist in the history of the United States. Yet... they're doing some pathetic recouping of old-and-senile Buffett now, mostly predicated on denouncing as heresy his actually useful contributions, two decades prior.
pete_dushenski At least Chadians dance and shit. << USians twerk

mircea popescu No, that's still the Chadians. Show me one of these fucktarded, social sciences major chick twerking. Preferably one that doesn't look like a whale coming aground.
pete_dushenski SM derps jiggle, black bitches twerk.
BingoBoingo If I still used the Facebook thing this might be possible.

mircea popescu youtube.com/watch?v=x0ef_q1_uoQ << US "brahmin"^xi culture. That's what it is.
assbot Douche Canoe An Original Song - YouTube
pete_dushenski youtube.com/watch?v=jGwo8-OCDcQ
assbot Best White Girl Twerk Compilation 2014 - YouTube
pete_dushenski Lol I shoulda used douchecanoe instead of contravex.

mircea popescu Sadly I can't evaluate your contribution because youtube considers it dangerous for minors such as myself.
BingoBoingo Lol, same here.
pete_dushenski youtube.com/watch?v=1uiODkiH_d0 << all white, not all terrible actually. Though it's tough to know if they're white when most faces are obscured and light levels not conducive to determining skin tone.
assbot Compilation Best White Girl Twerking Vines - August 2014 Part 1 - YouTube

mircea popescu White is scarcely the qualification here. 50k in debt, social sciences degree and a history of opining in the press is the qualification.^xii It'd be a sad world if white chicks were all fucktarded, just by virtue of being white.
pete_dushenski O right.
asciilifeform He [Yarvin] doesn't want the current one to crash << this is because he is persuaded (not necessarily wrongly) that he and his children^xiii will be eaten by orcs when crash.

mircea popescu So ? Suppose I ran for fucking Congress in say South Africa, on the internal conviction that upon the destruction of South Africa lies my prosperity. Would you expect the electorate there to welcome me ?

decimation I would ceratianly agree that whatever one wants to label "Brahmin culture" in the US, it hasn't contributed much to global human capital.
mircea popescu That for one thing. For the other, the only way to read Yarvin's definition outside of "the mob" would require absolute Midwestern innocence of the mob as an ~urban~^xiv institution mind you. It has nothing to do with Italians, other than in the sense the Italians were at the time the most urban ethnic group in the US.

asciilifeform The more interesting thing is the belief that 'compliance' will save them from gasenwagen.^xv
mircea popescu This is why stuff like 1984 is so good. The fuckwit hero actually believes that O'Brien is the guy to go to for the secret book. I mean... what the fuck more.

* decimation is innocent of the mob, in a Midwestern way.
mircea popescu I can tell.

decimation It is rarely the case that one walks around the city finding things labeled 'mob'.
mircea popescu Really ? I would suspect it much depends on what you mean by "one". The same argument could be made by a blonde twerking ditz going "it's not that she ever ran into anything labeled physics". Or "code".

decimation [As to the earlier point] I find it amusing that folks with retirement accounts work so hard to 'shelter' them from taxation under the latest rules, as if USG would allow one to accumulate wealth without taking it.
mircea popescu Hehehe quite.

decimation The latest deal is 'Roth' - the deal being that if you pay taxes now, USG promises never to tax your earnings on that money again. I find this to be as likely as Darth Vader abiding by his verbal contract.
mircea popescu And in the same vein : I find it amusing that folks in a quarrel with the government hire government agents to "defend" them at significant expense.^xvi

(The thread kinda dies here, and a new one is born)

ben_vulpes I'm now playing The Miseducation of Lauryn Hill loud enough for the bums outside the warehouse to hear. Landlord of record has 2? 3? KW of sound equipment for my pleasure.
mircea popescu ;;google Lauryn Hill nude

gribble Lauryn Hill Nude Photos Leaked Online - Mediamass: ; Lauryn Hill Highest-Paid Singer in the World - Mediamass: ; Lauryn Hill dead 2014 : Fugees ex-lead singer killed by celebrity ...:
mircea popescu Quite miseducated.

ben_vulpes Ever listened to the album in question? Actually better question, do you understand black american music as sung/read/rapped?
* asciilifeform [is] allergic.
ben_vulpes Not unexpected, asciilifeform. Y'r also not a filthy kike.
* asciilifeform wonders if hybrid of 'klezmer' and 'rap' exists.
ben_vulpes The gypsy dubstep fusion is about as close as it gets right now.
BingoBoingo Unholy hybrid, ear plugs recommended youtube.com/watch?v=nfWlot6h_JM
assbot Taylor Swift - Shake It Off - YouTube
mircea popescu "Understand" ? I get what the words are.

ben_vulpes On a first listen?
mircea popescu Yes, on a first listen. But I'm culturally rigid enough to generally regard the entire thing as you know... little more than children babbling. "O look how cute, he could almost say compunction in spite of his oversized lips".

ben_vulpes Hue.^xvii
decimation A more interesting question is: how does 'black music' go from Louis Armstrong to thug rap in 50 years?^xviii
asciilifeform Entropy?
BingoBoingo CIA corruption.
mircea popescu The white hierarchy supporting society collapsed ? How does the French underground go from rengaine to "Irreversible" ? WW2. Most of the better Frenchmen got shot. (If you've not seen that film btw... you might have to. Possibly worst film ever made + 10 minutes of Monica Belucci being raped in the dirt.^xix) But anyway, the point was that inasmuch as she's not published her cunt her education is quite appalingly poor.

decimation "White hierarchy collapsed" << seems legit. I blame complacency & wealth that came after the destruction of WWII.
BingoBoingo Also the decades of persistent paranoia through the cold war
decimation In retrospect, I think the paranoia was for Midwestern kulaks, the elites were all "anti-"communists, in the sense that they thought that the Soviet Union wasn't "real" communism. Those elites didn't mind sending said kulaks to die in various foreign adventures though.
BingoBoingo The paranoia shapes the discourse though, as well as the range of possible public discourse. A the end of the Cold War the Soviet block got to purge that, but the "West" had to redirect it to prop their system up.
mircea popescu Now that's an interesting point.

BingoBoingo The US government won by persisting, Eastern Bloc People won by quitting the conflict.
decimation Agreed. The same "anti-"communists now hate Putin because he represents everything they hated about Soviet fascism. This is why USG has such an irrational policy vis-a-vie Russia.
BingoBoingo It's also why the War on Drugs got all of the Military and Propaganda department support in 1992, and why the enshrinement of 9/11 so rapidly took little time. Were there really that much of a backstock of American Flag Lapel pins just waiting for such a crisis?
decimation Absolutely, the Cold War defense complex was aimlessly looking for a 'mission'.
mircea popescu Inasmuch as Bitcoin is a lot more fascist than Stalin ever got... I guess prepare for a helluva lot o' love.

ben_vulpes What do you mean by "fascist" in this context?
mircea popescu Well, socialism is the misguided expectation/belief that the problems of the individual will be resolved by the group. Fascism is exactly the opposite : the misguided expectation/belief that the problems of the group will be resolved by an individual.

ben_vulpes That's a tidy duality.
mircea popescu Hint : the group doesn't actually exist, not in any way meaningful on the plane where the individuals do. Consequently, both these come up with pretty contorted and quickly insane misrepresentations of the group. "To make it work".^xx

decimation Yes, it's useful anyway. By that definition, the usg 'anti-communists' I mentioned above are quite simply socialists with a beef against the soviets.
BingoBoingo I dunno any other explanation for Patton's political positions.
ben_vulpes What distinguishes 'socialism' from 'communism'?
mircea popescu Poverty.

ben_vulpes I mean I have no clue. Perhaps communism is just a thing that the US progpagandacrats came up with to point at to distract the proles from that as what was going on on the daily at home.
mircea popescu No, communists are poor socialists, socialists are rich communists. It's like, what's the difference between phase 2 and phase 4 lymphoma ? The wheel chair.

There's a bunch of ancillary points I wanted to make about this conversation. Through the magic of footnotes, they're all well made, but to sum up :

• Politics are for married people only when things work well. When the entirety of political dispute is limited to whether the shed should be painted pink or blue, married people may have a say. Once serious issues come to the fore however, matters such as dismantling and recreating the state on new foundations, they can at most be silent, and otherwise embarrass themselves. There's a reason Rome was made by young men without brides, and there's a reason the fathers of the Sabines lived in a country by a name that's not today remembered.
• Shyness is for married women. Coyness is for fat, ugly, reproductively marginal girls. Aged sixteen, you're either a brazen hussy or you don't exist, quite that plain and simple. Get that cunt on pinterest already, stop wasting your time, you can't ever have it back.
• You are not to expect potable water flowing out of a spring in the outhouse. The fruits of a poisonous tree doctrine is a doctrine for a reason. To think O'Brien is the guy holding the secret book of freedom is about as idiotic as to expect a vegetable garden growing in your stomach.
• Parasites, such as artists (parasitism is not a matter of skin color, by the way) only do well when there's a well structured society they can rely on for support, much like mushrooms need a something to prop them up. This is why you can have good music in the 50s, but you can't have good music today.

There's probably more, but hey... gotta leave something unwritten for tomorrow, right ?

1. If you're not familiar with the George Orwell novel in question this reference will be opaque to you.

   If you are familiar with it, however, you've perhaps considered the counterfactual. Suppose you were to find yourself in the boots of one Winston Smith, an aging, decaying intellectual of sorts, that manages to score an exceptionally juicy morsel of teenaged cunt. (And note, dear ladies perusing these texts, that the controlling quote is, exactly as predicted,

   With what seemed a single movement she tore off her clothes and flung them disdainfully aside.

   That's what she did, right in public, at the beach, on the street, that is what makes or breaks the woman. And so... have you published your nude, sprawled cunt on the Internet, with name and phone number yet ? Hurry up before you shrivel up. Time waits for no woman.)

   But back to the gender of interest : with your masculinity so validated, what now ? What's next ? How far would you go ?

   Clearly, you can no longer be a slave, for you are now a man (again, perhaps) and these two are incompatible. Just as a cripple can not be an Olympic champion, just so, exactly the same you can't really go back. Once crippled out of the herd of women and children slaves by the growth of your beard you're stuck in a spot. Which way now ?

   The way sissy pencilneck Winston goes is towards very onanistic "gossip group". He aims, like any collegiate faggot in the eleven centuries of collegiate history, to join the "bigger boys" and you know... write about it. Have a little reddit support group and "resist through culture". Obviously. And just as obviously, the whole echafaudage turns out to have been a fake, which you should have known, had you had any sort of schooling outside of the school, had you had any world experience whatsoever. But who has time to learn the language of the street in a world where kids gotta go to college, right ?

   Forget all that crud. What would you do if you were a man ? Would you perhaps observe that inasmuch as there's shortages and entire classes of goods outright absent, inasmuch as people have desires that aren't being satisfied and expectations that aren't being met and hopes that aren't being meaningful there's ample room in there to stick a crowbar and crack the whole world open ? Would you start small, trading gin for wormcastle biscuits and then inventing fake roulette wheels like I did when I was ELEVEN and then move on from there to work excuse slips and everything else ? All the way up ? Would you end up with an empire guarded by slavegirls in catsuits and would you end up the replacement for Big Brother through public acclamation ?

   Capitalism, you see, is not optional. Hard currency is not optional. These work, together, the way water works. Endlessly, tirelessly, indomitably, first at the foundation of the petrified establishment, then soon enough all the way to the roof supports. Nothing rigid, nothing established could ever dream to survive their workings, all that's needed is time. Not a lot of time, either. All that's needed is a little time.

   So, would you have been there, in the shadows, in the basements, running a criminal organisation, slowly taking over the distributive aspects of economy, piling up manpower and materiel all the way to the sky ? All the way to the point where you can finally kill your own father ? Or would you have run over to O'Daddy to tell him all about your nocturnal polutions and beg him to cut off your thingee, make you just like your sisters, make the whole mess of "feelings you're not sure about" stop ? Hm ? [↩]

2. The one he cited, thereby starting this avalanche. [↩]
3. Why do you suppose Stage n: Bitcoin exists is still unanswered to this day, outside of the (meanwhile...dead) attempt to create Urbit ? What did you think Urbit was supposed to be ? Paid for, by whom, to what purpose ?

   So now we understand each other. [↩]

4. d-s from now on ? [↩]
5. It point of fact, the mob is nothing anytime and anywhere but a structure. Which explains why it's so damned difficult to "fight". You can't win a war with the triangular shape. [↩]
6. For them. [↩]
7. The fast Fourrier transformation is perhaps the most important calculation we've discovered to date. [↩]
8. You remember, some inept blathermouth / NeoBee shill / assorted otherscam shill that I killed somethime in 2014. With my bare hands. [↩]
9. It's a country somewhere in Nowherelandia that only exists conceptually because it stole Romania's flag. [↩]
10. This is not a joke. In fact, it's about as far removed from a joke as it gets. You think anyone can do that ? Fuck you. [↩]
11. As a great Fallout fan, I can scarcely think of "brahmin" as anything but two-headed cows. Seems a bizarre insult, but w/e, not my terminology. [↩]
12. Remember that Leah McGrath Goodman imbecile ? That. [↩]
13. On the topic of "parents, those ex-humans that meanwhile succumbed to their biology, much in the way corpses are ex-humans that meanwhile succumbed to their biology" : Cine se casatoreste… This'd be the canonical word on the topic. [↩]
14. Urbanity is a complex thing to grok, but the Anonimity, or the urban versus rural dispute article remains in my opinion by far the best entry for they who absolutely must enter through reading. [↩]
15. This is a much more astute point than it appears on first read. Idiot Winston also thought O'Brian's going to save him, did he not. Because "the unknown" is always scary for immature dickies, and so... [↩]
16. Discussed over at Why it’s not actually in your best interest to allow a hired third party to speak for you in criminal proceedings. [↩]
17. I think it's how he laughs in writing. Not 100% sure. [↩]
18. Have you read Kink High ? Do not ask why the girls have stopped doing bukkake and are now cuckolding this season. It's really random. [↩]
19. By the way, have you noticed that other than the splendiferous tits, the chick's never made a film in which she's not raped ? Talk about a good example to women in videogames... [↩]
20. Yes, that's right, both disastrous, bloodthirsty utopias of the 20th century are in fact struggling with intractable ontological problems. The same one, at that. [↩]